Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg p m L Podcast. I'm pim Fox.
Speaker 1: Along with my co host Lisa Bramowitz. Each day we
Speaker 1: bring you the most important, noteworthy, and useful interviews for
Speaker 1: you and your money, whether you're at the grocery store
Speaker 1: or the trading floor. Find the Bloomberg p m L
Speaker 1: Podcast on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, and Bloomberg dot com. The
Speaker 1: rhetoric is hot. The action in markets is saying we
Speaker 1: don't buy it right now. The trade talk is way
Speaker 1: more powerful than the actual effects, at least according to traders.
Speaker 1: But are they taking things seriously enough and joining us
Speaker 1: down to talk about that. Alberto Gallo, Partner and portfolio
Speaker 1: manager of macro Strategies at Algebras UK Limited. Uh, coming
Speaker 1: to us from London. Alberto, we always love having you on.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for being with us. So you know,
Speaker 1: we heard President Trump of say We're gonna go ahead
Speaker 1: with tariffs on our our allies, the allies responding with
Speaker 1: absolute anger, markets totally shrugging it all off. Are they
Speaker 1: to senguine? I believe that markets are a little bit complacent,
Speaker 1: especially emerging markets. It's true that we had a very
Speaker 1: bad week last week, but generally speaking, we see an
Speaker 1: escalation in UH trade conflicts and UM the policies of
Speaker 1: the Trump administration is implementing we'll bring growth back to
Speaker 1: the US out of emerging markets. So what we're seeing
Speaker 1: actually in the credit space is a reprising of spreads
Speaker 1: across UH, some of the weakest emerging markets like Argentina
Speaker 1: and Turkey, but also some of the other ones like
Speaker 1: brazili and Mexico. And we think that these UM, these
Speaker 1: carry trades will continue to be under pressure. First it
Speaker 1: was currency is now even harder, even local currency debt,
Speaker 1: and then hard currency debt are repricing UM and also
Speaker 1: Europe will be on the more pressure because Europe depends
Speaker 1: very much on exports to emerging market. So you know,
Speaker 1: it's a stronger dollar trend even though we have some
Speaker 1: relief today, and it's a trend of divergence, not goldilocks,
Speaker 1: so the opposite of what we had last year. Alberto,
Speaker 1: how much of what you're saying, which is weaker as
Speaker 1: a prices in the in the European Union as well
Speaker 1: as an emerging markets, how much of that hinges on
Speaker 1: escalating trade tensions and how much do you think that
Speaker 1: just will happen based on where we are right now
Speaker 1: in the economic cycle. There's two things. One is that
Speaker 1: the trade tensions, as you said, have a potential to
Speaker 1: become worse. And geo political risk also is relatively high
Speaker 1: in the Middle East. So all these things can can
Speaker 1: hinder global trade. The second fear that we have is
Speaker 1: that after a week Q one, some economies may just
Speaker 1: not regain the momentum they have lost. So in the
Speaker 1: in the Eurozone, for example, you've seen a pretty weak
Speaker 1: Q one. The level of growth, the level of p
Speaker 1: m I are very good, but momentum is fading. And
Speaker 1: so what you should do, if if you are a
Speaker 1: policymakers now is to do a physical stimulus to um
Speaker 1: to UH push growth higher. And we know that some
Speaker 1: core European countries have a surplus um like Germany, France
Speaker 1: that they can spend, but there is lack of willingness
Speaker 1: to to use this um. So for the moment we
Speaker 1: are in a slowdown um, you know, in a slowdown
Speaker 1: of momentum. Well, Alberto, Italy doesn't seem to have any
Speaker 1: reticence about spending money that they don't have. And I'm
Speaker 1: curious about whether you believe Italy's problems are over because
Speaker 1: they have a new finance minister, Giovanni Tria, and I
Speaker 1: believe that in the past he has actually said that
Speaker 1: the euro is a rigged system in favor of Germany. Well,
Speaker 1: the Eurozone is favor in Germany, that is a fact.
