Speaker 1: Happy New Year, everybody, Happy new Year, Catherine.
Speaker 2: Happy Tuesday.
Speaker 3: It's a new year.
Speaker 1: Twenty twenty four is over, twenty twenty five is here.
Speaker 3: Let's get queer, let's get used to it.
Speaker 4: Let's please do.
Speaker 1: Also, we are now airing what are we doing on
Speaker 1: YouTube now, Catherine?
Speaker 3: Airing our full episodes or.
Speaker 2: Yes, we have full episodes available on YouTube as well
Speaker 2: as some older episodes that we're putting out now. So
Speaker 2: check for the weekly episode. They go up on Thursdays,
Speaker 2: just like the podcast, and you know we're throwing an
Speaker 2: extra old episode, okay, Fani, Great, well, great.
Speaker 3: Okay, yes.
Speaker 1: People ask all the time where they can watch the podcast,
Speaker 1: so now you can watch it and it's the full episodes,
Speaker 1: right Catherine.
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, oh great, this is awesome.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're gonna love it. And you have a book
Speaker 2: coming out.
Speaker 3: I'm coming out. I'll have what she's having ready for
Speaker 3: pre order.
Speaker 1: Comes out of my fiftieth birthday, Everybody February twenty fifth,
Speaker 1: and you can also watch me on E on January
Speaker 1: twelfth for the Critics' Choice Awards. I'm hosting again, so
Speaker 1: I will be doing that. Then on February twenty fifth,
Speaker 1: my book will be coming out and then I have
Speaker 1: another surprise in March.
Speaker 3: So many surprises, I know, so many. I'm excited about
Speaker 3: the New Year. I'm excited. Do you have goals set resolution?
Speaker 4: No?
Speaker 3: No, we come on, Catherine. I don't have time for
Speaker 3: reading that bullshit.
Speaker 1: No, but we do have a very very special, motivational
Speaker 1: New Year's guest who everyone is gonna love because she's
Speaker 1: all over the place right now with her new book.
Speaker 1: She's an author, she is a mind set coach and
Speaker 1: host of one of the most listened to podcasts in
Speaker 1: the world. Please welcome Mel Robbins. We have Mel Robbins
Speaker 1: here today, you guys, which is I've ingested all of
Speaker 1: Mel Robbins. I don't think there's a thing about you
Speaker 1: that I don't.
Speaker 4: Know, and you still invited me.
Speaker 3: I know, I know. It's a lot.
Speaker 1: It's kind of like when people drown themselves in information
Speaker 1: about me. I always seem like I'm so sorry and
Speaker 1: I ran and they're like, I've read everything, I've looked
Speaker 1: at everything, I'm so prepared for this interview, and I'm
Speaker 1: always like, I'm really so that you had to listen
Speaker 1: to all that, which is exactly what you said to me.
Speaker 1: When I ran into you the other day at some
Speaker 1: podcasts we were both doing. You were like, I'm so sorry.
Speaker 1: It was Mel Robbins week at my house. So we
Speaker 1: are educated because I knew of you from social media.
Speaker 1: But then when I read your story in your new book,
Speaker 1: The Let Them Theory, I like that you also come
Speaker 1: up with your own theories.
Speaker 3: I love that you talk in the beginning of the book.
Speaker 1: About your story, which is incredible, that you were eight
Speaker 1: hundred thousand dollars in debt and you.
Speaker 3: Were at the end of your rope, uh huh, and
Speaker 3: you had no.
Speaker 1: Idea how you were going to pay, and you had
Speaker 1: four children, and you had no idea how you were
Speaker 1: going to pay your finances, and you guys were broke.
Speaker 4: And I was also fucking furious with my husband because
Speaker 4: I thought it was his fault.
Speaker 3: Of course, and it's always everyone else's fault.
Speaker 1: And then you decided one day that you used to
Speaker 1: start practicing five four three two one.
Speaker 4: Yes. Well, the story is that I was having this
Speaker 4: moment if you've ever had a moment in your life,
Speaker 4: and I know you have, which is why we like
Speaker 4: each other, where you literally find yourself talking to yourself
Speaker 4: out loud, and you're saying, that's it. No more drinking.
Speaker 4: I'm not going to be bitch to everybody. I gotta
Speaker 4: find a job. I got to get in shape, I
Speaker 4: got to tell people what's going on. I got to
Speaker 4: take responsibility for my life. And by God, melt when
Speaker 4: that alarm rings tomorrow morning, you cannot lay there like
Speaker 4: a human pot roast, marinating in your problems. You got
Speaker 4: to get your ass out of bed and get those
Speaker 4: kids on the bus. And at that moment, I swear
Speaker 4: to God, a rocket ship launched across a television screen
Speaker 4: at the end of a commercial, and I thought, that's it.
Speaker 4: That's the answer. Tomorrow morning, when that alarm rings, I'm
Speaker 4: going to rocket myself out of bed so fast. I'm
Speaker 4: not going to be in that bed when that anxiety hits.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 4: I had had four Bourbon Manhattans that night, so it
Speaker 4: could have been the alcohol that gave me that idea,
Speaker 4: because I was drinking an awful lot back then. But
Speaker 4: that was the moment that changed my life because the
Speaker 4: very next morning, the alarm ring. And what's interesting about life?
Speaker 4: And when I show you this, you will never unsee it.
Speaker 4: And it's not my breasts, which you definitely don't want
Speaker 4: to see right now, but we'll get a picture. We'll
Speaker 4: get a picture of those. But there is this moment
Speaker 4: that defines your whole life, and it's this five second window.
Speaker 4: And it's the moment between knowing what you need to
Speaker 4: do and actually doing it. And we make a critical
Speaker 4: mistake where you know the thing that you need to do,
Speaker 4: but instead of doing it, you stop and consider how
Speaker 4: you feel about it. It's this moment of hesitation. And
Speaker 4: as soon as you drift from knowing what you need
Speaker 4: to do to thinking about whether or not you feel
Speaker 4: like doing it, in that five second moment of hesitation
Speaker 4: comes the doubt and the anxiety and the procrastination. And
Speaker 4: what's happening in your brain I didn't know this at
Speaker 4: the time, is that you're moving from being conscious to
Speaker 4: switching into the default mode in your brain where your
Speaker 4: patterns and habits take over. And I had a habit
Speaker 4: of avoidance, AD a habit of blaming. I had a
Speaker 4: habit of anger. I had a habit of hitting the
Speaker 4: snooze button over and over and over again.
Speaker 3: Like kind of like a victim mentality percent because.
Speaker 4: My problems felt so overwhelming that My response was to freeze,
Speaker 4: and I didn't think anything that I was going to
Speaker 4: do is going to matter, So why I do it? Right?
Speaker 4: And that's what I find is a massive challenge for
Speaker 4: most of us, that we all know the little things
Speaker 4: that we could be doing that would make us a
Speaker 4: little happier, healthier, Right.
Speaker 1: Right, that seemed like an uphill, almost insurmountable to even
Speaker 1: get there.
Speaker 3: But they're not insurmountable.
Speaker 4: They're not insurmountable. But if you have the opinion, well,
Speaker 4: why does it matter? Because in that moment when the
Speaker 4: alarm ring and I remembered the rocket launch, and this
Speaker 4: window of hesitation opened, and I go, I don't feel
Speaker 4: like any out of it. It's dark, it's cold, it's
Speaker 4: February in Boston. We're eight hundred thousand dollars in debt.
Speaker 4: How is this going to help? And for whatever reason,
Speaker 4: I just started counting backwards, just like NASA does, five four, three,
Speaker 4: two one, and I stood up and it was bizarre.
Speaker 4: And that was the first morning that I had gotten
Speaker 4: out of bed when the alarm rang in months, And
Speaker 4: so I went on with my day the next morning,
Speaker 4: same thing. Now, what were you.
Speaker 3: Doing before that?
Speaker 1: You would just your alarm would go off and you
Speaker 1: would just sit in bed and lie.
Speaker 4: I would rot in bed like most people and literally
Speaker 4: over your pocket. I mean, if you think about those
Speaker 4: moments where you wake up and you either hate your job,
Speaker 4: or you're in a crappy relationship, or you're not happy,
Speaker 4: or you're struggling with something. You wake up and you
Speaker 4: don't want to face a day. And so instead of
Speaker 4: facing the day, which would help, because once you get
Speaker 4: up you can keep going, typically I would lay there
Speaker 4: and as I would lay there and stare at the ceiling,
Speaker 4: and that feeling of dread would come over my body.
Speaker 4: My mind would then take over and start racing through
Speaker 4: all the problems that were going on, and they just
Speaker 4: started stacking up like a gravity blanket, pinning me there.
Speaker 4: And then when you feel that you don't want to
Speaker 4: wake up, what you want to do is avoid the day.
Speaker 4: And so I would hit the snoozee and to try
Speaker 4: to fall back asleep because I'm hoping that I'm just
Speaker 4: waking up in a nightmare. This isn't actually my life.
