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Speaker 1: On Saturday, September twenty fourth, nineteen eighty eight, the body

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Speaker 1: of nineteen year old Anthony Clan was discovered on the

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Speaker 1: east side of Cleveland, Ohio, in Rockefeller Parkstone Creek. He

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Speaker 1: had been stabbed in the chest three times and his

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Speaker 1: throat was slit on the verge of decapitation. The ground

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Speaker 1: around him was undisturbed, suggesting that.

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Speaker 2: The murder occurred elsewhere.

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Speaker 1: One of the three men who came to identify the

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Speaker 1: body on Monday, September twenty sixth, and thus began to

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Speaker 1: control the narrative, had arguably the most to gain from

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Speaker 1: doing so, a convicted rapist and drug dealer named Paul

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Speaker 1: Stony Lewis, whom Anthony Clan had once identified in another rape.

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Speaker 1: The two other men supported Stoney's narrative at trial. During

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Speaker 1: the investigation of fourth man emerged the victims cuckoled Edward Espinoza,

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Speaker 1: who joined the narrative and received leniency for the part

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Speaker 1: he played in the murder in exchange for his false

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Speaker 1: eyewitness testimony against his employer Michael Keenan and his co

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Speaker 1: worker Joji abroshow some elements of the story were real

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Speaker 1: and occurred on Thursday September twenty second, but had little

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Speaker 1: to do with the actual night of Anthony Clan's murder Friday,

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Speaker 1: September twenty third. Both Michael Keenan and Joe de Ambrosio's

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Speaker 1: whereabouts on Friday night were known, and despite Espinoza's two

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Speaker 1: separate and contradictory affidavits and knowing about the discrepancy between

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Speaker 1: the two nights, the prosecution nevertheless forged ahead, hiding a

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Speaker 1: mountain of exculpatory evidence and sending Joe de Ambrosio and

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Speaker 1: Michael Keenan.

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Speaker 2: Straight to death row. This is Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flamm.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back to Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flamm. Today you're

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Speaker 1: going to hear the story of Joe d Ambrose, who

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Speaker 1: is the sixth person to be exonerated from Ohio's Death Throw,

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Speaker 1: one hundred and fortieth in America to be exonerated. Joe,

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Speaker 1: this story is, I mean, it's got so many twists

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Speaker 1: and turns. But let me just for the audience's sake,

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Speaker 1: before I even introduce you, let me just say this

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Speaker 1: involves a group of cops that were so corrupted. Forty

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Speaker 1: four of them were charged with taking money and protecting

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Speaker 1: cocaine operations in Cleveland and northern Ohio. This goes back

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Speaker 1: to the nineteen eighties. Of course, it involves a date

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Speaker 1: that was changed in order to make the case fit

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Speaker 1: the facts instead of the other way around. It involves

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Speaker 1: a dead body found in Dones Creek that had been

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Speaker 1: stabbed and split throat and everything. I mean, this thing,

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Speaker 1: I'm not even scratching the surface. I hate to say it,

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Speaker 1: but you lived it. So Joe, I'm sorry for what

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Speaker 1: you went through, but I'm very very grateful and honor

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Speaker 1: that you're here on the show with us today.

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Speaker 3: Thank you very much.

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Speaker 1: And with us is a very you unique individual with

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Speaker 1: a unique name as well. We have Neil Kakutha, who

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Speaker 1: was one of the great heroes in this story, but

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Speaker 1: who was also When I say the unique individual, here's

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Speaker 1: a guy who's a nurse, a lawyer, and a priest.

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Speaker 1: I mean it almost sounds like the punchline and a

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Speaker 1: joke or the setup to a joke, right, a nurse,

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Speaker 1: a lawyer, and a priest walking a bar. But then

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Speaker 1: it was only one guy. Hey, and here he is,

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Speaker 1: so Neil Kakuthe. Thank you for being here with us today.

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Speaker 3: It's good to be with you.

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Speaker 1: And Joe, you were a guy who served in the

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Speaker 1: US Army, right You achieved the rank of sergeant.

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Speaker 3: Is that correct?

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Speaker 1: Yes, and we're honorably discharged. But were you a guy

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Speaker 1: who had had a lot of trouble with the law

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Speaker 1: before this crazy thing happened. Tell us a little bit

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Speaker 1: about your background, your upbringing.

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Speaker 3: I grew up just outside of Cleveland in the suburbs,

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Speaker 3: a little town called North Royalton, and the only thing

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Speaker 3: that was in that place was bars and gas stations

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Speaker 3: and farms. So I kind of a country boy, and

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Speaker 3: I didn't on a stay and be one of those

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Speaker 3: three things. So I joined the military as soon as

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Speaker 3: I got out of high school. I did my four

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Speaker 3: years in the military, and then I got out, honorably discharged,

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Speaker 3: sergeant out of the military, and then this thing comes

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Speaker 3: out of the blue.

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Speaker 1: I mean, is it fair to say that this could

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Speaker 1: happen to you? It could happen to anyone.

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Speaker 3: Oh, exactly, I'm the most common Joe there could be. Truly.

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Speaker 3: All it takes is one person, no other evidence, one

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Speaker 3: person to point their finger at you and say they

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Speaker 3: stood there and watched why you killed this person? And

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Speaker 3: there you go.

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Speaker 1: It's so nuts that you could have ended up on

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Speaker 1: death row just because of one person with a lot

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Speaker 1: to gain by saying so, right, an incentivized person.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 1: So I'd like to set this stage a bit here.

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Speaker 1: This is the late eighties and liter Lily on the

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Speaker 1: east side of Cleveland, Ohio, very reminiscent of Tony I.

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Speaker 1: Panovitch's story. Actually, you know, bar culture, lots of partying

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Speaker 1: going on, and in this case there's coke drinking and

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Speaker 1: a group of friends and acquaintances, some of whom Joe

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Speaker 1: worked with doing landscaping. And then there's a bit of

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Speaker 1: crossover from that group into the drug business of a

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Speaker 1: guy named Paul Stony Lewis.

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Speaker 4: So Stony was just your local two bit drug dealer

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Speaker 4: down in the little Italy neighborhood on the east side

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Speaker 4: of Cleveland. And Anthony Klan was one of these guys

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Speaker 4: that frequented Stony, as was a number of the other guys.

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Speaker 4: Michael Keenan in this case, at Espinoza and others hung

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Speaker 4: around together.

