Speaker 1: You're listening to Comedy Central. Wow from New York City,
Speaker 1: the only city in America. HiT's the show, then Hetting News,
Speaker 1: He's the Daily Show with your home cow Man. Welcome
Speaker 1: to the Daily Show. I'm cal Penn. I'm back for
Speaker 1: night too. Now listen after last night's show, this is
Speaker 1: very sweet. I got so many encouraging words from some
Speaker 1: of my political colleagues, and I wanted to read some
Speaker 1: of them from for you. This is an email I
Speaker 1: got from from Speaker Nancy Pelosi. Uh. It says, cal,
Speaker 1: if you don't donate five dollars by tonight, we're all
Speaker 1: gonna die. Thank you, Nancy. That was so touching. Anyway,
Speaker 1: we've got a great show for you tonight. Our guest
Speaker 1: tonight is the Foreign Minister of Pakistan. But first let's
Speaker 1: get into the headlines. Okay, let's kick things off with
Speaker 1: a big announcement from President Joe Biden. You remember during
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty campaign, Biden said this, by the way,
Speaker 1: no more drilling non federal lands period period period period,
Speaker 1: period period period COMMA. Because now Biden has approved a
Speaker 1: major oil drilling project on federal land in Alaska, which
Speaker 1: is disappointing, but Hey, when you're that age, that's the
Speaker 1: only kind of drilling you can do. No, come on,
Speaker 1: I'm kidding, I'm kidding, I'm kidding. I'm kidding this guy. Fin.
Speaker 1: The crazy part about this drilling project is that they'll
Speaker 1: be installing a device called a thermosypher that keeps the
Speaker 1: perma frost solid enough for drilling while it simultaneously melts
Speaker 1: due to global warming. Guest Cottaco Phillips has an irony division.
Speaker 1: I mean keeping the perma frost alive so they can
Speaker 1: kill it slowly. That's like some silence of the Lamb's
Speaker 1: Serial killer. Shit, would your planet? I'd see the planet.
Speaker 1: I worked at the White House, Now, Litsten, listen the
Speaker 1: good news. The good news is that Biden is also
Speaker 1: flip flopping in a good way, because back in the day,
Speaker 1: Biden used to think marijuana was a gateway drug, but
Speaker 1: now he's doing stuff like this. President Biden is offering
Speaker 1: help to people who have a federal conviction for simple
Speaker 1: marijuana possession so can now apply for a presidential pardon.
Speaker 1: To qualify, applicants must have been charged or convicted in
Speaker 1: federal court or DC Superior Court before October sixth of
Speaker 1: last year. This is huge and this is long overtoor
Speaker 1: yeah and look heartfelt. This is a moment of special
Speaker 1: congrats to the advocates who have been pushing for this
Speaker 1: for so long. They really did it now. They convinced
Speaker 1: someone with five decades of experience in Washington to change
Speaker 1: his mind. That's not easy. That would be like convincing
Speaker 1: Mitch McConnell to let Democrats appoint judges, or convincing Chuck
Speaker 1: Schumer that his glasses should be resting on the top
Speaker 1: of his nose. The top In any case, if you're
Speaker 1: wondering what the Oval Office looks like now that Joe
Speaker 1: Biden is a total stoner, it probably looks something like this.
Speaker 1: It's the same. It's twenty twenty three. People who smoke
Speaker 1: weed don't put tapestries on their wall anymore. I mean, yeah,
Speaker 1: the portrait of George Washington does glow in black light now,
Speaker 1: but that's it mostly the same anyway. Let's move on
Speaker 1: to some science news. Apparently NASA is tracking an asteroid
Speaker 1: that could slam into Earth on Valentine's Day in twenty
Speaker 1: forty six, which means that friend of yours who always
Speaker 1: does those sad Valentine's Day posts like I'm gonna die
Speaker 1: alone actually is yeah, but if you're in a relationship,
Speaker 1: then in a way, it would kind of be beautiful
Speaker 1: to die on Valentine's Day, you know, making sweet love
Speaker 1: with your partner one last time, or if you're married,
Speaker 1: laying in bed too full from dinner to have sex
Speaker 1: watching Paul Blart one last time. Either way super romantic.
Speaker 1: In other scientific news, researchers did a study on flamingos
Speaker 1: and it turns out that flamingo's form clicks just like
Speaker 1: high schoolers. This is one of those studies where I
Speaker 1: feel like we need to know more about the science
Speaker 1: who did this study, because maybe the flamingos just didn't
Speaker 1: want to hang out with them specifically. Seriously, though this
Speaker 1: sounds terrible. It's tough enough being a flamingo, now you
Speaker 1: also have to deal with flamingo mean girls. They must
Speaker 1: be so cruel. Do you see how short her neck is?
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it's giving EMU. And look at her legs,
Speaker 1: they're like a whole centimeter thick. It's like paging doctor Cankos.
Speaker 1: I heard she got a beak enhancement and the zookeeper
Speaker 1: paid for it. They're like totally fine, right, Oh wait,
Speaker 1: wait she's coming over. Here's coming over here. Hi, Jenny,
Speaker 1: Oh my god, you know what, you look incredible? Okay, bye,
Speaker 1: I literally hate her. And finally, thank you preticulous. And finally,
Speaker 1: let's check in on my home state of New Jersey.
Speaker 1: I'm sure, I'm sure they're not doing anything incredibly stupid.
Speaker 1: The city of Newark is admitting it got scammed. Earlier
Speaker 1: this year, Mayor ros Baraka invited who he thought was
Speaker 1: the Hindu nation of Kailasa at a city hall for
Speaker 1: a cultural trade agreement and to become sister cities. But
Speaker 1: it turns out Kailasa isn't a real nation, but rather
Speaker 1: the invention of a scam artist and fugitives from India
Speaker 1: who's been on the run since twenty nineteen. I have
Speaker 1: the immunity of non prosecute and immunity and protection as
Speaker 1: the end of the state. He was arrested their years earlier,
Speaker 1: accused of sexual assault charges by five women who say
Speaker 1: he abused them at a religious retreat back in New Jersey.
