WEBVTT - Short Stuff: Fanta - Nazi Favorite?

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, am welcome to the short Stuff. I'm Josh, and

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<v Speaker 1>there's Chuck and Chuck. I have a question for you. Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>don't you want to Fanta? Was that a slogan?

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<v Speaker 2>Mm hm oh don't you wanna?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I remember that now. It was very catchy, don't

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<v Speaker 2>you fana? Don't you wanna?

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<v Speaker 1>Was that it? Don't you want to Fanta? I remember?

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, I love Fanta?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean wait, wait, wait, you never answered my question.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, of course I do if I love it.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay.

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<v Speaker 2>I think I've mentioned plenty of times that I did

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<v Speaker 2>not grow up drinking much soda because as a family,

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<v Speaker 2>we didn't have the kind of money to just load

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<v Speaker 2>up the house with SODA's, so SODA's were only reserved

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<v Speaker 2>for my mom to drink tab.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh yes, she's a tab drinker.

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<v Speaker 2>Huh yeah, we had money for that. But I didn't

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<v Speaker 2>drink much soda growing up. So I don't drink a

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<v Speaker 2>soda now, thankfully, because that stuff is so bad for you,

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<v Speaker 2>generally speaking. But I will hammer down six cokes a year,

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<v Speaker 2>and maybe four or five fan of.

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<v Speaker 1>Oranges all at once once a year.

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<v Speaker 2>I love them. I love that fan of orange. I

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<v Speaker 2>just you know, you can't drink that stuff a lot.

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<v Speaker 1>Have you had any of the other fantas, the grape, etc.

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<v Speaker 2>I think I like dabbled in the grape and kneehigh

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<v Speaker 2>grape and stuff when I was a kid, But it's

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<v Speaker 2>really that. And I like sunkissed, preferred sunkist as a

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<v Speaker 2>kid here and there. Yeah, yeah, but Fanta orange is

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<v Speaker 2>one of my rare, rare guilty pleasures.

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<v Speaker 1>I got you. I was more of a fago man

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<v Speaker 1>as a kid.

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<v Speaker 2>Do I never drink those? And I also never have

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<v Speaker 2>drink any of the clear or yellows like I've never

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<v Speaker 2>tasted mountain dew. Didn't drink mellow yellow or sprite or

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<v Speaker 2>seven up or anything like that.

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<v Speaker 1>You missed out you've never tasted mountain dew or mellow yellow.

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<v Speaker 1>I just want to make sure I have that correct.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think so wow, I can't remember ever doing it.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I don't even know what it tastes like.

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<v Speaker 2>It looks lemon limey.

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<v Speaker 1>But no, no, it's not. It's its own thing, for sure.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know that you should ever break the streak

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<v Speaker 1>now that you've reached this along without trying it. But yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>it's not lemon lime. It's its own thing.

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<v Speaker 2>But what we're talking about is whether or not Fanta

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<v Speaker 2>is a Nazi drink, and we're going to go into

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<v Speaker 2>the history of that, and we're going to start out

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<v Speaker 2>talking a little bit about Coca Cola, the parent company,

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<v Speaker 2>as every most people know by now, it was invented

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<v Speaker 2>by doctor John Stith Pemberton in eighteen eighty six. He

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<v Speaker 2>was a morphine addicted Civil War veteran looking for a

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<v Speaker 2>better way to feel better than morphine and put together

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<v Speaker 2>some cocoa leaves and cola nuts, which had you know,

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<v Speaker 2>were stimulants because of cocaine and caffeine, and said, hey,

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<v Speaker 2>this is like a new kind of medicine. And after

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<v Speaker 2>he died it went on to be a very very

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<v Speaker 2>popular drink.