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Speaker 1: Right, And something that needs to be pointed out here

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Speaker 1: was that months before this murder occurred, back in May

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Speaker 1: nineteen eighty eight, Stoney allegedly raped Anthony Clan's roommate Chris Longenecker,

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Speaker 1: and Anthony and Chris were both scheduled to testify against

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Speaker 1: Tony Lewis, but Chris Longenecker was legally blind and misread

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Speaker 1: when they were supposed to appear in court, so Stony

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Speaker 1: was released, leaving Clan and Longeneck are in danger. Now

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Speaker 1: you mentioned before Mike Keenan and Edward Espinoza, who, from

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Speaker 1: what I understand, had a landscaping business. Mike Keenan Joe's

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Speaker 1: kind of co defended in this whole mess. He was

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Speaker 1: the owner and Espinosa was his foreman. And Joe around

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Speaker 1: the end of August nineteen eighty eight, you were going

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Speaker 1: to go back into the military, but you needed to

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Speaker 1: wait on your discharge paperwork to be reissued. And while

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Speaker 1: you waited, you worked for Mike Keenan. Do I have

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Speaker 1: that right?

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Speaker 3: Well, I needed a job to hold me over, and

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Speaker 3: I grew up in the country cutting grasses like in

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Speaker 3: my blood, So yeah, I got hired on September first,

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Speaker 3: nineteen eighty eight. September twenty sixth, I'm sitting in jail,

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Speaker 3: accused the most tenous crime in.

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Speaker 1: The world right. But before we even get to that,

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Speaker 1: I want to talk about Thursday night, September twenty second,

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Speaker 1: nineteen eighty eight, a day before this murder occurred. It

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Speaker 1: was the events of that night that were used to

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Speaker 1: predicate the narrative that was used against you and Michael

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Speaker 1: Keenan at both of your trials, while all along people

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Speaker 1: had seen the victim here, Anthony Clan alive the following night, Friday,

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Speaker 1: September twenty third, one of whom even gave him camp

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Speaker 1: Fair home. But we'll get to that later. So let's

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Speaker 1: go back to Thursday the twenty second.

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Speaker 4: On Thursday night of this week, all of these people,

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Speaker 4: Eddie Espinoza, Mike Keenan, with Mike Keenan's girlfriend, Anthony Clan, Joe,

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Speaker 4: Dan Brosio, Paul Stony Lewis, they were on a pub

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Speaker 4: call through the Coventry area of Little Italy, and so

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Speaker 4: they were all drinking that night. And Joe admittedly was

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Speaker 4: part of this drinking group on Thursday night at these

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Speaker 4: different bars, and at one of the bars, Joe, where

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Speaker 4: was it where they got into the restroom fight?

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Speaker 3: That was Coconut Joe's.

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Speaker 4: So Anthony Clan and Eddie Espinoza got into a somewhat

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Speaker 4: violent or at least racous altercation in the men's room

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Speaker 4: of the bar. There is some suspicion that Anthony Clan

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Speaker 4: was having a sexual relationship with Eddie Espinoza's girlfriend. Anyway,

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Speaker 4: that racus scene at the bar caused the bouncer to

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Speaker 4: throw them out, and Eddie Espinoza takes a beer bottle,

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Speaker 4: slams it against the bar, breaks it in half, and

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Speaker 4: starts threatening people. And so they're thrown out and the

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Speaker 4: night moves on, the police come, everybody assures them that

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Speaker 4: they're calmed down, there won't be any problem, and they

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Speaker 4: go home. So we've got Eddie Espinoza, who's already in

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Speaker 4: conflict with Tony Klan over something which we suspect as

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Speaker 4: a triangular romantic relationship. And we got Paul Stony Lewis,

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Speaker 4: who's involved with Anthony Clan because Anthony Klan is a

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Speaker 4: witness to this rape with Christopher Longenecker. And you've got

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Speaker 4: both of those people who are involved with Anthony Klan

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Speaker 4: from different perspectives.

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Speaker 1: So we're going to come back to Thursday night and

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Speaker 1: what eventually becomes the narrative of the case against Joe

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Speaker 1: and Mike Keenan in a minute, But first let's talk

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Speaker 1: about what we know. On Saturday, September twenty third, nineteen

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Speaker 1: eighty eight, nineteen year old Anthony Klan's body was found

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Speaker 1: by a jogger on the east side of Cleveland and

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Speaker 1: Rockefeller Parks Doan Brook or Doan Creek, depending on who

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Speaker 1: you're talking to, they have different names for it. He

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Speaker 1: had sustained multiple stabounds to the chest and his throat

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Speaker 1: had been slit so deeply that he had nearly been decapitated. Now,

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Speaker 1: no murder weapon was ever found, and the body went

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Speaker 1: unclaimed until Monday the twenty sixth.

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Speaker 3: That Monday, an anonymous caller called in to the morgue

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Speaker 3: and asked if there was a nineteen year old kid.

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Speaker 3: Does he have this color hair, these color eyes, these

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Speaker 3: tattoos and these marks on his hands and wrists? And

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Speaker 3: the detective got on the phone and the Detective's like, yes,

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Speaker 3: we have him. Can you come down and please identify him?

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Speaker 3: The guy he wouldn't identify himself, and then he hung up. Wow. Well.

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Speaker 3: Shortly after that, Stony Foot and Adam Flannick all went

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Speaker 3: down to the morgue and identified Anthony. But the thing is,

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Speaker 3: how did Stony know about the defensive wounds on Anthony's

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Speaker 3: hands and arms? All who was in the paper was

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Speaker 3: a little blurb that an unidentified white male was found

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Speaker 3: in Dome Creek and that was it.

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Speaker 1: Right, So at least it appears that the person on

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Speaker 1: the phone knew things that only someone involved could have

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Speaker 1: possibly known. And then, surprise, surprise, right after the Carter's

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Speaker 1: office got this anonymous call, who shows up but Paul Stony, Lewis,

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Speaker 1: James Russell, or as Joe called him, Foot and Adam Flannick,

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Speaker 1: three of the witnesses that helped with Joe and Mike

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Speaker 1: Keenan on death row. Now these three men identify the body,

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Speaker 1: and the narrative began to build that the murder happened

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Speaker 1: on the night you were all out together at the bar,

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Speaker 1: which was Thursday, which is when Stny went home early. However,

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Speaker 1: the murder actually occurred on Friday. Eventually, investigators caught up

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Speaker 1: with the guy who had fought with Clan on Thursday,

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Speaker 1: Tony Clan's cuckled, Edward Espinoza, who gave police a false

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Speaker 1: eyewitness account claiming to have witnessed Joe and Mike Keenan

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Speaker 1: commit the murder.

