Speaker 1: This is a Japanese way to get headache out.
Speaker 2: Long sleeve teachers roll them up and then tie up
Speaker 2: on my head head like this, were it tight? Okay
Speaker 2: like this, So now your headache is gone because this
Speaker 2: give you a new headache.
Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to the No Dunks podcast, probably a
Speaker 1: part of the Athletic Podcast Network. It's September twelfth, twenty
Speaker 1: twenty three. I'm your host for today, Trey Kirby. We
Speaker 1: got Jerome in the yard making the magic happen. And
Speaker 1: I'm happy to be joined today by a national women's
Speaker 1: basketball staff writer for The Athletic, one of the co
Speaker 1: hosts of the Athletic Women's Basketball Show alongside Xenakada and
Speaker 1: Sabrina Merchant. We got Ben Pickman on the show. Ben,
Speaker 1: what's up man?
Speaker 3: I'm doing super well, Super excited to hear.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I can't wait to w with you. Thank you
Speaker 1: to everybody here in the stream team joining us live today.
Speaker 1: Thanks to everybody listening to the podcast a little bit later,
Speaker 1: like subscribe, comment, email, engage with us, make this show
Speaker 1: a big time hit. Ben. Before we get into the playoffs,
Speaker 1: I want to talk to you a little bit about
Speaker 1: the regular season in the WNBA longest regular season we've
Speaker 1: ever had. We've got super teams in the w now,
Speaker 1: if I'm not mistaken, highest scoring season in WNBA history
Speaker 1: as well. Has this been as awesome of a regular
Speaker 1: season as it seems like to me?
Speaker 3: It has been, you know, extended games, extended season means
Speaker 3: a lot more records have fallen, a lot more incredible
Speaker 3: scoring performances. Scoring has been up, as you mentioned, a
Speaker 3: ton of triple doubles, some history in that category. All
Speaker 3: throughout the league, the super teams have been as good
Speaker 3: as advertised, even though New York did take a little
Speaker 3: bit of time to get going, you know, and you know,
Speaker 3: the bottom of the league, the middle of league has
Speaker 3: been super competitive too, just kind of topsy turvy. A
Speaker 3: lot has come down to the end of the regular
Speaker 3: season and it sets up for a really playoffs.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I thought the last week was really exciting
Speaker 1: because a few teams were really trying to qualify for
Speaker 1: the playoffs down the stretch, two teams I pull for.
Speaker 1: I'm a Canvas Parker fan first and foremost, but then
Speaker 1: the Sky and the Dream were like going down to
Speaker 1: the last games of the season to see if they
Speaker 1: were gonna make. It kind of reminds me, honestly of
Speaker 1: a Formula One season where we've got two teams really
Speaker 1: fighting for the title, a couple of good teams, and
Speaker 1: then a whole bunch of mid carters who you don't
Speaker 1: exactly know what you're gonna get from game to game.
Speaker 1: But it made for an exciting season, man, and I'm
Speaker 1: hyped for the playoffs to come around. Did you have
Speaker 1: a favorite game, a favorite moment from the regular season
Speaker 1: this year?
Speaker 3: I mean, there were a few memorable ones. I'm based
Speaker 3: in Brooklyn, so I've been around the Liberty a lot.
Speaker 3: I've seen a lot of Liberty games in person. I
Speaker 3: mean Brianna Shurts her first home game when she set
Speaker 3: a franchise record and career high forty five points against
Speaker 3: the Fever, Like, that's how you kick off a tenure
Speaker 3: with a franchise with a bang, right, Like it was
Speaker 3: an unbelievable performance. It was like, oh, man, now we
Speaker 3: are finally getting to watch Dewey in person. That was super,
Speaker 3: super exciting. All Star was a great weekend, super successful,
Speaker 3: ton of fun events there. Anytime you're around the aces
Speaker 3: and just seeing them in person, that is a treat.
Speaker 3: So those are some of the highlights for me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was lucky. I got to see the Aces
Speaker 1: play here in Atlanta twice, including Asia Wilson's fifty three
Speaker 1: point game. It was on a Tuesday, a school night.
Speaker 1: I got a second grader and a third grader and
Speaker 1: I kept them in the arena until the final final
Speaker 1: buzzer sounded because we couldn't miss a basket. Man, that's
Speaker 1: the most points I've ever seen in any basketball game.
Speaker 1: That was so awesome to see the fans, the Atlanta
Speaker 1: fans getting hype to see Asia Wilson go to the
Speaker 1: line and knock down free throws for the fifty and
Speaker 1: fifty first point before she went on to fifty three.
Speaker 1: That was incredible.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a treat for not only you but also
Speaker 3: your family and keep it him out on the score.
Speaker 1: Good for you on that exactly. You know, you don't
Speaker 1: learn everything you need to know from books. I'm watching.
Speaker 1: I'm like, this is history class right here. You'll probably
Speaker 1: never see a game this exciting again, So drink it
Speaker 1: in while you can. Those fun times. The man, Asia
Speaker 1: Wilson an absolute bucket. But we got the playoffs starting
Speaker 1: tomorrow Wednesday, night, So let's take a quick look at
Speaker 1: the bracket here at the end of the regular season,
Speaker 1: the Aces are taking on the Chicago Sky in the
Speaker 1: one versus eight matchup. Would be awesome if Candas Parker
Speaker 1: was healthy for that one, but does not seem to
Speaker 1: be the case. The team you covered, Ben, the New
Speaker 1: York Liberty take on the Washington Mystics, who do seem
Speaker 1: to be getting healthy at just the right time for
Speaker 1: the playoffs. In the three six matchup, we've got the
Speaker 1: Connecticut Sun, a surprisingly great team this year, taken on
Speaker 1: the Minnesota Links, who I'm very confused by. And then
Speaker 1: we got the Dallas Wings versus the Atlanta Dream. I'm
Speaker 1: hoping to get to a game in that four or
Speaker 1: five matchup then, But first question I've got for you.
Speaker 1: We mentioned how there's been two great teams this year,
Speaker 1: two super teams in the Aces and the Liberty. The
Speaker 1: Aces finished the season thirty four and six, first in offense,
Speaker 1: first in defense, but maybe a rocky or second half
Speaker 1: of the season after starting twenty four and two, they
Speaker 1: finished ten and four to end the regular season. Meanwhile,
Speaker 1: the Liberty, they finished thirty two and eight on the year,
Speaker 1: second in offense third in defense. They won eight of
Speaker 1: their last nine games fourteen of their last sixteen to
Speaker 1: challenge for the one seed at the end of the
Speaker 1: regular season. Are we destined to see these two teams
Speaker 1: in the finals or is there anybody who could knock
Speaker 1: one of these two teams off?
Speaker 3: I mean, it feels easy and maybe a little anti
Speaker 3: climactic to open this show and say that it feels
Speaker 3: like we're almost destined to have the Aces and the
Speaker 3: Liberty meet in the finals. But it certainly does feel
Speaker 3: that way. You know, these two teams have been the
Speaker 3: two best teams in the WNBA all season long. Oftentimes
Speaker 3: it is by a significant margin. Or we've certainly seen
Speaker 3: you know, New York most recently they blew out the
Speaker 3: Connecticut Sun and seem to put some distance between you know,
Speaker 3: the two and the three in this matchup. You know,
Speaker 3: certainly there's some other teams Connecticut can challenge Dallas. I
Speaker 3: think is an interesting dark hose in the postseason. And
Speaker 3: you know, we've certainly learned last year in this playoff format,
Speaker 3: there are no guarantees. We thought we were gonna get
Speaker 3: a Chicago Sky appearance in the finals. We didn't in
Speaker 3: the end, Connecticut beats them in the Semis in five games,
Speaker 3: five thrilling games, rather, but it definitely does seem like
Speaker 3: we are on this collision course to get Las Vegas
Speaker 3: and New York and frankly, I think for a lot
Speaker 3: of people that is okay, these are the two best
Speaker 3: teams talent wise, it's maybe two of the two best
Speaker 3: coaches in the league, two great fan bases, two great
Speaker 3: in arena experiences. So you know, if you're a fan
Speaker 3: of the other ten teams, of course you want your
Speaker 3: team to make it or the other six in the playoffs.
Speaker 3: But it does seem like nationally we're gonna get a
Speaker 3: Liberty Aces final, or that's what I'm thinking we're going
Speaker 3: to get in the end.
Speaker 1: Well, and that's been a spicy matchup as well. I
Speaker 1: think they somehow ended up playing four times against each
Speaker 1: other just in August. I don't know how the schedule
Speaker 1: worked out that way, but it made it exciting to
Speaker 1: see these two teams kind of like gearing up for
Speaker 1: the playoffs, assuming they're going to take on each other. Obviously,
Speaker 1: the Liberty took down the Aces and the Commissioner's Cup
Speaker 1: Championship game, I saw them celebrating like they had just
Speaker 1: won the WNB title. Stewe was saying afterwards, this is
Speaker 1: our first piece of hardware. What's the biggest weakness for
Speaker 1: the Aces, Because, like I said, first in offense, first
Speaker 1: in defense. I know they're missing Candas Parker and I
Speaker 1: haven't really seen an update on her return at all,
Speaker 1: so I'm assuming she's out for the playoffs. But how
Speaker 1: do you beat the Aces?
Speaker 3: I mean, it still seems like on the Candace Parker
Speaker 3: front that she is going to be out indefinitely, and
Speaker 3: as a result, just their depth has been a little
Speaker 3: bit more tested. Right Kea Stokes has slid into the
Speaker 3: starting lineup, and she is a very good defensive center,
Speaker 3: but she doesn't have the same impact nearly on the
Speaker 3: offensive end of the floor. And someone like Stokes, who
Speaker 3: was a valuable bench contributor at the start of the year,
Speaker 3: has been a valuable contributor for them in the past.
