1 00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:04,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Tracy V. 3 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 1: Wilson and I'm Holly Frye. Dorothy Arsner got the really 4 00:00:19,680 --> 00:00:23,520 Speaker 1: briefest of mentions in our episode on Billy Burke from 5 00:00:23,560 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: August of twenty twenty three, which I could have sworn 6 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:30,720 Speaker 1: was something that came out last year. Yeah, time is 7 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:34,600 Speaker 1: passing at an alarming rate. It is. We did not 8 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:38,480 Speaker 1: really say much about Dorothy Arsner in that Billy Burke episode, 9 00:00:38,800 --> 00:00:42,559 Speaker 1: other than that she was the only woman director in 10 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:45,599 Speaker 1: Hollywood at the time and that there were rumors that 11 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:49,680 Speaker 1: she and Burke were in a romantic relationship. I stumbled 12 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 1: across Dorothy Arsner's name again sometime recently. I don't even 13 00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 1: remember exactly when or where, but I was immediately intrigued. 14 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:01,280 Speaker 1: So I stopped what I was doing, checked in with 15 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:03,640 Speaker 1: Holly to make sure Holly did not have Dorothy Arsner 16 00:01:03,640 --> 00:01:06,320 Speaker 1: on her list. Nope, uh, and then I got started 17 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:10,880 Speaker 1: on an episode. Dorothy Arsner was not the first female 18 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:13,959 Speaker 1: film director in the United States, but she really was 19 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:18,199 Speaker 1: the only one working in the Hollywood studio system during 20 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:21,480 Speaker 1: most of the period of her career that's in what's 21 00:01:21,560 --> 00:01:25,440 Speaker 1: known today as the Hollywood Golden Age, and even though 22 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:28,520 Speaker 1: her career was fairly short, she is still one of 23 00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:34,560 Speaker 1: the most prolific female film directors in Hollywood history. Dorothy 24 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:38,399 Speaker 1: Emma Arsner was born on January third, eighteen ninety seven, 25 00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:41,760 Speaker 1: although later on she often gave her birth year as 26 00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 1: nineteen hundred. Her father, Ludwig Adolph Arsner, was from Germany 27 00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:50,040 Speaker 1: and he went by Lewis. Her mother, Janet Young, who 28 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:53,920 Speaker 1: was known as Jenny, was from Scotland. Dorothy had one 29 00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:56,920 Speaker 1: older brother named David, and when she was born, they 30 00:01:56,920 --> 00:02:01,640 Speaker 1: lived in San Francisco, California. So when Dorothy was about five, 31 00:02:01,840 --> 00:02:06,360 Speaker 1: her parents divorced. There's not a lot of detail available here, 32 00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:10,080 Speaker 1: but she did remember them arguing a lot prior to 33 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 1: that divorce. Lewis got sole custody of Dorothy and David, 34 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:17,639 Speaker 1: and they did not have contact with their mother again, 35 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,480 Speaker 1: and that includes even after her mother apparently tried to 36 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:26,640 Speaker 1: track them down a few years later. After the divorce, Lewis, Dorothy, 37 00:02:26,680 --> 00:02:29,720 Speaker 1: and David all moved to Los Angeles, and Lewis got 38 00:02:29,720 --> 00:02:34,000 Speaker 1: married again to a woman named Mabel Mills. This sounds 39 00:02:34,120 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: like it was all pretty understandably upsetting for both of 40 00:02:37,760 --> 00:02:41,480 Speaker 1: the children. Mabel tried to be nice, but she was 41 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:45,000 Speaker 1: really a stranger to them, and Dorothy and David refused 42 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:47,040 Speaker 1: to be left with her while their father went to 43 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 1: work at the restaurant that he was managing. In a 44 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:55,200 Speaker 1: partial autobiography that Arsner wrote much later on, she described 45 00:02:55,200 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 1: herself as eventually finding sympathy for everyone involved, but only 46 00:03:01,080 --> 00:03:05,639 Speaker 1: much later after she had matured. She describes Mabel as 47 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 1: kind to her and her brother and never trying to 48 00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:12,880 Speaker 1: force a relationship with them, but it's also clear that 49 00:03:13,040 --> 00:03:16,640 Speaker 1: at least at first, things were just not working. For 50 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:19,200 Speaker 1: a while, Dorothy and David were sent to live in 51 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 1: a boarding house, and then they were split up, with 52 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:25,119 Speaker 1: David going to live with an aunt in Cleveland, Ohio, 53 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:29,320 Speaker 1: and Dorothy going to live with Mabel's mother, Elizabeth, who 54 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:33,200 Speaker 1: she knew as Ma'am. Ma'am lived in Oakland, and when 55 00:03:33,280 --> 00:03:36,560 Speaker 1: Dorothy was eight years old. They lived through the nineteen 56 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 1: oh six earthquake and fire that we have covered on 57 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:42,200 Speaker 1: the show before that ran as a Saturday Classic on 58 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:46,280 Speaker 1: May twenty fifth, twenty twenty four. This earthquake is often 59 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 1: described as happening in San Francisco, but it was severe 60 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:53,600 Speaker 1: across the Bay in Oakland as well. Ma'am's house was 61 00:03:53,640 --> 00:03:56,200 Speaker 1: one of the few in their neighborhood that still had water, 62 00:03:56,600 --> 00:03:58,720 Speaker 1: and they tried to help their neighbors by sharing what 63 00:03:58,760 --> 00:04:02,840 Speaker 1: they had. Afterward, they housed some of MAM's friends from 64 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:05,720 Speaker 1: San Francisco who had lost their homes in the fire. 65 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:10,559 Speaker 1: As we've discussed on the show before, this fire destroyed 66 00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 1: a lot of San Francisco's vital records, and later on 67 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:16,960 Speaker 1: it seems like Arsner used this as cover to trim 68 00:04:17,040 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 1: those few years off of her age, but in the 69 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 1: more immediate aftermath of the earthquake, her father and stepmother 70 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 1: decided to reunite the family in Los Angeles. Louis Arsner 71 00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 1: ran a series of restaurants in Los Angeles. One of 72 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:34,800 Speaker 1: them was the Hoffman Cafe, which was known for its 73 00:04:34,839 --> 00:04:39,479 Speaker 1: Hollywood clientele, including people like Mary Pickford, Douglas Fairbanks, and 74 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 1: Charlie Chaplin. A lot of more recent writing about Arsner 75 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 1: points to this as an early exposure to the Hollywood 76 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 1: scene that she would later build a career in, something 77 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:53,039 Speaker 1: that familiarized her with industry lingo and made it feel 78 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 1: kind of like no big deal to be around a 79 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:59,400 Speaker 1: bunch of celebrities, But accounts from her lifetime are kind 80 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:03,640 Speaker 1: of contrad about this. She gave some interviews that made 81 00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:06,680 Speaker 1: it sound like she wasn't allowed to be at the restaurant, 82 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 1: but in other interviews she said that she was there 83 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:12,920 Speaker 1: a lot and was always overhearing conversations about show business. 84 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 1: It's also not really clear whether her time at the 85 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:19,320 Speaker 1: restaurant might have made her more comfortable around famous people. 