1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:04,320 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:17,480 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy B. Wilson and I'm Holly Fry. Before we 4 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:21,520 Speaker 1: start today's episode proper, we have kind of a I 5 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 1: think special thing coming up. It's unlikely at this point 6 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:28,560 Speaker 1: that we are going to do any touring this year. 7 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:32,240 Speaker 1: That we had some things on the calendar that had 8 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 1: been scheduled that we're you know, one off appearances in 9 00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:39,120 Speaker 1: places those have been canceled. I think the only one 10 00:00:39,159 --> 00:00:42,440 Speaker 1: that we actually announced on the show was we were 11 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:45,879 Speaker 1: planning in July five show at the Adams National Historical 12 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:51,080 Speaker 1: Park in Quincy, Massachusetts, UM that has been canceled. One 13 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 1: of our favorite things about these appearances is getting to 14 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 1: talk to people who listen to the show and answer 15 00:00:57,560 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 1: questions about the show. So we were thinking, since we're 16 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:03,800 Speaker 1: not getting to do any kind of touring this year UM, 17 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:05,679 Speaker 1: that we would have a Q and A episode with 18 00:01:05,680 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 1: with questions submitted by listeners. So we are going to 19 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:13,479 Speaker 1: be taking questions specifically for a Q and A episode 20 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:16,920 Speaker 1: up until June twelve, UM, and then we will record 21 00:01:17,600 --> 00:01:20,959 Speaker 1: an episode based on those questions shortly after that. And 22 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 1: put it out as an episode of the show. So 23 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:25,759 Speaker 1: if you have questions for us about episodes that you've heard, 24 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 1: or about how we do the show, or just random 25 00:01:28,480 --> 00:01:30,800 Speaker 1: things that you're curious about, send them along. We're at 26 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 1: History Podcast at I heart radio dot com. Um. We 27 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,440 Speaker 1: of course we'll still be having questions for listener mail 28 00:01:37,920 --> 00:01:39,880 Speaker 1: parts of the episodes and stuff like that. This week 29 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:41,920 Speaker 1: a special thing that will put out as an episode 30 00:01:42,360 --> 00:01:45,840 Speaker 1: of the show. Uh So I kind of excited about that. 31 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 1: And now on to to today's actual episode. I learned 32 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 1: about these practice babies when researching the episode that we 33 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:56,960 Speaker 1: just had about home economics, and my response was, like, 34 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:01,440 Speaker 1: what practice babies? When I was in school, home at 35 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 1: classes had parenting lessons that I'm putting in quotation marks 36 00:02:04,960 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 1: that were about looking after a decorated egg or a 37 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:10,520 Speaker 1: sack of flour. At my school, this was not really 38 00:02:10,520 --> 00:02:13,400 Speaker 1: about parenting, though. It was more about trying to discourage 39 00:02:13,440 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 1: teen pregnancy by trying to simulate the stresses of having 40 00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:19,320 Speaker 1: an infant using an egg with a face drawn on it. 41 00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 1: Um practice babies, though we're not eggs. They were living, 42 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:27,960 Speaker 1: breathing babies cared for by college seniors who were temporarily 43 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:31,360 Speaker 1: living in home ec practice houses, and in most cases 44 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 1: the babies came from orphanages or child welfare agencies, and 45 00:02:35,040 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 1: then after their time as a practice baby was over, 46 00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:42,359 Speaker 1: in most cases, they were usually adopted. This whole idea 47 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 1: tends to elicit pretty strong emotional reactions, especially from folks 48 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:50,680 Speaker 1: who are part of the adoption triad or people who 49 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 1: have some experience with foster care or institutions for children, 50 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 1: and the reasons why most of these babies were in 51 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:02,959 Speaker 1: institutions in the first place are definitely bubbling. But as 52 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:06,040 Speaker 1: with the incubator side shows that we talked about on 53 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:08,440 Speaker 1: the show late last year, this is a case where 54 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:12,400 Speaker 1: something that seems just clearly unethical and bizarre by today's 55 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:17,120 Speaker 1: standards at the time was actually probably doing more help 56 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 1: than harm, and something we should note before we get 57 00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:23,520 Speaker 1: started in talking about this. The history of adoption in 58 00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:27,840 Speaker 1: North America includes a long established pattern of placing Native 59 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:32,280 Speaker 1: American First Nations and other indigenous children with white families 60 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 1: as a tool for assimilation and cultural eradication, and it 61 00:03:36,160 --> 00:03:39,320 Speaker 1: is possible that this happened in practice baby programs at 62 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:42,880 Speaker 1: some point, but that is also not really documented. If 63 00:03:42,920 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 1: that was part of this story, at least not in 64 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:48,040 Speaker 1: the material that we had access to. Another important thing 65 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:50,720 Speaker 1: to note is that throughout the decades that we're talking 66 00:03:50,760 --> 00:03:54,320 Speaker 1: about today, children of color were removed from their families, 67 00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 1: in place and institutions more often than white children were. 68 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:00,880 Speaker 1: And there were definitely hull MAK and I mixed programs 69 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:04,440 Speaker 1: that had practice houses at schools for black students, as 70 00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:08,600 Speaker 1: well as home programs that were racially integrated, But overwhelmingly 71 00:04:08,920 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 1: the documentation that's available to us is centered on programs 72 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:16,040 Speaker 1: where the babies and their caregivers were or appeared to 73 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:19,159 Speaker 1: be white. So since we're going to be talking about 74 00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:22,440 Speaker 1: some social issues related to adoption, we would be remiss 75 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 1: to not mention all this and kind of pretend that 76 00:04:24,920 --> 00:04:27,920 Speaker 1: it didn't exist. But based on the information that we 77 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 1: have issues that are specific to indigenous communities and to 78 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:36,280 Speaker 1: transracial adoption seemed to be outside the scope of today's episode. 79 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:39,560 Speaker 1: The trend of practice babies as part of a home 80 00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:43,600 Speaker 1: economics practicum ran alongside the development of home economics as 81 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:46,120 Speaker 1: a field. It was something we just covered in our 82 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:49,159 Speaker 1: earlier episode on the Bureau of Home Economics, but it 83 00:04:49,240 --> 00:04:52,880 Speaker 1: also ran alongside changes to orphanages and to adoption and 84 00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:56,400 Speaker 1: foster care. In the United States, most of the nation's 85 00:04:56,480 --> 00:05:00,080 Speaker 1: orphanages were built in the nineteenth century as immigration in 86 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:04,000 Speaker 1: an urbanization, and other social and economic factors led to 87 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:08,280 Speaker 1: a huge increase and how many children were experiencing homelessness. 