1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:04,360 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast catch us 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:07,560 Speaker 1: Live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the 3 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:10,280 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app and the Bloomberg Business app. 4 00:00:10,240 --> 00:00:12,800 Speaker 2: Or listening on demand wherever you get your podcasts. 5 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:17,360 Speaker 3: It appears Fitch was the motivation negotiators may have needed 6 00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:20,880 Speaker 3: here in Washington, of course, putting the US on rating 7 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:25,159 Speaker 3: Watch negative because of the brinksmanship. And we're hearing some 8 00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 3: more optimistic commentary today. Go figure listen to Congress from 9 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:31,960 Speaker 3: Patrick McHenry, who is quite the pessimist a couple of 10 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:34,479 Speaker 3: days ago. He's the chair of the Financial Services Committee 11 00:00:34,479 --> 00:00:36,560 Speaker 3: in the House and of course helping to lead negotiations 12 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:40,680 Speaker 3: for Republicans. Telling reporters today in the corridors of Congress, 13 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:44,800 Speaker 3: he is not pessimistic and there is quote alignment on 14 00:00:44,880 --> 00:00:48,200 Speaker 3: what we need to work on unquote. Listen to McK henry. 15 00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 4: I think we've been close for. 16 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 2: Six or seven days. 17 00:00:54,560 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 4: The issues authority, they're difficult. There is the will to. 18 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:02,040 Speaker 2: Get a deal. 19 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:05,400 Speaker 3: There is the will to get a deal knowing that 20 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:08,760 Speaker 3: members are getting on airplanes today and may be pulled 21 00:01:08,800 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 3: back to Washington at any moment. Let's get it up 22 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:15,080 Speaker 3: to date here with Zach Cohen Bloomberg, government Congress reporter 23 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 3: joining us at the top here with the latest. Zach 24 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:20,319 Speaker 3: is in touch with the leadership, with the negotiating teams, 25 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:23,520 Speaker 3: and it feels like we're getting close to something. Here's Zach. 26 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 3: I don't know what the timeline is going to be exactly, 27 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:29,480 Speaker 3: but if they can figure out a deal today maybe tomorrow, 28 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:31,960 Speaker 3: that would give the weekend to print the paper and 29 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:33,880 Speaker 3: set things up for a vote early next week. Is 30 00:01:33,920 --> 00:01:34,600 Speaker 3: that what you're hearing. 31 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:37,880 Speaker 5: It could be they might wait until next week maybe 32 00:01:37,920 --> 00:01:40,720 Speaker 5: to bring out a bill, and then you give members 33 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:43,319 Speaker 5: the seventy two hours to come back home from their 34 00:01:43,319 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 5: Memorial Day recess to actually vote on that bill and 35 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:47,240 Speaker 5: then send over to the Senate, who's also coming back 36 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 5: on Tuesday. I think it's all still very much in flux. 37 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 5: I think it's not lost on us that a lot 38 00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:56,640 Speaker 5: of these talks happened yesterday over at the executive offices 39 00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:58,840 Speaker 5: over at the by the West Wing rather than the Hill. 40 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:02,440 Speaker 5: And I was talking to one a former Trump administration 41 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:04,520 Speaker 5: legislative li Aaison to pointed out, look, this is a 42 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 5: really easy way to get more into the nitty gritty 43 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:09,959 Speaker 5: of these kinds of negotiations than you normally would be 44 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:12,280 Speaker 5: able to when you're talking, you know, just principles over 45 00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 5: in Congress. So they're definitely you know, getting down to 46 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 5: brass tacks and there's less of the sort of you know, 47 00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:20,480 Speaker 5: partisan recriminations going back and forth. And I think usually 48 00:02:20,480 --> 00:02:23,240 Speaker 5: in Watchington people stop talking the real conversations are happening, 49 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:25,280 Speaker 5: and I think that's what we're seeing here. 50 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:28,840 Speaker 3: Got it. You mentioned the fact that talks moved to 51 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:30,919 Speaker 3: the other end of Pennsylvania Avenue, and I know Patrick 52 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:33,519 Speaker 3: McHenry had suggested they were taking place in the House 53 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 3: because Republicans said, quote the upper hand is that what 54 00:02:37,240 --> 00:02:39,040 Speaker 3: you're referring to? What does that mean that it went 55 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:41,440 Speaker 3: over to a four hour session at the White House? 56 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:44,080 Speaker 5: Yeah? I think you know, a longer beating is always 57 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:45,840 Speaker 5: a good news, right because you know, four hours of 58 00:02:45,880 --> 00:02:47,520 Speaker 5: just yelling at each other doesn't really get a lot done. 59 00:02:47,720 --> 00:02:49,839 Speaker 5: It makes me think they've probably got into a little 60 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:52,080 Speaker 5: more detailed and they typically do a lot other meetings, 61 00:02:52,120 --> 00:02:53,880 Speaker 5: have you know, been an hour or two hours, you know, 62 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:56,560 Speaker 5: kind of touch glove moments, probably just to get a 63 00:02:56,600 --> 00:02:58,400 Speaker 5: sense of where folks are and then going back to 64 00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:01,400 Speaker 5: their principles and getting in a sense of where they 65 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:03,800 Speaker 5: think they can get to a deal. But yesterday's meeting 66 00:03:03,919 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 5: probably got them closer, and a lot of the folks 67 00:03:06,040 --> 00:03:07,960 Speaker 5: come out of that meeting with a lot more optimism 68 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:10,520 Speaker 5: about getting to a deal. I do think, you know, 69 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 5: getting something done by June first is still gonna be 70 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 5: really tricky, just given the fact that there is no 71 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 5: bill yet. You know, nothing's been filed, and the House 72 00:03:18,840 --> 00:03:21,120 Speaker 5: is leaving. You know, it's very quiet around here here 73 00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:23,440 Speaker 5: on Capitol Hill right now, and so you're gonna need 74 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 5: to bring folks back vote on a bill, go through 75 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:27,840 Speaker 5: the procedural vigham a role. And so we're still at 76 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:29,480 Speaker 5: least a couple of days off from something. Go into 77 00:03:29,480 --> 00:03:31,520 Speaker 5: Biden's desk for an official signature. 78 00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 3: They're on call for the weekend here. 79 00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:35,120 Speaker 5: Right a little bit. 80 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:37,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll tell you what nobody wants to be pulled 81 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:39,400 Speaker 3: out of the Memorial Day parade. I'll be curious to 82 00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:40,720 Speaker 3: see if it comes to that point. 83 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 2: Zach. 84 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:45,120 Speaker 3: You reminded us yesterday on Balance of Power about what 85 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:48,640 Speaker 3: happened in twenty eleven lawmakers went home. I believe it 86 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:51,800 Speaker 3: was August in the throes of the Obamacare debate, and 87 00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:55,840 Speaker 3: they were faced by Tea Party protesters that made a 88 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:58,720 Speaker 3: lot of them change there, tune or at least galvanized 89 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:01,080 Speaker 3: views on that before they can came back to Washington. 90 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 3: Do we risk seeing the same thing happen. 91 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:06,760 Speaker 5: Yeah, in like two thousand and nine the Obamacare fights, 92 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:08,840 Speaker 5: and in twenty seventeen over the repeal. You know, there 93 00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 5: was when you send members back home to talk to 94 00:04:10,680 --> 00:04:12,480 Speaker 5: their constituents, they're re minded of why they're here in 95 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:14,840 Speaker 5: Washington in the first place. They're gonna hear you know, 96 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:16,640 Speaker 5: you got to spend less or you've got to stop 97 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:20,520 Speaker 5: the Republicans, whatever, whichever side you're on. I am reminded 98 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:22,800 Speaker 5: of twenty eleven when there was a you know, a 99 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 5: sort of credit downgrade and that kind of compelled negotiators 100 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:29,719 Speaker 5: to come to a deal. Then it was you know, 101 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 5: then Vice President Joe Biden and sentiment earlier Mitch McConnell 102 00:04:33,279 --> 00:04:35,000 Speaker 5: that got to that deal. And so I think we 103 00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:37,760 Speaker 5: might be seeing something similar to now with Fitch talking 104 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:41,119 Speaker 5: about potentially downgrading. Yeah, the US mister blay bond raiding. 105 00:04:43,040 --> 00:04:45,720 Speaker 3: Let's hope the town halls, if they're holding any of 106 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 3: this time go Okay, Zach, thanks for chiming in, Zach Cohen, Bloomberg, 107 00:04:49,680 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 3: Government Congress reporter, as we add the voice now of 108 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:56,039 Speaker 3: Greg Valiere, the chief US policy strategist at AGF Investments. 109 00:04:57,160 --> 00:04:59,440 Speaker 3: I can see your eye roll from here, Greg. I 110 00:04:59,480 --> 00:05:01,479 Speaker 3: know you've lived through a couple of these. Do you 111 00:05:01,560 --> 00:05:03,680 Speaker 3: see a deal emerging in the next day or two? 112 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 6: Maybe my eyes are not rolling too much, Joe. I 113 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:11,360 Speaker 6: think that Zach got it right. I think that we're 114 00:05:11,400 --> 00:05:14,880 Speaker 6: probably a few days away from an agreement. In principle, 115 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 6: we've only got a week to go, and I think 116 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 6: that to put everything in legislative language to assuage concerns 117 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:25,280 Speaker 6: on the part of Democrats and Republicans might take a 118 00:05:25,360 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 6: little longer than June first or second. It might go 119 00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:30,560 Speaker 6: into mid June. I think they I've been saying for 120 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 6: quite a while. I think there'll be an extension a 121 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 6: week or two, and I still think there will be. 122 00:05:35,839 --> 00:05:37,360 Speaker 3: This is going to have to be right, but that's 123 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:39,599 Speaker 3: going to come after a deal, because I imagine no 124 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:41,919 Speaker 3: one has the stomach for that now, because everyone promised 125 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:43,680 Speaker 3: there wouldn't be a short term solution. 126 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 6: Right, Yeah, exactly. I don't think anyone's going to rescind, 127 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:49,720 Speaker 6: but you've got to get it all in the legislative language. 