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Speaker 1: Wind down with Janet and her radio podcast. Okay, so

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Speaker 1: we know that obviously what we're talking about today UM

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Speaker 1: can be considered a controversial topic and there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of misinformation, and our intention is not to spread misinformation. UM.

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Speaker 1: We just want to allow our guests that we have

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Speaker 1: on today to give their opinions and have a discussion. UM.

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Speaker 1: That being said, we do not pretend to be doctors

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Speaker 1: or scientists or give medical advice. We just wanted to

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Speaker 1: have this conversation. But we encourage y'all to do your research,

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Speaker 1: consult with your health care professional. UM. We know that

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Speaker 1: there are many opinions, and we will continue the conversation

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Speaker 1: UM and educate ourselves UM, within our marriage and our

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Speaker 1: UM and you know, with with our kids. UM. You know,

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Speaker 1: we obviously have Robert Kenney Jr. Joining us today on

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Speaker 1: the show, and we also have a UM doctor, Dr.

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Speaker 1: A Malkin, UM who's going to just be on the

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Speaker 1: other side of things because we want there to there's always,

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Speaker 1: you know, two sides, and we believe that both voices

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Speaker 1: deserve to be heard. Yeah. I think it's just our

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Speaker 1: job as citizens and as people right on any kind

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Speaker 1: of topic that can be passionate and controversial is to

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Speaker 1: just gather information and that's all we're doing on this episode.

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Speaker 1: We just want to give different sides of the coin,

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Speaker 1: allow people to make up their own minds, and you know,

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Speaker 1: to not be um mean about it or post negative comments.

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Speaker 1: It's just again, UM, there's so many things out there

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Speaker 1: right now, lots of misinformation. So we just we got

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Speaker 1: the two best that we know to kind of debunk

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Speaker 1: certain things, um and express their thoughts and their feelings.

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Speaker 1: And don't worry, we'll be back to our regular scheduled

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Speaker 1: programming of Mike and Jana fighting next week. So until then, UM,

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Speaker 1: let's get on with the show. And just a disclaimer

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Speaker 1: because we're going there. The views and opinions express are

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Speaker 1: solely of the individuals participating in the podcast and do

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Speaker 1: not represent the opinions of I Heart Media or its employees.

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Speaker 1: This podcast should not be used as medical advice or

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Speaker 1: as imparting any healthcare recommendations at all. Individuals are advised

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Speaker 1: to seek independent medical counseling, advice, intoit therapy from a

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Speaker 1: competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition,

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Speaker 1: choices regarding vaccinations, mental health issues, health inquiry, or matter,

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Speaker 1: including matters discussed on this podcast. Guests and listeners should

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Speaker 1: not rely on matters discussing the podcast, and shall not

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Speaker 1: act or refrain from acting based on information contained the

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Speaker 1: podcast without first seeking independent medical advice. And that goes

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Speaker 1: as well for all the advice we give you in

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Speaker 1: our marriage, because the Lord knows we don't know what

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Speaker 1: we're doing, but we're just going on. We don't know

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Speaker 1: what we don't know. So take everything you're hear here

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Speaker 1: for what it is. You know, I was even talking

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Speaker 1: to my mother earlier. Why do you say it like that?

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Speaker 1: I hope that. I hope our kids never say my

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Speaker 1: mother earlier, my mommy, you my mommy. I do I

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Speaker 1: want you to say, I'm talking to mommy earlier, mommy earlier,

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Speaker 1: And I was telling her who we are having on today?

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Speaker 1: And it's just you know, even for I think any

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Speaker 1: generation is like like we're now legit, like you guys

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Speaker 1: are actually this is actually your job. Okay, Um, we

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Speaker 1: have a Kennedy on today, yes, um, very excited and

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Speaker 1: um I also have two of my high school girlfriends

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Speaker 1: joining us, Chelsea and Andrea say hello, hello, thanks for

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Speaker 1: having us. Of course, so we um we did an

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Speaker 1: episode a few weeks ago that involved UM. We talked

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Speaker 1: to Dr Oz and just a few questions, and I

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Speaker 1: gotta say I had Andrea looked through some of the comments,

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Speaker 1: but some of the comments on the podcast were pretty rough. Really. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: They said that, you know, our job is like that

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Speaker 1: we were kind of like misinforming. And I think the

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Speaker 1: issue is we were to talk about a lot of things, right,

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Speaker 1: but we also want to have different sides of the story,

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Speaker 1: just like you know how we have different therapists come

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Speaker 1: on in different opinions, and you know, Dr Oz was

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Speaker 1: four vaccinations, and you know, you have the other side

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Speaker 1: saying that it's dangerous for us to even talk about

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Speaker 1: the other side. And you know, I feel like that's

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Speaker 1: where we're doing a disservice too, because I think both

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Speaker 1: sides need to be heard. And I was reading some

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Speaker 1: of my comments and two of my high school girlfriends

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Speaker 1: UM had tagged uh Robert Kennedy Jr. In one of

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Speaker 1: my posts and said that we should get him on

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Speaker 1: the podcast to talk about the opposite side of vaccinations.

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Speaker 1: And I thought it was obviously in an interesting idea, UM,

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Speaker 1: because there is such a some information for one side.

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Speaker 1: And then the other UM. So that's how Andrea and

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Speaker 1: Chelsea are now on this podcast with us UM and

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Speaker 1: y'all have a lot of information on on Mr Kennedy.

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Speaker 1: Don't you sure this is the same come true to

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Speaker 1: be able to speak with him. He's one of the

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Speaker 1: most knowledgeable people out there on vaccine safety and legislator,

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Speaker 1: and he's worked to fight against huge major companies just

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Speaker 1: all in the name of children's rights, which is fantastic.

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Speaker 1: I commend you guys for bringing this up. A lot

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Speaker 1: of people won't touch this topic, and I do think

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Speaker 1: it's so important to tell both sides of the story right,

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Speaker 1: to give people a chance, give them the resources, give

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Speaker 1: them the information, give them a chance to make the

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Speaker 1: decision that's best for their family that they believe. And

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Speaker 1: so you know, you're never going to make everyone happy.

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Speaker 1: I get that, but I really applied you guys for

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Speaker 1: doing that. So why do you guys think subjects as

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Speaker 1: this where people their beliefs. It almost seems like it's

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Speaker 1: either right or wrong. Right, Like it's almost like Republican

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Speaker 1: first Democrat. Why is this topic, in y'all's opinions, such

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Speaker 1: a topic that it's like when someone believes the other

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Speaker 1: majority of people, it seems like, are like, well, that's

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Speaker 1: clearly wrong. Why would you believe that? H In my opinion,

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Speaker 1: I think it's because we're going to our doctors, right,

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Speaker 1: And it's really our doctors that are telling us this

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Speaker 1: is what we need to do. Your kind of mandated

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Speaker 1: to do these shots for your kids to go to school.

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Speaker 1: And so I think we're just trusting the people that

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Speaker 1: are advising our health for our children. And also in

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Speaker 1: media comes out and gives you all the ads and

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Speaker 1: everything that's pushing that they're safe. So I think it's

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Speaker 1: really hard to unlearn something that you've been indoctrinating with

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Speaker 1: really your whole life. If you've grown up knowing I

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Speaker 1: have to get my vaccines, these are gonna make me healthy,

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Speaker 1: this is gonna make me safe. I think it's really hard,

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Speaker 1: which is why we commend you so much for actually

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Speaker 1: been looking into this, because it's very eye opening once

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Speaker 1: you start reading about it, and it's hard. It's really

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Speaker 1: hard to wrap your mind around something that you believed

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Speaker 1: your whole life is safe to find out that it

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Speaker 1: might not be. And and here's here's what I believe.

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Speaker 1: I believe that the people that are in the positions

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Speaker 1: that Chelsea and I aron where they've really challenged vaccines

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Speaker 1: and they've done the research, they feel strongly about it

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Speaker 1: because we feel like the other side hasn't done that research,

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Speaker 1: because honestly, I don't know many people that can do

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Speaker 1: truly do that research, read the studies, find the wholes,

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Speaker 1: find the lies, and still pour it vaccinated so strongly

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Speaker 1: to your point, might like with the emotion and with

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Speaker 1: so much conviction, like I am just it's to me

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Speaker 1: it was very compelling, and I mean Chelsea and I

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Speaker 1: were pretty logical, pretty rational, well educated people. Like It's

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Speaker 1: not like I think it just surprises people. They think

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Speaker 1: that people who you know, challenge vaccinations aren't in their circles,

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Speaker 1: you know, they think that there's these people they don't know,

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Speaker 1: who are these crazy people like that are just you know,

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Speaker 1: they're children are getting sick all the time, infecting others,

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Speaker 1: And it's like, I think actually some of the friends

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Speaker 1: in our circles were shocked to learn that we were

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Speaker 1: quote those people, right, we were the people that are

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Speaker 1: actually challenging vaccines and haven't necessarily followed the full schedule

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Speaker 1: with our children. And I think two people are very

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Speaker 1: surprised to find out how healthy unvaccinated children are. And

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Speaker 1: I think it's hard for people to say, like, what

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Speaker 1: I did everything right? I did everything my doctor said,

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Speaker 1: why is my child always sick? But you're the one

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Speaker 1: who's supposed to have the sick child because you're not

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Speaker 1: doing it. So I think it's just a lot of

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Speaker 1: understanding and researching, but people need to change their entire

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Speaker 1: way of thinking. And my lunch side, it's like, once

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Speaker 1: I started really researching and seeing the hard facts, it's like,

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Speaker 1: this is this is just almost a crime against humanity.

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Speaker 1: What's going on? The last thing is just it's also

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Speaker 1: people are super defensive. It's their children, and nobody want

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Speaker 1: to maybe they made a decision for their children that

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Speaker 1: is maybe going to post problems for them later in life,

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Speaker 1: or that they had if they didn't have like a

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Speaker 1: severe bad reaction immediately, like maybe it's gonna So of

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Speaker 1: course everybody's defensive about that. We're all trying to make

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Speaker 1: the best issuerson for our children. You know, right, what

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Speaker 1: inspired both of you too to start going down this

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Speaker 1: this direction? Right? What was the one thing that kind

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Speaker 1: of sparked it for you to be like, wait a second,

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Speaker 1: I don't know about this. Yeah I I can, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I can start so. Um. So, when I had my daughter,

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Speaker 1: she's three now, we were living in California, and California

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Speaker 1: at the time was a state that only allowed medical exemptions,

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Speaker 1: meaning you could only be exempt from certain vaccines if

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Speaker 1: you had a medical reason and a note from your

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Speaker 1: doctor stating that. So whereas other states will allow like

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Speaker 1: personal belief exemptions and religious exemptions, so you can claim

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Speaker 1: that as a reason for which you're not vaccinating or

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Speaker 1: fully vaccinating your child. So at the time, you know,

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Speaker 1: even when I was pregnant, I started looking into it

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Speaker 1: because I'm a type of person that if there's any

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Speaker 1: debate on a topic, I want to know both sides,

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Speaker 1: I want to do my research and I want to

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Speaker 1: come to my own conclusion. I started looking into it,

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Speaker 1: and to be honest, I didn't found I didn't find

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Speaker 1: all the research that I ended up finding a couple

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Speaker 1: of years later or a year later, but I found

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Speaker 1: some and it was enough to to basically direct me

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Speaker 1: to a pediatrician or lead me to a pediatrician that

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Speaker 1: allowed a staggered schedule or like a delayed schedule. So

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Speaker 1: for the first year my daughter's life. We lived in

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Speaker 1: California and we were vaccinating on a very delayed schedule.

