1 00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:19,119 Speaker 1: Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan. Look y'all, I know 2 00:00:19,480 --> 00:00:23,480 Speaker 1: I talked about my childhood periodically on Body Bags, and 3 00:00:24,079 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: everybody has good and bad in their life. Everybody doesn't 4 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 1: matter who you are, nobody's immune to it. But in 5 00:00:31,200 --> 00:00:35,840 Speaker 1: my childhood, the good times stand out to me more 6 00:00:35,880 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 1: so than the bad. And I could complain about the 7 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:42,280 Speaker 1: bad if I wanted to, but at this point in 8 00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:44,480 Speaker 1: my life, I like to think about the good. And 9 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:47,640 Speaker 1: one of the really cool things about my childhood is 10 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:51,320 Speaker 1: that I spent a lot of time with my paternal grandparents, 11 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 1: and my grandfather, who I call Papau Morgan. I love 12 00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:01,880 Speaker 1: that man. He's a big man, real big men. He 13 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:05,800 Speaker 1: still raised mules, if you can imagine that for people 14 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:08,760 Speaker 1: that would There were actually a group of guys that 15 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:12,080 Speaker 1: would buy mules from him that wanted them to pull wagons. 16 00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:15,640 Speaker 1: And there was actually one old man that still preferred 17 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:20,240 Speaker 1: a mule drawn plow over a tractor. But when I 18 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:23,120 Speaker 1: had free time with my pipe all morning, one of 19 00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:24,960 Speaker 1: the things that he would take me to do too, 20 00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:32,120 Speaker 1: actually was to fish for bluegill that's brim with cane pole. 21 00:01:32,760 --> 00:01:36,839 Speaker 1: And number two was to go hunting. Now, think about 22 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 1: this is that in my family, everything my family did 23 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:46,000 Speaker 1: was for subsistence. They had a huge garden, and it's 24 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:49,040 Speaker 1: not like it was a hobby. They had to have 25 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 1: a garden and it was massive, and they worked in 26 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 1: it all the time. When they went hunting, it wasn't 27 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 1: like it was a pleasure trip. My grandfather would probably 28 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:01,000 Speaker 1: look back and laugh at these guys that pay thousands 29 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:03,080 Speaker 1: and thousands of dollars to go out and hunt from 30 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:07,520 Speaker 1: a helicopter. He did it so that he could put 31 00:02:07,560 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: food on the table. Now one of his primary things 32 00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: that he would hunt for. And I know many of 33 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:18,320 Speaker 1: you guys will recoil over this, will squirrel. My grandmother 34 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:21,400 Speaker 1: could take a squirrel and she would make squirrel and 35 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:23,800 Speaker 1: rice and it was one of the best tasting things 36 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:26,320 Speaker 1: in the world. Now, as I've gotten older, squirrel is 37 00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:30,360 Speaker 1: not necessarily in my repertoire anymore as it were. But 38 00:02:30,520 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: I remember going out in those piny woods in North 39 00:02:34,120 --> 00:02:39,600 Speaker 1: Louisiana with my papa walking along five six seven years old, 40 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:42,120 Speaker 1: and no, he didn't give me a gun. I just 41 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:45,080 Speaker 1: walked along with him, and his eyes were always toward 42 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:48,320 Speaker 1: the sky, looking at the tops of those trees and 43 00:02:48,400 --> 00:02:51,959 Speaker 1: he'd buy a squirrel every single time, and that was 44 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:56,800 Speaker 1: pure joy to me, just being with him, learning from him, 45 00:02:56,840 --> 00:02:59,399 Speaker 1: covering my ears from sound of that twelve gage shot 46 00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:04,639 Speaker 1: gun going on. But today we're going to talk about 47 00:03:05,280 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 1: a case that involves two deaths. One you're very familiar with, 48 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:16,639 Speaker 1: Crystal Rogers, and the other maybe not so much, but 49 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:21,880 Speaker 1: just as important in this case is Crystal rogers daddy, 50 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:25,800 Speaker 1: who went by the name Tommy Tommy Ballard. He was 51 00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 1: actually shot and killed while walking through the woods with 52 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:35,200 Speaker 1: his twelve year old grandson. And it's for that reason 53 00:03:35,280 --> 00:03:38,640 Speaker 1: I really wanted to talk about this case today. I'm 54 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:45,480 Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan and this is body Bags. The older 55 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:49,280 Speaker 1: I get, Dave, the more I would desire to have 56 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:52,120 Speaker 1: a time machine. I wish I could go back in 57 00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:56,280 Speaker 1: time and see my Papa, my granny again. I wish 58 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:59,200 Speaker 1: I could to sit at my granny's kitchen table. And 59 00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:03,920 Speaker 1: they had a very very tiny house. Their kitchen table 60 00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 1: was their dining room as well. We would have Christmas 61 00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:12,120 Speaker 1: meals and Thanksgiving meals in the same room where they 62 00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:14,520 Speaker 1: were being prepared, you know. But it was it was 63 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 1: a joyful scene. It was always warm and everybody's sit 64 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:19,839 Speaker 1: around the table and we talked about things. I remember 65 00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 1: sitting next to my granddaddy and he would actually the 66 00:04:23,800 --> 00:04:28,080 Speaker 1: way he would complain. He would complain about coffee because 67 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:31,480 Speaker 1: he liked it strong. My granny's name was Pearl. He'd 68 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:34,080 Speaker 1: be sitting there and I think she did this on purpose. 69 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:36,000 Speaker 1: He's a big man. She'd make him drink out of 70 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:41,800 Speaker 1: these little, tiny, tiny coffee cups with a saucer, and 71 00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:44,920 Speaker 1: if if the coffee wasn't strong enough, he'd say, Earl, 72 00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 1: you run out of coffee, Oh my goodness. And so 73 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:51,760 Speaker 1: you know, that was that was kind of his way. 74 00:04:51,839 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: And it had to have chickry in it by you know, 75 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:57,160 Speaker 1: in Louisiana. Chickry is a thing that developed back in 76 00:04:57,320 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 1: you know, I think probably pre Civil War. But they would, 77 00:05:00,360 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 1: you know, Southerners shall make coffee out of anything, and 78 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:05,559 Speaker 1: it had that. It's horrible taste to me. I don't 79 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:07,240 Speaker 1: like it. I know some of you guys will take 80 00:05:07,279 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 1: a fist of that too, probably, but I just don't 81 00:05:09,480 --> 00:05:10,279 Speaker 1: like chick or coffee. 82 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 2: Whenever I hear the name Pearl used as a Southern 83 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:17,760 Speaker 2: woman's name, the Beverly Hillbillies and Lester Flatt and Earl Scrugs. 84 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:19,679 Speaker 1: You know, Earl Pearl. 