WEBVTT - Big Scam on Campus: Diploma Mills 0:00:00.560 --> 0:00:02.760 Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeartRadio. 0:00:03.720 --> 0:00:06.760 Saren, Yes, over your sar. Yes. 0:00:07.120 --> 0:00:08.280 Do you know what's ridiculous? 0:00:08.320 --> 0:00:13.080 I do? Good question, Elizabeth. Okay, Tommy Smothers recently passed away, 0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:15.600 I know, alright, Yeah, so they had the Smothers Brother 0:00:15.720 --> 0:00:19.000 Comedy Hour. Do you ever know about what Keith Moon 0:00:19.079 --> 0:00:22.160 did on that show? No? So the who we're supposed 0:00:22.200 --> 0:00:25.240 to perform My Generation? Right, so you got all of them? 0:00:25.320 --> 0:00:31.000 Rodger Daltrey, Keith Moon is the drummer. Townshend's guitarist, right, 0:00:31.080 --> 0:00:34.280 so Moon bass drum. Right, He's got a little thing 0:00:34.479 --> 0:00:37.159 set up or the end of the song and when 0:00:37.200 --> 0:00:38.920 it gets to the end of the song he hits 0:00:38.920 --> 0:00:43.040 it and the drum explodes. He had loaned up to 0:00:43.280 --> 0:00:44.800 blow up live on TV. 0:00:44.960 --> 0:00:45.680 It's very Keith. 0:00:46.120 --> 0:00:48.760 When I say blow up, I mean like Roger Daltrey 0:00:48.800 --> 0:00:52.320 gets thrown at the camera right. The towns and Pete 0:00:52.320 --> 0:00:55.000 Townsend's hair is like on fire, singing smoking when they 0:00:55.000 --> 0:00:57.920 can when the smoke abates right now, and whistle cool 0:00:57.920 --> 0:00:59.880 as any bass player's just standing there like look whatever 0:01:00.080 --> 0:01:02.720 of that, because go and get me a drink. Right anyway, 0:01:03.680 --> 0:01:06.440 I thought that was absolutely amazing. Because also Keith Moon 0:01:06.560 --> 0:01:09.080 he got shrapnel in his own arm, so it played 0:01:09.120 --> 0:01:12.600 back ris on it right? Who never invited on TV 0:01:12.880 --> 0:01:14.920 to do that type of show ever again? Yeah, so 0:01:15.000 --> 0:01:18.119 there you go. Temmy Smothers, all right, rip and gave 0:01:18.200 --> 0:01:20.960 us that all right Moon? Right? Ridiculous? 0:01:21.040 --> 0:01:25.600 Huh that is ridiculous blowing up a set for effect. 0:01:25.600 --> 0:01:28.399 Do you know what else is ridiculous? Elizabeth fraud zaren 0:01:28.680 --> 0:01:52.640 it's fraud. This is ridiculous crime A podcast about absurd 0:01:53.040 --> 0:01:57.160 and outrageous capers, heists and cons. It's always ninety nine 0:01:57.160 --> 0:02:00.480 percent murder free and one hundred percent ridiculus. 0:02:00.600 --> 0:02:01.280 Oh you damn. 0:02:02.480 --> 0:02:05.320 Do you know what I have in common with Lord Kelvin? 0:02:05.720 --> 0:02:10.440 The famous physicist Adam Smith, the father of economics, seven 0:02:10.520 --> 0:02:15.000 Nobel laureates, three British Prime ministers, and actor Gerard Butler. 0:02:15.760 --> 0:02:19.760 A love of argyle socks and air bathing clothes. 0:02:20.320 --> 0:02:24.600 We are all University of Glasgow graduates. Yes, so I 0:02:24.639 --> 0:02:27.280 have my master's degree from the University of Glasgow in Scotland. 0:02:27.400 --> 0:02:29.680 Yes you do, thank you, thank you so much. Did 0:02:29.680 --> 0:02:32.119 you know the place opened in fourteen fifty. 0:02:31.840 --> 0:02:34.359 One, as in like the Middle Ages. 0:02:34.200 --> 0:02:36.120 Yes, it's ancient ancient. 0:02:36.320 --> 0:02:37.519 I know, it's one of the oldest in the world. 0:02:37.560 --> 0:02:39.200 If not, I know, I think Bologna is a little 0:02:39.200 --> 0:02:39.560 bit older. 0:02:39.680 --> 0:02:42.880 Yeah, it's one of what they call the ancient universities 0:02:42.919 --> 0:02:47.240 of Europe. Lots of notable Alumniamian you do that long. 0:02:47.200 --> 0:02:48.920 Yeah, figure you're going to hit a couple. 0:02:49.040 --> 0:02:51.240 And it wasn't easy to get in, and it wasn't 0:02:51.240 --> 0:02:54.080 easy to get the degree with highest distinction. 