Speaker 1: A few days after this ceremony, the city says it
Speaker 1: realized it had been deceived, calling it quote a regrettable
Speaker 1: incident this Newark. How can an entire city get catfished?
Speaker 1: Not a single person realized they never heard of this
Speaker 1: country before, not on a globe, not at the Olympics,
Speaker 1: not as a stage and street fighter. Look, if you
Speaker 1: can't find it as a cuisine on grubhub, it's not
Speaker 1: a real country. There must have been so many red flags,
Speaker 1: the biggest one being that anyone wanted to be sister
Speaker 1: cities with Newark. Although, look, to be fair, just because
Speaker 1: the country was started by a sex criminal doesn't mean
Speaker 1: it's fake. Just ask Thomas Jefferson for more on this.
Speaker 1: Please give it up for Daisy Leidecks. Why did you
Speaker 1: make of this story? Oh well, Calum, as a white person,
Speaker 1: I would like to know what you think of this story,
Speaker 1: because for me, I don't know. This is a little dicey.
Speaker 1: I don't want to upset anybody with any statements about
Speaker 1: whether Kailasa is a real country. Okay, well it's not.
Speaker 1: It's not a real country. It's a cult right right
Speaker 1: right then? Even so, I honor its culture and it's
Speaker 1: rich traditions, because what is culture if not culture? Does
Speaker 1: he come on, look look how they're dressed. Does that
Speaker 1: look real to you. Yes, no, no, no, no, those
Speaker 1: are just costumes. Whoa cal Their culture is not a costume.
Speaker 1: That is literally a costume. Does he? I understand what
Speaker 1: you're trying to do. You want to be an ally
Speaker 1: I definitely appreciate that. But Kailasa does not deserve your
Speaker 1: ally ship. It's leader as a sexual predator. Oh absolutely yes,
Speaker 1: and I can them all sexual predators. At the same time,
Speaker 1: it is important to support diversity among sexual predators. No, no, no,
Speaker 1: it's not. Does he stopped? This is a cult and
Speaker 1: they scammed the city of Newark. Of course they did. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1: they did. And they've been forced into a cult, into
Speaker 1: cult behaviors by Western imperialism. And isn't that the real scam? No? No, no,
Speaker 1: well yes, yes, but but no, wait, now you're confusing me.
Speaker 1: Hold on, there is no Western imperialism against Kailasa. There
Speaker 1: is no Kailasa. There are no Kyla sans. We say
Speaker 1: kilosans X. Now no we don't. Does he? Look? Look,
Speaker 1: I am giving you permission to criticize this fake country
Speaker 1: on behalf of brown people. It's okay. I'm not worried
Speaker 1: about brown people. Cow, I'm worried about other white people.
Speaker 1: If I disrespect this fake nation, they'll make my real
Speaker 1: Twitter a living hell. Does Kailassa look like a scammy called? Yes?
Speaker 1: Do I trust white people on Twitter to know the difference? No,
Speaker 1: Which is why I am proud to announce that The
Speaker 1: Daily Show, hosted by Cal Penn is now also a
Speaker 1: sister city with Kailasa No One. Oh my god, don't
Speaker 1: get out of your room. Don't you want? Everyone must?
Speaker 1: I'll be taking you on a tour by vibe. Oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, here, welcome back to The Daily Show. Look,
Speaker 1: a lot of people would be surprised to know that
Speaker 1: one of my favorite sports is a NASCAR Now. I
Speaker 1: know I don't look like your stereotypical NASCAR fan, but
Speaker 1: I also don't look like your stereotypical Abercrombie and Fitch homosexual. Yeah,
Speaker 1: here we are. So what do I love about Nascar?
Speaker 1: Take a look? Yeah, I know you're looking at me,
Speaker 1: and you're like, seriously, Cal, you've been a NASCAR fan
Speaker 1: for twelve years? Yes, my full of Blue state libs.
Speaker 1: Grab a beer and come with me. Nascar has it
Speaker 1: all day drinking, grilling, whoever this guy is and whoever
Speaker 1: this guy is wait, is that kid rock WHOA? You
Speaker 1: get here in this track and you fill the rumble
Speaker 1: inside you when those cars are going around. I'm getting
Speaker 1: chills just thinking about it right now. I felt the
Speaker 1: rumble in my dick. Yeah, exactly. I wasn't mad about it.
Speaker 1: I'm mad about it either. Yes, Okay, here's the deal.
Speaker 1: NASCAR is different from what you probably think. I feel
Speaker 1: like people think it's just really like a redneck thing,
Speaker 1: and I mean it kind of is, but it's for everyone,
Speaker 1: you know. I'm like, I've watched NASCAR since I was
Speaker 1: like twelve or before then because of because of my
Speaker 1: parents going to NASCAR races. Black people love racing. People
Speaker 1: may not realize how much African Americans love, not just NASCAR,
Speaker 1: any form of racing. Bubba Wallace is one of the
Speaker 1: biggest stars in the sport, and he happens to agree.
Speaker 1: I think, you know, from from outside looking in, especially minorities,
Speaker 1: feel the stigma's been there that they're not welcome. And
Speaker 1: I've always been like, that's not really true. You know,
Speaker 1: I've been in nascars my career. Who's been twenty years? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Years nine? Okay, Wow, I can tell you right now
Speaker 1: there is no New Jersey Parrot would let their kid
Speaker 1: drive at nine. So I always get the question what's
Speaker 1: it like being an Indian American actor? I would imagine
Speaker 1: it also drives you insane to get the question, Oh,
Speaker 1: what's it like being a black driver? So, what's it
Speaker 1: like being a black driver? So quick bite and news
Speaker 1: outlets they have to get their viewership up, and all
Speaker 1: the way they do that is black driver. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: don't walk around saying I'm a black driver. Yeah. So yeah,
Speaker 1: you embrace it and you go out and enjoy what
Speaker 1: you do. After I got my media clickbait, we moved
Speaker 1: on to an issue that every day Americans actually care about.