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Speaker 1: Then when we moved back to Michigan, a state that

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Speaker 1: allowed all exemptions personal, religious, and medical, when I tried

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Speaker 1: to find a pediatrician, the first question they all asked

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Speaker 1: me was are you fully vaccinating? And I was like, well, no,

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Speaker 1: but you know, and so then it really prompted me

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Speaker 1: to dig in further. And what I found then was like,

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Speaker 1: just to me, I was like, I was astounded. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I would read books and my heart would be racing

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Speaker 1: because then I would look at certain things that had

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Speaker 1: happened with my daughter, and they weren't major reactions, thankfully,

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Speaker 1: but there were little things along the way that I

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Speaker 1: was like, wow, was that because of the vaccines we

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Speaker 1: gave her. So what I did at that point was,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I really I dove in. I found Children's

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Speaker 1: Health Defense, I found Robert Kennedy. I watched his videos,

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Speaker 1: and I mean I was just shocked, and like, I

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Speaker 1: know that Robert will hit on a couple of the

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Speaker 1: high points, but the two that really I guess stuck

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Speaker 1: with me that I want to call out is the metals,

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Speaker 1: like the ingredients and there's a lot of ingredients that

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Speaker 1: there are that I have challenges with, but one is aluminum.

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Speaker 1: It's a known neurotoxin. And one example that I feel

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Speaker 1: like is so poignant because this information comes from the

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Speaker 1: CDC website, it comes from the FDA. One of the

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Speaker 1: popular versions of the heppy shot that's given to infants

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Speaker 1: less than twenty four hours old, has point to milligrams

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Speaker 1: of aluminum minute if you look at per If you

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Speaker 1: look at the FDA website, it says the safe amount

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Speaker 1: that's allowed in drinking water of aluminum is point to

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Speaker 1: milligrams per leader. Yet per milli leader of the vaccine,

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Speaker 1: there's point five milligrams of aluminum. So, like, how can

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Speaker 1: you trust the fact that this information you're getting from

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Speaker 1: the FDA directly negates what's happening with the CDC and

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Speaker 1: the information that's in the vaccine they want you to

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Speaker 1: give your child at twenty four hours old. That blew

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Speaker 1: my mind. Then the other one that I'm sure Robert

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Speaker 1: Robert will touch on is the fact that in the

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Speaker 1: law was passed that basically took all liability away from

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Speaker 1: vaccine manufacturers because they went to the government and said

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Speaker 1: vaccines are unavoidably unsafe, and there's too much liability for

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Speaker 1: us in this business. You need to protect us and

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Speaker 1: at that point free from all liability. So imagine you

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Speaker 1: have a car seat for your child. If you knew

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Speaker 1: that that sheet manufacturer was exempt from liability, would you

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Speaker 1: use that car seat for your child? That's that's the

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Speaker 1: analogy we use. So it is because it just like

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Speaker 1: any product anything, And if you knew that a bunch

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Speaker 1: of chill like then that we are using for because

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Speaker 1: climbing out of this crib. I just the one disclaimer

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Speaker 1: I want to make though, is like this is truly

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Speaker 1: this is a very personal choice. And I know that

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Speaker 1: people argue it affects others and it may, but we

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Speaker 1: all do things that affect each other every day. But

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Speaker 1: I just think this is a very personal decision. And

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Speaker 1: I think everybody needs to research on their own. As

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Speaker 1: you guys said, they need to come down to the

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Speaker 1: best choice for their family, and they also need to

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Speaker 1: research the risk on the disease and and and determine

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Speaker 1: is the risk of the disease going out weigh the

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Speaker 1: risk of the vaccine. Like, I think that's such an

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Speaker 1: important point because people you can't just go into this

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Speaker 1: blindly and be like, yeah, vaccines are unsafe. You have

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Speaker 1: to understand what you're up against and you have to

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Speaker 1: make your own decision. And I think that's why it's

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Speaker 1: not about being we we hate the term anti BAXX,

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Speaker 1: and thank you for not using it, because it's really

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Speaker 1: just about understanding that it's not one size fits all.

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Speaker 1: We want more transparency, we want more safety, and you

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Speaker 1: hear Robert advocate for at as well. We want we

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Speaker 1: want the exemptions, don't take away the exemptions, and a

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Speaker 1: lot of states are at risk for that. So I

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Speaker 1: just want to make that disclaimer that it's really just

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Speaker 1: about information, about doing your research and making the decision

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Speaker 1: that's best for your family, and we're not judging anybody

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Speaker 1: for what they do. We just want people to understand

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Speaker 1: that there is a lot of abalidity to this side. Chelsea,

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Speaker 1: what about you? Where was the spark for you? So

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Speaker 1: the spark for me was really, um, you know, when

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Speaker 1: I first started, when I was pregnant with my first child,

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Speaker 1: I just I had no idea about vaccines and I

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Speaker 1: just thought it was something you do, it's safe whatever. Um,

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Speaker 1: what really first piqued my interest was my our pediatrician,

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Speaker 1: who is very pro vaccine, told us not to do

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Speaker 1: the happy shot at birth. And that was really surprising

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Speaker 1: because then I started researching, like, well, okay, well what

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Speaker 1: about everything else? And he basically had said, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: do everything else, you know this and that, but just

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Speaker 1: don't do happy at birth. It's not necessary, it's unsafe.

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Speaker 1: And and so from there I went home and I

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Speaker 1: started reading more books and researching it more. Um, and

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Speaker 1: then I saw that on the CDC schedule that there

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Speaker 1: were four shots that they wanted to give. I think

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Speaker 1: it's what a two months old or eight weeks old,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, oh my gosh, four shots. That

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Speaker 1: that's crazy. Um. I don't even like to get shots,

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Speaker 1: much less to give my infant four shots all at once.

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Speaker 1: That it seemed strange to me and somewhat cruel that

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Speaker 1: we'd have to have their infant bodies, whose their immune

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Speaker 1: systems aren't completely developed, to fight off four viruses or

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Speaker 1: diseases all at once, when in a natural environment that

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Speaker 1: would really never happen. So that really started to pique

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Speaker 1: my interest. And then really just as a mom, initially

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Speaker 1: I'm like, this is just kind of cool. I don't

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Speaker 1: want to give my baby four shots all at once.

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Speaker 1: So initially it was really just I just wanted to

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Speaker 1: do one at a time and then go from there,

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Speaker 1: so doing one at a time. My daughter had an

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Speaker 1: initial adverse reaction to detail the first shot that she had,

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Speaker 1: and that was around eight months old, and then I

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Speaker 1: waited almost two years or like a year and a

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Speaker 1: half to give her her second shot of DETAP and

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Speaker 1: she was around two years old at that time, and

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Speaker 1: she had a really bad reaction to it at that time.

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Speaker 1: And since that first point of the first reaction around

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Speaker 1: her being just under a year, I started doing even

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Speaker 1: more research and more research. But again I was still

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Speaker 1: on the train of but I'm supposed to do this,

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Speaker 1: but my doctor says I should, and you know, he

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Speaker 1: even said, like, let's hold off on the detail for

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Speaker 1: a while and just do these other ones. So then

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Speaker 1: at that point I was kind of picking and choosing

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Speaker 1: which one is based on the research I did, like,

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Speaker 1: you know, does the disease outweigh the vaccine? And from there, um,

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Speaker 1: I think I was just really shocked on all of it,

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Speaker 1: and that just kind of piqued my interest in the night.

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Speaker 1: For the last three years, I've really been spending the

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Speaker 1: majority of my time researching things on vaccine safety and

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Speaker 1: really following UM Robert Kennedy Jr. In his pH d

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Speaker 1: and everything that they've been doing to advocate for this,

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Speaker 1: And I've really just had a passion for it because

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Speaker 1: I do see some of the other children suffering from

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Speaker 1: adverse reactions that people I don't think initially correlate with

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Speaker 1: vaccines UM. You know. So that's kind of where I've

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Speaker 1: started coming from. Well, speaking of Robert H. F. Kennedy Jr.

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Speaker 1: We have him in the waiting room, so should we

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Speaker 1: bring him on? Let's bring him in? Hey everybody, Hey, hey,

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Speaker 1: Mr Kennedy, how are you doing, sir? I'm great good.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna go ahead and intro you, intro you, and

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Speaker 1: then we're gonna get going. You look beautiful. Really, it's

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Speaker 1: all make up, all right. So we have a legend

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Speaker 1: in in in our on our show today and someone

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Speaker 1: who doesn't need much of an introduction, but we have

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Speaker 1: Mr Robert Kennedy Jr. On the show. Welcome him to wind.

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Speaker 1: Mr Kennedy, thank you so much for coming on our show.