0:02:54.800 --> 0:02:55.200 Look at you. 0:02:55.520 --> 0:02:58.080 But and it's not just like the diploma. It's everything 0:02:58.120 --> 0:03:00.360 behind it, you know. It's the effort that I put 0:03:00.360 --> 0:03:03.160 in so I can display certain skills as a result. 0:03:03.280 --> 0:03:05.560 Sure, and then also the imprimature of that school tells 0:03:05.639 --> 0:03:07.399 us that you did all this exactly. 0:03:07.960 --> 0:03:10.320 So people are proud of their alma maters. 0:03:10.480 --> 0:03:11.440 Yes, their sole mother. 0:03:12.880 --> 0:03:17.639 Jim Mann, chief Information Technology Officer of the State of Kansas. 0:03:17.960 --> 0:03:20.680 He was proud of his degree in business administration from 0:03:20.680 --> 0:03:26.000 the University of Devonshire. Jim Man Jim Man. George Way, 0:03:26.600 --> 0:03:31.680 President of Liberia and a retired Liberian football player. He 0:03:31.760 --> 0:03:34.160 was proud of his degree from Parkwood University. 0:03:34.200 --> 0:03:35.840 Football soccer, not football football. 0:03:35.960 --> 0:03:40.920 Yeah. Costas Margaritis, he's a Greek politician and he's a 0:03:40.960 --> 0:03:43.680 member of the New Democracy Party there. He has a 0:03:43.720 --> 0:03:45.360 degree from Shelbourne University. 0:03:45.400 --> 0:03:46.960 He's very proud of it, of course. 0:03:47.120 --> 0:03:52.760 Leonard Ingram aka bag One Raw Africa. He's a self 0:03:52.800 --> 0:03:55.960 proclaimed anger management specialist. He's writing a bunch of books. 0:03:56.000 --> 0:03:57.680 He was on that Penn and Teller TV show. 0:03:57.840 --> 0:03:58.520 Oh interesting. 0:03:58.640 --> 0:04:01.920 He's proud of his PA philosophy from glen. 0:04:01.600 --> 0:04:03.200 Cullen University, Glenn Collin. 0:04:03.600 --> 0:04:05.360 Who are these people's. 0:04:05.000 --> 0:04:06.840 Eric, Elizabeth? Are these friends of yours? 0:04:06.960 --> 0:04:12.520 No, these people are phonies. University of Devonshire, Parkwood University, 0:04:12.600 --> 0:04:16.720 Shelbourne University, glen Cullen University. They're all fake colleges. 0:04:16.839 --> 0:04:17.880 Oh, but the people are real. 0:04:18.120 --> 0:04:20.600 People are real. The colleges are faked. 0:04:20.360 --> 0:04:21.559 So they're not like AI people. 0:04:21.680 --> 0:04:25.520 No, they're real people with fake diplomas. Got These colleges 0:04:25.560 --> 0:04:30.440 are fronts for one diploma mill operation called university degree program. 0:04:30.640 --> 0:04:33.440 Wait one. They have all these different flavors of college 0:04:33.440 --> 0:04:33.840 you can pick. 0:04:33.839 --> 0:04:37.360 The Chronicle of Higher Education called this the quote Granddaddy 0:04:37.400 --> 0:04:41.040 of diploma mills. And so we'll get to this particular 0:04:41.080 --> 0:04:42.960 operation later, but right now, I want to give you 0:04:42.960 --> 0:04:43.560 some background. 0:04:43.720 --> 0:04:44.760 Please, I love background. 0:04:44.839 --> 0:04:46.640 What is a diploma Mill's. 0:04:46.480 --> 0:04:48.760 Errand Elizabeth, what is a diploma mill? 0:04:48.880 --> 0:04:53.720 Well, in today's society, Webster's Dictionary defines diploma mill as 0:04:53.839 --> 0:04:59.120 quote a usually unregulated institution of higher education granting degrees 0:04:59.160 --> 0:05:03.240 with few or no academic requirements. So it's a business 0:05:03.720 --> 0:05:06.599 that sells illegitimate diplomas for bogus degrees. 0:05:06.720 --> 0:05:08.960 Ah, degrees, those are important, I hear there. 0:05:09.200 --> 0:05:11.880 Yeah, they're kind of uh sometimes. 0:05:11.440 --> 0:05:13.480 So people use them all the time to leverage things 0:05:13.520 --> 0:05:13.840 they do. 0:05:13.960 --> 0:05:16.880 That is true. And so some of these diploma mills 0:05:16.920 --> 0:05:18.839 they claim that they offer credit. 0:05:18.560 --> 0:05:20.720 For prior learning, credit for prior learning, and. 