86 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:23,360 Speaker 1: She gave an interview in nineteen seventy three with director 87 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:27,000 Speaker 1: Francine Parker in which she said she was afraid of 88 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:29,560 Speaker 1: all of the actors because they liked to pick her 89 00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:32,440 Speaker 1: up and throw her into the air. So many questions 90 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:37,840 Speaker 1: emerge in that moment. She she didn't like to talk 91 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:41,000 Speaker 1: about herself is the vibe that I got, And she 92 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:43,240 Speaker 1: didn't like to talk about her career and any of that, 93 00:05:43,279 --> 00:05:45,960 Speaker 1: And I think that might contribute to why a lot 94 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:48,160 Speaker 1: of her interviews just don't say the same thing. My 95 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:50,279 Speaker 1: thing is more like they were doing what I'm sorry, 96 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:55,000 Speaker 1: were they physically lifting you and tossing you about? Not cool? Uh? 97 00:05:55,240 --> 00:05:58,279 Speaker 1: From the time she was very young, people thought of 98 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:01,880 Speaker 1: Dorothy as a tomboy as an adult. She wrote that 99 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:04,680 Speaker 1: she wondered whether this traced back to her relationship with 100 00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 1: her brother. David had desperately wanted a baby brother when 101 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:12,000 Speaker 1: she was born, and he basically treated her like one. 102 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 1: There are pictures of Arsner as a teen that show 103 00:06:15,440 --> 00:06:17,520 Speaker 1: her an ad dress with her hair loose and down 104 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:20,440 Speaker 1: to her waist, but there are also pictures of her 105 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 1: in what would be considered boy's clothes. For example, there's 106 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:28,039 Speaker 1: a scrapbook page labeled Garth for a night Quite a Boy, 107 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:30,960 Speaker 1: in which she's wearing a suit with a bow tie 108 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 1: in two of the pictures, and her hair is tucked 109 00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:38,160 Speaker 1: up under a newsboy cap. By nineteen twelve, her stepmother 110 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:42,440 Speaker 1: had started to see this tomboyishness as a concern, and 111 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:47,520 Speaker 1: Mabel enrolled Dorothy at Westlake School for Girls, apparently thinking 112 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:51,560 Speaker 1: that a college preparatory school for girls might make Dorothy 113 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:55,560 Speaker 1: more feminine. While there, she was on the yearbook staff, 114 00:06:55,800 --> 00:07:00,080 Speaker 1: and she was involved in art, drama, and tennis, as 115 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 1: far as Mabel's goal of making her more feminine. In 116 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 1: Dorothy's graduation photo, taken in nineteen fifteen, she's in a 117 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:09,960 Speaker 1: white dress with a large white bow holding her hair back, 118 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,680 Speaker 1: and she's holding her rose. Her expression really reads to 119 00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:15,720 Speaker 1: me like, here I put on the dress. Are you 120 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:19,120 Speaker 1: satisfied now? Or maybe kind of a mix of being 121 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:24,840 Speaker 1: like tolerant and simultaneously very annoyed in these pictures. To me, 122 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:27,280 Speaker 1: she just seems to feel a lot more at home 123 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:29,720 Speaker 1: as Garth for a night. But we really don't have 124 00:07:29,800 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 1: any information from her from her own point of view 125 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:37,840 Speaker 1: about how she conceived of her gender. After graduating from Westlake, 126 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:41,240 Speaker 1: Dorothy enrolled at the University of Southern California as a 127 00:07:41,280 --> 00:07:44,960 Speaker 1: pre med student, and she joined the university rowing team. 128 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:48,680 Speaker 1: Her plan was to go to medical school, but World 129 00:07:48,760 --> 00:07:51,760 Speaker 1: War One was already under way and the US entered 130 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:55,960 Speaker 1: the war in nineteen seventeen. Dorothy left school and she 131 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 1: started working on various projects to raise funds and gather supply. 132 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:04,240 Speaker 1: She also trained with the Los Angeles Emergency Ambulance Corps, 133 00:08:04,320 --> 00:08:08,520 Speaker 1: but she was never sent overseas. After the war ended, 134 00:08:08,640 --> 00:08:11,880 Speaker 1: and after the end of the nineteen eighteen flu pandemic, 135 00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:16,080 Speaker 1: Arsener didn't go back to school. In a later interview, 136 00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:18,640 Speaker 1: she was quoted as saying that she had decided it 137 00:08:18,720 --> 00:08:21,440 Speaker 1: just wasn't what she wanted. That she wanted to be 138 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: like Jesus, healing the sick and raising the dead instantly 139 00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:29,280 Speaker 1: without surgery or pills, but she also wanted to find 140 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:33,359 Speaker 1: a way to be financially independent rather than being supported 141 00:08:33,400 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 1: by her father. To that end, a friend helped her 142 00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:39,800 Speaker 1: get a job working the switchboard at a coffee wholesaler, 143 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:43,600 Speaker 1: where she made twelve dollars a week. She kept looking, though, 144 00:08:43,640 --> 00:08:47,880 Speaker 1: for other better paying jobs. While working with the Ambulance Corps, 145 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:52,240 Speaker 1: Arsener had met William de Mill, brother of filmmaker Cecil B. Demill. 146 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:56,040 Speaker 1: William was a screenwriter and director in his own right, 147 00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:58,720 Speaker 1: and both of the brothers were working at Famous Player's 148 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:02,280 Speaker 1: Last Ki, the product and distribution company that would later 149 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:05,600 Speaker 1: become Paramount Pictures. I feel like they're also a recurring 150 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:08,040 Speaker 1: character in the show. Yeah, we've had a lot of 151 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:11,360 Speaker 1: Paramount stuff. Once the war was over, Anna stark Weather, 152 00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:15,160 Speaker 1: commander of the Ambulance Corps, encouraged Arsner to meet with 153 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:18,960 Speaker 1: William de Mill about getting a job. The Hollywood film 154 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:21,959 Speaker 1: industry was still in its infancy at this point, having 155 00:09:22,000 --> 00:09:25,040 Speaker 1: moved from the East Coast over the early nineteen teens, 156 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:29,640 Speaker 1: Arsner didn't really know what she wanted to do with 157 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 1: her life, aside from the fact that she wanted to 158 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:36,719 Speaker 1: support herself without her father's help. Stark Weather drove her 159 00:09:36,760 --> 00:09:40,320 Speaker 1: to the appointment with Demil. Zamil asked Arsner what she 160 00:09:40,440 --> 00:09:43,079 Speaker 1: wanted to do in Hollywood. She said she didn't know. 161 00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 1: She thought she could maybe be a set dresser. He 162 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:50,679 Speaker 1: asked her what period the furniture in his office was from, 163 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:54,680 Speaker 1: and she did not know that either. In what seems 164 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:58,120 Speaker 1: to me like an incredibly generous offer on De Mill's part, 165 00:09:58,280 --> 00:10:00,440 Speaker 1: he said that he would give her access to the 166 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,840 Speaker 1: studio's various departments for a week so that she could 167 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:06,520 Speaker 1: look around and get a sense of how things worked 168 00:10:06,880 --> 00:10:09,840 Speaker 1: and figure out what she might want to do. Her 169 00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 1: mostly self guided tour of the studio lot included seeing 170 00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:15,960 Speaker 1: cecil B. De Mill at work as a director and 171 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 1: thinking that was the thing, to be the person in 172 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 1: charge telling everyone else what to do. One of the 173 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:25,040 Speaker 1: secretaries told her that if she really wanted to get 174 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 1: into the business, she should start out by typing scripts. 175 00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 1: That was an entry level job, and the script was 176 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 1: really the backbone of the movie. So when she went 177 00:10:35,320 --> 00:10:37,320 Speaker 1: back to William De Mill, and he asked her what 178 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:41,080 Speaker 1: she decided. She said she wanted to start at the bottom. 179 00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:43,880 Speaker 1: When he asked her what the bottom was, she said, 180 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 1: typing scripts, and he said for that answer, I'll give 181 00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:51,520 Speaker 1: you a job. There wasn't a typing position open right away, 182 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:55,079 Speaker 1: so Arsner kept working the switchboard at the coffee wholesaler. 