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<v Speaker 1>It sure did. One of the things that Coca Cola

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<v Speaker 1>did over time was they expanded around the world. They

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<v Speaker 1>became an ambassador of American democracy. One of the places

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<v Speaker 1>they expanded to is Germany, pre war Germany or maybe

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<v Speaker 1>inter war Germany. I'm not sure when they showed up,

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<v Speaker 1>but regardless, by the time World War II was starting

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<v Speaker 1>to ramp up, say the thirties the late thirties, Coca

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<v Speaker 1>Cola was heavily entrenched in Germany, and its subsidiary was

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<v Speaker 1>Coca Cola GmbH, which stands for gelschafft mitt besch kroner Hoftung,

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<v Speaker 1>which translates to company with limited liability. And there was

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<v Speaker 1>a guy named Max Kite who ran the show there,

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<v Speaker 1>and boy, oh boy, was he dedicated to Coca Cola

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<v Speaker 1>and furthering the cause of Coca Cola in Germany.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, for sure. There's a guy named Mark Pendergrast who

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<v Speaker 2>wrote a book called for God Country and Coca Cola

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<v Speaker 2>No Colon. Yeah you go, Mark, Yeah, that's incredible. And

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<v Speaker 2>he said that you know, this guy loved coke so

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<v Speaker 2>much he really just wanted to weave it into every

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<v Speaker 2>aspect of German life, including the Nazi Party, even though

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<v Speaker 2>supposedly he never was officially joined the Nazi Party. And

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<v Speaker 2>you think, like, well, Coke probably wasn't super stoked about this.

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<v Speaker 1>They didn't care.

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<v Speaker 2>Robert Woodruff was running Coke at the time, and he

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<v Speaker 2>was like, Hey, this is all good. We're going to

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<v Speaker 2>co sponsor the nineteen thirty six Perlin Olympics. We're going

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<v Speaker 2>to hang up some banners there with our logo right

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<v Speaker 2>next to the swastika, and it's all good everybody.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Can you imagine I looked high and low for

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<v Speaker 1>a photograph of that, and I could not find it.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm sure Coca Cola has dedicated a significant amount of

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<v Speaker 1>his operational fund to destroying any evidence of that banner. Ever.

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<v Speaker 2>I haven't been to the World of Coke Museum, but

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<v Speaker 2>I bet right here in Atlanta, I bet it's not

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<v Speaker 2>in there.

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<v Speaker 1>I'll bet they don't have it up too. There was

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<v Speaker 1>also the tenth anniversary of Coca Cola GmbH. They decided

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<v Speaker 1>to commemorate their deepest admiration for the fure for Hitler's

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<v Speaker 1>fiftieth birthday with a mass Nazi salute. I guess of

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<v Speaker 1>employees who worked there at the time, Yeah, exactly. So,

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<v Speaker 1>Coca Cola was very much entrenched in Nazi Germany even

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<v Speaker 1>before the war, especially before the war.

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<v Speaker 2>I should say, well, yeah, because once the war started,

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<v Speaker 2>they're like, oh, well, I guess we can't do business

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<v Speaker 2>with Germany anymore. And Germany was seizing enemy owned businesses

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<v Speaker 2>at will. I think General Motors actually got out of Germany,

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<v Speaker 2>but they did seize IBM, and Coca Cola said, sorry, kite,

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<v Speaker 2>we got to stop sending you our seven X flavoring

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<v Speaker 2>and he said, but that is the secret, and they went,

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<v Speaker 2>I know, and I'm really sorry. But even though we're friends,

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<v Speaker 2>our countries aren't friends right now. And that was a

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<v Speaker 2>huge hit on Coca Cola LLC GNB H Germany.

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<v Speaker 1>He could make coke.

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<v Speaker 2>So he was like, I got to come up with

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<v Speaker 2>a new plan.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. And also at the same time, he's walking this

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<v Speaker 1>fine line between not having access to the product that

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<v Speaker 1>his company makes and trying to keep the German government

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<v Speaker 1>from officially seizing and taking over his company. And to

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<v Speaker 1>do that he needs he needs a hit. He needs

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<v Speaker 1>the most delicious, most nutritious thing you could possibly put

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<v Speaker 1>together that's going to sweep Germany right off the bat.

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<v Speaker 1>And I feel like we should talk about this product

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<v Speaker 1>that Max Kite introduced after a break. Oh okay, Chuck.

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<v Speaker 1>So Max kite'es like, what am I going to do?

