WEBVTT - Questlove Supreme: Ed Eckstine 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:09.719 Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeart Radio. All right, 0:00:09.800 --> 0:00:13.119 let me know when you guys are done, write your verses. 0:00:15.520 --> 0:00:21.279 Writing just off the top. 0:00:22.120 --> 0:00:23.640 For me, the best part of the show is the 0:00:23.960 --> 0:00:25.480 pre rold panic of the theme. 0:00:25.720 --> 0:00:27.880 It's a little I'll point to you when it's your turn. 0:00:28.200 --> 0:00:30.200 See, I know everything you say about to say. 0:00:30.360 --> 0:00:34.520 No, it's just that's that frequency is a little daring, right, Yeah, 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:35.519 I do it as pressure. 0:00:35.560 --> 0:00:41.520 Let's go mm hm. When three people are done, is had. 0:00:44.720 --> 0:00:45.400 Three four? 0:00:45.440 --> 0:00:49.920 Here time, let's go kids, Let's go Dad. 0:00:51.520 --> 0:01:06.199 Suprema so Supremo role called Supremo Supremo roll. 0:01:06.720 --> 0:01:09.920 As I sit here, yeah, singing in this gym. 0:01:10.200 --> 0:01:18.120 Yeah, I remember a time the roots were almost on PolyGram. 0:01:16.720 --> 0:01:22.119 So Supreva roll called Supremo so so Supremo role. 0:01:22.640 --> 0:01:23.680 My name is Fante. 0:01:24.040 --> 0:01:27.880 Yeah, and I'm not alone because I'm with my peoples 0:01:28.600 --> 0:01:32.240 in the comfort zone. 0:01:33.120 --> 0:01:38.080 Supremo roll call Suprema Supremo role. 0:01:38.560 --> 0:01:39.640 My name is Sugar. 0:01:40.000 --> 0:01:41.640 Yeah. I like this setting. 0:01:42.120 --> 0:01:48.960 Yeah, but it's not as nice yeah as Klie's wedding. 0:01:51.000 --> 0:01:54.440 Supremo So Supremo roll. 0:01:54.480 --> 0:01:58.960 I'm unpaid bill, Yeah, I can't complain. Yeah, it's time 0:01:59.000 --> 0:02:01.640 for stories about purple ring. 0:02:01.760 --> 0:02:02.600 Whoa call. 0:02:04.520 --> 0:02:11.000 Supremo roll call Supremo Supremo roll. 0:02:10.919 --> 0:02:16.280 Like year, Yeah, exes here so much to say. Yeah, 0:02:16.600 --> 0:02:17.440 won't get in the rear. 0:02:17.480 --> 0:02:27.200 I didn't sup. 0:02:27.440 --> 0:02:31.520 Last name, first name is Yeah. How'd y'all get me? 0:02:31.800 --> 0:02:34.519 Yeah to come out of bed? 0:02:36.919 --> 0:02:45.440 Supremo roll call Suprema So Supremo roll call Supremo Supremo, 0:02:45.680 --> 0:02:50.280 roll call Supremo Supremo roll call. 0:02:52.440 --> 0:02:57.519 Wow, that was an interesting choice of versus you guys. 0:02:57.800 --> 0:02:59.600 We did good did Yeah? 0:02:59.639 --> 0:03:01.120 It was that was rather amazing. 0:03:02.320 --> 0:03:05.280 Yeah, man, shout out DJ Khalil for making this happen, man, 0:03:05.400 --> 0:03:05.959 big shots. 0:03:06.240 --> 0:03:07.840 Dj J made this happen. 0:03:08.400 --> 0:03:10.200 Okay, shots, that's FM. 0:03:10.360 --> 0:03:14.280 Oh yeah, man, Okay, we are still live in Los Angeles. 0:03:14.480 --> 0:03:16.200 How is it going kids? 0:03:17.720 --> 0:03:18.600 Great is always dead? 0:03:21.080 --> 0:03:23.560 Okay? What was the highlight of your night? 0:03:23.639 --> 0:03:27.600 So nope, you can only tell a great story one 0:03:27.639 --> 0:03:31.440 time from watching you. Yeah. 0:03:31.480 --> 0:03:33.200 Wait a minute. That was a national commercial. 0:03:33.560 --> 0:03:34.920 Yeah oh yeah. 0:03:35.600 --> 0:03:37.600 They kind of presented in a local ways. I thought 0:03:37.600 --> 0:03:38.920 it was just a Tri state area. 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:42.680 It's like, don't be a dragon lady. Wait, what's that 0:03:43.160 --> 0:03:45.080 non smoking? Don't be a dragon lady? 0:03:45.560 --> 0:03:48.400 Come on, that's a local Joe. We didn't have that. 0:03:48.360 --> 0:03:53.680 One smoking okay, okay, see I thought I thought that 0:03:53.760 --> 0:03:55.960 was just a Philly New York that was everywhere. 0:03:56.120 --> 0:04:00.160 That one in the in the Friday Eggs, that one, 0:04:00.320 --> 0:04:03.200 all right. So of course if you're not familiar, this 0:04:03.280 --> 0:04:06.120 is Quest Love Supreme, the award winning Quest Love Supreme. 0:04:06.360 --> 0:04:09.120 We won so many awards before. I don't know the 0:04:09.200 --> 0:04:11.960 other words that we just all love. 0:04:12.280 --> 0:04:14.120 We swept at the Schmuckies this year. 0:04:15.520 --> 0:04:18.960 I see, how's it going on? Tigelow Ah going good man, 0:04:19.000 --> 0:04:21.000 I'm making it. I guess by the time this comes 0:04:21.000 --> 0:04:22.720 on the festival. 0:04:23.400 --> 0:04:26.440 And Darren, I think hopefully to be over it by 0:04:26.480 --> 0:04:27.480 the time this ship come out. 0:04:27.480 --> 0:04:31.839 But nahunked over seventh. We did it and it was great. 0:04:32.440 --> 0:04:43.160 Nice Steve Jazz World, how's. 0:04:42.920 --> 0:04:43.400 He treating you? 0:04:43.839 --> 0:04:46.080 Everything's good. We got the album you did with David 0:04:46.120 --> 0:04:49.160 Murray that's available now. It's streaming and you know people 0:04:49.200 --> 0:04:51.880 are gonna vote for it for the Grammys and everything. 0:04:52.040 --> 0:04:52.200 You know. 0:04:52.240 --> 0:04:54.240 I was just I was just having a conversation with 0:04:54.400 --> 0:04:58.960 a recent Quest Love Supreme guest on the show, and 0:04:59.000 --> 0:05:02.560 he suggested, hey, well we do a project together so 0:05:03.040 --> 0:05:08.240 that in Haith Newman, yes, her like not too long, 0:05:08.240 --> 0:05:12.080 Faith Newman, Yes, at the nos birthday party yet down? 0:05:12.160 --> 0:05:12.680 Yeah yeah. 0:05:12.839 --> 0:05:16.320 Pano wants to make something happen Cappin Yeah, oh yeah, 0:05:16.440 --> 0:05:17.560 speed of making it happen, Cavin. 0:05:17.560 --> 0:05:20.039 When were we supposed to make something happen with Bob James? 0:05:20.200 --> 0:05:23.440 Yeah yeah, that got pushed puns. Sorry, okay, but I love. 0:05:23.360 --> 0:05:25.840 A quest Love Supreme collaboration a lot throughout the years. 0:05:25.839 --> 0:05:26.600 What's making happen? 0:05:26.960 --> 0:05:27.359 Yeah? 0:05:27.400 --> 0:05:28.920 All right, doctor Sesame Street. 0:05:29.160 --> 0:05:31.159 I listened to the David Murray Quest Love record and 0:05:31.200 --> 0:05:31.920 it is awesome. 0:05:31.920 --> 0:05:34.120 It's crazy, it's really good. I'm still discovering stuff. 0:05:34.120 --> 0:05:36.880 There's a lot of samples on its really you just isolate, 0:05:36.960 --> 0:05:37.520 very angry. 0:05:37.600 --> 0:05:39.919 That could be like the next twelve roots albums right there. 0:05:40.120 --> 0:05:41.280 Yeah it's incorrect. 0:05:41.320 --> 0:05:47.000 Four platters, Yes, it's called plumb. What was your logic? 0:05:47.040 --> 0:05:50.000 I wanted to call it Three Pleadians walk into a Bar, 0:05:50.160 --> 0:05:50.920 but of course you did. 0:05:52.240 --> 0:05:54.360 We did include that, right. 0:05:54.440 --> 0:05:56.320 One was called I got the name one song, but 0:05:56.480 --> 0:06:00.599 you know it's Steve. So what's our next project called peach? 0:06:00.960 --> 0:06:02.080 Okay? And what would that be? 0:06:02.560 --> 0:06:08.000 Hopefully Belile you Ray and Doyle Bramhall. 0:06:08.600 --> 0:06:12.320 I like that. I like that, Okay, I'm with that. 0:06:12.520 --> 0:06:16.239 Oh and Elaina Pinder hughes on flute, okay, like a quintet. 0:06:16.560 --> 0:06:20.520 That's what's up? Okay, Peach, I got it. How's how's life? 0:06:20.920 --> 0:06:21.560 Man? Listen? 0:06:21.600 --> 0:06:25.640 It's good also for really like putting in the hard 0:06:25.640 --> 0:06:28.839 work and organizing these Uh. She's sort of our person 0:06:28.880 --> 0:06:30.840 that targets the guests that come on the show. 0:06:31.240 --> 0:06:32.120 Booker. 0:06:34.640 --> 0:06:35.000 Out of the. 0:06:37.400 --> 0:06:40.760 Booker that level. I just feel like, I feel like 0:06:40.800 --> 0:06:41.440 you run this ship. 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:50.120 That's nice me yes me, okay you flowers, yeahs, you 0:06:50.160 --> 0:06:53.040 know we love you. 0:06:53.200 --> 0:06:56.680 Take this love. Thank you anyway, ladies and gentlemen. 0:06:56.920 --> 0:07:02.240 I will say that after are awesome Lisa Cortez episode 0:07:02.360 --> 0:07:04.760 of Quest Love Supreme in which we kind of went 0:07:04.800 --> 0:07:09.040 through the story of the close Butano Cigar outcome of 0:07:09.080 --> 0:07:11.000 where the roots were going to land as far as 0:07:11.000 --> 0:07:14.280 their major label was concerned. If you don't remember, we 0:07:14.680 --> 0:07:16.800 have been, you know, spending all of nineteen ninety three, 0:07:16.880 --> 0:07:20.480 thirty years ago, having showcases and whatnot. The very first 0:07:20.520 --> 0:07:25.960 label that we wanted to sign to, of course, Mercury PolyGram, 0:07:26.080 --> 0:07:28.480 and we were really excited. They took us out to dinner. 0:07:28.640 --> 0:07:32.400 We went to like a Black Sheep Legion video set. 0:07:32.960 --> 0:07:36.360 It was all exciting, and then because of a technicality, 0:07:36.560 --> 0:07:39.600 we wound up on another label. So I kinda see 0:07:39.600 --> 0:07:43.440 this as like an alternative universe. 0:07:44.280 --> 0:07:47.280 Yeah, yeah, like that movie Other Earth. 0:07:47.360 --> 0:07:50.960 This is an alternative universe in which I am talking 0:07:51.000 --> 0:07:54.920 to the former president of the label that I never 0:07:54.960 --> 0:07:58.560 got to sign to. But not that I mean as 0:07:58.640 --> 0:08:01.920 former president of Mercury, Hollo Graham. But he's also been 0:08:02.120 --> 0:08:06.520 a senior executive and also a producer, executive producer and 0:08:06.520 --> 0:08:09.560 a music producer for a lot of the music that 0:08:09.600 --> 0:08:13.160 we have grown up listening to still currently listen to. 0:08:13.400 --> 0:08:13.680 Name it. 0:08:13.760 --> 0:08:15.080 Michael Jackson, Quincy. 0:08:14.840 --> 0:08:20.000 Jones, bon Jovi, Kiss, Whitney Houston, Quinny g Brian McKnight, 0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:23.080 Tony Tony Tony very happy about that reunion. 0:08:23.120 --> 0:08:26.160 By the way, did you see the North Carolina show? No? 0:08:26.200 --> 0:08:26.800 I didn't see that. 0:08:30.240 --> 0:08:32.640 Oh wait, I thought their first they did a test 0:08:32.640 --> 0:08:33.720 show in North Carolina. 0:08:33.800 --> 0:08:36.720 I know there was in October first, which today is 0:08:36.920 --> 0:08:38.840 not Oh I get it. 0:08:39.760 --> 0:08:42.080 But you don't know that in September they did a 0:08:42.120 --> 0:08:46.520 secret show in North Carolina, Right, yeah they did. But 0:08:47.480 --> 0:08:50.559 the only thing about like towards when they start, if 0:08:50.559 --> 0:08:52.079 you don't see the first three shows is all but 0:08:52.200 --> 0:08:55.520 guarantee that they're going to shop the songs in half once. 0:08:55.400 --> 0:08:56.160 They find a rhythm. 0:08:56.240 --> 0:08:59.160 Yeah yeah, So I saw the set list of what 0:08:59.200 --> 0:09:01.240 their show was and it's way past the roots in 0:09:01.520 --> 0:09:03.840 ll It's like it's damn near three hours. 0:09:03.840 --> 0:09:04.280 Like it's a. 0:09:06.480 --> 0:09:09.160 Well, they start with all the classic filler. Then they 0:09:09.200 --> 0:09:11.480 go into Raphael's songs that he wrote for other people. 0:09:11.640 --> 0:09:16.240 Oh ship, because so he's doing cozy, He's doing. 0:09:15.920 --> 0:09:21.920 What covied that's Covin and cozy. 0:09:22.160 --> 0:09:25.240 I'm sorry as a as a word player, getting my 0:09:25.240 --> 0:09:31.040 sea words mixed these things. Beyonce thing, well, she's she's 0:09:31.080 --> 0:09:33.959 too omni president Like Beyonce is like. 0:09:33.920 --> 0:09:37.079 A air and water. It's like hard to resist. 0:09:37.640 --> 0:09:40.080 And then they go into the solo stuff and then 0:09:40.120 --> 0:09:43.920 they end with the hits. So but of course, you know, 0:09:44.160 --> 0:09:47.000 management stuff's like, uh, can y'all just turn this into 0:09:47.000 --> 0:09:48.960 a two hour sho because your audience is like whatever? 0:09:49.040 --> 0:09:50.440 But anyway, so much. 0:09:50.320 --> 0:09:53.840 With the Tony's Yes, our guest today, I pray has 0:09:54.640 --> 0:09:57.880 a lot of stories about his journey in this music 0:09:57.920 --> 0:10:01.040 business that we love. Please welcome to usself Supreme, the 0:10:01.120 --> 0:10:05.040 one and Only Ed Eckstein, Thank you, thank you. 0:10:06.280 --> 0:10:07.080 Pleasure to be here. 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:09.560 Thank you for being here. Man, it's a long clap. 0:10:09.600 --> 0:10:13.120 We got away for forty seconds clapping. How much for that? 0:10:16.200 --> 0:10:17.800 I guess that. Listen to the show too? 0:10:17.840 --> 0:10:19.680 How are you to day? You listen to the show? 0:10:19.960 --> 0:10:23.600 Yeah? I do. I listened when I walk in the morning. Wow, 0:10:24.440 --> 0:10:25.400 that roll call then. 0:10:28.080 --> 0:10:33.080 Shot right off the damn we knew the jazz guys. 0:10:33.120 --> 0:10:39.480 Gotta I get the feeling you've been telling you about, 0:10:39.520 --> 0:10:41.400 Like we got you out of bed this morning. 0:10:41.400 --> 0:10:43.280 What what is your morning routine? What do you do? 0:10:43.559 --> 0:10:47.240 I like to know what executives and creatives do for 0:10:47.280 --> 0:10:48.480 the first half hour of the morning. 0:10:48.520 --> 0:10:49.720 What's your morning routine? 0:10:49.880 --> 0:10:53.600 I get up, I do a meditation and prayer, and 0:10:53.640 --> 0:10:56.000 they go for a walk. I try to walk, you know, 0:10:56.600 --> 0:10:58.800 close to ten thousand steps for really more like five. 0:10:59.320 --> 0:11:02.560 Right. Hey, I'm with you. 0:11:03.760 --> 0:11:06.440 And I come home, you know, have my breakfast, chill 0:11:06.480 --> 0:11:08.920 with my wife and my son. Okay, you know, just 0:11:09.040 --> 0:11:11.400 get on and get on the computer, you know, do 0:11:11.480 --> 0:11:11.800 my thing. 0:11:12.320 --> 0:11:12.960 I was your son. 0:11:13.559 --> 0:11:14.679 He's twenty two, okay. 0:11:14.760 --> 0:11:17.000 Yeah, And what's your method for meditation? You know we're 0:11:17.000 --> 0:11:18.199 into that here. What's that about? 0:11:18.559 --> 0:11:21.240 Just close my eyes and you think about you know, 0:11:22.600 --> 0:11:24.360 what I can do to better my life and be 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:26.960 better for the for the world is collective that day, 0:11:27.080 --> 0:11:30.400 you know. Just so yeah, just positivity. Try to be 0:11:30.440 --> 0:11:31.480 as positive as possible. 0:11:31.640 --> 0:11:33.760 You said something, and now now I want to get there. 0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:36.600 Everyone reveal your steps right now? What's on your phone? 0:11:36.640 --> 0:11:37.160 Your steps? 0:11:37.320 --> 0:11:38.679 Do you know how to look at your steps? 0:11:39.120 --> 0:11:40.640 I went to the Gyn's money. I'm gonna win. 0:11:40.800 --> 0:11:41.800 Okay, what is it? You go first? 0:11:41.800 --> 0:11:42.920 Eight three hundred and six. 0:11:43.080 --> 0:11:44.960 I hate you right now? That's mine. 0:11:45.040 --> 0:11:46.560 I told you on a good day. That's why I 0:11:46.559 --> 0:11:48.880 hope they get to like me. Getting above five thousands 0:11:48.920 --> 0:11:49.520 my goal right now. 0:11:49.520 --> 0:11:51.000 I'm nine eighteen. 0:11:51.840 --> 0:11:52.640 That's not gonna. 0:11:54.360 --> 0:11:59.440 I'm a lazy. That's like sometimes in my in my 0:11:59.559 --> 0:12:02.199 hotel all the way, I'll walk twice. Hope I get 0:12:02.200 --> 0:12:03.920 it up to one thousand. What's your step, Steve? 0:12:05.040 --> 0:12:09.320 It says six in and out burgers, eighteen cigarettes. 0:12:11.360 --> 0:12:13.360 I'm at five hundred and forty four steps. 0:12:13.840 --> 0:12:15.200 I'm a twenty six seventy two. 0:12:16.080 --> 0:12:18.840 Ye Let's let's try to get it up to five thousand. 0:12:18.880 --> 0:12:20.480 At least that will help us. 0:12:21.120 --> 0:12:23.000 Okay, were you did you say? Yours? 0:12:23.559 --> 0:12:24.640 I sit nine hundred and eighteen. 0:12:25.440 --> 0:12:29.200 I slept late and use we just gonna do it. 0:12:29.240 --> 0:12:29.960 We just gonna do that. 0:12:30.520 --> 0:12:33.000 But you know, I'm supposed to do at least ten thousand, 0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:36.480 you know, So, like I know for you, and it's 0:12:36.600 --> 0:12:41.040 rare to meet executives. Oftentimes I'll meet executives that are 0:12:41.040 --> 0:12:47.440 more about saving their jobs and submitting their legacy, and 0:12:47.480 --> 0:12:50.880 they don't really seem to be passionate about music or 0:12:50.960 --> 0:12:54.959 music fans. But I definitely know that you are a 0:12:55.880 --> 0:12:58.840 passionate You love music more than. 0:12:59.280 --> 0:13:00.960 Anything in the blood. 0:13:01.240 --> 0:13:03.439 It's almost ird to me. Do you do you find 0:13:03.440 --> 0:13:04.280 that as well? 0:13:04.800 --> 0:13:09.800 Like that executives aren't are mostly there to cross teas 0:13:09.800 --> 0:13:11.760 and dot ies and really not. 0:13:11.360 --> 0:13:16.280 Not all, but a significant portion. Yeah, during my period 0:13:16.280 --> 0:13:20.079 when I was active in it, there was certainly there 0:13:20.080 --> 0:13:23.000 were music guys in there. In the Wall Street takeover happened, 0:13:23.200 --> 0:13:24.840 and it became, you know, sort of an element of 0:13:24.840 --> 0:13:26.800 give me twelve pounds of music to go. You know, 0:13:27.280 --> 0:13:28.520 nobody's really listening to it. 0:13:28.600 --> 0:13:30.720 You know, in my head, I kind of hold like 0:13:30.920 --> 0:13:35.160 nineteen ninety seven as kind of the Mason Dixon line 0:13:36.000 --> 0:13:40.600 of where hip hop, you know, suddenly realized it's it's 0:13:41.000 --> 0:13:46.320 earning power, and then suddenly it became big business, right 0:13:47.320 --> 0:13:51.199 as opposed to whatever me living in the delusional state 0:13:51.280 --> 0:13:53.960 of Hey, people love music for music and it's an 0:13:54.040 --> 0:13:55.079 artful and that sort of stuff. 0:13:55.120 --> 0:13:58.960 Good luck with that, right well, I know, right, But 0:13:59.120 --> 0:14:04.280 for you on the executive side of things, was there 0:14:05.440 --> 0:14:08.080 a glory period and then was there the Mason Dixon 0:14:08.160 --> 0:14:11.160 line period of like what am I doing here? 0:14:11.720 --> 0:14:15.600 Yes? From the executive side, what got frustrating was in 0:14:15.600 --> 0:14:18.520 those days it was still terrestrial radio largely. That was 0:14:18.559 --> 0:14:21.320 the master that we had to honor. You know, there 0:14:21.320 --> 0:14:23.720 were so many situations where there were acts that you 0:14:23.800 --> 0:14:25.600 loved eta you know, I'd love to try and go 0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:27.560 get after this and break it, but you knew that 0:14:27.640 --> 0:14:30.120 radio wasn't going to play it, and it was you 0:14:31.080 --> 0:14:33.520 had limited resources of what you could spend to make 0:14:33.560 --> 0:14:37.440 things happen, and so to a certain extent, I found 0:14:37.520 --> 0:14:41.880 myself in the position of chasing things that you thought 0:14:41.920 --> 0:14:46.560 were somewhat safer. But you know, not that my instincts 0:14:46.600 --> 0:14:49.360 may have gone in one direction, but the realities of 0:14:49.440 --> 0:14:52.200 the marketplace, and after all, I'm running a business, you know, 0:14:52.360 --> 0:14:54.640 is just another So all. 0:14:54.680 --> 0:14:58.600 Right, I need a five second moment of reflection right now, 0:14:59.320 --> 0:15:06.600 because instantly I'm regretting the decision I made. I'm literally 0:15:06.600 --> 0:15:10.800 sitting here like, wait a minute, if this person was 0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:13.440 at the top of the pyramid, how would of my 0:15:13.520 --> 0:15:16.640 life had turned out. I don't know if this particular 0:15:17.400 --> 0:15:19.680 tortoise in the hair journey it. 0:15:19.720 --> 0:15:22.720 Is for everybody and it's not. 0:15:23.760 --> 0:15:26.880 It was a long, hard thirty years in getting here, 0:15:27.600 --> 0:15:29.640 and I'm glad I'm here. So yes, I will say 0:15:29.680 --> 0:15:34.560 that I don't regret anything, but I will say that 0:15:34.880 --> 0:15:38.240 of anyone that I had dealt with in music, to 0:15:38.360 --> 0:15:43.040 even hear you speak on that level, in my head, 0:15:43.040 --> 0:15:48.960 I'm already like, damn, where's that person when I needed 0:15:49.000 --> 0:15:51.840 them in my career? Because we the reason why I'm 0:15:51.840 --> 0:15:54.120 here is because we had to fit for ourselves. People 0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:56.160 were just like, I don't know, figured it out for yourself, 0:15:56.200 --> 0:15:57.600 So we had to figure it out for ourselves. And 0:15:57.640 --> 0:16:01.440 so yeah, I'm having a moment of Oh, I wonder 0:16:01.480 --> 0:16:03.400 what happened to have we chose well? 0:16:03.400 --> 0:16:05.000 Who knows ed you might he might have been a 0:16:05.000 --> 0:16:06.560 different end in those days too. 0:16:06.800 --> 0:16:09.040 Yeah, and then I'm gonna ask, were you the same 0:16:09.120 --> 0:16:11.800 ad now that you were thirty years ago. 0:16:12.160 --> 0:16:15.960 Well in some ways yes, but no. But as far 0:16:16.000 --> 0:16:19.880 as you guys were concerned, because I remember vividly Kenya 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:22.880 I bet you do. Ken YadA Bell was the an 0:16:22.960 --> 0:16:25.120 R guy who was who was actually working for us, 0:16:25.120 --> 0:16:28.080 who who first identified you guys was excited about. He 0:16:28.120 --> 0:16:30.480 worked for Lisa Cortez, so he and Lisa came in 0:16:30.480 --> 0:16:32.800 and said, we're really interested in this band. They said 0:16:32.800 --> 0:16:35.320 the magic words banned to me because when I signed 0:16:35.320 --> 0:16:37.600 the Tonys was at a period when there was a 0:16:37.640 --> 0:16:40.440 lull in black bands, and I come up from that era, 0:16:40.840 --> 0:16:43.440 and I always viewed the Tonys as the last of 0:16:43.480 --> 0:16:45.960 the Mohicans on the R and B band level, but 0:16:46.120 --> 0:16:50.120 of the hip hop generation. I remember vividly seeing them 0:16:50.120 --> 0:16:53.560 play a performance at the Palladium one night in New York, 0:16:53.880 --> 0:16:55.960 and they were killing that night on stage and the 0:16:56.000 --> 0:16:59.520 audience was just dumbfounded, staring into space. And I was 0:16:59.560 --> 0:17:02.440 there with the late great Gary Harris, who was working 0:17:02.480 --> 0:17:06.399 for me at that time, and Gary and I say exactly, 0:17:08.720 --> 0:17:10.440 and Gary and I are saying, I'm look at him, said, gee, 0:17:10.400 --> 0:17:12.320 what's up man? How come nobody's reacting to him? They're 0:17:12.400 --> 0:17:14.479 killing up her? He says, you got to understand some man. 0:17:14.520 --> 0:17:16.639 He said, most of the kids in this audience have 0:17:16.760 --> 0:17:19.280 never seen kids their own age playing a musical instrument. 