128 00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:54,360 Speaker 6: So it's we're not quite there yet, and a lot 129 00:05:54,400 --> 00:05:56,400 Speaker 6: of things could blow it up. I think the Democrats 130 00:05:56,440 --> 00:05:59,840 Speaker 6: are angry. I think they feel that Biden may capitulate 131 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 6: and that a lot of Democrats may balk. We're getting closer, Yeah, angry. 132 00:06:05,960 --> 00:06:09,479 Speaker 3: Indeed, we spoke just the other day with Congressman Jim McGovern, 133 00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 3: a progressive Democrat from Massachusetts who is constantly beating the 134 00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:19,520 Speaker 3: drum on beating the hunger crisis in this country, and 135 00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:22,279 Speaker 3: he's upset about work requirements, among other things. Here he 136 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 3: is in the briefing room yesterday. 137 00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:26,480 Speaker 7: You know, Moody's says that their death seilling bill will 138 00:06:26,560 --> 00:06:30,359 Speaker 7: kill seven hundred and eighty thousand jobs. So they're killing 139 00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:32,720 Speaker 7: jobs but saying you have to get a job if 140 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 7: you want any of these benefits. I mean, what the 141 00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:38,080 Speaker 7: hell is wrong with these people? I mean, this is unconscionable, 142 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:41,000 Speaker 7: It is unjust, It is just mean, it is a 143 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:44,839 Speaker 7: rotten thing to do. Let me just say this, Democrats 144 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:47,279 Speaker 7: are not going to vote for a bill that screws 145 00:06:47,320 --> 00:06:51,239 Speaker 7: poor people while protecting rich people and paving the way 146 00:06:51,279 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 7: for another tax cut for billionaires to be period. End 147 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 7: of story. 148 00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:57,960 Speaker 3: Those were Jim McGovern's Democratic colleagues clapping, not the reporters 149 00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:00,560 Speaker 3: who were in the gallery. But Greg the President of 150 00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:02,800 Speaker 3: the United States, stands to lose a good swath of 151 00:07:02,839 --> 00:07:06,200 Speaker 3: progressive Democrats, you're much like Kevin McCarthy stands to lose 152 00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:09,359 Speaker 3: a swath of conservative Republicans in the House. Is that 153 00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:11,040 Speaker 3: a foregone conclusion. 154 00:07:11,120 --> 00:07:13,400 Speaker 6: Well, it's pretty likely, and that's a major reason why 155 00:07:13,480 --> 00:07:15,400 Speaker 6: this is not a done deal yet. You could see 156 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 6: in both parties, conservatives and liberals, saying that this is 157 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:22,080 Speaker 6: not what we signed up for. So I still think 158 00:07:22,080 --> 00:07:24,800 Speaker 6: we have a ways to go. And again I think 159 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 6: that this will go into June and it will require 160 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:28,600 Speaker 6: an extension. 161 00:07:29,400 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 3: What's the remaining item that's holding this up? Is it 162 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 3: spending caps? Does everything else fall together once they arrive 163 00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:36,840 Speaker 3: at a number. 164 00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 6: I think it's pretty much the caps. I'm not sure 165 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:42,280 Speaker 6: they've got an agreement on how long dealt Will they 166 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 6: really last for ten years? I'm not sure they're there yet, 167 00:07:46,320 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 6: and it's going to take a lot of negotiations. The 168 00:07:49,000 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 6: White House wants two years, so there's still I think 169 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:54,040 Speaker 6: a long way away on that provision. 170 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:56,560 Speaker 3: Great to have you back, Greg. Thank you, Greg Valley, 171 00:07:56,560 --> 00:08:00,200 Speaker 3: you're the chief US policy strategist at AGF Investments. The 172 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:02,320 Speaker 3: ground is shifting under our feet here. You know, you 173 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:04,240 Speaker 3: want to keep your eyes on the terminal, keep your 174 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:06,240 Speaker 3: ears on Bloomberg Radio, because as soon as you think 175 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:09,880 Speaker 3: you know what's going on, something changes. And we've had 176 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 3: repeated gaggles throughout the day, the last couple of days 177 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:14,680 Speaker 3: from the speaker, from the negotiators, so a lot could 178 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:17,080 Speaker 3: happen between now and the end of the day. Let's 179 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:19,840 Speaker 3: assemble our panel for their take on things. Bloomberg Politics 180 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:23,680 Speaker 3: contributors Jennie Shanzano and Rick Davis are back with us 181 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 3: here on the Thursday edition. The story hasn't changed too 182 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 3: much here, Genie. But to Greg's point, Progressives are upset. 183 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:36,320 Speaker 3: They're getting seems progressively more upset, even as Patrick McHenry, 184 00:08:36,320 --> 00:08:38,520 Speaker 3: and maybe that's why signals that we could be on 185 00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:40,480 Speaker 3: the verge of a deal here. It's just a question 186 00:08:40,559 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 3: of who's going to vote. 187 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 8: For it, right, that's right, And we are hearing that 188 00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:48,040 Speaker 8: Democrats are really worried that the White House is giving 189 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:50,600 Speaker 8: away the store everything they worked for in the first 190 00:08:50,600 --> 00:08:53,600 Speaker 8: two years of the Biden administration. They feel many of 191 00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 8: them is now at risk, which means it is going 192 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:58,760 Speaker 8: to be an uphill battle for Jeffries and his team 193 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 8: to get the support they needed to push this through. 194 00:09:01,480 --> 00:09:05,400 Speaker 8: That said, you're hard pressed to imagine that enough Democrats 195 00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:08,680 Speaker 8: defect and go against the White House because at this point, 196 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:11,000 Speaker 8: as you were just talking about, their backs are really 197 00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:13,400 Speaker 8: up against the wall. But I think the reality is 198 00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 8: this is going to make the President increasingly unpopular with 199 00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 8: the Democrats, particularly on the progressive side in the House. Again, 200 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:23,439 Speaker 8: depending on how this thing turns out, because we still 201 00:09:23,520 --> 00:09:25,320 Speaker 8: don't know what this agreement is going to look like. 202 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:27,720 Speaker 8: If he gives away too much, they are not going 203 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:30,600 Speaker 8: to be happy. But you know, on the Republican side, 204 00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:33,439 Speaker 8: we are hearing people, even Kevin Hearn saying we may 205 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:37,080 Speaker 8: see a deal as early as tomorrow and you could 206 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:39,360 Speaker 8: call these members back within twenty four hours. So there 207 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:41,560 Speaker 8: is some positive news on the horizon. 208 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:44,520 Speaker 3: You don't get too comfortable at home, right Rick the 209 00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 3: Speaker had an interesting line today because you know that 210 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 3: Joe Biden likes to talk about the ultra maga Republican Party. 211 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:55,360 Speaker 3: He says, this is not your grandfather's or your father's 212 00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:58,479 Speaker 3: Republican party. Here's what the speaker says about Democrats. 213 00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:00,960 Speaker 4: The difficult part is the Democrat today are not the 214 00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:01,720 Speaker 4: same Democrats. 215 00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:02,680 Speaker 2: They're very extreme. 216 00:10:02,679 --> 00:10:05,040 Speaker 7: They're much more on a socialist ring. We see them 217 00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:06,160 Speaker 7: up in their. 218 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:07,880 Speaker 9: Anger right now against the president when. 219 00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 10: He's trying to curve spending at the same time. 220 00:10:09,679 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 5: Negotiating with me. 221 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:12,720 Speaker 7: It's not productive, but it's it's really. 222 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 3: Challenging the very they're very extremely from a socialist wing. Rick, 223 00:10:16,760 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 3: does it Does it come down to the fact that 224 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:20,920 Speaker 3: both parties kind of have the same problem here. 225 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:24,880 Speaker 4: Yeah, they both parties do have the extreme wings who 226 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:28,680 Speaker 4: are not forgiving in their positions and and and look, 227 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:33,120 Speaker 4: they were amplified by their leadership. You know, the President said, oh, 228 00:10:33,240 --> 00:10:35,320 Speaker 4: I'm not going to negotiate for anything, I'm just going 229 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:38,920 Speaker 4: to do a clean debt limit. Uh, debt ceiling will increased, 230 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:41,200 Speaker 4: when everyone knew that he wasn't going to get a 231 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:44,320 Speaker 4: clean debt ceiling increase. And the same with McCarthy, who 232 00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:47,240 Speaker 4: you know, passed this bill that gave everything that he 233 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:50,320 Speaker 4: could have possibly given to the Freedom Caucus and the 234 00:10:50,320 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 4: MAGA wing and knowing that he was never going to 235 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:55,319 Speaker 4: get that bill signed by the President the United States. 236 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:58,600 Speaker 4: And so you know they're feeding the the the wings 237 00:10:58,600 --> 00:10:59,280 Speaker 4: of their party. 238 00:10:59,520 --> 00:11:00,280 Speaker 2: Uh. 239 00:11:00,320 --> 00:11:03,040 Speaker 4: And then they shouldn't be shocked when they then don't 240 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:04,560 Speaker 4: like a negotiated outcome. 241 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:08,680 Speaker 3: I mean, it's your own fault. Well, how true. Look, Democrats, 242 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:12,040 Speaker 3: to your point, Genie, are getting upset with the narrative. 243 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:14,679 Speaker 3: They think that Joe Biden lost the narrative, that he's 244 00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:19,560 Speaker 3: been painted into a corner here, a rhetorical corner here, 245 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:24,560 Speaker 3: I guess by Republicans. Promila Jaia Paul chairs the Progressive 246 00:11:25,280 --> 00:11:28,520 Speaker 3: Caucus in the US House. Listen to her talking to 247 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:31,720 Speaker 3: reporters yesterday who're asking her about the brinksmanship. 248 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:37,800 Speaker 11: They are willing to tank it? They no, no, no, no, no, no, sorry. 