1 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:07,960 Speaker 1: Hi, this is Annie and you're listening to stuff Mom 2 00:00:08,080 --> 00:00:22,480 Speaker 1: never told you. A lot of you have written in 3 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 1: lately asking about this whole sexy Halloween costume debate. Why 4 00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:35,160 Speaker 1: is it so common among female costumes costumes for women? 5 00:00:35,640 --> 00:00:39,680 Speaker 1: And this is a question that roared it's sexy head 6 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 1: when a couple of weeks ago, online retailer Yandy removed 7 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:48,559 Speaker 1: a quote brave red Maiden costume after a lot of 8 00:00:48,600 --> 00:00:51,920 Speaker 1: public pushback. If the name isn't clear, it was a 9 00:00:52,040 --> 00:00:56,639 Speaker 1: sexy handmade s Taiale costume. The description read in upsetting 10 00:00:56,760 --> 00:01:00,080 Speaker 1: Dystopian future has emerged where women no longer have a 11 00:00:59,800 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: s have her We say, be bold and speak your mind. 12 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:06,000 Speaker 1: And this brave red maiden costume featuring a red mini 13 00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 1: dress matching cloak with attached hood and a white bonnet headpiece. 14 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 1: Pantyhose not included. So it was the super skimpy, sexy 15 00:01:17,560 --> 00:01:24,959 Speaker 1: handmaid's tail costume and like if you to avoid copyright issues, 16 00:01:25,040 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 1: they don't call it that, but from the first line 17 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 1: and upsetting Dystopian future, it has emerged where women no 18 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:31,880 Speaker 1: longer have a say. A lot of people read that 19 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:35,600 Speaker 1: as also they were just used, they were raped and 20 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 1: just used to carry children, but we say be bold 21 00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:42,759 Speaker 1: and speak your mind. So Um, there was a lot 22 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:45,920 Speaker 1: of backlash, as you might guess, um, considering the subject 23 00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 1: matter of the show. A lot of people pointed out 24 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 1: that it was at best tone deaf, or, as one 25 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:56,040 Speaker 1: Twitter user put it, I can't decide if this misses 26 00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:59,200 Speaker 1: the point of the Handmaid's tail or encapsulates it completely. 27 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:02,600 Speaker 1: And yes. Some people defended the costume as pretty much 28 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:06,240 Speaker 1: the Handmaid's Tale taken to its ultimate conclusion, or that 29 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:08,880 Speaker 1: it took something about repressing women and turned it into 30 00:02:08,960 --> 00:02:14,079 Speaker 1: something empowering. Um. Still others said, well, there's sexy none costumes. 31 00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:19,760 Speaker 1: I don't see why you're getting so upset about sexy 32 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:24,200 Speaker 1: Handmaid's Tale costumes. Um. A lot of you wrote in 33 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:26,520 Speaker 1: and said that that it was mostly men making those 34 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:30,280 Speaker 1: kinds of comments. Um. The company pulled the costume with 35 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:34,080 Speaker 1: this statement. Over the last few hours, is become obvious 36 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:36,960 Speaker 1: that our yandy, brave red Maiden costume is being seen 37 00:02:37,040 --> 00:02:40,520 Speaker 1: as a symbol of women's oppression rather than expression of 38 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:44,799 Speaker 1: women's empowerment. This is unfortunate, as it was not our 39 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:48,520 Speaker 1: intention on any level. They said they got the inspiration 40 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:53,840 Speaker 1: from protesters surrounding Brett Kavanaugh, which is a very interesting 41 00:02:54,080 --> 00:02:58,280 Speaker 1: place to get your inspiration for a sexy Halloween costume. 42 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:02,400 Speaker 1: As as Halloween fast approaches and as a lot of 43 00:03:02,440 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 1: you have questions surrounding these sexy Halloween costumes, we thought 44 00:03:07,160 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 1: that we would rerun this classic episode to hopefully clarify 45 00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:19,720 Speaker 1: some things we hope you enjoy. Welcome to stuff Mom 46 00:03:19,800 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 1: never told you from housetop works dot com. Hi, and 47 00:03:27,480 --> 00:03:30,359 Speaker 1: welcome to podcast. This is Molly and I'm Kristin Kristen. 