1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:03,239 Speaker 1: Welcome back to ac cast. I am your host, Jamie Loftus, 2 00:00:03,279 --> 00:00:05,960 Speaker 1: and I've made it three whole nights without a large 3 00:00:05,960 --> 00:00:08,200 Speaker 1: two D Kathy cartoon appearing at the foot of my 4 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:11,520 Speaker 1: bed and threatening my one human life. We'll take the 5 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 1: winds where we can get them. In Part one of 6 00:00:14,080 --> 00:00:17,560 Speaker 1: this episode, we explored the women who preceded Kathy, guyswhite 7 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:21,200 Speaker 1: in the comic strip industry, who were frequently erased, as 8 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:24,760 Speaker 1: well as the radicals who worked in underground comics that's 9 00:00:24,920 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 1: c O, M, M, I X, thank you very much, 10 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:30,160 Speaker 1: while Kathy was getting her start in the far more 11 00:00:30,280 --> 00:00:34,199 Speaker 1: restrictive national funny pages. In Part two, I want to 12 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:38,320 Speaker 1: feature four of her contemporaries, all boomers with one exception, 13 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:42,240 Speaker 1: whose strips had missions similar to Kathy's, with very different 14 00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:46,560 Speaker 1: approaches that goal to document the day to day struggles 15 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:51,000 Speaker 1: of the boomer generation. The difference is all about who 16 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:54,280 Speaker 1: is being put into focus on that mission. Our first 17 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:57,440 Speaker 1: artist came straight out of the women's comic scene, far 18 00:00:57,520 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 1: from the mainstream funny pages. So let's get the theme 19 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:05,320 Speaker 1: song going right. She burst into the world in nineteen 20 00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:08,480 Speaker 1: seventy six. She's at what she's out on dates and 21 00:01:08,560 --> 00:01:11,959 Speaker 1: she don't like politics from Mama and herb and two 22 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:15,720 Speaker 1: with feminist friends. She's fighting all the stands with some 23 00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 1: chocolate and hair. Cathe she's fighting back to stressed with success. 24 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:26,920 Speaker 1: Let's call her some slack oh Cathey my Cathy, fun Cather, 25 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:49,040 Speaker 1: She's gotta like going on. The biggest star to come 26 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:53,560 Speaker 1: out of women's comics was, hands down, Alison Bechtel, who's 27 00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 1: now a MacArthur Genius Award recipient. She's the author of 28 00:01:57,480 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: books like fun Home and Are You My Mother? Fun 29 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 1: Home was turned into a huge Broadway musical also, but 30 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:07,840 Speaker 1: that ascent to the top was a slow and challenging one, 31 00:02:07,880 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 1: and one that women's comics helped lift Early in her career. 32 00:02:11,600 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: She first appeared in issues in the nineteen eighties. Beckdel 33 00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:18,560 Speaker 1: established herself as a cartoonist through her independent comic strip 34 00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 1: Dikes to Watch Out For, which ran in local feminist 35 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 1: newspaper Woman News beginning in nineteen eighty three and was 36 00:02:25,880 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 1: eventually syndicated in other all weekly papers beginning in nineteen 37 00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 1: eighty five. Most famously, a comic of two characters discussing 38 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 1: the lack of women speaking to each other in popular 39 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:40,560 Speaker 1: movies led to the coining of the Bechdel Test, popular 40 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:43,160 Speaker 1: media metric that requires that two women need to speak 41 00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 1: to each other about something other than a man for 42 00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:48,440 Speaker 1: two lines of dialogue to pass the test. Some people 43 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 1: we've even started podcasts about this, I've heard. Although it 44 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 1: is just a jumping off point for discussion, I'm sure 45 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 1: it's funny because the context of that comic is two 46 00:02:57,400 --> 00:03:00,760 Speaker 1: lesbian characters frustrated that women I ever speak to each 47 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:04,600 Speaker 1: other in movies, meaning that lesbian audience members couldn't ship 48 00:03:04,639 --> 00:03:07,160 Speaker 1: them together. So it's also a strip about a lack 49 00:03:07,200 --> 00:03:11,160 Speaker 1: of queer representation as well. Anyways, here's Bechdel and an 50 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 1: introduction for a two thousand and eight publication of the 51 00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:18,440 Speaker 1: comics entire run, explaining why she started the strip. Readers 52 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 1: seemed to like it and egged me on. But to 53 00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:23,239 Speaker 1: be honest, it was so comforting to see my queer 54 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:26,160 Speaker 1: life reflected back at me. I would have kept drawing 55 00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:29,240 Speaker 1: these dikes to watch out for just for myself. Let 56 00:03:29,280 --> 00:03:32,800 Speaker 1: me tell you, my friends, those were benighted times. Despite 57 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 1: what my mother thought about my lesbianism, being an Outdike 58 00:03:36,200 --> 00:03:38,880 Speaker 1: was not an easy row to hoe. We had no 59 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:42,520 Speaker 1: L word, we had no lesbian daytime TV hosts. We 60 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,760 Speaker 1: had no openly lesbian daughters of the creepy vice President. 61 00:03:46,160 --> 00:03:49,200 Speaker 1: We had personal best and we liked it. I saw 62 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 1: my cartoons as an antidote to the prevailing image of 63 00:03:52,040 --> 00:03:56,360 Speaker 1: lesbians as sick, humorless, and undesirable, our model, like Olympic 64 00:03:56,400 --> 00:04:00,360 Speaker 1: pent athletes, objective fodder for the mail gays. By drawing 65 00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:03,160 Speaker 1: the everyday lives of women like me, I hope to 66 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 1: make lesbians more visible, not just to ourselves but to everyone. 67 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 1: If people could only see us, how could they help 68 00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 1: but love us. Dikes To Watch Out For has an 69 00:04:12,760 --> 00:04:16,159 Speaker 1: expansive cast of characters who aged in real time for 70 00:04:16,200 --> 00:04:18,240 Speaker 1: the twenty five years that the comic ran in a 71 00:04:18,279 --> 00:04:21,479 Speaker 1: fictional city whose world reflected the reality of the US 72 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:25,720 Speaker 1: at that time. The comics protagonist is mo Testa, a 73 00:04:25,839 --> 00:04:29,159 Speaker 1: radical leftist lesbian who's trying to navigate building a life 74 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:32,600 Speaker 1: for herself while upholding her values. Her achilles heel is 75 00:04:32,640 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 1: a tendency to complain about everything, and she works at 76 00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 1: a lesbian feminist bookstore where we meet most of our 77 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:43,039 Speaker 1: other characters. There's Clarice, an environmental lawyer, and most college 78 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:46,440 Speaker 1: x who's in a long term relationship and eventually marries Tony, 79 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 1: a CPA. They later have a kid together as well. 80 00:04:49,279 --> 00:04:52,359 Speaker 1: There's Lois, a drag king who encourages everyone to be 81 00:04:52,440 --> 00:04:56,240 Speaker 1: more accepting. There's Ginger, the eternal grad student Sparrow who 82 00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:59,520 Speaker 1: runs a battered women's shelter and eventually comes out as 83 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:04,120 Speaker 1: a by sexual lesbian. There's Moe's girlfriend Sidney, and there's Jisanna, 84 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:06,839 Speaker 1: who owns and runs the bookstore. Not only is this 85 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:10,799 Speaker 1: comic really good, it touches on so many issues, issues 86 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:14,159 Speaker 1: relevant to queer people, to women, to boomers in general. 