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Speaker 1: Get in touch with technology with tech Stuff from How

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Speaker 1: Stuff Work stof Haylor and Welcome to tex Stuff. I'm

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Speaker 1: Jonathan Strickland and I'm and today we're going to talk

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Speaker 1: about torrence and how they work. And we actually Chris

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Speaker 1: and I did an episode about torrance well well well

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Speaker 1: into the past, but it was worth updating and talking

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Speaker 1: about because we're gonna be talking about some other torrent

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Speaker 1: related stuff in the near future. So we wanted to

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Speaker 1: kind of lay the groundwork and explain what exactly is

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Speaker 1: torrenting and how does that that technology actually work and

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Speaker 1: and why is there so much controversy around it. But

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Speaker 1: to start off, we kind of need to talk about

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Speaker 1: just how you would typically get a file, right, how

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Speaker 1: how files are transferred period at all? Under so the

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Speaker 1: normal process, yeah, by either by by any of the

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Speaker 1: protocols that you would use over the internet, be the

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Speaker 1: FTP or HTTP that's file Transfer protocol or hypertext Transfer

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Speaker 1: protocol excellent acronyms. So traditionally, your your computer, which in

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Speaker 1: this scenario we call the client, is going to contact

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Speaker 1: a a host computer a server in order to to say, hey,

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Speaker 1: I want that thing exactly. Yeah, whether that thing is

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Speaker 1: a web page. So if your web browser can be

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Speaker 1: a client. Yeah, that thing could be a web page.

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Speaker 1: That thing could be a music file, it could be

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Speaker 1: a movie file, it could be uh an email. It

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Speaker 1: all depends on the people content, right that that you

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Speaker 1: want to get. Um. The server would then send the

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Speaker 1: file to your computer according to whichever protocol you are using, right,

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Speaker 1: And it's using the basic set of rules that we

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Speaker 1: all know from the Internet, the idea of everything's in packets.

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Speaker 1: Those packets travel through different routes and then they get

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Speaker 1: reassembled on your computer. But yeah, it's essentially a one

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Speaker 1: to one relationship, right, I'm asking the server to send

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Speaker 1: me something, the server send something to the client. Done, done,

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Speaker 1: and you know, and the speed with which this can

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Speaker 1: happen depends on the amount of traffic on the server

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Speaker 1: the size of the file. Yeah. So let's let's boil

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Speaker 1: this down to an analogy. Alright, So, Lauren, you are

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Speaker 1: a server, I am, yes, So now you have entered

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Speaker 1: into the uh the service industry. You are a server

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Speaker 1: in a coffee shop. Okay, you serve terrible at that job.

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Speaker 1: But let's let's imagine Lauren, that this is a reality

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Speaker 1: where you're not terrible at your job, you're actually pretty good.

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Speaker 1: You can serve up to three people simultaneously, so amazing,

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Speaker 1: but only three people and uh, and the amount of

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Speaker 1: time it takes you to produce the order for the

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Speaker 1: customer depends upon what they ordered, like what size of it,

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Speaker 1: and how complicated is the drink. Obviously these things will

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Speaker 1: factor into how long it takes you to prepare it.

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Speaker 1: But you can still handle up to three. But then

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Speaker 1: there's a rush, right like, uh, I don't know, there's

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Speaker 1: some hipster band is in town and everyone needs their coffee,

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Speaker 1: so they all rushed the coffee shop at the same time.

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Speaker 1: And now you've got twenty people asking you to make

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Speaker 1: very complicated drinks, but you can only serve three at

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Speaker 1: a time, and these drinks are getting progressively more complicated

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Speaker 1: and larger. Things start to slow down, so that person

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Speaker 1: who's you know, seventeen people back, feels like they're waiting

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Speaker 1: forever to get a coffee, and they're thinking, what's the

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Speaker 1: big deal. It should only take It's just a coffee,

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Speaker 1: You should just take two minutes. I should be in

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Speaker 1: and out in two minutes, and instead I've been sitting

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Speaker 1: here for fifteen minutes. And the lines barely moved. That's

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Speaker 1: the same thing we experience with this traditional approach. If

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Speaker 1: you're talking about a single server hosting a lot of files,

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Speaker 1: a lot of clients contacting the server for the files,

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Speaker 1: and those files are big, it just means that things

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Speaker 1: can get bottlenecked and slow down. So there were some

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Speaker 1: different approaches to trying to figure out how to make

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Speaker 1: this uh more streamlined and put. One way is to

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Speaker 1: just increase broadband speed. Right, So, essentially, if you're talking

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Speaker 1: about the Internet being a series of tubes, that's it.

