WEBVTT - Cautious Optimism for UK Crypto Investors

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Stacy Marie Ishmael, Managing editor of Crypto for Bloomberg News,

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<v Speaker 1>and this is Bloomberg Crypto at Daily Bloomberg I Heart Podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>It's Friday, June tenth. In January, the United Kingdom officially

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<v Speaker 1>withdrew from the European Union. The fallout from Brexit, as

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<v Speaker 1>we all came to know it, is still being measured

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<v Speaker 1>across all industries. Some analysts predict it will take years

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<v Speaker 1>to fully understand the impact of Brexit on the UK economy.

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<v Speaker 1>Brexit even affected the crypto market, especially as far as

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<v Speaker 1>regulations are concerned. Bloomberg reporter Emily Nicole sees cautious optimism

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<v Speaker 1>among investors about the UK's approach to crypto regulation. She

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<v Speaker 1>joins me, now, Emily, thank you so much for joining

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<v Speaker 1>us today. Tell our listeners a little bit more about

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<v Speaker 1>the frankly fascinating landscape for to regulation in the UK,

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<v Speaker 1>Like what what is going on and as we like

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<v Speaker 1>to see in the US on the other side of

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<v Speaker 1>the pond. I think it's one of the more complex

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<v Speaker 1>regulatory landscapes that we've got going so far. That may

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<v Speaker 1>just be my perspective because I cover it, so I

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<v Speaker 1>know what's going on, um, But it's one where we've

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<v Speaker 1>had a lot of ups and downs and definitely a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of different players in the mix. So at the

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<v Speaker 1>moment crypto is largely an unregulated space. In the UK.

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<v Speaker 1>We have one main financial regulator here, the Financial Conduct Authority,

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<v Speaker 1>and then there's obviously also the government as well that

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<v Speaker 1>provides some some guidance there. Um. The regulator has done

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<v Speaker 1>its best, I guess they would say to regulate the

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<v Speaker 1>crypto space, trying to provide frameworks for crypto companies in

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<v Speaker 1>terms of money laundering regulations um and giving them kind

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<v Speaker 1>of space to innovate, while also providing a somewhat firm hand.

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<v Speaker 1>But mostly that has amounted to just continually warning consumers

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<v Speaker 1>that they could lose all their money if they invest

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<v Speaker 1>anything in cryptocurrencies, and not so much in terms of

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<v Speaker 1>providing consumer protections or any recourse there for investors. So

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<v Speaker 1>you would consider that more on the framework of consumer

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<v Speaker 1>advisory rather than consumer protection. You would say, yes, for sure,

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<v Speaker 1>there's there's definitely no real option for consumers if they

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<v Speaker 1>lose money in crypto at the moment. There's no insurance schemes,

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<v Speaker 1>there's no official licensing for crypto companies. UM, So if

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<v Speaker 1>you're an investor in the UK in crypto, it's as

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<v Speaker 1>good as anywhere else pretty much. Well, I do want

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<v Speaker 1>to ask you about that, because you know, one of

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<v Speaker 1>the things, especially after Brexit, that seemed to be or

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<v Speaker 1>I say, seemed that that looked like it might be true,

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<v Speaker 1>was that the UK was trying to set itself up

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<v Speaker 1>as a hub for crypto. Right that and based on,

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<v Speaker 1>for example, it's previous regulatory history of being a hub

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<v Speaker 1>for fintech. Fintech short full financial technology refers to the

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<v Speaker 1>use of digital technology, are replacement enhance traditional financial services.

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<v Speaker 1>So are you saying that that is is or isn't

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<v Speaker 1>happening from your perspective, I think from from the perspective

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<v Speaker 1>of people I've talked to in the industry, the UK,

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<v Speaker 1>as you said, it was known as a fintech powerhouse.

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<v Speaker 1>It still is. It's definitely the part of the tech

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<v Speaker 1>sector here that attracts the most investment every year. Um.