87 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:17,159 Speaker 1: Just like Kathy chronicled the week to week worries of 88 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 1: a number of white, middle class boomer ladies, Beckdel's work 89 00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:23,279 Speaker 1: does the same for the lesbian community over the course 90 00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,480 Speaker 1: of decades, and while Beckdel herself is a white lesbian, 91 00:05:26,720 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: she makes a concerted effort to show the diversity of 92 00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:34,400 Speaker 1: her community in race, gender, sexuality, and ability. One of 93 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 1: the early taboo topics that newspaper comics wouldn't have been 94 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:39,600 Speaker 1: able to touch with a ten foot poll was the 95 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 1: AIDS crisis, which Beckdel has her characters talk about frankly 96 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:46,279 Speaker 1: in the eighties and even works to correct some of 97 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:49,240 Speaker 1: the popular myths around the disease. Here's a strip from 98 00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:52,080 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty seven with Moe and Lois. Lois has just 99 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:56,680 Speaker 1: had unprotected sex, Mos as Lois, you can't just go 100 00:05:56,800 --> 00:06:00,320 Speaker 1: around betting every woman you meet. Haven't you heard there's 101 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 1: an epidemic going on, ah, Mo, relax. Lesbians are a 102 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 1: low risk group. I'm not going to get AIDS from 103 00:06:07,240 --> 00:06:11,839 Speaker 1: sleeping around with other women, Lois. Being a doesn't mean 104 00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:16,840 Speaker 1: you can't get AIDS. This conversation continues, with Mo overreacting 105 00:06:16,920 --> 00:06:20,480 Speaker 1: and demanding Lois b celibate. Lois refuses. Then Ginger shows 106 00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:23,720 Speaker 1: up and diffuses the situation by telling Lois that of 107 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:26,200 Speaker 1: course she can have sex, but while gay men were 108 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:28,560 Speaker 1: at higher risk for AIDS, that didn't mean that she 109 00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:31,960 Speaker 1: wasn't obligated to practice safe sex. And it all manages 110 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:34,720 Speaker 1: to be funny somehow. It's great Mo and her friends 111 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:38,200 Speaker 1: experience the world in real time. The whole gang goes 112 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:41,200 Speaker 1: to a kiss in to protest anti gay laws at 113 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:44,920 Speaker 1: the Real March on Washington in nineteen eighty seven. Clarice 114 00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 1: and Tony struggle to have their union formally recognized four 115 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:52,400 Speaker 1: years whether it's issues allowing Clarice to formally adopt her 116 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:55,919 Speaker 1: son that they have through artificial insemination, or by having 117 00:06:55,920 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 1: their eventual marriage recognized in states where gay people still 118 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:02,440 Speaker 1: could not marry at that time. Trans characters enter the 119 00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:07,039 Speaker 1: story as well. Mo is stupendously turfy at the start 120 00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 1: of one storyline that's short for trans exclusionary radical feminist 121 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 1: and they can say it with me flock right off 122 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:18,840 Speaker 1: to hell. In this storyline, a transwoman new to the 123 00:07:18,880 --> 00:07:22,040 Speaker 1: bookstore wants to join Moe's book club, and mo Is 124 00:07:22,040 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 1: hesitant to include her. Lois educates Mo and tells her 125 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 1: that she's being a bigoted asshole, and Mo changes her 126 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:33,120 Speaker 1: perspective much later in the comic. There is also a 127 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 1: trans teen coming out story from the early two thousands 128 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 1: in which Lois's partner's daughter navigates gender dysphoria, coming out 129 00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:44,960 Speaker 1: to her mom, and becoming a young transactivist. The economic 130 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 1: trends of these years are shown as well, when the 131 00:07:47,440 --> 00:07:50,480 Speaker 1: independent bookstore that everyone works at closes due to a 132 00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:54,400 Speaker 1: big box store coming to town. Mo's girlfriend survives breast cancer. 133 00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:58,280 Speaker 1: They attend anti war protests for every war that takes 134 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:00,920 Speaker 1: place between the eighties and the late two thousands, so 135 00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:04,840 Speaker 1: quite a few. Because Bechtel's characters had all kinds of 136 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:08,200 Speaker 1: different opinions on politics and pop culture, Dikes to Watch 137 00:08:08,200 --> 00:08:12,120 Speaker 1: out For was able to challenge schisms within the queer community, 138 00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:16,360 Speaker 1: within political parties, within friend groups. Here's a conversation between 139 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:19,640 Speaker 1: Ginger and Lois from nineteen ninety three about their frustration 140 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:22,480 Speaker 1: with white gay men being quicker to be embraced by 141 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 1: pop culture than queer women. Ginger says, news flash. A 142 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 1: recent sex survey of twenty somethings revealed that among men 143 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:34,960 Speaker 1: who fantasize about celebrities, Cindy Crawford and Demi Moore rank high. 144 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 1: Women opt for Luke Perry and President Clinton, while gay 145 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 1: men tapped Markie Mark and Tom Cruise period end of paragraph. 146 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 1: Do you think that means lesbians don't fantasize about celebrities 147 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:49,520 Speaker 1: or they don't answer surveys? How come men get to 148 00:08:49,559 --> 00:08:52,160 Speaker 1: be totally queer but women don't. I'm sick of being 149 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:56,000 Speaker 1: portrayed as some straight slob's porno fantasy and on paper, 150 00:08:56,160 --> 00:08:59,280 Speaker 1: Kathy and dikes to watch out For sound and are 151 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:03,199 Speaker 1: extreme different, but at their core their goal is pretty similar. 152 00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:06,000 Speaker 1: It's for their authors to pull from their own lives 153 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:08,960 Speaker 1: as boomer women to comment on the world around them, 154 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:12,360 Speaker 1: on the changing politics and standards of the US at 155 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 1: the end of the twentieth century. It's their perspectives and 156 00:09:15,679 --> 00:09:18,679 Speaker 1: where they published that are different. While Alice and Bechdel, 157 00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:22,320 Speaker 1: an outspoken queer, feminist and leftist, could talk about almost 158 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:25,080 Speaker 1: anything she wanted and addressed topics that were still a 159 00:09:25,120 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 1: taboo in the mainstream, the tradeoff was that less people 160 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:31,160 Speaker 1: would see it, and she would make a fraction of 161 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 1: the money her funny paid colleagues dead. Kathy was always 162 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:37,760 Speaker 1: beholden to the editors of the United Press Syndicate and 163 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:41,200 Speaker 1: the individual papers that carried her work. The trade off 164 00:09:41,240 --> 00:09:44,880 Speaker 1: for her more money and more eyeballs. But good luck 165 00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:47,040 Speaker 1: if you happen to want to vote for Michael Ducaucus. 