1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:04,760 Speaker 1: So we have just landed in Dapatula, and it could 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,039 Speaker 1: not be more different than what is. It's Saturday, January eleventh, 3 00:00:09,119 --> 00:00:12,680 Speaker 1: twenty twenty, and I've just landed in a small airport 4 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:18,560 Speaker 1: in Dabatula, on Mexico's southern border with Guatemala. Literally, we 5 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:25,759 Speaker 1: went from the northernmost border in Mexico to the southernmost border. 6 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:30,480 Speaker 1: We crossed the entire country of Mexico. I check my phone, 7 00:00:30,920 --> 00:00:35,280 Speaker 1: no messages inside the airport. I rush to baggage claim. 8 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:41,200 Speaker 1: I'm recording just a casey's outside quarter. 9 00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:43,360 Speaker 2: I don't see anybody, what I mean. 10 00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:50,440 Speaker 1: I look at every young man I pass, hoping he'll 11 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:52,199 Speaker 1: be here waiting for me. 12 00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:55,720 Speaker 3: He's you know where. 13 00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:57,320 Speaker 4: That's one of thosts. 14 00:00:57,880 --> 00:00:59,920 Speaker 1: Oh my eyes. All I was hoping for was aw 15 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 1: be here, and he's not. He's just not From Futuro Media. 16 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:26,760 Speaker 1: It's Latino USA. I'm Maria Inojosa. In our last episode, 17 00:01:26,840 --> 00:01:29,880 Speaker 1: we reported about how the real wall that Trump has 18 00:01:29,920 --> 00:01:34,039 Speaker 1: built is a paper wall, a wall of policies that 19 00:01:34,160 --> 00:01:37,560 Speaker 1: push asylum seekers out of the US and into Mexico. 20 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:40,679 Speaker 1: We visited the northern border and met some of the 21 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:43,760 Speaker 1: migrants stuck waiting for the chance to ask for asylum 22 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:47,440 Speaker 1: in the US, a place they believe they'll find safety. 23 00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:58,640 Speaker 1: Now I've come to Dapachula on Mexico's southern border. It's 24 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:02,240 Speaker 1: another city filled with asylum seekers from all over the world. 25 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:05,520 Speaker 1: I'm here to find out why so many migrants are 26 00:02:05,560 --> 00:02:09,680 Speaker 1: waiting here, almost two thousand miles away from the United States. 27 00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:15,600 Speaker 1: And there's another reason. I'm here to meet up with 28 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 1: a twenty three year old hon Duram migrant named Josue, 29 00:02:18,880 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 1: whose story I've been following for a year now. We 30 00:02:22,480 --> 00:02:25,799 Speaker 1: plan to meet up here, but for the last few days, 31 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: Josue hasn't picked up his phone. 32 00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:39,160 Speaker 3: I'm going to call him right now. I don't even 33 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:39,800 Speaker 3: know what to say. 34 00:02:41,919 --> 00:02:45,240 Speaker 1: It's a weird feeling, honestly, to be so anxious to 35 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: see him, because I don't really know this kid. I 36 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:50,960 Speaker 1: met him a year ago in Matamoros when I was 37 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:53,839 Speaker 1: interviewing migrants for a story about life at the US 38 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 1: Mexico border. He was my son's age at the time, 39 00:02:58,120 --> 00:03:02,400 Speaker 1: just twenty three, and was sleeping under a bridge. To 40 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:06,520 Speaker 1: see him alone in those conditions, it got to me. 41 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:09,840 Speaker 1: We spoke for like maybe two minutes, and I gave 42 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 1: him my card, just like I usually do with people 43 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:17,680 Speaker 1: I meet, but this kid, he actually called again and again. 44 00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 1: One of those calls came from a detention center in Texas. 