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Speaker 1: Cool Media.

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Speaker 2: Hi everyone, Margaret here and I'm not in my studio,

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Speaker 2: so this sound sounds different because I'm on tour. This

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Speaker 2: isn't a blurb about me being on tour. That's just

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Speaker 2: my excuse for the bad audio. Also, there's a large

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Speaker 2: dog next to me and she wants to be involved

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Speaker 2: in this recording, but she can't be. But the point

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Speaker 2: of this This week's episodes are about formal and informal

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Speaker 2: disaster relief organizations working together or as best they can

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Speaker 2: to try to help people in disaster situations. And I

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Speaker 2: recorded it a week and a half ago. Just a

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Speaker 2: few days ago, Hurricane Helene hit the US pretty badly,

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Speaker 2: and it in particular hit western North Carolina, and so

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Speaker 2: they n Apalachia in general in some of the least

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Speaker 2: resourced parts of the country, and people are as of

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Speaker 2: me recording this on Saturday, cut off from cell service,

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Speaker 2: cut off from food, gas, and water, and people are

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Speaker 2: working right now to try to alleviate that. And one

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Speaker 2: of the groups that I talk about a little bit

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Speaker 2: in this episode is Mutual Aid Disaster Relief Matter MADR,

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Speaker 2: and they are currently looking for resources and gear to

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Speaker 2: donate to the people, and they are working with pilots

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Speaker 2: and trucks to get your donations into the affected areas.

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Speaker 2: And I would heavily recommend that people check out Mutual

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Speaker 2: Aid Disaster Relief on social media, which is the name

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Speaker 2: of the organization, as well as the idea to find

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Speaker 2: how to donate. There are going to be in a

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Speaker 2: lot of areas elsewhere in North Carolina and likely elsewhere

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Speaker 2: staging ground areas where people are collecting gear to get

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Speaker 2: it to where it needs to go. But you can

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Speaker 2: also just donate money, and I have done so and

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Speaker 2: encourage you to do so because well, as they say,

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Speaker 2: we keep us safe, and there's a lot of people

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Speaker 2: that we can help keep safe right now, and I

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Speaker 2: hope you help me in doing that. Okay, I hope

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Speaker 2: you enjoyed the episode. Hello, and welcome to Cool People.

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Speaker 2: Did Cool Stuff your weekly reminder that hope is a

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Speaker 2: discipline and we have to find it sometimes and sometimes

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Speaker 2: it's hard, but it can usually be done, and so

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Speaker 2: we try to do it. I'm your host, Marrak Kiljoy

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Speaker 2: with my strangely earnest intro, but I have a guest

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Speaker 2: who's Katie Stole. Hi.

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Speaker 3: Hi, Hi, I loved your strangely earnest intro. I think

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Speaker 3: it's important and everything you said is accurate.

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Speaker 2: Thank you. I feel like hope is a thing that

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Speaker 2: is extra important at times when it's really easy to.

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Speaker 1: Not have it.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, absolutely, And you know what, people love a

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Speaker 3: little bit of earnestness, just a bit.

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Speaker 4: People appreciate it.

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Speaker 2: I hope so because otherwise I'm doomed on social media,

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Speaker 2: although I don't love it, so maybe if being doomed

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Speaker 2: off of it. Every now and then, I'll like say

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Speaker 2: things on Twitter and people will be like, you're just

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Speaker 2: not actually getting that. There's like levels of sarcasm and

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Speaker 2: irony happening here, and I'm like, I just don't know.

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Speaker 2: I'm old in earnest. Leave me alone. But listener, you

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Speaker 2: might know Katie from even more News and some more

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Speaker 2: news and lots of news, just the news, the news.

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Speaker 3: In general, Katie, the news stole coming at you. The

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Speaker 3: ones and twos. I don't know that's a recording saying right,

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Speaker 3: ones and twos? I think so, yeah, I think so

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Speaker 3: an old fashioned one. We don't really use ones and

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Speaker 3: twos these days.

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Speaker 2: The other voice you're hearing is Sophie.

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Speaker 1: Hi, Sophie, Hi, you talked to me about the practice

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Speaker 1: of hope all the time, and I appreciate it.

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Speaker 2: Oh thanks. I just feel like I the last couple

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Speaker 2: episodes I've did were dark and long, are complicated.

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Speaker 1: Well this one isn't that isn't that way, and it

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Speaker 1: talks deeply about the practice of hope and how it

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Speaker 1: should be disciplined into our dam and I appreciate that.

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Speaker 3: Well, I don't know what we're talking about, but I'm

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Speaker 3: already thrilled you invited me because that feels like my

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Speaker 3: own existential battle at all times, because I do have

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Speaker 3: inherent hope and it's hard, but I appreciate being reminded

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Speaker 3: and not having to search for it.

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Speaker 1: Yay.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I I've written about hope a lot. Actually it's

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Speaker 2: a thing that I try to avoid discourse. But I

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Speaker 2: will discourse about hope until the end of my day.

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Speaker 2: Is because of the fact that I believe in it anyway,

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Speaker 2: but also I believe in Rory our audio engineer, Hi Rory,

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Speaker 2: Hi Roy, Hello Rory, And our theme music was written

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Speaker 2: forced by old woman. This week's cool people is someone

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Speaker 2: you might have heard of, people, humanity.

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Speaker 4: People in general.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean we're going to in specific context, right okay,

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Speaker 2: but we're gonna like, Okay, look, it's easy to get cynical.

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Speaker 2: I do it myself. Pretty much everything bad humans have

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Speaker 2: done has been done by humans. It's in the name.

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Speaker 2: Although we're increasingly entering a stage where I don't think

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Speaker 2: that's true. I think that AI is going to do

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Speaker 2: some bad stuff for us.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, we're handing it over to them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, But this week we are going to talk about

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Speaker 2: the natural instinct to help one another out and how

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Speaker 2: that seems inextinguishable. Because you ever seen like a disaster movie,

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Speaker 2: like anything where anything bad happens, Yes, okay, you know

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Speaker 2: how when bad things happen, everyone like runs around and

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Speaker 2: kills each other and steals everything, and it's every person

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Speaker 2: for themselves, and the best you can hope for is

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Speaker 2: people like holding up with their family.

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Speaker 4: That's what I've been told, that's the trope.

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Speaker 2: As soon as disaster hits, everyone loses their fucking minds

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Speaker 2: and turns into the purge and runs around, kills each

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Speaker 2: other and loots, but in a bad way. Actually turns

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Speaker 2: out most looting as the people trying to feed themselves.

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Speaker 2: But you know whatever, hmmm, and everyone holds up in

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Speaker 2: a weird American frontiersman, dream homestead to wait things out.

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Speaker 2: That's the best you can hope for. That is essentially

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Speaker 2: every media depiction of disaster you'll ever see. And you

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Speaker 2: know that that's like not what happens at all.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what I thought you might be getting at. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: I do, I do know how that's not really what happens.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And I have a feeling that everyone secretly, deep

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Speaker 2: down also has been in a bad situation where people

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Speaker 2: help each other out. And I don't know if there's

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Speaker 2: ever been a greater difference between the common media representation

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Speaker 2: of an issue and the reality of the issue. Because

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Speaker 2: even war, right, which is the other one you could

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Speaker 2: come up with, there's a big difference between how media

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Speaker 2: depicts it and how it actually is. But for every

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Speaker 2: couple of like Hoai, American flags and Eagles battled, everything

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Speaker 2: is great movie, you get it all quiet on the

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Speaker 2: Western front, you get some like, oh, actually war is horrible.

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Speaker 2: But the reason that I say that our capacity to

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Speaker 2: help each other out is inextinguishable is because I really

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Speaker 2: believe that overall, like when we create things as society,

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Speaker 2: we kind of make them true, right, Like if everyone

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Speaker 2: convinces themselves of something we all kind of start.

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Speaker 4: Doing it absolutely like money.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, totally, Like oh that's a concept of money.