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Speaker 1: It's a bigger, bigger, longer tubes. Yeah, bigger tubes and

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Speaker 1: more tubes. Yeah, those are your two choices, right. You

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Speaker 1: make them bigger so that you can shove more stuff

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Speaker 1: through the tubes, or you make a lot more of

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Speaker 1: them so that there are new ways for it to

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Speaker 1: pass through. But you're still kind of ball necked by

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Speaker 1: the the server itself and how quickly it can respond

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Speaker 1: to requests. Sure, so if this approach is really slow,

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Speaker 1: then one alternative is to distribute a file across a

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Speaker 1: network so that you have lots of different options when

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Speaker 1: you need to get that file. Right. So, in this instance,

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Speaker 1: instead of saying that Lauren is the only person who

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Speaker 1: can serve coffee within a twenty mile radius. And that's

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Speaker 1: why we're all kind of uh, you know, up the

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Speaker 1: creek when we walk into the coffee shop and we

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Speaker 1: see there's fifteen people ahead of Instead, we have a

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Speaker 1: coffee shop on every corner and across the street from

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Speaker 1: each other, and next door to one another. Their coffee

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Speaker 1: shops everywhere. So really I just have to walk into

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Speaker 1: any coffee shop and I really just stand in the

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Speaker 1: middle of the street and show coffee and someone will

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Speaker 1: bring one. So that's that's kind of the idea of

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Speaker 1: the peer to peer network. In this sense, you have

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Speaker 1: some form of software that allows you to connect to

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Speaker 1: a distributed network where when you participate in this network,

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Speaker 1: you're essentially giving permission to access part of your hard drive. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you just set aside a little folder on your hard

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Speaker 1: drive that is okay for this program to access, and

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Speaker 1: then everyone else who is running the same program also

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Speaker 1: has folders set up. Hopefully they have stuff in them, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Because one thing you could do is you can set

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Speaker 1: up this folder and then immediately move stuff out of

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Speaker 1: the folder, and then you're leaching. That's the term, right right.

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Speaker 1: It's it's considered a faux pause in sharing circles just

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Speaker 1: because you're you're not putting anything back out into the community. Right.

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Speaker 1: So with peer to peer, let's say you've got this

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Speaker 1: folder that's designated as a shared folder, and when you're

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Speaker 1: connected to the software, anyone who's also connected the software,

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Speaker 1: when they're searching for a specific file, it your file.

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Speaker 1: If you happen to have that file within your folder,

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Speaker 1: you come up as an option to connect to download

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Speaker 1: from your computer. Now, the problem with peer to peer,

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Speaker 1: it solves one issue, right. The one issue is that

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Speaker 1: if you go with the clients server uh model, then

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Speaker 1: you are limited by the server. Like if the server

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Speaker 1: is the only machine out there that has an existing

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Speaker 1: version of this file, then that's the one destination you

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Speaker 1: can go to, and you are stuck with whatever problems

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Speaker 1: that might have. In peer to peer, you're adding more tubes,

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Speaker 1: but you're not making them any bigger. Right, So in

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Speaker 1: other words, like I could you know, if we're going

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Speaker 1: back to our coffee shop, example, and we have these

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Speaker 1: coffee shops everywhere, I can walk to the coffee shop

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Speaker 1: that's closest to me, but there's no guarantee that that

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Speaker 1: coffee shop won't have the world's slowest server, or you know,

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Speaker 1: like that someone who's just they they are very meticulous

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Speaker 1: about the way they make their coffee, or there might

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Speaker 1: be two or three people in front of me at

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Speaker 1: that coffee shop and I have to wait for them. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: it gives me more options. It does not necessarily mean

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Speaker 1: it will be faster, and the really good software will

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Speaker 1: identify the person with the best connection who has that

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Speaker 1: file exactly yes, So that way it gives you the

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Speaker 1: best chance of having a smooth transfer. And it's also

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Speaker 1: good to note that this creates more stability when you're

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Speaker 1: trying to get a file. So the other big issue

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Speaker 1: with the old clients server approach is that if that

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Speaker 1: server suffers a problem, if it goes down for some reason,

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Speaker 1: power outage or whatever, then you're stuck. You know, you

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Speaker 1: don't you do not get that file. And if you

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Speaker 1: were trying to download a big file and it was

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Speaker 1: maybe seventy of the way done and the power goes out,

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Speaker 1: there's a chance that file could get corrupted in the

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Speaker 1: process and then you have to start all over again, right,

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Speaker 1: which was a real bummer when peer to peer was

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Speaker 1: was really big back in the early two thousand's, like

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Speaker 1: late nineties, um, because you know, it was about that

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Speaker 1: modems that could that could handle broader band than fourteen

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Speaker 1: four speeds became available for consumer purchase. And after that,

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Speaker 1: you know, when when people started getting connected to the

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Speaker 1: ethernet was really when Peter Pierre happened. Yeah, and then

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Speaker 1: you you were able to you know, one of the

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Speaker 1: downsides is that traditionally, with most Internet service providers, your

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Speaker 1: upload speed is a fraction of what your download speed is. Right.

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Speaker 1: The reason for that is that ages ago, when companies

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Speaker 1: began to offer Internet service, they looked at the broadband

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Speaker 1: that they had available, like the bandwidth they had available

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Speaker 1: to the size of the tubes. Essentially, they're saying, all right,

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Speaker 1: here's here's what we are capable of delivering to our customers.

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Speaker 1: How are we going to determine how much is down

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Speaker 1: link versus uplink? And then they said, well, you know,

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Speaker 1: probably people aren't sending stuff up to the Internet that frequently.

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Speaker 1: They're mostly trying to consume stuff pull stuff down. This

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Speaker 1: was before we were uploading millions of years worth of

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Speaker 1: YouTube videos every second. Yeah, this was this was back

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Speaker 1: when that was not even a consideration. So the idea

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Speaker 1: was that, well, you know, we can just make it

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Speaker 1: fraction upload speeds will be a fraction of download because

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Speaker 1: you there's nothing as frustrating really as sitting down. Well

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Speaker 1: this is probably that's that's exaggerating, but it's very frustrating

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Speaker 1: to sit down and try and get at some sort

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Speaker 1: of content online and then just see either a buffering

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Speaker 1: thing or a loading screen and it just goes on forever.