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Speaker 4: Eddie Espinoza refers to him as little Tony, and supposedly

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Speaker 4: little Tony is his best buddy and he's going to

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Speaker 4: do everything he can to protect little Tony all along

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Speaker 4: the way. And so Eddie Espinoza gets arrested and taken

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Speaker 4: down to the station and he swears out an affidavit

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Speaker 4: that lists all of the dates, times, places, people and everything.

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Speaker 4: And then when the police come in and look at this,

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Speaker 4: they realize that what Eddie Espinoza has put down in

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Speaker 4: his the David does not fit the narrative that they

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Speaker 4: want to paint of this case, and so they have

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Speaker 4: him swear out another aff the davit that literally gives

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Speaker 4: different day, different times, different places, so that the police

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Speaker 4: can paint their narrative. And both of those Affi davits,

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Speaker 4: to this very day, they exist in the file and

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Speaker 4: you can put them side by side and you can

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Speaker 4: see that somebody coached Eddie Espinoza to change his story up.

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Speaker 1: Wow. They were like, no, no, that one's not so great?

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Speaker 1: Am I doing that over? We'll just give you a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a right.

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Speaker 4: Within forty eight hours of each other, two distinct aff

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Speaker 4: the Davits sworn out by Eddie Espinoza.

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Speaker 1: And then how in the world can anybody take anything

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Speaker 1: that guy says seriously? After that, well, you know, when

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Speaker 1: they want to get somebody, they get somebody.

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Speaker 4: And Eddie Espinoza has a violent history. He was also

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Speaker 4: in the service, dishonorably discharged for drugs and for violent behavior.

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Speaker 1: So you got a guy with a violent history and

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Speaker 1: a motive to kill as the spurned, cuckolded boyfriend of

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Speaker 1: the woman with whom Anthony Klan was having an affair,

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Speaker 1: and in his narraive events. After his fight with Anthony

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Speaker 1: Klan at the bar, he and Joe headed back to

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Speaker 1: Joe's apartment around one thirty am, at which point Mike

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Speaker 1: Keenan drove up and told them that Stony had stolen

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Speaker 1: drugs from him. Espinoza grabbed a bat, Joe grabbed a knife,

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Speaker 1: and the three of them drove around looking for Paul

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Speaker 1: Stony Lewis Now again, what about this so far is true?

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Speaker 3: Guess what?

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Speaker 1: None of this shit even fucking matters because this is

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Speaker 1: Thursday night, not the night of the murder, which was Friday,

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Speaker 1: so lies truth. It's utterly meaningless to even debated. Now,

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Speaker 1: another two witnesses supported this narrative, Carolyn Roselle and her

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Speaker 1: friend you'll remember him, James Russell. You know his dictum

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Speaker 1: was Foot said that the three men knocked on Rosell's

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Speaker 1: door looked looking for Stony at around three am. After

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Speaker 1: this encounter, Espinosa's narrative continues, saying that while driving along,

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Speaker 1: they eventually saw Anthony Clan walk on the side of

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Speaker 1: the road, forced him into the back seat, interrogated him

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Speaker 1: about Stoney's whereabouts, and after Espinoza hit him with a bat,

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Speaker 1: Clan told them Stony's address, and the men proceed to

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Speaker 1: Stony's apartment building. Now, according to Stony's neighbor, you'll remember him,

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Speaker 1: of course, Adam Flannick, he first heard the group yelling

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Speaker 1: at and banging on Stoney's door, saying I want my

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Speaker 1: dope or I want my coke. So Flanet continued to

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Speaker 1: claim to be able to see down into the car

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Speaker 1: where you Joe were allegedly pointing a knife up to

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Speaker 1: Anthony Clan's jaw, a view that would be totally impossible

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Speaker 1: from any vantage point because of how the back seats

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Speaker 1: and Kenyan's pick up face one Another but we still

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Speaker 1: don't know what Planet had to gain from saying that

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Speaker 1: maybe he was involved, maybe he was coerced, who knows,

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Speaker 1: maybe he was even confused. But what we do know

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Speaker 1: is that again, it really just doesn't fucking matter, because

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Speaker 1: Anthony Clan was not murdered that night, but the following night. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: back to Espinosa's narrative, the three men went back to Roselle's,

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Speaker 1: where they issued a warning for Roselle to deliver to

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Speaker 1: Stony that there was a quote contract out on him

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Speaker 1: and that they had Clan in the car who was

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Speaker 1: quote dead meat. Espinosa goes on to say that Clan

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Speaker 1: eventually escaped from the car. Keenan allegedly then told Joe

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Speaker 1: to finish him off, and then Joe allegedly ran after Clan.

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Speaker 1: Clan begged for his life while Joe allegedly killed him

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Speaker 1: with a knife. Again, this is a bogus recollection of

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Speaker 1: Thursday night, and we know this because we later found

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Speaker 1: out that Clan was seen alive again at Coconut Joe's

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Speaker 1: on Friday night. He got drunk and was given capfair

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Speaker 1: by the barmaid. So that was Friday night, the night

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Speaker 1: after this alleged Stony Lewis search party happened, and Joe,

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Speaker 1: on Friday, your whereabouts were totally accounted for, correct, right.

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Speaker 3: I was getting near being able to go back into

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Speaker 3: the military and I was getting evicted. So I was

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Speaker 3: having an eviction party that night, and there was a

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Speaker 3: bunch of people that were over all night long. But

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Speaker 3: the problem was I'm terrible with names.

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Speaker 4: Later, when we were able to identify some of the

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Speaker 4: names that Joe was talking about people who were indeed

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Speaker 4: at that inviction party, one of them mentioned to me

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Speaker 4: that on that Friday night, they were all gathered at

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Speaker 4: Joe's apartment and they were watching a football game, and

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Speaker 4: so I'm like, who's got a Friday night football game?

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Speaker 4: I'm doing this ten years later. So I literally ended

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Speaker 4: up doing some research at the Cuyahoga County Public Library

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Speaker 4: for old editions of the Cleveland Plane Dealer, and I

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Speaker 4: was looking through the high school games that were being

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Speaker 4: played on Friday night, and one of them was Brush

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Speaker 4: High School on the east side of Cleveland, and names

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Speaker 4: that we literally discovered later were there. And remember watching

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Speaker 4: that particular.