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Speaker 4: Yeah yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yet despite overwhelming media representations of everyone freaks out in

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Speaker 2: a crisis, that's not what people do. We help each

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Speaker 2: other out. Disaster brings us together more times than not.

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Speaker 2: It breaks down the social barriers between people.

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Speaker 3: It feels like perhaps one of the most innate aspects

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Speaker 3: of it. There's lots of innate, but I'm gonna put

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Speaker 3: it up there as innate as anything else. We that's

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Speaker 3: how we have formed societies and grown and you know communities.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no, totally, and like we have these like well'll

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Speaker 2: talk about a little later in the script too, but

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Speaker 2: it's like we have these ideas that you know, oh,

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Speaker 2: we all are just these isolated individuals, and especially America

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Speaker 2: is like built on this, right, but it's all a lie.

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Speaker 2: Like the Frontiersman was like well, stealing land but also

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Speaker 2: like getting subsidies from the government to do it. You know. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: The easiest way that I've ever found to explain how

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Speaker 2: we've come together in crisis, social barriers break down. Imagine

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Speaker 2: waiting for a bus in lots of places in the US,

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Speaker 2: if you're waiting for the bus. You don't talk to

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Speaker 2: the people who are standing right next to you. The

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Speaker 2: social barriers are in place. You might ask the time

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Speaker 2: if you're doing this in the nineties before cell phones.

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Speaker 2: You might ask for directions if you're doing this in

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Speaker 2: the early ots but smartphones. Yeah, but the conversations are

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Speaker 2: short and curt right, And this is not universally true

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Speaker 2: across all cultures within the United States. But it's a

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Speaker 2: thing that happens if the bus is exactly two minutes late,

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Speaker 2: Suddenly you're all friends because you have a common problem,

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Speaker 2: big or small, common problem. Where's the damn bus? Because

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Speaker 2: it's not even a we need each other that brings

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Speaker 2: each other together, this minor hardship. And I think the

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Speaker 2: trick is that the hardship needs to be shared right,

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Speaker 2: one person having a bad time. Unfortunately doesn't always work right.

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Speaker 2: People don't like talking to folks on the street who

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Speaker 2: are asking for money and help overall. Obviously some people do,

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Speaker 2: I hope many of our listeners do. I mean, but

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Speaker 2: you know whatever, I like. Also, sometimes we're all busy

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Speaker 2: and it's like, no, I don't want to have a

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Speaker 2: conversation about something right now, you know, but folks who

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Speaker 2: are living on the streets do talk to each other.

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Speaker 2: And if you're riding freight trains, which is the weird

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Speaker 2: example that I can use because they used write freight trains,

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Speaker 2: you talk to other freight riders even if you don't

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Speaker 2: trust them, right, Like, that's like a weird, scary, dangerous

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Speaker 2: thing where you're all breaking the law and everyone has

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Speaker 2: a reputation for being fighty and dangerous, and you still

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Speaker 2: all talk to each other because you have a shared hardship. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: that is my hypothesis of how this happens. Shared crisis

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Speaker 2: brings us together and disaster studies. The title of this

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Speaker 2: episode this is called Catastrophe Compassion.

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Speaker 4: Hmmm, I'm going to write that down. I like it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I know it's good. And there's a there's

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Speaker 2: a bunch of articles that talk about this, well, mostly papers.

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Speaker 2: This guy Jamil Zaki wrote a paper called Catastrophe Compassion

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Speaker 2: Understanding and Extending pro Sociality under Crisis. That's a word

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Speaker 2: I know how to say.

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Speaker 4: That is a that's a mouthful sociality.

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Speaker 2: I know it doesn't look like it would be, but

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Speaker 2: it gets stuck. Yeah, And I'm going to quote from

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Speaker 2: that for decades, social scientists have documented two narratives about

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Speaker 2: human behavior during crises. The first holds that following disasters,

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Speaker 2: individuals one panic, two ignore social order, and three act selfishly.

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Speaker 2: This cluster of beliefs characterizes popular media accounts of disaster

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Speaker 2: as well as lay forecasts. In one study, members of

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Speaker 2: the public generally agreed with statements including when there is

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Speaker 2: an emergency, crowd members act selfishly, and when there is

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Speaker 2: an emergency, social order breaks down. The second narrative comes

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Speaker 2: from historical records. Far from rendering people anti social and savage,

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Speaker 2: disasters produce ground swells of pro social behavior and feelings

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Speaker 2: of community in their wake. Survivors develop communities of mutual aid,

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Speaker 2: engage in widespread acts of altruism, and report a heightened

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Speaker 2: sense of solidarity with one another. And one of the

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Speaker 2: wildest things about all of this is that people therefore

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Speaker 2: miss crisis. Yes, because I mean, one, there's like trauma

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Speaker 2: bonding with people, but two, people like being in solidarity

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Speaker 2: where you have a sense of purpose, you know.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, they probably feel little lonely after that because

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Speaker 3: you're surrounded by people.

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Speaker 4: This is just all true.

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Speaker 3: I'm just going to share this, Yeah, I'm not sure

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Speaker 3: what's the right because this is going to be the

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Speaker 3: theme of.

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Speaker 4: The episode I see.

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Speaker 3: But one of my earliest memories was the eighty nine

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Speaker 3: earthquake in San Francisco Bay Area, and it is so

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Speaker 3: vibrant in my mind. Every like there's plenty of dark spots,

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Speaker 3: but when it hit and what happened and rushing outside

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Speaker 3: and my community. I spent the whole afternoon going around

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Speaker 3: helping people with my parents. I was very young. I

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Speaker 3: wasn't helping. I was mostly cheering people up by trying

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Speaker 3: to be cute.

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Speaker 2: Yeah that's helpful.

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Speaker 3: But my mom had ran her catering company out of

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Speaker 3: a retirement home at that point, and so she went

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Speaker 3: and checked in on all of the old folks and

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Speaker 3: helping our neighbors and there's burst pipes and so we're

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Speaker 3: bringing friends what they need. And that has stuck with

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Speaker 3: me my whole life, as during a crisis, you go

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Speaker 3: and help your neighbor.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, we should be doing that all the time, and

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Speaker 4: we forget.

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Speaker 3: This lesson in my mind, but it's like, now is

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Speaker 3: the time when we need each other and we're going

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Speaker 3: to show up, and yeah, I do. It's not that

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Speaker 3: I want something terrible to happen, but there are times

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Speaker 3: in my life where I'm like, I miss that feeling

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Speaker 3: of that you're protected and that you are a protector

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Speaker 3: at the same time.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, but anyway, it's just I keep thinking about that

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Speaker 4: as you're speaking so far.

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Speaker 2: No, that makes so much sense, and that's exactly the

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Speaker 2: kind of stuff we're talking about, and like, yeah, I

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Speaker 2: like that phrase that you're a protector and you're protecting

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Speaker 2: at the same time, that we are like interwoven instead

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Speaker 2: of like, yeah, one of the and I didn't end

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Speaker 2: up writing about this in papers and scripts. I'm off script,

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Speaker 2: so it's considered anecdotal because the sources for this one

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Speaker 2: aren't in the aren't in the notes. But one of

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Speaker 2: the things that I talked to one of my friends

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Speaker 2: is a therapist and a social worker about how one

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Speaker 2: of the main things that defeats PTSD is acting with

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Speaker 2: agency in the moment, and so when we create disaster

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Speaker 2: responses that incorporate everyone, including the people who are in trouble,

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Speaker 2: we reduce the actual amount of suffering caused by the disaster.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: I believe that there.

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Speaker 2: Is a reverse side of catastrophe compassion. There are people

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Speaker 2: who in a crisis, start shooting and act antisocially and

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Speaker 2: hold up and ignore everyone else. Those people are the rich, yep,

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Speaker 2: and the powerful.

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Speaker 3: Gonna say, the people that are most likely, in my

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Speaker 3: mind to go there are the people that have othered

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Speaker 3: everybody else.