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<v Speaker 1>I need to come up with something fast to keep

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<v Speaker 1>my company afloat. I think I'll just create an entirely

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<v Speaker 1>new drink that no one's ever even thought of making before. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>And because there's so many wartime rations going on, I'm

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<v Speaker 1>gonna have to get really creative here, but I'm gonna

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<v Speaker 1>do it.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, not only did he was he not

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<v Speaker 2>getting that sweet sweet seven X coke syrup. He didn't

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<v Speaker 2>have sugar, or at least much. They were rationing sugar

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<v Speaker 2>at the time, so he said all right. He ended

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<v Speaker 2>up saying the recipe was made from the leftovers of

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<v Speaker 2>the leftovers. The first fanta, which, by the way, is

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<v Speaker 2>the German word for fantasy or imagination. And supposedly he said, hey,

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<v Speaker 2>marketing team, use your fantasy to think of a good name,

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<v Speaker 2>and they said, how about fanta? And he went, that's great.

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<v Speaker 1>How about love?

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<v Speaker 2>I think he was gotta nip who officially thought of

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<v Speaker 2>the name. But he got apple pulp from leftover apple

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<v Speaker 2>cider making, beet sugar and whey, and by all accounts,

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<v Speaker 2>it was not orange at all, and it tasted like

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<v Speaker 2>sweet garbage.

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<v Speaker 1>It's yeah. It took me a couple of reads to

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<v Speaker 1>be like, well, wait a minute, how does that taste

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<v Speaker 1>like fanta? And then I realized it just sudden horror.

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<v Speaker 1>It didn't taste anything like fanta, And apparently it didn't

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<v Speaker 1>taste very well at all. Historians no one knows what

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<v Speaker 1>it tasted like. Or at least no one's been able

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<v Speaker 1>to find somebody who actually drank this stuff. But they're like,

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<v Speaker 1>just look at the ingredients. There's no way it tasted good.

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<v Speaker 1>And they think that it was probably mostly sold to

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<v Speaker 1>be used as like a flavor agent for soups and

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<v Speaker 1>stews and stuff like that. That people weren't just knocking

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<v Speaker 1>back bottles of this stuff, because they would have vomited

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<v Speaker 1>until they died. I guess instead they were just using

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<v Speaker 1>it in other ways. But that's not to say it

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't a huge hit. It was a big seller. And

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<v Speaker 1>not only that, it instilled like a kind of national

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<v Speaker 1>pride among Germans, like, look at how resourceful we are

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<v Speaker 1>in the face of you know, wartime scarcity. But have

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<v Speaker 1>you tried this stuff?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was their own. They're like, we have fanta

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<v Speaker 2>and beer, and like we're going to claim those and

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<v Speaker 2>love those and drink those until we fall over.

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<v Speaker 1>So he did.

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<v Speaker 2>Even though, like I said, he officially supposedly never joined

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<v Speaker 2>the Nazi Party, he did work very closely with the

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<v Speaker 2>Nazi Party because he needed their help. He needed their

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<v Speaker 2>help making sure that production continued, and you know, the

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<v Speaker 2>cooperation with the Nazis was a key part of that,

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<v Speaker 2>but that was able to keep the doors open, at

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<v Speaker 2>least officially. Coca Cola in April of nineteen fifty five,

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<v Speaker 2>post war, said why don't we rejigger Fanta and make

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<v Speaker 2>it taste good? And we've got the we have it copyrighted,

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<v Speaker 2>and it's already sort of got a little bit of

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<v Speaker 2>a cred at least in Europe. So let's just keep

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<v Speaker 2>the name and hopefully no one will remember the Nazi ties.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but also so this name, just the name, right,

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<v Speaker 1>they could have come up with anything else, but just

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<v Speaker 1>the name has Nazi ties. Like you said, it was

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<v Speaker 1>created in and for Nazi Germany, and it was also

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<v Speaker 1>made from apple pulp and beet sugar, and way, why

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<v Speaker 1>would you use that. I would think you would want

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<v Speaker 1>to do the exact opposite and bury that name, like

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<v Speaker 1>it was a banner with the coke logo in the swastika.

