1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:04,200 Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics, 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:07,160 Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of 3 00:00:07,200 --> 00:00:08,719 Speaker 1: today's best minds. 4 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:11,000 Speaker 2: We're on vacation, but that doesn't mean we don't have 5 00:00:11,039 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 2: a great show for you today. Solidarity Strategies founder Chuck 6 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:17,159 Speaker 2: Rosche talks to us about Biden's path to victory. But 7 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,480 Speaker 2: first we talked to Ramin Setuta about his new book, 8 00:00:20,560 --> 00:00:23,760 Speaker 2: Apprentice in Wonderland, How Donald Trump and Mark Burnett took 9 00:00:23,800 --> 00:00:25,279 Speaker 2: America through the Looking Glass. 10 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 1: Welcome to Fast Politics formIn. 11 00:00:28,120 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 3: Thank you, Mollie. Thank you so much for having me. 12 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:33,200 Speaker 1: Perhaps you could start by talking to me about why 13 00:00:33,240 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 1: you decided to write this book about The Apprentice and 14 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:41,880 Speaker 1: which is ultimately, weirdly the most important television program ever. 15 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:45,199 Speaker 3: Probably I agree. I think it unlocks the mystery and 16 00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:47,919 Speaker 3: secret of Donald Trump. And there's a lot of questions 17 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:50,479 Speaker 3: about who is he and how did he come to power, 18 00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:52,720 Speaker 3: and why do people like him? And what is going on? 19 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:55,400 Speaker 3: And I think if you look back on The Apprentice, 20 00:00:55,760 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 3: it answers all of those questions. And the reason I 21 00:00:58,480 --> 00:01:00,200 Speaker 3: decided to write this book was that one I was 22 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 3: a reporter in my twenties. I was working for Newsweek, 23 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:04,480 Speaker 3: and I needed a beat, and I needed something to 24 00:01:04,520 --> 00:01:07,680 Speaker 3: cover pretty consistently. And at the time, The Apprentice was 25 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 3: the hot show on TV. And at the time the 26 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:12,559 Speaker 3: person who was the easiest to interview was Donald Trump. 27 00:01:12,560 --> 00:01:15,600 Speaker 3: He would call office at Trump Tower. He had no publicist, 28 00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:20,360 Speaker 3: he had no bedding. He was his publicist right he publisher, 29 00:01:20,560 --> 00:01:23,040 Speaker 3: and as secretary would patch him through directly. I would 30 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:25,160 Speaker 3: call his office. I would be on the phone with 31 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 3: him before I could even turned on my tape recorder. 32 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:29,520 Speaker 3: He would give me three minutes, he'd answer any question 33 00:01:29,600 --> 00:01:31,680 Speaker 3: I asked, and then he'd hang up. And so when 34 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:33,800 Speaker 3: he became President of the United States, I would often 35 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 3: think back to that time of how easy it was 36 00:01:36,120 --> 00:01:37,880 Speaker 3: to access him, and how easy it was to talk 37 00:01:37,920 --> 00:01:40,679 Speaker 3: to him, and how surreal the whole thing was that 38 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:42,680 Speaker 3: we as a country were trapped in a reality show. 39 00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:44,720 Speaker 3: And so when he left the White House against his 40 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:47,560 Speaker 3: own will, I decided to work on this book, and 41 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:49,480 Speaker 3: he reached out to me. Before I even had to 42 00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:51,920 Speaker 3: call his office, write a letter, send an email. He 43 00:01:51,960 --> 00:01:53,560 Speaker 3: reached out to me and wanted to talk to me, 44 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:56,400 Speaker 3: And between twenty twenty one and twenty twenty three, we 45 00:01:56,480 --> 00:01:59,880 Speaker 3: actually spoke six times, four times in person. We watched 46 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,760 Speaker 3: clips of The Apprentice in his boardroom in Trump Tower. 47 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:04,720 Speaker 3: I went to mar A Lago, and I think this 48 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 3: book it's a dual narrative. It looks back on The Apprentice, 49 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:10,040 Speaker 3: but also looks forward on this shell of a man 50 00:02:10,160 --> 00:02:12,320 Speaker 3: that Donald Trump became after he left the White House, 51 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:16,959 Speaker 3: fixating on feuds, fixating on celebrities, very resentful of what happened, 52 00:02:17,040 --> 00:02:19,520 Speaker 3: and it was unlike any post presidency. I think we 53 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:21,520 Speaker 3: can imagine as the American public. 54 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:24,440 Speaker 1: Talk to me about Deborah Messing. 55 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:27,800 Speaker 3: Well, Donald Trump is obsessed with celebrities even when he 56 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 3: left the White House, and so a lot of our 57 00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:34,240 Speaker 3: time was that talking about his feuds and him feeling 58 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:37,360 Speaker 3: like he was slighted by Martha Stewart, by Bette Midler, 59 00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 3: by people that weren't on The Apprentice, because when he 60 00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:42,720 Speaker 3: became famous on a reality show and became a famous 61 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:45,600 Speaker 3: reality star, he thought all these famous people that were 62 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:48,679 Speaker 3: momentarily nice to him were actually his friends. And one 63 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 3: that he's really obsessed with is Deborah Messing. He recalls 64 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 3: very specifically being at the NBC Upfronts, which is a 65 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 3: term of people using the industry when they're going to 66 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:00,120 Speaker 3: go and try to sell advertising for their show. And 67 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:01,960 Speaker 3: they were here in New York and they were walking 68 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:04,600 Speaker 3: in and Debora Messing said something nice to him because 69 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:06,400 Speaker 3: at the time Willin and Grace are on the same 70 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 3: night as The Apprentice, and she said that his good 71 00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 3: ratings helped will embrace. That's his memory. That's a story, A. 72 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:15,040 Speaker 1: Very polite thing to say to someone you don't know. 73 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:19,720 Speaker 3: Very appropriate, totally like whatever. I'm sure famous people will 74 00:03:19,760 --> 00:03:22,240 Speaker 3: have conversations like this all the time. They're not really 75 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:25,520 Speaker 3: meant to indicate anything. It's just being polite, absolutely right. 76 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:29,359 Speaker 3: So he talked about how, in kind of creepy language, 77 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 3: how attracted she found her with her red hair, spoke 78 00:03:33,480 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 3: in this way that objectified her, and over the multiple 79 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 3: times he brought up Debora Messing indicated that he found 80 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 3: her attractive and had a crush on her, and so 81 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:46,640 Speaker 3: when she would tweet about him, he found it particularly 82 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:49,920 Speaker 3: hurtful that this person who sitcom star, who at one 83 00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 3: point said something vaguely nice to him, was no longer 84 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,520 Speaker 3: on his side as President a States of America. And 85 00:03:55,600 --> 00:03:59,000 Speaker 3: he was very aware and cognizant of what Devora Messing 86 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 3: was posting on Twitter about him, more so than his 87 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:04,680 Speaker 3: own policies, more so than his own legislation, more so 88 00:04:04,760 --> 00:04:06,320 Speaker 3: than his time in the White House. There was a 89 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:09,240 Speaker 3: lot of conversation about Debra Messing and our time together. 90 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 1: It's both very stupid but also makes a lot of sense. 91 00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 1: So more interested in the celebrities than his own policy. 92 00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:20,560 Speaker 3: More interested in celebrities than anything. He talked to me 93 00:04:20,600 --> 00:04:23,480 Speaker 3: about how he has a secret vote in Beverly Hills. 