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:22.600 That's a legitimate thing, but it has to be very 0:05:22.640 --> 0:05:27.160 carefully documented with like a confirmed method of conversion from 0:05:27.320 --> 0:05:28.920 experience to academic credit. 0:05:29.040 --> 0:05:31.440 So like if I was a un interpreter working in French, 0:05:31.839 --> 0:05:34.200 like the Francophone on the African continent, I could go 0:05:34.240 --> 0:05:38.520 in and get like French five credits, sure, something like that, 0:05:38.680 --> 0:05:39.400 something like that. 0:05:39.520 --> 0:05:42.279 Okay, So some of the diploma mills they don't even 0:05:42.360 --> 0:05:46.120 bother with any kind of conversion. Most of them also 0:05:46.240 --> 0:05:48.279 have a fake a creditor that make it look like 0:05:48.320 --> 0:05:50.080 there's some sort of quality assurance. 0:05:50.240 --> 0:05:51.040 Ah. 0:05:51.080 --> 0:05:54.159 And so you hear degree mill and diploma mill and 0:05:54.200 --> 0:05:55.120 they aren't the same thing. 0:05:55.279 --> 0:05:55.719 Interesting. 0:05:55.839 --> 0:06:00.800 Yeah, degree mill issues diplomas from unaccredited in institutions that 0:06:00.960 --> 0:06:04.440 may be legal in some states but are generally illegitimate. 0:06:04.480 --> 0:06:06.560 That's a degree mill, so this is like a medical 0:06:06.839 --> 0:06:08.839 degree from a school in Grenada totally. 0:06:09.160 --> 0:06:13.360 And then the diploma mill they issue counterfeit diplomas bearing 0:06:13.400 --> 0:06:15.159 the names of real universities. 0:06:15.400 --> 0:06:15.760 Uh huh. 0:06:16.000 --> 0:06:20.120 Sometimes there's an overlap in that I mentioned accreditation. Yes, 0:06:20.839 --> 0:06:25.320 diploma mills, they're usually shopping degrees from colleges that aren't 0:06:25.360 --> 0:06:32.200 accredited by a recognized institutional accreditor, and accreditors apparently like 0:06:32.360 --> 0:06:35.720 they keep colleges accountable to set standards. 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:38.400 I'm glad you bring this up. I know all about it. Credits, Elizabeth, 0:06:38.440 --> 0:06:40.680 I could tell you, I could wax poetic about it, 0:06:40.720 --> 0:06:43.960 because it's a really integral component of the academic experience, 0:06:44.000 --> 0:06:47.000 and people don't understand that colleges with us is accreditation. 0:06:47.120 --> 0:06:49.560 They could pose as we're seeing as anybody, and the 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:53.520 creditor actually guarantees your education in a way as much 0:06:53.560 --> 0:06:54.680 as your teacher does. 0:06:54.839 --> 0:06:56.600 Sure, No, I don't know. 0:06:56.760 --> 0:06:58.800 Well, I'm glad you've brought that up, and. 0:06:58.760 --> 0:07:01.120 It's like I should say that because a college is 0:07:01.200 --> 0:07:03.920 unaccredited doesn't mean it's bad or fake. 0:07:04.240 --> 0:07:06.039 No, so you know it. 0:07:06.160 --> 0:07:07.360 But accreditation is. 0:07:07.600 --> 0:07:09.960 Accreditation is like basically a certification of this stuff is 0:07:10.000 --> 0:07:12.280 what it says. 0:07:11.280 --> 0:07:13.880 And I think from my understanding, it's generally like sort 0:07:13.880 --> 0:07:19.600 of gate keeping federal financial aids. Interesting up of yeah, 0:07:19.600 --> 0:07:22.680 you should have known these things. For diploma mills, since 0:07:22.720 --> 0:07:25.600 they don't have the seal of approval from an accreditor, 0:07:26.120 --> 0:07:28.000 they have to do other stuff that's going to make 0:07:28.080 --> 0:07:31.280 them look legit to students. So some will say that 0:07:31.320 --> 0:07:34.360 they're fully accredited, but the accreditor is another scam on 0:07:34.400 --> 0:07:38.920 its own. There are accreditation mills, and so they make 0:07:39.000 --> 0:07:42.120 their websites look legit and they claim to be