Speaker 4: And then ultimately it would get to the point where
Speaker 4: the kids are standing next to me and the bus
Speaker 4: is already gone. And now I'm like, Okay, here we
Speaker 4: go again. And it's stunning how the smallest things can
Speaker 4: feel impossible in life, impossible. And what I know now
Speaker 4: is there's so much that explains why we're wired this way.
Speaker 4: But I didn't know any of this then. I just
Speaker 4: knew that my life was falling apart, and everything that
Speaker 4: I cared about was circling the drain, and there was
Speaker 4: absolutely nothing I was doing.
Speaker 3: That was helping.
Speaker 4: And yet I knew the little things that could help.
Speaker 4: I mean, obviously, if you don't have any money and
Speaker 4: you can barely put food on the table, you should
Speaker 4: get a job. Right. If you are drinking every night
Speaker 4: and then waking up with a hangover, it's not helping
Speaker 4: you face the stuff. And so avoids became a chronic
Speaker 4: habit for me, and this one little tool five four
Speaker 4: three two one, and pushing through this sort of insight
Speaker 4: that oh my god, there's a window of time between
Speaker 4: knowing what you need to do and then your brain
Speaker 4: killing your motivation to do it. And if you act
Speaker 4: in that window, whether it's speaking up at work or
Speaker 4: starting the hard conversation or getting your ass up off
Speaker 4: the couch, and or.
Speaker 1: An example, you use in the book is like, you know,
Speaker 1: someone asking you to dance and it being a great idea,
Speaker 1: but then you think about it and you're like, do
Speaker 1: I want to be.
Speaker 3: Dancing in front of all these people? Do I actually
Speaker 3: want to get up and dance? Yeah?
Speaker 1: And in that five seconds you lose your mojo when
Speaker 1: you could have been dancing this whole time and having
Speaker 1: a good time. Yes.
Speaker 4: And so you know, one of the things that I
Speaker 4: point out that I love to point out when I'm
Speaker 4: teaching this is if you think about the most famous
Speaker 4: tagline in the world, just do it right? Those three
Speaker 4: words right, just do it? What's the most powerful ward?
Speaker 5: Do?
Speaker 4: No, it's not it, It's just it's just I'm gonna
Speaker 4: explain why if Nike's tadline had been do it, that's
Speaker 4: not that inspiring. The word just acknowledges both your humanity
Speaker 4: and your potential. See, they're calling you from the sideline
Speaker 4: and inviting you to join in the game of life.
Speaker 4: They're saying, I see you there, I see that you
Speaker 4: want this, and I see you doubting yourself. I see
Speaker 4: you questioning yourself. They're acknowledging the only thing that is
Speaker 4: stopping you and it's that moment of hesitation where you
Speaker 4: stop and think and you question yourself. And that was
Speaker 4: my whole life. And so discovering this little tool five
Speaker 4: four three two one both acknowledge the just you're hesitating,
Speaker 4: and it became a tool that helped me push through
Speaker 4: anxiety or fear, or procrastination or old habits to do
Speaker 4: the little things that actually are everything, HM, just one
Speaker 4: small move at a time.
Speaker 1: And so then this led to you getting and realizing
Speaker 1: that you wanted to be a motivational speaker, right and
Speaker 1: within that when you're talking about the little steps you
Speaker 1: have to take in order to succeed and build a
Speaker 1: life that you want. Yeah, you were motivationally speaking without
Speaker 1: getting paid in the beginning.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So what happened is I used the five second
Speaker 4: role to turn my life back on track over the
Speaker 4: course of three years. And so I am in my
Speaker 4: life outside of Boston five for three two one networking
Speaker 4: until I get a job five worth three two one
Speaker 4: finding a second job five or three two one, going
Speaker 4: for walks like just one move one move on move
Speaker 4: in complete survival mode, like I'm trying to pay bills,
Speaker 4: I'm trying to get these kids to school. I am
Speaker 4: trying to keep my marriage on track. I'm trying not
Speaker 4: to be a raging bitch to everybody. I'm trying not
Speaker 4: to drink myself into the ground, one move, one move,
Speaker 4: one move at a time. And so I had never
Speaker 4: told anybody about it, because, first of all, sounds stupid.
Speaker 4: Oh Chelsea, you want to change your life? Count to five,
Speaker 4: I'm out. Podcast interviews over. And I also had no
Speaker 4: idea why it worked. I almost felt like I'd been
Speaker 4: given this little magic trick. Maybe I was a witch,
Speaker 4: Maybe there was some sort of spell I had learned.
Speaker 4: And I get a call from somebody that I had
Speaker 4: gone to college with and she's like, hey, now there's
Speaker 4: this event happening in San Francisco and they are offering
Speaker 4: two tickets to San Francisco and two nights at the
Speaker 4: Saint Regis And all you got to do is talk
Speaker 4: about career change. And you've changed your career so many times.
Speaker 4: I thought of you. Now, I don't think that's a compliment,
Speaker 4: But when you hear that you're eight hundred thousand dollars
Speaker 4: in debt and you've got leans on your house, that
Speaker 4: sounds like a vacation. Chelsey. So I'm like, I'll do it.
Speaker 4: I had no idea what ted was. I had no
Speaker 4: idea what ted X was. So I show up in
Speaker 4: San Francisco and it's one of the first ever TEDx conferences.
Speaker 4: It's not even registering that I'm going to walk on
Speaker 4: a stage and there's going to be seven hundred people there,
Speaker 4: and so they didn't really prepare you. You got nineteen minutes.
Speaker 4: I had a cheesy slide deck. If you watch my
Speaker 4: TEDx talk, you're witnessing a twenty one minute long panic attack.
Speaker 4: Look closely at minute one and you'll see a crash.
Speaker 4: That is the kind of rash people get when they
Speaker 4: are drinking. And I'm darting around the stage.
Speaker 3: I sho watch this. This is the one where Chris
Speaker 3: is in the audience or is that a separate ted talk.
Speaker 4: Oh no, that's the one.
Speaker 3: That's the one.
Speaker 4: And I'm darting in and out all over the place.
Speaker 4: And I wasn't planning on talking about the five second roll.
Speaker 4: I forgot how to end the speech.
Speaker 1: I remember that you were like, oh wait, I have
Speaker 1: one more thing to tell you at the end, and
Speaker 1: You're like, which, yes, why I'm fucking here In the
Speaker 1: first place.
Speaker 4: Yes, and then the part that you didn't see, because
Speaker 4: I ultimately had to write to them. I was so
Speaker 4: disassociated at the end, I barely remember it, Like, as
Speaker 4: I'm if I watched that video, I'm like, I don't
Speaker 4: even remember being on that stage. And at the very
Speaker 4: end after I say that, oh yeah, I'm like, oh,
Speaker 4: and if you have any questions, here's my email address.
Speaker 4: And I walk off the stage and I say to
Speaker 4: my husband, Honest to God, thank God, that's over. Thank God.
Speaker 4: Only those people saw that. This was the worst moment
Speaker 4: in my life. And I went on with my life.
Speaker 4: A year goes by and Tedex puts it online. I
Speaker 4: don't even know it's online. Another years goes by and
Speaker 4: it starts to go viral, and I start getting messages
Speaker 4: at that email address and people are like, I saw
Speaker 4: that thing. You didn't. I'm like, were you in the audience?
Speaker 4: Like no, no, no, it's online. And so I would stay
Speaker 4: up at night responding to emails from strangers because I
Speaker 4: was so blown away that this little thing that I
Speaker 4: invented was helping people stay sober, or helping them lose
Speaker 4: one hundred pounds, or helping them change jobs. Because it's
Speaker 4: a tool that helps you go from thinking about something
Speaker 4: to doing it well.
Speaker 1: Also, it's also it would be elementary if it was
Speaker 1: just five four three two one Get up. What you're
Speaker 1: explaining is that if you miss that little window, you're
Speaker 1: missing your day, you're missing your goals, you're missing your dreams.
Speaker 1: So it's what your brain does, and that's an integral
Speaker 1: part of it.
Speaker 4: Yes, And so then what happened is people started to
Speaker 4: write and ask if I would come, like do that
Speaker 4: talk at events. Now, Meanwhile, I'm a normal person. I
Speaker 4: think celebrities like you are people that get paid to
Speaker 4: do this. People have books, people that you know, have
Speaker 4: a have some sort of thing to say and have
Speaker 4: credentials to talk about this stuff. Like, I'm basically somebody
Speaker 4: who's fucked up her life and I figured out a
Speaker 4: simple thing to help me crawl out of the hole
Speaker 4: that I had dug for myself and then fallen into.
Speaker 4: And so I didn't even think that I would get
Speaker 4: paid to do something like this. So I show up
Speaker 4: at seven of different events. And here's the irony. They
Speaker 4: were all women's events. So they're all women's empowerment events,
Speaker 4: and I'm speaking for free, and I will never forget this.
