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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to save your production of by Heart Radio.

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Speaker 1: I'm Annyrie and I'm.

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Speaker 2: Lorn vogel Baum, and today we have an episode for

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Speaker 2: you about mooncakes.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and I think this is one where again you

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Speaker 1: do have an answer for why we're recording it.

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Speaker 2: I do, so the answer to why were you thinking

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Speaker 2: about this is always either I have no idea or

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Speaker 2: it's a tenth pole of some kind. Yeah. So, as

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Speaker 2: we record this episode, we are approaching the mid Autumn

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Speaker 2: festival of Chinese traditions, happening this year on Monday, October sixth.

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Speaker 2: Happy Autumn Moon Festival. In advance to anyone celebrating or

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Speaker 2: currently or in the past. I don't know when you're

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Speaker 2: listening to this, but yeah, the festival follows the lunar calendar.

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Speaker 2: It's the fifteenth day of the eighth lunar month, which

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Speaker 2: happens right around a full moon in the middle of autumn.

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Speaker 2: It's a it's a like family and other loved ones

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Speaker 2: like reunion and harvest holiday, celebrating bounty, that kind of thing.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and the mooncake is a big part of that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh yes, associated uh huh. Yeah. If you are

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Speaker 2: in a place where humans celebrate this festival. They probably

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Speaker 2: have mooncakes out in your local grocery store or local

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Speaker 2: specific grocery store.

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Speaker 1: Mm hmm, I've had I've had mooncakes this episode. Even

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Speaker 1: though I've had mooncakes, I didn't realize the variety. Think

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Speaker 1: I've really only had the sweet kind.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I've had a pretty narrow slice pun intended after

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Speaker 2: the fact of the own cake pie. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, me too. And I remember liking them, but I

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Speaker 1: don't I don't remember strongly what they tasted like. I

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Speaker 1: think it was a very subtle sweet taste. But reading this,

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Speaker 1: I'm like, what a world was right?

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Speaker 2: Oh, oh, it's fabulous.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I think the first time that I had one, you know,

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Speaker 2: I had moved to Atlanta and h Mart opened, and

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Speaker 2: I was like, what is this whole thing? And like

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Speaker 2: anything else in h Mart that I get curious enough about,

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Speaker 2: I was like, yeah, I'll buy one. Sure, let's go,

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Speaker 2: let's let's figure this out together. And yeah, very very

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Speaker 2: very rich, very sweet. I think I found either a

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Speaker 2: load of seed or a red bean paste one. Don't

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Speaker 2: remember at the time.

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Speaker 1: I think I had a honey. I think the last

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Speaker 1: one I had was honey based.

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Speaker 2: Yes, you can see our previous episodisodes on sort of

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Speaker 2: related materials like like dim sum, chili, crisp, mochi, jello aspects,

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Speaker 2: meat pies.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, this episode goes places. I know we say

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Speaker 1: that a lot, but it really does.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I had a number of tabs that would

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Speaker 2: give any absolute nightmares open on this one.

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Speaker 1: No, I don't like a lot of tabs people, but

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Speaker 1: I do love fall and I love a full moon,

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Speaker 1: so I'm very excited to talk about this.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Fall Festival is so good.

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Speaker 1: I guess all of this brings us to our question though, Sure,

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Speaker 1: sure mooncakes what are they?

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Speaker 2: Well? Mooncakes can be a lot of things, but you're

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Speaker 2: you're basically looking at a filled pastry that's intricately decorated

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Speaker 2: and very rich in sweet and or savory flavors. They

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Speaker 2: can be baked using usually a wheat crust, or steamed

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Speaker 2: and or chilled and set using glutinous rice or otherwise

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Speaker 2: gelatinous sort of crust, crust and scare quotes. I guess

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Speaker 2: either kind can be created in molds that have like

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Speaker 2: beautiful fluted edges and words or designs on top. The

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Speaker 2: baked ones are sometimes made free form and might be

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Speaker 2: stamped or painted with words or designs. They are often

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Speaker 2: round in shape to mirror you know, the moon, but

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Speaker 2: that can vary. The crust is often very thin in

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Speaker 2: both the baked and the chilled versions, with like a

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Speaker 2: much thicker filling or layers of filling inside. The baked

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Speaker 2: crusts can be cakeier or flakeier, kind of your whole

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Speaker 2: range of pie crust. The chilled can be chewier or bouncier,

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Speaker 2: but the real variety is in those fillings. The traditional

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Speaker 2: ones include pretty sweet, very dense pastes made of things

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Speaker 2: like lotue seed, red bean, or mung bean, sometimes with

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Speaker 2: preserved salted duck egg yolk inside for like a little

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Speaker 2: burst of salty contrast. There are also versions with sweet

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Speaker 2: paste then studded with like a lot of chopped nuts

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Speaker 2: or seeds and or dried fruit like red dates or

