1 00:00:00,560 --> 00:00:03,760 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class from how 2 00:00:03,800 --> 00:00:13,680 Speaker 1: Stuff Works dot com. Hello and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:13,720 --> 00:00:17,080 Speaker 1: I am editor Candice Gipson, joined as always by staff 4 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:21,520 Speaker 1: writer Joshua M clark. Hiere, josh, what's on your mind? 5 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:24,080 Speaker 1: But burning questions? Do you have for me today? Well? 6 00:00:24,120 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 1: You know, um, let me give a little leading. First 7 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:29,040 Speaker 1: of all, you don't pressure me here, Sorry about that. 8 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:30,960 Speaker 1: I'd like to get to the point. I know you do. 9 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 1: I know you do. I loved to meander and say 10 00:00:33,720 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: a lot. Have you noticed I don't know if you've noticed. 11 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:40,080 Speaker 1: I like to say indeed, yes, I like to say agreed, 12 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:44,960 Speaker 1: aren't we special? Well, anyway, as you know, I wrote 13 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:48,600 Speaker 1: How Cannibalism Works recently, and one of the points in 14 00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:53,000 Speaker 1: the article was about Columbus saying that he'd, you know, 15 00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 1: come across cannibals well, when he made a land in 16 00:00:56,880 --> 00:01:00,320 Speaker 1: in the Caribbean, um, and he met some a wax 17 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:03,639 Speaker 1: speaking people and supposedly another tribe that may or may 18 00:01:03,640 --> 00:01:10,640 Speaker 1: not have actually existed. The Caribs were um cannibals supposedly right, um. 19 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:13,800 Speaker 1: And the whole thing kind of reminded me of this. 20 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:16,440 Speaker 1: I'm kind of irked. Let me. Just put it this way, 21 00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:20,319 Speaker 1: I'm kind of irked that we have Columbus Day, that 22 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:26,560 Speaker 1: this one person is celebrated for discovering America when actually, 23 00:01:26,600 --> 00:01:29,959 Speaker 1: you know, Columbus may have been the first European to 24 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:33,759 Speaker 1: come across America, but clearly there were people already living there, 25 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:36,479 Speaker 1: at least the aarra Wax, if not more people, and 26 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: there were more people. Do you know about the Clovis people? Oh? 27 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:43,800 Speaker 1: You do? Huh? I do. Supposedly they took a land 28 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:46,400 Speaker 1: bridge and meandered all the way down from up in 29 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 1: the Alaska region, Is that right? Yeah, that's well, that's 30 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:52,240 Speaker 1: one theory. They may have also come from South America 31 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:55,000 Speaker 1: and gone north. We're not entirely certain. But we do 32 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:57,680 Speaker 1: know is that you know these that humans have been 33 00:01:57,720 --> 00:02:01,320 Speaker 1: in North America at least for eleven thousand, five hundred years, 34 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 1: if not, if not longer. And being a very empirical people, 35 00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:10,799 Speaker 1: we expect that the scholars and scientists and anthropologists who 36 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:14,520 Speaker 1: purport these theories of America's first discover what have you, 37 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:17,840 Speaker 1: produce tangible evidence of their presence. And that's one of 38 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:20,679 Speaker 1: the things that UM elevates. The Clovis and the fact 39 00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:23,040 Speaker 1: that they could have been the first Americans. And that's 40 00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:26,359 Speaker 1: that they left behind little arrowheads. Know that they were there. 41 00:02:26,480 --> 00:02:28,640 Speaker 1: That's how they're that's how they're known. And they can 42 00:02:28,919 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 1: just pop up out of nowhere and then disappear out 43 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:33,720 Speaker 1: of nowhere. There their arrowheads turned up in the fossil 44 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:38,000 Speaker 1: record and then disappear again. Um. And they're very mysterious. 45 00:02:38,040 --> 00:02:40,639 Speaker 1: But there, I guess we know that Clovis were the 46 00:02:40,680 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 1: first people, but which way they came from is in dispute. 47 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:47,400 Speaker 1: So you know there were already American Indians here when 48 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:51,760 Speaker 1: when Columbus arrived? Um? And I think the thing that 49 00:02:51,760 --> 00:02:55,520 Speaker 1: that excites my ires that you know, people say Columbus 50 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:59,919 Speaker 1: discovered America when actually Columbus may have been the first 51 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:03,959 Speaker 1: European to come across the New World, but even then 52 00:03:04,080 --> 00:03:07,000 Speaker 1: he was only the first European to go to Central America. 53 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:11,040 Speaker 1: When you're talking North America, you have to say that 54 00:03:11,160 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 1: it was Cabodo, an Italian explorer, who actually was the 55 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:19,600 Speaker 1: first European to make land in North America. Did you 56 00:03:19,639 --> 00:03:23,560 Speaker 1: know that you did? Okay, so you could say it 57 00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:27,200 Speaker 1: was Cabodo who was the first European to discover North America. 