48 00:03:30,440 --> 00:03:34,359 Speaker 1: Today is our Halloween episode. And you know we've already 49 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:38,000 Speaker 1: gotten one costume from a listener. Our listener Bailey wrote 50 00:03:38,040 --> 00:03:40,240 Speaker 1: us after the Guerrilla Girls podcast and said she was 51 00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:42,240 Speaker 1: going to be free to call oh, which I think 52 00:03:42,320 --> 00:03:44,120 Speaker 1: is pretty cool. That's a good one. That's a good one. 53 00:03:44,160 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 1: I think it'd be cool to be a gorilla girl 54 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:47,880 Speaker 1: for Halloween. Yeah, you could just wear a gorilla nose. 55 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 1: It would be I think a lot of explaining to people, 56 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 1: you know, not explaining, Molley, educating, educating, that's true. What 57 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 1: are you going to be for Halloween? I'm going to 58 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:00,680 Speaker 1: be President Taft. I will be rolled around owned all 59 00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:04,640 Speaker 1: night in a bathtub and it'll be great. It sounds 60 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:06,000 Speaker 1: like you would get to use a lot of pillows 61 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:07,640 Speaker 1: for that costume, which I think would be fun because 62 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 1: let me just get tired at a party. I'm just 63 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:12,240 Speaker 1: gonna call up Amy Sadaries, let her ask her fucking 64 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 1: borrow her fat suit? Nice, and then I'm going to 65 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:17,880 Speaker 1: get yeah, you know, call up a buddy with a 66 00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 1: with a monocle. Yes, my my friend Jim who wears 67 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:25,080 Speaker 1: a monocle everywhere and a top hat and a top hat. Yes, 68 00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:27,800 Speaker 1: monocle Jim, That's what I call him. Now. I think 69 00:04:27,839 --> 00:04:31,599 Speaker 1: that the inevitable question for a lady around Halloween time 70 00:04:31,800 --> 00:04:33,919 Speaker 1: is if you said to me, I'm going to be 71 00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:36,040 Speaker 1: president Taft, I'd make a joke and be like, how 72 00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:38,720 Speaker 1: are you going to be sexy President Taft? Yeah? Is 73 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,839 Speaker 1: there any unsexy president Taft? Is what I would respond, Molly. 74 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:47,720 Speaker 1: And that's because the topic of today's podcast related to Halloween, 75 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:51,919 Speaker 1: as requested on Facebook, is sexy and racy Halloween costumes 76 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:55,200 Speaker 1: for women? Why are women always expected to wear a 77 00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 1: sexy costume? Yeah? And we gotta go ahead and just 78 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:01,679 Speaker 1: throw out this term because even the New York Times 79 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:05,200 Speaker 1: has used this slut Owen. And that's the only time 80 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:07,000 Speaker 1: I'm going to say it. Yeah, because Mob and I 81 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:09,719 Speaker 1: are big fans of the word slot. But it comes 82 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:13,599 Speaker 1: up a lot around Halloween because if you go into 83 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:16,359 Speaker 1: a costume shop or go online and you look at 84 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:18,960 Speaker 1: women's costumes, we all know this. This is an old, 85 00:05:19,440 --> 00:05:22,239 Speaker 1: old media story. We're talking about folks. Everyone knows about 86 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:25,200 Speaker 1: you know, Oh, do you want to be sexy pirate, 87 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:31,080 Speaker 1: sexy nurse, sexy farmer, sexy astronaut, everything is sexy? Can 88 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:32,960 Speaker 1: I can we go through a few of the of 89 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:36,560 Speaker 1: the costumes because it's just they're so funny, Like I 90 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:38,600 Speaker 1: just I do think that there's an element of humor 91 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:42,080 Speaker 1: and some of these are so are so ridiculous because 92 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:46,719 Speaker 1: it's such a stretch. Sexy SpongeBob. Oh yeah, sexy Nemo. 93 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:50,479 Speaker 1: Sexy Nemo. Now, listen, people, Nemo as a clownfish and 94 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:54,799 Speaker 1: he changes sex biological sex frequently. That was not exploring 95 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:56,480 Speaker 1: in the Disney movie. But I've done a little research 96 00:05:56,560 --> 00:06:00,920 Speaker 1: on clownfish. So just throughout the factory, if you're gonna 97 00:06:00,920 --> 00:06:04,200 Speaker 1: be sexy Nemo, all right, this is my favorite, Kristen, 98 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: And if we decided to do you know, a duo costume. 99 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:09,280 Speaker 1: I kind of want you to be the sexy Michelangelo 100 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:12,799 Speaker 1: to my sexy Leonardo. That's right. There are sexy teenage mutant, 101 00:06:12,839 --> 00:06:20,880 Speaker 1: ninja turtle costumes. Oh wow, um, racy Robin Hood. Yeah. 102 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:22,600 Speaker 1: And you know, you know what I like about this 103 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:26,280 Speaker 1: list of sexy costumes is these are all male characters too. 104 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:28,560 Speaker 1: That's true. Well, here's another thing that kind of struck me, 105 00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:33,839 Speaker 1: Christen is there's a lot of sexy police officers, sexy firefighters, um, 106 00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:36,800 Speaker 1: sexy soldiers, and I think that these are professions that 107 00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:39,800 Speaker 1: we typically think of as male dominating. Yeah, when it 108 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 1: comes to Halloween, were perfectly fine having women be soldiers. 