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Speaker 1: Game, and that's the night that the murder actually took place,

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Speaker 1: not the Knight that was sort of substituted. So you

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Speaker 1: had all these people that could exonerate you, but you

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Speaker 1: had no way to subpoena them to testify because you

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Speaker 1: didn't have full names and numbers, nor did you have

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Speaker 1: lawyers who were even particularly interested. And then you've got

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Speaker 1: these guys who you've been working or just partying with

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Speaker 1: for about the last month, who are all spinning a

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Speaker 1: narrative together to close this case for the authorities on

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Speaker 1: you and your boss, Mike Keenan. And of course I'm

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Speaker 1: talking about Espinosa and Stony Lewis, who would probably have

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Speaker 1: thrown their own mother under the bus in order to

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Speaker 1: save themselves from death row.

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Speaker 3: Exactly so, because I barely knew any of these people,

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Speaker 3: I think myself that it was Paul, Stony Lewis and

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Speaker 3: Espinoza together killed Anthony because they both knew facts that

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Speaker 3: only the murder or would know, and then they were

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Speaker 3: able to point their finger elsewhere.

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Speaker 1: So three men ultimately were charged with this gruesome murder,

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Speaker 1: Michael Keenan, Edward Espinoza, and you, Joe. And it's important

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Speaker 1: again to note that in exchange for his testimony against

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Speaker 1: you and Keenan, who were tried separately. Espinoza pleaded guilty

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Speaker 1: to manslaughter and was given the lesser sentence of fifteen

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Speaker 1: to seventy five years in prison. So we know what

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Speaker 1: his motivation was. And this is a guy who we

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Speaker 1: know is a liar. You don't have to say he's

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Speaker 1: a liar. You can't sign two sworn affidavits that are

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Speaker 1: totally different within forty eight hours of each other and

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Speaker 1: not be lying. Okay, let's get to the trial. Tell

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Speaker 1: us a little about your representation.

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Speaker 3: It should be lack thereof representation. If my attorneys would

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Speaker 3: have believed me and did a little bit of investigation,

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Speaker 3: I never would have been convicted because father Neil, ten

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Speaker 3: years after the fact, was finding all this evidence with

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Speaker 3: little work. So my attorneys did very little. One was

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Speaker 3: running for mayor of a little town at the time

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Speaker 3: and couldn't be bothered, and the other one just didn't

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Speaker 3: want anything to do with me because they didn't believe

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Speaker 3: me from day one that I had nothing to do

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Speaker 3: with this, because they were the ones that talked to

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Speaker 3: me into going with a three judge panel because I

337
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Speaker 3: didn't know no better. You have to do very little

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Speaker 3: work as an attorney for a three judge panel case.

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Speaker 1: So the trial took place on February sixth, nineteen eighty nine,

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Speaker 1: in the Cayahoga Court of Common Please, as you said,

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Speaker 1: in front of a three judge panel. The prosecutor was

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Speaker 1: Carmen Marino. Now important to note that no murder weapon

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Speaker 1: was ever found in this case, right, So, how the

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Speaker 1: hell do you send a guy much less too to

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Speaker 1: death row with no murder weapon and no physical evidence.

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Speaker 3: Well, back then, I used to hunt and fish, and

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Speaker 3: I had my hunting knives. So when they came and

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Speaker 3: illegally entered my house and arrested me, they took my knives,

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Speaker 3: and all three of my knives tested negative for blood.

350
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Speaker 3: Yet throughout the whole trial they waved them around and

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Speaker 3: called them the murder weapons.

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Speaker 1: So they're parading around false evidence. What the hell else

353
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Speaker 1: was presented against you?

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Speaker 3: Most of the time on the stand was covered by

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Speaker 3: Espinoza and Paul Stony Lewis. You know when the two

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Speaker 3: real murderers are taking the stand and they're backed up

357
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Speaker 3: by the prosecutor, and then you throw in this joke

358
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Speaker 3: of a coroner we had that all she ever did

359
00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:45,919
Speaker 3: was rubber stamp. Whatever the cops said that was their

360
00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:50,480
Speaker 3: whole prosecution that Espinosa said he stood there and watched

361
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Speaker 3: why me and Mike Keenan killed Anthony clan Stony says,

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Speaker 3: the knight that Anthony was killed was the knight that

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Speaker 3: we were in the bars.

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Speaker 1: A very very important problem with this is that he

365
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Speaker 1: mixed up September twenty third as September twenty second.

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Speaker 3: Exactly what it was is they wouldn't say dates. All

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Speaker 3: they kept saying is on the night when we went

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Speaker 3: to the bar, when we were there, when we were

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Speaker 3: all together, nobody used a date.

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Speaker 1: And were you elbowing your lawyer going hey, hey, hey,

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Speaker 1: that's the wrong Oh you bet.

372
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Speaker 4: They did bring up the idea that the state was

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Speaker 4: painting the wrong day because the day that you were

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Speaker 4: at the bar was tequila Knite, right, And so tequila

375
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Speaker 4: Knight was Thursday not Friday. And you even had the

376
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Speaker 4: proprietor of the bar, Stephen Gaines I believe was his name. Yes,

377
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Speaker 4: Stephen Gaines, literally came and took the stand and said

378
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Speaker 4: these men were there on tequila knite Thursday, not Friday.

379
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Speaker 1: So this discrepancy was actually clearly pointed out. And I mean,

380
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Speaker 1: do you even have any theory whatsoever about how this

381
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Speaker 1: three junge panel could have been so blind and gotten

382
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Speaker 1: this so totally wrong.

383
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Speaker 4: You know, you've got anybody that might have been put

384
00:22:04,640 --> 00:22:08,000
Speaker 4: on the stand for Joe's case, we're not available at

385
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Speaker 4: the time of the trial to establish that alibi for Joe,

386
00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:14,080
Speaker 4: or to even be there as a character witness. And

387
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Speaker 4: so you put that up against Eddie Espinoza as suspect

388
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Speaker 4: as he may be, but he's claiming to be an

389
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Speaker 4: eye witness to this, and it literally becomes you know,

390
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Speaker 4: where's the greater way of the evidence and the credibility?