approved 0:07:42.120 --> 0:07:45.000 by the government like you know an accreditor would be, 0:07:45.680 --> 0:07:48.360 and then the college can link to that fake accreditor 0:07:48.440 --> 0:07:50.200 and students think it's all on the up and up, 0:07:50.240 --> 0:07:53.320 of course, and other times the fake college will say 0:07:53.320 --> 0:07:58.040 that they are internationally recognized by organizations like UNESCO, and 0:07:58.080 --> 0:08:01.640 that sounds impressive. Sure, problem is that UNESCO has no 0:08:01.720 --> 0:08:06.760 authority to recognize or credit colleges cultural sites completely. Oh 0:08:06.800 --> 0:08:10.840 that sounds you know, bad though, so some diploma and 0:08:10.880 --> 0:08:13.760 degree mills they like they draw students in by telling 0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:17.560 them that work history professional education can count towards a degree, 0:08:17.560 --> 0:08:20.720 which in some cases can't. Like you said, they might 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:23.240 even have the student write a dissertation or a thesis. 0:08:23.800 --> 0:08:26.800 Of course, the papers are usually like four pages long 0:08:26.880 --> 0:08:29.640 and don't require a defense. Okay, just turn it in. 0:08:30.040 --> 0:08:32.600 Another trick to make the place look legit is to 0:08:32.800 --> 0:08:36.920 use the following language in their promotional materials. They'll say 0:08:37.000 --> 0:08:41.360 degrees are quote attested and sealed for authenticity by government 0:08:41.400 --> 0:08:42.440 appointed notary. 0:08:42.640 --> 0:08:45.400 You're supposed to get a sealed notarized. 0:08:45.440 --> 0:08:47.920 All it means is that the signature on the document 0:08:47.960 --> 0:08:50.600 has been verified, so has nothing to do with the 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:53.200 contents of the document. I could get a replica of 0:08:53.320 --> 0:08:56.480 like the Declaration of Independence, sign it in front of 0:08:56.520 --> 0:08:59.120 a notary, get their stamp on it, boom, notarized. 0:08:59.240 --> 0:09:01.319 Yes, and the seal of course actually on the paper. 0:09:01.320 --> 0:09:03.559 It's not like it's been sealed in wax exactly. I 0:09:03.679 --> 0:09:05.880 misunderstood yes, thank you, or that. 0:09:05.840 --> 0:09:08.880 Maybe they say it's sealed most who knows so students 0:09:08.880 --> 0:09:12.240 they either fall for the dupe or they're into the 0:09:12.280 --> 0:09:16.120 scam because the college uses names that sound legit and 0:09:16.240 --> 0:09:19.160 are easily confused with real collegists. Do you remember doctor 0:09:19.240 --> 0:09:20.320 Dante yeh. 0:09:20.240 --> 0:09:22.800 Yeah, yeah, babbetizing doctor Donne exactly. 0:09:22.840 --> 0:09:25.640 He won his song one best song. He ran a 0:09:25.679 --> 0:09:30.920 diploma mill. If you'll recall Columbia State University, because I 0:09:30.960 --> 0:09:33.199 talked about it. Then. Distance learning was all the rage 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:36.640 in the late nineties, so he did correspondence courses by mail. 0:09:36.679 --> 0:09:39.160 He also did some online learning there, and he operated 0:09:39.200 --> 0:09:42.959 out of a mail drop in Louisiana. It's the one 0:09:43.000 --> 0:09:47.080 that higher ed expert John Bear said, quote Columbia State 0:09:47.200 --> 0:09:50.560 University is a complete fake. There's no such university. The 0:09:50.600 --> 0:09:52.840 photograph on the cover of their catalog is of Notre 0:09:52.880 --> 0:09:56.600 Dame University in Indiana, while administrative office number two three 0:09:56.679 --> 0:09:58.400 one is a three inch square mailbox. 0:09:58.720 --> 0:10:03.280 Well, you know, education come in a lot of different way. 0:10:04.679 --> 0:10:05.920 It's not one size fits all. 0:10:06.000 --> 0:10:09.280 What if you're saving money by using pictures of other colleges. 