Speaker 1: Welcome to Haunted Road, a production of iHeartRadio and Grimm
Speaker 1: and Mild from Aaron Manky.
Speaker 2: Listener discretion is advised.
Speaker 1: When Norman Baker arrived in Eureka Springs, Arkansas in nineteen
Speaker 1: thirty seven, he brought along promises of a miracle cure
Speaker 1: to cancer. His methods, he claimed, combined with the power
Speaker 1: of the healing springs in the area, would be potent
Speaker 1: medicine against the disease. Ailing patients flocked to the town
Speaker 1: deep in the Ozark Mountains seeking treatment at the Baker
Speaker 1: Cancer Curing Hospital. Many were removed under the cover of night,
Speaker 1: having succumbed to their illnesses, with Baker trying to hide
Speaker 1: their deaths and obscure the fact that his treatments were
Speaker 1: no more than smoke and mirrors. After Baker was run
Speaker 1: out of town as a fraud in a huckster, the building,
Speaker 1: which had been previously known as the Crescent Hotel and Spa,
Speaker 1: fell into disrepair, sitting abandoned for years. Eventually it was
Speaker 1: purchased by a hotel group and revived to its former
Speaker 1: glory as a Victorian era escaped for the well to
Speaker 1: Do in nineteen ninety seven, during renovations of the property,
Speaker 1: workers found a bizarre discovery in the woods behind the hotel.
Speaker 1: They unearthed a glass jar with a mystery object inside.
Speaker 1: Local authorities determined that it was a cancerous tumor preserved
Speaker 1: in alcohol, one of the very specimens that Norman Baker
Speaker 1: had used as evidence of the efficacy of his miracle cure. Eventually,
Speaker 1: more than four hundred jars and bottles were brought to light.
Speaker 1: What workers had discovered was the dump site for what
Speaker 1: Baker presented as evidence of his success, but was really
Speaker 1: just one more way he was hiding the truth about
Speaker 1: his deceptive practices, robbing desperate people of their money, their hope,
Speaker 1: and eventually their lives. Is it any wonder the Crescent
Speaker 1: Hotel is one of the most haunted places in America.
Speaker 1: I'm Amy Bruney, and this is haunted road. Long before
Speaker 1: European settlers colonized the area, the Native American Osage tribe
Speaker 1: talked of a great healing spring in what is now
Speaker 1: northern Arkansas. When Europeans arrived, the indigenous peoples are believed
Speaker 1: to have shared their knowledge of the spring, having frequented
Speaker 1: the water for its healing properties. In eighteen fifty six,
Speaker 1: doctor Alva Jackson, a man later referred to as a
Speaker 1: backwoods pseudo healer, came upon the waters in an unincorporated
Speaker 1: part of what had lately become Carroll County, Arkansas. He
Speaker 1: claimed to have accessed their healing properties, sharing the secret
Speaker 1: only local until eighteen seventy nine. Then Jackson brought to
Speaker 1: the spring a prominent local man, Judge LEVI Saunders, who
Speaker 1: presided over the Carroll County courts. Judge Saunders had a
Speaker 1: disease of the legs and bathed them in the waters
Speaker 1: during a hunting trip. When the man was healed of
Speaker 1: his affliction, words spread quickly. People came to the area
Speaker 1: in droves, hoping to be cured. Soon, Sonders set up
Speaker 1: camp in the area, followed by a handful of other families.
Speaker 1: According to the Encyclopedia of Arkansas, it was the judge's son,
Speaker 1: Buck Saunders, who suggested the name Eureka Springs, after the
Speaker 1: phrase Ponce de Leon is said to have exclaimed when
Speaker 1: he allegedly found the Fountain of Youth, which if you've
Speaker 1: been listening for a while you know is in Saint Augustine, Florida.
Speaker 1: Saunders built the first house in Eureka's springs, and the
Speaker 1: town was formerly founded on July fourth, eighteen seventy nine.
Speaker 1: Shortly after came a general store and a hotel, and
Speaker 1: droves of people building flimsy wooden shacks near the town's
Speaker 1: sixty two different springs. The cheap wooden structures were especially
Speaker 1: susceptible to fire, and the town burned down four times
Speaker 1: between eight eighteen eighty three and eighteen ninety three. Still,
Speaker 1: the area developed quickly, boosted by the Eureka Improvement Company
Speaker 1: founded by former Arkansas Governor Powell Clayton. During this time,
Speaker 1: the Industrial Revolution was growing cities, but also turning them
Speaker 1: dirtier and grittier than they had been before, bringing sickness
Speaker 1: and disease. Along with development, Victorian era people with expendable
Speaker 1: income were increasingly looking for natural treatments.
Speaker 2: One of the most.
Speaker 1: Popular was hydrotherapy, a water cure that purported to improve
Speaker 1: illnesses and boost general health through immersion in natural, clean,
Speaker 1: healing waters. Today it's considered an alternative therapy. Then it
Speaker 1: wasn't exactly embraced by the medical community either, with some
Speaker 1: hydrotherapy practitioners openly speaking against conventional medical practices. Eureka Springs
Speaker 1: appealed to affluent track as a natural reprieve from city life,
Speaker 1: but also as a method of connecting to nature to
Speaker 1: heal their ailments. The water cure peaked the interest of
Speaker 1: citizens at the epicenter of development, returning to the natural
Speaker 1: in times of sickness suddenly made sense. An eighteen eighty
Speaker 1: one Eureka Springs promotional pamphlet declared, certain diseases known as
Speaker 1: incurable have been brought here, and the improvement in the
Speaker 1: general health was so marked that invalids jumped at the
Speaker 1: conclusion that they were well. While people of all kinds
Speaker 1: had previously inhabited Eureka Springs, the newly founded Improvement Company
Speaker 1: knew that money and renown would only come from attracting
Speaker 1: the wealthy. Eureka Springs was to be a Victorian pleasure resort,
Speaker 1: not a camp for the down and out. To that end,
Speaker 1: Clayton and the Improvement Company constructed a marquee hotel high
Speaker 1: up on a mountaintop, a glamorous and elegant escape they
Speaker 1: called the Crescent Hotel and Spa, which opened in eighteen
Speaker 1: eighty six. The grand structure had one hundred guests rooms
Speaker 1: across five stories, its towers raising high above the tree line. Inside,
Speaker 1: healing waters from three local springs flowed from the taps.