391
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Speaker 4: And you know, the three judge panel, who were all

392
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Speaker 4: former prosecutors, have that prosecutorial bent and they're going to

393
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Speaker 4: lean that way to begin with.

394
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Speaker 3: See, the one thing that I made my attorneys do

395
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Speaker 3: is let me testify. And I figured if I could

396
00:22:45,119 --> 00:22:48,520
Speaker 3: get up there and tell the truth, the judges would

397
00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:51,879
Speaker 3: be like, come on, this this case is just wrong,

398
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Speaker 3: you know, and release me. So my attorneys threw me

399
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Speaker 3: up their cold They didn't give me any preparation, they

400
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:04,080
Speaker 3: didn't have checked when the prosecutor just tore me to pieces,

401
00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:07,000
Speaker 3: they kept telling me I'm lying, I'm just saying all

402
00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:10,359
Speaker 3: this to save my life. But the sad part is

403
00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:16,880
Speaker 3: they had evidence that proved that everything I said was true,

404
00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:20,480
Speaker 3: and they hid it from me. In a blink of

405
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:24,200
Speaker 3: an eye. My trial's over with. I have the shortest

406
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Speaker 3: penalty trial in the state of Ohio history, two and

407
00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 3: three quarter days from let's start to you die. You

408
00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:34,360
Speaker 3: know you hear that they're going to pass thirty thousand

409
00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:38,040
Speaker 3: volts through your body until you are dead for something

410
00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:39,119
Speaker 3: I had nothing to do with.

411
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Speaker 4: So I was ordained in nineteen ninety five and I

412
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:03,000
Speaker 4: was reading a cat flake newsweek called National Catholic Reporter,

413
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:06,560
Speaker 4: and in that there was a brother, Patrick Byrd from

414
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:10,720
Speaker 4: Texas who had his own death row pen Pale ministry,

415
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,080
Speaker 4: and he was looking for people to join him in

416
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:18,960
Speaker 4: writing to death row inmates. I eventually started writing to many, many,

417
00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:23,760
Speaker 4: many of the inmates and became penpales with them, including Joe.

418
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,760
Speaker 4: And in December of nineteen ninety eight, Dorothy Dan Brosio,

419
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:31,120
Speaker 4: Joe's mother, passed away here in Cleveland. I found out

420
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:34,399
Speaker 4: about it through the obituaries in the newspaper, and so

421
00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:38,960
Speaker 4: on Joe's behalf. I went to the funeral home to

422
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:43,119
Speaker 4: pay my respects and then The next day, I actually

423
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 4: went to the church to con celebrate his mother's funeral mass.

424
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Speaker 3: And then the.

425
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Speaker 4: Next time I was down on death row, I asked

426
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 4: the corrections officers if I could have just a few

427
00:24:56,560 --> 00:25:01,280
Speaker 4: minutes of Joe's time to express my condolence, says and

428
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:04,040
Speaker 4: paint a picture of his mother's funeral for him.

429
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:09,199
Speaker 3: At this point, I was writing everybody, every law school,

430
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:13,760
Speaker 3: every journalism school, all the news media. I was writing everybody,

431
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,719
Speaker 3: trying to get somebody to help me. But now I

432
00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 3: have a human being in my cell and he can't

433
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,480
Speaker 3: run away because he's locked in there with me. So

434
00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:28,040
Speaker 3: he's sitting there trying to explain my mother's funeral to me,

435
00:25:28,440 --> 00:25:31,600
Speaker 3: and I'm thanking him profusely, but I'm like, but you

436
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:33,919
Speaker 3: don't understand. You have to help me. I didn't do

437
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:37,240
Speaker 3: what they said I did. And he's like, no, no.

438
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:39,880
Speaker 3: He would go back to talking about my mom's funeral,

439
00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:43,080
Speaker 3: and then I would thank him again, you know, and

440
00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:46,480
Speaker 3: be like, you know, I appreciate and everything, but you

441
00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 3: don't understand. They're trying to put me where she's at.

442
00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:51,840
Speaker 3: They're trying to murder me for something I had nothing

443
00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:55,520
Speaker 3: to do. And that's when the attorney of him kicked in,

444
00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:58,960
Speaker 3: because he's not only a priest, he's an attorney and

445
00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,199
Speaker 3: a registered nurse, and he had to be all three

446
00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:03,879
Speaker 3: things to do what he did for me.

447
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:07,719
Speaker 4: And so I took the trial transcript home and I

448
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:10,159
Speaker 4: read it from cover to cover the first night, and

449
00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:14,160
Speaker 4: I knew that there was at least something wrong because

450
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:18,400
Speaker 4: I was reading the coroner's testimony and she was describing

451
00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:23,600
Speaker 4: Anthony Clan's wounds. Now, Anthony Klan was sliced ear to

452
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 4: ear and then stabbed three times in the chest. He

453
00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:31,720
Speaker 4: was almost decapitated. And so she testifies that after these

454
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:35,359
Speaker 4: massive holes are created in the trachea that, based on

455
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:40,520
Speaker 4: Eddie Espinoza's testimony, Anthony is running away from his perpetrators,

456
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 4: literally screaming for his life. Don't kill me, don't kill me, Please,

457
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:48,359
Speaker 4: don't kill me. Now, you don't have to be a

458
00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:53,680
Speaker 4: nurse to understand that when your airway is compromised, especially

459
00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:58,119
Speaker 4: as severely as his was, that you're not whispering, let

460
00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:02,119
Speaker 4: alone screaming any And not only that, but they all

461
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:05,840
Speaker 4: testified that he had six hundred and fifty milliters of

462
00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:10,080
Speaker 4: blood in his chest cavity and if you saw these wounds,

463
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,680
Speaker 4: you would know without question that he wasn't running at all,

464
00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 4: that he would never have been able to speak, and

465
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,800
Speaker 4: he would have been drowning in his own secretions. And

466
00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:23,200
Speaker 4: I'm like, somebody got away with this testimony, either lying

467
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:29,160
Speaker 4: or the cross examination just was totally nonexistent or totally ineffective.

468
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 4: And I began to ask myself, what else could be

469
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:33,240
Speaker 4: wrong in this case?

470
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 1: Tell us about what you found and how it led

471
00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:37,959
Speaker 1: to where we are today.