85 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:22,800 Speaker 2: Don't give your love to Earl. I just remember that. 86 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:25,159 Speaker 2: But Bartstown, Kentucky, if you look it up, you're going 87 00:05:25,240 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 2: to find out there is a number of stories I 88 00:05:29,440 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 2: bought Bardstown, beautiful town in Kentucky. The sad part is 89 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:35,160 Speaker 2: the most of the stories that you read are going 90 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:39,320 Speaker 2: to be of unsolved murders. Oh, not unsolved deaths. We're 91 00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:44,039 Speaker 2: talking unsolved murders. In this case where right off the 92 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:47,520 Speaker 2: top mentioning Crystal Rogers and her father, Tommy Ballard. Now, 93 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:53,279 Speaker 2: Crystal Rogers body has never been found. Tommy Ballard died 94 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:57,240 Speaker 2: sixteen months after Crystal went missing, and the only thing 95 00:05:57,320 --> 00:05:59,840 Speaker 2: we know for sure is that he didn't kill him 96 00:05:59,839 --> 00:06:03,120 Speaker 2: so because his gun had not been fired. That was 97 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:06,080 Speaker 2: something that was bandied about at first. Yeah, in the 98 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,279 Speaker 2: cases we're talking about today, the FBI had to be 99 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 2: called in. And oftentimes that is the case when you 100 00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 2: might have a conflict internally, the FBI has to be 101 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,559 Speaker 2: invited in. They don't just come in and take over, right, 102 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:25,240 Speaker 2: And we had in Bardstown, Kentucky. You have Bardstown Police Department, 103 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:28,440 Speaker 2: and you have the Sheriff's department. In this case, Crystal 104 00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:31,040 Speaker 2: Rogers and Brooks Houck had a two and a half 105 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 2: year old toddler that they biologically were the parents, and 106 00:06:35,160 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 2: Crystal Rogers had four other children and they were living 107 00:06:37,960 --> 00:06:41,440 Speaker 2: together under the same roof as husband and wife Brooks 108 00:06:41,440 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 2: Howe and Crystal Rogers. Now Crystal Rogers went missing. Her 109 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:47,800 Speaker 2: car was found on the side of the road two 110 00:06:47,880 --> 00:06:50,280 Speaker 2: days after she was reported missing. And we're talking about 111 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 2: in twenty fifteen, around the fourth of July holiday twenty fifteen, 112 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 2: when Crystal Rogers went missing, it wasn't Brooks how that 113 00:06:58,640 --> 00:07:03,240 Speaker 2: reported his partner live in partner, they cohabitated. That's what 114 00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:05,280 Speaker 2: boggles my mind. He did a report her missing, Joe. 115 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 2: She was reported missing by her mother. Because when Brooks 116 00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:13,040 Speaker 2: house is in Bardstown and he sees Crystal Rogers mother 117 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:15,760 Speaker 2: and she said, hey, Brooks, I hadn't talked to I 118 00:07:15,760 --> 00:07:18,480 Speaker 2: hadn't talked to Crystal. Where is she? He's I don't know, 119 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:20,600 Speaker 2: I hadn't seen her. What don't y'all live together? What 120 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:23,400 Speaker 2: do you mean you haven't seen her? And Brooks just 121 00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 2: goes on about as mary Way like nothing's up. Crystal 122 00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 2: Rogers mother goes well, I'm reporting her missing, and she 123 00:07:29,160 --> 00:07:31,520 Speaker 2: goes right to the police station. Right then, she knows 124 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 2: something is up because this is not how she has 125 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:36,520 Speaker 2: a relationship with her daughter. They talk every day, they 126 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:38,160 Speaker 2: see each other all the time. I mean this was 127 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:40,680 Speaker 2: a very small town. They knew one another, okay in 128 00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:44,800 Speaker 2: terms of friends and family, and not seeing somebody, not 129 00:07:44,920 --> 00:07:49,520 Speaker 2: talking to somebody is an unusual occurrence, and saying I 130 00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 2: don't know is not a good answer. 131 00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:55,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, you're you're right. And it's that familial circle you 132 00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 1: know that you and I talk about so often, Dave. 133 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:00,920 Speaker 1: If there's anything that disrupts that, and a lot of 134 00:08:00,920 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 1: it depends upon the other people within that circle and 135 00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 1: how acutely aware they are of the situation that's going 136 00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 1: on with you know, the dynamics of a couple and 137 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:12,800 Speaker 1: that sort of thing. Is there anything that that kind 138 00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 1: of stinks? You know, that just doesn't line up? And look, man, 139 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:20,000 Speaker 1: when when you begin to think about how first off, 140 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:23,280 Speaker 1: she had not had contact with her mother, right, and 141 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:27,520 Speaker 1: you've got the person in her life that okay, let's 142 00:08:27,520 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 1: face it is the most intimate relationship that you. 143 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:34,160 Speaker 2: Probably have year old child together. 144 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:38,680 Speaker 1: Oh boy, Yeah, and they're domicile together. Yeah, you know, 145 00:08:38,760 --> 00:08:40,920 Speaker 1: to top things off, you you had mentioned something and 146 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:43,640 Speaker 1: this roadway is going to come up a couple of times. 147 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:47,200 Speaker 1: And remind me, Dave, I'm ever heading up to Kentucky, which, 148 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:48,880 Speaker 1: by the way, I love that state is one of 149 00:08:48,920 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 1: the most beautiful places. The farms and oh my gosh, 150 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:55,280 Speaker 1: it's it's striking when you're up there. But if I'm 151 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:58,240 Speaker 1: going up there, remind me to stay off the Bluegrass Parkway. 152 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:04,000 Speaker 2: No, especially around Bardstown. Get off a walk, get a mutle, 153 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:05,400 Speaker 2: do not drive on that highway. 154 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:07,880 Speaker 1: I know, it's like you know, that keeps coming up. 155 00:09:07,880 --> 00:09:10,440 Speaker 1: And you know, when you have a person that is 156 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:17,559 Speaker 1: missing and you have their vehicle found along the roadway. 157 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:21,520 Speaker 1: First off, when you walk up to the vehicle, police 158 00:09:21,520 --> 00:09:24,760 Speaker 1: officers going to check and see, well, check one box, 159 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:28,360 Speaker 1: is anybody in it? And if it's absent any sign 160 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 1: of life or maybe somebody that's sleeping or maybe something 161 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 1: really bad, you're thinking maybe they're deceased and they're laying 162 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:38,720 Speaker 1: inside the visible space, which, by the way, is a 163 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 1: principle within law when if a police officer can walk 164 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:48,600 Speaker 1: up and actually evidence something inside of a vehicle, that's 165 00:09:48,640 --> 00:09:52,760 Speaker 1: immediately cause for them to want to explore further, and 166 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 1: sometimes if somebody's in danger, they don't necessarily have to 167 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:59,240 Speaker 1: have a warrant at that moment time, because it's the 168 00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:02,559 Speaker 1: idea that it's an emergent situation. I actually worked a 169 00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 1: case and you might find this interesting of a fellow 170 00:10:04,920 --> 00:10:08,720 Speaker 1: that was we found dead on the highway, dumped in 171 00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:13,400 Speaker 1: the middle of I two eighty five in Atlanta on 172 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:17,599 Speaker 1: a ramp, and this guy had been brutalized. He was 173 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:21,280 Speaker 1: shot multiple times, including in the head. It turns out 174 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:24,000 Speaker 1: that this fellow was at the Final Four in Atlanta. 175 00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:27,800 Speaker 1: He had tickets to the ball games games. He got 176 00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 1: robbed by two guys. They took his car and they 177 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:34,560 Speaker 1: were later caught in Ohio for speeding or breaking center line. 178 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:37,320 Speaker 1: And guess what the cop wound up seeing when he 179 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:39,560 Speaker 1: walked up to the car and pulled him over. It's 180 00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:42,439 Speaker 1: like that scene from pulp fiction where Marvin gets shot 181 00:10:42,440 --> 00:10:44,360 Speaker 1: in the head and they said, man, what do you shoot? 182 00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 1: Why do you shoot Marvin? And the whole back of 183 00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:50,440 Speaker 1: the interior that car is an Ohio State trooper. I'll 184 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:54,720 Speaker 1: never forget. This was just blasted with blood deposition. 185 00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:56,439 Speaker 2: Oh. He being killed in the car. 186 00:10:56,640 --> 00:11:00,480 Speaker 1: In Atlanta, and they had driven his car to Ohio. Man, 187 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:04,480 Speaker 1: so you know when you when you're taking care of 188 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 1: that man, the wolf's on it. Huh. So when you 189 00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:10,360 Speaker 1: you get up, you know, a police officer walks up 190 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 1: to a vehicle. Now, obviously that's a that's a stop 191 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,240 Speaker 1: when you find a car abandoned on the side of 192 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:17,480 Speaker 1: the road. And how many times do you ride down 193 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:20,320 Speaker 1: the road, Dave, and you might see a car sitting 194 00:11:20,360 --> 00:11:22,080 Speaker 1: on side of the road and it's been there for 195 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:25,160 Speaker 1: a while, and you're thinking, has anybody ever stopped to 196 00:11:25,240 --> 00:11:27,800 Speaker 1: take a look at that car? What's going on with that? 197 00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:29,760 Speaker 1: And why is it still here? Why have the authority 198 00:11:29,800 --> 00:11:32,320 Speaker 1: has not had it removed because it's obviously a hazard. 