45 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:31,240 Speaker 1: It was his second attempt to get to the US. 46 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:34,640 Speaker 1: Josue presented himself and asked for asylum. At the border, 47 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 1: he told officers he feared for his life if he 48 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:41,000 Speaker 1: was returned to Honduras, that he had been threatened by 49 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 1: the gangs, even though passed his first credible fear interview. Ultimately, 50 00:03:54,960 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 1: he was deported back to Honduras anyway. Josue then moved 51 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:09,120 Speaker 1: back in with his grandmother, the closest thing he still 52 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:12,320 Speaker 1: has to a parent. His mother died of cancer while 53 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 1: he was in detention, but he didn't stay in Londura's 54 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:19,640 Speaker 1: long Soon he was back on the road north again, 55 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:23,479 Speaker 1: this time with his grandma in tow. He crossed back 56 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:27,520 Speaker 1: into Mexico, and last time we spoke he was here 57 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:37,760 Speaker 1: in Tapachula. He told me he was petitioning for asylum here, 58 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:40,720 Speaker 1: and this was the first time I heard about this 59 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:45,080 Speaker 1: new strategy migrants hoping to reach the United States by 60 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:49,760 Speaker 1: first applying for asylum in Mexico. And it turns out 61 00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:54,520 Speaker 1: This is increasingly common because traveling to the northern border 62 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:59,360 Speaker 1: without legal documents has gotten harder and harder since Mexico 63 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:03,480 Speaker 1: has ramped up its own immigration enforcement. We'll talk more 64 00:05:03,520 --> 00:05:08,640 Speaker 1: about that later. Right now, I'm determined to find Josue. 65 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:11,479 Speaker 1: After being in touch for so long, this was the 66 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:14,880 Speaker 1: chance for me to finally really hear his story. And 67 00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:19,240 Speaker 1: though I've spent a lot of time in Mexico, this place, Tapachula, 68 00:05:19,839 --> 00:05:22,440 Speaker 1: is completely new to me, so I'm going to need 69 00:05:22,440 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: some help. Outside of the airport, I meet up with 70 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:28,039 Speaker 1: a local journalist named Benjamin Alfaro. He's going to be 71 00:05:28,080 --> 00:05:31,279 Speaker 1: helping me to report this story. When I mean Guiana, 72 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:35,479 Speaker 1: what's up? I'm seeing lesbian? I mean, you know, in 73 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:37,920 Speaker 1: the car on the way to the hotel, I get 74 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:41,279 Speaker 1: a first glimpse of Tapachula. Oh my other humidity is 75 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:45,920 Speaker 1: one hundred and ten percent, and it is beautiful and 76 00:05:46,080 --> 00:05:49,719 Speaker 1: sweaty and like in the tropics, and it's so green. 77 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:59,840 Speaker 5: Is gueros the mango ataulfour. 78 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:04,920 Speaker 1: As we drive past fields of mangoes, plantains, and coffee, 79 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:08,279 Speaker 1: Mahamin says, there's a saying here about the fertility of 80 00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:13,279 Speaker 1: this land through a seed on the ground it'll growa 81 00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:16,600 Speaker 1: That's why there have always been so many migrants here, 82 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:20,600 Speaker 1: he tells me, like Mexican farm workers in the United States. 83 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:25,040 Speaker 1: For decades, he says, mostly Waatemalans have crossed the border 84 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:29,839 Speaker 1: to work seasonally in the fields here. In recent years, 85 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 1: large numbers of migrants heading towards the United States have 86 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:38,240 Speaker 1: landed in Dapachula. The majority are from Central America, but 87 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 1: there's also a growing number of people from Haiti, India, 88 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:46,800 Speaker 1: and West Africa. Mexicans like Benghamen, who grew up here 89 00:06:46,960 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 1: are for the most part used to people coming and going, 90 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:53,240 Speaker 1: and Tapachula is not a small town. The official count 91 00:06:53,279 --> 00:06:56,479 Speaker 1: says the city has about three hundred thousand residents, but 92 00:06:56,640 --> 00:07:02,839 