Speaker 3: You know, she slides into the starting lineup and the
Speaker 3: bench gets even thinner, and so that is one real
Speaker 3: differentiating factor in my mind, between New York and Las Vegas.
Speaker 3: New York has a little bit more punch off the bench,
Speaker 3: not only scoring marine johannas the French guard she can be.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: Becky Hammond described her as just like a gun. She
Speaker 3: just comes into the game. She'll fire off eight straight points.
Speaker 3: Boom boom, boom, boom boom. Becky made that sound. They
Speaker 3: played a couple weeks back here in New York and
Speaker 3: then she checks out of the game, has done her damage,
Speaker 3: and that is her night. And New York just has
Speaker 3: other places and pieces that they plug into the lineup
Speaker 3: that I don't think Las Vegas has. So it's two
Speaker 3: stellar starting lineups, you know, some of the best players
Speaker 3: in the world. But the depth is really something I
Speaker 3: think at this point is worth watching. It wasn't. It
Speaker 3: didn't make a difference for Las Vegas during last year's
Speaker 3: playoffs they still had a short bench, but I think
Speaker 3: it might this time around, especially when they played New York.
Speaker 1: Is Marien Johannah the coolest player in the league?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think she might be. Certainly, she
Speaker 3: does some of the most unexpected things of anyone in
Speaker 3: the league. You know, Chelsea Gray herself might be the
Speaker 3: best highlot machine. You know, She's thrown some incredible passes
Speaker 3: this year. The one early in the year that was
Speaker 3: a no look that I think went super super viral
Speaker 3: my colleagues. Sabrina wrote about it and just all the
Speaker 3: Aces players reacting about how they were so surprised that
Speaker 3: Chelsea did it. But marine on a nightly basis, especially
Speaker 3: on a per minute basis, you know, I don't know
Speaker 3: how we would really quantify that staff, but you know,
Speaker 3: she just checked in and it's like, here's a one
Speaker 3: legged three, here's a no look pass, here's a you know,
Speaker 3: a dribble underneath the hoop and scoop around, and you know,
Speaker 3: throw some pass from an angle you've never seen before.
Speaker 3: Like she is so so exciting, especially considering how much
Speaker 3: or how little she plays in a game.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm sure she's thrown a regular pass at some point,
Speaker 1: but I think I've seen one hundred percent behind the
Speaker 1: back passes or something that's gonna end up in a
Speaker 1: highlight reel I mentioned. The Liberty really turned it on
Speaker 1: in the second half of the season. You follow the
Speaker 1: team quite closely, You're really close to Barclay Center. What
Speaker 1: changed for New York for them to go on this
Speaker 1: run in the second half of the season.
Speaker 3: I think it's a few things. I mean, I think
Speaker 3: just going back to the start of the season. Not surprisingly,
Speaker 3: it took Brianna Store the least amount of time to
Speaker 3: kind of settle into her role. She immediately she did
Speaker 3: everything for New York and almost was over extending herself
Speaker 3: or was asked to score, rebound facilitate at the start
Speaker 3: of the year because some of the other pieces they
Speaker 3: brought in just hadn't started to fit yet. Then Corney
Speaker 3: Vandersloute started to kind of acclimate and I think fgured
Speaker 3: out how to play better alongside Sabrina and Yunescu, who's
Speaker 3: come on super, super strong, especially in the second half
Speaker 3: of the year, just record breaking three point numbers. And
Speaker 3: then it was John Kula Jones and you know she's
Speaker 3: a former League MVP won it with Connecticut. Was equally
Speaker 3: one of these high profile acquisitions. Was going to come
Speaker 3: in and both anchor New York's defense and also play
Speaker 3: a huge role on offense. She was a little bit
Speaker 3: slow at the start of the year, coming off a
Speaker 3: foot injury. She eased her way back into training camp,
Speaker 3: didn't practice a ton back in camp. Was kind of
Speaker 3: seemed to be on a little bit of a minute
Speaker 3: restriction early on in the year. Was a little slow
Speaker 3: on defense, wasn't really fitting in spacing wise on offense,
Speaker 3: and she's come on super, super strong, especially in the
Speaker 3: month of August. She's just been a double double machine.
Speaker 3: Sandy Broundello actually tasked her after one loss at the
Speaker 3: end of July to just get a double double every night.
Speaker 3: That she hasn't done that exactly, but she's oftentimes come
Speaker 3: really really close or gotten doubles in a vast majority
Speaker 3: of their games. And so now that she is really
Speaker 3: settling in it, just the pieces have started to fit
Speaker 3: much better. It took a full season, and I guess
Speaker 3: we should have expected it to take bunch of time.
Speaker 3: But now that we're here in September with the postseason,
Speaker 3: the pieces do really fit together really nicely, and that
Speaker 3: is a big reason why New York is where they are.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm not surprised it took a bit longer for
Speaker 1: John Quell Jones to get going. We've seen it time
Speaker 1: and time again in the NBA when a big three
Speaker 1: comes together, the third person is always kind of the
Speaker 1: one figure out where their shots are going to come
Speaker 1: for and trying to figure out a way to go
Speaker 1: from having the ball all the time to being you know,
Speaker 1: maybe more of a one point five option or something
Speaker 1: like that. But she John Qwell Jones, was absolutely dominant
Speaker 1: in that Commissioner's Cup game. I thought she just ran
Speaker 1: wild inside and you could really feel the absence of
Speaker 1: Canvas Parker in that game, in particular for the Aces.
Speaker 1: So yeah, John Quell Jones seems to be a major
Speaker 1: X factor if those two teams meet. But that's going
Speaker 1: to be weeks from now. You mentioned it a little bit.
Speaker 1: Maybe the Connecticut Sun would have a chance against either
Speaker 1: of these two teams, if I'm not mistaken. They've made
Speaker 1: two finals and two semi finals the last four seasons.
Speaker 1: How does this team take the next step to get
Speaker 1: past this this sort of wall that they keep running into.
Speaker 1: I mean, they're running into good teams. They keep losing
Speaker 1: to good teams. They did make finals a couple of times,
Speaker 1: but they just seem maybe one piece away something like that.
Speaker 3: It's funny that you use the wall analogy because Alyssa Thomas,
Speaker 3: when you think about her, she is like running into
Speaker 3: a wall or playing against a wall, you know, because
Speaker 3: of her strength or physicality, and she just you run
Speaker 3: into her and you immediately bounce back the way you
Speaker 3: would if you were running into a wall. But for me,
Speaker 3: it's all about guard play for them, right Like Alyssa
Speaker 3: Thomas is gonna get her She's gonna create, she's gonna
Speaker 3: push the ball in transition, she's gonna get steals, she's
Speaker 3: gonna score on offense. But it seems like from a
Speaker 3: just from a backcourt. If you look at the backcourt
Speaker 3: that Connecticut has Tiffany Hayes, you know she is at
Speaker 3: the latter stages of her career. She can certainly still
Speaker 3: show flashes of getting to the rim of creating offense
Speaker 3: for herself. She's done that a few times throughout the
Speaker 3: regular season. But you know, I think she twenty games
Speaker 3: this season when she scored between zero and nine points.
Speaker 3: You know, this is a former All Star. She's turning
Speaker 3: thirty four years old during this postseason. But if she
Speaker 3: can explode during the playoffs, I think Connecticut's ceiling is
Speaker 3: a little bit higher. Nietzchecha Heideman another one of their
Speaker 3: guards in the backcourt. She played really well during last
Speaker 3: year's postseason and especially in some of the biggest games,
Speaker 3: their Game three first round elimination game against Dallas, Game
Speaker 3: five against the Chicago Sky. She played really well. I
Speaker 3: think she had fourteen in that one. The contest in
Speaker 3: the finals when Connecticut beat Las Vegas, she also had
Speaker 3: double digit scoring. So it's just can Connecticut's backcourt give
Speaker 3: them enough of a boost to you know, help Alissa
Speaker 3: Thomas to help the want to bonn her out. Those
Speaker 3: are two players, two all star players who will be
Speaker 3: reliable for Connecticut. But especially when you compare you know,
Speaker 3: the Connecticut backcourt to Las Vegas Chelsea Gray, Kelsey Plumb,
Speaker 3: Jackie Young, when you compare them to Courtney van der
Speaker 3: Sloot to Sabrina Yescu, that there is a difference there, frankly,
Speaker 3: between what Connecticut has and what New York has. That
Speaker 3: might just be the difference for now and until that
Speaker 3: is upgraded. For Connecticut, I think their ceiling kind of
Speaker 3: is what it is at least is currently constituted.
Speaker 1: Well, third best team is still pretty good as far
Speaker 1: as as far as the standings go. I gotta ask you,
Speaker 1: I guess now, because I can't imagine they're going to
Speaker 1: have a long run in the playoffs. Is there any
Speaker 1: chance the Sky can win a game in this series
Speaker 1: against the ass.
Speaker 3: I mean, the Sky play really, really hard, They're super competitive.
Speaker 3: Becky Hammond has actually talked about how they've given, uh,
Speaker 3: you know, Las Vegas some trouble this year, and certainly
Speaker 3: someone like Marina Maybray can go off. Kalia Copper, We've
Speaker 3: seen it in big moments. We've seen her star. I
Speaker 3: would bet not like you know, my guess, Las Vegas
Speaker 3: is going to come out and just bring it like
Speaker 3: they have been waiting all year for this postseason run.