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Speaker 1: If you're talking about the old old days of the Internet,

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Speaker 1: there's nothing like trying to look at a picture of

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Speaker 1: something and watch it slowly load pixel line by pixel line,

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Speaker 1: and you're just thinking, I have no idea what I'm

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Speaker 1: looking at. I won't know for another forty five minutes.

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Speaker 1: I would I would like the record to state that

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Speaker 1: I just used I just gestured at Jonathan to help

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Speaker 1: you guys understand what he was talking about and exactly

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Speaker 1: how ineffective that was. That was a great visual representation

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Speaker 1: on an audio podcast. Yeah, so you know that this

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Speaker 1: approach meant that we suddenly had all these other options,

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Speaker 1: this peer to peer approach, and this is the way

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Speaker 1: a lot of those file sharing services back in the

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Speaker 1: day worked because lime Wire, Napster, that kind of thing.

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Speaker 1: They well, yeah, it's all about let's find people who

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Speaker 1: have the stuff you want and connect this create a

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Speaker 1: connection directly to them. Yeah, so it almost becomes like

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Speaker 1: a direct phone line in a way, where the connection

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Speaker 1: is between the host computer and your computer, so you

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Speaker 1: can get the file and then of course once you

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Speaker 1: have the file, your computer can become a potential host computer.

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Speaker 1: So now an improvement on that was bit torrents approach, right,

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Speaker 1: and I think it will be really interesting to get

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Speaker 1: into the intricacies of how bit torrent works. But before

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Speaker 1: we do that, let's take a quick break. Let's get

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Speaker 1: back to the show. Alright, we're back, and Lauren, you

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Speaker 1: alluded to bit torrent. Now, this was a totally different

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Speaker 1: approach in the sense that it was someone coming up

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Speaker 1: with the idea of how can we make these download

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Speaker 1: speeds faster, not just more reliable so that I have

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Speaker 1: more options, but how can I get the stuff I

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Speaker 1: want faster, particularly if it's a really large file, you know,

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Speaker 1: and if you're if you're like Jonathan said earlier, if

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Speaker 1: your internet connection is maybe not the best and something

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Speaker 1: cuts out somewhere that you won't lose all of the

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Speaker 1: progress on downloading a file you had already made. So

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Speaker 1: this was the idea of a programmer named Bram Cohen. Now,

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Speaker 1: Bram Cohen had worked for several dot com startups that

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Speaker 1: never really took off, and they just kind of failed

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Speaker 1: over and over, and he really wanted to work on

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Speaker 1: something that worked. That was a big ambition of his

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Speaker 1: understandable And in two thousand one he was also getting

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Speaker 1: really irritated by these problems we're talking about the slow

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Speaker 1: download speed of large files. He liked the idea of

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Speaker 1: the peer to peer network, but he didn't care for

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Speaker 1: the execution. So in two thousand one he begins work

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Speaker 1: on a new protocol. Now we've used the word protocol

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Speaker 1: several times in this podcast, just to remind you. A

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Speaker 1: protocol really is just a set of rules. It's kind

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Speaker 1: of a kind of a seven instructions for a computer

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Speaker 1: to follow. So he designed a protocol that he called BitTorrent. Now,

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Speaker 1: this was an attempt to solve that connection problem um

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Speaker 1: and the speed problem at the same time. So you know,

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Speaker 1: peer to peer adjusted the connection. He wanted to do

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Speaker 1: speed as well, So how do you do that? Well,

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Speaker 1: his approach was to create this protocol that would allow

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Speaker 1: files to be distributed in pieces, and as you receive

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Speaker 1: a piece, you are also able to upload that piece

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Speaker 1: even before your file finishes downloading. So I might have

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Speaker 1: a file that's at twenty seven percent as it's slowly downloading,

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Speaker 1: that is completely available for other people on the network

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Speaker 1: who are also trying to get that file. You could

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Speaker 1: also get pieces of these files from multiple sources, so

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Speaker 1: as long as everyone had the same file, then you

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Speaker 1: could get, you know, a piece here and a piece there.

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Speaker 1: So imagine that everyone has at least some part of

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Speaker 1: a five piece puzzle, and one person down the street

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Speaker 1: is giving you pieces uh one through twenty seven, and

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Speaker 1: someone on another side of the street is giving you

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Speaker 1: pieces forty three through fifteen, and you're just getting You're

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Speaker 1: getting the whole puzzle, but you're getting them from different

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Speaker 1: locations all at the same time. It's like it's like

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Speaker 1: if everyone in that in that coffee house street has

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Speaker 1: a cup of coffee and you just kind of run

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Speaker 1: down and they all pour a little bit into your cup. Right. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's similar to that, except except with less like gross

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Speaker 1: spittle contamination. And also there's a pretty design at the top.

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Speaker 1: I don't know how they managed that while you running

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Speaker 1: down the street like a crazy person, but you know

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Speaker 1: they're talented, that's all. So he was thinking like this

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Speaker 1: would be the way of solving this problem of slow

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Speaker 1: download speeds. Now, he did not necessarily go about testing

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Speaker 1: this in a very scientific, scientific PC way. Did you

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Speaker 1: see how he tested Okay, folks, here's how he tested it.