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Speaker 2: And they're the people who are the most dramatically invested

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Speaker 2: in the previous status quo. And in disaster studies, this

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Speaker 2: is called elite panic. This term was coined by Rutgers

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Speaker 2: researchers Lee Clark and Karen Chess in a two thousand

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Speaker 2: and eight paper. They talk about how the reason that

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Speaker 2: policymakers tend to assume that everyone will panic, Like you

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Speaker 2: see this all the time in like I watch a

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Speaker 2: lot of sci fi shows. I'm sure they do in

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Speaker 2: other shows too, right, But they're like, we can't tell

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Speaker 2: everyone that the space alien bomb is going to kill everyone,

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Speaker 2: because then everyone will panic, So we have to keep

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Speaker 2: it hidden, you know, we have to not tell the public.

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Speaker 2: And it's like always this like moral compromise that the

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Speaker 2: like protagonist who is morally compromised, Like I guess I'm

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Speaker 2: gonna have to lie to everyone, and that's what's good.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, you know for everybody.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there is a lot of evidence that proves that

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Speaker 2: that is the exact opposite, because if you hide it

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Speaker 2: from everyone and then the bad thing happens, then everyone

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Speaker 2: freaks out. If you are honest the entire time, people

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Speaker 2: handle it, you know, right, And so in this paper

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Speaker 2: they talk about how the reason that policy makers tend

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Speaker 2: to assume everyone will panic is that assuming everyone will

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Speaker 2: panic works out in the policy maker's best interest. This

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Speaker 2: makes for poor disaster response, of course, because it's not

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Speaker 2: based on truth. Their policies emphasize lying to the public

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Speaker 2: to soothe everyone, centralizing resources and prioritizing the prior status

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Speaker 2: quo or recognizing how things have changed. And so this

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Speaker 2: is like, these are all bad ideas, right, these make

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Speaker 2: situations worse. You're the elite, Yeah, so if you centralize

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Speaker 2: all the resources, you're like, oh, I have to be

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Speaker 2: the one who controls where they go out. You're not

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Speaker 2: going to do a very good job of.

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Speaker 4: It, exactly.

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Speaker 3: And that's just for their interests. Yeah, that puts them

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Speaker 3: in a position to at least attempt to maintain control

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Speaker 3: throughout the situation.

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Speaker 4: It makes sense. It's terrible, but it makes why they

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Speaker 4: would think it that way.

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Speaker 2: Well, And it's like and as we record this, this

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Speaker 2: last week might be a couple weeks ago to you all,

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Speaker 2: unless it's happened again. The NYPD has shot and killed

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Speaker 2: someone for hopping a turnstall for two dollars and ninety cents, right,

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Speaker 2: and then they also shot other people, including another cop

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Speaker 2: in the process.

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Speaker 4: A cop.

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Speaker 2: And realistically, you're not supposed to kill people for stealing, right,

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Speaker 2: But if you're the cops, your priority is the continuance

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Speaker 2: of governance. It is the it's called COG and various

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Speaker 2: government things. You know, this idea that like we need

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Speaker 2: to be in charge is the greatest social good, even

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Speaker 2: if we have to kill people to do it, even

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Speaker 2: if we are basically judged dread acting as the executioner

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Speaker 2: in the streets, and so cops are basically always doing

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Speaker 2: an elite panic. But in disasters it gets worse. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: elite fearing panic actually tends to cause panics. In fall

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Speaker 2: two thousand and one, do you remember the anthrax attacks.

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Speaker 4: In the mail I mean last from the past, Yeah,

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Speaker 4: I do.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I hadn't thought about that, and forever till you

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Speaker 3: said those words.

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Speaker 2: I know, I hadn't either, until it was like in

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Speaker 2: this paper I was reading right, Yeah, you know, there

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Speaker 2: was anthrax attacks in the mail and it happened so

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Speaker 2: shortly after September eleventh that like no one remembers it

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Speaker 2: because like all we remember is September eleventh, you know, but.

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Speaker 1: I do now.

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Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, yeah, there was a period of time

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Speaker 3: where that was a thing and then it was a joke.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and it scared the shit out of everyone. It

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Speaker 2: did cause panic. Clark and Chess, the two researchers, proposed

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Speaker 2: that one major reason everyone freaked out was that the

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Speaker 2: government didn't tell anyone what the fuck was happening. Right,

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Speaker 2: They were afraid of people panicking, so they didn't talk

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Speaker 2: to people about what was happening. And they were like, like,

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Speaker 2: it was the first pulmonary anthrax poisoning in twenty five

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Speaker 2: years in the United States, like period or something, and

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Speaker 2: they were like, oh, I think he drank some bad

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Speaker 2: water out of a creek in North Carolina, you know. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And so when everyone's being lied to and then they

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Speaker 2: find out that something's happening that's different, people start to.

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Speaker 4: Panic, yeah, and kind of a roads trust.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, no, absolutely, Well that just allows for a vacuum

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Speaker 3: for people to fill in the blank. Whatever they want

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Speaker 3: about what the government or those the powers that be,

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Speaker 3: whatever they're doing. It's just yeah, maybe beside the point here,

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Speaker 3: but had to say it.

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Speaker 2: No, no, it's it's absolutely worth pointing out. You know.

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Speaker 2: It's like we're supposed to be able to trust the EPA,

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Speaker 2: we're supposed to be able to trust the Department of Health,

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Speaker 2: you know, and like right, the CDC. And it's like,

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Speaker 2: like I believe in vaccines, like real upfront, absolutely, but

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Speaker 2: it's like I understand where vaccine hesitancy comes from because

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Speaker 2: I understand why people don't want to trust the government

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Speaker 2: because it keeps lying to them.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely, Like what do you expect people?

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Speaker 3: You know, it's really hard to sift through what you're allowed,

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Speaker 3: what you should trust or shouldn't because.

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Speaker 4: You know you're stupid for ignoring them, you're bad. But

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Speaker 4: also you should have known better than to trust the government.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly. But you know how you can trust

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Speaker 2: me to cynically introduce ads because I can't say that

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Speaker 2: you can trust these ads because I don't know if

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Speaker 2: you can or not.

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Speaker 4: We just got to be upfront about that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, listener, discretion is advised. Here they are and we're

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Speaker 2: back and of course, the leads themselves often also panic,

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Speaker 2: like declaring that looters will be shot on site Katrina,

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Speaker 2: which is like, not even it was never the law

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Speaker 2: that that's allowed to be done. But they were like,

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Speaker 2: we don't care, We're just declaring that, right because of

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Speaker 2: this continuance of governance, this panic of you know, and

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Speaker 2: you have all these like in Katrina, there are white

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Speaker 2: militias going around and shooting people of color, right, and

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Speaker 2: it was mostly affluent from like affluent white neighborhoods. But

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Speaker 2: we are not focused on elite panic today or this

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Speaker 2: week or panic at all. We're focused on cool people

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Speaker 2: do cool stuff, like just getting in the worst places

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Speaker 2: and helping people out like you and your mom did.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and my dad but mostly my mom fair enough,

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Speaker 3: Well I don't know he was around, but my mom's

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Speaker 3: the mom memories stands strong in my fay.

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Speaker 4: Okay, sorry, I continue.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no offense, Dad, I'm sure you did fine. We

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Speaker 2: did a couple episodes a while back about Common Ground,

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Speaker 2: which was the disaster relief organization set up in New

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Speaker 2: Orleans and the wake of Hurricane Katrina in two thousand

395
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Speaker 2: and five. This is like scrappy activists and anarchists from

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Speaker 2: all over the country working with folks based in New Orleans,

397
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Speaker 2: like tying into old Black Panthers and New Orleans and

398
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Speaker 2: all this shit just set up a messy, imperfect, deeply

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Speaker 2: impactful and memorable collective to mitigate the worst effects of

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Speaker 2: the crisis. How they managed to go where traditional nonprofits

401
00:21:09,280 --> 00:21:12,399
Speaker 2: and government relief agencies were unable to. And there are

402
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Speaker 2: stories from that about like the National Guard accidentally redirecting

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Speaker 2: supplies from the Red Cross to a bunch of punk

404
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Speaker 2: kids because the Red Cross was like going to put

405
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Speaker 2: it in wearhouses for two weeks, and the punk kids

406
00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:25,440
Speaker 2: were out in the streets handing.