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Speaker 2: winter melon or citrus peel, this time for a textural contrast.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, you can really go anywhere with these, and

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Speaker 2: people do, depending on what's local or trendy, all kinds

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Speaker 2: of flavors, from fruit to chocolate to ham, textures, from

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Speaker 2: flavored bean paste to like a custard to jellies. They're

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Speaker 2: often given or shared as gifts with friends and family,

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Speaker 2: cut into small wedges and served with tea, especially on

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Speaker 2: or around the mid autumn festival. And they're like really

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Speaker 2: gazing at the moon, you know, like like like at

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Speaker 2: first you're kind of going like, oh, yeah, that's pretty,

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Speaker 2: but then you notice the depth and the textures and

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Speaker 2: experience this rich sort of wonder.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's lovely is what looking at the moon is like.

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Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, And I have.

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Speaker 1: To say another piece of this, other than all of

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Speaker 1: the different flavors, I the beauty of them. Really. Oh

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Speaker 1: I was blown away.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they are often striking. Yeah, look up look up

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Speaker 2: pictures if you're unfamiliar. But okay, so different regions have

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Speaker 2: different traditions and tastes around mooncakes, around China and basically

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Speaker 2: anywhere that Chinese peoples have immigrated. This episode is not

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Speaker 2: a comprehensive list. No, of course, if there is one

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Speaker 2: that you grew up with or are otherwise fond of,

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Speaker 2: we would love to hear about it in detail and

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Speaker 2: share it with your fellow listeners. But okay, the kind

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Speaker 2: of common one around the world is Cantonese style, or

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Speaker 2: derived from such. It's a baked crust type baked to

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Speaker 2: like a lovely golden brown in a decorative wooden mold.

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Speaker 2: But there are just ever expanding ways of creating these things,

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Speaker 2: and they can come in any size, from like individual

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Speaker 2: mini muffin to full on pie like nine inch pie. Okay.

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Speaker 2: The baked crust types can be very rich with lard,

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Speaker 2: usually whether they're on the doe or the flaky side.

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Speaker 2: They're often soft in texture the crusts, but they can

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Speaker 2: also be crisp and in that case either crumbly or flaky,

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Speaker 2: different types. Yeah, use the full range of pie and

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Speaker 2: pastry crusts for those traditional fillings that I ran through

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Speaker 2: at the top. Okay, Like, if you've never had lotus

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Speaker 2: seed paste or sweet bean paste, I described them. I've

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Speaker 2: described them before on the show. It's sort of like

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Speaker 2: peanut butter and jelly at the same time, like a

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Speaker 2: little savory, earthy, but quite sweet and stiff, like pasty,

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Speaker 2: not runny, but in a tender kind of way. You know. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I love red bean paste anyway. Yes, if they include

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Speaker 2: nuts and seeds, those might be peanuts, almonds, walnuts, pumpkin seeds,

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Speaker 2: melon seeds, sesame seeds. The seeded types are often called

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Speaker 2: five nut or five kernel mooncakes. I am not sure

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Speaker 2: whether the five is a literal number of types of

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Speaker 2: nuts involved, or if that's just what they're called. The

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Speaker 2: five nut mooncakes are considered a little bit old fashioned, though,

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Speaker 2: write in let us know, but right, All kinds of

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Speaker 2: flavored fruit, pastes or other fillings can go in a

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Speaker 2: baked mooncake. Examples that I've read about just today include pineapple,

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Speaker 2: light chi pandan, durian matcha, egg, custard, marmalade, rose, petal,

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Speaker 2: yam of various kinds, yep, whatever you like. And there

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Speaker 2: are also savory types that are filled with things like

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Speaker 2: chopped pork, chicken, sausage, seafood, mushrooms, maybe some greens in there,

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Speaker 2: sort of like a dumpling filling, you know, sometimes sweetened

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Speaker 2: with honey. I have not had the chilled ones, from

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Speaker 2: what I understand, they're usually smaller, like individual sized, and okay,

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Speaker 2: ones made with glutenous rice are going to be you know,

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Speaker 2: glutenous ricey, sort of like mochi or tapioca, And because

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Speaker 2: of that, their dough is baseline like a snowy white,

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Speaker 2: slightly translucent color. They are often called snowy or icy

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Speaker 2: mooncakes or snow skin mooncakes for that reason, but they

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Speaker 2: can be dyed all sorts of bright colors, which is

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Speaker 2: where you get some of the really pretty things going

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Speaker 2: on in here. You make the dough by cooking glutenous

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Speaker 2: rice flour plus maybe other flowers and or starches with

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Speaker 2: water or milk and usually a little bit of sugar.

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Speaker 2: When it cools, the dough can be molded, and these

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Speaker 2: are more likely to have non traditional fillings. Examples of

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Speaker 2: fillings that I've read about again like today include mango, orange, strawberry, honeydew, peach, blueberry, cherry, taro, chestnut, milk, tea,

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Speaker 2: chocolate with cream, cheese.

