Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2: Let's stick with Venezuela for a moment, though, knowing that
Speaker 2: this boat has been seized and the look, we've got
Speaker 2: another six tankers that have been sanctioned, so we could
Speaker 2: soon have our own shadow fleet. It sounds like the
Speaker 2: President talked about this yesterday at the White House.
Speaker 3: Listen.
Speaker 1: It's about a lot of things, but one of the
Speaker 1: things it's about is the fact that they've allowed millions
Speaker 1: of people to come into our country from their.
Speaker 2: Prisons, from gangs, from drug dealers, and from mental institutions,
Speaker 2: probably proportionately more than anybody else.
Speaker 3: So it has to do with a lot of things.
Speaker 2: They've treated us badly, and I guess now we're not
Speaker 2: treating them so good. That's where we start our conversation
Speaker 2: with the gentleman from Massachusetts who has authored a war
Speaker 2: Powers Act that could soon hit the floor less. Of course,
Speaker 2: the Speaker doesn't want to see that happen. This is
Speaker 2: a conversation that Democrats and Republicans are having here in Washington.
Speaker 2: Jim McGovern, Democrat from massachuse It's ranking member on the
Speaker 2: House Rules Committee with us in studio right now.
Speaker 3: It's really great to see you. Happy to be with
Speaker 3: you for coming in combine pleasure.
Speaker 2: You've introduced this War Powers resolution some time ago.
Speaker 3: Will it hit the floor soit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I expect to force a vote on it next week.
Speaker 1: It'll be ripe to be considered on Wednesday or Thursday
Speaker 1: of next week. We have Republican co sponsors Representative Massy
Speaker 1: and Representative Bacon and Marjorie Taylor Green on our on
Speaker 1: boards on this resolution as well. You know, again, this
Speaker 1: is not a democratic initiative. I mean these are This
Speaker 1: is a bipartisan effort by those of us who actually
Speaker 1: believe the Constitution means something and Congress has a role
Speaker 1: to play, and we don't want this president going into
Speaker 1: a war without a debate and without a vote and
Speaker 1: authorization by Congress.
Speaker 3: Would this be specific to Venezuela or more broad.
Speaker 1: It would be specific to Venezuela because that's you know,
Speaker 1: that's that's the conflict we seem to be getting sucked into.
Speaker 1: Although you know the clipp you just showed of the resident,
Speaker 1: he went on to further threat in Columbia, you know
Speaker 1: where he might do further action. But look at wars
Speaker 1: are easy to get into. Their hard as hell to
Speaker 1: get out of. And we have a history, you know,
Speaker 1: of talking tough, of getting sucked into these wars that
Speaker 1: cost you know, billions of billions of dollars, and then
Speaker 1: we find ourselves in a quagmire that we can't get
Speaker 1: out of.
Speaker 2: Now, I know for a fact that you understand the
Speaker 2: politics of the Caribbean better than most on Capitol Hill.
Speaker 2: You helped to begin normalizing relations with Cuba in the
Speaker 2: Obama administration. You've spent a lot of time in the region.
Speaker 2: So what do you think the president's aim is here?
Speaker 2: Is it regime change or something else?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's oil quite frankly, Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: this president is not about promoting human rights. He doesn't
Speaker 1: give a damn about democracy, and this is not about drugs.
Speaker 1: I mean, he pardoned the former president of Honduras who
Speaker 1: was one of the biggest ra narco traffickers in.
Speaker 3: The world, hundreds of tons of coaches.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I think, I mean, there must be some
Speaker 1: financial interest in pursuing this policy for the president, because
Speaker 1: that's all he really cares about, making money for his
Speaker 1: family and money for those who are close close to him. Look,
Speaker 1: our history in Latin America has been one of arrogance,
Speaker 1: has been one of putting profits ahead of human rights.
Speaker 1: And by the way, this administration doesn't give a damn
Speaker 1: about human rights. They just issued their National Security strategy
Speaker 1: and this is the first administration that has removed the
Speaker 1: word human rights from the from the strategy. So this
Speaker 1: is about Donald Trump's ego and it's about I think oil.
Speaker 1: I think that's at the end of the day.
Speaker 3: I think that's that's why we're seasoned tankers.
Speaker 1: You know. Again, it would be nice if we had
Speaker 1: a functioning Congress that would call his administration up and
Speaker 1: ask these questions like why are we doing this?
Speaker 4: Why?
Speaker 1: Now? Again, this is not about drugs. More drugs are
Speaker 1: coming from Mexico and China right than from Venezuela. So
Speaker 1: what is the strategy here? And the President's threatening you know,
Speaker 1: action on the ground in Venezuela. Now that's that's war.
