1 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:11,120 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:14,240 --> 00:00:17,120 Speaker 2: Well, Elon Musk is now the richest person on the planet. 3 00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:20,319 Speaker 3: More than half the satellites in space are owned and 4 00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:22,160 Speaker 3: controlled by one man. 5 00:00:22,760 --> 00:00:24,640 Speaker 2: Well, he's a legitimate super genius. 6 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:25,759 Speaker 1: I mean legitimate. 7 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:28,600 Speaker 4: He says he's always voted for Democrats, but this year 8 00:00:28,640 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 4: it will be different. 9 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 5: He'll vote Republican. 10 00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:33,159 Speaker 6: There is a reason the US government is so reliant 11 00:00:33,200 --> 00:00:33,560 Speaker 6: on him. 12 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:36,760 Speaker 1: Alon Musk is a scam artist and he's done nothing. 13 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:40,680 Speaker 5: Anything he does, he's fascinating people. 14 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 3: Welcome to elan Ing, Bloomberg's weekly podcast about Elon Musk. 15 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 3: It's Tuesday, September seventeenth. I'm your host, David Papadopolis. Now 16 00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:03,680 Speaker 3: following Elon can be a lot. One day he'll ekes 17 00:01:03,720 --> 00:01:06,880 Speaker 3: out a wild conspiracy theory or offer to give Taylor 18 00:01:06,920 --> 00:01:10,520 Speaker 3: Swift a child, and the next he's inking some multi 19 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:13,880 Speaker 3: billion dollar government contractor meeting with a powerful world leader. 20 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 3: You just never know what you're gonna get when you 21 00:01:16,600 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 3: open the newspaper. Will it be doctor Elon or will 22 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:24,279 Speaker 3: it be mister Musk. Sometimes it's a little of both, 23 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:27,640 Speaker 3: as was the case his past week. In recent days, 24 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:31,120 Speaker 3: Elon somehow inserted himself in the center of some of 25 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 3: the most controversial and ugly moments of a presidential campaign 26 00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:39,200 Speaker 3: season that has been frankly nothing but controversial and ugly. Meanwhile, 27 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:43,720 Speaker 3: his company, SpaceX made history one day and then landed 28 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 3: a seriously good contract the other. To cure the spinning 29 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:51,200 Speaker 3: in my head, I'm joined in the studio by our 30 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:56,400 Speaker 3: regulars Elon Musk, reporter Dana Hall there, Dana Hey, BusinessWeek 31 00:01:56,440 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 3: writer Max Chafkin, Max Hey, David, and Sarah, a friar 32 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:02,400 Speaker 3: who runs our Big Tech coverboard. 33 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:04,120 Speaker 6: Sarah, Hello, thank you for having me. 34 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:06,040 Speaker 3: Okay, so, and then later on we're going to be 35 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:10,359 Speaker 3: joined by Eric Johnson, our Space editor, to talk SpaceX. 36 00:02:11,200 --> 00:02:15,679 Speaker 3: But Sarah, let's start with the e sing. So, as 37 00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:18,520 Speaker 3: far as I could tell, and I was doing my 38 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 3: darnness not to pay too much attention, but mostly failing, 39 00:02:22,400 --> 00:02:26,119 Speaker 3: I've seen Elon on some kind of role. He did 40 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:30,639 Speaker 3: his best to spread the rumor that Haitian immigrants are 41 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:35,280 Speaker 3: consuming cats and dogs. He did, indeed tell Taylor Swift 42 00:02:35,320 --> 00:02:38,880 Speaker 3: that he would give her a child, and then, in 43 00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:41,919 Speaker 3: the wake of what appears to be a second assassination 44 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:46,400 Speaker 3: attempt on the former president Donald Trump. He wondered in 45 00:02:46,480 --> 00:02:50,160 Speaker 3: an ex why no one is taking a crack at 46 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:53,240 Speaker 3: Kamala Harris and Joe Biden Sarah. He would go on 47 00:02:53,320 --> 00:02:57,680 Speaker 3: to delete that ex but the damage was done. 48 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:01,320 Speaker 6: H The deleting was probably the most surprising part of that, 49 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:04,800 Speaker 6: the fact that he you know, backed down and took 50 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:08,640 Speaker 6: it back. I think we are just seeing Musk go 51 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:13,920 Speaker 6: on an absolute power trip over these conspiracies that I 52 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:18,320 Speaker 6: think are very popular in the Trump dvance world, but 53 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:21,160 Speaker 6: of course have have little connection or no connection in 54 00:03:21,200 --> 00:03:26,400 Speaker 6: the case of the Haitian conspiracy to reality. And I 55 00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:30,000 Speaker 6: think that it doesn't matter for Musk. When he took 56 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:32,320 Speaker 6: over Twitter, if you remember, he said, like, you know, 57 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:36,320 Speaker 6: humor is allowed on the Internet. Again, those aren't his 58 00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:39,400 Speaker 6: exact words, but he sees this as like as like 59 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:42,920 Speaker 6: playing online trolling and posting, and am I allowed to 60 00:03:42,920 --> 00:03:43,640 Speaker 6: say posting? 61 00:03:43,760 --> 00:03:44,280 Speaker 3: You just did? 62 00:03:44,480 --> 00:03:47,000 Speaker 6: I just did that is I think the technical term 63 00:03:47,080 --> 00:03:51,400 Speaker 6: for like just going absolutely wild on the internet against 64 00:03:51,440 --> 00:03:54,520 Speaker 6: your rivals and then saying it was. 65 00:03:54,480 --> 00:03:57,360 Speaker 1: All a joke, which is what he said about. 66 00:03:57,000 --> 00:04:00,440 Speaker 6: That Kamala Biden. You know, why have and they've been 67 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 6: assassinated to get comment. Of course, these things that he 68 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:08,920 Speaker 6: does do not exist in some you know X group 69 00:04:09,040 --> 00:04:13,800 Speaker 6: chat vacuum that he has. They have real world implications. 70 00:04:14,440 --> 00:04:17,880 Speaker 6: There have been bomb threats on schools in Springfield, where 71 00:04:18,040 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 6: one of the cities that has been a target of 72 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:25,919 Speaker 6: those anti immigrant rumors, and coming out and adding fuel 73 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:31,440 Speaker 6: to that fire has real world danger. And it really 74 00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:36,160 Speaker 6: doesn't seem to resonate with Musk that that's something that 75 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 6: he is control of, or maybe if he does sense 76 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:41,279 Speaker 6: that he has power over it, he doesn't care. 77 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:43,080 Speaker 1: You know what's weird to me about this is that 78 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 1: Musk is someone who is deeply paranoid about his own security, right. 