Speaker 3: You know, it is the area championship winning team we
Speaker 3: certainly know in other sports. Not that Las Vegas was
Speaker 3: complacent because we saw them become the number one seed
Speaker 3: get off to a historic start in the regular season,
Speaker 3: but the playoffs are a different animal. I would expect
Speaker 3: them to come out really fast at the start of
Speaker 3: the postseason on Wednesday night and continue to roll from
Speaker 3: their Chicago. I think they can keep these games competitive,
Speaker 3: but I just don't know if they have the talent
Speaker 3: frankly to match up with the Aces for a series.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because they traded or let all of their talent
Speaker 1: from the championship team in twenty twenty one walk away
Speaker 1: basically the last season, and then they traded three first
Speaker 1: round picks basically to bring in Marina maybriy, Was this
Speaker 1: a good season for the Sky? Like I said, they
Speaker 1: made it into the playoffs the very last week of
Speaker 1: the season, they finished below five hundred, and now they've
Speaker 1: got their next three first round picks going out. That
Speaker 1: doesn't seem right to me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, it's definitely a weird season for the
Speaker 3: Chicago Sky. I mean I think you know, we did
Speaker 3: a poll a round table among us as a staff
Speaker 3: on the Athletic Online and we asked for what our
Speaker 3: biggest surprise was, and for me, it was James Wade's
Speaker 3: resignation mid season. Like I think all the other things
Speaker 3: aside that have been on court and court, if you
Speaker 3: were going to tell a fan of the Sky and
Speaker 3: maybe a fan of the WNBA or anyone who follows
Speaker 3: the league, like James Wade, the coach and general manager
Speaker 3: of the team is going to resign abruptly in mid
Speaker 3: July to take a job as an assistant coach with
Speaker 3: the Toronto Raptors. I think that was the biggest surprise,
Speaker 3: at least in my opinion, of the whole year. Certainly,
Speaker 3: he made a big swing from Marina Maybrew, who is
Speaker 3: a really, really good player mind you, and she had
Speaker 3: a good year, but he traded all those picks and
Speaker 3: then he kind of left mid season, so it's certainly
Speaker 3: an accomplishment. They played really hard down the second half
Speaker 3: of the year. Getting in the playoffs is no small feat.
Speaker 3: They continue to bring it on a nightly basis. They
Speaker 3: did not quit despite the coaching change. But I don't
Speaker 3: know if it was a good season. It certainly was
Speaker 3: a noteworthy season, a surprising season, a strange season, maybe
Speaker 3: one of the strangest in the whole league.
Speaker 1: Frankly, Yeah, when the GM trades away all of the
Speaker 1: future and then leaves months into the future, that was
Speaker 1: pretty weird. Wighed out one in Wayne Wade now a
Speaker 1: part of the Chicago Sky So at least I'm feeling
Speaker 1: pretty confident about that. But uh, yeah, I was. It's
Speaker 1: tough to go from winning a championship almost getting back
Speaker 1: to now scraping into the playoffs and not exactly knowing
Speaker 1: where the next bit of help is going to come from.
Speaker 1: But at least Colia Kapfer signed an extension, so that's
Speaker 1: good because she is awesome to watch. Moving on, what
Speaker 1: do you think is going to be the most exciting
Speaker 1: first round? Series in the WNBA playoffs.
Speaker 3: To me, it is dream wings. I just think there's
Speaker 3: a lot of talent. That's the four or five series.
Speaker 3: It's just two teams that have very interesting, kind of
Speaker 3: up and coming rosters, a lot of young roster talent
Speaker 3: on both sides. You know, Ryan Howard, Alisha Gray kind
Speaker 3: of in Atlanta, they're back in the postseason for the
Speaker 3: first time since twenty eighteen. And then you have Dallas.
Speaker 3: Right Satu Sabili might win most improved players she's had,
Speaker 3: you know, the best year of her young career. Arique Ogombawalle,
Speaker 3: you know, one of the best bucket getters in the
Speaker 3: w and Dallas, I think just interest places one of
Speaker 3: the most interesting styles, can shape shift like few other
Speaker 3: teams in the WNBA. Their front court is really their
Speaker 3: strength or one of the things that really makes them
Speaker 3: so unique. I mentioned Satusaboli, but they have Tierra McCowan
Speaker 3: who's one of the best low post players on both
Speaker 3: ends in the league. Natasha Howard, a former Defensive Player
Speaker 3: of the Year. Also in that front court. Off the bench,
Speaker 3: they have Awa Kwir who's one of the most kind
Speaker 3: of intriguing young players. Another big who's super versatile, provides
Speaker 3: some rim protection, can also stretch on the perimeter. And
Speaker 3: Colonie Brown, who is another force, who's one of them,
Speaker 3: in my opinion, on the short list of players for
Speaker 3: most Improved. So they just throw big bodies at teams
Speaker 3: and can really frustrate them. We saw them frustrate Atlanta
Speaker 3: during their regular season that way. Dallas won all three
Speaker 3: games in Atlanta, who is already a little bit mid
Speaker 3: range happy, took more mid range shots against the Wings
Speaker 3: than they did on average. I believe it was four
Speaker 3: or five more on average. And so we'll see how
Speaker 3: Atlanta chooses to attack Dallas. Can they get to the rim,
Speaker 3: can they create But for me, these are just two
Speaker 3: teams that have expectations, that have young talent, and it's
Speaker 3: just a nutrition and clash of style. So that is
Speaker 3: a series I have mine on. Maybe you have that
Speaker 3: as well, being in Atlanta, or you're at least hoping
Speaker 3: to get a game, you said, and see him in person.
Speaker 1: That's exactly right. I was really happy to see Atlanta
Speaker 1: work their way up to the five seed because if
Speaker 1: they were playing Las Vegas or New York, I'm thinking,
Speaker 1: ain't no way there's going to be a playoff game
Speaker 1: here in Atlanta. For those that don't know the WNBA
Speaker 1: playoff format, in the first round goes the higher seeded
Speaker 1: team gets the first two games at home, and then
Speaker 1: if the lower seeded team wins one of those two games,
Speaker 1: the closeout Game three is in the lower seeded arena.
Speaker 1: So it would be a huge game if the Dream
Speaker 1: can somehow get the series back here. But I don't know.
Speaker 1: Like you mentioned Atlanta zero to three versus Dallas this
Speaker 1: season and then they got absolutely smoked on Sunday in
Speaker 1: the season finale. I guess the game didn't totally mean
Speaker 1: all that much, but not exactly how you want to
Speaker 1: be going in to the playoffs against this team, but
Speaker 1: at least they're back for the first time since twenty eighteen.
Speaker 1: Make a prediction for me, though, Ben, Do you think
Speaker 1: I'll get to go to a Game three in Atlanta?
Speaker 3: I don't think so.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Well, shows over, get out of here, man.
Speaker 1: I hate to hear that we'll see. Hopefully it turns out.
Speaker 1: I will be excited to see those, and hopefully it
Speaker 1: turns out that there's a game here in Atlanta. I
Speaker 1: did want to ask you about Sun versus Links. How
Speaker 1: are the Links tenth in the league in point differential,
Speaker 1: tenth in the league in net rating, and still a
Speaker 1: sixth seed in the playoffs. This is a team I
Speaker 1: can't figure out. Well.
Speaker 3: Partly it's because I think throughout the whole season, the
Speaker 3: middle of the WNBA has been so bunged that frankly,
Speaker 3: it has come down to a couple possessions here, a
Speaker 3: couple possessions there. You know, the margins and the eventual
Speaker 3: seating really didn't shake out the way it did until
Speaker 3: the final week, final ten days of the regular season. Minnesota,
Speaker 3: you know, could have very well seen themselves on the
Speaker 3: outside looking in, but played pretty well down the stretch
Speaker 3: of the season. They also do have one of the five,
Speaker 3: six seven best players in the league, Nafisakllier, and she
Speaker 3: had another great regular season. And because they have an
Speaker 3: anchor like that who can again create her own shot,
Speaker 3: can facilitate, can shoot it from the perimeter, can rim
Speaker 3: protect it. You know, I think I had her on
Speaker 3: one of my All defensive teams as well as on
Speaker 3: my All WNBA first team because they have a player
Speaker 3: of that caliber. When things break down, she is able
Speaker 3: to bail them out and I think overcome some of
Speaker 3: those statistical the notes you had, and again there really
Speaker 3: was not a lot separating Minnesota and Chicago, and frankly
Speaker 3: the Los Angeles Sparks, who find themselves on the outside
Speaker 3: looking in, right, these two teams really did jockey for position.
Speaker 3: So for me, it's just about fee and about making
Speaker 3: plays in big moments, and that's something that she has done.
Speaker 3: She did show Reeve one of the best coaches as well,
Speaker 3: So I don't expect, though you measured, you throw out
Speaker 3: some of the measurable stray You know they're playing Connecticut.
Speaker 3: Connecticut was significantly the third best team by a significant
Speaker 3: margin compared to Dallas, and was closer I think, to
Speaker 3: the upper echelon group, so I also expect to sweep
Speaker 3: in that one.
Speaker 1: Frankly probably, I think the only playoff team we haven't
Speaker 1: touched on yet is the Washington Mystics, and they're taken
Speaker 1: on the New York Liberty and the first round. Any
Speaker 1: chance of an upset there. I see. The Mystics are
Speaker 1: fourth in defense on the year. They've obviously got Alena
Speaker 1: Deladon back healthy. Ariel Atkins's play in Shakira Austin. I
Speaker 1: know is a question mark right now. But they just
Speaker 1: beat the Liberty on a buzzer beater, so that's got
Speaker 1: to give them a little confidence going in. Is that
Speaker 1: any any sort of upset threat coming from Washington?