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Speaker 1: We really appreciate it. We're we're honored, honored and humbled

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Speaker 1: that you're here with us, especially to talk about something

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Speaker 1: that's uh, I think on a lot of people's minds

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Speaker 1: these days, especially with young ones for sure. And I

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Speaker 1: didn't think you were going to DM me back. My

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Speaker 1: two girlfriends and I went to high school with UM

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Speaker 1: have followed you from the beginning, and UM you know

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Speaker 1: they love everything that you do with the Children's Health

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Speaker 1: Defense Organization and you know they were the ones that

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Speaker 1: said try and get him on your podcast. And so

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Speaker 1: that's when I was like, I texted Chelsea, the beautiful

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Speaker 1: one in pink, and I said, should I ask him

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Speaker 1: a I d MM? Like, what do I do? Should

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Speaker 1: I ask him out? You can please? You a perfect

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Speaker 1: time because I'm so technologically an app that I never

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Speaker 1: looked at my d ms before. It just happened. That

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Speaker 1: guy who was staying with man said, you know there's

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Speaker 1: a lot of people I mean, I was like, what

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Speaker 1: does that mean perfect timing? Well, I'm gonna go ahead

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Speaker 1: and jump in here with you, Mr Kennedy, because I

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Speaker 1: know your time is valuable. And you know, we had

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Speaker 1: a doctor oz on our show a couple of weeks

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Speaker 1: ago and we got onto the topic. Janna and I

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Speaker 1: have two young little ones. We have a five and

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Speaker 1: two year old, and we got on the topic of

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Speaker 1: vaccines and he was very pro vaccine and his right

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Speaker 1: in his opinion and his expertise is great. And but

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Speaker 1: we we like to give our listeners, you know, both

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Speaker 1: sides of the coin, because we just want people to

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Speaker 1: have all the information that they can and who have

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Speaker 1: who better to talk about the other side of it

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Speaker 1: than you? And I know Janna and I have gone

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Speaker 1: back and forth a lot recently about this, and you know,

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Speaker 1: we're of those minds as we want to trust our doctors,

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Speaker 1: the people who were ed ucated and given degrees professionally

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Speaker 1: for for information that they're giving us. And at what point, like,

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Speaker 1: are we supposed to start questioning our doctors And we

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Speaker 1: want to believe these people, but you know, it's scary

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Speaker 1: to think that we have to start questioning it. I mean,

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Speaker 1: let me go back a little. Okay, Doctors are not scientists.

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Speaker 1: They're not taught you know, they're not taught science. They're

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Speaker 1: brilliant people and they go to medical school and the

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Speaker 1: medical schools are largely funded by pharmaceutical companies, and they're

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Speaker 1: taught how to recognize as the is and they're um

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Speaker 1: and they memorize huge amounts of information. But those aren't

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Speaker 1: science schools. People who are scientists have an entirely different

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Speaker 1: set of skills, which is how to read a study critically.

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Speaker 1: A lot of it is statistical and and um, my

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Speaker 1: actual my career has been in legation and and our

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Speaker 1: metal itches. I brought hundreds and hundreds of cases. I

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Speaker 1: brought the case that was on now the subject of

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Speaker 1: the film of the Mark Buffalo filta dark Quarters, which

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Speaker 1: whether it was the DuPont case, I brought the you know,

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Speaker 1: I was on the trial team in the Santo case.

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Speaker 1: But hundreds and hundreds of cases, and in every one

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Speaker 1: of those cases cecific. And so you have experts on

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Speaker 1: one side that says, you know, roundup is who's a

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Speaker 1: who swear to you very convincingly the roundup is safe

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Speaker 1: and at it quite warm cause Monta Hodgkins and fauna.

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Speaker 1: And then we have our experts that come on and say,

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Speaker 1: wait a second. The studies that you were relying on,

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Speaker 1: our studies that were done by industry, and here are

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Speaker 1: the flaws that they have in them, and they are

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Speaker 1: a deliberate deception. They're deliberate fraud. Oh, of a battleground

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Speaker 1: of the experts, and those skills to read those studies

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Speaker 1: critically are seldom taught medical school. I've talked to many

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Speaker 1: many doctors and said to them, why do you think that,

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Speaker 1: including doctor Oz, it's my friend, and I've said to him,

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Speaker 1: why do you think that the vaccine is safe? And

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Speaker 1: can you name me a study this particular vaccine. Why

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Speaker 1: do you think that that vaccine is of earning more

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Speaker 1: problems than it's causing. Showed me the science, and I'll

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Speaker 1: believe you. And you know, all the years that I've

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Speaker 1: been doing is I've never had a doctor come back

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Speaker 1: and say, oh, well you can look at the you know,

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Speaker 1: the first rat and study and or anything like that.

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Speaker 1: And what they pediatricians particularly have told me is in

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Speaker 1: medical school, we are given at most half a day

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Speaker 1: on vaccines, and we're taught here, the vaccine is that

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Speaker 1: you give. Here are the disease they prevent. If you

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Speaker 1: don't give ease, we're gonna have an influx of diseases.

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Speaker 1: And they're not taught to read the manufacturers inserts. They're

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Speaker 1: never asked to look at the ingredients of the vaccine

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Speaker 1: and and explain how mercury injected into a child is

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Speaker 1: going to leave that child's body unharmed. Listen, if somebody

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Speaker 1: says to me, here's a study body that shows you're wrong,

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Speaker 1: that shows that vaccinated kids are healthier than unvaccinated, I'll

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Speaker 1: make this pledge to you today. I will put that

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Speaker 1: study on my website. I will close down my organization,

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Speaker 1: and I'll go back to doing what a keeper full time.

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Speaker 1: I'll never find that study. Damn. I mean, I'm gonna ask.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna play Devil's advocate for one second and I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna ask. So you're dealing with the masses here, and

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Speaker 1: things can become subjective to an extent. Think about psychological

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Speaker 1: issues maybe kids may deal with. Maybe a kid was

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Speaker 1: neglected or abandoned as a child. You take two kids

429
00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:21,840
Speaker 1: in the same scenario. One could turn out one way.

430
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:25,040
Speaker 1: One could turn out a completely different way, regardless of

431
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:27,439
Speaker 1: how even if they're raised the exact same way with

432
00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:31,080
Speaker 1: some kind of abandonment and neglect, addiction in their family

433
00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:33,800
Speaker 1: or whatever, and they can still turn out completely different. Right,

434
00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:37,639
Speaker 1: So something like this, you take the vaccines, and you

435
00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:39,639
Speaker 1: have two kids, and you and you, you know, inject

436
00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:41,479
Speaker 1: them with these vaccines and the end of the end

437
00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:43,840
Speaker 1: of their life or later in their life, they could

438
00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:47,360
Speaker 1: have completely different results. Right where there's I'm sure there's

439
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:49,679
Speaker 1: kids out there. I don't This isn't factual, just in

440
00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:51,760
Speaker 1: my opinion of playing the numbers game. I'm sure there's

441
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:53,800
Speaker 1: kids out there that haven't had any side effects or

442
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 1: issues due to vaccines, and then there's kids that apparently

443
00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 1: clearly have. So Mr Kennedy, are you trying to convince

444
00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:10,200
Speaker 1: like America to just stay away from vaccines altogether when

445
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:12,520
Speaker 1: you have these people that have had kids or that

446
00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:15,000
Speaker 1: have had no issues like I guess, how do you

447
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 1: even steer people like that away? Or are they just

448
00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:23,760
Speaker 1: anomalies and you just you can't help everybody. Oh, here's

449
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,720
Speaker 1: two answers questions. The first hand, there is I am

450
00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 1: not any vaccine. I am all I've said, and I've

451
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,760
Speaker 1: said that from the beginning. I had all my kids vaccinated.

452
00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:38,639
Speaker 1: All I got vacccines every single year, vaccines for twenty years.

453
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:42,679
Speaker 1: Would I do that if I want to go back, No,

454
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:46,120
Speaker 1: I would not, because now I know a lot about vaccines.

455
00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 1: But I am no, I'm not ideologically against vacccines. What

456
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:56,560
Speaker 1: I've said is if they test the vaccine like every

457
00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 1: other medication is supposed to be tested. And I'll call

458
00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 1: up shop. And what that means is you take a

459
00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:10,440
Speaker 1: vaccinated group and a politic EPO group, give them both

460
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:14,240
Speaker 1: the vaccine. That's what happens, and see who has better

461
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:19,159
Speaker 1: health outcomes, if the vaccinated children have better health outcomes,

462
00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,639
Speaker 1: and I close up shop and go away. But we

463
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:25,160
Speaker 1: have on our website we've been able to go through,

464
00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 1: you know that all of the archives of all the

465
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:33,560
Speaker 1: medical literature. There's one place where an I age. It's

466
00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:36,639
Speaker 1: a library for all the peer reviewed studies that have

467
00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:40,800
Speaker 1: ever been done, and it's called pub med, and we

468
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:44,520
Speaker 1: go on pub med and you know there haven't the

469
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:48,399
Speaker 1: CDC try just to stop these studies from being done

470
00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:54,879
Speaker 1: vaccinated for its unvaccinated studies, but nevertheless, scientists have managed

471
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,399
Speaker 1: throughout time to do them. And we have about the

472
00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:02,480
Speaker 1: sixth them now on my Instagram. I published them periodically

473
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:06,000
Speaker 1: in groups in a way that's very easy to read

474
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:10,240
Speaker 1: that anybody with the second grade education can read them,

475
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:14,680
Speaker 1: and um, and we know what the studies say. In

476
00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:17,280
Speaker 1: every case, we've been able to find the kids who

477
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:23,560
Speaker 1: are vaccinated have higher degrees of allergies, they have more

478
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:28,200
Speaker 1: allergic right nitis, they have I'm more visits to the hospital,

479
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:32,400
Speaker 1: they have much larger higher special education. They have more diabetes,

480
00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:37,480
Speaker 1: they are more arthritis there, they have shorter lifespans. And

481
00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:41,959
Speaker 1: so what I'm saying is, let's test these and listen,

482
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:47,320
Speaker 1: they're completely the company has no incentive to make these

483
00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:51,720
Speaker 1: vaccines safe. Think of the companies that you're dealing with here.

484
00:27:52,600 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 1: It's four companies, Merk, synophi Isser, and uh Glaxo Smith Clients. Yeah,

485
00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 1: those four companies, and these are the companies that brought

486
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:08,679
Speaker 1: us the opioidmic What if you told them you can

487
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,960
Speaker 1: sell all the oidiodes that you ever want and nobody

488
00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:15,119
Speaker 1: can ever be allowed to sue you. That's the position

489
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:19,400
Speaker 1: they're in. These four companies in the last ten years

490
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:26,040
Speaker 1: have paid thirty five billion dollars in criminal penalties and

491
00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:31,399
Speaker 1: damages for falsifying signs, for line to regulators, for defrauding doctors,

492
00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 1: providing blackmailing, committing all kinds of criminal acts. What makes

493
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:41,640
Speaker 1: it takes a kind of cognitive dissonance to believe that

494
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 1: those companies at what that that aren't doing that stuff,

495
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:50,680
Speaker 1: even when they can get caught and get sued. Did

496
00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 1: you read the political article that came out? Because I

497
00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:56,959
Speaker 1: was curious and what you thought about that because they

498
00:28:57,000 --> 00:29:02,600
Speaker 1: were saying that what article it? It said? It said, UM,

499
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:05,280
Speaker 1: Robert F. K Jr. Is our brother and uncle. He's

500
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,120
Speaker 1: tragically wrong about vaccines. And basically in the article it

501
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 1: had said UM immunizations prevent some two million to three

502
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 1: million deaths a year and have the potential to save

503
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:17,000
Speaker 1: another one point five million lives. And then it was

504
00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:20,000
Speaker 1: talking about how the measles are coming back because the

505
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:24,160
Speaker 1: kids that aren't vaccinated are now you know, uh with

506
00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:27,720
Speaker 1: a measle operate. There's like a hundred thousand plus deaths.