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<v Speaker 1>But instead they just went with it, and they introduced

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<v Speaker 1>it in Italy first. Is this the version we know now,

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<v Speaker 1>this orange soda version? And Italy was like, yeah, it's

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<v Speaker 1>pretty good, let's go with that, and they started to

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<v Speaker 1>export it finally made it into the United States in

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen fifty eight, which was I think three years after

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<v Speaker 1>they reintroduced it in Italy.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think with the deal was is it wasn't

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<v Speaker 2>widely known outside of Germany, so it's not like the

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<v Speaker 2>word Fanta had some negative connotation all over the world,

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<v Speaker 2>and the Germans loved it, so it actually had a

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<v Speaker 2>positive connotation and at least one market. So yeah, I

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<v Speaker 2>get it. I mean, maybe it would have been a

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<v Speaker 2>good pr move to change it because it's the Nazi thing,

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<v Speaker 2>but I don't think it was like some otherwise tainted name.

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<v Speaker 1>I see, I see what you mean. And they were like,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm sure people just forget about it. Anyway, within a

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<v Speaker 1>year or two, anybody who even knows about it, it'll

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<v Speaker 1>never come out.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, until you know, people started calling it a Nazi

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<v Speaker 2>drink and you know, on the Internet, and the idea

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<v Speaker 2>kind of spread and it was, you know, it was

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<v Speaker 2>Fanta and not Fanta. But yeah, people largely didn't think

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<v Speaker 2>much about it, and I still don't think much about it.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, it's not like if you buy a Fanta

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<v Speaker 2>or something today, you're supporting Nazis.

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<v Speaker 1>Right to the upkeep of Hitler's tomb or something like that.

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<v Speaker 1>A small donation, but the author Pendergrast, was like, it's

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<v Speaker 1>this is pretty It is still pretty significant that people

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<v Speaker 1>like this drink enough that even knowing it's its roots

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<v Speaker 1>or where it came from, it was like, it's just

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<v Speaker 1>it's an orange soda. I like it for what it is.

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<v Speaker 1>And it's not just orange. As we said, they have

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<v Speaker 1>a whole line of flavors, including grape, and I think

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<v Speaker 1>it's much more popular in South America right now, but yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>still pretty pretty big in America in the United States. Man,

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<v Speaker 1>we keep getting taken to task for that, for calling

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<v Speaker 1>the US America. Yeah, sorry, everybody, that's what That's what

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<v Speaker 1>they tell us. That's what they teach us here.

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<v Speaker 2>Uh. As far as Kite goes, he stuck around and

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<v Speaker 2>the Coca Cola company said, you know what, even though

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<v Speaker 2>your drinkles was garbage, you did the yeoman's work way

0:12:48.080 --> 0:12:50.960
<v Speaker 2>back then and kept that brand alive. And so he

0:12:51.160 --> 0:12:54.959
<v Speaker 2>was made eventually the head of Coca Cola Europe and uh,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, it seems like had a pretty good career

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<v Speaker 2>as a soda guy.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh. One other thing about that too, is as the

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<v Speaker 1>Nazis rolled in the country after country, Kite was right

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<v Speaker 1>behind the tanks going. Your division of Coca Cola is

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<v Speaker 1>now part of Coca Cola Deutsch Lant. Your division of

0:13:11.040 --> 0:13:13.520
<v Speaker 1>Coca Cola is now part of Coca Cola Deutsch Lant.

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<v Speaker 1>And so when he was made the head of Coca

0:13:16.080 --> 0:13:21.959
<v Speaker 1>Cola Europe, he had consolidated through conquering other businesses. He

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<v Speaker 1>had consolidated all into one company because of the Nazis

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<v Speaker 1>conquering these countries. Isn't that nuts? Yeah?

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, who better to lead the Coca Cola Europe

0:13:33.880 --> 0:13:35.480
<v Speaker 2>you know, I guess he was already taking place.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. He kept pounding his fist in his hand whenever

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<v Speaker 1>he talked at like board meetings and investors' meetings. That's right, Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>Well that's it for fanta? Do you want a Fanta?

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know. That's only a question you can answer yourself.

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<v Speaker 1>And while you think about that, we're done with this.

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<v Speaker 1>So short stuff is out.

0:13:58.440 --> 0:14:01.280
<v Speaker 2>Stuff he should know is a production of iHeartRadio. For

0:14:01.400 --> 0:14:05.559
<v Speaker 2>more podcasts my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

0:14:05.679 --> 0:14:07.520
<v Speaker 2>or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.