WEBVTT - Hell and Gone Murder Line: Paul Loyd

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<v Speaker 1>School of Humans. Helen Got Murder Line actively investigates cold

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<v Speaker 1>case murders in an effort to raise public awareness invite

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<v Speaker 1>witnesses to come forward and present evidence that could potentially

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<v Speaker 1>be further investigated by law enforcement. While we value insights

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<v Speaker 1>from family and community members, their statements should not be

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<v Speaker 1>considered evidence and point to the challenges of verifying facts

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<v Speaker 1>inherent in cold cases. We remind listeners that everyone has

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<v Speaker 1>presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

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<v Speaker 1>Nothing in the podcast is intended to state or imply

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<v Speaker 1>that anyone who has not been convicted of a crime

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<v Speaker 1>is guilty of any wrongdoing. Thanks for listening.

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<v Speaker 2>Sometime between seven and eight am on Saturday, January fifteenth,

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety four, in Hot Springs, Arkansas, thirty one year

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<v Speaker 2>old David Ferrell knocked on his roommate Paul's door.

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<v Speaker 3>Six year old Paul Lloyd was in bed.

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<v Speaker 2>With a woman named Glenna Jones, who he had been

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<v Speaker 2>hanging out with and dating. Paul and Glenna had partied

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<v Speaker 2>pretty hard the night before and had not gotten home

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<v Speaker 2>until late then they crashed. David's knocking woke them up.

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<v Speaker 2>David told Paul that his mom was on the phone

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<v Speaker 2>and that she wanted to know why Paul wasn't at work.

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<v Speaker 2>Paul tried to get David to talk to his mom

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<v Speaker 2>for him, but David told him he needed to talk

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<v Speaker 2>to her directly, so Paul got up and spoke to

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<v Speaker 2>his mom on the phone.

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<v Speaker 3>Paul told his mother that he would call her back later.

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<v Speaker 2>Shortly after that phone call from Paul's mother, at least

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<v Speaker 2>according to one version of this story, David left for work.

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<v Speaker 3>David worked at Stroop Tires.

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<v Speaker 2>His shift started at seven thirty am, and he later

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<v Speaker 2>told police he spent that day working on an Arkansas

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<v Speaker 2>State Police vehicle. David claims that after he left work

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<v Speaker 2>that day, he went to babysit his two sons, who

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<v Speaker 2>lived with his ex Mona Harris. Mona worked nights, so

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<v Speaker 2>David claimed he slept in the living room at her place,

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<v Speaker 2>and when he eventually got back to his house, Paul

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<v Speaker 2>and Glenna were gone. A few months later, on June first,

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety four, a couple was walking through the woods

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<v Speaker 2>in Hot Springs County. They were kind of lost near

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<v Speaker 2>an area called Jack Mountain, and they saw a piece

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<v Speaker 2>of tape attached to a tree written on that tape

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<v Speaker 2>where the words pack all rats together, they walked a

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<v Speaker 2>little bit further into the woods and saw a human skeleton.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Catherine Townsend. Over the past eight years of making

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<v Speaker 2>my true crime podcast, Helen Gone, I've learned that there

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<v Speaker 2>is no such thing as a small town where murder

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<v Speaker 2>never happens. I have received hundreds of messages from people

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<v Speaker 2>all around the country asking for help with an unsolved

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<v Speaker 2>murder that's affected them, their families, and their communities. If

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<v Speaker 2>you have a case, she'd like me and my team

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<v Speaker 2>to look in two. You can reach out to us

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<v Speaker 2>at our Helen Gone Murder line at six seven eight

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<v Speaker 2>seven four four six one four five. That's six seven

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<v Speaker 2>eight seven four four six one four five, or you

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<v Speaker 2>can send us a message on Instagram at Helen gonepod.

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<v Speaker 2>This is Helen Gone Murder Line. After the couple found

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<v Speaker 2>the body in the woods on June first, police recovered

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<v Speaker 2>the remains, but they didn't have a lot of other

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<v Speaker 2>forensic evidence. The body was dressed in cowboy boots, but

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<v Speaker 2>the remains were scattered over a range of about thirty yards,

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<v Speaker 2>so far that they could not even determine how the

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<v Speaker 2>victim had died. Police found four empty shell casings near

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<v Speaker 2>the body and bullets in the soil. Based on that

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<v Speaker 2>and on the fact that the shirt and jacket near

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<v Speaker 2>the skeleton each had three holes in them, police believed

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<v Speaker 2>that the victim had been shot. Eventually, they were able

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<v Speaker 2>to use dental records to identify the remains.

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<v Speaker 3>As Paul Lloyd.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's back up to January fifteenth, nineteen ninety four. It

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<v Speaker 2>was a Saturday. Paul Lloyd's mom called the house where

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<v Speaker 2>he lived with David.

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<v Speaker 3>They talked on the phone and Paul said he would call.

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<v Speaker 2>Back, But after that call, Paul Lloyd didn't show up

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<v Speaker 2>at work that day. Paul's brother Kenny, reported him missing

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<v Speaker 2>a few days later, on January twenty first, nineteen ninety four,

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<v Speaker 2>after he failed to show up and pick up his paychecks.

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<v Speaker 2>Paul's brother Kenny talked to police. He told them that David,

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<v Speaker 2>Paul's roommate, had introduced Paul to a man named Wayne Hortman,

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<v Speaker 2>who dealt and took methamphetamines. David had been selling drugs

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<v Speaker 2>for Wayne. Kenny also told police he had kind of

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<v Speaker 2>started doing his own investigation, which included stopping by Paul's

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<v Speaker 2>house to talk to David Ferrell. He told police that

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<v Speaker 2>David was very unhelpful when he asked about Paul. According

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<v Speaker 2>to police documents, Kenny said the last time he saw Paul,

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<v Speaker 2>Paul was on his way to meet with David and

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<v Speaker 2>Wayne Hortman because he was planning to trade his motorcycle

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<v Speaker 2>to them in exchange for drugs.

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<v Speaker 3>But David later claimed.