Speaker 1: He's threatening to cut off you know, air traffic.
Speaker 3: Are going to do the land.
Speaker 2: So you think that he would actually strike with around
Speaker 2: targets in Venezuela.
Speaker 1: Well, if he does, that's an act of war.
Speaker 3: That's an act of war. Blowing up drug boats not
Speaker 3: an active war. Well, I mean I think it is.
Speaker 1: I mean, we have some of my colleagues are debating
Speaker 1: that issue, but not only blowing up drug boats. I mean,
Speaker 1: it appears that we are guilty of serious human rights
Speaker 1: crimes by actually palmming survivors who are begging for help.
Speaker 3: Again.
Speaker 1: You know, Congress ought to be demanding a clearly defined
Speaker 1: mission in terms of what he is doing in Venezuela,
Speaker 1: and up to this point there have been very few
Speaker 1: question questions and he's provided very few answers.
Speaker 2: You said something interesting of functioning Congress is back off
Speaker 2: what we're talking about here for a minute. We are
Speaker 2: in a world now where it does seem that discharge
Speaker 2: petitions and reconciliation bills are the only way to get
Speaker 2: anything done in the Congress.
Speaker 3: Do you feel that way? Committee? You know?
Speaker 1: Yeah? I mean this Congress under Republican leadership does not function.
Speaker 1: It is not working. It is a terrible disservice to
Speaker 1: the American people. This is a place where trivial issues
Speaker 1: are getting debated passionately, and important ones not at all.
Speaker 1: I mean, we have a healthcare crisis right now. People
Speaker 1: are seeing their healthcare premiums skyrocket. People are deciding to
Speaker 1: go without health insurance next year because the costs are
Speaker 1: so high. We need to be talking about extending the
Speaker 1: ACA tax credits so that people can afford their health insurance.
Speaker 1: And we're not doing that. We're talking about stupid stuff,
Speaker 1: stuff that is probably not even going to go even
Speaker 1: be considered by the Senate, that is going nowhere. I mean, again, Congress,
Speaker 1: a functioning Congress means that we do the work of
Speaker 1: the American people. And I'd like to think, no matter
Speaker 1: what your politics may be, you know, making sure that
Speaker 1: we are addressing issues of affordability, which includes the cost
Speaker 1: of health care, are front and center. I mean, if
Speaker 1: the Republicans have a plan, then bring the plan to us,
Speaker 1: let's debate it and vote on it. They've got nothing, Well,
Speaker 1: let's talk about healthcare. Because the Republicans put up bill
Speaker 1: in the Senate yesterday.
Speaker 3: It failed.
Speaker 2: Then the Democratic plan failed. The Democratic plan, of course,
Speaker 2: would extend Obamacare subsidies. The Republican plan produced by Bill
Speaker 2: Cassidy would have health savings accounts.
Speaker 3: Congress.
Speaker 2: When I spoke with Nicole Malia Takis yesterday, who is
Speaker 2: signed on to a bipartisan effort in the House, D's
Speaker 2: and ours that would extend the subsidies, would add some
Speaker 2: eligibility controls as well, because someone like Nicole Malia Takis
Speaker 2: is not.
Speaker 3: A fan of the affordable character. She told us yesterday.
Speaker 3: Let's listen.
Speaker 4: Well, there's so much fraud here, which is why we
Speaker 4: think we have the proper balance, and this gives us
Speaker 4: enough time, by the way, to then work over the
Speaker 4: next year or two to be able to come up
Speaker 4: with something that can truly replace the Affordable Care Act
Speaker 4: and bring costs down. Now, what the Speaker and leadership
Speaker 4: are saying is that we're going to take up a
Speaker 4: health savings account measure which will help people certainly with
Speaker 4: their medical costs. And I support that initiative, but it
Speaker 4: doesn't go far enough.
Speaker 2: Okay, but this is unlikely to see the floor unless
Speaker 2: the discharge petition makes that happen.
Speaker 1: But we do with the discharge petition route, we won't
Speaker 1: be able to get to it until probably in early January.
Speaker 3: Sure.
Speaker 1: My question to Representative Malia Takasay is like, where the
Speaker 1: hell have you been? I mean, you're a Republican, your
Speaker 1: party's in charge. We've been talking about this issue from months.