79 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:50,599 Speaker 1: I mean, he travels with a phalanx of bodyguards, he 80 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:53,880 Speaker 1: has young kids. There are all kinds of like fans 81 00:04:53,920 --> 00:04:56,400 Speaker 1: and stalkers who are trying to like climb over the 82 00:04:56,440 --> 00:04:59,800 Speaker 1: SpaceX fence to get to him. And there was actually 83 00:04:59,880 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 1: like a disgruntled Tesla employee who drove to Austin from 84 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:07,520 Speaker 1: Minnesota after threatening to kill both Joe Biden and Elon. Fortunately, 85 00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:09,600 Speaker 1: like the cops got wind of bit ahead of time 86 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:12,400 Speaker 1: and they arrested this guy. But like Musk knows that, 87 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:15,320 Speaker 1: like there are serious attempts, you know, on all political 88 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 1: leaders and on himself. And so for someone who is 89 00:05:17,920 --> 00:05:20,720 Speaker 1: so paranoid about his own security to kind of make 90 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:25,600 Speaker 1: this flippant, quote unquote joke about the current president. I mean, 91 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:27,800 Speaker 1: I just sort of wonder legally if it if it's 92 00:05:27,839 --> 00:05:30,800 Speaker 1: incitement of violence, because that's certainly what critics are saying. 93 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 1: And I wonder, like, you know, he left it up 94 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,520 Speaker 1: for hours, it got forty million impressions. Did he take 95 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:38,120 Speaker 1: it down because he got a phone call from the 96 00:05:38,160 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 1: FBI or the Secret Service? Or was there just like 97 00:05:40,360 --> 00:05:43,839 Speaker 1: enough of a backlash among his employees, Like I mean, 98 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:46,400 Speaker 1: that tweet was up for quite a long time, and 99 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:48,680 Speaker 1: now he's just sort of back at it again today. 100 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, Max, you looked into the legality question, what 101 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:52,800 Speaker 3: would you find? 102 00:05:53,000 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 2: So in the United States famously has very expansive, very 103 00:05:58,640 --> 00:06:01,320 Speaker 2: expansive view of free speech, whu more expansive than in 104 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:05,200 Speaker 2: other countries. You know, what Musk did is probably legal. 105 00:06:05,320 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 2: The Supreme Court has held that it needs to be 106 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:11,840 Speaker 2: a true threat. In other words, if you're joking, if 107 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:15,000 Speaker 2: you're just spouting off, if you're engaging in political speech. 108 00:06:15,320 --> 00:06:18,680 Speaker 2: I think all of those are potential explanations for what 109 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:22,400 Speaker 2: Musk was doing, and of course he offered the joking explanation. 110 00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 2: You're allowed to get you know, you're allowed to use 111 00:06:26,760 --> 00:06:30,360 Speaker 2: violent metaphors and so on, so it's unlikely that it's illegal. 112 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:33,320 Speaker 2: But I do think Dan is probably right that that 113 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:37,240 Speaker 2: somebody in a position of authority may have complained, because 114 00:06:37,279 --> 00:06:40,120 Speaker 2: of course Musk isn't just a regular guy. He's got 115 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:44,719 Speaker 2: a huge following, and these the words that he is 116 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:49,000 Speaker 2: saying have consequences, consequences for real people. And Sarah brought 117 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:52,400 Speaker 2: up what's happened in Springfield, where Springfield, Ohio, where schools 118 00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 2: have closed, where people are suffering because of these lies 119 00:06:57,720 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 2: that are being you know, transmitted, generated by Elon Musk 120 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:05,040 Speaker 2: and others on his platform, and and like, you know, 121 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 2: we're seeing another version of it. You know, he took 122 00:07:07,120 --> 00:07:11,160 Speaker 2: it down and offered kind of a lame explanation that 123 00:07:11,200 --> 00:07:14,040 Speaker 2: doesn't make sense because I don't think it was funny. 124 00:07:14,280 --> 00:07:16,040 Speaker 2: But of course he's saying it was a joke, so 125 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:19,280 Speaker 2: hopefully he won't suggest that any other public figures need 126 00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 2: to be assassinated in the future. 127 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:24,760 Speaker 6: It's just so so frequently the response to this kind 128 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:27,480 Speaker 6: of thing, this kind of thing is that, you know, 129 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:31,440 Speaker 6: outrage from liberals is kind of the goal. Like when 130 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:34,040 Speaker 6: this kind of thing happens, it's it's like, oh my god, 131 00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 6: we made them freak out again, Like how do they 132 00:07:36,040 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 6: not understand our humor? Like why are they such you know, 133 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:43,840 Speaker 6: I remember the term snowflakes in the earlier Trump administration. Right, 134 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:48,000 Speaker 6: this is almost a means to to provoke, to to 135 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:51,120 Speaker 6: get a reaction, to troll to troll. And I think 136 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:54,840 Speaker 6: that the Kamala Harris campaign their strategy is to kind 137 00:07:54,840 --> 00:07:59,480 Speaker 6: of like point and laugh when when Republicans do that, 138 00:07:59,560 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 6: instead kind of leaning into the oh my gosh, we're 139 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:06,840 Speaker 6: so horrified, this is so scary Sarah. 140 00:08:06,560 --> 00:08:09,800 Speaker 3: Which is what she did so effectively during the debate 141 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:14,640 Speaker 3: when Trump launched into his hole in Springfield. They're eating 142 00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:17,240 Speaker 3: the cats, they're eating the dogs. She did break out 143 00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:19,920 Speaker 3: into laughter. I guess the other question I have, though, Max, 144 00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:23,320 Speaker 3: is when he took it down and before he did, 145 00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:27,880 Speaker 3: I wonder if the government had particular leverage on him, 146 00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:31,480 Speaker 3: given the nature the contracts that he's got with the 147 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 3: Defense Department, with NASAU, with with other departments across the 148 00:08:36,240 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 3: across the government. 