183 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,440 Speaker 1: When the job offer came from Paramount, the pay was 184 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:01,560 Speaker 1: fifteen dollars a week. That was more than she was 185 00:11:01,600 --> 00:11:05,480 Speaker 1: making at the coffee wholesaler, so she took it. Arsner 186 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 1: told this story in a lot of different interviews over 187 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:11,839 Speaker 1: the course of her career, and continuing that theme how 188 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:14,679 Speaker 1: these don't always have the same details. There are some 189 00:11:14,920 --> 00:11:18,839 Speaker 1: inconsistencies in the exact timeline of how all this played 190 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:21,800 Speaker 1: out and how much money she was being offered at 191 00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:24,720 Speaker 1: both of the jobs, But a lot of the time 192 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:27,280 Speaker 1: she really made it sound like she took this job 193 00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:31,840 Speaker 1: for the money, not because she had aspirations of using 194 00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:36,680 Speaker 1: it as her starting point to becoming a filmmaker. We're 195 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:39,400 Speaker 1: going to talk about Arsner's life in Hollywood after we 196 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 1: paused for a sponsor break. When Dorothy Arsner started her 197 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:55,840 Speaker 1: job as a script typist, she ran into an immediate problem, 198 00:11:56,120 --> 00:11:59,080 Speaker 1: which is that she could not type. She hunted and 199 00:11:59,160 --> 00:12:03,200 Speaker 1: pecked on the typewriter with two fingers. That's incredibly slow. 200 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:05,559 Speaker 1: And on top of being very slow, she made a 201 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:09,280 Speaker 1: lot of mistakes in her first days of work doing this. 202 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 1: She was constantly asking herself, like, what did I do? 203 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 1: She had left the switchboard job, which she was actually 204 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:17,960 Speaker 1: really good at, for this where she was a miss 205 00:12:18,880 --> 00:12:21,240 Speaker 1: After making sure it was okay to do so, she 206 00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:23,520 Speaker 1: took pages home with her at the end of the 207 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:27,839 Speaker 1: day and kept typing them from there. Her coworkers also 208 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:30,800 Speaker 1: felt sorry for her, and some of the fastest typists 209 00:12:30,800 --> 00:12:32,880 Speaker 1: in the pool would pick up some of her pages 210 00:12:32,880 --> 00:12:34,800 Speaker 1: and type them for her so that she could make 211 00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:38,400 Speaker 1: her deadlines. On top of all that, she arrived at 212 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:40,720 Speaker 1: work one day and accidentally parked in cecil By de 213 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,960 Speaker 1: Mill's parking space, like while he was waiting to get 214 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 1: in with his driver directly behind her. I feel all 215 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:52,679 Speaker 1: of this. I could see myself doing some of this, 216 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:55,680 Speaker 1: I know. One of the other typists told her that 217 00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:58,400 Speaker 1: if she wanted to move up, her next step should 218 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:01,320 Speaker 1: be as a script girl, also called a script clerk 219 00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:05,360 Speaker 1: or a script continuity supervisor. So that's the person who 220 00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:08,319 Speaker 1: keeps track of every take during filming and who works 221 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:10,440 Speaker 1: with the director and the editor to try to prevent 222 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:14,120 Speaker 1: continuity errors. She heard about an opening with actor and 223 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:17,840 Speaker 1: director Alan Nasimova, who had started her own production company 224 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:21,920 Speaker 1: and had a distribution contract with Metro Pictures that, of course, 225 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:26,080 Speaker 1: later became MGM. Nasimova was married to a man, but 226 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:29,800 Speaker 1: was also known for having relationships with women, and she's 227 00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:33,400 Speaker 1: often credited with being the first to describe Hollywood's community 228 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:38,880 Speaker 1: of lesbians and bisexual women as the sewing circle. Nasimova 229 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:42,080 Speaker 1: became one of Arsner's mentors in the film industry, and 230 00:13:42,120 --> 00:13:46,800 Speaker 1: they may have had a romantic relationship as well. After 231 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:51,240 Speaker 1: Arsner finished working on Nasimova's movie Stronger Than Death, she 232 00:13:51,320 --> 00:13:54,319 Speaker 1: went back to Paramount and started working as a script clerk. 233 00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:57,720 Speaker 1: Her next step up from there was as a film cutter, 234 00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:01,280 Speaker 1: cutting and splicing film negatives based on the decisions of 235 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:05,840 Speaker 1: the film's director and editor. Her mentor here was Nan Herron, 236 00:14:05,880 --> 00:14:09,040 Speaker 1: who taught her the ropes on the nineteen nineteen comedy 237 00:14:09,360 --> 00:14:13,600 Speaker 1: Too Much Johnson. Arsner came to really love this work. 238 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:16,720 Speaker 1: She was good at cutting and splicing and making sure 239 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 1: everything lined up seamlessly, and she could do it pretty quickly. 240 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:23,480 Speaker 1: She also loved how it let her make subtle improvements 241 00:14:23,520 --> 00:14:26,400 Speaker 1: on the scenes that she was working with, like trimming 242 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:28,680 Speaker 1: things up if an actor took too long to exit 243 00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:33,200 Speaker 1: a scene or snipping out errors. Soon, Arsner had moved 244 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:36,880 Speaker 1: to Paramount subsidiary Real Art Studio, where she led the 245 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:39,920 Speaker 1: editing department and taught other people how to do it. 246 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: In nineteen twenty one, twenty four year old Arsner met 247 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:48,800 Speaker 1: forty year old dancer, choreographer and screenwriter Marian Morgan on 248 00:14:48,840 --> 00:14:53,080 Speaker 1: a film set. Arsner had, or was at least rumored 249 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 1: to have had relationships with other women after this, but 250 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:00,360 Speaker 1: from this point she and Marian were to get for 251 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 1: the next fifty years. This was kind of an open secret. 252 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 1: They didn't really try to hide it, but they also 253 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:11,480 Speaker 1: did not discuss it. As Arsner became more well known 254 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:15,320 Speaker 1: and started doing more media interviews, she just didn't talk 255 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:18,560 Speaker 1: about her personal life at all. She could also even 256 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:21,400 Speaker 1: be reticent to talk about her previous films. She would 257 00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:23,760 Speaker 1: describe them as over and done with and just not 258 00:15:23,880 --> 00:15:28,280 Speaker 1: worth talking about anymore. In nineteen twenty two, Arsner was 259 00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:31,760 Speaker 1: hired to work on Blood and Sand, starring Rudolph Valentino. 260 00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:35,560 Speaker 1: Although she had worked on dozens of films at this point, 261 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 1: this one was notable. Valentino played a matador, and it 262 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 1: would have been prohibitively expensive and extremely dangerous to film 263 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:49,800 Speaker 1: this big film star actually doing bullfights. Arsner oversaw some 264 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:52,600 Speaker 1: of the filming herself, and she ter cut footage of 265 00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:56,680 Speaker 1: Valentino with stock footage of real bullfights, and that made 266 00:15:56,680 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 1: the bullfighting scenes a lot more compelling, while also saving 267 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 1: the studio a lot of time and expense. Arsner was 268 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:08,600 Speaker 1: also writing, starting out with scenarios or treatments, and then 269 00:16:08,680 --> 00:16:12,040 Speaker 1: working up to writing full screenplays. Some of these works 270 00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 1: were adapted from existing stories, including When Husband's Flirt and 271 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:20,680 Speaker 1: The Red Kimona. In nineteen twenty five, she wrote and 272 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:26,320 Speaker 1: edited Old Ironsides, in which the USS Constitution fights against pirates. 273 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:30,600 Speaker 1: In nineteen twenty six, Arsner had been doing various work 274 00:16:30,640 --> 00:16:34,120 Speaker 1: for other studios, but she had always come back to Paramount. 275 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:37,920 Speaker 1: After Old Ironsides, she started trying to get Paramount to 276 00:16:37,920 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 1: give her a directing job. Executives at the studio seemed 277 00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 1: reluctant to do this, and she threatened to leave Paramount 278 00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:48,840 Speaker 1: for Columbia Pictures instead, because she had already been offered 279 00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:52,880 Speaker 1: a contract there. Paramount came back with sort of vague 280 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 1: promises that they might find something for her in the future, 281 00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:58,400 Speaker 1: and she told them that if she didn't have an 282 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 1: a list picture in the next two weeks, she was walking. 