199 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:34,280 Speaker 1: It's dangerous, you know, to have these things on the 200 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:36,560 Speaker 1: shoulder of the road. But they're going to check inside 201 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: of it and they're going to look for any evidence. Now, 202 00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:42,199 Speaker 1: what stood out to you relative to when they they 203 00:11:42,240 --> 00:11:45,480 Speaker 1: got to her car and and they began to inspect it. 204 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:49,839 Speaker 2: The fact that it was found after she's reported missing. Okay, 205 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:56,320 Speaker 2: Bluegrass Parkway is a busy thoroughfare. It would have been noticed. 206 00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:59,000 Speaker 2: I would have thought before this. Okay, if it had 207 00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:03,160 Speaker 2: been there, so that's number one. Number two, the car 208 00:12:03,240 --> 00:12:06,319 Speaker 2: is found with a flat tire by Maril Mark or 209 00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:10,040 Speaker 2: fourteen on the Bluegrass Parkway. The keys are still in 210 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:13,839 Speaker 2: the ignition, and her purse and cell phone are inside. 211 00:12:14,360 --> 00:12:17,960 Speaker 2: If the keys are in the ignition, her purse and 212 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:21,120 Speaker 2: cell phone are inside the car, and there's a flat tire. 213 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:24,000 Speaker 2: If you assume that she had a flat tire and 214 00:12:24,040 --> 00:12:26,800 Speaker 2: pulled over and then had to leave to go get help, 215 00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 2: she would have left with her keys, her purse, her 216 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:32,920 Speaker 2: cell phone, just normal stuff that we would grab to leave. 217 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:36,520 Speaker 2: So immediately, you know, it appears to me to be 218 00:12:36,559 --> 00:12:40,079 Speaker 2: a staged scene because of the stuff that's left behind. 219 00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:42,319 Speaker 2: Because all you're left with is she had a flat 220 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:45,720 Speaker 2: tire and somebody came along and kidnapped her, grabbed her 221 00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 2: and threw her in their car and took off. 222 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: What lady is going to leave behind her possessions, particularly 223 00:12:52,440 --> 00:12:55,560 Speaker 1: things like a phone that can keep you safe. At 224 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:59,040 Speaker 1: least you have the ability at your fingertips to dial 225 00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:01,960 Speaker 1: nine one one or hit speed dial and hit somebody 226 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:04,760 Speaker 1: that is you know, that can take care of you. 227 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 1: You're just going to wander off on this roadway, which 228 00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 1: kind of painting the picture here. This for those of 229 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:13,880 Speaker 1: you that might not be familiar when you see the 230 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:17,079 Speaker 1: blue Grass Parkway, it's you know, it varies in lane 231 00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:20,000 Speaker 1: size periodically, but for the most part, it is a 232 00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:23,000 Speaker 1: state road that has four lanes. You know, you got 233 00:13:23,080 --> 00:13:25,600 Speaker 1: two on one side going going one direction, you got 234 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:27,480 Speaker 1: two on the other side. It's going to have a median, 235 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:29,920 Speaker 1: you know, and it's going to have shoulders on the 236 00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:31,240 Speaker 1: side of the road, and every now and then you'll 237 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:33,520 Speaker 1: come across a bit. It's not like necessarily being on 238 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: an inner state per se, but it's a well traveled area. 239 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 1: You're going to catch the attention. You know, when you 240 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:42,760 Speaker 1: think about kidnapping, you think about somebody going off the road. 241 00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:46,679 Speaker 1: You remember, recently we've covered this horrible case out out 242 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:49,480 Speaker 1: of Oklahoma where these women were taken down and that's 243 00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:51,640 Speaker 1: a that's kind of a that's an out of the 244 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:55,000 Speaker 1: way location. All right, We're not talking about that with 245 00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 1: the Blue Bluegrass Parkway. We're talking about you know, this 246 00:13:57,840 --> 00:13:59,720 Speaker 1: thing's got traffic on it. I mean there are will 247 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:02,200 Speaker 1: move back and forth. I think it runs kind of 248 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:06,439 Speaker 1: from the south west up to the northeast, and so 249 00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:09,040 Speaker 1: it's a way to get from point to point that 250 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:12,440 Speaker 1: you would see semi trailers on. I mean, you'd see 251 00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 1: campers on everyday traffic on. It's not like a farm 252 00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 1: road like in Oklahoma. 253 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:20,920 Speaker 2: Right, And that's why I'm saying, if her car was 254 00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 2: found two days after she's reported missing, there should have 255 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:28,680 Speaker 2: been based on the traffic and based on who's driving 256 00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:32,040 Speaker 2: along the Bluegrass Parkway on a regular basis, somebody would 257 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 2: have seen the car. They would have reported it. Hey, 258 00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:37,000 Speaker 2: I just saw a Crystal's car. It's not only they 259 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:40,280 Speaker 2: don't know one another, so there's a lot here to 260 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:43,440 Speaker 2: be concerned with. But based on her car is found 261 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:45,640 Speaker 2: with a flat tire and all of her personal belongings 262 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,960 Speaker 2: inside two days after she's reported missing, and by the way, 263 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 2: she's still missing. She went missing in twenty fifteen. They 264 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:54,480 Speaker 2: have not found Crystal Rogers Joe. 265 00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 1: I know. And that's a huge chilling piece to this day, 266 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:02,320 Speaker 1: is that after all of the she's nowhere to be found. 267 00:15:02,960 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 1: And I got to ask a question, do women like 268 00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:12,960 Speaker 1: Crystal Rogers just merely vanish, vaporize, disappear into thin air. 269 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:32,240 Speaker 1: I think not. In forensic science, we do what we 270 00:15:32,360 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 1: do in order to identify, collect and analyze evidence, We 271 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:44,400 Speaker 1: generate reports, and we present it to those interested parties 272 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:47,440 Speaker 1: to do with as they wish. When I'm thinking about 273 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:51,760 Speaker 1: a car like this that's found along a roadway, I'm 274 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: gonna want to know if the owner of the primary 275 00:15:55,560 --> 00:15:58,960 Speaker 1: operator is absent from that vehicle, what what wound up 276 00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:01,920 Speaker 1: bringing this vehicle to a halt in this particular location. 277 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:03,760 Speaker 1: Is there damage to the vehicle? I think that you 278 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 1: had mentioned, Dave, that there was a flat tire. Forensically, 279 00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 1: I don't want to know about the origin of that 280 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:11,960 Speaker 1: flat tire, because you know, you can catch a nail, 281 00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 1: and the Lord knows, I've caught things off of roadways, 282 00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:17,200 Speaker 1: angle iron, all kinds of stuff that have you know, 283 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:22,920 Speaker 1: split very expensive tires from me created or has a 284 00:16:22,960 --> 00:16:26,200 Speaker 1: tire been punctured like on the sidewall by something that 285 00:16:26,600 --> 00:16:32,200 Speaker 1: I don't know, ice picked knife, was it slashed? You know, 286 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:35,440 Speaker 1: we've heard stories of people going through apartment parking lots, 287 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:37,280 Speaker 1: you know, where they'll take a knife in our razor 288 00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 1: slash people's tires, and so there's a lot to be gleaned. 