1
00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:05,040
Speaker 1: Madonna. I know you listen to every episode of this

2
00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:08,280
Speaker 1: podcast and you heard it from Trix and Mattel. She

3
00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:09,960
Speaker 1: wants like a virgin Barbie.

4
00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:12,039
Speaker 2: No, you know, if she does it, she's gonna push

5
00:00:12,039 --> 00:00:13,840
Speaker 2: through like a ray of light Barbie, and we're gonna

6
00:00:13,840 --> 00:00:17,240
Speaker 2: get blue jeans and like like a Hotten shirt. Kabala Barbie.

7
00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:17,840
Speaker 1: I want that.

8
00:00:19,040 --> 00:00:25,000
Speaker 2: She's sheen am me, no me, not my name? Yo

9
00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:33,440
Speaker 2: yo yo? What is your childhood trauma? I have coo.

10
00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:36,080
Speaker 2: You know what's going down the floor like.

11
00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:49,280
Speaker 1: Round Welcome to Like a Virgin, the show where we

12
00:00:49,320 --> 00:00:55,000
Speaker 1: give yesterday's pop culture today's takes. I am Ra's Damu

13
00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:57,960
Speaker 1: and I am fran to Rota Virgins. You know you

14
00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:01,520
Speaker 1: will have heard our patch from Fire Island in our

15
00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:05,480
Speaker 1: episode last week. Also, if you're a patron patroon dot

16
00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:08,000
Speaker 1: com slash like a Virgin, you will have heard our

17
00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:14,720
Speaker 1: annual Fire Island episode. But our vacation is over. It's

18
00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:18,120
Speaker 1: back to real life. I had a great time. I

19
00:01:18,160 --> 00:01:20,640
Speaker 1: think you did as well. Fran Oh for sure.

20
00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,399
Speaker 3: I mean I still feel like my body is like

21
00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:26,600
Speaker 3: catching up with all the things that I put it through.

22
00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:27,800
Speaker 2: During that week.

23
00:01:28,640 --> 00:01:31,120
Speaker 3: Like honestly, vacation can be like I'm not going to

24
00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:34,200
Speaker 3: say exhausting, but like it's definitely like your body is

25
00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:38,000
Speaker 3: operating at a different level, taking in a different number

26
00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:38,920
Speaker 3: of drugs.

27
00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:42,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I and in the sun all day.

28
00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:45,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was really the thing that got me the day.

29
00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:48,520
Speaker 1: The day we got back, I needed just a reset

30
00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:54,240
Speaker 1: day and I did like an intense body cleanse, skincare, routine,

31
00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:57,400
Speaker 1: hair washing, and like afterwards, laying on my couch, I

32
00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:02,200
Speaker 1: just felt fried, like both both physically because I got

33
00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:06,400
Speaker 1: a lot of sun and mentally like even though literally

34
00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:10,839
Speaker 1: all we were doing was laying around and relaxing, I

35
00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:16,720
Speaker 1: needed a day to sort of get back to I

36
00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:19,560
Speaker 1: needed to bring me to life, as Amy Lee said

37
00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:23,480
Speaker 1: on the emin Essence debut album. And then the next

38
00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:26,400
Speaker 1: day was my birthday. Yes that's right, Virgins, I am

39
00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:27,880
Speaker 1: now thirty five years old.

40
00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:31,960
Speaker 3: Yes, and you celebrated by going to the place that

41
00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:35,400
Speaker 3: Carrie Bradshaw went to on her exact thirty fifth birthday,

42
00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:38,760
Speaker 3: which was a very mediocre Italian restaurant.

43
00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:43,000
Speaker 1: It was really it was actually bad, Like my entree

44
00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:46,880
Speaker 1: was bad. My entree was bad because I didn't realize

45
00:02:46,960 --> 00:02:49,520
Speaker 1: I thought that I was ordering a pasta that had

46
00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:52,440
Speaker 1: spinach in it, and instead what I ordered was a

47
00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:59,760
Speaker 1: pasta that substituted spinach for noodles. No, it was fine.

48
00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:02,040
Speaker 1: It was not about the food. It was about the vibes,

49
00:03:02,080 --> 00:03:04,880
Speaker 1: and it was not about the food. No. But it

50
00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:09,040
Speaker 1: was a very lovely birthday dinner. And actually this was

51
00:03:09,240 --> 00:03:12,040
Speaker 1: one of the best birthdays I've had in years, I

52
00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:17,760
Speaker 1: think mostly mostly because I approached it very much as

53
00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:21,400
Speaker 1: just another day. I worked during the day, I went

54
00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:24,240
Speaker 1: to the gym, I did very ordinary things. I went

55
00:03:24,280 --> 00:03:27,440
Speaker 1: to a bookstore and ran into a lovely virgin who

56
00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:30,160
Speaker 1: gave me a great discount and picked up a bunch

57
00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:32,520
Speaker 1: of new books. And then I had a wonderful meal

58
00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:36,120
Speaker 1: with my nearest and dearest, wearing I have to say,

59
00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:40,080
Speaker 1: a pretty sickening outfit. There was a great day.

60
00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:43,720
Speaker 3: We love that your outfit was incredible. Yeah, it was

61
00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:46,360
Speaker 3: cordial and it was simple, and that's exactly what you

62
00:03:46,400 --> 00:03:51,480
Speaker 3: need out of a birthday gathering. I feel like, you know, yeah,

63
00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:55,400
Speaker 3: the food, the food you we said, was like kind

64
00:03:55,480 --> 00:04:01,680
Speaker 3: of it was olive garden territory SERTs I thought were phenomenal.

65
00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:04,720
Speaker 1: The desserts were great. I love a tartufo. I hadn't

66
00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:07,280
Speaker 1: had forever. It was so good, and I think everyone

67
00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:09,119
Speaker 1: else I think I don't think anyone else had had

68
00:04:09,160 --> 00:04:11,880
Speaker 1: tartufo at that table, so it did gag them a bit.

69
00:04:12,200 --> 00:04:15,120
Speaker 1: For anyone who wants to know, we went to Il Cantonore,

70
00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:18,200
Speaker 1: which is if you remember the season four episode of

71
00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:20,880
Speaker 1: Sex and the City, The Agony and the Ecstasy. It's

72
00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:23,279
Speaker 1: the restaurant where Carry goes for her birthday dinner and

73
00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:26,680
Speaker 1: none of her friends show up and she has to

74
00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:28,719
Speaker 1: pay for her own birthday cake. The woman with the

75
00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:32,360
Speaker 1: birthday cake is here and she needs a bebate and

76
00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:35,880
Speaker 1: my friends did show up and it was lovely. We

77
00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:39,960
Speaker 1: had a great time and I also had sex that

78
00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:42,880
Speaker 1: night when I got home, and it was fabulous birthday.

79
00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:46,919
Speaker 1: It was really a perfect birthday. Was it was it with? Well?

80
00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:48,760
Speaker 2: Was it with Recurring the World?

81
00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:51,680
Speaker 1: If that's all we're going to say, that's all we're

82
00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:54,479
Speaker 1: going to say. The rest is for the Patreon divas. No,

83
00:04:54,600 --> 00:05:00,800
Speaker 1: the rest is for not people who listen to this podcast. Sorry,

84
00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:02,800
Speaker 1: but you know what we will talk about is the

85
00:05:02,839 --> 00:05:06,640
Speaker 1: fact that no is the fact that Taylor Swift released

86
00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:14,359
Speaker 1: Speak Now Taylor's version I am a little over the

87
00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:19,640
Speaker 1: Taylor's versions, I have to say, and I really felt

88
00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:23,039
Speaker 1: the fatigue with this one because I think I mean

89
00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:25,320
Speaker 1: a I didn't listen to it for basically a whole

90
00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:28,360
Speaker 1: week because we were not featuring it on Fire Island. No,

91
00:05:28,839 --> 00:05:29,320
Speaker 1: not to the.

92
00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:32,560
Speaker 3: Vibe we tried and then switched to just contemporary tailor

93
00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:34,040
Speaker 3: and Taylor's.

94
00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:39,159
Speaker 1: It just I think we've lost the plot in a way,

95
00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:43,760
Speaker 1: which is that the actual point of these albums is

96
00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:47,960
Speaker 1: to literally re record the existing music in such a

97
00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:54,960
Speaker 1: way that it replaces the old Scooter's versions. And yes,

98
00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:57,599
Speaker 1: we get the new tracks and everything, and you know,

99
00:05:57,640 --> 00:05:59,599
Speaker 1: some of the ones on this album are good, but

100
00:06:00,160 --> 00:06:03,280
Speaker 1: it just sounds so much like the original that I'm like,

101
00:06:03,720 --> 00:06:05,839
Speaker 1: what is the point?

102
00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,400
Speaker 3: And the bonus tracks, which like Hayley Williams and fallow

103
00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:13,880
Speaker 3: Way are amazing features to have on the bonus tracks, Sorry,

104
00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:16,440
Speaker 3: didn't really do it for me. I think the only

105
00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:20,400
Speaker 3: song that I will return to is I See You,

106
00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:23,719
Speaker 3: which was on the original or no, is that a

107
00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:24,440
Speaker 3: bonus track?

108
00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:27,440
Speaker 1: But that's the bonus track? Yeah? I thought that she

109
00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:30,440
Speaker 1: made the music video the stupidest music video ever for.

110
00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:32,440
Speaker 2: I loved that bonus track. I thought it was.

111
00:06:32,480 --> 00:06:35,880
Speaker 3: It's a good song, yeah, but no, I don't know.

112
00:06:36,880 --> 00:06:40,680
Speaker 3: I godspeed to everyone going to the Eras tour. Peyton

113
00:06:40,839 --> 00:06:43,240
Speaker 3: just went like seems like she actually I feel like

114
00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:46,719
Speaker 3: everyone we know was like at the Denver show for Eras,

115
00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:51,760
Speaker 3: Rose is still looking for tickets though, no, I'm You're like,

116
00:06:51,800 --> 00:06:52,560
Speaker 3: I'm not anymore.

117
00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:56,279
Speaker 1: I'm not. I'm seeing Beyonce next week. I'm good, love, enjoy.

118
00:06:57,320 --> 00:07:00,600
Speaker 1: I only have one big summer concert in me, and

119
00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:04,080
Speaker 1: that is the one I have been listening to speak

120
00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:08,440
Speaker 1: now Taylor's version, but I could just as easily listen

121
00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:13,760
Speaker 1: to Scooter's version and like be fine.

122
00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,240
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, I have I feel like I'm all

123
00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:19,480
Speaker 3: listened out, like I have so much music.

124
00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:22,240
Speaker 1: It's just this shtick is getting old.

125
00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:25,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I don't want to listen to Reputation Taylor's version,

126
00:07:25,760 --> 00:07:29,760
Speaker 3: like that's gonna be bizarre? No, no, no, no. What

127
00:07:29,800 --> 00:07:32,080
Speaker 3: if she did all acoustic, Like how is she going

128
00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:32,240
Speaker 3: to do?

129
00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:36,360
Speaker 2: That would be fab That would fab if like ras like, yeah,

130
00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:40,040
Speaker 2: an acoustic version of a reputation would be fabulous because

131
00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:44,320
Speaker 2: it would be different instead of just being a copy

132
00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:45,360
Speaker 2: paste of the music.

133
00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:48,720
Speaker 3: I have a question y as a as someone who's

134
00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:51,239
Speaker 3: a little more of a tailor scholar than I am.

135
00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:54,720
Speaker 3: I feel like she said maybe in her documentary that

136
00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:58,400
Speaker 3: reputation was kind of like an era that she regrets

137
00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:01,240
Speaker 3: a little bit. Is that she said something like that before.

138
00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:02,680
Speaker 3: I feel like she's talked about how it was like

139
00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:05,480
Speaker 3: a really dark time and how she felt like reputation

140
00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:09,760
Speaker 3: was in reaction to or retaliation against something instead of

141
00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:10,640
Speaker 3: like actual art.

142
00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:14,200
Speaker 1: I mean it was a reaction to the way she

143
00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:18,080
Speaker 1: was talked about post you know, like being quote unquote

144
00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:20,960
Speaker 1: exposed by Kim Kardashian and like the Kanye West of

145
00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:23,320
Speaker 1: it all. I don't know if she's ever said anything

146
00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:26,640
Speaker 1: about regretting it. I certainly don't regret it. Reputation is

147
00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:28,000
Speaker 1: one of my favorite Taylor albums.

148
00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:31,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's not. It's at the bottom of my list.

149
00:08:32,040 --> 00:08:35,680
Speaker 3: So but I, you know, whatever Taylor's version is gonna

150
00:08:35,679 --> 00:08:36,920
Speaker 3: look like, I'm here for it.

151
00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:40,480
Speaker 1: Speaking of Taylor and tunes, a lot of Taylor's music

152
00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:43,400
Speaker 1: was featured in the trailer for the second season of

153
00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:48,360
Speaker 1: The Summer I turned pretty Actually, Ryan when the trailer

154
00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:50,280
Speaker 1: dropped thought it was a short film that she had

155
00:08:50,320 --> 00:08:54,040
Speaker 1: made because he had no context for the show. The

156
00:08:54,120 --> 00:08:57,240
Speaker 1: first three episodes dropped on Amazon on Friday, and I

157
00:08:57,280 --> 00:09:01,000
Speaker 1: watched them all this weekend. And you know, I famously

158
00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:04,680
Speaker 1: don't love YA because I don't believe teenagers are real people.

159
00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:12,280
Speaker 1: But this is very compelling YA soap opera and there

160
00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:14,200
Speaker 1: is a lot of Taylor shot music featured in it.

161
00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:19,400
Speaker 1: So if you're looking for a very like no thoughts

162
00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:24,840
Speaker 1: had empty summer show to watch, that is a perfect one.

163
00:09:26,760 --> 00:09:28,920
Speaker 2: I'm not going to watch it, but it does sound

164
00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:29,480
Speaker 2: is it kind of?

165
00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:32,200
Speaker 1: I was talking to the Virgins, I know, I.

166
00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:33,960
Speaker 3: Was just saying, for the record, is it like a

167
00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:36,760
Speaker 3: kind of to all the boys I've loved before?

168
00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:39,880
Speaker 1: Coded? It's yeah, Well it's written. The book that it's

169
00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:42,440
Speaker 1: based onst written by Jenny Hahn, who wrote to All

170
00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:48,439
Speaker 1: the Boys. It's love Triangle, a girlye who is in

171
00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:54,840
Speaker 1: uh like, caught between two brothers. Brother. Yes, there's also

172
00:09:55,679 --> 00:10:00,320
Speaker 1: they're dealing with grief because the brother's mom died. It's yeah,

173
00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:03,400
Speaker 1: it's it's very good. Okay, Okay.

174
00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:06,320
Speaker 3: You know what I finished this weekend, which I don't

175
00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:07,760
Speaker 3: think you finished, was the other two?

176
00:10:07,880 --> 00:10:12,960
Speaker 1: Did you did you finish that? No? I watched two

177
00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:15,440
Speaker 1: and a half seasons of it in the span of

178
00:10:16,559 --> 00:10:19,440
Speaker 1: a week, and then got that midway through season three

179
00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:21,800
Speaker 1: and was like, no, I don't want to watch this anymore.