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Speaker 4: It out right as they should be.

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00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:30,439
Speaker 2: Yeah. No, And the thing that I love about that

409
00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:32,280
Speaker 2: isn't just like the punk kid isn't the only hero

410
00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:37,280
Speaker 2: in that story. The uniformed National guardsman, who is probably

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Speaker 2: not supposed to do what they are doing, is also

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Speaker 2: one of the heroes there, Which is to say, different

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Speaker 2: groups can and will and do work together in times

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Speaker 2: of crisis, ignoring all the reasons we're supposed to dislike

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Speaker 2: and distrust each other. And there is literally nothing in

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Speaker 2: this world that gives me more hope than that. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: And I think about all the time. Like we were

418
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Speaker 2: talking kind of before we started recording BOHW, like we

419
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Speaker 2: live in a like bonus polarized America right now, right,

420
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Speaker 2: and there are absolutely people who are like extreme right

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Speaker 2: and are not to be trusted in any way, in

422
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Speaker 2: any position, right, yeah, But overall, you're like my random

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Speaker 2: ass neighbor. We might not agree about some stuff, it's

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Speaker 2: probably gonna be fine if we have to like deal

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Speaker 2: with some shit together, you.

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Speaker 3: Know, absolutely, I honestly living in this community that I live,

427
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Speaker 3: and I live in the mountains for people that don't know, Yeah,

428
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Speaker 3: surrounded by people that a lot of people I agree

429
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Speaker 3: with different shades of agreement, and a lot of people

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Speaker 3: like don't they all have my back?

431
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Speaker 2: Yeah?

432
00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:44,800
Speaker 3: They have my back, and they're going to bring a

433
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Speaker 3: wide variety of skill sets to the table if if

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Speaker 3: I need them, you know, yeah, my random neighbor.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no, totally. And I want to give one quick

436
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Speaker 2: anecdote about all this that I've probably done before on

437
00:22:57,240 --> 00:22:59,359
Speaker 2: this show, but it lives in my head, so I

438
00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:03,480
Speaker 2: will say again every now and then, including right now.

439
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:04,960
Speaker 2: I think as I recorded this, I was like looking

440
00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:07,000
Speaker 2: up floods in eastern North Carolina and I was like,

441
00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:09,560
Speaker 2: which year was that, and it was like current news

442
00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:12,480
Speaker 2: about flooding in eastern North Carolina. Yeah, the eastern shore

443
00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:15,000
Speaker 2: of North Carolina floods terribly in this or that storm,

444
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 2: and it happens more and more often as climate change

445
00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:19,880
Speaker 2: kicks in. During one of these flood events, I think

446
00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:22,720
Speaker 2: maybe this is twenty sixteen with Hurricane Matthew, could be wrong.

447
00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:25,280
Speaker 2: A bunch of my friends were out there helping doing

448
00:23:25,400 --> 00:23:29,680
Speaker 2: disaster relief, and a coalition between all sorts of unlikely

449
00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:32,560
Speaker 2: folks came together, and so you had these like one

450
00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:34,960
Speaker 2: of my friends is this like scrappy, middle aged anarchist

451
00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:38,200
Speaker 2: who's telling soldiers what to do, like just directing where

452
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:40,159
Speaker 2: the supplies need to go, because they're like we just

453
00:23:40,160 --> 00:23:42,280
Speaker 2: got here. And my friends like, yep, they got to

454
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,840
Speaker 2: go over there, and like, you know, it's like five

455
00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:47,920
Speaker 2: foot two and yelling at these uh, you know, soldiers

456
00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:52,000
Speaker 2: or whatever. And you also have this moment where okay,

457
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:54,600
Speaker 2: a lot of the places that needed relief could only

458
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:57,840
Speaker 2: be reached by plane because flooding made the roads impassable.

459
00:23:58,160 --> 00:23:59,439
Speaker 2: And by the way, if you ever like I'm just

460
00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:02,399
Speaker 2: gonna go do flood relieve don't drive your pickup truck

461
00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:03,080
Speaker 2: into the flood.

462
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:06,080
Speaker 4: No, no, no, please no. Yeah, you'll make it worse.

463
00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:09,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, because then people got to rescue you because the

464
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:14,480
Speaker 2: air intake's in the grill. Yeah, and then your engine stops. Ironically,

465
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,439
Speaker 2: electric vehicles, like an electric sedan is better in a

466
00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:20,840
Speaker 2: flood than like a pickup truck. Oh really, I mean

467
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:23,760
Speaker 2: an electric pickup trub even better. Yeah. Electric vehicles don't

468
00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:26,440
Speaker 2: use air intakes, so they don't have this thing. Sorry

469
00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 2: I could, I won't get into this.

470
00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:29,119
Speaker 4: Look being surprised.

471
00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:30,720
Speaker 2: I know, I was really surprised with this too. I

472
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:32,960
Speaker 2: saw on this who rabbit hole of it recently, and

473
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:35,360
Speaker 2: because those videos of you know, when you're sitting around

474
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:37,760
Speaker 2: watching videos to see what vehicles can drive through what floods,

475
00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:42,720
Speaker 2: and that's one does. Yeah anyway, but you know it

476
00:24:42,760 --> 00:24:44,639
Speaker 2: isn't affected. This isn't an ad transition. You know, it

477
00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 2: doesn't have to worry about roads as fucking planes. Oh yeah,

478
00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:52,679
Speaker 2: so yes, tiny planes would fly supplies in And you

479
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 2: know who has tiny planes, rich libertarian dudes? Yeah they do,

480
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,040
Speaker 2: and I suppose they like should be in my elite

481
00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,640
Speaker 2: panic category. But it's like not always right, not every

482
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:05,560
Speaker 2: rich libertarian You.

483
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:07,080
Speaker 4: Feel like they're on the cusp there.

484
00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:10,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, but in this case they didn't. This case, they

485
00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:13,639
Speaker 2: were like, hell, yeah, I get to be useful. This

486
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:16,480
Speaker 2: hobby that I have that is real weird and will

487
00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 2: probably kill me gets to be useful, because I think

488
00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 2: deep down that's all we want.

489
00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:24,360
Speaker 4: Absolutely.

490
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:25,919
Speaker 2: We don't want to be useful.

491
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:31,880
Speaker 3: Absolutely, especially if you have a specific piece of gear equipment,

492
00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 3: oh yeah, vehicle like a plane.

493
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:35,800
Speaker 4: You're like, this is my time to shine.

494
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:38,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I'm always the one with a knife on

495
00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:40,520
Speaker 2: me at Christmas, and so when people have to open

496
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:44,320
Speaker 2: the weird blister packages, I'm like, ha ha, yeah, exactly

497
00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:50,720
Speaker 2: which one of my knives do you want? So it

498
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,159
Speaker 2: leads to this moment where one a different one of

499
00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:57,679
Speaker 2: my friends, who's this like crust lord Goblin who rides

500
00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:01,680
Speaker 2: freight trains and fixes bicycles with a you know, huge beer.

501
00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:03,240
Speaker 3: I really want to get it invited to one of

502
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:05,639
Speaker 3: your parties with all these cool setting friends of yours.

503
00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:08,119
Speaker 2: You should you definitely come. People will be into it,

504
00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 2: come out. Yeah. And so he loads up into this

505
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,480
Speaker 2: tiny plane with a retired libertarian guy and then they

506
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:17,960
Speaker 2: fly into a storm wild you know, and it's just like,

507
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:20,720
Speaker 2: and it's one of the scariest moments of my friend's life. Right.

508
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:23,920
Speaker 2: And they've of course ridden trains and been in riots

509
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:26,960
Speaker 2: and whatever, you know, but like, yeah, they were like, oh,

510
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:29,119
Speaker 2: I'm currently flying into a storm because I believe in

511
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:34,040
Speaker 2: what I'm doing with this, Yeah, libertarian man. And they

512
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:36,600
Speaker 2: made it safely. They distributed supplies and then they went

513
00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 2: back for more.