109 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:44,719 Speaker 1: We can't have them be soldiers the rest of the year. 110 00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:47,080 Speaker 1: We still won't let them serve an active duty. But 111 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:49,960 Speaker 1: if they're willing to be sexy when they're soldiers, maybe yeah, 112 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:54,040 Speaker 1: maybe if they started wearing sexy or uniforms. Hey, I 113 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 1: think I think I just don't want to go mind. Yeah, 114 00:06:56,680 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 1: I want you write your congress person with that. Um, 115 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:02,480 Speaker 1: there are some there are some female ones too, and 116 00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:06,040 Speaker 1: even the most unsexy females can be made into uh 117 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:10,720 Speaker 1: to sexy Halloween costumes. Here sexy Wednesday Adams. When sty 118 00:07:10,800 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 1: Adam Wednesday Adams, I don't think was ever going for 119 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:18,800 Speaker 1: obviously French maid. Yeah, that's a big one. Pirate Wench, 120 00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:22,920 Speaker 1: Pirate Wench very common. So um oh, here's one sexy 121 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:27,920 Speaker 1: Amelia Earhart. Oh man, really, yes she was. I saw 122 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:30,240 Speaker 1: the costume she's wearing, just kind of like booty shorts 123 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:33,440 Speaker 1: and thigh high boots and then just like a bra aviator. 124 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:36,680 Speaker 1: It's its style. Well and the got goals obviously. That 125 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 1: makes me kind of said, well, it's kind of funny 126 00:07:39,440 --> 00:07:41,160 Speaker 1: just because I think at the end of this costume, 127 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:44,080 Speaker 1: we're going to try and think of some more women friendly, 128 00:07:44,600 --> 00:07:47,480 Speaker 1: empowering costumes, and I think Amelia Earhart is one that 129 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:50,080 Speaker 1: a lot of people would have thrown out. But someone's 130 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:53,160 Speaker 1: sarry sexied her up. Yeah. Well, everything at this point 131 00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: basically has been sexied up. And by now it's established 132 00:07:57,320 --> 00:08:04,520 Speaker 1: fact that Halloween is dominated by the sexy parade of costumes, granted, 133 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:08,040 Speaker 1: and it sets the blogs all a flutter. Everyone's got 134 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 1: to weigh in on this, this concept of whether it's 135 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 1: good for women, bad for women, good for girls, bad 136 00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: for girls, And you know, there's a line of mean 137 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:18,880 Speaker 1: Girls where she goes, um, Halloween's the one night we 138 00:08:18,880 --> 00:08:20,640 Speaker 1: can dress up as a slut and no other girls 139 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 1: can say anything about it. You can't be judged for 140 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:25,600 Speaker 1: because it's Halloween. And that's just not true anymore because 141 00:08:25,600 --> 00:08:28,800 Speaker 1: it seems like everyone has some sort of opinion on it. 142 00:08:28,840 --> 00:08:31,840 Speaker 1: You have sites like Maxim saying, Yeah, this is awesome. 143 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:36,840 Speaker 1: I love this Halloween every day, and then you have 144 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:40,880 Speaker 1: sites like Jezebel saying, oh mg, ladies, what are we doing? 145 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 1: Even though Asbell would say, it way cooler than that, 146 00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 1: but you know, it's like it's still kind of um 147 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 1: Catch twenty two for women, because yeah, I would I 148 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:53,439 Speaker 1: would say that Mean Girls does have it right because 149 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:56,440 Speaker 1: it is at this point pretty accepted for women to 150 00:08:56,760 --> 00:08:59,880 Speaker 1: bear all on Halloween. But it still comes, I think, 151 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:03,720 Speaker 1: with some judgment. But my big question is when we 152 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 1: were talking about doing this podcast, was is there some 153 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:09,520 Speaker 1: way to figure out when all of this came about? 