249 00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:42,680 Speaker 11: That is exactly the problem is when the media reports 250 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:45,480 Speaker 11: this as not their fault. And I'm just going to say, 251 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:47,200 Speaker 11: I know so many of you, I have so much 252 00:11:47,240 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 11: respect for what you do, but let's tell the truth here. 253 00:11:50,360 --> 00:11:53,280 Speaker 11: We are not tanking anything. The debt ceiling has been 254 00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:56,760 Speaker 11: raised because we have an appropriations process, and during the 255 00:11:56,760 --> 00:12:02,160 Speaker 11: appropriation's process, the budget process, we negotiate the Republicans can 256 00:12:02,200 --> 00:12:05,800 Speaker 11: try to get whether they can there, but then we agree, no, 257 00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:08,760 Speaker 11: this is important. The American people should hear this. Then 258 00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:15,040 Speaker 11: we agree on spending. Republicans agree, Democrats agree. We decide 259 00:12:15,120 --> 00:12:19,319 Speaker 11: we appropriate money based on what Congress has passed, legislation 260 00:12:19,480 --> 00:12:23,000 Speaker 11: that we pass in this body. That is democracy, and 261 00:12:23,080 --> 00:12:28,560 Speaker 11: then when it's time, the debt ceiling is raised to 262 00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:31,960 Speaker 11: accommodate what we have already passed. 263 00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:36,520 Speaker 3: Genie, that is the sound of exasperation coming from the 264 00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 3: chair of the Progressive Caucus. What does Joe Biden say 265 00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:40,160 Speaker 3: to them? 266 00:12:40,559 --> 00:12:40,760 Speaker 12: You know? 267 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:44,199 Speaker 8: And I think exasperation understandably so, and I think the 268 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:47,800 Speaker 8: President is empathetic to what they are saying. The reality is, 269 00:12:47,840 --> 00:12:49,840 Speaker 8: you raise the debt ceiling to pay for what you 270 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 8: already spent, then you talk about future spending. And Democrats 271 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:56,720 Speaker 8: have long felt this. They are being pushed against the 272 00:12:56,720 --> 00:12:58,599 Speaker 8: wall that they are asked to do both at the 273 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:00,680 Speaker 8: same time, and if they don't, they will be somehow 274 00:13:00,679 --> 00:13:03,720 Speaker 8: blamed for not raising the debt ceiling and going into default. 275 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:06,880 Speaker 8: When the reality is you should raise it. It shouldn't 276 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:08,480 Speaker 8: even be there, but if you have it, you should 277 00:13:08,559 --> 00:13:10,360 Speaker 8: raise it to pay for what you spent. And then 278 00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:14,040 Speaker 8: you talk about spending, and Republicans have bungled, you know, 279 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:16,960 Speaker 8: put this together because they know that the cuts they 280 00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 8: want are really, really devastating. And by the way, we 281 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:23,360 Speaker 8: still don't know exactly what the implications of those are. 282 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:26,080 Speaker 8: And I would guess many Republicans once we see those 283 00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:30,000 Speaker 8: line items, once we see the appropriations specific, they are 284 00:13:30,040 --> 00:13:31,760 Speaker 8: not going to be too happy with where those cuts 285 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:34,360 Speaker 8: are either. But we don't see that now, and that's 286 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:38,000 Speaker 8: I think the exasperation. But the reality is Congress is 287 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:40,720 Speaker 8: working this way or not working this way, and there's 288 00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:42,600 Speaker 8: not a lot to be done about it at this point. 289 00:13:42,720 --> 00:13:45,560 Speaker 3: Well, progressives were already pretty upset with this president over 290 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:48,520 Speaker 3: the border. We've heard a lot of criticism coming from 291 00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:51,840 Speaker 3: that corner, certainly in the House, also in the Senate, 292 00:13:51,880 --> 00:13:54,080 Speaker 3: though Bob Menendez has been digging the president on this 293 00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 3: for months as well. Rick, And then you go back 294 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:59,920 Speaker 3: to build back better, remember that it was Formilijaiapaul again 295 00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:04,920 Speaker 3: at the podium questioning the president's intentions on this as 296 00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:09,560 Speaker 3: so many items that progressives wanted were left on the floor, 297 00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:12,360 Speaker 3: and of course that bill never became law anyway. Does 298 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:15,400 Speaker 3: he have a problem with progressive Democrats. 299 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,960 Speaker 4: Well, sure, I mean he has a part inside the House, right, 300 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:21,160 Speaker 4: I'm not sure he has a problem running for re 301 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:24,800 Speaker 4: election with progressive Democrats. I don't think he has a problem, 302 00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:27,080 Speaker 4: you know, building a coalition to be able to get 303 00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:29,880 Speaker 4: things done in the House. Probably a bigger problem in 304 00:14:29,920 --> 00:14:32,800 Speaker 4: the Senate, where folks like you know, Joe Manchin and 305 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:36,560 Speaker 4: Christen Cinema have kept you know, the Democrats sort of 306 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:40,240 Speaker 4: at bay. But the reality is that he's got the 307 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:43,760 Speaker 4: political coalition he needs. They're not going to go anywhere else. 308 00:14:43,800 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 4: There's not going to be a candidate that runs against 309 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 4: him from the left that's going to have any efficacy. 310 00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:53,240 Speaker 4: So he just needs to get through this legislative moracities 311 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:56,000 Speaker 4: in and they're not any help to him whatsoever. 312 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:59,160 Speaker 3: It feels like we've been here before. 313 00:15:02,120 --> 00:15:05,520 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the 314 00:15:05,560 --> 00:15:09,440 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the 315 00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:11,680 Speaker 1: tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com. 316 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:12,840 Speaker 2: And the Bloomberg Business App. 317 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:15,800 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 318 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 319 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 3: So did you get on Twitter? Spaces last night. Did 320 00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:28,520 Speaker 3: you hear Ronda Santis launch his presidential campaign? Those are 321 00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:31,440 Speaker 3: two separate questions, As it turns out, as the Big 322 00:15:31,440 --> 00:15:35,720 Speaker 3: show with Elon Musk was hampered by technical difficulties. 323 00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:39,520 Speaker 10: There's three eighty two thousand people listen, all right, great, 324 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 10: so let's. 325 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:41,320 Speaker 11: See there he is. 326 00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:44,120 Speaker 3: Keeps crashing. 327 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:48,600 Speaker 2: Just a massive number of people online. 328 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:51,520 Speaker 11: So it's services training somewhat. 329 00:15:51,880 --> 00:15:56,040 Speaker 3: Servers are stream captain. She can't take any more. This 330 00:15:56,080 --> 00:16:00,560 Speaker 3: one on for like twenty minutes. Hello, there was and 331 00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:04,920 Speaker 3: random people mentioning things. They didn't get it together for 332 00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:07,320 Speaker 3: like another twenty minutes in a different space with many 333 00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:08,240 Speaker 3: fewer people listening. 334 00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:12,040 Speaker 13: Biden's allowed woke ideology to drive his agenda. We will 335 00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 13: never surrender to the woke mob, and we will leave 336 00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:17,880 Speaker 13: woke ideology in the dust bin of history. 337 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:21,000 Speaker 3: So the woke message got out and Governor DeSantis took 338 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:24,440 Speaker 3: questions for the better part of an hour. Even with 339 00:16:24,680 --> 00:16:30,320 Speaker 3: the failure to launch, at least initially and somewhat tongue 340 00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 3: in cheek, the DeSantis campaign put a whole new video together, 341 00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:38,360 Speaker 3: separate from the slick produced video announcing his campaign, to 342 00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 3: claim that they broke the internet. 343 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:40,360 Speaker 11: Hi. 344 00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:43,240 Speaker 13: This is Governor Ron DeSantis. I'm running for president of 345 00:16:43,280 --> 00:16:47,040 Speaker 13: the United States to lead our great American comeback. We 346 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:50,360 Speaker 13: announced that on Twitter spaces earlier tonight, and it broke 347 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:53,720 Speaker 13: the Internet took so many people were excited about being 348 00:16:53,760 --> 00:16:54,720 Speaker 13: on that Twitter space. 349 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:57,760 Speaker 3: Who knew the governor had something in common with Kim Kardashian. 350 00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 3: But you better believe Donald Trump was watching. The President 351 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:07,200 Speaker 3: was too. President tweets this link works with a link 352 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 3: to his donation page, but the social media team was 353 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 3: busy watching this in real time. Donald Trump, for instance, 354 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:19,879 Speaker 3: posted this on truth Social They actually cobbled together with 355 00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 3: I don't know. They put actors in a room or 356 00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:25,800 Speaker 3: something their version of what happened. Who needs SNL with 357 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 3: this kind of stuff. 358 00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:29,080 Speaker 14: Hi, everyone, welcome to our Ronda Santas Twitter space. 359 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 2: Hello, is my microphone working correctly? George? 360 00:17:32,320 --> 00:17:33,080 Speaker 4: Can you just wait? 361 00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:35,240 Speaker 2: Can you hear me? 362 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:36,480 Speaker 14: We can all hear you. 363 00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:37,880 Speaker 1: George, Can you just hold on for second? 364 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:42,520 Speaker 3: This is not real? They see the coughing. I don't 365 00:17:42,520 --> 00:17:45,520 Speaker 3: think George knows how to use Twitter. Talking about George Soros. 366 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:46,720 Speaker 3: If you look at they actually had a name of 367 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:49,720 Speaker 3: George Soros is on there. Hitler the Devil. 368 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:51,639 Speaker 2: George. 369 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:55,080 Speaker 14: Can somebody just mute George? 370 00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:00,320 Speaker 3: And then Joe Biden had his own version. The White 371 00:18:00,359 --> 00:18:02,119 Speaker 3: House actually put something together here. 372 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:04,000 Speaker 15: That was something that we were very proud to do 373 00:18:04,040 --> 00:18:04,200 Speaker 15: with it. 374 00:18:05,040 --> 00:18:07,200 Speaker 13: So I would embrace proposals, you. 375 00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:11,280 Speaker 3: Know, with the sound of DeSantis talking about different issues 376 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:20,080 Speaker 3: and stop the feedback. But that's actually kind of what 377 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:24,679 Speaker 3: it sounded like. Let's reassemble our panel, Rick Davis and 378 00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:28,960 Speaker 3: Genie Shanzeno or with a spoonber of politics contributors. Rick, 379 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:30,320 Speaker 3: I'm sure this is not the way you would have 380 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:31,680 Speaker 3: launched a presidential campaign. 381 00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:34,480 Speaker 4: Well, I did say yesterday that we'd be talking more 382 00:18:34,480 --> 00:18:37,080 Speaker 4: about Musk today, and then we were Santas. I had 383 00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 4: no idea that we'd actually be talking more about Twitter 384 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:44,360 Speaker 4: spaces than we were talking about Musk and Disantas. 