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Speaker 1: He collected a batch of freely available pornographic material and

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Speaker 1: then invited beta testers to see about getting hold of

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Speaker 1: this stuff using the bit torrent protocol. Stay classy, Cohen,

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Speaker 1: But now he figured that this was kind of a

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Speaker 1: sure fire away. And because it was freely available stuff,

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Speaker 1: it wasn't like it wasn't copyright. I didn't have to

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Speaker 1: worry about running into problems with torrent systems have having

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Speaker 1: fact run into lots of copyright issues. We'll talk about

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Speaker 1: that towards the end of the show. You know, that's

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Speaker 1: that's a that's a totally different discussion. But yeah, he

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Speaker 1: he wanted to try and test it out, and apparently

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Speaker 1: that wasn't considered a terribly auspicious beginning. But he eventually

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Speaker 1: did launch a working version of bit torrent for the

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Speaker 1: general public in October two thousand two. Now two years

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Speaker 1: later in two thousand four, he had a five person

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Speaker 1: company working on a search engine that would work alongside

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Speaker 1: his protocol. So he designed the protocol, but one of

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Speaker 1: the issues people were running into was how do you

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Speaker 1: find the torrent files which are pointer files. I'll talk

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Speaker 1: about them a little bit more in a second. How

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Speaker 1: do you find these files that then facilitate the downloading

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Speaker 1: process when you're you're actually using the bit torrent software

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Speaker 1: and this is by a tracker server. Right, So he

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Speaker 1: created he worked with this five person company. Actually, this

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Speaker 1: five person company worked for him to create the search

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Speaker 1: engine that would look for these torrents to help make

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Speaker 1: this process work more smoothly. Uh. He was also then

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Speaker 1: looked at by a little company called Valve. Yeah, so Valive.

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Speaker 1: Valve is thinking, you know, we want to do a

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Speaker 1: downloadable distributed network approach for our games. We want to

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Speaker 1: have this ability to deliver games to our users that

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Speaker 1: is fast and reliable and doesn't put a lot of

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Speaker 1: pressure on our own servers. Right, we don't that way,

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Speaker 1: we don't have to build out a whole data center

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Speaker 1: just to support this. This model, this distribution model, so

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Speaker 1: they contacted Cohen and they hired him to work on

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Speaker 1: a platform that we now call Steam. Cohen was one

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Speaker 1: of the people who helped build that program out, and

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Speaker 1: it was all because they saw what he was doing

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Speaker 1: with bit torrent, and they said, that's the approach we

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Speaker 1: want to take. And in fact, Valve and Blizzard are

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Speaker 1: two companies that use bit torrent for a perfectly legitimate

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Speaker 1: means of distributing their files. It's a good time to

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Speaker 1: just mention there's nothing illegal about torrent files. No, no,

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Speaker 1: it's it's just a matter of distribution. It's kind of

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Speaker 1: like if you were to say, yeah, but you can

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Speaker 1: get illegal material that way. You can get illegal material

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Speaker 1: through the mail, But you wouldn't say that means we

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Speaker 1: should shut down the postal service. You might say we

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Speaker 1: should shut down the postal service for other reasons, but

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Speaker 1: not for that one. And same sort of argument you

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Speaker 1: could use for bit torrent, like to say, let's get

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Speaker 1: rid of bit torrent because some people are sharing illegal files,

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Speaker 1: even lots of people sharing illegal files, doesn't mean that

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Speaker 1: the tool itself is wrong, right. The technology itself can

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Speaker 1: be used for lots of really cool things like yeah,

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Speaker 1: like like letting people like Valve put games up online

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Speaker 1: without having to buy giant servers, or independent artists put

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Speaker 1: their music online, right right, Yeah, And there there are

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Speaker 1: a lot of reasons there their entire you know, whether

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Speaker 1: it's software or video files, music files. You know, there

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Speaker 1: are a lot of reasons why you would want to

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Speaker 1: take this approach. And uh, one of the big ones

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Speaker 1: is that it, like you said, it takes the strain

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Speaker 1: off the provider. Right. So, if I'm a small business

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Speaker 1: or an artist, an independent artist, I might not have

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Speaker 1: the resources available to me to create a dedicated server

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Speaker 1: where people can come and download stuff, especially if I'm

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Speaker 1: having to pay lots of fees to maintain that. And

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Speaker 1: you know, I mean, you know, for example, if you

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Speaker 1: post some music to your personal website and uh, Neil

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Speaker 1: Gaiman or Will Wheaton link it on Twitter, and all

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Speaker 1: of a sudden, you're completely overwhelmed. This, by the way,

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Speaker 1: is a complete invitation for both Will Wheaton and Neil

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Speaker 1: Gaiman to tweet about our podcast. We would love that.

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Speaker 1: That would be gorgeous. Um. But yeah, so I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: even know what to do with myself. I would probably

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Speaker 1: totally flip out. No, I would totally flip out. I

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Speaker 1: wouldn't probably there. There's no probably there. But yeah, in

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Speaker 1: two thousand five, already by this time, okay, the bit

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Speaker 1: torns only three years old from when it officially launched.