472
00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:41,560
Speaker 4: So I went down to the records room of the

473
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:46,120
Speaker 4: Cuyahoga County Justice Center and I started pulling the microfish

474
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:50,200
Speaker 4: files of all the major names in this case. And then,

475
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:54,920
Speaker 4: just as a fluke, I decided to pull Anthony Klan's

476
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:59,480
Speaker 4: microfish file and came across a notation from a police

477
00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:05,120
Speaker 4: report that Anthony had witnessed a rape in May nineteen

478
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,720
Speaker 4: eighty eight. And then you find out that the rapist

479
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:13,880
Speaker 4: is one Paul Stoney Lewis. And then in the records

480
00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:16,600
Speaker 4: they gave the name of the rape victim, a guy

481
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 4: by the name of Christopher Longeneker. Christopher is blind and

482
00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:23,480
Speaker 4: suffers from cerebral palsy, but he can read in just

483
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:27,040
Speaker 4: a very small sliver. And so Christopher Longeneker gets this

484
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 4: notice that he needs to appear in court for a

485
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:32,679
Speaker 4: pre trial, and he does. He shows up at the

486
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:37,560
Speaker 4: courthouse on August eleventh, but he had misread it. He

487
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:40,920
Speaker 4: was supposed to be there on August first. And because

488
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:45,200
Speaker 4: the only witness didn't show up, they released Paul stony Lewis,

489
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:48,240
Speaker 4: who had been in jail down there since May. And

490
00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:52,120
Speaker 4: now you've got a previous rapist just out on his

491
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:55,080
Speaker 4: own recognizance, and there's one guy out there that can

492
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:57,600
Speaker 4: testify him and put him in back in jail for

493
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:01,240
Speaker 4: a long, long, long long time, and that's Anthony Clan.

494
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,960
Speaker 4: And all of a sudden, Anthony Klan ends up dead

495
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 4: in Don't Creek. And the guy that points his finger

496
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:11,480
Speaker 4: to Joe is Paul stony Lewis, the guy who has

497
00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:14,800
Speaker 4: the most to do to save his neck. So that

498
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 4: rape was the seminole thing that got us back into

499
00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:24,520
Speaker 4: federal court. And Judge Kathleen O'Malley of the District Court

500
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:28,280
Speaker 4: here in Cuyahoga County, the sixth District Federal Court, gave

501
00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:33,040
Speaker 4: us sweeping discovery which literally said we had full access

502
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:37,960
Speaker 4: to the police files. The coroner's files the prosecutor's files,

503
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,240
Speaker 4: almost nothing could be withheld from.

504
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:42,760
Speaker 1: Us, so in July two thousand and four, at an

505
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:48,040
Speaker 1: evidentiary hearing, they presented the following evidence, none of which

506
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:51,960
Speaker 1: was given to the defense before Joe's initial trial.

507
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:52,240
Speaker 3: So.

508
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:56,560
Speaker 1: Two former Cleveland police detectives testified that because no grass

509
00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:58,840
Speaker 1: or weeds were disturbed in the area where Clan's body

510
00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 1: had been found, they believed he was killed elsewhere, dumped

511
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:05,560
Speaker 1: in the creek. Clan's ex roommate, Chris Longenecker, testified that

512
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:10,360
Speaker 1: Lewis had raped him shortly before Clan was killed. Longnecker

513
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:14,040
Speaker 1: said that after hearing of Clan's murder, Longenecker called the

514
00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:17,160
Speaker 1: police to say that he believed Clan was killed because

515
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:20,480
Speaker 1: he was likely aware of the rape. The records showing

516
00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 1: that at one time police had had an order or

517
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,640
Speaker 1: recording of a statement from a man named Angelo Crimini,

518
00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:29,760
Speaker 1: who also implicated others in the murder. At the same

519
00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:33,920
Speaker 1: July two thousand and four hearing, Joe's trial lawyer testified

520
00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:36,920
Speaker 1: that during a pre trial conference with Marino, he was

521
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:39,120
Speaker 1: not allowed to see any police reports. He was allowed

522
00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:44,240
Speaker 1: to take notes as Marino read selected portions. Huh yeah, okay,

523
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:46,880
Speaker 1: one of which ones they selected, and then the alibi

524
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:50,600
Speaker 1: finally right the alibi. Other witnesses now testified that on

525
00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 1: the night of September twenty third, nineteen eighty eight, Joe

526
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:55,720
Speaker 1: was not a Coconut Joe's, but rather was hosting a

527
00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 1: party at his own apartment because he was being evicted.

528
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 1: The one witness who was pregnant and therefore not drinking,

529
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:03,480
Speaker 1: recalled that Joe had passed out on his bed. It's

530
00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:05,560
Speaker 1: really hard. I don't know. I've never stabbed anyone, but

531
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:07,080
Speaker 1: I don't think I could do it while it was

532
00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:08,440
Speaker 1: passed out, even if I wanted to.

533
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:11,000
Speaker 4: So there was another piece of evidence that came to

534
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:13,760
Speaker 4: light for us was we have a witness by the

535
00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:16,800
Speaker 4: name of Linda Deblasio, who was a bar maid at

536
00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:21,680
Speaker 4: Coconut Joe's, who testified that Anthony Clan came to her

537
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 4: bar on Friday night. This would have been now twenty

538
00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:28,000
Speaker 4: four hours after the state said that he was dead,

539
00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:32,920
Speaker 4: and she served Anthony Clan alcohol, served him and realized

540
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 4: that he was not in any kind of shape to

541
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 4: get home on his own, so literally gave him money

542
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:40,400
Speaker 4: for a cab so that he could get home.

543
00:31:40,520 --> 00:31:43,040
Speaker 1: So finally, on March twenty four, two thousand and six, Judg.

544
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:45,440
Speaker 1: O'Malley granted the writ because of the failure to turn

545
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:48,960
Speaker 1: over exculpatory evidence, that conviction was vacated and the new

546
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,680
Speaker 1: trial was ordered. The US Court of Appeals for the

547
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,959
Speaker 1: Sixth Circuit affirmed the ruling, saying that the withheld evidence

548
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:58,920
Speaker 1: would have quote substantially increased reasonable jurors to doubt of

549
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:03,080
Speaker 1: the Ambrosio's guilt. The court said the evidence not only

550
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:06,320
Speaker 1: contradicted or weakened Espinosa's testimony and he was, of course

551
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 1: the only eyewitness for the prosecution, but also demonstrated a

552
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:12,960
Speaker 1: motive for Lewis to kill Clan. And of course the

553
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 1: state fought to retry you despite the evidence of your

554
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 1: innocence that they've been withholding since the investigation, and your

555
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:23,680
Speaker 1: team sought to bar the prosecution from retrying you. And

556
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 1: then something whirred.