507
00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 1: So where I guess that's where I get confused with

508
00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:35,680
Speaker 1: UM seeing some things and hearing other facts. It's like,

509
00:29:36,040 --> 00:29:39,040
Speaker 1: because the other kids, you know, there's now now a

510
00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:41,320
Speaker 1: measles outbreak, I'm like, what is that because the kids

511
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:45,520
Speaker 1: weren't being vaccinated? Or how did that even come? Okay,

512
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 1: because you ask a lot of questions there. First of all,

513
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:54,480
Speaker 1: is it UM isn't more than that three members of

514
00:29:54,520 --> 00:30:00,160
Speaker 1: my family got a hundred and five you know, UM

515
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:03,360
Speaker 1: and brother, eleven brothers and sisters. Is it important that

516
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:08,640
Speaker 1: three of them uh attacked me and uh Politico And

517
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,560
Speaker 1: when I would say to you, I you know, personally,

518
00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 1: I know a lot more about vaccines. I've spent fifteen

519
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:18,480
Speaker 1: years litigating them. And my family has a very strong

520
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 1: UM relationships with the public health community. You know, I

521
00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 1: grew up knowing Dr Fauci and Francis Collins the biggest

522
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:35,040
Speaker 1: UM institutional and I age as the Kennedy Greegor Institute,

523
00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:38,320
Speaker 1: the Unit Shrib Institute is over there. To my family

524
00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:41,200
Speaker 1: has been intertwined with them, and my activism has been

525
00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 1: an embarrassment to my family to member certain members of

526
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 1: my family who are particularly immersed in that you know area.

527
00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:52,320
Speaker 1: So and my family argues about everything we were. You know,

528
00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 1: we were raised to will argue with each other. I

529
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:01,000
Speaker 1: love each other, so they just doesn't up on me

530
00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:03,760
Speaker 1: at all. What bothered me a little bit about it

531
00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 1: is that I I did. I published, I wrote and

532
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,440
Speaker 1: submitted to Political a point by point refutation to every

533
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:18,760
Speaker 1: singal on point in that article, and Political refused to publish.

534
00:31:18,800 --> 00:31:24,640
Speaker 1: And I think the censorshipation is something that should bother

535
00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:29,200
Speaker 1: every American. People who want to read my reputation UM

536
00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:32,720
Speaker 1: can go on Children's Health Defense website and read it.

537
00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:36,000
Speaker 1: It's Children's Health Defense dot org. UM if you want

538
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:40,200
Speaker 1: to get more information. UM. The website has a lot

539
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:47,280
Speaker 1: of resources UM, seeking justice, exposing causes, protecting the future UM,

540
00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 1: and you know, talks all about it where you can

541
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:52,760
Speaker 1: research and also donate to the cause as well. Well.

542
00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 1: If I already wasn't stressed as a parent, I think

543
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:58,200
Speaker 1: we have a lot more information to be suggested to. No.

544
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:01,120
Speaker 1: I love it, and I'm gonna in the whole that

545
00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:03,200
Speaker 1: whole field. You know, this is a relationship show. We

546
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:05,240
Speaker 1: talk a lot about marriage and kids and all that.

547
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 1: Hence why we wanted to talk about vaccinations. UM. But

548
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:10,800
Speaker 1: you're in your third marriage to Cheryl Hines. So I'm

549
00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:12,840
Speaker 1: a big fan of big fan of curb your enthusiasm

550
00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:16,520
Speaker 1: and all of that. And so from a relationship standpoint,

551
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:19,720
Speaker 1: what has made this marriage work for you personally over

552
00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:25,320
Speaker 1: ones in the past. Uh. Well, you know, my my,

553
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 1: uh my last wife tragically died, um, and Cheryl came

554
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,880
Speaker 1: into my life around that time. I had six kids, um,

555
00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:42,840
Speaker 1: which she which Cheryl inherited and listening, I cannot take

556
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:47,520
Speaker 1: any credit for it. I can my I'm literally married

557
00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:54,720
Speaker 1: to an angel and she's ah, that is so sweet her.

558
00:32:55,280 --> 00:33:03,040
Speaker 1: She's wise, she's thoughtful. Um, she is always Uh, there's

559
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:07,120
Speaker 1: never I've never in my life in our relationship felt

560
00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:09,360
Speaker 1: like there was a quick broke while like you did

561
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:11,600
Speaker 1: this for me and I'll do this for you. It's

562
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:18,120
Speaker 1: all everything um is uh comes from a place of love,

563
00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 1: you know. And I was just wanting to make the

564
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:26,920
Speaker 1: other person feel comfortable and happy. And I feel like

565
00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:30,600
Speaker 1: if God gave me what I deserved, that I would

566
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:37,520
Speaker 1: have been struck by lightning. But he isn't. He's Angela.

567
00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:41,240
Speaker 1: You know. The other thing, she's super smart. Cheryl came

568
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 1: and you know what she she's a comedian. So being

569
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:48,200
Speaker 1: married wking what it is a better thing than being

570
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:50,880
Speaker 1: married a comedian. She's making me, she makes me laugh

571
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 1: all the time, and I'm constantly astonished by her. First

572
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:58,360
Speaker 1: of all, she is like a mom to my kids

573
00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:01,680
Speaker 1: in every way, you know, and they confide in her

574
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:04,200
Speaker 1: and they love her. And it was a difficult transition,

575
00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 1: you know, to go from um what they had to

576
00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:11,000
Speaker 1: go through to you know, to sort of accepting a

577
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 1: person in their life who they trus to know who

578
00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:18,120
Speaker 1: they love and um, and she acts in every way,

579
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:22,440
Speaker 1: like really caring, good mother. But she has wisdom, you know, wisdom.

580
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:27,120
Speaker 1: The word wisdom means the knowledge of God's will. It's

581
00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:32,840
Speaker 1: a it's an intuitive, um understanding of what's right and

582
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:37,400
Speaker 1: what's wrong. And she has that gift in almost every situation.

583
00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:41,440
Speaker 1: She kind of knows immediately, um, what the right thing

584
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:43,640
Speaker 1: to do, what the right thing to say is. I'm

585
00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 1: always astonished when I see her on TV and um,

586
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:52,360
Speaker 1: somebody asked her sort of an awkward question and about

587
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:55,959
Speaker 1: how definitely she handles it so that nobody gets embarrassed

588
00:34:56,080 --> 00:35:02,160
Speaker 1: and so that it's everybody seems smart, wies and and funny,

589
00:35:02,760 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 1: and so I just feel like I've got a uh,

590
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 1: you know, I feel like I've gotten this extraordinary gift.

591
00:35:11,280 --> 00:35:16,440
Speaker 1: And for me at this point in my life, I'm

592
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:20,000
Speaker 1: you know, I get a lot of joy from anticipating

593
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:24,000
Speaker 1: what she what it is gonna make her happy and

594
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 1: um and uh, and then trying to do it without

595
00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:30,440
Speaker 1: being asked to do it. She she likes to have

596
00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:33,239
Speaker 1: the bed made in the morning, and she likes you know,

597
00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,080
Speaker 1: she was joking with her friend or one of her

598
00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:42,920
Speaker 1: best friends is Susan Yeagley, who is married to Kevin

599
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:46,560
Speaker 1: Neil and and they were talking the other day and saying,

600
00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:49,520
Speaker 1: what's the sexiest thing that a man can do? And

601
00:35:49,600 --> 00:35:55,719
Speaker 1: Susie Haagley said, the dishes. That's actually a good one.

602
00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:59,040
Speaker 1: I prefer. I know, I prefer that when he cooks,

603
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:00,759
Speaker 1: I like to do the dishes. But I do not

604
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:02,759
Speaker 1: know how to cook. I'm not a chef. It's not

605
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 1: it's not my thing. Well, Mr Kennedy, thank you so

606
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:09,640
Speaker 1: so so much for your time today. We've had an

607
00:36:09,719 --> 00:36:13,520
Speaker 1: unbelievable time talking with you about everything. We talked to

608
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:15,560
Speaker 1: you all day and listen to you talk all day,

609
00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:19,279
Speaker 1: but I know myself, my wife, Gina, Chelsea, and Andrea,

610
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:21,959
Speaker 1: we all appreciate your time and we've learned a lot,

611
00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:24,680
Speaker 1: and I know our listeners will too. And thanks for

612
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:26,960
Speaker 1: being my damn friend. I'm gonna keep damning you so

613
00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:33,560
Speaker 1: and make sure to visit Children's Health Defense dot org

614
00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:35,720
Speaker 1: to learn more about the things that we talked about

615
00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:40,080
Speaker 1: today and follow me on Instagram. Although they have shut

616
00:36:40,120 --> 00:36:42,200
Speaker 1: down my Instagram, so I don't know if you can't

617
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:45,279
Speaker 1: even access it anymore, but they have me throttled, so

618
00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:48,800
Speaker 1: I was on it I think earlier today, so I

619
00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 1: know what I heard they were opening a little. Usually

620
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:55,160
Speaker 1: what they did is they shut it down so you

621
00:36:55,200 --> 00:37:00,680
Speaker 1: couldn't find it unless you wrote Robert F. Kennedy Jr. Oh, yeah, enproning.

622
00:37:02,520 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 1: That's been happening to a lot of people. Well, thank

623
00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:07,400
Speaker 1: you guys so much. I really appreciate. I'll talk to

624
00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:10,279
Speaker 1: you all soon. Thank you so much. Okay, all right,

625
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:28,120
Speaker 1: hi Mr Kennedy, if I was gonna say that, Okay. So,

626
00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:29,880
Speaker 1: as we said at the beginning of this episode, we

627
00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:33,200
Speaker 1: just wanted to gather some professionals who know way more

628
00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:36,480
Speaker 1: than us about the topics the sense of topics that

629
00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:40,360
Speaker 1: we talk about UM on today's episode and just in general.

630
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 1: And so we had were joined by Dr Abe Malkin,

631
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:47,520
Speaker 1: who is an MP D n b A in southern California.

632
00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:50,080
Speaker 1: He's been to every kind of medical school you can

633
00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:54,040
Speaker 1: think of. UM. He schools that we can't even pronounce.

634
00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:57,480
Speaker 1: They're so good. Yeah, stud Yeah, exactly. So he's way

635
00:37:57,520 --> 00:37:59,600
Speaker 1: more certified than any of us. And we went to

636
00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:01,920
Speaker 1: welcome dr Ape to the show. Dr thank you so

637
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:04,319
Speaker 1: much for joining us. Yeah, nice to do with you guys.