Speaker 1: All Right, A lot of people really want to know this.
Speaker 1: How do you pee in four hundred miles? I can't
Speaker 1: go forty five minutes without having ye, So, have you
Speaker 1: ever been in a high a journalan moment? Well once
Speaker 1: I once wrote a cheetah in the movie I know exactly,
Speaker 1: So you're really in the zone then for for that
Speaker 1: that's also and they always say if you do pee
Speaker 1: in the car, then you got to be there Monday
Speaker 1: morning to clean it out. Oh do you want to
Speaker 1: clean it out? You don't have somebody for that. They're
Speaker 1: not gonna do it. Here's here's here's here's another stereotype.
Speaker 1: Drivers aren't real athletes. They just lazily sit there making
Speaker 1: left turns. The athleticism side of it. To me, you
Speaker 1: know our heart rates, you know, peek at about one
Speaker 1: seven year ago and then during the race you're around
Speaker 1: the one forty area. I mean that's all. That's a
Speaker 1: high heart rate for a sustained long period time. And
Speaker 1: hydration is huge. I can lose up to about seven
Speaker 1: pounds in the race car on him one race? Yes, sir, oh,
Speaker 1: can I drive this race? I would love to look.
Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you, thank you. I appreciate that. And
Speaker 1: the drivers aren't the only jocks on the track. Meet
Speaker 1: DeLanda when Dano, a former college athlete who trained as
Speaker 1: a tire changer after being recruited through NASCAR's diversity initiative.
Speaker 1: Everybody knows how to change a time. Well, I don't
Speaker 1: know how to change the tirement. But what's the big
Speaker 1: deal about changing tires. It's just about how fast you
Speaker 1: can do it. One tire can take like maybe two
Speaker 1: or three seconds. We did reps after raps otter reps
Speaker 1: every time because I think two towns on the seconds
Speaker 1: cost a lot of money for our team if you
Speaker 1: make a mistake. As someone who was recently told he
Speaker 1: had a good physique, I knew that joining the pit
Speaker 1: crew would be easy. So like the jackman's jack in
Speaker 1: the car up, I'm like, deck, that's it up. He
Speaker 1: jacks it up. The guy's giving up some gas. I
Speaker 1: grabbed the other tire because that gonna take it out,
Speaker 1: and I bring it back like this and I kick
Speaker 1: it over there, and then everyone's like, we're almost gonna
Speaker 1: go win. So I grabba like that, bring it back
Speaker 1: over here, and I'm like, okay, great job, and the
Speaker 1: driver takes off. So he wins the race and we
Speaker 1: win a lot of money. Yeah, and theory, I think
Speaker 1: we missed a couple of steps, but yeah, and that's
Speaker 1: a penalty. After crushing it with the pit crew, I
Speaker 1: wanted to see if there were any indoor jobs with
Speaker 1: air condition. There's just so much more data and science
Speaker 1: that goes into it than I think anybody really realizes
Speaker 1: when they see cars car around in circles, right, So
Speaker 1: data comes from the cars, and then the car has
Speaker 1: its speed, it's got it's it's rpm and the gear
Speaker 1: that it's in. That's like, is the car loose, like
Speaker 1: wants to spin out? Or is it tight? We look
Speaker 1: at what the driver is doing with the wheel and
Speaker 1: then we try and tell him, Hey, you need to
Speaker 1: turn the wheel less or you need to be on
Speaker 1: the gas more. This sounds like cheating. Tom Brady fans
Speaker 1: would love this absolutely. As a number crunching genius Jr.
Speaker 1: Represents the new NASCAR and has that a front row
Speaker 1: seat to the sports evolution, the sports way different than
Speaker 1: it has been in the past. You know, my husband
Speaker 1: and I talk about it all the time, even myself
Speaker 1: working for Bubba. You know, I think a lot of
Speaker 1: people have always thought that this sport was kind of
Speaker 1: out of reach, not only because of they couldn't get
Speaker 1: into the sport, but also because they wouldn't be accepted
Speaker 1: by the sport. I mean, I think that just being
Speaker 1: out there and being vocal is super important. And I
Speaker 1: never thought twelve year old me would be doing it. Well,
Speaker 1: this was twelve year old me, and he would have
Speaker 1: been terrified by what I'm about to do. Where do
Speaker 1: I connect the bluetooth for the podcast? Oh? I was
Speaker 1: These things are meant for it to go fast, So
Speaker 1: anything extra, we just pull out of the car. Okay,
Speaker 1: I can't drive stick? Is that a problem? Now you're good? Okay.
Speaker 1: He basically just put you forth here to push you off. Man,
Speaker 1: do only the snowflake drivers get the push since we
Speaker 1: can't drive stick? Pretty much? Here we go. This is
Speaker 1: real inclusion NASCAR making space for athletes like me who
Speaker 1: can't drive stick. About to get a gap, to give
Speaker 1: a gap, to give a gap, give a gap. Recredible hunting,
Speaker 1: all of it, an run? Want to back D're in
Speaker 1: a car okay than one out there? All good? Share
Speaker 1: that fruit dry? Yeah? Yeah, but then I was like
Speaker 1: getting into it, and then after I paid my pants,
Speaker 1: it was such a relief. That was awesome. Okay, that
Speaker 1: was fun and I lost two pounds. But there is
Speaker 1: a more social way to enjoy racing. Hey, guys, can
Speaker 1: I come up? Thank you? This is the infield where
Speaker 1: families camp out for the weekend to watch the races
Speaker 1: up close. Sure, thank you, cheers, thank you guys. How
Speaker 1: long have you been coming here? For twenty three years?
Speaker 1: We're all family. You definitely have the best view, and
Speaker 1: that's really what NASCAR is all about. Family, speed and
Speaker 1: crushing beers on top of an RVW with a group
Speaker 1: of new friends. All right, stay tuned because when we
Speaker 1: come back, but Foreign Minister of Pakistan we'll be joining me,
Speaker 1: so don't go away, ye, welcome back to the Daily Show.