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Speaker 1: Right, so interested in all of this?

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Speaker 2: Oh, I love it? And like the baked types, they

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Speaker 2: can also contain textural bits like maybe candy pieces, puffed rice,

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Speaker 2: little bits of fruit, a layer of jam. You can

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Speaker 2: find ice cream mooncakes with either glutinous rice or chocolate

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Speaker 2: coatings other variations I know, right. Other variations include jelly mooncakes,

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Speaker 2: which are made with like agar agar or other gelatin

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Speaker 2: type stuff that's molded and set in pretty designs, often

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Speaker 2: with all kinds of different like translucencies and colors and

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Speaker 2: different flavors or ingredients. Layered in, which is why I

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Speaker 2: recommended aspects here we are. But yeah, yeah, you can

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Speaker 2: make these at home or spend a little bit or

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Speaker 2: a lot on a gift box that's either handmade or

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Speaker 2: industrially made. Fancy hotels around Hong Kong and other posh

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Speaker 2: cities sell tens of thousands a year, especially as they

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Speaker 2: have become like a gift that you might give to

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Speaker 2: business associates who you want to impress, think ingredients like

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Speaker 2: like like jenoa ham or truffles, or you know, like

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Speaker 2: gold plated or silk packaging, stuff like that. In some

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Speaker 2: cultures though they are in more everyday like year round

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Speaker 2: treat sort of thing. But I have also seen them

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Speaker 2: compared to fruitcakes in that they are, you know, a

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Speaker 2: traditional holiday gift, but one that not everyone actually enjoys

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Speaker 2: and might wind up throwing away.

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Speaker 1: I saw that too, and it made me laugh. It

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Speaker 1: gave me a good chuckle, just because there was such

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Speaker 1: a dichotomy of the nostalgia the love for it. These

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Speaker 1: really fancy, expensive ones that come in very lovely packaging.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, and then also they're like fruitcakes and people

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Speaker 1: throw them away.

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Speaker 2: I think that's part of why these these newer chilled

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Speaker 2: varieties have gained such popularity so quickly because yeah, they're

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Speaker 2: they're like, oh not another lotus seed paste thing with

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Speaker 2: a bunch of art in the crest. Huh, delightfully new,

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Speaker 2: nothing against again. I'm pretty sure that's the kind that

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Speaker 2: I had, and it was lovely. I was happy to

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Speaker 2: be consuming it.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I think I read an article from someone

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Speaker 1: who was She was saying, I don't like them, but

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Speaker 1: I must have them. That's the tradition, and I'm sad

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Speaker 1: if I don't have them.

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Speaker 2: Oh man, oh, I think there's a lot of holiday

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Speaker 2: foods like that. Yeah, I agree.

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Speaker 1: Back again, listeners, if you, I would love to hear

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Speaker 1: from you, because I'm curious about do you choose the

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Speaker 1: filling based on the person you're giving it to? Like?

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Speaker 1: What what kind of thought goes into all of this?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, Well let us know what about the nutrition?

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Speaker 2: Oh, that depends, can't tell you.

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Speaker 1: That's that's between you and the mooncake.

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Speaker 2: Yep. Uh huh, that's between you and your autumn festival.

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Speaker 1: Yep, all right, got it. Well, we do have some

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Speaker 1: numbers for you.

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Speaker 2: We do, okay, gosh, we do. I have read estimates

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Speaker 2: that put the global market from mooncakes at around two

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Speaker 2: point four billion dollars a year. Yep, it's a lot.

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Speaker 2: It's a lot. Snowy mooncakes might make up about half

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Speaker 2: of that, which is wild because again, like they're a

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Speaker 2: relatively new thing. The top four manufacturers control about ten

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Speaker 2: percent of the market, but there are over fifteen thousand

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Speaker 2: manufacturers around the world, over eight thousand of which are

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Speaker 2: in mainland China, China and Vietnam by the most mooncakes. Also,

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Speaker 2: some eighty percent of sales happen in the three months

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Speaker 2: leading up to the mid autumn festival. I further read

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Speaker 2: that about sixty five percent of the industrial market is

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Speaker 2: for those Cantonese style mooncakes. There are a few Guinness

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Speaker 2: records regarding mooncakes. The current record for largest mooncake was

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Speaker 2: set in twenty thirteen in Shanghai by a team up

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Speaker 2: of the chefs from two hotels, the Parkside Plaza and

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Speaker 2: the Shanghai Marriott. The mooncake in question weighed two four

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Speaker 2: hundred and ninety six point four kilos that's five five

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Speaker 2: hundred and two point seven pounds. It was two point

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Speaker 2: six meters across, which is about eight point four feet.

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Speaker 1: I'm scared.

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Speaker 2: You look, you look frightened.