166 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:50,280 Speaker 1: The mainstream papers were not ready for Alice and Bechdel, 167 00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 1: and certainly not for the women of women's comics, but 168 00:09:53,080 --> 00:09:56,240 Speaker 1: they hold a very important place in women's comic art, 169 00:09:56,400 --> 00:09:59,079 Speaker 1: and in the case of Bechdel and Trina Robbins, are 170 00:09:59,120 --> 00:10:03,480 Speaker 1: finally getting their inside note. Even Alison Bechdeal made a 171 00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:06,640 Speaker 1: jab at Kathy and a strip of hers Mo's ex 172 00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:09,600 Speaker 1: Harriet is like reading a newspaper in the Sunday Funnies 173 00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:12,440 Speaker 1: with a Kathy comic and the four panels Beckdal puts 174 00:10:12,440 --> 00:10:18,760 Speaker 1: in our Kathy saying diet by over read ak yeah, yeah, 175 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:22,280 Speaker 1: take a number. That is so insulting. I am so 176 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:25,880 Speaker 1: sorry she did that. Kathy. Alison Beckdale has spoken about 177 00:10:25,920 --> 00:10:29,559 Speaker 1: the power of telling one's own story and her similarities 178 00:10:29,600 --> 00:10:32,760 Speaker 1: to her protagonist Mo and a talk in twenty fifteen. 179 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:35,720 Speaker 1: I didn't see images anywhere of women who looked like 180 00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:37,480 Speaker 1: me and my friends, so I decided I would just 181 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:41,679 Speaker 1: make them myself. Another thing I really liked about working 182 00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:44,080 Speaker 1: with words and pictures together was the fact that cartoons 183 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:47,840 Speaker 1: were lowbrow. They were accessible and populist, and they didn't 184 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:51,240 Speaker 1: get scrutinized the way that fine art or literary writing 185 00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:54,400 Speaker 1: or criticized in the same way. I was very insecure 186 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:57,400 Speaker 1: as a young person after all those rejection letters. I 187 00:10:57,480 --> 00:11:00,480 Speaker 1: always liked being an outsider as a lesbian. It gave 188 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:03,800 Speaker 1: me a certain objectivity about how the world worked that 189 00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:05,960 Speaker 1: I would lose if I were on the inside and 190 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 1: benefiting tremendously from the system. But I also, of course 191 00:11:12,360 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 1: yearned on some deep level to just the normal, to 192 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 1: just have everything. That'd be such a big deal for 193 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:22,200 Speaker 1: my queerness to be seen as normal. Indics to watch 194 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:24,840 Speaker 1: out for. Alison Bechdel and Mo aren't the same person, 195 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:27,200 Speaker 1: but Moe is a tool for Bechdel to say what 196 00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:30,120 Speaker 1: she thought. Same guest for Kathy. Guys white and Kathy, 197 00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 1: I want them to hang out. I'd consider it. Okay, 198 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:52,200 Speaker 1: Relax now, I want to take a look at some 199 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:56,079 Speaker 1: of Kathy's contemporaries from inside the Funny Pages. All from 200 00:11:56,080 --> 00:12:00,880 Speaker 1: the Universal Press indicate Gary Trudeau of Douansbury, Lynn Johnston 201 00:12:01,080 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 1: of For Better or for Worse, and Aaron McGruder of 202 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:07,640 Speaker 1: The Boondocks. All three of these writers made strides in 203 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:10,160 Speaker 1: the Funny Pages, and as you know by now, it's 204 00:12:10,160 --> 00:12:13,200 Speaker 1: not really an easy medium to take strides in. We're 205 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 1: talking mostly about strips that pushed against the norm in 206 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:19,200 Speaker 1: this series, but it's important to remember what that norm was. 207 00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:23,120 Speaker 1: It's indisputable that for the majority of American comic strip 208 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:26,839 Speaker 1: history there have been more strips about household pets by 209 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:31,079 Speaker 1: white guys. However, beloved Garfield stand here, than there were 210 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 1: marginalized people working in the Funny Pages. Well, into the 211 00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:38,480 Speaker 1: nineteen eighties. Even when comic strips were not actively hostile 212 00:12:38,559 --> 00:12:41,560 Speaker 1: to women, queer people, and non white people, they were 213 00:12:41,800 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 1: disproportionately centered around white boys and men or traditional family values. 214 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 1: Family Circus is a comic that I'm pretty sure is 215 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:54,960 Speaker 1: completely built around white children misunderstanding various words. Andy Kapp 216 00:12:55,120 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 1: was a character famous for beating his wife. Dilbert had 217 00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:03,360 Speaker 1: some commentary on nineteen nineties office culture while also serving 218 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:07,240 Speaker 1: as a proto in cell Beetle Bailey was war propaganda 219 00:13:07,320 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 1: with gags. Oh, and there was The Farside, which still 220 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:13,560 Speaker 1: fucking rocks. But most beloved strips like Peanuts and Calvin 221 00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:17,080 Speaker 1: and Hobbes are classic childhood tales with larger casts, but 222 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 1: centered on the childhood experiences of white boys in the 223 00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:24,280 Speaker 1: middle class, which, to be fair, is how Gary Trudeau's 224 00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:29,079 Speaker 1: Dunesbury starts. Dunesbury is the rare comic strip that has 225 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:33,360 Speaker 1: been pretty intellectualized since it debuted back in nineteen seventy. 226 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 1: Creator Gary Trudeau is the son of a legacy family 227 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:40,160 Speaker 1: of doctors from Saranac Lake, New York. Went to a 228 00:13:40,280 --> 00:13:43,320 Speaker 1: private New Hampshire High School and then Yale, where he 229 00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:46,400 Speaker 1: started writing a comic strip called bull Tails, which was 230 00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:50,160 Speaker 1: an early version of Doonesbury. While Doonesbury would later become 231 00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 1: synonymous with political commentary and satire, it started and in 232 00:13:54,920 --> 00:14:00,000 Speaker 1: many ways remained semi autobiographical and pulled from the life 233 00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:03,320 Speaker 1: experiences of the people Trudeau was surrounded by. Here's what 234 00:14:03,360 --> 00:14:06,079 Speaker 1: he said to PBS News Hour in twenty ten about 235 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:09,959 Speaker 1: the beginnings of Dunesbury. Well, I think what it began 236 00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 1: as a kind of diary of my generation coming of 237 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:20,640 Speaker 1: age became the main driving force behind it. It's just 238 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 1: inherently fun watching a generation evolved, to see to see 239 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:26,360 Speaker 1: what it's meant. That's what you've always thought about it. 240 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:29,280 Speaker 1: I'm going to watch my generation evolved, I think. So. 241 00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:31,920 Speaker 1: I don't think it was I had quite such a 242 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:33,920 Speaker 1: grandiose take on it. I was just trying to get 243 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 1: through the day and create a series of jokes and 244 00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:39,120 Speaker 1: meet a series of deadlines. But I think looking back 245 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:41,840 Speaker 1: on it, that's that's that's pretty much what it became. 