289 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:44,320 Speaker 1: But if you've got people that are living together, if 290 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:47,640 Speaker 1: you're looking for a suspect, there is like DNA evidence 291 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 1: that's within the cabin of vehicle that you would expect 292 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:54,720 Speaker 1: to find within that vehicle. Doesn't mean that those people 293 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:57,320 Speaker 1: might not be associated with with their missing, but you 294 00:16:57,360 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 1: would want to find something that is going to be 295 00:16:59,840 --> 00:17:05,720 Speaker 1: an outlier, maybe perhaps somebody that's unexpected unidentified DNA or 296 00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:08,480 Speaker 1: blood evidence that's contained within here. And I just don't 297 00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 1: know to this point that they've really ever opened up 298 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:11,680 Speaker 1: about that day. 299 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:14,520 Speaker 2: There are a lot of issues surrounding the disappearance of 300 00:17:14,560 --> 00:17:17,520 Speaker 2: Crystal Rogers and the murder of Tommy Ballads, her father, 301 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:21,000 Speaker 2: sixteen months later that have to do with a cross 302 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:25,240 Speaker 2: section of police, Sheriff's Department, the Kentucky State Police, and 303 00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:28,159 Speaker 2: the FBI. And I don't throw that out there in 304 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 2: a minimalistic way because first things first, Brooks hout He 305 00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 2: is the significant other of Crystal Rogers when she goes missing. 306 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:38,240 Speaker 2: They're living together, they have a two and a half 307 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,280 Speaker 2: year old toddler, and they have Crystal Rogers for their children. 308 00:17:41,320 --> 00:17:44,880 Speaker 2: The Brooks house is the male parent of the household, 309 00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 2: and when she goes missing, he doesn't report her missing. 310 00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:52,360 Speaker 2: Her mother has to report her missing. Now, Brooks, how 311 00:17:52,680 --> 00:17:54,680 Speaker 2: would be the first person you would want to talk 312 00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:58,639 Speaker 2: to hey man, tell us what happened? Yep, His brother, 313 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:03,040 Speaker 2: brooks Howe has an older named Nick how Nick how 314 00:18:04,160 --> 00:18:07,520 Speaker 2: works as a police at the time as a police 315 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:12,720 Speaker 2: officer for the Bardstown Police Department. So keep these separate. 316 00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:16,520 Speaker 2: The Bardstown Police Department and the Sheriff's Apartment are two 317 00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:20,080 Speaker 2: separate entities. They don't always work together. Sheriff's Department serves 318 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:25,120 Speaker 2: an entire county Bardstown Police Bardstown City. The Sheriff's Department 319 00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:28,080 Speaker 2: is in charge of this case due to where everything 320 00:18:28,160 --> 00:18:31,720 Speaker 2: was found, and so brooks Howck is brought in for 321 00:18:31,760 --> 00:18:35,000 Speaker 2: an interview. What happened? Brooks tell us about you know, 322 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:38,679 Speaker 2: when did you last see Crystal Rogers because he is 323 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:43,600 Speaker 2: the last person to see her. He is having a 324 00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:50,920 Speaker 2: conversation with Sheriff's department investigator and during the interview, brooks 325 00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:54,760 Speaker 2: how receives a phone call from his brother, Nick, the 326 00:18:54,800 --> 00:19:00,880 Speaker 2: police officer with Bardstown Police Department. Now, Joe and we 327 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:03,479 Speaker 2: actually have the interview. You and I have both watched 328 00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:06,880 Speaker 2: the interview with Brooks Hawck and the Sheriff's Department where 329 00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 2: he lays out his story which we're going to share 330 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:12,400 Speaker 2: with you. But During the interview, Nick how calls brooks Hawk, 331 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:16,120 Speaker 2: and brooks Howk asks, Hey, you mind if I take this, 332 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:18,560 Speaker 2: it's I need to take it, and so he answers 333 00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 2: the phone. We only hear brooks Howke's sided the conversation. Yep, 334 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:30,240 Speaker 2: but I'm going to tell you to me. It sounded scripted, 335 00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:34,240 Speaker 2: it sounded planned out. It sounded like brooks Hawk was 336 00:19:34,280 --> 00:19:36,920 Speaker 2: trying to get his version of events on the record 337 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:42,200 Speaker 2: without ever being challenged. He knows everything's being recorded, and 338 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:44,520 Speaker 2: so there was one thing that he says on this 339 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:47,000 Speaker 2: phone call with his brother Nick. He says, Nick, I 340 00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:49,400 Speaker 2: don't think she ran off with another man, and you're 341 00:19:49,400 --> 00:19:51,040 Speaker 2: not going to convince me of it. They're not going 342 00:19:51,119 --> 00:19:53,679 Speaker 2: to convince me of it, you know. And I'm like, 343 00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:57,399 Speaker 2: so he's laying the guilty party, always lays out another 344 00:19:57,440 --> 00:20:00,359 Speaker 2: option for where the person is, and so is that 345 00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:03,639 Speaker 2: out there? But then he says, well, Nick, I'm just 346 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:05,399 Speaker 2: here to help. I just they need my help. I 347 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:07,800 Speaker 2: just want to help him find her. And if you 348 00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 2: say I need to leave because they're gonna jam me up, 349 00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 2: I'll leave. If you're telling me to leave. 350 00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:12,280 Speaker 1: I'll leave. 351 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:14,720 Speaker 2: And so he has the excuse, Hey, my brother. The 352 00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:16,879 Speaker 2: police officer just told me to end this because you 353 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:19,320 Speaker 2: guys are going to try to frame me, and he leaves, 354 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:22,119 Speaker 2: not before the police tell him, well, you're the main suspect. 355 00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:25,159 Speaker 2: You got holes in your story, man Nick out By 356 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:27,560 Speaker 2: the way, the older brother lost his job by doing that. 357 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, I call. Yeah. It seems staged to me, at least, 358 00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 1: it reminded me back when Saturday Night Live was something 359 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:40,000 Speaker 1: that I watched during the days of John Lovetz. He 360 00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:43,159 Speaker 1: did an over the top presentation of being an actor 361 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:45,119 Speaker 1: and he would do his hand up in there and 362 00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:48,440 Speaker 1: say I am an actor, you know, like that and 363 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:51,680 Speaker 1: that kind of it's kind of smacked of that. Oh yeah, 364 00:20:51,680 --> 00:20:54,119 Speaker 1: and listen, let me let me kind of interject this 365 00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:55,280 Speaker 1: into the conversation. 366 00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:58,280 Speaker 2: I thought, you're going to go with Morgan Fairchade. 367 00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:00,439 Speaker 1: No, No, not that one. No, I'm going to do 368 00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:03,199 Speaker 1: that one. But the idea that he's bold enough to 369 00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:07,120 Speaker 1: have this conversation and some people I've heard, actual people 370 00:21:07,200 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 1: that have criticized the police officer for allowing him to 371 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:14,080 Speaker 1: take that phone call. Let me tell you something. Police 372 00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:19,960 Speaker 1: are about harvesting data information and anything that you say, 373 00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:25,399 Speaker 1: anything that you say, anything that you say or do. 374 00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 1: Where it's being taped or recorded, it has potential utility 375 00:21:31,080 --> 00:21:36,200 Speaker 1: for their case. So the fact that he allowed him 376 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:39,720 Speaker 1: to have this conversation. If he had said, no, put 377 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:44,000 Speaker 1: it away, we're talking right now, we want to continue 378 00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:47,320 Speaker 1: this conversation, we wouldn't have even though it's a one 379 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:50,480 Speaker 1: sided conversation that he was having on the phone, we 380 00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:53,359 Speaker 1: wouldn't have that. It wouldn't be documented. And I think 381 00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:57,000 Speaker 1: for investigators, and certainly now in the wake of you know, 382 00:21:57,119 --> 00:22:00,640 Speaker 1: Loath these many years later, we have the FBI that's 383 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:03,320 Speaker 1: involved in the case. You think those guys have looked 384 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:06,000 Speaker 1: and looked at that video and listened to it. 385 00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:09,639 Speaker 2: That video was four days after after her disappearance. By 386 00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 2: the way, it was not even a week. It was 387 00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:16,120 Speaker 2: four days. Okay, they've got Brooks in there, four days 388 00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:20,320 Speaker 2: after she goes missing, and they're getting him his story. 