0:17:19.760 --> 0:17:22.280 I was like, wow, really, and so that that was 0:17:22.280 --> 0:17:24.639 the reality of it. So when I heard about you guys, 0:17:24.880 --> 0:17:28.000 you know, the combination of you know, Tarik and a band, 0:17:28.320 --> 0:17:30.760 I said, this is interesting to me. I always remember 0:17:30.760 --> 0:17:34.440 that the showcase was the coldest hell night in SI 0:17:34.720 --> 0:17:39.119 studios myself half to death. I had a clause in 0:17:39.160 --> 0:17:42.040 my contract in those days, because I'm from LA that 0:17:42.119 --> 0:17:44.840 if it got to single digits in New York I 0:17:44.880 --> 0:17:46.439 could I would turn around and go home. I mean, 0:17:46.960 --> 0:17:49.200 and if I was walking through time times square, the 0:17:49.280 --> 0:17:51.600 time and temperature, you know of the sign of the world, 0:17:51.640 --> 0:17:53.280 if I looked up and there was you know, three 0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:55.840 point fifty two eight degrees, I'd walk back to my 0:17:55.840 --> 0:17:58.320 office say, Chris booked me, I'm going home. And I 0:17:58.359 --> 0:17:59.960 think that night was one of those nights, you know, 0:18:00.520 --> 0:18:02.080 at least it got me to stick around to see 0:18:02.080 --> 0:18:03.720 the band. Thank you. Yeah, it's cool. 0:18:03.920 --> 0:18:06.520 Thanks, brilliant though, that's brilliant. 0:18:06.600 --> 0:18:09.400 Yeah, you know to put that in there, like that's 0:18:09.440 --> 0:18:11.280 so interesting, Like did somebody else tell you once, and 0:18:11.320 --> 0:18:12.920 you know, and when you do a new contract. 0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:15.680 No, because i'd worked, I'd spent enough time back He's 0:18:15.680 --> 0:18:17.240 because I went to high school back he's and I 0:18:17.280 --> 0:18:19.439 was working for Arista when I was at Ariston and 0:18:20.000 --> 0:18:22.680 I didn't have that. Clive wasn't playing that. 0:18:27.760 --> 0:18:29.400 I knew other name at x sign. 0:18:29.480 --> 0:18:32.199 Of course, when you read OM credits, I saw your 0:18:32.240 --> 0:18:35.879 name on like Vanessa Williams's projects and the Tony's and whatnot. 0:18:36.280 --> 0:18:40.960 But what was the road that led to your president? 0:18:41.080 --> 0:18:43.639 Like how long did it take from the moment you 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:46.400 entered the mailroom to presidency? 0:18:46.480 --> 0:18:47.160 How long was that? 0:18:47.880 --> 0:18:54.000 I started at PolyGram in nineteen eighty seven. Dick Asher 0:18:54.119 --> 0:18:56.640 was the president of PolyGram in those days, and he 0:18:56.920 --> 0:19:00.800 because PolyGram, just for a little inside baseball was a 0:19:01.000 --> 0:19:06.359 Dutch owned Phillips Dutch owned company based in based in Hilversom, Holland, 0:19:06.840 --> 0:19:10.639 with a with a European base in London, headquarters in 0:19:10.640 --> 0:19:14.600 New York, with satellite offices in Nashville and Los Angeles, 0:19:14.720 --> 0:19:18.280 but the creative centers were largely London in New York, 0:19:19.080 --> 0:19:22.480 so let's just extended Los Angeles. In those days, poly 0:19:22.680 --> 0:19:27.640 Phonogram UK would sign acts exclusively for UK and America 0:19:27.640 --> 0:19:29.520 wouldn't have the rights to the Dire Straits was one 0:19:29.520 --> 0:19:32.239 of those bands. Metallica was a banned like that. They 0:19:32.280 --> 0:19:34.600 weren't signed to PolyGram for the world. And so when 0:19:34.600 --> 0:19:37.240 a guy called Dick Asher took over, who would run 0:19:37.280 --> 0:19:40.200 a CBS role When when Dick took over PolyGram, part 0:19:40.240 --> 0:19:42.359 of the edict was to sign things for the world. 0:19:42.880 --> 0:19:45.400 So and they want up their presence as a West 0:19:45.440 --> 0:19:48.359 Coast creative center. So there was a head of A 0:19:48.440 --> 0:19:50.480 and R at PolyGram at the time. A guy called 0:19:50.480 --> 0:19:54.480 Dick wynd Gate shout out to Dick Richards, Yeah and 0:19:54.600 --> 0:19:58.760 uh so. Asher apparently had had a thing in his 0:19:58.800 --> 0:19:59.960 mind of who he was going to hire for this 0:20:00.080 --> 0:20:02.560 West Coast situation. But wing Gate and some of the 0:20:02.600 --> 0:20:04.520 A and R guys in the New York office felt 0:20:04.600 --> 0:20:06.760 he was going old, they want somebody younger. 0:20:07.119 --> 0:20:09.200 And I was going to ask you, is he well liked? 0:20:09.400 --> 0:20:11.880 Who only know the name Dick Asher? 0:20:12.000 --> 0:20:15.479 Because if you're a fan of liner notes, uh I 0:20:15.560 --> 0:20:20.640 believe on fear of Black Planet, Public Enemy wrote and 0:20:20.800 --> 0:20:23.959 fuck Dick Asher. We got Bill Stephanie watching our backs 0:20:24.560 --> 0:20:26.120 and I was like, well, what does that mean? 0:20:27.840 --> 0:20:30.639 Dick was cool or he was just an executive. 0:20:30.880 --> 0:20:33.960 Yeah, Dick was cool. It was great to me. Once again, 0:20:34.040 --> 0:20:36.760 sidebar story that I was having a conversation with my 0:20:36.760 --> 0:20:39.600 pops at one point after PolyGram had offered me the deal. 0:20:39.840 --> 0:20:41.879 You made me an offer, made me my offer, and 0:20:42.040 --> 0:20:44.000 I said, well, tell me, baby, tell me about the deal. 0:20:44.160 --> 0:20:46.080 I told him, ran the deal down to him, and 0:20:46.080 --> 0:20:48.600 when he sat in digest its, damn, sounds like you 0:20:48.640 --> 0:20:57.399 found old fashioned nigga lover. So those are kind of 0:20:57.400 --> 0:21:03.560 hard to find these days. Dick was great to me. 0:21:03.640 --> 0:21:07.040 Dick was absolutely wonderful, you know, and afford to be 0:21:07.080 --> 0:21:08.280 a great opportunity there. 0:21:08.200 --> 0:21:10.600 I see. All right, So what where were you born? 0:21:10.880 --> 0:21:13.320 Born here in l A, all right, Saint John's Hospital, 0:21:13.320 --> 0:21:14.080 Santa Monica. 0:21:14.240 --> 0:21:16.159 Do you remember your very first musical memory? 0:21:16.480 --> 0:21:20.000 I do? What is it being? My parents were having 0:21:20.040 --> 0:21:22.160 a party. We were living I was born in Santa Monica. 0:21:22.200 --> 0:21:24.919 We were living in Hollywood. My parents were having a party. 0:21:26.119 --> 0:21:29.560 I was apparently like two or three years old. They 0:21:29.560 --> 0:21:31.240 were having a party in the house and a whole 0:21:31.240 --> 0:21:33.760 bunch of bird was there. Billie Holiday and different people 0:21:33.760 --> 0:21:36.160 were at the crib, and uh, this is all going 0:21:36.160 --> 0:21:37.080 on on the house. 0:21:37.520 --> 0:21:48.760 You know, Wait, you were in this lifetime when Charlie Bird. 0:21:48.600 --> 0:21:49.960 Parker was was a life. 0:21:50.880 --> 0:21:53.720 Yeah, and you've seen or you've been in the presidence 0:21:53.760 --> 0:21:56.840 of Billie Holliday once is basically, But the story is 0:21:56.840 --> 0:21:57.640 even if you were too. 0:21:58.240 --> 0:22:00.960 My memory is because we had a two story house 0:22:01.359 --> 0:22:03.720 and the second floor. I somehow crawled out of my 0:22:03.760 --> 0:22:06.119 bed and there was you know, the second story and 0:22:06.160 --> 0:22:08.199 the you know, the things that hold them, and I 0:22:08.240 --> 0:22:10.359 was looking down at the party. My parents said they 0:22:10.359 --> 0:22:12.199 looked up and they could feel a presence, and all 0:22:12.200 --> 0:22:13.439 of a sudden they looked up and there was my 0:22:13.480 --> 0:22:15.840 little face looking down at everybody. You know. I was 0:22:15.840 --> 0:22:19.280 attracted to the music and the noise and the cacophony. 0:22:18.760 --> 0:22:21.560 And Billie Holliday. 0:22:22.000 --> 0:22:24.679 All right, I mean more stories of your life, Like 0:22:25.119 --> 0:22:27.119 give me a version of your childhood in which you 0:22:27.240 --> 0:22:31.040 don't know that God's in the room with you. Like, oh, 0:22:31.400 --> 0:22:35.560 my parents once told me that whatever I went to 0:22:35.600 --> 0:22:38.639 the school with Jackie Jackson, Well that's a bad example. 0:22:38.680 --> 0:22:41.840 But the best way I could answer that is just 0:22:42.280 --> 0:22:44.240 my dad was an avid golfer because he was on 0:22:44.240 --> 0:22:46.480 the road all the time, and when he'd come home 0:22:46.480 --> 0:22:48.800 from the road. He played golf a lot. And one 0:22:48.800 --> 0:22:50.600 of the things that was always fun was we'd come 0:22:50.600 --> 0:22:53.320 home from school, you know, because in our house you 0:22:53.400 --> 0:22:56.240 had like a little bar sort of speakeasy area where 0:22:56.240 --> 0:22:58.480 he used to chill after he played golf, and he 0:22:58.560 --> 0:23:00.480 never knew when we come home was going to be 0:23:00.480 --> 0:23:02.440 in the crib with him. We played golf with that day, 0:23:02.640 --> 0:23:04.320 had days where he'd come home and he was there 0:23:04.359 --> 0:23:07.320 with Smokey or there with Marvin Gaye, or there with 0:23:07.359 --> 0:23:08.200 Sean Connery. 0:23:08.720 --> 0:23:10.040 This is when he was on Motown, right. 0:23:10.280 --> 0:23:14.680 I know he signed in the mid sixties. Cool, but yeah, 0:23:14.680 --> 0:23:16.560 this is this is mid sixties stuff. I'm like twelve 0:23:16.640 --> 0:23:20.399 thirteen years old at that point. So just little things 0:23:20.440 --> 0:23:24.040 like that. The other aspects of it, there were, there 0:23:24.040 --> 0:23:27.720 were moments because the whole Billy ecksteinness of it all 0:23:28.400 --> 0:23:31.280 was he was just Pops. But you know the fact 0:23:31.320 --> 0:23:34.920 that you know, people, my friend, my kid's parents reacted 0:23:34.960 --> 0:23:37.040 more to him than you know, anything else, you know. 0:23:37.280 --> 0:23:38.840 And one of things that Pop's always tried to do 0:23:38.880 --> 0:23:40.800 to my brothers and I for my brothers and I 0:23:40.880 --> 0:23:44.080 was demystify the business but also sort of put a 0:23:44.160 --> 0:23:46.760 vibe on it to make us understand that although people 0:23:46.840 --> 0:23:49.000 kind of went buck wild when when he was around, 0:23:49.440 --> 0:23:51.720 that we had to realize that he was no better 0:23:51.960 --> 0:23:54.200 or no worse than anybody else than the people across 0:23:54.240 --> 0:23:57.320 the street who had you know, regular quote unquote regular jobs. 0:23:57.480 --> 0:23:59.200 His just happened to be in lights and people got 0:23:59.240 --> 0:24:04.360 excited about it. So that was really that was sort 0:24:04.359 --> 0:24:06.560 of a God moment in its own way of just 0:24:06.640 --> 0:24:10.159 you know that how life was. You know, Pops is 0:24:10.240 --> 0:24:13.280 just you know, Pops, so many brothers and you have 0:24:13.440 --> 0:24:16.520 there's seven of us. Where do you fall? I fall 0:24:16.560 --> 0:24:19.560 in the middle. It's five boys, two girls, two older 0:24:19.600 --> 0:24:22.600 three older brothers, two of whom are deceased now, and 0:24:22.640 --> 0:24:24.520 then then me and then my little brother and two 0:24:24.560 --> 0:24:25.280 younger sisters. 0:24:25.400 --> 0:24:28.280 Any of all those siblings they go into music anyway. 0:24:27.960 --> 0:24:31.600 Well, my brother guys a producer and a manager, and 0:24:31.600 --> 0:24:34.119 and my youngest sister, our youngest sister, Gene is a singer. 0:24:36.040 --> 0:24:38.680 As as a child or as a teen. 0:24:41.840 --> 0:24:47.560 Would other adults annoy you if they start singing to 0:24:47.600 --> 0:24:50.760 you like Moody's mood or anything like that, Your dad. 0:24:50.800 --> 0:24:54.760 Is really sort of get to us, was you know, 0:24:54.800 --> 0:24:57.240 collective because he was on the road so much, you know, 0:24:57.359 --> 0:24:58.760 and the only time we really talked to him was 0:24:58.760 --> 0:25:00.840 on the road was on Sunday nights. You know, hear 0:25:00.880 --> 0:25:03.120 from him. You know, Dad, I hit a home run 0:25:03.160 --> 0:25:04.840 on Tuesday by blah blah, you're that kind of shit. 0:25:05.640 --> 0:25:08.600 So when he was home, there were very valuable, cherished moments. 0:25:08.800 --> 0:25:11.320 If we went out to dinner as a family, invariably 0:25:11.359 --> 0:25:13.720 there's somebody to come. Ah, mister b I saw you 0:25:13.720 --> 0:25:17.600 in Moleen, Illinois in nineteen fifty one, you know, and 0:25:17.640 --> 0:25:19.359 we're trying to talk to Pops. And you know, we 0:25:19.600 --> 0:25:22.720 were sort of taught slash train that you know that 0:25:22.800 --> 0:25:25.040 the fans are the lifeblood of you know, of us 0:25:25.280 --> 0:25:27.440 having the ability to live the lives that we live. 0:25:27.560 --> 0:25:29.439 So just kind of smile your way through it, you know, 0:25:29.520 --> 0:25:31.919 be polite, be nice, and Pops would handle it from there. 0:25:31.920 --> 0:25:33.479 And if you if they stayed a little too long 0:25:33.520 --> 0:25:35.119 to say, hey baby, I'm trying to have dinner with 0:25:35.160 --> 0:25:37.040 my family here, you know, and then if they stayed long, 0:25:37.080 --> 0:25:38.200 said get the fuck out of here. 0:25:38.240 --> 0:25:40.040 You know, I was I was going to issue a 0:25:40.119 --> 0:25:42.560 mandate like none of you do there I go reference. 0:25:42.720 --> 0:25:46.400 So any what if you got us to do it, 0:25:46.600 --> 0:25:48.760 then we'd do it where you'd want us to do 0:25:48.800 --> 0:25:50.120 it so much. 0:25:51.680 --> 0:25:53.720 Did you have peers in that way though, is as 0:25:53.720 --> 0:25:56.240 you were part of this kind of music musical family. 0:25:56.280 --> 0:25:58.600 Did you have other kids that kind of felt the 0:25:58.640 --> 0:26:00.199 pains that you were going to through because their parents 0:26:00.200 --> 0:26:01.080 weren't one tour. 0:26:00.960 --> 0:26:05.800 And ish But we're I grew up in Sino, California, 0:26:05.920 --> 0:26:07.879 So we're the only black family there till the Jackson. 0:26:08.880 --> 0:26:11.000 There are people and so the Jackson's got. 0:26:10.840 --> 0:26:13.480 There, Okay, So y'all were there first, right because he's. 0:26:13.400 --> 0:26:18.320 Your dad, Yeah, and so any of the Sino at 0:26:18.320 --> 0:26:20.680 that point it still is. In the San Fernando Valley 0:26:20.920 --> 0:26:24.000 in Cina was basically two lane dirt road with orange 0:26:24.040 --> 0:26:26.480 groves and a lot of almond trees and shit, And 0:26:26.520 --> 0:26:29.960 then somewhere in the late late fifties became a bit 0:26:30.000 --> 0:26:32.280 of a go West young man syndrome. A lot of 0:26:32.280 --> 0:26:34.840 folks moving out to the hills there and a significant 0:26:34.880 --> 0:26:36.960 port because with the expanse of the film and TV 0:26:37.080 --> 0:26:38.800 business out here, and a lot of the folks that 0:26:38.880 --> 0:26:42.359 moved to that part of the valley were business people, 0:26:42.440 --> 0:26:44.879 largely Jewish from New York, from other parts of the 0:26:44.880 --> 0:26:47.840 country and certain parts of the city here were redlined 0:26:48.200 --> 0:26:50.679 that you know, certain Jews and Blacks couldn't live in 0:26:50.680 --> 0:26:54.480 certain areas. So the valley became the area of development, 0:26:54.560 --> 0:26:57.320 you know, of of principal development, and the line of 0:26:57.359 --> 0:27:00.800 demarcation in the San Fernanda Valley is in tro Boulevard. 0:27:01.040 --> 0:27:02.600 And a lot of the kids I grew up with were, 0:27:02.600 --> 0:27:06.360 you know, Mo Austin's kids, Eddie Rosenblatt kids, different shiz 0:27:06.560 --> 0:27:09.199 show biz kids, you know, making movies of the selves 0:27:09.280 --> 0:27:11.840 as Steely Dan said, right, and don't give a fuck 0:27:11.880 --> 0:27:12.720 about nobody else. 0:27:13.880 --> 0:27:15.960 So so they were your peers, but they really weren't 0:27:16.000 --> 0:27:16.880 your pee. 0:27:16.800 --> 0:27:19.320 Yeah, there were peers, and since their parents weren't performers. 0:27:19.359 --> 0:27:22.520 But you know, there were some my older brothers, like 0:27:22.640 --> 0:27:25.159 my second and third my second oldest brother went to 0:27:25.240 --> 0:27:29.920 high school with Sally Field and uh and cheer. So yeah, 0:27:30.000 --> 0:27:34.159 she went to school. Had had a moment about this 0:27:34.240 --> 0:27:37.200 was called fifteen years ago. It was during the the 0:27:37.280 --> 0:27:40.080 Kobe shack Laker years. It was one of the playoffs 0:27:40.200 --> 0:27:43.600 championship games. Sally Field happened to be standing in front 0:27:43.600 --> 0:27:46.720 of me at that game and in the stand. Since 0:27:46.760 --> 0:27:49.320 I tapped her on the shoulder and said she said hello, 0:27:49.560 --> 0:27:51.160 and said you went to high school with my brothers, 0:27:51.480 --> 0:27:53.240 and she kind of looked gave me a quizzical look 0:27:53.280 --> 0:27:55.520 of like, you know, to the sun Town. I was like, 0:27:55.520 --> 0:27:57.800 wait a minute, no, none of you motherfuckers said right right, 0:27:57.880 --> 0:28:00.160 Oh my god, you're kid. And Ron's brother. 0:28:02.160 --> 0:28:07.479 Instantly new so well, actually, I asked, okay. I asked 0:28:07.520 --> 0:28:10.840 the Jacksons the same question, but now that I know 0:28:10.920 --> 0:28:13.600 that you were there first, First of all, were you 0:28:14.560 --> 0:28:21.080 aware of the situation that you were placed in? I 0:28:21.160 --> 0:28:24.480 asked them what is it to be? 0:28:24.480 --> 0:28:26.600 Because I, you know, I always considered the Jacksons the 0:28:26.640 --> 0:28:34.720 first post civil rights result, like all that that between 0:28:35.040 --> 0:28:38.360 you know, reconstruction, slavery and civil rights. 0:28:38.200 --> 0:28:40.600 And then you get to this point post sixty eight. 0:28:41.080 --> 0:28:44.880 Where the idea of freedom or the idea of pursuit 0:28:44.920 --> 0:28:47.680 of happiness whatever, and the Jacksons sort. 0:28:47.440 --> 0:28:50.040 Of took that. And I asked him, like, what was 0:28:50.080 --> 0:28:50.560 it like. 0:28:50.960 --> 0:28:56.320 Navigating in those first five years in Encino in Los Angeles? 0:28:56.720 --> 0:28:58.640 You know, I've seen the photos. You guys have roles, 0:28:58.720 --> 0:29:02.560 voices and fancy cars, see and roaster and all that stuff. 0:29:03.120 --> 0:29:05.880 And Marlon was like yeah, and no routinely got stopped 0:29:05.880 --> 0:29:07.160 by cops and all and stuff. 0:29:07.960 --> 0:29:12.240 So were you aware that was like proceed with caution 0:29:12.920 --> 0:29:13.520 or was. 0:29:13.480 --> 0:29:18.360 It like yeah, very aware, partially because how we were raised. 