Speaker 4: I was at the Pennsylvania Women's Conference, and this would
Speaker 4: have been probably two thousand and thirteen or late twenty twelve,
Speaker 4: and I was in a room and the rooms are
Speaker 4: starting to get a little bit bigger, and so they're
Speaker 4: probably I don't know, seven hundred thousand people in there.
Speaker 4: And this woman comes up to me afterwards, Honest to god,
Speaker 4: she says, Mel, do you mind if I ask you
Speaker 4: a question? I said, yeah, absolutely, And she says, you know,
Speaker 4: I spoke this morning at another breakout session and I
Speaker 4: just thought you were absolutely fan fantastic. But I was
Speaker 4: just curious, have you gotten your check yet? I said, check,
Speaker 4: you got paid for this? And she took a step
Speaker 4: back and she went, oh my god, I just assumed.
Speaker 4: I mean, you have a big breakout where I'm like,
Speaker 4: you got paid for this.
Speaker 6: Now.
Speaker 4: Meanwhile, I'm still have leans on my house and I'm thinking.
Speaker 3: I could make money doing this.
Speaker 4: And I thought, you are you are the world's biggest idiot, Mel.
Speaker 4: And then I had a problem because I had no
Speaker 4: idea what to charge because I don't have a book,
Speaker 4: I don't have this, I don't have anything. I have
Speaker 4: this ted talk and I'm now starting to understand the
Speaker 4: value of it, because it is really like a credential
Speaker 4: when it comes to keynote speaking. And so I came
Speaker 4: up with this little thing that anybody starting a business
Speaker 4: should steal. I basically said to myself, I'm going to
Speaker 4: use the five second world to stop myself, because you
Speaker 4: can use five four three two one to push yourself
Speaker 4: forward or five four three two one to put yourself
Speaker 4: in pause. And the next time somebody calls me and
Speaker 4: they asked me if I'm available, I'm going to five
Speaker 4: or ThReD you want I pause, and I say, yeah,
Speaker 4: I think I could make it. And then I'm going
Speaker 4: to say what's your budget? And then I'm going to
Speaker 4: say five four three two one normally am double because
Speaker 4: I didn't know what to charge right. So a couple
Speaker 4: of weeks later, I get a call and it's from
Speaker 4: a guy who's in Dallas. Then he's calling me to
Speaker 4: see if I can come down and give a speech
Speaker 4: at some big event where there's going to be a
Speaker 4: bunch of people that are small business owners in it.
Speaker 4: And I said, great, I think I'm available. How much
Speaker 4: is it? He said, ten thousand dollars. I dropped the
Speaker 4: fucking phone. I that was like almost four months of
Speaker 4: my mortgage.
Speaker 5: Wow.
Speaker 4: I had no idea. I was expecting five hundred dollars
Speaker 4: and I pick up the phone. I forgot the second
Speaker 4: part about doubling the thing, and I'm like, yes, yes, yes, yes,
Speaker 4: And then a really important thing happened. I was so
Speaker 4: nerve and I felt so unworthy of that amount of
Speaker 4: money that I spent half of it with a graphic
Speaker 4: designer because I figured if I had a fancy presentation
Speaker 4: that that would make me seem fancy enough for that
Speaker 4: kind of money. And the nerves were really important, and
Speaker 4: the preparation was important because there are moments in your life,
Speaker 4: these at bat moments where you step up to the
Speaker 4: plate that you want to meet the moment. And because
Speaker 4: I prepared, I stepped onto that stage and I destroyed it.
Speaker 4: And he came up to me afterwards and he was like,
Speaker 4: I have been in this business twenty years. You are
Speaker 4: the single best female speaker I've ever seen in my life,
Speaker 4: and your top three of all time period. Who runs
Speaker 4: your business? And I was like, you do and he
Speaker 4: has run my business ever since. Oh wow, in terms
Speaker 4: of the speaking side of the business. And that next year,
Speaker 4: forty seven speeches, the next year ninety nine speeches. The
Speaker 4: next year was like one hundred and seventeen. And you know,
Speaker 4: I was so committed to paying off our debt and
Speaker 4: to paying our savings back. And because we had gotten
Speaker 4: into that hole because when my husband went into the
Speaker 4: restaurant business, when the first pizza joint was successful, we
Speaker 4: were complete idiots. We cashed everything out, We took out
Speaker 4: credit cards, a home equity line. We you know, what
Speaker 4: could possibly go wrong, and everything went wrong. And so
Speaker 4: when the business started to do this everything that we
Speaker 4: had worked our whole lives for, I was forty one
Speaker 4: years old. Three kids under the age of ten started
Speaker 4: going down in the dream too. And you know, if
Speaker 4: you're somebody that believes in manifesting, which I do, I
Speaker 4: never made a vision board that was like divorce, alcoholism,
Speaker 4: bankruptcy that was in part of the plan. And when
Speaker 4: things go off the rails in your life, it's funny,
Speaker 4: like it's super easy to give other people advice because
Speaker 4: it's not personal, but when it's you and it's the
Speaker 4: things that you're scared of or the things that you
Speaker 4: care about that are breaking apart in front of your eyes.
Speaker 4: You have a very hard time believing that these simple
Speaker 4: things actually work for you. And so what the five
Speaker 4: second rule taught me is it taught me that there
Speaker 4: is a skill that we can all develop, and it's
Speaker 4: a skill of being able to act in spite of
Speaker 4: your feelings, being able to recognize when you're afraid, or
Speaker 4: you're hesitating, or you're doubting yourself, and to either push
Speaker 4: through it or rise above it, but to allow your
Speaker 4: values or your goals or the thing that you really
Speaker 4: want to be driving your actions versus feeling held hostage
Speaker 4: by your emotions in the moment. Because motivations complete garbage
Speaker 4: in my opinion, because it's not there when you need it.
Speaker 4: And if motivation were available to us all at any time,
Speaker 4: we would all have millions of dollars and six pack
Speaker 4: abs and billion dollar businesses, and that would be that
Speaker 4: motivation simply means you feel like doing something thing. And
Speaker 4: what I've now learned, both through the experts that we
Speaker 4: have on my podcast and all the research that I've
Speaker 4: done for this book in particular, is that our brains
Speaker 4: are wired to move towards what's easy, and when you're struggling,
Speaker 4: like I was, struggling, it's easy to stand bed. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and your brain is wired to push against and move
Speaker 4: away from whatever feels hard, which sets up a problem.
Speaker 4: And the problem is changing is hard, and so you're
Speaker 4: never going to feel like it, but you can do
Speaker 4: it anyway. And recognizing that it's going to be hard
Speaker 4: and recognizing that you're going to feel resistance, that's just
Speaker 4: part of the natural wiring your body. Recognizing that, and
Speaker 4: then knowing it's a skill to go, Okay, this is
Speaker 4: going to be hard. Fuck it, I'm going And that's
Speaker 4: what my success is about. Like, my success literally boils
Speaker 4: down to the fact that I get out of bed
Speaker 4: on the days I don't feel like it, and every
Speaker 4: day I do the grueling, tedious, annoying crap that leads
Speaker 4: to incredible things over time.
Speaker 1: Well, right, and I think the productivity that gets more
Speaker 1: productivity Once you do get yourself out of that spot
Speaker 1: and you start to like work towards what you want
Speaker 1: to achieve, then that starts to become more of a habit, right,
Speaker 1: And you're so you're getting yourself out of one bad
Speaker 1: habit and leading yourself to better habits that are gonna I.
Speaker 4: Mean, there's lots of ways, I still screw things up.
Speaker 1: Well, we always, I mean, that's exactly like, I'm always like, okay, positivity, optimism,
Speaker 1: and in the last two weeks I'm like, get the
Speaker 1: fuck out of my face to anybody, you know, like,
Speaker 1: leave me alone, don't ask me to do one more thing.
Speaker 1: I'm at the end of my rope. I'm like, I
Speaker 1: want to be euthanized. I said that to my sister
Speaker 1: O that she goes, well, at least you're voicing it,
Speaker 1: because if you really wanted to euthanize yourself, you do
Speaker 1: just do it. She's like, so, I know you're full
Speaker 1: of shit. Anyway, I've been giving out your advice. When
Speaker 1: yesterday we're on a podcast, I was like, listen, you
Speaker 1: need to just follow the let them theory. But it
Speaker 1: was too it was two call because we have live callers.
Speaker 1: Your most recent book. That's just that just came out right,
Speaker 1: This is just out. Yeah, they'll let them theory. Is
Speaker 1: it three children you have for four?
Speaker 4: Three?
Speaker 3: Oh? Sorry, I said dogs and cage.
Speaker 4: Okay, you didn't chouragize who cares?
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, maybe there is another one. Maybe maybe you
Speaker 1: have another sibling you haven't met yet.
Speaker 4: That's why we won't do twenty three and eight. I
Speaker 4: don't want I'm already paying for everybody like that, I
Speaker 4: that I that I've created, so I don't need any hang.