Speaker 3: I think it like maybe the Juicy a series or
Speaker 3: the series with the most drama kind of storylines. You know,
Speaker 3: if you were to tell someone preseason that Washington was
Speaker 3: going to play New York in the first round, I
Speaker 3: think people would be pretty surprised and something would have happened,
Speaker 3: and something did happen. Washington dealt with a lot of
Speaker 3: injuries and that caused them to stumble down the standings
Speaker 3: a little bit during the regular season. The mystics are
Speaker 3: not short on confidence. I think that is Foreshore guaranteed,
Speaker 3: no matter who was on the court. We saw after
Speaker 3: they after they beat New York this past Sunday, you know,
Speaker 3: Natasha Cloud waved to the crowd almost to say bye bye,
Speaker 3: bye bye, but the irony of course being that she's
Speaker 3: coming back because Washington is playing in New York on
Speaker 3: Friday and then will play again on the following Tuesday,
Speaker 3: per Game two. So you know, it's it is a
Speaker 3: It is a team that has really frustrated New York
Speaker 3: throughout the regular season. They played early in the year,
Speaker 3: the first game of the season, Washington beat New York handily,
Speaker 3: and then they won Washington did the last day of
Speaker 3: the season. But across their four matchups, New York is,
Speaker 3: you know, a great three point shooting team. I think
Speaker 3: they shot something thirty seven, thirty eight, thirty nine percent
Speaker 3: during the year. They both took less threes when they
Speaker 3: played Washington, they shot it I think five or six
Speaker 3: a percentage points worse. And they also average I think
Speaker 3: five more turnovers per game, and a lot of that
Speaker 3: is just because of Washington's back Where you mentioned aaronl Atkins,
Speaker 3: Natasha Cloud, Britney Sykes, these are three players from the
Speaker 3: guard position who can frustrate anyone they play. These are
Speaker 3: All League defenders in the past. Some might make an
Speaker 3: All League a defensive team again this year. So their
Speaker 3: ability to put some of the clamps on New York's
Speaker 3: perimeter players and just be really switchable on the perimeter
Speaker 3: is one of their biggest advantages. The injury stuff is
Speaker 3: a question. New York is still the most talented team.
Speaker 3: You know, it's not crazy to pick the Mystics to
Speaker 3: upset the Liberty. Do I think it will happen. I don't.
Speaker 3: I think the talent of the Liberty is supreme, and
Speaker 3: I frankly think they took them a little while. I'm
Speaker 3: not sure how motivated they were exactly for Sunday's game,
Speaker 3: if you're going to give them some truth serum considering
Speaker 3: how early they fell behind by double digits early in
Speaker 3: that one. But it certainly is an intriguing series. I
Speaker 3: could see both games, or all three games coming down
Speaker 3: to the final couple minutes, but I do expect New
Speaker 3: York to still pull it out.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Maybe it's a classic hustlers move where you let
Speaker 1: them get a little bit of confidence before you crush
Speaker 1: them when it really matters. But yeah, let's see that
Speaker 1: bracket again real quick. Jerome WNBA playoffs start tomorrow night, Wednesday,
Speaker 1: September thirteenth. We're starting with The Aces and the Sky
Speaker 1: and the Sun and the Links. The other two series
Speaker 1: start on Friday of this week. I believe all those
Speaker 1: are on ABC or ESPN or one of their associated networks.
Speaker 1: The other thing I want to ask you about, Ben
Speaker 1: before we get into the athletics. Anonymous player poll, Big
Speaker 1: Time MVP race in the WNBA this season basically a
Speaker 1: three player race between Asia Wilson and Brianna Stewart, who
Speaker 1: we talked about quite a bit, also Alyssa Thomas. This
Speaker 1: has been an awesome race, all three of these players
Speaker 1: putting up historic numbers, but somehow not a toxic debate
Speaker 1: about all of these players. It seems that everybody's making
Speaker 1: solid cases for whoever they're pulling for, while also respecting
Speaker 1: the cases of everybody else. How would your ballot go
Speaker 1: when you're submitting?
Speaker 3: I mean, I would first say, sometimes WNBA twitter can
Speaker 3: get a little tense, So you know, I'm not going
Speaker 3: to say it was fully without just clean, healthy together.
Speaker 3: I think it was certainly tense at times. You know,
Speaker 3: this debate, this also this MVP race. Rather, it was
Speaker 3: really a matter of preference for a lot of people
Speaker 3: of do you look at best player on best team,
Speaker 3: do you look at best player and maybe those are
Speaker 3: the same people, or do you look at most valuable
Speaker 3: for me? In the end, on this one, I actually
Speaker 3: slightly leaned Alyssa Thomas. Both Brienna Stewart and Asia Wilson
Speaker 3: had historic seasons, and you know, as our poll suggested,
Speaker 3: and I think just from watching the games, I think
Speaker 3: Stewie and Asia are the two best players just in
Speaker 3: the league, and they will battle out for MVP after MVP.
Speaker 3: But the nature of Alyssa thomas seasons just the amount
Speaker 3: of triple doubleish she racked up, but more importantly just
Speaker 3: the on off splits related to her and Stewie in Asia, right,
Speaker 3: there's so much talent around both on the Liberty and
Speaker 3: the Aces that I did kind of struggle to parse through.
Speaker 3: You know that those on off numbers, right, I think
Speaker 3: Asia was if you took her off the team, in
Speaker 3: the minute she was removed, the net rating of the
Speaker 3: Aces was still like the fourth best in the WHO League.
Speaker 3: If you took Stewie off, they would be the fifth
Speaker 3: best team. I think Alyssa Thomas, if you took her
Speaker 3: off the court for Connecticut, they were like a minus
Speaker 3: twenty three per one hundred possessions. There was like a
Speaker 3: thirty point difference in terms of net rating with her
Speaker 3: on the floor. And she was like she I think
Speaker 3: was second in the WNBA in minutes, Like she had
Speaker 3: to literally do everything for the Connecticut Sun, and she
Speaker 3: did it at such a supremely high level that in
Speaker 3: this conversation, in this moment, I actually leaned with the
Speaker 3: kind of most valuable. I did rest on that word,
Speaker 3: which you know you can certainly quibble with, and I
Speaker 3: don't necessarily always think is the right thing to do,
Speaker 3: But I just found the numbers to be pretty stark.
Speaker 3: There is so much talent around the Aces, on the
Speaker 3: Aces and on the Liberty, Connecticut's roster just doesn't match up.
Speaker 3: And she really did carry them their other all star,
Speaker 3: Brianna Jones, she tore her achilles early in the season,
Speaker 3: Connecticut had to reinvent itself and leaned even more heavily
Speaker 3: into Alissa Thomas, and they were planning heading into the year,
Speaker 3: and so just a magnitude of her year, how special
Speaker 3: she was, I actually went that direction. I don't know
Speaker 3: if you disagree agree. I don't really think you can
Speaker 3: go wrong with any choice.
Speaker 1: Frankly, though, exactly right. There's like the three classic cases
Speaker 1: for the MVVP. Like you're saying, best player on best team,
Speaker 1: which would be Asia Wilson probably who I would choose,
Speaker 1: just because I think she's the best player, even though
Speaker 1: in the Athletics anonymous player poll and WNBA players think
Speaker 1: it's Brianna Stewart, So that's another great case for her.
Speaker 1: And then, like you're saying, the literal definition of valuable,
Speaker 1: it's hard to argue against Alyssa Thomas thirty points per
Speaker 1: one hundred possessions better when she's on the floor, that's
Speaker 1: pretty influential. And like you're saying, they lost their second
Speaker 1: best player as well, so for her to go to
Speaker 1: that level I think is incredible. I also feel like
Speaker 1: the WNBA does a pretty good job of spreading the
Speaker 1: wealth for these awards. I don't think we've had back
Speaker 1: to back WNBA MVP since the first two seasons in
Speaker 1: the league when Cynthia Cooper won for the comments. So
Speaker 1: I could see it going not to Asia Wilson and
Speaker 1: maybe bucking that trend of the best player in the
Speaker 1: on the best team getting the MVP. We know those
Speaker 1: three will be one, two, three in some order. Who's
Speaker 1: coming in fourth and fifth because there are other spots
Speaker 1: on the ballot.
Speaker 3: I mean, I like, if he's a Collier's case, I
Speaker 3: think she will, you know, find her name up there.
Speaker 3: Neka Gumikay also super deserving. I think those were the
Speaker 3: final two players on my ballot. Someone like Satusaboli for
Speaker 3: the Wings, I think will receive some votes and then
Speaker 3: maybe like an ancillary piece or not so ancillary, because
Speaker 3: these are incredible players and we're talking MVP baalt But
Speaker 3: like Jackie Young, you know, she had a great year.
Speaker 3: I wouldn't be shocked if she got some votes. But
Speaker 3: I do really think when the voting comes out, it
Speaker 3: will be pretty bunched up between one, two and three,
Speaker 3: and then down ballot, I think it will be a
Speaker 3: little bit more distance. Much like, frankly, the WNBA regular season,
Speaker 3: right there was a big gap between one to two
Speaker 3: and Connecticut was third, but you know, was pretty consistently
Speaker 3: the third best team throughout the entire year, and then
Speaker 3: four through twelve was much more bunch together. I think
Speaker 3: we'll see something similar, frankly, in MVP voting when it's released.
Speaker 1: Awesome stuff. Ben, If you've got an opinion out there
Speaker 1: on who should be WNBA MVP, let us know down
Speaker 1: in the comments, let us know here in the chat.