149 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 2: I mean, I have to think it didn't get that far. 150 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:44,960 Speaker 2: I mean, it does there is like something strange and 151 00:08:45,440 --> 00:08:50,840 Speaker 2: potentially interesting about about a major defense contractor first of all, 152 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:55,720 Speaker 2: major defense hunter getting so involved in the political processes 153 00:08:55,760 --> 00:08:58,679 Speaker 2: as Elon Musk has, but also you know, obviously like 154 00:08:59,559 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 2: going more towards a tiptoeing the line towards incitement like 155 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:05,560 Speaker 2: that seems like the kind of thing that the Defense 156 00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:08,200 Speaker 2: Department and others probably consider problematic. But my guess is 157 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:12,080 Speaker 2: like FBI, somebody in a position of authority gave him 158 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:14,960 Speaker 2: a friendly call and suggested that what he was doing 159 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:19,240 Speaker 2: was dangerous without having to exert any extra pressure. 160 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 3: And danis So I guess this has got me just 161 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 3: thinking that the whole thing, especially this ratitat that rapid fire, 162 00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:35,400 Speaker 3: you know, him inserting himself into one of these you know, 163 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 3: big issues after another and really throwing himself into the 164 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:43,440 Speaker 3: political sphere is just a window into the extreme politization 165 00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:44,840 Speaker 3: of Elon Musk. 166 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:48,120 Speaker 1: Well the way that I think of it as twofold. So, 167 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:51,360 Speaker 1: you know, on the one hand, Musk is using his money. 168 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:54,760 Speaker 1: He created a super pack called America Pack. They are 169 00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: not just funding, you know, helping to fund the Trump campaign, 170 00:09:57,920 --> 00:09:59,640 Speaker 1: but they are now going down ballot, like we have 171 00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:02,120 Speaker 1: a stor out this morning based on an FC filing 172 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:03,800 Speaker 1: that I spotted really late last night. They are now 173 00:10:03,840 --> 00:10:07,559 Speaker 1: funding like over fifteen house races and key districts in Maine, 174 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:11,559 Speaker 1: in Nebraska, California, Ohio, New Jersey, New York. Like he 175 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:14,079 Speaker 1: is all in. He's like the new Sheldon Nagelsen right 176 00:10:14,120 --> 00:10:17,440 Speaker 1: in terms of just like funding not just Trump but 177 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:21,120 Speaker 1: you know, but very key congressional races in an attempt 178 00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:25,960 Speaker 1: to keep the House. But separately, the way that he 179 00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:28,880 Speaker 1: behaves on X, the platform that he owns, is like 180 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:32,600 Speaker 1: an in kind contribution to the Trump campaign because Trump 181 00:10:32,640 --> 00:10:35,559 Speaker 1: and Vans are running on immigration and fear, and Elon 182 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:39,839 Speaker 1: Musk is all about amplifying those fears and amplifying all 183 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:43,880 Speaker 1: this nonsense about you know, immigration and crime, and like 184 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:46,000 Speaker 1: he so it's like it's like a tacit. 185 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:46,680 Speaker 5: You know. 186 00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:48,760 Speaker 1: I don't know if the campaigns are coordinating, but like 187 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:51,240 Speaker 1: that is the main message of the Trump Vans campaign, 188 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:53,720 Speaker 1: and those are the main messages that Musk is amplifying 189 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:55,040 Speaker 1: on the platform that he owns. 190 00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:57,120 Speaker 3: No, that's absolutely right. And I guess the question I 191 00:10:57,160 --> 00:11:01,440 Speaker 3: have for you guys is, you know, to me, as 192 00:11:01,480 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 3: I watched the way it played out two days later 193 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:06,960 Speaker 3: at the debate. It comes out of Trump's mouth and 194 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:10,680 Speaker 3: that ramble. It comes off to me watching it from apart, 195 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 3: as patently absurd and a losing hand for the Republicans 196 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:16,440 Speaker 3: and for their candidate. 197 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:16,959 Speaker 5: It's not a. 198 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:20,200 Speaker 1: Losing hand because it's all anyone is talking about. It's 199 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:23,800 Speaker 1: like it is a strategy, because all of a sudden, 200 00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:27,520 Speaker 1: everyone is talking about cats and dogs and Haiti and 201 00:11:27,559 --> 00:11:32,840 Speaker 1: immigration and not the economy and abortion rights, and it 202 00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:33,840 Speaker 1: is a strategy. 203 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 2: There's a difference though, between saying it's a good strategy 204 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 2: and it's a strategy. I think Dan is right. It 205 00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:44,160 Speaker 2: is a strategy, and depending on what happens, we can 206 00:11:44,200 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 2: conclude that it was good or bad. But it does not, 207 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:49,720 Speaker 2: on its face a good strategy. I think most people 208 00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:52,760 Speaker 2: when you look at the polling of that debate, the 209 00:11:52,920 --> 00:11:55,640 Speaker 2: polling was very much in Harris's favor. We've talked about 210 00:11:55,640 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 2: the ways that Elon Musk has sort of red pilled 211 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,800 Speaker 2: himself into the fringe and how that is bad for business. 212 00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:05,840 Speaker 2: I think it's also bad for Donald Trump. The fringe 213 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:07,400 Speaker 2: is not a majority, but. 214 00:12:07,559 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 6: If you watch the debate, sure, but people aren't getting 215 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:15,040 Speaker 6: their information from the events as they happen anymore, they're 216 00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:21,479 Speaker 6: getting the information as it's recycled and remixed by online commentators, 217 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:24,360 Speaker 6: and so in that world, this doesn't actually matter if 218 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:27,360 Speaker 6: something is true. It just matters if one of the 219 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:31,120 Speaker 6: people you follow, who you admire says it's good for 220 00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:31,760 Speaker 6: Trump process. 