94 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:26,919 Speaker 3: He's not interested in swing states or Middle America. He 95 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:30,360 Speaker 3: really wants famous people to like him. He's still incredibly 96 00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 3: resentful that he didn't win an Emmy for hosting The 97 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:35,280 Speaker 3: Apprentice in two thousand and four. In two thousand and five, 98 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:37,520 Speaker 3: when he was nominated and recalls going to get Emmy, 99 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:39,840 Speaker 3: He's thinking he was going to win. Having The Amazing 100 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:43,840 Speaker 3: Race when calling it an establishment show even though it wasn't, 101 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:46,480 Speaker 3: that makes no sense. The Amazing Race was a scrappy, 102 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 3: small reality show that didn't actually have that big of 103 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:52,279 Speaker 3: an audience back then, and it is very resentful. But 104 00:04:52,320 --> 00:04:54,240 Speaker 3: I think the reason this is all very important because 105 00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 3: we're entering into another election, right and we're there's a 106 00:04:57,000 --> 00:04:59,480 Speaker 3: lot of conversation about who Donald Trump is. Can the 107 00:04:59,520 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 3: Democrats it beat him? We know what's his take in 108 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:03,800 Speaker 3: his election, but what does that play? And Donald Trump 109 00:05:03,880 --> 00:05:06,680 Speaker 3: is a product of Hollywood, He is a product reality TV. 110 00:05:07,080 --> 00:05:09,760 Speaker 3: He is a product of celebrity culture. And there is 111 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:14,320 Speaker 3: a convergence in our society between political activity and celebrity culture. 112 00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:16,680 Speaker 3: And we saw it perhaps with Sarah Bala, and we 113 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:18,479 Speaker 3: definitely saw it with Obama, who used it as a 114 00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:20,599 Speaker 3: force of good not evil, and now we're seeing it 115 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:23,159 Speaker 3: with Donald Trump. And I think it's really important to 116 00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:25,919 Speaker 3: examine who Donald Trump is, where he came from, and 117 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:28,839 Speaker 3: how he sees the world, because that is the playbook 118 00:05:28,880 --> 00:05:30,599 Speaker 3: he's going to use to try it to beat Joe 119 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 3: Biden in the fall. 120 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: Mm yeah, I think that's right. So why is he 121 00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:37,840 Speaker 1: interested in Beverly Hills just because it's filled with famous 122 00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:38,760 Speaker 1: people or. 123 00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 3: Because where celebrities lived? You know, he never lived in 124 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:44,000 Speaker 3: Los Angeles or Hollywood, but he always wanted to be 125 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 3: accepted by Hollywood and his dream before he went into 126 00:05:46,839 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 3: real estate because as an ebo baby, that was the 127 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:52,000 Speaker 3: easier path. But his dream is to be a producer, 128 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:54,719 Speaker 3: either of film or Broadway shows. He was always drawn 129 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:56,159 Speaker 3: and fascinated by show business. 130 00:05:56,360 --> 00:06:01,080 Speaker 1: It's such a crazy thing. Do you think that, for example, 131 00:06:01,279 --> 00:06:07,040 Speaker 1: like having Robert de Niro at the debates would upset Trump? 132 00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:09,680 Speaker 1: I mean, do you think that there is a way 133 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:10,800 Speaker 1: for Biden to play this. 134 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:14,080 Speaker 3: Yes, I think that Biden needs to look at Trump 135 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 3: as a reality star, and he needs to the only 136 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:19,800 Speaker 3: way to beat a reality star is by eclipsing or 137 00:06:19,839 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 3: dimming that star's power. So yes, absolutely. Robert de Niro, 138 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:26,400 Speaker 3: who is a real actor and a real famous person 139 00:06:26,520 --> 00:06:29,240 Speaker 3: and was often much more famous than Donald Trump until 140 00:06:29,279 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 3: Donald Trump became president, I states being at the debates 141 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 3: would certainly unnerve Trump. Absolutely. 142 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:36,680 Speaker 1: Do you think that Trump had a moment since you 143 00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:41,359 Speaker 1: interviewed him after he lost the presidency? Do you think 144 00:06:41,400 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 1: that he ever felt that he was truly famous? 145 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 3: He felt like he was famous when he was the 146 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:49,760 Speaker 3: star of the Apprentice because he had two things right. 147 00:06:49,800 --> 00:06:52,640 Speaker 3: He had fame. He was at the top of the 148 00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 3: reality TV pecking order when The Apprentice in season one, 149 00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:57,839 Speaker 3: although the numbers kept dropping after season one, but whether 150 00:06:57,839 --> 00:07:00,240 Speaker 3: it was the most watched show on TV for one week. 151 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:03,520 Speaker 3: He has those ratings rained both in his office and 152 00:07:03,680 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 3: in mar A Lago and as the editor chy for Variety, 153 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:08,680 Speaker 3: he was always so excited to talk to me because 154 00:07:08,720 --> 00:07:12,400 Speaker 3: those ratings mean so much to him. Was wall. He 155 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:16,520 Speaker 3: looks at them, it's like comforting, soothing, and so I 156 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:18,840 Speaker 3: think that he was very fond of the period in 157 00:07:18,840 --> 00:07:21,920 Speaker 3: which he was hosted The Apprentice because first he was famous, 158 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 3: but second, just as important as being famous was that 159 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:27,280 Speaker 3: he was white. He wasn't a divisive figure. People thought 160 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:31,320 Speaker 3: he was an entertaining and you know, mostly loved saying 161 00:07:31,360 --> 00:07:33,800 Speaker 3: his catchphrase you're fired back to him. So he was 162 00:07:33,840 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 3: a famous person who also wasn't dividing the country. And 163 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:39,840 Speaker 3: as much as he is stoking division now and creating 164 00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:43,440 Speaker 3: drama and dividing the ISAs America and potentially just growing it, 165 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:45,760 Speaker 3: he liked the fact that everyone liked him and that's 166 00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 3: all that matters to him. 167 00:07:47,160 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's right, And it is interesting that 168 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:57,200 Speaker 1: he did feel that he was popular then as president 169 00:07:57,520 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 1: he had a lot of power, but he was liked 170 00:08:00,520 --> 00:08:02,520 Speaker 1: by the people he wanted to be liked by. Do 171 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: you think that was a real tension or now. 172 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:06,640 Speaker 3: Yes, I think that was one of the central tensions 173 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:09,280 Speaker 3: of this presidency. But it was two things. He wasn't 174 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:12,920 Speaker 3: liked by famous people, which really bothered him and got 175 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:15,320 Speaker 3: under his skin so much so that he was a 176 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 3: shell of a person after he left the White House 177 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:20,160 Speaker 3: over that, not over anything else, not over the insurrection, 178 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:22,480 Speaker 3: not over any of the other horrible things that he did. 179 00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:24,760 Speaker 3: But he was very upset that famous people no longer 180 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 3: liked him. But part of this was that he was 181 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:29,680 Speaker 3: powerful as president, I states, but he didn't know how 182 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:32,720 Speaker 3: to do the job. And when he reality show he 183 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 3: came in, he did whatever he did, he created, whatever 184 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:39,080 Speaker 3: problems he created. Sometimes his lines didn't make sense, but 185 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:41,880 Speaker 3: through the magic of editing, Mark Burnett and his team 186 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:45,520 Speaker 3: of producers always made Donald Trump a coherent, cohesive figure. 