180
00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:22,360
Speaker 1: It's bad.

181
00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:26,280
Speaker 3: The I will agree that a lot of the latter

182
00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:29,720
Speaker 3: half of season three is as you put it, ass

183
00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:33,280
Speaker 3: and I felt it, and I felt like the finale,

184
00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,320
Speaker 3: especially was a whole lot of assery, Like, I, so

185
00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:39,160
Speaker 3: how does it end? I'm not I skim skipped through

186
00:10:39,200 --> 00:10:42,160
Speaker 3: a lot of it. The show, especially in its finale,

187
00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:48,560
Speaker 3: decided to completely change genres and become a drama, a

188
00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:56,679
Speaker 3: like thoughtful, emotional, like personal journey drama about the moralistic

189
00:10:56,920 --> 00:10:59,600
Speaker 3: arc of these two characters and how they can reconcile

190
00:10:59,679 --> 00:11:03,440
Speaker 3: their misery and become like, I don't know, like people again,

191
00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:07,040
Speaker 3: and they get there. The redemptions are the redemption arcs

192
00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:11,040
Speaker 3: are really lovely, like they work fine, but the way

193
00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:15,120
Speaker 3: it's shot is totally completely different, And I feel like

194
00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:19,600
Speaker 3: the showrunner was maybe trying to do something that was

195
00:11:19,679 --> 00:11:23,840
Speaker 3: like profound and brilliant, but the way that the main

196
00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:27,199
Speaker 3: gay guy was portrayed and all of the internal struggle

197
00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:31,040
Speaker 3: that he went through about which was like obsessing over fame,

198
00:11:31,240 --> 00:11:34,800
Speaker 3: like getting overly involved with like the industry and like

199
00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:38,319
Speaker 3: and like you know, excommunicating all of his friends and

200
00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:41,080
Speaker 3: loved ones as a product of that. It feels like

201
00:11:41,120 --> 00:11:44,880
Speaker 3: something that the showrunner actually went through, and it felt

202
00:11:44,960 --> 00:11:48,160
Speaker 3: so transparently, something that the writer needed to just get

203
00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:52,559
Speaker 3: off of his chest to a degree that felt like Bros.

204
00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:54,920
Speaker 3: Coded Like it was like that scene in Bros. Where

205
00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:57,720
Speaker 3: Billy Eigner has that long monologue to the to the

206
00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:00,960
Speaker 3: his like kind of boo on the beach, talking about

207
00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:02,880
Speaker 3: like how people don't understand him, and I was like,

208
00:12:02,920 --> 00:12:05,560
Speaker 3: that's like lovely, but also like this is we know,

209
00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:06,080
Speaker 3: this is you.

210
00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:10,559
Speaker 1: That's such a That's not the ending I would expect

211
00:12:10,640 --> 00:12:13,120
Speaker 1: have expected the show to have. I actually feel like

212
00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:16,480
Speaker 1: it would be much truer to the show and the

213
00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:20,520
Speaker 1: characters to not redeem them and to instead maybe give

214
00:12:20,559 --> 00:12:25,120
Speaker 1: them some kind of come upance. Yeah for being horrible people.

215
00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:30,760
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, I mean they definitely got punished for their actions,

216
00:12:30,800 --> 00:12:34,480
Speaker 3: which is nice. But no, I don't know. The show

217
00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:37,200
Speaker 3: is so like if Virgins ever wanted to watch it.

218
00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:40,720
Speaker 3: The first two seasons are amazing, some of the second

219
00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:43,439
Speaker 3: season is not great, and there are some episodes of

220
00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:47,199
Speaker 3: the third season that are so genius, so laugh out

221
00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:51,560
Speaker 3: loud funny, so much insider baseball like stuff that is

222
00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:54,800
Speaker 3: like relevant to like queer people, especially like gay people

223
00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:58,800
Speaker 3: that exist in media and consume gay media. Oh so

224
00:12:58,960 --> 00:12:59,560
Speaker 3: fucking funny.

225
00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:02,720
Speaker 1: And well you loved you loved that Aid's Play episode.

226
00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:05,080
Speaker 1: Which I did not. I did not think was that.

227
00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:08,840
Speaker 3: There was a spoof of The Inheritance that was fucking hilarious.

228
00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:11,920
Speaker 3: I thought, featuring Lucas Gage. I also thought the muliu

229
00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:15,240
Speaker 3: A bit was so funny.

230
00:13:15,320 --> 00:13:17,680
Speaker 1: Well, I did like that Simulio talked about eating Molly

231
00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:21,520
Speaker 1: shan It's pussy a lot. But other than that, I'm

232
00:13:21,520 --> 00:13:23,320
Speaker 1: never going to watch the rest of the other two

233
00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:27,120
Speaker 1: because I'm too busy reading gay monster porn.

234
00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:29,840
Speaker 2: Okay say more please.

235
00:13:31,320 --> 00:13:35,920
Speaker 1: So I have been book Corner. This is Roses Book Corner,

236
00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:39,680
Speaker 1: which actually if you want to hear if you want

237
00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:46,000
Speaker 1: to hear me talk at length about books, you can

238
00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:49,480
Speaker 1: go on Patreon, Patreon dot com, slash like a Virgin

239
00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:53,120
Speaker 1: and that is the official home of Roses Book Corner.

240
00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:57,800
Speaker 1: But I have been reading a lot recently. I read

241
00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:00,600
Speaker 1: four books while we were on vacation. I'm on fire

242
00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:05,360
Speaker 1: right now and I've been reading a lot of lit thick,

243
00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:14,679
Speaker 1: so I needed a mindless you know, palette cleanser. And

244
00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:18,040
Speaker 1: as as virgins will know, I love a codpiece ripper,

245
00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:23,440
Speaker 1: which is our terminology for gay historical romance. What I

246
00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:30,240
Speaker 1: never have ventured into is gay is gay monster fucking

247
00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:36,400
Speaker 1: book tentacle ripper. Tentacle ripper maybe like eggsack ripper.

248
00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:37,840
Speaker 2: Not eggsac.

249
00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:42,840
Speaker 1: I have yet to encounter of sexy eggsac in these books,

250
00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:46,960
Speaker 1: but it could happen. So, based off of a TikTok recommendation,

251
00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:51,000
Speaker 1: I downloaded onto my kindle a book called Soul Eater

252
00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:55,200
Speaker 1: by an author named Lily Maine, and it is set

253
00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:59,120
Speaker 1: in a post apocalyptic America that is overrun by monsters

254
00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:02,160
Speaker 1: and the main care is a soldier at a military

255
00:15:02,200 --> 00:15:05,240
Speaker 1: base who studies monsters and they bring in like this

256
00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:10,600
Speaker 1: scary monster named Win, the soul Eater, who is like

257
00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:14,520
Speaker 1: in He's like super tall, his like grayskin and has

258
00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:16,680
Speaker 1: a hood so you can't see his face with there's

259
00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:20,000
Speaker 1: horns sticking out of it. And the monster like takes

260
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:21,920
Speaker 1: a liking to him, and they end up escaping the

261
00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:27,080
Speaker 1: facility and they start fucking and fall in love and

262
00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:30,480
Speaker 1: he loves not to make it all about his genitals,

263
00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:33,920
Speaker 1: but but it's about his let's talk about his genitals.

264
00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:41,520
Speaker 1: So he has a slit where a penis would be. Oh,

265
00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:45,960
Speaker 1: and then when he gets aroused, a penis comes out

266
00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:49,080
Speaker 1: of the sort just like a shape of water. And

267
00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:53,080
Speaker 1: when and they're they're flip fucking. So when the when

268
00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:56,160
Speaker 1: the soldier wants to fuck him, he fucks the slit

269
00:15:56,400 --> 00:16:01,000
Speaker 1: like under the penis, so that basically like the penises

270
00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:05,640
Speaker 1: are like together in the whole. And this is great.

271
00:16:06,160 --> 00:16:09,920
Speaker 1: It honestly is like really hot and fun and actually

272
00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:15,280
Speaker 1: like a good story, like with well drawn characters.

273
00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:16,880
Speaker 2: I support you. I support this.

274
00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:21,520
Speaker 1: I started reading this the first book last yesterday evening

275
00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:24,440
Speaker 1: around like five pm, and finished it this morning, and

276
00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:28,080
Speaker 1: then immediately started the second one. And there's I believe

277
00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:32,160
Speaker 1: seven in the series. So this is my new journey,

278
00:16:32,320 --> 00:16:38,800
Speaker 1: is reading a month porn. It is soul eater, soul sucker,

279
00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:44,160
Speaker 1: so there is definitely a lot of sucking going.

280
00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:46,840
Speaker 2: On into it. Slash you should write one of those,

281
00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:48,280
Speaker 2: slash you should adapt.

282
00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:52,080
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about it. I'm thinking I need to maybe

283
00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:56,400
Speaker 1: start writing some porn. I actually am feeling very creatively

284
00:16:56,560 --> 00:17:00,680
Speaker 1: repped up right now from everything I've been reading, I read.

285
00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:02,800
Speaker 1: As I said, I read a bunch of books on vacation,

286
00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:06,960
Speaker 1: and maybe, like I'll go more in depth into them

287
00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:09,720
Speaker 1: on the Patreon at some point, but just to like

288
00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:13,560
Speaker 1: quickly talk about them. My favorite book that I read

289
00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:16,440
Speaker 1: while we were on vacation is Vladimir by Julia May Jonas,

290
00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:20,840
Speaker 1: which is about a professor at a liberal arts college

291
00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:23,800
Speaker 1: in upstate New York whose husband has been accused by

292
00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:27,359
Speaker 1: several women of sexual misconduct, and as that's happening, a

293
00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:30,760
Speaker 1: young professor comes to the school and she becomes totally

294
00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:35,719
Speaker 1: obsessed with him. It's a really sharp and incredibly written

295
00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:41,280
Speaker 1: takedown of like me too culture and wokeness and academia,

296
00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:43,119
Speaker 1: and it's like one of my favorite things that I've

297
00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:46,199
Speaker 1: read in such a long time. The voice is just

298
00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:49,400
Speaker 1: so perfect. I also read We Could Be So Good

299
00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:52,760
Speaker 1: by Kat Sebastian, which is a codpiece ripper about two

300
00:17:53,119 --> 00:17:55,800
Speaker 1: newspaper reporters in nineteen fifties New York City who fall

301
00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:58,000
Speaker 1: in love. I thought it was very sweet and I

302
00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:00,960
Speaker 1: really like to see their love story. And then I

303
00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:03,439
Speaker 1: read The Guest by Emma Kline, which is sort of

304
00:18:03,480 --> 00:18:06,000
Speaker 1: the like hot Girl book of the Summer. It's got

305
00:18:06,040 --> 00:18:08,399
Speaker 1: a very like saturated cover.

306
00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:11,840
Speaker 2: We know what the cover looks like. And it's about

307
00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:12,520
Speaker 2: a sex.

308
00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:19,160
Speaker 1: Worker who is dating this man and staying with him

309
00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:21,720
Speaker 1: in his beach house and like probably the hamp Dens,

310
00:18:22,119 --> 00:18:24,119
Speaker 1: and he kicks her out, and so she has to

311
00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:28,600
Speaker 1: spend a couple of days just sort of going around

312
00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:32,359
Speaker 1: trying to like glom onto any man she can find.

313
00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:36,200
Speaker 1: And it's it's a really great character study. She makes

314
00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:39,760
Speaker 1: like bad decision after bad decision, and it's like you're

315
00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:42,560
Speaker 1: just like reading it screaming at her. And it's really

316
00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:45,240
Speaker 1: well done up until the ending, which was one of

317
00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:48,720
Speaker 1: the most disappointing endings of a book I read in

318
00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:51,520
Speaker 1: a very long time. It really needed like another chapter

319
00:18:51,760 --> 00:18:55,119
Speaker 1: or an epilogue or something. It was just so disappointing.

320
00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:57,719
Speaker 1: It was like it just like crashed off a cliff.

321
00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:01,679
Speaker 1: And then the fourth book I read was like a

322
00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:03,919
Speaker 1: codpiece of report that is not worth talking about. It

323
00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:09,680
Speaker 1: was aggressively fine. But I am going to Florida this

324
00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:11,800
Speaker 1: week to visit my family, so I'm sure I'll be

325
00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:15,560
Speaker 1: doing a lot of reading while i'm there, and you know,

326
00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:19,199
Speaker 1: stay tuned if you want more recommendations. Well, we have

327
00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:22,800
Speaker 1: a very exciting episode today. This is a long time coming,

328
00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:25,320
Speaker 1: both in terms of the fact that this movie has

329
00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:28,000
Speaker 1: been promoted forever. Barbie the Doll has existed for a

330
00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:30,720
Speaker 1: very long time, and we recorded this episode months ago.

331
00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:34,480
Speaker 1: But we have Trixy Mattel on the podcast today talking

332
00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:39,520
Speaker 1: all things Barbie. Yes, and we have to say, just

333
00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:42,720
Speaker 1: because we are who we are, we are in support

334
00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:43,879
Speaker 1: with this strike.

335
00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:47,320
Speaker 2: Okay, SAG hello is striking.

336
00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:48,040
Speaker 1: This is huge.

337
00:19:48,080 --> 00:19:50,280
Speaker 3: All of the videos we're seeing a fran dresser are amazing,

338
00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:53,240
Speaker 3: even though she's kind of an anti vaxxer, but she's amazing.

339
00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:56,720
Speaker 3: And this is not promotion for the movie Barbie. This

340
00:19:56,880 --> 00:20:01,000
Speaker 3: is a historicization of Barbie as an idyl and icon.

341
00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:06,080
Speaker 1: Ok Yes. And we will probably behind the scenes be

342
00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:09,359
Speaker 1: figuring out how we are going to approach talking about

343
00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:15,000
Speaker 1: new media in the wake of SAG and the W

344
00:20:15,119 --> 00:20:19,280
Speaker 1: A G A both being on strike. So this is evolving.

345
00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:22,960
Speaker 1: We're still figuring it out. But no scabs on this podcast.

346
00:20:23,119 --> 00:20:25,159
Speaker 1: No scabs, no thank you.

347
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,320
Speaker 3: This is a tricksy is a long time coming as

348
00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:33,000
Speaker 3: a guest, iconic iconic, So let's let's do it.

349
00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,359
Speaker 1: This episode is about and for the dolls.

350
00:20:35,880 --> 00:21:04,480
Speaker 2: That's right, pre Barbie movie, pre social media, pre like

351
00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:07,919
Speaker 2: I don't know, Jeremy Scott's boardby collection, pre all that stuff.

352
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:10,480
Speaker 2: I just I wanted to I wanted my zippers to

353
00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:12,280
Speaker 2: be this big compared to my body, you know what

354
00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:15,560
Speaker 2: I mean, even proportionally. I wanted to be a tiny

355
00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:19,480
Speaker 2: plastic thing. And I think it was like a maybe mentally,

356
00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:22,600
Speaker 2: it was like an escape route from the human experience.

357
00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:24,720
Speaker 2: It's like what if I also just had no thoughts,

358
00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:26,919
Speaker 2: you know, like what if I also had.

359
00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:28,240
Speaker 1: What if my head was squishy too?