Speaker 1: We're going to take a quick break here and when
Speaker 1: we come back, we will talk about the athletics. WNBA
Speaker 1: Anonymous player poll some good stuff back with no donks
Speaker 1: talking to the Athletics, Ben Pickman. Ben, you just collaborated
Speaker 1: with your co host Sabrina Merchant on an anonymous player poll,
Speaker 1: asking a bunch of tough questions to all of the
Speaker 1: WNBA players. So I wanted to pick your brain on
Speaker 1: some of the most interesting stuff. We've referenced it a
Speaker 1: couple of times already big question who is the best
Speaker 1: player in the NBA? And the voting shook out a
Speaker 1: little surprising to me, if I'm being quite honest, Ben,
Speaker 1: Brianna Stewart fifty four percent of the vote, Asia Wilson
Speaker 1: thirty one percent of the vote. No surprise those two
Speaker 1: came in at the top. Yakaguo McKay came in with
Speaker 1: nine percent of the vote, and then a couple other
Speaker 1: players got a vote as well. Were you surprised to
Speaker 1: see the gap that big between Breonna Stewart and Asia
Speaker 1: Wilson almost two to one vote for Stewie.
Speaker 3: You know, I was a little bit frankly, I will say,
Speaker 3: just for context, we talked to just under fifty players,
Speaker 3: so around a third of the league, so we certainly
Speaker 3: didn't talk to all one hundred and forty four or
Speaker 3: a little more or a little less, depending on who
Speaker 3: was in it at a given time. I mean, I
Speaker 3: do think part of it was just Brianna Stewart and
Speaker 3: just on a nightly basis, you know, she was incredible.
Speaker 3: But I guess I really don't have a reason as
Speaker 3: to why I think that difference was what it was that.
Speaker 3: You know, maybe it was just personal preference for a
Speaker 3: player playing against Stewie when we talked to them. You know,
Speaker 3: we we talked to at least two or three players
Speaker 3: on every team, so we certainly spread it out. We
Speaker 3: were you know, we tried diligently as we conducted the
Speaker 3: survey to not just have a concentration of players, you know,
Speaker 3: certain questions. You were not allowed to pick players on
Speaker 3: your own team, and we were clear about that when
Speaker 3: that was the context. So honestly, Trey, I wish I
Speaker 3: had a better reason. You know, I think I think
Speaker 3: All Star voting will be a little bit closer than
Speaker 3: one our pole suggested in the end. But and Asia
Speaker 3: might even be MVP. But maybe it was just the
Speaker 3: personal preference of the players we talked with. I really
Speaker 3: don't have a good explanation for you on that one.
Speaker 1: Well, Stewey scored forty what four times, I think this season,
Speaker 1: So I guess there's a good chance you may have
Speaker 1: talked to the players she lit up after those games,
Speaker 1: which would probably influence the voting. Like I mentioned, Gua McKay,
Speaker 1: Alyssa Thomas, and Jewel Lloyd all got votes for best
Speaker 1: player in the league, Yaka came in third, and then
Speaker 1: Alyssa and Jewel also got a vote. Do you think
Speaker 1: there's anybody else who would be deserving of showing up
Speaker 1: in the other category at the very least?
Speaker 3: I mean, if he's a Collier, I think would be
Speaker 3: the other name. I think she's one of the players.
Speaker 3: If you were, you know, starting a team, it wouldn't
Speaker 3: be unreasonable to want to start a franchise around her.
Speaker 3: We certainly see Minnesota right now building a franchise around her.
Speaker 3: But no, I mean, I think those are really the
Speaker 3: players you would target, the players that gms would target,
Speaker 3: the players that fans would target, would be would be
Speaker 3: the stars you mentioned.
Speaker 1: All right, that's the best player now. But another question
Speaker 1: I really liked that y'all asked was who will be
Speaker 1: the best player in the league in five years? Asia Wilson.
Speaker 1: She did come in first in the voting here but
Speaker 1: not by all that much. Thirty one percent of the
Speaker 1: vote going for the Aces Asia Wilson, followed by twenty
Speaker 1: seven zero point six percent for Elijah Boston. The rookie
Speaker 1: for the Indiana Fever. Jackie Young got some votes, Satu
Speaker 1: Sabai got some votes, as you mentioned, and then a
Speaker 1: whole bunch of other players as well. What's the ceiling
Speaker 1: for a Leah Boston. I know she's gonna win Rookie
Speaker 1: of the Year pretty easily. This year, the Fever had
Speaker 1: a chance maybe of making the playoffs if things went
Speaker 1: their way more in clutch time. What's the ceiling for
Speaker 1: a Leah because she seems like she's the best prospects
Speaker 1: to Asia Wilson.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think the ceiling is what this
Speaker 3: pole suggests. This ceiling might be that she could be
Speaker 3: the best player in the league in five years. If
Speaker 3: it even takes five years, I think she can be
Speaker 3: that good. We saw her impact almost from the jump
Speaker 3: from her very first game, from her first few games
Speaker 3: with Indiana this year, that franchise took a ton of
Speaker 3: step forwards on court, off court. I think they're investing
Speaker 3: more than maybe they have in the past, and you know,
Speaker 3: they have a real identity. You can see they put
Speaker 3: out a lot more then these things matter, like a
Speaker 3: lot more social content, a lot more stuff on social media,
Speaker 3: more personality. They've really started to build around her on
Speaker 3: all facets, the way you would expect a team to
Speaker 3: build around their franchise player in so many different ways.
Speaker 3: And so I think the ceiling is, you know what
Speaker 3: that pole suggests. I do want to if you know,
Speaker 3: you want to go back to that graphic or flash
Speaker 3: it up or I can talk through it again, you
Speaker 3: know that graphic. I think this question is one of
Speaker 3: the most interesting we did in the whole pole, and
Speaker 3: I just want to highlight two things on it. One,
Speaker 3: you know the other Brianna Steart is an other on
Speaker 3: this question, but she was the best player on the other.
Speaker 3: And I think one of the reasons they jumped out
Speaker 3: to me is that I think there is this perception
Speaker 3: that she's so much older than Asia Wilson, when there's
Speaker 3: really just a two year gap between the two. And
Speaker 3: so to see this kind of stark discrepancy between best
Speaker 3: player right now and who some players think will be
Speaker 3: the best player in five years, when Asia and Stewie
Speaker 3: are pretty close to contemporaries, or much more contemporaries than
Speaker 3: say Asia and Aliah Boston are. I think that was
Speaker 3: one thing that kind of surprised me as we were
Speaker 3: doing the poll was just how few people frankly said
Speaker 3: Brianna Stewart. And again maybe that's because of her achilles
Speaker 3: injury also a couple of years back, and Asia obviously
Speaker 3: hasn't had a significant injury like that yet. The other
Speaker 3: thing is no college players, right, No Caitlin Clark, no
Speaker 3: Angel Reese, no Camera Brink. You know we have there's
Speaker 3: gonna be an incredible influx of talent coming into the
Speaker 3: WNBA over the next couple of years. You could have
Speaker 3: set a college player for this question, we would have
Speaker 3: accepted it. No one went that route. I think a
Speaker 3: couple of people pondered it, thought about it. Maybe there
Speaker 3: is a college player I should go to, or there's
Speaker 3: so many choices, but nobody went that route, which I
Speaker 3: think was super interesting because a year ago at this time,
Speaker 3: Aliah Boston was playing in college, so things happened really fast.
Speaker 3: They think it will be super interesting in three years time.
Speaker 3: Say if we ask this question again just to see
Speaker 3: what people.
Speaker 1: Say, Oh yeah, in three years time, do you think
Speaker 1: Aliah Boston will still be the choice. I mean, she'll
Speaker 1: be halfway through her five years at that point.
Speaker 3: She might be and honestly, she might be the best
Speaker 3: player in the league of that choice, I think, or
Speaker 3: maybe it will be thirty thirty thirty Stuart Wilson Aliah Boston.
Speaker 3: I think we'll have to see it, wouldn't be shocked.
Speaker 3: Maybe Caitlin Clark also, who really knows.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we shall see. You mentioned that on some of
Speaker 1: these questions you had to tell the players they can't
Speaker 1: include anybody on their own team, and that is the
Speaker 1: case for most underrated player in the league, which has
Speaker 1: a funny result because other came out as the champion.
Speaker 1: So who's your choice here as the most underrated player
Speaker 1: in the league.
Speaker 3: I mean, I think this was tough because there is
Speaker 3: a media angle to it, or like a public perception angle,
Speaker 3: and I think Jackie Young, who was the player who
Speaker 3: received the most votes, with a singular player that received
Speaker 3: the most votes, like, I think she is still undercovered,
Speaker 3: under discussed, maybe publicly, and that is why a lot
Speaker 3: of players you know, ended up saying her, you know,
Speaker 3: you don't see a ton of you know, tweets or
Speaker 3: big talk shows or segments about Jackie Young, but cheers
Speaker 3: someone who most improved Player, All Stars starter. You know,
Speaker 3: she probably make first or second team this year, one
Speaker 3: of the five to ten best players twelve best players
Speaker 3: in the league. But because she is a little bit
Speaker 3: more quiet as an outward personality, I think maybe doesn't
Speaker 3: get the coverage she deserves. But she also was a
Speaker 3: number one pick herself in twenty nineteen, and she just
Speaker 3: had this kind of steady growth, this steady improvement year
Speaker 3: over year. Now she is one of the best players
Speaker 3: in the league. But I don't think she's kind of
Speaker 3: talked about in that same group. So that answer didn't
Speaker 3: surprise me. But Benija Laney another candidate who received a
Speaker 3: bunch of votes, she has been super important for the
Speaker 3: Liberty this year. She's really the Swiss Army knife defender
Speaker 3: for them. She's far more than just a kind of
Speaker 3: three and D wing. And when she can create offense,
Speaker 3: when she can score the basketball, she makes New York
Speaker 3: even more dangerous. They're starting five and their depth. She
Speaker 3: often guards best players on their team, you know, on
Speaker 3: a team of super teams. I think she often is
Speaker 3: forgotten a little bit, but she just signed an extension
Speaker 3: with New York to keep her there for the next
Speaker 3: couple of years as well. So she's a little bit underrated,
Speaker 3: and I think, especially as the postseason comes, she's a
Speaker 3: player to keep your eye on as you're watching New
Speaker 3: York because she'll play a big role in everything they
Speaker 3: do in all the success that they may have.