154 00:09:09,559 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 1: When did we just start cutting the middrifts out of 155 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 1: costumes and parading around in booty shorts? I mean, because 156 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:19,880 Speaker 1: it's cold on Halloween. My goal, by the way, when 157 00:09:19,920 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 1: I think of Halloween costumes is not really appearance. So 158 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:26,760 Speaker 1: much as warmth, which is which is why taft as 159 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 1: an excellent joint, which is what have you ever worn 160 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:31,959 Speaker 1: a fat suit? They are warm? It would be very 161 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:33,959 Speaker 1: handy for your trick or treating. Well, there was a 162 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 1: two thousand six articles in the New York Times and 163 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 1: one lady who deals in costumes. Her theory as to 164 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:42,199 Speaker 1: why we why we have this sexy market is because 165 00:09:42,200 --> 00:09:44,840 Speaker 1: of baby boomers. That you know, Halloween used to be 166 00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:47,840 Speaker 1: very much this homemade holiday for children and all they 167 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:49,520 Speaker 1: did was trick or treat and that was that was 168 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:52,000 Speaker 1: it for Halloween. You waited for the Great Pumpkin if 169 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:53,840 Speaker 1: you were in a Charlie Bount Brown Cat cartoon. But 170 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:56,880 Speaker 1: that's it. But she claims that as these baby boomers 171 00:09:56,880 --> 00:09:58,680 Speaker 1: grew up, they did not want to let go of 172 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:01,160 Speaker 1: Halloween and it became a time to throw parties for 173 00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:04,560 Speaker 1: adults and it became less about kids. And you know, 174 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 1: I don't know if I agree with that, but that's 175 00:10:06,440 --> 00:10:09,640 Speaker 1: one it's one theory. Yeah, I think that Halloween has 176 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:12,520 Speaker 1: definitely become an adult holiday. Of course, we love to 177 00:10:12,559 --> 00:10:15,600 Speaker 1: see the little kiddies parading around in their adorable costumes, 178 00:10:15,640 --> 00:10:17,160 Speaker 1: and then we want them to go to bed, but 179 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:18,840 Speaker 1: we want them to go to bed so we can 180 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:22,360 Speaker 1: drink some adult beverage. We can drink spike cider and 181 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:26,320 Speaker 1: um and eat candy. And so is that okay? Are 182 00:10:26,320 --> 00:10:29,200 Speaker 1: you kidding? Probably not? If you're wearing a skin revealing costume, 183 00:10:29,720 --> 00:10:32,280 Speaker 1: even better, I say, But but I still like the 184 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:36,600 Speaker 1: candy part of Halloween now. Of course, in true stuff, 185 00:10:36,600 --> 00:10:40,640 Speaker 1: Mo'm never told you style. We did find a scholarly 186 00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:44,880 Speaker 1: article on gender and Halloween costumes people, and I believe 187 00:10:44,960 --> 00:10:46,920 Speaker 1: she writes in the intro that this is the only 188 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:50,679 Speaker 1: study she knows of that is about gender and Halloween costumes. 189 00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:54,200 Speaker 1: The title of said paper is the Pink Dragon is 190 00:10:54,280 --> 00:11:00,760 Speaker 1: Female Halloween Costumes and gender markers. And the reason that 191 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:02,960 Speaker 1: this comes, the reason this is gonna be relevance because 192 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:05,120 Speaker 1: you know, it's one thing. I think if adult women 193 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 1: want to choose to wear something that's revealing, you know, 194 00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:10,000 Speaker 1: that's sort of I think the essence of feminism is 195 00:11:10,040 --> 00:11:12,040 Speaker 1: you can choose what you want to do with your body. 196 00:11:12,080 --> 00:11:14,720 Speaker 1: If you want to be a sexy firefighter, and do it. 197 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:18,199 Speaker 1: If you want to be a fully clothed firefighter, do it. 198 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:20,600 Speaker 1: That's that's probably not the issue, and there are a 199 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:24,480 Speaker 1: lot of women who who enjoy just like that nightive exhibitionism. 200 00:11:25,240 --> 00:11:28,720 Speaker 1: You don't normally wear sexy, you know, firefighter outfits the 201 00:11:28,760 --> 00:11:30,560 Speaker 1: rest of the year, So if you're really into that, 202 00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:33,080 Speaker 1: do it. And also, I will say the one thing 203 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:35,360 Speaker 1: if you you know, if you choose to wear a 204 00:11:35,559 --> 00:11:39,320 Speaker 1: scandalous Halloween costume, you might be able to get more 205 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 1: of a past because you're surrounded by people and scandalous 206 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:45,040 Speaker 1: Halloween costumes, so it's not like you're just going to 207 00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:47,000 Speaker 1: be standing out in the crowd. So it is a 208 00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 1: nice time for people who want to explore that side 209 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 1: of themselves, want to show up some flesh, show ups 210 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:54,360 Speaker 1: some flesh. So there you'll find just as many rationales 211 00:11:54,440 --> 00:11:56,719 Speaker 1: like that on the Internet as you'll find the oh 212 00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:58,920 Speaker 1: my gosh, what is what is feminism done to us? 213 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:01,560 Speaker 1: But I think it gets more troubling when you look 214 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:04,080 Speaker 1: at what the little children are doing. Because the Washington 215 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:07,559 