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<v Speaker 1>But that hasn't necessarily extended itself over to crypto. Brexit

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<v Speaker 1>is one part of that. A lot of people thought,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, the idea of Brexit was that the UK

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<v Speaker 1>would get regulatory freedom from the EU will be able

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<v Speaker 1>to write its own rules. But actually, over the last

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<v Speaker 1>few years since we voted to leave in Brexit has

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<v Speaker 1>meant that the Financial Conduct Authority and the government have

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<v Speaker 1>had far too much on their plate to really even

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<v Speaker 1>think about crypto. So while fintech was in its earliest days,

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<v Speaker 1>they were able to pay a lot of attention to it,

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<v Speaker 1>considered the best way to help in industry innovate and

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<v Speaker 1>create new technologies while keeping everything kind of under wraps

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<v Speaker 1>and supervised. Um, those early years for crypto passed by

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<v Speaker 1>and there wasn't really much attention paid to it at all. So,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, in the early days of fintech, and when

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<v Speaker 1>we talk about that, we're talking about companies like PayPal

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<v Speaker 1>or online banks or you know, other folks that are

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<v Speaker 1>putting the finances and technology as it were. Whereas right now,

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<v Speaker 1>what are the some of the equivalent kinds of companies

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<v Speaker 1>in crypto operating in the UK that perhaps we're expecting

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<v Speaker 1>to have more of a sort of a friendly or

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<v Speaker 1>accommodative regime. So there are obviously a few companies that

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<v Speaker 1>would style themselves as crypto banks. Um, there are some

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<v Speaker 1>fintech companies in the UK that offer banking services and

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<v Speaker 1>crypto trading on the side, like Revolute Um, and actually

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<v Speaker 1>offering the crypto services has not been much of a

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<v Speaker 1>help to them when trying to get an official banking license,

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<v Speaker 1>because it's something that the regulators are still aren't comfortable

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<v Speaker 1>saying yes, okay, that's a part of your business that

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<v Speaker 1>will accept or assesss fit and proper um. I think

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<v Speaker 1>the area where crypto companies have mostly been over overseen

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<v Speaker 1>by the regulator here is um in the world of exchanges,

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<v Speaker 1>but specifically limited to kind of asset management or brokerage.

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<v Speaker 1>So earlier companies in this space, like u Toro for example,

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<v Speaker 1>had a digital brokerage license, which meant that they could

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<v Speaker 1>offer you know, stock trading, and they kind of got

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<v Speaker 1>in that way a bit like a robin Hood kind

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<v Speaker 1>of model, and when they started offering crypto on the side,

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<v Speaker 1>it was considered separate. But when when it came time

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<v Speaker 1>to start seeking guidance from the FCO over anti money

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<v Speaker 1>laundering rules or any of the other places that they've

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<v Speaker 1>started to look at in crypto, they already had that

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<v Speaker 1>relationship and that rapport established, which definitely helped them UM,

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<v Speaker 1>where other crypto companies got no help at all. Let's

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<v Speaker 1>take a moment to listen to the UK Secretary to

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<v Speaker 1>the Treasury, John Glenn. He was recently talking to Bloomberg

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<v Speaker 1>Technology about how the government in the UK is thinking

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<v Speaker 1>about these regulations as it relates to crypto. Let's listen. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>I think we've got to accept that this is going

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<v Speaker 1>to be a great opportunity. We've got to regulate to

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<v Speaker 1>innovate those so we've gripped it in the UK. I

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<v Speaker 1>made a each last Monday and I announced the number

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<v Speaker 1>of interventions we want to bring industry together with our regulator,

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<v Speaker 1>with government so we can work out the best steps

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<v Speaker 1>to take this interesting phenomena forward because it has many

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<v Speaker 1>applications both for financial services and to the wider economy.

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<v Speaker 1>And so I'm excited about that and I'm pleased that

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<v Speaker 1>we're able to get that engagement with industry both here

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<v Speaker 1>and in London in order to drive it forward. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, to your point um, so much of regulation

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<v Speaker 1>is really about relationships. Who you know, who you can

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<v Speaker 1>successfully lobby, And certainly various of these companies have been

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<v Speaker 1>finding because they haven't been successful with their efforts or

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<v Speaker 1>they're not getting the attention and they think they deserve

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<v Speaker 1>They're looking to other financial centers. Dubai is a huge

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<v Speaker 1>one for crypto. You know, they have some very attractive

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<v Speaker 1>propositions to potential crypto folks. Switzerland is always always on

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<v Speaker 1>folkus as radar. What is it about these financial centers

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<v Speaker 1>that are causing people to reconsider their commitment to the UK.