360
00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:31,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was squish my head. What if my knees

361
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:36,159
Speaker 2: you know, snapped? And then when I started like I

362
00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:38,639
Speaker 2: guess I got the cart before the horse, and like

363
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:40,600
Speaker 2: in my later twenties, I started being like, well, I

364
00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:44,159
Speaker 2: take all this inspiration from America's favorite fashion doll, but

365
00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:46,679
Speaker 2: what do I really know about it? And then for

366
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:49,800
Speaker 2: like a good year, I pretty much read every nonfiction

367
00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:54,320
Speaker 2: book about Mattel and Barbie that is in existence, everything

368
00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:57,920
Speaker 2: from the biography and autobiography of Ruth Handler to studies

369
00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:01,680
Speaker 2: about child development to the history of Barbie. And I'm

370
00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:03,840
Speaker 2: probably mentally ill and so when I get focused on

371
00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:07,920
Speaker 2: something I really like, hit record and learn everything about

372
00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:11,840
Speaker 2: it very quickly. And so now I just like, I mean,

373
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:13,840
Speaker 2: I really know everything about Barbie. I think I know

374
00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:15,760
Speaker 2: everything there is to know. So what do you want

375
00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:17,480
Speaker 2: to know? That's why we brought you on.

376
00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:21,040
Speaker 1: Now we're going to test your knowledge. No, we're not

377
00:22:21,119 --> 00:22:25,919
Speaker 1: here to getcha, but I am really interested to get

378
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 1: maybe like, why do you think Barbie was so groundbreaking

379
00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:33,800
Speaker 1: as a toy and why has she endured the way

380
00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:34,640
Speaker 1: she has.

381
00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:39,080
Speaker 2: Well, there's a few reasons. Right, number one first of

382
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:41,760
Speaker 2: its kind. Right until Barbie came along in nineteen fifty nine,

383
00:22:41,760 --> 00:22:44,480
Speaker 2: little girls were encouraged to pretend to be moms. That's it.

384
00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:47,120
Speaker 2: All dolls were babies. So that's like the number one.

385
00:22:47,119 --> 00:22:49,719
Speaker 2: This is the first toy that had women imagining they

386
00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:53,120
Speaker 2: could be nurses or flight attendants or doctors or like anything.

387
00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:55,520
Speaker 2: Not to mention you have to imagine in nineteen fifty

388
00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:58,560
Speaker 2: nine a toy to have breasts and no husband and

389
00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:00,840
Speaker 2: have her own apartment and be a mo which means

390
00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:05,400
Speaker 2: she has her own income. Extremely scandalous, Like it's basically

391
00:23:05,480 --> 00:23:09,199
Speaker 2: a porn toy for children at the time. Yeah, but

392
00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:14,439
Speaker 2: this was at a time where a woman's second biggest

393
00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:17,480
Speaker 2: fear is that her daughter's going to be like overdeveloped

394
00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:21,720
Speaker 2: and slutty and like too independent. Her number one fear

395
00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:24,479
Speaker 2: is that she's going to be ungroomed and unmarriable because

396
00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:27,400
Speaker 2: a husband was a meal ticket. So even women who

397
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:28,960
Speaker 2: are a little conservative is like, well, if I get

398
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:31,360
Speaker 2: my daughter this doll, maybe she'll become interested in styling

399
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:34,600
Speaker 2: her hair and dressing herself. Like it was a way

400
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:38,119
Speaker 2: for women to communicate like, hey, I want you to

401
00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:41,440
Speaker 2: be comfortable in your life, and if you want that,

402
00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:44,080
Speaker 2: this is the template. Like this will get you fed,

403
00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:46,600
Speaker 2: this will get you a house. Like that was sort

404
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:50,760
Speaker 2: of the communication there under the surface. And so that's

405
00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:53,600
Speaker 2: the number one reason I think that that that's turned

406
00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:57,919
Speaker 2: into now every adult has a Barbie memory, and you

407
00:23:57,960 --> 00:23:59,840
Speaker 2: want your children to have the experience you had. So

408
00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:01,399
Speaker 2: now it's like a rite of passage where it's like

409
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:03,400
Speaker 2: she's old enough for a barbie, let's get her a barbie.

410
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:07,040
Speaker 2: I mean, you give your kid the tool to imagine

411
00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 2: anything happening to them. Because originally, I mean the doll

412
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:13,440
Speaker 2: was invented when Ruth Handler would see her daughter using

413
00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:16,359
Speaker 2: paper dolls to play out like adult scenarios. She was like, well,

414
00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:20,400
Speaker 2: why doesn't this exist in the three dimensional The other

415
00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:23,800
Speaker 2: reason it's so popular is because, I hate to say it,

416
00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:26,200
Speaker 2: the good and bad press that comes out every five

417
00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:28,640
Speaker 2: or ten years. You know, this year we're gonna get

418
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:31,360
Speaker 2: obsessed with Barbie's body not being big enough, and this

419
00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:35,159
Speaker 2: year we're gonna barbiecore is gonna get big again. So

420
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:37,120
Speaker 2: it's going to go through runways for like a year.

421
00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:40,880
Speaker 2: Like every few years, it pops researches again in fashion,

422
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:43,880
Speaker 2: or there's a movie about it, or an SNL skit

423
00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:47,439
Speaker 2: or just it's such a common link. I mean, the

424
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:50,359
Speaker 2: average little girl in the United States owns eleven dolls.

425
00:24:50,359 --> 00:24:54,800
Speaker 2: Eleven Barbies. Wow, yeah, an average jealous So the numbers

426
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 2: like everybody has a Barbie story. And the flip side

427
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:01,520
Speaker 2: of that is, let's say every woman has a little

428
00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 2: bit of body stuff, right, things about their body they

429
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,119
Speaker 2: struggle with. If everyone owned a doll. I'm not saying

430
00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:10,720
Speaker 2: it's fair, but it becomes the common thread that I

431
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,840
Speaker 2: think becomes a scapegoat for a lot of conversations about

432
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,159
Speaker 2: the culture as a whole. I don't like my body,

433
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,000
Speaker 2: I don't either did you have a Barbie? Me too?

434
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:21,960
Speaker 2: It must like I think that's a little too reductive.

435
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:27,159
Speaker 2: Body things and stuff like that is more than just

436
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:31,160
Speaker 2: some toy you had. It's commercials, it's movies, it's you know, everything.

437
00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:36,240
Speaker 1: So that coverage girl has eleven dolls? How many dolls

438
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:37,320
Speaker 1: do you have?

439
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:41,040
Speaker 2: That's what I was gonna have. I'm about probably like

440
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:44,359
Speaker 2: six hundred little girls. Now more than that, like probably

441
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 2: six thousand little girls, which means not if but when I.

442
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:50,040
Speaker 3: You're every woman, Wait, is it six hundred or is

443
00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 3: it six thousand a half?

444
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:52,480
Speaker 1: No?

445
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:54,919
Speaker 2: I probably have. I mean, if we're being honest, I

446
00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:58,640
Speaker 2: probably have. We're talking the body, like how many plastic

447
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:00,600
Speaker 2: dolls do I have? Because then there's clothes, which is

448
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:06,000
Speaker 2: a whole other thing. Yeah, it's not even quantifiable. Oh wow,

449
00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:08,480
Speaker 2: So they're not They're not like in short or anything

450
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:11,199
Speaker 2: or like, is it like like a filing system. Are

451
00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:12,720
Speaker 2: they all in a safe yeah? Are they invent?

452
00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:13,040
Speaker 1: Are there?

453
00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:16,160
Speaker 2: Is there an archive in our inventory? Or they're kind

454
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:18,800
Speaker 2: of spread out? Like at the motel and the reception,

455
00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:22,000
Speaker 2: we have maybe three two or three dozen of my

456
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 2: my real vintage collection. So if you go in there,

457
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 2: some of those dolls are like they amn near on

458
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:29,119
Speaker 2: a thousand dollars, don't steal them. And then at my

459
00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:32,080
Speaker 2: condo where I keep at my like uh drag studio,

460
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,160
Speaker 2: that's where I have like most of my vintage ones.

461
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:37,000
Speaker 2: That's where I have I have a number one Barbie

462
00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 2: deep in the closet, buried because that's a very valuable piece.

463
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:45,720
Speaker 2: Mind sent signed by Ruth Handler. Two. So I have

464
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:48,200
Speaker 2: a lot, and I'm always looking. I mean, I've stopped,

465
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:50,199
Speaker 2: I've started narrowing. So now I'm in the middle of

466
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:52,159
Speaker 2: getting rid of my nineties because most of what I

467
00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:56,239
Speaker 2: collect is like sixties mad Barbie. So I'm getting rid

468
00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:58,200
Speaker 2: of a lot of my nineties Barbie right now because

469
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:00,680
Speaker 2: I just I need to thin the herd. All collectors

470
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:00,879
Speaker 2: do this.

471
00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:03,320
Speaker 1: It's like her Flop in the nineties.

472
00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:07,240
Speaker 2: No Barbie in the nineties, I believe is honestly the

473
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:13,680
Speaker 2: Golden era, because we're talking like tan, orange skin, blue eyeshadow,

474
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:17,000
Speaker 2: this big white hair, and every look is like ice skates,

475
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:21,679
Speaker 2: roller skates, ice cream glitter. It's nuts because for a

476
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:29,040
Speaker 2: good like mid two thousands to twenty fifteen, it was,

477
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,040
Speaker 2: in my opinion, the least interesting time Barbie was in

478
00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:34,760
Speaker 2: jeans and T shirts, you know, like.

479
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,000
Speaker 1: Ooh, normcore Barbie.

480
00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,280
Speaker 2: Kind of like, I mean, there's important things they do now,

481
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:42,119
Speaker 2: like career of the Year Barbie. It will be this

482
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:46,040
Speaker 2: year she's a robot technician. This year she's running for president,

483
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:46,840
Speaker 2: and like.

484
00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:47,879
Speaker 1: That year podcaster.

485
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 2: Maybe she's a podcaster. One year she was like a

486
00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:54,920
Speaker 2: music producer, so she had like a little keyboard in

487
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 2: a computer and headphones. But I of course like the

488
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,840
Speaker 2: heightened versions. So like when Barbie a few years ago

489
00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:04,920
Speaker 2: started doing the extra dolls, It's like, that's fierce when

490
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:08,520
Speaker 2: they're in like fur coats and pumps, and because Barbie

491
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:12,200
Speaker 2: used to be so aspirational and theatrical, and I feel

492
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,560
Speaker 2: that for a while it was getting really joggers and

493
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:20,360
Speaker 2: T shirt as a collector. It wasn't only the collector

494
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,160
Speaker 2: dolls were cool. But want I like a world where

495
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:25,400
Speaker 2: I can walk through Target and see dolls that I want,

496
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:28,080
Speaker 2: you know, I want those to be cool too. Yeah,

497
00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:30,720
Speaker 2: it's hard. I mean the dolls are made from plastic,

498
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:34,520
Speaker 2: and plastics made from oil and natural oils are all

499
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:36,600
Speaker 2: loose going up in price, and when you have like

500
00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:39,880
Speaker 2: I'm sure Walmart or whatever is like we'll buy this

501
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:41,840
Speaker 2: meny dolls from you, matel but they have to be

502
00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 2: under ten dollars to beat this price point. Then it

503
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 2: makes the toy company and the not the decorators, the designers,

504
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:51,000
Speaker 2: and the toy company like they're limited because they have

505
00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 2: to make a doll that's accessible. They can't spend all

506
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:58,000
Speaker 2: the money because then it's gonna be one hundred fifty dollars.

507
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:04,240
Speaker 2: Like I am fine with that, but yeah, you're like whatever.

508
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, but a little like Mary Sue shopping a target

509
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:10,320
Speaker 1: in you know, like Kansas City.

510
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, like it's have you ever been in like a

511
00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 2: CBS and they have like an eight dollar doll where

512
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:17,200
Speaker 2: she's just in this from suit. They still have to

513
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:21,120
Speaker 2: have an impulse purchase level doll. Yeah. For the kid

514
00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:22,840
Speaker 2: who's like nagging at the store, is like can I

515
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 2: just have one?

516
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:26,680
Speaker 1: Well, the ones that I got to get, Like when

517
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 1: I was a kid and like wasn't allowed to have dolls.

518
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:31,960
Speaker 1: It was like when I had a couple dollars and

519
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:34,720
Speaker 1: I was like didn't have supervision. That's when I was

520
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,400
Speaker 1: able to like buy the you know, Walgreens Aisle Barbie

521
00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:43,080
Speaker 1: and then hiding that I kept in my closet that

522
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,240
Speaker 1: my parents didn't know about and would play with them

523
00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:45,840
Speaker 1: in secret.

524
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 2: Right, Oh wow, that was that's your doll origin story?

525
00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 1: Was that is my doll origin story. It's like covered

526
00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:55,400
Speaker 1: in shame because of like you know, like the you

527
00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:58,040
Speaker 1: know whatever it was saying about like my gender, like

528
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:00,720
Speaker 1: my queerness or whatever. You know, it was very, very shameful.

529
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:03,040
Speaker 1: I knew that I was not allowed to have them

530
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 1: because I already did too many girly things, and you know,

531
00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:09,200
Speaker 1: like I think my mom kind of looked the other way,

532
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:11,960
Speaker 1: but I knew that it was wrong. And now I

533
00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:14,320
Speaker 1: look back on it and like, of course I wanted

534
00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:17,640
Speaker 1: to play with dolls. Hello, Like why is it? Why

535
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:18,520
Speaker 1: was it so shameful?

536
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:21,560
Speaker 2: But it really was, honestly, Well, it's not a two

537
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:23,480
Speaker 2: way street either, Like if your daughter wants to talk

538
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 2: a truck, no one cares, But if your someone wants

539
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:26,400
Speaker 2: a barbie, it's an issue.

540
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:27,960
Speaker 1: Yes, say that.

541
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:30,080
Speaker 3: I'm so glad earlier that you brought up the kind

542
00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 3: of like the boy girl toys and McDonald's, because that

543
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 3: was such like a moment in the culture, like like

544
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 3: and and the kind of fascism required for me to

545
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:41,240
Speaker 3: get a NASCAR toy as a child, like.

546
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:44,680
Speaker 2: I don't want that fucking Nascar toy, Like, how dare

547
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:46,120
Speaker 2: that was so rude?

548
00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:50,920
Speaker 3: I was like that it was it was violence, honestly almost.

549
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 2: There was something almost more aspirational for me too about

550
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:57,960
Speaker 2: like the McDonald's Happy Meal Barbies, because a lot of

551
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 2: times the hair was plastic and sculpted, so it was like,

552
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:04,760
Speaker 2: she's almost like a religious totem. She's like a little

553
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:07,280
Speaker 2: statue of the perfect woman. And I mean, as a kid,

554
00:31:07,360 --> 00:31:11,600
Speaker 2: I really was just worshiping the dolls. I mean before

555
00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:15,800
Speaker 2: I understood, before I understood that she was sort of

556
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:19,880
Speaker 2: at that point in the nineties, Barbie was almost doing drag.