Speaker 1: There's a making his study which shows that Germany is
Speaker 1: gaining around two and fifty billion euros in savings from
Speaker 1: being in the Eurozone by funding a negative yields and
Speaker 1: by having an exchange rate which is lower than than
Speaker 1: a potential dodge Mark would be. So some of these
Speaker 1: benefits are not being redistributed. But it's also true that
Speaker 1: Germany cannot bear the weight of saving all the periphery
Speaker 1: countries and Italy hasn't done the reforms it should have done.
Speaker 1: So you know, the truth is in the middle at
Speaker 1: least been very much the UM the target of all
Speaker 1: the migrant flows, together with Spain in Greece from North Africa,
Speaker 1: and so it has been under a particular physical strain
Speaker 1: to um to host all the all the migrants. Around
Speaker 1: almost a million people arrived in the last few years.
Speaker 1: So I would say the euro exit fear is has
Speaker 1: been a it overdone Italy doesn't want to exit. Three
Speaker 1: out of four Italians want to stay in the European
Speaker 1: Union and in the Eurozone. But maybe a little bit
Speaker 1: of slack on the physical side. The pro growth measures
Speaker 1: are needed in the periphery where you still have very
Speaker 1: high youth unemployment. Okay, So Alberto, I want to put
Speaker 1: you on the spot. What would make you actually trade
Speaker 1: on some of the trade talk? In other words, you
Speaker 1: know what, what so far have we heard with respect
Speaker 1: to rhetoric that has actually affected your investing thesis and
Speaker 1: uh and made you shift around your portfolio generally, I
Speaker 1: would say we have already shifted towards a less positive
Speaker 1: stance on some of the emerging market country's debt which
Speaker 1: we were invested in last year. So we have reduced
Speaker 1: exposure to some of the riskiest countries in emerging markets.
Speaker 1: We have actually hedged or overheaged um some of the
Speaker 1: weakest ones like Turkey or Argentina and also Brazilian Mexico
Speaker 1: which face elections this year. We're not looking for a crisis,
Speaker 1: but there is a potential for repricing because the FED
Speaker 1: is hiking so liquidit is going away from em back
Speaker 1: to America to dollar assets, so some of these carry
Speaker 1: trades that were so profitable aren't profitable anymore. And also
Speaker 1: that you know, the trade escalation could be a negative
Speaker 1: growth driver for countries that export to the to the US,
Speaker 1: for for China and all the countries that rely on
Speaker 1: on on China. UM and all these things are you know,
Speaker 1: if you look at valuations, they're not really priced in UM.
Speaker 1: There's been a very good year last year for emerging
Speaker 1: markets debt and equity, and and you know this year
Speaker 1: we had a small a small correction, but you know,
Speaker 1: spreads in emerging market debt are still near record lows.
Speaker 1: Thanks very much, Alberto Gallo, portfolio manager. Ahead of macro Strategies,
Speaker 1: Algebra Investments joining us from London. The shares of Merk
Speaker 1: are higher by nearly two percent right now. This comes
Speaker 1: after the results of a follow up to follow up
Speaker 1: studies having to do with advanced melanoma showing that Merk's
Speaker 1: key true to drug demonstrated long term survival benefits. Here
Speaker 1: to tell us more about this and other wonders of
Speaker 1: the scientific world attending the American Society of Clinical Oncology
Speaker 1: conference in Chicago is none other than our healthcare reporter
Speaker 1: for stocks Tatiana Dar and she joins us now and
Speaker 1: I recommend you follow Tatiana on Twitter at Tatiana Dor.
Speaker 1: That's D A R I double E when it comes
Speaker 1: to being on Twitter. Tatiana tell us about this meeting.
Speaker 1: Why is this this clinical oncology conference so important to companies? Yes,
Speaker 1: thanks so much for having me them so we have.