88 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 1: Orphanages were attempts to move these children out of poor 89 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:16,240 Speaker 1: houses and prisons and other facilities that were really designed 90 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:19,839 Speaker 1: for adults. Many of these children did have at least 91 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:23,400 Speaker 1: one living parent, but for a variety of reasons, the 92 00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:27,479 Speaker 1: family couldn't or didn't care for them at home. Poverty 93 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 1: was also seen as a valid reason to remove children 94 00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:35,760 Speaker 1: from their parents custody conditions. In nineteenth century orphanages often 95 00:05:35,760 --> 00:05:38,440 Speaker 1: were not much better than the prisons and workhouses that 96 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:42,440 Speaker 1: they were replacing. At best, they tended to offer very 97 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,920 Speaker 1: little in the way of care, education, entertainment, and stimulation. 98 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:49,240 Speaker 1: By the early twentieth century, the United States was trying 99 00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:52,080 Speaker 1: to move away from orphanages and to focus more on 100 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:56,279 Speaker 1: placing children with foster families. The nation also started to 101 00:05:56,320 --> 00:05:58,919 Speaker 1: move away from using poverty alone as a reason to 102 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:03,040 Speaker 1: institutionalized children, but it wasn't until the nineteen forties that 103 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:06,159 Speaker 1: the number of children living in orphanages really started to 104 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 1: drop in terms of changes to the foster care and 105 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:13,839 Speaker 1: adoption systems. Really, for all of human history there have 106 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 1: been babies and children who were raised by somebody other 107 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 1: than their birth parents, So fostering and adoption have always 108 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 1: been part of the human experience, but in terms of 109 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 1: formal laws and processes, these didn't really start to develop 110 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:31,000 Speaker 1: in the United States until the middle of the nineteenth century. 111 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:34,760 Speaker 1: The first modern adoption law in the United States was 112 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:39,240 Speaker 1: passed in Massachusetts in eighteen fifty one. Other states followed, 113 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:42,320 Speaker 1: with the details of these laws really varying from state 114 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:45,760 Speaker 1: to state. Research into outcomes for children who had been 115 00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:49,080 Speaker 1: fostered or adopted didn't really start until after the first 116 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:53,599 Speaker 1: practice baby programs were established. The first major outcome study, 117 00:06:53,680 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 1: titled How Foster Children Turned Out, was published in nineteen 118 00:06:57,360 --> 00:07:00,640 Speaker 1: twenty four, and it wasn't really until the nineteen sixties 119 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:04,200 Speaker 1: that people started doing major research into connections between adoption 120 00:07:04,279 --> 00:07:07,720 Speaker 1: and foster care and mental and emotional health. And by 121 00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:10,240 Speaker 1: the time that work was being done, the last practice 122 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:14,920 Speaker 1: baby programs were already ending. There was some research into 123 00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:19,120 Speaker 1: how being a practice baby affected children's emotional and mental 124 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:21,640 Speaker 1: health and development, and we'll talk about the specifics of 125 00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:25,000 Speaker 1: that research later on in the show, But especially in 126 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,080 Speaker 1: the later years of these programs, those kinds of studies 127 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 1: became a lot harder to carry out, in part because 128 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:35,360 Speaker 1: of an increasing focus on keeping adoption records completely sealed, 129 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:38,640 Speaker 1: So a lot of practice baby programs didn't fall up 130 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 1: on children's later lives, not because they just didn't care 131 00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:45,240 Speaker 1: about the children's future well being, but because that information 132 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:47,400 Speaker 1: about the families they had been placed with and where 133 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 1: they were now that was sealed. A lot of this 134 00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:53,760 Speaker 1: has to do with stigma, especially within the white middle class. 135 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:57,640 Speaker 1: Becoming pregnant out of wedlock was increasingly stigmatized from the 136 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:01,160 Speaker 1: nineteen thirties through the nineteen fifties and six teas. By 137 00:08:01,160 --> 00:08:03,760 Speaker 1: the middle of the twentieth century. If someone was pregnant 138 00:08:03,760 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 1: and unmarried, they were likely to spend their last months 139 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:09,760 Speaker 1: of pregnancy somewhere out of sight, like in a maternity 140 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:12,280 Speaker 1: home or living with a relative from out of town, 141 00:08:13,200 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 1: and then to be pressured, coerced, or outright forced into 142 00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:22,760 Speaker 1: an adoption. Infertility was also stigmatized, so sealed adoption records, 143 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:27,120 Speaker 1: which were often inaccessible even to the children involved, allowed 144 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 1: everyone involved in the whole process to keep all of 145 00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 1: this secret. Of course, this is not at all how 146 00:08:33,000 --> 00:08:36,600 Speaker 1: it's recommended to handle adoptions today, and this practice made 147 00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 1: it incredibly hard for people who were adopted as babies 148 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:42,720 Speaker 1: to get any information at all about their birth family 149 00:08:42,800 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: or their health history. So the babies who were part 150 00:08:45,679 --> 00:08:49,000 Speaker 1: of these home economics programs generally had some kind of 151 00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:53,120 Speaker 1: trauma in their backgrounds before becoming a practice baby. Maybe 152 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:55,800 Speaker 1: their parents had died and they were placed in an orphanage, 153 00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:58,880 Speaker 1: or their parents were alive but just financially could not 154 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:02,400 Speaker 1: care for them. Many were born to unmarried parents who 155 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:05,880 Speaker 1: had little to no say in the adoption decision. In 156 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:09,760 Speaker 1: article in the Journal of Home Economics, Catherine h Read, 157 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:12,080 Speaker 1: head of the Department of Family Life in the School 158 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:15,840 Speaker 1: of Home Economics at Oregon State College, stressed that babies 159 00:09:15,880 --> 00:09:18,680 Speaker 1: should be placed in practice houses only if these kinds 160 00:09:18,720 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 1: of circumstances suggested that it would be in their best interests. 161 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 1: College programs generally kept these babies identities confidential. Students generally 162 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:32,120 Speaker 1: knew them by first names only, although they often gave 163 00:09:32,160 --> 00:09:35,360 Speaker 1: them temporary last names that varied from school to school. 164 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:38,640 Speaker 1: So for example, babies at Cornell University were giving the 165 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 1: last name Domicon, which was short for Domestic Economy. Eastern 166 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:47,199 Speaker 1: Illinois State Teachers College had two teaching houses, and babies 167 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:50,319 Speaker 1: were given last names for which house they were living 168 00:09:50,320 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 1: in north or South. Since everything was confidential, students didn't 169 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:57,920 Speaker 1: generally meet the babies families or follow up with them 170 00:09:58,040 --> 00:09:59,959 Speaker 1: later on in their life. And we're going to talk 171 00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:02,880 Speaker 1: more about these practice houses and the babies in them 172 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:14,440 Speaker 1: after we first have a sponsor break. Broadly speaking, home 173 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:17,840 Speaker 1: economics programs in the United States had two types of 174 00:10:17,880 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 1: houses that were part of their instruction and practice. At 175 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 1: the high school level, there were cottages where students could 176 00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:28,000 Speaker 1: learn and practice, but where they did not generally live 177 00:10:28,240 --> 00:10:32,680 Speaker 1: full time. These