Speaker 1: My guest tonight is the Foreign Minister of Pakistan. Please
Speaker 1: welcome Billiwal Bhutto Zardari. Hell n to see him, a welcome,
Speaker 1: thank you, thank you for having me of course, thanks
Speaker 1: for being here for for folks who don't know. Your
Speaker 1: mom was former Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto who was assassinated
Speaker 1: in two thousand and seven. But now you are the
Speaker 1: youngest foreign minister in Pakistan's history. You're thirty four, true, yeah,
Speaker 1: and you're a very young country. I think the median
Speaker 1: age in Pakistan is only twenty something like that, right,
Speaker 1: sixty percent of our population and beneath the age of
Speaker 1: thirty five. Wow. So how does how does your age
Speaker 1: create an opportunity for leadership in a country that's so young. Oh,
Speaker 1: that's an interesting question. I think that most of if
Speaker 1: you look at the politics and Parkistan are the political
Speaker 1: landscape landscape, it's one or two generations above me that
Speaker 1: are that are the main players. So I'm sure that
Speaker 1: given that I am so young, I think bring a
Speaker 1: unique perspective, And I think that's so important because everybody
Speaker 1: who's in power right now or in positions of influence
Speaker 1: and making decision for our country, they'll live for ten
Speaker 1: twenty years. We have to think about sort of the
Speaker 1: long picture now, climate change and poverty and all the
Speaker 1: income in inequality and discrimination that people are facing across
Speaker 1: the country. How are we going to address those issues
Speaker 1: in the long term. Do you feel like there's every
Speaker 1: generational divide between the people who you think? Absolutely, I
Speaker 1: think it's a It's been an experience working with people
Speaker 1: from a whole host of different age groups, and absolutely
Speaker 1: I felt a sort of throughout my political career just
Speaker 1: as a result of my age. Perhaps the same idea
Speaker 1: is same suggestions given from other people of a most
Speaker 1: senior age will be taken more seriously as opposed to
Speaker 1: coming from a younger perspective. But at the same time,
Speaker 1: I think I'd like to say I've proven over the
Speaker 1: course of time, whether I was in opposition or a
Speaker 1: foreign minister, that ages just in number and we can
Speaker 1: still get quite a lot done. So it's it's time
Speaker 1: we're having you here tonight, tropical right now. You know,
Speaker 1: Pakistan is facing some unrest over the imminent arrest of
Speaker 1: former Prime Minister in Ron Khan. Mister Kan says that
Speaker 1: your government wants him arrested so that he's disqualified from
Speaker 1: upcoming elections. Is that true? Okay? So, unfortunately, Pakistan is
Speaker 1: facing a perfect store. Not only do we have heightened
Speaker 1: by heightened partisanship and political polarization to the extent that
Speaker 1: political parties or political stakeholders aren't even in a position
Speaker 1: to sit in a room and discuss issues amongst themselves.
Speaker 1: We're also facing an economic crisis. We're facing a security
Speaker 1: threat and security crisis, and that fall out from into
Speaker 1: the fall of the of Khan government and the increasing
Speaker 1: the terrorist attacks that are taking place with increasing frequency
Speaker 1: in Pakistan. We just face the biggest climate catastrophe of
Speaker 1: our history, where a third of the land mass of
Speaker 1: our country was under water. That's something that my generation
Speaker 1: generations to come are going to be paying the price
Speaker 1: for the decisions that others have taken. And unfortunately, in
Speaker 1: all this chaos and in all these while we're facing
Speaker 1: these simultaneous crises, we have the question of mister Khan,
Speaker 1: who believes that the Pakistani constitution doesn't apply to him,
Speaker 1: the Pakistani law doesn't apply to him, that he can
Speaker 1: get up and leave, is resigned from parliament and a
Speaker 1: runaway in the system. In this particular instance, it's not
Speaker 1: a question of me wanting to arrest mister Khan. I
Speaker 1: come from a family who faced genuine arrest in the
Speaker 1: face of military dictatorships. My mom my mother, when she
Speaker 1: was younger than me, she battled it in this Islamist
Speaker 1: dictator at the time who threw her in prison. My
Speaker 1: father spent eleven and a half years in prison and
Speaker 1: was tortured without a conviction. I would never want any
Speaker 1: politician in my country or any country to go to
Speaker 1: go to jail for political reasons. In mister Khan's case,
Speaker 1: he's under the threat of arrest because of his ego.
Speaker 1: He says, the courts are saying that he has to
Speaker 1: come to court and fight his cases, whatever cases are,
Speaker 1: he gets them, and he says, I'm a rand Khan
Speaker 1: and I'm too important and I'm not going to turn
Speaker 1: up to court. And what we've seen over the last
Speaker 1: couple of weeks has been a complete mockery of the
Speaker 1: judicial system in Pakistan or rule or law of the
Speaker 1: constitution in Pakistan, where had he gone to court. There's
Speaker 1: probably no reason he had to fear imminent arrest because
Speaker 1: he's violated court orders time and time again. Finally, the
Speaker 1: courts have instructed the police to produce him before court,
Speaker 1: but he's called on his citizen, on his workers, on
Speaker 1: his supporters to come and confront the police. The police
Speaker 1: went to him with no intention of violence. And as
Speaker 1: you may be aware of Pakistan's histories full of politicians
Speaker 1: who have gone to prison right, wrong or otherwise, in
Speaker 1: this case, mister Khan is refusing to even present himself
Speaker 1: before court, refusing to defend himself. I'm sure if he's innocent,
Speaker 1: he'll be able to clear his names through the judicial system.
Speaker 1: So we caught in a situation with his this political
Speaker 1: chaos playing out on the streets and distracting from the
Speaker 1: real issues that are affecting everyday Pakistani's What does that
Speaker 1: say about the state of democracy in Pakistan? Is it
Speaker 1: fragile right now? Now? Absolutely? Pakistan has been most of
Speaker 1: our history into direct military dictatorship. After the assassination of
Speaker 1: my mother is a brief period of democratic transition. Political
Speaker 1: parties came together, they reached a consensus that you know,
Speaker 1: we removed all the detator's laws from the constitution, devolved
Speaker 1: power to parliament, had peaceful transfer of power for the
Speaker 1: first time in our history from one government to another.