638
00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:06,920
Speaker 1: Thanks for having me. Oh absolutely, you know, we we

639
00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:09,440
Speaker 1: wanted you to come on today because we talked to

640
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:13,880
Speaker 1: Robert Kennedy Jr. U earlier in the show, and you know,

641
00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:17,719
Speaker 1: it's amazing how there's these certain topics right in in

642
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:19,960
Speaker 1: life and in society that we talk about. And what

643
00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:21,319
Speaker 1: we were talking about with him was a lot about

644
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:24,880
Speaker 1: vaccinations and it gets so personal. It's just like politics

645
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:26,920
Speaker 1: in general. Right, It's just one of those topics that

646
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:29,799
Speaker 1: it's hard for people to see the other side of

647
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:31,960
Speaker 1: the coin because it just feels so personal, and they

648
00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:34,719
Speaker 1: make it so personal because it is, especially when it

649
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:37,880
Speaker 1: comes to your children, like vaccinations and so on. And

650
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:40,560
Speaker 1: so just to pick up where we left off with

651
00:38:40,560 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 1: with RFK Jr. Is the whole vaccination thing from your expertise,

652
00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:48,120
Speaker 1: you know, your doctor and family medicine, and I'm sure

653
00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 1: you talked to parents and children. For you, when you're

654
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 1: talking to these parents and reassuring them and maybe what

655
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,320
Speaker 1: they want to do, how do you approach such a

656
00:38:57,400 --> 00:39:02,640
Speaker 1: topic as this. Yeah, I you have to be considered

657
00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:06,320
Speaker 1: of the fact that parents are, you know, concerned about

658
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:09,640
Speaker 1: what they hear out in the media, and uh, you know,

659
00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:14,960
Speaker 1: these are their precious children. So although we as doctors

660
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:17,880
Speaker 1: can sometimes tend to be a little bit more medical

661
00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:21,480
Speaker 1: and scientific given our training, you know, there's definitely a

662
00:39:21,560 --> 00:39:25,359
Speaker 1: human element to this and uh that needs to be addressed. So,

663
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:27,920
Speaker 1: you know, whenever I talk to parents about vaccination, but

664
00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:31,279
Speaker 1: I do recognize that there are different opinions, although you know,

665
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:35,000
Speaker 1: certainly in the minority, but that has to be reconciled.

666
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:37,920
Speaker 1: When you're talking about a young child, the baby, you know,

667
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:43,040
Speaker 1: getting vaccines, vaccination shots. It can be jarring to a parent,

668
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 1: especially when they hear things that make it seem like

669
00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:48,279
Speaker 1: that could be harmful to them. Um. But what I

670
00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:50,359
Speaker 1: try to do is really stick to some of the

671
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:54,920
Speaker 1: facts that that you know, uh indicate the vast majority

672
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:59,120
Speaker 1: of people support vaccines, but also address the human element,

673
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,759
Speaker 1: and you know, talk to a parent like as just

674
00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:06,760
Speaker 1: another caring individual where my goal is not just simply

675
00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:08,919
Speaker 1: to follow a protocol, but actually to do what's best

676
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:12,080
Speaker 1: and the best interests of their child, um, which ultimately

677
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:15,239
Speaker 1: give them the most healthy and fruitful life. So I

678
00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:19,560
Speaker 1: think coming out from that angle, the more impassioned empathetic

679
00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:23,360
Speaker 1: stance definitely helps a lot in having those discussions with parents.

680
00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:26,520
Speaker 1: Is it I make up in my own mind that

681
00:40:26,560 --> 00:40:29,360
Speaker 1: it could be frustrating because if I was an expert

682
00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:31,640
Speaker 1: at one thing, and if I heard just people coming

683
00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,640
Speaker 1: into my office on a regular base basis saying I

684
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:38,160
Speaker 1: read that, I heard you know this, someone said this.

685
00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:41,480
Speaker 1: And when you're hit with that, is it? I mean,

686
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 1: you're a human too. Is it frustrating at times? And

687
00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:47,280
Speaker 1: when you're trying to to do the best for your patients?

688
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:49,800
Speaker 1: How do you handle that? Like as a clinical professional

689
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:52,880
Speaker 1: who went to school to know more information than the

690
00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:55,319
Speaker 1: general public, right, and when you have people saying, well,

691
00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:57,120
Speaker 1: I read on this, I've heard this, and how do

692
00:40:57,160 --> 00:40:59,520
Speaker 1: you kind of handle that aspect? Yeah, I mean I

693
00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:04,120
Speaker 1: think medicine as a whole is constantly evolving. So it's

694
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:06,560
Speaker 1: not as though we live in this dogmatic world where

695
00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:09,160
Speaker 1: you know one thing is true and it's true forever

696
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:12,759
Speaker 1: and and you know we we're not. We're very inflexible. Uh.

697
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,759
Speaker 1: That being said, in medicine, we do change at a

698
00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:18,920
Speaker 1: very glacial pace, in the sense that in order for

699
00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:23,200
Speaker 1: something to be adopted as practice current practice of care,

700
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:27,080
Speaker 1: it needs to have randomized controlled trials, large scale studies

701
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 1: vetted by professionals in order to change our practice behavior. So,

702
00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 1: you know, we do here all the time. I saw

703
00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:35,360
Speaker 1: this on WebMD or heard this on Dr Google or

704
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:38,800
Speaker 1: my friend told me this. But that doesn't change our

705
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:42,280
Speaker 1: practice behavior. What does change our practice behavior is randomized

706
00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:44,760
Speaker 1: controlled trials that are vetted and published by the medical

707
00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:48,880
Speaker 1: the medical community. So, um, that's what we go by

708
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:52,680
Speaker 1: as physicians, you know, because it does allow us to

709
00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:55,880
Speaker 1: fall back on knowing that those have been really vetted studies.

710
00:41:56,239 --> 00:42:01,320
Speaker 1: You know, hearsay anecdotal evidence, you know, maybe impetus for change,

711
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:04,279
Speaker 1: but it's certainly not something that's gonna lead to a

712
00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:07,400
Speaker 1: full scale change in our behavior. What I don't know

713
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:09,640
Speaker 1: if you've heard, if you heard some of the Robert

714
00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 1: Kennedy junior interview, But when he says that there like

715
00:42:14,600 --> 00:42:18,400
Speaker 1: he wants the scientific proof behind it, and that like

716
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:21,240
Speaker 1: he would love that evidence, and then he would basically

717
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:24,120
Speaker 1: stop talking about that. Why, I mean, is there a

718
00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:30,000
Speaker 1: scientific evidence or is there not? So there there's many,

719
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:35,040
Speaker 1: many studies that show the efficacy of vaccines. Each vaccine

720
00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:39,680
Speaker 1: itself has a myriad of literature supporting it, whether it

721
00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:45,440
Speaker 1: be flu vaccines, MMR, measles, yellow fever, smallpox, these have

722
00:42:45,480 --> 00:42:48,800
Speaker 1: all been studied in numerous studies that have shown the

723
00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:54,480
Speaker 1: efficacy and the drastic, drastic reduction in cases um, you know,

724
00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:58,040
Speaker 1: using the vaccine. And conversely, there have been studies that

725
00:42:58,080 --> 00:43:02,560
Speaker 1: have shown that UH risks and the negative effects that

726
00:43:03,360 --> 00:43:08,200
Speaker 1: anti vaccination individuals claim are just not substantiated. You know.

727
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:12,320
Speaker 1: The biggest one, of course, was study that Dr Wakefield,

728
00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:16,120
Speaker 1: who kind of pioneering in the anti vaccination movement UH

729
00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:20,160
Speaker 1: provided to show that you know, MMR vaccine caused autism,

730
00:43:20,520 --> 00:43:24,000
Speaker 1: and very shortly thereafter that was debunked by a number

731
00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 1: of people in the medical community, where in fact, when

732
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:29,719
Speaker 1: it's far to say that his results were falsified. So

733
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:36,680
Speaker 1: I don't really understand that position that there isn't scientific evidence.

734
00:43:36,719 --> 00:43:40,839
Speaker 1: There's a vast abundance of evidence, um And I think

735
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:45,879
Speaker 1: there may be small scales studies done by questionable individuals

736
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:49,680
Speaker 1: that may show differing opinions, but that's certainly not the majority.

737
00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:53,400
Speaker 1: And you know, there's plenty of evidence on the contrary.

738
00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:55,640
Speaker 1: You know. I was when we were talking to him,

739
00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:57,960
Speaker 1: I kind of played Devil's advocate and I asked him,

740
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:01,000
Speaker 1: I was like, you know, is what he was ultimately

741
00:44:01,040 --> 00:44:03,399
Speaker 1: saying is he doesn't believe it's a one size fits

742
00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:06,960
Speaker 1: all kind of mentality, which I get but at the

743
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:10,239
Speaker 1: same time, you're trying to provide something to the masses, right,

744
00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:16,000
Speaker 1: and each vaccination can't be a customizable thing per individual.

745
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:19,239
Speaker 1: That's just I don't know how that's medically or financially possible,

746
00:44:19,800 --> 00:44:21,960
Speaker 1: right to test it or do all those things. So

747
00:44:21,960 --> 00:44:24,160
Speaker 1: I asked him. I was like, isn't there just gonna

748
00:44:24,200 --> 00:44:26,640
Speaker 1: be no matter what you do, there's gonna be some fallout,

749
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:29,040
Speaker 1: There's gonna be some side effects, Like it's a numbers game,

750
00:44:29,120 --> 00:44:31,799
Speaker 1: So not everyone is going to react the same way

751
00:44:31,840 --> 00:44:34,840
Speaker 1: to every medication, right. That that's why there's multiple different

752
00:44:34,840 --> 00:44:38,680
Speaker 1: metal medications to treat the same symptom or the same issue,

753
00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:42,640
Speaker 1: because people react differently. And I make up that for vaccinations.

754
00:44:42,680 --> 00:44:44,760
Speaker 1: It's kind of the same. People are going to react differently.

755
00:44:44,960 --> 00:44:49,400
Speaker 1: It's unfortunate, it sucks, but that's also life, right Like

756
00:44:49,440 --> 00:44:52,480
Speaker 1: car accidents. Sometimes it's just an accident. It's no one's fault.

757
00:44:52,920 --> 00:44:55,080
Speaker 1: And you know, I don't mean to compare. I would

758
00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:56,759
Speaker 1: just say that I'm one thing though, if you know,

759
00:44:56,760 --> 00:45:00,680
Speaker 1: because I've saw something on Instagram and a baby died

760
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:03,719
Speaker 1: young because of vaccination, if that was your baby in

761
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:05,799
Speaker 1: that died, you might take a different stance on it

762
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:07,600
Speaker 1: just be like, oh, sure, you know, that's where I

763
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:10,760
Speaker 1: would be like, no, that's why it's hard, No for sure.