were everything from converted classroom spaces inside 178 00:10:32,679 --> 00:10:34,960 Speaker 1: the school building which had been made to look like 179 00:10:35,040 --> 00:10:39,200 Speaker 1: little homes, or a standalone cottage that the school either 180 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:43,000 Speaker 1: owned or rented. Colleges, on the other hand, had houses 181 00:10:43,120 --> 00:10:46,520 Speaker 1: or apartments where upper level students actually lived for a time. 182 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:49,640 Speaker 1: In the words of Dr Louise Stanley, chief of the 183 00:10:49,679 --> 00:10:52,400 Speaker 1: Bureau of Home Economics, quote, it is a house in 184 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:56,080 Speaker 1: which groups of students organized as a family group live 185 00:10:56,200 --> 00:10:59,680 Speaker 1: for varying periods and apply their home economic training to 186 00:10:59,760 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 1: the solution of the different housekeeping and homemaking problems as 187 00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:07,320 Speaker 1: they arise. Stanley recommended that each state college have at 188 00:11:07,400 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 1: least two practice houses, one outfitted like a home in 189 00:11:11,080 --> 00:11:13,959 Speaker 1: a city or town and the other replicating a house 190 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 1: in a rural district. The first documented practice houses were 191 00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:21,359 Speaker 1: built in nineteen o four. One was at Stout Institute 192 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:24,600 Speaker 1: in Wisconsin, and the other was at the Tuskegee Institute 193 00:11:24,600 --> 00:11:29,120 Speaker 1: in Alabama. By nine twenty, there were seventies seven practice 194 00:11:29,160 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 1: houses at colleges and universities around the United States, as 195 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:35,880 Speaker 1: well as some number of apartments that served the same purpose. 196 00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 1: Some schools bought or rented an existing property, and others 197 00:11:40,320 --> 00:11:43,520 Speaker 1: had a practice house custom built. For example, at the 198 00:11:43,520 --> 00:11:46,880 Speaker 1: Hampton Institute, the funding for the house came from a 199 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:50,280 Speaker 1: gift for the school, and the structure itself was built 200 00:11:50,280 --> 00:11:53,840 Speaker 1: by the school's trade school students. The exact details of 201 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 1: a student's time in a practice house could vary, but 202 00:11:57,080 --> 00:11:59,840 Speaker 1: in general it tended to involve six to eight senior 203 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:02,680 Speaker 1: who usually lived in the house for six to ten weeks. 204 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:08,199 Speaker 1: Faculty or sometimes graduate students were on hand to instruct, supervise, 205 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 1: and evaluate the students who were expected to cook, clean, 206 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:15,440 Speaker 1: serve meals, make budgets, and just generally manage the household. 207 00:12:15,679 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 1: And in the words of Alba Bates, head of the 208 00:12:17,520 --> 00:12:20,960 Speaker 1: School of Home Economics at North Dakota Agricultural College, quote, 209 00:12:21,320 --> 00:12:23,600 Speaker 1: the big thing which we expect of the students and 210 00:12:23,679 --> 00:12:27,160 Speaker 1: upon which we check them is their family relationships, such 211 00:12:27,160 --> 00:12:32,359 Speaker 1: as the spirit of cooperation, helpfulness, generosity, kindness, and tolerance 212 00:12:32,400 --> 00:12:35,920 Speaker 1: of the mistakes of others. At some schools, these family 213 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:39,440 Speaker 1: relationships practiced in the house involved caring for a baby. 214 00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:44,520 Speaker 1: This infant care was usually described as mothercraft, and mothercraft 215 00:12:44,559 --> 00:12:48,079 Speaker 1: as a specialization was something that was introduced into American 216 00:12:48,120 --> 00:12:52,199 Speaker 1: home economics programs following the establishment of the first mothercraft 217 00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 1: schools in England that happened in nineteen fourteen. As had 218 00:12:55,920 --> 00:12:59,160 Speaker 1: been the case with homemaking in general, the home economics 219 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:01,600 Speaker 1: movement can that her child rearing to be a worthy 220 00:13:01,679 --> 00:13:06,360 Speaker 1: vocation that deserved study and refinement. Home economics approached homemaking 221 00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:10,400 Speaker 1: through science and mothercraft did the same with parenting. The 222 00:13:10,480 --> 00:13:14,200 Speaker 1: mothercraft approach was very precise and regulated, with parents trying 223 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:18,120 Speaker 1: to establish set schedules for babies with regular times for meals, 224 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:21,320 Speaker 1: bass play, and sleep, and a diet that was carefully 225 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:24,920 Speaker 1: measured and managed. By the late nineteen teens, it was 226 00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:29,560 Speaker 1: generally agreed that practical study of mothercraft was critical to 227 00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:33,840 Speaker 1: a home economics degree. Raising children was a huge part 228 00:13:33,880 --> 00:13:37,320 Speaker 1: of a typical homemaker's work, so home economics programs that 229 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:41,679 Speaker 1: had no hands on experience with childcare were just incomplete. 230 00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:45,080 Speaker 1: This wasn't just about completeness for its own sake, though. 231 00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 1: A ninety article in the Journal of Home Economics noted 232 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:53,600 Speaker 1: that under the Smith Hughes Act, vocational contact was required 233 00:13:53,600 --> 00:13:56,800 Speaker 1: for people who were going to teach home economics, So 234 00:13:56,840 --> 00:13:59,840 Speaker 1: if you were going to teach mothercraft, you had to 235 00:13:59,880 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 1: have some vocational contact in childcare in your own education 236 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:06,760 Speaker 1: in order to be able to do so. Schools approached 237 00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:10,800 Speaker 1: this hands on component in several ways. Some had daycare 238 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:14,160 Speaker 1: centers and preschools on or near campus, which were staffed 239 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:18,840 Speaker 1: partly or entirely by home economics students. Others brought infants 240 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:22,200 Speaker 1: and older children from the community to campus for supervised 241 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:25,720 Speaker 1: play and workshops, or they arranged for groups of students 242 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:28,960 Speaker 1: to observe and interact with babies and children in their 243 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:32,720 Speaker 1: own homes out in the community, and some, as we've said, 244 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:36,160 Speaker 1: brought babies to live full time in their practice houses. 245 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 1: The same nineteen twenty article outlined the first documented practice 246 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:43,920 Speaker 1: baby program in the United States, which took place at 247 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 1: the University of Minnesota in nineteen eighteen and nineteen nineteen. 248 00:14:48,280 --> 00:14:52,160 Speaker 1: The university's to home management houses each had one child 249 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 1: in residence in the spring and summer quarters, and although 250 00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:58,680 Speaker 1: it became common to place children in practice houses as 251 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:01,920 Speaker 1: young as possible, and this pilot program the babies were 252 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 1: Russell aged thirteen months and Earl aged twenty one months, 253 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 1: both of whom had been living in baby homes since 254 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:11,720 Speaker 1: they were born. In this program, each student in the 255 00:15:11,760 --> 00:15:15,280 Speaker 1: practice houses acted as a so called baby manager. For 256 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:18,360 Speaker 1: one week. She was on duty with the baby's care 257 00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:20,960 Speaker 1: between six and eight each morning and four thirty to 258 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 1: six each night. The baby manager was generally in charge 259 00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:27,480 Speaker 1: and was responsible for the baby's laundry and for keeping 260 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:31,480 Speaker 1: up with documentation, including recording all of the day's tasks 261 00:15:31,520 --> 00:15:35,320 Speaker 1: and monitoring the baby's progress. The other three or four 262 00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:38,720 Speaker 1: students rotated through the rest of the day's childcare tasks, 263 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:42,000 Speaker 1: depending on how their own class schedules and commitments worked out. 264 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:45,000 Speaker 1: There was one brief window each weekday when all of 265 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:47,240 Speaker 1: the students were in the same class, at which point 266 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:50,320 Speaker 1: a faculty member or a home X student