187 00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 3: And as PRESIDENTI states, yes, he was powerful, but I 188 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:50,280 Speaker 3: don't think he knew how to use that power. And 189 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:53,079 Speaker 3: I think the reason why he was constantly flailing in 190 00:08:53,120 --> 00:08:55,960 Speaker 3: the White House was that he wasn't in control of 191 00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:58,600 Speaker 3: the situation. And I think it was very unsettling for 192 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:01,200 Speaker 3: him to not be in charge even though he was 193 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:02,320 Speaker 3: supposedly in charge. 194 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 1: Can you talk about his cognitive issues. 195 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:06,880 Speaker 3: One of the things I noticed when I went to 196 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:09,960 Speaker 3: visit him was that he hadn't changed in many ways 197 00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:12,640 Speaker 3: since I first started talking to him, but his memory 198 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 3: was certainly much more foggy. The first time I sat 199 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:17,640 Speaker 3: down with him and talked to him, we had a 200 00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:21,240 Speaker 3: very lengthy conversation. He told Jason Miller how much he 201 00:09:21,320 --> 00:09:24,040 Speaker 3: loved talking to me. He extended our time to his 202 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 3: second meeting immediately. And then the second time I went 203 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:29,080 Speaker 3: to talk to him, we had had and again, this 204 00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:30,760 Speaker 3: isn't someone who's been talking to a lot of press. 205 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:33,240 Speaker 3: At that time, Donald Trump was really laying low and 206 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:35,720 Speaker 3: I sat down and he had a blank expression on 207 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 3: his face. He didn't remember talking to me. I asked 208 00:09:38,520 --> 00:09:41,679 Speaker 3: him specifically, do you remember talking to me? And he said, no, 209 00:09:41,840 --> 00:09:43,520 Speaker 3: that was a long time ago, even though it was 210 00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 3: only a few months ago. And in terms of what 211 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:49,199 Speaker 3: I found is that his memory is incredibly foggy when 212 00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:52,000 Speaker 3: it comes to things that are happening that are recent. 213 00:09:52,120 --> 00:09:55,320 Speaker 1: Which is a dementia thing. Because my mother has dementia 214 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:58,720 Speaker 1: and recent stuff. She can remember stuff from twenty years ago, 215 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: but stuff that happened, yes, she can't remember. 216 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:03,480 Speaker 3: I found that to be the exact same case to 217 00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:06,520 Speaker 3: Donald Trump. He could remember with very specific detail the 218 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:09,800 Speaker 3: night that The Apprentice aired, Supposedly Alli called him to 219 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:12,280 Speaker 3: congratulate him. He could remember going to Themes, he could 220 00:10:12,320 --> 00:10:14,760 Speaker 3: remember getting an Emmy nomination. But when it came to 221 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 3: actually asking him specifically about things that happened during his 222 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:21,280 Speaker 3: time in the White House and specifically things that happened 223 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:24,240 Speaker 3: were happening in real time, it was all kind of 224 00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 3: abstract and theoretical, and it was utterly it was alarming. 225 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:32,280 Speaker 1: And he wasn't drawing from recent memories. He was drawing 226 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:34,480 Speaker 1: from other people's reminder to memories. 227 00:10:34,800 --> 00:10:37,520 Speaker 3: And it doesn't seem like he's retaining recent events, which 228 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:40,240 Speaker 3: is very important as we had into this election, that 229 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:42,439 Speaker 3: needs to be a central focus of the debate. There 230 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:44,400 Speaker 3: does need to be a discussion about that. As a 231 00:10:44,440 --> 00:10:47,120 Speaker 3: seventy eight year old man, what is it exactly that's 232 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:48,320 Speaker 3: going on with Donald Trump? 233 00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:52,520 Speaker 1: Yeah? Do you think one of the things that I 234 00:10:52,600 --> 00:10:54,600 Speaker 1: just wrote about that I think a lot about is 235 00:10:54,640 --> 00:11:00,480 Speaker 1: his obsession with projunction. So I'm wondering if we talk 236 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 1: about his memory issues and then we talk about his 237 00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 1: you know, he has very successfully projected the idea that 238 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:11,960 Speaker 1: Joe Biden has dementia. And even though I took to 239 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:14,079 Speaker 1: someone who was in the White House for three hours 240 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:16,520 Speaker 1: the other day. People meet with him all the time 241 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:19,559 Speaker 1: find him to be quite sharp. It has become a 242 00:11:19,679 --> 00:11:22,640 Speaker 1: narrative that has really taken off. Do you think that 243 00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:26,520 Speaker 1: there is some intentionality there with Trump's own issues? 244 00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:30,200 Speaker 3: I think, either consciously or subconsciously, in the same way 245 00:11:30,280 --> 00:11:33,560 Speaker 3: he called Hillary Clinton cricket Hillary, but the one that 246 00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:36,920 Speaker 3: never really followed the rules or of the law. I 247 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:39,559 Speaker 3: think that there's something similar going on here. Yes. Absolutely. 248 00:11:39,559 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 3: And when he said over the weekend that Joe Biden 249 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:44,640 Speaker 3: needs to take a common test, I really you know, 250 00:11:44,720 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 3: I flashed back to that day where he had this 251 00:11:47,000 --> 00:11:50,080 Speaker 3: completely blank expression on his face and didn't seem to 252 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:52,720 Speaker 3: know what was happening. And there were moments where we 253 00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:54,640 Speaker 3: were talking and he wouldn't seem to know what was happening, 254 00:11:54,640 --> 00:11:56,960 Speaker 3: and then he would become more clear and less clear, 255 00:11:56,960 --> 00:11:57,920 Speaker 3: and he went in and out of it. 256 00:11:58,200 --> 00:12:01,680 Speaker 1: It's so interesting. One of the things that I'm struck 257 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:05,800 Speaker 1: by is he's obsessed with Hunter Biden, and Hunter Biden 258 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:10,079 Speaker 1: has a substance abuse problem or had a substance abuse problem. 259 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:13,200 Speaker 1: I've written a lot about it. As someone who's sober myself, 260 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:19,640 Speaker 1: I wonder how much you think that Trump, who's never 261 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:23,080 Speaker 1: had a drink, and Biden, who's never had a drink, 262 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:27,400 Speaker 1: how much sort of substances play here with Trump. 263 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:29,760 Speaker 3: I think that is part of it, because he brought 264 00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:33,320 Speaker 3: up Hunter Biden in our conversation unprompted when he was 265 00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:36,320 Speaker 3: talking about the election fraud and how the media wasn't 266 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:39,760 Speaker 3: covering what was happening. But he also brought up substance 267 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:43,520 Speaker 3: on drinking when he was talking about firing Chloe Kardashian 268 00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 3: af of The Celebrity Apprentice, And there was this whole 269 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:48,000 Speaker 3: narrative on the show where he learned that she had 270 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:50,640 Speaker 3: a dui, and because of that, even though she had 271 00:12:50,640 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 3: the dui before she was even castle on the show, 272 00:12:53,040 --> 00:12:55,679 Speaker 3: he decided to randomly fire her one week helping them 273 00:12:55,679 --> 00:12:59,360 Speaker 3: both later uncovered that he also majorrogatory sexist remarks about 274 00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:01,800 Speaker 3: her appearance, which I think is the real reason he 275 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:05,360 Speaker 3: fired her, but using the duy as excuse. So I 276 00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 3: do think that Donald Trump doesn't have a sophisticated understanding 277 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:12,680 Speaker 3: of substance abuse issues and doesn't have a real handle 278 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:14,960 Speaker 3: on it, even though his brother suffered from it. But 279 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:17,680 Speaker 3: I also think that he has a real jealousy when 280 00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 3: it comes to the children of other famous people, because 281 00:13:20,040 --> 00:13:23,280 Speaker 3: he always is kind of comparing and stacking up his 282 00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:26,000 Speaker 3: own kids with other kids, and one of the ways 283 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:28,319 Speaker 3: in which he asserts dominants is by thinking he has 284 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 3: the best kids. Whenever we talked about other children of 285 00:13:31,320 --> 00:13:34,480 Speaker 3: famous people, like Wilsa Rivers, Jon Rivers daughter, I could 286 00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:36,240 Speaker 3: see there was a calculation in his head where he 287 00:13:36,320 --> 00:13:38,400 Speaker 3: was trying to figure out how his kids measured up. 288 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:41,480 Speaker 3: Or Martha Stewart's daughter Alexis, who was a judger on 289 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:44,600 Speaker 3: The Celebrity Apprentice Martha Stewart. He was very resentful of 290 00:13:44,640 --> 00:13:46,960 Speaker 3: how bad she was and how good Avanca was. So 291 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,000 Speaker 3: I think part of the way in which he compares 292 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:51,560 Speaker 3: himself to other people and makes himself feel better is 293 00:13:51,640 --> 00:13:54,360 Speaker 3: through the fame of his kids, particularly at Boonka. 