221 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:34,760 Speaker 3: That's definitely a fair point, and you know, all shall 222 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:38,080 Speaker 3: be revealed when they cast the votes in early November. 223 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:40,959 Speaker 3: But Sarah, I would say that a a lot of 224 00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 3: people actually did watch that debate. I don't remember the 225 00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:46,560 Speaker 3: exact number, but it was a significant chunk of the population. 226 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:50,200 Speaker 3: And b again, I get how everyone's talking about it, 227 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,520 Speaker 3: but you know, when Hillary Clinton made that big mistake 228 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:57,160 Speaker 3: of uttering the words, you know, calling a large chunk 229 00:12:57,200 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 3: of the Trump supporters or was it a basket of 230 00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:03,079 Speaker 3: the poor plorable, everybody was talking about that as well, 231 00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:06,760 Speaker 3: and that was an unmitigated disaster for her campaign. But 232 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:08,680 Speaker 3: you know, Dana, you've been doing a lot of reporting 233 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:12,480 Speaker 3: on the activity of Musk's pack. I believe you guys 234 00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 3: are reported recently that they've we've seen some of the 235 00:13:14,840 --> 00:13:16,959 Speaker 3: numbers in terms of the kind of money they've actually 236 00:13:17,040 --> 00:13:19,240 Speaker 3: been spending in the last couple months. 237 00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:21,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's so it's the filings tick up 238 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:24,520 Speaker 1: every you know, like there's basically like a filing every 239 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:27,480 Speaker 1: night that looks at their expenditures and the total spent 240 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:29,400 Speaker 1: by the pack is fifty million. And this is on 241 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:33,319 Speaker 1: everything's from text messages to mailers to hiring door knockers 242 00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:36,679 Speaker 1: and key states like North Carolina and Michigan. But Musk 243 00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 1: is also going down ballot and in this filing last night, 244 00:13:40,480 --> 00:13:43,760 Speaker 1: you're seeing them spend it's like roughly two million dollars 245 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:46,439 Speaker 1: on like fifteen different house races and that that might 246 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:48,079 Speaker 1: not sound like a lot of money, but like we're 247 00:13:48,080 --> 00:13:50,520 Speaker 1: going to continue to see spending between now and November, 248 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:52,720 Speaker 1: and just the fact that they are now targeting the 249 00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:55,760 Speaker 1: house just shows that, like Musk is going for the 250 00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:59,400 Speaker 1: trifecta and you know these are these are key races 251 00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:01,880 Speaker 1: that could that could swing you know, they're just gonna 252 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:02,600 Speaker 1: be very important. 253 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:06,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, we've got actually one of the ads here that 254 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:08,800 Speaker 3: has been produced by his pack. Let's listen to it. 255 00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:09,000 Speaker 5: Now. 256 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:12,200 Speaker 7: If you sit the selection out, Kamala and the Crazies 257 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:15,280 Speaker 7: will win. That means you'll be stuck with igher costs 258 00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:18,600 Speaker 7: and more illegals invading our country. Now Trump is the 259 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:22,440 Speaker 7: American badass. Will stop this nonsense, vote for Trump and 260 00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 7: save America. 261 00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:28,240 Speaker 3: You know what, this whole thing strikes me as as 262 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:32,160 Speaker 3: a lifelong gambler who knows what it's like as you're 263 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 3: getting towards the end of the end of the day 264 00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 3: at the races and your down money max is, you know, 265 00:14:38,520 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 3: you start doubling and tripling down to try to get 266 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:43,200 Speaker 3: out and try to get back to even or up money. 267 00:14:43,600 --> 00:14:46,520 Speaker 3: I get the sense that when he, you know, launched 268 00:14:46,560 --> 00:14:49,160 Speaker 3: in and threw his support behind Trump, things were looking 269 00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:52,360 Speaker 3: rosy and pretty darn good, and now that they're looking 270 00:14:52,560 --> 00:14:57,080 Speaker 3: a little less good, you know, he's like I get 271 00:14:57,080 --> 00:14:59,440 Speaker 3: a little bit of this double and triple down sense. 272 00:14:59,720 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 2: I mean, I think that Dana and Sarah are both 273 00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:05,080 Speaker 2: hinting at this in various ways. But like, you know, 274 00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:08,000 Speaker 2: turning out your base is like one part part of 275 00:15:08,080 --> 00:15:10,240 Speaker 2: how you win an election, and like I think you 276 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 2: could kind of you can, you know, interpret this ad 277 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 2: in that way as like this is a way to 278 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:19,560 Speaker 2: increase turnout among people who are likely to support President Trump. 