WEBVTT - Can Labour Dial Back the Doom with the Investment Summit? 0:00:03.160 --> 0:00:08.760 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. 0:00:10.240 --> 0:00:13.720 Earlier this year, before the election, the Labor Party seemed 0:00:13.720 --> 0:00:16.280 to be all in on its mission to be party 0:00:16.280 --> 0:00:18.520 of business. We've covered in a lot on this podcast 0:00:18.720 --> 0:00:23.760 the amount of courting of business people, investors, time spent 0:00:23.880 --> 0:00:26.439 by the new Chancellor or the shadow Chancellor, their ritro routes. 0:00:26.480 --> 0:00:30.160 Here in the City of London, everyone seemed to be 0:00:30.200 --> 0:00:33.640 convinced that Labor was different than it was going to 0:00:33.680 --> 0:00:36.360 be a pro business administration. But now cut to just 0:00:36.440 --> 0:00:42.040 three months after the party's landslide victory, questions are emerging 0:00:42.040 --> 0:00:46.920 about how committed the party is to its pro growth pledge. 0:00:47.280 --> 0:00:49.440 This week, We're going to take stock of Labour's progress 0:00:49.479 --> 0:00:51.720 to win back the support of corporate Britain and ask 0:00:51.760 --> 0:00:54.960 what's at stake if the city's leaders are losing faith 0:00:55.400 --> 0:01:00.800 in Labour's commitment. Welcome to the City of London, The 0:01:00.840 --> 0:01:10.120 City of London, mind gad between the financial hearts of 0:01:10.160 --> 0:01:16.600 the country. 0:01:15.000 --> 0:01:16.279 The City, the City. 0:01:16.720 --> 0:01:22.800 Welcome to In the City, Clear of the Doors, Pea. 0:01:23.959 --> 0:01:27.759 Welcome to another episode of In the City. I'm David Merritt, 0:01:27.840 --> 0:01:30.760 I'm Alegri Stratton and I'm Francine Lackwall. Later in the show, 0:01:30.760 --> 0:01:32.800 we're going to hear from Richard Harrington. He's the former 0:01:32.880 --> 0:01:36.800 government minister who published a review into foreign direct investment 0:01:37.360 --> 0:01:40.839 in November of last year. His review made recommendations about 0:01:40.840 --> 0:01:43.800 how the UK could attract more cross border investment, and 0:01:43.800 --> 0:01:46.360 we're going to get his thoughts on whether the Labor 0:01:46.360 --> 0:01:49.760 government is taking his suggestions on board and what more 0:01:49.760 --> 0:01:53.520 could be done to tackle the barriers to investment. But 0:01:53.600 --> 0:01:56.680 before that, with us in the studio is Bloomberg Radio 0:01:56.680 --> 0:01:59.960 host Karen Hepka, who has authored a piece on how 0:02:00.000 --> 0:02:03.880 how the city is now viewing the Labor Party's first 0:02:03.920 --> 0:02:04.800 one hundred days. 0:02:05.280 --> 0:02:05.760 Welcome to the. 0:02:05.760 --> 0:02:07.440 Podcast, Karen, Thanks for having me. 0:02:07.880 --> 0:02:12.320 So you spend your days talking to business people, interviewing 0:02:12.320 --> 0:02:15.960 them modern radio. How has the mood shifted from you know, 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:18.360 before this year when everyone was thinking, hey, Labor is 0:02:18.400 --> 0:02:22.400 really making efforts to be seen as a pro business party, 0:02:22.720 --> 0:02:25.160 to what they've actually done and what's happened since they 0:02:25.200 --> 0:02:25.680 won power. 0:02:26.040 --> 0:02:27.920 Yeah, well I spent the last few weeks sort of 0:02:27.919 --> 0:02:31.160 trying to ascertain that with a few key players. So 0:02:31.360 --> 0:02:35.600 people like Anne Glover from Amadeus Capital Management. She's key 0:02:35.639 --> 0:02:39.359 in that investment scene in the UK. People like Lloyd 0:02:39.440 --> 0:02:43.400 Lee from you Capital working on one of the biggest 0:02:43.440 --> 0:02:48.680 regeneration projects in London. Phoenix Group their CIO. You know 0:02:48.760 --> 0:02:50.840 they if you recall, at their heart of the mansion 0:02:50.840 --> 0:02:53.919 House Accord trying to get pension funds to invest more 0:02:53.919 --> 0:02:55.880 in the city. Spent a few weeks talking to them. 0:02:56.000 --> 0:03:01.000 I think surface level there is trepidation, there is anticipation 0:03:01.040 --> 0:03:04.639 about the budget. Mostly everybody agrees that in the first 0:03:04.680 --> 0:03:07.000 one hundred days, which is what I was looking at, 0:03:07.280 --> 0:03:10.639 actually nothing much has happened on the economic front. I 0:03:10.639 --> 0:03:12.320 think quite a lot of other things have happened. 