Speaker 3: I'm sure some extras.
Speaker 1: They let them theory also would seem pretty basic, but
Speaker 1: it's not basic for all of us. It's like letting
Speaker 1: people do their things that really have nothing to do
Speaker 1: with you. Letting go of control basically is like allowing people.
Speaker 1: If someone wants to be an asshole, if someone wants
Speaker 1: to be in a bad mood, if your kid doesn't
Speaker 1: want to go to a party with you, let them,
Speaker 1: let them stay home. Let that person be in a
Speaker 1: bad mood, don't try to tinker with their mood to
Speaker 1: make it what you want.
Speaker 3: It to be.
Speaker 1: Yes, which is advice that obviously everyone can use, and
Speaker 1: which is advice. I'm very excited you're here today because
Speaker 1: we have people who call in for advice, and it's
Speaker 1: nice to have another sister to Leno. So we're going
Speaker 1: to take a break and we'll be right back with
Speaker 1: Mel Robbins. And we're back with Mel Robbins and her
Speaker 1: new book, which is called The Let Them Theory.
Speaker 3: You guys need to pick this up.
Speaker 1: It's a great read, and I think there's a lot
Speaker 1: of common allies.
Speaker 3: And you mentioned this within the book.
Speaker 1: You talk a lot about Buddhism or stoicism or letting go,
Speaker 1: and well, hold.
Speaker 4: On a second, let me say something about this. I
Speaker 4: don't believe in letting go.
Speaker 3: You don't, God, no, oh, I do oh.
Speaker 4: I don't let me tell you.
Speaker 3: About like the let them theory and letting go are similar.
Speaker 4: Not at all.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 4: See, I've never been able to let anything go because
Speaker 4: I'm competitive as hell, and when somebody says, mel just
Speaker 4: let it go, that to me means admit defeat and
Speaker 4: move on. And I don't like to let something go
Speaker 4: or feel like I have to just give up because
Speaker 4: it's out of my hands, and so I've never been
Speaker 4: able to access that. To me, me, let them is
Speaker 4: very different because when you say let them, you're seeing
Speaker 4: what somebody is doing and you're allowing it without allowing it.
Speaker 4: And when I say let it go, I feel defeated.
Speaker 4: When I say let them, I feel superior. And so
Speaker 4: it's this tool that allows me to not only detach,
Speaker 4: but it allows me to feel in control and superior
Speaker 4: to the things that are irritating me, or that are
Speaker 4: worrying me, or that have hurt me. And so I
Speaker 4: feel it is very different in terms of the emotional
Speaker 4: experience and the psychological experience.
Speaker 1: I feel like letting go of things isn't about giving
Speaker 1: up or defeatism.
Speaker 3: Like I feel like.
Speaker 1: When you can let go of something, it is very
Speaker 1: analogous to what you're saying. You're kind of rising above it.
Speaker 1: You're not giving into it. You're going let that go.
Speaker 3: That's not for me.
Speaker 1: I don't not I'm giving it away or I'm giving up.
Speaker 1: It's almost like that's not my business either, let that go,
Speaker 1: Let my grudge against this person go, let that go.
Speaker 3: I feel like it is very similar.
Speaker 1: But you are the author and it doesn't work for you,
Speaker 1: so we'll agree to disagree on that. But all of
Speaker 1: these are modes and ways to not focus on what
Speaker 1: other people are doing and to focus on yourself and
Speaker 1: the things that you can control.
Speaker 4: And here's the reason why this matters. The reason why
Speaker 4: this matters is because you have no idea how much
Speaker 4: time and energy you are wasting yeah on things that
Speaker 4: either don't matter or that you will never be able
Speaker 4: to control. If you feel tired or overwhelmed, or you
Speaker 4: feel like you're last on your list, or you're just
Speaker 4: not as happy as you would like to be in
Speaker 4: your life. I'm going to tell you right now, the
Speaker 4: problem isn't really you. The problem is you're unknowingly giving
Speaker 4: so much power to other people, and that's what's draining you,
Speaker 4: and that's why you have no time. And one of
Speaker 4: the enormous benefits of learning how to use the let
Speaker 4: them theory, both in relationships and in your day to
Speaker 4: day life is it's the ultimate boundary between you and
Speaker 4: the world because you get to choose when you say
Speaker 4: let them what actually impacts you and what doesn't. And
Speaker 4: what I was stunned by when I started using this
Speaker 4: thing is I could not believe, first of all, how
Speaker 4: many times I said it. So I must have a
Speaker 4: lot of anger issues because I was in travel let them.
Speaker 4: I'm at the cash registerance you want, let them. I
Speaker 4: walk in the front door and my dog is barfed
Speaker 4: right on the entry and my husband's somebody hasn't picked
Speaker 4: it up. It let them, And it was like this
Speaker 4: little lever that allowed me to go from not stressed
Speaker 4: and on edge and kind of annoyed, but actually just
Speaker 4: stay peaceful and unbothered. And when you can go through
Speaker 4: life like that, you get your time back and you
Speaker 4: get energy back, and that's time and energy that you
Speaker 4: can pour into other things. And your whole experience of
Speaker 4: life is determined by what you pour time and energy into,
Speaker 4: and so it shifts absolutely everything.
Speaker 1: Okay, great, I'm excited to take some collergies. Yeah, we
Speaker 1: have What do we have first for Mel?
Speaker 2: Well, let's start with Katie, She writes, Dear Chelsea, I
Speaker 2: don't really know how to write a fun, kitschy greeting
Speaker 2: with the current political climate, so I'm just gonna get
Speaker 2: right down.
Speaker 1: I really forget about the politics when we're doing this podcast.
Speaker 3: It's such a nice reprieve. I forget what's happening.
Speaker 4: I know.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry to remind you.
Speaker 3: I would appreciate not getting any letters like this.
Speaker 2: But I saw you address this Mel and so with
Speaker 2: let them theory, and so I thought this was a
Speaker 2: good question for you. I'm a thirty four year old
Speaker 2: white liberal female with she her pronouns that was very
Speaker 2: unfortunately born and raised in a red state. I've always
Speaker 2: viewed myself as a positive and understanding person that accepts
Speaker 2: people's differences. It's a beautiful thing as long as we're
Speaker 2: all treating each other with love and kindness. But with
Speaker 2: over half the country voting and electing such an openly
Speaker 2: hateful and dangerous human being, I'm really struggling to find
Speaker 2: any positivity in my day to day life. I've gone
Speaker 2: to great lengths to build the community around me and
Speaker 2: to be supportive and safe for all people. But since
Speaker 2: announcing the new president elect, I have covered that a
Speaker 2: disgusting amount of my friends, family, and coworkers are actually
Speaker 2: celebrating his impending presidency. I've been crying, screaming, and raging
Speaker 2: about this for days, and I do not foresee any relief,
Speaker 2: as I have suddenly found myself surrounded by hate and
Speaker 2: without any hope for a better future. My community has
Speaker 2: been dismantled, Our democracy, our very basic human rights and
Speaker 2: bodily autonomy are at risk. And there's a very big
Speaker 2: part of me that just wants to light a match
Speaker 2: and watch the world burn. How do I, yeah, how
Speaker 2: do I let go of this rage so I can
Speaker 2: move forward and try to find a light at the
Speaker 2: end of the tunnel. I do not want to let
Speaker 2: this evil man turn me into a hateful and intolerant
Speaker 2: person at rock bottom, Katie.
Speaker 3: Mal why why don't you take the lead on this.
Speaker 3: I'd love to go for it.
Speaker 4: I'd love to There was a particular line in there
Speaker 4: that struck me. Can I see that absolutely?
Speaker 6: Here?
Speaker 4: It is I've suddenly found myself surrounded by hate and
Speaker 4: without any hope for a better future. That was the
Speaker 4: line that hit me the most, without any hope for
Speaker 4: a few And the reason why that line hit me
Speaker 4: is because this illustrates the problem with giving power to
Speaker 4: other people. Why on earth would you put all of
Speaker 4: the power for a better future in the hands of
Speaker 4: one idiot who's running this country? And how dare any
Speaker 4: of us forget the power that we have to make
Speaker 4: an enormous difference no matter what the hell is going
Speaker 4: on in our families and our communities, in our schools
Speaker 4: and our relationships. You know what I can't stand is
Speaker 4: that when I think about relationships, I see a spider web.
Speaker 4: And when you're out in the morning walking the dew
Speaker 4: hits the spider web. Right. That means we're all interconnected,
Speaker 4: and we allow one person who has a narcissistic personality
Speaker 4: or toxic behavior or a challenging demeanor or really bigoted
Speaker 4: opinions to go in and tap tap tap that spider
Speaker 4: web and impact all of us. I believe something different.