294 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:57,400 Speaker 1: Right, he loves Vonka. Did you feel like he didn't 295 00:13:57,480 --> 00:14:00,680 Speaker 1: like Eric? I love this topic. Please just I know 296 00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:02,320 Speaker 1: I'm patty, but let's hear it. 297 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:04,880 Speaker 3: It seemed to me like clearly he likes Levonca the 298 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:09,120 Speaker 3: best for the sons. He didn't really engage that much 299 00:14:09,679 --> 00:14:12,600 Speaker 3: in his sons. So Eric talked to me for this 300 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:14,960 Speaker 3: book and he actually invited me to Trump Tower and 301 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:17,720 Speaker 3: I sat in Eric's office and he went through sort 302 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:20,360 Speaker 3: of the play by play and how important the Apprentice 303 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:23,480 Speaker 3: is for the family, but he didn't give me any 304 00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:26,280 Speaker 3: real sense of how we felt about his sons. But 305 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 3: also he's very good at not even though he's great 306 00:14:29,080 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 3: at reliving feuds and talking about all the issues that 307 00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 3: he's happened with various people, he is really good about 308 00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:38,360 Speaker 3: keeping his kids out of his conversations. Although when I did, 309 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:40,640 Speaker 3: I asked him about there was a storyline on The 310 00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:43,680 Speaker 3: Apprentice where apparently Don Junior was having an affair with 311 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:46,320 Speaker 3: Aubrey O. Day. He said he'd heard that and that 312 00:14:46,440 --> 00:14:48,440 Speaker 3: was reported at the time, and Aubrio Day ended up 313 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 3: saying that it happened. And again, this is I mean, 314 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:52,720 Speaker 3: you can say this is Patty and the Sicilian, this 315 00:14:52,760 --> 00:14:54,800 Speaker 3: is ridiculous, but this is a family that's running a 316 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:58,280 Speaker 3: reality show. Don Junior judge on the show. He's married 317 00:14:58,320 --> 00:14:59,800 Speaker 3: at the time, and he's having an affair with a 318 00:14:59,840 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 3: can tested who he's giving a secret help to you 319 00:15:02,680 --> 00:15:05,800 Speaker 3: because Audreode was like calling Don Junior and getting help 320 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:08,160 Speaker 3: on this season of The Apprentice, And it just is 321 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:10,440 Speaker 3: a playbook for how the Trumps do business. 322 00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:14,680 Speaker 1: That's so crazy? Can you talk to us about what 323 00:15:14,720 --> 00:15:17,040 Speaker 1: you say? The lesson Joe Biden could take from this. 324 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:20,000 Speaker 3: I think that Joe Biden needs to be aware of 325 00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:22,920 Speaker 3: the fact that even though in the media it does 326 00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:25,440 Speaker 3: seem like, Okay, well, how can we go through this again? Right, 327 00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:27,960 Speaker 3: We're really going to do this again? There's no When 328 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:30,760 Speaker 3: Donald Trump left the White House in disgrace, I think 329 00:15:30,760 --> 00:15:32,520 Speaker 3: a lot of us thought that Trump arrow was over. 330 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:36,360 Speaker 3: But Donald Trump does still have broad pockets of support 331 00:15:36,400 --> 00:15:38,560 Speaker 3: throughout the United States, and I think Joe Biden needs 332 00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:41,200 Speaker 3: to realize that he's not going up against a traditional 333 00:15:41,240 --> 00:15:44,440 Speaker 3: political candidate. He is going up against this Frankenstein created 334 00:15:44,480 --> 00:15:47,280 Speaker 3: by reality TV. And even though the polling is close 335 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:50,120 Speaker 3: and Biden now has a slight edge, I don't think 336 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:52,280 Speaker 3: we can discount the fact that Donald Trump can win. 337 00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:55,560 Speaker 3: I think it's extremely possible that somehow Donald Trump can 338 00:15:55,600 --> 00:15:58,000 Speaker 3: eke out of victory because he will use every trick 339 00:15:58,280 --> 00:16:01,400 Speaker 3: in his playbook as a reality TV star to deflect 340 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:05,800 Speaker 3: confused suggests things on of Biden that actually are true 341 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:08,360 Speaker 3: to himself. He did the same thing to Hillary Clinton 342 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:11,880 Speaker 3: and in twenty twenty we were all suffering from COVID, 343 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 3: we were trying to heal as a nation. There were 344 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 3: a lot of forces that were at play. And I 345 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:19,160 Speaker 3: think that the country has gotten complacent and we have 346 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:22,080 Speaker 3: to remind ourselves that Donald Trump is a creation of 347 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:25,280 Speaker 3: reality television and this is a very dangerous thing because 348 00:16:25,320 --> 00:16:28,560 Speaker 3: the general American public will fall for these tricks. He's 349 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 3: a mirage by Mark Burnett, and I think one of 350 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:33,440 Speaker 3: the things I cover in this book is exactly how 351 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:36,160 Speaker 3: he became popular and became who we became. You know. 352 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:38,160 Speaker 3: One of the contestants told me, he's playing a character, 353 00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:40,440 Speaker 3: and I believe that this is a character that Joe 354 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:43,560 Speaker 3: Biden's going up against, not an actual political figure. 355 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, he's playing a character. Donald Trump is not an 356 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:52,040 Speaker 1: actual political figure, right. He's a sort of Manchurian candidate. 357 00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: I mean, he doesn't believe in anything, does he. 358 00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:57,400 Speaker 3: He believes in whatever we'll get him the most amount 359 00:16:57,560 --> 00:17:00,480 Speaker 3: of phrase and approval at that time, and that's why 360 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:03,560 Speaker 3: he became so much more conservative because the bar Ray 361 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:06,480 Speaker 3: wing of the party started supporting him. But he he 362 00:17:06,680 --> 00:17:09,159 Speaker 3: whatever he needs to say to feel approval and to 363 00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:12,679 Speaker 3: feel like people support him. That's what drives Donald Trump. 364 00:17:12,880 --> 00:17:15,400 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for joining us. I hope you'll 365 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:15,840 Speaker 1: come back. 366 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:17,720 Speaker 3: Thank you so much, Molly, I really like talking to you. 367 00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:25,119 Speaker 1: Spring is here and I bet you are trying to 368 00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:28,720 Speaker 1: look fashionable. So why not pick up some fashionable all 369 00:17:28,800 --> 00:17:33,439 Speaker 1: new Fast Politics merchandise. We just opened a news store 370 00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 1: with all new designs just for you. Get t shirts, hoodies, hats, 371 00:17:38,359 --> 00:17:43,359 Speaker 1: and top bags. To grab some, head to fastpolitics dot com. 372 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:46,679 Speaker 2: Chuck Roscha is a Democratic strategist and the founder of 373 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:48,200 Speaker 2: Solidarity Strategies. 374 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:55,560 Speaker 1: Welcome to Fast Politics, Chuck, Yes, tell us what's going on. 375 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:58,280 Speaker 1: Is Joe Biden going to lose Hispanic voters? 