0:03:12.600 --> 0:03:15.280 I think one of the things that labourhood trumpeted a 0:03:15.280 --> 0:03:18.359 lot to business was we're going to bring back stability 0:03:18.760 --> 0:03:22.960 to Britain. We've had weeks of headlines of freebies for 0:03:23.120 --> 0:03:26.959 government termoil reports of all those inviting. Do business people 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:30.360 feel frustrated by that ongoing sense of chales. 0:03:30.480 --> 0:03:35.000 I think there was such huge desperation for some new 0:03:35.040 --> 0:03:38.120 direction in the UK after fourteen years of increasingly erratic 0:03:38.160 --> 0:03:40.400 government that yes, I think there was a huge moment 0:03:40.440 --> 0:03:43.760 of relief. The fact that Labour has this huge mandate 0:03:44.040 --> 0:03:45.920 and a five year term I was talking about a 0:03:45.960 --> 0:03:49.160 ten year term. That's why I think there's a lot 0:03:49.160 --> 0:03:51.680 of anxiety. There is not just a huge amount going 0:03:51.720 --> 0:03:56.120 on geopolitically, but also domestically. And I think that the 0:03:56.160 --> 0:03:59.320 people that I spoke to talked about the government having 0:03:59.320 --> 0:04:01.560 to learn on the job and how it's very difficult 0:04:01.600 --> 0:04:03.440 to do that in just the space of three months, 0:04:03.520 --> 0:04:07.000 and that's immensely difficult. I think it's put even more 0:04:07.040 --> 0:04:09.280 emphasis on the tone and the content of the budget. 0:04:09.320 --> 0:04:12.480 Basically that there have been all of these strands that 0:04:12.520 --> 0:04:17.200 they've talked about, infrastructure spending, the National Wealth Fund, gb Energy, 0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:20.160 all that is a good damn payment, but nothing's actually 0:04:20.200 --> 0:04:22.360 been done. That's kind of top level. 0:04:23.920 --> 0:04:26.080 I wonder rather when you speak to you know, Blackstone, 0:04:26.080 --> 0:04:28.479 black Rock, Golden Sex, I'm not sure they're aware of 0:04:28.480 --> 0:04:30.400 who the chief of staff of Kerestarmer is. I mean, 0:04:30.400 --> 0:04:32.800 it's been a hundred days, but I wonder whether it 0:04:32.800 --> 0:04:35.560 really impacts you know, you know, someone saying, look, I 0:04:35.560 --> 0:04:37.080 want to put one hundred million, I want to put 0:04:37.120 --> 0:04:39.760 two hundred million in this country. I think they're probably 0:04:39.760 --> 0:04:42.000 waiting more for the budget, to see the non arm, 0:04:42.320 --> 0:04:45.120 to see the taxes and where they land on this. 0:04:45.480 --> 0:04:47.440 The issue though, also is that the timing of the 0:04:47.440 --> 0:04:50.799 Business Summit has been has been mistimed. Right. Everybody pretty 0:04:50.839 --> 0:04:53.440 much was in unanimity that the Investment Summit should come 0:04:53.480 --> 0:04:54.799 after the budget, and that's happening. 0:04:54.839 --> 0:04:57.760 That's just because that's happening next week, this big summit 0:04:57.800 --> 0:05:00.840 where the government is trying to pull in huge names 0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:02.920 from business all around the world to come and sort 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:05.560 of celebrate habritains over the business. But it's happening in 0:05:05.600 --> 0:05:09.000 this sort of gray zone before we know what the policies. 0:05:08.600 --> 0:05:09.080 Are going to be. 0:05:09.160 --> 0:05:11.400 And weirdly, of course, it was a success from the 0:05:11.440 --> 0:05:14.840 conservative era right that the Toys did that two years 0:05:14.880 --> 0:05:18.360 in a row. It did bring in big announcements and 0:05:18.440 --> 0:05:22.040 also big global investors at least to have the conversation 0:05:22.120 --> 0:05:22.920 without the UK. 0:05:23.160 --> 0:05:25.400 Yeah, yeah, and we had everyone at the time. You 0:05:25.440 --> 0:05:27.680 had a number of sovereign wealth funds also from the 0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:29.960 Middle East that showed up last year. It was very 0:05:30.000 --> 0:05:31.600 well done. It was well prepared. 