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<v Speaker 2>He wasn't even there that day, that he merely introduced

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<v Speaker 2>Paul and Wayne, and that they were planning on doing

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<v Speaker 2>the motorcycle for drug trade themselves. So the Hot Springs

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<v Speaker 2>Police Department started looking into Paul Lloyd's case, but they

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<v Speaker 2>weren't making a ton of progress at first because since

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<v Speaker 2>they hadn't found Paul's body, it was still being investigated

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<v Speaker 2>as a missing person's case. But then in March of

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety four, they were questioning Wayne Hortman about something

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<v Speaker 2>else when he said he had information about what had

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<v Speaker 2>really happened to Paul Lloyd. Wayne said that about two

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<v Speaker 2>weeks after Paul went missing, David told Wayne that he

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<v Speaker 2>had a gun, an SKS rifle that he was nervous about.

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<v Speaker 2>Wayne claimed David had handed him this SKS rifle and

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<v Speaker 2>told him to do something with it, so Waine said

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<v Speaker 2>he took David's gun back to his place he was

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<v Speaker 2>living with his mother at the time. But then Wayne

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<v Speaker 2>said David was at his house a few weeks later

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<v Speaker 2>and saw the gun there. He noticed that Wayne had

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<v Speaker 2>not gotten rid of the gun, so at that point

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<v Speaker 2>Wayne claimed that David got very angry and first tried

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<v Speaker 2>to destroy worry the weapon by slamming it against a tree,

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<v Speaker 2>and then when that didn't work, David told Wayne to

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<v Speaker 2>drive him to the Highway to seventy Bridge over Lake Hamilton.

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<v Speaker 2>So Wayne said he did, and he claimed that when

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<v Speaker 2>they got there, David got out of the vehicle and

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<v Speaker 2>threw the gun into the lake. Wayne wasn't the only

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<v Speaker 2>one under investigation. The Bureau of Tobacco, Alcohol and Firearms

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<v Speaker 2>was investigating David Ferrell on a matter unconnected with Paul's disappearance,

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<v Speaker 2>so an ATF agent named Glenn Cook did some checking

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<v Speaker 2>and found out that the year before, in March of

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety three, David had purchased an SKS rifle. So

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<v Speaker 2>divers from Garland County went into the area near where

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<v Speaker 2>Wayne claimed that gun was, and on May twentieth, nineteen

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<v Speaker 2>ninety four, an investigator went into the water on the

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<v Speaker 2>side of two seventy West Bridge and found a piece

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<v Speaker 2>of an SKS the barrel receiver assembly, basically the core

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<v Speaker 2>component of the gun. Investigators from the ATF matched the

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<v Speaker 2>serial number of the pieces of the rifle they pulled

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<v Speaker 2>from the lake to an SKS rifle that David got

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<v Speaker 2>from Monny's Pawnshop in Hot.

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<v Speaker 3>Springs, Arkansas.

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<v Speaker 2>Investigator Cook also matched the document signatures of David to

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<v Speaker 2>the pawnshop receipts. They confirmed this was David Ferrell's gun

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<v Speaker 2>and they believed this could be their murder weapon, but

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<v Speaker 2>they still were suspicious of Wayne Hortman. Police arrested Wayne Hortman,

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<v Speaker 2>and on June second, they charged him with Paul Lloyd's murder.

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<v Speaker 2>Then Wayne Hortman told him something else. He claimed he

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<v Speaker 2>had not only seen the possible murder weapon thrown into

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<v Speaker 2>the lake, but he had witnessed Paul Lloyd's murder himself.

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<v Speaker 2>Wayne Hortman admitted to police that David killed Paul, not him.

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<v Speaker 2>He said he had been at David's home on South

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<v Speaker 2>Patterson Street on January fifteenth, and that David shot Paul there.

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<v Speaker 2>Wayne said that David's girlfriend at the time, Regina, was

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<v Speaker 2>also present, so police searched the house on South Patterson Street.

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<v Speaker 2>They cut out three sections of carpet that were stained

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<v Speaker 2>with blood and they sent them to the crime lab

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<v Speaker 2>for testing. The results came back and found that the

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<v Speaker 2>blood was not human blood, and yet they continued to

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<v Speaker 2>build a case against David Ferrell. David claimed that on

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<v Speaker 2>the day of Paul's murder, he wasn't at home at all.

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<v Speaker 2>He said he was at work all day at Stroop

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<v Speaker 2>Tire in Hot Springs, and after that he was babysitting.

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<v Speaker 3>His two boys.

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<v Speaker 2>But David was charged with capital murder. If convicted, he

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<v Speaker 2>faced the death penalty. David told police that Wayne killed

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<v Speaker 2>Paul Lloyd. He said Wayne was dealing drugs and also

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<v Speaker 2>worked undercover with the police, and that meant Wayne could

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<v Speaker 2>cut deals with the police and with the prosecutor to

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<v Speaker 2>stay out of jail. Wayne did tell the police that

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<v Speaker 2>he in an associate of his name, Freddie McCaslin, had

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<v Speaker 2>been involved in major methamphetamine trafficking in Arkansas for eight years.

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<v Speaker 2>Wayne explained every two weeks he would fly to Bell

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<v Speaker 2>Gardens in California, which was near Los Angeles, to buy meth.

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<v Speaker 3>Waine would then strap.

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<v Speaker 2>Pounds of this methamphetamine to his belt line and fly

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<v Speaker 2>back to Hot Springs to meet with Freddy, his contact. Meanwhile,

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<v Speaker 2>Wayne was also talking to the police and he kept

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<v Speaker 2>changing his story. First he said Paul Lloyd had been

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<v Speaker 2>killed at David's house. Later he said Paul was killed

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<v Speaker 2>at Crystal Springs Lake, then at a gravel pit, then

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<v Speaker 2>along a highway between Hot Springs and Malvern. Finally, Wayne

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<v Speaker 2>said Paul had been murdered on Jack Mountain, near where

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<v Speaker 2>his remains were found on June third. After Wayne confessed

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<v Speaker 2>about the shooting at Jack Mountain, Wayne Hortman cut a

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<v Speaker 2>deal so the state dropped the capital murder charges against him,

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<v Speaker 2>and in the end, he was only charged with hindering prosecution.

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<v Speaker 2>In return, he promised to testify against David at trial.

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<v Speaker 2>David was arrested in charge with capital murder and transferred

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<v Speaker 2>to the Hot Springs.