Speaker 1: And those people or those forces that benefit from undemocratic
Speaker 1: rule in Barkistan didn't like that. So they they they
Speaker 1: supported mister Khan and brought him into power. And that's
Speaker 1: now blown up not only in those individuals face, but
Speaker 1: has had severe consequences for our country. You talked about
Speaker 1: your own family, and so I just wanted to expand
Speaker 1: on that because I think for an American audience especially,
Speaker 1: you see a lot of politicians, not just in Barkistan
Speaker 1: but obviously many countries, regardless of political party, who are
Speaker 1: accused of corruption, accused of other charges in and out
Speaker 1: of prison or violence. How do you know whether someone
Speaker 1: has committed a credible violation of law or whether something
Speaker 1: is politic motivated. What's the litmus there? And how do
Speaker 1: your voters, not just from your party but overall in Pakistan,
Speaker 1: how do they respond to that? And how do you
Speaker 1: take that tip with it? So that is something that
Speaker 1: I've lived with my entire life because my mother was
Speaker 1: Prime Minister of Pakistan for a few years, but she
Speaker 1: spent most of her life in opposition, either in country,
Speaker 1: in prison or in exile, fighting not one but two
Speaker 1: military dictatorships. She spent those thirty years of her life
Speaker 1: fighting politically motivated cases where the perception was built in
Speaker 1: the media and otherwise at this corruption and whole host
Speaker 1: of allegations. After she was assassinated, her name has been
Speaker 1: cleared from each in every single case, and that was
Speaker 1: lodged against her in her lifetime, and I as her son,
Speaker 1: and who's someone who lived through that, really wish that
Speaker 1: had happened while she was still hearing amongst us. Unfortunately,
Speaker 1: that was the tradition of Pakistani politics. After my mother's assassination,
Speaker 1: the big political parties in Pakistan came to again. Then
Speaker 1: they said, look, if we're going to be fighting amongst
Speaker 1: ourselves all the time and taking our political differences as
Speaker 1: personal differences, and whoever's in power they arrest the opposition,
Speaker 1: then we're never going to get anything done as a country.
Speaker 1: And we saw a gap of ten years where we
Speaker 1: didn't go after each other with two different political parties
Speaker 1: came into power, they saved up, they served out their term,
Speaker 1: We're voted out and the people and the next political
Speaker 1: party claim into place. Mister Khan is the one who
Speaker 1: unfortunately broke those precedences. So you're talking about essentially what
Speaker 1: sounds like a fragile democracy and things that are are malleable,
Speaker 1: and moving back and forth to what extent does that
Speaker 1: impact economics in Pakistan? I know that right now the
Speaker 1: IMF and you are, you know, sort of at odds,
Speaker 1: and I know that you know they're withholding some money
Speaker 1: until tax reforms are met. I believe that was correct.
Speaker 1: Me if I'm wrong, that was negotiated by previous government.
Speaker 1: But now you're in power, you're dailing. The carpet party
Speaker 1: needs to follow up on what was negotiated. So how
Speaker 1: does that political instability then affect? So two things. As
Speaker 1: far as how democratic are we right now? I would
Speaker 1: say we're in a democratic transition and I hope that
Speaker 1: this goes well and we transition towards a more democratic
Speaker 1: society because I believe that Pakistan is facing a whole
Speaker 1: host of problems. But no matter the problem, the answer
Speaker 1: is in more democracy. But I might be wrong and
Speaker 1: it could go the other way. As far as our
Speaker 1: economic situation is concerned, as I mentioned, we're in the
Speaker 1: perfect storm. You're absolutely right. The deal with the IMF
Speaker 1: is made by the previous government, and the previous government
Speaker 1: violated that deal with the IMF that put Pakistan in
Speaker 1: an extremely precarious economic situation. We've also liked the rest
Speaker 1: of the field feeling the economic impacts of the war
Speaker 1: in Ukraine, of the COVID pandemic, and at the same time,
Speaker 1: as a result the fall of Carbol a year ago,
Speaker 1: we've seen the return to terrorism in our country, an
Speaker 1: increase in terrorist activity that has its own impact on economics,
Speaker 1: and the climate catastrophe, the floods that took out five
Speaker 1: million acres of standing crops one in seven pakistanis that's
Speaker 1: thirty three million people were affected. Many people are still affected.
Speaker 1: All of these things coming together, sorry, all of these
Speaker 1: things coming together put our economy under incredible strain and stress.
Speaker 1: And you're absolutely right. Our negotiations are still ongoing and
Speaker 1: have not been concluded with the IMF. And I completely
Speaker 1: I'm actually left to center political party, who within our
Speaker 1: own politics, calls for, you know, an increase in tax
Speaker 1: revenue equal sort of addressing the income inequalities, etc. But
Speaker 1: at this point of time, I think then, when Pakistan
Speaker 1: is facing such a perfect storm, some problems of our
Speaker 1: own creation, but some like the flood and others that
Speaker 1: are not of our own, that the conversation with the
Speaker 1: IMF really should take that into account. And I don't
Speaker 1: think it is at the moment. But in terms of
Speaker 1: how the tax structure works in Pakistan, I don't want
Speaker 1: to get two in the weeds on tax structure. I
Speaker 1: know that's not that's not your job. But one of
Speaker 1: the things that I was arounded of when I was
Speaker 1: when I was prepping for a conversation, I know that
Speaker 1: you're from a historically from a relatively wealthy landowning family,
Speaker 1: and there are many in Pakistan. Do you know who
Speaker 1: Bernie Sanders is? Yes, Okay, so Bernie. You know Bernie's
Speaker 1: a big fan of making sure the one percent pay
Speaker 1: their fair share and all that big topic here. Is
Speaker 1: there a version of that in Pakistan? Can the wealthiest
Speaker 1: families do something to sort of help economically? That's so
Speaker 1: interesting that you are answer that question from the mainstream
Speaker 1: political parties in Pakistan with the Pakistan People's Party and
Speaker 1: we are the left of center political party today. We're
Speaker 1: a left of center political party. When we started out,
Speaker 1: we were actually a socialist a political party, and my
Speaker 1: grandfather was heading the party at the time. Became the
Speaker 1: country's prime minister, and that's exactly what he did. He
Speaker 1: rebelled against his own class because he is a rich,
Speaker 1: wealthy landlord that owned masses of land. But he led
Speaker 1: land reforms which took away vast amounts of lands with
Speaker 1: the wealthy and redistributed it amongst the landlist people of
Speaker 1: the area. He read industrial reforms where twenty two families
Speaker 1: in Pakistan had like a death grip on our economy
Speaker 1: and they own all the industry in our country. So
Speaker 1: then he nationalized the industry so that it worked for
Speaker 1: the many and not for the few. Mala Bernie. At
Speaker 1: the moment, unfortunately, where we are in Pakistan is very
Speaker 1: far away from the vision that the founders of my
Speaker 1: party laid out or the efforts that my mother did
Speaker 1: as far as addressing the gap between the rich and poor.