Speaker 1: It's important because we have really the biggest UH and
Speaker 1: the most prominent doctors and cancer and in the fields
Speaker 1: of oncology attending this meeting to really stay on top
Speaker 1: of the research and innovation in this field. And this
Speaker 1: year it appears that Mark is a clear winner here
Speaker 1: because they just posted data in UM stage four lung
Speaker 1: key answer. These are really patients that have no other
Speaker 1: options and the most important finding here is that their drug,
Speaker 1: key Truda, was able to help patients live longer than
Speaker 1: those on chemos therapy. So this studies really positions the
Speaker 1: company to UM allow patients to avoid chemotherapy altogether and
Speaker 1: just go on Truda, and the benefit there was from
Speaker 1: four to eight months. That's a remarkable UM benefit, you
Speaker 1: know for those patients who really don't have a lot
Speaker 1: of options. So Mark a winner one loser Nectar Therapeutics.
Speaker 1: You just put out a story noting that it has
Speaker 1: lost a third of its value today after a study
Speaker 1: that it put out. Can you tell us more about that? Yes,
Speaker 1: exactly so. And the last time I check you was
Speaker 1: about a quarter. I think that they are they lost
Speaker 1: or even more than that. It's incredible the move. Investors
Speaker 1: are really punishing Nectar Therapeuts here, and that's because expectations
Speaker 1: were really high going into the conference. This is a
Speaker 1: company that's presented very promising results of its drug in
Speaker 1: combination with bristol um squibbed up pivo and uh those results.
Speaker 1: The big question for investor here has been will those
Speaker 1: promising results called up in a bigger patient population, And
Speaker 1: unfortunately we have seen as those response rates come down
Speaker 1: and melanoma and kidney cancer. Well, the company has been
Speaker 1: assuring investors that yet too early to tell and rush
Speaker 1: to conclusions about the drugs benefit because they've only presented
Speaker 1: data on patients that happened on the treatment for just
Speaker 1: a couple of months. So they will have up an
Speaker 1: state later in the year. But you know, today it
Speaker 1: looks like investors are have been really disappointed so far.
Speaker 1: Tatiana how do you describe to people this world of
Speaker 1: gene editing, because that seems to be such a hot
Speaker 1: area when it comes to investments and also scientific advances. Yes,
Speaker 1: I'm um uh, probably the best way to describe it
Speaker 1: right now, you know, in science fiction, because this is
Speaker 1: really something. It's just incredible to have um doctors being
Speaker 1: able to you know, and scientists being able to edit
Speaker 1: your DNA information so that it can provide a cure
Speaker 1: for some diseases that have genetic mutations and have no
Speaker 1: other alternative today. But it's very early, and you know,
Speaker 1: we've seen and we've learned with Christmas Therapeutics. The FDA
Speaker 1: has put a hold on a trial that they haven't
Speaker 1: even started, and that's because there is still a lot
Speaker 1: of questions when it comes to doing this in people.
Speaker 1: We have data in animals. We know it works on
Speaker 1: agriculture with plants. With animals, we don't know yet if
Speaker 1: it works in humans and if it's sad enough. Tell
Speaker 1: us about a company called Bluebird Bio. They're based in Cambridge,
Speaker 1: and of course the Bloomberg one or six one Boston, Newburyport.
Speaker 1: Tell us about Bluebird Bio. The shares are up about
Speaker 1: three and a half percent today. Yes, Blue was also
Speaker 1: subject to a pretty interesting debate here at the conference,
Speaker 1: they posted data showing that their drug I delayed the
Speaker 1: progression of a melanoma in patients by almost about a year.