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<v Speaker 3>County Jail to await trial.

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<v Speaker 2>As David's attorneys prepared for this trial, in July of

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety four, they filed motions for discovery. A lot

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<v Speaker 2>of the discovery involved the physical evidence that had been

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<v Speaker 2>taken to the state crime lab and they waited, but

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<v Speaker 2>nothing ever came. The Arkansas State Crime Lab had long delays,

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<v Speaker 2>and those delays actually almost derailed the trial entirely. In

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<v Speaker 2>February of nineteen ninety five, Judge Sheeran threatened to dismiss

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<v Speaker 2>the charges against David entirely due to the State Crime

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<v Speaker 2>Laboratory's delays in evidence testing. He said the delays could

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<v Speaker 2>potentially stop David's defense attorneys from having adequate time to

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<v Speaker 2>prepare his case. The right to a speedy trial is

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<v Speaker 2>required by Arkansas state law, which means most of these

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<v Speaker 2>cases had to go to trial within a year. The

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<v Speaker 2>judge set a timeline of February ninth for this evidence

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<v Speaker 2>to be produced, and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and

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<v Speaker 2>Firearms produced the tests in time to hit that deadline.

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<v Speaker 2>The trial started and the state produced nine witnesses. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>all of them said they heard David Bragg about shooting Paul.

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<v Speaker 2>The prosecutor, Dan Harmon, said that his theory was that

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<v Speaker 2>David killed Paul because David believed that Paul was a

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<v Speaker 2>drug informant for the police. Again, these stakes were high

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<v Speaker 2>for David. If convicted, he faced the death penalty. This

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<v Speaker 2>was a capital murder charge when David's trial finally started

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<v Speaker 2>in nineteen ninety five, and this is something I've never

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<v Speaker 2>heard of happening. One of the other weird twists in

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<v Speaker 2>this case was that the trial took place not in

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<v Speaker 2>a courtroom, but in an industrial complex in Hot Springs.

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<v Speaker 2>The reasons for the weird location were because there were

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<v Speaker 2>supposedly renovations happening at the Hot Springs court It ended

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<v Speaker 2>up being just another strange set of circumstances in an

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<v Speaker 2>already very odd case. The state's case against David's seemed weak.

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<v Speaker 2>They had no fingerprints or physical evidence tying David to

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<v Speaker 2>the crime scene at all. They didn't even have a

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<v Speaker 2>definite cause of death. But they had the bullets and

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<v Speaker 2>the shell casings. A firearms expert, Joseph Mason, testified in

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<v Speaker 2>court that he could conclusively match three of the four

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<v Speaker 2>shell casings two David's SKS weapon, and although he said

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<v Speaker 2>he was unable to make a definitive match between David's

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<v Speaker 2>SKS and the bullet fragments found, he said that the

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<v Speaker 2>bullets came from the same type of weapon as the SKS.

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<v Speaker 2>Doctor Charles Kocus, the medical examiner, did not perform the autopsy,

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<v Speaker 2>but he testified due to the decomposition of Paul's body,

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<v Speaker 2>he could not conclusively determine.

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<v Speaker 3>The cause of death.

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<v Speaker 2>However, he did observe Paul's wounds were consistent with death

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<v Speaker 2>by gunshot. The jacket and shirt that Paul Lloyd had

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<v Speaker 2>been wearing each had three small holes in the back,

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<v Speaker 2>which doctor Koca said were consistent with bullet entry, and

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<v Speaker 2>an expert from the state crime Lab found traces of

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<v Speaker 2>lead around the holes in the jacket and shirt, which

0:15:03.360 --> 0:15:08.480
<v Speaker 2>he believed indicated bullet entry. Later in David's appeal, David

0:15:08.520 --> 0:15:12.120
<v Speaker 2>made another incredible claim that the body found at Jack

0:15:12.160 --> 0:15:15.160
<v Speaker 2>Mountain wasn't Paul Lloyd's at all, but that the prosecutor,

0:15:15.280 --> 0:15:19.480
<v Speaker 2>Dan Harmon had substituted another John Doe body for Paul Lloyd's.

0:15:20.680 --> 0:15:23.480
<v Speaker 2>Dan Harmon had a lot of issues of his own.

0:15:23.800 --> 0:15:26.520
<v Speaker 2>He ended up resigning as a prosecutor a year after

0:15:26.600 --> 0:15:30.360
<v Speaker 2>David Ferrell's trial after Dan Harmon was arrested on assault

0:15:30.440 --> 0:15:36.040
<v Speaker 2>charges and Dan Harmon's illegal activities ultimately impacted David's overall case.

0:15:36.960 --> 0:15:38.680
<v Speaker 3>But David couldn't.

0:15:38.320 --> 0:15:41.120
<v Speaker 2>Prove Dan Harmon had planted a body and the skeleton

0:15:41.240 --> 0:15:43.640
<v Speaker 2>in addition to having pieces of clothing nearby with whole

0:15:43.840 --> 0:15:46.480
<v Speaker 2>in them that a firearms expert and testified could be

0:15:46.480 --> 0:15:49.800
<v Speaker 2>bullet holes, was also wearing a belt with Paul written

0:15:49.840 --> 0:15:54.240
<v Speaker 2>on the back. David also claimed that the people who

0:15:54.320 --> 0:15:57.280
<v Speaker 2>said they had heard him confess to Paul's murder had

0:15:57.320 --> 0:16:01.320
<v Speaker 2>been coerced or even threatened by Dan Harmon even after

0:16:01.360 --> 0:16:04.400
<v Speaker 2>hearing those witnesses. Though the bulk of the state's case

0:16:04.480 --> 0:16:08.080
<v Speaker 2>rested on one person, the alleged eye witness, Wayne Hortman,

0:16:08.720 --> 0:16:12.280
<v Speaker 2>and as we said before, Wayne Hortman changed his story

0:16:12.480 --> 0:16:16.600
<v Speaker 2>several times. In David's petition, he pointed out that quote,

0:16:16.880 --> 0:16:19.960
<v Speaker 2>depending on which statement you read, Paul Lloyd was killed

0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:22.360
<v Speaker 2>either at David's house, at Crystal Springs Lake, at a