279 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:22,200 Speaker 2: On the other hand, it does feel just like the 280 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 2: kind like just not something that is gonna like sway 281 00:15:25,760 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 2: a swing voter. I just taken a couple steps back. 282 00:15:28,640 --> 00:15:31,040 Speaker 2: One thing that has struck me listening to Dana and 283 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:34,120 Speaker 2: reading her reporting is just when Elon Musk first started 284 00:15:34,120 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 2: talking about these donations, right there was all of this 285 00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:39,200 Speaker 2: question like is he really gonna do it? He kind 286 00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:41,840 Speaker 2: of created all this uncertainty. He's like, I'm not supporting Trump, 287 00:15:41,920 --> 00:15:45,880 Speaker 2: I'm I'm just creating a meritocratic pack or whatever, and 288 00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:48,640 Speaker 2: like that's all out the window right this. And it's 289 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:50,160 Speaker 2: not only out the window in the sense that he 290 00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:52,200 Speaker 2: is all in for Trump, as you're saying, as we're 291 00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 2: all saying, but also in the sense that he's spending 292 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:58,240 Speaker 2: real money, Like we're fifty three million dollars. That's that's 293 00:15:58,280 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 2: where it is. I just looked according to Open secrets 294 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 2: dot Com. Could be a day or something late, but 295 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 2: like that's fairly up to date in terms of how 296 00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 2: much money they spent. That's a big number. That makes 297 00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:11,160 Speaker 2: it one of the biggest independent committees this cycle to date, 298 00:16:11,520 --> 00:16:13,520 Speaker 2: and there's it's going to go up from there, Like 299 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 2: he We're going to look back on this as being 300 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 2: an election where Elon Musk put a significant amount of 301 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:22,520 Speaker 2: money to work. Comparing Micheldon Adelson I think is the 302 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 2: correct comparison. 303 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:26,560 Speaker 3: And for the uninitiated, Sheldon Aedelson. 304 00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:31,000 Speaker 2: Was a prominent, a very wealthy Republican donor who donated 305 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:34,440 Speaker 2: to conservative causes and was Trump's main backer. 306 00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:34,800 Speaker 7: You know. 307 00:16:34,960 --> 00:16:39,040 Speaker 2: Elon Musk. His rationale for like supporting Trump was he 308 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:44,040 Speaker 2: watched the assassination attempt, the first assassination attempt, and thought 309 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 2: like wow, like this guy is really tough. And that 310 00:16:47,240 --> 00:16:51,200 Speaker 2: that was like how he explained his rationale of support. 311 00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:53,960 Speaker 3: We need to say goodbye to Sarah, but Max and 312 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:56,600 Speaker 3: Dana don't go anywhere, Sarah. We will see you soon. 313 00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:57,800 Speaker 5: Thank you, thank you. 314 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:06,240 Speaker 3: Okay, so we're now done with politics and conspiracy theories. 315 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:09,439 Speaker 3: We're done with mister Musk. We shall now move on 316 00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 3: to doctor Elon and his business empire, which up in 317 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:21,240 Speaker 3: space is doing quite quite well. Last week, his space company, SpaceX, 318 00:17:21,960 --> 00:17:25,959 Speaker 3: pulled off the first commercial spacewalk in history, and then 319 00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:30,080 Speaker 3: a day or so later, a unit of SpaceX, Starlink, 320 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:35,440 Speaker 3: signed a big deal to provide the Internet to United Airlines. 321 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:39,080 Speaker 3: And to talk about that, we've got Eric Johnson, our 322 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:43,120 Speaker 3: crack Space editor. Hey there, Eric, good to be here, Okay, Eric, 323 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 3: So it's my understanding here that with this SpaceX commercial 324 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:53,359 Speaker 3: spacewalk they pulled off that there are a few records 325 00:17:53,359 --> 00:17:56,800 Speaker 3: and firsts achieved hit us with them. 326 00:17:57,000 --> 00:17:57,480 Speaker 5: That's right. 327 00:17:57,560 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 4: So is a big week for SpaceX. You saw four 328 00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:06,520 Speaker 4: crew civilians, relatively untrained astronauts go up and perform the 329 00:18:06,560 --> 00:18:09,400 Speaker 4: world's first commercial space Let. 330 00:18:09,359 --> 00:18:11,040 Speaker 3: Me interrupt you for a second and say, by the way, 331 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:16,560 Speaker 3: while when we say space walk throughout the show here, 332 00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:18,680 Speaker 3: our listeners won't see it, but we're gonna do air 333 00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:21,639 Speaker 3: quotes around walk. Okay, space walk. 334 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 5: I was waiting for you to jump in on that. 335 00:18:24,640 --> 00:18:27,640 Speaker 4: So just to be clear, they didn't actually walk anywhere, right, 336 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:30,520 Speaker 4: This wasn't like the Apollo era moon landings. But they 337 00:18:30,520 --> 00:18:34,040 Speaker 4: did go fourteen hundred kilometers up, which is the furthest 338 00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:36,960 Speaker 4: that humans have gone since the moon landings, and so 339 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 4: that was an incredible milestone. 340 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:39,840 Speaker 5: Another thing that. 341 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:43,880 Speaker 4: They achieved was actually depressurizing the capsule in the middle 342 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:46,199 Speaker 4: Lovelus to set up the walk, and so they actually 343 00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 4: opened the hatch and expose the entire interior to the 344 00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:52,480 Speaker 4: vacuum of space. And so two of them, billionaire Jared 345 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:57,720 Speaker 4: Eisaman and SpaceX is Sarah Gillis, an engineer, actually took 346 00:18:57,760 --> 00:19:03,119 Speaker 4: turns and for a few minutes halfway out of the capsule, roughly. 347 00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:06,119 Speaker 3: They were so frits popping out of like a hole 348 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:07,320 Speaker 3: or something is what. 349 00:19:07,760 --> 00:19:09,359 Speaker 5: Or like a turtle put his head out and then 350 00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:10,159 Speaker 5: sucking it back in. 351 00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:13,120 Speaker 4: But you know, to be fair, they were hurtling around 352 00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:15,600 Speaker 4: the Earth at you know, seventeen thousand miles per hour. 353 00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:19,960 Speaker 4: It's dangerous, precarious, and and so they they emerged from 354 00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:23,840 Speaker 4: the capsule, they did some maneuvers with a relatively sleek 355 00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:28,720 Speaker 4: and skinnier spacesuit that SpaceX designed and test the mobility 356 00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:32,800 Speaker 4: of it, and then went back in, returned pressure to 357 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:36,480 Speaker 4: the cabin and came home, you know, just for people 358 00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:38,399 Speaker 4: to understand, I mean, they were higher up than the 359 00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:41,800 Speaker 4: International Space Station, and so you know, everybody knows that 360 00:19:41,840 --> 00:19:45,280 Speaker 4: spacewalks are relatively common. I mean we've seen them, of course, 361 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,080 Speaker 4: you know in Hollywood, but we see the astronauts and 362 00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:51,880 Speaker 4: their huge bulky spacesuits go out the ISS and they 363 00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:55,639 Speaker 4: do repairs and different fixes on the station. But this 364 00:19:55,760 --> 00:19:57,600 Speaker 4: was the first. This is different than that in that 365 00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:01,040 Speaker 4: they were in their own spacecraft separate from anything else 366 00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:03,639 Speaker 4: and exposed to the vacuum of space for the direction. 