283 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 1: The results of this was the silent film Fashions for Women, 284 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:10,440 Speaker 1: which was the start of Arsner's career as a director 285 00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,480 Speaker 1: for Paramount. In addition to directing this movie, Arsner co 286 00:17:14,560 --> 00:17:18,119 Speaker 1: wrote the screenplay, which was adapted from earlier work, and 287 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:21,919 Speaker 1: she and Marian Morgan edited the film together. This was 288 00:17:21,960 --> 00:17:25,720 Speaker 1: an early starring role for Esther Rawlson, who had started 289 00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:28,560 Speaker 1: out as a vaudeville child performer and had played smaller 290 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:32,280 Speaker 1: roles than dozens of films before this point. This film 291 00:17:32,359 --> 00:17:36,720 Speaker 1: was released on March twenty sixth, nineteen twenty seven. From there, 292 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:42,160 Speaker 1: Arsner directed other Silent films, including Ten Modern Commandments, Get 293 00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:47,680 Speaker 1: Your Man, and Manhattan Cocktail. Manhattan Cocktail is sometimes described 294 00:17:47,720 --> 00:17:51,760 Speaker 1: as a part talkie because it had synchronized vocal music 295 00:17:51,840 --> 00:17:55,840 Speaker 1: and silent dialogue. Mary and Morgan worked on all three 296 00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 1: of these films as well. This did not make Arsner, 297 00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:03,439 Speaker 1: the first woman director in the motion picture industry in 298 00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:07,520 Speaker 1: the United States. We've already talked about Allen Asimova, and 299 00:18:07,720 --> 00:18:12,440 Speaker 1: other women directors included Lois Weber, who was a truly 300 00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:17,120 Speaker 1: prolific director and screenwriter, and Alice Gui Blachet, who had 301 00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:21,040 Speaker 1: started her career in France before founding her own studio 302 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:24,320 Speaker 1: with her husband Herbert back when the film industry was 303 00:18:24,359 --> 00:18:28,679 Speaker 1: still headquartered in New Jersey. According to research by the 304 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:32,720 Speaker 1: American Film Institute, during the Silent film era, more than 305 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:37,760 Speaker 1: ten percent of feature film credits were to women directors, writers, 306 00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:42,440 Speaker 1: and producers, and women wrote almost twenty percent of feature 307 00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:46,960 Speaker 1: films during that era. Unfortunately, most of these films are 308 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:50,679 Speaker 1: lost today because they were not preserved and their film 309 00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:55,199 Speaker 1: stock either deteriorated or was intentionally destroyed because of the 310 00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:59,919 Speaker 1: expense involved with conserving and properly storing it. This is 311 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:03,600 Speaker 1: its true of all of the silent films that Arsner directed, 312 00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:09,480 Speaker 1: but overwhelmingly these women directors didn't make the transition from 313 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:12,840 Speaker 1: silent films to talkies starting in the late nineteen twenties, 314 00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:16,360 Speaker 1: and there were a lot of reasons for this. Filmmaking 315 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 1: had started out as something new and very experimental, and 316 00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:23,280 Speaker 1: the earliest films were typically very short, so there was 317 00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 1: a lot more opportunity for people to kind of try 318 00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:29,760 Speaker 1: their own thing. By the nineteen twenties, even before the 319 00:19:29,840 --> 00:19:33,160 Speaker 1: move away from silent films, production had become a lot 320 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:37,320 Speaker 1: more expensive and involved, and corporations like Paramount and MGM 321 00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:41,840 Speaker 1: were really dominating Hollywood as smaller independent companies were driven 322 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 1: out of business. The major studios also kept extremely tight 323 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:50,480 Speaker 1: control on what was made and how it was made. 324 00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:54,720 Speaker 1: As the industry became more corporate and more male dominated, 325 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:59,880 Speaker 1: executives and other decision makers gave women fewer and fewer opportunities. 326 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:04,359 Speaker 1: As studios started to unionize, some of the unions also 327 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:08,880 Speaker 1: allowed only men as members, and as productions started shifting 328 00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:12,840 Speaker 1: away from silent films, women often were not given access 329 00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: to the training and education and experience that they would 330 00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:18,159 Speaker 1: need to just keep up with all the changes in 331 00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:23,959 Speaker 1: the industry. Dorothy Arsner became the lone exception. She managed 332 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:27,240 Speaker 1: to keep directing movies when other women did not, possibly 333 00:20:27,359 --> 00:20:30,800 Speaker 1: because of her complete refusal to back down and her 334 00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:34,280 Speaker 1: willingness to go somewhere else if a studio wouldn't negotiate. 335 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:38,159 Speaker 1: Arsener became not only the only woman working as a 336 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:41,680 Speaker 1: director in the Hollywood studio system, but also in a tour. 337 00:20:42,640 --> 00:20:45,240 Speaker 1: She preferred to have screenwriters on set with her so 338 00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:48,919 Speaker 1: they could work together and with the editor, including turning 339 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 1: characters that had been written as one dimensional stereotypes and 340 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 1: the source material into complex people with complicated motives and personality. 341 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:03,800 Speaker 1: This amount of control director was extremely unusual. At this point. 342 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:06,960 Speaker 1: The studios were really calling the shots and making a 343 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:10,560 Speaker 1: lot of those kinds of decisions, but Arsner was willing 344 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 1: to walk away if they wouldn't give her that authority. 345 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:17,959 Speaker 1: She was also focused on making movies with other women, 346 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:20,919 Speaker 1: so those writers and editors that she was working so 347 00:21:21,119 --> 00:21:25,400 Speaker 1: closely with were usually women as well. They also mainly 348 00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 1: focused on women's stories. Arsner was quoted as saying, quote, 349 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:32,000 Speaker 1: try as a man may he will never be able 350 00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:36,080 Speaker 1: to get the woman's viewpoint in telling certain stories. The 351 00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:39,480 Speaker 1: studios also used this idea in their marketing. They would 352 00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:43,000 Speaker 1: really hype up that this was a woman's film being 353 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:47,720 Speaker 1: told by the only woman director, and Irony hears that 354 00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:51,040 Speaker 1: within the industry, Arsner seems to have been regarded more 355 00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:54,560 Speaker 1: as one of the boys. A number of people including 356 00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:58,680 Speaker 1: director Robert Aldrich, described her this way. She always kept 357 00:21:58,680 --> 00:22:01,240 Speaker 1: her hair short, and while she she sometimes wore straight 358 00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:05,120 Speaker 1: dresses or conservative skirts and blazers, she was just as 359 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:08,440 Speaker 1: often in a suit, sometimes with a tie. She could 360 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:11,160 Speaker 1: also be more dramatic with her dress like There are 361 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 1: photos of her on the set of a western dressed 362 00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:17,960 Speaker 1: as a cowboy, and production stills from old ironsides show 363 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:21,160 Speaker 1: her in a sailor suit. Some of the media coverage 364 00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:24,080 Speaker 1: of her career just kind of glosses over this, describing 365 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:27,439 Speaker 1: her as feminine and as having no patience for vulgarity 366 00:22:27,520 --> 00:22:31,840 Speaker 1: or loudness on her sets. At the same time, it 367 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:36,119 Speaker 1: does seem like what was tacitly accepted or glossed over 368 00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 1: in Hollywood might have had a negative impact elsewhere in 369 00:22:39,960 --> 00:22:43,680 Speaker 1: her life. In nineteen twenty nine, Arsner tried to get 370 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:45,959 Speaker 1: a loan to buy a house in the Los Buelist 371 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:49,040 Speaker 1: neighborhood of Los Angeles, and the bank turned her down. 372 00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 1: It does not seem like there was a legitimate financial 373 00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:56,800 Speaker 1: reason for this, and Arsner cashed in some investments so 374 00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 1: that she could pay for this house without needing a loan. 375 00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:03,159 Speaker 1: This wound up working out in her favor since Just 376 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:06,280 Speaker 1: a few months later, in October of nineteen twenty nine, 377 00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:09,240 Speaker 1: the stock market crashed, marking the start of the Great 378 00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:13,280 Speaker 1: Depression that would have wiped out most of the value 379 00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:15,879 Speaker 1: of those investments that she had sold to build the house. 