0:05:32.880 --> 0:05:33.360 This year. 0:05:33.560 --> 0:05:35.159 When we speak to a lot of Wall Street titans, 0:05:35.200 --> 0:05:36.919 a lot of them can't be there because of boards, 0:05:37.360 --> 0:05:39.400 so they won't say it's because the budget is two 0:05:39.440 --> 0:05:41.960 weeks afterwards. But timing makes a little sense if you're 0:05:41.960 --> 0:05:43.279 going to put a lot of money in this country. 0:05:43.320 --> 0:05:45.880 And we've talked quite pessimistically about the UK. 0:05:46.000 --> 0:05:47.200 But the other weird. 0:05:46.960 --> 0:05:50.040 Dichotomy the numbers are not that bad, and that there 0:05:50.080 --> 0:05:53.599 should be more kind of optimism. We understand what the 0:05:53.680 --> 0:05:56.719 issue for Britain is, right growth and the lack of investment. 0:05:56.720 --> 0:05:59.279 Nobody knows the exact recipe for how to boost economic 0:05:59.279 --> 0:06:01.120 growth in Britain, but we know that you know what 0:06:01.200 --> 0:06:04.520 the various levers are. It is the difficulty what do 0:06:04.520 --> 0:06:05.560 you do on day one a one? 0:06:05.640 --> 0:06:07.680 You know, in the first few days their emphasis on 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:10.680 planning reform was manner from heaven. That was what the 0:06:10.680 --> 0:06:12.840 city wanted to hear, wasn't it. And we should remember 0:06:12.880 --> 0:06:14.479 that that they made a lot of kind of the 0:06:14.560 --> 0:06:15.520 right noises early on. 0:06:15.640 --> 0:06:17.080 But also they just need to make sure that they 0:06:17.120 --> 0:06:20.000 have growth right. So I imagine that every lens they're looking 0:06:20.080 --> 0:06:22.200 at is like, okay, I can get twenty millis you know, 0:06:22.240 --> 0:06:25.960 private equity carried interest? Does that lead if you make 0:06:25.960 --> 0:06:28.240 that higher, does it lead to extra growth or does 0:06:28.240 --> 0:06:30.720 it lower growth? I don't really know the answer to that. 0:06:31.240 --> 0:06:32.960 Like what you were saying is that this budget is 0:06:32.960 --> 0:06:35.400 tricky because they need to show the world that they're 0:06:35.400 --> 0:06:39.040 open for business, get money in, but actually it's understanding 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:42.920 what can be taxed and not hurting growth because at 0:06:42.920 --> 0:06:44.240 the end of the day, it's not the time. I mean, 0:06:44.480 --> 0:06:46.120 they can get money in, but they really need to 0:06:46.240 --> 0:06:48.520 grow the GDP of this country. 0:06:48.680 --> 0:06:51.760 The thing that has emerged in the last week ten days, 0:06:52.279 --> 0:06:55.680 which I think she's they've let emerge because they realized 0:06:55.680 --> 0:06:57.360 that they were in a massive hole of kind of 0:06:57.400 --> 0:07:00.000 you know, you've been too pessimistic, which is this borrowing 0:07:00.080 --> 0:07:02.919 to invest? Yes, I don't know, but I suspect that 0:07:03.120 --> 0:07:05.359 was a kind of pull down from shelf, not in 0:07:05.440 --> 0:07:07.960 case of emergency, but in case everybody's grumpy and you 0:07:08.040 --> 0:07:09.840 need something to kind of shift the narrative. 0:07:10.080 --> 0:07:11.840 Yeah, And I think the people that I speak to, 0:07:12.000 --> 0:07:14.760 you know, they are all saying, we are standing ready 0:07:14.840 --> 0:07:16.880 like females, we are standing ready to put the money 0:07:16.880 --> 0:07:19.680 in there, but we've got to understand the direction. I 0:07:19.680 --> 0:07:23.200 think there's even more emphasis on the budget and on 0:07:23.320 --> 0:07:25.440 getting that right. And also I kind of just wonder 0:07:25.480 --> 0:07:27.280 when she does stand up. You were saying, as the 0:07:27.320 --> 0:07:31.800 first female chancellor in like eight hundred years in the UK. 0:07:32.160 --> 0:07:35.760 Can she actually deliver tonally that shift you know that 0:07:36.280 --> 0:07:38.640 we are hope of a business that we're going for great, 0:07:38.800 --> 0:07:41.600 She's got to come up with some great phrases, you know, 0:07:41.800 --> 0:07:43.920 to galvanize the nation. 