385 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:45,399 Speaker 3: So I don't know. 386 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:48,760 Speaker 4: I mean it, It is not the way to start 387 00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:53,520 Speaker 4: a campaign. The pre campaign wasn't a particularly good outing either, 388 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:59,399 Speaker 4: So I would say maybe, unlike most campaigns that have 389 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:02,359 Speaker 4: been launched so far in the Republican side, the Santa 390 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:05,639 Speaker 4: still has to prove that he can campaign, and so 391 00:19:06,280 --> 00:19:09,120 Speaker 4: I think that's usually a pretty low bar, but that seems. 392 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:11,760 Speaker 3: To have been raised in his case, boy, So how 393 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 3: do you recover from something like By the way, everyone 394 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:18,000 Speaker 3: should know, Genie was giving me real time updates during this. 395 00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:20,040 Speaker 3: We had to We were texting each other just as 396 00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:23,879 Speaker 3: sort of a support group. You heard the whole thing, Genie, 397 00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:25,760 Speaker 3: you were one of those numbers on there that they're 398 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:29,080 Speaker 3: taking credit for helping to break the internet. What do 399 00:19:29,119 --> 00:19:31,119 Speaker 3: you do now if you're on to Santas. 400 00:19:31,040 --> 00:19:34,199 Speaker 8: Boy, Joe, I was texting you, I texted Rick. You know, 401 00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:37,919 Speaker 8: I got on, I was pushed off. I was thrown 402 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 8: into somebody's space with men and women talking. I didn't 403 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:44,600 Speaker 8: know where I was. There's no Twitter spaces on the homepage. 404 00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:47,840 Speaker 8: I found it again. I got in. There was the 405 00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:50,760 Speaker 8: all the coughing and the hot mic moment. It was 406 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:53,200 Speaker 8: very confusing, but I did stick through the whole thing, 407 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:56,679 Speaker 8: and I was messaging you and you know, so you know, 408 00:19:56,880 --> 00:20:00,280 Speaker 8: if you talk about you know, his major all in 409 00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:03,000 Speaker 8: card seems to be that he's electable and that he 410 00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:05,360 Speaker 8: can keep the trains running on time because he can 411 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:08,520 Speaker 8: execute when he governs. I'm not so sure this is 412 00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:11,080 Speaker 8: the rollout that they wanted. In fact, I'm sure it's not. 413 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:14,360 Speaker 8: It is going to become a metaphor for a botched 414 00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:19,399 Speaker 8: launched and a botched campaign. It's recoverable, but boy was 415 00:20:19,440 --> 00:20:21,800 Speaker 8: it a mess. And you know, he was trying to 416 00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:25,480 Speaker 8: stick it to the establishment traditional media. I think he 417 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:28,200 Speaker 8: did exactly the opposite, because one could say that when 418 00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:30,520 Speaker 8: he went on Fox with Trey Goudi that's where he 419 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:33,720 Speaker 8: should have started. It was normal. You could understand, you 420 00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:36,880 Speaker 8: want to appeal to people in Iowa. They're older, they're 421 00:20:37,119 --> 00:20:39,480 Speaker 8: you know, not as much on Twitter. Fox was the 422 00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:40,120 Speaker 8: place to go. 423 00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:44,199 Speaker 3: Who knew, Well, maybe a lot of people. Here's what 424 00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 3: I think our listeners need to hear about, though, Rick. 425 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:50,680 Speaker 3: I mean, when you're running a presidential campaign, there are 426 00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:53,280 Speaker 3: ways to do this. I mean, if let's say there's 427 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 3: a world in which you did sanction such a campaign launch, 428 00:20:56,560 --> 00:20:58,880 Speaker 3: there'd be an advance crew, right, There'd be a dry 429 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:01,800 Speaker 3: run somewhere on Twitter. They apparently took Elon at his 430 00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:03,360 Speaker 3: word that this would all work. Yeah. 431 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:07,600 Speaker 4: No, this is not for primetime players running this campaign. 432 00:21:08,320 --> 00:21:11,000 Speaker 4: It's a mostly Florida crowd that haven't had a lot 433 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,440 Speaker 4: of experience in the national arena. Maybe things that work 434 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:19,399 Speaker 4: in Tallahassee don't necessarily work in other venues around the world, 435 00:21:20,080 --> 00:21:23,040 Speaker 4: just a lot of miscalculations and as you point out, Joe, 436 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 4: a real lack of preparation. I mean, you would have 437 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:29,119 Speaker 4: tested this out, you know, With all due respect to 438 00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:33,440 Speaker 4: the massive meltdown of their servers. Five hundred thousand people 439 00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 4: signed on is not a lot of people for a server, 440 00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:42,320 Speaker 4: and two hundred and fifty thousand that ultimately were there 441 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:46,160 Speaker 4: by the time the candidates showed up in the broadcast 442 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:51,520 Speaker 4: is a sentilla of what a normal TV audience for 443 00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:54,400 Speaker 4: prime time would be in any other network. I mean, 444 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:58,320 Speaker 4: even NBC gets a bigger rating than two hundred and 445 00:21:58,359 --> 00:22:02,320 Speaker 4: fifty thousand people. So the reality is none of this 446 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:06,000 Speaker 4: makes any sense. I mean, after the fact, you look 447 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,119 Speaker 4: at this and say, you know, what were they thinking 448 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:11,439 Speaker 4: in Tallahassee. This is a This is a really botched effort, 449 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:15,320 Speaker 4: and it just shows the lack of experiency experience that 450 00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:19,760 Speaker 4: the campaign team put their candidate in a very awkward position. 451 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 3: Well, Donald Trump Junior tweeted a new nickname last evening. 452 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 3: This is right in the middle of the six twenty 453 00:22:26,160 --> 00:22:28,159 Speaker 3: pm whether they're trying to figure out, you know, what 454 00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:32,240 Speaker 3: the plug in and what the reboot. He tweeted simply 455 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:37,280 Speaker 3: hashtag disaster. I wonder if that one sticks, and his 456 00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:39,640 Speaker 3: dad was quick to come out with a video on 457 00:22:39,680 --> 00:22:40,680 Speaker 3: social media too. 458 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:44,000 Speaker 12: Rob the sanctimonious and his poll numbers are dropping like 459 00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:47,960 Speaker 12: a rock. I would almost be inclined to say these 460 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 12: are record falls. The question is Rob just young, inexperience, 461 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:57,199 Speaker 12: a naive or more troubling, is he a fool who 462 00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:00,520 Speaker 12: has no idea what the hell he's doing. You already 463 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:01,960 Speaker 12: have one of those in office. 464 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 2: We don't need another one was. 465 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 3: A fool who is no Wow, Genie, did Donald Trump 466 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:09,480 Speaker 3: have the best night of his campaign last night? 467 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:12,840 Speaker 8: He had a pretty good one. I liked the I 468 00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:14,720 Speaker 8: can't say the way you do a disaster, but. 469 00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:16,159 Speaker 3: Yes, yes, right. 470 00:23:16,359 --> 00:23:18,600 Speaker 8: There was a lot of debacles because I guess you 471 00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 8: don't want your name beginning with dee at this point. Really, 472 00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:25,280 Speaker 8: the Trump truth that I didn't understand it, Joe, maybe 473 00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:27,680 Speaker 8: you can explain me was the one. Rob. My red 474 00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:30,879 Speaker 8: button is bigger, better, stronger in his working yours does not. 475 00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:33,520 Speaker 8: I didn't understand. I try to make sense for you. 476 00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:36,960 Speaker 8: That truth was beyond me. I'm still not sure what 477 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:40,479 Speaker 8: he was talking about. So it was a typical Donald Trump. 478 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:43,719 Speaker 8: He got a lot of play on this, and you know, 479 00:23:44,080 --> 00:23:47,800 Speaker 8: it was fascinating because with all of this, Ron DeSantis 480 00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:51,520 Speaker 8: didn't even take it to Donald Trump directly. He did 481 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:55,280 Speaker 8: not really mention him apparently until he spoke with journalists 482 00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:58,520 Speaker 8: on this call afterwards. And you know, the two hundred 483 00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:01,640 Speaker 8: and fifty thousand people were gone, So you know, it's 484 00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:05,760 Speaker 8: it's sort of head scratching when you're down by thirty points, unreal. 485 00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:09,919 Speaker 3: Elon Musk tweeted, by the way, after the Disantis event, quote, 486 00:24:09,960 --> 00:24:13,520 Speaker 3: all presidential candidates are most welcome on this platform. I 487 00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 3: believe it was Rick Davis who compared him to David Letterman. 488 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 3: This is apparent league and I just wonder how many, 489 00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:21,520 Speaker 3: if any take the bait on this. But it brings 490 00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:24,640 Speaker 3: us back to nineteen eighty Remember this the DNC when 491 00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:30,840 Speaker 3: the balloons wouldn't drop. Jimmy Carter has heard on ABC 492 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:36,320 Speaker 3: News that night. Pat tip to Howard Mortman for posting this. 493 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:39,680 Speaker 3: By the way, it certainly brought us back. Jimmy Carter 494 00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:41,400 Speaker 3: is looking up at the ceiling, the balloons won't fall. 495 00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 3: Give that thing a shake. Come on, the bands play. 496 00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:52,160 Speaker 3: We're trying to launch a campaign here Peter Jennings bailed 497 00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:52,600 Speaker 3: me out. 498 00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:56,280 Speaker 14: Getting the balloons down on large box car. Then at 499 00:24:56,320 --> 00:25:00,840 Speaker 14: the top of your screen they are one is stuck 500 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:04,160 Speaker 14: and the other is only partially opening. So what we're 501 00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:05,679 Speaker 14: getting is a kind of waterfall of. 502 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:10,479 Speaker 3: The waterfall of balloons. There were no balloons, however. On Twitter, 503 00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:15,040 Speaker 3: Rick Davis and g D Shanzano many thanks, as always 504 00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:17,800 Speaker 3: our signature panel. I'm Joe Matthew in Washington. 505 00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast Catch us 506 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:25,000 Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the 507 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:27,680 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business app. 508 00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:30,200 Speaker 2: Or listening on demand wherever you get your podcasts. 