Speaker 4: I believe that the person that is calm and peaceful
Speaker 4: and rational and connected has more power than that person,
Speaker 4: and it's time we all start using it. And so
Speaker 4: it is appropriate to feel your emotions and let those
Speaker 4: emotions come up. And the reason why you're writing I
Speaker 4: want to acknowledge is important because you now understand that
Speaker 4: those emotions that are very mentally healthy response to what's
Speaker 4: happening around you. By the way, those emotions mean you're
Speaker 4: working well. It means your mind and your body are
Speaker 4: working the way that it should. So that's great, and
Speaker 4: you're writing for help because you also know something else.
Speaker 4: You don't want any other person, whether it's your family
Speaker 4: members or the people that just got elected, or what
Speaker 4: is going on anywhere around you, to impact your mental health.
Speaker 4: And here's what I'm going to say. They don't have to.
Speaker 4: And the reason why you have to say let them
Speaker 4: is because the election's over and the people that you
Speaker 4: care about have opinions that you do not understand and
Speaker 4: arguing with them. We know, based on research just turns
Speaker 4: off the part of the brain that has anybody hear anything,
Speaker 4: And so being in conflict with people doesn't change them.
Speaker 4: It actually creates more resistance to hearing you or to
Speaker 4: changing themselves. And so when you say let them, you're
Speaker 4: not agreeing with anything. You're not allowing anybody to trample
Speaker 4: you or your right and you're.
Speaker 1: Also not trying to convince anyone of anything. Yes, no,
Speaker 1: because you can convince people. You're a highly influential person
Speaker 1: through your behavior and your energy, and people only change
Speaker 1: when they can or when they feel like changing. And
Speaker 1: when you give people the space to come to their
Speaker 1: own conclusions and you influence them through your behavior and energy,
Speaker 1: they change on their own. When you engage in arguments
Speaker 1: and battles and judgment over these things, even if your
Speaker 1: judgments are right, and by the way they're judging you
Speaker 1: and they think they're right, you create deadlock. And that's
Speaker 1: what's wrong with the political system in most of the
Speaker 1: world right now, is we're all in deadlock. And so
Speaker 1: I'm not saying that what's happening is right. I'm not
Speaker 1: saying that, you know, there's not reasons to be nervous.
Speaker 1: What I am saying is this. If you don't let them, if.
Speaker 4: You don't detach from this, you're going to allow the
Speaker 4: stress and anger and anxiety of uncertainty to hijack your
Speaker 4: brain and you are not going to be able to
Speaker 4: think strategically, and you are not going to be motivated.
Speaker 4: And in a moment like this, what we need is
Speaker 4: more light. In a moment like this, your job is
Speaker 4: to glow. It is not to turn the light off.
Speaker 4: And so I say, this is the perfect moment to say,
Speaker 4: let them, because you recognize what's happened has happened. People
Speaker 4: believe what they believe. Your power is not in managing that.
Speaker 4: Your power is taking responsibility for how you're going to respond.
Speaker 4: And let's even just look at the word responsibility. It's
Speaker 4: the ability to respond. And in life you always have
Speaker 4: three things. You have three things within your control. This
Speaker 4: is where your power is. Number one, you get to
Speaker 4: choose what you think. So you get to choose what
Speaker 4: you think about what just happened, and more importantly, what
Speaker 4: you think you're going to do about it. Number two,
Speaker 4: you get to choose what you're going to do or
Speaker 4: not do. And I will remind you of that famous
Speaker 4: professor Margaret read quote of it only takes a small
Speaker 4: group of committed citizens to change everything. In fact, that's
Speaker 4: the only thing that ever has. And if you don't
Speaker 4: like what you see that person as you. And so
Speaker 4: you get to choose not only what you're going to
Speaker 4: do or not do, but you also get to choose,
Speaker 4: by the way, whether or not you're going to stay
Speaker 4: in a conversation or a dining room table, or a
Speaker 4: family text chain, or a conversation or a date or
Speaker 4: a job interview. You get to choose, which means you're
Speaker 4: in power. And you also get to choose is what
Speaker 4: you're going to do with your emotions. And if you're
Speaker 4: tired of being angry, and I really acknowledge the fact
Speaker 4: that you recognize that this is no longer a healthy
Speaker 4: emotion for you, what I would focus on is I
Speaker 4: would focus on going inward processing your anger, and then
Speaker 4: I would focus on you doing what you need to
Speaker 4: do to become the best version of you, because when
Speaker 4: you do that, you are better prepared to face the
Speaker 4: challenges in the world, the things that you care about,
Speaker 4: and to get to work, because that's what we all
Speaker 4: need to do.
Speaker 3: Yes, Amen, I agree with that.
Speaker 1: I think that when you feel depleted and you feel angry,
Speaker 1: you feel like you're at the end of your rope.
Speaker 4: You're in a weak in state.
Speaker 1: You are in a state where you're going to hate,
Speaker 1: you're going to blame, and you're going to feel hopeless.
Speaker 1: And it's your job to get you back into more
Speaker 1: of an activated state so that you can actually spread
Speaker 1: love and joyfulness and kindness even to the people that
Speaker 1: you disagree with, because that is the medicine that everybody needs.
Speaker 1: That's the medicine that's going to make you feel good
Speaker 1: about what you're doing, and that's the medicine that is
Speaker 1: going to spread around your community. Don't talk to them
Speaker 1: about politics. Just treat them like human beings, and you
Speaker 1: don't know who they voted for. Like even though you
Speaker 1: know and it's bothersome to you, it's not your job
Speaker 1: to sit there and judge them, you know, Like, we'll
Speaker 1: all see what's going to happen in the next couple
Speaker 1: of years, and it could be terrible or it could
Speaker 1: not be so terrible.
Speaker 3: We seriously don't know.
Speaker 1: But acting or living in this kind of dread isn't
Speaker 1: useful to anyone, including yourself. So you have to figure
Speaker 1: out a way in the next couple of days to
Speaker 1: five four three two one get up and do something
Speaker 1: different other than feel sorry and hopeless about the future,
Speaker 1: because that is not a way to effectuate change.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 4: The other thing that I'm going to say is this,
Speaker 4: So there's a tool that I talk about in this
Speaker 4: book called frame of reference, because I'm never going to
Speaker 4: tell you that if there are people in your life
Speaker 4: that have very bigoted opinions or opinions about who you
Speaker 4: are as a person, or your identity or who you love,
Speaker 4: you still are in control of who you spend time
Speaker 4: with and how much access people have to you. But
Speaker 4: that is a deeply personal decision. What I have found
Speaker 4: to be incredibly helpful to me because one of my
Speaker 4: deep values is family, and there are people in my
Speaker 4: life that have very different political opinions than I have.
Speaker 4: And so I choose, because I think we all need
Speaker 4: to get better at this. I choose, instead of judgment,
Speaker 4: to go, how the heck could somebody that I know
Speaker 4: is a really decent person than a smart person and
Speaker 4: a caring person actually vote for this person? And so
Speaker 4: instead of pulling back, I let them have their opinions
Speaker 4: and their beliefs right, which creates space. It creates space
Speaker 4: for two things to be true. I mean, I think
Speaker 4: one of the reasons that their families is because it
Speaker 4: teaches you how to love people you hate sometimes and
Speaker 4: having the ability to give people the space to think
Speaker 4: what they think and to have their opinions about things.
Speaker 4: It's a way of loving people even when you disagree
Speaker 4: with them. And so what I choose to do because
Speaker 4: I'm like, I don't fucking understand how you like, I
Speaker 4: know who you are, Like, this does not compute. I go,
Speaker 4: how do I step into your shoes? And I actually
Speaker 4: understand why this made sense to you. And I'm going
Speaker 4: to give you my personal opinion. Everybody's distracted. Unless you
Speaker 4: have a hyper bigoted like person. Most people are wildly distracted.
Speaker 4: And if you look at the algorithms and you look
Speaker 4: at the way everything changed in terms of you look
Speaker 4: at one video, the algorithms show you fifty thousand more videos. Right.
Speaker 4: Most people are getting their news on tikknok. Nobody trusts
Speaker 4: any news source, and so you have all of this
Speaker 4: information going at people, and so you might have somebody
Speaker 4: go yeah, but the joint chiefs of staffs, I'm like
Speaker 4: ninety five percent of people don't even know who that
Speaker 4: is or what that is or why they matter. And
Speaker 4: by the way, they didn't see it. And so now
Speaker 4: you have a situation where you have tremendous amount of
Speaker 4: pent up anger that is aimed at the government because
Speaker 4: of the lockdown and the pandemic. Right, so, people are
Speaker 4: in a stressed out state. In fact, doctor Aditi Neurokar
Speaker 4: from Harvard, one of the most respected stress management doctors
Speaker 4: in the world, believes that eighty three percent of people
Speaker 4: in the United States are any chronic state of stress,
Speaker 4: which means you're amygdala is on and you're in fight
Speaker 4: or flight. When you're in fight or flight, you can't
Speaker 4: really think critically. When you spend six hours a day
Speaker 4: on social media, which is what the research now shows
Speaker 4: the average person does. Oh my god, I mean kids,
Speaker 4: it's like twelve. And I'm putting this in context not
Speaker 4: to justify anything, but because I choose to want to understand.