0:07:44.240 --> 0:07:52.440 Right, Thanks so much, Carolina. Thanks now, as promised, Richard 0:07:52.480 --> 0:07:55.240 Harrington joins us. Lord Harrington is a former government minister 0:07:55.280 --> 0:07:58.400 who published a review into foreign direct investment in November 0:07:58.480 --> 0:08:00.800 of last year. We're happy to have them with us 0:08:00.840 --> 0:08:03.800 to check in on the recommendation he laid out nearly 0:08:03.960 --> 0:08:06.560 a year ago and whether the Labor government has taken 0:08:06.880 --> 0:08:09.119 any on board. Richard, welcome back to in the city. 0:08:09.320 --> 0:08:10.920 Thank you. It's a pleasure to be here. And of 0:08:10.920 --> 0:08:14.720 course the review itself was launched here at Bloomberg. I 0:08:14.880 --> 0:08:17.760 felt very optimistic about it. Jeremy Hunt was very much 0:08:17.800 --> 0:08:22.040 behind it and they're opposition now. The government were so 0:08:22.800 --> 0:08:23.160 although a. 0:08:23.240 --> 0:08:25.680 Year's gone by, Richard behind it well. 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:29.360 The new government was behind it in opposition and very 0:08:29.440 --> 0:08:32.400 much in favor of it now. And we're expecting an 0:08:32.440 --> 0:08:36.240 announcement on the subject because it's all about stuff which 0:08:36.280 --> 0:08:38.920 a lot of people think is quite boring because it's 0:08:38.920 --> 0:08:42.840 not the most glamorous sun headline stuff. But it's reorganizing 0:08:42.920 --> 0:08:45.959 the government in a much more favorable modern way for 0:08:46.120 --> 0:08:47.000 inward investment. 0:08:47.240 --> 0:08:50.880 And we've got the Investment Summit happening next week and 0:08:50.920 --> 0:08:52.599 some people are saying, well, the timing of that's a 0:08:52.600 --> 0:08:54.920 bit strange. You know, everyone's really just waiting for the budget. 0:08:56.120 --> 0:08:57.920 You know, there's a lot of nervousness about what sort 0:08:57.920 --> 0:09:02.079 of measures might be there in terms of wealth, you know, 0:09:02.400 --> 0:09:05.439 coupital gains, all these things. But what is your outlook 0:09:05.440 --> 0:09:06.840 for the investments on me? Are you saying we're going 0:09:06.840 --> 0:09:09.600 to actually get some substantive announcements ahead of it that 0:09:09.640 --> 0:09:11.200 are going to really attract investment. 0:09:11.240 --> 0:09:14.920 Well, first of all, you know, everyone that's not involved 0:09:14.920 --> 0:09:17.760 in something is always slacking it off. I mean, it's 0:09:17.800 --> 0:09:21.120 normal in polity. But actually I think it's a very 0:09:21.160 --> 0:09:24.040 good time to have the summit. Yes, there will be 0:09:24.080 --> 0:09:27.640 some tax questions and things like that because people are 0:09:28.000 --> 0:09:31.720 waiting to see what changes are, but decisions are not 0:09:31.880 --> 0:09:34.800 made on the day. This is not something where someone 0:09:34.800 --> 0:09:37.800 will arrive in the morning not thinking they're going to invest, 0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:40.000 and leave in the afternoon and think, oh, I'm going 0:09:40.040 --> 0:09:42.560 to invest now, or I'm not. It isn't that so 0:09:42.600 --> 0:09:45.280 I think the fact it's before the budget is not relevant. 0:09:45.800 --> 0:09:48.560 But the government with a lot of effort of put 0:09:48.600 --> 0:09:52.319 together a large group of very senior investment people from 0:09:52.360 --> 0:09:54.800 all over the world. I'm assuming so because these are 0:09:54.840 --> 0:09:57.000 the people that were there last year. They were the 0:09:57.040 --> 0:10:02.160 top people from banks, from multinationals, from sovereign wealth funds, 0:10:02.160 --> 0:10:05.520 et cetera. And it's a big show piece for the country. 