Speaker 1: Post had this article that basically followed around eleven year 216 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:10,040 Speaker 1: olds and their moms through a party city and they 217 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:13,679 Speaker 1: could not find anything that was not sexied up for 218 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:16,880 Speaker 1: a little eleven year old to wear. Yeah, and specifically 219 00:12:17,120 --> 00:12:21,120 Speaker 1: eleven year old girls because the boys are gonna be superheroes, Spiderman, 220 00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:24,720 Speaker 1: they're going to be the fully closed Firefighter, they're gonna 221 00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:28,240 Speaker 1: be power Rangers if those are still cool. Yeah, I 222 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:29,600 Speaker 1: was going to say, I think you're now you're naming 223 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:35,080 Speaker 1: costumes from but I'm dating myself and uh today though, 224 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:39,720 Speaker 1: for girls, the whole kind of slut oween idea has 225 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:42,160 Speaker 1: trickled down to the kid's market, and that's I think 226 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 1: that's what really bothers people. Yeah, if you can't get 227 00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:48,320 Speaker 1: like a really cool like Eminem costume when you're eleven, 228 00:12:48,360 --> 00:12:53,719 Speaker 1: I think there's something sexy cat but that and that 229 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:56,040 Speaker 1: was the point of this Washington Post article where all 230 00:12:56,040 --> 00:13:00,240 Speaker 1: of these horrified parents following their daughters around who wanted 231 00:13:00,280 --> 00:13:04,760 Speaker 1: to be French made and sexy bo Pete, But even 232 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 1: to be like a rock star you had to buy 233 00:13:06,559 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 1: like a bare middrift outfit and like the thigh high boots. 234 00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:11,720 Speaker 1: I mean it's it's just every costume that could just 235 00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:14,679 Speaker 1: be cool becomes sexy. And that's why we're going to 236 00:13:14,760 --> 00:13:17,760 Speaker 1: turn to this paper. The Pink Dragon is female by 237 00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:20,760 Speaker 1: eight Nelson because she argues that we are the ones 238 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:22,840 Speaker 1: setting our kids up for this. Yeah, and she claims 239 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:25,160 Speaker 1: that this has really been We've kind of been leading 240 00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:30,080 Speaker 1: up to this point because of gender markers in children's 241 00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:34,440 Speaker 1: Halloween costumes. So get ready to let's look at every 242 00:13:34,520 --> 00:13:38,000 Speaker 1: children's Halloween costume with a with a just a disgusted look. 243 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:40,040 Speaker 1: Because what she does is she looks at four and 244 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:43,680 Speaker 1: sixty nine children's Halloween costumes. I would have been in 245 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:45,599 Speaker 1: this study. We always have how the studies you wouldn't do, 246 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:48,160 Speaker 1: I do this, We can do this one. So she 247 00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 1: looks at all these Halloween costumes and she basically identifies 248 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 1: them as aim towards girls based on whether there's a 249 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:56,720 Speaker 1: girl in the picture, the costume is pink or another 250 00:13:56,760 --> 00:13:59,360 Speaker 1: traditional girl color, or whether it is you know, just 251 00:13:59,400 --> 00:14:02,280 Speaker 1: like a dress. It's obviously aimed for girls. She does 252 00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 1: the same for what the ones that are aimed at 253 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:07,560 Speaker 1: the boys, and then she does gender neutral and gender neutral. 254 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:10,319 Speaker 1: She kind of identifies as you can't see the kids 255 00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 1: shoes or if I mean, you can, but it's not 256 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:16,560 Speaker 1: like high heels or ballet flats, or there's a picture 257 00:14:16,559 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 1: of both the boy and a girl wearing the costume. 258 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:22,280 Speaker 1: Things like food that can't be turned into a cookie, 259 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:25,600 Speaker 1: gender pepperoni pizza. She names the Pepperoni pizza costume like 260 00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:27,680 Speaker 1: four times in this paper, and I am on the 261 00:14:27,680 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 1: lookout for that costume. But as you might guess, no 262 00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:37,040 Speaker 1: gender neutral costumes really exist. Very few. Yeah. Out of 263 00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:41,840 Speaker 1: the giant pool of costumes, she found hundred masculine costumes, 264 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 1: two three feminine costumes, and only forty one gender neutral costumes. 