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Speaker 1: Even by then, Hollywood had taken notice and was not

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Speaker 1: terribly happy. Yeah, the Motion Picture Association of America and

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Speaker 1: also the Recording Industry Association of America. That's um, the

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Speaker 1: m P A A and the R double A R

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Speaker 1: I double A is is like that's music. Essentially an

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Speaker 1: m P A is film. Uh So m P A A.

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Speaker 1: UH in particular was concerned because the bit torrent protocol

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Speaker 1: did make moving large files much easier, which meant that

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Speaker 1: suddenly people were able to upload and download large files

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Speaker 1: like rips of films. They take a DVD and ripped

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Speaker 1: the film from the DVD and then share it and

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Speaker 1: you would get illegal copies. Or if you were working

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Speaker 1: on a digital film and you were part of a

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Speaker 1: digital film production and you had access to the file,

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Speaker 1: there were movies that leaked out. Um some famous instances

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Speaker 1: of movies that leaked out before they had even hit

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Speaker 1: the theaters where people were getting hold of pirated copies,

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Speaker 1: and Hollywood was really taking him a bit torrent, even

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Speaker 1: though again, as we said, but torrents a tool, it's

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Speaker 1: not like it was specifically facilitating the illegal activity. However,

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Speaker 1: on November twenty two, two thousand five, Brand Cohen had

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Speaker 1: a joint news conference with the chairman of the m

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Speaker 1: p A A. Dan Glickman, and announced that he had

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Speaker 1: agreed to prevent his own bit torrent website from linking

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Speaker 1: to torrents pointing to illegally available movies. Now, before that point,

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Speaker 1: their policy was that if they were alerted to a

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Speaker 1: torrent that linked to those pointing to they would take

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Speaker 1: it down. So that was there, that was their policy

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Speaker 1: all all along. But they said, well now we're just

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Speaker 1: going to make sure that that's much more streamlined. Which

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Speaker 1: if you've followed these kind of these kind of cases

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Speaker 1: not just with bit torrent, but with other providers, other

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Speaker 1: platforms like YouTube for example, there are examples of takedown

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Speaker 1: notices that were improperly um yeah, in probably dealt with

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Speaker 1: or improperly submitted people who didn't actually have the rights

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Speaker 1: to something demanding they get taken down and then it

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Speaker 1: gets taken down, um. And then there then there's some

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Speaker 1: embarrassing ones I think Microsoft just recently issued a takedown

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Speaker 1: request to itself. Yeah, so sometimes these sort of things

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Speaker 1: can end up being kind of embarrassing, but he was

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Speaker 1: saying that we want to, you know, we don't want to.

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Speaker 1: So um, today you can find bit torrent on lots

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Speaker 1: of different platforms. In fact, bit torrent today allows you

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Speaker 1: to do things like produce content and then distribute it.

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Speaker 1: So it's designed more now to help, like I said,

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Speaker 1: the small businesses, the independent artists to create content, and

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Speaker 1: then even to to enable it so it'll perform properly

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Speaker 1: on things like smartphones, tablets, consoles, creating a huge distribution

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Speaker 1: network that people wouldn't have had access to, you know,

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Speaker 1: ten years ago. So there are many reasons why it's

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Speaker 1: a very useful tool. So let's talk a little bit

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Speaker 1: about how it actually does what it does now. First

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Speaker 1: of all, it's open source, which kind of tells you

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Speaker 1: that Cohen wasn't necessarily looking to create like a a

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Speaker 1: uh multibillion dollars a commercial venture. No, he wanted he

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Speaker 1: really believed in this. An open source means you can

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Speaker 1: see the source code. You can go and get the

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Speaker 1: source code for the bit torrent, play around with it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you can change it, you can make your own product

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Speaker 1: based upon it. It's open source UM. And then there

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Speaker 1: are sites that house torrent files. Torrent files are not

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Speaker 1: they don't have any material in them other than pointer

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Speaker 1: information that will point a your software to the right

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Speaker 1: destinations that will have the actual file you're looking for.

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Speaker 1: It's it's a little bit like that that like a

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Speaker 1: protocol that we were talking about, but just in a

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Speaker 1: in a file format. It's and it's kind of like metadata.

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Speaker 1: It's it'share information about the file you want, the information

409
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Speaker 1: mainly being where you can get it. Like it's it's

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Speaker 1: allowing the software that you have on your computer and

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Speaker 1: when when you when you run a program to uh

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Speaker 1: to to go go out and find the little pieces

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Speaker 1: of this file across the internet, across the swarm of

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Speaker 1: computers that contain it. That's good. Yeah, it's so. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Your basic computer that has you know, the file, the

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Speaker 1: full file on it, you would call it a seed.