Speaker 1: Yeah, kind of similar scenarios for Jackie Young and Benijua
Speaker 1: Lay being maybe the fourth player after the big threes
Speaker 1: on their teams, which is crazy to say, like you're
Speaker 1: saying for Jackie Young, she was a number one pick.
Speaker 1: She's gonna finish top twenty in points and assists and
Speaker 1: basically was fifty forty ninety this season and she's the
Speaker 1: number four option and that tells you how stacked a
Speaker 1: team like the Aces. Are a couple of things that
Speaker 1: stood out to me that I like to see Cheyenne
Speaker 1: Parker getting votes for most underrated player in the league.
Speaker 1: Played a few played a handful of seasons in the
Speaker 1: w but really turned it on this year for the
Speaker 1: Dream giving them an interior presence. She made All Star
Speaker 1: for the first time. I love watching her play. And
Speaker 1: the other thing that kind of surprised me is no
Speaker 1: votes for Chelsea Gray Finals MVP the point God, like
Speaker 1: you're saying she's got highlights time and time again. I
Speaker 1: was a little surprised that she didn't get any votes
Speaker 1: just because she seems impossible to play against and a
Speaker 1: guaranteed clutch basket when it comes down to it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but she just created a lot of highlights. And
Speaker 3: I think a lot of this is just the perception
Speaker 3: and people tend to know Chelsea Gray's name, so you know,
Speaker 3: maybe that was part of true. But yeah, I mean,
Speaker 3: you know, maybe Chelsea on another team if she is
Speaker 3: the clear one A option, whereas you know in Las
Speaker 3: Vegas she can be one A, she can be you know,
Speaker 3: two A, two three A, or four A depending on
Speaker 3: who is on the court. You know, maybe she's a
Speaker 3: little bit underrated considering how good she is. But I mean,
Speaker 3: we see a lot of Chelsea Gray. But I think
Speaker 3: the Shrian Parker is another good show too.
Speaker 1: I noticed you didn't ask most overrated player. That caused
Speaker 1: a ton of waves in the NBA when the question
Speaker 1: was asked and Trey Dung came back as the most
Speaker 1: overrated player in the league. Who do you think would
Speaker 1: have won that vote.
Speaker 3: I will I will bite my tongue on that, but
Speaker 3: I will say a lot of players also bit their tongues.
Speaker 3: It was something we set out to ask a little
Speaker 3: bit on. We set out to ask a little bit
Speaker 3: about that, and a lot of players really did not
Speaker 3: take to that question. I will say some had thought
Speaker 3: about it, some did not take to it. I think
Speaker 3: it's one. Frankly, it's like it is a tough one.
Speaker 3: If you're not getting a fair sample on like to
Speaker 3: just run. And that was something we wrestled with as
Speaker 3: we were putting this both together.
Speaker 1: I will say, all right, fair enough, moving on another
Speaker 1: great question, which organization would you most like to play for?
Speaker 1: And the Las Vegas Aces won this one pretty handily,
Speaker 1: taking home twenty seven percent of the vote. The next
Speaker 1: highest finishing team the Washington Mystics and Los Angeles Sparks,
Speaker 1: both at twenty percent. What makes the Aces such a
Speaker 1: special organization? They've been great since they joined the WNBA.
Speaker 3: It's talent, but it's also investment. They have a sixty
Speaker 3: four thousand square foot brand new practice facility that has
Speaker 3: every amenity that you would want, every kind of recovery
Speaker 3: tub and chamber, and food and you know, own beautiful
Speaker 3: lockers and a practice court that you can access at
Speaker 3: any time. It's just overall investment. I think it is
Speaker 3: a big reason why a lot of players chose them,
Speaker 3: Certainly playing in Las Vegas and it's fun and games
Speaker 3: are fun, and the game ops are great, and they
Speaker 3: do a lot of things to engage the fans. The
Speaker 3: crowds are really into it. But you know, I don't
Speaker 3: think it's a coincidence that some of the franchises that
Speaker 3: were most said or in pole were some of the
Speaker 3: ones that have owners who have invested or have success.
Speaker 3: I mean, Washington a big thing. You know, they certainly
Speaker 3: have used some of the Mystics facilities, amenities and have
Speaker 3: access to the monumental Sports Group Los Angeles. A ton
Speaker 3: of people said them frankly, they have a little less
Speaker 3: investment than some of the other teams on the list,
Speaker 3: but whether you know, playing in La playing in Staples
Speaker 3: or Crypto dot com playing in that arena and the
Speaker 3: kind of appeal there, though they don't have their own
Speaker 3: practice facility like some of the others. And then New
Speaker 3: York Location continued investment in the franchise, but Las Vegas
Speaker 3: stands out because of the talent, the ownership, their commitment
Speaker 3: to the product. I think that's pretty clear, and I
Speaker 3: think it's not really a surprise that we saw them
Speaker 3: at this point in this point. I think that was
Speaker 3: the answer we were expecting and it's the answer we heard. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I see these sky crept in there with ten percent
Speaker 3: of the vote. You think that's the Dwayne Wade effect. Yeah,
Speaker 3: that's actually a really good point. I think it definitely
Speaker 3: could be. I think it could be because they're another
Speaker 3: team that you know, they don't historically have the same
Speaker 3: level of investment as say New York right now or
Speaker 3: Las Vegas, or maybe even a Washington or someone like
Speaker 3: Indiana who might be able to draw from some of
Speaker 3: the NBA facilities or the NBA ownership groups. Yeah, Dwayne
Speaker 3: Wade effect is a really good one. I think also
Speaker 3: playing in Chicago is still appealing, and we certainly saw
Speaker 3: during those finals runs, the final run that they had
Speaker 3: that crowd is great, Like they get really into it,
Speaker 3: they're super supportive of the team, and yeah, maybe things
Speaker 3: are starting to change for Chicago. I think for a
Speaker 3: lot of players's personal preference to whether location where they're from,
Speaker 3: little factors like that that maybe they we wish they
Speaker 3: wouldn't factor in as much, but their answers so.
Speaker 1: So beeah, exactly right. I mean, you play forty games,
Speaker 1: that's a lot of games, but there's three hundred and
Speaker 1: twenty five other nights out there that you gotta worry
Speaker 1: about as well.
Speaker 3: Summers in Chicago not bad.
Speaker 1: Summer's in Chicago not bad. But winters in Chicago, yeah,
Speaker 1: they are bad. As it turns out. Change in lands
Speaker 1: here a little bit. This is actual from a different survey.
Speaker 1: ESPN also ask some WNBA players the biggest issue facing
Speaker 1: the WNBA, and they came back with fifty three percent
Speaker 1: of the vote saying that travel is the biggest issue
Speaker 1: in the WNBA. I know, y'all just did a big
Speaker 1: episode on the travel problem in the WNBA on The
Speaker 1: Athletic Women's Basketball Show. Do you agree this is the
Speaker 1: biggest question that the w has to figure out going forward?
Speaker 3: I do. I also think it is one that is
Speaker 3: really central to the upcoming collective bargaining agreements. And not
Speaker 3: to get too in the weeds and get too nerdy here,
Speaker 3: but I think it is one thing that the league
Speaker 3: recognizes is going to have to change or players really
Speaker 3: want to change. And I think it is something that
Speaker 3: will change in the next two or three years when
Speaker 3: the new CBA gets renegotiated and eventually comes into effect.
Speaker 3: I mean, we see players on a nightly basis, especially
Speaker 3: in this extended forty game season, talk about flight delays,
Speaker 3: talk about travel issues. It's something that I think a
Speaker 3: lot of people don't realize is there are so few
Speaker 3: off days the WNBA because the day after a game,
Speaker 3: a team is flying from one arena to the other.
Speaker 3: And as anyone who travels commercially for fun, travels for work,
Speaker 3: goes on trips during the summer recognizes, you know, a
Speaker 3: travel day is not the same thing as an off
Speaker 3: day getting in an airport, flying commercial, waiting in long lines.
Speaker 3: You know, we did this big report in mid August
Speaker 3: that I recommend people checking out. I talked to Kathy Engelbert,
Speaker 3: the commissioner, I talked to the WNBPA had Terry Jackson
Speaker 3: and more than a dozen players about just small little
Speaker 3: solutions that they would want to see on the travel problem.