0:29:18.360 --> 0:29:20.440 You know, my dad was very active in the civil 0:29:20.520 --> 0:29:23.840 rights movement, and the conversation around the dinner table or 0:29:23.880 --> 0:29:27.080 all meals actually was either showbiz or the civil rights 0:29:27.120 --> 0:29:29.360 move because civil rights movement played out on TV every 0:29:29.440 --> 0:29:32.280 night on Walter Cronkite and stuff like that, and Pops 0:29:32.360 --> 0:29:35.880 was was close with Doctor King's, close with Malcolm. So 0:29:35.960 --> 0:29:37.880 as a result, we were very aware of who we 0:29:37.880 --> 0:29:40.280 were and what was up, you know, my parents pretty much. 0:29:40.360 --> 0:29:42.400 That was one of the things they hammered home to us. 0:29:42.400 --> 0:29:44.240 You know, don't for one minute start thinking you're white 0:29:44.240 --> 0:29:46.080 open here. You know, it's this is the reality of 0:29:46.120 --> 0:29:47.080 your existence, you know. 0:29:48.000 --> 0:29:50.440 Which you must have confused people a little bit visually 0:29:50.440 --> 0:29:50.760 as well. 0:29:51.080 --> 0:29:52.680 Well. And I realized that some of that too was 0:29:52.720 --> 0:29:55.680 you know, because there's a certain amount of ethnic ambiguity, 0:29:55.800 --> 0:29:58.880 you know, inherent to uh, to the suntan right and 0:29:58.920 --> 0:30:00.760 then you know, and and the hair at the time 0:30:00.960 --> 0:30:04.160 and uh and as a result, you know, there's but 0:30:04.320 --> 0:30:06.080 there was always a kid every year in school, the 0:30:06.200 --> 0:30:08.680 one stepped to one of my brothers and nigger, you know, 0:30:08.720 --> 0:30:11.960 he pop somebody in the face and then uh, and 0:30:11.960 --> 0:30:14.040 then you'd get sent to the principal's office and then 0:30:14.080 --> 0:30:16.080 they said, well, we're gonna call your parents. And you 0:30:16.120 --> 0:30:17.920 didn't want my mom coming down. You know, Mom was 0:30:18.040 --> 0:30:21.080 straight out of Georgia, Thomas and Georgia. She wouldn't have it. 0:30:21.160 --> 0:30:22.800 So she was like, you know, if they don't hit 0:30:22.800 --> 0:30:24.640 those people, if they don't punch them, you know, when 0:30:24.640 --> 0:30:28.120 they get home, they's go be their ass. That was 0:30:28.120 --> 0:30:30.600 that was that was our reality. But yeah, the Jackson's 0:30:30.640 --> 0:30:34.240 period was was cool because I that's when I first 0:30:34.240 --> 0:30:37.320 met them and John McClain. During that period of time, 0:30:38.320 --> 0:30:40.240 I was. I was. I went to a boarding school 0:30:40.240 --> 0:30:44.240 in western Pennsylvania, a place called the Kiski School outside 0:30:44.240 --> 0:30:48.840 of Pittsburgh. Actually, Jake, your your producer, went to one 0:30:48.840 --> 0:30:56.040 of rival schools. So I was at the school Pennsylvania 0:30:56.040 --> 0:30:58.480 and one of my really close friends here was was 0:30:58.640 --> 0:31:00.320 screwing up in school here and he got sent to 0:31:00.360 --> 0:31:03.000 a private school, private day school here in town, which 0:31:03.040 --> 0:31:05.320 was where Motown sent to Jackson's once they could no 0:31:05.360 --> 0:31:07.400 longer go to public school here, a place called the 0:31:07.440 --> 0:31:09.960 Walton School. So when I come home on vacations, our 0:31:10.040 --> 0:31:13.280 vacations were out of sink with my friends vacations here. 0:31:13.560 --> 0:31:16.320 So ostensibly my days would end up being spend either 0:31:16.360 --> 0:31:18.280 hanging out with my mom because Pops was on the road, 0:31:18.440 --> 0:31:20.520 hanging out mom going doing what mom was gonna do, 0:31:20.600 --> 0:31:22.960 or sit at home and just listening to records all day, 0:31:23.000 --> 0:31:24.400 which I did a fair share of that, and play 0:31:24.480 --> 0:31:26.520 my guitar. But my buddy was like, Doude, once you 0:31:26.600 --> 0:31:28.000 come to the come down to my school and hang 0:31:28.000 --> 0:31:30.200 out with us. Jackson's are here, blah blah blah blah blah. 0:31:30.240 --> 0:31:33.280 All the honeys are on the Jackson's hard And I 0:31:33.320 --> 0:31:35.160 was in an all boys school, so I mean I'm in. 0:31:35.400 --> 0:31:38.320 So I started going to show up to show up 0:31:38.360 --> 0:31:41.240 on the campus. Yeah, we did, and play ball and 0:31:41.320 --> 0:31:43.239 we played ball all day and that's where I met 0:31:43.360 --> 0:31:46.080 met those guys. And Mike was Mike was little, you know, 0:31:46.160 --> 0:31:47.760 chasing insects and rats around. 0:31:47.920 --> 0:31:51.200 Right, sounds about right. It sounds about right. 0:31:51.840 --> 0:31:55.200 What was your Do you remember the first album you 0:31:55.280 --> 0:31:56.400 ever purchased. 0:31:56.560 --> 0:31:59.240 First album I ever purchased was Meet the Beatles? First 0:31:59.240 --> 0:32:01.000 single ever, which was My Girl. 0:32:01.520 --> 0:32:03.320 Where's the family record collection? 0:32:03.920 --> 0:32:05.640 Yeah? Where is the family record collection? 0:32:06.600 --> 0:32:10.320 I had? I sold my vinyl about fifteen years ago. 0:32:10.360 --> 0:32:14.000 I had, you know, fifteen thousand pieces sold. 0:32:14.400 --> 0:32:15.480 Okay on behalf of. 0:32:17.800 --> 0:32:22.360 On pay bill. Yeah, long story, long story, but yeah, 0:32:22.360 --> 0:32:24.680 I sold it and then, uh, mom and Dad's collection. 0:32:24.760 --> 0:32:26.200 I still have a bunch of it, you know, but 0:32:28.120 --> 0:32:31.360 they had a fair share, not a lot. Some of 0:32:31.360 --> 0:32:33.280 this guy sold. I got a great story that we 0:32:33.320 --> 0:32:36.560 had a lady who was a housekeeper for us in 0:32:36.600 --> 0:32:39.120 the late fifties when Ray Charles was blown up with 0:32:39.160 --> 0:32:42.120 all the Atlantic records, and mom and pops loved those records, 0:32:42.200 --> 0:32:43.800 so they had all the Ray Charles album you know, 0:32:43.800 --> 0:32:46.080 the early Ray Charles records. They came home from tour 0:32:46.080 --> 0:32:48.080 at one point, went to get to put their Ray 0:32:48.160 --> 0:32:51.000 Charles joints on. They weren't there, and they're like, where's 0:32:51.000 --> 0:32:55.640 the records in this one housekeeper, lady Gussie Gussie Gussie, 0:32:55.760 --> 0:32:58.920 you know, pinched the records. So she she she left, 0:32:58.960 --> 0:33:01.080 and Mom and Dad told us, look, all's forgiven, just 0:33:01.080 --> 0:33:02.640 bring the records back, you know, you gotta have your 0:33:02.720 --> 0:33:05.040 job back. No, she didn't want the job back. She 0:33:05.120 --> 0:33:11.280 kept the fucking records. 0:33:10.840 --> 0:33:11.280 Her family. 0:33:11.360 --> 0:33:14.200 Right now, now I got to check my collection. 0:33:15.280 --> 0:33:17.959 Yeah, so Jesus Christ, when you sell a record collection, 0:33:18.080 --> 0:33:21.480 that means you're really that music is in the rear 0:33:21.560 --> 0:33:22.160 view mirror. 0:33:22.720 --> 0:33:25.720 Well I ever, I just digitized everything. But yeah, I 0:33:25.720 --> 0:33:26.040 mean I. 0:33:26.000 --> 0:33:30.040 Love you know, I need tangible proof, tactile thing I did. 0:33:30.080 --> 0:33:34.120 Something in the end of Man is judged by his 0:33:34.200 --> 0:33:36.800 record collection pretty much. 0:33:37.200 --> 0:33:38.960 People come in my house, That's the first thing they do. 0:33:39.080 --> 0:33:42.000 They like, what are you listening to? 0:33:42.160 --> 0:33:44.120 That sort of thing, and you know, look at stuff. 0:33:44.240 --> 0:33:45.959 Yeah. I was known for it because when I used 0:33:46.000 --> 0:33:48.880 to go to go to Kiski school is called Kiskie. 0:33:49.040 --> 0:33:51.480 When I kis come up with the holidays, I always 0:33:51.520 --> 0:33:54.240 have three or four foot lockers filled with vinyl, filled 0:33:54.280 --> 0:33:56.280 with records. They took me so all the kids school 0:33:56.320 --> 0:33:58.960 do me as a record guy? You know? Can I 0:33:58.960 --> 0:34:00.240 ask a little follow? Yeah? 0:34:00.280 --> 0:34:00.760 Good question. 0:34:00.920 --> 0:34:03.080 So the first two records you bought, The Beatles and 0:34:03.680 --> 0:34:04.120 My Girl. 0:34:04.240 --> 0:34:04.480 Yeah? 0:34:04.960 --> 0:34:08.440 How did those first to purchase shape your taste in 0:34:08.520 --> 0:34:09.439 music and career? 0:34:09.480 --> 0:34:11.400 I was the Beatles on Ed Sullivan kid. You know, 0:34:11.400 --> 0:34:12.960 when I saw the Beatles and Ed Sullivan I was like, 0:34:13.000 --> 0:34:15.040 I want to play guitar. I wanted to play drums first, 0:34:15.239 --> 0:34:17.400 but moms wouldn't happen it, right, I ain't gonna have 0:34:17.480 --> 0:34:20.200 all that noise over in my house, So so I 0:34:20.280 --> 0:34:22.319 play guitar, and then I got a guitar, you know, 0:34:22.400 --> 0:34:25.120 later that year for my birthday. Don't play well, but 0:34:25.160 --> 0:34:28.120 I collect him pretty well. But my son actually is 0:34:28.160 --> 0:34:32.640 this prolific player, prodigious player. And my girl was just 0:34:32.640 --> 0:34:35.480 because I love the single, you know, the lick and 0:34:35.480 --> 0:34:38.879 all that stuff. Yeah, yeah, And I always tell the story. 0:34:38.880 --> 0:34:40.879 People say, what do you sing? You sing like your dad. 0:34:41.600 --> 0:34:43.719 So I must have been like eleven, and I was 0:34:43.760 --> 0:34:45.840 singing my girl in the show. My dad opened the 0:34:45.840 --> 0:34:51.040 shower to stop singing. Boy closed the shower and walked away. 0:34:51.560 --> 0:34:53.680 Billy XI tells me not to sing. I'm not going 0:34:53.719 --> 0:34:54.000 to sing. 0:34:54.080 --> 0:34:56.440 I was going to say, that's where the billy he 0:34:56.480 --> 0:35:02.200 ain't really works the prince. So I would assume being 0:35:02.560 --> 0:35:07.640 a young teenager in the late sixties early seventies, uh, 0:35:07.960 --> 0:35:10.319 and being in the position that you're in, you've been 0:35:10.400 --> 0:35:16.120 privy to many a concert experience. Can you give me 0:35:17.120 --> 0:35:20.920 your top three concert going experiences as a kid? 0:35:21.320 --> 0:35:24.880 Yeah? Well, kid meaning under twenty one or just whenever. 0:35:24.920 --> 0:35:27.000 All right, well, give me your your what's the first 0:35:27.000 --> 0:35:31.160 concert you went to? That's not your dad, but even then, 0:35:31.280 --> 0:35:33.879 I'm certain that your dad's done festivals and stuff you've seen. 0:35:34.360 --> 0:35:36.279 Yeah, all right, so you gotta include your dad. 0:35:36.560 --> 0:35:40.480 I want to see Marvin gay at what's now a 0:35:40.480 --> 0:35:43.520 club called Cerroo's with my older brother when he was 0:35:43.600 --> 0:35:45.160 when he was in college. I was like eight or 0:35:45.200 --> 0:35:48.200 nine years old, pre beard Marvin Gaye, yeah, when he 0:35:48.360 --> 0:35:51.720 still still suits, you know, yeah, stubborn kind of fellow 0:35:51.719 --> 0:35:53.160 Mark early. 0:35:54.160 --> 0:35:56.600 Was it just like man? Or did you it? 0:35:56.600 --> 0:35:57.520 Because I loved all that shit? 0:35:57.600 --> 0:35:57.799 Yeah? 0:35:57.800 --> 0:36:00.520 Okay, yeah, I loved all And there used to be 0:36:01.440 --> 0:36:03.600 a theater out in the valley in Woodland Hills called 0:36:03.600 --> 0:36:05.400 the Valley Music Theater. It was one of those theaters 0:36:05.400 --> 0:36:08.760 in the round. Valley Music Theater used to do shows. 0:36:08.800 --> 0:36:11.760 And this was before the rock and roll industrial complex, 0:36:11.760 --> 0:36:13.840 as we've come to know it came to Puish and 0:36:13.920 --> 0:36:16.760 came to life. And in those days, all this baby 0:36:16.840 --> 0:36:19.120 rock bands were out here making records, but there was 0:36:19.120 --> 0:36:21.440 really they're having hits, but there was nowhere for them 0:36:21.480 --> 0:36:23.200 to play. They weren't touring, so they would do a 0:36:23.239 --> 0:36:26.200 lot of promotion shows for local pop station r KRLA, 0:36:26.320 --> 0:36:29.360 and so Carol A did a show at the Valley 0:36:29.400 --> 0:36:33.480 Music Theater of like the Doors, The Birds, The Buffalo, Springfield, 0:36:34.160 --> 0:36:35.880 three other bands I'm not thinking of right now. I 0:36:35.920 --> 0:36:38.799 remember cutting going out one night, you know, on my 0:36:38.840 --> 0:36:41.320 bike riding to the game. My parents were work. My 0:36:41.440 --> 0:36:43.479 dad was on the road. Mom was with him going 0:36:43.480 --> 0:36:45.839 to that gig and then you know, down the road, 0:36:46.000 --> 0:36:50.920 you know once a, you know, professionally Stones nineteen seventy 0:36:51.520 --> 0:36:54.200 three at the Forum. 0:36:54.280 --> 0:36:57.080 Oh se you saw a post exile show. 0:36:57.280 --> 0:36:59.840 Oh yeah, absolutely. When they did the tour with the 0:37:00.040 --> 0:37:02.400 Lotus Flower that opened, you know, yeah opened like they 0:37:02.400 --> 0:37:04.440 opened a honky talk woman and Mick was hanging off 0:37:04.440 --> 0:37:07.520 the front front Pedes tour. Yeah, it was great. 0:37:07.800 --> 0:37:09.000 Was Stevie opening for them? 0:37:09.040 --> 0:37:12.600 Maybe Stevie was with Ray Parker and Ali and the band. 0:37:12.719 --> 0:37:15.879 Yeah yeah, and uh Denise Williams. 0:37:15.560 --> 0:37:16.600 Do yep, exactly. 0:37:16.640 --> 0:37:21.239 She She gave a lot of debaucherous stories about that. 0:37:22.840 --> 0:37:29.799 And then Bootsy Bootsy at the Forum nineteen seventy eight, 0:37:31.160 --> 0:37:34.440 you know, post the year, yeah, post post the Pfunk 0:37:34.520 --> 0:37:37.759 Earth tour, but just Bootsy play the thing, you know, 0:37:37.920 --> 0:37:41.360 with uh, you know, with Macio doing the the opening 0:37:41.400 --> 0:37:49.399 high Bootsy, you know, you know, the place, the whole 0:37:49.400 --> 0:37:51.120 forum was just shaken. It was amazing. 0:37:56.000 --> 0:38:00.600 So by the mid seventies or even in the late sixties, 0:38:01.440 --> 0:38:05.319 are you trying to figure out what your path or 0:38:05.360 --> 0:38:08.360 what your goal in life was like? And I'm certain 0:38:08.520 --> 0:38:10.120 everyone asked you, like, and what do you want to 0:38:10.160 --> 0:38:11.960 be when you grew Like, all right, so when you 0:38:11.960 --> 0:38:14.000 were twelve, what did you want to be when you 0:38:14.080 --> 0:38:14.400 grew up? 0:38:14.440 --> 0:38:16.200 I wanted to pitch for the Dodgers. I want to 0:38:16.200 --> 0:38:17.480 be in the Black Sandy Kofax. 0:38:18.080 --> 0:38:21.799 Oh okay, this was up. So when you were in 0:38:23.360 --> 0:38:27.040 tenth grade fifteen sixteen, did that change? 0:38:27.600 --> 0:38:29.960 Yeah? I still wanted me Cofax, but I was mourned 0:38:30.000 --> 0:38:31.840 to me. I was also into music at that point, 0:38:32.080 --> 0:38:35.720 and in those days, the Twain hadn't met yet. Where 0:38:35.960 --> 0:38:38.680 you know, basically jocks were jocks, and you know, it 0:38:38.760 --> 0:38:41.400 was very much sort of beer frat shit, you know, 0:38:41.840 --> 0:38:44.319 whereas music was hipper, you know, and the girls were there. 0:38:44.480 --> 0:38:49.280 And so I was like, yeah, I don't know, sports 0:38:49.280 --> 0:38:51.799 things cool, but no, and then it's certain when I 0:38:51.840 --> 0:38:53.760 got to college it all sort of went up and smoked. 0:38:53.880 --> 0:38:57.120 What kind of smoke, indo smoke. 0:38:57.719 --> 0:39:00.319 Yes. By the time you got out of high school, 0:39:00.400 --> 0:39:03.320 Uh huh, would you say, then, that's when you saw 0:39:03.360 --> 0:39:04.120 your path too. 0:39:04.160 --> 0:39:07.000 Yeah, I knew I pretty much wanted to pursue something 0:39:07.000 --> 0:39:09.600 in the music business because right out of high school 0:39:09.600 --> 0:39:11.320 I did not want to go to college. Immediately. I 0:39:11.360 --> 0:39:13.480 wanted to take the you know, the bridge year as 0:39:13.520 --> 0:39:15.600 they called them in those days. Okay, and my parents 0:39:15.680 --> 0:39:18.040 weren't having that, you know, my parents were immediately what 0:39:18.440 --> 0:39:20.120 college was this Boston University? 0:39:20.480 --> 0:39:21.319 Oh shit? 0:39:21.480 --> 0:39:23.799 Okay, So my parents weren't having it. You know, there 0:39:23.880 --> 0:39:26.319 was a striver thing and all that stuff, and if 0:39:26.360 --> 0:39:28.239 you go to Europe it means you're never coming back 0:39:28.239 --> 0:39:31.600 to college. Blah blah blah. So my interest was music. 0:39:31.640 --> 0:39:33.279 You know, I figured, you know, I love my parents deally, 0:39:33.320 --> 0:39:34.640 but I wanted to get as far away from them 0:39:34.680 --> 0:39:37.759 as possible, which is la. I went to Boston, and 0:39:37.800 --> 0:39:40.240 Boston had a very thriving music scene in those days. 0:39:41.160 --> 0:39:44.520 That's it still does, you know, significant college population. So 0:39:44.719 --> 0:39:46.080 I just immersed myself in that. 0:39:47.600 --> 0:39:48.440 It's kept me a live. 0:39:48.920 --> 0:39:51.319 Used to walk down the street. Aerosmith was a local band. 0:39:51.360 --> 0:39:54.120 They're playing in front of the student union. Jay gilesman 0:39:54.239 --> 0:39:56.560 Peter Wolf was still on the radio in Boston. Giles 0:39:56.640 --> 0:39:57.240 band was playing. 0:39:57.360 --> 0:40:00.360 You got to witness these people when they were just upstarts. 0:40:00.200 --> 0:40:03.400 To see Aerosmith every freaking day, it seemed, playing on 0:40:03.520 --> 0:40:06.160 Commonwealth Avenue in front of the BU student Union, you know, 0:40:06.840 --> 0:40:08.440 doing the same stick that they did. You know, a 0:40:08.520 --> 0:40:13.279 zillion years later and cut to nineteen seventy three, seventy four. 0:40:13.880 --> 0:40:15.960 I'm here back home in LA I'm driving down the 0:40:15.960 --> 0:40:18.040 freeway and I'm listening to a rock station k Los 0:40:18.560 --> 0:40:21.040 and dream On plays and your dream. I have that 0:40:21.040 --> 0:40:23.279 moment where they called something here's why do I know 0:40:23.360 --> 0:40:24.920 that song? I know it's from somewhere. It was so 0:40:25.040 --> 0:40:27.239 out of context. And when when the guy fys, oh, 0:40:27.280 --> 0:40:29.719 there are new bad boys from Boston Aerosmith, I was like, 0:40:29.960 --> 0:40:34.920 oh shit, those motherfuckers got So. 0:40:35.200 --> 0:40:36.799 There have been a few guests on our show. 0:40:37.080 --> 0:40:41.040 What earlier you mentioned a and m exact oh John 0:40:41.080 --> 0:40:43.880 McClean that we always miss so you know, I mean, 0:40:43.920 --> 0:40:47.799 we've had guests on the show, notably Lenny Kravitz telling 0:40:47.840 --> 0:40:49.319 me of a period especially like. 0:40:49.400 --> 0:40:52.480 Between seventy five. 0:40:53.760 --> 0:40:58.879 In eighty one, eighty two in which kind of black Hollywood, 0:40:59.200 --> 0:41:02.759 black young Holly would That world was so small that 0:41:02.960 --> 0:41:08.799 you had to know the Carrie Gordy's, the Cravis's, the Medina's, 0:41:09.440 --> 0:41:14.440 like anybody in Apollo. Were you ever sort of associated 0:41:14.560 --> 0:41:18.040 or inducted in that circle? Because everyone seems to have 0:41:18.120 --> 0:41:19.880 known each other. We can never get John McClean on 0:41:19.920 --> 0:41:20.960 the show. And I'm mad as hell. 0:41:22.680 --> 0:41:25.200 I knew people, I knew them, but I didn't hang 0:41:25.400 --> 0:41:26.840 you know, I was in it, but not of it 0:41:27.600 --> 0:41:29.319 because I had my own little sort of world at 0:41:29.320 --> 0:41:33.080 that point, and that was earlier part of seventy five. 0:41:33.120 --> 0:41:35.080 I was already working for Quincy by then. But you know, 0:41:35.239 --> 0:41:37.600 seventy two to seventy three period, that's when I first 0:41:37.640 --> 0:41:40.040 got in the game as a writer. That's when I 0:41:40.080 --> 0:41:42.239 first started doing writing for Soul magazine at the time. 0:41:42.680 --> 0:41:43.439 You wrote for Soul. 0:41:43.680 --> 0:41:44.560 That was my first gig. 0:41:45.360 --> 0:41:47.839 Shit, you know how much money I just put down 0:41:47.880 --> 0:41:50.440 for back issues of Soul? That is crazy. 0:41:50.680 --> 0:41:52.800 Yeah. Actually, the way I ended up there was I 0:41:52.920 --> 0:41:54.279 was there was a kid that I grew up with 0:41:54.400 --> 0:41:57.359 in my neighborhood, a guy called David Guest. David lived 0:41:57.440 --> 0:42:03.280 somewhat infamy as the guy was married somewhat. 0:42:03.960 --> 0:42:07.440 Yeah sure, and U wait, what don't you family? 0:42:08.320 --> 0:42:11.000 And David and I grew up, grew up Ansino together, 0:42:11.200 --> 0:42:13.680 and uh, you know he was he was a record 0:42:13.719 --> 0:42:16.000 troll too. I see David a lot in the music stores. 0:42:16.320 --> 0:42:18.399 We had different pursuits because I was the guitar player. 0:42:18.400 --> 0:42:21.320 I was into gitar you know, guitar rock stuff. David 0:42:21.520 --> 0:42:24.640 was was into girl groups and ship. So we had 0:42:24.680 --> 0:42:27.080 this thing, you know, mississ and whoever got on first 0:42:27.320 --> 0:42:30.160 would pull the other along. So David was writing for 0:42:30.280 --> 0:42:32.440 Soul at that point, and uh he. 0:42:32.640 --> 0:42:36.960 He wrote for Soul magazine. Well, okay, wait for it. 0:42:40.040 --> 0:42:42.840 So so I used to tag along with him to 0:42:42.880 --> 0:42:45.040 shows and stuff because in those days l A the 0:42:45.120 --> 0:42:47.520 sort of deal here was like Monday nights stuff would 0:42:47.520 --> 0:42:49.719 happen at the Whiskey, Tuesday night was opening is at 0:42:49.760 --> 0:42:52.680 the Troubadour. Wednesdays with the Roxy Roxy was opened. By 0:42:53.080 --> 0:42:55.799 Thursday night would be a total experience down the hood 0:42:56.080 --> 0:43:00.279 and from Friday Friday Saturday, Friday Friday Saturday night would 0:43:00.280 --> 0:43:03.960 be concerts. So I would tag with David and as 0:43:05.440 --> 0:43:07.480 and in those days the press was treated with a 0:43:07.520 --> 0:43:11.520 certain level of dare I say respect or cater to. 0:43:12.000 --> 0:43:13.399 And so I would, I would, I would, I would 0:43:13.440 --> 0:43:15.040 hang with my man and get in the rooms, and 0:43:15.120 --> 0:43:18.080 you know, obviously be in this tall tall dude, tall 0:43:18.120 --> 0:43:19.640 black dude in the rooms. There weren't a lot of 0:43:19.719 --> 0:43:22.640 us there. So as a result, one of the things 0:43:22.680 --> 0:43:24.600 that happened was I would see the shows with David. 0:43:24.760 --> 0:43:27.160 And David could hardly write his name, let alone write 0:43:27.200 --> 0:43:29.080 a story. And because I'd gone to a school that 0:43:29.200 --> 0:43:31.800 you know, English was you know, put upon us, I 0:43:31.880 --> 0:43:34.280 wrote all his stories. It wasn't like it was exactly 0:43:34.360 --> 0:43:38.839 true joints. I wrote his joints. So one day David 0:43:38.920 --> 0:43:41.480 had gotten hired by London Records to work with Al 0:43:41.560 --> 0:43:44.080 Green for Hot with High and UH, and he went 0:43:44.120 --> 0:43:46.399 into Regina and Regina and the editor at the time, 0:43:46.400 --> 0:43:48.600 he said, I'm leaving. I'm going to do this, blah blah, David. 