265 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:48,960 Speaker 1: And I think it's important to point out that these 266 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:51,600 Speaker 1: are not just also not just like the packages of 267 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 1: costume you can just buy ready made. She also looks 268 00:14:53,480 --> 00:14:56,600 Speaker 1: at patterns at craft store, So you would think that those, 269 00:14:56,720 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 1: you know, I would think they'd be a little bit 270 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:02,040 Speaker 1: more just sort of neutral, Like here's a eminem you 271 00:15:02,040 --> 00:15:04,920 Speaker 1: can make, but I mean it shows on the pattern examp, 272 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:08,480 Speaker 1: for example, the girl wearing the green eminem who's feminine 273 00:15:08,480 --> 00:15:10,440 Speaker 1: in the commercials, and the boys wearing like the red 274 00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:12,760 Speaker 1: and yellow eminem's, which are male in the commercials. Sure, 275 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:15,080 Speaker 1: because a little boy might not be too jazzed about 276 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:19,119 Speaker 1: the prospect of his mom or dad making a costume 277 00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:22,560 Speaker 1: with a little girl on the pattern. Right, So even 278 00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:24,520 Speaker 1: in just you know, the ones you make yourself that 279 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 1: you can put your own stamp on, those are also 280 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 1: very commonly recognized by the gender they're meant for. Nelson 281 00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:36,520 Speaker 1: then classifies these costumes in terms of whether it's a 282 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:40,120 Speaker 1: hero of villain or a fool, because obviously a lot 283 00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:44,480 Speaker 1: of kids costumes are superheroes, evil witches, things like that, 284 00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:48,000 Speaker 1: and she makes the point that a lot of the 285 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:52,520 Speaker 1: descriptors for the boys costumes, both hero and villain, are 286 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 1: powerful words. You know, you're strong men's superhero king, whereas 287 00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 1: the girls costumes are usually described with more diminutive adjectives 288 00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:11,800 Speaker 1: or almost erotic adjectives. A beautiful bride, yes, lovely witch. 289 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 1: Even the witches have to be lovely, yeah, pretty little witch, cute, cuddly, bewitched, 290 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 1: little skull girl, midnight madness, like, yeah, you have this 291 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,280 Speaker 1: little kid who wants to be a skull girl, but 292 00:16:25,320 --> 00:16:29,800 Speaker 1: you're a little schoolgirl, tiny skull girl. Whereas obviously if 293 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:32,760 Speaker 1: a guy, if a little boy wants to be skullboy, uh, 294 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 1: you know it's going to be like wicked skull boy, 295 00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:40,520 Speaker 1: like scary skullboy. So you know. Nelson makes this argument 296 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:43,280 Speaker 1: that from the time kids are toddlers. Toddlers is when 297 00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 1: she starts seeing these patterns emerged. Infant costumes are pretty 298 00:16:46,160 --> 00:16:49,120 Speaker 1: gender neutral. But by the time kids are toddlers, that's 299 00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:54,000 Speaker 1: when they start getting these descriptions of um descriptions attached 300 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 1: to their costumes, which put them in these boxes pretty 301 00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:59,360 Speaker 1: early on. And she says, you know, despite the fact 302 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:03,320 Speaker 1: that she found more feminine costumes, there are fewer types 303 00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 1: of feminine costumes than there are male costumes. The men, 304 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:08,200 Speaker 1: you know, just goes on and on forever in terms 305 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:14,200 Speaker 1: of monsters and superheroess and clowns and animals, whereas I mean, 306 00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:20,760 Speaker 1: they're pretty much five groups for girls. Princess, beauty, queen, bride, cheerleader, dancer. Yeah, 307 00:17:21,280 --> 00:17:24,439 Speaker 1: that's it. So she says, pretty early on, we're teaching 308 00:17:24,560 --> 00:17:28,320 Speaker 1: women and little girls that Halloween is about looking beautiful 309 00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 1: and looking the way a stereotypical every single you know, 310 00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:36,639 Speaker 1: gender norm attached to it woman looks. And so Nelson's 311 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:41,199 Speaker 1: theory about this whole idea of adult sexy costumes is 312 00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:44,200 Speaker 1: that it starts with the kids. And it's also partially 313 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:48,960 Speaker 1: the Halloween industries fault and our I guess our fault 314 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:51,640 Speaker 1: for buying them, because as all the costume makers said, 315 00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:54,680 Speaker 1: Adamant leaves like there are biggest sellers, they're the most popular. 