who wasn't 267 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:53,080 Speaker 1: living in the house would come and fill in. Both 268 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:56,200 Speaker 1: Russell and Earl arrived at the university with some health 269 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 1: issues that were associated with their time in the baby home. 270 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:03,200 Speaker 1: Both of them were described as listless and underweight, with 271 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:08,240 Speaker 1: anemia and ricketts. Russell also had exema, but at the 272 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:10,560 Speaker 1: end of their two quarters in the practice houses, they 273 00:16:10,560 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 1: had gained weight, they were showing fewer signs of nervousness 274 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:17,880 Speaker 1: and distress. Students reported that the babies became more active 275 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:21,680 Speaker 1: and more engaged. Their rickets had been resolved, and Russell's 276 00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:25,560 Speaker 1: exema was also under control. The A doctor who examined 277 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:27,480 Speaker 1: both babies at the end of their time at the 278 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:30,880 Speaker 1: university noted quote, the improvement in the condition of these 279 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:35,720 Speaker 1: children speaks highly for your cooperative motherhood. Other programs followed 280 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:40,040 Speaker 1: from there pretty quickly. Survey found that of the seventy 281 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:44,120 Speaker 1: seven practice houses operating in the US, sixteen had a 282 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:47,440 Speaker 1: child in residence. By the time these programs were phased 283 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 1: out about fifty colleges had brought babies into their practice houses. 284 00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:54,840 Speaker 1: Although this episode and our earlier one on the Department 285 00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:57,640 Speaker 1: of Home Economics has focused on the United States, there 286 00:16:57,680 --> 00:17:01,960 Speaker 1: were practice houses with practice babies elsewhere as well. For example, 287 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:05,399 Speaker 1: the University of Manitoba had thirty three practice babies in 288 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 1: its home economics houses between the years nineteen thirty and 289 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:12,919 Speaker 1: nineteen fifty. The details of exactly how these programs worked 290 00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:16,120 Speaker 1: varied from school to school. For example, by the mid 291 00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:20,359 Speaker 1: nineteen fifties, Iowa State College had six practice houses for 292 00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:24,440 Speaker 1: home economics students. Babies stayed in one of the houses 293 00:17:24,520 --> 00:17:27,719 Speaker 1: for a quarter, and each group of eight students lived 294 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:31,160 Speaker 1: in the practice house for half of a quarter. Each 295 00:17:31,200 --> 00:17:34,520 Speaker 1: student had primary care of the baby for about four 296 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:37,879 Speaker 1: to five consecutive days, so by the end of each quarter, 297 00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:42,200 Speaker 1: each baby had been cared for by sixteen women in sequence. 298 00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:45,200 Speaker 1: From the beginning, there was some debate within the home 299 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:47,960 Speaker 1: economics field about whether this was an effective way to 300 00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:52,040 Speaker 1: teach mothercraft and whether having so many caregivers could harm 301 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:55,400 Speaker 1: the babies in some way, But in the nineteen fifties, 302 00:17:55,440 --> 00:17:59,600 Speaker 1: public opinions started to shift as well. In nineteen fifty four, 303 00:17:59,800 --> 00:18:02,960 Speaker 1: Estern Illinois State Teachers College became the focus of a 304 00:18:03,119 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 1: huge national controversy surrounding a practice baby known as David North, 305 00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:09,960 Speaker 1: who was only the second baby brought to the school. 306 00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:14,120 Speaker 1: Dr Ruth Schmallhausen had been hired at the college's Home 307 00:18:14,160 --> 00:18:18,360 Speaker 1: Economics department in nineteen fifty and the school's first practice 308 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:21,359 Speaker 1: houses came into use in nineteen fifty two. They had 309 00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 1: actually been authorized before World War Two, but because of 310 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:27,960 Speaker 1: the war, they were delayed. When the schools started looking 311 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:32,280 Speaker 1: for practice babies, Smallhousen went to Dr Roman Haremsky of 312 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:37,480 Speaker 1: the Illinois State Child Welfare Division for help. However, Harensky 313 00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:41,600 Speaker 1: had some concerns about this program's potential impact on the children, 314 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:45,120 Speaker 1: and he refused to be involved in this, so Schmallhausen 315 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:49,000 Speaker 1: worked directly with families in the community. Eastern Illinois State 316 00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:53,800 Speaker 1: Teachers Colleges first practice baby was Margaret Anne North, whose 317 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:56,240 Speaker 1: mother had been referred to the school by the Salvation 318 00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:59,840 Speaker 1: Army Home in Chicago. Margaret Anne's time as a p 319 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:03,320 Speaker 1: actus baby seemed to have passed without raising any eyebrows, 320 00:19:03,840 --> 00:19:07,160 Speaker 1: but in nineteen the college brought in David North, who 321 00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 1: had been born pre term and whose mother was unmarried. 322 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:12,879 Speaker 1: She had arranged for the school to take care of 323 00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:16,199 Speaker 1: him temporarily so that she could return to work, also 324 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:21,360 Speaker 1: arranging for visitation rights and regular updates about his progress. However, 325 00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:25,400 Speaker 1: after an article about the program ran in a local newspaper, 326 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:29,840 Speaker 1: Haramsky was livid, both because of his concerns about it 327 00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:33,320 Speaker 1: and because the school had done all this without his involvement. 328 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:36,840 Speaker 1: He was also concerned that there was no father figure 329 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 1: involved in baby David's life. He ordered Child Welfare Services 330 00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:46,840 Speaker 1: to investigate. During all this, David's pediatrician, Dr William Kahite commented, quote, 331 00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:50,520 Speaker 1: the infant boy is in excellent physical condition. He has 332 00:19:50,560 --> 00:19:53,679 Speaker 1: received physical care which is far superior to that given 333 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 1: in the best Foundling homes and in most American homes. Furthermore, 334 00:19:58,040 --> 00:20:00,480 Speaker 1: he has loved, which is the basic fact in the 335 00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 1: healthy developmental environment. This child has benefited tremendously from the 336 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:07,800 Speaker 1: good start he is receiving and will show it for 337 00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:12,200 Speaker 1: years to come. On January twelfth, ninety four, this became 338 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:15,679 Speaker 1: a national news story, with most of the coverage about 339 00:20:15,720 --> 00:20:20,440 Speaker 1: it being pretty negative. Reporting focused on the evolving fields 340 00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:23,919 Speaker 1: of psychiatry and mental health. And on concerns that women 341 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:27,760 Speaker 1: were abandoning their so called natural role as wives and 342 00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:31,640 Speaker 1: mothers in order to join the workforce. Time magazine ran 343 00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:34,639 Speaker 1: an article about this with a photo of two students 344 00:20:34,720 --> 00:20:38,639 Speaker 1: feeding David, together with the caption quote David North and 345 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:44,200 Speaker 1: mother's heaven knows how many neuroses. Ultimately, Child Welfare Services 346 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:47,320 Speaker 1: found that since this had been arranged privately between David's 347 00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:50,520 Speaker 1: mother and the school and there was no adoption involved, 348 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:55,359 Speaker 1: it wasn't within their jurisdiction to intervene. Eventually, the furor 349 00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:58,720 Speaker 1: died down and David finished his time as a practice baby, 350 00:20:58,840 --> 00:21:01,639 Speaker 1: and then a new practice ba be Amy Norse, arrived 351 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:05,679 Speaker 1: in the fall of n with no public outcry. The 352 00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:09,880 Speaker 1: furor over David North was tied to an evolving understanding 353 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:13,520 Speaker 1: of how an infant's early life affected their later mental 354 00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:16,399 Speaker 1: and emotional health and development, which is one part of 355 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 1: why this practice ended. You will get more into that 356 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:31,080 Speaker 1: research after a sponsor break. As we noted earlier, opinions 357 00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:35,240 Speaker 1: were divided about how best to teach practical mothercraft in 358 00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:38,520 Speaker 1: American home economics schools. I mean that that debate went 359 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:41,080 Speaker 1: all the way back to when this subject was first introduced. 