0:43:48.600 --> 0:43:50.440 We don't want you to leave. We'll need the stuff 0:43:50.480 --> 0:43:52.160 so much, all that ship, you know, on and on. 0:43:52.480 --> 0:43:54.799 David says, well, you like my stuff so much, meet 0:43:54.880 --> 0:43:57.120 the guy who's been writing it, and and from stage 0:43:57.200 --> 0:44:01.120 left here I come and uh, and they signed me 0:44:01.200 --> 0:44:02.959 something and I wrote a couple you know, I wrote, 0:44:03.000 --> 0:44:05.360 I wrote for him for about a year. That is crazy. 0:44:05.920 --> 0:44:08.200 Okay, So you mentioned those clubs, and this is what 0:44:08.280 --> 0:44:13.440 I want to know. So my period of la obviously, 0:44:13.800 --> 0:44:17.799 I came after I came in on the tail end 0:44:18.080 --> 0:44:25.160 of whatever the former scene was, where like Sunset Boulevard 0:44:26.440 --> 0:44:29.680 was sort of a safe right well, it was also 0:44:29.760 --> 0:44:33.200 the Death Road period, so say after ninety eight, it 0:44:33.320 --> 0:44:37.160 was more you know anyway, you know what I'm trying 0:44:37.160 --> 0:44:37.480 to get at. 0:44:38.120 --> 0:44:43.600 But if you are wanting to hang with like where 0:44:43.600 --> 0:44:46.800 it's hip and your people's like, is the Total Experience 0:44:46.880 --> 0:44:48.359 club the only option in town? 0:44:48.840 --> 0:44:51.719 Mavericks Flats another club I've heard of that? 0:44:51.840 --> 0:44:52.640 Now, where's that at? 0:44:53.200 --> 0:44:55.400 Right down the street from on crnscheall right down the 0:44:55.440 --> 0:44:56.879 street from when the Total Experience. 0:44:56.680 --> 0:44:58.600 Was so it was no thing to hang on Crenshaw 0:44:58.680 --> 0:45:00.799 in the seventies or in the eighties. 0:45:00.680 --> 0:45:04.400 It was well, well, Mavericks and Total Experience in the 0:45:04.480 --> 0:45:07.880 eighties maybe the Comedy Act theater. Okay, you know there 0:45:07.920 --> 0:45:08.759 was stuff to do there. 0:45:09.160 --> 0:45:11.680 Comedy Act is where like Robin Harrison. 0:45:11.480 --> 0:45:13.040 Yeah, exactly, that's how I signed up. 0:45:13.600 --> 0:45:15.880 Damn, that's right, you signed Robin Harris. 0:45:16.000 --> 0:45:16.320 I got that. 0:45:17.239 --> 0:45:20.799 So for you, though, were you an open format fan, 0:45:21.680 --> 0:45:23.759 as in Okay, I'm gonna see Arrismith one night and 0:45:23.880 --> 0:45:25.759 the next night, I'm gonna see Rufus next night. 0:45:25.960 --> 0:45:28.840 Absolutely country, whatever the case may be. You know, I 0:45:28.960 --> 0:45:29.200 get it. 0:45:29.840 --> 0:45:31.959 Were you at all and see the La punk scene 0:45:32.560 --> 0:45:34.600 like not much, not much, so you didn't see like 0:45:34.680 --> 0:45:35.759 bands like X or nothing. 0:45:35.760 --> 0:45:39.760 I did see X, did see Missing Persons, Chili Peppers 0:45:40.120 --> 0:45:42.480 with the Chili Peppers, So. 0:45:42.560 --> 0:45:46.719 We were like those pre skoy Fish bony post punk 0:45:46.920 --> 0:45:47.839 band Where would they. 0:45:47.800 --> 0:45:51.320 Play Madam Wongs Madame Woks was a Chinese restaurant on 0:45:52.360 --> 0:45:57.840 on Wilshire Boulevard, Don Don Brentwood, Borderline, Brentwood, Santa Monica, 0:45:58.040 --> 0:46:00.680 and then also there was Madame Wongs downtown. They would 0:46:00.680 --> 0:46:06.040 play there, or the star Wood, which was at Los 0:46:06.120 --> 0:46:10.239 Sienega in Santa Monica Boulevard. Isn't that still a or 0:46:10.520 --> 0:46:14.120 of Creston Heights and Santa Minchael Boulevard. It's not there anymore. 0:46:14.120 --> 0:46:16.160 I think it's been developed into like a mini mall 0:46:16.280 --> 0:46:19.480 or something. But that was a place where Van Halen 0:46:19.520 --> 0:46:24.600 emerged from, and I remember seeing Clinton do the Uncle 0:46:24.680 --> 0:46:27.839 Jam Tour there, Uncle Jam Jam Show there, Funkadelic show. 0:46:28.080 --> 0:46:30.680 Okay, you mentioned working for Quincy. What was your first 0:46:31.440 --> 0:46:32.120 industry get? 0:46:32.520 --> 0:46:35.320 Well, they paid me any money or just period because 0:46:37.000 --> 0:46:39.879 where you start soul music thing and then also soul 0:46:39.960 --> 0:46:41.839 magazine thing. And also I had a gig at Rogers 0:46:41.960 --> 0:46:44.960 and Collen one summer PR from Big Time PR from 0:46:45.000 --> 0:46:49.640 here Intown. They were looking after Stacks, uh, and the 0:46:49.719 --> 0:46:52.400 guy who was who was the head publicist there, a 0:46:52.440 --> 0:46:56.200 guy called Sandy Friedman. Sandy hired me to do some 0:46:56.280 --> 0:46:58.840 writing for them. I was working in the mailroom. Actually 0:46:59.040 --> 0:47:01.760 Deanie Parker, who was ahead of PR for for Stacks, 0:47:02.280 --> 0:47:05.080 recommended me for this job. Al Bell recommended for the 0:47:05.160 --> 0:47:07.920 job actually in the mail room at Rogers and Cowen, 0:47:08.000 --> 0:47:11.279 and Uh, I was you know, I was token black kid. 0:47:11.360 --> 0:47:13.600 Did they hired because they had a black account And 0:47:13.680 --> 0:47:16.280 so I was there and did that for a minute. 0:47:16.840 --> 0:47:20.600 And you wait, guys, we we just had a guest 0:47:20.640 --> 0:47:23.840 on the show that also started out as PR and remote. 0:47:25.000 --> 0:47:26.880 I'm sorry, I was trying to get mine. Have you 0:47:27.080 --> 0:47:33.560 ran into him in circles before? Okay, now I get it, 0:47:33.640 --> 0:47:34.000 I get it. 0:47:34.160 --> 0:47:37.640 Okay, Yeah, so you so the time, did. 0:47:37.600 --> 0:47:40.719 You think you're going to start as a publicist. 0:47:40.360 --> 0:47:42.440 Or I kind of was that. I mean, Quincy initially 0:47:42.520 --> 0:47:44.960 hired me. That's pretty much what I was there to do. 0:47:45.120 --> 0:47:46.640 You know, I was there to sort of blow up. 0:47:46.920 --> 0:47:49.240 He called me a pigmy stretcher. He said, go stretch 0:47:49.280 --> 0:47:56.560 some fucking pigmies and that's Quincy pylons. Yeah, so he 0:47:56.680 --> 0:47:59.359 hired me to as he said, I'll make the music, 0:47:59.440 --> 0:48:01.840 you make the no and uh and that that was 0:48:01.920 --> 0:48:03.960 kind of what I did. So, Sarah, you basically do 0:48:04.160 --> 0:48:06.719 pr marketing and sort of keep an eye on his 0:48:06.880 --> 0:48:09.719 interest at the record company. And I was floating around 0:48:09.719 --> 0:48:11.120 the n M a lot people looking at me like, 0:48:11.160 --> 0:48:12.839 who is this nigga? What's he doing here? What's he doing? 0:48:12.960 --> 0:48:13.400 And this was it. 0:48:13.520 --> 0:48:16.280 This is for Quest Records, Quincy Jones Productions. 0:48:16.840 --> 0:48:18.439 So it was just like doing the sounds and stuff 0:48:18.480 --> 0:48:20.480 like that period or body heat, body heat. 0:48:21.760 --> 0:48:24.520 So he the reason why he did a really random 0:48:24.600 --> 0:48:27.480 guest on Soul Train, like with the brothers Johnson is my. 0:48:27.480 --> 0:48:31.799 Brother playing drums, my little brother playing drums. Yeah, yeah, 0:48:31.880 --> 0:48:32.760 guys playing drums. 0:48:32.960 --> 0:48:38.040 Oh my god, oh my god. Oh I'm sorry now 0:48:39.360 --> 0:48:44.320 to watch it. What are your relationships like? 0:48:44.640 --> 0:48:47.760 Because I know now for instans like there's former interns 0:48:47.800 --> 0:48:51.160 of mine at the Tonight show that then interned that 0:48:51.239 --> 0:48:55.319 record labels and maybe in a year or two they'll 0:48:55.440 --> 0:48:57.799 figure out, Okay, my n R, my publicist or whatever. 0:48:58.200 --> 0:48:59.399 There's a system to go through. 0:48:59.800 --> 0:49:03.160 Are are you going through a road less traveled? Like 0:49:03.239 --> 0:49:07.239 in terms of publicity, like how do you know who 0:49:07.440 --> 0:49:08.680 to market Quincy Jones? 0:49:08.719 --> 0:49:10.840 Too? Like do you know the people at People magazine? 0:49:10.880 --> 0:49:12.920 Do you know if Rolling Stone's into them? 0:49:13.600 --> 0:49:16.560 It was at that point it was just pull out 0:49:16.600 --> 0:49:19.560 the gun and shoot where you may, you know, good luck, 0:49:19.719 --> 0:49:23.040 you know. So it was just too I mean, at 0:49:23.080 --> 0:49:27.400 that point he had voluminous credits and not a lot 0:49:27.440 --> 0:49:31.360 of hits, you know, and my job is to basically 0:49:31.680 --> 0:49:34.640 make those voluminous credits seem As I used to say 0:49:34.640 --> 0:49:37.600 at the time, you say to people, you know Quincy Jones, Yeah, 0:49:37.600 --> 0:49:40.479 I know the name. What can you have? No idea? 0:49:40.680 --> 0:49:43.080 People didn't really know what to attach the name to, 0:49:43.200 --> 0:49:45.560 you know, and my jobs attached to I wanted to know. 0:49:45.600 --> 0:49:48.160 How potent he was pre off the wall in terms 0:49:48.239 --> 0:49:51.879 of like because I know the idea of Quincy Jones, 0:49:52.000 --> 0:49:56.560 especially now, he's definitely the post thriller effect, and you know, 0:49:56.680 --> 0:49:58.840 he's told me stories that even off the wall was 0:49:58.840 --> 0:50:01.120 a hard selle because like they didn't want him, you know, 0:50:01.280 --> 0:50:03.120 the guy's old, past his prime. 0:50:03.239 --> 0:50:06.080 Whatever. Well, actually the line was they said, he'll make 0:50:06.120 --> 0:50:08.400 him sound. He'll make Michael sound like the brothers Johnson 0:50:09.000 --> 0:50:14.279 and Brothers were, which Platinum was great, and Mike was like, okay, right, 0:50:15.000 --> 0:50:17.839 I see that. But in terms of the potency, I mean, 0:50:17.960 --> 0:50:19.840 obviously it was it was a build because when he 0:50:20.000 --> 0:50:23.280 hired me. Ostensibly. The short of the very long story 0:50:23.440 --> 0:50:26.359 is I was there to do an interview with him 0:50:26.360 --> 0:50:29.200 about Body Heat. I got a call from the publicity 0:50:29.239 --> 0:50:31.800 department A and M asking me what I'm interested in 0:50:31.840 --> 0:50:33.680 talking to him about body Eat. So I listened to 0:50:33.680 --> 0:50:35.719 the record, loved it, said I'd love to. And I 0:50:35.840 --> 0:50:37.920 had known him since I was a kid because he 0:50:38.000 --> 0:50:40.360 had conducted for my dad and and he had signed 0:50:40.360 --> 0:50:42.400 my dad. He made some of my dad's records at 0:50:42.440 --> 0:50:45.040 Mercury when he was head of A and rn't Mercury. 0:50:46.880 --> 0:50:48.880 So we went. He told me to meet him at 0:50:48.920 --> 0:50:50.560 A and M because he was still doing his big 0:50:50.640 --> 0:50:53.759 band down down at Disneyland. Disneyland used to do big 0:50:53.840 --> 0:50:56.440 band shows during the summer. Uh, he said, meet him 0:50:56.440 --> 0:50:58.080 in a. M met him in a and M got 0:50:58.160 --> 0:51:01.080 on the band bus, went down there. We sat backstage 0:51:01.120 --> 0:51:03.600 and talked for you know, all night. He never did 0:51:03.680 --> 0:51:05.440 do the interview, so come by the crib the next day. 0:51:05.480 --> 0:51:08.400 I did, and talked more for twelve more hours. Never 0:51:08.480 --> 0:51:10.200 did do the interview, told me to come back Sunday 0:51:10.239 --> 0:51:12.360 and do it again. We didn't again on Sunday, and 0:51:12.440 --> 0:51:15.080 I really never did do the interview. And I realized 0:51:15.120 --> 0:51:16.600 after it was all said and done, while I was 0:51:16.640 --> 0:51:19.160 there to interview him, he was actually interviewing to me, 0:51:20.480 --> 0:51:22.400 and the truth was he had. He explained to me 0:51:22.600 --> 0:51:25.640 something I came to realize years later. Quincy shed skin 0:51:26.040 --> 0:51:28.080 every seven years seven years or so. You know, he 0:51:28.120 --> 0:51:30.480 makes changes overall, and changes and whatever he's working on, 0:51:31.160 --> 0:51:33.040 and he was about to make. He said to me, 0:51:33.440 --> 0:51:36.759 body heat was indicative of many things he was. He 0:51:36.840 --> 0:51:39.320 was moving away from the whole big band arrangement anything 0:51:39.440 --> 0:51:43.319 to a more rhythm section based electronic R and B vox. 0:51:43.640 --> 0:51:45.160 And as he said to me, say man, he said, 0:51:45.160 --> 0:51:47.120 I feel like every day I'm going to film studios 0:51:47.160 --> 0:51:49.440 doing this big band conducting thing, but I'm going home 0:51:49.480 --> 0:51:52.440 at night listening to Stevie Rufus and Chako Ohio Players 0:51:52.480 --> 0:51:54.319 and Earth Wind and Fire and he said, I want 0:51:54.320 --> 0:51:55.879 to I want to jump in those waters. And that's 0:51:55.920 --> 0:51:59.760 ostensibly what Body Heat was. And then you know, Body 0:51:59.800 --> 0:52:02.719 Heat was his first gold record worked Melon Madness was 0:52:02.880 --> 0:52:06.120 you know, first platinum record, first golden platinum, and Brothers 0:52:06.160 --> 0:52:08.919 Johnson Lookout for Number One was also platinum, the first 0:52:09.000 --> 0:52:11.400 golden platinum albums by Black Arts the A and M 0:52:11.480 --> 0:52:13.520 had had and he just you know, slowly built it 0:52:13.560 --> 0:52:16.239 from there. You know, it's crazy. Yeah, I found your 0:52:16.280 --> 0:52:19.759 brother by the way, Yep, yep, there is that back 0:52:20.000 --> 0:52:20.920 to my brother guy. 0:52:27.520 --> 0:52:30.399 What is your How long did you stay with Quincy Jones? 0:52:30.440 --> 0:52:33.160 And he was there for eleven years from nineteen seventy 0:52:33.200 --> 0:52:34.239 three to nineteen eighty four. 0:52:35.719 --> 0:52:40.040 Wow, who was the brain trust behind his branding? 0:52:40.719 --> 0:52:43.439 Like I've never seen someone have their logo on someone 0:52:43.480 --> 0:52:44.480 else's record before. 0:52:44.600 --> 0:52:46.640 Yeah, he said, he was like, I want to, I 0:52:46.719 --> 0:52:48.719 want my logo on there, you know, and said we 0:52:49.080 --> 0:52:50.080 thought helped him fight for it. 0:52:50.200 --> 0:52:54.880 But that's so unprecedented though, Like who knew to do that? 0:52:55.200 --> 0:52:55.239 Like? 0:52:55.400 --> 0:52:56.319 Is that is that the first? 0:52:56.440 --> 0:52:56.520 Uh? 0:52:56.960 --> 0:52:59.200 What do you call the drop that every producer has like, oh, 0:52:59.600 --> 0:53:06.080 like a guy a producer tag like this music. No, no, 0:53:06.200 --> 0:53:08.840 but seriously, I mean, if not to that extent, but no, 0:53:09.120 --> 0:53:12.319 it really was great, Brandon, because every time you saw 0:53:12.440 --> 0:53:14.759 that logo, you knew what the record was going to 0:53:14.800 --> 0:53:17.640 sound you, at least for me as a kid, like 0:53:17.800 --> 0:53:20.840 reading that and seeing Quincy Jones productions like, Okay, I 0:53:20.960 --> 0:53:23.800 know I'm getting Polino Da Costa, Jerry Hay, I know 0:53:23.880 --> 0:53:26.359 I'm getting Rod Tempersent, right, you know what I mean? 0:53:26.440 --> 0:53:28.960 It was already just kind of a building selling. 0:53:29.120 --> 0:53:30.600 The other thing we said you to is when he 0:53:30.760 --> 0:53:33.120 was doing a new artist, So I said, Quincy Jones presents, 0:53:33.600 --> 0:53:35.200 you know, Brothers Johnson or whatever. 0:53:36.160 --> 0:53:39.759 At any point do you sort of elevate past like 0:53:39.920 --> 0:53:43.879 doing this publicity to like actually working, So like, why 0:53:43.960 --> 0:53:47.400 do you work with Patty Austin where it's weird, Like 0:53:47.480 --> 0:53:50.279 I know, I believe she's this god daughter or. 0:53:54.000 --> 0:53:54.840 Her I feel like forever? 0:53:55.040 --> 0:54:00.040 Right, So, like, what was your first big. 0:54:00.080 --> 0:54:02.520 Responsibility Brothers Brothers Johnson. 0:54:03.000 --> 0:54:03.239 Really? 0:54:03.400 --> 0:54:03.600 Yeah? 0:54:03.800 --> 0:54:06.200 Okay? So for those three four. 0:54:06.440 --> 0:54:09.160 Albums, ibserved for four records, from the first album through 0:54:09.360 --> 0:54:12.959 through the st the Night. Okay, look out for number 0:54:13.000 --> 0:54:17.400 one second record, right, on time, right on time, and the. 0:54:17.440 --> 0:54:20.080 Worst beating in my life. Well, you know, because they 0:54:20.200 --> 0:54:24.240 jumped again. This is another impressible Americans in Trouble story. 0:54:24.880 --> 0:54:27.360 You know, they're jumping on the album cover and the 0:54:27.920 --> 0:54:32.920 I guess the camera right, And so I once I 0:54:33.400 --> 0:54:37.480 used to always go to my dad's band mates like 0:54:37.719 --> 0:54:40.640 and try it jumping, and I jumped and dropped the 0:54:41.560 --> 0:54:46.440 dad's guitar players and yeah, boy, and talk about lookout. 0:54:46.160 --> 0:54:47.760 For number one. Number one was the belt. 0:54:49.600 --> 0:54:50.279 You live to tell? 0:54:50.719 --> 0:54:50.919 Yeah? 0:54:51.360 --> 0:54:54.320 Yeah, man, Yeah, So, like, what were your duties in 0:54:54.480 --> 0:54:55.760 terms of their projects? 0:54:56.360 --> 0:55:00.440 I was de facto manager, but really yeah, like a 0:55:01.000 --> 0:55:03.279 project manager or like manager. 0:55:02.920 --> 0:55:05.919 Of that product manager product as well as artist manager. 0:55:05.960 --> 0:55:08.000 You know, just sort of connected the dots on his 0:55:08.080 --> 0:55:11.200 behalf because in the early days, the first three records, 0:55:11.280 --> 0:55:13.760 yeah there were, Quincy had a management company called Mellow 0:55:13.840 --> 0:55:16.239 Management and then and it was he basically he and 0:55:16.280 --> 0:55:19.640 I got a guy called Peter Long and Peter Long 0:55:19.719 --> 0:55:22.880 actually was It's funny missed in Sesame Street. He was 0:55:22.960 --> 0:55:26.759 married to uh along the red along, Yeah, exactly, and 0:55:26.840 --> 0:55:28.960 Peter Peter was how long was he married to a 0:55:29.000 --> 0:55:29.399 long time? 0:55:29.520 --> 0:55:30.719 He played keyboards? Right? No? 0:55:30.960 --> 0:55:33.520 Uh no, He was a stage manager at the Apollo 0:55:34.000 --> 0:55:38.399 and he and he ran the Apollo Kids. Luther came 0:55:38.480 --> 0:55:40.440 through there. Now Rogers came through there. 0:55:40.560 --> 0:55:46.040 Yeah, and Luther the only authorized book. That's how I know. 0:55:46.120 --> 0:55:51.080 The name Luther kind of speaks of how like wanting 0:55:51.239 --> 0:55:57.480 Peter Long's approval of Like I guess Peter was sort 0:55:57.520 --> 0:56:00.960 of like the doting father that you know, never gave. 0:56:01.360 --> 0:56:04.920 He was very acerbic, right, and Luther. 0:56:04.800 --> 0:56:08.160 Always felt like no matter he would sell out consonants. 0:56:08.200 --> 0:56:09.279 He was Luther Vangrosen. 0:56:09.920 --> 0:56:14.040 Finally, like maybe the Busy Body tour, the Night I 0:56:14.120 --> 0:56:16.799 Fell in Love tour, like Peter Long was like. 0:56:17.800 --> 0:56:18.360 I'm proud of you. 0:56:18.480 --> 0:56:20.960 You did well for yourself, and like Luther like cried, 0:56:21.080 --> 0:56:22.960 like finally I made my dad proud, like that sort 0:56:23.000 --> 0:56:23.239 of thing. 0:56:23.960 --> 0:56:25.480 That's how I know Peter Long. 0:56:25.680 --> 0:56:29.160 Yeah, Peter was the responsible adult because during the course 0:56:29.239 --> 0:56:31.640 of the early period of my existence with Quincy, he 0:56:31.680 --> 0:56:33.840 would always bring in because I was a kid. He 0:56:33.960 --> 0:56:36.560 hired me when I was nineteen, and he would always 0:56:36.600 --> 0:56:38.880 bring in a so called responsible adult to kind of 0:56:38.960 --> 0:56:40.880 you know, balance me out, you know, make sure I 0:56:40.920 --> 0:56:43.839 didn't get two buck. And Peter was that guy. 0:56:44.480 --> 0:56:44.800 Okay. 0:56:44.920 --> 0:56:47.879 Yeah, so as a manager, and so I'm glad I'm 0:56:47.920 --> 0:56:49.960 interviewing someone who was a manager in the seventies. 0:56:51.800 --> 0:56:58.240 Were writers a thing? Yeah that okay, so similar to now. 0:56:58.880 --> 0:57:01.960 Ish but yeah, but you know now they're more pronounced, 0:57:02.360 --> 0:57:04.960 and in those days, you know, it was primarily you know, 0:57:05.320 --> 0:57:08.600 the black promoters consortium, you know, so you know, if 0:57:08.640 --> 0:57:10.840 you tried that, I only want the red eminems like 0:57:10.920 --> 0:57:11.759 nigga fuck all right. 0:57:15.040 --> 0:57:17.960 So I later found out from David Lee Roth that 0:57:18.200 --> 0:57:21.040 they weren't separating the green eminems. If you don't know, 0:57:21.800 --> 0:57:27.400 Van Halen was world famous for separating the brown eminem's 0:57:27.520 --> 0:57:30.840 from the pile, and we thought that was the most 0:57:31.240 --> 0:57:34.080 arrogant rock star the boucher shit ever but we later 0:57:34.560 --> 0:57:38.800 discovered that not true. Yeah, we later found out that 0:57:39.080 --> 0:57:41.520 the reason why Van Halen had that in their writer 0:57:42.520 --> 0:57:47.439 was because sometimes promoters would not read the writers at all. 0:57:47.560 --> 0:57:49.840 To see if you're paying attention to details, right, And 0:57:50.080 --> 0:57:52.560 so that was the that was the thing. Wait, one 0:57:52.640 --> 0:57:54.080 more question about them. 0:57:56.160 --> 0:57:59.160 What happened in nineteen eighty one with the Winners record 0:57:59.280 --> 0:58:02.320 and why didn't Quincy produced that album? 0:58:02.720 --> 0:58:04.560 I was gone by that, I mean, I wasn't gone. 0:58:04.600 --> 0:58:10.040 Then you know, guys wanted to Quincy got tired of 0:58:10.160 --> 0:58:12.680 hearing Yeah, these records are great, but wait till you 0:58:12.760 --> 0:58:14.240 hear what we do when we get a chance to 0:58:14.240 --> 0:58:16.720 do it ourselves, you know. And Quincy was like, okay, 0:58:17.320 --> 0:58:18.320 have some with that, right. 