Speaker 1: The Crescent enjoyed a prosperous beginning as a year round hotel,
Speaker 1: but by nineteen oh one interest in the healing waters
Speaker 1: had dwindled. The hotel switched to summer only accommodations in
Speaker 1: nineteen oh eight. For the other three seasons, the hotel
Speaker 1: became the Crescent College and Conservatory for Young Women, an
Speaker 1: academy for affluent girls. Tuition was high, and during the
Speaker 1: Great Depression the college shuttered. The hotel limped along as
Speaker 1: a summer destination and then as a junior college for
Speaker 1: another decade. Another issue arose around the time of the depression.
Speaker 1: Cases of typhoid were linked to three of Eureka Spring's waters.
Speaker 1: Not only did this bode poorly for resort goers, it
Speaker 1: also put a shadow on the town built on healing.
Speaker 1: As historian doctor Timothy Covalchik notes, talk of death in
Speaker 1: the healing town was almost non existent. Perhaps because the
Speaker 1: town's economy was so closely tied to its reputation, people
Speaker 1: there became comfortable with the idea of concealing the truth.
Speaker 1: Certainly at the Crescent, the future held more of that darkness.
Speaker 1: There were also two tragic deaths at the Crescent in
Speaker 1: its early years. During its construction, Michael, an Irish Stonemason
Speaker 1: is said to have fallen to his death where Room
Speaker 1: two eighteen would later be. During the college years, a
Speaker 1: young student fell to her death from a balcony. Whether
Speaker 1: she was pushed or she jumped is unclear, but there
Speaker 1: were whispers that it might have been over a failed
Speaker 1: love affair, with the town in a market economic downturn.
Speaker 1: It only makes sense that when Norman Baker came swooping
Speaker 1: in with promises of prosperity, the residence of Eureka Springs
Speaker 1: welcomed him with open arms. So what if he had
Speaker 1: a dark past? As you might guess, things got ugly fast.
Speaker 1: A vaudeville performer turned inventor, Baker made his fortune by
Speaker 1: owning the second largest radio station in North America, a
Speaker 1: platform he used to pedal his own version of snake oil.
Speaker 1: At his Baker Institute, which he opened in Iowa. He
Speaker 1: claimed to be able to heal all manner of sickness.
Speaker 1: According to the book Border Radio by Jean Fowler and
Speaker 1: Bill Crawford. His patients roamed around Muscatine with open sores
Speaker 1: that contaminated town drinking fountains with blood. The hospital began
Speaker 1: to take in as much as one hundred thousand dollars
Speaker 1: a month, and the cash was taken out in suitcases
Speaker 1: under cover of night. Some reports contended that deceased patients
Speaker 1: were similarly discharged from the Palace of Healing. Baker claimed
Speaker 1: so much success at the institute that he attracted attention
Speaker 1: for him the wrong kind. He was exposed as a
Speaker 1: fraud who had no medical training and was run out
Speaker 1: of the state. Eventually, Baker discovered Eureka Springs when he
Speaker 1: announced his intention to buy the shuttered Crescent Hotel. Locals
Speaker 1: knew of his reputation and that the a Mareamerican Medical
Speaker 1: Association denied Baker's claims to cure cancer, but Eureka Springs
Speaker 1: was desperate and held the man up as a path
Speaker 1: back to prosperity. During renovations of the hotel, it was
Speaker 1: renamed the Baker Cancer Curing Hospital. He painted much of
Speaker 1: the building purple, which is still visible on the chimneys.
Speaker 2: To this day.
Speaker 1: Baker also installed one of his inventions, a caliophone, which
Speaker 1: projected songs for miles around. For whatever reason, people believed Baker,
Speaker 1: buying into his claims that he really could cheer the
Speaker 1: terminally ill. When he opened his new hospital, he brought
Speaker 1: in his staff from the Iowa location, and more than
Speaker 1: one hundred patients from the other hospital followed him to Arkansas.
Speaker 1: Baker advertised secret remedies based on the work of two
Speaker 1: other known medical fraudsters whose work he had promoted. Even
Speaker 1: after patients died in droves, he would inject those remedies,
Speaker 1: largely comprised of carbolic acid, glycerine, alcohol, and brewed tea,
Speaker 1: into tumors, claiming the medicine would eat the cancer without
Speaker 1: harming the surrounding tissue. Desperate people went to the hospital
Speaker 1: looking for hope, and Baker was happy to take their money.
Speaker 1: The town of Eureka Springs was also feeling the effects
Speaker 1: of renewed tourist interests and was returning to financial stability,
Speaker 1: But not everyone in town loved Norman Baker. A well
Speaker 1: respected local couple, Ray and Chloe Freeman, spoke widely about
Speaker 1: his false claims. They owned some businesses in town, and
Speaker 1: seeing that Eureka Springs relied largely on tourism. The couple
Speaker 1: had contact with many visitors to the area. They had
Speaker 1: apparently heard rumors of the dark happenings on the ridge
Speaker 1: above town and warned incoming patients that those who went
Speaker 1: to Baker Hospital to find a cure found disappointment and
Speaker 1: sometimes well many times even death. Among the horrific accounts
Speaker 1: of Baker's treatments, he was said to have attempted to
Speaker 1: cure brain cancer by cutting open the scalp and pouring
Speaker 1: in a mixture of spring water and ground watermelon seeds
Speaker 1: directly onto the brain. The victims who died of his
Speaker 1: unproven methods were treated no better in death than they
Speaker 1: were in life. For victims at Baker Hospital, according to
Speaker 1: paranormal writer Troy Taylor, it was said that he hid
Speaker 1: the bodies for weeks until they could be burned in
Speaker 1: the incinerator in the middle of the night. As his
Speaker 1: publicity claimed that he could cheer cancer in a matter
Speaker 1: of weeks, he had to keep the press from finding
Speaker 1: out that many of his patients died every month. But
Speaker 1: Baker didn't just try to keep outsiders from the truth.