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Speaker 1: I'm a little afraid. I'm kind of shaken. Sounds like

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Speaker 1: a pastry that could kill me if it wanted to,

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Speaker 1: if it was sentient. Oh grudge, Yeah, that would be

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Speaker 1: the end.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you'd watch out for that one. It was debuted

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Speaker 2: at the Mid Autumn Festival that year and was made

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Speaker 2: up of five hundred kilos of flour, three hundred kilos

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Speaker 2: of sugar, four thousand egg yolks, and two thousand, three

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Speaker 2: hundred kilos of lotus seed paste.

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Speaker 1: M Well, that's that's a lot.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, rather large. Yeah, if it's coming for you,

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Speaker 2: look out. Also.

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Speaker 3: Uh.

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Speaker 2: The largest word or phrase made out of mooncakes was

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Speaker 2: achieved in twenty twenty four by a restaurant in Guangdong.

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Speaker 2: It consisted of one eight hundred and eighty mooncakes that

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Speaker 2: formed the words mooncake master.

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Speaker 1: Honestly, that makes me a little nervous too.

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Speaker 2: And both of these are intimidating records.

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Speaker 1: They are. They're impressive, but intimidating. I feel like I

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Speaker 1: could see a character a sentient mooncake that when the

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Speaker 1: moon comes out, who knows what it will do?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, all right, blending our October vibes. I

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Speaker 2: like it.

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Speaker 1: I like it, of course, of course. Well, we do

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Speaker 1: have an interesting the mess of a history to go

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Speaker 1: through here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, uh yeah, we're gonna we're gonna have to do

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Speaker 2: separate episodes about like all of these key ingredients and

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Speaker 2: some of the regional varieties because there's a certain point

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Speaker 2: at which you have to stop. But but for the

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Speaker 2: things that we are going to cover, we're going to

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Speaker 2: get into all of that history as soon as we

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Speaker 2: get back from a quick break for a word from

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Speaker 2: our sponsors, and we're back.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, sponsor, Yes, thank you. Okay. So, the mid

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Speaker 1: Autumn festival dates back over three thousand years in China,

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Speaker 1: and it was a way to celebrate full harvest and

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Speaker 1: ask the gods for more prosperity in various ways. It

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Speaker 1: was a time of giving offerings, coming together to share

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Speaker 1: food and good times. Early records indicate that there were

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Speaker 1: moon cake esque on pastries in China going back to

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Speaker 1: the six hundred to nine hundred CE. They were not

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Speaker 1: necessarily related to any festival though. So this is where

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Speaker 1: we come to kind of the massy part of the history,

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Speaker 1: because people have a lot of stories and legends about it.

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Speaker 1: A lot of them are contradicting, and i'd like a

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Speaker 1: good chronological timeline. Sometimes I can't get that timeline.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no, this is not one of those.

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Speaker 1: No, it's absolutely not. So bear with me. We're gonna

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Speaker 1: go into a lot of interesting and fun places, but

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Speaker 1: they're kind of all over the place. Yes, yes, all right. So,

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Speaker 1: according to legend, in the fourteenth century, when the Mongols

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Speaker 1: ranged in China, Chinese rebels used mooncakes to pass along

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Speaker 1: secret messages to help their cause, including dates and details

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Speaker 1: of uprisings. Some stories get even more specific into the

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Speaker 1: exact dates and details. A rebel leader and his aid

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Speaker 1: came up with the idea when the Autumn festival was approaching.

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Speaker 1: That leader, Ju yuan Jong, went on to become emperor

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Speaker 1: of the newly established Ming dynasty. Most historians say that

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Speaker 1: mooncakes had nothing to do with the uprising, but that

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Speaker 1: is how the telling is told so often that this

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Speaker 1: is sort.

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Speaker 2: Of like the idea a lot of people have, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: of where they come from.

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Speaker 1: Some researchers looking into this strongly suspect that this legend

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Speaker 1: was created by Chinese nationalist in the twentieth century. There

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Speaker 1: are other similar versions of this story that recount emperors

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Speaker 1: giving moon cakes to other officials after a victory or

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Speaker 1: as a reward, some going back to the six hundred's ce.

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Speaker 1: I couldn't confirm this, but a lot of sources report

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Speaker 1: that the Taisha cake is the ancestor of mooncakes, and

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Speaker 1: this was a cake that is three thousand years old,

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Speaker 1: created in memory of a prime minister at the time,

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Speaker 1: and sometime in the six hundreds to eight hundred CE period,

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Speaker 1: the then prime minister really didn't like that this cake

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Speaker 1: was named after this other prime minister and wanted to

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Speaker 1: rename them, And while looking at his consort who was

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Speaker 1: staring at the moon, he got the idea for moon cake.