367 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:07,520 Speaker 3: Now I get the sense here that a lot of 368 00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 3: this mission was about those super cool, sleek space suits 369 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 3: and testing them out. Was that the I mean, and 370 00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:17,920 Speaker 3: I guess in addition to charging this billionaire money to 371 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:21,760 Speaker 3: give them this space walk or space walk, was it 372 00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:23,399 Speaker 3: all about testing out these suits? 373 00:20:24,080 --> 00:20:26,879 Speaker 4: That was a major mission parameter is you know, we 374 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:30,840 Speaker 4: don't exactly know what SpaceX intends to do with these suits, 375 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:33,880 Speaker 4: but visually, at least esthetically, I mean, you know, SpaceX 376 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:36,439 Speaker 4: elon Musk they love aesthetics. So if you compare the 377 00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:39,600 Speaker 4: suits they were wearing to the traditional suits, they were 378 00:20:40,119 --> 00:20:46,040 Speaker 4: you know, thinner and usually like skinny go skinny jeans, skinny, 379 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:48,919 Speaker 4: and so when they came out of the capsule, you 380 00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:51,440 Speaker 4: saw them moving their arms around. You know, they still 381 00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:54,960 Speaker 4: didn't have total mobility. But the idea, presumably is that 382 00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:57,760 Speaker 4: there's space actual have an iterative approach to these suits, 383 00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:00,639 Speaker 4: so they will be used in some form for future missions. 384 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:03,800 Speaker 4: They'll be upgraded and then you know, when they go 385 00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 4: people go to Mars at some point, maybe some futuristic 386 00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:09,280 Speaker 4: version of this suit. 387 00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:12,160 Speaker 3: Will be used everyone's going to be wearing skinny jeans 388 00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:14,200 Speaker 3: and skinny suits up on Mark. What I mean, Dana, 389 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:17,680 Speaker 3: when you just did that whole Mars interview last week, 390 00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:20,040 Speaker 3: did the I can't remember, did the space suits come up? 391 00:21:20,280 --> 00:21:22,320 Speaker 1: We didn't really talk about the spacesuits. Kirsen and I 392 00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:24,720 Speaker 1: were talking more about like how people are going to 393 00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:27,199 Speaker 1: eat on Mars and what their protein source is going 394 00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:29,080 Speaker 1: to be. But I do have a question for Eric, 395 00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 1: Like I barely paid attention to this mission. All I 396 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:34,119 Speaker 1: knew was that like a billionaire and was one of 397 00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:38,919 Speaker 1: the people on Polaris John, So did he fund this 398 00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 1: whole thing? 399 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 5: Like? 400 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 1: How did this whole how did this whole like sort 401 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:45,720 Speaker 1: of joint venture come about between these private people that 402 00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:48,440 Speaker 1: wanted to go up and SpaceX being the cap being 403 00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:50,360 Speaker 1: the launch provider that got them there. 404 00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:53,159 Speaker 4: That's a great point, is that so SpaceX supplied the 405 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:54,640 Speaker 4: rocket and the capsule put it up. 406 00:21:54,920 --> 00:21:56,479 Speaker 5: Jared isisming bankrolled it, right. 407 00:21:56,720 --> 00:21:58,840 Speaker 4: We don't know how much he's spent to do that, 408 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:03,959 Speaker 4: but he's a massive aviation enthusiast, he's a pilot. And 409 00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:06,679 Speaker 4: then you know, of course you have the SpaceX personnel 410 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:10,760 Speaker 4: that joined and so this is part of the Polaris program, 411 00:22:11,119 --> 00:22:15,439 Speaker 4: which is a multi mission program bankrolled by Isaacman. This 412 00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:19,000 Speaker 4: was one of the first steps or second flight actually 413 00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 4: the first time the private crew went around the Earth 414 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:23,760 Speaker 4: a few times and came back. This time they did 415 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:26,480 Speaker 4: a spacewalk, and then there'll be additional missions in the 416 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:31,680 Speaker 4: future that will culminate at some point with a crude 417 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:36,879 Speaker 4: mission on one of SpaceX's colossal starship rockets. Don't know 418 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:39,480 Speaker 4: when that is, and we don't know exactly what parameters 419 00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:41,720 Speaker 4: or shape these missions will take, but it's part of 420 00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:48,200 Speaker 4: the Polaris program. 421 00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:50,520 Speaker 3: We need to come back to Earth or closer to 422 00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:55,040 Speaker 3: Earth and talk about this big deal that SpaceX is 423 00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:58,840 Speaker 3: starlink unit signed with United Airlines. 424 00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:00,200 Speaker 5: Tell us about it again. 425 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:03,800 Speaker 4: Big week for SpaceX. This was a pretty landmark deal, 426 00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 4: a watershed moment. This was the first US major airline 427 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:11,399 Speaker 4: that SpaceX has been able to woo to its starlink service. So, 428 00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:13,919 Speaker 4: you know, as everyone knows, Starlink has grown to be 429 00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:17,560 Speaker 4: the most advanced and largest, you know, space beamed internet 430 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:23,880 Speaker 4: service globally. They've made substantial inroads with maritime shippers, cruise lines. 