Speaker 4: And that's what we have lost is a skill in
Speaker 4: terms of human relationships. And when I look at all
Speaker 4: of that and I go, oh, there's a lot of
Speaker 4: frustration and pent up anger that people have about what
Speaker 4: happened these last four years and how they feel about
Speaker 4: the new normal and hybrid work and the rise of
Speaker 4: costs of things, and everybody wants to blame everybody. Look
Speaker 4: at me when I was so in debt, who did
Speaker 4: I blame my husband? And so it's easy to blame.
Speaker 4: And when you go into the election booth and you vote,
Speaker 4: you literally have the capacity to remember just about one thing.
Speaker 4: I remember this as a young trial lawyer when I
Speaker 4: was a public defender at Legal Aid, the OJ case
Speaker 4: was happening, and so a lot of our supervisors when
Speaker 4: I was a public defender would talk a lot about
Speaker 4: the fact that when you're doing a case, cases come
Speaker 4: down to the thing you want a jury to repeat
Speaker 4: when they go back to deliberations. And if I to say,
Speaker 4: even to my daughters who are in their twenties, if
Speaker 4: the glove doesn't fit, you got to acquit. You know
Speaker 4: exactly what case I'm talking about, even though this was
Speaker 4: decades ago. Please tell me the Democrats tagline right, and
Speaker 4: whether you vote for one side or the other, the
Speaker 4: other backline is nostalgic and personal. So everybody actually thinks
Speaker 4: it means something else. And so if you have people
Speaker 4: who are stressed out getting their news on TikTok, going
Speaker 4: in and going Okay, well, who's going to do better
Speaker 4: by me? Guess who they choose. And so that's how
Speaker 4: I have come to rationalize. Oh, that's how I understand
Speaker 4: even though all these other things don't line up with
Speaker 4: your character, how you would make that decision. M right
Speaker 4: and so. But this is the most important part. You
Speaker 4: get to choose. You get to choose if the person's
Speaker 4: opinions are that offensive to you. You get to choose
Speaker 4: how much time and energy you put into it.
Speaker 1: And you also get to choose how much grace you
Speaker 1: you know, you are able to demonstrate for a person
Speaker 1: who has such conflicting and opposing views because.
Speaker 3: You there's a lot of sources.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of joy in that as well, being
Speaker 1: graceful for another person's opinions that don't mesh with yours.
Speaker 1: I think that's a nice skill set to learn and
Speaker 1: something you should think about, you know, moving forward, once
Speaker 1: you get out of this funk, which you are going
Speaker 1: to get out of this funk.
Speaker 3: Okay, what do we.
Speaker 1: Have next, Catherine? I want I want to get as
Speaker 1: many callers on as possible.
Speaker 2: Subject line is anxious gay with therapist, husband seeks podcast help.
Speaker 2: Dear Chelsea, I'm a thirty night.
Speaker 3: If we're putting it in terms we can understand. Oh,
Speaker 3: but there they are.
Speaker 2: Oh Hi, So they say dear Chelsea. And this comes
Speaker 2: from Anthony. At first, he says, I'm a thirty nine
Speaker 2: year old married gay man. My husband, Justin and I
Speaker 2: have been together for twelve years and married for almost two.
Speaker 2: He's a licensed therapist, very level headed and soft spoken.
Speaker 2: And then there's me, not a therapist, slightly neurotic, a
Speaker 2: bit of an oversharer, and kind of all over the place.
Speaker 2: Think the gay version of Jenny Mullin, obsessed with his
Speaker 2: exes and all. A lot of our friends find our
Speaker 2: dynamic fascinating and entertaining. So I thought, why not start
Speaker 2: a podcast, maybe even a YouTube or a TikTok account,
Speaker 2: where we give opinions and advice on anything everything. Who
Speaker 2: wouldn't want to get guidance from him? A real therapist
Speaker 2: and they're kind of messy but well meaning.
Speaker 3: Friend me.
Speaker 2: It sounds fun, but we have no idea where to start. Also,
Speaker 2: the world already feels flooded with influencers and content creators,
Speaker 2: so falling into that category. Is kind of embarrassing to me.
Speaker 2: That alone makes me almost want to abandon the idea.
Speaker 2: Love the podcast. It's where I got this whole ridiculous
Speaker 2: idea from Love Anthony, and I guess justin ps, I
Speaker 2: haven't told him a writing this in yet.
Speaker 1: Hi boys, Oh hi, I you well, you're in luck
Speaker 1: because we have a real ringer here today.
Speaker 3: Mel Robbins.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah.
Speaker 1: So, first of all, there is no bad podcast idea because,
Speaker 1: as it has been proven, everyone can have a podcast,
Speaker 1: and so having an idea in and.
Speaker 3: Of itself is always possible.
Speaker 1: But if you're poo pooing the idea, if you find
Speaker 1: the idea embarrassing, that's not how you launch a podcast.
Speaker 1: You have to be committed and fully into it, because
Speaker 1: I do think, I mean, just listening to you, I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 1: why would that be a podcast? There's a lot of
Speaker 1: gay out there just to start with that would be
Speaker 1: interested in getting, you know, feedback from another gay couple.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 6: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I guess mainly it's just not knowing really where to.
Speaker 6: Start.
Speaker 4: Yeah, really, I don't think that's your issue.
Speaker 5: Oh why says embarrassing, It's that's more of how he
Speaker 5: describes his anxiety is well, your Instagram bios, embarrassed about everything.
Speaker 1: It's everything.
Speaker 4: No, no, let me let me tell you what your
Speaker 4: issue is. You ready?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, I know.
Speaker 4: I'm serious. Your your issue is very clear to me.
Speaker 4: And the issue is you're giving power to other people's opinions.
Speaker 4: I do that a lot, yes, and so I'm going
Speaker 4: to teach you how to stop doing that. Because if
Speaker 4: you want something in your heart, the only person that
Speaker 4: can stop you from doing it is you. And if
Speaker 4: you are sitting there saying I would like to launch
Speaker 4: a podcast, the things you need to do are easy.
Speaker 4: Just google it and Ai'll spit out the seven steps
Speaker 4: and do it. But what's going to stop you is
Speaker 4: you're going to stop and consider what other people are
Speaker 4: going to think about this. And that means you're giving
Speaker 4: power to another person's thought. And here's the reason why
Speaker 4: that sucks. The average person has seventy thousand thoughts a day,
Speaker 4: and you will never be able to crawl up into
Speaker 4: their head and manipulate what they think about you. And so,
Speaker 4: instead of causing your self anxiety, and instead of navigating
Speaker 4: your life trying to do things so that people don't
Speaker 4: think something negative, I want you to do the opposite.
Speaker 4: I want you to use my let them theory. And
Speaker 4: when you feel anxious and you start to go, I
Speaker 4: don't know what to do, and no, no, no, you're worried.
Speaker 4: People are going to judge, and you're going to say,
Speaker 4: let them think negative thoughts, let them judge me, let
Speaker 4: them unfollow, let them not listen, let them think whatever
Speaker 4: they're going to to think, because I know it's a
Speaker 4: waste of my time and energy to try to manage
Speaker 4: something I'm never going to be able to control. So
Speaker 4: I'm going to let them think what they want. And
Speaker 4: then you're going to say the second part, which is,
Speaker 4: let me take the power back and follow the list
Speaker 4: on AI and launch the damn podcast. Because when you
Speaker 4: do that and you no longer allow other people's opinions
Speaker 4: to be an obstacle, you're going to be proud of yourself.
Speaker 4: And when you're proud of yourself, you won't give a
Speaker 4: shit what anybody thinks, because you know who you are.
Speaker 4: But as long as you're giving power to something you
Speaker 4: can never control, which is what somebody else is going
Speaker 4: to think, you will be standing in your way and
Speaker 4: robbing yourself of the potential of your life for the
Speaker 4: rest of your life. Do not do that. That is
Speaker 4: a sad way to go through life. And you have
Speaker 4: something to offer, and the fact that you took the
Speaker 4: time to write in to Chelsea to ask about it
Speaker 4: means you want to do it. So do not allow
Speaker 4: someone else's opinion, which you cannot control, start saying, let
Speaker 4: them have a negative opinion.
Speaker 3: This is the book, Yeah, go get at it. The
Speaker 3: letter copy today. This is going to tell you exactly.
Speaker 1: This is going to tell you her story, how she
Speaker 1: began everything she was facing, and how she got herself
Speaker 1: out of it, and how she got herself into motion.
Speaker 3: And this is what you need to read.