509 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,960 Speaker 3: Hayley, We've got more news that's coming from the other 510 00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 3: end of Pennsylvania Avenue. This time YEP speaker McCarthy and 511 00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:42,240 Speaker 3: Congressman Patrick McHenry, the chair's Financial Services. We're speaking optimistically, 512 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:47,120 Speaker 3: although interesting, mckenry said, I'm not pessimistic. Yes, this means 513 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:47,960 Speaker 3: he's optimistic. 514 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:50,000 Speaker 9: I don't know. I feel like there's a distinction to 515 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:54,840 Speaker 9: be drawn between not pessimistic and optimistic, because he specifically 516 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:57,440 Speaker 9: didn't say that he was optimistic. He also earlier said 517 00:25:57,440 --> 00:25:59,520 Speaker 9: that there was alignment on the work they needed to do, 518 00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:02,280 Speaker 9: which is another way of saying that they're still unaligned 519 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:03,800 Speaker 9: on some things. 520 00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:07,760 Speaker 3: So yeah, it's like the difference between mostly Cloudy and 521 00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:12,000 Speaker 3: partly Sonny. Still but now the president, the President's I 522 00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:14,240 Speaker 3: like the sound. I believe we will come to an agreement. 523 00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:16,639 Speaker 3: When speaking, McCarthy kind of said as much yesterday. 524 00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:19,240 Speaker 9: Yeah, but he then the President went on to say 525 00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:23,200 Speaker 9: that the negotiations with McCarthy now are about budget outlines, 526 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:26,120 Speaker 9: and that he put forward a proposal to free spending 527 00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:28,080 Speaker 9: for two years. But this is what we keep coming 528 00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:31,000 Speaker 9: back to, this idea that freezing spending is not going 529 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:32,480 Speaker 9: to be enough for the Republican side. 530 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 3: Got to be cutting spending. 531 00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 6: Yep. 532 00:26:34,840 --> 00:26:37,159 Speaker 3: And I don't know exactly how that's all going to 533 00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:40,399 Speaker 3: work out. No one does. In fact, Patrick McHenry was 534 00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:43,840 Speaker 3: saying it. Everyone's being is an expert on this. Everybody's 535 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:46,639 Speaker 3: talking about the finer details we had. The ones in 536 00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:49,719 Speaker 3: the room have no idea what those details are going 537 00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:49,960 Speaker 3: to be. 538 00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:52,320 Speaker 9: Yeah, and then we need to figure out what the 539 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:55,399 Speaker 9: result of those details is, right, because we are so 540 00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:57,879 Speaker 9: worried about getting a deal. But when a deal is done, 541 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,480 Speaker 9: if spending cuts are included in theory, it's going to 542 00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:02,040 Speaker 9: have an impact on the US economy. 543 00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:06,800 Speaker 3: So Mark Zandy did some research on this a couple 544 00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:12,160 Speaker 3: of weeks back. What if limit Save grow passed as written, 545 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:15,320 Speaker 3: and it was pretty tough. It was actually more damaging 546 00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:17,879 Speaker 3: to the job market than what Bloomberg Economics came up with. 547 00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:20,440 Speaker 3: This week, Anna Wong told us five hundred and seventy 548 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:22,919 Speaker 3: thousand jobs would be lost. I believe Mark had a 549 00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:27,159 Speaker 3: couple one hundred thousand more than that. Yep, And I 550 00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,320 Speaker 3: wonder his thoughts on this warning. You saw what Fitch 551 00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:30,080 Speaker 3: has to say too. 552 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:33,840 Speaker 9: Yeah, Fitch Ratings putting the US's triple A credit rating 553 00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 9: on watch negative. So not a downgrade, but also not a. 554 00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:42,720 Speaker 3: Reminder that everybody's watching here. Mark Sandy, of course, is 555 00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:45,680 Speaker 3: the chief economist at Moody's Analytics, has been a busy Guyletly, 556 00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:48,400 Speaker 3: every time I look up, there's Mark Zandy. It's great 557 00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:52,000 Speaker 3: to have you back here. Mark, Just before we get 558 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:55,840 Speaker 3: into the impact of a potential deal, what are you hearing? 559 00:27:55,880 --> 00:28:00,399 Speaker 3: What's your thought here? When Fitch drops a news release 560 00:28:00,560 --> 00:28:02,480 Speaker 3: like that, drops a warning like that, it seems to 561 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:03,200 Speaker 3: motivate people. 562 00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:08,760 Speaker 15: Well, it's good to be with you, Kayley. I'll have 563 00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:14,840 Speaker 15: to tell you I'm getting more nervous. Yeah, just talking 564 00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:15,680 Speaker 15: to folks. 565 00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:15,879 Speaker 6: In d C. 566 00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:19,439 Speaker 15: Both on the Hill and you know, uh and the administration. 567 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:22,520 Speaker 15: It just feels like this thing can really go off 568 00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:26,000 Speaker 15: the rails. The politics are just so vexed. 569 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:26,359 Speaker 14: You know. 570 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:31,760 Speaker 15: The Speaker's got a pretty tough group of folks on 571 00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:34,400 Speaker 15: the on the right, the Freedom Caucus, and of course 572 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,040 Speaker 15: the President's got the folks on the left of the 573 00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:39,920 Speaker 15: number of progressives, and finding the votes in the middle 574 00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:44,920 Speaker 15: is really very difficult, tricky. So I'd have to say 575 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:49,400 Speaker 15: the odds that this goes to the XT date and 576 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:53,520 Speaker 15: we breach meaning the Treasury can't pay everyone on time, 577 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 15: is not inconsequential. I put it one in four at 578 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:01,680 Speaker 15: this point. Still, you know, better than even odds they 579 00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:03,840 Speaker 15: get this thing done in time. But I have to 580 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:06,480 Speaker 15: say one and four just feels really uncomfortable to me. 581 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:10,160 Speaker 9: Yeah, I mean, we all recognize that there is room 582 00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 9: for error. Even if we do get a handsheet shake 583 00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:14,880 Speaker 9: deal between Speaker McCarthy and President Biden, it still needs 584 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:17,640 Speaker 9: to make it through both chambers of Congress, exactly to 585 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,280 Speaker 9: your point, And of course we had Joe the tweet 586 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:23,080 Speaker 9: from Senator Mike Lee earlier today saying he will use 587 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:26,640 Speaker 9: every procedural tool at his disposal to impede a debt 588 00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 9: ceiling deal that doesn't contain substantial spending and budgetary reforms. 589 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:34,240 Speaker 9: So we have to keep in mind that a deal 590 00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:36,240 Speaker 9: is really just part one. But on the subject of 591 00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:39,680 Speaker 9: those spending and budgetary reforms, Mark Joe was talking about 592 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:41,800 Speaker 9: the research he put out. You know, when the Limit 593 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:44,680 Speaker 9: Save Grow Act was just passed, if we're not talking 594 00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:48,440 Speaker 9: about spending cuts, more of a two year kind of deal, 595 00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:52,480 Speaker 9: something more moderate, how could the forward looking economic picture 596 00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:53,160 Speaker 9: be different in. 597 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:57,400 Speaker 15: That case, Well, it'll be a drag on growth. I mean, 598 00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:00,040 Speaker 15: I think if it were you know, let's say a 599 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:03,719 Speaker 15: twenty three spending levels, the twenty twenty three fiscal year 600 00:30:03,760 --> 00:30:07,840 Speaker 15: spending levels and frozen at that, so that would be 601 00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:12,120 Speaker 15: no growth in nominal discretionary spending for twenty twenty four 602 00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:15,720 Speaker 15: twenty twenty five. Then you know, oous, that's more of 603 00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:19,680 Speaker 15: a headwind than the current the current budget, but it's 604 00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:21,800 Speaker 15: not enough of a headwind I think to push the 605 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:27,479 Speaker 15: economy into recession. So that's that's manageable. That's doable. I mean, 606 00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:30,800 Speaker 15: if there's outright cuts, then it becomes a lot more tricking. 607 00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:33,120 Speaker 15: As you pointed out, if you get limits safe grow 608 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,400 Speaker 15: which was put spending back to fiscal year twenty twenty 609 00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:39,160 Speaker 15: two levels and grow it out at one percent per AUM, 610 00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:42,600 Speaker 15: that is a much bigger hit and recession becomes much 611 00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:45,720 Speaker 15: more likely. So it's you know, obviously the economy is struggling, 612 00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:49,720 Speaker 15: it's working really hard to stay out of recession, and 613 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:52,000 Speaker 15: you know, any kind of weight you put on it 614 00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:54,120 Speaker 15: makes it more likely it will go into recession. 615 00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:56,720 Speaker 3: Of course, we don't know where the cuts would be, right, 616 00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:02,280 Speaker 3: they're negotiating over top line figure gears as we call them, Mark. 617 00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:07,000 Speaker 3: So could this potentially change when the appropriations folks get 618 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:09,040 Speaker 3: together and actually lay out where these cuts would go. 619 00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:13,160 Speaker 15: Yeah, sure, I think you're right, Joe. And also maybe 620 00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:16,200 Speaker 15: the timing, I mean, the timing here is a bit 621 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:19,240 Speaker 15: unfortunate because you know, on paper, it would begin that 622 00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:21,120 Speaker 15: the start of the new fiscal year, fiscal year twenty 623 00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:23,960 Speaker 15: four begins in October, the fourth quarter of the year, 624 00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:26,720 Speaker 15: and that's when most economists, you know, the consensus is 625 00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:29,200 Speaker 15: we're going into recession that limit or not. I think 626 00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:33,320 Speaker 15: Bloomberg's in that camp that, you know, if you get 627 00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:35,600 Speaker 15: cuts in the fourth quarter, that you know, makes it 628 00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:38,200 Speaker 15: much more difficult for the economy to avoid an economic downturn. 