514
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:38,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, and that.

515
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:43,840
Speaker 2: Makes me happy. And even the Department of Homeland Security,

516
00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:47,280
Speaker 2: the last people you would expect to give props to anarchists,

517
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:51,200
Speaker 2: have had to admit in print that decentralized efforts are

518
00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:54,159
Speaker 2: like really important to disaster relief.

519
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:58,119
Speaker 3: Yeah, people that are trained in Yeah, decentralized, that's the

520
00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:00,840
Speaker 3: key word here, because when and then you're in the

521
00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:04,080
Speaker 3: midst of a disaster and your normal modes of communication

522
00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:10,000
Speaker 3: or transportation are no longer effective, you have to be

523
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:13,520
Speaker 3: able to rely on people that have the infrastructure and

524
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:16,240
Speaker 3: training and just generally know what they're doing, and boots

525
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:17,680
Speaker 3: on the ground know the area.

526
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:23,600
Speaker 2: Yep, totally, and just are already there, you know. Yeah.

527
00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:28,840
Speaker 2: And in twenty thirteen, the Department of Homeland Security put

528
00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 2: together a task team and they wrote a report called

529
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:36,240
Speaker 2: the resilient social network. And it's a case study of

530
00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:42,640
Speaker 2: Occupy Sandy. You heard of Occupy Sandy, No, okay. This

531
00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:46,720
Speaker 2: report focuses on the response to Superstorm Sandy, which in

532
00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:49,159
Speaker 2: twenty twelve just yeah, fucked up New York City and

533
00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:49,760
Speaker 2: New Jersey.

534
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:50,240
Speaker 4: Yeah.

535
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, And a bunch of occupy activists came together formed

536
00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:58,119
Speaker 2: Occupy Sandy, which was like, you know, the kind of

537
00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:00,440
Speaker 2: like almost cringey thing, where like in two eleven and

538
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,760
Speaker 2: twenty twelve everyone was like, occupy this, occupy.

539
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:04,640
Speaker 4: It became the thing.

540
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:09,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they were like, all right, Occupy Sandy, and

541
00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:12,159
Speaker 2: they changed the way that disaster relief works and on

542
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:16,880
Speaker 2: some level, like are probably why climate change hasn't yet

543
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:20,600
Speaker 2: been as bad as it could be. Yeah, because climate

544
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:24,560
Speaker 2: change is getting worse, disasters are getting worse. Both informal

545
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:29,520
Speaker 2: and formal networks for dealing with crisis and disaster are

546
00:28:29,680 --> 00:28:33,919
Speaker 2: getting more experienced. And a lot of that was learned

547
00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:37,960
Speaker 2: from both sides during Superstorm Sandy.

548
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:39,880
Speaker 4: That's really incredible.

549
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:44,120
Speaker 2: The report put it like this. At its peak, it

550
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:48,600
Speaker 2: Occupied Sandy had grown to an estimated sixty thousand volunteers,

551
00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:51,240
Speaker 2: more than four times the number deployed by the American

552
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:55,440
Speaker 2: Red Cross. Wow, and they did it with no leaders,

553
00:28:55,720 --> 00:29:00,400
Speaker 2: no bureaucracy, none of that shit. The DHS ignowed that

554
00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 2: quote and they didn't use the word anarchist anywhere in here,

555
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 2: and I'm annoyed, but anyway, but we know, yeah, and

556
00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:09,480
Speaker 2: I didn't want to spend all my time searching like

557
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,960
Speaker 2: Department of Homeland Security anarchists and on my Google. Yeah, yeah,

558
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 2: that's a dicey search. Maybe, yeah, And the DHS acknowledge

559
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,080
Speaker 2: that quote. It is clear from our research that the

560
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:23,680
Speaker 2: occupy movement complemented the efforts of the official response and

561
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,760
Speaker 2: in some cases filled critical gaps. We can learn lessons

562
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:30,000
Speaker 2: from Occupy Sandy successes to ensure a ready and resilient nation.

563
00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:32,880
Speaker 2: And it then is like a like long ass report

564
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:36,280
Speaker 2: just being like, here's everything that can be learned for

565
00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:41,320
Speaker 2: us from what these like scrappy folks did. Sandy did

566
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 2: nineteen billion dollars in damages and killed forty three people

567
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 2: in New York City. It is the second most expensive

568
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,440
Speaker 2: storm to ever hit the US, I believe, after Katrina.

569
00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:53,200
Speaker 2: So when that happened, people just got together and did shit.

570
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:56,480
Speaker 2: They used a wedding registry on Amazon to announce what

571
00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 2: they needed and so people could just buy them what

572
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:01,800
Speaker 2: they needed. They up relief centers all over the place.

573
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:03,800
Speaker 2: I think the first two were in churches, and then

574
00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,680
Speaker 2: they just kind of spread out everywhere that people needed stuff, right,

575
00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:09,680
Speaker 2: because all these people are suddenly like homeless, vehicleless, without

576
00:30:09,680 --> 00:30:12,400
Speaker 2: places to stay warm, maybe just without power or whatever.

577
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:17,360
Speaker 2: You know, hot meals available everywhere. To quote New York

578
00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:21,240
Speaker 2: Times from twenty twelve, there is an occupy motor pool

579
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:24,160
Speaker 2: of borrowed cars and pickup trucks that ferries volunteers to

580
00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:27,680
Speaker 2: ravaged areas, and occupy weathermen sits at his computer and

581
00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:32,040
Speaker 2: issues regular forecasts. Occupy construction teams and medical committees have

582
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 2: been formed. Wow so fast too, Oh yeah, like less

583
00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:40,120
Speaker 2: than twenty four hours. And I think I think a

584
00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:43,000
Speaker 2: lot of those people were like they're the day of

585
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 2: like while it was.

586
00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:49,120
Speaker 4: Happening, also probably being affected. Oh yeah, absolutely everything. Yeah.

587
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,880
Speaker 2: Yeah. They coordinated with volunteers from all over the city.

588
00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:55,160
Speaker 2: And the main thing I remember hearing from my friends

589
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:56,880
Speaker 2: who were doing it is just like the walking up

590
00:30:57,040 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 2: endless flights of stairs because the elevators were out, and

591
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:02,320
Speaker 2: so people would just go door to door to make

592
00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:04,320
Speaker 2: sure everyone had what they needed, Like they'd just like

593
00:31:04,760 --> 00:31:06,720
Speaker 2: go knock on your door and be like you need candles,

594
00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 2: you need flashlights, you need a medications filled Like what

595
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:11,160
Speaker 2: do you need because like a lot of people didn't

596
00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 2: leave because without an elevator, they can't get out of

597
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:16,040
Speaker 2: their buildings, you know, depending on your level of fitness.

598
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:18,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, and like what are you walking out into?

599
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:24,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. It took formal organizations days. Occupy Sandy was

600
00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 2: there within twenty four hours. The local FEMA office. Don't worry,

601
00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:29,720
Speaker 2: they're on it. They saw that weather coming and they

602
00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:35,080
Speaker 2: closed quote do to weather, come on. Yeah. They put

603
00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 2: signs on the door of the office.

604
00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 4: It's believable. It's believable.

605
00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:40,760
Speaker 2: It's like handwritten in surpy.

606
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 3: Like bite later losers.

607
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, exactly, And it would be hilarious if it

608
00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 2: was I mean, it's still hilarious, but if it was

609
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 2: just an office, it'd be hilarious. But it's also where

610
00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:56,080
Speaker 2: they stored their like mobile warming centers and food distribution

611
00:31:56,160 --> 00:31:58,480
Speaker 2: hub and stuff like that. What the right, So they

612
00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:00,840
Speaker 2: were like, oh, gotta get our warm centers out of here,

613
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:04,160
Speaker 2: and just drove everything out all six of the FEMA

614
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,360
Speaker 2: centers in New York City, including those that were not

615
00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:09,360
Speaker 2: in harm's way, closed ahead of the store.