Speaker 1: He took those who suffered the most and placed them
Speaker 1: in an annex. Some sources referred to it as an
Speaker 1: asylum where they would die in extreme pain. Baker was
Speaker 1: aware of the talk. In nineteen thirty nine, he published
Speaker 1: an open letter to them in the local newspaper, claiming
Speaker 1: that they had used underhanded methods, made discriminating statements, and
Speaker 1: spread pure falsehoods in attempting to discredit Baker Hospital and
Speaker 1: doctors to deprive the hostile hospital of patients. He also
Speaker 1: had fear of attack from the American Medical Association. His
Speaker 1: office in the Crescent reflected that paranoia. It was walled
Speaker 1: off behind bulletproof glass. In his personal quarters, it is
Speaker 1: said that he kept two submachine guns on the wall
Speaker 1: for easy access, just in case. It took more than
Speaker 1: two years of patients dying in the clandestine removal of
Speaker 1: their remains for officials to investigate Baker Hospital. Eventually, he
Speaker 1: was fined a fraction of the millions he defrauded from people,
Speaker 1: and sentenced to four years in prison. He died ironically
Speaker 1: of cancer shortly after his release. The hospital closed in
Speaker 1: nineteen thirty nine, and the building was abandoned until nineteen
Speaker 1: forty six, when investors purchased the property and returned the
Speaker 1: Crescent to its original use as a hotel. In nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety seven, Marty and Elise Rennick purchased the Crescent and
Speaker 1: have operated it as since, though Marty was killed in
Speaker 1: a car accident in two thousand and six. The building
Speaker 1: they bought was run down and in disrepair, and they
Speaker 1: set out to return it to its Victorian heyday. It
Speaker 1: was during the Rennicks renovations that workers uncovered those four
Speaker 1: hundred jars of tumorous remains in secret remedies. The Arkansas
Speaker 1: Archaeological Survey matched them up to specimens Baker had used
Speaker 1: to advertise the hospital in its heyday. According to the
Speaker 1: Northwest Arkansas Democrat Gazette, the bottles weren't left behind by Baker,
Speaker 1: reporting that Keith Scales, who leads the ghost tours of
Speaker 1: the Crescent, said officials were told that subsequent owners of
Speaker 1: the building took all of Baker's specimen bottles to the
Speaker 1: dump in the nineteen sixties. He thought that meant a
Speaker 1: landfill near Berryville, but apparently it meant a dump behind
Speaker 1: the building. Today, the Crescent looks much the same as
Speaker 1: it would have in eighteen eighty six, when it opened
Speaker 1: its doors. One of the main differences, though, is that
Speaker 1: guests won't just find access to the healing waters around
Speaker 1: the building, they'll also more than likely find ghosts. The
Speaker 1: Crescent has been called America's most haunted hotel. While I'm
Speaker 1: not totally sold on whether that's actually true. There are
Speaker 1: a lot of haunted hotels out there with a lot
Speaker 1: of really cool activity and ghost stories. There's no denying
Speaker 1: that there are many accounts of unexplained activity at the Crescent.
Speaker 1: The most notable ghost at the Crescent is that of
Speaker 1: the Irish stonemason Michael, who died during the hotel's construction
Speaker 1: when he fell from the roof. Stories say that he
Speaker 1: was trying to catch the attention of a beautiful lady
Speaker 1: down below. Michael fell to his death in the spot
Speaker 1: where room two eighteen would be. Guests who stay in
Speaker 1: this room report a list of intense experiences. They range
Speaker 1: from strange sounds and sensations. Just seems so terrifying that,
Speaker 1: according to Haunted Ozark's, guests have left the room screaming
Speaker 1: and refuse to return. One guest even reported seeing hands
Speaker 1: reaching out from the bathroom mirror at night, the sound
Speaker 1: of a large object falling can be heard, but a
Speaker 1: more visual event has also been noted. Instead of simply
Speaker 1: hearing the thud of what can only be Michael's fatal fault,
Speaker 1: people have also reported seeing the aftermath. According to Troy
Speaker 1: Taylor's writings about the hotel, the wife of one of
Speaker 1: the proprietors reportedly stayed in Room two eighteen one evening.
Speaker 1: In the middle of the night, she ran from it screaming.
Speaker 1: When staff approached her and asked what inside of the outburst,
Speaker 1: she claimed that she had seen blood splattered all over
Speaker 1: the walls. Staff members ran up to look, but found
Speaker 1: no blood or any signs of a disturbance, let alone
Speaker 1: a violent crime or an accident. Other guests of Room
Speaker 1: two eighteen have experienced this same phenomenon to the same
Speaker 1: degree of horror. Another frequent sighting is of the ghost
Speaker 1: of the college student who died there. Stories say that
Speaker 1: she was perhaps jilted by her lover, but whatever the
Speaker 1: details are, they were known only to her as she
Speaker 1: stood on a balk of the crescent, while the main
Speaker 1: tale claims that she jumped to escape her sadness. According
Speaker 1: to Haunted Ozarks, there are other more whispered accounts perhaps
Speaker 1: some speculate that she was pushed. That would add a
Speaker 1: sharper edge to her screams, which have been heard by
Speaker 1: many guests of the Crescent. Since the most common experience
Speaker 1: that people report are with the ghosts of the hotel
Speaker 1: in its time as the Baker Hospital, it only makes
Speaker 1: sense if spirits linger in places of intense emotion, then
Speaker 1: they're likely to linger at a place that sold false hope,
Speaker 1: where suffering people place their hope in a man who
Speaker 1: was lying to them and stealing their money, only to
Speaker 1: have their trust betrayed and more than likely to die.
Speaker 1: As Taylor wrote, the deeds committed during this era have
Speaker 1: unquestionably had a lasting impact on the building and perhaps
Speaker 1: on the spirits who still linger. Official stories downplay local legend,
Speaker 1: but those stories maintain a vibrant life based on the
Speaker 1: unending stream of pairs normal anomalies. Within the Crescent Hotel,
Speaker 1: a young woman by the name of Theodora appears regularly.