Speaker 1: And if you compare that to the current standard of
Speaker 1: care or the current treatments that patients are getting, they're
Speaker 1: only seeing a benefit of about four months. So you know,
Speaker 1: that's an impressive benefit of almost double the current benefit
Speaker 1: that they're getting. But the question for investors, also based
Speaker 1: on high expectations um on primary results, has been if
Speaker 1: they can provide a larger benefit, and I think investors
Speaker 1: were looking for something closer to fifteen months. But doctors,
Speaker 1: you know, again, I guess they had those conversations over
Speaker 1: the weekend they said, this is a very solid result
Speaker 1: a year versus the four months we're currently seeing. Tatiana,
Speaker 1: I'm wondering, just if you take a step back, whether
Speaker 1: there's been any discussion about President Trump's talk of lowering
Speaker 1: drug prices given the fact that these are largely pharmaceutical companies. Uh, well,
Speaker 1: not so much, Lisa, that this conference is very, very
Speaker 1: focused on the latest innovation in on colloge here and
Speaker 1: I guess that that the talk has in town has
Speaker 1: been anti TUDA and also on combination approaches, because unfortunately
Speaker 1: we're seeing a great benefit and lung cancer patients, but
Speaker 1: there are lots of other cancers and lots of other
Speaker 1: patients who currently don't have many options. So doctors are
Speaker 1: trying to um to to see what the latest innovation
Speaker 1: there is. Tatiana, thank you so much for being with us.
Speaker 1: It's always a fascinating conference. We look forward to your
Speaker 1: reports out of it. Tatiana Darier, Healthcare reporter for Boomberg.
Speaker 1: Reporting from the American Society of Clinical Oncology Winners and
Speaker 1: losers emerging as these companies reveal tests and uh studies
Speaker 1: that show whether or not their their strategies are effective.
Speaker 1: The advertising industry has been rapidly changing. In one company
Speaker 1: in particular is trying to reflect that change in itself.
Speaker 1: Joining us now is John Seafort Cifert. Excuse me, John cifer,
Speaker 1: Chairman and chief executive officer of ogilvie H. He is
Speaker 1: here in our eleven three oh studio. So tomorrow is
Speaker 1: a big day. You are rebranded, rebranding but also refounding
Speaker 1: this agency. Tell us what's happening exactly. Well, Tomorrow is
Speaker 1: really a milestone in the nearly thirty month journey that
Speaker 1: we've been going through to transform the company. Uh, we're
Speaker 1: nearly seventy years old, will be seventy in this coming September,
Speaker 1: since David Ogilvy founded the company in New York, and
Speaker 1: we're probably going through the biggest business transformation in our
Speaker 1: company's history. We're pulling down all the silos, all the
Speaker 1: specialist divisions that have been built up over years, and
Speaker 1: really trying to bring it all together and connect it
Speaker 1: as one company. Tomorrow is what we're calling our refounding
Speaker 1: affectionately and David's honor. He started the company as one brand,
Speaker 1: and so tomorrow we're reintroducing the brand to our fifteen
Speaker 1: thousand plus employees, all in the context of giving them
Speaker 1: greater clarity on really the founding purpose of of why
Speaker 1: Ogilvy exists, which we believe it's to make our clients
Speaker 1: brands matter in an incredibly chaotic, fast paced, changing world
Speaker 1: where technology and social media and so many other factors
Speaker 1: have change the way brands are built today. John, I
Speaker 1: remember the booklet that David Ogilvie would offer to all
Speaker 1: new employees. It was called what we Believe and how
Speaker 1: we behave, and he described Ogilvy as a teaching hospital.
Speaker 1: And I'm wondering if you can use your own experience
Speaker 1: of joining Ogilvy. Uh, you didn't even get out of college.
Speaker 1: I believe you were an intern and Bill Phillips took
Speaker 1: you on and you just war people down to accept
Speaker 1: You tell people a little bit of your story and
Speaker 1: how that kind of exemplifies this idea of what we
Speaker 1: believe in how we behave. Well, you're touching on exactly
Speaker 1: the motivation for why we want to do this refounding,
Speaker 1: because I do believe in my personal story it is
Speaker 1: a story of the brand Um. I was fortunate enough
Speaker 1: to have a family friend who works for David Ogilvie,
Speaker 1: and she um she was concerned that, as a sort
Speaker 1: of c student at the University of Southern California who
Speaker 1: spent more time with his friends and at parties, I
Speaker 1: might need a little kick in the butt to get
Speaker 1: my act together. And so she appealed to then uh
Speaker 1: president of Ogilvie and may theer in the u S
Speaker 1: Bill Phillips, to give me a summer job. So I
Speaker 1: showed up on the doorstep in June of nine seventy nine,
Speaker 1: with nothing more than a business card from Bill that said,
Speaker 1: give this guy a summer job and uh and and
Speaker 1: that's what happened. So I am a product of the
Speaker 1: system of a commitment to teach someone who knew almost
Speaker 1: nothing about either advertising or business or marketing UH, to
Speaker 1: help help bring out my kind of I guess natural
Speaker 1: inclination to work hard and and and learn from an
Speaker 1: amazing group of people. So the message is staying the same.