431 00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 4: They are on some airlines already like Air Baltic and 432 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:33,280 Speaker 4: Hawaiian and JSX, but they finally were able to crack 433 00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:35,360 Speaker 4: into the US aviation network. 434 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:39,160 Speaker 5: It's early, they have a lot to prove, but this. 435 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:42,240 Speaker 4: Deal is significant in that you know, they've got more 436 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:46,280 Speaker 4: than three million subscribers globally for on the consumer side, 437 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:49,360 Speaker 4: so it's a strong sign to growth. And I think 438 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:51,800 Speaker 4: you saw that in the reaction of the stocks from 439 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:53,000 Speaker 4: legacy satellite. 440 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:53,280 Speaker 7: Yeah. 441 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:55,639 Speaker 3: I did notice that. You know, Visa sat which is 442 00:23:55,680 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 3: one of those legacy providers. Yeah, it's stock collapsed fifteen 443 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:04,879 Speaker 3: percent that day. Go Go another one fell a fair amount. Obviously, 444 00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:09,240 Speaker 3: Max Starlink and SpaceX are private companies, so it's hard 445 00:24:09,280 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 3: to see. It's hard to know just what kind of 446 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:14,800 Speaker 3: value investors are putting on a deal like this. But 447 00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:18,040 Speaker 3: if you take the inverse of those collapses and those stocks, well, 448 00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:21,399 Speaker 3: presumably it's an increase in the in the value of 449 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:22,560 Speaker 3: SpaceX and stock. 450 00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:24,919 Speaker 1: I just have to say, as someone who recently flew 451 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:28,720 Speaker 1: from Washington, d C. To San Francisco on United where 452 00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 1: I had to pay eight dollars for really lousy Wi Fi, like, 453 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:35,680 Speaker 1: I think this is great, like as a consumer, and 454 00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:39,560 Speaker 1: I think that Starlink is going to be a big 455 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:42,359 Speaker 1: It's going to be a big revenue maker for SpaceX. 456 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:44,840 Speaker 1: I guess the question I always have is like when 457 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:48,760 Speaker 1: or is SpaceX going to spin out Starlink, because at 458 00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:50,960 Speaker 1: one point there was this whole idea that Starlink was 459 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,800 Speaker 1: going to be spun out as like a separate business 460 00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:56,720 Speaker 1: and IPO separately from SpaceX as a whole. But we 461 00:24:56,720 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: haven't really heard much about that recently. I mean, they're 462 00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:03,120 Speaker 1: not separate companies. Starlink is basically like the big business 463 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:04,320 Speaker 1: unit within SpaceX. 464 00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:06,399 Speaker 2: So the one thing I'll say about this is that, like, 465 00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:09,080 Speaker 2: it's great news obviously for SpaceX. Totally agree with what 466 00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:11,680 Speaker 2: Eric's saying, but like these companies that you're talking about, 467 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:14,560 Speaker 2: Eric via sad, these are not large businesses, not by 468 00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:17,919 Speaker 2: Elon Musk standards. Like Vasat's market cap not sure how 469 00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:22,119 Speaker 2: much tiny it's yeah it's tiny, Yeah one point seven. 470 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:23,919 Speaker 2: I just looked it up, and you know, obviously the 471 00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:28,000 Speaker 2: stock fell a lot. But with SpaceX, they're talking about valuations, 472 00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:30,520 Speaker 2: and even if it's if it's just Starlink, we're going 473 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:34,280 Speaker 2: to be talking about a much much larger valuation. And 474 00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:37,600 Speaker 2: I don't think it's clear yet that the company has 475 00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,040 Speaker 2: come anywhere near living up to that. Selling internet to 476 00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:44,320 Speaker 2: consumers is a very difficult, very competitive business. It's if 477 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:46,960 Speaker 2: to make this work, it's like going to be some 478 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:49,919 Speaker 2: combination of kind of the Elon Musk Elon Musk kind 479 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,320 Speaker 2: of ability to tell a story, and the story has 480 00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:55,600 Speaker 2: to be that like they're taking the whole market because 481 00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:58,040 Speaker 2: the because the markets for these things are not very large. 482 00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:01,000 Speaker 3: But you know, Eric, for me, actually, I was thinking 483 00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:04,600 Speaker 3: that as I see this deal get inked, and I 484 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:07,520 Speaker 3: think about the way it's increasingly being used in places 485 00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:10,720 Speaker 3: like you know, the remote you know, farms in Brazil, 486 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:15,400 Speaker 3: certainly for all its you know, defense and wartime applications, 487 00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:17,440 Speaker 3: the way it's being used in maritime and so on 488 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:21,280 Speaker 3: and so forth. That to me, I feel like the 489 00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,760 Speaker 3: business model and the growth model for Starlink are starting 490 00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:28,119 Speaker 3: to come more clearly into focus. Max is obviously having 491 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:28,640 Speaker 3: none of it. 492 00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:31,959 Speaker 4: What say you, I think Max makes some very good Max, 493 00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 4: but the growth of Starlink and the challenges. When I 494 00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:43,680 Speaker 4: saw this press release, my first thought is, Okay, SpaceX 495 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:48,879 Speaker 4: has finally been able to demonstrate to a global US 496 00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 4: carrier that this service can be better than what it 497 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:58,520 Speaker 4: has it for years struggled to do that because they 498 00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:00,640 Speaker 4: had capacity problems. And I have to get a little 499 00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:03,960 Speaker 4: geeky for a second. The companies whose stocks were battered 500 00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:09,280 Speaker 4: operate colossal satellites that are orbit in fixed position over 501 00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:12,560 Speaker 4: the Earth, very high up, much higher than SpaceX's satellites. 