0:16:22.400 --> 0:16:25.800
<v Speaker 2>gravel pit along a highway between Hot Springs and Malvern,

0:16:26.360 --> 0:16:29.320
<v Speaker 2>or actually on Jack Mountain, near where his remains were

0:16:29.320 --> 0:16:34.120
<v Speaker 2>found end quote. The jury found David guilty of Paul's murder,

0:16:34.680 --> 0:16:37.400
<v Speaker 2>but they did return with the recommendation of a lighter

0:16:37.440 --> 0:16:41.640
<v Speaker 2>sentence than death, life without the possibility of parole, and

0:16:41.760 --> 0:16:46.760
<v Speaker 2>Judge Sheeran agreed with the record commendation. In twenty ten,

0:16:47.240 --> 0:16:51.160
<v Speaker 2>David's attorneys filed a writ of habeas corpus. David stated

0:16:51.160 --> 0:16:53.960
<v Speaker 2>in his appeal that he believed that he was entitled

0:16:53.960 --> 0:16:56.760
<v Speaker 2>to DNA and blood type testing. He claimed that he

0:16:56.840 --> 0:17:01.800
<v Speaker 2>was convicted with false evidence. David stated both the State

0:17:01.840 --> 0:17:05.240
<v Speaker 2>Crime Lab and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms

0:17:05.360 --> 0:17:08.440
<v Speaker 2>failed to get a positive match on the bullets, shell casings,

0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:09.720
<v Speaker 2>and fragments.

0:17:09.200 --> 0:17:10.240
<v Speaker 3>Introduced him to evidence.

0:17:10.320 --> 0:17:14.560
<v Speaker 2>Among other things, David claimed the verdict should be overturned

0:17:14.600 --> 0:17:18.800
<v Speaker 2>because if the jury had known about the prosecutors behind

0:17:18.800 --> 0:17:22.840
<v Speaker 2>the scenes activities, he would never have been convicted. David

0:17:22.840 --> 0:17:26.560
<v Speaker 2>claimed that Dan Harmon, who along with the Prosecuting Attorney's

0:17:26.560 --> 0:17:29.880
<v Speaker 2>Office of the seventh Judicial District of Arkansas ran the

0:17:30.000 --> 0:17:34.560
<v Speaker 2>Seventh Judicial District Drug Task Force, coerced witnesses into saying

0:17:35.000 --> 0:17:38.640
<v Speaker 2>David confessed to Paul's murder and this wasn't the first

0:17:38.640 --> 0:17:40.840
<v Speaker 2>time Dan Harmon was charged with this kind of thing.

0:17:41.760 --> 0:17:44.440
<v Speaker 2>In nineteen ninety seven, Dan Harmon and went to trial

0:17:44.520 --> 0:17:48.560
<v Speaker 2>in federal court. He was convicted of federal racketeering, extortion,

0:17:48.880 --> 0:17:53.040
<v Speaker 2>and drug conspiracy. The government charged that Harmon and his

0:17:53.160 --> 0:17:58.400
<v Speaker 2>colleagues actually distributed marijuana themselves and also extorted people. Dan

0:17:58.480 --> 0:18:02.120
<v Speaker 2>Harmon would blackmail them by promising not to prosecute.

0:18:01.640 --> 0:18:03.800
<v Speaker 3>Them in exchange for money.

0:18:04.400 --> 0:18:08.120
<v Speaker 2>One of the men who Dan Harmon allegedly blackmailed was

0:18:08.160 --> 0:18:13.680
<v Speaker 2>Freddie McCaslin Wayne Hortman's meth dealing partner, and the behavior

0:18:13.880 --> 0:18:18.440
<v Speaker 2>described in this federal case is truly shocking.

0:18:18.000 --> 0:18:18.720
<v Speaker 3>In my opinion.

0:18:19.200 --> 0:18:22.520
<v Speaker 2>In one instance, Dan told the wife of a man

0:18:22.720 --> 0:18:25.280
<v Speaker 2>charge with possession of marijuana that if she spent the

0:18:25.360 --> 0:18:27.600
<v Speaker 2>night with him at a hotel, they could work things out.

0:18:28.120 --> 0:18:29.280
<v Speaker 3>She declined to take that.

0:18:29.280 --> 0:18:32.040
<v Speaker 2>Offer, and Dan Harmon said he would drop the charges

0:18:32.040 --> 0:18:35.320
<v Speaker 2>against her husband for ten thousand dollars. So the couple

0:18:35.440 --> 0:18:39.000
<v Speaker 2>paid Dan Harmon and the charges were dropped. And not

0:18:39.080 --> 0:18:42.040
<v Speaker 2>only did Dan Harmon make deals to extort money, he

0:18:42.240 --> 0:18:46.480
<v Speaker 2>dealt drugs himself. The court alleged that Dan Harmon conspired

0:18:46.520 --> 0:18:50.240
<v Speaker 2>to possess marijuana with intent to distribute, so he was

0:18:50.280 --> 0:18:54.160
<v Speaker 2>involved in bringing marijuana into the house, repackaging it into

0:18:54.200 --> 0:18:57.840
<v Speaker 2>one pound bags, and helping sell the marijuana. He also

0:18:58.000 --> 0:19:02.000
<v Speaker 2>oversaw the collection of funds. So you have a situation

0:19:02.120 --> 0:19:06.200
<v Speaker 2>where the prosecutor, the person in charge of punishing drug dealers,

0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:09.840
<v Speaker 2>was not only dealing drugs himself, but was taking payments

0:19:09.840 --> 0:19:12.920
<v Speaker 2>from other drug dealers in exchange for dropping charges against them.

0:19:15.600 --> 0:19:18.520
<v Speaker 2>Dan Harmon was convicted of those charges plus some additional

0:19:18.560 --> 0:19:21.880
<v Speaker 2>drug charges. In the end, he was behind bars for

0:19:21.920 --> 0:19:25.800
<v Speaker 2>eight years. Dan Harmon was disbarred in nineteen ninety nine.