58 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:31,960 Speaker 1: But that's wrong as well. Actually, the first Europeans to 59 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 1: discover North America were the Vikings. Did you know that? 60 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:38,880 Speaker 1: Is that fact? That's a fact, isn't it. I don't 61 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:41,160 Speaker 1: know that. I entirely agree with you. Oh yeah, well 62 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:44,720 Speaker 1: who was here before the Vikings? Then? Actually, Josh, some 63 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 1: scholars believe that there was a seafaring monk from Ireland 64 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 1: who made it before the Vikings. I'm not sure that 65 00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:55,120 Speaker 1: your Viking theory is all that fact to all. Well, okay, 66 00:03:55,200 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 1: the Vikings left evidence behind um at a place in 67 00:04:00,440 --> 00:04:03,040 Speaker 1: uh in Canada, and I think Nova scotiould call what 68 00:04:03,160 --> 00:04:06,480 Speaker 1: lawnzo meadow. I think your your French accent is much 69 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:11,400 Speaker 1: better than mine, right, is that right? Yeah? Okay? Good? Um? 70 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: And that was about one thousand C right. So when 71 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 1: would this monk have come. He supposedly came in the 72 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:22,599 Speaker 1: sixth century, and he was a rather ambitious monk. His 73 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:25,479 Speaker 1: name was St. Brendan, and he decided one day that 74 00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:27,960 Speaker 1: he was going to go fine the Promised Land, the 75 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:31,600 Speaker 1: sort of exciting special place that monks knew existed, and 76 00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 1: his paradise on Earth. And um, after seven years he 77 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:40,440 Speaker 1: found it. He found this land of it was vastly 78 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:45,360 Speaker 1: full of landforms and gems and fruits. There were rivers 79 00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:49,000 Speaker 1: and volcanoes, and it was such a massive piece of 80 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:52,040 Speaker 1: land that after walking across it for forty days, they 81 00:04:52,080 --> 00:04:54,360 Speaker 1: still weren't the other end of it yet. Okay, So, 82 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:57,080 Speaker 1: but I mean this could have been anywhere, right, Yeah, 83 00:04:57,120 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 1: it could have, except that marine biologist in the nineteen 84 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:05,360 Speaker 1: eighties found petroglyphs in West Virginia. The head Oh, I'm sorry, 85 00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:11,960 Speaker 1: they're rock carvings. He found these rock carvings inscribed with 86 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:15,839 Speaker 1: a type of ancient Irish writing, and when he translated it, 87 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 1: according to his interpretation, it was a story as an activity. 88 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:24,240 Speaker 1: What I know, I know. So who else but a 89 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:29,119 Speaker 1: seafaring Irish monk, deeply penitent and religious would have carved 90 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 1: into a rock the story of the Nativity. Okay, so 91 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: then that's it. That's the Irish monk beat the vikings 92 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:38,000 Speaker 1: when it wasn't everybody know this well, because a lot 93 00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:40,159 Speaker 1: of people are unsure if the accounts are really true. 94 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 1: He wrote a book, He wrote a treaty about his travels. 95 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:47,320 Speaker 1: The Irish Monk did the travels of St. Brendan. And 96 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:51,400 Speaker 1: when people rediscovered this book and the ninth century, they 97 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:54,479 Speaker 1: thought quite frankly, it was sort of faction. You know. 98 00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:57,680 Speaker 1: There were stuff that was pretty straightforward, like the river 99 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:00,520 Speaker 1: is this long and wide according to my eyes, But 100 00:06:00,560 --> 00:06:05,560 Speaker 1: there were other more fantastical detail like, um, he delivered 101 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:08,520 Speaker 1: communion on the back of a whale. Yeah, I guess 102 00:06:08,560 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 1: it could happen. Yeah, if the whale was very willing. Yeah, 103 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:15,680 Speaker 1: the well would have had to holl Is pretty still 104 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 1: for communion. But because it was so deeply infused with 105 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 1: biblical references and allegories, people were less inclined to believe it, 106 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:29,080 Speaker 1: because again, it wasn't just empirical data. It told the 107 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:32,919 Speaker 1: story of a religious experience. But as far as the 108 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:36,800 Speaker 1: Vikings being in America, first, apparently there were reports that 109 00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:39,279 Speaker 1: when American Indians saw the Vikings it was sort of 110 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:41,960 Speaker 1: old hat did down. They're like, yes, you're white. We 111 00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:44,919 Speaker 1: have seen people if you're kind before and must have 112 00:06:44,920 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 1: been the Irish. Apparently these people could speak languages. It 113 00:06:48,600 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 1: sounded pretty similar to Irish. We would the Vikings have 114 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:54,920 Speaker 1: recognized the Irish language? They would have. They certainly would 115 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:57,400 Speaker 1: have because they lived in close proximity to the Irish 116 00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:02,279 Speaker 1: precisely precisely, but where a lot of people take real 117 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:04,800 Speaker 1: issue with. The story is not necessarily about religion at 118 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:08,839 Speaker 1: about technology. They asked, how could an Irish monk have 119 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:12,520 Speaker 1: built seacraft that would have withstood the rough waters of 120 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:15,000 Speaker 1: the seas to make it all the way to North America. 