360 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:45,919 Speaker 1: People questioned whether bringing babies into practice houses was the 361 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:49,680 Speaker 1: most practical or effective way to teach, and they questioned 362 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:53,439 Speaker 1: whether it was harmful or exploitive. Along with things like 363 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:57,280 Speaker 1: budgets and logistics and other practical issues. These concerns were 364 00:21:57,320 --> 00:22:00,520 Speaker 1: some of the reasons why not every home economics program 365 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:04,680 Speaker 1: sought out babies for its practice homes. Articles and primary 366 00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:08,280 Speaker 1: source documents from these programs are full of anecdotes about 367 00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:11,200 Speaker 1: the experience from the students and teachers points of view, 368 00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:14,560 Speaker 1: and not all of them are positive. Some students talked 369 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:18,280 Speaker 1: about feeling overwhelmed or even terrified when they were expected 370 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:22,040 Speaker 1: to care for a baby. In articles about her novel 371 00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:26,520 Speaker 1: The Irresistible Henry House, author Lisa Grinwald mentioned getting an 372 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:31,040 Speaker 1: email from one home economics graduate who quit her program saying, quote, 373 00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:35,080 Speaker 1: you can't treat children this way. But other anecdotes are 374 00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:39,159 Speaker 1: more positive and documents from the time students described the 375 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: programs as beneficial to their education, everything from giving them 376 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:47,320 Speaker 1: practical mothering experience to strengthening their connection to their own mothers, 377 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:50,480 Speaker 1: to the baby's presence in the practice house transforming other 378 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:54,800 Speaker 1: domestic work from a drudgery to a joy. A nine 379 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:58,600 Speaker 1: article in Successful Farming quotes an instructor from the University 380 00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:02,160 Speaker 1: of Minnesota as observed ring that the program allowed students 381 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,520 Speaker 1: to do kind of a trial run of the often 382 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:08,240 Speaker 1: frazzled first few weeks of parenthood in a more controlled 383 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:13,040 Speaker 1: setting with some experienced supervision. Anecdotally, the program could be 384 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:17,400 Speaker 1: beneficial for the babies as well. Archival documents from programs 385 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:20,879 Speaker 1: all over North America described babies brought into the programs 386 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:25,240 Speaker 1: from institutions where they had been deprived, babies who were malnourished, 387 00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:28,320 Speaker 1: with conditions like anemia and ricketts as we mentioned earlier, 388 00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:32,159 Speaker 1: who just weren't very active or expressive, and who seemed 389 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,600 Speaker 1: disconnected from the people around them, and then after their 390 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:38,159 Speaker 1: time in the practice house, the babies were placed with 391 00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:43,080 Speaker 1: adoptive families, now apparently happy and healthy. There are numerous 392 00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:46,880 Speaker 1: reports of former practice babies being particularly sought after by 393 00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:50,080 Speaker 1: families who wanted to adopt because they were considered to 394 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:52,199 Speaker 1: have been treated with the most up to date and 395 00:23:52,280 --> 00:23:57,440 Speaker 1: sophisticated care. In the nineteen fifties, though, the general concerns 396 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:00,760 Speaker 1: that babies might be harmed by all this started to 397 00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:06,120 Speaker 1: be reflected in some psychological research. Most notably, psychologist Henry 398 00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:09,560 Speaker 1: Harlow did a series of experiments with baby reesless monkeys 399 00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:13,439 Speaker 1: in the late nineteen fifties. He separated the monkeys from 400 00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:16,720 Speaker 1: their mothers and then placed them in enclosures with sort 401 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,560 Speaker 1: of surrogate mothers, one of them made out of wire 402 00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:22,879 Speaker 1: and the other covered in a soft terry cloth. He 403 00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:25,800 Speaker 1: made a lot of observations from this setup, like if 404 00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:28,480 Speaker 1: a monkey was in an enclosure with both types of 405 00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:31,760 Speaker 1: quote mothers and Harlow put a scary wind up toy 406 00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:33,960 Speaker 1: in there, the monkey would go to the soft mother 407 00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:37,280 Speaker 1: for comfort, not the wiry one. This was true even 408 00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:40,840 Speaker 1: if the wire mother dispensed milk and the soft mother didn't. 409 00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:43,440 Speaker 1: And the monkeys that had no soft mother in their 410 00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:47,120 Speaker 1: enclosure behaved differently than the ones who did. They would 411 00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:50,480 Speaker 1: scream or throw themselves on the floor if something scary happened, 412 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:53,680 Speaker 1: while monkeys with a terry cloth mother seemed more resilient 413 00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:57,720 Speaker 1: and able to soothe themselves. Harlow's work folded into a 414 00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:01,400 Speaker 1: body of research that increasing He suggested that a person's 415 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:08,000 Speaker 1: experience and infancy, including love, comfort, security, and stability, affected them. 416 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:11,159 Speaker 1: Later on, some of this research involved children who had 417 00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:14,960 Speaker 1: been raised in institutional settings where they were truly deprived 418 00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:18,439 Speaker 1: of care and affection, and it quickly became accepted that 419 00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:22,160 Speaker 1: an infant whose early months were severely deprived would show 420 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 1: signs like listlessness, poor sleep, and failure to maintain weight, 421 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:28,840 Speaker 1: even with a diet that seemed like it would be sufficient, 422 00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:32,760 Speaker 1: so just a general failure to thrive. And older children 423 00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:36,720 Speaker 1: issues included an inability to make close friendships or other 424 00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 1: strong relationships, lack of concentration, and a range of mood 425 00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:46,200 Speaker 1: and behavioral disorders that came to be called attachment disorder. Naturally, 426 00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:50,080 Speaker 1: people started to wonder whether these conclusions could also apply 427 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 1: to practice baby programs. In general, practice babies got plenty 428 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:58,159 Speaker 1: of care, but that was from multiple people rather than 429 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:01,480 Speaker 1: one primary caregiver with whom the baby could develop a 430 00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:06,080 Speaker 1: strong attachment. The first formal studies into this question actually 431 00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 1: started before Harlowe's research with monkeys, and December of nineteen 432 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:13,320 Speaker 1: thirty three, a paper was published in the Journal of 433 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:18,000 Speaker 1: Experimental Education, the Tailing the Welfare of Practice Babies at 434 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:21,480 Speaker 1: the Iowa State College of Agriculture and Mechanic Arts Hall 435 00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:26,200 Speaker 1: Management Houses. Critics had questioned whether the children there could 436 00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:30,919 Speaker 1: quote develop the necessary feeling of security under such circumstances, 437 00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:35,960 Speaker 1: and the American Vocational Association had appointed a committee to investigate. 