0:19:26.520 --> 0:19:29.440
<v Speaker 2>He was also accused of using his office to facilitate

0:19:29.480 --> 0:19:33.640
<v Speaker 2>sexual misconduct. This is important because this is the person

0:19:33.680 --> 0:19:37.720
<v Speaker 2>who prosecuted David Ferrell. In the end, hundreds of cases

0:19:37.720 --> 0:19:41.800
<v Speaker 2>were dismissed due to Dan Harmon's corruption, but David Ferrell's

0:19:42.000 --> 0:19:53.400
<v Speaker 2>would not be one of them. Dan Harmon was released

0:19:53.400 --> 0:19:56.760
<v Speaker 2>from prison in two thousand and six. Then four years later,

0:19:56.840 --> 0:20:01.360
<v Speaker 2>in twenty ten, Dan Harmon was arrested again after allegedly

0:20:01.400 --> 0:20:05.200
<v Speaker 2>selling drugs to an undercover officer near a school in Sheridan, Arkansas.

0:20:06.120 --> 0:20:09.640
<v Speaker 2>He was acquitted of those drug charges. Dan Harmon stayed

0:20:09.760 --> 0:20:12.760
<v Speaker 2>in Seline County after that and for the rest of

0:20:12.760 --> 0:20:17.520
<v Speaker 2>his life. He died on September twenty second, twenty twenty three.

0:20:17.600 --> 0:20:18.920
<v Speaker 3>At the age of seventy eight.

0:20:20.200 --> 0:20:24.840
<v Speaker 2>In twenty eleven, Judge Philip Shearan announced his retirement. When

0:20:24.840 --> 0:20:27.840
<v Speaker 2>the Sheridan Highlight asked him about his most unusual case,

0:20:28.280 --> 0:20:30.960
<v Speaker 2>he said it was the capital murder trial of David Ferrell,

0:20:31.400 --> 0:20:34.920
<v Speaker 2>which he told the newspaper was of considerable interest to

0:20:34.960 --> 0:20:37.760
<v Speaker 2>a motorcycle gang. He said the trial had been moved

0:20:37.800 --> 0:20:42.000
<v Speaker 2>to a quote makeshift courtroom in the Hot Springs County Industrial.

0:20:41.520 --> 0:20:42.920
<v Speaker 3>Complex end quote.

0:20:43.760 --> 0:20:46.520
<v Speaker 2>David Ferrell argued in his position for appeal that the

0:20:46.600 --> 0:20:49.920
<v Speaker 2>jury never heard the complete story. He claimed there were

0:20:50.000 --> 0:20:54.600
<v Speaker 2>major inconsistencies that were never fully disclosed. This included Wayne's

0:20:54.640 --> 0:20:59.680
<v Speaker 2>connections to local drug dealers, who, in turn, David claimed

0:20:59.960 --> 0:21:03.440
<v Speaker 2>were connected to Dan Harmon. This is called a Brady

0:21:03.520 --> 0:21:07.520
<v Speaker 2>violation when the prosecution doesn't turn over exculpatory evidence that

0:21:07.560 --> 0:21:10.960
<v Speaker 2>could have helped David's case. David claimed law enforcement knew

0:21:10.960 --> 0:21:14.440
<v Speaker 2>of evidence that was not disclosed to the defense. If

0:21:14.480 --> 0:21:18.320
<v Speaker 2>you're interested in the legal precedent, the actual case is

0:21:18.360 --> 0:21:21.760
<v Speaker 2>Brady versus Maryland. It means that suppressing evidence, even if

0:21:21.800 --> 0:21:26.080
<v Speaker 2>it's unintentional, can overturn a conviction if that evidence is material.

0:21:27.800 --> 0:21:30.800
<v Speaker 2>David and his attorney's claimed the state's case depended on

0:21:30.880 --> 0:21:35.600
<v Speaker 2>witnesses whose testimony had been compromised, either by promised undisclosed

0:21:35.600 --> 0:21:40.080
<v Speaker 2>benefits or pressure by Dan Harmon. David claimed this case

0:21:40.240 --> 0:21:43.360
<v Speaker 2>was tied to a bigger network, a network involving drug

0:21:43.400 --> 0:21:46.520
<v Speaker 2>actimvity informants and a prosecutor who was also connected to

0:21:46.560 --> 0:21:50.640
<v Speaker 2>the Drug Task Force, and David even claimed that federal agencies,

0:21:50.920 --> 0:21:54.320
<v Speaker 2>the FBI, the ATF, and the DEA were aware of

0:21:54.360 --> 0:21:58.400
<v Speaker 2>what was going on. In twenty fourteen, the case went

0:21:58.440 --> 0:22:01.680
<v Speaker 2>to the Arkansas Supreme Court. David was asking to have

0:22:01.840 --> 0:22:05.760
<v Speaker 2>some of the evidence presented at his trial retested. In

0:22:05.800 --> 0:22:10.160
<v Speaker 2>May of twenty fourteen, David lost. The court ruled David

0:22:10.160 --> 0:22:12.600
<v Speaker 2>had failed to show that the trial judge in Hot

0:22:12.640 --> 0:22:15.600
<v Speaker 2>Springs County was wrong to have denied his request for

0:22:15.680 --> 0:22:18.760
<v Speaker 2>a new review of the evidence. So David stayed in prison,

0:22:18.800 --> 0:22:22.760
<v Speaker 2>where he remains to this day. David Ferrell has always

0:22:22.800 --> 0:22:26.440
<v Speaker 2>maintained his innocence, and over the years he's filed several petitions.

0:22:27.760 --> 0:22:31.640
<v Speaker 2>Multiple conflicting accounts have emerged. Some were given at trial,

0:22:32.000 --> 0:22:36.720
<v Speaker 2>others years later in sworn affidavits. Some of these affidavits

0:22:36.800 --> 0:22:39.240
<v Speaker 2>back up David's claims that he was not there when

0:22:39.240 --> 0:22:42.360
<v Speaker 2>Paul was killed. One of them was from David's ex

0:22:42.440 --> 0:22:46.640
<v Speaker 2>Mona Harris, swore in an affidavit that Dan Harmon had

0:22:46.680 --> 0:22:49.320
<v Speaker 2>told her if she didn't give him the answers that

0:22:49.360 --> 0:22:52.160
<v Speaker 2>he wanted, she would not be allowed to go home

0:22:52.320 --> 0:22:55.800
<v Speaker 2>to see her two kids. David also as an affidavit

0:22:55.800 --> 0:23:00.640
<v Speaker 2>from someone else, Paul Lloyd's girlfriend, Glenna. Now Glenna told

0:23:00.680 --> 0:23:05.520
<v Speaker 2>a completely different story than Wayne Hortman did. In an Aphidavid,

0:23:06.080 --> 0:23:08.880
<v Speaker 2>Glenna stated that the conviction of David had been a

0:23:08.920 --> 0:23:12.360
<v Speaker 2>grave injustice, and she explained some background about what had

0:23:12.400 --> 0:23:15.920
<v Speaker 2>brought her and Paul to David's house. Glenna said she

0:23:16.120 --> 0:23:19.680
<v Speaker 2>originally contacted David around September of nineteen ninety three because

0:23:19.760 --> 0:23:22.120
<v Speaker 2>David was an old friend of hers At the time.