0:10:05.600 --> 0:10:10.000 So don't criticize them for the timing at all. I'm 0:10:10.040 --> 0:10:12.880 sure it will be a success because these things have 0:10:13.000 --> 0:10:15.080 the right kind of people in the room. But it's 0:10:15.160 --> 0:10:18.360 not a question of yes or no, because a lot 0:10:18.400 --> 0:10:21.680 of it just helps create the environment that we need, 0:10:22.000 --> 0:10:25.520 and I do feel an announcement on that day will 0:10:25.559 --> 0:10:27.720 be very important towards investment. 0:10:28.080 --> 0:10:31.520 What is the environment that you know global investors need? So, 0:10:31.760 --> 0:10:34.040 is it again on paper cutting out the red tape 0:10:34.400 --> 0:10:36.760 so that if a blackstoner of black Rock wants to 0:10:36.760 --> 0:10:38.560 put two million pounds on where they can do it 0:10:38.600 --> 0:10:41.040 in twenty four hours, or is it actually just making 0:10:41.040 --> 0:10:42.800 sure that the new government, then a lot of people 0:10:42.840 --> 0:10:45.240 are still getting to know, are really pro business. 0:10:45.480 --> 0:10:50.280 Well, the answer is both. That's a classic politicians answer 0:10:50.360 --> 0:10:54.000 isn't it. But very briefly, the former I found in 0:10:54.040 --> 0:10:57.360 the and we interviewed about two hundred companies, sovereign wealth funds, 0:10:57.400 --> 0:11:00.200 pension funds, et cetera. And the course of review, and 0:11:00.600 --> 0:11:02.720 if I just go through what the obstacles were, and 0:11:02.760 --> 0:11:05.920 then we can decide whether investments some it's going to help. 0:11:06.200 --> 0:11:10.840 First of all, lack of consistency in policy investors, be 0:11:10.920 --> 0:11:14.640 their sovereign wealth funds or indeed companies, they want stability 0:11:14.640 --> 0:11:17.520 of policy and a very reason to believe that a 0:11:17.559 --> 0:11:20.400 new government, hopefully there for four or five years, irrespect 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:22.960 to what parts of the art, will bring some stability. 0:11:23.440 --> 0:11:26.760 But beyond that, we've got a series of obstacles which 0:11:26.800 --> 0:11:30.199 were first of all money. There were pots and challenges 0:11:30.320 --> 0:11:34.400 and funds all over the place. Companies get very frustrated 0:11:34.400 --> 0:11:36.240 by this. What they really want to know is if 0:11:36.240 --> 0:11:38.760 the government's partnering up with me in any way, this 0:11:38.920 --> 0:11:41.200 is what we need, You've done all the due diligence, 0:11:41.280 --> 0:11:43.600 have either got it or I haven't. Then there's a 0:11:43.600 --> 0:11:47.480 whole series of other obstacles, such as connections to the grid, 0:11:47.679 --> 0:11:51.720 planning skills. There's a lot of things like visas, etc. 0:11:52.400 --> 0:11:58.079 So by having a new organization which has been rumored 0:11:58.120 --> 0:12:01.000 to be called invest UK and what it would be called, 0:12:01.160 --> 0:12:04.800 it doesn't really matter. Bringing together all of the different 0:12:04.840 --> 0:12:09.559 groups in government that do this into one unit I 0:12:09.600 --> 0:12:12.640 think would help a lot, providing it has the power 0:12:13.080 --> 0:12:16.080 and the power of the Prime Minister to make sure 0:12:16.120 --> 0:12:20.240 that the whoever runs this as Investment Minister and the 0:12:20.280 --> 0:12:24.160 OFIB behind it has real clout to give an offer 0:12:24.200 --> 0:12:27.520 to a company saying yes, here's a site we've found 0:12:27.600 --> 0:12:30.040 with planning permission for you. It will be connected to 0:12:30.080 --> 0:12:32.640 the grid. If you want visas, you'll get them within 0:12:32.720 --> 0:12:36.640 fourteen days because you're investing so much money. And we're 0:12:36.679 --> 0:12:39.560 going to actually have a skills academy near you because 0:12:39.800 --> 0:12:42.360 we know you'll need thousands of new engineers or whatever 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:42.640 it is. 0:12:42.840 --> 0:12:45.480 Richard, this doesn't sound revolutionary. I mean it's just common sense. 