380 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:20,160 Speaker 1: The stock market crash not long after Arsener had directed 381 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 1: her first talkie. That was The Wild Party, starring Clara Bow, 382 00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:27,640 Speaker 1: who had previously worked with Arsener on Get Your Man. 383 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:31,880 Speaker 1: Arsner is often cited as inventing the boom mic during 384 00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:35,320 Speaker 1: the production of this film, although similar rigs were used 385 00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:38,679 Speaker 1: on other films at around the same time. With the 386 00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:42,080 Speaker 1: introduction of spoken dialogue in movies, actors had to hit 387 00:23:42,119 --> 00:23:45,359 Speaker 1: their marks and hold still to deliver their lines, which 388 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:49,520 Speaker 1: was awkward and often wound up seeming stilted. This was 389 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:53,520 Speaker 1: also Bow's first talkie and she was struggling with the microphones, 390 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:56,840 Speaker 1: so Arsner had hung one from a fishing rod which 391 00:23:56,880 --> 00:23:59,720 Speaker 1: could be suspended over the actors and move as they 392 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:04,159 Speaker 1: moved moved. The Wild Party was a box office success 393 00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:07,040 Speaker 1: and also one of the first leading roles for actor 394 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 1: Frederick Marsch. Arsner then directed Charming Sinners, which also came 395 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:15,000 Speaker 1: out in nineteen twenty nine and Behind the Makeup in 396 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:19,359 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty. Sarah and Son also came out in nineteen 397 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,719 Speaker 1: thirty and starred Ruth Chatterton, who was nominated for an 398 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:26,960 Speaker 1: Academy Award as Best Actress for the role. By this point, 399 00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:30,919 Speaker 1: Arsner was starting to develop a reputation as a star maker. 400 00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 1: This was Chatterton's second Best Actress nomination, and soon after this, 401 00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:39,240 Speaker 1: Frederick March was named Best Actor for his role in 402 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:43,760 Speaker 1: Doctor Jekyl and Mister Hyde. Arsner's last film for Paramount 403 00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:47,320 Speaker 1: was Merely We Go to Hell in nineteen thirty two. 404 00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,840 Speaker 1: While movies were a hugely popular form of entertainment for 405 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 1: people hoping to escape from the stresses of the Great Depression, 406 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:58,639 Speaker 1: Paramount was on the edge of financial disaster. Part of 407 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:02,320 Speaker 1: this was because of the economy, but the movie studio 408 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:07,160 Speaker 1: was also facing increasing competition from other Hollywood movie studios. 409 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,040 Speaker 1: Paramount wanted Arsner to sign a new contract that would 410 00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:14,639 Speaker 1: cut her pay by fifty percent, which was happening pretty 411 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:18,199 Speaker 1: much across the board, but she refused. She spent the 412 00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:21,080 Speaker 1: rest of her career as a freelancer, working for whatever 413 00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:25,040 Speaker 1: company she wanted. We'll talk about her life after leaving 414 00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:38,480 Speaker 1: Paramount after a sponsor break. In nineteen thirty three, Dorothy 415 00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 1: Arsner directed Christopher Strong for RKO Pictures. This was Catherine 416 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:47,000 Speaker 1: Hepburn's second feature film, and it also featured Billy Burke. 417 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:51,960 Speaker 1: Arsner and Hepburn butted heads a lot during this film. 418 00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:56,920 Speaker 1: It seems like Hepburn thought Arsner's directing was uninspired and 419 00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:02,080 Speaker 1: Arsner thought Hepburn's tone was too, and they also just 420 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:07,000 Speaker 1: seemed to clash personally, but this also added to Arsener's 421 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 1: reputation as a starmaker. Katherine Hepburn earned an Academy Award 422 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,720 Speaker 1: for Best Actress in Morning Glory, which came out later 423 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:18,919 Speaker 1: that same year. Arsner had actually originally been on board 424 00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:22,399 Speaker 1: to direct Morning Glory, but the production schedule did not 425 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 1: work out. All of Arsner's films up to this point 426 00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: fall under the umbrella of pre code Hollywood, and they 427 00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:34,120 Speaker 1: often had some transgressive themes. The Wild Party is set 428 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:38,160 Speaker 1: at a women's college and is read as having lesbian undertones. 429 00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:42,000 Speaker 1: In Merrily we Go to Hell, and Heiress marries a 430 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:44,840 Speaker 1: reporter who turns out to be a very heavy drinker, 431 00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:47,880 Speaker 1: and when she catches him in an affair, they basically 432 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:51,880 Speaker 1: arranged to have an open marriage. This was way way 433 00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:54,920 Speaker 1: more scandalous in nineteen thirty two than it would be today, 434 00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:59,000 Speaker 1: and some newspapers actually refuse to even advertise Merrily We 435 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:03,280 Speaker 1: Go to Hell just because of its title. In Christopher Strong, 436 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:06,119 Speaker 1: Catherine Hepburn plays an aviator who falls in love with 437 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,119 Speaker 1: a married man, and the film involves an out of wedlock, pregnancy, 438 00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:14,280 Speaker 1: and a suicide. Overall, in one way or another, a 439 00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:18,400 Speaker 1: lot of Arsner's pre Code films framed heterosexual marriage as 440 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:22,960 Speaker 1: a repressive and even oppressive dynamic. But over the nineteen 441 00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:27,480 Speaker 1: twenties and thirties, the industry had become increasingly concerned about 442 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:31,000 Speaker 1: the moral content of its films. Some of this was 443 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:35,720 Speaker 1: tied to greater socioeconomic factors. For example, the Great Depression 444 00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:39,440 Speaker 1: was seen as an emasculating force for men as many 445 00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:43,080 Speaker 1: of them lost their jobs as women were entering the workforce, 446 00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:47,440 Speaker 1: so there were a lot of fears around changing gender 447 00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:52,120 Speaker 1: norms and gender roles. Hollywood had also been hit by 448 00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:57,200 Speaker 1: a lot of scandals, including the murder of William Desmond Taylor. 