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<v Speaker 1>One thing that the UK did do that others haven't

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<v Speaker 1>on cryptoregulation was explicitly banned retail investors from accessing crypto

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<v Speaker 1>derivatives products. Now, if you look at somewhere like Europe,

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<v Speaker 1>crypto derivatives have been a very big part of the

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<v Speaker 1>ecosystem for quite a few years. They've been around since

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<v Speaker 1>about twenty fifteen, and as we know now with the

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<v Speaker 1>with the US fight for a Bitcoin ETF, it's definitely

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<v Speaker 1>touted as the way that institutional investors will get access

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<v Speaker 1>to crypto because they can use listed products that will

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<v Speaker 1>track the price of something like bitcoin without actually having

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<v Speaker 1>to hold it. When the UK decided to ban those

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<v Speaker 1>products retail investors, it also inadvertently created the environment where

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<v Speaker 1>clearing houses weren't that comfortable with listing them, even for

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<v Speaker 1>just professionals. UM and it made life difficult for for

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<v Speaker 1>companies like you Toro, for example, who offered them already.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's one area where Europe has been able to

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<v Speaker 1>pull ahead. Switzerland is one of the biggest hubs for

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<v Speaker 1>these exchange shaded products on crypto. It's got a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of space there. It's also got an area like Cirque,

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<v Speaker 1>which is known as Crypto Valley um. And so when

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<v Speaker 1>this year when companies were struggling to get permissions from

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<v Speaker 1>the f c A to remain operating in the UK,

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<v Speaker 1>they had to meet certain anti money laundering requirements and

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<v Speaker 1>more than crypto companies that applied struggled to do that.

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<v Speaker 1>They basically faced the decision of downing tools and stopping

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<v Speaker 1>the business or moving the part of the business that

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<v Speaker 1>would be considered under that regulated part of crypto abroad,

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<v Speaker 1>and Switzerland was one of the key cups, alongside places

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<v Speaker 1>like Croatia and Dubai. As you mentioned, got it now

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<v Speaker 1>downing tools throwing toys out of the prom You know,

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<v Speaker 1>various folks have had perspectives on if this was a

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<v Speaker 1>a commensurate response to moves by by the Sea and

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<v Speaker 1>Treasury and others. But you know, you you in the

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<v Speaker 1>course of your reporting, you talked to a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>the folks in the market, what specifically are they saying,

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<v Speaker 1>would would the f C or the Treasury have to

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<v Speaker 1>be doing or have to be trying harder on to

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<v Speaker 1>recreate it that impression that the UK is an attractive

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<v Speaker 1>place for these kinds of companies, particularly ones doing the

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<v Speaker 1>more complicated products. So in the last few months the

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<v Speaker 1>Treasury announced that it wants to be a global crypto hub,

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<v Speaker 1>which I think was definitely the first start. A lot

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<v Speaker 1>of crypto companies that I spoke to said, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>even if we find other parts of crypto regulation the

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<v Speaker 1>UK incredibly difficult to deal with, you're only ever going

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<v Speaker 1>to take a message like that from the Treasury as

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<v Speaker 1>a positive. So that that was kind of the start.

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<v Speaker 1>But since then there have been a lot of moves

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<v Speaker 1>to basically get the ball rolling on putting actual regulation

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<v Speaker 1>in place for crypto and one of those was a

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<v Speaker 1>Crypto Sprint by the f C A which is like

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<v Speaker 1>a two day event where lots of crypto executives but

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<v Speaker 1>also interested parties in the space like lawyers and accountants

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<v Speaker 1>and consultants are all invited into a room with top

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<v Speaker 1>staff from the FCA to talk about crypto and what

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<v Speaker 1>it is that they need from the regulator and vice versa.

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<v Speaker 1>Um topics that they discussed their according to some of

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<v Speaker 1>the people who went, are things like, you know, whether

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<v Speaker 1>there is already kind of de facto crypto regulation in

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<v Speaker 1>place that the exchanges are having to be the guardians

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<v Speaker 1>of because they act as almost the gatekeepers to the

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<v Speaker 1>industry and deciding which projects to this and therefore which

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<v Speaker 1>tokens consumers get access to. They also were very concerned

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<v Speaker 1>about custody and whether the essay wants to regulate that

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<v Speaker 1>that's something that's already regulated in countries like Germany um.