Speaker 1: counting migrants, there's probably tens of thousands more. As we 93 00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:05,880 Speaker 1: arrive at my hotel, I asked Bejamen to do me 94 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:17,960 Speaker 1: a favor and try calling Hosue from his phone totally 95 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:27,240 Speaker 1: and nothing. So I go down to the hotel restaurant 96 00:07:27,240 --> 00:07:30,320 Speaker 1: to have dinner. But I can't help but think about 97 00:07:30,360 --> 00:07:32,200 Speaker 1: a question. Benhamen asked me. 98 00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:36,640 Speaker 6: So you just heard me say, what what's happened with Sue? 99 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:39,560 Speaker 6: And we're kind of thinking that he's just like, it 100 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:41,840 Speaker 6: is strange that he disappears the day before you're coming. 101 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:45,800 Speaker 6: You know, is there a potential that he's being kidnapped 102 00:07:46,840 --> 00:07:49,480 Speaker 6: extorted because he's been in communication with someone from the 103 00:07:49,520 --> 00:07:50,160 Speaker 6: United States. 104 00:07:50,880 --> 00:07:55,800 Speaker 1: I mean, we have no idea. It may sound like 105 00:07:55,880 --> 00:08:00,200 Speaker 1: a stretch, but maybe it isn't. And that's because has 106 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:06,560 Speaker 1: already been a victim of crime here in Tapatula. It 107 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:09,920 Speaker 1: was last year after his grandmother had given up on 108 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:20,080 Speaker 1: migrating and left to go back to Andduas. One day, 109 00:08:20,320 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 1: hoss says he and three other hunter and guys were 110 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:26,239 Speaker 1: picked up near his shelter by a man who said 111 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 1: he had a job for them at a ranch. Josuez 112 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:31,960 Speaker 1: said he needed the money, so he jumped at the 113 00:08:32,080 --> 00:08:35,240 Speaker 1: chance to work. On the way, Hosue says, they were 114 00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:38,320 Speaker 1: told that actually they were being hired to kill someone. 115 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:41,480 Speaker 1: It sounds like a story straight out of a movie. 116 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: Hosue says he was able to jump out of the 117 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 1: truck and flee, and then he saw the news. 118 00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:52,960 Speaker 7: In Vestiga Fiscalia, in front amento q jo at tres 119 00:08:53,000 --> 00:08:54,200 Speaker 7: personas Murtas and. 120 00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:58,840 Speaker 1: Tapatula, three men had been found dead inside a truck. 121 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:02,520 Speaker 1: Graphic photos of men with blood dripping down their faces 122 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:06,320 Speaker 1: flashed on the screen. Who was swebleize? The men were 123 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:10,360 Speaker 1: the other Hondurans he was looking for work with. A 124 00:09:10,400 --> 00:09:13,920 Speaker 1: month later, hosuezs he was robbed while selling doughnuts in 125 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:17,360 Speaker 1: the street. He filed a police report and also gave 126 00:09:17,400 --> 00:09:20,280 Speaker 1: a statement about what happened the day he jumped out 127 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:24,080 Speaker 1: of the truck. Shortly after Jossuet had to leave the 128 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:28,319 Speaker 1: shelter to make space for new arrivals. Without legal documents 129 00:09:28,360 --> 00:09:32,080 Speaker 1: to work, and completely alone in Tapachula, he ended up 130 00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 1: living on the street and that's where he still was. 131 00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:38,000 Speaker 1: The last time we spoke, just a few days ago. 132 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:40,720 Speaker 1: The last thing he said to me was that he 133 00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 1: was afraid someone would kill him. It is nine twelve 134 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:52,840 Speaker 1: on Saturday, January eleventh, and we just finished dinner here 135 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:55,959 Speaker 1: in Tapachula. All I do is I look out into 136 00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 1: the night and I'm like, where is this kid? Where 137 00:09:59,080 --> 00:10:03,240 Speaker 1: is this kid? That all I'm asking myself how did 138 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:08,400 Speaker 1: he disappear? And why did he disappear? The day before 139 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:14,240 Speaker 1: I get here, I