Speaker 1: According to accounts by paranormal writer Janie Tremir, she often
Speaker 1: asks for her room key before vanishing. Differing accounts report
Speaker 1: that she was either a patient or a caretaker of
Speaker 1: the terminally ill. Some accounts placed Theodora in Room four nineteen,
Speaker 1: where she has most often been spotted by housekeepers. Theodora's
Speaker 1: voice has reportedly been captured on EVP. In Hauntings of America,
Speaker 1: Taylor wrote that in nineteen eighty seven, a guest claimed
Speaker 1: she saw a nurse pushing a gurney down the hallway
Speaker 1: in the middle of the night. The nurse reached the
Speaker 1: wall and then vanished. Many others have recounted witnessing that
Speaker 1: very same scene, while others not brave enough to open
Speaker 1: their door report hearing the squeaking and squealing of a
Speaker 1: heavily laden cart. She always pushes the cart after eleven PM,
Speaker 1: Norman's reported curfew for his patients. The Morgue is unsurprisingly
Speaker 1: a hotspot for paranormal activity. According to Bill Ott, the
Speaker 1: Cressens director of Marketing and Communications, the Morgue still features
Speaker 1: the walk in cooler Baker used to store cadavers and
Speaker 1: body parts, as well as an adutopsy table he used
Speaker 1: chiefly to explore removed cancer, not patience after death. Hotel
Speaker 1: staff also recounted that they would get calls on the
Speaker 1: switchboard from the basement recreation room, but no one was
Speaker 1: at the other end, they couldn't be because the room
Speaker 1: was unused and locked at all times, and the only
Speaker 1: key was held at the front desk. When staff would
Speaker 1: check it out, they'd often find that the wreck room
Speaker 1: phone had been taken off the hook, but by who
Speaker 1: or what was never answered. They had no idea who
Speaker 1: it could have been because there was only one entrance
Speaker 1: and exit and one key, which they had. A later occurrence,
Speaker 1: a staff member received yet another one of the mysterious calls.
Speaker 1: According to Taylor, when he went down to the basement
Speaker 1: to check, the phone was still on the receiver, but
Speaker 1: he still maintains that he felt another press the room
Speaker 1: with him. He locked the door behind him, taking the
Speaker 1: single key with him as he returned to his post.
Speaker 1: Within five minutes of returning, the switchboard alerted him to
Speaker 1: yet another incoming call from the very room he just
Speaker 1: checked and found seemingly empty. Baker himself has been seen
Speaker 1: as well in his standard white suit in lavender shirt.
Speaker 1: Sources recall that he appears sour, confused, and trapped. He
Speaker 1: is most often seen in the basement, near the old
Speaker 1: recreation room or on the first floor landing. According to Tremir,
Speaker 1: she wrote that while it is unclear whether Baker felt
Speaker 1: remorse or was even cognizant of the wrongdoings he committed.
Speaker 1: An operation that is believed to be Baker himself has
Speaker 1: been spotted. Those who have seen him say that he
Speaker 1: looks lost, first going one way and then another. Up next,
Speaker 1: I will be talking to Sarah eccles, a ghost tour
Speaker 1: guide from the Crescent Hotel. You won't want to miss
Speaker 1: her first hand accounts, which if you're a panormal investigator,
Speaker 1: are going to make you want to book a stay
Speaker 1: there sooner rather than later. That is coming up after
Speaker 1: the break. So I am now joined by Sarah E. Kelly,
Speaker 1: who is a tour guide at the Crescent Hotel, and
Speaker 1: I'm thrilled to have her with us, just because this
Speaker 1: is such a bucket list location for me, so I'm
Speaker 1: really eager to hear all about it. So thank you
Speaker 1: for joining us my pleasure. I read a bit about
Speaker 1: the activity that goes on there, and you are a
Speaker 1: tour guide there, so I'm sure you see a lot.
Speaker 1: You've experienced a lot. How long have you been there exactly?
Speaker 1: Working at the hotel.
Speaker 3: I have been there just about four years now and
Speaker 3: we get a lot of activity a lot of times
Speaker 3: we're working and we can't take the time to capture
Speaker 3: the activity. I work in the day Spa as well
Speaker 3: as a tour guide there, so I'm there quite a
Speaker 3: bit throughout the day and the evening. But it's it's
Speaker 3: a really cool place to work, and I've been there
Speaker 3: for quite a while now.
Speaker 1: Now you say you work in the day's spa. It's
Speaker 1: funny because I frequent a hotel here in New England,
Speaker 1: the Mount Washington Hotel in New Hampshire, and I consider
Speaker 1: the spa to be one of the most haunted places
Speaker 1: in the hotel, which I don't like to advertise personally
Speaker 1: right exactly, but is that the case for you as well?
Speaker 3: We have activity in the spa as well. You know,
Speaker 3: we have the old bowling lanes from nineteen oh one,
Speaker 3: which you know is kind of fun. But I would
Speaker 3: tell you a lot of the activity happens in the hotel,
Speaker 3: like during the day on the room floors. We really
Speaker 3: get a lot of that because you know, spirit most
Speaker 3: active when they would have been alive, you know, during
Speaker 3: their life, or wouldve been awake during their life, and
Speaker 3: so I find the creepiest parts of the day are
Speaker 3: like between eleven and three on the room if I'm honest.
Speaker 1: So, yeah, basically like right after checkout or check insbody left.
Speaker 2: And it should be quiet, but sometimes it's not.
Speaker 1: So yeah, And I think there's something to that, because
Speaker 1: you know, I'm sure you've encountered this. A lot of
Speaker 1: people assume that paranormal activity just happens at night, but
Speaker 1: when you have places like a hotel, I think the
Speaker 1: reason people are more cognizant of it at night is
Speaker 1: because that's when it's the most quiet.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if a hodel is busy, people are bustling around
Speaker 1: and you know, the restaurants are open, and a ghost
Speaker 1: could walk right in front of you and you think
Speaker 1: it was a living person.
Speaker 3: Yeah, or you could debunk just about any picture, any
Speaker 3: sound that you heard, thinking that it's another guest in.
Speaker 2: The hallway or in another room exactly.
Speaker 1: But I think that spirits are probably more active during
Speaker 1: the day just because they're active on our schedules, especially
Speaker 1: in a place like that.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, it wasn't that long ago that I was coming
Speaker 3: back from a lunch break in you know, working in
Speaker 3: the day spa, and through a couple of bars on
Speaker 3: the stairs, I saw two little hands and two little
Speaker 3: eyes peeking through and I thought it was a real
Speaker 3: kid because and I like kids.