629 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:42,320 Speaker 15: So maybe they could finesse it. Obviously, the politics of 630 00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:46,120 Speaker 15: everything are vexed, including that, but they could push it 631 00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:49,240 Speaker 15: out a little bit and you know, kind of smooth 632 00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:50,840 Speaker 15: it out a little bit. That would I think be 633 00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:51,840 Speaker 15: better for the economy. 634 00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:54,480 Speaker 9: Well, and of course there's the question of what happens 635 00:31:54,520 --> 00:31:56,440 Speaker 9: to the economy and the event that we see something 636 00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:59,560 Speaker 9: akin to twenty eleven and potentially a downgrade of the 637 00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:02,160 Speaker 9: United seats this credit rating Fitch putting us all on 638 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:06,720 Speaker 9: watch with this negative watch that it put out in 639 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,080 Speaker 9: the last twenty four hours. Mark. How concerned are you 640 00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:13,280 Speaker 9: that the credit rating ratings agencies would do something like 641 00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 9: S and P Global did twelve years ago. 642 00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:18,520 Speaker 15: Well, let me first say, Kaylee, I'm not in the 643 00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:21,480 Speaker 15: rating agency, so I don't have any specific insight here, 644 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:25,360 Speaker 15: and each rating agency has a different set of methodologies 645 00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:30,160 Speaker 15: for determining, you know, what to do. I'm most versed 646 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:35,960 Speaker 15: on Moody's policy, and Moody's is pretty clear that downgrade 647 00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:39,800 Speaker 15: would only occur if the Treasury did not pay on 648 00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,880 Speaker 15: the debt. If the Treasury did not prioritize the debt payments, 649 00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:46,960 Speaker 15: then that would be the fodder for a downgrade. But 650 00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:50,000 Speaker 15: I think the odds of that are zero. I can't 651 00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:54,880 Speaker 15: at least initially. I just don't see the Treasury not 652 00:32:55,160 --> 00:33:00,080 Speaker 15: paying on the debt because it would create downgrades in 653 00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:04,920 Speaker 15: a cascade of downgate grades, because every entity that's backstopped 654 00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:08,720 Speaker 15: explicitly or implicitly by the federal government would be downgraded. 655 00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:12,480 Speaker 15: So Fanny May, Freddie Mack, you know, who are key 656 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:15,800 Speaker 15: to the housing mortgage markets, the federal homeown bank system, 657 00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:19,800 Speaker 15: key to the funding, particularly in the banking system today 658 00:33:19,840 --> 00:33:23,920 Speaker 15: given the crisis that they've been grappling with, every sippy bank, 659 00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:26,800 Speaker 15: systemically important bank, you know, I think JP, Morgan Chase 660 00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:30,440 Speaker 15: or Bank of America, municipalities. I mean, the list is long, 661 00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:34,400 Speaker 15: and it would be chaos, and that would be appropriate 662 00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:36,520 Speaker 15: at that point to say that's catastrophic. That would be 663 00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:38,960 Speaker 15: the economy evaporate at that point. So I just don't 664 00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:42,480 Speaker 15: see them doing that. I think they they will prioritize 665 00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:44,840 Speaker 15: debt payments and then everyone else will get paid. Like 666 00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:47,520 Speaker 15: by the way that they can't do that forever because 667 00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:50,600 Speaker 15: I suspect they'll get sued, The Treasury will get sued, 668 00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:53,520 Speaker 15: and so security recipient will say, well, why in the 669 00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:55,720 Speaker 15: world did you put the bond holder ahead of me? 670 00:33:55,840 --> 00:33:58,959 Speaker 15: I mean, I'm, you know, eighty three year old grandma, 671 00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:01,680 Speaker 15: and you're just going to get pay a bondholder, which 672 00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 15: could be, by the way, a Chinese bond holder or 673 00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:05,960 Speaker 15: a Saudi bond holder. Does that make sense to anybody? 674 00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:11,440 Speaker 15: So that's that's a near term kind of workaround to 675 00:34:11,840 --> 00:34:15,279 Speaker 15: you know, chaos. But it's only a temporary workaround, not. 676 00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:18,120 Speaker 3: The best politics. I do wonder, Kayley, what Mark Zandi 677 00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:21,560 Speaker 3: pictures in his head when he considers the economy evaporating. 678 00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:24,040 Speaker 3: To use his word, I don't want to know what. 679 00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:26,360 Speaker 15: You don't want to go there, Joe, I really don't. 680 00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:29,239 Speaker 3: That's a that's a horror. 681 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:29,839 Speaker 15: Show, pretty dark. 682 00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:33,319 Speaker 3: What's different this time, Mark, Because you know, when you 683 00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:36,960 Speaker 3: go back and recall what happened in twenty eleven, the 684 00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:42,359 Speaker 3: downgrade followed the deal. It seems the ratings agencies they'll 685 00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:44,240 Speaker 3: want to carry this all the way to June fifteenth 686 00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:46,480 Speaker 3: and actually have to see a default to make a 687 00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:49,400 Speaker 3: move here, Why was it different when it was fiscal 688 00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:50,560 Speaker 3: cliff time in twenty eleven. 689 00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:53,759 Speaker 15: Well, that's a great question. I mean, if you go 690 00:34:53,880 --> 00:34:57,280 Speaker 15: back to that twenty eleven downgrade, that was shocking, surprising. 691 00:34:57,320 --> 00:34:59,120 Speaker 15: I was surprised by It didn't make sense to me, 692 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:03,759 Speaker 15: to be frank, you know. You know, the folks at 693 00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:06,200 Speaker 15: S and P who downgraded, you know, pointed to governance 694 00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:08,759 Speaker 15: and political issues and the long term fiscal outlook so 695 00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:10,920 Speaker 15: for them, so on. But that didn't add up to 696 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,800 Speaker 15: me to the action that they took. So I've always 697 00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:16,920 Speaker 15: been perplexed by that move. I actually, just on the 698 00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:19,680 Speaker 15: merits of it, I don't think it was appropriate. But 699 00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:23,360 Speaker 15: but I you know, I don't know what their policies 700 00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 15: sp policies are like now. I don't follow it carefully enough, 701 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:31,280 Speaker 15: but I think you know, they're they're probably much different 702 00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:32,640 Speaker 15: than they were back in twenty eleven. 703 00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:35,320 Speaker 9: Well, you mentioned they're kind of the long term fiscal 704 00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:38,160 Speaker 9: trajectory of the country being a factor in that, and 705 00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:40,600 Speaker 9: I think we don't come around to that point as 706 00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:43,520 Speaker 9: frequently as maybe we should. That even once we lift 707 00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:45,640 Speaker 9: the debt ceiling this time, we are adding to a 708 00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:49,600 Speaker 9: massive debt pile, tens of trillions of dollars and there 709 00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:52,560 Speaker 9: are long term consequences to that. Hence the effort on 710 00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:55,719 Speaker 9: the Republican side toward deficit reduction, and of course on 711 00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:57,440 Speaker 9: the Democratic side as well. They just like to go 712 00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:00,399 Speaker 9: about it a different way. But are we paying enough 713 00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:04,600 Speaker 9: attention to that problem? What are the longer term consequences there? 714 00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:04,879 Speaker 8: Mark? 715 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:08,359 Speaker 15: Yeah, you make a great point, Kayley. I mean, at 716 00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:09,920 Speaker 15: the end of the day, this is about trying to 717 00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:14,520 Speaker 15: put the nation's fiscal path on a sustainable one, and 718 00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:17,680 Speaker 15: it's not. You know, if we don't make changes to 719 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:21,920 Speaker 15: spending policy and tax policy, and you do the arithmetic 720 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,040 Speaker 15: in course the correctial pledge office, non person group that 721 00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:30,000 Speaker 15: does this for a living, the outlook is really uncomfortable. 722 00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:34,400 Speaker 15: We do need to make changes, and you know, the 723 00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:36,880 Speaker 15: mechanism for doing that is not obvious. But what I 724 00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:39,640 Speaker 15: do think is obvious is the debt limit. Isn't the 725 00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:43,040 Speaker 15: mechanism for doing that. It just creates a lot of drama, 726 00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:48,120 Speaker 15: strm and drang. You know, even if at the end 727 00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:50,920 Speaker 15: of the day we got limits safe grow that that 728 00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:52,880 Speaker 15: won't come even close to addressing on our long term 729 00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:55,800 Speaker 15: fiscal problems. To focus on the wrong things on discretionary spending, 730 00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:59,600 Speaker 15: and that's not the problem. I mean, actually, under current 731 00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:03,520 Speaker 15: law declinent that spending on discretion spending declines to sure 732 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:07,839 Speaker 15: GPS really obviously social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid, and that's 733 00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:09,600 Speaker 15: where we need to focus. But you can't do that 734 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:13,040 Speaker 15: in the cauldron of a debt limite pay. It's just 735 00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:13,800 Speaker 15: not possible. 736 00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:15,080 Speaker 6: So you know, the. 737 00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:17,359 Speaker 15: Debt limit is not the approach. We've got to think 738 00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:19,799 Speaker 15: about a different mechanism for you know, addressing our long 739 00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:21,200 Speaker 15: term fiscal problems. 740 00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:24,120 Speaker 3: You mentioned the entitlements. They're off the table here, which 741 00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:27,719 Speaker 3: makes this way more difficult to your point, to get anywhere, 742 00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:30,120 Speaker 3: But the pentagon is also off the table. I wonder 743 00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:33,080 Speaker 3: how does defense spending stack up to the entitlements in 744 00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:35,840 Speaker 3: terms of sort of overall liability. 