557
00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:24,000
Speaker 2: She was parodying femininity on such a high level. I mean,

558
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:28,960
Speaker 2: miss Yvonne Barbie peg Bundy. There was this pocket of

559
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:33,160
Speaker 2: like women doing drag that was like I think probably

560
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 2: a response to women's movements like in the nineties, like

561
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 2: shaved heads and tape over the titties. And there was

562
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:43,400
Speaker 2: this beginning conversation about what we expected women and like

563
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:46,120
Speaker 2: me and me from Drew Carrey, it's like, when we

564
00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:48,880
Speaker 2: show what women are supposed to be like, and we

565
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 2: pushed that a little bit. We show how stupid it

566
00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:53,960
Speaker 2: is to expect women to do anything or be any

567
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:56,920
Speaker 2: type of way. You know, That's something I'm always wanting

568
00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 2: to explore with Tricksy, especially in the beginning, was like,

569
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,040
Speaker 2: if my waist is this big, and my titties are huge,

570
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:04,160
Speaker 2: and my hairs and all this is if you look

571
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,760
Speaker 2: at me and see a woman, I think that's actually

572
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:10,120
Speaker 2: very illuminating that, like I read, doesn't do I look

573
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:12,640
Speaker 2: like your mother or your sister? No, So like it's

574
00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:16,080
Speaker 2: interesting that you see women when I look fucking crazy.

575
00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:19,160
Speaker 1: I'm sure you look like someone's mother or sister.

576
00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:20,880
Speaker 2: And I will I will say, like when I got

577
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 2: out of Texas, They're like, your hair reminds me my mom.

578
00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 2: I'm like, can I see it? And I have to

579
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 2: say so, I actually watched her unboxing of your number one,

580
00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 2: of your number one Barbie, the original was it nineteen

581
00:32:56,920 --> 00:33:00,800
Speaker 2: sixty five Barbie just off the Fountain nineteen fifty nine?

582
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:01,160
Speaker 1: Thank you.

583
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:05,560
Speaker 3: I have to say that the original Barbie, her mug

584
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:10,240
Speaker 3: was pretty cunty, like she had like like thin brows

585
00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:12,640
Speaker 3: and a side eye, and she had like, you know,

586
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:14,960
Speaker 3: like thick eyeliner leg She.

587
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 1: Looked kind of her face is giving a little like she's.

588
00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:20,000
Speaker 2: Like you sure, and I'll say she's she's a little

589
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 2: severe looking for a child's toy, I will say. And

590
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:26,440
Speaker 2: that's part of why, you know, in nineteen fifty eight,

591
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 2: when the handlers were showing Barbie toys used to be

592
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:31,959
Speaker 2: purchased this way. There would be a toy convention at

593
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:35,720
Speaker 2: let's say the Radison San Diego, and all the toy

594
00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 2: store owners in the country would fly to town and they

595
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 2: would go hotel room to hotel room, and they would

596
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 2: get pitched new toys by little toy developers. And that's

597
00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 2: how toy stores would stock shelves. They would try to

598
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 2: predict what's going to be big or like, this isn't

599
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:52,480
Speaker 2: out yet. And Barbie was a brand new thing, and

600
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:55,000
Speaker 2: you have to imagine they thought this is gonna be

601
00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:58,400
Speaker 2: a major hit, and they barely did numbers. I mean,

602
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:02,840
Speaker 2: everybody was mortified and grossed out by this doll when

603
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 2: it was shown at the nineteen fifty eight toy fair.

604
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:09,000
Speaker 2: So then the first run of Barbie, which is that

605
00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:11,799
Speaker 2: number one with like the really cunty face and she

606
00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 2: looks not even nice, she looks severe. That run of

607
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:20,000
Speaker 2: those was under three hundred thousand pieces like maybe two

608
00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:25,440
Speaker 2: h and fifty because it was never Nobody thought it

609
00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:27,239
Speaker 2: was going to be a hit except the people making it.

610
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:30,280
Speaker 2: And if you don't know this too, this is crazy.

611
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:32,799
Speaker 2: Mattel was one of the first companies to realize you

612
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:36,160
Speaker 2: don't have to sell to the child. You have to

613
00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:38,920
Speaker 2: sell to the parent, because that's ultimately who buys the product.

614
00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:43,239
Speaker 2: So Mattel was the first company, basically one of the

615
00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 2: first companies to put commercials for toys during the children's

616
00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:52,719
Speaker 2: cartoon hours. Nobody had thought to do that. Like if

617
00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:54,640
Speaker 2: you sell it to the child, the child will sell

618
00:34:54,680 --> 00:34:57,120
Speaker 2: it to the parent. Basically that's how you get a

619
00:34:57,160 --> 00:35:01,920
Speaker 2: toy sold. And so that's part of those commercials is

620
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 2: like popping up during cartoon breaks. Is what made it

621
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:07,239
Speaker 2: go from like a toy at a convention that no

622
00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 2: one cared about to like basically Ferbie in the nineties,

623
00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:15,399
Speaker 2: like clamoring to a sensation. Yeah, and I mean only

624
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:17,200
Speaker 2: a few toys have broken through like that if you

625
00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 2: think of like easy Bake oven or there's only a

626
00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:25,880
Speaker 2: few toys that have had a complete whirlwind in Mattel.

627
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:30,239
Speaker 2: Mattel in the first three years went from nobody to

628
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:33,360
Speaker 2: the I think that the number one toy company in

629
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:36,680
Speaker 2: the world in like three years. But she was initially

630
00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:39,280
Speaker 2: a flop, which is kind of great, a total flop,

631
00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:42,279
Speaker 2: like less than a flop. People being like you're joking right,

632
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:46,160
Speaker 2: Like this all has nipples. This is disgusting. This, this

633
00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:50,760
Speaker 2: is just sickles. Maybe the og Ones had at least,

634
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:53,719
Speaker 2: like I think the original prototype had nipples and they

635
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:55,440
Speaker 2: removed them before they went to shelf.

636
00:35:55,719 --> 00:35:58,799
Speaker 1: Oh, I imagine they were hard nipples and not sort

637
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 1: of like a rubbery song like deep.

638
00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:05,439
Speaker 2: Brown and like this big around. Yeah, dinner plates.

639
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:08,480
Speaker 1: Put nipples back on barbies. I'll say.

640
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:11,600
Speaker 2: If you watch the documentary Tiny Shoulders on Hulu, it

641
00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:15,239
Speaker 2: opens with like a reenactment of that. I think it

642
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:19,000
Speaker 2: was Ryan who owns the patent on Barbie, who he

643
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:21,120
Speaker 2: did own the patent on Barbie. He basically picked up

644
00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:22,840
Speaker 2: the doll, took a nail file and shaved off the

645
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:24,799
Speaker 2: nipples and was like, no, it's perfect, and that's kind

646
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:26,319
Speaker 2: of like the lore of how they did it.

647
00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:29,040
Speaker 1: No, which they still are.

648
00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:30,920
Speaker 2: People are still hung up on nipples.

649
00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:34,480
Speaker 1: So oh yeah, I mean you get my nipples sanded off.

650
00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:36,160
Speaker 1: This weekend, I did not have a good time.

651
00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:40,000
Speaker 2: I know, now are all the girls just standing off

652
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:44,080
Speaker 2: their nipples? It's the culture there are.

653
00:36:44,120 --> 00:36:47,840
Speaker 3: I want to know, what which of the barbies do

654
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:50,640
Speaker 3: you know within your knowledge that were like controversial or

655
00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:54,719
Speaker 3: like recalled or like created hubbub I know, like one

656
00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:57,319
Speaker 3: of the things that I was thinking of was like

657
00:36:57,840 --> 00:36:59,760
Speaker 3: kind of I want to say, like in the aughts,

658
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:02,960
Speaker 3: there was a pregnant barbie that was recalled because she

659
00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:05,800
Speaker 3: didn't have a wedding ring. That was like a huge

660
00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:08,640
Speaker 3: thing and it was like I can't get pregnant out

661
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:10,760
Speaker 3: of wedlock or whatever, and they were all recalled.

662
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:14,000
Speaker 2: Are there any other like controversial barbie stories like that?

663
00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:17,439
Speaker 2: There's a lot, And I want to say, I don't

664
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:19,279
Speaker 2: work for Mattel, but I will descend them until the

665
00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:23,040
Speaker 2: day I die. This is a doll that's been out

666
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:24,880
Speaker 2: for seventy years. So if you're going to judge the

667
00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:27,160
Speaker 2: dolls of sixty years ago by the standards of today,

668
00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:30,880
Speaker 2: you're always disappointed. Okay, Like, but you know when they

669
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:33,560
Speaker 2: did slumber Party, there was a slumber party barbie that

670
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:35,880
Speaker 2: came with a scale and a diet book and the

671
00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:39,200
Speaker 2: inside or the back of it said donate that hasn't

672
00:37:39,239 --> 00:37:41,239
Speaker 2: aged well. I don't think it was an issue at

673
00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:44,080
Speaker 2: the time, but it was, you know, as not age

674
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:44,480
Speaker 2: at the time.

675
00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:45,880
Speaker 1: They were like, oh my god, thanks for reminding me

676
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,440
Speaker 1: not to eat well.

677
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:50,160
Speaker 2: I wear a lot of vintage clothes, and I mean

678
00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:53,280
Speaker 2: when I shot vintage, I'm like, we're women seventy pounds

679
00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:55,880
Speaker 2: and I'm like, I think they were like, clothes are

680
00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:58,880
Speaker 2: this big, nonstretched, fabrics waste.

681
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:01,760
Speaker 1: It's like when you go to like a medieval museum

682
00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:05,400
Speaker 1: and all the doors are like this tall, and you're like,

683
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:07,560
Speaker 1: totally people were extremely short.

684
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:12,000
Speaker 2: They were, and then you know, there's there's so many

685
00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:14,680
Speaker 2: I mean, there was a doll called teen Talk Barbie

686
00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:16,320
Speaker 2: where if you pushed a button on her back, she

687
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:19,080
Speaker 2: said phrases. It was in the eighties or the early nineties.

688
00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:21,239
Speaker 2: One of the phrases she said was math is hard,

689
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:24,120
Speaker 2: and that was controversial for a female toy to be said,

690
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:29,080
Speaker 2: like women can't do math, but yes, math is math

691
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:32,360
Speaker 2: famously hard. That's what I'm saying. I'm like the apologist,

692
00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:34,319
Speaker 2: So don't ever expect me to get mad, because I'm like,

693
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:37,959
Speaker 2: you know, there's things that are a little more transparently,

694
00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:41,680
Speaker 2: like an oversight like there was an Oreo Barbie, that

695
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:44,720
Speaker 2: there there was an Orio Barbie. She came as black

696
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:47,280
Speaker 2: or white, and like a black Barbie called Orio Barbie.

697
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:52,560
Speaker 2: I would you know, No, I'm sure they didn't love

698
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:56,520
Speaker 2: that that happened. And then earing Magic Ken, they said

699
00:38:56,520 --> 00:38:58,359
Speaker 2: he was gay. It depends if you want to say

700
00:38:58,360 --> 00:38:59,360
Speaker 2: that's controversy or not.

701
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:03,080
Speaker 3: He would so I own an earring Magic Ken and

702
00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:05,040
Speaker 3: he was I actually have it on my desk.

703
00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:08,239
Speaker 2: I was he looks. I mean, I don't think he's gay.

704
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:10,640
Speaker 2: I think he's a response to Vanilla Ice, who was

705
00:39:10,680 --> 00:39:13,439
Speaker 2: so big at the time. Well it looks like Ice,

706
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:16,120
Speaker 2: so well I okay, So the story that I read

707
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 2: online and I don't know if this is like I

708
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:19,880
Speaker 2: only read like, you know, one article about it.

709
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:22,759
Speaker 3: But like that they they were trying to like, you know,

710
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:25,200
Speaker 3: rebrand Ken. They didn't know if they should sell Ken

711
00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:27,360
Speaker 3: dolls anymore, if they should find a new doll that

712
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:30,400
Speaker 3: wasn't named Ken or whatever. And they surveyed teen girls

713
00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:33,200
Speaker 3: about what they wanted in a Ken doll, and then

714
00:39:33,320 --> 00:39:36,359
Speaker 3: and teen girls and like you know, young girls were like,

715
00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:38,560
Speaker 3: this is what I want, and they like you know,

716
00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:41,640
Speaker 3: gave a bunch of recommendations. Yes, they gave a bunch

717
00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:43,960
Speaker 3: of recommendations on the styling. And so for the virgins

718
00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:46,759
Speaker 3: who can't see, this is a this is a you

719
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:50,240
Speaker 3: know what do we got like platinum highlight kind of blowout?

720
00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:52,480
Speaker 2: We got a notch? Is that a notch? And as

721
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:55,600
Speaker 2: I wrote, now ear rings. But also like also, this

722
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:59,480
Speaker 2: is exactly how Vanila I is dressed exactly top.

723
00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:02,520
Speaker 1: And motemnr on his inner lip that says come pig.

724
00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:07,640
Speaker 1: He's holding a bottle of rush.

725
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:10,320
Speaker 3: This is but this is like a blue pleathar vest,

726
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:15,520
Speaker 3: a lavender messher and a literal cock ring around his neck,

727
00:40:15,680 --> 00:40:18,680
Speaker 3: Like what is going on like this? I'm not surprised

728
00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:22,279
Speaker 3: girls voted for this because like I mean tricksy and

729
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:24,520
Speaker 3: I'm sure you know this better than anyone that like,

730
00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:29,120
Speaker 3: the main market for drag and like lots of queer

731
00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:31,240
Speaker 3: culture is teenage girls.

732
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:35,840
Speaker 2: Oh, gay men don't even like me. I'm the audience

733
00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:40,720
Speaker 2: is thirteen year old sister girls cis gender women periods.

734
00:40:43,520 --> 00:40:47,360
Speaker 2: That's what's interesting with all this like discourse about drag

735
00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:50,600
Speaker 2: being appropriate for kids. I'm somebody who accidentally has the

736
00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:54,400
Speaker 2: maybe the youngest audience. But I have never said I

737
00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:57,240
Speaker 2: liked kids or pulled punches when it comes to saying

738
00:40:57,280 --> 00:40:58,560
Speaker 2: disgusting and horrible things.

739
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:01,680
Speaker 1: So I'm just talk about you how you don't like

740
00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:04,719
Speaker 1: children one hundred percent.

741
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:06,719
Speaker 2: And I mean when I get on stage, I talk

742
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:11,279
Speaker 2: about like rimming my dad. So I've never I've It's

743
00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:13,360
Speaker 2: not a bait and switch where I've pretended to be

744
00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:16,600
Speaker 2: kid friendly. Now I've always said I'm not kid friendly.

745
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:18,000
Speaker 2: But then they come to the show. So what am

746
00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:20,759
Speaker 2: I supposed to do? You know, I'm not going to

747
00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:23,399
Speaker 2: kick them out because when I was thirteen, I felt

748
00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:25,080
Speaker 2: like an adult and I wanted to watch adult shit.

749
00:41:25,239 --> 00:41:26,480
Speaker 2: So whatever.

750
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 1: There's also and they have disposable money for merch exactly.