389 00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:23,120 Speaker 2: This is the first thing police have to do. You're 390 00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:25,399 Speaker 2: a suspect because you're in the relationship with her, but 391 00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:27,399 Speaker 2: you got your last person that saw her, you know, 392 00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:29,880 Speaker 2: and we need to know where you were, what you 393 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:32,560 Speaker 2: two were doing, and they're gonna get that story. And 394 00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:35,640 Speaker 2: this is the story you're held That's why attorneys say, 395 00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:39,359 Speaker 2: do not talk to police ever, because whatever you say 396 00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:43,560 Speaker 2: is now your story. That's my story, and I'm sticking 397 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 2: to it. Okay, you're anything you change from here on 398 00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:48,720 Speaker 2: out proves you're a liar, right so. 399 00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:50,840 Speaker 1: And that's the way, that's the way it would roll 400 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:53,240 Speaker 1: roll on. But you know, looking at this on the 401 00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:56,240 Speaker 1: flip side as well, you know we talked about the intimacy, 402 00:22:56,680 --> 00:23:00,840 Speaker 1: level of intimacy with this relationship. Let me tell you something. 403 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:08,080 Speaker 1: If this was my precious wife, i'd, you know, first off, 404 00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:10,160 Speaker 1: they'd have to keep me chained to the chair because 405 00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:12,800 Speaker 1: I'm gonna be out beating the bushes looking. I'm gonna 406 00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:15,760 Speaker 1: be up and down, up and down that parkway out there, 407 00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:18,920 Speaker 1: the Bluegrass Parkway, which you and I have both now 408 00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:23,719 Speaker 1: sworn off of. I'm gonna be beating the bushes out there, 409 00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:26,439 Speaker 1: and I'm gonna be looking. I'm gonna assemble friends, I'm 410 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 1: gonna do everything that I can and look, let the 411 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:31,720 Speaker 1: hide come with the hairs, they say. I'm gonna be 412 00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:35,760 Speaker 1: going through this area as rigorously as I possibly can 413 00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:39,720 Speaker 1: to try to track down this person that I've got 414 00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 1: a child with, that I've shared a life with. But 415 00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:46,359 Speaker 1: the problem is, Dave, is that we don't see this 416 00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:50,760 Speaker 1: coming through. We don't see that kind of evangelical zeal here. 417 00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:55,280 Speaker 1: And for an investigator that's digging into this, and when 418 00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:57,800 Speaker 1: you've got somebody that I'm sure they picked up on 419 00:23:57,960 --> 00:24:00,760 Speaker 1: pretty quickly, it seems to be kind of play acting, 420 00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:05,720 Speaker 1: if you will. There are a lot more unanswered questions 421 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:31,120 Speaker 1: to come. In Alabama. We're known here and to maybe 422 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:34,679 Speaker 1: a lesser degree, Alabama has quite the reputation though for 423 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:37,960 Speaker 1: severe weather. It's a part and parcels living here, and 424 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:40,320 Speaker 1: you know, we deal with tornadoes and all those sorts 425 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:43,720 Speaker 1: of things. But the old adage that comes to mind 426 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:46,800 Speaker 1: for me when you talk about storms. I know it's 427 00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:51,240 Speaker 1: a metaphor for life, but the idea of lightning never 428 00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:56,639 Speaker 1: striking twice in the same location, there is some truth 429 00:24:56,760 --> 00:25:00,480 Speaker 1: to that, I think, both as a metaphor and there 430 00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:02,120 Speaker 1: are people out there that have been struck by light 431 00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:05,679 Speaker 1: in multiple times. But for the most part, to have 432 00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:10,920 Speaker 1: two critical events happen in such close proximity. And I'm 433 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:15,320 Speaker 1: talking about Crystal Rogers and I'm talking about her daddy, Tommy. Dave, 434 00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:19,480 Speaker 1: what are the odds that this that this could actually occur? 435 00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,600 Speaker 1: And here's that. Here's our favorite roadway again. I've got 436 00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 1: to see it again, the Parkway, the Bluegrass Parkway. You know, 437 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:30,560 Speaker 1: these these two events happen in proximity to this roadway. 438 00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:33,960 Speaker 1: That's that's why it seems cursed to me almost it is. 439 00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:39,480 Speaker 2: And to get to Tommy Ballard, Crystal Rogers father, sixteen 440 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:41,840 Speaker 2: months after she's missing, now I want to go back 441 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:45,119 Speaker 2: very quickly. Brooks How in a relationship with Crystal Rogers. 442 00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 2: They have a two and a half year old toddler. Now, 443 00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:50,560 Speaker 2: as part of his story for what he was doing 444 00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:53,520 Speaker 2: when they last saw each other, brooks How told police 445 00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:55,800 Speaker 2: that he actually he and Crystal Rogers were at his 446 00:25:55,880 --> 00:26:02,400 Speaker 2: mom's farm. Okay, at brooks House's mom and at midnight, 447 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:04,800 Speaker 2: we're talking in the middle of the night, that's what 448 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,960 Speaker 2: he told. They were just out walking around. Now the 449 00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:12,600 Speaker 2: officer is at the toddler's two and a half years old. 450 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:14,920 Speaker 2: Who goes out to a farm in the middle of 451 00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:16,639 Speaker 2: the night with a two and a half year old 452 00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:20,719 Speaker 2: nobody because they can't walk really without you know, you 453 00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:23,760 Speaker 2: can't see there's just a lot wrong with his story. 454 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:27,320 Speaker 2: But you have to look at his story and figure 455 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:30,280 Speaker 2: out what's he trying to spend Is he trying to 456 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:33,560 Speaker 2: set himself up as being at the farm property in 457 00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:36,520 Speaker 2: the middle of the night in case somebody saw, Because 458 00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:41,359 Speaker 2: that's what it sounds like now. Early on, they brought 459 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:45,040 Speaker 2: out tracker dogs to these different sites that Brooks Houck 460 00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:47,760 Speaker 2: has mentioned, including the farm, because they wanted to track 461 00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:50,440 Speaker 2: Crystal Rogers. You know, did they pick Crystal up out 462 00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:55,800 Speaker 2: at the farm? Well, they did. These dogs tracked Crystal 463 00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:59,960 Speaker 2: Rogers out at brooks House's mom's farm without any trouble 464 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:02,639 Speaker 2: at all. But you know what they didn't do. The 465 00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:06,760 Speaker 2: dogs went were the same dogs that tracked Crystal Rogers' 466 00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:10,000 Speaker 2: body out at the farm. They were also brought to 467 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:13,560 Speaker 2: her car on Bluegrass Parkway to see did she get 468 00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:17,320 Speaker 2: out of that car and walk? Those same dogs malfunctioned 469 00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:20,360 Speaker 2: and couldn't pick up a scent. So they can pick 470 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:23,440 Speaker 2: her scent up at the farm, but they can't pick 471 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:28,480 Speaker 2: her scent up at her car on the Bluegrass Parkway. 472 00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:32,800 Speaker 2: What does that tell you? Okay, so here we go. 473 00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:35,359 Speaker 2: We know she was at the park because we know 474 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:37,800 Speaker 2: that's what they were told. We also know that Nick 475 00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:40,440 Speaker 2: how tells his brother Brooks get out of there don't 476 00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:43,600 Speaker 2: talk to the Sheriff's department. So now Nick, how wait, 477 00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 2: why are you telling your brother to not do this? 478 00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:48,120 Speaker 2: This is an unwritten rule. You don't do this, man. 479 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,320 Speaker 2: So now Nick Hawk is in trouble with his boss. 480 00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:54,400 Speaker 2: He's also now a suspect because why is he doing 481 00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 2: this with his brother? So here we go. They can't 482 00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:01,359 Speaker 2: find Crystal Rogers anywhere. They've got signs they keep putting up, 483 00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:03,560 Speaker 2: and you know what, somebody goes around town and takes 484 00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 2: these signs down. Joe, Crystal Rodgers is missing. They have 485 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:09,800 Speaker 2: this huge bourbon festival. Bartstown is like the Bourbon capital 486 00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:12,399 Speaker 2: of the world, right Bartstown, Kentucky, for crying out loud, 487 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:15,120 Speaker 2: and they have thousands of people that come into Bartstown 488 00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:18,479 Speaker 2: and the people they were really trying to find Crystal Rogers. 