246 00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:45,800 Speaker 1: It was certainly marketed that way. What's that do you say? 247 00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 1: Another comic strip that was a chronicle of boomer life 248 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,880 Speaker 1: over the course of decades. In nineteen seventy, at age 249 00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:56,320 Speaker 1: twenty two, the Universal Press indicates signed Trudeaux On had 250 00:14:56,400 --> 00:14:58,920 Speaker 1: him change the name of the comic from bull Tails 251 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:02,240 Speaker 1: to Dunesbury, and it was off to the races. Dunesbury 252 00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:06,440 Speaker 1: began with a relatively small casp that would expand rapidly 253 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:09,400 Speaker 1: in the fifty years that followed, and much like Alice 254 00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:12,880 Speaker 1: and Bechdel's characters in Dice to watch out for, Trudeau's 255 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:16,480 Speaker 1: characters aged in real time and some of them even die. 256 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: Even as someone who would rather cut my own head 257 00:15:18,920 --> 00:15:22,120 Speaker 1: off than hand it an ivy league educated white guy 258 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 1: from a rich family, I do have to hand it 259 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:29,440 Speaker 1: to Gary Trudeau. Dunesbury is maybe the riskiest, boldest work 260 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:32,760 Speaker 1: in the funny pages in the twentieth century. It's pretty 261 00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 1: punk and you don't need to just take my word 262 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:37,760 Speaker 1: for it. Aaron Recruiter, creator of The Boondocks, who we'll 263 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 1: be talking about in a bit, has regularly credited Trudeau 264 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:44,600 Speaker 1: as his biggest influence. Its beginnings are pretty innocuous. We 265 00:15:44,720 --> 00:15:48,480 Speaker 1: meet Mike Dunesbury, a hippie womanizer of a college student, 266 00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:53,160 Speaker 1: b d the quarterback, Mark Slackmeyer, the radical, and Zonker, 267 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:56,440 Speaker 1: the stoner student who joins the football team and pisses 268 00:15:56,480 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 1: bad off endlessly, so kind of another strip for the boy, 269 00:16:00,160 --> 00:16:02,920 Speaker 1: it seemed like at first, but the comic made political 270 00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:07,040 Speaker 1: commentary right away. Many of the students at Trudeau's fictional 271 00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:11,920 Speaker 1: Walden College were firmly anti Vietnam Smoked Weed, and Trudeau 272 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:15,960 Speaker 1: commented on his strong anti war feelings and criticism of 273 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 1: protest and activism through his different characters. As the comic continued, 274 00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:23,520 Speaker 1: the cast widened and became more inclusive to better comment 275 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:26,119 Speaker 1: on the movements that were on fire in the seventies. 276 00:16:26,240 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 1: Commentary on Black American activism told through the law student 277 00:16:30,280 --> 00:16:34,800 Speaker 1: turned congressional candidate Jinny, Feminist activism through Jinny and her 278 00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:38,480 Speaker 1: eventual roommate Joanie, who left her husband and children when 279 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:41,520 Speaker 1: Mike and Mark drove past on their motorcycle and offered 280 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:44,160 Speaker 1: to let her live on their commune. Joanie's one of 281 00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 1: my favorite characters, and she's featured heavily in the Dunesbury 282 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:50,800 Speaker 1: special from nineteen seventy seven, where we see her working 283 00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:53,200 Speaker 1: to make ends meet at a day care center with 284 00:16:53,280 --> 00:16:55,720 Speaker 1: a bunch of young girls who were reacting to the 285 00:16:55,800 --> 00:17:00,680 Speaker 1: second wave feminist movement and feeding them and picking a 286 00:17:00,760 --> 00:17:05,720 Speaker 1: back of them mostping to fight. Yes, but I'm getting 287 00:17:05,760 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 1: paid for it? How much not? In Nut Honey, the 288 00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:14,960 Speaker 1: strip touches on boomer women who were raised to be 289 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:19,600 Speaker 1: housewives discovering their personal power through the character Boopsie b 290 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:23,600 Speaker 1: D's quote unquote cheerleader bimbo girlfriend who goes on to 291 00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:27,120 Speaker 1: build a successful career as an actress and remains very 292 00:17:27,160 --> 00:17:30,960 Speaker 1: happy in her marriage. B D enlists in Vietnam thinking 293 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:34,000 Speaker 1: he was being patriotic in his early twenties, only to 294 00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:37,800 Speaker 1: befriend a member of the Vietcong and questioned the war himself. 295 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:41,159 Speaker 1: Andy Lippencott was an early out gay character in the 296 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:44,760 Speaker 1: comic from Og character Mark later in the strip. In 297 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:48,720 Speaker 1: its heyday, Doonesbury caused a lot of controversy, either for 298 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:52,159 Speaker 1: its political commentary or by representing people who were simply 299 00:17:52,200 --> 00:17:54,679 Speaker 1: not accepted by the media of the day. In the 300 00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:59,080 Speaker 1: newspaper Funnies a shortlist of Doonesbury controversies, Let's get the 301 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:03,440 Speaker 1: Music started. The Washington Post ran an editorial criticizing Doonesbury 302 00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:08,639 Speaker 1: character Mark for calling Nixon guilty, guilty, guilty during Watergate. 303 00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:12,080 Speaker 1: Trudeau got in trouble for implying that two forty year 304 00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:16,320 Speaker 1: olds were having premarital sex. In nineteen seventy six, he 305 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:20,720 Speaker 1: got busted for criticizing tobacco companies for refusing to acknowledge 306 00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 1: the link between cancer and cigarettes. John McCain once said 307 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 1: on the floor of the Senate in nineteen ninety five, 308 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:30,480 Speaker 1: suffice it to say that I hold Trudeau in utter contempt. 309 00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:35,600 Speaker 1: When Doonesbury criticized Bob Dole, Hunter s Thompson, Santa Gary, 310 00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:40,080 Speaker 1: Trudeau a bag full of his own shit and a classic. 311 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 1: He got in trouble for saying son of a bitch. 312 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:44,280 Speaker 1: So yeah, it was a lot, and there were a 313 00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:48,040 Speaker 1: few misfires thematically from Doonesbury, but for the most part, 314 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 1: the strip does a great job at pissing off government conservatives. 315 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:55,280 Speaker 1: So a victim was crime. So yes, Trudeau had dealt 316 00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:57,840 Speaker 1: with his comic being moved from the funnies to the 317 00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:01,480 Speaker 1: op ed page of newspapers repeat seatedly over his fifty 318 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:04,600 Speaker 1: year tenure, usually when his subject matter went against the 319 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:07,600 Speaker 1: political leanings of the paper it was being printed in, 320 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 1: or upset readers. But you don't have to cry for him. 321 00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:13,879 Speaker 1: Trudeau is maybe one of the most decorated comic strip 322 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:17,120 Speaker 1: artists of all time. In fact, he became the first 323 00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:21,159 Speaker 1: strip cartoonist to win the Pulitzer Prize for Editorial Cartooning 324 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:24,480 Speaker 1: for his Watergate series, and was a Pulitzer finalist again 325 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:27,800 Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety, two thousand four, and two thousand and five. 326 00:19:28,080 --> 00:19:31,119 Speaker 1: That nineteen seventy seven Doonesbury special I played a clip 327 00:19:31,119 --> 00:19:34,199 Speaker 1: of that was nominated for an Academy Award in nineteen 328 00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 1: seventy eight. So for all the risks that Trudeau took, 329 00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:39,600 Speaker 1: a lot of them paid off, and the strip is 330 00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 1: still well regarded today. Doonesbury was so much the intellectual's 331 00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:47,200 Speaker 1: comic strip that Kathy Geiswite references it in a strip 332 00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:50,439 Speaker 1: from the late seventies of Kathy. Kathy is talking to 333 00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:53,359 Speaker 1: Andrea and the strip and says, this man happens to 334 00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:56,400 Speaker 1: be very bright. He says he reads Doonesbury every day. 335 00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:59,640 