616
00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:10,600
Speaker 4: That's absurd.

617
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:14,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then the National Guard just packed up and

618
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:18,960
Speaker 2: left because it was too risky. There's the National guardsman. Meanwhile,

619
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 2: volunteers at churches just kept handing out food and water.

620
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:23,520
Speaker 4: Yeah.

621
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:29,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so Occupy Sandy was informal but not unorganized,

622
00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 2: So it wasn't just like total chaos time, right. It

623
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:37,520
Speaker 2: was organized. New volunteers were onboarded, people are giving sensitivity

624
00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 2: trainings and like trainings on how to go door to door,

625
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:41,840
Speaker 2: how to talk to people, and there's just like it

626
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 2: was all coordinated with like huge numbers of Google sheets

627
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:51,000
Speaker 2: and like just fucking weird online twenty twelve. Shit. These days,

628
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 2: the emergent relief organizations are part of disaster planning, right,

629
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:58,680
Speaker 2: even like FEMA and all those groups. When they're like, okay,

630
00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:01,600
Speaker 2: what's gonna happen in this crisis, They're like, Okay, well, fortunately,

631
00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:03,320
Speaker 2: scrappy people are going to do all the shit we're

632
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,120
Speaker 2: not going to do. Yeah, which is a little bit

633
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:09,360
Speaker 2: like aggravating, but whatever.

634
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:12,080
Speaker 3: That is what it is, Yeah, it is what it is.

635
00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 3: It is both aggravating and it is what it is. Yeah.

636
00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, Occupy Sandy, as far as I can tell, is

637
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:21,479
Speaker 2: the first time in the US that the emergent relief

638
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 2: like the you know, the DIY, Scrappy whatever stuff, coordinated

639
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:30,200
Speaker 2: actively with the formal relief like Red Cross and you know,

640
00:33:30,560 --> 00:33:32,920
Speaker 2: FEMA and all that stuff. But there was always some

641
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 2: tension there. One of the co founders of Occupy Sandy,

642
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 2: Michael Primo, told the website The City quote, these behemoth

643
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:44,920
Speaker 2: aid organizations play a role within the broader landscape, but

644
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:48,280
Speaker 2: are ultimately unresponsive to community needs and aren't designed to

645
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:51,760
Speaker 2: be agile. They aren't designed to communicate long term needs.

646
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:54,440
Speaker 2: And that's what Occupies Sandy was really trying to do.

647
00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:59,920
Speaker 2: Because there's this like it's interesting because right, it's easy.

648
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:02,200
Speaker 2: It's not easy. It's very hard. It's easy to show

649
00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 2: up when it's like sexy and cool to go help people,

650
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,200
Speaker 2: like when you're standing in the flood waters. Don't stand

651
00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:10,560
Speaker 2: in floodwaters anyone, Yeah, don't. But the long term work

652
00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 2: of rebuilding is also part of it. Right, So Occupy Sandy,

653
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:18,600
Speaker 2: I think on some level considers itself still around it.

654
00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:21,400
Speaker 2: I think it overall is like not really, but it

655
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:24,000
Speaker 2: was like around for a long time, and then it well,

656
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:27,799
Speaker 2: the same network came together during the early days of

657
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:31,000
Speaker 2: COVID to get food to people and like to coordinate

658
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:33,360
Speaker 2: all the different mutual aid groups that were popping up

659
00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:35,239
Speaker 2: in the city once again with like spreadsheets and shit,

660
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 2: you know, to make sure that everyone knew where everyone

661
00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:38,160
Speaker 2: else was and what they were doing.

662
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:40,319
Speaker 4: And now we've got Google spreadsheets.

663
00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:45,120
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And of course twenty twenty saw the largest

664
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:47,240
Speaker 2: explosion of mutual aid groups the US has ever seen.

665
00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:50,840
Speaker 2: And yeah, so many people found their way into disaster

666
00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 2: relief as a result of Occupy Sandy, including people who

667
00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:56,360
Speaker 2: like now work in the formal organizations or like I

668
00:34:56,480 --> 00:34:58,560
Speaker 2: worked for a while as a copy editor for a

669
00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:01,920
Speaker 2: friend who specific wrote really lengthy papers. I couldn't find

670
00:35:01,920 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 2: them in my hard driving time to do the research,

671
00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:06,240
Speaker 2: but I used to copy it at these papers about

672
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:10,280
Speaker 2: informal and formal disaster relief organizations and how they work together,

673
00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:13,919
Speaker 2: and like how the strengths and weaknesses of each one

674
00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:18,680
Speaker 2: can help each other. But you know what can help

675
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:22,320
Speaker 2: everyone is owning medieval weaponry.

676
00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:25,960
Speaker 4: Absolutely. I was hoping you would say that.

677
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, because it often gets forgotten about in the mix

678
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:32,640
Speaker 2: you know everyone's talking about it because it's medieval. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

679
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:34,200
Speaker 2: People think that you don't need it.

680
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:35,319
Speaker 4: They want the new gear.

681
00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:39,000
Speaker 2: I know, I know that you do write like a guisamar.

682
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:41,279
Speaker 2: I actually don't pronounce this, but I remember, mind, I

683
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:43,120
Speaker 2: was gonna try and talk about pole arms, but then

684
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:44,600
Speaker 2: I realized it had to pronounce any of them cause

685
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 2: they're all French.

686
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:47,239
Speaker 3: I was just gonna go ahead and pretend like I

687
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:48,440
Speaker 3: knew what these things are.

688
00:35:48,480 --> 00:35:50,759
Speaker 2: But yeah, there's a bunch of polearms that are new

689
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:53,160
Speaker 2: fangled compared to like older ones. And I was trying

690
00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:56,600
Speaker 2: to unfangled full arm. Yeah you know they're from like

691
00:35:56,600 --> 00:35:58,479
Speaker 2: the sixteen hundreds instead of the twelve hundred.

692
00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, but oh that fancy new tech.

693
00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:05,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, so is this This podcast is sponsored by new

694
00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:06,320
Speaker 3: Fangled Pollarms.

695
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:10,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, new Fangled poll arms for all your fangled poll

696
00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:13,840
Speaker 2: arm needs, just check out. It's also sponsored by the

697
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:17,440
Speaker 2: nonprofit that will be starting called Give your Friends Medieval Weapons.

698
00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:20,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, it is a vital vital.

699
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 2: It's a decentralized one, and so it's just up to

700
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:33,319
Speaker 2: you to give your friends medieval weapons. And we're back.

701
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:38,840
Speaker 2: Hopefully no other podcasts snuck in, but I mean other ads.

702
00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:42,880
Speaker 2: You ever get to the point of tiredness and overworked

703
00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:44,959
Speaker 2: where nouns just replace each other in your brain.

704
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:45,719
Speaker 4: Absolutely.

705
00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:49,120
Speaker 3: Sometimes I'll start speaking hoping that I have words to

706
00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:50,439
Speaker 3: finish the sentence and I don't.

707
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:53,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally, that's just called being a podcaster.

708
00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:56,439
Speaker 3: There have been several times I'm talking and I'm blah

709
00:36:56,480 --> 00:37:00,120
Speaker 3: blah blah, and then I'll say and I was hoping

710
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:03,120
Speaker 3: i'd remember my point, but I don't, so end of sentence.

711
00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:06,160
Speaker 2: Yep, thats just podcast.

712
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:08,719
Speaker 4: This a little peak behind the curtain, y'all.

713
00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:13,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, h I talk for a living. It's strange.

714
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:16,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, It's just like there's different sentences and points and

715
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:19,719
Speaker 3: phrases just kind of wriggling around in there.

716
00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:22,120
Speaker 2: Yeah. I remember when I first started trying to do

717
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 2: this podcast. I was like, I'm just going to make

718
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 2: a list of notes and then I'm going to kind

719
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:26,880
Speaker 2: of free form it. And Sophie was like, you are

720
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:29,760
Speaker 2: going to write a script and I was like, oh,

721
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:30,680
Speaker 2: thank God, and.

722
00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:32,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, you're gonna be grateful for it.