0:58:19.000 --> 0:58:21.520 It's weird because it's not like they stopped working with 0:58:21.840 --> 0:58:24.680 I mean, you know Lewis still yeah, exactly was working 0:58:24.720 --> 0:58:27.440 with them. But in their mind they're like, did they 0:58:27.480 --> 0:58:29.560 feel as though they wanted to get a more modern 0:58:29.680 --> 0:58:30.480 sound or you. 0:58:30.560 --> 0:58:32.280 Thought they had graduated and were ready to get out 0:58:32.360 --> 0:58:34.320 on their own, you know, ah, and. 0:58:34.320 --> 0:58:39.480 You don't let that happen. Is this also a classic 0:58:39.560 --> 0:58:42.120 case of like, you know, you got to let them 0:58:42.160 --> 0:58:42.959 find out on their. 0:58:42.880 --> 0:58:45.280 Own, and he did in their own way. And then 0:58:45.360 --> 0:58:47.400 then also Quincy at that point is doing other stuff, 0:58:47.520 --> 0:58:50.840 so you know, Mike mic and his own records, and. 0:58:51.480 --> 0:58:52.760 So where did you jump to after that? 0:58:54.120 --> 0:59:00.560 After Ariston? I went to aristone eighty four. I started 0:59:00.600 --> 0:59:03.600 in January eighty five, I had uh, so. 0:59:03.680 --> 0:59:07.000 It's kind of after you No, well, I mean I 0:59:07.080 --> 0:59:09.560 always consider Angelo Bouthfield like mine. 0:59:09.960 --> 0:59:12.280 Yeah, I loved it, loved her, I loved her. 0:59:12.440 --> 0:59:16.200 Yeah, what was he like because anytime she was on television, 0:59:16.840 --> 0:59:19.400 she was the most her and Tota Vega was the 0:59:19.480 --> 0:59:23.840 most eccentric humans I've ever seen get interviewed. 0:59:24.040 --> 0:59:26.400 Right, she was and what was about her? 0:59:26.600 --> 0:59:26.640 Like? 0:59:27.080 --> 0:59:28.040 Was he just does she have? 0:59:28.280 --> 0:59:28.320 Like? 0:59:28.600 --> 0:59:29.840 Was humor her shield? 0:59:30.240 --> 0:59:32.040 I don't know. I was crushed out because you know, 0:59:32.160 --> 0:59:34.320 she was on g RP and Gruson is one of 0:59:34.360 --> 0:59:35.760 Quincy's closest friends, and it was. 0:59:35.920 --> 0:59:37.640 D Dave Bruson really ran GRP. 0:59:38.160 --> 0:59:41.480 He and Larry Larry Rosen. Yeah, and I remember when 0:59:41.520 --> 0:59:43.800 she played here for the Angela Night record, you know, 0:59:44.240 --> 0:59:46.560 big coming out party here in La and I was 0:59:47.040 --> 0:59:51.280 I was crushed out, crushed out fanboy. And uh, when 0:59:51.320 --> 0:59:55.360 I got to Arista, they too tough, had just sort 0:59:55.400 --> 0:59:58.000 of happened, had happened, and they were doing the Greatest 0:59:58.040 --> 1:00:03.160 Hits record, and Clive had me looking for songs for 1:00:03.240 --> 1:00:05.200 the Greatest Hits Record. You know they want to add 1:00:05.280 --> 1:00:07.600 two extra song, Yeah, extra song. So we just song 1:00:07.680 --> 1:00:10.200 called Still in Love that Derek Bramble produced and wrote. 1:00:10.600 --> 1:00:14.040 And uh, and she should call me high ed. She 1:00:14.120 --> 1:00:17.320 had little little cutesy voice and she was, you know, 1:00:17.640 --> 1:00:20.040 said kind of eccentric. Yeah, she was cool she's. 1:00:19.920 --> 1:00:21.680 Very under the moon and over the star. 1:00:21.880 --> 1:00:22.520 Yeah, exactly. 1:00:23.200 --> 1:00:28.200 So what was working with prime Clive Davis? 1:00:28.520 --> 1:00:32.160 Like, well, nineteen eighty four, when Quincy and I stopped 1:00:32.200 --> 1:00:34.120 working together, I got a call from Neil Port. Now 1:00:34.600 --> 1:00:36.760 Port now you know who ran the Grammys. And Neil 1:00:36.800 --> 1:00:38.320 at that point was ahead of West head of the 1:00:38.320 --> 1:00:41.200 West Coast for Arista. So he calls me because I 1:00:41.240 --> 1:00:43.840 knew him from from record business out here. He worked 1:00:43.840 --> 1:00:46.600 for twenty Century Records, worked Verry White and stuff like that, 1:00:47.160 --> 1:00:50.160 Very White, and then James Inger, the original James's first 1:00:50.200 --> 1:00:53.800 deal was actually a twentieth twentieth Century Wow. Yeah, we 1:00:53.960 --> 1:00:56.680 jacked him basically from them. Okay, And Neil calls me 1:00:56.760 --> 1:00:58.880 one day in the office and and what's up. Neil says, 1:00:59.120 --> 1:01:02.040 there's a rumor that you're leaving Quincy. He said, it's 1:01:02.080 --> 1:01:04.360 not a rumor. I said, I'm leaving. He said, would 1:01:04.360 --> 1:01:06.240 you be interested in talking to Clive? It's because Jerry 1:01:06.240 --> 1:01:08.280 Griffith is leaving. Jerry Griffith, being the guy who had 1:01:08.280 --> 1:01:10.840 signed Whitney, found Whitney. He said, would you be interested 1:01:10.840 --> 1:01:12.920 in talking to Clive? You know, I said yeah, sure, 1:01:12.960 --> 1:01:14.800 Because I was well aware of the legend of and 1:01:14.880 --> 1:01:17.640 all that stuff, and had never met the man. Neil says, 1:01:17.720 --> 1:01:19.880 he said, there's just one thing to remember, and I said, well, 1:01:19.960 --> 1:01:22.800 he said, Eris is a label of artists, and Clive's 1:01:22.840 --> 1:01:26.600 the biggest artist on the label. And uh, oh, I 1:01:26.720 --> 1:01:29.360 got you. So I got a call and met him 1:01:29.360 --> 1:01:31.520 over at the Beverly Hills Hotel. You know, the legendary 1:01:31.960 --> 1:01:35.480 Enclaver he olds court when he's here, and uh in 1:01:35.600 --> 1:01:38.240 a in a suite, you know, with speakers. Basically I 1:01:38.280 --> 1:01:41.720 thought it was in a fucking Metallica gig, you know, cranked, 1:01:41.960 --> 1:01:45.200 you know, and he people music and he's blasting, you know, 1:01:45.640 --> 1:01:48.400 and he's played me Whitney. He's Whitney was working progress. 1:01:48.480 --> 1:01:51.560 The first record he played, You Give Good Love, played 1:01:52.160 --> 1:01:54.640 a bit of how well I Know and Saving All 1:01:54.640 --> 1:01:57.680 My Love for you, and you know when just back 1:01:57.720 --> 1:01:59.440 to back to back, and you couldn't really talk to 1:01:59.520 --> 1:02:01.240 him after I said, oh, that's Whitney. Hears that. He 1:02:01.280 --> 1:02:04.360 goes really, how'd you know? I said, I said, I 1:02:04.440 --> 1:02:07.040 know these things, you know. And recently they had had 1:02:07.080 --> 1:02:10.040 a showcase here in LA for writers and producers, which 1:02:10.120 --> 1:02:11.920 was kind of legendary story at the time, where he 1:02:12.000 --> 1:02:14.800 was pitching for songs and stuff, and Quincy couldn't make it. 1:02:15.000 --> 1:02:18.840 But I was well aware, and you know, Whitney was fine, 1:02:19.080 --> 1:02:21.280 you know, and I was smart enough to know that. 1:02:21.880 --> 1:02:23.960 So do those things generally work? 1:02:24.520 --> 1:02:29.400 Like when you gather uh, you know, a bunch of 1:02:29.680 --> 1:02:33.080 of of not even named brand but writers and producers 1:02:33.880 --> 1:02:37.120 in a room and someone tries to sell you on 1:02:37.240 --> 1:02:39.840 their artists, like we're going to really make it work. 1:02:40.320 --> 1:02:43.120 Sometimes that generally work. Sometimes when its Clive Davis or 1:02:43.160 --> 1:02:46.280 Quincy Jones. Yeah, you know, so when it's just you know, 1:02:46.640 --> 1:02:51.880 some pisher an our guy, but not so much. But yeah, 1:02:51.960 --> 1:02:54.040 so you know, he played me, played me, that played 1:02:54.080 --> 1:02:56.520 me a kashif some of the Kachiff record that was 1:02:56.600 --> 1:03:01.640 in motion Kenny g record, which was basically record with 1:03:01.680 --> 1:03:02.680 Kenny playing solos. 1:03:03.360 --> 1:03:07.280 Was he generally you know, okay, not not to throw 1:03:07.440 --> 1:03:09.720 the bus, but like kind of like the way that 1:03:09.840 --> 1:03:13.200 Jimmy Ivying operated during the time when we were under 1:03:13.360 --> 1:03:16.560 the tutelage of Jimmy Ivy. Like, you know, it's like 1:03:16.760 --> 1:03:18.720 if you're in a world where you're dealing with sting 1:03:19.240 --> 1:03:23.400 and no doubt in eminem then it's like you might 1:03:23.560 --> 1:03:26.680 just get like a once a year below there and whatever. 1:03:26.800 --> 1:03:29.880 But in general, was Clive the type of artist that 1:03:30.720 --> 1:03:31.800 paid attention. 1:03:31.560 --> 1:03:35.240 To a group like Real, a group like Real to Real, 1:03:35.680 --> 1:03:38.880 just like he would you know about Real to Real, Dude, 1:03:39.000 --> 1:03:40.400 I'm a leon. We're a leon. 1:03:43.360 --> 1:03:45.400 And I took him a copy of the Real Real cassette. 1:03:45.440 --> 1:03:46.640 He'd forgotten all about it, Dude. 1:03:46.640 --> 1:03:50.400 They just released that that album. They just digitized it 1:03:50.520 --> 1:03:52.920 like maybe a month ago. Wow, it's finally on streaming. 1:03:53.240 --> 1:03:55.160 But I'm saying, would he pay attention to them as 1:03:55.240 --> 1:03:57.440 much as he would air supply or no? 1:03:57.840 --> 1:04:03.680 No, I don't know their situation. I mean basically the 1:04:03.800 --> 1:04:05.560 role of thumb that we had amongst the A and 1:04:05.600 --> 1:04:07.560 our staff, whether it was true or not, but it was. 1:04:07.640 --> 1:04:10.600 We found it to be the practical reality, which was 1:04:10.680 --> 1:04:12.880 if he had stuff that he was excited about at 1:04:12.920 --> 1:04:15.880 one point and then somehow had lost its luster, it 1:04:15.920 --> 1:04:18.600 didn't perform in the marketplace or whatever, and they went 1:04:18.640 --> 1:04:20.200 back in to do their fill in the blank second 1:04:20.280 --> 1:04:22.120 or third record, and the new songs that came in 1:04:22.200 --> 1:04:24.240 weren't his cool and blah blah blah, but they didn't 1:04:24.280 --> 1:04:27.040 want to pay out to throw the bone to the 1:04:27.080 --> 1:04:29.480 ANR guys, here fix this, you know. And Real the 1:04:29.520 --> 1:04:31.960 Real was one of those situations for me. 1:04:32.360 --> 1:04:36.440 Okay, now know what happened to like average White Band and. 1:04:38.040 --> 1:04:40.200 Real the Real and Patrese. 1:04:40.760 --> 1:04:44.520 Yeah that's right, but yeah it feels so real, like well, 1:04:45.280 --> 1:04:47.400 it's hard to tell, like when if you're a kid 1:04:47.480 --> 1:04:51.760 and you hear a song long enough as yeah, yeah, 1:04:51.880 --> 1:04:54.840 but okay, So even Jeffrey Osborne explained to his situation 1:04:55.120 --> 1:04:57.520 with with the Aerosmith and the same with Ray Parker Jr. 1:04:58.120 --> 1:05:01.760 So yeah, like who would you at at Arista? Who 1:05:02.040 --> 1:05:03.880 what was your duties there as far as like. 1:05:04.120 --> 1:05:07.000 I was vice president of an R for aren't the 1:05:07.120 --> 1:05:08.479 R and b R and B area? 1:05:08.600 --> 1:05:10.040 What X came onto your tutelage? 1:05:12.280 --> 1:05:17.320 Obviously they were under clives too, right, you know? But uh, Aretha, 1:05:17.720 --> 1:05:21.760 it was during the Freeway love period, just heavily during 1:05:21.760 --> 1:05:24.080 the Narda period. I have some great fun. 1:05:24.640 --> 1:05:25.480 Yeah, please give me. 1:05:26.280 --> 1:05:34.280 I'm also curious about just how jazz fusion guys, ironically 1:05:34.440 --> 1:05:39.440 weird enough start establishing the pop landscape of the eighties, 1:05:40.040 --> 1:05:41.240 and Narda is one of those people. 1:05:41.360 --> 1:05:42.480 With him is I should have loved you? 1:05:42.640 --> 1:05:42.800 You know? 1:05:43.160 --> 1:05:46.400 I mean, yeah, very well because brothers Johnson toured. The 1:05:46.480 --> 1:05:49.680 tour was Noardi, Michael Walden, Rufus and Shaka heat Wave 1:05:49.880 --> 1:05:54.240 and brothers Johnson and Bill Yeah one, Bill Arenas and 1:05:54.480 --> 1:05:58.360 uh and Narda had like fifteen minutes up front. You know, basically, 1:05:58.480 --> 1:05:59.200 I should have loved you. 1:05:59.200 --> 1:06:01.160 And then you know some I don't want anybody else 1:06:01.200 --> 1:06:01.720 to dance with you. 1:06:03.440 --> 1:06:05.760 Now, I think that was what's his name Jackson was? 1:06:05.880 --> 1:06:07.320 Yeah, he was seventeen. 1:06:08.240 --> 1:06:10.960 Yeah, So as an an R and you know who 1:06:11.000 --> 1:06:16.400 your boss is, how heavy is the pressure to readjust 1:06:17.960 --> 1:06:23.840 your ears and your preferences to sort of blend in 1:06:23.960 --> 1:06:27.360 with his for survival's sake, as opposed to. 1:06:29.880 --> 1:06:32.480 I think it should go in this direction. 1:06:32.640 --> 1:06:38.240 Yeah, it was a frustrating experience, but I learned a 1:06:38.280 --> 1:06:40.960 great deal. And I hold dear to my to my 1:06:41.040 --> 1:06:43.600 heart to twenty months that I worked for Clive because 1:06:43.600 --> 1:06:45.720 he puts you up on game, you know, because when 1:06:45.720 --> 1:06:47.280 I came out of Quincy, it was kind of like 1:06:47.360 --> 1:06:50.040 I'd been in a glorified mom and Pop or I've 1:06:50.080 --> 1:06:52.320 been at Howard and going to Clive was like going 1:06:52.360 --> 1:06:52.880 to Harvard. 1:06:54.440 --> 1:06:58.160 What's the main lessons that Quincy taught you that and 1:06:58.440 --> 1:06:59.960 what's the main lessons that Clive taught you. 1:07:00.920 --> 1:07:04.080 Quincy, I'd say song, song is king and melody is queen, 1:07:05.040 --> 1:07:08.520 truth and honesty at all times, and you know, vatively 1:07:08.760 --> 1:07:13.600 business all the above. Okay, Yeah, My take on q 1:07:13.760 --> 1:07:15.680 in those days was if there were two doors in 1:07:15.760 --> 1:07:18.160 a room, one was marked artist, one was marked business, 1:07:18.880 --> 1:07:20.960 ninety seven percent of the times he would go in 1:07:21.040 --> 1:07:22.760 and out of the artist or but you know the 1:07:22.840 --> 1:07:26.000 business store was was he was well oiled. He was 1:07:26.040 --> 1:07:28.440 in other you know, he was highly evolved as a businessman. 1:07:28.880 --> 1:07:31.360 Get it. He was really driven by the business and 1:07:31.760 --> 1:07:33.800 his business drove his art in a lot of levels. 1:07:35.880 --> 1:07:38.680 So Clyde was the was it Everse was he was 1:07:38.760 --> 1:07:39.680 more business than. 1:07:39.800 --> 1:07:42.720 Clyde was song. But he was definitely business and it 1:07:42.920 --> 1:07:49.480 was the feel for the marketplace. This sounds like a 1:07:49.560 --> 1:07:52.520 pejorative and it's not intended to be per se, but 1:07:53.000 --> 1:07:56.120 we used to hear from time to time just because 1:07:56.160 --> 1:07:58.600 their artist doesn't mean they know what they're doing. It's 1:07:58.640 --> 1:08:01.240 our responsibility as a our people and creative people at 1:08:01.240 --> 1:08:04.280 the record company, because we're spending the money to find hits, 1:08:04.800 --> 1:08:05.520 to find the hits for. 1:08:05.840 --> 1:08:08.240 So, is there an example of a song in which 1:08:09.200 --> 1:08:12.280 the artist might be perceived as kicking and screaming like 1:08:12.480 --> 1:08:14.880 there is air supply, like we had. 1:08:14.800 --> 1:08:18.360 This, even I wasn't really with their supply. Air supply 1:08:18.479 --> 1:08:23.040 wasn't there when I was there and Manilow had, Manelo 1:08:23.160 --> 1:08:25.360 had more or less had left the label at that point. 1:08:27.000 --> 1:08:29.160 I was there during the you know it was Billy Ocean, 1:08:29.280 --> 1:08:31.040 you know, with the give stuff. Hoo, Denei, with the 1:08:31.120 --> 1:08:36.200 give stuff. That's what friends are for Dionne. Because that 1:08:36.400 --> 1:08:37.840 that was a frustrating record for me. 1:08:41.120 --> 1:08:43.479 Why didn't last night only getting the worse? 1:08:44.240 --> 1:08:46.200 That was just the record single? 1:08:46.280 --> 1:08:49.479 Yeah, what's the story of that? From your nuts? 1:08:50.320 --> 1:08:53.360 My frustration was Arthur Baker and Little Stephen had come 1:08:53.439 --> 1:08:56.479 to me with the with the Sun City record. We 1:08:56.479 --> 1:08:58.519 didn't want to do that, and and and I played 1:08:58.520 --> 1:09:00.519 it for Climb and played it for Roy, rented up 1:09:00.520 --> 1:09:03.240 the Flagpoole for all the obvious reasons. I really wanted it, 1:09:03.600 --> 1:09:06.160 and I like Arthur and I like Steven, and I 1:09:06.240 --> 1:09:09.200 brought it in and it kind of dangled and dawdled 1:09:09.439 --> 1:09:11.760 for a bit and then we're not gonna do it. 1:09:11.840 --> 1:09:13.680 We're gonna do the dion has just come to me 1:09:13.800 --> 1:09:16.280 with this idea from Burt Backrack blah blah blah. It 1:09:16.400 --> 1:09:18.599 was the front end of the whole AIDS epidemic thing, 1:09:18.680 --> 1:09:21.000 you know, And I admit that I was a bit 1:09:21.040 --> 1:09:23.080 of a knucklehead. I was like, fuck e fuck that. Yea, 1:09:23.520 --> 1:09:26.920 this is important to Sun Cities. However, black people, black people, 1:09:26.960 --> 1:09:30.000 black people, and you know, they weren't having it, and 1:09:30.080 --> 1:09:33.800 then so he wasn't having it. So ultimately Arthur and 1:09:33.920 --> 1:09:37.559 Stephen took it to Manhattan to Bruce Lunvall. I guess yeah, uh, 1:09:37.680 --> 1:09:40.960 and then Clive, you know, they did. That's what friends 1:09:41.000 --> 1:09:43.120 are for. And this is pre digital, so any kind 1:09:43.160 --> 1:09:45.719 of cuts and edits, we're actual tape cuts and stuff. 1:09:46.160 --> 1:09:47.400 And there's a guy who was on the A and 1:09:47.520 --> 1:09:50.320 R staff with me then, uh, still a friend of 1:09:50.320 --> 1:09:52.280 a guy called John Mervos. Mervos and I have had 1:09:52.320 --> 1:09:54.160 a running bit ever since then because there was an 1:09:54.200 --> 1:09:56.320 A and R meeting at one point where Clive had 1:09:56.439 --> 1:09:59.720 us in there listening to a bazillion different mixes and 1:10:00.000 --> 1:10:04.600 different cuts. You know, Stevie first, Gladys first, you know, 1:10:05.160 --> 1:10:08.960 you keep smiling, He's smiling, so. 1:10:09.080 --> 1:10:12.080 You're trying to tell me that they wanted the piecemeal together, 1:10:12.240 --> 1:10:14.880 like yeah, all right, so we'll bring glass in the end. 1:10:14.880 --> 1:10:17.800 And they did it all they did. Everybody had a 1:10:17.880 --> 1:10:19.639 solo verse. Everybody had an ad lib. 1:10:19.720 --> 1:10:22.880 So everyone saying the verse, and then you guys had 1:10:22.880 --> 1:10:23.879 to figure out the nomination. 1:10:24.280 --> 1:10:27.240 He would offer his you know that, and how do 1:10:27.320 --> 1:10:30.160 you figure out the sequence first? 1:10:31.840 --> 1:10:32.000 There? 1:10:34.479 --> 1:10:35.599 I was always felt that song. 1:10:35.720 --> 1:10:38.000 I mean I was five six whenever it came out, 1:10:38.000 --> 1:10:39.920 but I always thought it felt like they were trying 1:10:39.920 --> 1:10:41.240 to make a wee all the world, like they were 1:10:41.280 --> 1:10:44.559 going for that moment, like another anthem kind of that's 1:10:44.600 --> 1:10:46.240 what yeah, you know what I mean. 1:10:47.360 --> 1:10:51.479 But I always wondered why Gladys Knight never got a verse. 1:10:52.080 --> 1:10:56.960 She just comes in on the ad lib at the end, smile, smiling. 1:10:57.080 --> 1:10:58.519 That's the only time she appears on. 1:10:58.600 --> 1:11:01.720 It, right, So goo ahead. So were you there for 1:11:01.840 --> 1:11:03.880 the recording of it or just like not. 1:11:04.000 --> 1:11:05.400 In the studio, but you know, in the in the 1:11:05.479 --> 1:11:07.720 office because you know that was a client project, so 1:11:07.840 --> 1:11:09.720 you know, you'd bring me and our guys in, you know, 1:11:09.800 --> 1:11:11.560 when when there was a decision to be made or 1:11:11.600 --> 1:11:13.280 listen to this what do you think kind of stuff? 1:11:13.320 --> 1:11:13.479 You know? 1:11:14.200 --> 1:11:17.320 And uh, and how long did it take to slice 1:11:17.320 --> 1:11:18.400 together and all of those things. 1:11:18.720 --> 1:11:20.960 I don't know, I remember. I just remember the meeting 1:11:21.040 --> 1:11:24.080 being interminable, you know, and a certain pint like. 1:11:26.880 --> 1:11:29.360 We got to get Steve Little Stephen on the show 1:11:29.439 --> 1:11:33.800 because I just finished his reading his autobiography and him 1:11:33.880 --> 1:11:38.120 talking about leaving leaving right on the payoff of boring 1:11:38.160 --> 1:11:42.560 in the USA to do uh, artist against apartheid. 1:11:42.080 --> 1:11:45.640 And he's a good man. I almost almost hired him 1:11:45.640 --> 1:11:48.080 at one point at Mercury really because you know, he's 1:11:48.120 --> 1:11:49.320 part of the bon Jovie mob. 1:11:49.600 --> 1:11:50.920 And uh, he's a record guy. 1:11:51.040 --> 1:11:52.479 Yeah, so I used to see him a lot around 1:11:52.560 --> 1:11:55.080 John and Richie and those guys. Okay, you talked to 1:11:55.160 --> 1:11:57.400 me when he had it was just formed of the 1:11:57.439 --> 1:12:00.639 Disciples of Soul, his band, and uh. I remember being 1:12:00.680 --> 1:12:03.360 in England with bon Jovi and Stephen was there and 1:12:03.800 --> 1:12:07.080 kicking it with the said our job. You know. 1:12:07.240 --> 1:12:10.400 So how long was your your run at Arista? 1:12:10.760 --> 1:12:11.360 Twenty months? 1:12:11.840 --> 1:12:14.600 Okay from January it was your last few months. 1:12:14.439 --> 1:12:20.320 Like weird. It got weird there from a bit because 1:12:20.360 --> 1:12:23.320 the project that I ended up working on that took 1:12:23.760 --> 1:12:26.720 It became pretty clear to me early on in the 1:12:26.800 --> 1:12:31.200 process that I always said that you know, it's Clive's 1:12:31.240 --> 1:12:32.960 candy store, and if he doesn't want a certain kind 1:12:32.960 --> 1:12:37.160 of chocolate in the candy store, you're fucked. And there 1:12:37.200 --> 1:12:38.920 were things that I wanted to do that you know, 1:12:39.000 --> 1:12:40.439 kept getting shot down because. 