438 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,119 Speaker 1: This committee carried out an eight month study of the 439 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:41,880 Speaker 1: three children who had been practiced babies at the college 440 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:45,960 Speaker 1: between nineteen and nineteen nine, and then the four children 441 00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:50,159 Speaker 1: who were there in nine nineteen thirty. They compared them 442 00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:52,600 Speaker 1: to other children who were within two weeks of the 443 00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:55,520 Speaker 1: same age and the same sex, and had been living 444 00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:59,000 Speaker 1: in a boarding home or an orphanage. They also compared 445 00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:02,480 Speaker 1: all of these children into control groups. These were children 446 00:27:02,560 --> 00:27:04,760 Speaker 1: of the same age and sex who had been raised 447 00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:09,040 Speaker 1: with their birth families in professional and non professional households. 448 00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:13,320 Speaker 1: The assessors conducted a range of physical, mental, and psychological 449 00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:18,120 Speaker 1: assessments and had parents and caregivers fill out questionnaires. They 450 00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:22,840 Speaker 1: concluded that the practice babies as a group excelled in intelligence, 451 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:28,120 Speaker 1: motor development, language development, adaptive behavior, and personal social behavior. 452 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:32,560 Speaker 1: They performed slightly better than both control groups in their 453 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:35,640 Speaker 1: motor development and slightly better than the children from non 454 00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:40,040 Speaker 1: professional homes in their personal social behavior. They were slightly 455 00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:43,680 Speaker 1: behind the control groups and language development and adaptive behavior, 456 00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:48,480 Speaker 1: but they quote compared favorably in physical health and emotional stability. 457 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:52,080 Speaker 1: The researchers only had seven children to evaluate, and some 458 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:56,760 Speaker 1: of the measurements involved were really pretty subjective, but overall quote, 459 00:27:56,840 --> 00:28:00,320 Speaker 1: an analysis of the investigator's notes gave no evidence that 460 00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:03,960 Speaker 1: the home management house children suffered emotionally because of their 461 00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:08,720 Speaker 1: apparently complex social situation. They compared very favorably with the 462 00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:12,320 Speaker 1: control groups and emotional stability, they were less timid in 463 00:28:12,359 --> 00:28:16,600 Speaker 1: the presence of strangers, They cried less during the medical examinations. 464 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:20,879 Speaker 1: There was less thumbsucking and nail biting among them. The 465 00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:24,960 Speaker 1: home management house children were noticeably superior in physical health. 466 00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:28,800 Speaker 1: No ailments of any kind were registered against them. While 467 00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:33,479 Speaker 1: the investigations were in progress, more research was conducted starting 468 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:37,320 Speaker 1: in the nineteen fifties. Fully possible there was other research 469 00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:40,120 Speaker 1: in the interim, but the nineteen fifties research was what 470 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 1: I found doing this. In nineteen fifty five, Iowa State 471 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:47,120 Speaker 1: College and the Iowa Children's Home Society got a grant 472 00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:51,200 Speaker 1: from the Elizabeth McCormick Memorial Fund to conduct a longitudinal 473 00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:55,920 Speaker 1: study into how quote, non continuous mothering and home management 474 00:28:55,920 --> 00:29:00,440 Speaker 1: houses affected babies personalities. They studied about forty baybies who 475 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:03,200 Speaker 1: had lived in the Whole Economics houses, following up with 476 00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 1: babies who had already been through the program, and also 477 00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:09,040 Speaker 1: doing baseline assessments of new babies as they came in. 478 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:12,160 Speaker 1: The practice babies were Group A and had lived in 479 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:14,840 Speaker 1: the home management house for about twelve weeks during their 480 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:18,200 Speaker 1: first six months of life. Group B were infants of 481 00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:20,640 Speaker 1: the same agent sex who had spent a comparable amount 482 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:24,680 Speaker 1: of time in foster care before being adopted. Groups were 483 00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:27,200 Speaker 1: also the same agent sex and had lived with their 484 00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:30,760 Speaker 1: birth families since being born. Because they wanted to study 485 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:34,719 Speaker 1: only the effects of non continuous mothering and they didn't 486 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,880 Speaker 1: want it to be influenced by other possible contributing factors, 487 00:29:38,920 --> 00:29:42,880 Speaker 1: this team excluded children who had congenital disabilities or who 488 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:45,760 Speaker 1: had been born prematurely, and then they did a battery 489 00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:48,320 Speaker 1: of tests when the babies were six months, nine months, 490 00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:51,440 Speaker 1: twelve months, eighteen months, and twenty four months old. In 491 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:55,440 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty one, the team published non Continuous Mothering in 492 00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 1: Infancy and Development in Later Childhood in the journal Child Development. 493 00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:04,320 Speaker 1: Lead author D. Bruce Gardner referenced the ongoing longitudinal study 494 00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:07,120 Speaker 1: as well as efforts to track down older children who 495 00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:11,040 Speaker 1: had been previously living in these management homes. Of sixty 496 00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:13,920 Speaker 1: two children between the ages of nine and seventeen who 497 00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:17,000 Speaker 1: had been through the program, twenty nine were still living 498 00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:20,400 Speaker 1: in Iowa. That was Group A. They compared those twenty 499 00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:23,240 Speaker 1: nine children to children living in the same communities who 500 00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:25,600 Speaker 1: were of the same age and sex but had been 501 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:29,680 Speaker 1: raised in their birth family Group B. They also factored 502 00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:34,040 Speaker 1: in things like socioeconomic status, parents, education, and the children's 503 00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:38,680 Speaker 1: intelligence when making these comparisons. Then, the researchers administered a 504 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:42,440 Speaker 1: number of tests, including the California Test of Personality and 505 00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:46,000 Speaker 1: the Iowa Every Pupil Test of Basic Skills, to these 506 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:48,600 Speaker 1: two groups of children, and they found little to no 507 00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:52,560 Speaker 1: difference between the two groups. The difference between their quote 508 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:56,640 Speaker 1: personal adjustment scores was close enough to the threshold of 509 00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:59,520 Speaker 1: significant that it was noted as something that should not 510 00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:02,400 Speaker 1: be were looked, but it also was something that they 511 00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:05,520 Speaker 1: couldn't really say was conclusive. They also had a separate 512 00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:09,440 Speaker 1: psychologist conduct a study to evaluate whether the children's responses 513 00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:13,520 Speaker 1: to frustrations were healthy or mature. In the twenty nine 514 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:16,520 Speaker 1: older children, the response from the child in Group A 515 00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:21,760 Speaker 1: was considered healthier twelve times, and in group B seventeen times. 