723
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 2: Yeah. I didn't yet know how to deviate from a script,

724
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:35,920
Speaker 2: you know.

725
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:38,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I get the allerb that You're like, I'm

726
00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:42,320
Speaker 3: prepared but in the moment you get lost.

727
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:46,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, but who doesn't get lost? If there's one mutual

728
00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:49,319
Speaker 2: A disaster relief group, I would point people towards. It's

729
00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:53,840
Speaker 2: the one called mutual A Disaster Relief. This is a

730
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 2: decentralized national network of semi autonomous working groups. I know

731
00:37:57,080 --> 00:37:59,680
Speaker 2: that's sort of a mouthful, but all those words mean things.

732
00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:03,439
Speaker 2: The national network, all these different working groups get together

733
00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:07,320
Speaker 2: and coordinate and show up where disaster relief is needed,

734
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:09,759
Speaker 2: and they put on trainings. They have all kinds of

735
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:12,680
Speaker 2: resources on their website mutual Aid Disaster Relief dot org

736
00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:15,879
Speaker 2: and has information about how to join start your own group.

737
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:18,279
Speaker 2: Two and I want to read you a bit of

738
00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 2: their r history section. Early in the morning. Are September nineteenth,

739
00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:28,040
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty five, a major earthquake hit off the Pacific

740
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 2: coast of Michoacan, Mexico City was devastated. At least five

741
00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:35,719
Speaker 2: thousand people lost their lives. Eight hundred thousand people were

742
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:39,440
Speaker 2: made homeless as soldiers and police largely stood by neighbors,

743
00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:43,080
Speaker 2: fed and sheltered each other, formed cleanup crews and relief brigades.

744
00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:46,759
Speaker 2: These brigadistas, as they were called, dug people out of

745
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:49,440
Speaker 2: the rubble, and students laid down in front of bulldozers

746
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:53,880
Speaker 2: so the search for survivors could continue. Demificados as the

747
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:58,280
Speaker 2: new houseless, were called one housing rights seamstresses after witnessing

748
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 2: owner salvage machinery. Before people started a women's union, people

749
00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 2: organized collectively in popular assemblies. These experiences led many to

750
00:39:07,120 --> 00:39:09,560
Speaker 2: question why they needed a centralized state that did not

751
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:12,080
Speaker 2: care for the well being or survival of its people.

752
00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:15,920
Speaker 2: With this understanding, Mexican civil society was awakened.

753
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:17,800
Speaker 4: Yeah.

754
00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:19,520
Speaker 2: I did some more digging. This is not where mutual

755
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:21,719
Speaker 2: aid relief, disaster relief starts, but this is like kind

756
00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:25,680
Speaker 2: of the earlier you know they talk about the blood

757
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:30,160
Speaker 2: survival programs nineteen eighty five. Okay, mutually disaster reallyf more

758
00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:32,040
Speaker 2: formally is going to start like in the twenty odds,

759
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:35,760
Speaker 2: after things like Katrina and after some of the Occupy

760
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:38,919
Speaker 2: Sandy and things like that. I did some more digging

761
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:42,600
Speaker 2: about that particular research speaking of nouns that don't work

762
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:45,360
Speaker 2: with each other. I did more digging on that earthquake

763
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:48,640
Speaker 2: and the response to it. Five thousand is the minimum

764
00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:53,239
Speaker 2: death count anyone has suggested. National Seismological Service suggests as

765
00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:54,879
Speaker 2: forty five thousand people died.

766
00:39:55,640 --> 00:40:00,000
Speaker 4: Wow. Yeah, wow, that's a huge difference.

767
00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:02,880
Speaker 2: I know, I know, and I think the five thousand

768
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:05,520
Speaker 2: was the ruling government at the time that really wanted

769
00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 2: to downplay it. Yeah, of course, Ugh one of the

770
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:10,880
Speaker 2: groups that came out of it, and they actually are

771
00:40:10,880 --> 00:40:12,879
Speaker 2: a formal organization now. But this is like a good

772
00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:15,600
Speaker 2: example of how that the line between formal and informal

773
00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:18,520
Speaker 2: like is kind of meaningless in some ways. A group

774
00:40:18,520 --> 00:40:21,640
Speaker 2: of youth got together and started digging tunnels into collapsed

775
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:22,960
Speaker 2: buildings to rescue people.

776
00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:23,840
Speaker 4: Wow.

777
00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:27,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, within a week they tunneled into a collapsed hospital

778
00:40:27,719 --> 00:40:30,160
Speaker 2: and then okay, I only found this on one guy's blog.

779
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:31,960
Speaker 2: I couldn't find another source of it. And it's a

780
00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:35,799
Speaker 2: little bit wild. They found forty three newborn babies in

781
00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:38,920
Speaker 2: the nursery who had gone a week without sustenance and

782
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:41,440
Speaker 2: were alive. Wow.

783
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:43,880
Speaker 4: Yeah.

784
00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:47,759
Speaker 2: Today that group is still around today. They are known

785
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:51,840
Speaker 2: as the Brigata de Topos de Tulatukum the Mole Brigade

786
00:40:51,880 --> 00:40:55,280
Speaker 2: of Tula Tukum, and they are a professional research organization

787
00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:57,399
Speaker 2: that travels around the world to save people. And they

788
00:40:57,680 --> 00:41:01,120
Speaker 2: they're nonprofit and that they're like stilly, they're traveling on

789
00:41:01,160 --> 00:41:03,160
Speaker 2: their own dime by commercial airlines, so they can't even

790
00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:05,680
Speaker 2: bring much gear or whatever, but they've saved so many

791
00:41:05,719 --> 00:41:08,160
Speaker 2: people's lives. They just go everywhere that people need help,

792
00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:09,360
Speaker 2: and they're just like, all right, we know how to

793
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:12,440
Speaker 2: dig into buildings. We're gonna do it. Yeah, We're the

794
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:13,160
Speaker 2: fucking moles.

795
00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:14,880
Speaker 4: Yeah.

796
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:16,319
Speaker 2: I really like them.

797
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:20,720
Speaker 3: I love I mean, it's a horrible story, but yeah,

798
00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:22,160
Speaker 3: also incredible.

799
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:28,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I love DIY mutual later really organizations. But

800
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 2: where I find the most fascinating and kind of as

801
00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:33,520
Speaker 2: I've been talking about, is where they intersect with establish

802
00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 2: larger organizations. Just I mean, I don't necessarily like the

803
00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:40,200
Speaker 2: giant organization, I don't know, whatever, but like I like

804
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:44,080
Speaker 2: that there's people at all levels trying to do a thing,

805
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:47,640
Speaker 2: and the scrappy people have the problem of lack of

806
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:52,239
Speaker 2: institutional power, right, and then the institutional people have the

807
00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:58,680
Speaker 2: problem of institutional right, Yeah, And like the people are

808
00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:02,880
Speaker 2: trying to figure out how to solve that problem because

809
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:06,319
Speaker 2: there's a role for everyone in disaster relief, although the

810
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:08,480
Speaker 2: roles of groups like FEMA often seems to be to

811
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:11,040
Speaker 2: get in everyone's way, even in the way of smaller government.

812
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:11,399
Speaker 4: Make it worse.

813
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:15,200
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, but we'll get into that even more. There's

814
00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:19,240
Speaker 2: a role for everyone, even it turns out the city

815
00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:24,719
Speaker 2: of Portland, Oregon. Oh, and we'll talk about that on Wednesday.

816
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:29,000
Speaker 2: That's okay, that's my uh, that's the cliff cliffhanger. Yeah,

817
00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:30,960
Speaker 2: my cliffhangers. I'm going to talk about Portland. It's not

818
00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:33,080
Speaker 2: that it's not I've done better cliffhangers in my life, but.

819
00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:36,120
Speaker 4: The city of Portland, Oregon.

820
00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:38,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, they're going to break their own rules and

821
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:40,839
Speaker 2: get in trouble for helping people, which is about all

822
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:42,319
Speaker 2: I want for governments to do.