1:12:40.240 --> 1:12:41.439 This is a canine story. 1:12:41.680 --> 1:12:46.160 I had LeVert early Wait what Yeah, I had Lavert 1:12:47.120 --> 1:12:50.080 because because Eddie and uh, Eddie and Harry Coombs called 1:12:50.120 --> 1:12:51.680 me one day and said, hey, man, what you doing? 1:12:52.920 --> 1:12:54.400 He said, me and Eddie are gonna come out here. 1:12:54.439 --> 1:12:56.720 You want your headies? Kid? He played me, played me. 1:12:56.760 --> 1:12:59.080 They had an independent record of the song I'm Still Yes, 1:12:59.360 --> 1:13:01.560 and then heard it and smash, you know, and the 1:13:01.680 --> 1:13:04.120 kid sounds like his dad was all good and uh 1:13:04.360 --> 1:13:06.479 and played it for the boss and he was like, 1:13:08.080 --> 1:13:09.520 you know, so pass. 1:13:10.000 --> 1:13:13.920 Okay without really in the most respectful way, or if 1:13:13.920 --> 1:13:19.719 you just want to be honest, does sometimes this black 1:13:19.800 --> 1:13:21.160 music have to be explained to him? 1:13:21.520 --> 1:13:23.280 Like did he know the magic that he had in 1:13:23.439 --> 1:13:26.400 Hudini or is this like oh these rap guys went 1:13:26.479 --> 1:13:26.880 gold too. 1:13:27.680 --> 1:13:29.479 That was really Clive Calder and Barry Wise and a 1:13:29.680 --> 1:13:31.880 Carle and Carly you should have on the show sometimes. 1:13:33.080 --> 1:13:38.160 Tokyoski Yo. Yeah, he had a pretty good feeling he 1:13:38.160 --> 1:13:40.519 had a feel for songs, songs and trends, you know. 1:13:41.920 --> 1:13:46.439 So yeah, all right, okay, So I'm revisiting and there's 1:13:46.479 --> 1:13:48.479 a reason why I have all the Soul Trained stuff. 1:13:49.080 --> 1:13:51.519 So now I'm kind of in the Sole Train Awards thing, 1:13:51.560 --> 1:13:55.040 and I'm watching season two of the Soul Train Awards 1:13:55.080 --> 1:13:57.320 and you can clearly hear the booze and the jeers 1:13:57.400 --> 1:13:58.720 of the second album. 1:13:59.400 --> 1:13:59.920 In the build. 1:14:00.720 --> 1:14:04.240 I was there, Okay, so in the building even though, 1:14:04.760 --> 1:14:08.800 and it's so weird because everyone's relationship with I want 1:14:08.840 --> 1:14:13.720 to dance with somebody now, like I put I want 1:14:13.720 --> 1:14:16.360 to dance with somebody in what I call the September file, 1:14:18.040 --> 1:14:21.280 I don't I don't believe that Earth when Fire really 1:14:21.400 --> 1:14:24.040 thought like September was going to be their signature song, 1:14:24.760 --> 1:14:26.640 just like I don't think run DMC thought that it's 1:14:26.760 --> 1:14:28.760 tricky it's going to be their signature song. 1:14:29.560 --> 1:14:30.200 Now it's like. 1:14:31.800 --> 1:14:33.720 When I play I want to Dance with Somebody who 1:14:33.760 --> 1:14:37.280 loves me, it's almost like I see the revisionist reaction. 1:14:37.080 --> 1:14:40.439 Of everyone, like we've always loved the song, but I. 1:14:40.520 --> 1:14:42.599 Did as a little girl when it came out as 1:14:42.640 --> 1:14:43.120 a That's. 1:14:43.080 --> 1:14:45.120 Because when you were young and no, no, no, and 1:14:45.760 --> 1:14:50.360 it's technically nothing, it's nothing wrong with it, but there's 1:14:50.400 --> 1:14:51.160 a reason. 1:14:52.640 --> 1:14:52.920 For me. 1:14:53.360 --> 1:14:53.639 Okay. 1:14:53.800 --> 1:14:58.120 So George Clinton once told this joke, said that slide 1:14:58.120 --> 1:15:02.519 Stone said this about Prince. I was like, man, he 1:15:02.640 --> 1:15:04.519 walked around here like they want to some Sign of 1:15:04.520 --> 1:15:06.200 the Time show, and George is like, what'd you think? 1:15:06.280 --> 1:15:07.920 Like that was the first time that Sly really got 1:15:07.960 --> 1:15:12.040 to see Princess, and Sli allegedly said, man, man, he 1:15:12.520 --> 1:15:17.599 up there tasting like broccoli when he should be tasting 1:15:17.680 --> 1:15:23.439 like mustard greens. I got that, and so I think 1:15:23.520 --> 1:15:26.840 in my mind the thing was I tried to figure 1:15:26.840 --> 1:15:30.800 out Okay, so the version that I would have wanted 1:15:30.880 --> 1:15:32.280 Whitney Houston to come out with. 1:15:32.880 --> 1:15:35.360 Then it would just probably been like a she record. 1:15:36.040 --> 1:15:38.679 More thinking about you is more you give good loves, 1:15:39.080 --> 1:15:40.519 which we're still our gems. 1:15:42.280 --> 1:15:43.680 But I don't know. 1:15:44.760 --> 1:15:47.200 Oftentimes I don't want to be the fan that punishes 1:15:47.280 --> 1:15:54.479 someone for having to adjust to the climate. And it's 1:15:54.520 --> 1:15:56.760 almost like I don't know what the answer is. But 1:15:56.920 --> 1:16:00.200 I do remember when I got that record, you know, 1:16:00.439 --> 1:16:03.679 loves the Contact Sport, and I was just like, wow, 1:16:03.760 --> 1:16:06.360 this is really poppy, and I wasn't thing like an 1:16:06.400 --> 1:16:07.880 an r at the age of fifteen, but. 1:16:07.920 --> 1:16:13.479 Even I knew, like from inception, the the motive always was. 1:16:14.280 --> 1:16:17.240 I remember just being there, She's a pop star, Whitney's 1:16:17.240 --> 1:16:19.200 gonna be the biggest pop star in the world, and 1:16:19.320 --> 1:16:21.160 that was that was that was the goal. And the 1:16:21.280 --> 1:16:24.720 Kashif tracks were there to basically introduce her to put 1:16:24.840 --> 1:16:27.200 toe in the water at black radio, get black folks, 1:16:27.240 --> 1:16:29.320 you know, to know what it is. But then we're 1:16:29.360 --> 1:16:30.280 crossing it from there. 1:16:30.160 --> 1:16:32.479 You know, did anyone ever asked? But at what cost? 1:16:33.840 --> 1:16:36.080 That's not Whitney Houston, because I'm almost certain that she 1:16:37.200 --> 1:16:40.519 too was like, hello, I don't know, I don't know, Okay, 1:16:41.040 --> 1:16:42.720 so do you know what the general feeling in the 1:16:42.760 --> 1:16:45.439 building was after the Sole Train Award situation, because I'm 1:16:45.479 --> 1:16:47.800 really shocked they didn't edit. 1:16:48.840 --> 1:16:51.559 So they later edited those booze out, but I. 1:16:51.640 --> 1:16:54.800 Recorded it like the full sentence of mere fort a 1:16:54.840 --> 1:16:55.240 young folk. 1:16:55.360 --> 1:16:55.599 Okay. 1:16:55.800 --> 1:16:59.000 So at the Soul Train Awards, and it really wasn't 1:16:59.000 --> 1:17:01.439 Whitney's fault, but she was just like, too you biquit, 1:17:01.520 --> 1:17:04.839 it's winning too much. And so when they were nominated 1:17:04.960 --> 1:17:07.519 and the nominas of her so emotional winning us and 1:17:07.600 --> 1:17:07.880 you just. 1:17:07.880 --> 1:17:08.479 Clearly hear. 1:17:11.120 --> 1:17:15.680 It's just crazy crazy booze and me and my mom 1:17:15.720 --> 1:17:17.640 looking at each other watching the Soul Train Awards like yo, 1:17:17.920 --> 1:17:20.800 like wow, and so who do. 1:17:20.880 --> 1:17:22.560 We want to win? I'm like, now a retrospect to 1:17:22.640 --> 1:17:24.000 I'm like, who do we think? God dooped? 1:17:24.640 --> 1:17:26.840 I was frustrated at her career. 1:17:27.000 --> 1:17:31.280 I'm proud of this success, but there was just too 1:17:31.400 --> 1:17:33.840 much scene on it for me, too much Yamaha Dix 1:17:33.880 --> 1:17:38.759 seven too much, you know, the Michael Master intros and everything. 1:17:39.640 --> 1:17:44.479 But it's weird because now it's like, oh, I love 1:17:44.560 --> 1:17:48.040 this all along, which is you know, but what were 1:17:48.080 --> 1:17:50.560 your general feelings like what was the feelings of the 1:17:50.600 --> 1:17:52.320 building after the Soul Train Awards? 1:17:53.160 --> 1:17:55.280 Just disappointment? You know what the fuck was that? You 1:17:55.360 --> 1:17:58.080 know kind of thing? You know, But was it an. 1:17:58.000 --> 1:18:00.439 Instant like we gotta fix this or was Claud aware 1:18:00.560 --> 1:18:01.800 like we might have to fix this. 1:18:02.040 --> 1:18:04.360 Let's just keep it moving. That was the vibe. I guys, 1:18:04.479 --> 1:18:06.160 keep it moving, you know, keep putting it on the 1:18:06.280 --> 1:18:07.040 radio and blow it up. 1:18:07.080 --> 1:18:07.280 You know. 1:18:12.040 --> 1:18:14.799 What happened after Arista what the PolyGram? 1:18:15.120 --> 1:18:18.439 There was a new music seminar was going on in 1:18:18.560 --> 1:18:23.120 New York. It was August July of eighty six, and 1:18:24.080 --> 1:18:26.920 I'd run into this guy called Bob Scoo Scorro ended 1:18:27.000 --> 1:18:28.479 up being in my head at A and R for 1:18:28.640 --> 1:18:31.200 Mercury the pop side, and Bob and I had known 1:18:31.240 --> 1:18:32.519 each other from out here because he used to be 1:18:32.560 --> 1:18:36.880 a song plugger for EMI Music and I saw him 1:18:36.920 --> 1:18:38.760 when he was like, dude, how I am? You know 1:18:38.800 --> 1:18:40.639 one of those things? What's happening? I said, dude, get 1:18:40.680 --> 1:18:42.880 me out of here? He said what he said, just 1:18:43.040 --> 1:18:46.160 get me out of here. I see. It wasn't working 1:18:46.200 --> 1:18:49.439 out for me. It was it was weird environment. I said, 1:18:49.439 --> 1:18:50.840 I don't want to be here anymore, and I had 1:18:50.880 --> 1:18:53.720 aspirations of doing something. You know, Arista was not a 1:18:53.760 --> 1:18:55.720 great place to be at that time. If you were 1:18:55.720 --> 1:18:59.679 a creative person who had illusions of your own personal grandeur. 1:18:59.760 --> 1:19:02.840 You know, who did you try to bring there that 1:19:03.840 --> 1:19:04.639 besides LeVert? 1:19:04.880 --> 1:19:12.280 Like LeVert who got away basically LeVert us mostly songs? 1:19:12.320 --> 1:19:13.759 Could you find songs and stuff? 1:19:13.800 --> 1:19:14.120 You know that? 1:19:14.280 --> 1:19:17.200 Uh? That you what songs did you ride for that? 1:19:17.439 --> 1:19:21.200 Caravana Love for Angie really yeah wow? 1:19:21.479 --> 1:19:23.920 Caravan Love Angel. 1:19:25.760 --> 1:19:31.000 Yeah wow? My my ex girlfriend from years her sister 1:19:31.160 --> 1:19:34.720 was married to Ernie, and uh, and that's yeah, I 1:19:34.760 --> 1:19:37.240 got to call it one one point. You know, Ernie 1:19:37.280 --> 1:19:39.519 and Chris have songs they want you to hear. So yeah, 1:19:39.520 --> 1:19:41.880 I'm looking for songs for Angie Bofield. Well we got 1:19:41.920 --> 1:19:43.400 a perfect song for They came up and played me 1:19:43.640 --> 1:19:45.479 Caravana Love, and uh. 1:19:46.400 --> 1:19:47.000 I didn't see it. 1:19:47.160 --> 1:19:54.280 No, so no, it's too preachy. So yeah, okay, Yeah, anyway. 1:19:54.200 --> 1:19:56.960 I assume that he's trying to hit Middle America. Yeah, 1:19:57.160 --> 1:20:01.040 yesh okay, and you're trying to hit all of America exactly. 1:20:02.640 --> 1:20:07.719 So that got frustrating. And the projects that I actually 1:20:07.760 --> 1:20:10.840 ended up working with Kenny g got dropped in my lap, 1:20:10.960 --> 1:20:14.120 you know, because I did the toes Thank you? 1:20:14.600 --> 1:20:15.960 Can you plan that moment? 1:20:16.520 --> 1:20:16.560 Like? 1:20:17.200 --> 1:20:20.759 Can you plan that level of lightning in a bottle? 1:20:20.880 --> 1:20:24.040 Here's the moment. I'd known Kenny as Kenny Gorlic when 1:20:24.040 --> 1:20:26.200 he was playing with Jeff Lauber's band. I was a 1:20:26.280 --> 1:20:29.120 Laber fan and uh, and so when I got in 1:20:29.200 --> 1:20:31.519 then and once again I spent some time with Kashif 1:20:31.880 --> 1:20:34.439 and out here in La Hi, How You Doing was 1:20:34.560 --> 1:20:36.800 actually a hit record on the radio, which was a 1:20:36.880 --> 1:20:39.000 Kenney record, but it was a kaif with Kenny solo 1:20:39.080 --> 1:20:42.360 in it, and uh So, one day I get a 1:20:42.400 --> 1:20:46.479 call Clive actually Roy Lott, who's the number two guy 1:20:46.640 --> 1:20:49.200 in Ariston, and Roy says, you know Kenny Kenny g 1:20:49.320 --> 1:20:51.439 blah blah blah blah blah. So yeah, cool, let me 1:20:51.479 --> 1:20:53.120 hear it. I said, I know who he is. Let 1:20:53.160 --> 1:20:55.360 me hear it. And then Kenny calls Kenny's manager, guy 1:20:55.400 --> 1:20:58.800 called Dennis Turner, who had managed George Benson. I knew. 1:20:58.880 --> 1:21:02.280 I knew him from the Gimme the Night days. So 1:21:02.520 --> 1:21:04.760 they came by and Kenny walks in and he says, dude, 1:21:04.840 --> 1:21:06.320 I don't want to be here anymore. I want to 1:21:06.360 --> 1:21:08.080 get off the label. I hated here. I fucking hate 1:21:08.120 --> 1:21:09.800 it here. I'm tired of being a sideman on my 1:21:09.840 --> 1:21:12.680 own records. And I looked at I said, dude, I 1:21:12.720 --> 1:21:14.320 know who you are. I said, I saw you play 1:21:14.360 --> 1:21:16.120 with Jeff many times. I said, I like your playing. 1:21:16.479 --> 1:21:19.960 He looked at me, like what what what? I said, Yeah, Dick, 1:21:20.000 --> 1:21:22.519 how you sounded good with with Larber's band. I said, 1:21:22.520 --> 1:21:24.080 I know what you're trying to do. I said, but 1:21:24.200 --> 1:21:26.560 the reality is is people are trying to put you 1:21:26.680 --> 1:21:28.120 in a in a box that you need to be 1:21:28.160 --> 1:21:30.920 Sonny Rollins and John Coltrane when the reality of it is, 1:21:31.000 --> 1:21:33.240 I know you your path in it is like David 1:21:33.320 --> 1:21:38.000 Sanborn and Grover you know, and Junior Walker. So that 1:21:38.160 --> 1:21:40.120 was like music to me. This it was at the time, 1:21:40.280 --> 1:21:42.680 was at the front end of the CD thing, but 1:21:42.800 --> 1:21:44.080 also it is at the front end of the whole 1:21:44.360 --> 1:21:47.360 smooth jazz the wave format, you know. And I said, 1:21:47.439 --> 1:21:49.320 I think you can live in that zone. And then 1:21:49.360 --> 1:21:51.120 he gave me a cassette of you know, the home 1:21:51.200 --> 1:21:53.200 stuff that he was working on, which was ultimately the 1:21:53.280 --> 1:21:55.720 bones of the meat and bones of what was the 1:21:55.800 --> 1:21:58.200 duo toun And and I told him to say, man, look, 1:21:58.240 --> 1:22:00.120 here's what we need to do. If you trust me, 1:22:00.160 --> 1:22:02.040 here's what we need to do to make this fly. Here. 1:22:02.280 --> 1:22:04.200 So we got to do two covers. We got to 1:22:04.200 --> 1:22:06.519 do two vocal songs. One of them's got to be 1:22:06.560 --> 1:22:08.439 a cover and that was what does it Take to 1:22:08.439 --> 1:22:11.400 Win Your Love? And then another and another vocal song, 1:22:11.439 --> 1:22:15.240 which was don't Don't make Me Wait for Love? 1:22:15.479 --> 1:22:15.719 Okay. 1:22:16.479 --> 1:22:18.759 We got a guy called Ellis Hall, who's a keyboard 1:22:18.760 --> 1:22:20.320 player up up in the Bay Area that did a 1:22:20.360 --> 1:22:22.800 lot of stuff for Narda got Ellis to sing it, 1:22:23.320 --> 1:22:27.040 and ultimately he ended up putting Bolton on it. I said, 1:22:27.160 --> 1:22:29.200 and if we do that, we have some of the radio. 1:22:29.240 --> 1:22:31.439 Can promotion can take the radio. We're off to the 1:22:31.520 --> 1:22:33.200 race and the rest will live on it. So and 1:22:33.320 --> 1:22:35.759 you'll you'll be the king of you know whatever, smooth jazz. 1:22:36.200 --> 1:22:37.040 And we did so. 1:22:37.280 --> 1:22:40.200 Nowhere and you can't end it. We did, I mean 1:22:40.240 --> 1:22:40.479 we did. 1:22:40.880 --> 1:22:43.479 You weren't done you surely you weren't thinking like, and 1:22:43.680 --> 1:22:45.639 this is going to sell you ten million copies. 1:22:45.680 --> 1:22:47.200 No, I didn't think that, because I didn't think the 1:22:47.320 --> 1:22:49.320 songbird would would end up emerging. 1:22:49.000 --> 1:22:51.680 A songbird, even I was working at sam Goodies at 1:22:51.720 --> 1:22:55.200 the time. Even like the amount of people that's how 1:22:55.240 --> 1:22:58.280 I knew. I've realized that I knew some songs from 1:22:58.600 --> 1:23:02.000 a previous record, right, But the amount of people just 1:23:02.080 --> 1:23:02.920 kept in somber. 1:23:03.400 --> 1:23:05.680 That's I don't know what a dou withtones is? How 1:23:05.760 --> 1:23:07.960 did y'all? How did song I was? 1:23:08.040 --> 1:23:10.680 I was gone by then, But basically what happened. The 1:23:10.720 --> 1:23:13.519 story that I'm told is Donnie Einer, who is the 1:23:13.560 --> 1:23:16.439 head of promotion in Ariston in those days, best promotion 1:23:16.920 --> 1:23:19.960 man of his of his of his period of his era. 1:23:20.800 --> 1:23:23.080 Donnie had gotten a call from some guy up and like, 1:23:23.520 --> 1:23:26.080 I want to say, Uh, what's the part of Pennsylvania 1:23:26.120 --> 1:23:30.200 that Biden talked about aways from? Uh, Scranton some some 1:23:30.320 --> 1:23:32.400 p D and Scranton had been using it for some 1:23:32.800 --> 1:23:35.120 using it as a theme for some like daytime call 1:23:35.240 --> 1:23:37.960 in show or something, just the melody, and I guess 1:23:38.000 --> 1:23:40.439 people started calling station what is that? What's that melody? 1:23:40.520 --> 1:23:42.360 Play man? And so they put the record on late 1:23:42.400 --> 1:23:44.760 at night and then phone started lighting up and they 1:23:44.840 --> 1:23:46.880 called Donnie and said, I think you may have something here, 1:23:47.160 --> 1:23:49.680 and Donnie pushed Donnie and Cliveve pushed the button, put 1:23:49.720 --> 1:23:50.880 it out and off off it went. 1:23:51.680 --> 1:23:55.840 Yeah, okay, So at PolyGram, how long does it take 1:23:55.920 --> 1:23:59.679 you to get to the top of the mountain? 1:24:00.920 --> 1:24:03.680 I had I was working at aristat and Ramon came 1:24:03.720 --> 1:24:05.360 by to see me one day, just you know, on 1:24:05.439 --> 1:24:10.400 some some whatever, and uh, Vanessa at that point, had 1:24:10.479 --> 1:24:12.559 you know done, just dur frysco at that shake and hey, 1:24:12.600 --> 1:24:15.760 good looking on on the PFONK record, on George Clinton record, 1:24:16.080 --> 1:24:18.880 and uh, and I knew that they'd been in and 1:24:18.960 --> 1:24:22.840 out of mini offices here shopping a deal, and ostensibly 1:24:22.920 --> 1:24:25.200 what was happening was that she was kind of being 1:24:25.240 --> 1:24:28.120 ogled at by you know, record company presidents and A 1:24:28.200 --> 1:24:30.559 and R people whatever, but nobody was really taking it seriously. 1:24:31.000 --> 1:24:33.200 And he said, you know, we haven't been able to 1:24:33.200 --> 1:24:35.240 get anything happen, and blah blah blah blah. And I 1:24:35.280 --> 1:24:36.880 told him, I said, look on the lowest and I'm 1:24:36.920 --> 1:24:38.880 leaving here in about six weeks. I got this software 1:24:38.920 --> 1:24:41.439 PolyGram to start a label for them, and I'm going 1:24:41.520 --> 1:24:44.120 back home to California. I said I would entertain the 1:24:44.200 --> 1:24:47.200 notion then, because my theory at the time was I 1:24:47.240 --> 1:24:50.000 could start a new label with Susie Jones, you know, 1:24:50.080 --> 1:24:52.760 black on Army female that nobody nobody's ever heard of, 1:24:53.160 --> 1:24:55.120 or I could do with Vanessa Williams. I named that 1:24:55.200 --> 1:24:57.600 everybody knew, and I said it was in coming on 1:24:57.680 --> 1:24:59.000 me as an A and R guy and a record 1:24:59.040 --> 1:25:01.360 maker to make the music, to find the right hole 1:25:01.479 --> 1:25:03.760 to put her in. And so he said, okay, cool. 1:25:03.800 --> 1:25:05.880 So I flew. I came home and she and I, 1:25:06.240 --> 1:25:08.360 she and I sat and had dinner one night, and uh, 1:25:09.200 --> 1:25:10.360 after the races, we went. 1:25:10.320 --> 1:25:12.519 You know, is the goal of an an R to 1:25:12.640 --> 1:25:18.919 find like three signature artists so that you can eventually 1:25:19.240 --> 1:25:21.800 like get considered for well. 1:25:22.280 --> 1:25:28.240 Interestingly enough, the uh, the presidency thing was not what 1:25:28.400 --> 1:25:32.120 I ever aspired to be, you know, president of the 1:25:32.160 --> 1:25:34.800 whole Mercury thing. I never aspired to be that guy. 1:25:35.479 --> 1:25:38.320 But there was a certain aspect of when it was 1:25:38.400 --> 1:25:40.559 offered to me. I thought about a lot of those 1:25:40.600 --> 1:25:42.720 old school dudes that I knew from, you know, from 1:25:42.760 --> 1:25:45.439 my dad's era. You know, old old old brothers who 1:25:45.439 --> 1:25:48.560 would promotion and whatever the Dave Clark's, Joe Medlin's in 1:25:48.600 --> 1:25:51.200 the world. People like people probably worked your old man's records. 1:25:51.720 --> 1:25:55.720 So yeah, so those guys were very qualified and extremely 1:25:55.960 --> 1:25:58.160 good at what they did, but they never were offered. 1:25:58.160 --> 1:26:00.840 The situation never got never got shot. I thought about it. 1:26:00.840 --> 1:26:03.559 I said, who am I to say no? So they 1:26:03.600 --> 1:26:05.360 made me an offer I couldn't refuse, and I didn't 1:26:05.360 --> 1:26:08.200 refuse it. But the truth of the matter is the path, 1:26:08.280 --> 1:26:09.800 if I had stayed on the path that I was 1:26:09.840 --> 1:26:14.639 on doing the wing thing, Vanessa, Blue, Tony's Blue, Robin 1:26:14.680 --> 1:26:19.080 Harris was was gonna do, was gonna blow. Unfortunately lost 1:26:19.160 --> 1:26:21.360 them in a period of time, and then that's when 1:26:21.400 --> 1:26:23.639 I found Brian along the same period of time, Brian McKnight. 