Speaker 2: You know, there's lots of kids in the hotel.
Speaker 3: And I pop back up the stairs to like wave
Speaker 3: and there was no kid there. But there is a
Speaker 3: child that is seen on that set of stairs all
Speaker 3: the time, and so it was kind of fun to
Speaker 3: think that they're connecting with me. But I didn't have
Speaker 3: time to take a picture or like, but there that
Speaker 3: was those little hands, of those little eyes peeking at me.
Speaker 1: Well, I think there's something to be said for the
Speaker 1: personal experience. I think sometimes we get so caught up
Speaker 1: in trying to capture activity or capture some sort of evidence.
Speaker 1: But to me, I find those kind of like personal
Speaker 1: experiences just as compelling.
Speaker 3: So I tell people all the time, you yourself is
Speaker 3: your best ghost hunting tool, all of your senses, you know, so.
Speaker 1: Well absolutely, like we don't. I try to kind of
Speaker 1: tell people, if you're in this to have an experience
Speaker 1: for your don't worry so much about what other people
Speaker 1: are going to think of it or trying to kind.
Speaker 2: Of justify it. Right, so you know, you had it,
Speaker 2: you had it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So this child that you saw because you said
Speaker 1: that's a regular occurrence, Like, how often are people encountering this, uh,
Speaker 1: this spirit pretty often?
Speaker 3: Actually, Now it's not somebody that it's not a spirit
Speaker 3: that we talk about on the tour. It just seems
Speaker 3: to be an interaction that we have quite often on
Speaker 3: those stairs. People will feel like they got their dress
Speaker 3: tugged on. People wake up in the middle of the
Speaker 3: night to a little kid waking them like they do
Speaker 3: in the middle of the night, and that activity is
Speaker 3: kind of second floor and down those stairs there, And
Speaker 3: we've gotten pictures of her several times. In fact, when
Speaker 3: I had my experience with her, i'd mentioned it to
Speaker 3: another guide and she's like, you're kidding, because we just
Speaker 3: got a picture of that same girl going up the
Speaker 3: stairs like last night, and it was like, oh, that's
Speaker 3: kind of cool when you connect those stories as well
Speaker 3: with somebody's photograph or whatever it is. But she becomes
Speaker 3: very regular for us.
Speaker 1: Now, do you have any idea who she might be?
Speaker 3: We don't write at the moment, and we're always investigating
Speaker 3: trying to find out. But I feel like in the
Speaker 3: Crescent especially, we have so many spirits that they're ready
Speaker 3: to connect with us that want to have that interaction
Speaker 3: with us. But it's almost hard to pitpoint. I find
Speaker 3: when I'm investigating a lot of times I can't rely
Speaker 3: that there's only one person trying to come through that
Speaker 3: we get several coming through. So it's hard to pinpoint
Speaker 3: names and things like that. But yeah, but she looks
Speaker 3: like she's kind of from the Victorian times, from the pictures.
Speaker 3: She wears a little dress and has her hair kind
Speaker 3: of curled in that, you know, same kind of way,
Speaker 3: or maybe shortly after in the twenties, But she is
Speaker 3: not of this time, that's for sure.
Speaker 1: No, And yeah, no, that doesn't sound yo, So do
Speaker 1: you What would you think is maybe kind of the
Speaker 1: more common types of activity that people encounter at the hotel.
Speaker 3: More commonly, you know, in their rooms, they will get
Speaker 3: woken or poked. We have one particular spirit named Michael
Speaker 3: who's particularly roguish, and women will say that he strokes
Speaker 3: their hair or will tickle them, or or open the
Speaker 3: bathroom door on them while they're in there. You know,
Speaker 3: things like that become kind of calmon occurrences.
Speaker 2: And also another one.
Speaker 3: Of our really most felt experience or I should say
Speaker 3: smelled experiences is doctor Ellis was a doctor there. He
Speaker 3: was the hotel physician, and they smell his cherry tobacco
Speaker 3: down the hallways in the lobby. And usually when I
Speaker 3: tell the story, like half of my tour was like,
Speaker 3: oh my gosh, I smelled it earlier. Oh my gosh,
Speaker 3: I smelled it, you know, two days ago. And it
Speaker 3: doesn't happen all the time. We can't smoke in the hotel.
Speaker 3: Cherry tobacco is not something that is very popular right now,
Speaker 3: so it becomes something that you go, huh, okay.
Speaker 2: But that's one that I hear quite often.
Speaker 1: Now. I understand, like the hotel history is kind of dark,
Speaker 1: you know, it's definitely different. Uh, But from what I've heard,
Speaker 1: it doesn't necessarily have a heavy feeling to it.
Speaker 2: Is that? Yeah?
Speaker 1: And why do you think that is?
Speaker 3: I actually think, you know, the dark part of our
Speaker 3: history was so short, you know, Norman Baker being there
Speaker 3: and running it as a cancer hospital was only about
Speaker 3: two years of our existence. But most of the time
Speaker 3: it was a place of celebration. It was a place
Speaker 3: that the wealthy folks went to vacation and they didn't
Speaker 3: have as many promblems as some of the less fortunates.
Speaker 3: And also I think that our spirits are friendly as
Speaker 3: far as you know. They're not negative entities. They had
Speaker 3: an unfortunate passing, and they're just trying to connect with somebody,
Speaker 3: And so if they were to try to scare us off,
Speaker 3: I don't know that everybody would want to connect, but
Speaker 3: I do think it's mostly and I'm not saying there
Speaker 3: aren't a couple of negative energies in the hotel, but
Speaker 3: for the most part, people's spirit experiences become almost comical
Speaker 3: or like trickery, you know, and not necessarily that scary
Speaker 3: kind of spirit experience. For instance, I had a guest
Speaker 3: that had told me they brewed coffee in the morning,
Speaker 3: and the coffee pot you can't see through, so she
Speaker 3: figured it brewed. She went to pour it and there
Speaker 3: was nothing in there. And then a couple hours later,
Speaker 3: underneath the coffee pot there's a drawer that it was
Speaker 3: sitting on, and the.