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Speaker 1: Whatever the case, at the height of anti government protests

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Speaker 1: in Hong Kong and twenty nineteen, rebellious messages on moon

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Speaker 1: cakes returned. Or maybe we're for the first time with

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Speaker 1: messages like keep on fighting. Some mainland Chinese folks boycotted

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Speaker 1: bakeries that did so. So that's how like embedded this

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Speaker 1: story is of passing these messages. Yeah, yeah, being kind

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Speaker 1: of a rebellious thing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Another legend starts far earlier than all of this, somewhere

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Speaker 1: between the six hundred and nine hundred CE, similar to

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Speaker 1: the Emperor one I guess, But as the legend goes,

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Speaker 1: this was a time of extreme heat that led to

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Speaker 1: crops withering and death. So the imperial court summoned up

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Speaker 1: a master archer named Ho Yee to use his skills

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Speaker 1: to shoot down nine of the ten suns that were

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Speaker 1: circling the planet. He did so, and the moon gods

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Speaker 1: rewarded him with two elixirs that would grant him everlasting life.

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Speaker 1: The whole thing.

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Speaker 2: Made him power hungry, though, and he.

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Speaker 1: Grew more and more volatile and tyrannical. His wife, chang E,

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Speaker 1: sought to stop him before he became too powerful, and

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Speaker 1: drank both of the elixirs. As a reward, the gods

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Speaker 1: floated her up to the moon, or, in some readings,

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Speaker 1: as a punishment, they floated her up to the moon

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Speaker 1: ah Yes. Another version of this claims that she drank

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Speaker 1: the second elixir to keep it from her husband's greedy apprentice,

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Speaker 1: and that her husband prepared a feast every year on

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Speaker 1: the day when the moon was the most full, desiring

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Speaker 1: to see his wife. Yet another version claims that there

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Speaker 1: was only enough elixir for one and that the archer

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Speaker 1: gave it to his wife or she stole it. Yes,

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Speaker 1: I love how it's so like she's either really a

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Speaker 1: really good a bastion of goodness, or she's being punished. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is a terrible thing that she's done. And also

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Speaker 1: the same with the archer and some versions he's the

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Speaker 1: bad guy. In some versions he's the good guy. China's

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Speaker 1: spacecraft Shanga one, two, three, and four were named after her,

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Speaker 1: So that's also there's so many different versions of that legend,

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Speaker 1: and I recommend reading them because there I like reading legends.

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Speaker 2: Like this, yeah, and just sort of comparing and contrasting

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Speaker 2: because right, there's a lot of different details that work

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Speaker 2: their way in based on who's doing.

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Speaker 1: The telling exactly, and like opposites so often. But that

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Speaker 1: is a big story behind the mooncake. It was during

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Speaker 1: the Ming dynasty though, that text first related mooncakes to

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Speaker 1: the mid autumn festival.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's like the thirteen to sixteen hundreds, and

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Speaker 2: this is when mooncakes really started gaining popularity.

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Speaker 1: Provinces all over China started making mooncakes their own, matching

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Speaker 1: their taste and ingredients, eventually leading to a wealth of

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Speaker 1: different kinds of mooncakes. The shape generally remained the same,

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Speaker 1: and eventually two mooncakes spread to other Asian countries, where

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Speaker 1: they were also adapted. In the nineteen sixties, Hong Kong

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Speaker 1: started really pushing exports of what was dubbed the Cantonese

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Speaker 1: style mooncake. These were typically filled with red bean paste

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Speaker 1: or lotus seed paste.

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Speaker 2: I had trouble tracking down the history of snowy mooncakes,

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Speaker 2: but folks seemed to agree that they started in Hong

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Speaker 2: Kong sometime in the nineteen sixties through the nineteen eighties.

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Speaker 2: One particular Hong Kong bakery chain called Taipan claims to

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Speaker 2: be the first to offer them in nineteen eighty nine.

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Speaker 2: Taypon actually just shut down earlier this year amid financial troubles,

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Speaker 2: which has been called the end of an era. But however,

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Speaker 2: they came about because snowy mooncakes are a lot lighter

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Speaker 2: than those traditional baked moon cakes, and because they're seen

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Speaker 2: as like less old fashioned and or more fun. They

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Speaker 2: did catch on pretty quick.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and then in twenty thirteen the Chinese government reprimanded

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Speaker 1: official expenditures of giving mooncakes.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, to reiterate, high end moon cakes can be very expensive.

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Speaker 2: You boxed up very artistically, and so The argument here

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Speaker 2: wasn't like, hey, don't give moon cakes. It was like, hey,

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Speaker 2: don't give bribes with public money. And apparently this had

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Speaker 2: been big enough of a problem that this new rule

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Speaker 2: like put a dent in the industry for a couple

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Speaker 2: of years.

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Speaker 1: Wow.

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Speaker 2: At any rate. In twenty eighteen, we got a mooncake emoji.

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Speaker 2: It displays in a few different styles of Cantonese mooncake.