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<v Speaker 1>And they were very concerned about stable coins as well,

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<v Speaker 1>particularly in the context of terrorist collapse, and whether regulators

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<v Speaker 1>should demand more transparency over which assets or algorithms are

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<v Speaker 1>backing slash supporting these coins. Well, Emily, thank you for

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<v Speaker 1>giving us a lay of the land of that digital

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<v Speaker 1>or hopefully digital landscape in the UK as it relates

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<v Speaker 1>to crypto regulation. Any kind of closing teakaways for someone

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<v Speaker 1>who is trying to learn more about what they should

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<v Speaker 1>understand about crypto, and I think regulation is you know,

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<v Speaker 1>while some people would say it's boring. I think it's

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<v Speaker 1>the key thing to pay attention to here because the

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<v Speaker 1>crypto investor market is large, stable, it grows in ebbs

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<v Speaker 1>and flows like anywhere else. Um. But regulation is the

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<v Speaker 1>place where the UK is really trying to stand out

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<v Speaker 1>or be different, and over the next twelve months is

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<v Speaker 1>when there will kind of be a calling card. We

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<v Speaker 1>spoke to the former Chancellor Philip Hammond back in January

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<v Speaker 1>who kind of said if the if the UK doesn't

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<v Speaker 1>get ahead in crypto or just even figure out what

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<v Speaker 1>it's doing by the end of this year, there will

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<v Speaker 1>be no coming back from that. UM. So definitely the

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<v Speaker 1>next twelve months are very crucial on that slightly foreboarding note, Emily,

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<v Speaker 1>thank you very much for joining us today. Really appreciate

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<v Speaker 1>having you here. You can find more of Emily Nicole's

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<v Speaker 1>reporting on the Bloomberg Terminal, on Bloomberg dot com and

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<v Speaker 1>on Twitter at Emily J. Nicole. That's n I C

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<v Speaker 1>O L L E. We'll be right back for a

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<v Speaker 1>look at what makes investors in the UK crypto market

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<v Speaker 1>excited and maybe a little bit nervous. So what exactly

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<v Speaker 1>are UK investors in the digital asset landscape encouraged by

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<v Speaker 1>these days and what are they wary of? A regulatory

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<v Speaker 1>framework for cryptocurrencies is beginning to take shape. I think

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<v Speaker 1>what we're seeing effectively the opportunity of leaving away from

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<v Speaker 1>traditional kind of transition into how can we create legislation

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<v Speaker 1>for what we want to do kind of going forward.

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<v Speaker 1>That's Blair Holiday, the UK head of the cryptocurrency exchange Gemini.

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<v Speaker 1>Blair joins us now. Blair, so good to have you.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you for joining us today. Absolute a lot it

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<v Speaker 1>to be here, thank you. So first I'm going to

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<v Speaker 1>ask you are the UK head of Gemini, which is

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<v Speaker 1>a crypto exchange. Can you say a little bit more

0:12:46.120 --> 0:12:49.040
<v Speaker 1>about what it is that you and Gemini do? Exactly

0:12:49.600 --> 0:12:53.120
<v Speaker 1>absolutely so. Gemini is a crypto exchange and custodian. We

0:12:53.120 --> 0:12:55.440
<v Speaker 1>are founded in the US have We've been in the

0:12:55.520 --> 0:12:58.160
<v Speaker 1>UK for about two years now, where a one of

0:12:58.160 --> 0:13:00.320
<v Speaker 1>the few firms that have an f C a crypto

0:13:00.360 --> 0:13:04.320
<v Speaker 1>asset registration. We're also authorized as any money institutions, so

0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:08.040
<v Speaker 1>effectively we enable customers to buy, sell, and still crypto

0:13:08.120 --> 0:13:12.400
<v Speaker 1>on our platform. And so you mentioned both retail and institutional,

0:13:12.480 --> 0:13:15.240
<v Speaker 1>which means you have like lots of people who regulate you,

0:13:15.440 --> 0:13:18.960
<v Speaker 1>I would imagine given the variety of customer bases that

0:13:19.000 --> 0:13:21.240
<v Speaker 1>you have, can you say a little bit more about

0:13:21.640 --> 0:13:24.640
<v Speaker 1>what you think the regulatory landscape in the UK is like,

0:13:24.840 --> 0:13:28.240
<v Speaker 1>especially post Brexit as it relates to crypto companies like

0:13:28.240 --> 0:13:31.240
<v Speaker 1>the one you are at, you know, in terms of

0:13:31.280 --> 0:13:35.400
<v Speaker 1>the opportunities kind of coming further down the line, the

0:13:35.480 --> 0:13:39.120
<v Speaker 1>UK about a month or so ago, through John Glenn

0:13:39.520 --> 0:13:43.280
<v Speaker 1>announced it's intent to make the UK a global crypto hub,

0:13:43.720 --> 0:13:45.920
<v Speaker 1>and on the back of that the the f C

0:13:46.040 --> 0:13:49.120
<v Speaker 1>a ouncer f C a crypto sprint, and then Brexit