Speaker 1: And what we have is a system where the elites
Speaker 1: like myself can whether these storms without much pain or
Speaker 1: without feeling much difference, but whether it is our deals
Speaker 1: with the IMF or our own internal economic policy. There's
Speaker 1: an outside burden on the poorest of the poor. There's
Speaker 1: an outside version, a burden on the bottom of the pyramid,
Speaker 1: and what we'd like to see. I believe the only
Speaker 1: way for us to have a functioning economy that works
Speaker 1: for everyone would be not only for everyone to pay
Speaker 1: their fair share as far as taxation is concerned, but
Speaker 1: we do need a fundamental reform about how we talk
Speaker 1: about our economy and what decisions we take domestically in
Speaker 1: order to achieve that. I know that last year you
Speaker 1: did a lot of work raising awareness on the fact
Speaker 1: that a third of your country was underwater from those
Speaker 1: devastating floods. That's obviously faded from international news since then.
Speaker 1: Can you give us an update on the status of
Speaker 1: the people affected? No, thank you so much for asking.
Speaker 1: We're a country that is experienced floods and monsoons consistently.
Speaker 1: This was something apocalyptic out of sort of you know
Speaker 1: Olah Noah's Arks floods scale. I've never seen anything like it,
Speaker 1: and we're still battling with the consequences. I absolutely been
Speaker 1: raising awareness. I'm very grateful that the international community stood
Speaker 1: with Pakistan on not one but two occasions. One at
Speaker 1: the COP where Pakistan was the chair of the Developing
Speaker 1: Countries Group of g seventy seven and we helped push
Speaker 1: for lost and damage to be included on a COPS agenda,
Speaker 1: which I think is a big achievement as far as
Speaker 1: the climate movement is concerned and the future of developing countries.
Speaker 1: And the second is when we had held a Resilient
Speaker 1: Climate Resilient Pakistan conference in Geneva, where the international community
Speaker 1: stood with us and pledged some money for reconstruction. As
Speaker 1: far as attention is concerned, of course, international media attention
Speaker 1: span is very small and that has moved on. But
Speaker 1: the sad thing is that domestic attention is moved on.
Speaker 1: I come from the province of Synth which is the
Speaker 1: most devastated. Two thirds of our province was on water
Speaker 1: is a result of this floods. The political conversation is
Speaker 1: moved on. We're talking about whether in around Kahn's going
Speaker 1: to get arrested or not, and we're not talking about
Speaker 1: the millions of people who are at the moment in
Speaker 1: danger of you know, I don't like to throw about
Speaker 1: where it's like famine, but there's a food food scarcity
Speaker 1: issue for them, the people that are thrown into poverty.
Speaker 1: I mean there's this impression right that it's a completely
Speaker 1: impoverished people that had no hope and this still poe.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's awful that anybody get affected by floods,
Speaker 1: but I just want to emphasize that of these people,
Speaker 1: thirty three million people that were affected, some of these
Speaker 1: people would. I mean, they're not living the most elitist lives,
Speaker 1: the most well off lives, but they were getting by.
Speaker 1: They had their little shop, they had their little bit
Speaker 1: of land that they were eking a living out of,
Speaker 1: and they've been thrown into poverty. And it's going to
Speaker 1: take us a while to claw back from that. And
Speaker 1: until we do so, unfortunately, I wish I could stand
Speaker 1: here and say that my country was paying the attention
Speaker 1: that it should to this issue, but unfortunately I'm afraid
Speaker 1: to him and we're being distracted. Uh. I want to
Speaker 1: ask you about solutions. Also, you mentioned loss and damage.
Speaker 1: We said and damage. Can you talk about what that is?
Speaker 1: And then also what are what are sort of the
Speaker 1: plans on an addressing climate longer term for book? Okay,
Speaker 1: so the two arguments around the sort of the loss
Speaker 1: and damage to bake it. Coppon the sort of the
Speaker 1: more basic, sort of more activists approach that that conversation
Speaker 1: is that rich countries, industrialized countries have created this crisis
Speaker 1: and their whole host of countries climate climate crisis, the
Speaker 1: climate crisis, and it is a results of it's their industrialization, right,
Speaker 1: It's the rich worlds industrialization that the poor world is
Speaker 1: paying the cost of in the form of massive floods
Speaker 1: or massive droughts and um and there should be some
Speaker 1: loss of damage for this. Some people advocate for Repper.
Speaker 1: I'm actually not one of those people. I like to
Speaker 1: be sort of you know, left in our approach to
Speaker 1: politics and things, but I also like to get things done.
Speaker 1: I mean reparations was I feel like India, Pakistan and
Speaker 1: the US from the UK, That's exactly what I mean, right,
Speaker 1: So we haven't got any post colonial reparations and slavery reparations.
Speaker 1: The conversation hasn't going anyway. I mean, fair enough, the
Speaker 1: activists who want to argue for that should and it's
Speaker 1: it's a legitimate point to make. But I think a
Speaker 1: practical approach is for us to say, okay, loss and
Speaker 1: damage exists. Let's decide who's going to pay for it later.