557
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:25,000
Speaker 3: It happens.

558
00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:30,840
Speaker 1: One day before O'Malley ruled not to bar retrial, Edward Espinoza,

559
00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:34,440
Speaker 1: who had been released after serving twelve years, was found

560
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:37,640
Speaker 1: dead in a Chicago suburb. Now, who knows if this

561
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:41,520
Speaker 1: is a coincidence or not, but anyway, your team renewed

562
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 1: their motion to borrow retrial, arguing that they would not

563
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:46,400
Speaker 1: be able to cross examine the only eyewitness against Joe

564
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,960
Speaker 1: with all the newly discovered evidence. The motion was granted,

565
00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:54,200
Speaker 1: and after the state's appeal was ultimately denied, your nightmare

566
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:57,600
Speaker 1: was finally over. Can you tell us about your first

567
00:32:58,400 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 1: taste of freedom?

568
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 3: Well, the first time I was actually out, I was

569
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:06,640
Speaker 3: out on bond, and so that was like the first

570
00:33:06,720 --> 00:33:09,800
Speaker 3: time that I was actually out in fresh air without

571
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:13,560
Speaker 3: bars around me. I was on that for exactly one

572
00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:18,880
Speaker 3: year before Judge Sindenberg dismissed the case and refused to

573
00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:20,200
Speaker 3: allow him to retry me.

574
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 4: But Joe, where was the first place your lawyers took

575
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:25,920
Speaker 4: you on the day that you were freed?

576
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:30,240
Speaker 3: They took me across the street from the Justice Center

577
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 3: to a bar to have a drink.

578
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:34,440
Speaker 4: And who was having a fit?

579
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:40,320
Speaker 3: You were having a fis because He's like, really, he

580
00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 3: was in this because he was at bars, and now

581
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 3: you're going to take him to a bar and give

582
00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:51,560
Speaker 3: him alcohol. And they were like, yes, yes, we are.

583
00:33:51,040 --> 00:33:54,440
Speaker 5: Give him whatever you want at that point, exactly right,

584
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,000
Speaker 5: And Jesus, I feel like I need a drink after

585
00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:06,680
Speaker 5: hearing your story.

586
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:13,879
Speaker 4: There's a part that you guys don't know and never

587
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:16,880
Speaker 4: made it into the trial records or trial transcripts. But

588
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:20,920
Speaker 4: it's the smoking gun, and the smoking gun is Teresa Farinacci.

589
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:26,200
Speaker 4: So Teresa Farinacci is a woman who lived in Little

590
00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:30,760
Speaker 4: Italy at the time of the murder. Teresa Farinacci knows

591
00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:35,400
Speaker 4: dates and times because she anchors everything that she does

592
00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:41,040
Speaker 4: around her niece's wedding. So on Friday night, Teresa Farinacci

593
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:47,920
Speaker 4: is at her niece's wedding rehearsal and dinner, comes home

594
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:52,960
Speaker 4: on Friday night early Saturday morning, where she hears a

595
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:58,200
Speaker 4: violent altercation taking place in the home next to her.

596
00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 4: This is Little Italy. They are set rated by just

597
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:03,439
Speaker 4: little alleyways that maybe one or two people side by

598
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:07,239
Speaker 4: side can walk through. And she hears this violent altercation

599
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:12,200
Speaker 4: taking place and calls the police, and the police logs

600
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:16,399
Speaker 4: still in existence indicate that the police responded to her call,

601
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:22,000
Speaker 4: but when they arrived everything's calm, and so rather than investigate,

602
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:26,840
Speaker 4: the police just say, well, whatever it is, it's over with.

603
00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:32,279
Speaker 4: Now comes Saturday morning and Teresa Farinacci is going to

604
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,879
Speaker 4: her niece's wedding and she's being picked up, and as

605
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 4: she walks out of the house, she glances at the

606
00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:42,600
Speaker 4: street next to her, where Mike Keenan's truck is parked,

607
00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:48,640
Speaker 4: because Eddie Espinoza was Mike Keenan's foreman for his Sunshine

608
00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:54,400
Speaker 4: Landscaping company, and so Eddie Espinoza often borrowed Mike Keenan's

609
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 4: truck for his own personal use with Mike Keenan's permission.

610
00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:01,800
Speaker 4: And Anthony Klnn is in the bed of the truck

611
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 4: and she calls out to Anthony Klan and he does

612
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:11,920
Speaker 4: not respond. She thinks that he's sleeping off a drunk,

613
00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:17,120
Speaker 4: and so she calls out to Anthony Clan again with

614
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:22,080
Speaker 4: no response, and she says, you know, because the US

615
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:27,720
Speaker 4: Marshals interviewed her in Joe's retrial proceedings, that she wishes

616
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,640
Speaker 4: she had gone over to literally check on him because

617
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:33,920
Speaker 4: she would have found out that he was dead in

618
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:36,759
Speaker 4: the bed of that truck on Saturday. But she was

619
00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:38,839
Speaker 4: going to be late if she didn't. So she gets

620
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:41,560
Speaker 4: in the car and she goes off to the wedding

621
00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 4: and there's Anthony Klan in the bed of that truck

622
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 4: and the US marshals say to her, so you think

623
00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:51,560
Speaker 4: you saw Anthony Klan in the bed of that truck,

624
00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:54,840
Speaker 4: And she says, you're not listening to me. She said,

625
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:58,520
Speaker 4: I know I saw Anthony Klan in the bed of

626
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:02,720
Speaker 4: that truck was Saturday as she was going to her

627
00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:05,640
Speaker 4: niece's wedding. But because we never got to a retrial,

628
00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:07,800
Speaker 4: that's not out there.

629
00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 3: Oh well wait, wait, you didn't hear the best part.

630
00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:14,080
Speaker 3: Guess who lives in the apartment next to.

631
00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 4: Her where the commotion was taking place.

632
00:37:17,920 --> 00:37:22,120
Speaker 1: Tell me Paul Stony Lewis saw that coming.

633
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:26,040
Speaker 4: On that very same night, Friday night to Saturday morning.