751
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:32,640
Speaker 2: Hello, you know, hard just to eat gay guys to

752
00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:35,839
Speaker 2: do anything. Well, what if something better comes along? Like okay, fine,

753
00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:38,400
Speaker 2: don't come you know, But I mean, ask any working

754
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:40,640
Speaker 2: drive queen if they make more money at a brunch

755
00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 2: with a bunch of gay guys or a bunch of bachelorettes,

756
00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:44,960
Speaker 2: ask them who they make more money with, and they'll

757
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:49,520
Speaker 2: play the truth. You know. I recently DJed like I

758
00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:51,879
Speaker 2: recently picked up a little DJ gig in Australia, and

759
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:54,040
Speaker 2: sometimes I like to pick up DJ gigs under the

760
00:41:54,120 --> 00:41:56,680
Speaker 2: radar and not telling you when I'm going because I

761
00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:59,839
Speaker 2: just want to play for fun and not like have

762
00:41:59,880 --> 00:42:02,239
Speaker 2: to be tricksy in a way, you know. And I

763
00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:05,080
Speaker 2: picked up a DJ gig at the Steamworks in Perth

764
00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:11,000
Speaker 2: and I just went out of drag DJ at Steamworks

765
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:13,839
Speaker 2: Perth and a few people recognized me and said hi.

766
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:17,000
Speaker 2: But all in all, it was like so refreshing to

767
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:21,439
Speaker 2: be ignored by gay guys again and drag like, because

768
00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:23,799
Speaker 2: that was my experience for the first like ten years

769
00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:26,720
Speaker 2: in drag was just like gay guys barely paying attention

770
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:29,920
Speaker 2: to me. And now it's mostly not gay guys and

771
00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:32,279
Speaker 2: they're very much paying attention to me, which I love,

772
00:42:32,360 --> 00:42:34,800
Speaker 2: of course, But it was like it was a reality

773
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:37,279
Speaker 2: check to just play for gay guys ignoring me again.

774
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:39,720
Speaker 2: I was like, how this makes me appreciate the audience

775
00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:42,799
Speaker 2: I have because these guys at Steamworks could don't care

776
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:44,560
Speaker 2: if I'm dead or alive, and what songs I play

777
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:46,160
Speaker 2: do not matter, So.

778
00:42:46,680 --> 00:42:48,839
Speaker 1: I've never been as long as there's a rhythm for

779
00:42:48,880 --> 00:42:49,759
Speaker 1: them to you know.

780
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:52,080
Speaker 2: Oh, and I was playing all my nasty music that

781
00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:54,239
Speaker 2: really wouldn't fly at like a dance club. But I

782
00:42:54,280 --> 00:42:59,280
Speaker 2: was playing like you know, gross, like spoken wordy, nasty, nasty.

783
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:00,319
Speaker 1: Wait.

784
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:04,680
Speaker 2: I have never been to a Steamworks branch. Did they regularly?

785
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:07,200
Speaker 2: I didn't know they have DJ sets at Steamworks that's

786
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:10,560
Speaker 2: a thing. I've never been to one either until this one.

787
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:13,759
Speaker 2: And it was it was like it's like a it's

788
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:16,200
Speaker 2: a steam it's a sauna. What is a Steamworks for

789
00:43:16,200 --> 00:43:20,120
Speaker 2: the virgins? It's just like it's I mean, I'm not

790
00:43:20,200 --> 00:43:22,960
Speaker 2: the expert. This was my first time at one. It

791
00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:26,400
Speaker 2: seemed like a bathhouse. Basically, it's a little private rooms

792
00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:29,200
Speaker 2: with a spa and a steam shower and a gym,

793
00:43:29,360 --> 00:43:30,920
Speaker 2: and it had a little The one in Perth had

794
00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:34,680
Speaker 2: a little mini nightclub basically had a room with a

795
00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:37,440
Speaker 2: bar and a little dance floor and a DJ booth

796
00:43:37,480 --> 00:43:39,960
Speaker 2: and it was a nice DJ booth. It was it

797
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:43,240
Speaker 2: was like four CDJs, like really nice, brand new equipment.

798
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:46,600
Speaker 2: I was like, I was like, this is really nice.

799
00:43:46,640 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 2: And I was like I've played at other bars in

800
00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:51,319
Speaker 2: Perth and they don't have as nice of equipment as

801
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:53,120
Speaker 2: the DJ equipment at Steamers.

802
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 1: All right, like yeah, we're getting scrills in next week,

803
00:43:57,560 --> 00:43:57,920
Speaker 1: I know.

804
00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:00,640
Speaker 2: But it was just it's it's if you ever like

805
00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:02,800
Speaker 2: are out and you think it's me behind, if you

806
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:04,920
Speaker 2: see like a ball guy DJing, it probably is me.

807
00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:06,800
Speaker 2: And I just didn't advertise it because I just wanted

808
00:44:06,840 --> 00:44:10,279
Speaker 2: to just be invisible. But I love that. I mean,

809
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:11,640
Speaker 2: you you a legend.

810
00:44:11,719 --> 00:44:15,480
Speaker 3: Kind of like doing a incognito set at steam Marks

811
00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:17,480
Speaker 3: is kind of reminding me of like when Bette Midler

812
00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:19,680
Speaker 3: used to do when she was like the kind of

813
00:44:19,760 --> 00:44:21,880
Speaker 3: singer for bat gay bath houses in New York and

814
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:22,560
Speaker 3: stuff like that.

815
00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and I was like the only one there

816
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:27,200
Speaker 2: with clothes on. Yeah, it was like I had a

817
00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:29,560
Speaker 2: T shirt on, and I was like vastly overdressed. Like

818
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:32,840
Speaker 2: also's naked people were on the dance floor naked, just

819
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:35,279
Speaker 2: naked dancing, and I was like, all right, work, that's

820
00:44:35,320 --> 00:44:35,840
Speaker 2: so fun.

821
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:37,920
Speaker 1: I also was like I can't swing you.

822
00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:40,279
Speaker 2: I can't take pictures with any of you because right

823
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:42,920
Speaker 2: now in the States they literally google drag queens and

824
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:44,680
Speaker 2: pull a picture and it's usually mine and they put

825
00:44:44,719 --> 00:44:46,279
Speaker 2: on the news and call me a pedophile. So like,

826
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:49,400
Speaker 2: I can't take any pictures here. Like then again, at

827
00:44:49,440 --> 00:44:54,040
Speaker 2: a at a bar place like that, pictures are prohibited anyway, so, right, Rose,

828
00:44:54,080 --> 00:44:55,640
Speaker 2: have you ever been to a steamworks?

829
00:44:56,440 --> 00:44:59,040
Speaker 1: Not a steam works, but I've been to many bath

830
00:44:59,080 --> 00:45:00,560
Speaker 1: houses many, she's.

831
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:02,640
Speaker 2: Any bath house, water in the kitchen and get naked.

832
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:04,440
Speaker 2: I'm just I'm just imagine.

833
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:08,000
Speaker 3: I'm just imagining just like on a dance floor naked

834
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:10,920
Speaker 3: that I feel like logistically that could be dangerous.

835
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:13,239
Speaker 1: Well, I mean to be fair, when I've been at

836
00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:15,640
Speaker 1: a bath house, I certainly haven't been on the dance floor.

837
00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:17,520
Speaker 1: I've been doing the other things that you do at

838
00:45:17,520 --> 00:45:18,400
Speaker 1: a bath house, right.

839
00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:20,279
Speaker 2: Other things that you do at a bath house. Like

840
00:45:20,680 --> 00:45:24,080
Speaker 2: I like the idea that somebody has like a steamworks

841
00:45:24,080 --> 00:45:26,920
Speaker 2: membership and uses it, like it's the fucking why they

842
00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:28,800
Speaker 2: go there to actually use a treadmill and shower and

843
00:45:28,880 --> 00:45:29,480
Speaker 2: leave mm hmm.

844
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:31,839
Speaker 1: And they're just sort of like they're like they're like

845
00:45:31,880 --> 00:45:34,400
Speaker 1: on the elliptical and there's like someone getting railed in

846
00:45:34,440 --> 00:45:37,319
Speaker 1: the background, and they're just like listening to like our

847
00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:39,040
Speaker 1: podcast while they work out.

848
00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:44,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're listening to like NPR, Yeah fresh Air.

849
00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:49,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, that is kind of my my gym in Brooklyn

850
00:45:49,920 --> 00:45:51,640
Speaker 3: and on a gym that I will not name, like

851
00:45:51,760 --> 00:45:54,440
Speaker 3: I joined when it like in an in an earlier

852
00:45:54,480 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 3: stage when it's it's not as crowded as it it

853
00:45:56,520 --> 00:45:59,200
Speaker 3: wasn't as crowded as it is now. And like I

854
00:45:59,239 --> 00:46:00,640
Speaker 3: signed up and I was like, oh, this is a

855
00:46:00,680 --> 00:46:04,759
Speaker 3: family gym for like local Brooklyn people and like you know,

856
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:08,040
Speaker 3: their dads or whatever, and and you know, I've been there.

857
00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:09,200
Speaker 3: I've been there for a while now.

858
00:46:09,200 --> 00:46:10,839
Speaker 2: And like after like a month or two, I was like, Oh,

859
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:15,040
Speaker 2: everyone here is fucking Like everyone here is looking and

860
00:46:15,080 --> 00:46:17,839
Speaker 2: fucking and this is a gay gym. And the way

861
00:46:17,840 --> 00:46:21,360
Speaker 2: you're describing is kind of my gym because like the

862
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:24,960
Speaker 2: actual like cis hat like Brooklyn dads are just like

863
00:46:24,960 --> 00:46:27,080
Speaker 2: like you know, in the steam room, like don't mind me,

864
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:29,000
Speaker 2: I'm just getting my steam in. I know you guys

865
00:46:29,080 --> 00:46:30,759
Speaker 2: got to do your business, but like I'm just a

866
00:46:30,840 --> 00:46:34,000
Speaker 2: dad or whatever. It's I love the it's really as

867
00:46:34,040 --> 00:46:36,799
Speaker 2: a coexist moment. Well that was the other thing I

868
00:46:36,840 --> 00:46:39,319
Speaker 2: was DJing somewhere. We're to be honest, most people there

869
00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:43,680
Speaker 2: were trying to keep a low profile, and most like

870
00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:45,560
Speaker 2: straight guys and stuff, they don't know who I am,

871
00:46:45,640 --> 00:46:47,560
Speaker 2: and if they figure out, they're not gonna telling why.

872
00:46:47,360 --> 00:47:09,160
Speaker 1: Way, so right exactly secret safe with me. Tricksy I

873
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:12,799
Speaker 1: do really want to know, because you know, we are,

874
00:47:13,120 --> 00:47:15,239
Speaker 1: as we've said, like we're kind of in the year

875
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:18,280
Speaker 1: of Barbie right now, or like one of the year's Barbie,

876
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:21,520
Speaker 1: because Greta Garway's Barbie film is coming out this summer.

877
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:25,320
Speaker 1: What are you, like, are you excited? What do you

878
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:28,719
Speaker 1: want from it? Like, do you or do you have

879
00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:32,080
Speaker 1: any suspicions now that we've got a couple of trailers

880
00:47:32,120 --> 00:47:35,640
Speaker 1: out about what it could be about, like what's I

881
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:36,280
Speaker 1: haven't even.

882
00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:41,800
Speaker 2: Watched the trailer because it feels like I don't know.

883
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:46,600
Speaker 2: I want to go and blind. And I also, you

884
00:47:46,680 --> 00:47:51,279
Speaker 2: have to understand, anytime anything Barbie adjacent ever happens, my

885
00:47:51,360 --> 00:47:55,320
Speaker 2: phone blows up. And so I also am like already early,

886
00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:59,520
Speaker 2: like inundated about it, Like you're hearing about this movie

887
00:48:00,239 --> 00:48:03,239
Speaker 2: constantly for over a year. So it was like by

888
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:05,120
Speaker 2: the time the trailers out and everything's reacting to it.

889
00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:07,440
Speaker 2: I also, this is so crazy and this is my

890
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:11,239
Speaker 2: own damage. I also feel like, great, now everyone's a bandwagoner,

891
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:11,400
Speaker 2: do you.

892
00:48:11,400 --> 00:48:11,879
Speaker 1: Know what I mean?

893
00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:15,279
Speaker 2: I like it as somebody who can name the year

894
00:48:15,440 --> 00:48:17,480
Speaker 2: in the name of every outfit in that trailer, I'm

895
00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:19,480
Speaker 2: sure I'm like, oh, did you like it? Did you

896
00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:19,960
Speaker 2: like that movie?

897
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:22,120
Speaker 1: You're gonna be sitting theater like you're all a bunch

898
00:48:22,200 --> 00:48:24,040
Speaker 1: of fakes, Get out of here. Yeah.

899
00:48:24,360 --> 00:48:28,120
Speaker 2: But I also I love the Sims, for example, and

900
00:48:28,239 --> 00:48:30,680
Speaker 2: I hate when people who love the Sims do nothing

901
00:48:30,719 --> 00:48:33,080
Speaker 2: but shit on the Sims. The same way I hate

902
00:48:33,080 --> 00:48:36,560
Speaker 2: when people like I love drag Race, but there's too

903
00:48:36,680 --> 00:48:38,959
Speaker 2: much of it, there's too much. Like I hate people

904
00:48:39,120 --> 00:48:44,480
Speaker 2: complaining about the wealth of something they like, like as

905
00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:47,319
Speaker 2: if it's the Hunger Games and President Snow forces people

906
00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:49,239
Speaker 2: to watch drag Race, Like when people complain about too

907
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:51,799
Speaker 2: many drag Race, I'm like, don't watch it, Mary, who

908
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:52,640
Speaker 2: fucking cares.

909
00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:56,000
Speaker 3: I'm definitely forced to watch drag Race. So it's definitely

910
00:48:56,040 --> 00:48:59,480
Speaker 3: a state sanctioned like three to four hours drag race.

911
00:48:59,640 --> 00:49:01,439
Speaker 2: Yeah. And if in New York, if you don't watch

912
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:04,400
Speaker 2: drag Race, every franchise AOC gives you a parking ticket.

913
00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:05,000
Speaker 1: Yeah.

914
00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:07,760
Speaker 2: No, actually you get you get tax breaks for watching

915
00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:12,759
Speaker 2: drag races. But I actually, I have a very open mind,

916
00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:14,080
Speaker 2: and I'm sure I'm gonna go see it when it

917
00:49:14,120 --> 00:49:18,600
Speaker 2: comes out, but I have no expectations, and I go

918
00:49:18,800 --> 00:49:21,479
Speaker 2: into things wanting to like them. So I'm not a hater.

919
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:23,760
Speaker 1: I'm sure that Barbie can't imagine.

920
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:30,040
Speaker 2: Nobody's gonna hate this movie except the most hardcore, annoying

921
00:49:30,120 --> 00:49:32,600
Speaker 2: Barbie fans where they're like nothing was ever going to

922
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:37,120
Speaker 2: be good enough for them. I no matter what, I yeah,

923
00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:37,439
Speaker 2: I want.

924
00:49:37,800 --> 00:49:39,759
Speaker 3: I was going to ask you about the trailer. I

925
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:41,399
Speaker 3: would love to know your take on it. If there's

926
00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:43,319
Speaker 3: something that happens. I won't spoil it. But there's something

927
00:49:43,360 --> 00:49:44,960
Speaker 3: that happens in like the first five seconds of the

928
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:48,360
Speaker 3: trailer that is so gratifying, and it's like it's like

929
00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:50,920
Speaker 3: it's just like an Ahama.