764
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:13,480
Speaker 1: And how do they know that they baby died from

765
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 1: vaccination helplication? They like right after they got it, baby

766
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:20,759
Speaker 1: went like bad red plotches everywhere. And then it is

767
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:24,439
Speaker 1: that something that does happen every once in a while. Yeah,

768
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:27,800
Speaker 1: And you bring up a really great point, Michael Um

769
00:45:27,840 --> 00:45:31,840
Speaker 1: that this is not one size fits all. As with anything,

770
00:45:31,880 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 1: there's going to be outliers. So for example, you know,

771
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:37,920
Speaker 1: babies that are you know, compromised will not do well

772
00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:42,920
Speaker 1: with a vaccine because you're introducing a potentially harmful element

773
00:45:42,960 --> 00:45:45,040
Speaker 1: into their body. But that's again that's a you know,

774
00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:50,520
Speaker 1: infantestily small number of children, um children who have severe

775
00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:54,120
Speaker 1: allergic reaction. To your point that certainly those will be

776
00:45:54,160 --> 00:45:58,040
Speaker 1: at risk. So and again what you have to you know,

777
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:00,560
Speaker 1: and again if it is your child, to your baby,

778
00:46:00,680 --> 00:46:03,960
Speaker 1: you certainly wouldn't look at this objectively. You have a

779
00:46:04,040 --> 00:46:06,960
Speaker 1: much more subjective emotional response to it. But as a

780
00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:10,040
Speaker 1: as a society, as a health public health issue, we

781
00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:12,520
Speaker 1: do have to think about what is best for the

782
00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:15,319
Speaker 1: greatest good. And I think at this point. You know,

783
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:20,160
Speaker 1: mass vaccinations are certainly out benefit that way as the risk.

784
00:46:20,680 --> 00:46:22,440
Speaker 1: And then you know, in the future we are going

785
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:26,160
Speaker 1: to work towards personalized medicine. We are seeing genetic testing

786
00:46:26,200 --> 00:46:29,439
Speaker 1: done in and more an adult setting, to to personalize antibiotics,

787
00:46:29,440 --> 00:46:32,919
Speaker 1: to personalize psychiatric medications. You know, I could see ten

788
00:46:32,960 --> 00:46:34,879
Speaker 1: twenty years down the line where when a baby is born,

789
00:46:34,920 --> 00:46:36,600
Speaker 1: we have their full genetic map and we know how

790
00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:40,360
Speaker 1: to tailor vaccines and medications to fit that fit them personally.

791
00:46:40,400 --> 00:46:43,880
Speaker 1: So I think things will continue to improve, but in

792
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:46,560
Speaker 1: the meantime, this is definitely the best we have out there.

793
00:46:47,000 --> 00:46:50,520
Speaker 1: What about when they say that the vaccinations aren't being tested,

794
00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:55,320
Speaker 1: is that is that false or it's it's certainly false.

795
00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:56,799
Speaker 1: You know. The reason that it takes so long for

796
00:46:56,840 --> 00:47:02,040
Speaker 1: a COVID vaccine is because there's four stages of testing

797
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:04,600
Speaker 1: the vaccines have to go through. First, it has to

798
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:07,040
Speaker 1: you know, first they have to test it to make

799
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:09,520
Speaker 1: sure it makes sense scientifically. Then they have to make

800
00:47:09,520 --> 00:47:11,399
Speaker 1: sure that it's effective, Then they have to make sure

801
00:47:11,440 --> 00:47:13,600
Speaker 1: it's safe. Then they have to test it in humans.

802
00:47:13,600 --> 00:47:16,000
Speaker 1: So every vaccine has to go through that in order

803
00:47:16,000 --> 00:47:18,239
Speaker 1: to obtain it. The approval and how come there's so

804
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:20,560
Speaker 1: much more, Like I mean, as a baby, I didn't

805
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:23,640
Speaker 1: get these many vaccines um and then there's so much

806
00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:26,160
Speaker 1: more in the vaccines now too. You know some of

807
00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:29,279
Speaker 1: the things that I read, I'm like, that's in there? Um?

808
00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:32,560
Speaker 1: You know? Is that? Is that just the progress of

809
00:47:32,600 --> 00:47:37,320
Speaker 1: how you know, the vaccinations are being made um to

810
00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:40,680
Speaker 1: to help these other diseases or like what what? Why?

811
00:47:40,840 --> 00:47:42,880
Speaker 1: I just I don't know why am I going to

812
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:45,160
Speaker 1: lack something because I didn't get the same vaccinations that

813
00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:50,319
Speaker 1: my kids did? Or so we definitely do modify vaccines

814
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:54,120
Speaker 1: to target, you know, different public health issues. So measles

815
00:47:54,200 --> 00:47:57,560
Speaker 1: vaccines obviously became much more popular and we've basically eradicated

816
00:47:57,640 --> 00:48:00,960
Speaker 1: measles as a result. In fact, some of the ingredients

817
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:03,080
Speaker 1: have actually been taken out. So mercury is obviously a

818
00:48:03,120 --> 00:48:05,800
Speaker 1: hot topic when it comes to vaccines. Let's just address

819
00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 1: the mercury. There's actually very few vaccines now that do

820
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:12,839
Speaker 1: contain mercury. And the reason they use mercury, and it's

821
00:48:12,840 --> 00:48:17,840
Speaker 1: called thermosol, is because it's actually an antimicrobial agent that

822
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:23,200
Speaker 1: helps prevent fungus and bacteria from growing inside of a vaccine. Bottle.

823
00:48:23,719 --> 00:48:26,799
Speaker 1: And the reason we that's important is because in order

824
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:30,480
Speaker 1: to produce enough vaccines to vaccinate the entire population of children,

825
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:33,160
Speaker 1: we need to use multidose files. It's very expensive to

826
00:48:33,200 --> 00:48:35,880
Speaker 1: use single dose files for every single child. So if

827
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:38,520
Speaker 1: you're using a multidose file and it's uh, you know,

828
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:40,279
Speaker 1: going to be on the shelf for a week or

829
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:42,880
Speaker 1: two weeks while you're using it from different children in

830
00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 1: order to prevent it from developing infection within the bile,

831
00:48:46,280 --> 00:48:50,120
Speaker 1: mercury is helpful, so uh it. But in the last

832
00:48:50,120 --> 00:48:53,160
Speaker 1: ten years, the FDA has really come down and removed

833
00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:56,399
Speaker 1: mercury from almost all vaccines that we use. The only

834
00:48:56,440 --> 00:48:58,080
Speaker 1: two that it really is still used for is the

835
00:48:58,160 --> 00:49:01,439
Speaker 1: D TAP and T TAP vaccines because it's just there's

836
00:49:01,440 --> 00:49:03,959
Speaker 1: four different vaccines than one, and it's a multitose file,

837
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:07,840
Speaker 1: and it's often you know, it needs to be sterile.

838
00:49:08,239 --> 00:49:09,960
Speaker 1: So to your point, that was along with the answer

839
00:49:09,960 --> 00:49:11,759
Speaker 1: to say, we actually have done a good job of

840
00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:15,360
Speaker 1: removing certain things for vaccines which may potentially be harmful.

841
00:49:16,560 --> 00:49:22,880
Speaker 1: Is it, you know, like we're talking about obviously someone

842
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:28,719
Speaker 1: who is experienced the negative outcome of a vaccine with

843
00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:32,759
Speaker 1: their children, as obviously more subjected to, you know, the

844
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:37,480
Speaker 1: emotional response around this topic. Have you known any doctors

845
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:41,880
Speaker 1: or clinical professionals that have had children that have suffered

846
00:49:41,920 --> 00:49:46,560
Speaker 1: from that unfortunate, you know, circumstance and either change their

847
00:49:46,600 --> 00:49:51,759
Speaker 1: position or still been like, well, they understand the possibility

848
00:49:51,840 --> 00:49:55,600
Speaker 1: of some negative outcome. Yeah, I mean, I personally have

849
00:49:55,640 --> 00:49:58,080
Speaker 1: not known anyone that had that outcome. But I think

850
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:00,440
Speaker 1: to your point earlier, I think we all do come

851
00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:04,319
Speaker 1: at this from an empathetic standpoint, and we can understand

852
00:50:04,440 --> 00:50:07,320
Speaker 1: the reason why someone who, especially if they had a

853
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:09,399
Speaker 1: bad outcome or their friend at a bad outcome, would

854
00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:12,520
Speaker 1: want to take that stance. But we treat on a

855
00:50:12,520 --> 00:50:15,239
Speaker 1: public health basis. We we at this point, we it's

856
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:19,560
Speaker 1: it's not feasible to treat every single individual child differently

857
00:50:19,640 --> 00:50:22,440
Speaker 1: because we just wouldn't be able to to vaccinate effectively

858
00:50:22,440 --> 00:50:25,759
Speaker 1: at that point. And you know, herd immunity is a

859
00:50:25,800 --> 00:50:29,440
Speaker 1: real thing, So if a certain number of children in

860
00:50:29,480 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 1: the community are being vaccinated, it prevents all children. So

861
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:35,680
Speaker 1: it's really important. You know, even if a couple of

862
00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:39,480
Speaker 1: children decide to to remove themselves or their parents decide

863
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:41,920
Speaker 1: to remove them, because the vast majority of the children

864
00:50:41,920 --> 00:50:45,840
Speaker 1: are being vaccinated, those children actually do afford the benefit

865
00:50:45,880 --> 00:50:49,640
Speaker 1: of vaccination. So I understand if people individual and an

866
00:50:49,640 --> 00:50:53,000
Speaker 1: individual basis need to remove themselves for certain reasons, but

867
00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:55,920
Speaker 1: we really do need to maintain her immunity because that's

868
00:50:55,920 --> 00:50:58,480
Speaker 1: incredibly important, even for those children that don't get back.