489 00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:21,400 Speaker 2: Help us find she's missing. This mother of five, thirty 490 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:23,560 Speaker 2: five years old is missing. Police help, and they're putting 491 00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:26,320 Speaker 2: signs everywhere so that everybody, the thousands of people that 492 00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:28,280 Speaker 2: come to the festival will be able to help us 493 00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:33,760 Speaker 2: find Crystal. But you know what, somebody, somebody is taking 494 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:38,040 Speaker 2: the flyers down, taking the signs down. Right before all 495 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:39,720 Speaker 2: these thousands of be able to get to they're taking 496 00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:41,560 Speaker 2: them down? Who would do that? 497 00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:43,960 Speaker 1: What kind of monster takes those down? Who could be 498 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,560 Speaker 1: that bold? Or who could be who could be that 499 00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:50,120 Speaker 1: emboldened in order to do this? And the fact that 500 00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:53,920 Speaker 1: you know, she seems literally to vanish into thin air. 501 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:56,760 Speaker 1: M h. I think relative to the car, did the 502 00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:01,800 Speaker 1: dogs actually, as you had said, function out there had 503 00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:07,000 Speaker 1: to have or or or was the car driven out 504 00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:13,040 Speaker 1: there without her presence? And they've worked before? So what 505 00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:17,160 Speaker 1: has happened in between those times where they don't you know, 506 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:19,560 Speaker 1: they don't get a hit that they're and it's not 507 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:24,160 Speaker 1: like you're talking about a single animal, and so what 508 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:26,560 Speaker 1: are what are yeah? What are the odds? Now when 509 00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:28,200 Speaker 1: you begin to think about this, because. 510 00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:30,720 Speaker 2: She'd be tied and she was there, you would expect 511 00:29:30,760 --> 00:29:31,880 Speaker 2: that she would have gotten out of the car to 512 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:35,000 Speaker 2: at least look, hey, what's going on? You know, and 513 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:37,880 Speaker 2: so you would have that they didn't pick up anything, Joe, nothing, 514 00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:40,120 Speaker 2: the same dogs picked up at the house. 515 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:43,920 Speaker 1: It's it's fascinating when you think about that relative to 516 00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:48,640 Speaker 1: what's and she's not unfamiliar with this area, right, Okay, 517 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 1: this is Kith and Kent. You know, she's grown up here, 518 00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:56,080 Speaker 1: she's got people here. You know that she's going to 519 00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:59,160 Speaker 1: know where to go or you know, know how to 520 00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:01,720 Speaker 1: get access to She has a phone. 521 00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:03,880 Speaker 2: Her cell phone is found in the car for crying 522 00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:06,000 Speaker 2: out loud. You mentioned it earlier. She could have called 523 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:09,080 Speaker 2: nine to one one if anything, you know, But I 524 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:11,080 Speaker 2: want to get to something very quickly because Nick How 525 00:30:11,280 --> 00:30:14,760 Speaker 2: brooks Howk's older brother, he's a police officer, Bardstown Police. 526 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:16,840 Speaker 2: He tells his brother to leave that don't talk to 527 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:20,680 Speaker 2: the cop anymore. So after that his boss brings him in. 528 00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 2: They read in the riot Egg. By the way, Nick 529 00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:26,080 Speaker 2: How gets fired three or four months later. We can't 530 00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:29,520 Speaker 2: tolerate this because they set him up for a polygraph. 531 00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,000 Speaker 2: They bring in brooks How. Nick How, We're gonna get 532 00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 2: you guys on a polygraph. You're telling the truth, okay, 533 00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:38,480 Speaker 2: no worries. So Nick How comes in and he fails 534 00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:42,160 Speaker 2: miserably on this polygraph test and they basically call him out. 535 00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:43,920 Speaker 2: You know, we know you know more than what you're 536 00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:47,880 Speaker 2: telling us. And he has told nick How is told 537 00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:51,040 Speaker 2: we use luminol on the trunk of your squad car 538 00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:54,400 Speaker 2: and it lit up like chernobyl. That's the phrase they used. 539 00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:58,600 Speaker 2: It lit up like Chernobyl. So I don't know if 540 00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:00,600 Speaker 2: they were saying that and true or if they were 541 00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:03,320 Speaker 2: saying it to trip him up. I don't know, but 542 00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:06,760 Speaker 2: we do know this Crystal Rogers still hasn't been found 543 00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:10,240 Speaker 2: in sixteen months after she goes missing. Her dad. Tommy Ballard, 544 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:14,200 Speaker 2: he's with his It's early in the morning. He's with 545 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:18,440 Speaker 2: his twelve year old son, grandson rather, and they're gonna 546 00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:22,160 Speaker 2: go hunting. A pretty common occurrence for those who like 547 00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:25,880 Speaker 2: the outdoors that live around Bartstown, Kentucky. So Tommy Ballard 548 00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:29,800 Speaker 2: has his hunting rifle and his twelve year old grandson 549 00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:35,360 Speaker 2: and they're on their own property, right. Yeah, And somehow 550 00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:38,959 Speaker 2: in the early morning hours, if I'm not mistaken, it 551 00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:45,920 Speaker 2: was around six am. Yes, and somehow, someway, Tommy Ballard 552 00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:52,880 Speaker 2: is shot in the chest from a rifle that can't 553 00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:54,040 Speaker 2: be seen from anywhere. 554 00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:58,160 Speaker 1: Yep. Let me hang on. Let me ask you something 555 00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:01,160 Speaker 1: real quick. First, blush here, what does that tell you 556 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:05,960 Speaker 1: about the individual that fired this weapon? And yeah, and 557 00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:09,160 Speaker 1: and it also goes to familiarity. Oh buddy, yeah, you 558 00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:11,320 Speaker 1: know so that you have to know points of access. 559 00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 1: Here's here's another bit here that's kind of it is. 560 00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:20,480 Speaker 1: It truly is, and you have to understand the utility 561 00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:23,800 Speaker 1: of those of those perspectives. When we're working a shooting 562 00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:30,640 Speaker 1: scene from a reconstruction standpoint, we consider if say you've 563 00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:36,239 Speaker 1: got uh, Tommy who has been shot, you're going to 564 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:39,200 Speaker 1: pull You're going to pull these kind of lines of 565 00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:43,120 Speaker 1: sight that like a wagon wheel, the spokes of a 566 00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:45,960 Speaker 1: wagon wheel kind of radiate out from his body. Okay, 567 00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,280 Speaker 1: but you have to consider, and this is something that 568 00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:52,800 Speaker 1: we assess at autopsy, kind of the ankle from which 569 00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:58,600 Speaker 1: this round struck him. That's where the grandson's testimony, our statement. 