Speaker 1: People on riding with us is we continue to broadcast
Speaker 1: the balance and defend the discourse from these hip hop
Speaker 1: weekly studios. Welcome back to Civic Cipher. I am your host,
Speaker 1: Ramsey's job.
Speaker 2: He is Ramsey's job. I am still q Ward. You
Speaker 2: are either still listening or tuning back in to Civic Scycer.
Speaker 1: Listen we the way. We appreciate it because we are
Speaker 1: talking that talk today. We got some special guests in
Speaker 1: the building Angelo Salazar, she is the Equity Programs director,
Speaker 1: and Marta Rabinowska, Marketing and brand manager for the YWCA.
Speaker 1: We got some heavy hitters in the building and we
Speaker 1: are talking about women's autonomy and really how the intersection
Speaker 1: of politics and women's ability to be humans and kind
Speaker 1: of what that looks like. So we have a whole
Speaker 1: second half that we're gonna talk about it. But of
Speaker 1: course we could talk about this all day, but you're
Speaker 1: encouraged to stick around for the next part of this conversation.
Speaker 1: We definitely are going to be talking about how bodies
Speaker 1: are policed by these artificial agents in this country. But
Speaker 1: before we get there, it's time to become a better ally.
Speaker 1: So let's discuss a ba Baba. Today's Babla sponsored by
Speaker 1: Friends of the Movement. You can sign up for the
Speaker 1: free voter wallet from fotmglobal dot com to support black
Speaker 1: businesses and allied businesses as well as make an impact
Speaker 1: that you're spending.
Speaker 2: Again.
Speaker 1: That's Fotmglobal dot com and today we're talking about building bridges.
Speaker 1: You're encouraged to support our friends. Let me share Arizona
Speaker 1: form for change. I'll just read this. This is from
Speaker 1: a statement from the y Luca. Join us for the
Speaker 1: Radical Justice Forum, a dynamic platform designed to tackle pressing
Speaker 1: issues surrounding racial justice and equity. Our form will delve
Speaker 1: into four key topics bodies, women's finance, gun violence, and transportation,
Speaker 1: with special emphasis on how these intersect with mental health
Speaker 1: and advocacy. Led by insightful keynote speakers and engaging panel discussions,
Speaker 1: we aim to foster open dialogue and interactive participation to
Speaker 1: raise awareness, promote understanding, and inspire actionable steps towards systemic change.
Speaker 1: Be a part of the transformative event as we push
Speaker 1: for a more just and equitable future for all Jonas
Speaker 1: and be the change you wish to see in the world.
Speaker 1: It's going to take place at May tenth at seven
Speaker 1: a m. And you can check out UH why double
Speaker 1: c A A Z dot org. Uh if you want
Speaker 1: to support the organization that we're you know, having today's
Speaker 1: conversation with, or if you want to do something locally
Speaker 1: in your city. If you live outside of the state
Speaker 1: of Arizona, which most of you do, you can just
Speaker 1: check out UH justice dot y do w U c
Speaker 1: A dot org. Either way, get involved. You know, the
Speaker 1: more I learn about what it is that y w
Speaker 1: c A is up against, the more I feel like
Speaker 1: we have to really help out. And fortunately we're in
Speaker 1: a position and do a little bit. So let's get
Speaker 1: back to these conversations. So uh, let's discuss you know,
Speaker 1: what I do want to discuss, like the ways that
Speaker 1: women's bodies are policed. And you know, being a man,
Speaker 1: I've never been subjected to really anything like that. How
Speaker 1: that might feel. And you know, obviously there's at least
Speaker 1: fifty percent of the population that knows how that feels.
Speaker 1: But for us, we often feel like we can do
Speaker 1: a lot of fighting. We should do most of the fighting.
Speaker 1: We are black men, we should do most of the fighting.
Speaker 1: But there are certain battles where allies non Black people
Speaker 1: can be more effective than we can be on behalf
Speaker 1: of black people. Right. So I say that to say
Speaker 1: that half of the population will know full well what
Speaker 1: it means to have your rights restricted, to take your
Speaker 1: decisions about what it is that you feel your family
Speaker 1: should look like and your path forward should look like, etc.