0:10:09.640 --> 0:10:14.040 Here's a quick note about that environment very environmental. You're 0:10:14.120 --> 0:10:18.560 so conscientious, doctor Bear. Little aside on him. He's listed 0:10:18.600 --> 0:10:21.880 all over as a higher education expert. But I also 0:10:22.000 --> 0:10:26.600 stumbled onto a higher Education Distance Learning Conspiracy message board. 0:10:26.760 --> 0:10:29.160 What there's a post about him? 0:10:29.280 --> 0:10:31.079 Okay, say that all again. 0:10:31.080 --> 0:10:36.200 Higher Education Distance Learning Conspiracy message Board. It was just 0:10:36.280 --> 0:10:38.000 like too much. It was too good, and I was 0:10:38.040 --> 0:10:40.600 just like, did someone make this just like to dupe me? 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:43.480 Because it's it's they know I'd think this is hilarious. 0:10:43.760 --> 0:10:46.600 So someone on there wrote this article thing about like 0:10:46.679 --> 0:10:49.080 alleging that John Bear is in his real name and 0:10:49.080 --> 0:10:52.480 that he secretly runs diploma mills himself and he's trying 0:10:52.520 --> 0:10:56.040 to destroy the competition. Like it was a rabbit hole, 0:10:56.120 --> 0:10:58.400 to be sure, and it was weird. And anyway, back 0:10:58.400 --> 0:11:00.920 to Colombia, Okay, back to this day my alma mater, 0:11:01.520 --> 0:11:05.400 remember a Columbia State University. A six to eight page 0:11:05.440 --> 0:11:08.080 thesis got you a master's degree, yes, and at twelve 0:11:08.080 --> 0:11:10.720 page one got you a doctorate yes, and then both 0:11:11.040 --> 0:11:14.160 degrees could be completed in I don't know, twenty seven 0:11:14.240 --> 0:11:17.440 days a long month average was like two to four months. 0:11:17.440 --> 0:11:19.960 Okay, yes, you could get a PhD. 0:11:19.640 --> 0:11:23.440 For like three grand and they let you haggle and that. 0:11:23.640 --> 0:11:26.760 So he had Columbia State University. Some of the US 0:11:26.800 --> 0:11:29.520 diploma mills they use British sounding names. Like the ones 0:11:29.559 --> 0:11:32.720 I talked about Earl Year. These are similar but not 0:11:32.840 --> 0:11:34.320 identical to the names of. 0:11:34.400 --> 0:11:36.520 Actual universe Saint Exeter. 0:11:36.320 --> 0:11:40.800 Yeah exactly. They do this for two reasons. First, British 0:11:40.920 --> 0:11:45.559 universities are seen as like superior, super rigorous. 0:11:45.640 --> 0:11:47.960 Of course, yes, it's why we have British sounding actors 0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:50.480 always playing in historical movies, because it's a whole Yes, 0:11:50.559 --> 0:11:52.559 of course sound British. 0:11:52.600 --> 0:11:54.880 And then there's the fact that they're far away and 0:11:54.960 --> 0:11:57.680 not likely to be like driven by or visited by 0:11:57.760 --> 0:11:58.560 average American. 0:11:59.280 --> 0:12:00.720 You can't go and take a self in front of 0:12:00.760 --> 0:12:02.080 like the school, exactly. 0:12:02.120 --> 0:12:05.080 And so some examples of British sounding names used by 0:12:05.080 --> 0:12:09.960 diploma mills are Shaftsbury University, Oh yes, University of Dunham, 0:12:10.520 --> 0:12:13.239 Reading University, and Suffield University. 0:12:13.320 --> 0:12:17.640 Wait a minute, it's just like just off. 0:12:18.320 --> 0:12:21.480 Higher ed institutions in the US have the UURL suffix 0:12:21.520 --> 0:12:25.719 on their websites dot edu. Some diploma mills use an 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:31.240 AC top level domain name like which resembles a genuine 0:12:31.320 --> 0:12:35.640 second level academic domain name like AC dot UK. So 0:12:35.720 --> 0:12:38.679 like you know, for UK University it's you know, dot 0:12:38.679 --> 0:12:42.080 ac dot UK, okay, but the AC is actually the 0:12:42.160 --> 0:12:46.640 domain for Ascension Island, and so this has become so 0:12:46.720 --> 0:12:50.600 prevalent that legit colleges are starting to register that ac 0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:54.560 domain for their institutions just to redirect to their real 0:12:54.640 --> 0:12:57.080 sites to prevent digital scammers from using. 