516 00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:24,080 Speaker 1: So there was a slight difference in favor of the 517 00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:26,720 Speaker 1: children who had been raised in their birth families, but 518 00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:30,440 Speaker 1: again not one that met the threshold of significance the 519 00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:34,840 Speaker 1: overall conclusion quote In none of these variables could differences 520 00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:38,000 Speaker 1: be attributed to the factor of discontinuity of mothering in 521 00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:42,640 Speaker 1: early childhood. Tracking down the final results of that longitudinal 522 00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 1: study proved to be a little trickier. I spent a 523 00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:49,560 Speaker 1: lot of time going through old journals um looking for 524 00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:54,400 Speaker 1: like a final comprehensive result. In nineteen sixty four, Physical 525 00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:57,600 Speaker 1: Status and Non Continuous Mothering was published in the Journal 526 00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:00,760 Speaker 1: of Home Economics, and that discussed only of the children's 527 00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:05,160 Speaker 1: physical measurements. That particular paper found no differences between the 528 00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:08,440 Speaker 1: two groups that could be attributed to their their time 529 00:32:08,560 --> 00:32:11,800 Speaker 1: in a in a Practice baby program, but other papers 530 00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:16,880 Speaker 1: summarizing the work characterized it as showing no meaningful differences 531 00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:20,400 Speaker 1: that would suggest that the non continuous mothering was harmful 532 00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 1: to the babies. So again, these are small studies looking 533 00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:27,680 Speaker 1: only at children who lived at Iowa State College, usually 534 00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:30,840 Speaker 1: for twelve weeks, usually in their first six months of life. 535 00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:34,920 Speaker 1: So you can't necessarily apply these findings to other programs, 536 00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:38,080 Speaker 1: which may have kept children for longer or shorter periods, 537 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,479 Speaker 1: or earlier or later in their life. At the same time, 538 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:45,040 Speaker 1: all this research and the general concerns about whether these 539 00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:47,239 Speaker 1: babies would have been better off in a home with 540 00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:51,640 Speaker 1: just one mother were informed by perceptions of how families 541 00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:55,440 Speaker 1: and motherhood should work and specifically what women should be. 542 00:32:56,000 --> 00:32:59,040 Speaker 1: The idea that children should live in a small family 543 00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 1: unit with one parent being their primary caregiver, and that 544 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:06,400 Speaker 1: parents specifically being their mother was seen as the normal 545 00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:09,920 Speaker 1: standard that families should aspire to, but that is definitely 546 00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:14,160 Speaker 1: not universal. For example, research into societies that are more 547 00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:18,440 Speaker 1: communal or more likely to have large, extended families with 548 00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:22,200 Speaker 1: many family members all contributing to a baby's care, that 549 00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:26,480 Speaker 1: research doesn't suggest that those other types of families cause 550 00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:31,040 Speaker 1: attachment disorders. As this research was happening the same societal 551 00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:34,200 Speaker 1: changes that were shifting the field of home economics, we're 552 00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:37,680 Speaker 1: also leading to the end of practice houses and practice babies. 553 00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:41,960 Speaker 1: In addition to changing expectations related to gender and work, 554 00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:46,400 Speaker 1: ideas around parenting were also changing. There was a move 555 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:50,200 Speaker 1: away from the strictly measured, scheduled, very scientific idea of 556 00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:54,360 Speaker 1: mothercraft to a more relaxed and intuitive model illustrated by 557 00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:57,959 Speaker 1: Benjamin's Box. The Common Sense Book of Baby and Childcare, 558 00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:02,200 Speaker 1: which was first published in eight It's first chapter, which 559 00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:05,560 Speaker 1: is called Trust Yourself, starts off quote you know more 560 00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:08,960 Speaker 1: than you think you do. So we know very little 561 00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:11,520 Speaker 1: about the adult lives of people who spent part of 562 00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:15,960 Speaker 1: their infancy in a practice house. Because of confidentiality rules 563 00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:21,080 Speaker 1: and sealed adoption records and attitudes about adoption in previous decades. 564 00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:24,359 Speaker 1: It's possible that there are people living today who were 565 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 1: in these practice baby programs and don't actually know about it. However, 566 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:31,600 Speaker 1: in the nineteen nineties, the stories of two different former 567 00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:36,719 Speaker 1: practice babies made headlines. One was Donald Aldinger, whose reunion 568 00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:39,880 Speaker 1: with at least four home X students at Cedarcrest College 569 00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:43,360 Speaker 1: in Allentown, Pennsylvania was covered in The Morning Call in 570 00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:48,520 Speaker 1: nineteen three. Aldinger had been declared abandoned shortly after his 571 00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:52,000 Speaker 1: nineteen forty six births because his mother was incarcerated for 572 00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:55,359 Speaker 1: vagrancy at the time. He was known as Donnie. At 573 00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:58,759 Speaker 1: the cedar Crest practice house, Aldinger was placed with a 574 00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:01,560 Speaker 1: foster family at the age of thirteen months and raised 575 00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:04,400 Speaker 1: on a dairy farm with many many other foster children 576 00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:07,680 Speaker 1: who came and win Aldinger was there until the age 577 00:35:07,719 --> 00:35:11,400 Speaker 1: of seventeen. After meeting some of his practice mothers, he 578 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:14,000 Speaker 1: was quoted as saying, for the first time in my life, 579 00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:17,200 Speaker 1: I feel like everybody else who had a family. Articles 580 00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:21,319 Speaker 1: about his experience, framens is like having reconnected with somebody 581 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:26,239 Speaker 1: in a generally positive experience. Shirley Kirkman's story, published in 582 00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:31,239 Speaker 1: Oregon in is almost the opposite. Kirkman had been a 583 00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:34,760 Speaker 1: practice baby in the nineteen thirties at Oregon State College 584 00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:38,840 Speaker 1: before being adopted. She described this home as a lonely 585 00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:42,400 Speaker 1: one with her mother quote chili and her father addicted 586 00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:45,440 Speaker 1: to alcohol. In terms of her time in the practice house, 587 00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:48,000 Speaker 1: she was quoted as saying, quote, I'm sure I got 588 00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:51,239 Speaker 1: excellent care. That's not the hurtful part. It's that I 589 00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:55,839 Speaker 1: was used. Kirkman had thirty four students involved in her care, 590 00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,400 Speaker 1: and she described her experiences as an infant as leaving 591 00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:03,560 Speaker 1: her una to love and quote dead inside. In addition 592 00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:07,080 Speaker 1: to the book The Irresistible Henry House, which we mentioned earlier, 593 00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:10,719 Speaker 1: there's another work of fiction about this that's related, which 594 00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:13,600 Speaker 1: is Carol Shields The Republic of Love. And if you're 595 00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:16,640 Speaker 1: still interested in more, there is also a play which 596 00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:19,760 Speaker 1: is called Borrowed Babies, and that was written by Jennifer Blackmer. 