869
00:50:59,040 --> 00:51:00,719
Speaker 1: I was just gonna ask him, this is my my

870
00:51:00,840 --> 00:51:03,360
Speaker 1: last question around the vaccination that I want to change gears,

871
00:51:03,400 --> 00:51:10,080
Speaker 1: But do you think it's uh appropriate that whether it's

872
00:51:10,120 --> 00:51:14,440
Speaker 1: government or states or whatever can determine, you know, can

873
00:51:14,520 --> 00:51:18,840
Speaker 1: make vaccinations mandatory. Do you think that in your personal

874
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:20,959
Speaker 1: belief do you think that's appropriate or like you said,

875
00:51:20,960 --> 00:51:25,279
Speaker 1: if it's a herd immunity, still I make up that

876
00:51:25,320 --> 00:51:28,800
Speaker 1: the higher population is still gonna, you know, use vaccinations

877
00:51:28,840 --> 00:51:31,520
Speaker 1: and everything that if you do have those outliers that

878
00:51:31,600 --> 00:51:33,719
Speaker 1: for religious beliefs, personal belifs, whatever it may be, and

879
00:51:33,760 --> 00:51:36,080
Speaker 1: they choose not to, it's like, okay, you choose not to,

880
00:51:36,200 --> 00:51:38,080
Speaker 1: but at least we still have the majority that are

881
00:51:38,080 --> 00:51:42,239
Speaker 1: being vaccinated. So that's a that's a mine field of

882
00:51:42,239 --> 00:51:47,200
Speaker 1: a question. Um, you know, I will say that from

883
00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:50,880
Speaker 1: a personal perspective, given that I think the benefits of

884
00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:54,840
Speaker 1: vaccine are extremely valuable. I think that for certain people

885
00:51:54,880 --> 00:51:58,040
Speaker 1: involved in a group setting, whether it be schools or

886
00:51:58,120 --> 00:52:02,719
Speaker 1: other public functions, you know, vaccines can be required. But

887
00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:06,720
Speaker 1: I don't think that, you know, on a just freedom level,

888
00:52:07,160 --> 00:52:09,600
Speaker 1: people should have to vaccinate their children if they choose

889
00:52:09,600 --> 00:52:12,719
Speaker 1: to homeschool or if they choose to remove them in

890
00:52:12,760 --> 00:52:17,799
Speaker 1: other ways from a public setting. But obviously that's very difficult.

891
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:21,120
Speaker 1: So in reality, it would probably be a scenario which

892
00:52:21,120 --> 00:52:24,600
Speaker 1: someone would have together because vaccinated understandable. Okay, I want

893
00:52:24,600 --> 00:52:27,080
Speaker 1: to shift gears real quick, because it says you're also

894
00:52:27,160 --> 00:52:31,040
Speaker 1: a Board certified Addiction Medicine a member of the American

895
00:52:31,120 --> 00:52:36,160
Speaker 1: Society of Addiction Medicine UM, being one who suffers from

896
00:52:36,160 --> 00:52:40,919
Speaker 1: an addiction, not you know, a substance addiction. But I'm

897
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:43,320
Speaker 1: just curious around that. I haven't heard much about addiction

898
00:52:43,360 --> 00:52:46,279
Speaker 1: medicine UM. Can you just kind of film myself in

899
00:52:46,360 --> 00:52:50,040
Speaker 1: our listeners in and kind of what that is? Sure? So, uh,

900
00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:52,560
Speaker 1: you know, over the last ten twenty years, we've really

901
00:52:52,560 --> 00:52:55,160
Speaker 1: started to see addiction more of a disease as as

902
00:52:55,160 --> 00:52:58,600
Speaker 1: opposed to a behavior choice. You know, addiction used to be,

903
00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:01,160
Speaker 1: you know, something that we or to criticize. People are

904
00:53:01,200 --> 00:53:04,840
Speaker 1: ridiculed them because of their choices, but now we're realizing

905
00:53:04,880 --> 00:53:07,640
Speaker 1: it's it's a it's a it's a disease, just like diabetes,

906
00:53:07,960 --> 00:53:12,000
Speaker 1: you know, cancer, other things where once a person develops

907
00:53:12,040 --> 00:53:16,120
Speaker 1: that addiction, whether it be through genetic reasons or you know,

908
00:53:16,280 --> 00:53:19,160
Speaker 1: behavioral issues as a child, they really don't have a

909
00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:22,040
Speaker 1: lot of choice in the matter and need medical help.

910
00:53:22,200 --> 00:53:25,160
Speaker 1: So I work with a lot of patients with multi

911
00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:30,919
Speaker 1: substance issues, whether it be alcohol, opiates, Benzo's, gambling, other

912
00:53:30,960 --> 00:53:34,879
Speaker 1: types of addictions, and really try to help them either

913
00:53:35,280 --> 00:53:39,279
Speaker 1: in a pharmaceutical way or in a behavioral therapy way

914
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:42,600
Speaker 1: to battle those addictions. And it's very gratifying for me

915
00:53:42,719 --> 00:53:45,560
Speaker 1: because I'm seeing people that in other areas of their

916
00:53:45,600 --> 00:53:49,080
Speaker 1: life are excelling, but have unfortunately addiction problems that are

917
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:52,600
Speaker 1: really limiting them reaching the full potential. So um I

918
00:53:52,760 --> 00:53:56,160
Speaker 1: do my practice specifically, I work with patients sort of

919
00:53:56,200 --> 00:54:00,600
Speaker 1: on a very individual in home concierge model, whereas there's

920
00:54:00,640 --> 00:54:02,880
Speaker 1: many many other options for patients who need to go

921
00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:05,799
Speaker 1: into a residential treatment setting or an OPICII program or

922
00:54:05,840 --> 00:54:09,880
Speaker 1: a manages a little bit more individualized. Have you found

923
00:54:09,960 --> 00:54:13,640
Speaker 1: with the more substance abuse driven addictions with you know,

924
00:54:14,040 --> 00:54:17,480
Speaker 1: narcotics or alcohol, that there is some kind of pharmaceutical

925
00:54:17,960 --> 00:54:22,640
Speaker 1: remedy for that. Yeah, So I would say about fifty

926
00:54:22,680 --> 00:54:26,279
Speaker 1: percent of addiction is genetic and it's very hard to that.

927
00:54:26,360 --> 00:54:30,280
Speaker 1: The other fifty percent is due to dopamine pleasure reward

928
00:54:30,320 --> 00:54:33,200
Speaker 1: pathways in the brain. So when you see something it

929
00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:37,160
Speaker 1: triggers a certain emotion or feeling that it causes a

930
00:54:37,200 --> 00:54:40,000
Speaker 1: certain behavior. So I would say that aspect of addiction

931
00:54:40,080 --> 00:54:42,840
Speaker 1: can be treated pharmaceutically, the genetic component to it is

932
00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:45,520
Speaker 1: very hard to So you know, there are there are

933
00:54:45,560 --> 00:54:50,680
Speaker 1: medications out there that block the receptor that that substance triggers.

934
00:54:50,840 --> 00:54:54,520
Speaker 1: So for example, take a drink of alcohol, it's stimulate

935
00:54:54,800 --> 00:54:57,879
Speaker 1: or us. An opiate stimulates opioid receptor in your brain

936
00:54:57,960 --> 00:55:00,480
Speaker 1: that releases dopamine that makes you feel good. If you

937
00:55:00,480 --> 00:55:02,480
Speaker 1: can block that receptor so that when you take the

938
00:55:02,560 --> 00:55:05,040
Speaker 1: drink of alcohol, you use that Okay, you don't feel

939
00:55:05,040 --> 00:55:10,520
Speaker 1: that euphoria. That now breaks the that positive feedback mechanism

940
00:55:10,600 --> 00:55:12,719
Speaker 1: that wants you to keep doing more and more. So

941
00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:15,040
Speaker 1: this is not a full proof, but this is definitely

942
00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:17,800
Speaker 1: something helpful pharmacologically that can help a lot of people.

943
00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:21,080
Speaker 1: That's really interesting and so I mean, I'm a we're

944
00:55:21,120 --> 00:55:23,000
Speaker 1: open on the show. My all my stuff is out there.

945
00:55:23,040 --> 00:55:25,719
Speaker 1: So I suffer from sex addiction, um and I've been

946
00:55:25,960 --> 00:55:29,560
Speaker 1: in recovery for that for the past four years, you know,

947
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:31,960
Speaker 1: on and off, been doing you know, fight my good

948
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:35,279
Speaker 1: fight per se around that. And it for me, you know,

949
00:55:35,360 --> 00:55:39,520
Speaker 1: with something like that that's not of substance based, you know,

950
00:55:39,640 --> 00:55:42,680
Speaker 1: it's been hard even for myself early on to wrap

951
00:55:42,719 --> 00:55:45,560
Speaker 1: my head around it, to to understand it, let alone

952
00:55:45,640 --> 00:55:49,480
Speaker 1: my wife or the people around me to understand. It's like, okay,

953
00:55:49,520 --> 00:55:51,759
Speaker 1: alcohol or substance abuse, you can kind of get that

954
00:55:51,800 --> 00:55:55,760
Speaker 1: there's a chemical like it's almost it's easier to understand

955
00:55:55,800 --> 00:55:59,360
Speaker 1: the physical you know chemical around that with you know,

956
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:02,759
Speaker 1: the sexy aspect or maybe gambler's addiction or whatever it

957
00:56:02,800 --> 00:56:06,239
Speaker 1: may be. It's it's a little different, and it's it's

958
00:56:06,280 --> 00:56:11,000
Speaker 1: been hard to um live with. It's been hard to

959
00:56:11,120 --> 00:56:16,319
Speaker 1: articulate to people and help them understand and put into

960
00:56:16,360 --> 00:56:18,239
Speaker 1: words the things that go on in my head and

961
00:56:18,600 --> 00:56:20,800
Speaker 1: where all that comes from and the dopamine and everything.

962
00:56:21,239 --> 00:56:23,279
Speaker 1: So with those kind of addictions, are you saying that

963
00:56:23,320 --> 00:56:27,640
Speaker 1: there's still there could be some pharmaceutical benefit around that,

964
00:56:28,840 --> 00:56:32,799
Speaker 1: some somewhat you know, for for for gambling addiction, there

965
00:56:33,080 --> 00:56:36,240
Speaker 1: are some medications that have been trialed. For sex addiction,

966
00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:40,000
Speaker 1: there's really no FDA approved medication. However, you know, the

967
00:56:40,040 --> 00:56:43,400
Speaker 1: typical treatment course or someone with behavioral addiction such as

968
00:56:43,520 --> 00:56:47,360
Speaker 1: sex addiction is twofold. Number one is psychotherapy to uncover

969
00:56:47,440 --> 00:56:51,799
Speaker 1: any underlying issues, maybe traumas like child or you know,

970
00:56:51,840 --> 00:56:55,880
Speaker 1: things that have caused these behaviors. And number two behavioral therapy,

971
00:56:55,960 --> 00:56:59,359
Speaker 1: so where psychotherapy looks back to understand what has caused

972
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:01,839
Speaker 1: the behavior in the past. Behavioral therapy is say, in

973
00:57:01,880 --> 00:57:04,560
Speaker 1: that moment, what can I do to change my behavior?