0:12:57.200 --> 0:12:58.040 Yeah. Interesting. 0:12:58.600 --> 0:13:00.360 So what's it like to go to a diploma a mill? 0:13:00.840 --> 0:13:02.240 Can you actually go to one? 0:13:02.480 --> 0:13:05.600 I guess so? Like, you may have to buy textbooks, Okay, 0:13:06.000 --> 0:13:08.319 you might have to take some tests really yeah, whether 0:13:08.360 --> 0:13:09.960 those are graded or not, who knows. 0:13:10.080 --> 0:13:11.960 But you actually have to pretend to do some of 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:12.280 the work. 0:13:12.880 --> 0:13:15.800 Sometimes it depends. It's on the flavor of it. You 0:13:15.840 --> 0:13:17.119 may have to write a paper. 0:13:16.880 --> 0:13:19.160 And call it a what is this college? 0:13:19.280 --> 0:13:23.120 Someone might read it, maybe not, maybe not. I would 0:13:23.160 --> 0:13:25.679 love to get my hands on some of the papers 0:13:25.760 --> 0:13:30.079 turned into those places. Yeah, I would probably have an aneurysm. 0:13:33.480 --> 0:13:38.319 The programs available are generally pretty squishy squish, I mean, 0:13:38.360 --> 0:13:41.760 they aren't hard sciences. I lean on things that are 0:13:41.760 --> 0:13:45.360 like more vague or subjective or esoteric, and like sometimes 0:13:45.360 --> 0:13:49.480 it's total pseudoscience, like the gay like PhDs in aromatherapy 0:13:49.520 --> 0:13:53.680 and astrology. Oh yeah, like or anything obscure or lacking 0:13:53.720 --> 0:13:54.360 peer review. 0:13:54.640 --> 0:13:56.600 My friend and I we invented a fake college for 0:13:56.640 --> 0:14:00.440 a while called Sandalwood State College, and we actually offered 0:14:00.440 --> 0:14:03.440 degrees in a roma therapy. So yeah, I just wanted 0:14:03.440 --> 0:14:06.440 to let you know that I've been working this scam myself, 0:14:06.520 --> 0:14:07.280 So go on. 0:14:08.160 --> 0:14:10.199 I taught at a community college that had a name 0:14:10.400 --> 0:14:13.480 very similar to a university that was well known, and 0:14:13.640 --> 0:14:14.680 there were a lot of confusion. 0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:16.640 Yeah, I could see that who. 0:14:16.520 --> 0:14:18.560 Teaches at these diplomas. 0:14:18.120 --> 0:14:19.320 Teaches at these elizabeth A. 0:14:20.720 --> 0:14:23.080 Student's never going to meet them because you know, they 0:14:23.080 --> 0:14:26.680 don't have a campus. No one's actually going going. No, 0:14:27.280 --> 0:14:29.560 they just stand out, so they just sign off on 0:14:29.640 --> 0:14:32.720 assignments or like for a price, a student can get 0:14:32.760 --> 0:14:35.720 a reference letter. It's like in a la krte systems 0:14:36.080 --> 0:14:36.400 like this. 0:14:36.520 --> 0:14:38.520 Yes, why not if there are. 0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:42.240 Professors employed, their certification to teach is either a degree 0:14:42.320 --> 0:14:46.240 from that very fake institution or something from somewhere else 0:14:46.280 --> 0:14:49.440 that's totally unrelated to any of the received degrees. So 0:14:49.480 --> 0:14:52.640 it's like if I started teaching advanced mathematics at prof 0:14:52.680 --> 0:14:56.360 and bottom Glen University, like I'd sign you off on anything. 0:14:56.480 --> 0:14:59.160 Yeah, but like, do you ever have any like disgraced 0:14:59.240 --> 0:15:02.480 teachers who've like also fall into this where they're like, 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:04.200 you know, basically cashing out. 0:15:04.440 --> 0:15:08.400 Probably exactly. Well, and like if there's a faculty directory 0:15:08.400 --> 0:15:11.880 on the college website with like really robust professor bios, 0:15:12.280 --> 0:15:15.320 it's likely stolen from the website of a real university. 