376 00:17:58,920 --> 00:18:01,240 Speaker 4: No, the question is is he going to win them 377 00:18:01,320 --> 00:18:04,600 Speaker 4: by enough to win the presidency? Because the Latino vote, 378 00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:08,080 Speaker 4: Hispanic voters will probably be the lynchpin in this election 379 00:18:08,359 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 4: in lots and lots of states. 380 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:14,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, Latino voters are not a monolist. It's a bunch 381 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:18,119 Speaker 1: of different groups all much together in one word that 382 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:21,600 Speaker 1: does not describe. And so maybe you could walk me 383 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:25,760 Speaker 1: through the different states, the different groups or however you 384 00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:28,440 Speaker 1: want to talk and sort of give us the landscape 385 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 1: of what the Latino voter, who is who and which 386 00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:35,280 Speaker 1: group is which and how Biden can appeal to them. 387 00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:38,320 Speaker 4: Or of the problem with Latino voters is that there 388 00:18:38,359 --> 00:18:40,600 Speaker 4: are small groups made up within a group, and I 389 00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:43,600 Speaker 4: will walk you through who we are. But just like me, 390 00:18:43,720 --> 00:18:46,080 Speaker 4: if you're listening to this podcast, you're like, why would 391 00:18:46,119 --> 00:18:48,240 Speaker 4: Molly have an old white man on here to talk 392 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:51,119 Speaker 4: about the Latino vote. It's because I saund like an 393 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:54,040 Speaker 4: old white man when I speak. But I'm very much 394 00:18:54,640 --> 00:18:58,080 Speaker 4: a Mexican redneck from East Texas. I love it man well, 395 00:18:58,119 --> 00:19:00,359 Speaker 4: because I was raised by my white grand da Eddie 396 00:19:00,359 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 4: in Rouley's, Texas on a working farm. If you're not 397 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:06,640 Speaker 4: seeing my beautiful brown complexion with that funny cowboy hat, 398 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:09,040 Speaker 4: I sound like every other white redneck I grew up with. 399 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:12,200 Speaker 4: But I am, in fact a Latino voter. My last 400 00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:16,359 Speaker 4: name is Rocha. Rocha from the Great Wanna Wato state 401 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:21,080 Speaker 4: of Mexico, and Mexicans make up about sixty eight percent 402 00:19:21,119 --> 00:19:24,560 Speaker 4: of all Latino voters in America and the biggest difference 403 00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:27,040 Speaker 4: between and we'll get to this, Molly, the biggest difference 404 00:19:27,440 --> 00:19:30,880 Speaker 4: of what the Latino vote is now and Latino voters 405 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:34,160 Speaker 4: are the fastest group of growing, the fastest growing group 406 00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:37,880 Speaker 4: of voters within that diaspora are second and third generation 407 00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:41,399 Speaker 4: Latinos like myself. Twenty years ago, they were more of 408 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:44,959 Speaker 4: a foreign born group of folks who are newer immigrants. 409 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 4: Well now the children of those folks and the children 410 00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:50,240 Speaker 4: of their children, like my thirty five year old son, 411 00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:54,800 Speaker 4: who's also named Charles Rocha, who lives in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, 412 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 4: with my two beautiful grand boys, also is a Latino voter. 413 00:19:58,840 --> 00:20:02,359 Speaker 4: That's what's really happened in this group that we're coming 414 00:20:02,359 --> 00:20:05,080 Speaker 4: of age. The average age of a Latino in America 415 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:08,600 Speaker 4: is twenty seven and the second largest group behind the 416 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:12,320 Speaker 4: Mexicans or Puerto Ricans, and Puerto Ricans are the majority 417 00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:16,240 Speaker 4: of Latinos in a state like Pennsylvania. That really matters 418 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:18,439 Speaker 4: to the president. So if you have a lot of 419 00:20:18,840 --> 00:20:23,399 Speaker 4: well meaning, woke white consultant strategist around you trying to 420 00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:26,719 Speaker 4: figure out the diaspora of how we reach Latinos, if 421 00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:29,639 Speaker 4: you don't have one of us in the room explaining 422 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:33,560 Speaker 4: the nuances of the cultures and the differences, you'll mess up. 423 00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 4: But half of this battle is literally just showing up, Molly. 424 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,919 Speaker 1: Half of this battle is showing up sounds to me, 425 00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:42,800 Speaker 1: like field offices, what does showing up mean? 426 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:46,360 Speaker 4: Showing up means buying a lot of digital ads, because, 427 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 4: as I just said, the average age of a Latino 428 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 4: is twenty seven. Most twenty seven year olds in America 429 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:54,440 Speaker 4: don't own a TV or pay for cable. That means 430 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:58,000 Speaker 4: if you run that same Spanish language TV commercial, which 431 00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:01,760 Speaker 4: Univision and Telemundo will for both of them. Don't sue 432 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:05,040 Speaker 4: me here. It's very important for Latino voters. But that 433 00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:08,639 Speaker 4: twenty seven year old Latino kid, my kid in Pittsburgh 434 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:12,240 Speaker 4: is not watching Univision or Telemundo in Spanish, so you 435 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:15,720 Speaker 4: have to go show up where they're consuming information normally 436 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:19,480 Speaker 4: on some streaming service, some gaming app, or something that's 437 00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:22,280 Speaker 4: tied to their cell phones. And lots of times in 438 00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:26,200 Speaker 4: the democratic groups, we don't spend enough time dissecting those 439 00:21:26,240 --> 00:21:30,280 Speaker 4: subgroups because it's not efficient, and it's not efficient because 440 00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:33,880 Speaker 4: younger voters don't vote at the propensity of older Spanish 441 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:36,679 Speaker 4: speaking voters, so we spend a lot of time talking 442 00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:38,879 Speaker 4: to them instead of the young folks. Then you have 443 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:42,479 Speaker 4: generations of people who just don't get any information, so 444 00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:46,919 Speaker 4: they start getting Republican curious or third party curious and 445 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:49,520 Speaker 4: that's where you start seeing just kind of getting some 446 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:51,159 Speaker 4: losses on the margins. 447 00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:55,040 Speaker 1: I'm hoping you could talk about with the case that 448 00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:58,840 Speaker 1: needs to be made to Latino voters. I feel like 449 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:03,280 Speaker 1: different groups have different concerns. What are the big concerns? 450 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 1: And again not a monoliths, so different groups are going 451 00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:08,720 Speaker 1: to have different concerns. But what do you see? I mean, 452 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,840 Speaker 1: is inflation number one? Is religion number one? I mean, 453 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:17,840 Speaker 1: are they different concerns than regular voters? Younger voters discuss. 454 00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:19,959 Speaker 4: One of the things that me and Mike Madrid are 455 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,640 Speaker 4: Republican Operative do a podcast every week called The Latino 456 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,359 Speaker 4: Vote Podcast. That's my pitch for our podcast, and we 457 00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:29,560 Speaker 4: talk a lot about this on the podcast because the 458 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:34,480 Speaker 4: fastest growing group within the quote unquote non college educated 459 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:38,360 Speaker 4: voter middle class working their way from the lower classes 460 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:42,240 Speaker 4: that do the working middle class are these Latino workers. 