1:26:23.920 --> 1:26:26.240 So if I had just done those records and just 1:26:26.280 --> 1:26:28.800 stayed in their careers, you know that was you know 1:26:28.880 --> 1:26:32.640 that one success breeds another album. I would have been 1:26:32.800 --> 1:26:34.599 four or five albums deep on each one of them. 1:26:34.680 --> 1:26:37.520 You know, you came through the Tonys because of Foster mceilroy. 1:26:37.600 --> 1:26:41.840 But I thought they were more Warner based and no, like, 1:26:43.000 --> 1:26:43.760 how did they come to you? 1:26:43.880 --> 1:26:49.120 I put them with Denny Tommy. Oh yeah, short. How 1:26:49.160 --> 1:26:50.920 they came to me was the Tony said made us 1:26:51.160 --> 1:26:53.560 made a single, the twelve inch on Macolo Records, the 1:26:53.640 --> 1:26:55.200 local indie record, indy label. 1:26:57.680 --> 1:27:03.280 Yeah, he tells you designs video games. 1:27:04.640 --> 1:27:07.439 Yeah, I forget to nip because I was thinking about it. 1:27:07.640 --> 1:27:11.479 I can't find it now. I shouldn't have sold my vinyl. Yes, 1:27:12.680 --> 1:27:15.000 So they had a twelve inch on mycola and my 1:27:15.080 --> 1:27:16.880 head of promotion at Wing at the time was a 1:27:16.920 --> 1:27:19.479 guy called Michael Johnson. And Michael came to me one 1:27:19.560 --> 1:27:21.240 day and said, man, you got to hear this record 1:27:21.280 --> 1:27:23.639 and I heard. I said, yeah, it's cool. Sorry, I said, 1:27:23.760 --> 1:27:25.680 He said, man, they're here in times. Let's you want 1:27:25.720 --> 1:27:28.200 to fuck with him? And said yeah. Their manager came 1:27:28.240 --> 1:27:29.880 by and I sat with him a little bit and 1:27:30.120 --> 1:27:32.160 and upon hearing it, I went, these guys sound good, 1:27:32.439 --> 1:27:35.280 but they need help. They need somebody to help fare 1:27:35.880 --> 1:27:37.600 sort it out a little bit. In those days, my 1:27:37.720 --> 1:27:40.680 theory was every producer worth any degree of salt had 1:27:40.720 --> 1:27:42.880 a cassette in his back pocket of an act that 1:27:42.920 --> 1:27:44.439 they wanted to work with. You know, oh, this is 1:27:44.520 --> 1:27:47.240 my cousin, this is my brother, you know what? And uh, 1:27:47.680 --> 1:27:49.280 I said, you know, these guys are cool, so let me. 1:27:49.880 --> 1:27:53.320 David Lombard, who manages Denny and Tommy, was a friend. 1:27:53.400 --> 1:27:56.719 And I went to see Club Nouveau because Club Nouveau 1:27:56.840 --> 1:27:58.439 was playing here in town. So when Danny and Tommy 1:27:58.479 --> 1:28:00.280 were still in the band before they left, it was 1:28:00.400 --> 1:28:02.680 actually the last gig they played with him, So was 1:28:02.720 --> 1:28:04.559 the show with David, and he introduced me with Danny 1:28:04.600 --> 1:28:06.639 and Tommy, and I told him, I said, man, I'd 1:28:06.720 --> 1:28:08.120 like to have you guys work on this band that 1:28:08.160 --> 1:28:10.439 I'm thinking about signing. Really who And I told me, oh, 1:28:10.520 --> 1:28:12.960 we know those guys. They knew them from Oakland because 1:28:12.960 --> 1:28:15.080 I guess they'd worked with Tommy in the studio up 1:28:15.120 --> 1:28:15.559 in Oakland. 1:28:16.120 --> 1:28:18.960 So at the time, did you realize that you were 1:28:19.360 --> 1:28:24.040 working with possibly the last well not the last R 1:28:24.040 --> 1:28:26.840 and B group, But I meant, if it starts with 1:28:26.880 --> 1:28:29.320 Sling the Family Stone in sixty eight and it kind of. 1:28:31.080 --> 1:28:33.639 The bracket ends with Tony Tony Tony in eighty eight. 1:28:33.760 --> 1:28:36.280 I was. I was very aware of it. Absolutely, So you. 1:28:36.320 --> 1:28:39.360 Knew that black music was in trouble even in eighty 1:28:39.600 --> 1:28:43.920 sixty seven. And what were some of that indicators for you? 1:28:44.560 --> 1:28:49.439 Black radio? You know, there was that that MTV video 1:28:49.520 --> 1:28:53.000 of video killed the Radio Star, and I said, black 1:28:53.080 --> 1:28:56.360 radio killed the Black radio star during the period of 1:28:56.439 --> 1:28:57.680 time you know about that? 1:28:57.920 --> 1:29:00.479 Is it just in terms of promoting you talk about 1:29:00.479 --> 1:29:03.640 Donnie Iron, which I didn't know it even started and. 1:29:03.920 --> 1:29:05.920 Start there, but that was when it was a big 1:29:05.960 --> 1:29:07.519 gig before he went to we went to Son. 1:29:07.680 --> 1:29:10.400 Yeah, okay, So when you talk about promotion, men, do 1:29:10.520 --> 1:29:14.280 you tell about the difference between as much as you're 1:29:14.280 --> 1:29:18.000 allowed to say, like how these songs get on radio 1:29:18.080 --> 1:29:21.759 or how they get promoted as opposed to that which. 1:29:21.720 --> 1:29:25.000 I you know, and explain what you mean about how 1:29:25.040 --> 1:29:26.840 it killed because we didn't really explain it. 1:29:26.920 --> 1:29:27.599 Yeah, that part. 1:29:28.920 --> 1:29:33.679 Yeah, both of the above So to give a perfect 1:29:33.720 --> 1:29:36.519 example as it worked with me, was when we released 1:29:36.520 --> 1:29:38.840 the first Brothers Johnson album in nineteen seventy six, look 1:29:38.880 --> 1:29:41.320 Out for Number One. The first city that it blew 1:29:41.400 --> 1:29:45.080 up in was d C. So we being George and Lewis, 1:29:45.439 --> 1:29:48.560 were going to d C to do some promotion and 1:29:48.840 --> 1:29:51.320 we're coming in from Dulles in the car and we're 1:29:51.320 --> 1:29:55.200 hearing and turn on h U R and ky asked 1:29:55.520 --> 1:29:57.639 right over the other stations in d C and they're 1:29:57.760 --> 1:30:01.400 blasting good to you. Get the phone, look out my face, thunders, 1:30:01.439 --> 1:30:03.880 thumbs and lightings like free and single and tomorrow playing 1:30:04.040 --> 1:30:06.960 five even the filler yep, five cuts deep, you know, 1:30:07.080 --> 1:30:09.000 playing the ship out of it. You know this is 1:30:09.400 --> 1:30:11.400 exactly playing a ship out of it, and say, oh 1:30:11.439 --> 1:30:13.000 my god, this is great, you know it was. It's 1:30:13.000 --> 1:30:16.320 all like that. So that night we were the local 1:30:16.400 --> 1:30:18.320 guy in the market took us to dinner with the 1:30:18.840 --> 1:30:20.479 program director music director of. 1:30:22.240 --> 1:30:27.000 W o L, the big radio one. Yeah, that was 1:30:27.040 --> 1:30:31.920 preen w L w M m J is Katy Katy's 1:30:31.960 --> 1:30:32.320 first station. 1:30:32.840 --> 1:30:35.080 So they took us to dinner with these guys. It 1:30:35.200 --> 1:30:37.479 was a program director at the time is a guy 1:30:37.520 --> 1:30:39.599 called Bobby Bennett, who was known as the Burner, sort 1:30:39.600 --> 1:30:43.000 of legendary radio guy, another guy called Chuck McCool, guy 1:30:43.080 --> 1:30:45.240 called Cortes Thompson who went on to become a head 1:30:45.240 --> 1:30:48.439 of promotion at at Warner Brothers. And another guy whose 1:30:48.520 --> 1:30:50.599 name escapes soon. So you know, we're at the dinner 1:30:50.640 --> 1:30:53.000 table and I'm green behind you as I'm geeked, Oh, 1:30:53.120 --> 1:30:55.000 this is worth the palm. This is great, this is great. 1:30:55.240 --> 1:30:57.000 You guys are playing it right the car well, we 1:30:57.080 --> 1:30:59.320 heard our record the whole way in. And one of 1:30:59.360 --> 1:31:01.120 them looks, come, young brother, let me talk to you 1:31:01.160 --> 1:31:03.640 a minute. He took me into the bathroom, you know, 1:31:03.720 --> 1:31:06.240 and said, and then five guys come in the bathroom 1:31:06.240 --> 1:31:08.559 and what the fuck this said? Let me explain something 1:31:08.600 --> 1:31:11.680 to you. It said, Okay, said basically, you know, we're 1:31:11.720 --> 1:31:13.120 playing the Ship out of your record, but you know 1:31:13.160 --> 1:31:14.800 we can play the Ship out of his record or 1:31:14.880 --> 1:31:17.639 her record or his record too. But here's here's here's 1:31:17.680 --> 1:31:19.880 your payback for this. We're gonna do it. We're doing this. 1:31:20.000 --> 1:31:22.320 We're also concert promoters. We're gonna do a series of 1:31:22.400 --> 1:31:26.639 shows in the d C, d M v DC, Maryland, Virginia. 1:31:27.560 --> 1:31:31.320 It was P. P. Funk, Natalie Cole and the Bootsy 1:31:31.320 --> 1:31:35.000 and the Brothers Johnson and whatever you're going rate is, 1:31:35.080 --> 1:31:37.040 it's not gonna be your going rate. So and we'll 1:31:37.120 --> 1:31:40.320 keep you'll keep those spins up. And they did and 1:31:40.479 --> 1:31:43.120 we did, and uh, this is. 1:31:43.240 --> 1:31:47.360 How the Chef Gordon Teddy Pendergrast story comes into play 1:31:47.680 --> 1:31:53.000 because Shef Gordon told us that programmers and DJs were 1:31:53.160 --> 1:31:56.320 like any concerts that you saw in the seventies and 1:31:56.360 --> 1:32:00.960 eighties were due to the radio station, not independent of Hey, 1:32:01.640 --> 1:32:03.479 I'm coming to town and you pay me. 1:32:03.800 --> 1:32:06.840 Right, so they the promo show. 1:32:06.960 --> 1:32:09.439 I guess era getting of the promo shows because that. 1:32:12.000 --> 1:32:14.479 Show you're gonna play our Christmas show? You know years 1:32:14.520 --> 1:32:17.560 later A see, So how did they kill it? 1:32:17.640 --> 1:32:19.080 How did black radio kill it? For you? 1:32:19.800 --> 1:32:23.000 There's so much I don't want to say payola, but 1:32:23.200 --> 1:32:27.519 just there are limited spots. Guys were taking money and 1:32:27.600 --> 1:32:28.960 then you know they wouldn't play the way you know, 1:32:29.040 --> 1:32:30.479 it didn't get the spends that you know that you 1:32:31.040 --> 1:32:33.400 expected to get, you know, so many hours in the 1:32:33.479 --> 1:32:36.799 day and then you know, but legitimate hits got played, 1:32:36.880 --> 1:32:38.840 but stuff that you know that you you want to 1:32:38.880 --> 1:32:40.560 get a shot. You know, I think we could do 1:32:40.640 --> 1:32:42.439 well with this. Here's X amount. You know, I need 1:32:42.560 --> 1:32:47.080 whatever fifty spins this weekend. Whatever didn't happen, you know, 1:32:47.160 --> 1:32:49.320 guys took your money and ran, you know, and then 1:32:49.439 --> 1:32:53.160 all of a sudden, there's no loyalty anymore to legacy acts. 1:32:53.560 --> 1:32:56.000 You know. You know when you see like that, I'm 1:32:56.040 --> 1:32:59.320 talking early into late nineties. When you're seeing that, Luther Stevie, 1:32:59.520 --> 1:33:01.360 I need a People out there are having to fight 1:33:01.439 --> 1:33:04.639 to get on the radio at black radio. That's really 1:33:04.680 --> 1:33:07.200 a sad state of affairs, it is. 1:33:07.680 --> 1:33:08.800 I think about it all the time. 1:33:08.880 --> 1:33:12.080 But for you, it's like when when do you consider 1:33:12.400 --> 1:33:16.679 you leaving or do you consider yourself completely graduated from 1:33:17.439 --> 1:33:18.799 quote unquote the business? 1:33:19.000 --> 1:33:21.560 Yeah, am I'm more or less retired. I still do 1:33:21.640 --> 1:33:23.920 little bits and pieces of stuff here and there, you know, 1:33:23.960 --> 1:33:26.240 because I get these occasional phone calls, Hey, Ed, I 1:33:26.320 --> 1:33:28.720 got an idea, And I always say, does the check 1:33:28.760 --> 1:33:32.600 come with that idea? I'll pay attention. So what do 1:33:32.720 --> 1:33:33.320 you is. 1:33:33.520 --> 1:33:35.439 Watching the State of music right now? 1:33:36.640 --> 1:33:39.479 Is it a dizzying experience somewhat? 1:33:39.560 --> 1:33:42.519 Is it like a beautiful mind meme where you see 1:33:43.280 --> 1:33:45.160 like is it like that for you? 1:33:45.320 --> 1:33:48.519 Yeah, somewhat. It was interesting. In preparation for today, I 1:33:48.680 --> 1:33:50.920 was thinking about, you know, I said, if I get 1:33:50.960 --> 1:33:53.400 asked the question, what are you listening to? And I 1:33:53.439 --> 1:33:56.240 had to realize I hate answering that question. Yeah, I 1:33:56.320 --> 1:33:59.120 realized that, you know, of most of the new stuff 1:33:59.120 --> 1:34:01.000 that I listened to is old stuff that's either been 1:34:01.080 --> 1:34:04.760 released or it's new on my radar, you know. But 1:34:05.000 --> 1:34:06.519 it's just not a lot of new stuff that you know, 1:34:06.560 --> 1:34:08.280 I don't mean to sound like an old man, but 1:34:08.320 --> 1:34:09.600 it's not a new a lot of new stuff that 1:34:09.720 --> 1:34:10.479 rocks my world, you know. 1:34:10.560 --> 1:34:14.720 Know, We're we're a band of a folk who it's 1:34:14.760 --> 1:34:15.640 somewhat frustrated. 1:34:16.120 --> 1:34:17.720 It's just harder to find it these days. There's way 1:34:17.720 --> 1:34:19.960 too many options. Because at the same time we say that, 1:34:20.000 --> 1:34:22.000 but then I also I'll hear y'all two talking about 1:34:22.040 --> 1:34:23.640 like new R and B acts and stuff like that 1:34:23.720 --> 1:34:25.679 that I've never heard of, and I'm just like, fuck, 1:34:25.760 --> 1:34:27.200 how do I even find these people? 1:34:28.040 --> 1:34:28.200 Well? 1:34:28.520 --> 1:34:30.200 Yeah, I mean, I mean, now you have to have 1:34:30.320 --> 1:34:31.040 the patience to. 1:34:32.760 --> 1:34:35.880 You know, either scroll on the internet or in my case, 1:34:36.840 --> 1:34:41.080 I have at least twenty music snobs that I just 1:34:41.160 --> 1:34:43.519 peek on their Spotify and see what they're listening to, 1:34:43.600 --> 1:34:44.000 and then. 1:34:44.240 --> 1:34:46.559 I'll take that and take That's how I know whose 1:34:46.560 --> 1:34:47.720 salt was, you know what I mean? 1:34:47.840 --> 1:34:48.760 So I like salt. 1:34:49.120 --> 1:34:52.160 Yeah, it's quick, there's there's there's a few, a few left. 1:34:52.560 --> 1:34:55.280 I don't want to ask what year. So you're president 1:34:55.520 --> 1:34:59.280 of a Mercury from what years? 1:34:59.360 --> 1:34:59.760 When did you? 1:35:00.000 --> 1:35:03.080 I was co president? Initially, I was a polygra. I 1:35:03.120 --> 1:35:06.040 was a PolyGram during the wing from nineteen eighty six 1:35:06.640 --> 1:35:09.479 to nineteen eighty eight, and then I became co president 1:35:09.560 --> 1:35:13.080 of Mercury from nineteen eighty eight till nineteen ninety with 1:35:13.160 --> 1:35:16.479 a guy called Mike Bone, and then I became the 1:35:16.520 --> 1:35:19.000 sole president from nineteen ninety till I left to nineteen 1:35:19.080 --> 1:35:19.479 ninety eight. 1:35:19.960 --> 1:35:21.760 Oh wow, Okay, it was a run. 1:35:22.120 --> 1:35:25.240 So in terms of I wanted to know with hip hop, 1:35:25.680 --> 1:35:28.080 looking back on it now, like Murcury was always a 1:35:28.200 --> 1:35:30.719 label with hip hop. I mean, y'all had black sheet 1:35:30.960 --> 1:35:34.880 you know what I'm saying. You had like elous scratch, you. 1:35:34.880 --> 1:35:35.320 Know what I'm saying. 1:35:35.360 --> 1:35:38.760 Like y'all have records edog, you know what I mean. 1:35:38.880 --> 1:35:41.920 And so for me, it seems like Mercury was one 1:35:41.920 --> 1:35:45.000 of the first labels that I in retrospect. Now, they 1:35:45.120 --> 1:35:48.479 y'all had like records and artists, but it was kind 1:35:48.560 --> 1:35:52.519 of like unless that artists was attached to like black. 1:35:52.320 --> 1:35:54.439 Sheet, they were attached to Native tones, you know what 1:35:54.439 --> 1:35:54.840 I'm saying. 1:35:55.160 --> 1:35:57.360 But if you had artists that had great records, if 1:35:57.400 --> 1:36:01.439 they weren't attached to another production company, like you know 1:36:01.479 --> 1:36:04.639 what I'm saying, or like like you know what became 1:36:04.760 --> 1:36:08.280 Rockefeller and murder In and all of those things, it 1:36:08.439 --> 1:36:12.120 was kind of the beginning for me of losing faith. 1:36:12.640 --> 1:36:14.680 In major labels doing hip hop. 1:36:15.040 --> 1:36:18.960 Like if I just saw Columbia, I'm like that, if 1:36:19.080 --> 1:36:22.320 I see, you know, Rockefeller slash, I'm like, oh, okay. 1:36:22.200 --> 1:36:24.320 You know what I mean, it's like a good housekeeping 1:36:24.600 --> 1:36:27.519 stamp over approval or the Quincy Jones reduction. Yeah, exactly, 1:36:27.800 --> 1:36:28.200 you know what I mean. 1:36:28.400 --> 1:36:32.280 So, how did you as a labelhad how did push 1:36:32.360 --> 1:36:34.320 in hip hop coming from like the pop background and 1:36:34.360 --> 1:36:37.320 with Clive and stuff, How did you adapt to marketing 1:36:37.400 --> 1:36:37.760 hip hop? 1:36:38.600 --> 1:36:40.160 You just see, you get in where you can fit in, 1:36:40.280 --> 1:36:42.639 you know. And if it was this case of finding 1:36:42.640 --> 1:36:45.120 stuff that was attached to somebody else or something else, 1:36:45.400 --> 1:36:47.960 that's how you did it, you know, because you knew 1:36:47.960 --> 1:36:50.240 there was an uphill climb if you're starting it from scratch, 1:36:50.720 --> 1:36:53.400 because at radio once again, the first question you're going 1:36:53.479 --> 1:36:55.400 to ask is who are they down with? You know who? 1:36:56.920 --> 1:36:59.840 So it was that, you know, Similarly, there's like a 1:36:59.880 --> 1:37:03.040 new phase of white rock music in the same time period, right, 1:37:03.040 --> 1:37:06.280 it's bon Jovi, def Leppard, Mellencamp, Tears for Fears, Kiss, Like, 1:37:07.080 --> 1:37:09.920 what what made the diversity of what you were doing? 1:37:09.960 --> 1:37:11.320 I think you started with R and B. Now it's 1:37:11.680 --> 1:37:14.200 rock music like they were. How'd you feel about being 1:37:14.280 --> 1:37:15.679 that guy that ushered that kind of stuff? 1:37:15.880 --> 1:37:18.080 Yeah, the h all those artists were already at the 1:37:18.160 --> 1:37:20.120 label when I got there, you know, I inherited them, 1:37:20.560 --> 1:37:23.240 and it was interesting. 1:37:23.360 --> 1:37:25.439 Did you have good relationships with most of them? 1:37:26.280 --> 1:37:28.320 Or did you did you feel that there was resistance 1:37:28.360 --> 1:37:30.640 from the rock people that maybe you don't understand them. 1:37:30.840 --> 1:37:33.160 I know there was a situation where Sylvia roon at 1:37:33.479 --> 1:37:36.840 Elektra with like Metallica, and there was a lot of 1:37:36.880 --> 1:37:39.719 disrespect on their end because they're like, who does. 1:37:39.640 --> 1:37:40.840 This black woman know about that? 1:37:41.080 --> 1:37:43.400 Like I had my version of that, you know. One 1:37:43.479 --> 1:37:45.680 point was sort of asked the question, what does he 1:37:45.800 --> 1:37:47.720 know about rock and roll, and I say a whole 1:37:47.760 --> 1:37:49.120 lot more than you know about R and B. 1:37:49.640 --> 1:37:52.240 You know that my people created it, right. 1:37:53.400 --> 1:37:56.879 But there's a line here that says John Mellencamp being difficult. 1:37:57.160 --> 1:38:08.080 I'm sure there's a story there said John's also an essentric. 1:38:08.160 --> 1:38:09.519 I think all artists are centric. 1:38:10.520 --> 1:38:15.599 So you know, I liked him, but he's he definitely 1:38:15.840 --> 1:38:21.760 what's the Q tip line record? Yeah, John definitely read 1:38:21.800 --> 1:38:25.799 that book and then had had suspicion of everybody. Everybody 1:38:25.840 --> 1:38:27.240 record company is an idiot. 1:38:26.960 --> 1:38:29.400 You know, and uh and you know, and he was 1:38:29.439 --> 1:38:31.920 successful though he was, but he just had you know, 1:38:32.520 --> 1:38:35.000 everything was were you the brain chow behind him? 1:38:37.439 --> 1:38:43.599 What is Tim? Tim wi our new words a lot? 1:38:46.280 --> 1:38:48.800 Tim White? Timothy White who used to be the editor 1:38:48.840 --> 1:38:51.560 of Billboard. Tim and I were pretty friendly, and he 1:38:51.640 --> 1:38:54.160 was one of John's closest friends. And I knew that 1:38:54.280 --> 1:38:56.479 if I pitched John directly, here's an idea I have 1:38:56.600 --> 1:39:01.160 for a duet, But he was fuck you. So Tim 1:39:01.280 --> 1:39:03.439 calls me at one point and says we're having a conversation. 1:39:03.520 --> 1:39:05.400 He goes, I'm trying to help John make some sense 1:39:05.400 --> 1:39:07.439 to this next record. He said, what do you think? 1:39:07.520 --> 1:39:09.679 I said, Well, a cover might be a cool idea. 1:39:09.920 --> 1:39:12.800 I covered it day he goes let's got it, I said, 1:39:13.040 --> 1:39:15.880 Michelle and na Ocello, she was the girl of the moment, 1:39:15.920 --> 1:39:18.640 and so I said, John, you know it's satisfied his 1:39:18.800 --> 1:39:20.800 Negro Jane and so. 1:39:21.720 --> 1:39:24.280 Hey, this is once play a little Ricorvette at a 1:39:24.360 --> 1:39:27.559 walk man like to his audience, like back in. 1:39:27.560 --> 1:39:30.720 Eighty two, and so yeah, Tim basically with the John 1:39:30.800 --> 1:39:33.799 So here's an idea, but min and John Levan Morrison, 1:39:33.880 --> 1:39:35.560 so it's cool. Then he did it. 1:39:37.040 --> 1:39:39.200 I was at I was at a Michelle show at 1:39:39.240 --> 1:39:41.800 the Blue Note and some poor soul in the back 1:39:41.960 --> 1:39:43.040 was like shouted it out. 1:39:43.680 --> 1:39:48.200 I was like, how was the response? 1:39:49.040 --> 1:39:51.400 She laughed, Okay, oh thats how. 1:39:51.720 --> 1:39:56.439 Involving you and the creation of Vanessa's The Comfort Zone 1:39:56.479 --> 1:39:57.599 album one. 1:39:57.520 --> 1:40:00.240 Hundred percent okay, producer you work with on it? 1:40:00.439 --> 1:40:01.000 Keith Thomas. 