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Speaker 2: Some have a slice taken out, some have a little

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Speaker 2: duck egg in there. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And as of late, yeah, there are all kinds of

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Speaker 1: promotional tie ins and gimmicks with mooncakes, especially around luxurious mooncakes.

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Speaker 1: This is another thing I recommend looking up if you

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Speaker 1: would like. Oh, there have been low or non fat offerings.

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Speaker 1: Some of all of this is controversial. It's caused a

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Speaker 1: lot of conversation about what a mooncake is?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, what right? What does it mean to you?

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Speaker 2: What should it mean? Can it mean different things to

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Speaker 2: different people? Are times changing too quickly? Is it in

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00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:00,000
Speaker 2: fact the kids who are wrong? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, something we've run into in a lot. It's

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Speaker 1: not only mooncakes, but certainly there are people who do

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00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:15,120
Speaker 1: not like the luxurious one. Specifically, I think that that's

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00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:15,879
Speaker 1: not what it's about.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I don't know, right right. Like also, like

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Speaker 2: like typical things that you run into with any kind

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00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:25,040
Speaker 2: of food item, you know, low sugar mooncakes have been

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00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:30,080
Speaker 2: a thing or like lower sugar or things with with

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Speaker 2: with trendy ingredients. There's been like a burst of sustainable

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Speaker 2: packaging for them. Yeah, stuff like that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, because the packaging is a at least in some cases,

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00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 1: it's a pretty big deal how it looks, and it

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Speaker 1: can also be very very pretty.

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Speaker 2: So oh yeah, yeah, I think I didn't. I didn't

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Speaker 2: confirm it with like a second source, but but I

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Speaker 2: read that. I read that there's a law in some

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Speaker 2: places where the cost of the packaging can only be

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Speaker 2: twenty percent of the cost of the total gift set. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: unconfirmed number, but yeah, like people are really thinking about

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Speaker 2: that kind of stuff.

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Speaker 1: I ran into something like that too, where they were

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Speaker 1: with the kind of really expensive ones. They were talking

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Speaker 1: about how much of that is going to the packaging

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Speaker 1: versus the moon cake. So this is, as we said,

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00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 1: there's so many other avenues we could go down. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is pretty much what we have for you today.

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Speaker 1: But if listeners, we would love to hear from you.

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Speaker 1: If you have experience or things that you would really

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Speaker 1: like us to cover that would be basing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, yeah, please please do right in. But that

432
00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 2: is what we have to say about Mooncake for now,

433
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:03,240
Speaker 2: and we do already have some listener mail for you,

434
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:04,560
Speaker 2: and we will get into that as soon as we

435
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:06,200
Speaker 2: get back from a quick break for a word from

436
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 2: our sponsors.

437
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:19,960
Speaker 1: We're back, Thank you, sponsors, Yes, thank you, and we're

438
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:31,240
Speaker 1: back with listener singing to the moon.

439
00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:37,480
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, I do like a fool. Oh they're

440
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 2: pretty mm hmmmmm.

441
00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 1: Okay. I love how many people have written in about soccer.

442
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:51,160
Speaker 1: Tort Dan wrote appropriately, just got caught up on my

443
00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 1: flight to Vienna the other day, had no idea about

444
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:58,920
Speaker 1: soccer sort, So here I am at Cafe Soccer. Thanks

445
00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 1: for the tip. I must say it is pretty decent.

446
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:06,240
Speaker 1: Not a huge dessert person, especially chocolate and fruit or

447
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:08,640
Speaker 1: not my thing, but it's not as sweet as I

448
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:12,240
Speaker 1: was expecting, and the texture is fantastic. Slightly dense but

449
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:17,520
Speaker 1: not dry. Picks attached for attention. About a forty minute

450
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:20,080
Speaker 1: wait to get in, but definitely worth a stop if

451
00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 1: you're in the neighborhood. Oh cool, that is cool. I

452
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 1: always love when we hear from listeners who heard an

453
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:32,840
Speaker 1: episode of ours and go to investigate or go to

454
00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:33,360
Speaker 1: try it.

455
00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:37,880
Speaker 2: That's and also when it's just on time, when it's like, oh,

456
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 2: I happened to be flying to Vienna, so thank you. Yeah. Yeah,

457
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 2: I promise we're not psychic, or if we are, we

458
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 2: don't know about it.

459
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 1: So that's true.

460
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:49,080
Speaker 2: And if we didn't know about it, we would almost

461
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:50,920
Speaker 2: certainly use our powers for good.

462
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:58,960
Speaker 1: I yes, I think, I think so. I yeah, thanks

463
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:03,440
Speaker 1: for letting us know. Yeah, I've appreciated hearing from people

464
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:07,680
Speaker 1: who have visited one of the two purported homes of

465
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:12,400
Speaker 1: soccer chorts, and I'm glad to hear that it stood

466
00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:15,120
Speaker 1: up at least I would say it stood up, like

467
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,240
Speaker 1: maybe you wouldn't go again, but it's a share.