0:13:49.200 --> 0:13:51.480
<v Speaker 1>obviously has occurred, and now it's a period of time

0:13:51.480 --> 0:13:55.000
<v Speaker 1>that has effectively traveled whereby the UK it's kind of

0:13:55.520 --> 0:13:59.040
<v Speaker 1>effectively moved further down. It's transition out of the EU

0:13:59.320 --> 0:14:01.720
<v Speaker 1>into a situation action work and start to develop more

0:14:01.760 --> 0:14:05.640
<v Speaker 1>of its its legislation, and crypto being an obvious one

0:14:05.679 --> 0:14:09.160
<v Speaker 1>for them to get into. So I think we're incredibly

0:14:09.160 --> 0:14:13.000
<v Speaker 1>exciting time for legislation in the UK, specifically in the

0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:17.240
<v Speaker 1>in the crypto space. So to your point about the

0:14:17.320 --> 0:14:20.800
<v Speaker 1>landscape that you want to see, what are some specific

0:14:20.880 --> 0:14:23.560
<v Speaker 1>things that you might be hoping will come out of

0:14:23.600 --> 0:14:26.720
<v Speaker 1>that sprint? Well, I think clarity. I think clarity and

0:14:26.800 --> 0:14:32.680
<v Speaker 1>nuance are those things in contradiction. Okay, So what I

0:14:32.720 --> 0:14:34.680
<v Speaker 1>mean by that is that I think there's a kind

0:14:34.680 --> 0:14:37.400
<v Speaker 1>of a recognition that the framework is there when it

0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:39.800
<v Speaker 1>comes to regulation in the UK. The f c A

0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:42.720
<v Speaker 1>is a principle's plans to regulated and those principles can

0:14:42.760 --> 0:14:45.880
<v Speaker 1>certainly be adopted in a wide ranging different areas of

0:14:45.920 --> 0:14:48.880
<v Speaker 1>financial services. So I think what we'll you know, what

0:14:48.960 --> 0:14:52.240
<v Speaker 1>we'd like to see is the opportunity to crypto has

0:14:52.360 --> 0:14:55.760
<v Speaker 1>to expand and have some of those principles kind of

0:14:55.880 --> 0:15:00.160
<v Speaker 1>adapted and introduce into the into kind of a more

0:15:00.240 --> 0:15:05.400
<v Speaker 1>fuse of regulation requiring or enabling firms to seek regulatory

0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:08.760
<v Speaker 1>approval within the UK. And that doesn't mean it needs

0:15:08.840 --> 0:15:12.800
<v Speaker 1>to be easy. We understand that the amail process of

0:15:12.880 --> 0:15:16.840
<v Speaker 1>these administration process was challenging and sets a high bar,

0:15:17.080 --> 0:15:19.720
<v Speaker 1>and we support that and we you know, we welcome that.

0:15:20.200 --> 0:15:22.800
<v Speaker 1>Gemini is an interesting position because, as you mentioned, started

0:15:22.840 --> 0:15:24.840
<v Speaker 1>in the US, is now operating the UK has a

0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:28.560
<v Speaker 1>lot of visibility into the European landscape. Is there anything

0:15:28.560 --> 0:15:30.840
<v Speaker 1>about the fact that no two countries or areas seem

0:15:30.920 --> 0:15:33.120
<v Speaker 1>to have the same approach to crypto that makes your

0:15:33.160 --> 0:15:36.040
<v Speaker 1>life more complicated. What we've definitely kind of seen from

0:15:36.080 --> 0:15:38.680
<v Speaker 1>the look from the UK, the US and the U,

0:15:39.040 --> 0:15:44.440
<v Speaker 1>there is definitely a desire for agile regulation. All of

0:15:44.520 --> 0:15:47.200
<v Speaker 1>us the working crypto understand how quickly it can change

0:15:47.680 --> 0:15:53.080
<v Speaker 1>and having having legislation planned without kind of having the

0:15:53.080 --> 0:15:56.280
<v Speaker 1>ability to adjust that will be problematic in this environment

0:15:56.280 --> 0:15:59.040
<v Speaker 1>because it was a quick moving environment. So look, we're

0:15:59.040 --> 0:16:02.880
<v Speaker 1>certainly excited by the regulatory landscape across the board. And

0:16:02.960 --> 0:16:06.240
<v Speaker 1>just as a kind of a closing thought, what do

0:16:06.240 --> 0:16:10.880
<v Speaker 1>you think is the biggest current selling point that UK

0:16:11.080 --> 0:16:13.800
<v Speaker 1>regulators have, Like nothing else changes that, you know, we're

0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:18.200
<v Speaker 1>not talking about future regulations. Why are people there right now? Talent?