Speaker 1: Andrea shrugs and says, big deal. Millions of people read 336 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:03,560 Speaker 1: Sberry every day. Kathy melts, She's like in full crush mode, 337 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:06,960 Speaker 1: and she says, yeah, but he understands it every day. 338 00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:11,280 Speaker 1: So this was like smart people content, and I could 339 00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:14,600 Speaker 1: talk about Dudesbury for much longer. How Trudeau taking a 340 00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 1: hiatus in eighty three and eighty four and returning with 341 00:20:17,600 --> 00:20:20,720 Speaker 1: his characters aged up as boomers who would shed their 342 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:25,240 Speaker 1: activists past and become sellout adults. Was completely inspired or 343 00:20:25,240 --> 00:20:28,679 Speaker 1: how I can't stand the illustration style, or how early 344 00:20:28,840 --> 00:20:33,080 Speaker 1: the strip was to denouncing Trump, or Janie's radical career, 345 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,760 Speaker 1: or Mike Doonesbury's turn as a single father, or the 346 00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:40,359 Speaker 1: comics pivoting to the millennial children of the original characters 347 00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:44,080 Speaker 1: over time. But what Doonesbury does stand for is proof 348 00:20:44,119 --> 00:20:47,200 Speaker 1: that the Funny Pages could say a lot in the seventies. 349 00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:50,280 Speaker 1: As a white Ivy League guy, Trudeau had less to 350 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:53,360 Speaker 1: lose than many of his counterparts, He took a lot 351 00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 1: of risks, He moved the medium forward in many ways, 352 00:20:56,880 --> 00:21:00,680 Speaker 1: and he was rewarded handsomely for it. By ninety nine 353 00:21:00,720 --> 00:21:03,920 Speaker 1: there had been a lot of boundaries pushed in comics. 354 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:08,560 Speaker 1: Doonesbury made political commentary in The Funny Pages Pulitzer worthy 355 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:12,520 Speaker 1: and inspired many impostors and women cartoonists like Kathy and 356 00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:15,760 Speaker 1: Lynn Johnston had found a foothold in the industry and 357 00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:18,160 Speaker 1: the money to back it up. But the Funnies were 358 00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:21,719 Speaker 1: and always had been extremely white and center liberal, too 359 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:26,600 Speaker 1: conservative in their politics. Enter the Boondocks by Aaron McGruder, 360 00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 1: a comic about black socialist nine year old Huey Freeman 361 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 1: and his brother, the gangster rap obsessed Riley, moving to 362 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:36,680 Speaker 1: a predominantly white neighborhood in Maryland with their granddad. Other 363 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:40,119 Speaker 1: characters regular in the strip are Jasmine, a naive by 364 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:43,040 Speaker 1: racial child of lawyers, one black and one white, who 365 00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 1: believe in the democratic establishment and are constantly at odds 366 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:50,080 Speaker 1: with Huey, and Michael Caesar, who is Huey's best friend, 367 00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:53,280 Speaker 1: also a black socialist, but has a brighter outlook on 368 00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 1: the future of the world. And if you haven't read 369 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:58,400 Speaker 1: The Boondocks, which ran in papers with the Universal Press 370 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:01,200 Speaker 1: indicate from nineteen ninety nine two thousand and six, just 371 00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:03,520 Speaker 1: turn off the podcast and go read some or the 372 00:22:03,560 --> 00:22:07,080 Speaker 1: animated series, which is also great, is streaming on HBO Max. 373 00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:09,159 Speaker 1: This is a clip from the pilot of that show, 374 00:22:09,320 --> 00:22:17,280 Speaker 1: which is also pulled from the comics. Excuse me, everyone, 375 00:22:17,359 --> 00:22:21,320 Speaker 1: I have a brief announcement to make Jesus was black, 376 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:24,640 Speaker 1: Ronald Reagan was the devil, and the government is lying 377 00:22:24,760 --> 00:22:28,680 Speaker 1: about ninety eleven. Thank you for your time, and good 378 00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:38,120 Speaker 1: night dad. That's the tone of the Boondocks, black radicalism 379 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:40,960 Speaker 1: is in its DNA, and as much as his readers 380 00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:44,680 Speaker 1: loved it, old guard comic publishers were afraid of it. 381 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:49,560 Speaker 1: Aaron mcgruder's journey into the newspaper was distinctly gen x. 382 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:53,560 Speaker 1: He began publishing it online at hitlist dot com in 383 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,960 Speaker 1: nineteen ninety six, and it was extremely popular. But when 384 00:22:57,000 --> 00:23:00,199 Speaker 1: the still college student wanted to take it nationally, he 385 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:03,320 Speaker 1: was met with a ton of resistance from the traditional 386 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:06,560 Speaker 1: comic syndicates. This is from a Washington Post piece on 387 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:10,000 Speaker 1: the topic by Lena O'Neill Parker in nineteen ninety seven, 388 00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:14,400 Speaker 1: almost two years before the Universal Press Indicate finally gave 389 00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:17,639 Speaker 1: it the green light. Now he wants to take it national, 390 00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:19,800 Speaker 1: but things are a little too edgy in the Boondocks 391 00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:23,560 Speaker 1: to suit the cartoon syndicators. McGruder has submitted The Boondocks 392 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,399 Speaker 1: to seven of the nine major comic strip syndicates and 393 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:29,679 Speaker 1: has gotten some praise and encouragement in return, but six, 394 00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:33,040 Speaker 1: including the Washington Post Writers Group, have turned him down 395 00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:37,200 Speaker 1: so far. Too angry, too college oriented, one syndicator said, 396 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:42,199 Speaker 1: too confrontational, said another. Amy Lago, executive editor for Comic 397 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:45,360 Speaker 1: Art at United Media says it's a conservative market. There 398 00:23:45,359 --> 00:23:48,679 Speaker 1: are complaints among edgier readers or cartoonists who would like 399 00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:51,840 Speaker 1: to do edgier material that everything on the newspaper comic 400 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:55,359 Speaker 1: page is milktoast. It becomes very difficult for newspapers to 401 00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:58,720 Speaker 1: take chances anymore. Lago says there's too much chance that 402 00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:01,399 Speaker 1: enough readers will come playing about the subject matter of 403 00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:04,879 Speaker 1: the strip and they'll threaten to cancel their subscription. The 404 00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:09,119 Speaker 1: real criticism McGruder believes is that his strip is too black, 405 00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:12,639 Speaker 1: and it doesn't seem like McGruder was wrong. All of 406 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:15,960 Speaker 1: the syndicates who rejected the Boondocks told him not to 407 00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:19,359 Speaker 1: change a thing. It's just that the world wasn't ready 408 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,240 Speaker 1: for it, as if these people had no control over 409 00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:24,679 Speaker 1: whether they could syndicate the strip or not. In nineteen 410 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:28,680 Speaker 1: ninety seven, there were only four nationally syndicated black cartoonists, 411 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:31,760 Speaker 1: and those numbers have not improved that much over time. 412 00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:49,960 Speaker 1: After years of this rejection and patronizing responses from the 413 00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: white higher ups who refused to carry a black socialist 414 00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:56,920 Speaker 1: cartoon in spite of its huge audience, the Universal Press 415 00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:00,720 Speaker 1: syndicate Home of Dunsberry and Kathy, Finally we picked it up. 416 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,520 Speaker 1: Unlike Gary