449 00:27:57,800 --> 00:27:59,960 Speaker 1: We just ran our episode on that as a sad 450 00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:04,919 Speaker 1: Saturday classic. Various religious and political groups were calling on 451 00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:10,479 Speaker 1: Hollywood to regulate itself over issues like obscenity, violence, and 452 00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:14,800 Speaker 1: indecency in films. This led to the adoption of the 453 00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:20,200 Speaker 1: Motion Picture Production Code, better known as the Hayes Code. 454 00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:23,560 Speaker 1: The Hayes Code grew out of earlier standards and rules, 455 00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:26,199 Speaker 1: and it went through numerous revisions from the time it 456 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:29,440 Speaker 1: was introduced in nineteen thirty four to the creation of 457 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:33,399 Speaker 1: the modern film rating system in nineteen sixty eight, But 458 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,240 Speaker 1: for the most part, the code always had the same 459 00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:41,120 Speaker 1: three general principles. One, no picture shall be produced which 460 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:44,840 Speaker 1: will lower the moral standards of those who see it. Hence, 461 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:47,400 Speaker 1: the sympathy of the audience should never be thrown to 462 00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:53,080 Speaker 1: the side of crime, wrongdoing, evil, or sin. Two. Correct 463 00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:56,560 Speaker 1: standards of life, subject only to the requirements of drama 464 00:28:56,680 --> 00:29:03,000 Speaker 1: and entertainment, shall be presented. Law natural or human shall 465 00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:07,440 Speaker 1: not be ridiculed, nor shall sympathy be created for its violation. 466 00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 1: There are a lot of specifics that were spelled out 467 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:14,600 Speaker 1: in various ways over the years as well, like that 468 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:19,560 Speaker 1: films should not make their audiences sympathize with murderers or 469 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:25,240 Speaker 1: other criminals. They should not make adultery, miscegenation, or homosexuality 470 00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:30,920 Speaker 1: seem acceptable. Obscenity and profanity were also forbidden. While these 471 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:33,959 Speaker 1: standards restricted some of what she could do in the 472 00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:38,120 Speaker 1: post code era, Arsener's films continued to be focused on women. 473 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:42,920 Speaker 1: Craig's Wife, starring Rosalind Russell, came out in nineteen thirty six. 474 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:46,600 Speaker 1: I was based on a Pulitzer Prize winning play. It 475 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:49,360 Speaker 1: told the story of a very strong, willed woman who 476 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,360 Speaker 1: approached her marriage as more of a business arrangement than 477 00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:55,800 Speaker 1: a romance, and what happened as she alienated the people 478 00:29:55,840 --> 00:30:00,320 Speaker 1: around her. In nineteen thirty seven, Arsener directed The Ride 479 00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:04,080 Speaker 1: Wore Red starring Joan Crawford, which was a romantic comedy 480 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:07,800 Speaker 1: that was layered with issues of class and identity. In 481 00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:10,760 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty eight, Arsner became the first woman to join 482 00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:15,720 Speaker 1: the Screen Director's Guild, later the Director's Guild of America. 483 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:20,280 Speaker 1: In nineteen forty, Arsner directed Dance, Girl Dance, starring Lucille 484 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:24,280 Speaker 1: Ball and Marine O'Hara, Even though the film industry had 485 00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:27,840 Speaker 1: really locked down the more subversive elements of a lot 486 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:31,760 Speaker 1: of Arst's earlier career. Today, this movie has a reputation 487 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:36,480 Speaker 1: as a feminist film. Ball played Bubbles, a chorus girl, 488 00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:41,040 Speaker 1: and O'Hara was Judy, a classically trained ballet dancer. Toward 489 00:30:41,080 --> 00:30:44,080 Speaker 1: the end of the film, Bubbles offers Judy a job, 490 00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:47,240 Speaker 1: and Judy doesn't realize she has been hired to play 491 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:50,880 Speaker 1: a stooge, meaning that she's supposed to be ridiculed and 492 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:55,440 Speaker 1: booed off the stage before Bubble's performance. Judy takes this 493 00:30:55,520 --> 00:30:58,760 Speaker 1: job because she's desperate for work, and she eventually stops 494 00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:02,160 Speaker 1: the show and delivers a monologue to the audience, saying, 495 00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:06,200 Speaker 1: in part quote, go ahead and stare. I'm not ashamed, 496 00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,600 Speaker 1: go on laugh, get your money's worth. Nobody's going to 497 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:11,920 Speaker 1: hurt you. I know you want me to tear my 498 00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,640 Speaker 1: clothes off so you can look your fifty cents worth 499 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:17,440 Speaker 1: fifty cents for the privilege of staring at a girl 500 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:21,720 Speaker 1: the way your wives won't let you. Arsner's last Hollywood 501 00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:24,640 Speaker 1: film was First Comes Courage, which came out in nineteen 502 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:28,640 Speaker 1: forty three. It was a wartime drama starring Merle Oberon 503 00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,560 Speaker 1: as a member of the Norwegian Resistance. Arsner got sick 504 00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:36,080 Speaker 1: during filming. In some accounts it was pneumonia, and in 505 00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:39,920 Speaker 1: others it was pleurisy. Charles Vidor had to be brought 506 00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:43,280 Speaker 1: in to take her place. Over the next few years, 507 00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:46,640 Speaker 1: there were various news reports about her being the top 508 00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:49,760 Speaker 1: choice to direct a number of films, but none of 509 00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:52,800 Speaker 1: those films ever happened, or if they did go forward, 510 00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:57,360 Speaker 1: someone else directed them. There's a lot of speculation about 511 00:31:57,400 --> 00:32:01,720 Speaker 1: why Arsner left Hollywood. It's possible that she just wasn't 512 00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:04,840 Speaker 1: enjoying the work as much in the face of increasingly 513 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:08,760 Speaker 1: strict enforcement of the Hayes Code. While she'd had a 514 00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:12,120 Speaker 1: reputation as quote one of the boys, Hollywood was also 515 00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:17,720 Speaker 1: just becoming increasingly homophobic. The House an American Activities Committee 516 00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:20,360 Speaker 1: had been established in nineteen thirty eight, and a few 517 00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:23,320 Speaker 1: years later it became really focused on the idea of 518 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:28,440 Speaker 1: communist infiltration in Hollywood. It's possible that Arsner just thought 519 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:31,000 Speaker 1: it was better for her not to be there. Some 520 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:34,440 Speaker 1: of her final films, including The Bride war Red, also 521 00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:36,640 Speaker 1: just had not been as well received as some of 522 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:40,680 Speaker 1: her earlier work. After her departure from the industry in 523 00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:44,680 Speaker 1: nineteen forty three, there were no women working as directors 524 00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:48,880 Speaker 1: from major Hollywood studios until Ida Lupino, who started an 525 00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:53,440 Speaker 1: independent Film Company with her husband. They started producing films 526 00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:58,120 Speaker 1: for RKO in nineteen forty nine. Arsner had been very 527 00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,320 Speaker 1: careful with her earnings and her innson. She was able 528 00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:03,640 Speaker 1: to live comfortably for the rest of her life, and 529 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:07,360 Speaker 1: she did do some other work. She helped direct training 530 00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:10,920 Speaker 1: films for the Women's Army Auxiliary Corps during World War II, 531 00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:14,520 Speaker 1: and she taught whack trainees to make training films of 532 00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:18,560 Speaker 1: their own. These training films are unfortunately presumed to be 533 00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:22,800 Speaker 1: lost today. In the late nineteen fifties, Joan Crawford, who 534 00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 1: was married to Pepsi executive Alfred Steel, convinced Arsner to 535 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:31,280 Speaker 1: direct a series of commercials for Pepsi. In nineteen fifty one, 536 00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:35,800 Speaker 1: Arsner and Marian Morgan moved to Laquinta, California, southwest of 537 00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:38,560 Speaker 1: Palm Springs, where they lived for the rest of their lives, 538 00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:41,760 Speaker 1: but Arsner continued to go back to the Los Angeles 539 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:45,160 Speaker 1: area for work. In nineteen fifty two, she was named 540 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:48,560 Speaker 1: head of the Television and Motion Picture department at Pasadena 541 00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:52,040 Speaker 1: Playhouse College of Theater Arts, and she taught the first 542 00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:56,360 Speaker 1: filmmaking course there. She also produced stage plays at the theater. 