570 00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:00,880 Speaker 1: Let's put it to you that way, you know, put 571 00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:04,840 Speaker 1: it out there that way. What position were you and 572 00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 1: grandad in when you were walking and he fell, Because 573 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:13,280 Speaker 1: you might actually depend upon the distance. He may have 574 00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:15,360 Speaker 1: seen him fall first before he heard the report of 575 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:16,840 Speaker 1: the weapon, or he may have heard the report of 576 00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:18,880 Speaker 1: the weapon. He's going to turn his head and then 577 00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:23,160 Speaker 1: witness his grandpa maybe gasp, grasp his chest or just 578 00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:27,120 Speaker 1: fall over graveyard dead right there on the spot. So it, 579 00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:29,200 Speaker 1: you know, one of the things that you try to 580 00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:33,360 Speaker 1: assess it a scene, and once you can establish that point, 581 00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 1: the directionality of the bullet. That's one of the things 582 00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:38,440 Speaker 1: that we always try to do. You know, you hear 583 00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:42,760 Speaker 1: about our assessments at autopsy where we talk about we'll say, well, 584 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:46,200 Speaker 1: it's from front to rear, around travels from front to rear. 585 00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:50,080 Speaker 1: It goes from high to low, which means maybe you're 586 00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:53,080 Speaker 1: in a position of dominance and firing down on a target, 587 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:56,800 Speaker 1: or from below to above. Maybe it lists from right 588 00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:59,840 Speaker 1: to left of the decedent it originated to his rights, 589 00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:03,280 Speaker 1: and we can actually look at these injuries and give 590 00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:06,440 Speaker 1: you an idea. But here's the problem with this particular 591 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,440 Speaker 1: injury that this man has sustained, Dave, is that the 592 00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:14,120 Speaker 1: range is indeterminate because it's not like somebody walked up 593 00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:17,719 Speaker 1: to him and fired this round into his chest, where 594 00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:20,520 Speaker 1: we're going to have soot deposition and all of those 595 00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,719 Speaker 1: things that we'd look for relative to close close gunfire. 596 00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:26,239 Speaker 1: This is fired at a distance, so the only thing 597 00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:28,960 Speaker 1: that you're really going to have is this kind of 598 00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:32,520 Speaker 1: a braided area around the round. And it you know 599 00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:35,440 Speaker 1: where this originates from, you'll see it. It's kind of 600 00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:39,520 Speaker 1: red irritated a little area that's around the actual injury itself, 601 00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:42,200 Speaker 1: and it's because a bullet is spinning through the air 602 00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:45,200 Speaker 1: and it literally twists the skin like that. That's all 603 00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:47,600 Speaker 1: you see on these indeterminate. 604 00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:50,240 Speaker 2: Actually see that in the skin. 605 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:54,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you can. And microscopically you can pick up 606 00:34:54,200 --> 00:34:56,680 Speaker 1: on you take Yeah, you can pick up and take 607 00:34:56,760 --> 00:34:59,279 Speaker 1: sections of it. And it's demonstrated pretty well. But you 608 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:02,000 Speaker 1: can see it with I'll tell you can see it 609 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,040 Speaker 1: with a hand len it's a magnifying glass. You can 610 00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:06,799 Speaker 1: actually take it and see it like that once the 611 00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:09,160 Speaker 1: wound is cleaned of blood and that sort of thing. 612 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:11,960 Speaker 1: But the only thing that it really tells you is 613 00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:15,160 Speaker 1: that it's from an indeterminate distance once you get away, 614 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,800 Speaker 1: you know, beyond Some people have a variety of different 615 00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:21,880 Speaker 1: parameters they put on it. You think about thirty six inches, 616 00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 1: it's generally about the maximum distance. So anything within thirty 617 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:30,640 Speaker 1: six inches you might have shot at getting soot depositions. 618 00:35:30,680 --> 00:35:34,120 Speaker 1: So out beyond about thirty six inches, brother, you can't 619 00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:36,520 Speaker 1: get nothing. And so it's not going to tell you 620 00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:41,440 Speaker 1: how the range of fire. But we know that no 621 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:46,880 Speaker 1: one was approximating him with this weapon, Like some mystery 622 00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:49,840 Speaker 1: person appeared in the woods as they're walking down this 623 00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:53,640 Speaker 1: path and fired the round. Here's another thing too that's 624 00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:57,239 Speaker 1: interesting about this is that, Dave, you know we were 625 00:35:57,239 --> 00:36:00,440 Speaker 1: talking about we're talking about the roosters are just way up, 626 00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:03,879 Speaker 1: all right. This is early early in the day. How 627 00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:10,280 Speaker 1: is a killer going to know about the timetable involved 628 00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:13,040 Speaker 1: when you exit out of your home with your grandson. 629 00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:17,279 Speaker 1: You talk about a total disregard. This might this ranks 630 00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:19,400 Speaker 1: right up there with one of the more callous things 631 00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:24,200 Speaker 1: that we've covered, because you're literally murdering this gentleman in 632 00:36:24,239 --> 00:36:27,239 Speaker 1: front of his twelve year old grandson, just sinking. Let 633 00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:29,200 Speaker 1: that sink in for a second. Is this is this 634 00:36:29,239 --> 00:36:31,640 Speaker 1: something that's going to leave his mind? You remember how 635 00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:33,600 Speaker 1: I was talking about early on, I was talking about 636 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:36,160 Speaker 1: memories that I had walking through the woods of my papa. 637 00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:38,719 Speaker 1: I still remember it to this day. My grandfather was 638 00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:42,440 Speaker 1: not murdered. You know, this is a time that is 639 00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:45,680 Speaker 1: marked in this child's mind forever and ever. Amen, you know, 640 00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:50,160 Speaker 1: moving forward, and so, who's familiar enough with the schedule 641 00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:54,560 Speaker 1: that Tommy would have had, And going back to Crystal, 642 00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:58,560 Speaker 1: who's familiar enough with her schedule to get her off 643 00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:01,560 Speaker 1: the road, if you will, and out of the regular 644 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:06,440 Speaker 1: rhythm rhythm you're talking about a lady that has children, 645 00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:11,160 Speaker 1: five kids. Yeah, she has a very regimented world. This 646 00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:15,600 Speaker 1: idea that are parents, grandparents, You've got brothers and sisters. 647 00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:18,720 Speaker 1: You know that if you're the person in charge, baby, 648 00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:21,879 Speaker 1: you got to keep a time tight timetable and the 649 00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:26,040 Speaker 1: more elements children that you have in the picture, the 650 00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:29,200 Speaker 1: tighter your time is. You don't have time for foolishness. 651 00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:33,120 Speaker 1: So you have to be able to understand who in 652 00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:36,080 Speaker 1: her world, who in Tommy's world would have had enough 653 00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:40,520 Speaker 1: of an awareness of what their daily routine was. And 654 00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:42,799 Speaker 1: back to Tommy, I know I'm kind of running back 655 00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:44,600 Speaker 1: over the same pass here, but there's so much to 656 00:37:44,680 --> 00:37:47,240 Speaker 1: unpacked with this case. When you think about time alone, 657 00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,000 Speaker 1: Who in the world would have known that on that 658 00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:53,240 Speaker 1: particular day, at that particular time, he would have exited 659 00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:56,960 Speaker 1: from his house with his grandson and begin to trek 660 00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:58,200 Speaker 1: off into the woods. 661 00:37:57,920 --> 00:37:59,560 Speaker 2: To hunt from that location. 662 00:37:59,640 --> 00:38:02,920 Speaker 1: By the way, from that specific location, who would have 663 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:03,399 Speaker 1: known it? 664 00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:07,719 Speaker 2: And by the way, that specific location but right up 665 00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:09,359 Speaker 2: against the Bluegrass. 