Speaker 1: Are decided by people you've never met, will never meet,
Speaker 1: and they are imposing these restrictions on you. Right, But
Speaker 1: there's a lot there's another half of the population that
Speaker 1: has the potential to be really strong allies on behalf
Speaker 1: of the people affected by these restrictions. Right. So I
Speaker 1: do want to, you know, take a moment to talk
Speaker 1: about maybe some of the ways that some of the
Speaker 1: restrictions that you're familiar with, and some of the ways
Speaker 1: they impact how you move through time and space, how
Speaker 1: you plan things in the future, how it feels. Because again,
Speaker 1: this is something I cannot know. It's never been a
Speaker 1: thing for me. So let's start with you and then
Speaker 1: we'll come to your next market.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that is it's an interesting dynamic because
Speaker 3: if I choose to have a child because I want
Speaker 3: a child, like I'm gonna have a child, right, If
Speaker 3: I choose and say I don't want to have children
Speaker 3: because of X, Y and Z. Maybe I want I
Speaker 3: love my independence. Maybe I feel like, you know, it's
Speaker 3: so costly to.
Speaker 2: Have a child.
Speaker 1: Maybe you already have children correct and need to support them.
Speaker 3: Not only that, in some communities, they all also have
Speaker 3: to worry about living. The mortality rate for black mothers
Speaker 3: is increasing minute by minute, and so that's another concern
Speaker 3: that people have. I don't want to have I don't
Speaker 3: want to get pregnant because or I don't want to
Speaker 3: have a child because I might die on the hospital
Speaker 3: bed having this child.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of concerns.
Speaker 3: But you know, we always constantly compare ourselves to our
Speaker 3: male counterparts, because y'all don't have to think about that,
Speaker 3: right you're not the one having a human being grow
Speaker 3: out of your body.
Speaker 1: And so.
Speaker 3: I feel like that that ties into why we have
Speaker 3: this issue right now. Why who's dominating politics right now?
Speaker 3: Is it men versus women? Women are coming out very fast,
Speaker 3: but right now and throughout all of history, it's always
Speaker 3: been male dominated, and so it's easy for them to say, hey,
Speaker 3: I want to get all over your business. Your privacy
Speaker 3: rights no longer are being considered because now I need
Speaker 3: to know whether you're going to have a child, and
Speaker 3: how many weeks are you pregnant? Even a woman doesn't
Speaker 3: even know she's pregnant up until right about that time
Speaker 3: of the fifteen week mark. I think that's what they're
Speaker 3: and other places could be around that time. But at
Speaker 3: the you know, men don't know this, like we don't
Speaker 3: know we're pregnant until we don't see a period. In
Speaker 3: some cases, some people still have a period. So they think, oh, well,
Speaker 3: let's just pick fifteen weeks and men, do you do
Speaker 3: these male politicians know that? Piece do they know all
Speaker 3: these other things that we have to consider. A woman
Speaker 3: has to consider all of these factors when it comes
Speaker 3: to pregnancy, and so that, like I said, it is
Speaker 3: one gender base, one historical base, because who has been
Speaker 3: the majority for this whole time?
Speaker 1: Now, marta real quick We've talked about abortion access, but
Speaker 1: I know that there are some other areas where women's
Speaker 1: mobility may have been like kind of artificially restricted or
Speaker 1: otherwise policed. And I know that there's like social factors too,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, what sort of standard of beauty,
Speaker 1: how a person should dress, these sorts of things, and
Speaker 1: by conforming, you have access to different levels in society
Speaker 1: and so forth. So just share a little bit about
Speaker 1: that and what those restrictions mean. Because again, I mean,
Speaker 1: you see me now, the way that I'm dressed. I
Speaker 1: don't even have to wear a shirt most of the time.
Speaker 1: I don't my son. Yeah, anyway, So yeah, can share
Speaker 1: a little bit about about that, because we do want
Speaker 1: to get your thoughts on this one too.
Speaker 4: Definitely, I think that's very valid for me myself. I'm
Speaker 4: a younger woman, and there are certain things that I
Speaker 4: cannot wear it to the office because I feel like
Speaker 4: it may be deemed inappropriate or you know, I don't
Speaker 4: wear braids. I don't have to worry about wearing my
Speaker 4: hair natural like some black women do. And I know
Speaker 4: that they've been ostracized in the workplace or they've been,
Speaker 4: you know, in some ways penalized for wearing their hair
Speaker 4: natural for example, or wearing their braids in a certain way.
Speaker 4: And I also have to worry about walking on the
Speaker 4: street and what I'm wearing, right, and especially if I'm
Speaker 4: walking around at night, it can be very scary as
Speaker 4: a young woman, especially if you're by yourself. So that's
Speaker 4: not necessarily policing, but it's kind of a self policing
Speaker 4: mentality right of how I have to keep myself safe.