502 00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:17,560 Speaker 4: SpaceX's big idea is to have thousands of smaller satellites 503 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:21,080 Speaker 4: orbiting much closer to the Earth, and therefore as the 504 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 4: satellites whizz around the Earth and talk to each other, 505 00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:26,480 Speaker 4: they can beam data down much quicker. 506 00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:27,960 Speaker 5: Than these other satellites that are much higher up. 507 00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:31,200 Speaker 4: Now, the higher up ones are really great because they 508 00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:33,639 Speaker 4: orbit in a fixed position and so you have a 509 00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:37,199 Speaker 4: reliable stream of data right where you want it. And 510 00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:39,720 Speaker 4: so the problem SpaceX needed to solve was that it 511 00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:42,320 Speaker 4: needed to launch a huge number of satellites to be 512 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:45,280 Speaker 4: able to compete with this, so that the scale, if 513 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:48,000 Speaker 4: you will, has started to tip in their favor. I 514 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:51,400 Speaker 4: do think Max makes a great point about the rollout, 515 00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 4: because there's major questions about how this technology will perform 516 00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:57,240 Speaker 4: on United flights. 517 00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:00,159 Speaker 3: And eric on that point, and with this we need 518 00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:02,640 Speaker 3: to wrap up here, my friend, But you said that 519 00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:06,200 Speaker 3: this starlink service is already being used on several air lines, 520 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:10,880 Speaker 3: including Hawaiian air How has it held up so far? 521 00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:16,159 Speaker 3: Is it truly superior or even far superior to what 522 00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 3: you'd get on other flights and other carriers. 523 00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:23,440 Speaker 4: I mean, the reports overall are good, but it's SpaceX's 524 00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:26,960 Speaker 4: Starlink is really good at rural and remote locations. So 525 00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:29,840 Speaker 4: over the ocean, right if you think about a ship 526 00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:32,320 Speaker 4: or with its crew sitting in the middle of the Atlantic, 527 00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:35,800 Speaker 4: that works. But as they encroaches closer and closer on 528 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:40,480 Speaker 4: dense urban areas where there's huge demand and pressure put 529 00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 4: on a single satellite from lots of consumers, that's when 530 00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:44,680 Speaker 4: the service can start to bring it. 531 00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:47,560 Speaker 3: Wasn't there a case a couple of years ago, like 532 00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,160 Speaker 3: over Chicago or something, Well, we made it. 533 00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:53,120 Speaker 5: You made it by breaking the news. 534 00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 4: So SpaceX had this big trial and they were with 535 00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:59,560 Speaker 4: Delta and they took a single flight up over Chicago 536 00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,160 Speaker 4: and this was a big demonstration flight for starlink. 537 00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,360 Speaker 5: A couple of years back. To be fair and starlingkuin 538 00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:06,200 Speaker 5: connect they. 539 00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:09,480 Speaker 4: Couldn't get it to work, and so SpaceX's quick solution 540 00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:13,560 Speaker 4: was to shut down Internet connection to the city of 541 00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,640 Speaker 4: Chicago below to all their customers. Then the flight worked, 542 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:19,400 Speaker 4: they proved it. It was great, big success and so 543 00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:22,680 Speaker 4: and then it was very embarrassing. So that's my point 544 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:25,000 Speaker 4: is that they struggled with capacity, but it appears that 545 00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:28,680 Speaker 4: they are overcoming those challenges and making inroads with the carriers. 546 00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:31,720 Speaker 4: Question is who's next, right, Can they get Delta, Can 547 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:34,200 Speaker 4: they get American, Can they get Southwest? Can they expand 548 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,280 Speaker 4: that it appears the momentum feels like it's in their favor. 549 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,840 Speaker 3: All right, good stuff, Eric, We really really appreciate you 550 00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:44,720 Speaker 3: having you on, saying to you as always Max and Dana. 551 00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:45,160 Speaker 1: Thanks so much. 552 00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:47,960 Speaker 5: Eric, Thank you, guys, appreciate it great to be here. 553 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:57,959 Speaker 3: This episode was produced by Stacey Wong. Naomi Shaven and 554 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 3: Rayhan Harmans are our senior editor. The idea for this 555 00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:06,480 Speaker 3: very show also came from Rayhon Blake Maples, Handel's engineering, 556 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:11,320 Speaker 3: and David Purcell fact checks. Our supervising producer is Magnus Henrikson. 557 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 3: The elon Ing theme is written and performed by Taka 558 00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:19,400 Speaker 3: Yasuzawa and Alex Sugiira. Brendan Francis Newnham is our executive 559 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:22,400 Speaker 3: producer and Sage Bauman is the head of Bloomberg Podcasts. 560 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,840 Speaker 3: A big thanks, as always to our supporter Joel Weber. 561 00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:29,440 Speaker 3: I'm David Papadopoulos. If you have a minute, rate and 562 00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:32,680 Speaker 3: review our show, it'll help other listeners find us. See 563 00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:36,840 Speaker 3: you next week.