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Speaker 1: It's a seed computer. UM. And then the swarm is

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Speaker 1: all the different computers that are connect to the network

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Speaker 1: that have some portion of that file and are actively

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Speaker 1: downloading and or uploading that file right that are also

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Speaker 1: running this This torrent sway, right, everything has to be

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Speaker 1: working running the software at the same time. If you

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Speaker 1: stop running the software on your computer, you disconnect from

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Speaker 1: this network. You're probably you're still on the internet, but

425
00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:54,760
Speaker 1: you're not part of the bit torrent network anymore. So, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the torrent file just kind of points the software in

427
00:22:57,720 --> 00:22:59,560
Speaker 1: the right direction so you can get these pieces. It

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Speaker 1: gives them the software the information it needs to identify

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Speaker 1: and pull those those pieces of file into your computer. Classically,

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Speaker 1: this is all organized by a central server called a

431
00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:15,919
Speaker 1: tracker like I mentioned earlier. Um, these these days, that's

432
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,000
Speaker 1: it's it's a little bit um a little more complicated

433
00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:21,239
Speaker 1: than that. But yeah, your classic bit torrent has a

434
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:25,320
Speaker 1: tracker server that kind of acts like a traffic driver,

435
00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:27,800
Speaker 1: like it's it's the one that's making sure everyone is

436
00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 1: going to the right place. Um, and you're so, you've

437
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:35,280
Speaker 1: got your seed, you've got your swarm. You are constantly

438
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:38,960
Speaker 1: downloading as long as you're connected to this or downloading

439
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:40,800
Speaker 1: end upling as long as you're connected to this, uh,

440
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:43,880
Speaker 1: this network. The cool thing is with bit torrent that

441
00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:48,600
Speaker 1: your download speeds depend upon your participation within the network. Right,

442
00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:52,720
Speaker 1: you get a rank based on how many files you

443
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 1: are allowing the system to upload from you, and and

444
00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:58,440
Speaker 1: your and your actual upload speed as well, So those

445
00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:02,359
Speaker 1: two things factor in. So if you are being you know,

446
00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 1: if you are altruistic and you are sharing a lot,

447
00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 1: then you can also download faster, right because your rank

448
00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:09,359
Speaker 1: goes up and that means that your download speed's improve

449
00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:11,359
Speaker 1: and so you don't have to wait eight hours to

450
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:13,680
Speaker 1: get you know, that music file you wanted to get.

451
00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:16,160
Speaker 1: It will download in a matter of minutes maybe or

452
00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:19,399
Speaker 1: or faster, depend upon your broadband speed and the speed

453
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:22,600
Speaker 1: of course of the various computers that are hosting pieces

454
00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:25,719
Speaker 1: of that file. But it does mean that you go

455
00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:28,560
Speaker 1: much faster than you would with your traditional peer to

456
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:32,720
Speaker 1: peer or client server relationship kind of a protocol. You

457
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:35,520
Speaker 1: end up getting the pieces of the file you need,

458
00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:38,160
Speaker 1: and then once you've got all the pieces you you're

459
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:40,200
Speaker 1: good to go. So you don't have to depend upon

460
00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:43,080
Speaker 1: one computer and its connection to the network. You're depending

461
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:47,840
Speaker 1: upon the entire network and anyone who has pieces of

462
00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 1: that particular file. Now, like we said, there's nothing illegal

463
00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 1: about this. This is just a distribution network. So if

464
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:58,240
Speaker 1: your file that you're distributing doesn't have any sort of

465
00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:02,199
Speaker 1: copyright to it, or if it's licensed under something like

466
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:05,280
Speaker 1: creative comments that gives the person who has the file

467
00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:09,200
Speaker 1: the the ability to distribute it however they like. Then

468
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 1: there's no issue there. That's completely legal, and in fact,

469
00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:16,520
Speaker 1: that might even be the intent of that content, you know,

470
00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:18,800
Speaker 1: the person who made it. Maybe I want this to

471
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:21,240
Speaker 1: be shared with as many people as possible. That's why

472
00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:26,119
Speaker 1: I uploaded it to the bit torrent network. Uh. However,

473
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:29,840
Speaker 1: it does also mean that it can create an environment

474
00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:33,680
Speaker 1: that allows for illegal sharing in a way that is

475
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:36,680
Speaker 1: a lot more difficult to fight than the clients server

476
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:40,320
Speaker 1: approach right, Right, Because it's not located in a single place.

477
00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:43,120
Speaker 1: You can't go knock on one particular person's door and

478
00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:46,280
Speaker 1: say you're holding this file. Because it's spread out over

479
00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:48,760
Speaker 1: so many people that exactly I can't it's a lot

480
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:51,240
Speaker 1: harder to trace back. I can't go into lawrence coffee

481
00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:53,639
Speaker 1: shop and tell her that she has to stop serving

482
00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:56,440
Speaker 1: this one type of coffee. If everyone around her is

483
00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:59,160
Speaker 1: serving that same type of coffee, it doesn't do any good, right,

484
00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:02,560
Speaker 1: same sort of thing. Yeah, So this is although I mean,

485
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 1: I don't know you could. You can make some arguments

486
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:09,679
Speaker 1: that even even the illegal portions of torrenting are beneficial

487
00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:12,200
Speaker 1: in a way because you know, first of all, it's

488
00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:17,119
Speaker 1: it's made the industry um create its own legal ways

489
00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 1: of distributing files the faster, you know. I I think

490
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:24,080
Speaker 1: that the direct streaming on like Netflix and Amazon Instant

491
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:26,560
Speaker 1: all that kind of stuff is of direct response. I

492
00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:29,000
Speaker 1: agree to torrenting. I agree. And it also means that,

493
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:33,000
Speaker 1: you know, encouraging the studios to find new ways to

494
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:36,600
Speaker 1: get content to people who who want want to buy it,

495
00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:39,840
Speaker 1: let me give you my money. They're eager to participate

496
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:42,200
Speaker 1: in this. If you make it easy enough and you

497
00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 1: don't price gouge, then you're not really inspiring piracy. There's