121 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 1: The Vikings were, you know, the earliest explorers. By all accounts, 122 00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:21,720 Speaker 1: they had like shipbuilding down and as far as I know, 123 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 1: nobody really had an ocean going vessel up to that 124 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 1: point before the Vikings. So, I mean, how could an 125 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:31,040 Speaker 1: Irish monk have gotten to North America. It's a pretty 126 00:07:31,040 --> 00:07:34,840 Speaker 1: long voyage, right it is. And not to confuse the 127 00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 1: matter too much, I was sort of reminded of an 128 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:42,520 Speaker 1: argument and another article that I researched and wrote about 129 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:48,320 Speaker 1: the Easter Islanders. And these were essentially Polynesians who fashioned 130 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 1: very simple, dugout wooden boats. And there are two theories 131 00:07:52,400 --> 00:07:55,440 Speaker 1: behind the Easter Islanders. Either they came from the tip 132 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:59,240 Speaker 1: of South America or they came from Micronesia to settle 133 00:07:59,280 --> 00:08:02,960 Speaker 1: Easter Island. Either way, it's a really, really long way away. 134 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:05,240 Speaker 1: If they came from the tip of South America, we're 135 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:09,480 Speaker 1: talking approximately two thousand, two d ninety miles. They came 136 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 1: from Polynesia. We're talking about a thousand miles and this 137 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:19,040 Speaker 1: was about two centuries before St. Brendan. So again I 138 00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 1: don't know if this is a relevant point or not, 139 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:22,800 Speaker 1: because it's not as though the Easter Islanders would have 140 00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 1: been in touch with them. They weren't exactly pen pals, 141 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:30,200 Speaker 1: but people were thinking up seafaring technology. What's more, when 142 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:32,520 Speaker 1: they traveled, it was during the midst of what was 143 00:08:32,559 --> 00:08:35,679 Speaker 1: an Elmino like weather pattern, so they weren't, you know, 144 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:38,680 Speaker 1: sailing the Placid seas. They were up against really rough 145 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 1: winds and rainstorm and St. Brendan ship would have been 146 00:08:43,400 --> 00:08:45,600 Speaker 1: a little bit more complex, supposedly was you know, it 147 00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 1: was a wooden frame that it was covered in ox 148 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 1: hide and waterproofed with tar, so it would have been 149 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,920 Speaker 1: a little bit more stable than these people sea craft. 150 00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 1: And then there was a guy back in six to 151 00:08:56,400 --> 00:08:58,840 Speaker 1: Severn who decided he was going to try to recreate 152 00:08:58,880 --> 00:09:01,040 Speaker 1: the journey to see if a would be done in 153 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:04,320 Speaker 1: a very primitive seacraft. Did he make it? He did? 154 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:07,120 Speaker 1: He did. He did in the same kind of boat 155 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:11,400 Speaker 1: that St. Brendan supposedly, so it is theoretically possible that 156 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:14,800 Speaker 1: an Irish monk did make it to America. It certainly is. 157 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:18,720 Speaker 1: That is fascinating. I know, I know, and I have 158 00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 1: one more fascinating tidbid for you. What tell me? To 159 00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:23,120 Speaker 1: be honest? I don't know how do you see this is? 160 00:09:23,160 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: But I'm part Irish. Um, I'm no second cousin to 161 00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:29,360 Speaker 1: Roma Downey, but my grandmother's maiden name was O'Brien, and 162 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:31,440 Speaker 1: I have a fiery temper to prove it well. At 163 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:33,160 Speaker 1: least do you answer whether or not it was the 164 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:36,720 Speaker 1: Vikings who were the first to discover America. First European 165 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:39,240 Speaker 1: said is so thanks for that? You are very welcome, 166 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:41,120 Speaker 1: And if you want to clear it up even more, 167 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:44,000 Speaker 1: you can read was an Irish monk the first European 168 00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:48,840 Speaker 1: to find America? On how stuff works dot com for 169 00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:51,240 Speaker 1: more on this and thousands of other topics. Is it 170 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:54,560 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot com. Let us know what you think. 171 00:09:54,880 --> 00:10:04,319 Speaker 1: Send an email to podcast at how stuff works dot com.