461 00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:45,919 Speaker 3: So they're the second generation, the third generation. They're starting 462 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:47,520 Speaker 3: to go to college at a high rate, but they're 463 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:54,199 Speaker 3: still disproportionately non college educated, just workers. So they really 464 00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:56,960 Speaker 3: fall in line. And when I was running Bernie Sanders 465 00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,840 Speaker 3: presidential campaign and we got over seventy percent of the 466 00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:03,560 Speaker 3: life Latino vote in every place that we competed for 467 00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 3: that was there was a Latino running the whole organization, 468 00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:10,560 Speaker 3: which was me, So we were filtered into everything. But 469 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:15,480 Speaker 3: we ran on this economic populist message. Latinos really get 470 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:19,160 Speaker 3: for giving your college loans. They really get a rig 471 00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:22,080 Speaker 3: system that's really tilted towards the rich and not towards 472 00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 3: folks who are just trying to work every day and 473 00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:25,879 Speaker 3: make it. And Molly, if you said, how do I 474 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 3: dumb that down to what's your thing on your hat? 475 00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:30,879 Speaker 3: I would say, what are you going to do? And 476 00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:33,440 Speaker 3: I see this in focus groups every week. The Latino 477 00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:34,520 Speaker 3: voter wants. 478 00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:36,960 Speaker 4: To know what are you going to do immediately to 479 00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:40,520 Speaker 4: help me and my family have more money, make more money, 480 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:42,560 Speaker 4: and help me get my kids into school so they 481 00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:44,520 Speaker 4: don't have to have this shitty job that I've got. 482 00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:49,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, it strikes me that there is a certain sense 483 00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:54,320 Speaker 1: in which the Latino voter is very similar. 484 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:54,640 Speaker 2: Right. 485 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:59,120 Speaker 1: It's this idea that the system is really rigged against them, 486 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:02,480 Speaker 1: So it's populism. But one of the things that I'm 487 00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:04,760 Speaker 1: struck by is Joe Biden. One of the reasons why 488 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:07,800 Speaker 1: rich people are so mad at him right now, and 489 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:10,200 Speaker 1: we're seeing that a lot. It's funny because a lot 490 00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:13,359 Speaker 1: of the anchors who do finance are like telling me 491 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:16,760 Speaker 1: in horror that all these people they know are so 492 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:20,000 Speaker 1: furious at Biden because they don't like raising taxes on 493 00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:24,879 Speaker 1: the wealthy, they don't like the antitrust stuff. They don't like, 494 00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:27,919 Speaker 1: you know, a student loan forgiveness. I mean, it seems 495 00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:31,199 Speaker 1: to me, though Biden maybe not as good at transmitting it, 496 00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:34,359 Speaker 1: He's really done a lot of stuff that's economic populism. 497 00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:36,119 Speaker 4: Yeah, and that goes back to the point about the 498 00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:39,359 Speaker 4: average age of this newer electored Molly get this forty 499 00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:42,240 Speaker 4: percent of the Latino voters and this election will be 500 00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 4: new since twenty sixteen, forty percent. So they're just younger. 501 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,280 Speaker 4: They don't know what Joe Biden has done because they 502 00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:52,080 Speaker 4: just aren't tuned in to the part of how we 503 00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:55,679 Speaker 4: communicate to normal voters. And what I mean by quote 504 00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 4: unquote normal voters is we in both parties spend a 505 00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 4: lot of money buying TV advertising. That's how you communicate 506 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:06,400 Speaker 4: to the masses. But I would give that an asterisk 507 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,480 Speaker 4: and say to the masses of old people, because old 508 00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 4: people like me like to watch the evening news because 509 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,600 Speaker 4: I want to know what the weather's going to be tomorrow. 510 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:16,280 Speaker 3: Or what the traffic's going to be. And young people 511 00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:18,639 Speaker 3: could give a shit less. And so if that's the 512 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:21,560 Speaker 3: way you're communicating, you're missing a lot of folks. And 513 00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:22,679 Speaker 3: what Donald Trump. 514 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:24,679 Speaker 4: Has done is just kind of showed up in the 515 00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:29,040 Speaker 4: space halfheartedly with a do and just kind of like 516 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:31,439 Speaker 4: walked in and said, I'm Donald Trump. You know me 517 00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:33,520 Speaker 4: from TV. You should vote for me because that guy 518 00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 4: over there don't give a shit about you. And it's 519 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:38,679 Speaker 4: just not true. But just him showing up in the 520 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,520 Speaker 4: space and buying some advertising helps him get two percent, 521 00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:45,119 Speaker 4: three percent, eight percent more. And so that's where you 522 00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:47,920 Speaker 4: start seeing the difference is there's not this big migration 523 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:50,280 Speaker 4: to the Republican Party. You just have a bunch of 524 00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 4: Latinos that are Republican curious that. 525 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,520 Speaker 1: You could lose, and you have to remind them of 526 00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:57,760 Speaker 1: what you're doing for them. 527 00:25:57,880 --> 00:25:59,800 Speaker 4: Right every time we're in a focus group, when you 528 00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:02,600 Speaker 4: tell them what Joe Biden has done for them and 529 00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 4: what he's done with bills to create jobs in America, 530 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:07,359 Speaker 4: what he's done to help their kids be able to 531 00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:10,240 Speaker 4: get into college and I have affordable colleges. They're like, yes, 532 00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:12,520 Speaker 4: why didn't we know this? And I'm like, cause we're 533 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:14,879 Speaker 4: not sending you that at on TikTok, which we should be. 534 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:17,119 Speaker 1: Yeah. So what should Biden be doing. 535 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:20,080 Speaker 4: He's doing exactly what I would be doing right now. 536 00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:23,199 Speaker 4: Oh good, And that is this is that he realizes 537 00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:26,359 Speaker 4: he has a problem. For twenty years, Democrats were like, oh, 538 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:30,000 Speaker 4: Latinos are good, They're just as reliable as black voters, almost, 539 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:31,920 Speaker 4: and we'll just go flush them out when it comes 540 00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:32,640 Speaker 4: election time. 541 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:36,200 Speaker 3: Well, those days are long gone. When Donald Trump won 542 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 3: these exponentially high numbers in Miami and in the Texas 543 00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:42,360 Speaker 3: Valley in twenty sixteen, it was a wake up call 544 00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:46,000 Speaker 3: to Democrats. And so what Joe Biden started doing is 545 00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:50,639 Speaker 3: advertising to Latinos in digital and TV earlier than any 546 00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:52,959 Speaker 3: time in the history of American elections that I've noticed. 