Speaker 3: You know, A very simple one that some players talk
Speaker 3: about is lounges, just having lounge access consistently. Delta American
Speaker 3: Airlines United, being able to rest there, to recharge, to
Speaker 3: separate from the general public, like that is something that
Speaker 3: WNBA players don't even have when they fly commercial. The WNBPA,
Speaker 3: they did launch this partnership with Priority Pass, which is
Speaker 3: a kind of, I guess, a service that provides some
Speaker 3: lounge access, but it's a mostly international service, so you know,
Speaker 3: there are some markets in which teams could take advantage
Speaker 3: of it, but not that many, and so you know,
Speaker 3: travel is going to continue to be a big topic
Speaker 3: of discussion. One other thing I would say on it
Speaker 3: before you know, this is a long topic and we
Speaker 3: talked a lot about it. As you mentioned Trey on
Speaker 3: the podcast, is the w NBPA, all they really want
Speaker 3: is choice and optionality, Like that is the big thing
Speaker 3: they are pushing for. They're not necessarily right now saying
Speaker 3: we want charters on every flights. They just want teams
Speaker 3: to have the ability to charter as much as they can.
Speaker 3: You know, if you want to charter three flights, five flights,
Speaker 3: eight flights, whatever. Teams don't even have that choice right now,
Speaker 3: and that is something that they really want to see
Speaker 3: going forward. So I do expect some change on that though,
Speaker 3: I'm going forward.
Speaker 1: When is the CBA up and when the negotiations take place.
Speaker 3: It will be basically two or three years is when
Speaker 3: the opt out is and it all will coincide with
Speaker 3: a new media deal coming into effect. So you know,
Speaker 3: I think the league is saying, if we can get
Speaker 3: a new media rights deal that creates this influx of money,
Speaker 3: basically months later we're going to see is when the
Speaker 3: CBA would be renegotiated or accepted or could be. I guess,
Speaker 3: you know, they can always amend things and agree earlier
Speaker 3: or later depending on what happens, But the timeline between
Speaker 3: the CBA and the media rights deal are aligned. And
Speaker 3: so I think, you know, assuming the NBA the WNBA
Speaker 3: gets a deal that they want, I think the players
Speaker 3: will see some charter changes if they want. One other
Speaker 3: thing that I think will be really interesting to this
Speaker 3: audience in particular, is you know, the NBA doesn't actually
Speaker 3: require charter flights. Like if you go through their CBA
Speaker 3: passed and the new one, there's nothing in there that
Speaker 3: says teams have to fly charter. Teams are just given
Speaker 3: the option to fly charter. It's just become the standard,
Speaker 3: and every team does it. And if an NBA team
Speaker 3: didn't fly charter, you know I better. I think anyone
Speaker 3: would suggest they're not going to get the same level
Speaker 3: of free agents buy out guys are not signing with
Speaker 3: teams that are flying commercial at this point anything like that,
Speaker 3: Whereas in the w NBA CBA the way it's currently written,
Speaker 3: teams are really restricted. You're not allowed to book charter flights.
Speaker 3: Teams are not allowed to do that. You have to
Speaker 3: fly economy plus and if a player even wants to
Speaker 3: fly first class, they have to pay out of pocket
Speaker 3: to do that. So that's just one really interesting kind
Speaker 3: of CBA nuance. Again, we're getting into the weeds here
Speaker 3: late in this episode, but you know, I think it
Speaker 3: just speaks to again the WNBA just wanting the players,
Speaker 3: wanting some choice as they look for this to change
Speaker 3: going forward.
Speaker 1: I think that's an easy ask, just being able to
Speaker 1: do it, and like you're saying, that would separate organizations. Furthermore,
Speaker 1: the teams that are willing to take charters, that are
Speaker 1: willing to invest that money, are going to be able
Speaker 1: to lure even better players. So hopefully that comes about
Speaker 1: in the next CBA, which said will be a couple
Speaker 1: of years. I assume that's the earliest that the league
Speaker 1: could also address something from the Athletic Player Poll, which
Speaker 1: is expansion. You asked players if they would rather expand
Speaker 1: via teams or if they would rather expand via roster spots,
Speaker 1: though they're not necessarily mutually exclusive. Eight percent of the
Speaker 1: vote went for expanding rosters, forty two percent went towards
Speaker 1: adding more teams, Which do you think is more likely?
Speaker 1: Do you think either of these happen next time around?
Speaker 3: I definitely do. I think we'd see movement on both fronts,
Speaker 3: and as you mentioned, they aren't mutually exclusive, and I
Speaker 3: think roster spots is something that I think players hope.
Speaker 3: Why doesn't it happen before CBA negotiation because I don't
Speaker 3: even think it would take that a full CVA renegotiation
Speaker 3: to expand roster sizes. You know, one thing that is
Speaker 3: a little bit of a misconception is the WNBA. It often,
Speaker 3: you know, calls itself the one forty four, and you
Speaker 3: know there's some symbolic significance to that, or there's kind
Speaker 3: of power of the activism all the off court, you know,
Speaker 3: power that the players have kind of in speaking to
Speaker 3: social issues and political issues and using their voice. That's
Speaker 3: part of the one forty four collective. But on a
Speaker 3: WNBA season, across the league, at a given point, there's
Speaker 3: almost never one hundred and forty four players signed. Many
Speaker 3: teams only roster eleven players, sometimes even ten players. There's
Speaker 3: something called emerge and sy hardship contracts, which is a
Speaker 3: big thing in the WNBA and just makes things very
Speaker 3: messy in players kind of coming in on and off
Speaker 3: rosters at any given point, and so just expanding it
Speaker 3: to fourteen fifteen players, maybe it's two players who don't
Speaker 3: dress four games but can then be activated. You know,
Speaker 3: that can be twenty four more jobs, thirty six more
Speaker 3: jobs immediately. A lot of players in our poll, you know,
Speaker 3: when we asked this question, they said, you know, before
Speaker 3: we expand to more markets, can you just treat us
Speaker 3: better they treat the players you have better, make their
Speaker 3: experiences more positive. That was a common refrain we had,
Speaker 3: you know, tend to those people in your house before
Speaker 3: building a whole new house. Was to paraphrase one of
Speaker 3: the remarks from a player. And I think that's a
Speaker 3: super fair refrain, and I don't think there's a reason
Speaker 3: that there couldn't be you know, more spots right now.
Speaker 3: I always tell people when they're getting into the WNBA
Speaker 3: or comparing a little bit the NBA and the w
Speaker 3: IS watch garbage time in the WNBA, because even in
Speaker 3: a thirty point blowout game, teams, you know, front runners
Speaker 3: for the sixth player of the year, the seventh best
Speaker 3: player on a team, they still have to play garbage time.
Speaker 3: It gets a thirty five point game and they're still
Speaker 3: in the game, whereas in an NBA game you never
Speaker 3: see that, right, Like it really is, the concept of
Speaker 3: empty a your bench does not really exist in the WNBA.
Speaker 3: More roster spots would change that problem, but it also
Speaker 3: would have a much more have much more effects obviously
Speaker 3: than just that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because at the start of the season it was
Speaker 1: a big controversy that all of these young players were
Speaker 1: trying to break into the league right and there just
Speaker 1: weren't enough roster spots to the point where number one
Speaker 1: overall picks are getting waived a couple of seasons into
Speaker 1: their careers, which is something like you're saying, you wouldn't
Speaker 1: see in the NBA. So adding you know, thirty more
Speaker 1: jobs would have a big time effect.
Speaker 3: I think yeah, And look, I think first round picks
Speaker 3: you usually get maybe a one season in which it
Speaker 3: feels pretty safe, and some in recent years we seen
Speaker 3: haven't even made it through that. But generally I think
Speaker 3: a first year for a first round pick is safe.
Speaker 3: But by year two, when that preseason, that training camp
Speaker 3: comes around, like you are fighting for your job just
Speaker 3: like any other player. We see it with second round picks,
Speaker 3: third round picks right off the bat. I think it's
Speaker 3: like why in our business sometimes doing WNBA draft grades
Speaker 3: like feels kind of silly because it's like, what are
Speaker 3: we really evaluating here? What are we really grading? Like
Speaker 3: what chance do these players really have of making the team.
Speaker 3: It's kind of it's a sad thing to say, but
Speaker 3: it is a little bit of the reality that one rookie,
Speaker 3: you know, maybe two will make a roster on occasion,
Speaker 3: three will make a roster if that and sometimes don't
Speaker 3: even have first round picks. It just makes you know
Speaker 3: it is really hard for rookies to break in. Expanding
Speaker 3: the rosters with help player development, and again, it would
Speaker 3: alleviate a lot of problems. You said too, train well.
Speaker 1: You mentioned fixing the house that you're in before building
Speaker 1: a new house. If the WNBA decides to build a
Speaker 1: new house, which city is the next to get a team?
Speaker 3: I mean, I think the front runners. A lot of
Speaker 3: people expect Toronto, which we saw a preseason game this
Speaker 3: year between Minnesota and Chicago, sellout crowd, amazing atmosphere. I
Speaker 3: think they just put out a w NBA branded court.
Speaker 3: I forget where in the city it is, but you know,
Speaker 3: if you can someone search on Twitter, it is a
Speaker 3: super super cool looking court. I think that city is
Speaker 3: primed and ready to go. I think the Bay Area
Speaker 3: is also another front runner. You know, maybe it's affiliated
Speaker 3: with the folks that own the Golden State Warriors. Maybe
Speaker 3: it isn't, but that is another market that I think
Speaker 3: is clamoring for WNBA team that I think a w
Speaker 3: NBA team would definitely succeed in.
Speaker 1: Awesome stuff. We will wait and see what actually ends
Speaker 1: up happening with travel, with expanding roster spots, with expanding
Speaker 1: the entire league in general. We're gonna head to tweet
Speaker 1: of the night tweet O the night Wow tweeted the
Speaker 1: night Post and then I call it what you want.