0:12:45.720 --> 0:12:48.880 I'm not a revolutionary person. Well, thank you very much. 0:12:49.360 --> 0:12:52.800 It is common sense. I think the Investment Summit itself 0:12:53.720 --> 0:12:56.560 is it's a different matter. You know, that is a 0:12:56.600 --> 0:13:01.160 great summit, and it's just a good opportuittunity for the 0:13:01.200 --> 0:13:04.440 government to say, actually we accepted the Harrington Review. The 0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:07.760 previous government did it wasn't fully implemented because there was 0:13:07.800 --> 0:13:10.400 a general election. So to give you an example, Jeremy 0:13:10.520 --> 0:13:13.800 Hunt convened a Government Investment Committee, which is all the 0:13:13.840 --> 0:13:17.560 main sectors of states. The first meeting had to be 0:13:17.600 --> 0:13:20.840 canceled because the election was called. I mean, but I 0:13:20.920 --> 0:13:25.720 hope they will say, yes, we accepted in opposition the review. 0:13:26.120 --> 0:13:29.960 We're now formally accepting it, and here's our plans and 0:13:30.000 --> 0:13:32.280 that for example, we're going to have a greatly enhanced 0:13:32.320 --> 0:13:36.400 Office for Investment, which will have instead of reactive powers, 0:13:36.480 --> 0:13:38.840 that is, someone comes to us with a possible investment 0:13:39.120 --> 0:13:42.000 and we scurry around, We're going to spread through our 0:13:42.040 --> 0:13:46.000 trade commissioners all over the world. We're going to identify 0:13:46.280 --> 0:13:49.480 what sectors we want to entice people and companies to 0:13:49.480 --> 0:13:52.160 come here, what we're going to do to help them 0:13:52.600 --> 0:13:55.160 and sort out all of these obstacles for them. Other 0:13:55.240 --> 0:13:57.000 countries do, Other countries do. 0:13:57.080 --> 0:13:59.800 But so what the UK is very good at, is 0:13:59.840 --> 0:14:02.679 it at least meeting number ten is very good at 0:14:02.679 --> 0:14:04.760 meeting with a lot of these chief executives that want 0:14:04.800 --> 0:14:07.640 to invest. I would say people are still trying to 0:14:07.679 --> 0:14:10.480 get to know this government. They don't really one hundred 0:14:10.520 --> 0:14:11.840 percent know what they stand for. 0:14:12.000 --> 0:14:13.920 In this long wait, in what we hear and what 0:14:14.600 --> 0:14:18.479 we've been talking to. Karen Hepca from Bloomboth Radiation's interviewing investors' 0:14:19.440 --> 0:14:21.880 private eputy companies. Everyone is really nervous. 0:14:21.920 --> 0:14:22.080 You know. 0:14:22.120 --> 0:14:24.160 There was a lot of talk before the election, Rachel 0:14:24.160 --> 0:14:26.800 reospend a lot of time in the city saying we 0:14:26.880 --> 0:14:29.920 are pro business. Now there's been this long period for 0:14:29.960 --> 0:14:33.560 the budget, reading headlines about changes to capital gains, carried interest. 0:14:33.920 --> 0:14:36.560 What was this week was about a potential exit tax 0:14:36.600 --> 0:14:38.280 if you wanted to leave. All of this stuff is 0:14:38.320 --> 0:14:42.480 creating a lot of uncertainty in nerves and people saying 0:14:42.720 --> 0:14:44.440 do we really want to invest in Britain? So the 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:48.400 Coman seemed to be creating that uncertainty rather than dealing 0:14:48.400 --> 0:14:48.640 with it. 0:14:48.680 --> 0:14:51.800 Aren't. Well, yes, you're right, and the investment summit is 0:14:51.840 --> 0:14:54.800 a good, very good opportunity that have the right people 0:14:54.800 --> 0:14:58.160 in the room and the right people listening externally to 0:14:58.240 --> 0:15:00.840 say very clear and I'm sure in the ChIL A's speech, 0:15:01.440 --> 0:15:03.160 not that I've seen it, but I'm sure she'll be 0:15:03.200 --> 0:15:08.960 reassuring companies and perspective investors precisely to get over those 0:15:09.080 --> 0:15:12.400 hurdles and it's time that from the investment point of view, 0:15:12.400 --> 0:15:15.640 the government controlled the narrative instead of allowing all these 0:15:15.720 --> 0:15:19.280 rumors to come out. Having said that, you know, investors 0:15:19.280 --> 0:15:22.520 are nervous. Generally, the world's in a difficult position. I'm 0:15:22.560 --> 0:15:25.560 sure other countries. It's not that other countries are brilliant. 