Trudeau, Aery mcgruder's journey to being a comic 417 00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,239 Speaker 1: strip star was met with constant barriers to entry, in 418 00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:10,639 Speaker 1: spite of the fact that their missions to talk about 419 00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,880 Speaker 1: issues that affected them in an explicit and political way 420 00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 1: weren't dissimilar at all. But the Boondocks took off in 421 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:21,600 Speaker 1: the papers, immediately criticizing the then massive culture of gangster 422 00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 1: rapp through Riley's character, the hollow nationalism and warmongering the 423 00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:29,640 Speaker 1: came after nine to eleven, the entire concept of working 424 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,959 Speaker 1: within the system and the different ways that Huey, Riley 425 00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:36,840 Speaker 1: and their granddad navigated a world of racist, micro and 426 00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:40,600 Speaker 1: macro aggressions at school, in their neighborhood, and in the 427 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:43,800 Speaker 1: media they consumed, and McGruder had a lot of controversies 428 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:46,920 Speaker 1: as well. Let's cue the music again. Newspapers pulled a 429 00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:50,040 Speaker 1: strip of Huey calling a tipline to report Ronald Reagan 430 00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:53,240 Speaker 1: for funding terrorism after nine to eleven. The strip was 431 00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:56,360 Speaker 1: also pulled for a calling Condoleeza Rice a quote female 432 00:25:56,440 --> 00:25:59,960 Speaker 1: Darth Vader type that seeks a loving mate to torture. Unquote. 433 00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:02,600 Speaker 1: Strips got pulled or moved to the op ed section 434 00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:07,480 Speaker 1: when Huey criticized black Conservative commentator Larry Elder Beet got 435 00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:10,360 Speaker 1: mad when the Boondogs made fun of their repeated failures 436 00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:13,480 Speaker 1: to connect with black audiences, and one of my favorites. 437 00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:16,760 Speaker 1: There was a lot of criticism of mcgruder's ribbon and 438 00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:21,440 Speaker 1: flaggy propaganda comics made after nine eleven to mock strips 439 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 1: that were going whole uncritical nationalists instead of examining the 440 00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:30,359 Speaker 1: war that George W. Bush was starting for no reason. Okay, 441 00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:32,720 Speaker 1: we can stop the music. And again, there were some 442 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:35,480 Speaker 1: misfires within the strip. For example, the way that the 443 00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:38,879 Speaker 1: strip treated Whitney Houston through her addiction was very cruel. 444 00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:44,240 Speaker 1: But mcgruder's controversies generally mirror Trudeau's in that they intentionally 445 00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:47,560 Speaker 1: pissed the establishment publishing his work all the way off. 446 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:51,639 Speaker 1: But he didn't get the Pulitzers or establishment recognition that 447 00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:54,879 Speaker 1: Trudeau had, and given how much racism he'd been subjected 448 00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,840 Speaker 1: to in the pursuit of getting published nationally in the 449 00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:00,359 Speaker 1: first place, it is easy to guess why that may be. 450 00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:03,560 Speaker 1: What the establishment couldn't take were the sheer number of 451 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:06,720 Speaker 1: people who loved the comic and Huey Freeman, and much 452 00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:09,480 Speaker 1: of this has to do with its successful marketing crossover 453 00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 1: into an animated series on Adult Swim that ran from 454 00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:16,320 Speaker 1: two thousand and six to twenty fourteen, with mcgruder's close involvement, 455 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:19,560 Speaker 1: including a role as head writer. That was a major 456 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:22,480 Speaker 1: component of mcgruder's choice to not return to the strip 457 00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:24,880 Speaker 1: in two thousand and six, in spite of the universal 458 00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:27,760 Speaker 1: press indicate begging him to return. Here he is in 459 00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:31,480 Speaker 1: nineteen ninety nine, as the comic was becoming a cultural phenomenon. 460 00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:35,520 Speaker 1: On Charlie Rose, Sorry, and he's speaking about the challenges 461 00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,639 Speaker 1: of working in the medium. That's a tough question. I 462 00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:41,000 Speaker 1: mean some people said, well, did you get were you 463 00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:43,040 Speaker 1: just picked up because it was a black strip? And 464 00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:45,280 Speaker 1: is that why it's I'm just positive that's all these 465 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:47,600 Speaker 1: other things first, right, No, I mean, but does it 466 00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:49,520 Speaker 1: breakthrough because of that? But you know, I mean, let's 467 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:51,760 Speaker 1: we had you know, this is a it is certainly 468 00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:54,280 Speaker 1: a black strip. You know, there is nothing in comics 469 00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:57,359 Speaker 1: history to indicate that it is at all benefit to 470 00:27:57,400 --> 00:27:59,159 Speaker 1: be a black cartoonist or to do a black strip. 471 00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:03,440 Speaker 1: Those cartoonists that I mentioned again, Rob Armstrong is the 472 00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:06,680 Speaker 1: biggest and distribution. He's in over three hundred papers, and 473 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:08,359 Speaker 1: he's been doing it for over ten years. And you 474 00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:11,960 Speaker 1: want to compare that to the Peanuts or Calvin Howes, 475 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:16,160 Speaker 1: which each which are each in two thousand, two hundred papers. 476 00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:20,159 Speaker 1: So there has been no hugely successful black strip in 477 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:22,959 Speaker 1: the over one hundred year history of the medium. So 478 00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:27,000 Speaker 1: in that sense, it would the argument would be, you know, no, 479 00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 1: it's probably successful in spite of it being a black strip. 480 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 1: The Boondocks is a classic, and black cartoonists, non white 481 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:38,560 Speaker 1: cartoonists in general, are routinely passed over for wide syndication 482 00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 1: awards and recognition to this day. Again, for every time 483 00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:45,240 Speaker 1: that a comic syndicate has taken what they consider to 484 00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:48,720 Speaker 1: be a risk, they take ten boring comics by white 485 00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:53,440 Speaker 1: guys about household pets or literally nothing. Finally, I want 486 00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:56,959 Speaker 1: to discuss the comic that was most directly influenced and 487 00:28:57,040 --> 00:29:01,400 Speaker 1: was originally picked up off of Cathy's success, Lynn Johnston's 488 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 1: For Better or for Worse, launched in nineteen seventy nine 489 00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:08,080 Speaker 1: in the Universal Press Syndicate, partially off the strength of 490 00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:12,240 Speaker 1: Kathy's success in that same syndicate, starting in nineteen seventy six. 491 00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:15,520 Speaker 1: Johnson was a trained Canadian artist that had worked in 492 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:18,720 Speaker 1: animation and as a medical artist, and got her start 493 00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:21,880 Speaker 1: in strips while she was pregnant and drew single panel 494 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,880 Speaker 1: cartoon for her obstetrician's office. This collection later got published 495 00:29:25,880 --> 00:29:29,480 Speaker 1: as a book called David We're Pregnant in nineteen seventy three, 496 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:32,520 Speaker 1: leading to a contract with the Universal Press Indicate that 497 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:37,040 Speaker 1: was for twenty years. That is some scientology shit. An 498 00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:41,360 Speaker 1: early friend and mentor to Johnston was Charles Schultz of Peanuts. 