930
00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:52,560
Speaker 2: Where you're like, oh, this is the movie I'm gonna get.

931
00:49:52,640 --> 00:49:54,800
Speaker 3: But I will say, you know, you were talking earlier

932
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:57,319
Speaker 3: about like Barbie of the nineties, the blown out hair,

933
00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:00,399
Speaker 3: like the golden era of Barbie. That definitely he does

934
00:50:00,560 --> 00:50:04,400
Speaker 3: feel like the Barbie they are channeling. Obviously, they're tapping

935
00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:06,960
Speaker 3: into a lot of different eras of barbiees and making

936
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:09,880
Speaker 3: specific references to barbiees throughout the years, but you can.

937
00:50:09,800 --> 00:50:12,440
Speaker 2: Tell it's like a nineties movie.

938
00:50:12,640 --> 00:50:16,719
Speaker 3: And I do feel like Ryan Gosling's Ken is very

939
00:50:17,120 --> 00:50:20,239
Speaker 3: earring Magic Ken, like I think it's it feels like

940
00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:20,880
Speaker 3: a reference.

941
00:50:22,200 --> 00:50:25,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I mean yeah, yeah, he looks gay. I

942
00:50:25,440 --> 00:50:28,920
Speaker 2: think that's intentional. It's also a business and I think

943
00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:31,239
Speaker 2: it says a lot about nineties Barbie that when you

944
00:50:31,640 --> 00:50:34,200
Speaker 2: draw car if you drew a cartoon of Barbie quick,

945
00:50:34,680 --> 00:50:36,920
Speaker 2: you would draw nineties Barbie. You wouldn't draw two thousands

946
00:50:36,960 --> 00:50:40,960
Speaker 2: of Barbie without draws. Yeah, you would draw this girl. Yeah,

947
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:43,360
Speaker 2: so now he has something to do with When I

948
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:46,160
Speaker 2: dub nineties Barbie like the golden age of Barbie, I'm

949
00:50:46,239 --> 00:50:50,040
Speaker 2: not being like it's my preference, and so it's true.

950
00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:54,200
Speaker 2: I think it. I think they actually etched her in permanently,

951
00:50:54,239 --> 00:50:56,239
Speaker 2: because the other Barbie you think of would maybe be

952
00:50:56,360 --> 00:50:59,680
Speaker 2: be simsuit Barbie from the fifties, Like that's the other

953
00:50:59,719 --> 00:51:02,160
Speaker 2: barbe you think of. But when I think of Barbie,

954
00:51:02,320 --> 00:51:04,400
Speaker 2: I mean I think of like I don't know, like

955
00:51:04,640 --> 00:51:10,600
Speaker 2: roller skates, cassette player, like gymnastics ninety shit, that's the

956
00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:12,920
Speaker 2: Barbie that I think of. I But like I said,

957
00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:15,960
Speaker 2: I have no expectations, and I think it's like I'm

958
00:51:16,040 --> 00:51:18,719
Speaker 2: just excited. I mean, I really, to my core, to

959
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:21,880
Speaker 2: my bones, love and respect Barbie and anything, any little nibble,

960
00:51:22,200 --> 00:51:25,040
Speaker 2: any little I'm happy for it. I love it.

961
00:51:25,160 --> 00:51:28,280
Speaker 1: But are you furious that Margot Robie was cast instead

962
00:51:28,280 --> 00:51:28,440
Speaker 1: of you?

963
00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:32,160
Speaker 2: I do think it's funny to it's interesting to think

964
00:51:32,160 --> 00:51:36,279
Speaker 2: that wasn't an originally Amy Schumer. I think that that was.

965
00:51:36,480 --> 00:51:38,359
Speaker 2: I think that that was in the works. Yeah, I'm

966
00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:39,120
Speaker 2: pretty sure I.

967
00:51:39,160 --> 00:51:39,960
Speaker 1: Think it was. Originally.

968
00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:41,600
Speaker 2: When I first heard about the movie, I heard that

969
00:51:41,640 --> 00:51:45,480
Speaker 2: Amy Schumer was playing Barbie like four years ago, and

970
00:51:45,560 --> 00:51:49,920
Speaker 2: then I'm I love I love Morgart Robbie. I'm sorry,

971
00:51:50,640 --> 00:51:56,120
Speaker 2: like Suicide Squad, she gives Okay, she's amazing Suicide Squad

972
00:51:56,120 --> 00:52:01,040
Speaker 2: movies and it Tanya Girl Girl Girl Once Part a Time.

973
00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:01,239
Speaker 1: Hal.

974
00:52:01,920 --> 00:52:03,880
Speaker 2: But you know, I'm just gonna say this too. I

975
00:52:03,920 --> 00:52:07,520
Speaker 2: don't like good movies. This year I watched like like

976
00:52:07,960 --> 00:52:10,320
Speaker 2: Tar the Whail Triangle of Sadness, Like that is not

977
00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:12,800
Speaker 2: for me, that type of movie. I watch it like

978
00:52:12,920 --> 00:52:17,040
Speaker 2: stank faced, like this sucks, and then like but but

979
00:52:17,160 --> 00:52:20,719
Speaker 2: I'm like, let's rewatch the original Super Marios movie, Like

980
00:52:21,120 --> 00:52:23,360
Speaker 2: that's my level of movie that I love. And so

981
00:52:23,600 --> 00:52:25,200
Speaker 2: I know I'm gonna like this was it.

982
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:28,520
Speaker 1: Like me, You're like me, I prefer I draw this division.

983
00:52:28,840 --> 00:52:32,320
Speaker 1: I like movies not films, and I think that's a

984
00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:36,799
Speaker 1: very clear difference between the two. I like the populist entertainment,

985
00:52:37,200 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 1: and I definitely think I do think because of who's involved,

986
00:52:41,120 --> 00:52:45,640
Speaker 1: Barbie is going to straddle the two like it's going

987
00:52:45,760 --> 00:52:47,920
Speaker 1: to be because of the Barbie of it all, it's

988
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:51,359
Speaker 1: going to be accessible. But I also think because it's

989
00:52:51,520 --> 00:52:56,000
Speaker 1: Greta Gerwig, that there's going to be something intelligent there

990
00:52:56,440 --> 00:52:56,680
Speaker 1: by the.

991
00:52:56,680 --> 00:52:59,680
Speaker 2: Way, the way that I thought Greta Greta Gerwig was

992
00:52:59,680 --> 00:53:02,520
Speaker 2: Greta Thumberg, and I was like, oh is it not.

993
00:53:03,800 --> 00:53:07,960
Speaker 2: I just was like that climate girl. I was like, yeah,

994
00:53:09,040 --> 00:53:12,840
Speaker 2: Like I'm not like a smart film person like David

995
00:53:12,960 --> 00:53:16,320
Speaker 2: is like the Ring of the Letter bled. No, I

996
00:53:16,520 --> 00:53:18,360
Speaker 2: just watch what I watched. I re watched The Office

997
00:53:18,400 --> 00:53:19,080
Speaker 2: over and over again.

998
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:23,640
Speaker 3: Marco Robbie is really good at being unhinged, and you

999
00:53:23,719 --> 00:53:26,880
Speaker 3: can tell that this is going to be a slightly

1000
00:53:27,040 --> 00:53:30,320
Speaker 3: unhinged Barbie like without you know, leaning to into it.

1001
00:53:30,480 --> 00:53:33,280
Speaker 3: Like they're definitely making it a weird movie.

1002
00:53:33,840 --> 00:53:36,279
Speaker 2: And we had a hard enough on the.

1003
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:38,560
Speaker 3: Pod and she talked a little bit about it and like,

1004
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:42,040
Speaker 3: I don't think I realized, like how fucking stacked this

1005
00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:44,920
Speaker 3: cast is like do a lipa in this movie like

1006
00:53:45,000 --> 00:53:46,759
Speaker 3: so many people where I was like, oh, you're in

1007
00:53:46,880 --> 00:53:50,880
Speaker 3: this movie, like and so now it's like Sarah Yes, but.

1008
00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:55,239
Speaker 2: It's also it's also like The Ocean's eleven Yes, where

1009
00:53:55,239 --> 00:53:57,319
Speaker 2: it's like it's the Knives out of it All, where

1010
00:53:57,320 --> 00:54:02,560
Speaker 2: you're like, we need to get seventy five as actors. Now.

1011
00:54:03,200 --> 00:54:05,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, the only way you can have a hit these days.

1012
00:54:05,640 --> 00:54:10,720
Speaker 2: It needs to be all unknowns or all like literally

1013
00:54:10,760 --> 00:54:11,920
Speaker 2: Barack Obama has to be in.

1014
00:54:11,960 --> 00:54:17,279
Speaker 1: It all stars, all winners. Yes, totally, but you.

1015
00:54:17,320 --> 00:54:19,160
Speaker 2: Know, honestly, and this is a little bit of a throwback.

1016
00:54:19,320 --> 00:54:22,319
Speaker 2: The best Barbie we've ever seen in film, hands down

1017
00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:24,880
Speaker 2: and TV because you know, we've seen Barbie Perry in

1018
00:54:24,920 --> 00:54:28,040
Speaker 2: our SNL. Although I love those Epsenel skits where they

1019
00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:31,600
Speaker 2: have like the Barbie Instagram account. Have you seen those?

1020
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:35,480
Speaker 2: Those skits are amazing. The best Barbie we've ever seen

1021
00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:38,000
Speaker 2: in cinema or media or whatever is Barbie from Toy

1022
00:54:38,080 --> 00:54:41,200
Speaker 2: Story two when they go through the toy aisle and

1023
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:44,520
Speaker 2: there's tour guide Barbie. I mean that whole scene. But

1024
00:54:44,600 --> 00:54:46,640
Speaker 2: you know, because we get Barbie in the form of

1025
00:54:46,719 --> 00:54:51,000
Speaker 2: Gwendy and small soldiers, we get Barbie, like we get

1026
00:54:51,200 --> 00:54:53,800
Speaker 2: a Barbie without saying Barbie in a lot of types

1027
00:54:53,840 --> 00:54:58,840
Speaker 2: of media, and in Toy Story, we actually got branded Barbie,

1028
00:54:58,960 --> 00:55:02,759
Speaker 2: which made it so fun and they wrote her so funny. Yeah,

1029
00:55:03,000 --> 00:55:05,719
Speaker 2: that was like formative, like that whole scene as a

1030
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:08,759
Speaker 2: kid watching where they like go down the Barbie aisle.

1031
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:13,960
Speaker 2: I was like, Wow, there's like these moments where like

1032
00:55:14,080 --> 00:55:18,040
Speaker 2: my creativity or like my vision jumps leaps.

1033
00:55:18,560 --> 00:55:19,440
Speaker 1: That was one of them.

1034
00:55:19,920 --> 00:55:21,360
Speaker 2: I would say. One of the other ones was the

1035
00:55:21,560 --> 00:55:24,160
Speaker 2: Jeremy Scott like think pink Barbie collection. When I saw

1036
00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:27,759
Speaker 2: that runway, my mind, like, I think my head exploded.

1037
00:55:27,840 --> 00:55:30,640
Speaker 2: I think my fontanelles gave out and my brain shot

1038
00:55:30,719 --> 00:55:32,960
Speaker 2: out of the back of my head because I just

1039
00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:34,920
Speaker 2: had never I mean, I guess I love heather At

1040
00:55:34,960 --> 00:55:37,080
Speaker 2: and it reminded me of Heather Ret, but I had

1041
00:55:37,160 --> 00:55:41,920
Speaker 2: never love love. I mean, early heather At is very

1042
00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:44,759
Speaker 2: very barbiecore Barbie Court.

1043
00:55:44,840 --> 00:55:51,040
Speaker 1: Heatherat is a fashion brand that used to exist and

1044
00:55:51,520 --> 00:55:53,279
Speaker 1: I went to one of their shows like when I

1045
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:56,560
Speaker 1: first moved to New York, and it was like a gag.

1046
00:55:57,040 --> 00:55:59,719
Speaker 3: I yeah, I have no ing, I've never heard of them,

1047
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:04,040
Speaker 3: but I'm curious just as a collector. Like something that

1048
00:56:04,120 --> 00:56:06,640
Speaker 3: I was really shook by when I was like, you

1049
00:56:06,719 --> 00:56:09,279
Speaker 3: know when I watch your unboxing video, was that you

1050
00:56:09,560 --> 00:56:12,879
Speaker 3: you actually unbox these Barbies? Do you like take all

1051
00:56:12,960 --> 00:56:15,719
Speaker 3: of your dolls like out of boxes and like unfasten

1052
00:56:15,800 --> 00:56:17,560
Speaker 3: them or like I thought it was like a collector's

1053
00:56:17,600 --> 00:56:20,080
Speaker 3: thing to like not unboxed toys. It's like a very

1054
00:56:20,200 --> 00:56:22,040
Speaker 3: like I don't know anything about collector world.

1055
00:56:22,040 --> 00:56:25,239
Speaker 2: It's like what how do you decide like whether to

1056
00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:28,520
Speaker 2: unpackage or unpackage, like what to undo and not undo

1057
00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:32,480
Speaker 2: what you preserve? Well, nineteen fifty nine Barbie, it's not

1058
00:56:32,600 --> 00:56:36,560
Speaker 2: like she came shrink crapped. Yeah, like toys, toys back then,

1059
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:39,000
Speaker 2: we're just you could just open the lid of it,

1060
00:56:39,360 --> 00:56:40,960
Speaker 2: you know, like it's in the box. It's just a

1061
00:56:41,040 --> 00:56:46,040
Speaker 2: box sell of my toys. Like I have a Francy.

1062
00:56:46,239 --> 00:56:49,400
Speaker 2: I have a mod black Francy. And you know, black

1063
00:56:49,520 --> 00:56:51,800
Speaker 2: dolls when they started making them were always harder to

1064
00:56:51,840 --> 00:56:54,160
Speaker 2: come by, and they were made in a lot smaller numbers,

1065
00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:59,200
Speaker 2: so a lot of times the black doll is worth more.

1066
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:02,040
Speaker 2: I have like a black Fancy and she's wrapped in

1067
00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:04,840
Speaker 2: plastic like some of them if they come in the

1068
00:57:04,960 --> 00:57:08,520
Speaker 2: store plastic. Some of them have I have really old

1069
00:57:08,640 --> 00:57:10,480
Speaker 2: cool ones that have like the price tag from the

1070
00:57:10,560 --> 00:57:13,880
Speaker 2: store on it on the plastic in the box, my

1071
00:57:14,000 --> 00:57:16,200
Speaker 2: nineteen fifty nine, Like it was clear it had been

1072
00:57:16,240 --> 00:57:19,200
Speaker 2: open and handled before, so it wasn't like the steaks

1073
00:57:19,320 --> 00:57:22,960
Speaker 2: were me peeling back plastic, you know. But if I

1074
00:57:23,160 --> 00:57:25,200
Speaker 2: like something now, I'll just get two so that I

1075
00:57:25,320 --> 00:57:27,360
Speaker 2: have one in the closet in one I can fuck

1076
00:57:27,400 --> 00:57:27,800
Speaker 2: around with.