498
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:52,080
Speaker 1: also been several surveys of varying reliability that have suggested

499
00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:55,119
Speaker 1: that people who pirate stuff also tend to be some

500
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:59,639
Speaker 1: of the it's right right, which you know, people who

501
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:03,120
Speaker 1: are torrenting are probably more likely to buy things online

502
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:06,359
Speaker 1: than your average consumer anyway, because they're more computer and

503
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 1: internet savvy to begin with. But but you know, but

504
00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 1: the number that gets tossed around a lot is from

505
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:12,920
Speaker 1: a study by the American Assembly, which is connected to

506
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:15,119
Speaker 1: Columbia University. So it's more or less on the up

507
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:16,879
Speaker 1: and up. Yeah, this is that that's a that's a

508
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:22,600
Speaker 1: fairly reputable institution. They at least call themselves nonpartisan. They do,

509
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:24,600
Speaker 1: they do have a little bit of a liberal slant,

510
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:28,000
Speaker 1: I would say, but um, but they found that UM

511
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:33,000
Speaker 1: peer to peer file share users purchase more music online

512
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 1: than non peer press. And then of course there's also

513
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:40,080
Speaker 1: the argument that a lot of these organizations make the

514
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:42,000
Speaker 1: m p A and r I double A is that

515
00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:48,120
Speaker 1: UH stolen property UH directly translates to lost revenue. And

516
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:53,600
Speaker 1: we've seen multiple studies, including studies that were specifically UH

517
00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:56,600
Speaker 1: funded by the government. You know, there were government agencies

518
00:27:56,640 --> 00:28:00,159
Speaker 1: that looked into this to see how much, how how

519
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:03,560
Speaker 1: much in damage is really is caused by piracy, and

520
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,040
Speaker 1: the conclusion is that you cannot come up with a

521
00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:09,280
Speaker 1: number because you cannot say for certain that someone who

522
00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:13,199
Speaker 1: pirates something would have purchased that something had they not

523
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:16,240
Speaker 1: had access to the piracy software, and furthermore, that they're

524
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:18,280
Speaker 1: not going to go out and purchase it afterwards, that

525
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:21,040
Speaker 1: they weren't trying before they bought it. Right, So in

526
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 1: both cases, you don't know if they went out and

527
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:24,920
Speaker 1: bought it anyway, and you don't know if they would

528
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:28,480
Speaker 1: have bought it. So without knowing those two factors, you

529
00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 1: can't say that this actually cost anybody anything. And and

530
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,399
Speaker 1: you know, it's not like a physical copy of something,

531
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:38,240
Speaker 1: where if I walk into a store and I shoplift,

532
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,600
Speaker 1: that store is out a physical piece of inventory. When

533
00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 1: you download a digital file, you're making a copy of something.

534
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:47,720
Speaker 1: The original version of that file is still on a

535
00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:50,560
Speaker 1: person's computer somewhere else, so it's not like they have

536
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:53,560
Speaker 1: lost that. So with all of these factors, it really

537
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 1: means it's so complicated that we cannot put an actual

538
00:28:56,840 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 1: dollar amount. Not that that has stopped anyone from doing

539
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:04,960
Speaker 1: so when creating massive lawsuits against either a company that

540
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:09,320
Speaker 1: creates the software or the users of that software. Absolutely,

541
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:11,640
Speaker 1: And we we will talk a little bit about that

542
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:14,760
Speaker 1: in a future episode that you'll hear probably in just

543
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:16,719
Speaker 1: a couple of days, because I think we're recording get

544
00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:19,720
Speaker 1: immediately after we finished this one. Yes, we're talking about

545
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:24,920
Speaker 1: specific right. Um. My favorite unofficial study, by the way,

546
00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 1: is an anecdote on the effects of purchasing and and

547
00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:34,000
Speaker 1: free downloads was when uh Neil Gaiman in his publisher,

548
00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 1: which I believe in this case is HarperCollins, um put

549
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:42,160
Speaker 1: up a copy of American Gods for free and just

550
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:45,160
Speaker 1: just free ebook download. Go do it, people, And I

551
00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:47,000
Speaker 1: don't think it's up anymore. I might you might not

552
00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:48,680
Speaker 1: be able to find it. I could have just lied

553
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 1: to you tremendously. But they had. They had a free

554
00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:54,719
Speaker 1: copy up for a certain period of time, and sales increased,

555
00:29:55,320 --> 00:30:00,400
Speaker 1: definitely increased, like appreciably increased in the immediate future after

556
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:03,320
Speaker 1: it was that. I will say that, um there, you know,

557
00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:05,280
Speaker 1: And I've told this story several times in the past,

558
00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 1: so you know I'm comfortable telling it again. Uh. The

559
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 1: you know, I I definitely was one of the people

560
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:16,880
Speaker 1: who downloaded something outside the realm of the law. Because

561
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,640
Speaker 1: I downloaded a television show that was made in England

562
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 1: that was not available in the United States. There was

563
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:25,320
Speaker 1: no way for me to purchase it legally. Not that

564
00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 1: that justifies illegal behavior. It doesn't. So I'm still in

565
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 1: the wrong, you know, I'm still in the wrong for

566
00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:35,000
Speaker 1: doing it. But I downloaded Space, the show that Edgar

567
00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:37,480
Speaker 1: Wright and Simon peg And and several other people did,