Speaker 1: This is not something's just for the right since before
Speaker 1: the shutdown, well before, we've been talking about it during reconciliation. Right,
Speaker 1: So we go back months and months and months, and
Speaker 1: we've been saying we got to focus on this, and
Speaker 1: all we've been hearing from Republicans is like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: we'll get to it, We'll get to it. And now
Speaker 1: we're out of time. People are going to lose their
Speaker 1: health insurance. Healthcare ought to be considered a fundamental human
Speaker 1: right for everybody in this country. You know, I mean
Speaker 1: you need health care. If you don't have health care,
Speaker 1: you end up in an emergency room, right, you know,
Speaker 1: I mean, this is this is crazy. So look, I
Speaker 1: there were a number of discharge petitions that are going
Speaker 1: to that have been introduced with various approaches to helping
Speaker 1: people afford their health insurance. I mean, let's let let's
Speaker 1: figure out what the US one is and let's move
Speaker 1: on it. But the stalling and the excuses and the
Speaker 1: faker pointing it has to end. You know, we have
Speaker 1: been we want to debate this issue, we want to
Speaker 1: vote on this issue. We want to help the millions
Speaker 1: of people in this country who are about to get screwed.
Speaker 2: What's the conversation in Worcester, Massachusetts. Right now, if you
Speaker 2: stop in Kelly Square and ask somebody about their health insurance,
Speaker 2: are they seeing these increases in dropping off the rolls
Speaker 2: or are they saying I can't afford it any way?
Speaker 3: So to your point, I'm going to go to the
Speaker 3: emergency room, I guess so.
Speaker 1: I mean, we're hearing some really terrible stories of people
Speaker 1: basically saying I can't afford by health insurance. Our office
Speaker 1: is getting innudated with calls. Look at people in Worcester
Speaker 1: just want us to do our job, and they get it.
Speaker 1: There are differences between Democrats and Republicans, but at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, they want us to get something done.
Speaker 1: You don't have to agree on everything to agree on something,
Speaker 1: but whatever that's something is. It has to be about
Speaker 1: improving the quality of life for the people who live
Speaker 1: in Worcestern all around the country. And the problem with
Speaker 1: what some of the what the Senate did on the
Speaker 1: Republican side is the stuff that they're proposing.
Speaker 3: You know, it doesn't mean anything in anybody's life.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, saying I'm fixing healthcare, but in reality,
Speaker 1: not fixing healthcare, not making it more affordable.
Speaker 3: Well, that doesn't help anybody, right.
Speaker 1: You know, we ought to have a larger discussion how
Speaker 1: we fix our entire healthcare system because it's a mess.
Speaker 1: It's two for profit oriented. But we're not going to
Speaker 1: do that in a week or two.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: Right now, we need to extend these tax credits so
Speaker 1: that millions of people don't see their premium skyrocket and
Speaker 1: millions don't lose their health insurance.
Speaker 3: We've only got about a minute left here.
Speaker 2: A terminal user just wrote us while we're talking, ask
Speaker 2: the congressman why the ACA failed that they designed.
Speaker 3: Maybe I can reframe that a bit.
Speaker 2: A lot of Republicans come on the air and they
Speaker 2: say this thing was never affordable. Obamacare itself has raised premiums.
Speaker 2: Is this plan broken?
Speaker 3: No, look at it.
Speaker 1: I think it's not perfect. Yeah, but it is better
Speaker 1: than the alternative, which is no ACA.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: I mean, the bottom line is millions and millions of
Speaker 1: people have now have coverage because of the Affordable Care Act.
Speaker 1: You know, if we extended the tax credits, it's affordable.
Speaker 1: But as I said, we need we need to have
Speaker 1: a bigger conversation look at it. If it was up
Speaker 1: to me, we would have a Medicare for All system.
Speaker 1: When I was the chairman of the Rules Committee, we
Speaker 1: were the first committee needed the House or Senate to
Speaker 1: do a hearing. I'm Medicare for All, and I'll tell
Speaker 1: you it was a very, very powerful hearing. But you know,
Speaker 1: to fix healthcare holistically, you know it's going to take
Speaker 1: some time. In the meantime, let's extend those tax credits.
Speaker 1: Let's let's let's help people afford their health insurance.
Speaker 2: Let's talk when the War Powers Act hits the floor.
Speaker 2: We've got a lot more to talk about. Congressman, Let's
Speaker 2: do this next time at Coney Island.
Speaker 1: All right, I'm with you.
Speaker 3: Onions or no, Yeah, with onions. With onions, it's the
Speaker 3: only way to That's how dogs in the world. They
Speaker 3: really are too. I'm Jill Matthew in Washington.
Speaker 2: Congressman Jim McGovern of Massachusetts, this is Bluebird.