547 00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:56,119 Speaker 4: And in the last off year elections, Molly we outspent 548 00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:00,520 Speaker 4: Democrats Republicans almost six to one in Spanish language, everizing 549 00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:03,600 Speaker 4: in Senate States. Because again, there's one way to fix 550 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:05,920 Speaker 4: a problem Democrats like to do, and that's throw money 551 00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:08,359 Speaker 4: at that problem. And I will take their money at 552 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:10,800 Speaker 4: least they acknowledge that there's a problem, and you know, 553 00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:13,639 Speaker 4: they hired Julie Chavez Rodriguez to be their manager for 554 00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:16,679 Speaker 4: Joe Biden. That's a hat tip to Latinos. And then 555 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:20,320 Speaker 4: you start advertising because no pay so, no sayso in 556 00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:22,719 Speaker 4: my world, and so you've got to show up and 557 00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:25,360 Speaker 4: spend money. And they're doing that now earlier than they 558 00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:25,760 Speaker 4: ever have. 559 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:30,040 Speaker 1: That's so good. I'm very happy to use this because 560 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:31,919 Speaker 1: there's a lot I don't know if you know this, 561 00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 1: but there's a lot of hand ringing going on a lot. 562 00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:38,600 Speaker 4: What bothers me the most, Molly, is there's no doubt 563 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:41,399 Speaker 4: that there will be no stone unturned with the Biden 564 00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:44,280 Speaker 4: campaign because they'll have more money than they know what 565 00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:47,000 Speaker 4: to do with to fix lots of problems. And so 566 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:49,760 Speaker 4: they have Julie Chavez there. She's going to make sure 567 00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:51,880 Speaker 4: things are done. They're going to be coachly competent. They've 568 00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:55,239 Speaker 4: already hired a trailer full of Latino consultants who are 569 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:57,560 Speaker 4: making adds in digital. What I worry about, Molly, is 570 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:01,200 Speaker 4: underneath that at the Senate level and at the House level, 571 00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:04,240 Speaker 4: not in the party committees or they're supporting super packs. 572 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,879 Speaker 4: I know I'm getting down in the weeds. But in 573 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:11,720 Speaker 4: the campaigns themselves, you have it. Seeing the infrastructure of 574 00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:15,920 Speaker 4: democratic campaigns keep up with this exponential growth of Latino 575 00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:20,040 Speaker 4: voters with Latino managers or operatives, So you lose some 576 00:28:20,119 --> 00:28:23,119 Speaker 4: of that cultural competency at that local level. 577 00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:25,280 Speaker 1: And I want to talk about that because one of 578 00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:27,720 Speaker 1: the great injustices in American life right now is that 579 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:33,040 Speaker 1: we've only had three black female senators this class of senators. 580 00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:35,800 Speaker 1: There are a bunch of black female senators. You have 581 00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:40,840 Speaker 1: a really a good group, but you're not seeing Latino senators, 582 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 1: especially in the Sunbelt. 583 00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:45,239 Speaker 4: The Ruben Diego Yes, and I'm working for Ruben and 584 00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,440 Speaker 4: he is killing it right, He's doing great. 585 00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:50,080 Speaker 3: But what a lot of these people are missing, especially 586 00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:52,280 Speaker 3: not especially. I shouldn't say that because everybody does it, 587 00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:54,240 Speaker 3: So I don't fault these black women who are running 588 00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:55,920 Speaker 3: for the Senate, who are going to be amazing if 589 00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:59,760 Speaker 3: they get elected. Also Brooks in Maryland, the amazing woman 590 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:03,040 Speaker 3: in Delaware. But they all have one thing in common, Molly, 591 00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:07,200 Speaker 3: is they have white media consultants. Oh interesting, and they 592 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:11,280 Speaker 3: control the diaspora within the party apparatus. Now there is 593 00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:15,320 Speaker 3: emerging amazing black and Latino on firms. But it's so 594 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:18,080 Speaker 3: hard to break into these top races because you have 595 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:20,880 Speaker 3: to show, as you should, that you could handle a 596 00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 3: race like that, So you need to have work history 597 00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 3: doing that. And it also becomes this place where, well, 598 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:27,800 Speaker 3: if you don't hire me for the first one, I 599 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:30,520 Speaker 3: never can have the experience. So it becomes a self 600 00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:34,600 Speaker 3: fulfilling prophecy where there's not a lot of folks doing 601 00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:37,160 Speaker 3: this at the highest level who could be making sure 602 00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:39,680 Speaker 3: that we're doing it right with black or Latino. And 603 00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:42,440 Speaker 3: I take it a step further with AAPI. This is 604 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:45,200 Speaker 3: a problem within the party that we need to fix 605 00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:48,680 Speaker 3: now at the party committee levels. Let's say the DNC, 606 00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:52,600 Speaker 3: the d TRIPLC, and the Senate Campaign Committee. They know 607 00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:55,040 Speaker 3: they have a Latino problem, and they're doing the right 608 00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:57,840 Speaker 3: things by hiring a lot of Latino consultants, hiring lots 609 00:29:57,840 --> 00:30:00,240 Speaker 3: of Latino staffers because they're going to make sure even 610 00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 3: if the campaigns are doing a shitty job at talking 611 00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:05,600 Speaker 3: to brown and black people, the party committee can make 612 00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:07,680 Speaker 3: up with that with a lot of money and a 613 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:11,520 Speaker 3: lot of TV, radio and digital targeted to those subgroups 614 00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:13,760 Speaker 3: of voters. And that's how I think we actually went 615 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:15,840 Speaker 3: back the House and have a shot at the Senate. 616 00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:20,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I agree. So debunk something for me because 617 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:23,280 Speaker 1: there's a lot of anxiety on the Democratic side, not 618 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,040 Speaker 1: just me but all my friends, and there's a lot 619 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:30,960 Speaker 1: of like this thinking that Trump has this masculinity that's 620 00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:35,600 Speaker 1: very appealing to young men. Debunk that for me or don't. 621 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:37,760 Speaker 4: Well, I can tell you this that Donald Trump and 622 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:41,320 Speaker 4: Joe Biden have a problem with voters. I've been doing 623 00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:44,040 Speaker 4: this for thirty four years, and I've never seen two 624 00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:50,720 Speaker 4: nominees underperform their House or Senate parties, nominees or incumbents 625 00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:53,800 Speaker 4: in states like these two people do. So I am 626 00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:56,760 Speaker 4: a Democrat and a yellow dog Democrat, going back Molly 627 00:30:56,800 --> 00:30:59,520 Speaker 4: to when I work for Anne Richards in Texas. I 628 00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:02,240 Speaker 4: seen a few elections, right, And I say that to 629 00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:04,239 Speaker 4: show how long in the tooth I am, and I 630 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:07,680 Speaker 4: have never seen like folks double haters. As you can say, 631 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:09,560 Speaker 4: they're double haters and they don't like either one of them. 632 00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:12,800 Speaker 1: But that's not really true, right. They're bored with Biden, 633 00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:14,600 Speaker 1: but they hate Trump. That crow. 634 00:31:14,800 --> 00:31:16,520 Speaker 4: What the point I want to make there is that 635 00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:19,720 Speaker 4: this third party thing is a real problem in certain 636 00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:22,480 Speaker 4: states and the more states that RFK Junior gets on 637 00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 4: could be something. Now the people flock their no, but 638 00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:26,840 Speaker 4: the margins are going to be so small. And to 639 00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:30,240 Speaker 4: actually answer your question about the masculinity piece, is that 640 00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:33,320 Speaker 4: you have groups of people that have come of age 641 00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:36,920 Speaker 4: since twenty sixteen who just want something different. And it's 642 00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:40,880 Speaker 4: not as much in focused groups, this masculinity piece. It's 643 00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:43,680 Speaker 4: the piece of and people they deem it that. But 644 00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:46,760 Speaker 4: take it from a non college educated Mexican redneck here 645 00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:49,960 Speaker 4: on this microphone who says that it's more about warning 646 00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:53,160 Speaker 4: and being able to break things or say things that 647 00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:57,760 Speaker 4: people are scared to say. Folks miscategorize that as toxic 648 00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:00,920 Speaker 4: masculinity or masculinity, when in fact it's just people that 649 00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,880 Speaker 4: are tired of the same old, buttoned up politician saying 650 00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:07,959 Speaker 4: the same old catchphrases and they like somebody who's just different, 651 00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:09,800 Speaker 4: who don't give a shit about what they're saying. It 652 00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:12,760 Speaker 4: could be fascist in off the cuff and talking about 653 00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:15,760 Speaker 4: sharks and all the crazy shit that Donald Trump talks about. 