597 00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:25,320 Speaker 1: In a weird twist of googling, UM, I learned about 598 00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:29,000 Speaker 1: this play by trying to figure out whether my grandmother's 599 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:33,520 Speaker 1: home mech program had a practice house, which it did. 600 00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:36,920 Speaker 1: I don't know if it did while she was in 601 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:39,839 Speaker 1: school there because the article that I found talking about 602 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:42,400 Speaker 1: the practice out there was from the forties and she graduated. 603 00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:47,879 Speaker 1: UM and the uh that uh that college had put 604 00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:50,640 Speaker 1: on a performance of this show, and like that was 605 00:36:50,680 --> 00:36:54,799 Speaker 1: how I wound up finding it by about them by 606 00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:58,080 Speaker 1: coincidence doing a performance of this show. So that is 607 00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:02,360 Speaker 1: the practice Babies, I uh. I. A lot of articles, 608 00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:07,000 Speaker 1: like just popular articles, not necessarily academic articles that have 609 00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:09,719 Speaker 1: been written about it in the last ten years have 610 00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:13,000 Speaker 1: a just a horrified tone and describe it with words 611 00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:18,600 Speaker 1: like dystopian um. And there's a lot of reason to 612 00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:22,480 Speaker 1: be upset about conditions during a lot of this period, 613 00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:25,360 Speaker 1: like so many of these children were living in experiences 614 00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:28,480 Speaker 1: that that were truly deprived and that there's so many 615 00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:32,200 Speaker 1: stories of people being forced into adoption because they were 616 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:36,600 Speaker 1: not married, um, and all of that to me is 617 00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:42,520 Speaker 1: a lot more troubling than the practice house component of it. Anyway, 618 00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:46,520 Speaker 1: I also have a listener mail. Fabulous listener mail is 619 00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:49,200 Speaker 1: from Jess. Jess says, Hi, Holly and Tracy, thank you 620 00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:52,479 Speaker 1: for doing an episode about bees and beekeeping. I'm headed 621 00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:54,840 Speaker 1: into my second season of beekeeping and I'm up to 622 00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:57,880 Speaker 1: four hives this year, all of which are the Langstroth type. 623 00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:00,800 Speaker 1: I'm working with a couple of low goal farmers to 624 00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:03,279 Speaker 1: place hives as the years go on to better help 625 00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:06,640 Speaker 1: their crops out. I'm anticipating getting upwards of a hundred 626 00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:09,320 Speaker 1: pounds of honey this year. Once we all have offices 627 00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:11,680 Speaker 1: to go to again, I'll have to send you some honey. 628 00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:14,960 Speaker 1: I did have one possible correction in relation to the 629 00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:17,560 Speaker 1: use of smokers and hives. While they may have been 630 00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:21,080 Speaker 1: intended to disburse the bees initially, it's not that effective 631 00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:25,080 Speaker 1: in doing so. Primarily, using smoking hives interrupts their ability 632 00:38:25,120 --> 00:38:28,000 Speaker 1: to communicate since they use pheromones to do that. Basically, 633 00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:30,279 Speaker 1: if one bee is anxious about a keeper being in 634 00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:33,200 Speaker 1: the hive, it prevents that from spreading through the hive, 635 00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:36,240 Speaker 1: keeping the bees calm and easy to work with and around. 636 00:38:36,920 --> 00:38:39,840 Speaker 1: I laughed about the privacy wall the bees made, but 637 00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:43,120 Speaker 1: it is possible that they may have done that. Bees 638 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:46,360 Speaker 1: create a product called properis, which is basically be glue. 639 00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:50,040 Speaker 1: It is a sticky, water resistant residue that bees can 640 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:52,160 Speaker 1: and do cote the inside of their hive with to 641 00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:55,240 Speaker 1: help prevent water from getting in. Thanks again for keeping 642 00:38:55,239 --> 00:38:57,880 Speaker 1: me entertained. I've attached some pictures and a video of 643 00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:00,799 Speaker 1: dropping a new hive this year after a split, which 644 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:04,000 Speaker 1: is the manual version of a swarm. Thanks Jess, Thank 645 00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:08,040 Speaker 1: you so much for sending this note, Jess. UM. One 646 00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:10,280 Speaker 1: of the things that I did not get into detail 647 00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:14,680 Speaker 1: about in that episode was that while today most of 648 00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:18,520 Speaker 1: the things that are used in smokers are not considered 649 00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:20,239 Speaker 1: to be harmful to bees and it does have a 650 00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:24,759 Speaker 1: pacifying effect UM, earlier in history some of the things 651 00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:28,279 Speaker 1: that people have burned when dealing with bees UM have 652 00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:31,520 Speaker 1: been things that were a lot more harmful UM, and 653 00:39:31,560 --> 00:39:35,240 Speaker 1: in some cases we're were things that when burned, would 654 00:39:35,280 --> 00:39:38,520 Speaker 1: like really irritate or even kill the bees, which is 655 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:41,480 Speaker 1: of course not done today. UM. And as I as 656 00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:46,279 Speaker 1: I was trying to UH to like narrow down the 657 00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:48,759 Speaker 1: immense history of beekeeping. That was one of the things 658 00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:51,200 Speaker 1: that I did not really get into you as much. 659 00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:55,960 Speaker 1: I could not specifically say whether when I was talking 660 00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:58,600 Speaker 1: about using smoke to drive the bees out, UM, whether 661 00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:01,360 Speaker 1: that was correct or not. Because I've rented that textbook 662 00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:04,520 Speaker 1: and it has gone back, it is no longer something 663 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:08,240 Speaker 1: I can go back to to check the deals without 664 00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:12,360 Speaker 1: renting it again. UM. If physical libraries were open, I 665 00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:16,080 Speaker 1: could have gotten a physical copy from UH from a 666 00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:21,480 Speaker 1: fancy university library, but couldnt anyway. So UH, that is 667 00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:25,600 Speaker 1: a little tidbit about the smoking and the beeves. UM. 668 00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:27,719 Speaker 1: If you'd like to write to us, whether it's just 669 00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:30,840 Speaker 1: for basic listener or mail, or if if you're interested 670 00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:33,560 Speaker 1: in having a question in a in a Q and 671 00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:36,640 Speaker 1: a episode that we're planning in the relatively near future. 672 00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:38,960 Speaker 1: So just a note. We're a history podcast at I 673 00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:42,319 Speaker 1: heart radio dot com and then we're also all over 674 00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:44,960 Speaker 1: social media at missed in History. That is where you'll 675 00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:48,640 Speaker 1: find our Facebook, Twitter, Pinterest, and Instagram. And you can 676 00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:51,200 Speaker 1: subscribe to our show on the I heart radio app 677 00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:54,759 Speaker 1: and Apple podcasts and anywhere else you'd like to get podcasts. 678 00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:02,040 Speaker 1: Stuff you Missed in History Class is a production of 679 00:41:02,120 --> 00:41:05,320 Speaker 1: I heart Radio. For more podcasts from I heart Radio, 680 00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:08,520 Speaker 1: visit the i heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 681 00:41:08,600 --> 00:41:10,080 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.