974
00:57:04,920 --> 00:57:11,440
Speaker 1: And that may be a neural laguistic linguistic programming n LP,

975
00:57:12,120 --> 00:57:15,640
Speaker 1: it might be other types of behavioral therapy which have

976
00:57:15,719 --> 00:57:17,720
Speaker 1: been used in a lot of different walks of life.

977
00:57:17,960 --> 00:57:23,280
Speaker 1: You know, a lot of um success coaches, teach CEOs

978
00:57:23,320 --> 00:57:26,880
Speaker 1: and athletes the physical things that they can do to

979
00:57:27,000 --> 00:57:30,560
Speaker 1: really be present in the moment. You know, things simply

980
00:57:30,600 --> 00:57:33,480
Speaker 1: as like brushing your hair, touching your finger, touching a

981
00:57:33,520 --> 00:57:37,200
Speaker 1: watch which reminds you of something. That's that's what behavioral

982
00:57:37,200 --> 00:57:40,200
Speaker 1: therapy is. So maybe when you get those urges, you know,

983
00:57:40,240 --> 00:57:42,800
Speaker 1: you you touch something that reminds you of your your

984
00:57:42,880 --> 00:57:45,240
Speaker 1: children or your wife, and that makes you you're not

985
00:57:46,160 --> 00:57:50,160
Speaker 1: engage in that behavior. I know my wife's over here.

986
00:57:50,200 --> 00:57:55,720
Speaker 1: Like if there's a drug out there, my husband the cocktail,

987
00:57:58,640 --> 00:58:02,160
Speaker 1: it just stops. Well, that's fascinating that I make up.

988
00:58:02,160 --> 00:58:05,439
Speaker 1: That has to be extremely rewarding to kind of work

989
00:58:05,440 --> 00:58:08,040
Speaker 1: into that field and couters to you just being someone

990
00:58:08,080 --> 00:58:10,560
Speaker 1: who suffers from that, and to know that there's you know,

991
00:58:10,600 --> 00:58:14,000
Speaker 1: good doctors like you who are constantly working at at

992
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:17,840
Speaker 1: helping those who suffer from addiction because it impacts so

993
00:58:17,960 --> 00:58:20,160
Speaker 1: many people, not just the person who suffers, you know,

994
00:58:20,200 --> 00:58:24,000
Speaker 1: there's so many people around it, um that deal with it. Yeah. Absolutely,

995
00:58:24,600 --> 00:58:27,439
Speaker 1: I do have a question because I've I've used Dr

996
00:58:27,480 --> 00:58:30,360
Speaker 1: Google on this one, so I'm just curious. Um, I

997
00:58:31,200 --> 00:58:35,080
Speaker 1: you know, I've I've suffered from anxiety and PTSD and um,

998
00:58:35,120 --> 00:58:37,120
Speaker 1: I've been on a medicine for god, I don't even

999
00:58:37,160 --> 00:58:40,640
Speaker 1: know how many years now, ten or twelve, fifteen plus years,

1000
00:58:40,800 --> 00:58:44,120
Speaker 1: and you know a part of me is like, Okay,

1001
00:58:44,720 --> 00:58:47,080
Speaker 1: I know now that I'm not going to die. I'm like,

1002
00:58:47,320 --> 00:58:48,920
Speaker 1: I'm not I don't need to call the ambulance. I

1003
00:58:48,920 --> 00:58:52,720
Speaker 1: don't need to you know, you know, alert the entire neighborhood.

1004
00:58:52,760 --> 00:58:54,440
Speaker 1: Like I'm okay, I know how to work through a

1005
00:58:54,440 --> 00:58:56,720
Speaker 1: panic attack right now. Now, I like being on I'm

1006
00:58:56,760 --> 00:59:00,240
Speaker 1: on a very low dosage of lexapro, and I get

1007
00:59:00,400 --> 00:59:02,960
Speaker 1: but is it is it harmful to continue to be

1008
00:59:03,000 --> 00:59:05,240
Speaker 1: on a drug for that long and to continue to

1009
00:59:05,240 --> 00:59:07,880
Speaker 1: stay on it, because I don't I'm so fearful of

1010
00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:09,520
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't even like taking tile at all.

1011
00:59:09,520 --> 00:59:10,840
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh my god, is this going to cause

1012
00:59:10,880 --> 00:59:13,040
Speaker 1: cancer or is this gonna you know, or is this

1013
00:59:13,160 --> 00:59:15,200
Speaker 1: just the thing that's going to just keep me like

1014
00:59:16,240 --> 00:59:20,560
Speaker 1: calm for moments. So lexipro in particular, is it is

1015
00:59:20,600 --> 00:59:22,560
Speaker 1: a very low risk drug. So that's the kind of

1016
00:59:22,640 --> 00:59:25,360
Speaker 1: drug you can take decades and decades and you're completely

1017
00:59:25,400 --> 00:59:28,640
Speaker 1: find it. Also, you're on a moderate to low dose,

1018
00:59:28,720 --> 00:59:31,560
Speaker 1: so not something that I would consider that you have

1019
00:59:31,640 --> 00:59:34,880
Speaker 1: to taper. There are other medications, you know, like bens

1020
00:59:34,920 --> 00:59:37,400
Speaker 1: and as a pen zan x valuum added in. Those

1021
00:59:37,440 --> 00:59:39,919
Speaker 1: medications can be very harmful to someone, and I would

1022
00:59:39,920 --> 00:59:42,080
Speaker 1: certainly recommend that people get off of them as early

1023
00:59:42,160 --> 00:59:43,880
Speaker 1: in their life as they can because the lawmen are

1024
00:59:43,920 --> 00:59:47,760
Speaker 1: only be more difficult. Um the way that the mechanism

1025
00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:51,680
Speaker 1: of action from lexapros specifically is not harmful to the body,

1026
00:59:52,040 --> 00:59:55,520
Speaker 1: whereas in contrast, other medications like the bends with as

1027
00:59:55,520 --> 00:59:58,280
Speaker 1: pains that I mentioned can be harmful. So, um, every

1028
00:59:58,280 --> 01:00:01,360
Speaker 1: medication is different in your case, that's fine for your

1029
01:00:01,360 --> 01:00:05,240
Speaker 1: stay on it. Thanks doc, well, thank you so much

1030
01:00:05,280 --> 01:00:06,880
Speaker 1: for coming out. I mean, is there anything that you

1031
01:00:06,960 --> 01:00:12,680
Speaker 1: just want everyone to know about just overall health? And um, doctors,

1032
01:00:14,080 --> 01:00:16,400
Speaker 1: I say the same thing every time I get on

1033
01:00:16,960 --> 01:00:19,920
Speaker 1: It's my soapbox about health. You know, we're especially in

1034
01:00:19,960 --> 01:00:22,160
Speaker 1: this time of COVID. We're all thinking about like is

1035
01:00:22,200 --> 01:00:24,400
Speaker 1: there going to be a vaccine and what's the treatment?

1036
01:00:24,560 --> 01:00:26,880
Speaker 1: You know? But I have you know, I have a

1037
01:00:26,960 --> 01:00:29,920
Speaker 1: relatively small practice because it's a concierge practice, and my

1038
01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:34,000
Speaker 1: patients are tend to be more health conscious and you know,

1039
01:00:34,080 --> 01:00:37,040
Speaker 1: health optimizers, and many of them have gotten COVID and

1040
01:00:37,080 --> 01:00:39,360
Speaker 1: many and all all of them have recovered fine. So

1041
01:00:39,400 --> 01:00:41,560
Speaker 1: I used that as a small sample size to say,

1042
01:00:41,680 --> 01:00:44,480
Speaker 1: if you just take care of your body, exercise, get

1043
01:00:44,600 --> 01:00:47,720
Speaker 1: enough sleep, avoid toxins, make sure you have enough vitamins,

1044
01:00:47,720 --> 01:00:50,280
Speaker 1: and your body, eat a healthy diet. You know, you're

1045
01:00:50,320 --> 01:00:52,480
Speaker 1: going to be in a good place relative to the

1046
01:00:52,520 --> 01:00:56,080
Speaker 1: rest of society. Okay, awesome, thank you so much, very

1047
01:00:56,120 --> 01:00:58,240
Speaker 1: thank you for your time. We really appreciate it, and

1048
01:00:58,320 --> 01:01:00,920
Speaker 1: you're welcome back any time because every enjoy talking to you,

1049
01:01:00,960 --> 01:01:05,240
Speaker 1: so thank you. Likewise, thank you. That was fascinating some

1050
01:01:05,320 --> 01:01:09,400
Speaker 1: of the especially the stuff that we talked about afterwards. Yeah,

1051
01:01:09,480 --> 01:01:13,760
Speaker 1: I think again, like we kind of started this episode

1052
01:01:13,760 --> 01:01:16,479
Speaker 1: with I think it it was really important to have

1053
01:01:16,760 --> 01:01:20,640
Speaker 1: just two different minds about this stuff because again, we're

1054
01:01:20,680 --> 01:01:24,560
Speaker 1: not professionals. Don't take our word for anything. And even

1055
01:01:24,680 --> 01:01:27,240
Speaker 1: Robert Kennedy said it, even with his as much as

1056
01:01:27,280 --> 01:01:29,200
Speaker 1: he's on the other side of the fence, he's like,

1057
01:01:29,240 --> 01:01:33,760
Speaker 1: just ask questions, you know, and and and dr Abe

1058
01:01:33,760 --> 01:01:35,760
Speaker 1: even when we asked him, it's like, how do you

1059
01:01:35,840 --> 01:01:38,440
Speaker 1: how does he receive you know, people asking questions, And

1060
01:01:38,480 --> 01:01:40,919
Speaker 1: he seemed very open to it. You know, he wasn't

1061
01:01:40,960 --> 01:01:43,440
Speaker 1: like defense about he was just like, yeah, it's okay,

1062
01:01:43,480 --> 01:01:45,680
Speaker 1: people come in. It's a very personal thing. So art

1063
01:01:45,720 --> 01:01:47,360
Speaker 1: he was saying, he's like, our job is to be

1064
01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:50,040
Speaker 1: empathetic to that that this is a lot of these

1065
01:01:50,040 --> 01:01:53,320
Speaker 1: topics involved their children, which were we protect more than

1066
01:01:53,360 --> 01:01:57,680
Speaker 1: anything in this world, so I really enjoyed this episode.

1067
01:01:57,720 --> 01:02:01,000
Speaker 1: There's a lot of information, so take it all for

1068
01:02:01,080 --> 01:02:04,800
Speaker 1: what it is and that's all it is. Just ask questions,

1069
01:02:04,840 --> 01:02:08,920
Speaker 1: process information, and make your own decision for sure. I

1070
01:02:09,000 --> 01:02:10,280
Speaker 1: love you guys later