499 00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:44,120 Speaker 1: He was also an early advocate for Kathy Guyswighte and 500 00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:47,920 Speaker 1: was known to mentor younger comic creators and provide support 501 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:51,000 Speaker 1: for people who were relatively new to the medium. Upon 502 00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:54,880 Speaker 1: accepting her twenty year contract, one of the first people 503 00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:59,760 Speaker 1: who called Lynn Johnston was wait for it, it was Kathy. 504 00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,960 Speaker 1: Kathy called her. Here's Lynn Johnston talking about that in 505 00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:07,720 Speaker 1: twenty nineteen to interviewer Bob Andelman, I mean, what a 506 00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:12,000 Speaker 1: great group of people, and we all got to know 507 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:15,040 Speaker 1: each other quite well. In fact, Kathy was the first 508 00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: person I talked to. Lee gave me her home phone number, 509 00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:20,160 Speaker 1: and she was gracious enough to have a nice long 510 00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:23,320 Speaker 1: conversation and sort of tell me how she worked the 511 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,800 Speaker 1: way she managed. I mean, coming up with ideas is 512 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:28,959 Speaker 1: the one thing we all ask each other about. I mean, 513 00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:30,520 Speaker 1: how do you do it? Where do you do it? 514 00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:34,640 Speaker 1: Sparky Schultz used to sit and doodle on yellow legal pads, 515 00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:36,360 Speaker 1: but I like to sit on a couch with a 516 00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:39,720 Speaker 1: coffee and a pad on my lap. And Kathy said 517 00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:41,760 Speaker 1: the thing that helped her the most was to write 518 00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 1: vignettes as if she was writing for a play, like 519 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:48,840 Speaker 1: a short, a short, four panel play. And I found 520 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:51,960 Speaker 1: that work the best for me. And you want to 521 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,480 Speaker 1: just make clear what Kathy we're talking about. Yeah, the 522 00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:59,440 Speaker 1: guys who has done called Kathy for many, many, many 523 00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,520 Speaker 1: years and also suggested I not call the strip the 524 00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:06,600 Speaker 1: Johnston's because she said, I have really wondered if it 525 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:08,840 Speaker 1: was a good idea to call the strip Kathy because 526 00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 1: she was so closely connected to it. And really, I mean, 527 00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:15,480 Speaker 1: even if the characters look like you or your family's all, 528 00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:18,840 Speaker 1: it's all pretty well made up. I love it. I 529 00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:21,800 Speaker 1: love Kathy. Okay, for better or for worse follows. The 530 00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:26,520 Speaker 1: Patterson family primarily stressed out matriarch Ellie Patterson who is 531 00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:31,040 Speaker 1: the wife to Sweetie Pie, dentist John and mother to Michael, Elizabeth, 532 00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:34,760 Speaker 1: and eventually April Patterson. In nineteen ninety one, Lynn Johnston 533 00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:37,720 Speaker 1: takes a pretty different tack to Kathy guys White when 534 00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:41,320 Speaker 1: exploring the anxieties of boomer women, though many of those 535 00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:44,440 Speaker 1: anxieties are the same. For Better or for Worse was 536 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:47,560 Speaker 1: much more mellow and realistic in tone than Kathy's more 537 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:51,720 Speaker 1: manic achisms. Ellie Patterson goes through periods of feeling bad 538 00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 1: about her body, often postpartum. There's a strip from the 539 00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,960 Speaker 1: eighties that shows three silent panels of Ellie trying to 540 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:00,880 Speaker 1: put on her pre pregnancy pants, looking at herself in 541 00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,440 Speaker 1: the mirror, looking at herself in a bathing suit, and 542 00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:05,840 Speaker 1: in the final strip, her well meaning husband looks at 543 00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:08,760 Speaker 1: a vacation brochure and says, yes, sir, if there's one 544 00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 1: thing I'm looking forward to when this cruise were taken, 545 00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:14,120 Speaker 1: it's the bood. Ellie looks at him blankly, knowing that 546 00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:16,280 Speaker 1: he doesn't get it. I've read quite a bit of 547 00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:19,120 Speaker 1: For Better for Worse and I like it. Ellie Patterson 548 00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:21,880 Speaker 1: is more or less the woman that Kathy was told 549 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,960 Speaker 1: she needed to be. She's a supermom, a loving wife 550 00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:27,400 Speaker 1: and daughter who is trying to have a career on 551 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,120 Speaker 1: top of it all, and this seems pretty firmly rooted 552 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:34,520 Speaker 1: in Johnston's own experiences as a wife, mother, and career woman. 553 00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:37,600 Speaker 1: But Ellie's career is very start and stop, depending on 554 00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:40,000 Speaker 1: the state of her family. At the beginning of the strip, 555 00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:42,959 Speaker 1: she works as a dental assistant in her husband's office, 556 00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:46,080 Speaker 1: then gets a job at a library, loses that job, 557 00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:48,560 Speaker 1: starts a part time job at a bookstore, and her 558 00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:51,920 Speaker 1: husband eventually buys the bookstore for her to run. Things 559 00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:55,520 Speaker 1: end well for her, but unlike Kathy, Ellie is a 560 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:59,560 Speaker 1: family before career woman, not too uncommon for the funny pages, 561 00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 1: but again it's Lynn Johnston's lived experience that gives the 562 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:08,360 Speaker 1: strip dimension. Ellie is constantly second guessing her life choices 563 00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:11,760 Speaker 1: in spite of being generally pretty happy. Is she not 564 00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:15,320 Speaker 1: being a good enough modern woman? Is wanting more for herself? 565 00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:19,800 Speaker 1: Inherently selfish, She's by no means a passive, happy housewife. 566 00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:23,160 Speaker 1: She's constantly trying and often failing, to find a better 567 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:25,560 Speaker 1: balance in her life. Here's a strip from the early 568 00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:28,760 Speaker 1: nineties to that effect. Ellie is returning to work after 569 00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:32,200 Speaker 1: having her third child and thinks to herself the following, 570 00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:37,800 Speaker 1: I haven't reviewed a book for weeks. I wonder how 571 00:33:37,840 --> 00:33:40,840 Speaker 1: my typing is. I wonder if the girl who's replaced 572 00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:43,800 Speaker 1: me as doing a good job. Is she doing better? 573 00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:47,200 Speaker 1: Do they miss me? I feel lost at work. I 574 00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:50,320 Speaker 1: had my identity, I had a title that meant something. 