0:15:15.560 --> 0:15:17.760 See you wonder, like who you know, what other places 0:15:17.800 --> 0:15:21.240 are they? No professors means no classrooms. 0:15:21.280 --> 0:15:22.200 Really. 0:15:22.400 --> 0:15:25.600 In order to be accredited, colleges have to provide library 0:15:25.640 --> 0:15:29.120 and student support services, and for online work, there has 0:15:29.160 --> 0:15:33.240 to be evidence of what they call regular and substantive interaction. 0:15:33.840 --> 0:15:36.360 Okay, regular and substitute so they actually have to face 0:15:36.400 --> 0:15:37.720 face to face time. 0:15:37.720 --> 0:15:40.760 Not face to face, but for like distance education, zoom calls, 0:15:41.400 --> 0:15:43.800 calls present any kind of communication with. 0:15:43.960 --> 0:15:45.840 Your instructor and your fellow students. 0:15:45.920 --> 0:15:48.280 Yeah, you're not just like plugging in and they do 0:15:48.360 --> 0:15:49.200 automated tests. 0:15:49.440 --> 0:15:51.400 Let me tell you this is very important to accreditors. 0:15:51.600 --> 0:15:53.920 They're always talking about student outcomes, and this is something 0:15:53.920 --> 0:15:56.960 that's very important to really. Yeah, yeah, important because in 0:15:57.000 --> 0:15:58.400 the face to FaceTime is a way for you to 0:15:58.440 --> 0:15:58.840 gauge that. 0:15:59.000 --> 0:16:05.120 Okay, well, well, all that evidence of interaction isn't true. 0:16:05.160 --> 0:16:09.120 Obviously at a mill, there's no library, there's no registrars office, 0:16:09.160 --> 0:16:12.040 no counselors, no labs, and then the address for the 0:16:12.040 --> 0:16:15.080 most part is like a postbox and a male forwarding 0:16:15.120 --> 0:16:16.440 service or like a suite number. 0:16:17.200 --> 0:16:19.680 So well great, though if they had like a swim team, 0:16:19.960 --> 0:16:23.760 like they have nothing to go down to the pool, 0:16:23.760 --> 0:16:24.960 they actually have people there. 0:16:24.960 --> 0:16:28.479 Swing sweatshirts made for these fake these fake colleges. 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:30.120 Tell you, Sandwood State College, I can get your merch. 0:16:30.200 --> 0:16:32.040 We have the whole We already got the thing going. 0:16:32.400 --> 0:16:33.560 I should have told you about this early. 0:16:33.640 --> 0:16:35.720 So like when someone writes a doctoral thesis or a 0:16:35.760 --> 0:16:41.320 dissertation at a legitimate university, it's available from University Microfilms International, 0:16:41.400 --> 0:16:44.760 which is a national repository, or the institution's own library. 0:16:45.280 --> 0:16:48.720 That's not true for the mills. At most colleges, the 0:16:48.760 --> 0:16:52.080 motto for faculty is publisher parish, so you have to 0:16:52.080 --> 0:16:55.280 be writing scholarly articles, conducting research, or for the arts 0:16:55.360 --> 0:16:58.920 creating works in order to keep your job. At diploma mills, 0:16:59.040 --> 0:17:01.920 there's either none of them or it's faked. And a 0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:04.960 red flag is that tuition and fees are charged by 0:17:05.000 --> 0:17:08.359 the degree, so students don't pay by units per semester. 0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:10.000 You just do a flat fee for the whole thing. 0:17:10.560 --> 0:17:13.919 That's a problem. Okay, remember that that's a red flag. 0:17:14.160 --> 0:17:16.919 They don't market themselves at college fairs or like in 0:17:16.960 --> 0:17:20.880 regular areas. It's generally like spam emails, and the emails 0:17:20.960 --> 0:17:24.720 often like urge students and role now before tuition or 0:17:24.720 --> 0:17:27.240 feesing are increased. That's not how it works. 