543 00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:00,960 Speaker 1: Arsner left Pasadena Playhouse in the late night nineteen fifties, 544 00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:04,200 Speaker 1: and started teaching at the Graduate Film School at the 545 00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:08,360 Speaker 1: University of California, Los Angeles. She remained in that position 546 00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:12,880 Speaker 1: until nineteen sixty three. By this point Arsner had lived 547 00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:16,440 Speaker 1: and worked through the transition from silent films to talkies 548 00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:21,280 Speaker 1: and from pre code to post code Hollywood. Her teaching 549 00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:25,879 Speaker 1: work was part of another transition from virtually all filmmaking 550 00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:29,719 Speaker 1: education happening on the job or through apprenticeships, to the 551 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:34,120 Speaker 1: existence of film schools. She didn't really love her first 552 00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:38,400 Speaker 1: year of teaching at UCLA, which was almost entirely lecture based. 553 00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:42,920 Speaker 1: Over her time there, her classes became progressively more hands on, 554 00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:46,319 Speaker 1: from working with a viewfinder and asking students how they 555 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:50,279 Speaker 1: would compose a scene, to bringing TV cameras into the classroom, 556 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,160 Speaker 1: to turning the room into a miniature set and having 557 00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:58,279 Speaker 1: her students make short films with professional actors. Eventually she 558 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:01,920 Speaker 1: was supervising fifty graduate A student filmmakers at a time. 559 00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:06,640 Speaker 1: While her own films had had a lot of groundbreaking 560 00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:09,920 Speaker 1: elements at the time that they were made, her teaching 561 00:35:10,040 --> 00:35:13,560 Speaker 1: was overall very conventional in terms of how to compose 562 00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:16,640 Speaker 1: a scene, light it and direct it to tell a story. 563 00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:19,600 Speaker 1: It seems like some of this was really about her 564 00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:22,680 Speaker 1: wanting her students to be able to work in Hollywood, 565 00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:26,719 Speaker 1: which was still very conventional and very constrained by the 566 00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:30,000 Speaker 1: Hays Code, but also some of it was about learning 567 00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:34,880 Speaker 1: the rules of film before breaking them. Arsner's most famous 568 00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:39,040 Speaker 1: student was Francis Ford Coppola. Coppola described her as having 569 00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:41,279 Speaker 1: a heart that was as big as the world, and 570 00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:44,319 Speaker 1: also as always having cookies and crackers on hand for 571 00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:48,680 Speaker 1: her students who she knew were starving. Marian Morgan died 572 00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:51,840 Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy one at the age of ninety A 573 00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:55,359 Speaker 1: year later, Arsner's film The Wild Party was screened at 574 00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:58,880 Speaker 1: the first International Festival of Women's Films, which sparked a 575 00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:02,799 Speaker 1: revival and interest in her work. The festival hosted a 576 00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:07,320 Speaker 1: retrospective of her films the following year. In nineteen seventy five, 577 00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:11,200 Speaker 1: the Director's Guild of America hosted a tribute to Arsner 578 00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:14,520 Speaker 1: that included a telegram that was read from Katherine Hepburn. 579 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:18,560 Speaker 1: This telegram said, quote, isn't it wonderful that you've had 580 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:20,960 Speaker 1: such a great career when you had no right to 581 00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:25,200 Speaker 1: have a career at all. That same year, Dorothy Arsner 582 00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:29,439 Speaker 1: Towards a Feminist Cinema was published by the British Film Institute, 583 00:36:29,719 --> 00:36:34,239 Speaker 1: edited by Claire Johnston. Dorothy Arsner died on October first, 584 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:37,799 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy nine, at the age of eighty two. She 585 00:36:37,880 --> 00:36:41,200 Speaker 1: had directed eighteen feature films over the course of her career, 586 00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:45,160 Speaker 1: but she was never given any industry awards during her lifetime. 587 00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:48,080 Speaker 1: In nineteen eighty six, she was given a star on 588 00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:51,600 Speaker 1: the Hollywood Walk of Fame. In two thousand and seven, 589 00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:55,160 Speaker 1: Dance Girl Dance was selected for preservation in the National 590 00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:59,520 Speaker 1: Film Registry. The Librarian of Congress's announcement set of the 591 00:36:59,560 --> 00:37:03,040 Speaker 1: film quote. Although there were numerous women filmmakers in the 592 00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:06,920 Speaker 1: early decades of Silent cinema, by the nineteen thirties, directing 593 00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:11,040 Speaker 1: in Hollywood had become a male bastion. With one exception, 594 00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:15,160 Speaker 1: Dorothy Arsner graduated from editing to directing in the late 595 00:37:15,239 --> 00:37:19,640 Speaker 1: nineteen twenties, often exploring the conflicted roles of women in 596 00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:24,600 Speaker 1: contemporary society in Dance Girl Dance. Her most intriguing film, 597 00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:28,680 Speaker 1: two women, Lucille Ball and Marine O'Hara pursue life in 598 00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:33,040 Speaker 1: show business from opposite sides of the spectrum, burlesque and ballet. 599 00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:37,000 Speaker 1: The film is a meditation on the disparity between art 600 00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:41,120 Speaker 1: and commerce. The dancers strive to preserve their own feminist 601 00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:44,839 Speaker 1: integrity while fighting for their place in the spotlight and 602 00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:49,200 Speaker 1: for the love of male lead Lewis Hayward. In twenty eighteen, 603 00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:53,040 Speaker 1: Paramount named the dressing room building on its studio lot 604 00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:57,600 Speaker 1: in Los Angeles after Dorothy Arsner. Francis Ford Coppola was 605 00:37:57,640 --> 00:37:59,759 Speaker 1: a big part of getting this building named for her, 606 00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:02,600 Speaker 1: and that the dedication. He talked about how much he 607 00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:05,799 Speaker 1: respected her and how much she had taught him. He 608 00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:09,000 Speaker 1: has also credited her encouragement with keeping him in film 609 00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:12,920 Speaker 1: school when he was thinking of quitting. There is not 610 00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:16,520 Speaker 1: currently a full biography of Drothy Arsner, at least not 611 00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:20,600 Speaker 1: one I could find. There is a book of collected interviews, 612 00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:23,879 Speaker 1: and also a book that's largely focused on her film work. 613 00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:26,600 Speaker 1: Like It has an autobiographical section, but a lot of 614 00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:29,360 Speaker 1: it is film criticism. Neither of these is just strictly 615 00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:34,360 Speaker 1: a biography. She started on an autobiography that she never finished. 616 00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:36,520 Speaker 1: We've mentioned that a couple of times in the episode. 617 00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:42,520 Speaker 1: It stops shortly before meeting Mariyan Morgan. It is possible 618 00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:45,759 Speaker 1: that that is why she did not continue it. There 619 00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:48,360 Speaker 1: was really no way to tell her life story without 620 00:38:48,400 --> 00:38:51,000 Speaker 1: Marian and she was still living at a time when 621 00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:54,560 Speaker 1: there was so much stigma and hostility around lesbianism that 622 00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:58,240 Speaker 1: you might not have thought it was workable. This partial 623 00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:02,399 Speaker 1: autobiography was not published until decades after her death, as 624 00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:05,879 Speaker 1: part of work that is more focused on film criticism 625 00:39:05,960 --> 00:39:09,960 Speaker 1: than on her life. There are rumors of a biopic 626 00:39:10,120 --> 00:39:12,560 Speaker 1: that would be directed by Todd Haynes that have been 627 00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:16,800 Speaker 1: circulating for more than twenty years. I have no idea 628 00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:18,719 Speaker 1: of anything else about this other than that it has 629 00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:25,000 Speaker 1: been rumored for more than twenty years. Uh, let's start 630 00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:28,040 Speaker 1: the arsener. I love her. I'm so glad you picked 631 00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:32,319 Speaker 1: this one, was I? Yes? Yes? Do you also have 632 00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:36,200 Speaker 1: some listener mail? I do I have listener mail from Caitlin. 