Speaker 1: But actually it's a problem that we all have to
Speaker 1: address together, and international financial institutions are just not equipped
Speaker 1: to deal with even one climate tragedy to the scale
Speaker 1: of what we faced now. The unfortunate thing is not
Speaker 1: just one country. We have historic floods in Pakistan, so
Speaker 1: we have historic droughts in China. And at the same
Speaker 1: time you've got forest fires here in California or it's flooding,
Speaker 1: and so we need to rework international financial institutions. Rather
Speaker 1: than looking this as reparations, how are we going to
Speaker 1: work together to come up with the money to address
Speaker 1: loss and damage as a result of climate change. The
Speaker 1: fight to put loss and damage onto the agenda is
Speaker 1: a thirty year old fight. At the last clop it
Speaker 1: was achieved under the chairmanship of Egypt that it's now
Speaker 1: going to be on the agenda. It's going to take
Speaker 1: a while for this to be argued out in the
Speaker 1: international community to come to decision. It's an important, instant,
Speaker 1: important achievement. But rather than I don't want us to
Speaker 1: pit the global North against the global South and try
Speaker 1: and find solutions to climate change like that, I believe
Speaker 1: that this is a problem too big for just America
Speaker 1: to deal in on their own or just China to
Speaker 1: deal with on their own. This is something that the
Speaker 1: world has to come together and decide. Are we going
Speaker 1: to be distracted by war and conflict and politics as
Speaker 1: usual or are we going to find a solution to
Speaker 1: this problem? And I have just fect that, and I
Speaker 1: can say that like experiencing I've just experienced this from
Speaker 1: the Pakistani perspective, from this one flood that wiped out
Speaker 1: so much and caused so much devastation that we're not
Speaker 1: equipped for that. I see how, whether it's domestic politics
Speaker 1: or geopolitics get in the way of things we even
Speaker 1: can do now. So I hope that, I mean, I
Speaker 1: know that your president has done a lot of stuff
Speaker 1: domestically on climate and I really hope that that sort
Speaker 1: of approach, that sort of mentality is translated out into
Speaker 1: the world stage and we can work together to sort
Speaker 1: this out. Otherwise, Pakistan is we've contributed less than zero
Speaker 1: point one percent to the global carbon footprint, but we're
Speaker 1: amongst the ten most climate stress countries on the planet.
Speaker 1: Did you know that there's a third pole, There's a
Speaker 1: North Pole in a South Pole that we all knew
Speaker 1: about and we're worried about it's melting. The third pole
Speaker 1: is in Pakistan, in the Himalayan regions of ours. We
Speaker 1: like our numbers to go up. So just the third
Speaker 1: pole is technically in Pakistan. God just a number of
Speaker 1: glaciers on the peaks of the mountain ranges between our
Speaker 1: two countries, and i'm as a result of climate change.
Speaker 1: Obviously the North and South Pole are going to be melting,
Speaker 1: but the third Pole is going to be melting. Our
Speaker 1: rivers are fed by these glaciers. So what that means
Speaker 1: is in the short term, as these as this pole melts,
Speaker 1: as these glaciers melts, we will be faced by floods.
Speaker 1: The flood that we just experienced, by the way, not
Speaker 1: a river or in flood, a flood that came from
Speaker 1: the skies. We're predicted to face far more greater flooding
Speaker 1: from the rivers as these glaciers melt. Once these glaciers melt,
Speaker 1: our water source is done. We won't be able to
Speaker 1: provide drinking water for the people that live in my country.
Speaker 1: This is one country's problem when it comes to crimate change.
Speaker 1: There are a whole host of other countries that are
Speaker 1: facing for them and for us, the crisis is here
Speaker 1: and now this is not a tomorrow issue. For all
Speaker 1: of these issues. Is their capacity to take both in
Speaker 1: the short or long term for you or is that
Speaker 1: something that is being worked out? And I'm asking that
Speaker 1: also in the context of you are clearly very passionate
Speaker 1: about this issue. This almost goes back to my first
Speaker 1: question about you. Being a young leader in Pakistan, I
Speaker 1: would imagine you feel this issue a lot more than
Speaker 1: others night. So the two things. First of all, I'm
Speaker 1: very proud of the fact that my mother's last manifesto
Speaker 1: in two thousand and seven before she's assassinated, she was
Speaker 1: the first Pakistani politician to have climate on her agenda.
Speaker 1: And I often think that had we started addressing things
Speaker 1: then in two thousand and seventy eighty nine, maybe we
Speaker 1: wouldn't be here today. But despite all of that, I
Speaker 1: was not the you know, the most hyper of climate activist, like, Okay,
Speaker 1: I got it, we'll do some way and we'll do
Speaker 1: some solar and hopefully things will be fine. My worldview
Speaker 1: changed overnight. When my home, the village is around it,
Speaker 1: the people that I know it was suddenly just water
Speaker 1: as far as the eye could see it. It's and now, yeah, frankly,
Speaker 1: I go, Greta, I'm completely I think it is. We've
Speaker 1: been four four from uh. Until you know, until it
Speaker 1: doesn't happen to you, you don't really know what's coming.
Speaker 1: And now that it has happened to us, the thought
Speaker 1: that this could happen regularly, it devastated me because I've
Speaker 1: never felt so disempowered in that moment. What do you
Speaker 1: do when overnight thirty three million people need you to help.
Speaker 1: You don't have the tenths, you don't have the rations,
Speaker 1: You can't you don't we we're usually used to drought,
Speaker 1: we don't have boats. How do we get out to this?
Speaker 1: It was the most difficult period in my public life.
Speaker 1: And it's it's not on the agenda, it's not in
Speaker 1: the media conversation, but on the ground, it's we're feeling
Speaker 1: this like, oh, this is why I wanted to ask
Speaker 1: you about it. I thought it was a work that
Speaker 1: you're doing. Um, you know, the Thalbon is back in
Speaker 1: power in Afghanistan. I think my biggest curiosity since they
Speaker 1: are the government in Afghanistan or your neighbor. What's it
Speaker 1: like negotiating with them? What's it like when you have to?