634
00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:30,680
Speaker 4: There is an affidavit from a married couple that lived

635
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:35,279
Speaker 4: in that same complex. This man and woman swore out

636
00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:39,640
Speaker 4: an affidavit that that very same night they heard someone

637
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:44,040
Speaker 4: say we need to dump the body in the basement.

638
00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:49,480
Speaker 4: And so we believe that is where Anthony Clan was murdered.

639
00:37:50,320 --> 00:37:53,439
Speaker 4: We believe he was murdered by Paul Lewis and Eddie

640
00:37:53,560 --> 00:37:57,319
Speaker 4: Espinoza in concert with each other. We believe that he

641
00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:00,480
Speaker 4: was later taken from that basement, thrown in the bed

642
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:04,320
Speaker 4: of that truck and dropped off at Don's Creak. Sometime

643
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:06,680
Speaker 4: Saturday morning early afternoon.

644
00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:10,120
Speaker 1: Joe, have you ever received any compensation?

645
00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:14,279
Speaker 3: We struck a deal with the state of Ohio to

646
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:19,480
Speaker 3: get me compensation nowhere near anything I should have gotten,

647
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:24,240
Speaker 3: and I could have gotten if I continued to fight

648
00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:27,920
Speaker 3: it in the courts. But I'm getting too old. I

649
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:30,799
Speaker 3: needed something to retire on.

650
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:37,200
Speaker 1: Well, listen, I wish you nothing but the best of everything.

651
00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:40,919
Speaker 1: Thank you, And of course now we turn to our

652
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:45,120
Speaker 1: closing of our show, which is appropriately called Closing Arguments.

653
00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:48,040
Speaker 1: First of all, I thank you once again. I really

654
00:38:48,120 --> 00:38:52,240
Speaker 1: appreciate you being on the podcast today, and now closing

655
00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:56,200
Speaker 1: Arguments works like this, I turn off my microphone, kicked

656
00:38:56,280 --> 00:39:00,360
Speaker 1: back in my chair and just listen. You get to

657
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:04,560
Speaker 1: say whatever do you want. Father, With all due respect,

658
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:06,719
Speaker 1: We're going to save the best for last. The star

659
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:09,120
Speaker 1: of our show courses Joe. But it's so great to

660
00:39:09,160 --> 00:39:11,320
Speaker 1: have you here. And Joe, if you wouldn't mind going first,

661
00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:12,760
Speaker 1: Father and Neil Kokuth.

662
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:16,720
Speaker 4: So I would just say, when it comes to the

663
00:39:16,920 --> 00:39:20,759
Speaker 4: matter of sentencing people to death, to be very very

664
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:25,719
Speaker 4: very careful. People's lives are at stake here, and you

665
00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:27,759
Speaker 4: know a lot of people will tell me I'm the

666
00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 4: liberal priest that believes everything that the death row innate says,

667
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:36,360
Speaker 4: and that is not the truth. And Joe would be

668
00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:39,360
Speaker 4: the first one to tell you that. I get letters

669
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:44,440
Speaker 4: from around the country and sometimes around the world, and

670
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,120
Speaker 4: many of them from guys right here on Ohio's death

671
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:50,239
Speaker 4: Row saying you need to do for me what you

672
00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 4: did for Joe, and I say to them, I didn't

673
00:39:54,080 --> 00:40:00,080
Speaker 4: do anything for Joe. The evidence freed Joe, and we

674
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:02,640
Speaker 4: just needed to find it, and we just needed somebody

675
00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:05,480
Speaker 4: to present it. People think you got away with murder

676
00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:09,120
Speaker 4: on a technicality, and that is not the case. This

677
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:13,000
Speaker 4: went through district court, federal court, Supreme Court with some

678
00:40:13,080 --> 00:40:16,920
Speaker 4: of the finest jurists in the country, and literally the

679
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 4: evidence freedom. So don't take things at face value, go

680
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:26,880
Speaker 4: deep and look and then ask yourself some serious questions.

681
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:29,239
Speaker 4: And one of those questions for me would be this,

682
00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:35,280
Speaker 4: do we really want to give our government the power

683
00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 4: and the authority to take someone's life from them when

684
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:45,440
Speaker 4: the system is so screwed up?

685
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:51,279
Speaker 3: Joe, The thing that people have to understand is that

686
00:40:51,320 --> 00:40:58,160
Speaker 3: they're murdering in your name. You're paying to have this done.

687
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:05,440
Speaker 3: To have the death penalty is so ludicrous places like

688
00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:11,759
Speaker 3: Russia abolish their death penalty and we still hang on

689
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:17,239
Speaker 3: to it because all it is is revenge, and our

690
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:23,120
Speaker 3: justice system should not be about revenge. It's not supposed

691
00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:28,280
Speaker 3: to be. So if you even think for a second

692
00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:33,960
Speaker 3: that the system is so perfect that you're willing to

693
00:41:34,040 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 3: bet somebody's life and it could be your own, then

694
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:42,080
Speaker 3: don't do anything about it, because, like we started out saying,

695
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:44,600
Speaker 3: if this could happen to me, this could happen to

696
00:41:44,640 --> 00:41:48,120
Speaker 3: you very easily. But I think you need to stand

697
00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:50,600
Speaker 3: up right now. In Ohio, we have two bills that

698
00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:54,280
Speaker 3: are trying to get the death penalty abolished in Ohio,

699
00:41:54,760 --> 00:41:58,399
Speaker 3: and this is the time to do it. People need

700
00:41:58,440 --> 00:42:01,520
Speaker 3: to stand up and say that you don't kill in

701
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:05,879
Speaker 3: my name and just stop this stupidity that's going on

702
00:42:06,280 --> 00:42:12,680
Speaker 3: with the duck penalty.

703
00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:18,400
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flamm.

704
00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:22,040
Speaker 1: Please support your local innocence organizations and go to the

705
00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:24,600
Speaker 1: links in our bio now to see how you can help.

706
00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 1: I'd like to thank our amazing production team Connor Hall,

707
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:32,520
Speaker 1: Justin Golden, Jeff Clyburn, and Kevin Wardis. The music on

708
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:35,600
Speaker 1: this show, as always is by three Time Oscar nominated

709
00:42:35,640 --> 00:42:39,200
Speaker 1: composer Jay Ralph. Be sure to follow us on Instagram

710
00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 1: at Wronful Conviction and on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction podcast.

711
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:47,080
Speaker 1: Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flamm is a production of Lava

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00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:52,400
Speaker 1: for Good Podcasts and association with Signal Company Number one