Speaker 2: Coffee ended up in the drawer. Not scary, just.
Speaker 3: Letting them know in that way that is unmistakable that
Speaker 3: something crazy happened here and.
Speaker 2: It was not human done, you know, right exactly.
Speaker 1: And that's so I feel like I investigate many hotels
Speaker 1: that kind of have that same vibe. And I know
Speaker 1: a lot of us have speculated that perhaps spirits have
Speaker 1: had great, you know, memories there and they're coming back
Speaker 1: for some reason, like something profound happened to them, or
Speaker 1: they vacation there. And so you do have these kind
Speaker 1: of spirits that make themselves known, but they're not necessarily
Speaker 1: doing anything harmful. Ohka, now, USA, say you had a
Speaker 1: couple that might make themselves done and more of it.
Speaker 1: I don't want to say negative, but maybe anymore mischievous way.
Speaker 1: What kind of interactions do those ones pose?
Speaker 3: Mostly it's a sadness above anything else. When I say negative,
Speaker 3: I don't even mean like mean or hateful. Uh. It
Speaker 3: really is this sadness that comes over people when they're
Speaker 3: in our morgue area where they used to keep the bodies,
Speaker 3: or in the area where he used to keep in
Speaker 3: the We call it the pain Asylum. But this place
Speaker 3: that he used to keep people, well, they were very
Speaker 3: sick because it wasn't good for his business to see
Speaker 3: people dying of cancer. And you feel a real heaviness.
Speaker 3: Sometimes people feel the pain in their stomach. We had
Speaker 3: a medium ount not that long ago, and I can't
Speaker 3: be in there myself. I get the same pain, and
Speaker 3: I'm not very sensitive myself, but can a firm that
Speaker 3: that was something that she was feeling and thought it
Speaker 3: was spirit connected. I've had people burst into tears as
Speaker 3: we get into the Morgue area that are like, I'm
Speaker 3: not a crier, and as they're like, you know, pouring
Speaker 3: tears on their eyes. I just had somebody do it
Speaker 3: the other night. So those are the things that I
Speaker 3: find to be more negative. No, nothing's super harmful. It
Speaker 3: just doesn't make you feel real good, you know, right.
Speaker 1: I mean that's kind of the classic almost unfinished business.
Speaker 1: You know, this is kind of a very strange set
Speaker 1: of circumstances where you have people who are terminally ill
Speaker 1: and it's kind of being hidden in a way. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and like what does what imprint does that leave?
Speaker 3: Well?
Speaker 1: Even oh sorry, go ahead, no, go ahead, you know
Speaker 1: that I do so.
Speaker 3: And not only that, but like Norman Baker when he
Speaker 3: was telling them that they're you know, they needed to
Speaker 3: go back to the asylum because the asylum or sanitary,
Speaker 3: and you want to go get healthy to be sick.
Speaker 3: Part of his treatment was mental therapeutics, and he was
Speaker 3: very much putting it on them like you're not doing
Speaker 3: this properly or you would be healed. So they also
Speaker 3: felt I think a level of guilt or like I
Speaker 3: can feel that sometimes in the hotel, like I didn't
Speaker 3: do enough for myself, when actually it was not something
Speaker 3: that they could have done for themselves. They were kind
Speaker 3: of being swindled into thinking this would work.
Speaker 1: You know, Yeah, I can't even imagine like a their mindset,
Speaker 1: but be like what that leaves behind rights? Yeah, so
Speaker 1: many spirits we encounter. It is, you know, they there's
Speaker 1: something that is keeping them there. There's something that they
Speaker 1: either feel guilty about, or there's something that they a
Speaker 1: message they want to get across. And I can't imagine
Speaker 1: being in that place where you're basically being told you're
Speaker 1: dying because you're not.
Speaker 3: Doing good enough exactly, And then how do you handle that?
Speaker 3: And when they finally pass, of course they feel like
Speaker 3: they could have probably done more, or they should have
Speaker 3: done something different, or you know, their families weren't ready
Speaker 3: for them to go and they just can't cross over.
Speaker 3: I mean, all those kinds of things come into play.
Speaker 3: But again it's it's kind of specific areas in the
Speaker 3: hotel and that most of it like you said, is
Speaker 3: pretty lighthearted connecting. I'd also tell you that they miss people.
Speaker 3: In the wintertime, when we do get a little bit slow,
Speaker 3: they're not as active, you know, because there's not people
Speaker 3: around to interact with. And we do something in the
Speaker 3: wintertime called Eurekas brings paranormal weekends and we open all
Speaker 3: our haunted rooms. We hunt them for a couple of
Speaker 3: days and it's like a convention. But you can feel
Speaker 3: the buzz in the hotel when they It's like they
Speaker 3: know it's coming, and you can find the energy rise
Speaker 3: up and things start to happen around us, and then
Speaker 3: we're like, oh my god, they know the people are
Speaker 3: coming to see them.
Speaker 2: It's a really.
Speaker 3: Crazy feeling to know that some of them are looking
Speaker 3: not all of them, but some of them are looking
Speaker 3: forward to that connection with people again that they haven't
Speaker 3: had in a.
Speaker 2: Month or so. You know.
Speaker 1: Well, I think we really experienced that during kind of
Speaker 1: the height of the pandemic when some of these places
Speaker 1: were closed.
Speaker 2: I'm sure you were to.
Speaker 1: And I felt like some of these entities were kind
Speaker 1: of like what is going on? Where are my people exactly?
Speaker 1: And when we would come back and investigate places, they
Speaker 1: were so eager to interact, Like, you know, I don't
Speaker 1: think we realize how much they kind of either look
Speaker 1: forward to or just even rely on us to keep
Speaker 1: them kind of engaged. Absolutely, Now, how many people visit
Speaker 1: the hotel and just have no idea of its reputation?
Speaker 1: Like I feel like it's like everyone should know that
Speaker 1: it's haunted. But do you ever if people just come in
Speaker 1: and are just completely surprised by this fact.
Speaker 3: Yes, And I'm always surprised that they're surprised because it's
Speaker 3: all over the place. It's really hard to avoid.