575 00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:54,200 Speaker 1: Her daughter, Elizabeth walks up to her desk, says, hi, mom, 576 00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:56,880 Speaker 1: and hugs her. Ellie thinks this to herself in the 577 00:33:56,920 --> 00:34:01,760 Speaker 1: final panel, and again, maybe I still do. And Lynn 578 00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:05,160 Speaker 1: Johnston did more than just the comic strips. She also 579 00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:08,560 Speaker 1: served as the president of the National Cartoonist Society in 580 00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:12,160 Speaker 1: the nineties. You know that organization that refused to admit 581 00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:15,280 Speaker 1: women at all until nineteen fifty one. And you won't 582 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:18,520 Speaker 1: believe this, but she wasn't always treated with respect there. 583 00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:21,359 Speaker 1: Here's how she describes her experience with the old Guard 584 00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:25,440 Speaker 1: of Cartoonists in that twenty nineteen interview. Well, at one 585 00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:29,400 Speaker 1: point I was actually president in National Cartoonists Society, and 586 00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:32,239 Speaker 1: they would draw naked pictures of me as I'm trying 587 00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:34,440 Speaker 1: to conduct a meeting, right, But I drew a few 588 00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:37,399 Speaker 1: naked pictures of my own and got back at them. 589 00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:39,840 Speaker 1: But you know, it was hard. They kind of preferred 590 00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:42,959 Speaker 1: that I would make them coffee and serve them tea 591 00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:46,880 Speaker 1: and not really run the meeting. In the long run, sorry, 592 00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:49,279 Speaker 1: in the long run, when it comes right down to it, 593 00:34:49,600 --> 00:34:52,080 Speaker 1: we really like each other, We really care for each other, 594 00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:55,080 Speaker 1: and I know that they like me. So it's water 595 00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:57,000 Speaker 1: under the bridge. But at the time, if you're trying 596 00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:01,440 Speaker 1: to conduct a meeting, put that pencil down. Johnston went 597 00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:04,719 Speaker 1: on to become the first woman and Canadian to ever 598 00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:07,800 Speaker 1: win the Reuben Award in nineteen eighty five, a full 599 00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:10,560 Speaker 1: thirty nine years after it started to be given out. 600 00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:13,680 Speaker 1: The second woman to win that award was Kathy Geiswhite 601 00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:17,000 Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety two. Johnston was also a finalist to 602 00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:19,719 Speaker 1: win a Pulitzer Prize for a coming out story that 603 00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:22,239 Speaker 1: ran in the comic strip in the early nineties at 604 00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:24,880 Speaker 1: the height of the AIDS epidemic, when no other artists 605 00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:27,680 Speaker 1: in the Funnies besides maybe Gary Trudell would touch it. 606 00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:30,600 Speaker 1: She's spoken out over the years on being a survivor 607 00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:34,640 Speaker 1: of child abuse, domestic abuse, and feeling unprepared to have 608 00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:37,080 Speaker 1: a child for the first time. For Better for Worse 609 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:40,760 Speaker 1: was a well loved, quietly subversive comic with a well loved, 610 00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:45,120 Speaker 1: quietly subversive creator, and the work still holds up. Two 611 00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:49,960 Speaker 1: conclude where Kathy falls in boundary push and comics very 612 00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:53,080 Speaker 1: much depends on what lens you're using. On the pages 613 00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:56,440 Speaker 1: of the Funnies, she represented the beginning of a resurgence 614 00:35:56,480 --> 00:36:00,880 Speaker 1: of women in nationally syndicated strips talking about their own experiences, 615 00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:04,240 Speaker 1: a surge that hadn't been seen for around fifty years. 616 00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:07,239 Speaker 1: If you use women's comics as a yardstick, it's a 617 00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:10,280 Speaker 1: reminder that Kathy was far from one of the radical 618 00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:13,840 Speaker 1: voices that shaped the underground movement. Again, the role to 619 00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:17,319 Speaker 1: Kathy character serves was as an observer of how things 620 00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:20,080 Speaker 1: were for women like her at the time, not an 621 00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:22,839 Speaker 1: attempt to shift the norm. Okay, Kathy, you can come 622 00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:25,680 Speaker 1: out now. You didn't talk about Dalebird? No, I didn't. 623 00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:28,919 Speaker 1: I decided to love myself again? Or Ziggy? Is he cool? 624 00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:33,040 Speaker 1: We fucked? Don't talk much anymore, Kathy. You really do fuck, 625 00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:37,960 Speaker 1: don't you? I really do, I really really do. Okay, 626 00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:41,040 Speaker 1: we'll be talking more about the comics and comic artists 627 00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:43,880 Speaker 1: who came after Kathy in a future episode, and the 628 00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:46,839 Speaker 1: explosion in new voices that came to the forefront when 629 00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:50,239 Speaker 1: zines and the Internet became the norm, and how the 630 00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:54,160 Speaker 1: Funnies lagged so far behind that they've arguably become kind 631 00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:57,640 Speaker 1: of irrelevant in their time and the format where they appeared. 632 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:00,960 Speaker 1: Kathy and for Better or for Worse found their strength 633 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:05,440 Speaker 1: in showing women who were not particularly subverting expectations, but 634 00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:07,839 Speaker 1: we're doing their best in a world where they were 635 00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:10,360 Speaker 1: never supposed to have at all. But for all the 636 00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:13,400 Speaker 1: airtime Boomers were given in the newspapers, they went on 637 00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:18,279 Speaker 1: to become one of the country's most despised generations of 638 00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:21,600 Speaker 1: all time, by me specifically, but by others too. And 639 00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:24,680 Speaker 1: that's what we're talking about next episode, Kathy and the 640 00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:29,120 Speaker 1: boomer generation's journey from young radicals to Reagan era yuppies 641 00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:32,280 Speaker 1: to a generation that even now can't let go of power. 642 00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:34,880 Speaker 1: We'll talk about the generation at large and to a 643 00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:39,040 Speaker 1: series of boomer women your Mommy's about their journey in 644 00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:42,239 Speaker 1: the workplace, and of course we'll talk to our girl, Kathy. 645 00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:46,680 Speaker 1: That's in two weeks on ac Cast. Ac Cast is 646 00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:51,560 Speaker 1: an iHeartRadio production hosted, written and researched by me Jamie Loftus. 647 00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:54,480 Speaker 1: The show is executive produced by the wonderful Sophie Lichtermann, 648 00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:58,280 Speaker 1: edited by the wonderful Isaac Taylor. Music is by Zoe 649 00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:02,319 Speaker 1: Blade and our theme from Brad Dickert. Voices you heard 650 00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:07,960 Speaker 1: today include my Mother. Also includes Joel Smith, Caitlin Durante, 651 00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:11,680 Speaker 1: and Jackie Michelle Johnson as Kathy. This has been the 652 00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,600 Speaker 1: first half of Act cast. We are taking next week 653 00:38:14,719 --> 00:38:17,759 Speaker 1: off for you to just soak it in, and we'll 654 00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:20,120 Speaker 1: be back with the remainder of the show a week 655 00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:25,480 Speaker 1: from Monday. Bye.