0:23:22.200 --> 0:23:24.960
<v Speaker 2>She said she was dating someone else, a boyfriend who

0:23:25.000 --> 0:23:28.040
<v Speaker 2>was not Paul Lloyd. David said Glenna and her boyfriend

0:23:28.080 --> 0:23:30.080
<v Speaker 2>could come to Arkansas to get back on their feet.

0:23:30.440 --> 0:23:31.040
<v Speaker 3>She agreed.

0:23:31.680 --> 0:23:34.680
<v Speaker 2>David picked Glenna and her boyfriend up at the bus

0:23:34.680 --> 0:23:37.760
<v Speaker 2>station in Hot Springs. She and her boyfriend went to

0:23:37.800 --> 0:23:41.000
<v Speaker 2>stay with David, David's girlfriend, Regina, who was living there

0:23:41.040 --> 0:23:44.600
<v Speaker 2>at the time, and Paul Lloyd. At the time, David

0:23:44.720 --> 0:23:48.000
<v Speaker 2>was making and selling meth for Wayne Hortman. After a

0:23:48.040 --> 0:23:50.600
<v Speaker 2>few weeks had gone by, Paul and Glenna made a plan.

0:23:50.920 --> 0:23:53.960
<v Speaker 2>Paul would drive her and her boyfriend back to Houston, Texas.

0:23:54.520 --> 0:23:57.960
<v Speaker 2>But then there was some drama because Glenna said, on

0:23:58.000 --> 0:24:00.560
<v Speaker 2>the night they were planning to leave, David found out

0:24:00.560 --> 0:24:02.480
<v Speaker 2>that Regina was cheating on him and they got into

0:24:02.480 --> 0:24:03.160
<v Speaker 2>a huge fight.

0:24:03.640 --> 0:24:05.120
<v Speaker 3>Now this is where the gun comes.

0:24:04.920 --> 0:24:09.560
<v Speaker 2>In because Glenna claim during that fight, Wayne Hortman asked

0:24:09.600 --> 0:24:12.960
<v Speaker 2>her to take David's SKS rifle out of the house

0:24:13.000 --> 0:24:15.160
<v Speaker 2>and give it to him. So she said that's what

0:24:15.240 --> 0:24:19.080
<v Speaker 2>she did. She took David's gun and gave it to Wayne. Afterwards,

0:24:19.120 --> 0:24:22.040
<v Speaker 2>she said, she Paul, and her boyfriend took off and

0:24:22.120 --> 0:24:25.840
<v Speaker 2>left for Houston. When they got to Houston, Glenna said

0:24:25.960 --> 0:24:28.480
<v Speaker 2>she and Paul dropped her boyfriend off and went to

0:24:28.480 --> 0:24:31.200
<v Speaker 2>get some meth in a motel room and partied all night.

0:24:32.160 --> 0:24:34.680
<v Speaker 2>Glenna said during that time, Paul was talking to her

0:24:34.680 --> 0:24:36.600
<v Speaker 2>about a meth deal that he was planning to make

0:24:36.640 --> 0:24:40.440
<v Speaker 2>with someone. Paul let those people take his truck. Then

0:24:40.520 --> 0:24:42.600
<v Speaker 2>the people Paul made the deal with never came back

0:24:42.640 --> 0:24:45.640
<v Speaker 2>with his vehicle. So then Paul called David back in

0:24:45.720 --> 0:24:49.360
<v Speaker 2>Arkansas and asked for help. Then David somehow arranged for

0:24:49.400 --> 0:24:53.280
<v Speaker 2>Paul to come home. Paul went back to Arkansas. Glenna

0:24:53.320 --> 0:24:56.120
<v Speaker 2>stayed in touch with him. They were dating at that point.

0:24:56.160 --> 0:24:58.480
<v Speaker 2>Glenna called Paul on New Year's Eve in nineteen ninety

0:24:58.520 --> 0:25:00.800
<v Speaker 2>four and they made plans for her to come stay

0:25:00.800 --> 0:25:04.520
<v Speaker 2>with him for a few days in Arkansas. So then Thursday,

0:25:04.600 --> 0:25:07.680
<v Speaker 2>January thirteenth rolled around, Glenna borrowed a car from a

0:25:07.720 --> 0:25:10.040
<v Speaker 2>friend of hers. She drove to Hot Springs and met

0:25:10.080 --> 0:25:13.680
<v Speaker 2>up with Paul on January fourteenth, Friday morning, David was

0:25:13.720 --> 0:25:16.800
<v Speaker 2>at work when Glenna got to their house, so she

0:25:16.920 --> 0:25:19.440
<v Speaker 2>said she didn't see him, but she and Paul party

0:25:19.520 --> 0:25:22.200
<v Speaker 2>that night and got back late. She said she never

0:25:22.240 --> 0:25:27.520
<v Speaker 2>saw David on Friday, so this brings us back to

0:25:27.560 --> 0:25:31.840
<v Speaker 2>that fateful next morning, January fifteenth, Glenna said David opened

0:25:31.840 --> 0:25:34.440
<v Speaker 2>the door between seven and eight am and told Paul

0:25:34.480 --> 0:25:36.840
<v Speaker 2>his mom was on the phone wondering why Paul wasn't

0:25:36.840 --> 0:25:41.360
<v Speaker 2>at work. We've heard that story before, but this is

0:25:41.400 --> 0:25:45.000
<v Speaker 2>where the story diverges because as Glenna said that, a