Speaker 1: The backdrop, though, has changed dramatically. In the past few
Speaker 1: years have been somewhat difficult for the advertising business and
Speaker 1: for ogilvie UM and I want you to talk a
Speaker 1: little bit about why. Well. One of the things that
Speaker 1: give us such conviction about the changes we're making and
Speaker 1: the motivation to to refound the brand, so to speak,
Speaker 1: is that we are seeing unprecedented change within our client organizations.
Speaker 1: They themselves and their industries are in a complete state
Speaker 1: of disruption, whether that is through new business models, new
Speaker 1: brands that have come onto the scene with none of
Speaker 1: the legacy challenges of of their cost structure, their innovation pipeline,
Speaker 1: their access to capital, and are really innovating in a
Speaker 1: much more dynamic, much faster way to the needs and
Speaker 1: interests of the the end consumer than we've ever seen,
Speaker 1: certainly that I've ever seen in my lifetime. And with
Speaker 1: that disruption has come a lot of pressure on these
Speaker 1: businesses to get their own cost structures in line, simplify
Speaker 1: and and get the complexity of out of their own
Speaker 1: business systems, and then think about brand building in a
Speaker 1: modern way, which is, how do you connect everything from
Speaker 1: your promise, your values, the point of view you have
Speaker 1: in the marketplace to the things that matter in terms
Speaker 1: of how do I buy your products and services by
Speaker 1: my mobile phone or how do I, you know, enjoy
Speaker 1: an experience that transforms the way I think about your
Speaker 1: value to me in my life. So every client we
Speaker 1: we have right now is going through this kind of
Speaker 1: set of changes. What's the biggest change in skills that
Speaker 1: employees at Ogilvie need to have in order to be
Speaker 1: successful today? We are training them in the spirit of
Speaker 1: teaching hospital to think holistically. We absolutely need specialist skills,
Speaker 1: be it in understanding the coding that goes behind the
Speaker 1: technology that serves a consumer through a mobile device or
Speaker 1: or or through UH through some other form of of
Speaker 1: digital experience, but we also need people to see the
Speaker 1: whole brand to understand that the trust that's built through
Speaker 1: employees and their belief in what they're selling and how
Speaker 1: they serve and what they promise to customers can be
Speaker 1: fulfilled by the institution of the clients themselves. And so
Speaker 1: we think of almost every audience reg later's employees and consumers,
Speaker 1: the partners that many of our clients are now doing
Speaker 1: business with. All of these audiences are vital. For those
Speaker 1: companies and brands that don't have a holistic view of
Speaker 1: it and can see how to connect the dots, we
Speaker 1: think those companies are going to suffer to either new
Speaker 1: brands or brands that transform faster, and to us, that's
Speaker 1: the future of of where this is all going from
Speaker 1: a brandom business perspective. Are there's some things that don't change.
Speaker 1: For example, Uh, I remember reading something about how you
Speaker 1: got promoted early on in your career, and it was
Speaker 1: about a breakfast buffet, and I'm wondering if you could
Speaker 1: just quickly tell that story and about how it doesn't
Speaker 1: matter what you do, but everything you do has to
Speaker 1: be exceptional to the point of trying to make that
Speaker 1: connection with the client no exactly. I mean, I um
Speaker 1: it was. It still befuddles me to some extent. But
Speaker 1: I used to work on the Mattel toys business. We
Speaker 1: used to make hundreds of toy commercials every year, primarily
Speaker 1: for showing at what was called the Wayfair to see
Speaker 1: which of the major retailers would accept a new toy
Speaker 1: and uh. We used to screen these rough cut commercials
Speaker 1: of these different toy commercials at seven in the morning
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles because it was the only way to
Speaker 1: clients could come see the films, give you comments, and
Speaker 1: then get back to their offices through the horrendous l
Speaker 1: A traffic. And so one morning, normally we would just
Speaker 1: put out some simple you know, bagels and orange jues
Speaker 1: and things, and I thought to myself, you know, this
Speaker 1: is kind of boring. Let's try and spice this up.