654 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,480 Speaker 4: But there's a small piece of the electric especially young 655 00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:21,480 Speaker 4: men of color and other folks like that, who are 656 00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 4: just looking for they're so desperate for something different that 657 00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:27,320 Speaker 4: even him breaking shit is something that they're at least 658 00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:28,120 Speaker 4: curious about. 659 00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:32,320 Speaker 1: Right. No, I mean I think that's right. And you're 660 00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:35,200 Speaker 1: basically talking about the charisma factor, right. 661 00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:38,320 Speaker 4: And then when you have a group of professionals who 662 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:40,520 Speaker 4: are some of my best friends and they do amazing work. 663 00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:44,480 Speaker 4: When I talk about well meaning white consultants, they're literally 664 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:47,400 Speaker 4: the top of the heap of doing great work. But 665 00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:50,640 Speaker 4: there's little pieces that we miss when we run campaigns. 666 00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:53,120 Speaker 4: I never graduated from college. I went to work in 667 00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:55,040 Speaker 4: a factory when I was nineteen. I had a baby 668 00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:57,440 Speaker 4: when I was nineteen who I had full cust he 669 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,000 Speaker 4: for now for thirty five years, I have a different 670 00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 4: vision of life. Does it make it better or worse? No, 671 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:06,680 Speaker 4: But it makes me when I talk to people, I'm 672 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:09,800 Speaker 4: closer to the paint. I remember going to a payday 673 00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:12,200 Speaker 4: lender to get money to make it to payday so 674 00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:14,640 Speaker 4: I could buy dippers for that boy. So when I'm 675 00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:17,760 Speaker 4: writing an ad, Molly, it just looks a little different 676 00:33:17,920 --> 00:33:22,040 Speaker 4: than the same group of very highly educated professional some 677 00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:25,120 Speaker 4: of the best in the business TV makers, because I'm 678 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:28,360 Speaker 4: just looking through a different lens and I think sometimes 679 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:30,360 Speaker 4: that's where we miss around the edges of having the 680 00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:32,880 Speaker 4: same message to the same group of people because the 681 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,760 Speaker 4: same posters writing the same poll for every candidate, right. 682 00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:39,360 Speaker 1: Right, right, right, that's a really good point. What do 683 00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:43,280 Speaker 1: you think this sort of solve is with Biden when 684 00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:44,840 Speaker 1: you're going against Trump? 685 00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:50,120 Speaker 4: I say, contrast, contrast, contrast, and make sure that there's 686 00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 4: no such thing as a gootv universe. 687 00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:54,920 Speaker 3: And for all of you at home, you follow Molly, 688 00:33:54,960 --> 00:33:56,280 Speaker 3: you know that means get out the vote. 689 00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:58,720 Speaker 4: There's groups of voters suit you don't worry about talking 690 00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:00,440 Speaker 4: to till the very end because you just know they're 691 00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:03,120 Speaker 4: going to be good Democrats. Now, those of us who 692 00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:05,280 Speaker 4: work in data know that if somebody votes in a 693 00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:08,759 Speaker 4: Democratic primary and their regular primary voters, we probably don't 694 00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:10,200 Speaker 4: have to talk to them in the general because they're 695 00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:11,879 Speaker 4: just going to show up. But we need to take 696 00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:14,760 Speaker 4: more of those filters off and talk to a bigger 697 00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:17,920 Speaker 4: group of people because we're just not operating in your 698 00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:21,960 Speaker 4: mama or Daddy's Democratic Party anymore, and we're losing so 699 00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:24,839 Speaker 4: many folks because we've over let me make up a word, 700 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:29,239 Speaker 4: we've overdatified our elections. Where we've come up with models 701 00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,319 Speaker 4: of people who should be acting like their friends and 702 00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:35,759 Speaker 4: neighbors to make sure that we run campaigns more efficiently, 703 00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:38,960 Speaker 4: which is important, but we leave out swaths of people 704 00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:41,239 Speaker 4: that we've not talked to in a while. And if 705 00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:43,560 Speaker 4: you just go talk to them, and what I mean 706 00:34:43,560 --> 00:34:45,600 Speaker 4: by talk to them is send them a mail piece, 707 00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:47,799 Speaker 4: send them a text message, and call them on the 708 00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:50,680 Speaker 4: phone and say there's a difference between Joe Biden and 709 00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:53,040 Speaker 4: Donald Trump, and here's just a few things that are 710 00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:56,319 Speaker 4: very different in drawing a contrast, and that's how you 711 00:34:56,360 --> 00:34:58,839 Speaker 4: get them and you win this election. Is drawing that 712 00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:01,319 Speaker 4: contrast to a li larger group of people, not just 713 00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:06,120 Speaker 4: your modeled scientific universe. Of this small little group of 714 00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:08,960 Speaker 4: folks that your data scientists team have told you are 715 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:11,840 Speaker 4: the most likely persuadable voters, but I'm talking about that 716 00:35:11,880 --> 00:35:14,200 Speaker 4: twenty four year old kid who may have only voted 717 00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:17,080 Speaker 4: in one election in their lifetime, who probably is thinking 718 00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:20,640 Speaker 4: about setting this out or skipping that, like, have that conversation. 719 00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:23,440 Speaker 4: We can do that now through the text messaging and 720 00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:26,480 Speaker 4: other things that are out there where we've just stopped 721 00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:28,480 Speaker 4: not doing that enough, And I think that's how we 722 00:35:28,560 --> 00:35:29,080 Speaker 4: come back. 723 00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:33,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you, thank you, thank you. Very interesting and important. 724 00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:34,520 Speaker 1: Thank you. 725 00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:36,200 Speaker 3: No my pleasure. I just need to know where to 726 00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:37,399 Speaker 3: send the invoysh for this thing. 727 00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 1: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in 728 00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,560 Speaker 1: every Monday, Wednesday and Friday to hear the best minds 729 00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:48,800 Speaker 1: in politics makes sense of all this chaos. If you 730 00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:51,600 Speaker 1: enjoyed what you've heard, please send it to a friend 731 00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:55,200 Speaker 1: and keep the conversation going. And again, thanks for listening.