Speaker 1: Ben brought us something special. So walk me through what
Speaker 1: we got here from Ryan Howard.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Really, it is kind of the tweet of the season,
Speaker 3: and you know, the exchange of the season. It is
Speaker 3: going back to a game earlier in the year when
Speaker 3: Atlanta and New York played each other. Atlanta blew out
Speaker 3: New York on this I think it was June twenty third,
Speaker 3: was the night of the game, a thirty point game
Speaker 3: in Atlanta, and Ryan Howard tweets out July twenty seven,
Speaker 3: she has marked her calendar because that was the next
Speaker 3: time that New York and Atlanta. We're gonna play. Like
Speaker 3: any good Twitter story, this is a multi part drama.
Speaker 3: So if you go to the next tweet, the next screen,
Speaker 3: you can see on July twenty seventh, these two teams
Speaker 3: played the New York Liberty on their official account. They
Speaker 3: certainly knew that Ryan Howard marked her calendar. And as
Speaker 3: they said, like we said before, business is business. The
Speaker 3: New York Liberty handled Ryan Howard and the Atlanta Dream
Speaker 3: that night. They actually did it twice. They you know,
Speaker 3: did that kind of polo graphic thing that you often
Speaker 3: see a site like Clench. I don't even know how
Speaker 3: to describe that. The little screenshot in the tweet. Another
Speaker 3: tweet to reference Ryan Howard's Then Ryan said, you know,
Speaker 3: she kind of acknowledged that New York got the last laugh,
Speaker 3: and you know she said, no, it's cute like she's
Speaker 3: gonna redeem herself going forward. You know this is a
Speaker 3: three part play. She didn't have the opportunity to redeem herself.
Speaker 3: These teams won't meet in the postseason, I believe. I'm
Speaker 3: not sure. I guess I'm pretty sure or I feel
Speaker 3: very likely saying that they will not meet in the postseason.
Speaker 3: I'm not sure how the math breaks out. I think
Speaker 3: they're on other sides of the draw entirely. But it
Speaker 3: will wait until next year to see if there's a
Speaker 3: fourth act of this play, if there's any future resolution.
Speaker 3: Clearly no love lost between Ryan Howard and the New
Speaker 3: York Liberty and the New York Liberty social media staff
Speaker 3: because they also got engaged in this fun not just
Speaker 3: a players.
Speaker 1: Well. I don't know when Game one of the WNBA
Speaker 1: Finals is scheduled, but I'd love to see a Ryan
Speaker 1: Howard tweet calling out the New York Liberty I'll see
Speaker 1: you in the finals.
Speaker 3: Maybe she'll be wearing an Aces jersey sitting courtside.
Speaker 1: Who knows well this one backfired. But I do know
Speaker 1: Ryan Howard is good with callout tweets because she went
Speaker 1: to some Hawks games and she said, Trey Young, when
Speaker 1: do you come into a dream game? He showed up
Speaker 1: to a dream game in Las Vegas, if I'm not mistaken,
Speaker 1: Las Vegas or Los Angeles, and she's like, that's nice.
Speaker 1: How about a home game? And then he ended up
Speaker 1: showing up at a home game as well. So you know,
Speaker 1: sometimes it works and sometimes you get beat by the
Speaker 1: New York Liberty unfortunately. Yeah.
Speaker 3: But who's spiciest tweeter. It's Sidney Colson. Yeah, she would
Speaker 3: be the MVP of the whole season. I would recommend
Speaker 3: following Sidney Colson. She is a part time comic. Las
Speaker 3: Vegas Aces guard one of their reserves, but she is
Speaker 3: unafraid about tweeting tons of sarcasm at her humor at
Speaker 3: her teammates. I think on the night that Asia scored
Speaker 3: fifty three, she was like, fifty four would have been nice.
Speaker 3: The whole team pranked her at the start of the
Speaker 3: year and pretended that she had been cut. Becky Hammond
Speaker 3: even got it involved in the prank. I mean, she
Speaker 3: is tweeting out her teammates, poking fun at them. She
Speaker 3: is fully spicy, she is fully getting in the mix.
Speaker 3: She is lighting up on WNB Twitter, not afraid to engage.
Speaker 3: She might be the single player who is the MVP
Speaker 3: of WNB Twitter, and that might not just be for
Speaker 3: this year, but in recent years too.
Speaker 1: What was it like on Emoji Day for you, when
Speaker 1: Brianna Stewart was just tweeting out random strings of emojis
Speaker 1: and everybody was trying to crack the code.
Speaker 3: It was pretty crazy, Like I certainly didn't know what
Speaker 3: they meant. And it was one of the things that
Speaker 3: when I first sat down with Stewie in New York
Speaker 3: at the start of the season, we did an interview
Speaker 3: during training camp as the training camp was ending, and
Speaker 3: I had actually printed out all those tweets I recommend
Speaker 3: people reading this story on the Athletic and I just
Speaker 3: said to codey's for me, and she at certain points
Speaker 3: was like, I'm not really sure what this one meant,
Speaker 3: Like I genuinely don't know. I think I was discussing
Speaker 3: with people and I kind of respected it, like, you know,
Speaker 3: some of them made sense, some of them. She was
Speaker 3: trying to explain and then some were both at a loss,
Speaker 3: And I think that was kind of the fun of it,
Speaker 3: you know, certainly good for the drama. I think we'll
Speaker 3: see something similar this year. She harkened back to Blake
Speaker 3: Griffin and DeAndre Jordan and Chris Paul and that the
Speaker 3: famous what Clippers rockets locking in the house? Where's the chair?
Speaker 3: All the playing stuff? That was her inspiration, which I
Speaker 3: also thought was such a great callback for some Twitter
Speaker 3: emoji offseason battle.
Speaker 1: Yeah, very relatable. I mean, you and I are podcasters.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of times where we know exactly what
Speaker 1: we're trying to say, and a lot of times where
Speaker 1: we're just talking and some stuff is just coming out.
Speaker 1: It even happens to Brianna Stewart, which I suppose is
Speaker 1: good to know. Ben, thanks so much for joining me.
Speaker 1: Tell me a little bit about the Athletic Women's Basketball Show.
Speaker 1: I know y'all are just a couple of episodes in,
Speaker 1: but I've really been enjoying it so far.
Speaker 3: Yeah, thanks a lot. It's certainly been a ton of
Speaker 3: fun so far. Basically, twice a week, we're gonna talk
Speaker 3: a lot about the WNBA, much like we did today.
Speaker 3: It will be on court stories, what's going on around
Speaker 3: the league in terms of games, pre viewne playoffs, pre
Speaker 3: vieune matchup. It will also be something we do in
Speaker 3: the college season, previewing the on court, the on core game,
Speaker 3: what's going on. We'll also talk topics, travel, expansion, pay, inequity, nil,
Speaker 3: things like that. Last year I was lucky enough to
Speaker 3: go abroad. I visited a ton of w NBA players overseas.
Speaker 3: That's something I think we may be able to do
Speaker 3: or we may be doing again this year. And so
Speaker 3: we're going to talk a little bit about the WNB
Speaker 3: off season, overseas, international basketball, which is a really important
Speaker 3: part of the professional game. I think our hope is
Speaker 3: to just both educate, to inform, to entertain all different breasts,
Speaker 3: not just be on court, not just be topics, not
Speaker 3: just be America. We'll sprinkle in the international flair. As
Speaker 3: I said, we hope it's just a place that you listen,
Speaker 3: you learn, we talk about women's basketball. It will be.
Speaker 3: It's been a ton of fun to do and I
Speaker 3: think it will continue to just be a really enjoyable thing.
Speaker 3: So we hope people continue to follow a long subscribe
Speaker 3: follow like give us feedback, and yeah, looking forward to it.
Speaker 1: I definitely will be. Y'all are going to be covering
Speaker 1: college basketball as well, right because I have to. This
Speaker 1: is one of the most anticipated NCAA women's seasons that's
Speaker 1: ever been.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, super exciting women's season in college coming up,
Speaker 3: a ton of talent, and yeah, we'll be doing it
Speaker 3: throughout college twice a week then as well, so Ryan,
Speaker 3: you know, finish the WNBA season with us. We kind
Speaker 3: of started it as the postseason crunch time was going,
Speaker 3: and we'll flow right into the college season, so no
Speaker 3: breaks for us.
Speaker 1: Should be awesome. Make sure to check that out. It's
Speaker 1: called The Athletics Women's Basketball Show. You can find it
Speaker 1: on the Athletic app. You can find it anywhere you
Speaker 1: get podcasts. Ben, thank you so much for coming on,
Speaker 1: but no, thank you for saying that the dream are
Speaker 1: going to get swept. I will hold that against you
Speaker 1: until the next time we talk, which maybe we'll have
Speaker 1: to do something for the finals or something like that
Speaker 1: a little bit later on.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I think you should just tweet out the date
Speaker 3: you want me to come back. Mark it on your
Speaker 3: own by Howard, and I'll come back to it when
Speaker 3: that time comes.
Speaker 1: I love it. We will have to talk then. As
Speaker 1: for No Dunk's Task is back tomorrow with a new
Speaker 1: episode of No on the Athletic Baseball Show Feed and US.
Speaker 1: No Dunks guys will be back next week at the latest,
Speaker 1: if anything happens in the NBA, because the biggest news
Speaker 1: right now is Boban coming back to the Rockets. Did
Speaker 1: you have a take on that one, Ben, Boban's.
Speaker 3: Back pretty surprising, honestly pretty surprising. But I'm excited to
Speaker 3: see that his NBA career is not over. Maybe his
Speaker 3: acting career also not over. We'll see about that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exactly right. Until then, Clipper Brows, you heard
Speaker 1: it here first, have a great time, turn up, love
Speaker 1: you guys. Awesome, all right, embrace the day people. We're
Speaker 1: back soon.