1:40:01.240 --> 1:40:03.760 Yeah, Keith, Yeah, man, Like, how did that? 1:40:03.840 --> 1:40:06.559 Because was my favorite song on that album again, good 1:40:06.600 --> 1:40:10.800 Bye that was by MC knights comes in at the end. 1:40:14.520 --> 1:40:19.479 That was the Yeah, Keith Thomas, because I really like 1:40:19.560 --> 1:40:21.600 the B, B and C C record I'm Lost Without You. 1:40:21.840 --> 1:40:22.040 Yeah. 1:40:23.479 --> 1:40:26.000 And then Keith had produced that record, wrote and produced 1:40:26.040 --> 1:40:29.599 that record, and uh, Keith was kind of Christian David Foster, 1:40:29.880 --> 1:40:31.960 you know, that was the vibe, you know. And when 1:40:32.080 --> 1:40:34.439 when the publishing person played me save the Best for 1:40:34.600 --> 1:40:37.040 Last and I said yeah, and I played for v 1:40:37.200 --> 1:40:39.280 and she dug it. I said, who's the right person 1:40:39.320 --> 1:40:40.880 to produce that? Foster would be great to do it, 1:40:40.920 --> 1:40:44.200 but I know he won't. But Uh, Keith Thomas. I 1:40:44.280 --> 1:40:46.840 called Keith Scott. Folks who was in our capit on 1:40:46.920 --> 1:40:50.960 those days, front on you, everybody fronted up. 1:40:51.160 --> 1:40:53.519 Dreaming was a proven hit by the folks. 1:40:53.720 --> 1:40:57.000 Folks fronted, yeah, she had to do it again to 1:40:57.080 --> 1:40:58.200 prove it. Yeah, exactly. 1:40:58.400 --> 1:40:58.920 Goddamn. 1:40:59.479 --> 1:41:02.439 Keith respect called Keith and and they and they, and 1:41:02.520 --> 1:41:04.880 he said, yeah, I'm down. The funny part about is 1:41:05.000 --> 1:41:08.960 Keith's production assistant had sent me a cassette of just 1:41:09.120 --> 1:41:12.040 ideas that he had and then left out to two 1:41:12.160 --> 1:41:13.800 songs that Keith thought had come to me he thought 1:41:13.840 --> 1:41:15.760 it passed on. One of them was Baby Baby, the 1:41:15.760 --> 1:41:18.200 Amy Grant record, and the other was the song that 1:41:18.360 --> 1:41:20.519 was this big Selena hit. So that's that's the Keith 1:41:20.600 --> 1:41:23.360 Thomas story. You know, Keith, Keith, Keith was a good dude. 1:41:23.280 --> 1:41:25.840 And how was it, because another one of your hip 1:41:25.880 --> 1:41:27.400 hop I really like Dimond D. 1:41:27.720 --> 1:41:29.719 He had what you involve. 1:41:30.120 --> 1:41:32.080 We had a deal with I can't remember the name 1:41:32.080 --> 1:41:35.240 of the label, Mstry Chemistry Records, Chemistry Records, a guy 1:41:35.240 --> 1:41:38.720 called Brian Chen. Brian was the dance dance music editor 1:41:38.800 --> 1:41:41.120 Billboard for a long time. And and Brian had a 1:41:41.200 --> 1:41:43.680 partner whose name escapes me right now, but they did, 1:41:44.280 --> 1:41:48.519 they did, They had chemistry. Eto Ge was theirs. Yeah, 1:41:48.520 --> 1:41:49.560 a few things. Diamond D. 1:41:50.320 --> 1:41:59.360 Yeah, so yeah, can you please tell us the girlfriend's story? 1:42:00.479 --> 1:42:07.080 Oh? Sure. So nineteen eighty seven, eighty six, eighty seven, 1:42:07.080 --> 1:42:09.960 I'm working with Vanessa on her first record, so we're 1:42:10.000 --> 1:42:12.920 trying to make some sense of who would produce, who 1:42:12.960 --> 1:42:15.960 would work with on that record. And I knew these 1:42:16.000 --> 1:42:20.639 two guys from Cincinnati at the time, called Kenny Edmunds 1:42:20.680 --> 1:42:23.519 and Antonio Reid. I had met them because when I 1:42:23.560 --> 1:42:28.480 was working for Quincy, there was a local street producer entrepreneur, 1:42:28.520 --> 1:42:31.599 a guy called Pablo Davis in the Cincinnati, Columbus, Ohio area, 1:42:32.280 --> 1:42:36.600 and Pablo turned me onto the Callaway Brothers then and 1:42:36.720 --> 1:42:40.480 also and he was looking after Kenny. Kenny and Antonio 1:42:41.200 --> 1:42:44.400 they were just becoming La and Babyface. They hadn't gotten 1:42:44.439 --> 1:42:46.880 on yet, and they came by my office, had Vanessa 1:42:46.960 --> 1:42:49.120 go by their place and they worked. She worked with 1:42:49.200 --> 1:42:53.479 him on some songs and they gave he a song 1:42:53.560 --> 1:42:56.240 called Girlfriend, which was great. I forget who was singing 1:42:56.280 --> 1:42:58.600 the lead on the demo, and I've heard it, so 1:42:58.760 --> 1:43:01.000 this smash. I got to have this record, and I 1:43:01.080 --> 1:43:04.040 thought we'd made a deal. We played let's make a deal, 1:43:04.720 --> 1:43:08.720 and v was she was pregnant with her first child 1:43:08.800 --> 1:43:12.760 at that point, and I guess truth of the matter 1:43:12.880 --> 1:43:15.439 is cut to the end, Pebbles was the perfect person 1:43:15.520 --> 1:43:17.759 for it because she had the attitude. She was that persona. 1:43:18.040 --> 1:43:19.320 Vanessa's not that persona. 1:43:19.600 --> 1:43:23.160 But it was tried with the yeah, yeah, the right 1:43:23.200 --> 1:43:25.200 stuff was a little bomb squatted out and yeah and 1:43:26.400 --> 1:43:30.519 and the second single, uh from the cumber Zone. 1:43:30.320 --> 1:43:37.240 Album, Yeah, running back to you, right, yeah, so attitude anyway, So, 1:43:37.439 --> 1:43:38.880 like I said, I thought it had made a deal 1:43:38.920 --> 1:43:41.160 for these like four songs on the tape, that we 1:43:41.240 --> 1:43:44.280 wanted them all and her girlfriend was one of them. 1:43:44.720 --> 1:43:46.840 And at the last minute, right when I thought it 1:43:46.920 --> 1:43:50.120 was time for us to get started, l A Bales, 1:43:50.280 --> 1:43:51.800 he said, He said, I can't fuck with you on 1:43:51.840 --> 1:43:54.000 this recommend. You know, I guess Lowell that he played 1:43:54.040 --> 1:43:56.680 him for Lowell and Lil you know Lowland Jerrell and 1:43:56.800 --> 1:43:58.760 they you know, they loved him, loved it, and then 1:43:58.960 --> 1:44:01.080 you know, threw money I made and Offrey couldn't refuse, 1:44:01.600 --> 1:44:04.960 and you know I got left ass out. So yeah, 1:44:05.080 --> 1:44:07.160 I wasn't. I was, you know, it was it was. 1:44:07.280 --> 1:44:09.240 It was nearly an an R wars, you know, because 1:44:09.240 --> 1:44:11.080 I was like, I want to beat this brother's ass. 1:44:13.880 --> 1:44:15.640 Thank you man. Yeah. 1:44:15.800 --> 1:44:19.800 So, so what do you feel from Afar. 1:44:20.840 --> 1:44:22.360 From CET three or two of the Bleachers? 1:44:22.880 --> 1:44:28.320 Yes, exactly. Do you have hope that. 1:44:29.960 --> 1:44:32.439 Sort of the thing that And again, I know this 1:44:32.560 --> 1:44:35.800 is such a subjective question because I'm certain that there's 1:44:35.920 --> 1:44:39.920 some fourteen year old that's in their feelings at a 1:44:40.080 --> 1:44:43.519 Billie Eilish show that you know, probably the same way 1:44:43.720 --> 1:44:46.360 your dad's looking at Sli the family Stone, like what 1:44:46.520 --> 1:44:47.000 the hell is this? 1:44:47.240 --> 1:44:48.679 Like I knew Billy. 1:44:48.479 --> 1:44:52.320 Holliday, But in your mind, do you think that there 1:44:52.400 --> 1:44:58.160 will be an itch that gets scratched as far as 1:44:58.240 --> 1:45:02.040 your relationship to music and and what brought you to it? 1:45:03.080 --> 1:45:04.679 I don't know, Or is it just in your kid's 1:45:04.720 --> 1:45:06.960 hands down is my kid's hands down, because there's a 1:45:07.000 --> 1:45:09.400 certain aspect of it that I wonder that, you know, 1:45:09.800 --> 1:45:12.479 if the tree falls in the forest, does anybody hear it? 1:45:12.560 --> 1:45:15.160 You know, I'm wondering at times that if whatever that 1:45:15.320 --> 1:45:18.800 next big flash point is, if it happens, William Bay 1:45:18.840 --> 1:45:21.040 really how much William Bay really give a fuck? And 1:45:21.200 --> 1:45:25.519 the give a fuck factor is decidedly different now in 1:45:25.600 --> 1:45:29.640 terms of what that impact is. You know, it's the 1:45:30.120 --> 1:45:31.640 because there's so many options, you know. 1:45:32.560 --> 1:45:36.280 You know, this is probably this is this is the 1:45:36.360 --> 1:45:38.760 episode that I wish. The Faith Newman episode was like 1:45:38.800 --> 1:45:44.320 I feel satisfied. I always always tease her about like, 1:45:44.520 --> 1:45:46.360 you know, you made the worst Q less. 1:45:48.280 --> 1:45:51.080 It's just the Monica episode was the bomb. 1:45:52.600 --> 1:45:55.320 That's your favorite's favorite QL episode so far. 1:45:56.280 --> 1:45:59.360 Bootsy was cool. That was great. Monica was cool. 1:45:59.880 --> 1:46:03.360 You're gonna love the Robert Townsend episode. That is like 1:46:03.560 --> 1:46:06.640 Robert Towns in it. In my opinion, has put the 1:46:06.760 --> 1:46:09.479 Family Stand Jimmy Jam was first. 1:46:09.640 --> 1:46:10.559 Yeah, Jam was great. 1:46:10.640 --> 1:46:12.960 That was great, But then for me, the Family Stand 1:46:13.360 --> 1:46:17.120 episode was the Jimmy Jam episode with humor and a 1:46:17.200 --> 1:46:20.920 lot of salacious, unnecessary. 1:46:21.600 --> 1:46:23.120 And are slashing. 1:46:24.400 --> 1:46:27.479 I pray that Sylvia comes on the show eventually, and 1:46:27.560 --> 1:46:31.200 then Robert. I don't know the Robert Towns's episode was 1:46:31.240 --> 1:46:35.479 an unexpected nice surprise. But no, this is equally satisfied. Man, 1:46:35.640 --> 1:46:37.519 I learned so much today, man can reach. 1:46:37.720 --> 1:46:41.080 One roots question. Yes, So in retrospect, as you were 1:46:41.120 --> 1:46:44.320 watching this ship go by without you, did you ever 1:46:44.400 --> 1:46:46.240 have any moments where you were like, man, if I 1:46:46.240 --> 1:46:47.720 only able to sign with me, I would have did 1:46:47.800 --> 1:46:49.600 da d H. I would have been had them and 1:46:49.680 --> 1:46:49.880 so and. 1:46:49.920 --> 1:46:51.800 So and so someone told you that five minutes after 1:46:51.880 --> 1:46:52.880 this episode. 1:46:55.960 --> 1:47:00.320 For us, for me my roots moment because once again 1:47:00.360 --> 1:47:02.800 I wasn't as invested at the time when you were 1:47:02.800 --> 1:47:05.679 showcasing it was really Lisa and Kenyata and I would 1:47:05.760 --> 1:47:08.200 have jumped on board had you know, had we gotten 1:47:08.240 --> 1:47:10.240 the mid green lighted the deal, So I would have 1:47:10.320 --> 1:47:12.360 jumped on board to give you a little sidebar to 1:47:12.439 --> 1:47:14.960 digress them. But how the whole thing went down when 1:47:15.040 --> 1:47:16.960 you know a couple of names were spelled wrong. Yes, 1:47:17.160 --> 1:47:19.840 that ended up being a huge moment for us inside 1:47:19.880 --> 1:47:22.719 the label because a PolyGram At that time, all business 1:47:22.760 --> 1:47:25.600 affairs was kind of done centrally out of corporate and 1:47:25.680 --> 1:47:28.599 the label. Individual labels didn't have their own business affairs people, 1:47:28.920 --> 1:47:31.120 and I made so much fucking noise. 1:47:30.880 --> 1:47:32.719 About that I fired fired somebody. 1:47:32.840 --> 1:47:34.880 Yeah, well I didn't fire the person, but one of 1:47:34.920 --> 1:47:37.120 the business fairs persons. And ultimately what it led to 1:47:37.400 --> 1:47:41.160 was me getting my own business fairs person inside of 1:47:41.200 --> 1:47:43.640 the company, which is a woman called Julie Swiddler and 1:47:43.720 --> 1:47:46.200 Swiddler's Julie's now they had of business affairs and has 1:47:46.280 --> 1:47:48.719 been for the last ten years at Sony globally. 1:47:49.120 --> 1:47:51.599 So yeah, and she crossed every team, do every idea 1:47:51.800 --> 1:47:52.400 right exactly. 1:47:53.479 --> 1:47:56.400 So I was drugg that we lost you. But answer 1:47:56.400 --> 1:47:59.760 your question, what really resonated with me was when you 1:47:59.800 --> 1:48:03.240 got went to England, because I was dealing with Giles 1:48:03.280 --> 1:48:07.040 a lot in those days. And then also that how 1:48:07.160 --> 1:48:10.960 you know when you initially blew up quote unquote blew up. 1:48:11.720 --> 1:48:14.840 I met a couple of my friend's kids, white who 1:48:14.880 --> 1:48:17.320 were college students in the East, were he have you. 1:48:17.360 --> 1:48:19.240 Heard ever heard of the roots red? 1:48:19.600 --> 1:48:23.519 I'm pretty sure that was me, So yeah, there's a 1:48:23.520 --> 1:48:25.439 lot of that. I was like, I loved what you 1:48:25.520 --> 1:48:27.400 guys were generating it on your own, because I don't 1:48:27.400 --> 1:48:28.400 think it was being marketed that. 1:48:29.080 --> 1:48:31.639 Now, Wendy Goldstein did what was allowed at the time. 1:48:31.760 --> 1:48:35.479 But you know, it's almost like literally the second we signed, 1:48:35.600 --> 1:48:38.920 then the crisis started happening. No more Nirvana, no more Aerosmith, 1:48:39.000 --> 1:48:42.160 no more you know, guns and Roses. And then it's like, ah, 1:48:42.520 --> 1:48:44.200 we should have went to the PolyGram. 1:48:44.479 --> 1:48:46.200 Maybe I got a couple of things here. 1:48:46.520 --> 1:48:53.160 Yes, Yes, he's presenting me with records. Yeah, whoa, Okay, 1:48:54.120 --> 1:48:55.080 he explaining what this is. 1:48:55.479 --> 1:49:00.280 Yes, speak to ship. It's a seventy eight of Wow 1:49:01.520 --> 1:49:08.479 the Hearts, Wow on chests with your racial chests, logan. 1:49:08.680 --> 1:49:11.720 His dad's group, Wow on chest chests. 1:49:11.520 --> 1:49:14.200 Records, don't cry. 1:49:17.120 --> 1:49:17.200 Up. 1:49:17.800 --> 1:49:20.360 Whatever you need to do it have your moment. 1:49:21.920 --> 1:49:24.479 That was That was That was an artifact that came 1:49:24.520 --> 1:49:27.920 from my mom and dad. You know Pops. Pops didn't 1:49:27.920 --> 1:49:30.559 give a funk about Duop, but apparently he likes your 1:49:30.640 --> 1:49:33.720 dad's grew man because you had their record Wow. 1:49:34.439 --> 1:49:37.280 And it's a seventy eight. Do you have something to 1:49:37.280 --> 1:49:38.160 play at seventy eight on? 1:49:38.439 --> 1:49:38.840 Like you. 1:49:40.520 --> 1:49:41.360 I had to frame this. 1:49:42.040 --> 1:49:43.280 That's what you do with that? 1:49:43.400 --> 1:49:47.519 Don't play that? I feel like it'll just like I'm 1:49:48.000 --> 1:49:49.760 so I'm beyond grateful for this man. 1:49:49.840 --> 1:49:50.160 This is. 1:49:52.000 --> 1:49:54.960 Wow. I've never seen not a speechless guy. 1:49:55.080 --> 1:49:56.160 Ed made a speechless guy. 1:49:56.240 --> 1:50:00.960 Well done, man, that's real now. And oh man, even 1:50:01.040 --> 1:50:03.400 Roy Calhoun's the girl around the corners on the beach. 1:50:03.479 --> 1:50:05.040 Oh shit, and what do you have? 1:50:09.120 --> 1:50:11.320 Well, wait a minute, look at the back of it, 1:50:12.040 --> 1:50:14.519 and I'll read you the letter, because there's a. 1:50:16.800 --> 1:50:17.160 What is it? 1:50:17.280 --> 1:50:20.759 So? The legend is told that when Prince was initially 1:50:21.360 --> 1:50:24.000 doing demos and shopping himself, he only made three demos 1:50:24.040 --> 1:50:26.720 to send out. One was to go to the one 1:50:26.840 --> 1:50:28.640 was to go to Warner Brothers. One was to go 1:50:28.720 --> 1:50:31.160 to Columbia. And the lore has been A and M, 1:50:31.520 --> 1:50:35.840 but it was Quincy Jones and and so I got 1:50:35.920 --> 1:50:36.360 this letter. 1:50:37.200 --> 1:50:39.000 I got this letter. You guys have to see this. 1:50:39.400 --> 1:50:42.880 I got this letter. This is like a year before 1:50:42.960 --> 1:50:45.960 COVID from Owen Husney. Owen was Prince's original managers and 1:50:46.000 --> 1:50:49.080 old friend. Ed. Sorry, this is forty years later in 1:50:49.120 --> 1:50:51.679 getting to you. You know how the mail is these days. 1:50:52.320 --> 1:50:54.640 This is the early eight track demo before me we 1:50:54.720 --> 1:50:57.479 made the original twenty four track demo that got him 1:50:57.479 --> 1:50:59.960 signed to Warner Brothers. Your name is in my hand 1:51:00.040 --> 1:51:02.639 and writing, and the rest is Prince you can still 1:51:02.720 --> 1:51:04.960 make an offer to sign him if you like what's 1:51:05.000 --> 1:51:10.560 on the tape. Hope all is well, Please keep the 1:51:10.640 --> 1:51:12.719 secure as this is worth quite a bit to collectors. 1:51:13.600 --> 1:51:18.360 Holy. Yeah, and there is someting wet and aces that 1:51:19.840 --> 1:51:23.320 you know, you know, I mean, it's up with this 1:51:23.920 --> 1:51:27.360 very stereo, very very very stereous. 1:51:27.360 --> 1:51:29.040 Prince Rogers Nelson Esquire. 1:51:29.560 --> 1:51:32.760 Right, this is why it's so important to know your 1:51:32.840 --> 1:51:35.439 history and the players. And we gotta keep saying your name, 1:51:35.560 --> 1:51:38.519 say your name, say your name, dude. 1:51:39.320 --> 1:51:40.760 Go to nice gift and for the rest of us, 1:51:44.520 --> 1:51:45.639 the first. 1:51:45.439 --> 1:51:53.839 Dominant, he wrote, Prince Nelson Esquire, Prince Nelson Esquire. 1:51:53.920 --> 1:51:56.760 That's hilarious, very stereo. He's a lawyer, man. 1:51:56.800 --> 1:52:00.680 That's so that's seventy How how is that? How you 1:52:00.760 --> 1:52:02.719 think that pression is well. 1:52:02.640 --> 1:52:08.400 Tear drops came out and fifth fifty eight? Wow? Bro, yeah, 1:52:08.400 --> 1:52:09.920 holy you guys show the camera that they got No, 1:52:10.040 --> 1:52:12.760 that's yeah, this this this came out in fifty eight, 1:52:12.920 --> 1:52:16.240 so wow. And that's an original press and that's like. 1:52:16.320 --> 1:52:19.599 Yeah, yeah, you can say somebody played the ship out 1:52:19.600 --> 1:52:26.799 of it. A yeah, Wow, that's amazing. 1:52:28.200 --> 1:52:30.080 Wow, this is I. 1:52:30.080 --> 1:52:32.880 Brought a couple of why you signed? 1:52:32.960 --> 1:52:33.639 Did you sign Joe? 1:52:34.240 --> 1:52:34.439 Huh? 1:52:34.680 --> 1:52:35.240 You signed Joe? 1:52:35.800 --> 1:52:37.639 Yeah? Anyone? He was signed? 1:52:38.320 --> 1:52:38.479 Yeah? 1:52:38.520 --> 1:52:39.479 Yeah, yeah, yeah he was. 1:52:39.680 --> 1:52:40.439 I had the first album. 1:52:40.479 --> 1:52:42.760 Guy called Dave McPherson signed him. Yeah. 1:52:43.120 --> 1:52:47.360 Also, we didn't discuss the Jason's Lyrics soundtrack, perhaps one 1:52:47.360 --> 1:52:48.760 of my favorite soundtracks time. 1:52:49.439 --> 1:52:53.200 It is that the way for whatever reason, you will, 1:52:56.560 --> 1:52:59.680 I love that. But that was so wow. This is 1:52:59.760 --> 1:53:01.200 your this is your. 1:53:02.840 --> 1:53:04.320 This is your Blackman unit. 1:53:04.560 --> 1:53:07.439 Wasn't we can talk about that? 1:53:07.840 --> 1:53:10.960 Actually, wait a minute, did you take a stab at 1:53:11.120 --> 1:53:15.479 di'angelo before you signed it? Yeah? 1:53:15.960 --> 1:53:18.519 Gary? And then Joscelyn. Jocelyn was working for me in 1:53:18.520 --> 1:53:19.360 there in those days too. 1:53:20.040 --> 1:53:23.439 Were you in the were you in the wait? Joscelyn 1:53:23.760 --> 1:53:25.320 was shopping at the time or no. 1:53:25.520 --> 1:53:28.320 Joscelyn had a publishing company with me. I'd made we 1:53:28.400 --> 1:53:31.920 made a deal called for Midnight Music and uh, when 1:53:31.960 --> 1:53:35.200 Gary took a em I Jocelyn signed the publishing deal 1:53:36.360 --> 1:53:38.680 had him and Gary. They weren't going to use you 1:53:38.760 --> 1:53:42.280 will know for his album and George Jackson and Doug 1:53:42.360 --> 1:53:45.040 mckenry were doing Jason's lyric and that brought me in. 1:53:45.160 --> 1:53:48.599 I was music supervising it with him and I'd heard 1:53:49.439 --> 1:53:51.240 you will know from Gary, and I said this would 1:53:51.240 --> 1:53:53.320 be perfect for the for the for the soundtrack, given 1:53:53.600 --> 1:53:55.880 the theme of the film and all that stuff and 1:53:56.000 --> 1:53:57.960 having you know, come from the sort of the Q world. 1:53:58.280 --> 1:53:59.640 I came up with the idea of let's do it 1:53:59.680 --> 1:54:02.240 as were the worldish kind of thing and called it 1:54:02.400 --> 1:54:04.719 black B and you because that's what they're calling prisons 1:54:04.760 --> 1:54:07.639 at that point, black Man University was, you know, because 1:54:08.520 --> 1:54:11.760 in jail prisons called BM you, and I said let's 1:54:11.800 --> 1:54:14.040 call it BMMU, and then I said black Men United, 1:54:14.600 --> 1:54:15.400 oh ship, and then we. 1:54:15.439 --> 1:54:17.640 Did so then but you also did the same for 1:54:18.080 --> 1:54:21.320 women for the Panther. 1:54:22.640 --> 1:54:23.040 Exactly. 1:54:23.360 --> 1:54:24.880 Well, I want to thank you for coming on the 1:54:24.880 --> 1:54:26.280 show man. Thank you. 1:54:27.200 --> 1:54:29.160 You've been by like some of my favorite records man, 1:54:29.280 --> 1:54:31.439 like Amy, like you know, just from Vanessa Williams and 1:54:31.560 --> 1:54:33.680 the Tony's you know, like if I saw your name 1:54:33.720 --> 1:54:36.200 on it, I was like, okay, it's yeah, it's. 1:54:36.040 --> 1:54:36.960 Basically not for real. 1:54:37.000 --> 1:54:37.160 Man. 1:54:39.080 --> 1:54:42.040 Thank you for listening to The Quest Love Supreme hosted 1:54:42.080 --> 1:54:48.680 by Amra cous loved Thomas, Why You, Saint, Clair Coleman, Sugar, 1:54:48.760 --> 1:54:54.480 Steve mandell An, Unpaid, Bill Sherman, Executive producers are a 1:54:54.600 --> 1:54:59.320 Mere Quest, Love Thompson, Sean g and Brian Calton. 1:55:00.400 --> 1:55:04.000 Produced by Britney, benjer Cousin. 1:55:03.800 --> 1:55:11.560 Jake Payne, Wah Sinkley, edited by Alex Connolly, Produced by iHeart. 1:55:11.320 --> 1:55:16.160 By Noel Brown and Mike John's. Audio engineering by Graham 1:55:16.240 --> 1:55:29.320 Gibson and iHeart LA Studio. West Love Supreme is a 1:55:29.360 --> 1:55:31.120 production of iHeart Radio. 1:55:34.600 --> 1:55:37.840 For more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, 1:55:38.080 --> 1:55:41.120 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.