Speaker 1: So I went and bought fresh orange juice for everybody.
Speaker 1: I got this amazing array of of Danish and fruit
Speaker 1: and and everything, and the meeting went so well, I think,
Speaker 1: probably because some of this stuff put people in a
Speaker 1: better mood than they came in that my supervisor came
Speaker 1: to me a week later and said, you know, the
Speaker 1: way you handled yourself in that meeting was phenomenal. I
Speaker 1: didn't do anything but bring the catering. It. We think
Speaker 1: your account super our senior account executive material. Uh, congratulations.
Speaker 1: So but it was really just to your point. It
Speaker 1: was a foundation of go the extra make the extra
Speaker 1: effort and and and create a client experience that people
Speaker 1: remember and make sure that people eat well. Yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: just gonna say that I've learned throughout my career Pete,
Speaker 1: feed people well, good things happen. Thanks very much. John
Speaker 1: Seifert is the chairman and the chief executive of Ogilvy,
Speaker 1: their division of w p P. And congratulations and best
Speaker 1: wishes on your refounding. Uh, this is going to be
Speaker 1: an exceptional time in the world of appetizing in a
Speaker 1: world of mass production, one company remains committed to hand
Speaker 1: made items, specifically hand made beds and linen's And joining
Speaker 1: us now is Yan right. He is the executive chairman
Speaker 1: of Houstins and they are based in Sweden, and it's
Speaker 1: a pleasure to have him here in our eleven three
Speaker 1: y OHD studio. Yean, thank you very much for being here.
Speaker 1: Give people just a little a brief history of this
Speaker 1: is a fifth generation family owned business and you start.
Speaker 1: The business started by making saddles and now it makes
Speaker 1: mattresses as well as other items to help you sleep better. Yes,
Speaker 1: my grandfather's grandfather also master saddler, and he founded the
Speaker 1: company twenty two on March eighteen hundred fifty two. So
Speaker 1: we are on a mission to sorry people, to make
Speaker 1: people's lives better. And the focus have been on belts
Speaker 1: since the start and only on belts, Son and accessories
Speaker 1: hundred sounds since nineteen seventeen. So I was reading through
Speaker 1: your catalog and the mattresses can go from four thousand
Speaker 1: dollars up to more than a hundred and dollars depending
Speaker 1: on what you customize them. They are a luxury product
Speaker 1: made from natural ingredients and handcrafted. I'm trying to understand
Speaker 1: how the business has changed for you, because when I
Speaker 1: travel on the subway in New York City, I see
Speaker 1: a lot of advertisements for for Caspers or uh, you know,
Speaker 1: name your mattress shop. It seems like it has gotten
Speaker 1: more competitive and more crowded with companies that don't have
Speaker 1: the same kind of overhead. Well, it's a lot of
Speaker 1: crap out there in the jungle. The keys that the
Speaker 1: consumer are intelligence and they recognized they have a lack
Speaker 1: of sleep, they are sleep deprivated and so on. So
Speaker 1: they are looking for for some things that really changed
Speaker 1: that and what other product would be better for your health?
Speaker 1: What other product would be better for your beauty? And
Speaker 1: sleeping really really good in the Hastin's path, have you
Speaker 1: seen business expand substantially over the past few years. Yes,
Speaker 1: we are growing rapidly. We've been growing rapidly for almost
Speaker 1: forty years and right now we are growing pcent in
Speaker 1: the United States this year compared last year growth were
Speaker 1: We are are aiming for more than growth and we
Speaker 1: do that in ten of our top markets. How much
Speaker 1: how much does this sort of hinge on the population
Speaker 1: of wealthy individuals and how that's increased. Um, I don't know.