Speaker 4: And we found out today we are the twelfth most
Speaker 4: stream show on all of Spotify this year on her
Speaker 4: A little bit about what I'm talking about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, on the planet, Yeah, so fucking listen up. Okay, guy,
Speaker 1: I let them think negative thoughts. And one more thing
Speaker 1: about the influencer thing. You influence people. Now, everybody on
Speaker 1: the planet is an influencer because we are influenced by
Speaker 1: other people's behavior. And so don't let the label that
Speaker 1: you will never be able to control anyway stop you
Speaker 1: from going out and expressing yourself or trying to make
Speaker 1: a difference let them.
Speaker 2: Well, you'll also find in the first fifty pages or
Speaker 2: so of the book that mel story is very similar.
Speaker 2: How you were like, ah, this seems so, but you know,
Speaker 2: went out and got headshots and made a website and
Speaker 2: all that stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have nothing more to add to that, I
Speaker 1: think she yeah, really kind of gave you your marching orders.
Speaker 3: Boys. Well jeez, I guess so. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think, yeah, use that and apply it
Speaker 1: into all facets of your life, because while being inveterately
Speaker 1: embarrassed or whatever your Instagram handle is might be cute
Speaker 1: and funny, you're really giving a lot of people power
Speaker 1: by having so many things that embarrass you. You can
Speaker 1: be embarrassing without being embarrassed about it. Do you know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying?
Speaker 3: No, yeah, I understand that makes sense. I'll go change
Speaker 3: it right.
Speaker 4: Well, you know what you could also say, let Chelsea
Speaker 4: have her opinion, and then let me remind myself that
Speaker 4: I can choose what I think, and I can choose
Speaker 4: what I do, and I can choose how I process things.
Speaker 2: So yeah, okay, and go have fun, do a fun
Speaker 2: creative project together. This will be great, You'll have a
Speaker 2: great time. Yeah, that's kind of how it all really started.
Speaker 5: I mean, yeah, we have a lot of friends who
Speaker 5: are like incredibly supportive idea, Like they like they want
Speaker 5: us to do it, they're begging us to do it,
Speaker 5: and it's just one of those things. It's like okay,
Speaker 5: like and there sounds good, right, but almost how will
Speaker 5: it actually like be with people? Like, how will they.
Speaker 4: They're focused on the wrong thing, Yeah, and not look
Speaker 4: at it. Yes, because here's the thing. You're not doing
Speaker 4: it so people listen. You're doing it to prove to
Speaker 4: yourself that you actually believe in yourself and that you
Speaker 4: honor the things that you want to try. You're not
Speaker 4: doing this so that other people like it. You're doing
Speaker 4: it so that you like yourself.
Speaker 3: And by virtue of that, people will be interested.
Speaker 1: Yes, by virtue in your own self belief, people will
Speaker 1: be interested.
Speaker 6: All Right.
Speaker 1: I love that.
Speaker 5: It's very growth mindset.
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, all right, thanks. That sounds great. It sounds
Speaker 3: like we fixed everything. Okay, Bye, boys.
Speaker 6: Yeah a problems bye.
Speaker 2: I thinks.
Speaker 3: Well, take a quick break and we'll come back to
Speaker 3: wrap up with Mel Robbins.
Speaker 2: All Right, So our last one we have another caller.
Speaker 4: Let's do it.
Speaker 2: Okay? Great. This is Brooklyn and she's thirty three. She says,
Speaker 2: Dear Chelsea, my name is Brooklyn and I'm from Vancouver, BC.
Speaker 2: I need some advice on what to do about my sister.
Speaker 2: She's been involved with a man for four years now
Speaker 2: that will not commit to her, which is a blessing
Speaker 2: because he's the worst human imaginable. Him not committing makes
Speaker 2: her want him even more. When he did quote unquote commit,
Speaker 2: he cheated left, right and center. He's involved with very
Speaker 2: dangerous people, himself being the main one. She's missing out
Speaker 2: on so many opportunities to meet a great guy because
Speaker 2: she's wasting her time with this low life. She's successful
Speaker 2: in the beauty industry and consumes her life outside of
Speaker 2: that trying to get his approval. All our friends hate him,
Speaker 2: our parents don't want him around. This could ruin her life.
Speaker 2: The potential is that bad? What do I do? Brooklyn?
Speaker 6: Hi?
Speaker 3: Brolyn?
Speaker 6: Hello?
Speaker 1: Hi, this is Mel Robbins, our special guest today.
Speaker 6: You guys are my talk to podcasts I listen to.
Speaker 6: That's so crazy.
Speaker 4: Oh my god, Well thank you for that. Do you
Speaker 4: do you want to go?
Speaker 3: And as me, you go take the leave.
Speaker 4: So is this the first time she's been in a
Speaker 4: relationship with somebody who won't commit, or is this a pattern?
Speaker 7: She had a great boyfriend Okay, okay, yeah, so she's
Speaker 7: had successful relationship.
Speaker 4: Well, I asked that because there's a lot of research
Speaker 4: around this, and if it's a pattern, it's one piece
Speaker 4: of advice. If it's not a pattern, it's a different
Speaker 4: piece of advice. Part of the problem is that she
Speaker 4: is in a dynamic with somebody that sounds like an
Speaker 4: abuse cycle, where it's really good and then it's really bad,
Speaker 4: and then there's an apology and then it's really good,
Speaker 4: and that activates addiction circuitry in the brain, which makes
Speaker 4: it very hard to leave. They've done a lot of
Speaker 4: study about the fact that if somebody's bad to you
Speaker 4: all the time, it's easier to leave. If somebody is good,
Speaker 4: then bad, then they're really good, then they're bad, then
Speaker 4: they're bad, then they're good. You don't understand like it's
Speaker 4: you start kind of craving the good and you explain
Speaker 4: away the bad, and so you're dealing with circuitry in
Speaker 4: the brain that is hard to overcome. And the reason
Speaker 4: why I'm going to start there is because people do
Speaker 4: well when they can, and she's in a situation where
Speaker 4: it doesn't sound like she can do well yet. And
Speaker 4: I am going to highly recommend that you dive deep
Speaker 4: into the let them theory, because she's not going to
Speaker 4: leave him until she feels like it, and she is
Speaker 4: going to stay in this longer if she feels judgment
Speaker 4: from you guys, because the judgment or the distance adds
Speaker 4: more shame, which makes her want to fix it more.
Speaker 4: And she's got to have You're smart in not bringing
Speaker 4: up but there's now this dynamic where she knows this
Speaker 4: is not the right relationship and she's probably embarrassed about it.
Speaker 4: And when you're in that situation, the only way to
Speaker 4: redeem yourself is to somehow save the relationship, because if
Speaker 4: she finally breaks up with him, what are you going
Speaker 4: to hear? I told you so. And so you're in
Speaker 4: this dynamic with her where there's a standoff and knowing
Speaker 4: that she will do well when she can, and because
Speaker 4: of the dynamic of this relationship, she can't right now.
Speaker 4: And one of the best things that you can do
Speaker 4: is you can approach this very differently. First of all,
Speaker 4: have you apologized for judging. Have you apologized for pressuring her?
Speaker 6: No?
Speaker 7: I've kind of approached the conversation as I tell her
Speaker 7: like I don't have anything nice to say, so I
Speaker 7: don't want to say it anymore.
Speaker 6: Like that's kind of where that would end.
Speaker 4: Uh huh okay. So there's something that I write about
Speaker 4: in the book called the ABC loop, and A stands
Speaker 4: for apologize and then ask open ended questions. And the
Speaker 4: asking of the open ended questions is, well, how do
Speaker 4: you feel about it? And is there anything that you
Speaker 4: want to change? And then you say is there anything
Speaker 4: I can do to be more supportive? And that's it.
Speaker 4: And what you're doing is you're actually, in a non
Speaker 4: judgmental way, you're creating space for her to talk about
Speaker 4: what's working and what's not working. And she might lie
Speaker 4: to me, Oh, everything's great. But here's the thing. Based
Speaker 4: on the research, what you're doing by asking open ended
Speaker 4: questions is you're raising tension internally because she knows it's
Speaker 4: not working. Yeah, she knows this guy's a dickhead. She
Speaker 4: knows that she deserves better, but she's trapped in it,
Speaker 4: and so you're raising this tension that allows her to
Speaker 4: start to face the thing that she's in. She's gaslighting
Speaker 4: herself around, and then you're going to be back off
Speaker 4: because people don't change until they can or they feel
Speaker 4: like it, and nobody wants to change and be told
Speaker 4: I told you so, So you're just back off and
Speaker 4: give her space. But they I don't say anything. I
Speaker 4: don't know what to say, so I don't say anything.
Speaker 4: That's actually not an apology that you haven't backed off
Speaker 4: yet because she knows you're judging her. That's why the
Speaker 4: A part is important. Now you're going to back off
Speaker 4: for at least three months, and then you've got to
Speaker 4: just model positive behavior meaning acceptance, love, ask her bring
Speaker 4: him around, no, like, hey, I want to see you,
Speaker 4: And if that means he's coming to I'm going to
Speaker 4: change how I am around him. And you're going to
Speaker 4: notice something. She doesn't want him around because she knows
Speaker 4: he's not good for her. Do you see what I'm saying?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 7: I like what you said because I think that would
Speaker 7: bring us closer, because there's this divide between us where
Speaker 7: we're not open anymore because we can talk about everything.