Speaker 1: But all social police scene, i'd probably i mean, just
Speaker 1: for me, I'd probably take it a step further because
Speaker 1: I've heard and this is just from my sister, who
Speaker 1: again is one woman, but she's a woman in my
Speaker 1: life and helped shape my view of these things. One time,
Speaker 1: she was going home from school. I shared this with
Speaker 1: you before Q. She's going home from school and she
Speaker 1: called me. She's at Arizona State just going home and
Speaker 1: shout out to the protesters by the way. She's going
Speaker 1: home and she calls me on the phone. I'm on
Speaker 1: the radio at the time. She's just talking talking. I'm like, hey, well,
Speaker 1: I got to get back to the radio. I got
Speaker 1: to get back to my show. She said, ma'am's is
Speaker 1: just stay on the phone with me. I got a
Speaker 1: show to do. I'm doing a night show. I got
Speaker 1: a show to do. I got to Ramses, stay on
Speaker 1: the phone with me. I'm like, what's up? What's going on?
Speaker 1: She was like, Ramses, have you ever had to walk
Speaker 1: to your car at night as a woman? And then
Speaker 1: she proceeded to say even if something did happen to me,
Speaker 1: if I'm not dressed a certain way, the police won't
Speaker 1: believe me. Right, And so when you talk about the
Speaker 1: social conformity and the policing of how women dress, those
Speaker 1: sort of artificial influences may have something to do with it,
Speaker 1: at least according to that one story I've heard from
Speaker 1: that one woman. I never want to speak for women.
Speaker 1: I just want to be an ally.
Speaker 2: So you use the words policing, and that might make
Speaker 2: people just think police, but you, I think everyone that's
Speaker 2: having this conversation with us today mentioned the kind of
Speaker 2: weaponization of religion and indoctor nation by the right to
Speaker 2: justify the controlling policing and kind of dictatorship with regards
Speaker 2: to women, not just with their autonomy and reproductive rights,
Speaker 2: but how much they can weigh how they dress, the
Speaker 2: style of their hair, how they're perceived by others, appropriate,
Speaker 2: what is appropriate without any critical backlash, because you can't
Speaker 2: come back at it. If it's it's God, it's the
Speaker 2: word of God and the will of the Lord, then
Speaker 2: you cannot even critically oppose them being a woman. And
Speaker 2: that that's kind of a way forgive me for backtracking.
Speaker 2: I spoke about. You know, women who kind of organize, vote, elect,
Speaker 2: and speak out against their own best interest. It's kind
Speaker 2: of a mental manipulation to use their beliefs, and they're,
Speaker 2: like I said, uncritical beliefs. Because we you know, when
Speaker 2: you believe in something, especially with regard to religion, it
Speaker 2: almost can't be challenged. Whatever happens and will be is
Speaker 2: the will of God, right, so there's nothing that you
Speaker 2: can say to oppose it. I know how frustrating it
Speaker 2: is for me, and Ramses gets to feel and hear
Speaker 2: my frustration on our show weekly. That's what we is
Speaker 2: when I see people who should be allies who do
Speaker 2: not stand next to and support us. You guys are
Speaker 2: sitting now with two brothers of yours who you can
Speaker 2: educate not just on what you're up against, want to
Speaker 2: more so on how to show up for you. So
Speaker 2: when using the words policing, I don't want people to
Speaker 2: just think that that's the police. That's society at large,
Speaker 2: that's colleagues, friends, family members. So some advice to some
Speaker 2: men who have no idea. Even this man who was
Speaker 2: raised by a single mother with six sisters, still has
Speaker 2: no idea how it feels to live under that type
Speaker 2: of soul social policing by everyone in your position. What
Speaker 2: is that like on a daily and how do we
Speaker 2: show up for you better or more effectively than we
Speaker 2: have already?
Speaker 4: I can jump in on that one, because things women
Speaker 4: like also are frowned upon. Right. There's no male counterpart
Speaker 4: for what a chick flick is. Right. Action movies and
Speaker 4: adventure movies. They're oh, yeah, The Godfather, Absolutely everybody loves
Speaker 4: that film, right, But we talk about chick flicks and
Speaker 4: it's like, ah, really, oh that's what girls like. Right.