0:16:19.080 --> 0:16:22.240
<v Speaker 1>The UK has a terrific level of talent. It's a

0:16:22.280 --> 0:16:27.200
<v Speaker 1>traditional hub for financial services. It's also an incredibly versioning

0:16:27.280 --> 0:16:32.200
<v Speaker 1>environment for fintech. The UK has, for example, prior to breakfit,

0:16:32.360 --> 0:16:35.600
<v Speaker 1>had more email institutions than the rest of the combined.

0:16:36.000 --> 0:16:39.160
<v Speaker 1>So that talent in fintech is there. The talent in

0:16:39.200 --> 0:16:43.120
<v Speaker 1>traditional finances there, so there's a tremendous opportunity in terms

0:16:43.120 --> 0:16:46.680
<v Speaker 1>of talent to be acquired by crypto firms. We've seen

0:16:46.680 --> 0:16:49.200
<v Speaker 1>that with our own hire, and we've seen incredible talent

0:16:49.480 --> 0:16:52.520
<v Speaker 1>from a variety of different industries come on board. As

0:16:52.520 --> 0:16:55.320
<v Speaker 1>well as that, you also have a government that is

0:16:55.440 --> 0:16:59.560
<v Speaker 1>very much kind of peddling towards a pro crypto stance,

0:17:00.040 --> 0:17:03.680
<v Speaker 1>So the opportunities from the UK for crypto have never

0:17:03.720 --> 0:17:06.720
<v Speaker 1>been bright. Well. On that unusually positive notes, I gotta

0:17:06.760 --> 0:17:11.880
<v Speaker 1>say thank you again. I appreciate you taking the time

0:17:11.920 --> 0:17:13.680
<v Speaker 1>to be here. Thank you very much for a pot

0:17:13.720 --> 0:17:18.679
<v Speaker 1>of me. On the next episode of Bloomberg Crypto. Have

0:17:18.800 --> 0:17:21.400
<v Speaker 1>you ever heard the saying everything is bigger in Texas?

0:17:21.880 --> 0:17:24.879
<v Speaker 1>The same applies to mining bitcoin in the state. The

0:17:24.920 --> 0:17:29.040
<v Speaker 1>States of Texas is flush with bitcoin miners, including the

0:17:29.119 --> 0:17:32.480
<v Speaker 1>city of Fort Worth that started a small mining operation

0:17:32.560 --> 0:17:35.520
<v Speaker 1>out of its city hall. Tomorrow, I'll talk with Bloomberg

0:17:35.520 --> 0:17:38.119
<v Speaker 1>report to Mike Smith about what makes the state so

0:17:38.200 --> 0:17:41.919
<v Speaker 1>attractive to crypto enthusiasts, and you'll hear from Lee bratcha

0:17:42.280 --> 0:17:44.960
<v Speaker 1>head of the Texas Blockchain Council, who will share more

0:17:45.040 --> 0:17:51.000
<v Speaker 1>about that partnership with the City of Fort Worth. I'm

0:17:51.040 --> 0:17:55.000
<v Speaker 1>Stacy Marie Ishmael, and this is Bloomberg Crypto, a daily

0:17:55.040 --> 0:17:58.879
<v Speaker 1>podcast from Bloomberg and I Heart Radio for more shows

0:17:58.880 --> 0:18:01.640
<v Speaker 1>from I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app,

0:18:02.080 --> 0:18:06.440
<v Speaker 1>Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Email your questions,

0:18:06.480 --> 0:18:10.480
<v Speaker 1>comments or suggestions to Crypto at bloomberg dot net. Follow

0:18:10.560 --> 0:18:16.480
<v Speaker 1>us on Twitter We're at Crypto. The supervising producer and

0:18:16.600 --> 0:18:20.159
<v Speaker 1>editor of this episode is Vicky Verglina. Our producer is

0:18:20.200 --> 0:18:24.760
<v Speaker 1>Mohammed Farouk. Zan Abdiki is our associate producer. Desk to

0:18:24.840 --> 0:18:28.520
<v Speaker 1>wander At is our engineer. Original music by Leo Sidron.

0:18:29.280 --> 0:18:31.600
<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg's head of Podcasts is Francesco Levi