0:25:45.000 --> 0:25:48.600
<v Speaker 2>short while later, after David left for work, Wayne Hortman

0:25:48.720 --> 0:25:51.720
<v Speaker 2>came over to the house. Glenna said she knew who

0:25:51.760 --> 0:25:54.120
<v Speaker 2>Wayne was. She said Wayne and Paul had been in

0:25:54.160 --> 0:25:57.880
<v Speaker 2>business together dealing methamphetamines and on that morning, they had

0:25:57.960 --> 0:26:03.080
<v Speaker 2>unfinished business involving drugs, money, and a motorcycle. According to

0:26:03.120 --> 0:26:06.600
<v Speaker 2>what Glenna told police, Paul was planning to trade his

0:26:06.640 --> 0:26:10.640
<v Speaker 2>Suzuki Intruder motorcycle to Wayne in exchange for an unspecified

0:26:10.680 --> 0:26:14.400
<v Speaker 2>quantity of meth. Wayne wanted the bike, but Paul hadn't

0:26:14.400 --> 0:26:17.880
<v Speaker 2>received full payment yet, so on that morning, Wayne told

0:26:17.920 --> 0:26:19.720
<v Speaker 2>Paul he had the rest of what he owed him

0:26:19.760 --> 0:26:22.120
<v Speaker 2>meeting the drugs and that the meth was out near

0:26:22.160 --> 0:26:25.560
<v Speaker 2>a mountain somewhere. Wayne told Paul they should take a

0:26:25.680 --> 0:26:29.160
<v Speaker 2>ride out there. Paul agreed, and at first Wayne told

0:26:29.200 --> 0:26:32.360
<v Speaker 2>Glenna she should stay home, but Paul said no, that

0:26:32.440 --> 0:26:34.840
<v Speaker 2>he and Glenna would ride together in her car and

0:26:34.880 --> 0:26:38.120
<v Speaker 2>follow Wayne in his red truck. After that, Glenna and

0:26:38.160 --> 0:26:40.840
<v Speaker 2>Paul planned to ride to Malvern to pick up Paul's paycheck,

0:26:41.400 --> 0:26:44.320
<v Speaker 2>so Glenna said that's what they did. They left Hot

0:26:44.320 --> 0:26:48.000
<v Speaker 2>Springs together. Wayne drove in his red truck, Paul and

0:26:48.040 --> 0:26:51.200
<v Speaker 2>Glenna followed. When they got a few miles out of town,

0:26:51.280 --> 0:26:54.560
<v Speaker 2>the road started getting smaller, and then they turned onto

0:26:54.640 --> 0:26:57.280
<v Speaker 2>a dirt road, and, according to what Glenna told police,

0:26:57.480 --> 0:27:01.440
<v Speaker 2>across a low wooden bridge, approximately three miles down a

0:27:01.480 --> 0:27:05.240
<v Speaker 2>dirt path. She said the bridge was quote just long

0:27:05.280 --> 0:27:08.600
<v Speaker 2>boards crossing a creek. It was quite scary end quote.

0:27:09.440 --> 0:27:13.960
<v Speaker 2>Wayne stopped, she pulled up behind him. Paul got out

0:27:13.960 --> 0:27:16.560
<v Speaker 2>of her car and walked up to Wayne's truck. The

0:27:16.600 --> 0:27:18.640
<v Speaker 2>two of them sat in Wayne's truck for a few minutes,

0:27:18.680 --> 0:27:21.280
<v Speaker 2>and then they got out and Paul and Wayne started

0:27:21.320 --> 0:27:23.360
<v Speaker 2>walking up the side of a steep hill about fifty

0:27:23.440 --> 0:27:26.560
<v Speaker 2>yards away on the right side of the road. Glenna

0:27:26.680 --> 0:27:29.080
<v Speaker 2>saw that Wayne had a rifle that looked like the

0:27:29.080 --> 0:27:31.280
<v Speaker 2>one he asked her to take from David's house several

0:27:31.320 --> 0:27:34.400
<v Speaker 2>months earlier. She said they were gone for a few

0:27:34.400 --> 0:27:38.080
<v Speaker 2>minutes and then she saw Wayne hold the rifle up

0:27:38.120 --> 0:27:40.880
<v Speaker 2>and fire the first shot, but she said.

0:27:40.640 --> 0:27:41.680
<v Speaker 3>She didn't see what he hit.

0:27:42.320 --> 0:27:45.440
<v Speaker 2>Then she said she heard more guns, maybe three or four,

0:27:45.800 --> 0:27:50.000
<v Speaker 2>and then another final single shot. Glenna said in the

0:27:50.000 --> 0:27:52.920
<v Speaker 2>affidavit quote, I don't like guns, and I was already

0:27:52.960 --> 0:27:54.720
<v Speaker 2>scared of being out in the woods, and I was

0:27:54.760 --> 0:27:57.720
<v Speaker 2>afraid someone would call the police to report the gunshots

0:27:57.920 --> 0:28:00.240
<v Speaker 2>that someone was out in the woods acting stupid. So

0:28:00.320 --> 0:28:03.640
<v Speaker 2>I started my car and drove off really fast. I said,

0:28:03.680 --> 0:28:05.680
<v Speaker 2>to hell with this, I'm not gonna end up in

0:28:05.720 --> 0:28:07.480
<v Speaker 2>jail because they want to play with guns. While in

0:28:07.480 --> 0:28:11.200
<v Speaker 2>the middle of the woods doing a dope deal end quote,

0:28:11.240 --> 0:28:14.360
<v Speaker 2>she said she got back into her car and drove away.