Speaker 2: If you have not googled us one time, you know,
Speaker 2: you must have not known.
Speaker 3: But we still do get people that don't know that
Speaker 3: place is haunted, and some of them are comfortable with it,
Speaker 3: some of them are not. I always just try to,
Speaker 3: you know, let them know. In my experience that most
Speaker 3: spirits are people, and most people are not bad people.
Speaker 3: Maybe they're not as friendly or maybe they're more friendly,
Speaker 3: but they are just people in that it's nothing to
Speaker 3: be afraid of, you know.
Speaker 2: But it does happen sometimes.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think humanizing them is very important, you know,
Speaker 1: it's I think a lot of the things that spirits
Speaker 1: do Uh, if you actually like saw a living person
Speaker 1: doing it, most of the time, it would not be
Speaker 1: that crazy, right, although sometimes right right, right, But most
Speaker 1: of the.
Speaker 3: Time they're just doing these daily you know things, or
Speaker 3: again just trying to connect, not trying to scare you
Speaker 3: away or get.
Speaker 2: You out of their space.
Speaker 1: You know. Right now, are there apparitions seen at the hotel?
Speaker 1: There is, I know, the little girl, but is there
Speaker 1: anyone else that people might stumble upon?
Speaker 3: Becky is one of our most seen I think spirits.
Speaker 3: He's a little boy that was there during the college
Speaker 3: days and he seems to be very I mean, he
Speaker 3: seems to connect with the children, and we get a
Speaker 3: lot of families in so that's one that they because
Speaker 3: these kids, gosh, they're so much more open than we are.
Speaker 3: They don't doubt themselves. I definitely saw a little boy
Speaker 3: right there, and he wasn't one of us, you know,
Speaker 3: So I think he's one of our most seen spirit
Speaker 3: by eyeball. Everything else can kind of be felt. Pictures
Speaker 3: are taken in reflections, but he seems to be pretty
Speaker 3: well interacting with people on the regular.
Speaker 2: So mm hmm.
Speaker 1: And then now, what about like shadow figures, shadow figures,
Speaker 1: we do have one.
Speaker 3: I would say actually in the morgue area, which is
Speaker 3: connected to the laundry room and all that stuff. But
Speaker 3: he whatever that I say, it's a heat. I don't
Speaker 3: know for sure, but whatever the shadow figure is will
Speaker 3: peek around the corner. Now, when we take a tour
Speaker 3: down there, it's a private tour, you know, only ticketed
Speaker 3: people can be down there, and it's gotten every guide
Speaker 3: at least one time where it looks like some of
Speaker 3: the peaks around the corner or shadow does and we
Speaker 3: go to kick somebody out of the area.
Speaker 2: And there's nobody there.
Speaker 3: And I don't think that that's actually related to Norman
Speaker 3: Baker at all. I think that was a little bit
Speaker 3: later on. But that shadow figure, the person is very
Speaker 3: tall and leans around corners all over that place.
Speaker 1: So yeah, now when you started, did you start in
Speaker 1: the spa first or.
Speaker 2: Were you a child?
Speaker 3: I actually started in the day Spa, and I was
Speaker 3: there first for about a year before I started doing
Speaker 3: the tours. But you know, the activity was always there,
Speaker 3: you knew it was there. And then when I started
Speaker 3: doing the tours, you know, I really got involved in
Speaker 3: the paranormal investigating side. And you you're I'm always surprised
Speaker 3: at what kind of activity we can get.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so was there a point where you kind of went, oh,
Speaker 1: there's something to this, Like you started in a spot,
Speaker 1: did you have an experience or an epiphany like, oh,
Speaker 1: this place is definitely haunted that made you kind of
Speaker 1: want to be more interested in maybe get involved in
Speaker 1: the paranormal side.
Speaker 3: It was kind of interested in it from the beginning,
Speaker 3: I would say, interested in that kind of stuff. But
Speaker 3: I would say the most poignant moment for me was
Speaker 3: and also seeing how commonplace it was. We were cleaning
Speaker 3: up the day spa, and of course that's what we
Speaker 3: do when we're not busy as we clean and there
Speaker 3: was a glass cleaner on the counter and it moved
Speaker 3: over all by itself and one of the girls jump back,
Speaker 3: put her hands up and said, today, boy, I'll see that.
Speaker 3: And one girl said yes and three of us said no,
Speaker 3: and then we just went back to cleaning. And I
Speaker 3: was like, really, okay, well that's how common this stuff
Speaker 3: is and again.
Speaker 2: Not harmful, just moved it over. We all went okay,
Speaker 2: we saw that, and then we moved on with our lives.
Speaker 1: But uh, yeah, it's funny, like you're just like, this
Speaker 1: is what happens here here, and everybody.
Speaker 3: Were like, Okay, that's just the way it is around here.
Speaker 3: But again, nobody seems afraid. I have very sensitive friends
Speaker 3: that work with me in the day spa and they
Speaker 3: still continue to work there, which says something about, you know,
Speaker 3: our spirit activity not being threatening. But that was one
Speaker 3: of those moments where I was like, boy, this is
Speaker 3: a little bit more common than I thought. But you
Speaker 3: can feel the energy as soon as you walk it.
Speaker 3: I would say, as soon as you drive onto the property,
Speaker 3: you just know you're someplace really special that has something
Speaker 3: above and beyond your hotel experience.
Speaker 1: Now, what do you think lends to that? Do you
Speaker 1: think it's just because it's the hotel itself? Do you
Speaker 1: think it's something environmental? Like, why do you think this
Speaker 1: has become such a haunted.
Speaker 3: Well, I definitely think the limestone has a lot to
Speaker 3: do with it. You know, we do find I'm to
Speaker 3: understand that the water running over limestone makes electromagnetic forces
Speaker 3: that they're measurable. It's creating energy, and so we do
Speaker 3: see that in the you know, the limestone walls. When
Speaker 3: it rains down those walls, there is an energy that
Speaker 3: can be picked up and the spirits are way more active.
Speaker 2: We have these limestone.