316 00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:56,480 Speaker 1: That's the thing we're gonna you know, a lot of 317 00:17:56,520 --> 00:18:00,600 Speaker 1: a lot of us will disparage the slew of sexy 318 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 1: costumes and how impossible it can be to find, not 319 00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:10,120 Speaker 1: find an unsexy costume if you're a woman. But they're 320 00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:12,320 Speaker 1: putting all of them out there because they sell. Yeah, 321 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:15,720 Speaker 1: we're buying them. Someone's buying them, someone's buying them. So 322 00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:19,240 Speaker 1: I guess the question is is it really a bad 323 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:22,640 Speaker 1: thing if all of if so many women are dressing 324 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:24,840 Speaker 1: up in sexy costumes. I mean, I want to hear 325 00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:28,560 Speaker 1: from listeners, male and female on on this issue because 326 00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:30,879 Speaker 1: I'm I'm honestly a little bit torn. You know, my 327 00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:35,560 Speaker 1: knee jerk feminist reaction is cover up. Can we please 328 00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:39,600 Speaker 1: get some more Susan b. Anthony's out here, somebody for dance. 329 00:18:40,080 --> 00:18:44,640 Speaker 1: I'm going to be a sexy suffraget. Sexy suffraget. Yeah, 330 00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:48,240 Speaker 1: or perhaps maybe I will, you know, be a sexy cop. 331 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:50,960 Speaker 1: And yet it would be an ironic sexy cop. Well 332 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: that's why, that's why they're on the feminine mystique in 333 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:56,520 Speaker 1: my tool belt. That's what the New York Times argues 334 00:18:56,600 --> 00:18:58,159 Speaker 1: is that you can do it with some sort of 335 00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:01,840 Speaker 1: camp or humor. That the up up ends all these 336 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:03,960 Speaker 1: gender stereotypes. But I don't think you want to be 337 00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:06,280 Speaker 1: the person at the Halloween party going around saying, oh, yeah, 338 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:09,080 Speaker 1: this is ironic, This is totally ironic. But there was 339 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:13,199 Speaker 1: a blog that we found saying that we need to 340 00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:17,159 Speaker 1: stop disparaging, you know, like I said, all these sexy 341 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:19,919 Speaker 1: female costumes. And she points to a lot of the 342 00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 1: feminist blogs that every every year around this time put 343 00:19:24,080 --> 00:19:27,000 Speaker 1: up their photo galleries of of horror of all of 344 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:31,760 Speaker 1: these terrible, demeaning women's costumes. But she says, you know what, 345 00:19:31,920 --> 00:19:35,680 Speaker 1: in terms of sex positive feminism, we should own this 346 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 1: holiday to yeah, show it off if we want to 347 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:41,040 Speaker 1: show it off. What's wrong with that? So that's why 348 00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:43,639 Speaker 1: we want your feedback. On the second thing, as promise, 349 00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:45,399 Speaker 1: we're going to end with some ideas that have been 350 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:49,119 Speaker 1: on the internet for feminists costumes. Yeah, and also, well, 351 00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:51,240 Speaker 1: I don't think you're getting out of this episode scot 352 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:54,720 Speaker 1: free without sharing your costume idea. I'm not sure yet. 353 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:56,800 Speaker 1: I really do kind of like the sexy suffraget idea. 354 00:19:57,040 --> 00:20:00,119 Speaker 1: All right, can't can't that be ironic? If I go 355 00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:02,480 Speaker 1: around and get fun facts about how women got the vote? 356 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:05,120 Speaker 1: Or if you can't think of anything, you can help 357 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 1: me by pushing around my bathtub on wheels. I'd be fine. 358 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:11,480 Speaker 1: I can be your vice president. But here are a 359 00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:14,040 Speaker 1: few things this This first list is from animator, who 360 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:17,720 Speaker 1: writes for the St. Louis Examiner. Her ideas are Rosie 361 00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 1: the Riveter wonder Woman, which can be kind of sexed up, unfortunately, um, 362 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:26,879 Speaker 1: Cleopatra joan of Arc familiar air Heart, which, unfortunately me 363 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:30,359 Speaker 1: know it can be sexed up. Um, how about a 364 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 1: little more current. How about you know Justice Kagan carry 365 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:37,560 Speaker 1: around a baseball bat or softball bat. I mean that's 366 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:39,920 Speaker 1: I think one of her most identified biable features. Yeah, 367 00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:43,680 Speaker 1: I think so do Mayor Kagan judicial rope. There, we 368 00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:46,040 Speaker 1: don't don't try and be a sexy Supreme Court judge. 