0:28:15.400 --> 0:28:19.920
<v Speaker 2>If Glenna's account is accurate, it directly contradicts the version

0:28:19.920 --> 0:28:24.600
<v Speaker 2>of events presented at trial. So why didn't Glenna come

0:28:24.640 --> 0:28:28.560
<v Speaker 2>forward sooner? She said in her affidavit that she was

0:28:28.640 --> 0:28:32.000
<v Speaker 2>unaware that David had been convicted of Paul's murder. She

0:28:32.160 --> 0:28:34.480
<v Speaker 2>said if she knew what was going on at the time,

0:28:34.920 --> 0:28:37.920
<v Speaker 2>that she would have gone to the police. In addition

0:28:37.960 --> 0:28:41.640
<v Speaker 2>to Glenna's accounts of what happened that morning, David produced

0:28:41.640 --> 0:28:45.480
<v Speaker 2>other affidavits from his two young sons. David's son Carl,

0:28:45.600 --> 0:28:48.240
<v Speaker 2>stated in the affidavit that David could not have killed

0:28:48.280 --> 0:28:51.840
<v Speaker 2>Paul because on the night that Paul disappeared, David was

0:28:51.840 --> 0:28:55.600
<v Speaker 2>with Carl and his brother Cody all night. He remembers

0:28:55.720 --> 0:28:58.520
<v Speaker 2>David falling asleep in the recliner holding Cody and not

0:28:58.600 --> 0:29:00.320
<v Speaker 2>waking up and leaving until his.

0:29:00.360 --> 0:29:02.360
<v Speaker 3>Mom came in from her late night shift.

0:29:03.560 --> 0:29:06.840
<v Speaker 2>Carl said he remembered that day well because it was

0:29:06.840 --> 0:29:09.960
<v Speaker 2>the last night they spent with their father in ten years.

0:29:10.560 --> 0:29:13.760
<v Speaker 2>Carl said that the prosecutor did not allow him to testify,

0:29:13.840 --> 0:29:16.720
<v Speaker 2>but he said if he had, Carl would have sworn

0:29:16.760 --> 0:29:19.600
<v Speaker 2>in court that his father was with him and his brother.

0:29:20.360 --> 0:29:24.840
<v Speaker 2>Carl's brother Cody made a similar sworn affidavit. So if

0:29:24.840 --> 0:29:29.040
<v Speaker 2>those statements are true, why was David charged with Paul's murder.

0:29:30.200 --> 0:29:33.960
<v Speaker 2>David testified during his trial that Wayne had told him

0:29:34.040 --> 0:29:36.800
<v Speaker 2>he had the police in his pocket and that if he,

0:29:37.080 --> 0:29:39.440
<v Speaker 2>meaning David, knew what was good for him, he would

0:29:39.520 --> 0:29:43.840
<v Speaker 2>keep quiet about Paul Lloyd. David said Wayne told him

0:29:44.000 --> 0:29:46.280
<v Speaker 2>he had at least fifty instances where he had cut

0:29:46.320 --> 0:29:48.440
<v Speaker 2>deals with the police to get off of pending charges.

0:29:50.160 --> 0:29:53.880
<v Speaker 2>Wayne has completely denied that version of events and stated

0:29:54.120 --> 0:29:56.280
<v Speaker 2>he was not involved in Paul Lloyd's death.

0:29:56.920 --> 0:29:59.560
<v Speaker 3>It's important to remember all charges against.

0:29:59.320 --> 0:30:02.680
<v Speaker 2>Wayne Hortman were dropped, and neither he nor anyone else

0:30:02.760 --> 0:30:06.080
<v Speaker 2>connected to him has ever been arrested or charged in

0:30:06.120 --> 0:30:12.240
<v Speaker 2>connection with Paul Lloyd's murder. David was convicted of Paul's murder. However,

0:30:12.480 --> 0:30:16.000
<v Speaker 2>the inconsistencies in this case and the irregularities in the

0:30:16.000 --> 0:30:19.760
<v Speaker 2>prosecutor's behavior afterwards, have led a lot of people to

0:30:19.800 --> 0:30:23.920
<v Speaker 2>wonder what really happened on January fifteenth, nineteen ninety four

0:30:24.000 --> 0:30:26.800
<v Speaker 2>out in those woods? Was David Ferrell there at all?

0:30:27.480 --> 0:30:29.800
<v Speaker 2>And as we continue to look into this case, we

0:30:29.880 --> 0:30:33.640
<v Speaker 2>have been communicating with David Ferrell. We would also like

0:30:33.720 --> 0:30:37.960
<v Speaker 2>to talk to anyone who was involved in Dan Harmon's prosecutions.

0:30:38.640 --> 0:30:43.320
<v Speaker 2>Did David Ferrell really kill Paul Lloyd? And if it

0:30:43.360 --> 0:30:47.040
<v Speaker 2>wasn't David Ferrell, could Paul's killer still be out there?

0:30:48.080 --> 0:30:52.960
<v Speaker 2>I'm Katherine Townsend. This is Helen Gone Murder Line. Helen

0:30:53.000 --> 0:30:55.000
<v Speaker 2>Gone Murder Line is a production of School of Humans

0:30:55.000 --> 0:30:58.160
<v Speaker 2>and iHeart Podcasts. It's written and narrated by me Catherine

0:30:58.160 --> 0:31:02.040
<v Speaker 2>Townsend and produced by Etily's Perez Special thanks to Amy

0:31:02.080 --> 0:31:05.320
<v Speaker 2>Tubbs for her research assistance and James Wheaton for legal review.

0:31:05.720 --> 0:31:08.480
<v Speaker 2>Noah Camera mixed and scored this episode. Our theme song

0:31:08.560 --> 0:31:12.600
<v Speaker 2>is by Ben Sale, Executive producers of Virginia Prescott, Brandon Barr,

0:31:12.640 --> 0:31:16.200
<v Speaker 2>and LC Crowley. Listen to Helen Gone adfree by subscribing

0:31:16.240 --> 0:31:19.400
<v Speaker 2>to the iHeart True Crime Plus channel on Apple Podcasts.

0:31:19.880 --> 0:31:22.360
<v Speaker 2>If you were interested in seeing documents and materials from

0:31:22.360 --> 0:31:25.160
<v Speaker 2>the case, you can follow the show on Instagram at

0:31:25.320 --> 0:31:28.040
<v Speaker 2>Helen gonpod. If you have a case you'd like me

0:31:28.080 --> 0:31:30.120
<v Speaker 2>and my team to look into. You can reach out

0:31:30.120 --> 0:31:32.240
<v Speaker 2>to us at our Helen Gone Murder Line at six

0:31:32.320 --> 0:31:35.760
<v Speaker 2>seven eight seven four four six one four five. That's

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<v Speaker 2>six seven eight seven four four six' one four.

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<v Speaker 1>Five school Of humans