666 00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:13,080 Speaker 1: Parkway access an opportunity and showing up with the tools, 667 00:38:13,120 --> 00:38:15,080 Speaker 1: showing up with the tools to do the job, being 668 00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:18,319 Speaker 1: familiar with the terrain. Is there a place you could 669 00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:21,120 Speaker 1: go and hide? Well, yeah, I mean, oh you look, 670 00:38:21,440 --> 00:38:23,479 Speaker 1: do me a f don't believe what I'm saying. Next 671 00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:25,840 Speaker 1: time you're riding down the road and you're on a 672 00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 1: four lane highway, a state highway, look on the either side, 673 00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:30,680 Speaker 1: look at the brush line that's there. You can't see 674 00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:32,840 Speaker 1: what's on the other side. Now, you might come across 675 00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:35,040 Speaker 1: a field every now and then where it's cleared out, 676 00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:39,280 Speaker 1: but for the most part, you're going to see pine trees. 677 00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:41,120 Speaker 1: You might see an occasual oak tree, but you're going 678 00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:44,920 Speaker 1: to see low level brush, which if you wanted to 679 00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:47,520 Speaker 1: create a hide, you know, if you put it in 680 00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:49,600 Speaker 1: the terms of and let's just face it, this is 681 00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:54,359 Speaker 1: an assassination. I think where that's planned, you have an 682 00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:57,440 Speaker 1: opportunity to do it. This isn't like some random round, now, 683 00:38:57,520 --> 00:38:59,719 Speaker 1: is it, Dave that just traveled out of nowhere and 684 00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:01,600 Speaker 1: have to strike this man in the chest. 685 00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:04,440 Speaker 2: And it happened on November nineteenth, So we're talking about 686 00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:07,680 Speaker 2: the early morning hours of a cold November morning in Kentucky. 687 00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:13,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, and this is right right at the time of year, 688 00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:16,560 Speaker 1: at least down here in south where most deer season. 689 00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:19,000 Speaker 1: White tail season kicks off, you know, so you're in 690 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:21,759 Speaker 1: that area. Well, he's going out. I guess he's going 691 00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:23,799 Speaker 1: to try to bag a deer with his grandson. That's 692 00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:26,160 Speaker 1: probably what they're going to try to do. And they're 693 00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:28,920 Speaker 1: out there, they're in motion. This is property that he knows. 694 00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:30,920 Speaker 1: I don't know. Maybe he's got salt blocks out on 695 00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:34,080 Speaker 1: his property. Maybe he has a specific area where, you know, 696 00:39:34,200 --> 00:39:35,920 Speaker 1: deer going to walk into his field of view and 697 00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:37,680 Speaker 1: he'll be able to take a deer and his grandson 698 00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:39,440 Speaker 1: will be able to witness it. I don't know. 699 00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:43,680 Speaker 2: When you look at this, it says Ballard was preparing 700 00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:45,920 Speaker 2: for a hunting trip with his twelve year old grandson 701 00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:49,560 Speaker 2: on family property next to the Bluegrass Parkway in Barstown, Kentucky. 702 00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:54,360 Speaker 2: An unknown subject fired one shot and hit Ballard in 703 00:39:54,440 --> 00:40:01,200 Speaker 2: the chest and instantly killed him. Yeah. The gun that 704 00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:03,800 Speaker 2: the rifle they believe that was used and the murder 705 00:40:03,840 --> 00:40:08,240 Speaker 2: of Tommy Ballard was once owned by Nick Howck Holy Smokes, 706 00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:13,480 Speaker 2: the older brother of Brooks Howck. This story continues. These 707 00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:16,520 Speaker 2: are Brooks Howk has been arrested and charged in the 708 00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:18,880 Speaker 2: murder of Crystal Rogers, even though they haven't found her. 709 00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:19,200 Speaker 1: Body. 710 00:40:19,239 --> 00:40:20,920 Speaker 2: Now, Joe, I have a question. How do you do that? 711 00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:22,480 Speaker 1: What do they do with you? 712 00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:24,520 Speaker 2: Do you come into play where the police sit down 713 00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:27,960 Speaker 2: and say, okay, Professor Morgan, we haven't found the body, 714 00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:31,000 Speaker 2: but here's what we do have. Can you is there 715 00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:33,720 Speaker 2: any way you believe this person might still be alive? 716 00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:35,959 Speaker 2: What do we do here? And we have the body 717 00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:37,560 Speaker 2: of Tommy Ballard, we do not have the body of 718 00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:38,360 Speaker 2: Crystal Rodgers. 719 00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:43,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, and unfortunately, well, I'll say unfortunately this is from 720 00:40:43,680 --> 00:40:48,160 Speaker 1: a practicality standpoint, there's nothing really that the medical examiner 721 00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:52,520 Speaker 1: can do in that circumstance if you don't have like 722 00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:58,080 Speaker 1: we play into our world, plays into a missing individual 723 00:40:58,440 --> 00:41:01,680 Speaker 1: where they are declared dead. If say, and here's the 724 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:05,520 Speaker 1: term that people people get frustrated with it sometimes. But 725 00:41:05,719 --> 00:41:08,720 Speaker 1: when you have a copious amount of blood at a scene, 726 00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:11,600 Speaker 1: one of the things that we'll ask the medical examiner 727 00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,640 Speaker 1: is this much blood that we're seeing at the scene, 728 00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:18,680 Speaker 1: is this compatible with life? And you might look at 729 00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:20,719 Speaker 1: it and there's really if you have a big blood stain, 730 00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:24,560 Speaker 1: there's no way to actually calculate the volume. Okay, on 731 00:41:24,719 --> 00:41:27,640 Speaker 1: carpet and anywhere else, we can speak to that and 732 00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:31,000 Speaker 1: say Yeah, this, this volume of blood might not be 733 00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:35,960 Speaker 1: compatible with life today. With Crystal, We're not talking about 734 00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:39,440 Speaker 1: a volume of blood. We're talking about a woman that 735 00:41:39,640 --> 00:41:43,560 Speaker 1: has just vanished. And how do people vanish? I think 736 00:41:43,560 --> 00:41:48,920 Speaker 1: one of the most interesting things about about Crystal's disappearance 737 00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:53,680 Speaker 1: and continuing absence. You know she has Yeah, as you 738 00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:56,840 Speaker 1: had mentioned rightly that she's been declared dead at this 739 00:41:56,880 --> 00:41:58,960 Speaker 1: point in time. This is a homicide. It's been he's 740 00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:02,680 Speaker 1: been charged with home side and you do not you 741 00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:05,680 Speaker 1: do not charge with somebody with homicide if you do 742 00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,920 Speaker 1: not believe that subject to in fact be debt. So 743 00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:12,759 Speaker 1: one of the interesting elements is how do you make 744 00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:17,200 Speaker 1: a body disappear? Do you have access to heavy equipment? 745 00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:22,239 Speaker 1: Do you have access to, say, for instance, I don't 746 00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:27,120 Speaker 1: know tools to create cement with. Do you have access 747 00:42:27,280 --> 00:42:30,759 Speaker 1: to the ability to render down a body? And when 748 00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:34,720 Speaker 1: I say that, I'm talking about dismemberment, I'm talking about fire. 749 00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:40,920 Speaker 1: Do you have the willpower and the tools and the 750 00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:49,040 Speaker 1: ability to do that? And still, since we're talking twenty fifteen, Dave, 751 00:42:50,480 --> 00:42:54,200 Speaker 1: as of this recording right now, it's twenty twenty four, 752 00:42:55,520 --> 00:42:58,279 Speaker 1: a lot of water's passing inder the bridge There's been 753 00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:02,520 Speaker 1: a lot of people looking for There are rewards out there. 754 00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:08,160 Speaker 1: There are rewards for both Tommy and for Crystal, And 755 00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:12,920 Speaker 1: to this point, we don't know really any more than 756 00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:17,000 Speaker 1: we have when she went missing. But I'll tell you this, 757 00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:21,759 Speaker 1: the police are still investigating and hopefully at some point 758 00:43:21,760 --> 00:43:24,520 Speaker 1: in time we're going to see more evidence come to light. 759 00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:27,680 Speaker 1: We'll be keeping an eye on this case moving forward. 760 00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:30,160 Speaker 1: I can guarantee you that because this is one of 761 00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:35,000 Speaker 1: the biggest mysteries that I have covered some time, and 762 00:43:35,239 --> 00:43:38,680 Speaker 1: we're going to travel down the Bluegrass Parkway one more time. 763 00:43:40,520 --> 00:43:44,360 Speaker 1: I'm Joseph Scott Morgan, and this is body Bags