745 00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:39,000 Speaker 15: Here It's it's small. I'm speaking from memory, Joe, But 746 00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:44,560 Speaker 15: you know, I'd say I think non defense discretionary was 747 00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:47,400 Speaker 15: probably two three PERCENTAGY, probably closer to three percent of GP. 748 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,719 Speaker 15: Defense is about three percent of GDP, So I don't 749 00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:54,040 Speaker 15: think i'd look there either. It's not about just the 750 00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:57,040 Speaker 15: kind of the appropriations and discretionary. It's about the mandatory, 751 00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:00,000 Speaker 15: yes spending, and you know it's and it's not only 752 00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:03,160 Speaker 15: just the spending, it's really the tax revenue because we're 753 00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:06,400 Speaker 15: all getting older. That's about That's what Social Security, Medicare 754 00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:09,279 Speaker 15: and medicator are all about, getting older and you know, 755 00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:14,160 Speaker 15: helping take support you know, the disadvantage and the folks 756 00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:18,680 Speaker 15: that are in poverty. That's the Medicaid program, and that population, 757 00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:22,160 Speaker 15: the aging of the population is even if we spend 758 00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:25,360 Speaker 15: the same amount of healthcare for each individual, the demands 759 00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:27,799 Speaker 15: are going to increase because we just have more older 760 00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:30,560 Speaker 15: people who need more health care. And so you know, 761 00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 15: from that prism, it's about it's about spending restraint, but 762 00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:35,880 Speaker 15: it's also about tax revenue. We have to make the 763 00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:38,400 Speaker 15: decision that if we're going to provide the same level 764 00:38:38,440 --> 00:38:43,120 Speaker 15: of healthcare as we have historically to our under our 765 00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:46,440 Speaker 15: disadvantage in our older population, we're going to have to 766 00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:48,560 Speaker 15: figure out new ways to generate revenue. 767 00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:53,000 Speaker 9: Just quickly as we have this fiscal conversation Mark June 768 00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:55,160 Speaker 9: doesn't just bring a potential X date, it also brings 769 00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:58,000 Speaker 9: another FED decision. How does the monetary policy picture fit 770 00:38:58,040 --> 00:38:58,359 Speaker 9: in here? 771 00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:01,960 Speaker 15: Yeah, I think this is one more reason why the 772 00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:04,440 Speaker 15: FED made to say, hey, time to take a pause. 773 00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:07,000 Speaker 15: You know, there are a lot of things going on here. 774 00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:10,360 Speaker 15: I mean, you got the banking crisis kind of that 775 00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:13,400 Speaker 15: kind of pushed the sideline here, but that's that's still simmering. 776 00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:15,960 Speaker 15: I don't know that that's been completely nailed down that 777 00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:19,040 Speaker 15: we're going to have to come back to that. You know, 778 00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:22,960 Speaker 15: inflation is moderating, maybe not as fast as some folks 779 00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:24,399 Speaker 15: on the Fed would like to see, but it is. 780 00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:27,200 Speaker 15: It is clearly moderating, and the path forward looks pretty good. 781 00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:30,279 Speaker 15: The economy is moderating again, maybe not as fast as 782 00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:32,560 Speaker 15: some folks would like, but it definitely is. So all 783 00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:35,920 Speaker 15: the signs to me point to, hey, let's let's just 784 00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:38,600 Speaker 15: take a pause here and see how things play out. 785 00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:41,520 Speaker 15: And you know, if inflation turns out to be more stubborn, 786 00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:43,719 Speaker 15: then we can start raising rates again later in the year. 787 00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:47,600 Speaker 15: But at this point, I think everything's starting to scream. Hey, 788 00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:49,120 Speaker 15: take a break, let's pause. 789 00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:53,480 Speaker 3: I got to tell you what, Mark Xandy gets upset. Mark, 790 00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:56,600 Speaker 3: it's great to have you. Thank you being so measured 791 00:39:56,719 --> 00:40:01,160 Speaker 3: and fourth, right, Mark Xandy the chief economist at Booty's Analytics. 792 00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:03,960 Speaker 3: He's so balanced. Yeah that when Mark says he's getting 793 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:05,800 Speaker 3: more nervous. Suddenly I'm more nervous. 794 00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:06,719 Speaker 8: Same. 795 00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:10,040 Speaker 9: Watch you and me both, Joe. 796 00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:15,400 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. 797 00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:18,920 Speaker 2: Catch the program live weekdays at one Eastern on. 798 00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:22,319 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio, the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com. 799 00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:23,480 Speaker 2: And the Bloomberg Business App. 800 00:40:23,600 --> 00:40:26,480 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 801 00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:30,960 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 802 00:40:32,880 --> 00:40:34,759 Speaker 3: It's unclear if we're going to get a deal at 803 00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:36,759 Speaker 3: some point between now and the weekend. Although based on 804 00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:39,920 Speaker 3: the timeline we've been discussing here with Mark Zandy and others, 805 00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:42,200 Speaker 3: it's it's actually imperative for them to get something done 806 00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:43,719 Speaker 3: in the next twenty four hours. They got to get 807 00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:46,040 Speaker 3: something together before the weekend. So why did they let 808 00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:46,560 Speaker 3: everybody go? 809 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:47,120 Speaker 2: Is the question? 810 00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:49,440 Speaker 9: Well, I guess the thinking here is that you have 811 00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:51,439 Speaker 9: that seventy two hour rule in place. 812 00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:51,680 Speaker 5: Right. 813 00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:54,240 Speaker 9: Speaker McCarthy said he's not going to waive the mandate 814 00:40:54,280 --> 00:40:56,880 Speaker 9: that lawmakers have to have three days to read the 815 00:40:56,960 --> 00:40:59,520 Speaker 9: legislative text before voting on it. So I guess if 816 00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:02,439 Speaker 9: you're doing the timing math here, when you reach a deal, 817 00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:04,600 Speaker 9: you know you need the three days anyway, that is 818 00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:07,120 Speaker 9: the stretch of the long weekend, so everybody can still 819 00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:09,799 Speaker 9: go to the parades and read the bill in their 820 00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:12,880 Speaker 9: spare time. Afterwards, come back and vote on it after 821 00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:13,440 Speaker 9: the holiday. 822 00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:16,759 Speaker 3: Everybody's gonna sit down with the bill. Yeah, funny, so 823 00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:20,720 Speaker 3: I'm reading this morning. Not everybody loved this idea. Catherine 824 00:41:20,719 --> 00:41:25,880 Speaker 3: Clark really scolded the Republican leadership for letting people go in. 825 00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:30,400 Speaker 3: Congresswoman Debbie Dingle, who was supposed to be in Italy 826 00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:34,360 Speaker 3: this weekend officiating her I believe god daughter's wedding. Yeah, 827 00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:39,080 Speaker 3: canceled the trip and said, no, we're staying here to 828 00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:42,799 Speaker 3: get something done. It's quite a message to send, and 829 00:41:42,840 --> 00:41:44,680 Speaker 3: so we wanted to talk to the congress woman. She's 830 00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:48,480 Speaker 3: with us now, Debbie Dingle, the Democrat, of course, from Michigan. 831 00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:52,160 Speaker 3: I'm sure your goddaughter wasn't happy to hear this, Congresswoman, 832 00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:54,040 Speaker 3: But why did you make that decision when everybody else 833 00:41:54,120 --> 00:41:54,760 Speaker 3: is flying away? 834 00:41:55,719 --> 00:41:58,319 Speaker 10: Well, good afternoon to both of you. 835 00:41:58,440 --> 00:41:59,360 Speaker 3: Thanks for being here. 836 00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:01,520 Speaker 10: It's good to be with you, though I have to 837 00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:03,200 Speaker 10: admit to you my mood is not great. 838 00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:04,480 Speaker 3: I understand. 839 00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:07,880 Speaker 10: I mean, I've been struggling with this. I began to 840 00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:11,560 Speaker 10: warn them last weekend, right after we had finished the 841 00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:14,600 Speaker 10: script for the wedding got everything signed off, that this 842 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:18,799 Speaker 10: was happening, but this vote could be very close, and 843 00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:22,759 Speaker 10: every vote is going to matter, and I'm not I mean, 844 00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:27,080 Speaker 10: I'm flying commercial coach like everybody else, and the ability 845 00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:31,319 Speaker 10: to get back quickly from Italy is not guaranteed, and 846 00:42:31,360 --> 00:42:33,160 Speaker 10: we don't know when this vote is going to occur. 847 00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:37,000 Speaker 10: But I also think it's irresponsible for the Republicans to 848 00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:40,719 Speaker 10: let us leave town when we could default on the 849 00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:43,560 Speaker 10: loan or meet on our debt ceiling, which we should 850 00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:46,520 Speaker 10: not be doing. Every person should be paying our bills. 851 00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:50,640 Speaker 10: We should not be holding our economy hostage. And I've 852 00:42:50,640 --> 00:42:53,440 Speaker 10: got constituency. I had a constituent who called my office 853 00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:56,680 Speaker 10: yesterday who I don't know, but she trusts me, and 854 00:42:56,719 --> 00:42:58,600 Speaker 10: she said I was going to buy a house, but 855 00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:01,720 Speaker 10: what happens if you default? Well in the economy tanks. 856 00:43:01,880 --> 00:43:04,439 Speaker 10: I can't afford this. I can't afford a high interest loan. 857 00:43:04,920 --> 00:43:08,040 Speaker 10: I mean, people are worried, and we've got a job 858 00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:09,759 Speaker 10: to do, and we should be doing it. I mean, 859 00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:14,120 Speaker 10: my district elected me to be responsible elected official, and 860 00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:16,759 Speaker 10: that means I can't you know, if something door happen 861 00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:19,120 Speaker 10: and bled me with the luck I've had, my plane 862 00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:21,480 Speaker 10: would be the one with the plane problem and I'd 863 00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:25,080 Speaker 10: be stuck in, you know, in an airport overseas, not 864 00:43:25,200 --> 00:43:27,000 Speaker 10: able to get home and vote. And what's the most 865 00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:29,320 Speaker 10: important thing in the world in my constituents. 866 00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:33,160 Speaker 9: Well, I'm sure your constituents appreciate your personal sacrifice to 867 00:43:33,160 --> 00:43:35,400 Speaker 9: be able to be in Washington if and when a 868 00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,279 Speaker 9: vote does happen, Congresswoman, But you talk about the worry 869 00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:41,600 Speaker 9: your constituents are feeling. It seems they're feeling in on 870 00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:43,800 Speaker 9: Wall Street too. We were just talking with Mark Zandi 871 00:43:43,880 --> 00:43:46,719 Speaker 9: of Moody's who said he is growing more worried at 872 00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:49,560 Speaker 9: the same time that those negotiating this deal seem to 873 00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:53,120 Speaker 9: be projecting more optimism. So what is your degree of 874 00:43:53,160 --> 00:43:56,040 Speaker 9: optimism or pessimism right now? Do you think we're getting closer? 