369 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,560 Speaker 1: I just think there's so much wrong with that. Um. 370 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:53,760 Speaker 1: She throws out octomom. So you could do some pop 371 00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:56,680 Speaker 1: culture gals. I've seen a few funny octo moms in 372 00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:58,840 Speaker 1: Halloween's passed. I think that's a little I think that's 373 00:20:58,840 --> 00:21:01,280 Speaker 1: a little h lay it out little two thousand nine. 374 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 1: If you ask me. Carmen san Diego, I've seen some 375 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:07,880 Speaker 1: good Carmen san Diego as an excellent pretty classic um. 376 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:11,600 Speaker 1: And then we have another list Glorious Steinham. And then 377 00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:13,159 Speaker 1: if you do want to be sexy, you can be 378 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:16,440 Speaker 1: Glorious Steinham when she went undercover at Playboy. See there 379 00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:18,359 Speaker 1: we go. So if you're gonna be a Playboy bunny, 380 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:22,840 Speaker 1: please be the glorious Steinum Ellen Ripley from Alien. That 381 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 1: would be fun, empowering. Jim and the Holograms. I've wanted 382 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:27,879 Speaker 1: to be Jim for a long time. So those are 383 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:29,600 Speaker 1: a few of the ideas out there on the internet 384 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:32,439 Speaker 1: for feminist costumes. We'd love to hear yours or just 385 00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:35,880 Speaker 1: hear about the cool, funny, uh spooky things you're gonna 386 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,959 Speaker 1: be for Halloween. And the email address to send all 387 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:42,160 Speaker 1: that too, and pictures if you feel like it, mom 388 00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:44,760 Speaker 1: stuff at house stuff works dot com. And let's read 389 00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:50,199 Speaker 1: a few emails. I have one from the Adra and 390 00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 1: this is from the Boy Why boys don't play the 391 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:56,159 Speaker 1: harp of the podcast so gender musical instruments. And this 392 00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:58,280 Speaker 1: one caught my eye Kristen because the subject line was 393 00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:02,119 Speaker 1: called no farts in the flutes section. What whoa? She writes. 394 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:04,840 Speaker 1: Our school band was huge in high school. We had 395 00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:07,399 Speaker 1: three separate bands, with the smallest being maybe fifty and 396 00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:09,760 Speaker 1: the largest easily one hundred. In the four years I 397 00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: was there, there was always at least a little gender diversity, 398 00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:14,639 Speaker 1: a boy or two in the flute and clarinet section, 399 00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 1: a couple of girls in the trombone section, and lots 400 00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:19,400 Speaker 1: of girls scattered throughout the percussion of brass. I don't 401 00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:21,479 Speaker 1: think there was a lot of overt prejudice against students 402 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:24,240 Speaker 1: playing opposite gendered instruments, but there were a few jokes 403 00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:27,520 Speaker 1: wearing around because about the boys being effeminate. Honestly think 404 00:22:27,520 --> 00:22:29,200 Speaker 1: it was a little more difficult for the girls, though, 405 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:31,439 Speaker 1: if only because they were stuck sitting next to boys 406 00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:33,960 Speaker 1: who in high school are so immature and annoying. It 407 00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:35,959 Speaker 1: took a certain kind of girl to sit surrounded by 408 00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:37,840 Speaker 1: guys and their guy humor for what could be hours 409 00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:39,840 Speaker 1: at a time. I liked hanging out with them, but 410 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:41,560 Speaker 1: I was always happy to go back to my section. 411 00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:45,800 Speaker 1: You can only handle so many penis jokes and spitballs. Well. 412 00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:48,320 Speaker 1: If you have thoughts to share with us, you can 413 00:22:48,359 --> 00:22:50,800 Speaker 1: email us at mom Stuff at how stuff works dot com. 414 00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:54,520 Speaker 1: You can also share it on Facebook. You can follow 415 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:56,840 Speaker 1: us on Twitter if you like, and of course you 416 00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:59,200 Speaker 1: can check out our blog during the week, It's stuff 417 00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:00,960 Speaker 1: Mom Never told you you, and you can find it 418 00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:06,159 Speaker 1: at how stuff works dot com. For more on this 419 00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:10,879 Speaker 1: and thousands of other topics, visit how stuff works dot com. 420 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,639 Speaker 1: Want more how stuff works, check out our blogs on 421 00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 1: the how stuff works dot com home page.