468
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:19,600
Speaker 2: A pleasant experience.

469
00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, yeah, exactly.

470
00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 2: Eric wrote the Wonderful World of Tea, all the different

471
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:29,320
Speaker 2: flavors you can go with. I think selecting Earl Gray

472
00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 2: to start with is a good choice. The flavor on

473
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,120
Speaker 2: it is nice. I also love all the varieties of

474
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 2: grays that are out there. One of our favorites is

475
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:40,120
Speaker 2: from Fortenham and Mason Victoria. Gray has a touch of

476
00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 2: lavender and other flavors to it. Could go on about

477
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,000
Speaker 2: all the different varieties, but I think you did a

478
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:47,479
Speaker 2: good job covering some of the common ones. The London

479
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:50,200
Speaker 2: fog is also a wonderful way to enjoy, and an

480
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 2: iced one can really hit the spot on a hot day.

481
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:56,560
Speaker 2: Himan Aberko is tasty. I've had a taste of the

482
00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:00,320
Speaker 2: white label on a charcuterie board and did enjoy it.

483
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:02,680
Speaker 2: It is something to try, but is definitely one of

484
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 2: those treat type things. It had a richness that was enjoyable,

485
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:08,960
Speaker 2: but that richness is one that I think needs to

486
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:11,720
Speaker 2: be in small amounts or it becomes way too much.

487
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:14,960
Speaker 2: There are a lot of foods like that, absolutely wonderful,

488
00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:18,640
Speaker 2: but pricey and best done in small bites. I can't

489
00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:20,840
Speaker 2: remember the last time I had a fresh apricot, but

490
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:24,120
Speaker 2: I do love dried ones straight up snack in a salad,

491
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:26,800
Speaker 2: and we had a fruitcake once that had apricots in

492
00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:29,440
Speaker 2: it that was lovely. Always interesting to hear the story

493
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 2: behind something you generally just pick up and snack on.

494
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 2: And now I want to coogle. It has been years.

495
00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:39,840
Speaker 2: All the way back to college, my fraternity was predominantly Jewish,

496
00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 2: and some of them lived real close to campus with

497
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,560
Speaker 2: their family, so it was not uncommon to occasionally go

498
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:47,480
Speaker 2: there for dinner. I remember having at least one at

499
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:51,200
Speaker 2: a meal. The whole raisin thing is definitely interesting. It

500
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 2: seems like people either love raisins or want nothing to

501
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:56,880
Speaker 2: do with them. I like raisins, but I also think

502
00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 2: they need to be used properly in some dishes. They

503
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:02,040
Speaker 2: work when used, but it can also be a matter

504
00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:05,080
Speaker 2: of when they get added. Sounds like maybe a raisin

505
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 2: show in the future. Oh yeah, oh yeah, that is

506
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:13,600
Speaker 2: on our list. We may or may not have to

507
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:16,320
Speaker 2: do a whole side episode about the California raisins.

508
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 1: Yes, which, if you don't know about the California raisins,

509
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 1: you were in for a horrifying treat. They scared me anyway,

510
00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:30,560
Speaker 1: but I absolutely startled.

511
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 2: So yeah, I just kind of have a thing with clamation.

512
00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:36,640
Speaker 2: It sort of has always spooped me out. But yeah,

513
00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 2: uh well now the season yeah, oh my goodness, Yeah, yeah,

514
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 2: all of this. I the different varieties of Earl Gray, right,

515
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:51,120
Speaker 2: I feel like I need to I just usually go

516
00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:53,600
Speaker 2: with just Earl Gray, and I need to branch out

517
00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:53,960
Speaker 2: a little.

518
00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 1: I mean, it's true, what you say. There is the

519
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:04,960
Speaker 1: world of its huge, so many flavors. Before I realized

520
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 1: my poor tea affliction, I used to go it was Tbana,

521
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:13,440
Speaker 1: not a sposor, but I would go there and they

522
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 1: had all the samples and it would just be so

523
00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:20,920
Speaker 1: many samples and I didn't understand how how would I

524
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:27,360
Speaker 1: ever find the tea tea? Yeah, when there's this whole world.

525
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:29,600
Speaker 1: I did really like. There was a white jasmine one

526
00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:30,720
Speaker 1: I really loved.

527
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:36,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, but yeah, there's a lot of Earl Grays we

528
00:34:36,960 --> 00:34:39,120
Speaker 3: only touched on, and that one we only touched on,

529
00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:41,719
Speaker 3: Lady Gray as the alternate, but I think I had

530
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:43,600
Speaker 3: a list of at least ten.

531
00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:47,839
Speaker 1: That are pretty popular, like Russian Rearl Gray, French All Gray.