Speaker 1: Of course, they need to sleep, but everyone needs to sleep.
Speaker 1: So we are on a mission to reach any consumer
Speaker 1: that from four thousand dollars and upwards, anyone that prioritize
Speaker 1: to live better, to have a better life, be happier
Speaker 1: and look younger and sleep. But they are we are
Speaker 1: here for them. Tell us about your plans in specifically
Speaker 1: in India, because as I was noting that you have
Speaker 1: You've got a franchise model there and you have really
Speaker 1: tried to expand the business and maybe just give us
Speaker 1: a little bit of look better. Why you you selected India, Well,
Speaker 1: we are working with farty seven countries right now. India
Speaker 1: is one of them. It's maybe a coincidence that you
Speaker 1: picked India. But we have a growth rate. I saw
Speaker 1: the morning's figures. We have a growth rate compared to
Speaker 1: last year. We have plus two thousand percent in India.
Speaker 1: So we are working. We have local partners, that is,
Speaker 1: people that have discovered our product. They sleep in our
Speaker 1: product themselves and they feel that our mission to make
Speaker 1: this world a better place and how people sar people
Speaker 1: to sleep better is amazing thing. So so I'm wondering.
Speaker 1: You know a lot of people talk about the input costs.
Speaker 1: You know, the commodity prices have been increasing, and I'm wondering,
Speaker 1: from your perspective, have you seen that it is getting
Speaker 1: more expensive not only to source materials but also to
Speaker 1: pay people to actually do the labor. Well, of course
Speaker 1: labor costs, but but we are located in Sweden, so
Speaker 1: we have the usual increase and we have very qualified labor.
Speaker 1: But I love him. It's like people live well in Sweden.
Speaker 1: I'm like you, and the this isn't an issue in Sweden.
Speaker 1: I know Swedenly swedenly isn't the low cost country to produce,
Speaker 1: but we do that because we want to have the
Speaker 1: highest quality. What about the commodity prices, Well, we source
Speaker 1: the highest and best quality materials and of course the
Speaker 1: prices go up, but they are following index. It's it's
Speaker 1: nothing special. Also, just to mention it because it may
Speaker 1: not be evident, but your beds can be found in
Speaker 1: hotels as well as in cruise ships. That's another more
Speaker 1: And it's not just the stationary market. Uh, Is that
Speaker 1: something that you're also pursuing. We are not prioritized that.
Speaker 1: We have started very recently working with the hospitality. So
Speaker 1: it has only been individuals that have been sleeping on
Speaker 1: our beds. Someone they have started sleeping in hastins. They
Speaker 1: want it in their yacht, they want it in our airplane.
Speaker 1: So we supply our planes and we can customize whatever
Speaker 1: you want. Yeah, and right, thank you so much for
Speaker 1: being with us. Young right, executive chairman of Hostins, talking
Speaker 1: about the importance of sleep and him he doesn't need
Speaker 1: to convince me, does he needs to convince you, not
Speaker 1: at all. But I I just spend more time getting
Speaker 1: up earlier now I do, yes, all right, so I
Speaker 1: get older. Well, you know, in fairness, my bed often
Speaker 1: gets shared. It's certainly early morning by the little pitter
Speaker 1: pattern that comes tramping in and it's wid spy. Yeah.
Speaker 1: They disturbed my sleep plenty, exactly. Um, thank you very
Speaker 1: much for being with us. Thanks for listening to the
Speaker 1: Bloomberg P and L podcast. You can subscribe and listen
Speaker 1: to interviews at Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, or whatever podcast platform
Speaker 1: you prefer. I'm pim Fox. I'm on Twitter at pim Fox.
Speaker 1: I'm on Twitter at Lisa abramowits one before the podcast.
Speaker 1: You can always catch us worldwide on Bloomberg Radio