0:15:25.600 --> 0:15:28.960 You know, if I if I had five quid for 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:32.760 everyone that told me that they had Macron's mobile on 0:15:32.880 --> 0:15:37.080 speed dial because he'd given it to them at some investment, yeah, 0:15:37.160 --> 0:15:37.520 I don't. 0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:38.880 Actually I'm a little bit disappointed. 0:15:39.600 --> 0:15:43.800 But the truth is, I'm being sarcastic about President Macron, 0:15:43.960 --> 0:15:46.080 but I'm sure he networks very well, but it's the 0:15:46.200 --> 0:15:51.040 delivery that matters. Delivery sounds boring all this organizational stuff, 0:15:51.280 --> 0:15:54.200 but what has happened in the past, We've had it 0:15:54.400 --> 0:15:57.480 very good investment ministers. Take Dominic Johnson, who had the 0:15:57.560 --> 0:16:00.680 job for the last government, who's a very talented salesman. 0:16:01.240 --> 0:16:05.840 That was his professional life as well. They raise expectations 0:16:05.840 --> 0:16:09.000 by doing a really good pitch, but the actual delivery 0:16:09.040 --> 0:16:12.680 behind it was disappointed, disappointing, and that's why the government's 0:16:12.720 --> 0:16:14.160 really trying to get to grips with this. 0:16:14.320 --> 0:16:16.360 I mean you can't be all things to all people. 0:16:16.400 --> 0:16:18.760 So what kind of investors would you want to attract? 0:16:18.880 --> 0:16:23.280 Is it sovereign wealth fund? Is it for private public partnerships? 0:16:23.360 --> 0:16:25.280 Is it infrastructure? 0:16:24.680 --> 0:16:24.720 Like? 0:16:25.360 --> 0:16:28.360 What is this? What is the industrial plan for this country? 0:16:28.440 --> 0:16:31.640 Well, the government, I hope, will also be announcing that 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:35.760 the third, so one string, is the new National Wealth Fund, 0:16:36.240 --> 0:16:39.960 The second is reorganizing the investment part of government, and 0:16:40.000 --> 0:16:43.400 the third is Industrial strategy. And I believe the government 0:16:43.400 --> 0:16:46.200 will be announcing the chairman of the Industrial Strategy Council, 0:16:46.560 --> 0:16:49.760 something which Greg Clark and I set up under Andy Haldane. 0:16:50.440 --> 0:16:53.200 I think it was in twenty sixteen. Unfortunately, for some reason, 0:16:53.240 --> 0:16:56.000 Boris decided to abandon it. But I'm sure they will 0:16:56.000 --> 0:16:58.480 bring this back. They're pledged to do it. And what 0:16:58.560 --> 0:17:01.800 that will do because it's people think oh industrial, that 0:17:01.880 --> 0:17:04.879 means it's sort of banging pots and pans and factories, 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:08.479 But it's a business investment strategy. It's saying, look, we 0:17:08.520 --> 0:17:11.520 are we can't do everything exactly is the point you made, 0:17:11.560 --> 0:17:13.840 because you know we're too small, don't have the money. 0:17:14.040 --> 0:17:17.439 But what we can do is identify as a strategy 0:17:17.840 --> 0:17:21.160 where we think we've got a competitive advantage. For example, 0:17:21.240 --> 0:17:25.600 it might be in in I don't know, wing manufacturer 0:17:25.600 --> 0:17:28.120 for aircraft. We good at that. What do we need 0:17:28.200 --> 0:17:32.080 to do to attract other companies in that field, suppliers 0:17:32.480 --> 0:17:35.080 for the supply chain and everything else. So it sets 0:17:35.080 --> 0:17:38.720 out a strategy for where we can succeed and with 0:17:38.800 --> 0:17:41.280 what resources we have got, what we're going to put 0:17:41.320 --> 0:17:44.920 into it. And then the machinery, which I hope will 0:17:44.920 --> 0:17:46.960 be the beefed up Office for Investment, which I hope 0:17:47.000 --> 0:17:51.560 will be announced, then provides the implementation of that. So 0:17:51.680 --> 0:17:54.840 I think I think the industrial strategy or government investment strategy, 0:17:54.880 --> 0:17:56.920 doesn't matter what it's called, is very important. 