532
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:50,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, they kind of the trouble with some of

533
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 2: those definitions is that are some of those terms is

534
00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:56,160
Speaker 2: that they're real wibbly wobbly, like they don't they're they're

535
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:59,640
Speaker 2: pretty proprietary from brand to brand about what they're actually

536
00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:02,440
Speaker 2: talking about. And so yeah, that's why I didn't really

537
00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:06,160
Speaker 2: go into like defined terms because I was like, eh,

538
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:08,680
Speaker 2: some people put lavender in there. Tasty.

539
00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:15,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, for sure, we run into that kind of thing.

540
00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:20,960
Speaker 1: A lot. I also think Harmona Barrico, I agree. I

541
00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:25,799
Speaker 1: think it's delicious, but I yeah, I'm sure I could

542
00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:28,440
Speaker 1: eat a lot, but it's so expensive and it is

543
00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:32,399
Speaker 1: pretty rich, yeah, having like cheese with it, so it's

544
00:35:33,239 --> 00:35:36,240
Speaker 1: I don't I can't do too much.

545
00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:39,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, I wouldn't. I mean, like, it's kind of good

546
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:43,080
Speaker 2: that it's outrageously expensive, because right, like you don't really

547
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:46,480
Speaker 2: want to just a little as nice move on to

548
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:49,879
Speaker 2: something else, which is the whole great thing about meat

549
00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 2: and cheese plates, right, get to snack on all the

550
00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:53,480
Speaker 2: little different stuff.

551
00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,439
Speaker 1: I did. I had my meat and cheese night, which

552
00:35:57,440 --> 00:35:59,560
Speaker 1: I can't remember if I mentioned. I mentioned it was

553
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:03,759
Speaker 1: coming up in some recent episode, and it was pretty spectacular,

554
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:08,840
Speaker 1: and I have to say it was devoured. Usually I

555
00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:13,319
Speaker 1: like have cheese left for a long time. That's not

556
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:16,960
Speaker 1: gonna be the case this time. So I'm very happy

557
00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:17,680
Speaker 1: with that outcome.

558
00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:20,359
Speaker 2: Wonderful. Yeah, I know, I know that leftovers drive you

559
00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:22,240
Speaker 2: a little ban.

560
00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:28,960
Speaker 1: So I don't like leftovers and I cheese. Don't get

561
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:31,480
Speaker 1: me wrong. I've had many a cheese leftover from a

562
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:34,120
Speaker 1: cheese plate. But eventually you're kind of like, I need

563
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:39,080
Speaker 1: a vegetable other than cheese, something else than just cheese,

564
00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:44,719
Speaker 1: because badly doesn't really go with cheese like a cheese plate.

565
00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:50,640
Speaker 1: Cheese anyway, So I do have I have some breath left,

566
00:36:50,680 --> 00:36:54,080
Speaker 1: but it will it will go well in hand.

567
00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:56,719
Speaker 2: Oh good, good, I'm glad. I wouldn't want you to

568
00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:58,120
Speaker 2: have cheese stress.

569
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:02,520
Speaker 1: No, no, no, that's not what we need right now.

570
00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:05,440
Speaker 2: Oh and yeah I need I need some cookle too.

571
00:37:07,120 --> 00:37:12,120
Speaker 1: Yes, I must try it. I've decided the noodle one

572
00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:15,000
Speaker 1: is that, the savory noodle one is the one one

573
00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:18,920
Speaker 1: for you, but the potato one is a close second.

574
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:21,200
Speaker 2: The potato one is really good.

575
00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:24,920
Speaker 1: I think I'd be very happy with either.

576
00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:28,279
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, oh yeah, it's a starch cast role.

577
00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:36,000
Speaker 1: Yeah delicious. Yeah, yes, we'll see if we can rectify

578
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:40,800
Speaker 1: these things. And definitely raisins. I'm excited.

579
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:44,919
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it's gonna be a lot, but it's gonna

580
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:45,200
Speaker 2: be great.

581
00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:50,320
Speaker 1: Yeah. We love strong opinions, as you know. Oh well.

582
00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:53,279
Speaker 1: In the meantime, thanks to both of these listeners for

583
00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:54,960
Speaker 1: writing in. If you would like to write to us,

584
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:57,600
Speaker 1: you can or email us hello at savorpod dot com.

585
00:37:57,640 --> 00:38:00,359
Speaker 2: We're also on social media. You can find us on

586
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:03,719
Speaker 2: Instagram and Blue Sky at Saber Pod and we do

587
00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 2: hope to hear from you. Savre is production of iHeartRadio.

588
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:10,120
Speaker 2: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, you can visit the iHeartRadio app,

589
00:38:10,320 --> 00:38:13,240
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

590
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:16,279
Speaker 2: Thanks as always to our super producers Dylan Fagan and

591
00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:18,759
Speaker 2: Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and we hope

592
00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 2: that lots more good things are coming your way