0:17:27.320 --> 0:17:29.560 It's like University of Phoenix. Part of this. Would you 0:17:29.600 --> 0:17:30.240 say that they. 0:17:30.280 --> 0:17:36.439 A touchy subject. They're not technically there are they're not 0:17:36.520 --> 0:17:40.000 technically we'll put it that way. So they but they 0:17:40.119 --> 0:17:42.879 urge you to get the early bird special, you know, 0:17:42.920 --> 0:17:46.399 and roll now. The marketing materials, the college catalog, the 0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:49.280 website usually have all sorts of like spelling and grammar errors. 0:17:49.760 --> 0:17:51.439 And they love putting stuff in Latin. 0:17:52.000 --> 0:17:52.760 Of course, my. 0:17:52.840 --> 0:17:55.760 Diplomas in Latin. By the way, did I get scammed? 0:17:56.760 --> 0:17:59.080 But so that's it makes it look fancy, it puts 0:17:59.119 --> 0:17:59.639 an edge on it. 0:17:59.680 --> 0:18:03.520 So's the patina you want exactly put it in Latin. 0:18:03.720 --> 0:18:07.040 So we know about like what a diploma or degree 0:18:07.080 --> 0:18:10.560 mill looks like. Take a break, we come back. I'm 0:18:10.600 --> 0:18:12.520 going to tell you about some of the biggest defenders 0:18:12.600 --> 0:18:36.359 and how the law came a call in welcome. Hey, hey, 0:18:36.800 --> 0:18:37.600 diploma mills. 0:18:37.680 --> 0:18:38.720 Yeah, it's Alma maters. 0:18:38.720 --> 0:18:42.000 We've been around forever. In two thousand and four, FBI 0:18:42.080 --> 0:18:45.560 Special Agent Autho Alan Eazel. 0:18:45.440 --> 0:18:49.359 White, what yeah, is he also think ezel? Okay, I 0:18:49.440 --> 0:18:50.440 love see. 0:18:50.520 --> 0:18:54.119 My neck on my back testify to the House Subcommittee 0:18:54.400 --> 0:18:59.280 on twenty first Century Competitiveness. Quote. Degree mills are not 0:18:59.720 --> 0:19:02.399 just a recent problem, He's all told the committee. We 0:19:02.520 --> 0:19:05.040 have had them in the United States since about eighteen 0:19:05.160 --> 0:19:09.040 thirty five. As long as we have a credential conscious 0:19:09.119 --> 0:19:12.160 society where the degree you possess gets you the promotion 0:19:12.320 --> 0:19:15.480 or salary increase, then we will have degree mills. This 0:19:15.640 --> 0:19:18.800 is education fraud and no different from any other fraud. 0:19:19.600 --> 0:19:23.479 Eighteen the camera, Yeah, we had agree mills longer than 0:19:23.520 --> 0:19:24.320 we've had cameras. 0:19:24.359 --> 0:19:28.480 Yes, exactly. In nineteen seventy eight, Mike Wallace reported for 0:19:28.520 --> 0:19:29.160 sixty minutes. 0:19:29.200 --> 0:19:30.560 Yes, oh yeah, love. Yeah. 0:19:31.960 --> 0:19:34.960 He did an expose where he interviewed the owner of 0:19:35.080 --> 0:19:41.159 California pacifica University and a suspected diploma mill, and the 0:19:41.200 --> 0:19:45.919 guy was arrested mid interview, and he like wound up 0:19:45.920 --> 0:19:48.880 pleading guilty to multiple cuts of mail fraud. He did time, 0:19:49.040 --> 0:19:54.320 did Mike time that he did then find them? 0:19:54.440 --> 0:19:56.440 Yeah, basically, I'll tell you this is when we're recording, 0:19:56.520 --> 0:19:58.199 show up. An hour after I get set up. 0:20:00.000 --> 0:20:03.560 Authorities shut down Dallas State College in Texas in nineteen 0:20:03.640 --> 0:20:08.480 seventy five. The owners turned around and almost immediately opened 0:20:08.560 --> 0:20:13.280 up as Jackson State University in California in California. Yeah, 0:20:13.760 --> 0:20:16.000 I like Jackson up in the Golden I don't know, 0:20:16.119 --> 0:20:19.400 I think so. Then the post office shut down their 0:20:19.440 --> 0:20:22.440 mail there and they disappeared, but they popped up again 0:20:22.480 --> 0:20:25.040 as John Quincy Adams University in Oregon. 0:20:25.160 --> 0:20:26.880 One of this wacked bowl. 0:20:27.800 --> 0:20:31.199 That is the best remscription of this total whackable. It 0:20:31.240 --> 0:20:34.359