1077
00:57:28,040 --> 00:57:31,160
Speaker 1: Oh that's smart. I've been thinking about this recently because

1078
00:57:31,160 --> 00:57:34,800
Speaker 1: I'm sort of like in my collectible era. I'm like

1079
00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:38,600
Speaker 1: going back and finding toys from when I was a

1080
00:57:38,720 --> 00:57:41,120
Speaker 1: kid that I didn't get to have and buying them now.

1081
00:57:41,920 --> 00:57:43,800
Speaker 1: And I did recently buy And I know you'll appreciate

1082
00:57:43,840 --> 00:57:46,280
Speaker 1: this tricksy because I know that you like Buffy. I

1083
00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:49,920
Speaker 1: bought a Willow action figure recently and it's of her.

1084
00:57:50,200 --> 00:57:53,640
Speaker 1: It's Vampire Willow, and I have it in the box.

1085
00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:55,920
Speaker 1: I have it taken it out, and I do want

1086
00:57:55,960 --> 00:57:57,320
Speaker 1: to play with it, but there's a part of me

1087
00:57:57,400 --> 00:58:01,240
Speaker 1: that wants it to stay pristine in the box. And

1088
00:58:02,640 --> 00:58:04,400
Speaker 1: I mean, I have told this story on the pod before,

1089
00:58:04,480 --> 00:58:06,360
Speaker 1: but when I used to get toys as gifts when

1090
00:58:06,360 --> 00:58:07,040
Speaker 1: I was a kid.

1091
00:58:07,360 --> 00:58:09,520
Speaker 2: I would tape them back up into the box to

1092
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:13,600
Speaker 2: like preserve that. It was like really psycho behavior. No,

1093
00:58:13,800 --> 00:58:17,400
Speaker 2: I think, I honestly think that the packaging, to me,

1094
00:58:17,560 --> 00:58:20,160
Speaker 2: is part of the collectible. It's not a shell. I

1095
00:58:20,200 --> 00:58:24,160
Speaker 2: think it's part of it. I think it being packaged

1096
00:58:24,280 --> 00:58:26,160
Speaker 2: is part of and the way it's packaged is also

1097
00:58:26,240 --> 00:58:28,160
Speaker 2: part of the time capsule of it. This is how

1098
00:58:28,240 --> 00:58:31,680
Speaker 2: things were packaged at this time, and with Barbie especially,

1099
00:58:32,360 --> 00:58:35,600
Speaker 2: every aspect of it is a time capsule. This is

1100
00:58:35,640 --> 00:58:38,600
Speaker 2: what women wore. Oh, Barbie was a flight attendant. That's

1101
00:58:38,640 --> 00:58:40,160
Speaker 2: because at this time women that was one of the

1102
00:58:40,240 --> 00:58:43,080
Speaker 2: first jobs that women were doing. Like, every part of

1103
00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:45,440
Speaker 2: it is a time capsule, and so the packaging is

1104
00:58:45,480 --> 00:58:48,560
Speaker 2: part of that, the fonts, the colors, the wording. So

1105
00:58:48,880 --> 00:58:50,480
Speaker 2: most of the time I don't want to open it.

1106
00:58:51,120 --> 00:58:55,760
Speaker 2: But because I collect mostly like sixty two to let's say,

1107
00:58:55,800 --> 00:59:00,160
Speaker 2: like seventy one, because I collect that era, a lot

1108
00:59:00,200 --> 00:59:03,160
Speaker 2: of what I have is not boxed, and if I

1109
00:59:03,240 --> 00:59:05,480
Speaker 2: have it boxed, it's worth way more and I have

1110
00:59:05,640 --> 00:59:08,160
Speaker 2: to like care for it like in a safety deposit box.

1111
00:59:08,920 --> 00:59:10,840
Speaker 2: Like I have my number I have my number one

1112
00:59:11,040 --> 00:59:14,760
Speaker 2: on display here, but it's not my number one. It's

1113
00:59:14,840 --> 00:59:17,280
Speaker 2: a reproduction of a number one because I want people

1114
00:59:17,320 --> 00:59:19,160
Speaker 2: to ask about it and I want to say, yes,

1115
00:59:19,200 --> 00:59:20,840
Speaker 2: I really have it, but this isn't it because I

1116
00:59:20,840 --> 00:59:21,760
Speaker 2: don't trust you in my home.

1117
00:59:21,840 --> 00:59:25,920
Speaker 1: It's a conversation piece. Yeah, when you die, do you

1118
00:59:26,280 --> 00:59:29,600
Speaker 1: want to be put into a sort of life size

1119
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:35,880
Speaker 1: Barbie box and wrapped in plastic? We can, because it happen, but.

1120
00:59:35,960 --> 00:59:38,000
Speaker 2: That's kind of giving Dori and Corey. Don't you think

1121
00:59:38,920 --> 00:59:40,200
Speaker 2: wrapping a body in plastic?

1122
00:59:40,680 --> 00:59:43,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, maybe glass?

1123
00:59:44,280 --> 00:59:48,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe I will. Oh my god, this is horrible,

1124
00:59:48,320 --> 00:59:49,200
Speaker 2: but uh.

1125
00:59:50,600 --> 00:59:50,880
Speaker 1: Maybe.

1126
00:59:51,200 --> 00:59:52,800
Speaker 2: I don't know how I want to die. I probably

1127
00:59:52,880 --> 00:59:56,200
Speaker 2: want a pink coffin though, for sure, or a pink eurn,

1128
00:59:56,440 --> 00:59:59,280
Speaker 2: like I want. Pink means a lot to me, and

1129
01:00:00,200 --> 01:00:02,840
Speaker 2: it's my you know, it's sort of my my trauma

1130
01:00:02,920 --> 01:00:05,800
Speaker 2: bond with that color is so extreme and like it

1131
01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:09,120
Speaker 2: means so much to me that you know, everything being

1132
01:00:09,160 --> 01:00:11,040
Speaker 2: pink makes me. I mean just the color pink makes

1133
01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:13,560
Speaker 2: me happy. I mean that's like corny and most people

1134
01:00:13,840 --> 01:00:15,919
Speaker 2: when they're like the pink Lady of Hollywood or whatever,

1135
01:00:16,080 --> 01:00:18,919
Speaker 2: it's like a sign of like, ooh, that person's wild

1136
01:00:19,120 --> 01:00:22,000
Speaker 2: when they're like, I'm all pink every day, but I

1137
01:00:22,160 --> 01:00:25,400
Speaker 2: love pink, and so I don't know. But then again,

1138
01:00:25,440 --> 01:00:28,080
Speaker 2: one time I saw it was like the show Obsessed

1139
01:00:28,320 --> 01:00:30,680
Speaker 2: or with this woman. If you guys ever seen that

1140
01:00:30,720 --> 01:00:32,480
Speaker 2: episode of that, that woman her husband died and she

1141
01:00:32,600 --> 01:00:35,200
Speaker 2: would lick her finger and fund dip his ashes, and

1142
01:00:35,240 --> 01:00:38,600
Speaker 2: she was addicted to eating his ashes. So if David

1143
01:00:38,640 --> 01:00:40,360
Speaker 2: doesn't do that, if David doesn't do that for me,

1144
01:00:40,440 --> 01:00:44,160
Speaker 2: he doesn't love me. And they were like, well, what

1145
01:00:44,200 --> 01:00:46,080
Speaker 2: happens when you run onto the ashes? And she was like,

1146
01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:47,000
Speaker 2: I don't know what I'm gonna do.

1147
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:50,120
Speaker 1: Is I'm going to do that to you when I

1148
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:50,480
Speaker 1: kill you?

1149
01:00:50,840 --> 01:00:52,960
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, oh thank you, that's so sweet.

1150
01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:54,680
Speaker 1: But I'll also snort your ashes.

1151
01:00:55,120 --> 01:00:57,120
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean you'll get a I don't even

1152
01:00:57,160 --> 01:00:58,200
Speaker 2: know how that would make you feel.

1153
01:00:58,320 --> 01:01:01,200
Speaker 1: Probably it will be in the hines on Fire Island

1154
01:01:01,280 --> 01:01:03,560
Speaker 1: and I'll be like, this one's for Fran. Actually, this

1155
01:01:03,640 --> 01:01:04,640
Speaker 1: one is Fran.

1156
01:01:05,840 --> 01:01:07,560
Speaker 2: Am I am I an upper or a downer?

1157
01:01:07,680 --> 01:01:10,920
Speaker 1: What do you think? I think you start as an

1158
01:01:11,000 --> 01:01:12,960
Speaker 1: upper and then we go down?

1159
01:01:13,160 --> 01:01:15,280
Speaker 2: Okay, love, Yeah, that's a that's a good. That's a

1160
01:01:15,320 --> 01:01:15,960
Speaker 2: good little arc.

1161
01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:18,040
Speaker 1: I wow.

1162
01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:21,000
Speaker 2: I mean maybe I'll be in my doll collecting era too. Now, Rose,

1163
01:01:21,080 --> 01:01:22,760
Speaker 2: now that you're doing you should, I mean, if I could.

1164
01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:24,880
Speaker 2: If you guys are really anybody who's listening wants to

1165
01:01:24,920 --> 01:01:27,600
Speaker 2: really nerd out. There's this book called Forever Barbie by

1166
01:01:27,800 --> 01:01:33,720
Speaker 2: MG Lords, and it's basically her like deep dive into

1167
01:01:34,160 --> 01:01:38,640
Speaker 2: the cultural, societal whatever significance is of Barbie, and she

1168
01:01:38,920 --> 01:01:44,960
Speaker 2: really elegantly illustrates the extreme butterfly effect that that toy

1169
01:01:45,080 --> 01:01:49,680
Speaker 2: had on the world, because in some ways Barbie influences

1170
01:01:49,920 --> 01:01:53,360
Speaker 2: the world, but in many ways, Barbie is just reflecting

1171
01:01:53,440 --> 01:01:57,000
Speaker 2: what's going on. So like in the sixties when like

1172
01:01:57,200 --> 01:01:59,520
Speaker 2: or like in the early seventies, when like Brady Bunch happened,

1173
01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:02,400
Speaker 2: suddenly Malibu Barbie happened and she happened to look a

1174
01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:05,520
Speaker 2: lot like jan or Marsha Brady, and then like you know,

1175
01:02:05,640 --> 01:02:08,840
Speaker 2: there's just there's ways where you can track when Barbie

1176
01:02:08,920 --> 01:02:11,760
Speaker 2: is mirroring what's popular in the world. And then because

1177
01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:14,720
Speaker 2: Bardie's around so long, you can track ways that Barbie

1178
01:02:14,880 --> 01:02:18,160
Speaker 2: itself because in nineteen fifty nine, what was Barbie style.

1179
01:02:18,400 --> 01:02:21,560
Speaker 2: Barbie style was reflecting the fashion of teenagers of the time,

1180
01:02:22,360 --> 01:02:26,320
Speaker 2: and now Barbie style is its own style, yeah, which

1181
01:02:26,320 --> 01:02:29,200
Speaker 2: I think is really interesting. Yeah. I mean that's as

1182
01:02:29,280 --> 01:02:29,760
Speaker 2: we've noted.

1183
01:02:29,800 --> 01:02:31,680
Speaker 3: That's like why you know, the barbiees of the of

1184
01:02:31,760 --> 01:02:34,920
Speaker 3: the aughts were wearing north faces and ugs as as

1185
01:02:34,960 --> 01:02:37,160
Speaker 3: they should be Tom's shoes.

1186
01:02:36,880 --> 01:02:39,560
Speaker 1: You know, not Tom shoes.

1187
01:02:40,000 --> 01:02:41,800
Speaker 2: Yeah. Next, like I bet you next year Barbie's are

1188
01:02:41,800 --> 01:02:43,800
Speaker 2: going to have those dumb puffy red boots that are

1189
01:02:43,960 --> 01:02:44,640
Speaker 2: going to be big. Now.

1190
01:02:44,880 --> 01:02:46,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess the thing that maybe the thing to

1191
01:02:46,800 --> 01:02:49,400
Speaker 3: end on is like I'm thinking about, like what's the

1192
01:02:49,560 --> 01:02:52,200
Speaker 3: what's the Barbie of the twenty twenties, Like, like what

1193
01:02:52,400 --> 01:02:54,200
Speaker 3: is cool? I know that you know, she is her

1194
01:02:54,240 --> 01:02:57,440
Speaker 3: own style obviously, but like hypothetically, like I don't even

1195
01:02:57,480 --> 01:02:58,680
Speaker 3: know what twenty twenties culture.

1196
01:02:58,760 --> 01:03:01,080
Speaker 1: It's kind of like twenty twenty five Barbie. Okay, here's

1197
01:03:01,080 --> 01:03:03,479
Speaker 1: what here's what is it? What he's wearing. She's wearing

1198
01:03:03,480 --> 01:03:08,320
Speaker 1: a pair of Margiala tabbies. She's got a bottle of Estradle,

1199
01:03:09,920 --> 01:03:12,760
Speaker 1: and she's got she's got a microphone set to do

1200
01:03:12,840 --> 01:03:13,520
Speaker 1: her podcast.

1201
01:03:13,760 --> 01:03:16,520
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and but she DJs on the weekends for sure,

1202
01:03:16,920 --> 01:03:18,800
Speaker 2: totally and by DJing, I mean, she just has a

1203
01:03:18,840 --> 01:03:21,840
Speaker 2: MacBook and she literally is on Spotify. Yeah, yeah, she's

1204
01:03:21,880 --> 01:03:25,000
Speaker 2: on Spotify. Yeah, And I think I think they can

1205
01:03:25,080 --> 01:03:28,160
Speaker 2: of the twenty twenty threes. It's like, you know, Trimex,

1206
01:03:28,680 --> 01:03:34,600
Speaker 2: it's ozempic, it's it's injectable. Tanner, it's a unit, it's

1207
01:03:34,600 --> 01:03:35,240
Speaker 2: a mile unit.

1208
01:03:35,600 --> 01:03:37,040
Speaker 1: Yes, he's on a.

1209
01:03:37,040 --> 01:03:40,960
Speaker 2: Turkey for the hairlines. Your size too, yeah yeah yeah.

1210
01:03:41,520 --> 01:03:44,200
Speaker 2: But but I mean, if we're ending all jokes aside,

1211
01:03:44,320 --> 01:03:46,960
Speaker 2: like when you really sit and think of like the

1212
01:03:47,200 --> 01:03:50,480
Speaker 2: massive impact. We always talk about the impact Barbie has,

1213
01:03:50,520 --> 01:03:53,560
Speaker 2: but when you really think about the massive positive impact,

1214
01:03:54,280 --> 01:03:57,760
Speaker 2: I mean, this toy opened up a possibility for women

1215
01:03:57,840 --> 01:03:59,760
Speaker 2: to imagine their life to be anything at a time

1216
01:03:59,800 --> 01:04:02,320
Speaker 2: where they were only encouraged to imagine to be moms.

1217
01:04:02,560 --> 01:04:06,000
Speaker 2: I mean, it really is incredible, and I'm excited.

1218
01:04:05,680 --> 01:04:06,080
Speaker 1: For the movie.

1219
01:04:06,160 --> 01:04:07,960
Speaker 2: To be honest, the Doll of twenty twenty three is

1220
01:04:08,040 --> 01:04:11,240
Speaker 2: going to probably be whatever most popular look for the movie.