0:17:57.200 --> 0:17:59.800 I mean, just in general, I'm sensing a lot of 0:18:00.040 --> 0:18:02.840 timism here that we are going to make progress with 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:05.280 this government on a lot of the things that you 0:18:05.320 --> 0:18:08.760 put in your report that you've recommended, and a sense 0:18:08.800 --> 0:18:13.720 of continuity on the business environment, and that is, you know, 0:18:13.760 --> 0:18:15.480 that's odds with some of some of the nerves that 0:18:15.480 --> 0:18:18.200 we're hearing around the city, like what does the company 0:18:18.240 --> 0:18:20.480 need to do next week to really put to rest 0:18:20.480 --> 0:18:21.400 all of those concerns. 0:18:21.680 --> 0:18:24.360 Growth is the big thing for the government. It's the 0:18:24.400 --> 0:18:28.080 only way for the government to be able to invest 0:18:28.160 --> 0:18:31.119 spend the kind of money they want on public services. 0:18:31.119 --> 0:18:34.040 No secret there. They can't put up taxes much because 0:18:34.040 --> 0:18:36.719 they're very high. It's got to be growth and a 0:18:36.720 --> 0:18:40.000 combination of Jonathan Reynold's the Business Secretary and Rachel Reaves 0:18:40.000 --> 0:18:41.560 the chance too. I've got a lot of time for 0:18:41.600 --> 0:18:45.040 both of them. Makes me optimistic, but they have to 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:49.160 reset the agenda and just a press release say are great, 0:18:49.160 --> 0:18:52.359 we want growth, etc. Investors are sophisticated people. 0:18:52.600 --> 0:18:55.280 You know, they overdid the doom mungering a bit, didn't they. 0:18:55.480 --> 0:18:58.360 They did I've crushed a bit of confidence or yeah. 0:18:58.040 --> 0:18:59.960 I didn't approve of that, but it's exactly what the 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:03.160 coalition did in twenty ten. It's blaming everything on your predecessor, 0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:06.440 isn't it like that? But the reality is now people 0:19:06.440 --> 0:19:09.719 are looking for more than just the superficial messaging. And 0:19:09.840 --> 0:19:13.159 if there are detailed plans for the Wealth Fund, for 0:19:13.280 --> 0:19:17.359 an industrial strategy, and for reorganizing the whole investment area, 0:19:17.800 --> 0:19:21.600 then I think investors will really come back into this country. 0:19:21.880 --> 0:19:23.960 Richard, what about pensions? What would you do with pensions 0:19:24.040 --> 0:19:26.520 and pension reforms? I mean, you know, there's an issue 0:19:26.520 --> 0:19:31.280 that not enough investors, retail investors, but even pensions take 0:19:31.359 --> 0:19:32.040 enough risk. 0:19:32.240 --> 0:19:34.439 You know. I think what Jeremy Hunt started was a 0:19:34.480 --> 0:19:37.560 good thing in the mansion House compact. But in the end, 0:19:37.600 --> 0:19:40.600 the only way pension funds are going to invest here 0:19:40.760 --> 0:19:44.000 more of their money is by having tax breaks on 0:19:44.040 --> 0:19:47.560 investing in UK companies. And I think that's quite a 0:19:47.640 --> 0:19:52.960 legitimate tool for countries to do. Other countries do it. 0:19:53.000 --> 0:19:55.040 There's slightly more carrot than stick in a way, is it. 0:19:55.640 --> 0:19:57.720 Well, you can try the stick, but in the end 0:19:58.119 --> 0:20:00.000 they look at the numbers and if there's a big 0:20:00.080 --> 0:20:03.520 advantage for them for investing in UK companies, they won't 0:20:03.520 --> 0:20:06.480 do it out of philanthropy or charity because they've got 0:20:06.480 --> 0:20:09.919 the fiduciary duty to their beneficiaries that people that have 0:20:10.000 --> 0:20:13.520 the pensions. So I would strongly incent them to do that. 0:20:14.240 --> 0:20:17.440 But I also think I again I have a bit 0:20:17.520 --> 0:20:20.840 of a plug for myself. But when I was Pensions Minister, 0:20:20.920 --> 0:20:23.480