Speaker 4: Pumpkin spice lattes also a joke. We're laughing, right, but
Speaker 4: it's proven, like, like they did data and measurements and
Speaker 4: studies and they prove people like pumpkin spice lattes and
Speaker 4: Starbucks makes billions of dollars a year on the thing.
Speaker 4: But it's laughable and why And so I think something
Speaker 4: we can do is take that sh take it back.
Speaker 4: You know, things women like are good. People like women.
Speaker 4: We're half of the like you were saying, we're half
Speaker 4: the population, we're half of the market. That's half of
Speaker 4: the dollars that are raised across the country. It's not
Speaker 4: a laughable thing, So don't laugh at us.
Speaker 1: It's this thing.
Speaker 2: For example, she knew I was going to laugh, and
Speaker 2: she set me up. And as my sister, she should
Speaker 2: be a better ally than she.
Speaker 1: Just did you know. There's something that I want to
Speaker 1: add here to. I was having this conversation earlier today
Speaker 1: with Leanna Taylor, who's on the board of Directors Why Sad,
Speaker 1: and we're talking about chick flicks, and I mentioned to her,
Speaker 1: I was like, I never really understood that term chick
Speaker 1: flix because men fall in love too. Amen. You know,
Speaker 1: at least me. If you're a man and you've lived
Speaker 1: your life and you haven't fallen in love, you're doing
Speaker 1: it wrong. So so yes, I understand how it is marketed.
Speaker 1: I think, coming from someone who the only type of
Speaker 1: movies that don't like are scary movies. Because I like
Speaker 1: to be happy. I like to laugh, so I like
Speaker 1: laughing movies. I like movies that make me think. I
Speaker 1: like love, so I like movies about love, right, And
Speaker 1: so I never really understood that thing. So just just
Speaker 1: a thing that I wanted to say. Now, listen, I
Speaker 1: know you brought some notes. Yeah, so why don't you
Speaker 1: talk to me? Why don't you educate me and Q
Speaker 1: on some things that we need to know about, and
Speaker 1: in doing so, I think we're going to educate our
Speaker 1: listeners too.
Speaker 3: Yes, So, going back to cues question like how to
Speaker 3: be a bitter ally, we always try to push the
Speaker 3: message message of thinking outside of the norm because we
Speaker 3: we all grew up in society and these social norms.
Speaker 3: This is what we call social norms. Right, We're supposed
Speaker 3: to think and act a certain way. We're not supposed
Speaker 3: to rock the boat. We're not supposed to as a woman,
Speaker 3: I'm not supposed to like sports and drink beer and cigars,
Speaker 3: right Like, But what if I do this? You know,
Speaker 3: I'm not in the social norms anymore. So when we
Speaker 3: talk about being a better ally, men have to start
Speaker 3: thinking in terms of outside the box as well. What
Speaker 3: is the potential of woman being your ally versus beneath you?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 3: So, all of society, all of history, it's always been
Speaker 3: like this unspoken cast system. Right, you have a man
Speaker 3: at the top, women kind of fall behind, and all
Speaker 3: the messaging, social media, music, news, all that stuff, it
Speaker 3: kind of keeps it going. It keeps feeding our younger
Speaker 3: generation to fall in line and still have the same
Speaker 3: thought process. So as men and you start raising families,
Speaker 3: let's not fall into the social norm your your girl,
Speaker 3: your daughter shouldn't have to go to ballet when she
Speaker 3: wants to be a skateboarder, right, allow her to be
Speaker 3: a skateboarder. So things like that, like think outside the box.
Speaker 3: What are the potential of this female versus your son?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 3: If your son wants to do ballet, let him do ballet. Ye, right,
Speaker 3: So we always try to say, just try to you
Speaker 3: don't have to fall within the social marks. Like we
Speaker 3: can all have our own individual thoughts, our own individual opinions,
Speaker 3: and let's value each other's thoughts and opinions. And I
Speaker 3: think the more that we're open to those thoughts and opinions,
Speaker 3: then we start being a little bit more. How do
Speaker 3: I say, embracing of things changing versus no, it has
Speaker 3: to stay in line. And so going back to we
Speaker 3: were talking about politics. You know, it's fear tactics that
Speaker 3: they use. It's going back to gay mentality. You say
Speaker 3: something against what everybody else is saying. They're gonna look
Speaker 3: at you, they can give you a side eye, they're
Speaker 3: gonna you know, hey, you aren't supposed to say that
Speaker 3: how about this.