Speaker 3: Quarries in town where everything was locally limestone deposits where
Speaker 3: things were locally quarried from, and they're still free flowing
Speaker 3: springs going through those. And also remembering that there's places
Speaker 3: all over the world with high concentrations of limestone that
Speaker 3: talk about the same things that we do, you know,
Speaker 3: religious places, sacred places, healing waters. Is not that weird
Speaker 3: that this combination of different kinds of stone and these
Speaker 3: waters going through kind of help out the spirit activity.
Speaker 2: I would think right makes sense.
Speaker 1: Now, So if someone's going to visit the hotel and
Speaker 1: they would like to have an interaction on a paranormal level,
Speaker 1: like do you have any recommendations for them? Where should
Speaker 1: they go, what should they do, how should they apply?
Speaker 3: I really think the best way to do it is
Speaker 3: to keep an open mind. I always like to tell
Speaker 3: people to introduce yourself, let them know that you're open
Speaker 3: to activity, that you're not afraid to connect with them.
Speaker 3: And of course we have specific counted rooms that are
Speaker 3: more active than others, and all that means it's not
Speaker 3: that the other rooms are not active as well, but
Speaker 3: that it's more consistently active.
Speaker 1: And I was just going to ask that any rooms
Speaker 1: that people should go or we.
Speaker 2: Have we have five five rooms. I'm gonna get this wrong, but.
Speaker 3: There there is for nineteen we have two, eighteen, two, twelve,
Speaker 3: one oh one, and then the North Penthouse, which is
Speaker 3: the five is five oh two, but that's Norman Baker's
Speaker 3: suite as well. So we have quite a few rooms
Speaker 3: that are are more active than others. I would say,
Speaker 3: more consistently active.
Speaker 1: Okay, Now, if someone is there and they're experiencing paranormal
Speaker 1: activity and they don't necessarily want to, what is your advice.
Speaker 3: My advice to them would be keep calm and relax,
Speaker 3: you know, don't overthink it because a lot of times
Speaker 3: it's not spirit activity. You know, it is just somebody.
Speaker 3: Because we are haunted. Unfortunately, people like to add to
Speaker 3: the experience. They'll come by and knock on your door,
Speaker 3: or they will make woo sounds outside and uh because
Speaker 3: it is a beautiful place to be. But also in
Speaker 3: that same way, just letting the spirits know I am
Speaker 3: not cool with this. So if we can just keep
Speaker 3: it to a minimum. I always say that talking out
Speaker 3: loud to spirits is the best way to get through,
Speaker 3: you know, because they are listening, you know. And whether
Speaker 3: that will make them not mess with you or make
Speaker 3: them mess with you more, I'm not sure. But I
Speaker 3: do find the non believers get that activity just to
Speaker 3: like so they could prove.
Speaker 2: That they're there.
Speaker 3: So maybe just being friendly and open and also letting
Speaker 3: them know that I really want to have a good
Speaker 3: night's sleep tonight.
Speaker 2: If we could just keep it to them be great. Exactly.
Speaker 1: That's the same advice I give people. And I'm always like,
Speaker 1: if you're that worried about it, you better bring sleeping spear,
Speaker 1: blood fear blogs and and good night.
Speaker 3: Trying to take a little melantonin to up your so
Speaker 3: but really, again, it's not supposed to be scary and uh.
Speaker 3: And again for those people that have come to the
Speaker 3: hotel and been either scared or non believers, you know,
Speaker 3: they still left with a great experience and and wanted
Speaker 3: to still come back.
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, that's great. So if people do want
Speaker 1: to visit, obviously they can book a room or whatever.
Speaker 1: But if they want to do a ghost tour, if
Speaker 1: they want to do investigating, what do they do?
Speaker 3: We actually have reserve Eureka dot com, which is a website.
Speaker 3: You go on there and you can buy tickets for
Speaker 3: the ghost tour. They run twenty nine fifty per person,
Speaker 3: and we will sometimes do up to twelve to thirteen
Speaker 3: ghost tours a night on a weekend night during the
Speaker 3: busy time, so we have plenty of opportunity. We take
Speaker 3: about twenty people on each tour, and we tour the
Speaker 3: entire hotel, and the only way you can get down
Speaker 3: into the morgue is to take the tour, So that's great.
Speaker 1: Well, I really appreciate you taking the time.
Speaker 2: Thank you telling me I appreciate you.
Speaker 1: I am super curious about the hotel. I've come this
Speaker 1: close so many times to getting there, so I'm going
Speaker 1: to make it happen.
Speaker 3: And I come to see you s And I also
Speaker 3: want to say that I'm a big fan of yours
Speaker 3: that I appreciate the reality that you bring to ghost investigating.
Speaker 3: So I appreciate you guys and your show as well.
Speaker 1: Oh well, thank you, we appreciate that. Yes, So, Sarah,
Speaker 1: thanks for joining me. I and hope you will meet
Speaker 1: in person very soon.
Speaker 2: Good. Thank you so much.
Speaker 3: Amy.
Speaker 1: The Crescent Hotel has clearly had so much more history
Speaker 1: and happiness in its past than despair. But the despair
Speaker 1: that does exist in its past is intense, more intense
Speaker 1: than most beautiful hotels you'd visit. I really can't think
Speaker 1: of many places that would have that much cause for
Speaker 1: a haunting. Imagine the mindset of someone desperately ill and dying,
Speaker 1: walking through the doors and feeling hope, saying goodbye to
Speaker 1: family members, hoping to return to them, cured, only to
Speaker 1: be carted away in the middle of the night after
Speaker 1: not making it at all, perhaps pieces of them cut
Speaker 1: out and left to rot behind the building. Remember that
Speaker 1: mindset when you visit the Crescent and reach out to
Speaker 1: those spirits there accordingly. I'm Amy Bruney and this was
Speaker 1: Haunted Road. Haunted Road is hosted and written by me
Speaker 1: Amy Bruney, with additional research by Taylor Haggerdorn and Cassandra
Speaker 1: de Alba. This show is edited and produced by rema
Speaker 1: El Kali, with supervising producer Josh Thain and executive producers
Speaker 1: Aaron Manke, Alex Williams, and Matt Frederick. Haunted Road is
Speaker 1: a production of iHeartRadio and Grim and Mild from Aaron Menke.
Speaker 1: Learn more about this show over at grimanmild dot com,
Speaker 1: and for more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.