633 00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:38,759 Speaker 1: Caitlyn is a frequent correspondent, and I think we have 634 00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:43,080 Speaker 1: read another Kaitlin email in the not too long ago past. 635 00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:48,600 Speaker 1: Caitlin wrote after our episode on Pelagra and said, Hi, 636 00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:51,319 Speaker 1: Tracy and Holly, I was so excited to see the 637 00:39:51,320 --> 00:39:53,719 Speaker 1: first part of the Pelagra two parter are in my 638 00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:57,480 Speaker 1: feed and when you alluded to the fortification of grain 639 00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:01,239 Speaker 1: products to provide more niacin imediately made me think of 640 00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:04,279 Speaker 1: a story my grandmother told me about some of her 641 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:08,240 Speaker 1: advocacy work. My grandmother got involved in the spina bifida 642 00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:11,160 Speaker 1: community when my aunt was born with it in nineteen seventy. 643 00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:15,239 Speaker 1: Spina bifida is a congenital disability that's classified as a 644 00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:18,680 Speaker 1: neural tube defect, and it occurs very early in a pregnancy, 645 00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:22,360 Speaker 1: between four and six weeks, often before a person knows 646 00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:25,360 Speaker 1: they are pregnant. One of the risk factors is a 647 00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:28,600 Speaker 1: lack of enough full ate vitamin B twelve during those 648 00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:33,719 Speaker 1: very early days of fetal development. My grandmother vividly remembers 649 00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:37,480 Speaker 1: when fullate started being included as one of the vitamins 650 00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:40,880 Speaker 1: in enriched grains and how quickly it seemed to affect 651 00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:45,240 Speaker 1: the number of children born with spina bifida. According to Graham, 652 00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:49,480 Speaker 1: though Hispanic families in our part of Texas continued to 653 00:40:49,560 --> 00:40:53,200 Speaker 1: seek out the Spina Bifida Association at the same rate, 654 00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:56,600 Speaker 1: she said very confidently that it was due to the 655 00:40:56,760 --> 00:41:01,920 Speaker 1: enriched grain programs primarily focusing on wheat products, while Hispanic 656 00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:06,480 Speaker 1: families tended to use corn products and specifically said MASSA 657 00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:09,839 Speaker 1: was not enriched like in a good historian. I tried 658 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,000 Speaker 1: to find resources to back this up, and it seems 659 00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:15,239 Speaker 1: Graham is correct. The FDA does not require MASSA to 660 00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:19,480 Speaker 1: have fullic acid the synthetic form of full eight added, 661 00:41:19,760 --> 00:41:23,719 Speaker 1: although it does recommend manufacturers do so. There's still a 662 00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:28,600 Speaker 1: documented disparity in rates of neural tube defects, including spina bifida, 663 00:41:28,640 --> 00:41:32,400 Speaker 1: between Hispanic and non Hispanic populations in the United States. 664 00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:35,520 Speaker 1: I thought that this connection to another form of B 665 00:41:35,719 --> 00:41:38,040 Speaker 1: vitamin was really interesting, and I hope you did too. 666 00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:41,479 Speaker 1: I enjoyed the Pelagra episodes. It fascinates me to try 667 00:41:41,520 --> 00:41:46,759 Speaker 1: and imagine the paradigm shifts society underwent as concepts like 668 00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:51,799 Speaker 1: tiny animalcules are causing disease and foods have invisible properties 669 00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:55,040 Speaker 1: that we need to survive for being introduced, especially the 670 00:41:55,080 --> 00:42:00,440 Speaker 1: time period where those overlap. Of course, people were for 671 00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:04,280 Speaker 1: a bacterial or viral cause of pelagra. They just accepted 672 00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:07,600 Speaker 1: that's how sickness worked. Thank you, as always for the 673 00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:10,200 Speaker 1: work you do. I've attached some pet tax photos of 674 00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:13,240 Speaker 1: Dmitri My orange guy who recently got some teeth pulled 675 00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:16,160 Speaker 1: but hasn't seemed to notice and shark to puss the 676 00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:18,640 Speaker 1: queen tority of the house, as well as the photo 677 00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:21,440 Speaker 1: of my grandmother and uncle circa nineteen seventy three to 678 00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:24,120 Speaker 1: seventy four. Best Caitlin. Hey, Caitlin, thanks so much for 679 00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:28,880 Speaker 1: this email. I loved this email a lot. We have talked, 680 00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:31,360 Speaker 1: I think in the recent behind the scenes about my 681 00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,080 Speaker 1: mom and my mom's work with disabled people for most 682 00:42:34,120 --> 00:42:36,440 Speaker 1: of her career, and that included working with some kids 683 00:42:36,440 --> 00:42:42,279 Speaker 1: with spina bifida. And I also what would volunteer with 684 00:42:42,360 --> 00:42:44,120 Speaker 1: some of the programs that my mom worked with when 685 00:42:44,120 --> 00:42:47,640 Speaker 1: I was a teen and worked with some kids who 686 00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:51,840 Speaker 1: had this condition. It would not have occurred to me 687 00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:55,120 Speaker 1: to think about that. With the full late and disparities 688 00:42:55,120 --> 00:43:00,879 Speaker 1: and where full late is being enriched, I mostly had 689 00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:04,520 Speaker 1: heard about this. I am not giving this as advice. 690 00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:06,960 Speaker 1: I'm saying this is what the advice was. When I 691 00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:11,000 Speaker 1: was taking high school health class. The advice in health 692 00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:13,760 Speaker 1: class was that anyone who was thinking of becoming pregnant 693 00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:17,200 Speaker 1: should go ahead and start taking prenatal vitamins because of 694 00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:19,640 Speaker 1: those be vitamins that are in there that are really 695 00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:25,960 Speaker 1: important to fetal development from the very earliest points of pregnancy, 696 00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:29,040 Speaker 1: before a person might be aware that they are pregnant. Yeah. Boy, 697 00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:32,239 Speaker 1: do we have some cute kitty cats. We have an 698 00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:35,400 Speaker 1: orange kitty with a little blup looking on the floor 699 00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:39,959 Speaker 1: like a silly orange kitty cat face. Uh oh, man, 700 00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:44,200 Speaker 1: we have another collection of orange cat fluffy cat. We 701 00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:49,680 Speaker 1: just read another listener male that was similarly orange cat 702 00:43:49,719 --> 00:43:55,720 Speaker 1: and fluffy cat. This fluffy cat stretched out on some carpet. Man, 703 00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:58,800 Speaker 1: we have multiple kitty cats in these pictures, or multiple 704 00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:01,040 Speaker 1: pictures subduced to kitty cats. Thank you so much, Caitlin. 705 00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:03,759 Speaker 1: Thank you again for this email. I did not know 706 00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:07,719 Speaker 1: any of this and I was glad to know of it. 707 00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:11,520 Speaker 1: If you'd like to send us a note about this 708 00:44:11,640 --> 00:44:14,839 Speaker 1: or any other podcast, we are at History Podcasts at 709 00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:19,360 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio dot com. You can subscribe to our show on 710 00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:22,239 Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app and anywhere else you like to get 711 00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:29,840 Speaker 1: your podcasts. Stuff you missed in History Class is a 712 00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:34,279 Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the 713 00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:37,799 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your 714 00:44:37,800 --> 00:44:38,799 Speaker 1: favorite shows.