823
00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:47,560
Speaker 4: So absolutely, Yeah, okay Portland, I see you. Yeah, awesome.

824
00:42:47,600 --> 00:42:49,200
Speaker 4: I'm excited for that part.

825
00:42:49,800 --> 00:42:53,560
Speaker 2: But if people are excited about what's happening currently in

826
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:55,960
Speaker 2: the world, do you have any suggestions about where they

827
00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:59,880
Speaker 2: could find news or analysis of news. Maybe with puppets,

828
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:01,280
Speaker 2: maybe without puppets.

829
00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:06,880
Speaker 3: Yeah. I recently stumbled upon my show, Yeah, the first

830
00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:08,240
Speaker 3: and only news podcast.

831
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:08,880
Speaker 4: Have you heard of it?

832
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:14,640
Speaker 3: I run Some More News along with Cody Johnston. We

833
00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:17,839
Speaker 3: have a YouTube channel you can check out. We also

834
00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:21,200
Speaker 3: have a podcast called even more News. Also on our

835
00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 3: YouTube channel. Both shows are available as a podcast that

836
00:43:25,640 --> 00:43:28,000
Speaker 3: you can just listen to or with as a video

837
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:31,000
Speaker 3: that you can watch, so yeah, you can do that.

838
00:43:31,160 --> 00:43:34,440
Speaker 3: We talk about things happening now, pretty dialed in on

839
00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:37,600
Speaker 3: the election at the moment, makes sense. Yeah, we got puppets,

840
00:43:38,280 --> 00:43:42,600
Speaker 3: we got characters, strange storylines, and a lot of very

841
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:44,800
Speaker 3: well researched and thought out content.

842
00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:46,160
Speaker 4: So check it out.

843
00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:48,279
Speaker 2: And we were even just talking about it beforehand. It's like,

844
00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:49,920
Speaker 2: you all have fact checkers.

845
00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:51,640
Speaker 4: Oh, yeah, we do.

846
00:43:51,719 --> 00:43:51,960
Speaker 1: We do.

847
00:43:52,200 --> 00:43:53,000
Speaker 4: We try our best.

848
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:55,040
Speaker 2: A lot of people who are like I get my

849
00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 2: news from YouTube. That's not always a good sign, but

850
00:43:58,360 --> 00:44:02,279
Speaker 2: it's not There are people who do well, I don't know,

851
00:44:02,280 --> 00:44:05,799
Speaker 2: it's DIY, but it's not like CNBC or whatever. You know, No,

852
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:07,479
Speaker 2: there are people who do it right.

853
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:08,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, we do our best.

854
00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:16,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, we we have researchers compiling stuff on each topic

855
00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:19,920
Speaker 3: and then it gets fact checked by two different people.

856
00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:24,000
Speaker 3: So every so often something slips through the cracks. But

857
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:27,719
Speaker 3: you can trust us to correct ourselves when that happens.

858
00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:30,120
Speaker 3: But for the most part, it hasn't happened a long time.

859
00:44:30,360 --> 00:44:33,719
Speaker 2: That's pretty good because yeah, all of us, the best

860
00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:35,759
Speaker 2: we can do is be like we are pretty sure

861
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:37,240
Speaker 2: that this is what we is true.

862
00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:39,400
Speaker 4: You know, we're doing our very best.

863
00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:43,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you are listening to this, I might be

864
00:44:43,520 --> 00:44:46,000
Speaker 2: on tour. I might be on tour with The Sapling

865
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:48,560
Speaker 2: Cage right now, depending on when you're listening to this,

866
00:44:48,600 --> 00:44:50,480
Speaker 2: Although maybe five years from now still be touring with

867
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:52,160
Speaker 2: that book. That'd be a little bit strange. I'll probably

868
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:54,120
Speaker 2: be dealing touring with the third book in the trilogy

869
00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:56,120
Speaker 2: of the Daughters of the Empty Throne trilogy. But the

870
00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:58,759
Speaker 2: first book comes out September twenty fourth, twenty twenty four,

871
00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:01,479
Speaker 2: which is in the past, and it's called The Sapling Cage,

872
00:45:01,480 --> 00:45:04,120
Speaker 2: and it is about a young trans witch who has

873
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:08,359
Speaker 2: to save the world with her friends for everyone who

874
00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:12,840
Speaker 2: is really mad about Harry Potter. Here's another story about

875
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:16,840
Speaker 2: kids learning magic, only they have spears, because I like spears.

876
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:18,440
Speaker 2: There's a lot of medieval weapons in this book, a

877
00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:21,359
Speaker 2: lot of medieval weapons. Yeah, that one was definitely brought

878
00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 2: to you by medieval weapons, kind of in a literal way.

879
00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:26,840
Speaker 2: The first time I ever sold a book with an advance,

880
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:28,920
Speaker 2: like a real advance, like a I mean real advance

881
00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:32,839
Speaker 2: was two grand I immediately bought my first sword.

882
00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:37,160
Speaker 4: It's money well spent, seems like I think so it's

883
00:45:37,239 --> 00:45:37,839
Speaker 4: paying off.

884
00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:41,480
Speaker 2: Yeah. So if you think got anything you want to plug.

885
00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:45,960
Speaker 1: Oh so Weird Little Guys by Molly Conger. Listen to

886
00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:47,880
Speaker 1: Better Offline hosts Red Citron.

887
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:49,319
Speaker 2: Oh Weird Little Guys is so good.

888
00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:51,840
Speaker 1: Yeah. Have you listened to it, Katie?

889
00:45:52,400 --> 00:45:55,080
Speaker 4: No, but I'm writing it down to remind myself.

890
00:45:55,200 --> 00:45:56,359
Speaker 1: Katie, you'd love it.

891
00:45:56,640 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 2: Yeah.

892
00:45:57,080 --> 00:45:58,640
Speaker 4: I will be listening to it later.

893
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:01,840
Speaker 1: Listen to A sixteenth Been a Fame Jimmy loftus but

894
00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:07,200
Speaker 1: politics hosted by propaganda Buying the Bastards, opened by Robert Evans.

895
00:46:07,239 --> 00:46:09,080
Speaker 2: I think the filmmaker.

896
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:13,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, the ghost of that filmmaker, and it could

897
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:15,200
Speaker 1: happen here. A daily show. Did I forget anybody?

898
00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:17,879
Speaker 4: I'm so sorry you guys have so much going on?

899
00:46:18,080 --> 00:46:20,520
Speaker 1: I forget? Did I forget anybody?

900
00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:21,480
Speaker 4: I have this?

901
00:46:21,680 --> 00:46:24,839
Speaker 1: I wake up every day going did I give? Did

902
00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:25,319
Speaker 1: I do it?

903
00:46:26,280 --> 00:46:27,680
Speaker 2: Did all of your children get love?

904
00:46:28,320 --> 00:46:28,680
Speaker 1: Yeah?

905
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:32,200
Speaker 3: You're like Aria's little list, but it's different because it's

906
00:46:32,560 --> 00:46:34,520
Speaker 3: people that you love and want to succeed.

907
00:46:34,800 --> 00:46:38,080
Speaker 1: Okay, I just fact checked my own website. I did it, hooray.

908
00:46:39,000 --> 00:46:41,520
Speaker 2: And what we're going to do is take a break

909
00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:43,160
Speaker 2: for a few minutes, and you all are going to

910
00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:45,319
Speaker 2: take a break for like two days, unless you're listening

911
00:46:45,320 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 2: to the future, which because you know, take a break

912
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:53,640
Speaker 2: at all. But we'll talk to you on Wednesday. Bye bye.

913
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:57,640
Speaker 1: By Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff is a production

914
00:46:57,719 --> 00:47:00,919
Speaker 1: of cool Zone Media. A more podcast some cool Zone Media.

915
00:47:01,080 --> 00:47:04,359
Speaker 1: Visit our website foolzonemedia dot com, or check us out

916
00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:07,799
Speaker 1: on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get

917
00:47:07,840 --> 00:47:08,640
Speaker 1: your podcasts.