1221
01:04:11,320 --> 01:04:12,880
Speaker 2: That's what's because you know that Mattel is going to

1222
01:04:12,920 --> 01:04:14,439
Speaker 2: make outfits of all of those for sale.

1223
01:04:14,560 --> 01:04:15,320
Speaker 1: Yes, damn.

1224
01:04:15,440 --> 01:04:18,840
Speaker 2: Like yeah, I feel like now people for the next

1225
01:04:19,080 --> 01:04:21,920
Speaker 2: year and or two, Like, just as you said, barbiecore

1226
01:04:22,000 --> 01:04:23,280
Speaker 2: is going to be back again, and we're all going

1227
01:04:23,360 --> 01:04:26,640
Speaker 2: to be dressing like Barbie's and you know, Bigbocre has

1228
01:04:26,720 --> 01:04:28,320
Speaker 2: been back for a while. You know, I think of

1229
01:04:28,440 --> 01:04:31,040
Speaker 2: like faggots with white walls and gold fixtures and plants

1230
01:04:31,080 --> 01:04:35,360
Speaker 2: in their houses, like that is so like needs to

1231
01:04:35,440 --> 01:04:40,560
Speaker 2: be retired. That like geriatric millennial approach to like living

1232
01:04:40,760 --> 01:04:45,240
Speaker 2: is so tired, no whispers, Yes, it's so tired. And

1233
01:04:45,400 --> 01:04:47,960
Speaker 2: so I think Barbiecore is a reflection of I mean,

1234
01:04:47,960 --> 01:04:51,440
Speaker 2: we experienced this at the Trixy Motel. Maximalism is swinging

1235
01:04:51,560 --> 01:04:56,080
Speaker 2: back so hard and what's more like fabricated and fun

1236
01:04:56,160 --> 01:04:59,000
Speaker 2: and bouncy and synthetic feeling than like Barbiecore. I mean.

1237
01:05:00,240 --> 01:05:02,280
Speaker 2: And what's funny is it's gonna surge and it's gonna

1238
01:05:02,280 --> 01:05:04,600
Speaker 2: go away, but not for that long. I meane, Barbiecore.

1239
01:05:05,480 --> 01:05:07,200
Speaker 2: Now it's gonna be all these cool articles about it,

1240
01:05:07,280 --> 01:05:08,800
Speaker 2: but it's always around.

1241
01:05:08,920 --> 01:05:10,880
Speaker 1: It's around, She'll really about.

1242
01:05:11,760 --> 01:05:14,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, all pink is the same as all blacks. Some

1243
01:05:14,800 --> 01:05:15,320
Speaker 2: people were all.

1244
01:05:15,280 --> 01:05:17,680
Speaker 1: Black, some people were all think that's the binary. Those

1245
01:05:17,680 --> 01:05:26,840
Speaker 1: are the two genders. Slide into our dms and let

1246
01:05:26,920 --> 01:05:29,840
Speaker 1: us know, are you a Barbie girl? Are you just ken?

1247
01:05:30,880 --> 01:05:32,480
Speaker 1: Did you play with dolls when you were a kid.

1248
01:05:32,880 --> 01:05:33,560
Speaker 1: Are you a doll?

1249
01:05:33,720 --> 01:05:33,880
Speaker 2: Now?

1250
01:05:34,160 --> 01:05:39,040
Speaker 1: We want to know? You can also buy our merchant

1251
01:05:39,160 --> 01:05:41,400
Speaker 1: Like a Virgin for twenty sixty nine dot com and

1252
01:05:41,880 --> 01:05:44,680
Speaker 1: become patron at Patreon dot com slash Like a Virgin

1253
01:05:44,840 --> 01:05:48,240
Speaker 1: four weekly bonus episodes. You can follow us at Like

1254
01:05:48,280 --> 01:05:50,840
Speaker 1: a Virgin for twenty sixty nine on Instagram, and you

1255
01:05:50,920 --> 01:05:54,480
Speaker 1: can follow me anywhere you want at ros Daumu, and

1256
01:05:54,600 --> 01:05:56,920
Speaker 1: you can follow me at Franz squish Goo anywhere you like.

1257
01:05:57,680 --> 01:06:00,760
Speaker 1: Like a Virgin is an iHeartRadio production, and our producer

1258
01:06:01,000 --> 01:06:04,680
Speaker 1: is Phoebe Unter, with support from Lindsay Hoffman and Nikki Etour.

1259
01:06:05,680 --> 01:06:18,280
Speaker 1: Until next week, Au revoir Bye, good bye, Well and

1260
01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:21,000
Speaker 1: here's a clip from this week's Patreon episode. You can

1261
01:06:21,040 --> 01:06:24,560
Speaker 1: become a patron at Patreon dot com slash Like a Virgin.

1262
01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:27,040
Speaker 1: The book that we're talking about today is one that

1263
01:06:27,120 --> 01:06:30,920
Speaker 1: I mentioned on the main show earlier this year, Fingersmith

1264
01:06:31,000 --> 01:06:36,320
Speaker 1: by Sarah Waters, which I finished a month ago now

1265
01:06:36,400 --> 01:06:38,800
Speaker 1: at this point, just because of various scheduling things, it

1266
01:06:39,520 --> 01:06:41,440
Speaker 1: took a long time for me to read it, and

1267
01:06:41,520 --> 01:06:44,120
Speaker 1: then took a while for us to actually record this episode,

1268
01:06:44,480 --> 01:06:47,439
Speaker 1: so thank you virgins who actually did read the book

1269
01:06:47,480 --> 01:06:51,920
Speaker 1: and have been anxiously awaiting us talking about it. But

1270
01:06:52,160 --> 01:06:54,520
Speaker 1: we are going to be talking about it today, and

1271
01:06:54,600 --> 01:06:59,080
Speaker 1: we'll also be talking about the two films that were

1272
01:07:00,320 --> 01:07:05,960
Speaker 1: that were adapted from it, the BBC mini series also

1273
01:07:06,040 --> 01:07:10,360
Speaker 1: called Fingersmith, and then the film The Handmaiden, And.

1274
01:07:10,600 --> 01:07:12,880
Speaker 3: These are so I just for the virgins have never

1275
01:07:12,920 --> 01:07:15,920
Speaker 3: read the book. I have never seen the miniseries. But

1276
01:07:16,080 --> 01:07:19,520
Speaker 3: The Handmaid in its adaptation, which is very different from

1277
01:07:19,520 --> 01:07:22,360
Speaker 3: the book, we'll get into it is extremely different. Is

1278
01:07:22,480 --> 01:07:25,520
Speaker 3: one of my favorite queer films ever. Like I think

1279
01:07:25,560 --> 01:07:28,320
Speaker 3: it's like such a good point of reference for anybody

1280
01:07:28,520 --> 01:07:32,040
Speaker 3: that considers themselves a sinophile in the queer space. It's

1281
01:07:32,120 --> 01:07:35,600
Speaker 3: like to meet required viewing if you want to brush

1282
01:07:35,720 --> 01:07:39,800
Speaker 3: up on like queer cinema in general, because like part

1283
01:07:39,920 --> 01:07:42,920
Speaker 3: Chan Wook is, I mean, such a phenomenal director. But

1284
01:07:43,080 --> 01:07:48,760
Speaker 3: beyond that, it's just like you don't see WLW romances

1285
01:07:49,240 --> 01:07:51,240
Speaker 3: like this ever, like not even.

1286
01:07:51,080 --> 01:07:54,280
Speaker 1: In a case do see WLW sex scenes like this

1287
01:07:54,720 --> 01:07:57,280
Speaker 1: in porn, which I think is part of the problem. Well,

1288
01:07:57,480 --> 01:07:59,960
Speaker 1: and we'll we'll get to my thoughts on the hand

1289
01:08:00,160 --> 01:08:01,800
Speaker 1: Made And I first would like to talk about the

1290
01:08:01,880 --> 01:08:05,480
Speaker 1: book to give you some context for when we get Yes,

1291
01:08:05,520 --> 01:08:11,160
Speaker 1: please to conversations. So Fingersmith is a two thousand and

1292
01:08:11,200 --> 01:08:13,960
Speaker 1: two novel written by Sarah Waters, who is a renowned

1293
01:08:14,640 --> 01:08:18,960
Speaker 1: British lesbian author. She primarily writes historical fiction, and most

1294
01:08:19,040 --> 01:08:24,720
Speaker 1: of her most celebrated work has lesbian themes lesbian characters.

1295
01:08:25,400 --> 01:08:27,920
Speaker 1: Her novel Tipping the Velvet, which is her first book,

1296
01:08:28,160 --> 01:08:32,040
Speaker 1: is my favorite book of all time, Oh Fingersmith, really.

1297
01:08:31,920 --> 01:08:34,800
Speaker 2: Of all time, like all time meaning, like of all

1298
01:08:34,880 --> 01:08:35,400
Speaker 2: time meaning.

1299
01:08:35,680 --> 01:08:37,439
Speaker 1: But it is among like.

1300
01:08:38,240 --> 01:08:40,680
Speaker 2: A top ten books of all time. I assume it's

1301
01:08:40,720 --> 01:08:41,760
Speaker 2: not like the number one.

1302
01:08:42,439 --> 01:08:44,519
Speaker 1: No, it is the number one. It's my favorite book.

1303
01:08:46,640 --> 01:08:49,720
Speaker 1: My job is I've said this on the podcast before. Okay, no, no, no,

1304
01:08:49,880 --> 01:08:53,519
Speaker 1: I'm not doubting you. I'm just I'm just always learning

1305
01:08:53,680 --> 01:08:57,200
Speaker 1: and relearning your favorites and your tops, which I love well.

1306
01:08:57,240 --> 01:08:59,280
Speaker 1: I mean, is that that surprising because as we've talked

1307
01:08:59,280 --> 01:09:04,840
Speaker 1: about on this, I love historical fiction and specifically queer history,

1308
01:09:04,920 --> 01:09:08,800
Speaker 1: and this is really well written queer historical fiction, which

1309
01:09:08,880 --> 01:09:11,360
Speaker 1: is usually not the case. Like usually it's like you know,

1310
01:09:11,840 --> 01:09:18,240
Speaker 1: a mod it's like Roman honest ripper. Yeah, yeah, the

1311
01:09:18,439 --> 01:09:23,559
Speaker 1: the term that we coined. So you know, I loved

1312
01:09:25,000 --> 01:09:29,360
Speaker 1: Tipping the Velvet, and Tipping the Velvet is very much

1313
01:09:29,400 --> 01:09:34,840
Speaker 1: about queerness, but it's much more and and it's about identity,

1314
01:09:35,120 --> 01:09:38,479
Speaker 1: but it has much more to do with gender, because

1315
01:09:38,560 --> 01:09:43,679
Speaker 1: Tipping the Velvet is all about cross dressing. It's about

1316
01:09:43,760 --> 01:09:48,640
Speaker 1: these performers, these female performers who dress up as men,

1317
01:09:48,840 --> 01:09:54,040
Speaker 1: and this woman who like become this woman who becomes

1318
01:09:54,520 --> 01:09:57,760
Speaker 1: a rent boy when she's like cast out by her lover,

1319
01:09:57,960 --> 01:10:00,360
Speaker 1: she starts dressing up as a man and engaging sex

1320
01:10:00,439 --> 01:10:03,800
Speaker 1: work and then you know, becomes sort of like an

1321
01:10:03,880 --> 01:10:08,040
Speaker 1: in house concubine of this rich lesbian who has this

1322
01:10:08,479 --> 01:10:16,960
Speaker 1: circle of other rich lesbians. So I loved Sarah Waters,

1323
01:10:17,840 --> 01:10:22,960
Speaker 1: and I had probably seen like an article or something

1324
01:10:23,040 --> 01:10:26,080
Speaker 1: talking about Fingersmith earlier this year. So I bought it.

1325
01:10:26,280 --> 01:10:30,920
Speaker 1: And it was very hard getting into because the beginning

1326
01:10:31,040 --> 01:10:37,040
Speaker 1: is very slow, and I sort of like waffled on

1327
01:10:37,160 --> 01:10:41,160
Speaker 1: about it for a while, and then like one day

1328
01:10:41,160 --> 01:10:43,800
Speaker 1: I finally just like sat down and really powered through

1329
01:10:44,720 --> 01:10:47,360
Speaker 1: the beginning, and once it picked up a certain amount

1330
01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:50,160
Speaker 1: of steam, I just could not put it down. And

1331
01:10:51,840 --> 01:10:56,200
Speaker 1: so the novel is set in the Victorian era in England.

1332
01:10:56,880 --> 01:11:00,479
Speaker 1: The there are two protagonists, but the one whose story

1333
01:11:01,000 --> 01:11:03,800
Speaker 1: we follow from the beginning is an orphan named Sue

1334
01:11:04,520 --> 01:11:07,720
Speaker 1: who is part of a family of thieves and criminals,

1335
01:11:08,400 --> 01:11:12,160
Speaker 1: and she has been raised by this woman missus Sucksby,

1336
01:11:13,040 --> 01:11:16,360
Speaker 1: and their family are all these like pickpockets, and they're

1337
01:11:16,560 --> 01:11:19,840
Speaker 1: called fingersmiths. That's where the title of novel comes from.

1338
01:11:20,600 --> 01:11:24,400
Speaker 1: And on a dark and stormy night, this family friend

1339
01:11:24,640 --> 01:11:27,800
Speaker 1: called Gentleman comes to their house and says that he

1340
01:11:27,920 --> 01:11:31,280
Speaker 1: has a job for Sue. He has been posing as

1341
01:11:31,280 --> 01:11:36,200
Speaker 1: an aristocratic man in this countryside estate, helping this man

1342
01:11:36,320 --> 01:11:41,360
Speaker 1: who has a large book collection, and he has discovered

1343
01:11:41,400 --> 01:11:43,439
Speaker 1: that this man has a niece who has like a

1344
01:11:43,640 --> 01:11:47,360
Speaker 1: huge dowry to her name, and he wants to cheat

1345
01:11:47,400 --> 01:11:49,800
Speaker 1: her out of it. So his plan is that Sue.

1346
01:11:50,320 --> 01:11:54,679
Speaker 1: He will recommend Sue as this woman her name's Maud,

1347
01:11:54,880 --> 01:11:59,800
Speaker 1: as her new mate lady's maid, and Sue will help

1348
01:12:00,160 --> 01:12:02,880
Speaker 1: him woo her and marry her so that he can

1349
01:12:02,960 --> 01:12:04,960
Speaker 1: get access to her, so that he can get access

1350
01:12:04,960 --> 01:12:08,320
Speaker 1: to her fortune, and then she will and then she

1351
01:12:08,400 --> 01:12:13,240
Speaker 1: will help him prove that Maud is mad and have

1352
01:12:13,400 --> 01:12:16,920
Speaker 1: her dumped in a madhouse so that he can you know,

1353
01:12:17,000 --> 01:12:19,479
Speaker 1: run them UK with her money and Sue will get

1354
01:12:20,280 --> 01:12:22,600
Speaker 1: a portion of the funds and that will be her

1355
01:12:22,680 --> 01:12:24,880
Speaker 1: payment for you know, running this con with him