875 00:43:56,680 --> 00:43:58,480 Speaker 10: This is what I want to say to you. We 876 00:43:58,920 --> 00:44:04,240 Speaker 10: can not fault. We have no choice. Republicans have got 877 00:44:04,280 --> 00:44:07,480 Speaker 10: to come to the table. We have to get this done. 878 00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:12,080 Speaker 10: I'm sick of the drama that happens in this city, 879 00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:16,920 Speaker 10: these showdowns that we always have, and I am just 880 00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:20,200 Speaker 10: We have to get it done. We have no choice 881 00:44:20,200 --> 00:44:22,240 Speaker 10: but to get this done, and we should be getting 882 00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:25,320 Speaker 10: it done today. We should have gotten it done long 883 00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:29,800 Speaker 10: before this. But as your economists are telling you, businesses 884 00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:33,160 Speaker 10: are telling you, my constituents, who range from a whole 885 00:44:33,160 --> 00:44:36,760 Speaker 10: lot of different my small businesses, my larger businesses, people, 886 00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:41,480 Speaker 10: my retirees with savings accounts. We know all the people 887 00:44:41,480 --> 00:44:43,640 Speaker 10: that are going to be intected by this, people who 888 00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:47,000 Speaker 10: are on Social Security. We cannot do this to the 889 00:44:47,000 --> 00:44:50,080 Speaker 10: American people, to the American economy. We have to get 890 00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:50,959 Speaker 10: this deal done. 891 00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:55,200 Speaker 3: Congresswoman, there's a lot of concern among progressive Democrats about 892 00:44:55,200 --> 00:44:57,720 Speaker 3: what might end up in a potential deal. We spoke 893 00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:01,279 Speaker 3: with Congressman Jim McGovern two days ago about this. He 894 00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:04,040 Speaker 3: said he's a no vote if additional work requirements end 895 00:45:04,120 --> 00:45:06,360 Speaker 3: up in the deal. Are you worried about what President 896 00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:07,239 Speaker 3: Biden might agree to. 897 00:45:08,480 --> 00:45:11,680 Speaker 10: I believe the President Biden is in touch with the 898 00:45:11,719 --> 00:45:15,920 Speaker 10: Democrats in this caucus. He knows what matters. He is 899 00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:19,680 Speaker 10: fighting for those values. I believe, no matter where you 900 00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:22,600 Speaker 10: are in the spectum inside the Democratic Party, we share 901 00:45:22,680 --> 00:45:28,040 Speaker 10: those same values. And I believe he is going to 902 00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:32,279 Speaker 10: not agree to any saying that the majority of our 903 00:45:32,280 --> 00:45:35,560 Speaker 10: caucus cannot support, or that's what I know. I am 904 00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:38,480 Speaker 10: very hopeful of he does know how our caucus feels. 905 00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:40,960 Speaker 10: I know that he talks to us regularly. 906 00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:44,960 Speaker 9: A congresswoman, as he needs to compromise in theory to 907 00:45:45,040 --> 00:45:47,640 Speaker 9: get to get a deal done. Are you willing to 908 00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:50,200 Speaker 9: vote for whatever it is that the President does agree 909 00:45:50,200 --> 00:45:51,640 Speaker 9: to to avoid a default. 910 00:45:52,200 --> 00:45:54,400 Speaker 10: I will never say that I will vote for something 911 00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:58,040 Speaker 10: I have not seen that is irresponsible for any elected official. 912 00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:02,759 Speaker 10: I know how important it is not to default on 913 00:46:02,800 --> 00:46:05,880 Speaker 10: the loan on our debt ceiling. I keep cling this 914 00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:12,640 Speaker 10: loans that we cannot default, But I really do have 915 00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:14,839 Speaker 10: to see what is in that bill on what the 916 00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:16,719 Speaker 10: impact is going to be in our people. And I 917 00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:20,120 Speaker 10: think that it is very important that people understand right 918 00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:24,480 Speaker 10: now that we cannot negotiate a package to appease the 919 00:46:24,520 --> 00:46:28,200 Speaker 10: far right of the Republican Party, who are never going 920 00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:31,920 Speaker 10: to vote for this agreement anyway. We need to be 921 00:46:32,080 --> 00:46:36,120 Speaker 10: negotiating a deal that helps the working men and women 922 00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:40,840 Speaker 10: of this country across the country. That is what both 923 00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:45,480 Speaker 10: parties need to be focused on, not to a very 924 00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:47,360 Speaker 10: far right group of people that are never going to 925 00:46:47,400 --> 00:46:48,160 Speaker 10: vote for this bill. 926 00:46:48,200 --> 00:46:48,439 Speaker 2: Ever. 927 00:46:49,440 --> 00:46:52,600 Speaker 3: We're talking with Congresswoman Debbie Dingle, the Democrat from Michigan 928 00:46:52,680 --> 00:46:55,600 Speaker 3: on Bloomberg. Congress Woman, you wait in on the president. 929 00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:58,560 Speaker 3: Do you believe Speaker Kevin McCarthy is a credible actor 930 00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:02,000 Speaker 3: on the other side of the table speaking across. 931 00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:05,359 Speaker 10: He was elected by the members of his caucus, so 932 00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:11,440 Speaker 10: he is responsible for reflecting all of that caucus. So 933 00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:14,799 Speaker 10: he's the man that's in the room that is deliberating, 934 00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:20,759 Speaker 10: So he has it's on his shoulders to also understand 935 00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:26,239 Speaker 10: that if we default on our debts, that he has 936 00:47:26,320 --> 00:47:31,480 Speaker 10: responsibility for it. He is as responsible as anybody else 937 00:47:31,600 --> 00:47:34,239 Speaker 10: for where we are. Quite frankly, I think the Republicans 938 00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:38,280 Speaker 10: are holding a pastage. So he's the man they elected, 939 00:47:38,560 --> 00:47:40,960 Speaker 10: He's the person in the room. He's the one I'm 940 00:47:41,000 --> 00:47:43,600 Speaker 10: holding accountable, and I have to believe he knows what's 941 00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:45,839 Speaker 10: at stake well, and what. 942 00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:47,759 Speaker 9: Else could be at stake is the credit rating of 943 00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:49,799 Speaker 9: the United States. We heard from Fitch in the last 944 00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:51,959 Speaker 9: twenty four hours that the US is TRIPA, a credit 945 00:47:52,040 --> 00:47:54,799 Speaker 9: rating has been put on watch negative, and they specifically 946 00:47:54,880 --> 00:47:58,839 Speaker 9: cited political partisanship Congressman, are you worried that we could 947 00:47:58,840 --> 00:48:02,040 Speaker 9: see another downgrade? Would it be irresponsible of a credit 948 00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:05,520 Speaker 9: readings agency, given the deadlock we are seeing in Washington 949 00:48:05,560 --> 00:48:07,600 Speaker 9: on this issue at the moment, to say that our 950 00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:09,800 Speaker 9: credit worthiness has been impaired. 951 00:48:10,719 --> 00:48:13,920 Speaker 10: I want to say something to you all that and 952 00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:18,880 Speaker 10: take a bigger picture. I think the political divide in 953 00:48:18,920 --> 00:48:25,120 Speaker 10: this country. I think this lack of civility is a 954 00:48:25,160 --> 00:48:29,879 Speaker 10: significant factor every day now in business decisions that are 955 00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:34,120 Speaker 10: being made. People are looking at states that have more 956 00:48:34,200 --> 00:48:38,280 Speaker 10: of the political division than other states that they're making 957 00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:42,840 Speaker 10: decisions about where there are locating plan a cargirl, you 958 00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:47,680 Speaker 10: know that decisions about where manufacturing facilities are going to 959 00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:50,960 Speaker 10: be located, where people are opening their businesses. This is 960 00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:53,600 Speaker 10: people that you look at the state of Florida and 961 00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:58,000 Speaker 10: how bitterly divided that they are. I think we all 962 00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:01,160 Speaker 10: need to understand I'm an American first, I'm not a 963 00:49:01,239 --> 00:49:04,480 Speaker 10: Democrat or and my friends on the other side of 964 00:49:04,520 --> 00:49:07,480 Speaker 10: the all are Republicans were Americans, and we need to 965 00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:11,879 Speaker 10: be working together for the American people. This political divide 966 00:49:12,400 --> 00:49:15,840 Speaker 10: is poisoning us, and it is hurting us in many ways. 967 00:49:16,080 --> 00:49:21,600 Speaker 10: This is the example today of the dangerous down potential 968 00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:23,120 Speaker 10: downgrade of our credit rating. 969 00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:27,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, talkus when we can hear the passion in your voice. Here, 970 00:49:28,800 --> 00:49:29,960 Speaker 3: What are you going to do in the next couple 971 00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:31,480 Speaker 3: of days while you wait for something to happen. 972 00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:35,320 Speaker 10: I'm gonna be sitting here in my office in Washington, 973 00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:40,320 Speaker 10: d C. My godmother's daughter has promised me she's gonna 974 00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:45,000 Speaker 10: send me video live or you know of what is happening. 975 00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:50,279 Speaker 10: But we need to come together. We need to make 976 00:49:50,320 --> 00:49:53,400 Speaker 10: sure we never get in this position again. Do we 977 00:49:53,520 --> 00:49:55,800 Speaker 10: need to look at our spending. Do we need to 978 00:49:55,840 --> 00:49:58,840 Speaker 10: cut our deficit? Yes, But by the way, I would 979 00:49:58,840 --> 00:50:00,920 Speaker 10: not I'll say this to any of your listeners. I 980 00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:04,040 Speaker 10: wouldn't take revenue razors off the table as the Republicans 981 00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:07,799 Speaker 10: have done. One of the reasons this non deficit has 982 00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:11,360 Speaker 10: increased were the tax cuts that were given to billionaires 983 00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:16,040 Speaker 10: in corporations in absentives to offshore several years ago. I 984 00:50:16,040 --> 00:50:19,720 Speaker 10: don't think a minimum tax were a billionaire is something 985 00:50:19,719 --> 00:50:23,920 Speaker 10: that we should be taking off the table. So you know, 986 00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:27,960 Speaker 10: I think we're also being presented with very false choices. 987 00:50:28,280 --> 00:50:32,320 Speaker 10: So I hope we never find ourselves in this position again, 988 00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:34,520 Speaker 10: and that we will act to keep from being in 989 00:50:34,520 --> 00:50:35,480 Speaker 10: this position again. 990 00:50:35,719 --> 00:50:38,239 Speaker 3: Well, listen, I hope you do get on Facebook live 991 00:50:38,280 --> 00:50:41,040 Speaker 3: with your goddaughter. And it's very kind of you to 992 00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:43,960 Speaker 3: share this moment with us, and I'm very sorry that 993 00:50:44,000 --> 00:50:46,040 Speaker 3: you can't make the trip to Italy. Would you come 994 00:50:46,040 --> 00:50:47,440 Speaker 3: talk to us when this is all done? 995 00:50:47,800 --> 00:50:50,759 Speaker 10: I sure will. I'm around all weekend too. 996 00:50:51,280 --> 00:50:54,319 Speaker 3: Hey, well I might just call you, Congressman. Thank you again. 997 00:50:54,440 --> 00:50:57,680 Speaker 3: Debbie Dingle, the Democrat from Michigan with us here on 998 00:50:57,800 --> 00:51:00,640 Speaker 3: sound On. The closer we get to the act state, Kayley, 999 00:51:00,920 --> 00:51:07,200 Speaker 3: the more passion we're here. Thanks for listening to the 1000 00:51:07,239 --> 00:51:10,200 Speaker 3: Sound On podcast. Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, 1001 00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:13,160 Speaker 3: at Apple, Spotify, and anywhere else you get your podcasts. 1002 00:51:13,520 --> 00:51:16,200 Speaker 3: And you can find us live every weekday from Washington, 1003 00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:20,960 Speaker 3: DC at one pm Eastern Time at Bloomberg dot com