Speaker 4: Of course, well, because you're judging her, yes, and yes,
Speaker 4: it's just him but no, no, no, no, no, hold on,
Speaker 4: hold on. You don't get to pick and choose that way.
Speaker 4: If you're judging the person I'm dating, you're judging me, okay,
Speaker 4: And so when you judge another human being, that doesn't
Speaker 4: create motivation for connection or change. It creates resistance to it.
Speaker 4: And you're going to have to wrap your brain around
Speaker 4: this is the hardest thing in the world to understand. You.
Speaker 4: You are right, and wanting the best for your sister
Speaker 4: is a beautiful and loving thing, and I want the
Speaker 4: best for your sister and you too, But you're going
Speaker 4: about it in a way that you're working against the
Speaker 4: circuitry of the way that human beings are wired, and
Speaker 4: it's creating pressure and resistance and distance, and that's not
Speaker 4: what you want.
Speaker 7: Would this make a difference if he was dangerous?
Speaker 4: Yes? And the average domestic violence relationship. I was a
Speaker 4: crisis intervention counselor on a domestic violence hotline.
Speaker 3: Jesus, you really have had a lot of careers.
Speaker 4: It takes somebody an average of seven times to leave.
Speaker 7: It's not domestic violence. He's dangerous himself in his life
Speaker 7: and his job in his life.
Speaker 4: Choices understood and when that's the case. There's almost always
Speaker 4: commingling of that type of violence in the relationship too,
Speaker 4: whether it's emotional or physical, and there's a tremendous amount
Speaker 4: of denial about what's actually going on. And so I
Speaker 4: think you need to talk to somebody that has expertise
Speaker 4: in domestic violence and in emotional abuse, because there's probably
Speaker 4: a lot of narcissistic personality style things going on too.
Speaker 4: And what the experts will tell you I would start
Speaker 4: following doctor Romani di Versla, who's the world's leading expert
Speaker 4: on narcissism. But what the experts will tell you is
Speaker 4: that one of the hardest forms of abuse to unwind
Speaker 4: in somebody is the abuse that you receive when you're
Speaker 4: in a relationship with somebody that has a narcissistic and
Speaker 4: controlling personality style. And so you need to look at
Speaker 4: your sister as somebody who is in almost like a
Speaker 4: hostage situation. She doesn't even know it. And again, people
Speaker 4: do well when they can, and so you're when you
Speaker 4: say let them, you're not allowing this to happen to her.
Speaker 4: You're recognizing what's happen happening to her, and you're also
Speaker 4: recognizing that you can't get her out of this. She
Speaker 4: has to get herself out of this with your support,
Speaker 4: and the only way that's going to happen is if
Speaker 4: you can draw her closer to you, and as long
Speaker 4: as you're judging her or she feels that you are
Speaker 4: creating distance. And so this is a situation where I
Speaker 4: would get support from a licensed therapist or counselor that
Speaker 4: deals with domestic violence or narcissism brain circuitry, so they
Speaker 4: can advise you on this. But you really want to
Speaker 4: take an approach of open arms and no judgment and support,
Speaker 4: and that's going to draw her to you. Does that
Speaker 4: make sense?
Speaker 6: Yeah, it totally does.
Speaker 1: It's almost like you have to outsmart the two of them,
Speaker 1: you know, instead of being reactive to the situation, you
Speaker 1: kind of have to be the bigger person and see
Speaker 1: the situation for what it is, which probably has an
Speaker 1: expiration date, and getting closer to your sister rather than
Speaker 1: pushing her farther away, is probably going to help expedite
Speaker 1: that expiration date without you controlling the situation.
Speaker 6: That's so true, and I was doing the opposite. So
Speaker 6: that's really good advice from both of you.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Great, if you give the producers your address. I'm going
Speaker 4: to mail you a copy of the Let Them Theory
Speaker 4: before it's even out, so that because you need to
Speaker 4: read this right.
Speaker 6: Now, fazing. Thank you.
Speaker 1: That's all right, all right, Well take care and good
Speaker 1: luck with everything with your sister.
Speaker 6: So much, Chelsea, thank you.
Speaker 4: You're welcome.
Speaker 6: I appreciate it.
Speaker 3: Hie, you know what I wanted to ask you before
Speaker 3: we wrap up.
Speaker 1: So then this book you talk about seeing like a
Speaker 1: group of friends of yours going on vacation, which I
Speaker 1: think is something that a lot of people can relate
Speaker 1: to in the age we live in. And you were
Speaker 1: fixated on this idea that you weren't invited to this
Speaker 1: weekend and this girls get away.
Speaker 3: Even though you weren't very close friends.
Speaker 1: With these girls at the time, right you had known
Speaker 1: them over the years. So have you had any interactions
Speaker 1: with those women, like have they read this? They haven't
Speaker 1: read this yet.
Speaker 6: Oh.
Speaker 4: I reached out to two of them, Oh, and let
Speaker 4: them know. And like the story of the house, it's
Speaker 4: like six different friends and I'm like, it's not just you.
Speaker 4: And there's a person with queen bunk buds in there.
Speaker 4: So here's the thing in the book, there's a story
Speaker 4: where I see on social media that people have gone away.
Speaker 4: And by the way, it's a mentally healthy response to
Speaker 4: feel disappointed when you're not invited. That's a sign that
Speaker 4: you're actually well. The problem is you then turn it
Speaker 4: against yourself and believe that you've done something wrong. And
Speaker 4: so having the let them theory was life saving because
Speaker 4: normally I would have spiraled for weeks. I would have
Speaker 4: distanced myself from people I deeply care about, and I
Speaker 4: would have made up stories in my mind that made
Speaker 4: me feel like some loser like I did in middle school.
Speaker 4: And instead I said, let them, let them go away,
Speaker 4: let them have a weekend without me, let them live
Speaker 4: their lives. And then you have to say, they'll let
Speaker 4: me part. And this is the part that nobody likes.
Speaker 4: Everyone loves to get let them tattooed on them because
Speaker 4: you feel superior. But the let me part is where
Speaker 4: you have power and you take responsibility because then you go, well,
Speaker 4: let me look a little deeper. If this hurts this much,
Speaker 4: Clearly I value friendship, and now I got to ask
Speaker 4: myself what am I thinking, doing or feeling about it?
Speaker 4: And when I looked in the mirror, a Chelsea, I
Speaker 4: was working so much, I had let my friendships go.
Speaker 4: And it's no one else's responsibility to create those relationships
Speaker 4: but mine. When was the last time I invited anybody over?
Speaker 4: When's the last time I planned a week in a way?
Speaker 4: When's the last time I picked up the phone and
Speaker 4: asked any one of those women that I now felt
Speaker 4: excluded from how they were doing. And the truth is
Speaker 4: I hadn't done it in a very long time. And
Speaker 4: so then you go, well, what right do you have
Speaker 4: to expect to be invited if you're not even putting
Speaker 4: in the effort. And so the let them theory also
Speaker 4: reveals not just where other people are falling short and
Speaker 4: where you need to speak up and talk about what
Speaker 4: you need or how you may feel. It also reveals
Speaker 4: where you are, where you're sitting back bitching about your
Speaker 4: job but you're actually phoning it in, Where you are
Speaker 4: feeling lonely but you haven't left your house in five days,
Speaker 4: where you have complaints about your family, but you haven't
Speaker 4: reached out to your siblings in a while. And so
Speaker 4: I love this so much because whether you're talking about
Speaker 4: politics or you're talking about a very scary situation, like
Speaker 4: that last caller, and you would do anything to extract
Speaker 4: your sister from that, just like we would do anything
Speaker 4: to help somebody get sober. But when you pressure, you
Speaker 4: actually create resistance to change. And when you blame, you
Speaker 4: failed to see your power and responsibility in creating the
Speaker 4: things that you want in your life. And so it
Speaker 4: has been the single most powerful thing I've ever discovered.
Speaker 4: It has changed my life more than anything that I
Speaker 4: have ever learned about or used in my life. And
Speaker 4: I one thousand percent believe this is the legacy I
Speaker 4: will leave on this earth.
Speaker 1: Ooh, we love it well. We loved having email Robbins.
Speaker 1: And this book is obviously going to be a huge success.
Speaker 1: We know that for sure, and congrats on all of
Speaker 1: your success. It's very very inspiring to see someone turn
Speaker 1: their life around in the way in which you have.
Speaker 4: Thank you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So goodbye everyone. We will see you next week.
Speaker 2: If you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email
Speaker 2: at Dear Chelsea podcast at gmail dot com and be
Speaker 2: sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited
Speaker 2: and engineered by Brad Dickert executive producer Catherine Law and
Speaker 2: be sure to check out our merch at Chelseahandler dot
Speaker 2: com