Speaker 1: So there's another thing that I feel like you can
Speaker 1: touch on before before we're done for today's episode. Talk
Speaker 1: to us about kind of the intersection of structural racism
Speaker 1: and sexism and how fighting one battle influences the other
Speaker 1: or something like that, because this is something that's new
Speaker 1: to me and I kind of work in this space.
Speaker 1: We work in this space now, but you know, you
Speaker 1: being from the YWCA, which is like a legit or
Speaker 1: another we just we just talk on a radio and DJs,
Speaker 1: so you guys actually know this stuff and we're learning.
Speaker 1: But you know, talk about that intersection and how that
Speaker 1: overlap is something that people need to be aware of
Speaker 1: because I think that it might inspire the thought of
Speaker 1: not only how and where to get involved, but why.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so when we talk about structural racism, there are
Speaker 3: things that have been put in place for centuries, know
Speaker 3: that part, right, And then you start breaking it down
Speaker 3: to identities, and that's where sexism comes into play. You know,
Speaker 3: we're we're globally the highest country that incarcerates people, right, uh,
Speaker 3: by far by any country, we probably quadruple any other country.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 3: And then so then when you talk about that's a
Speaker 3: piece of structural racism. We got to keep people in mind, right,
Speaker 3: And then you talk about women's rights, so those who
Speaker 3: are women are not uh, I know probably is going
Speaker 3: to be coming off some kind of way, but women
Speaker 3: are not incarcerated as much as men are. And so
Speaker 3: I feel like women, and again going back to all
Speaker 3: the time, have been placed behind or beneath a man.
Speaker 3: And so when you talk about sexism, there's always been
Speaker 3: like this entity versus I'm just a fellow human being.
Speaker 3: You're this entity. And so if you're going to start
Speaker 3: saying things, questioning things, what are we going to do
Speaker 3: to counteract that?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 3: And you know it's I want to use the example
Speaker 3: of the maternal ray because that is a form of
Speaker 3: structural racism and sexism on that and then going back
Speaker 3: to the abortion band too, states that have abortion bands
Speaker 3: also have the highest maternal rates.
Speaker 1: And then that disproportionally affects black and brown women.
Speaker 3: Exactly, And so who's benefiting from that?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 3: We want to ask who's benefiting from it? And then
Speaker 3: I know, before we started this conversation, you had mentioned
Speaker 3: the same people who are pushing abortion bands are the
Speaker 3: same people that were against getting a vaccination.
Speaker 1: Oh, that's funny.
Speaker 2: My body, my choice. They said, leave it the Q.
Speaker 1: To make to connect those dots. Well, you know what,
Speaker 1: one of the things that I will say is that
Speaker 1: we have an election that's coming up, and I heard
Speaker 1: the most recent State of the Union, and I won't
Speaker 1: say what I won't say, Okay, but our current president
Speaker 1: his name is Joe Biden. That's a fact. Feel how
Speaker 1: you feel. But he did say something in his recent
Speaker 1: State of the Union. In its decision to overturn Roe v. Wade,
Speaker 1: the Supreme Court majority wrote, women are not without electoral
Speaker 1: or political power, no kidding. Clearly, those ragging about overturning
Speaker 1: Roe v. Wade have no clue about the power of
Speaker 1: women in America, but they found out when reproductive freedom
Speaker 1: was on the ballot. So we'll leave that one right there.
Speaker 1: I'd like to thank you for tuning into this episode
Speaker 1: of Civic Cipher once again. I've been your host rams
Speaker 1: this job.
Speaker 2: And I am still Q war indeed.
Speaker 1: And I appreciate that because we need you to keep
Speaker 1: on keeping on.
Speaker 2: Just doing what I can do when I can do it, right.
Speaker 1: I love that, man, So listen up. Let's uh, but
Speaker 1: before you go, let's give your social media's if you
Speaker 1: have those, So Angela Sawas are you go first?
Speaker 3: You can find me at Huskatura Instagram or Angela Saul's
Speaker 3: are on LinkedIn.
Speaker 1: All right, and Marta, why don't you if you feel comfortable,
Speaker 1: you know, let people know how to keep up with
Speaker 1: you and your your advocacy.
Speaker 4: Well, you can follow White w c A at at
Speaker 4: yew C A A Z on every platform.
Speaker 1: There is no right that's good enough for me. And
Speaker 1: of course you can follow the show at Civic Cipher
Speaker 1: and we'll leave that one right there until next week, y'all.
Speaker 2: Peace,