568
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 1: and uh, and I loved it, but you know, there

569
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:41,200
Speaker 1: was no way for me to legally get it in

570
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:44,040
Speaker 1: the United States at that time. As soon as it

571
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:46,680
Speaker 1: became available, as the day that it came out on DVD,

572
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:50,040
Speaker 1: I went on purchase it because I loved it, I

573
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 1: wanted to support it, and I wanted to have a

574
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: really good copy of it. UM. That's another reason that

575
00:30:55,360 --> 00:30:59,120
Speaker 1: things that like the studio backed stuff is getting more popular,

576
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 1: because the quality tends to be better and you don't

577
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:07,520
Speaker 1: have to worry about like about malware packages usually unless

578
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:11,120
Speaker 1: the DRM is also malware. Sony, I'm looking at you,

579
00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:14,880
Speaker 1: UM much better recently, by the way, but you know

580
00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 1: that that CD thing still sticks in my craws. I

581
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:21,239
Speaker 1: think even classically though that I mean, you know, this

582
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:24,760
Speaker 1: conversation is reminding me of you know how you used

583
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 1: to go to NERD conventions and they would have all

584
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:31,800
Speaker 1: of these illegal Hong Kong VHS tapes of various UM

585
00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 1: did Battle Royal that way. But I thought that as

586
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:38,400
Speaker 1: soon as it came available to and and I think

587
00:31:38,400 --> 00:31:42,120
Speaker 1: that similarly that really that kind of underground black market

588
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:45,600
Speaker 1: VHS sort of thing, aside from inciting nostalgian people of

589
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 1: a certain age, really pushed movie companies to say, oh, hey,

590
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:51,959
Speaker 1: there's there's a reason like there's a reason for us

591
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:55,920
Speaker 1: to publish this in America, people in other countries outside

592
00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 1: of their original origin. People love this. There is a

593
00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:00,840
Speaker 1: market for it. We can you know, if we provide

594
00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:03,600
Speaker 1: it and we price it properly, we will make money.

595
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 1: Like That's that's the lesson that a lot of these

596
00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:09,000
Speaker 1: companies have learned. Uh. And people can argue that, you know,

597
00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 1: these are things that various industries have had to learn,

598
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 1: uh in a staggered amount. So like the music industry

599
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:19,080
Speaker 1: learned it first, and now the book industry also because

600
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:22,440
Speaker 1: with the books that definitely raised it. But as broadband

601
00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:27,239
Speaker 1: speeds have improved for the common users. Yeah, so so

602
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:30,320
Speaker 1: it's interesting. I mean, and again, you know, BitTorrent is

603
00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:33,080
Speaker 1: just a means of distribution. You don't necessarily have to

604
00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:35,600
Speaker 1: have it be something where you're pirating movies and tv

605
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:38,280
Speaker 1: um um there there is a little bit of a

606
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:43,240
Speaker 1: fight back. As of April, mccaffee had patented a system

607
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:47,440
Speaker 1: that identifies pirated content and can prevent users from downloading

608
00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:50,640
Speaker 1: it by um either blocking it entirely depending on how

609
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:53,240
Speaker 1: you set up the software. UM it's it's through side advisors,

610
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:55,200
Speaker 1: So depending on how you set up side advisor. It

611
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:58,720
Speaker 1: would either block the software entirely, um or block the

612
00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:01,680
Speaker 1: download entirely I'm sorry, or just give you a little

613
00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 1: pop up window that says, hey, it looks like you're

614
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:07,920
Speaker 1: trying to use a torrent file that is torrenting illegally

615
00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:11,240
Speaker 1: copied material. Do you really want to do that? Maybe

616
00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:14,560
Speaker 1: here's some legal alternatives that you could use to download

617
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,800
Speaker 1: that that on the up and up for money you

618
00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 1: give to the creator. I kind of wonder how John

619
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 1: McAfee would feel about that. He's, of course the guy

620
00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:25,320
Speaker 1: who who founded that company, and then we did a

621
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:29,160
Speaker 1: whole podcast about him. He crazy, he's uh, he is

622
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:31,800
Speaker 1: a character. Yeah, he's to have more character than a

623
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:36,479
Speaker 1: Tolstoy novel. Alright. So yeah, guys, I hope you enjoyed

624
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 1: this discussion about bit torrent and torrent technology in general.

625
00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: It's really an interesting innovative way of getting around that

626
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,920
Speaker 1: speed problem. And uh, and it leads us into a

627
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,520
Speaker 1: discussion about a particular website that we will talk about

628
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:53,400
Speaker 1: in our next podcast, which I don't want to give

629
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:58,520
Speaker 1: it away here, I'll just say y anyway, Uh, if

630
00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:00,720
Speaker 1: you have any suggestions for if you your topics that

631
00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:02,840
Speaker 1: we should cover here on tech Stuff, Send this an

632
00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:05,920
Speaker 1: email let's know our addresses tex stuff at Discovery dot com,

633
00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:08,400
Speaker 1: or find us on Facebook or Twitter. You can do

634
00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:10,880
Speaker 1: that by looking for the handle tech stuff hs W

635
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 1: because that's us and we'll talk to you again really soon.

636
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:21,399
Speaker 1: For more on this and thousands of other topics, does

637
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:34,239
Speaker 1: it How staff works dot com