Speaker 1: So that's an interesting question. Okay, So the Taliban in
Speaker 1: Afghanistan are now in the interim government there, and that
Speaker 1: is a result of the Doha Deal process that they
Speaker 1: negotiated directly with the United States, and we be in
Speaker 1: their neighbor, even though like the rest of the world,
Speaker 1: we haven't recognized them diplomatically, etc. Are forced to engage
Speaker 1: with the reality on our border. We can't afford to
Speaker 1: sort of wash our hands and turn our backs and
Speaker 1: pretend that nothing is changed, and we are advocating not
Speaker 1: only for ourselves but for the international community to also
Speaker 1: engage with them. I believe that we were off to
Speaker 1: a positive staff initially, but given what's happened with women's
Speaker 1: education and they're right to access education, it's becoming incredibly
Speaker 1: difficult for me or others like me who do want
Speaker 1: to engage with them, do want to find solutions to
Speaker 1: the problems the people of Afghanistan are facing, because they're
Speaker 1: taking these decisions that at the very least, I mean
Speaker 1: to say it the most diplomatically then I can. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's not helping us help them, and our consistent concern
Speaker 1: is that whatever happens in Ivanistan, Pakistan is going to
Speaker 1: be the first people to fill the consequences. This is
Speaker 1: old saying that if Carbal sneezes a slam bath, catches
Speaker 1: a cult and we're already seeing that we have. The
Speaker 1: United Nations says that ninety seven percent of the population
Speaker 1: in Avanistan are falling beneath the poverty line. That means
Speaker 1: that the number of refugees and their extra doors is
Speaker 1: going to be affected. Pakistan has already accepted millions of
Speaker 1: refugees in the past, but thousands, hundreds of thousands of
Speaker 1: refugees have come over since the fall of Carbal. The
Speaker 1: more the economic situation deteriorates in Afghanistan, the more canon
Speaker 1: cannon for the terrorist groups over there are going to have,
Speaker 1: the more people they're going to be able to recruit
Speaker 1: to their cause. And we have seen since the fall
Speaker 1: of Kapo a steady uptick of terrorist activity in Pakistan.
Speaker 1: If there's a regime that says that girls can't get
Speaker 1: education in Afghanistan, it's not going to be too wrong
Speaker 1: till politicians are going to start popping up in my
Speaker 1: neck of the would saying that we should also not
Speaker 1: let girls have access to education. So I think, a
Speaker 1: it's incredibly important to engage with them a bit. At
Speaker 1: the same time, my request to them and through your
Speaker 1: TV show to them, would be like, let girls learn guys.
Speaker 1: The Yeah, the contrast that you just set up is
Speaker 1: certainly pronounced. And you know, most Americans, I think, still
Speaker 1: associate Pakistan with harboring bin laden with issues of terror.
Speaker 1: How do we move beyond that in terms of US
Speaker 1: Pakistan relations? You know what's next? Look, I get, so,
Speaker 1: how do we move beyond that? I think that at
Speaker 1: that whatever happened during the sort of the war on
Speaker 1: Terror and the entire period that followed, there's like a
Speaker 1: there's a fog of war and that colors everyone's decision
Speaker 1: making everyone's perception. What we have now is a reality
Speaker 1: in Afghanistan, a reality that has very serious consequences, first
Speaker 1: for Pakistan, but all the issues I mentioned, whether it's
Speaker 1: the refugees or terrorism, it's a Pakistan's problem today, Tomorrow
Speaker 1: it'll be other country's problem. We have to get serious
Speaker 1: about engaging on the topic of Afbanistan. I believe that
Speaker 1: in the based on the facts on the ground, the
Speaker 1: position and perspective of Pakistan in the United States. Actually
Speaker 1: we meet eye to eye. We see things quite simple.
Speaker 1: I mean, we're basically on the same page. And whatever
Speaker 1: has happened in the past, we should be able to
Speaker 1: have honest conversations about that. And there can be many
Speaker 1: studies and analysis about what went wrong where. But it's
Speaker 1: also time for us to get working together and what
Speaker 1: we're going to do about the future, what we're going
Speaker 1: to do a boy the present day, and that's what
Speaker 1: I've been working on with my counterparts. Actually, Blincoln, I
Speaker 1: have one last question for you. You know, I know,
Speaker 1: regardless of your political party or your political opposition, clearly
Speaker 1: you are the youngest person to serve in this role.
Speaker 1: What's your message to other young people who feel called
Speaker 1: to serve? I would never give up and give it
Speaker 1: your best shot. I can't tell you the amount of times.
Speaker 1: For example, when we removed mister Khan from his prime ministership,
Speaker 1: it was the first time in Pakistan's history that a
Speaker 1: dictator didn't come in and kick out a prime minister,
Speaker 1: that a judge didn't order the removal or a prime minister.
Speaker 1: But for the first time our parliament voted them out
Speaker 1: and that idea, that proposition came from me, but it
Speaker 1: took me two years to convince everybody else because no
Speaker 1: one believed that it would happen, and ultimately it did.
Speaker 1: So the one thing that I've from what I'm doing
Speaker 1: that it's difficult and it's tough and all those other things.
Speaker 1: But the more young people we have who get to
Speaker 1: look at things for the long term and not just
Speaker 1: sort of the imminent future, the short term solution, but
Speaker 1: actually have to live with the consequences of their decisions,
Speaker 1: the better decisions we can make. Thank you for joining us,
Speaker 1: and thank you for your candor. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Thank you for support, so I appreciate it. Okay, we're
Speaker 1: gonna take a quick break, but we'll be right back
Speaker 1: after this. Thank you so much. Really detail but finally starting.
Speaker 1: All right, that's our shel for tonight. But before we go,
Speaker 1: please consider supporting South Asian Youth Action. They provide accessible, safe,
Speaker 1: and culturally affirming year round programming to New York City students.
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