try one more time and nothing, 140 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:41,680 Speaker 1: He's gone. And I'm gonna have to try and find 141 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 1: this guy in a city that I've never been to 142 00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:47,720 Speaker 1: where there are hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of Central 143 00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:52,200 Speaker 1: American migrants hundering young men in their twenties just like him, 144 00:10:52,840 --> 00:11:03,120 Speaker 1: And now I've got to find him. Coming up mahamen 145 00:11:03,160 --> 00:12:02,400 Speaker 1: and I go looking for Housway stay with us, Yes, hey, 146 00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:06,160 Speaker 1: we're back. So the next morning, Bhamena and I set 147 00:12:06,160 --> 00:12:08,720 Speaker 1: off to see if we can find clues as to 148 00:12:08,800 --> 00:12:13,600 Speaker 1: Josuez whereabouts. We visit key spots or migrants around Tapachula, 149 00:12:14,120 --> 00:12:16,760 Speaker 1: which gives me a chance to understand what migration looks 150 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:20,439 Speaker 1: like here on the southern border. So I'm just fascinated 151 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:22,880 Speaker 1: because we have now walked. I guess we're going to 152 00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:25,320 Speaker 1: go up these stairs and we're going to see the river. 153 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:29,440 Speaker 1: But there's like a mural painted on these stairs and 154 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:34,480 Speaker 1: it says, welcome Yemenidos to Baso el Koyote, Welcome to 155 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 1: the El Koyote crossing. First we go to see the 156 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:42,559 Speaker 1: Succhiette River, and that's the river that separates Mexico from 157 00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 1: its southern neighbor, Guatemala. So there is a legal and 158 00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:53,680 Speaker 1: a less legal way to cross this border. The actual 159 00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:56,839 Speaker 1: international bridge and official port of entry is visible from 160 00:12:56,840 --> 00:13:00,120 Speaker 1: where I'm standing. It's less than a mile down, but 161 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:04,920 Speaker 1: this unofficial crossing is the more popular one. We watch 162 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:08,760 Speaker 1: as people right across the river into Mexico on makeshift 163 00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:14,880 Speaker 1: rafts and on top of big inner tubes, Like you've 164 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:18,839 Speaker 1: got two huge inner tubes, you've just got planks of wood, 165 00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 1: So the most basic kind of transportation. They mostly seem 166 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:30,320 Speaker 1: to be students and workers. Others cross to Mexico to 167 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:33,280 Speaker 1: do their shopping. After all, there is a Walmart in 168 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:37,920 Speaker 1: Tapachula here and there, though, tired looking young men with 169 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:43,480 Speaker 1: backpacks hop on alone and in small groups. So one 170 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:45,920 Speaker 1: of the things that I'm thinking a lot about as 171 00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 1: I'm standing on this river between what the Mala and 172 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:54,480 Speaker 1: Mexico is, is this where Houswa crossed. Then I see 173 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:56,920 Speaker 1: a well dressed older man in khakis and a pink 174 00:13:56,960 --> 00:14:00,360 Speaker 1: polo shirt board a raft from the watermal. Inside he's 175 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:04,080 Speaker 1: holding a briefcase and he almost seems out of place. 176 00:14:06,400 --> 00:14:11,800 Speaker 1: You stay on this, so I extro, so does Clas. 177 00:14:13,640 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 1: His name is Freddy, He's Guatemalan, sixty years old. He 178 00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:20,560 Speaker 1: works in Mexico as a teacher, and says he crosses 179 00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 1: to Tapachula on a raft because it's easier and faster 180 00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:30,920 Speaker 1: than the official crossing. Bez por kibes. 181 00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 3: Tahiri la hinte, and you don't have a problem. 182 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:45,080 Speaker 1: He's quick to point out that no one bothers him 183 00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:48,240 Speaker 1: because they kind of know who the locals are, and 184 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 1: he doesn't look like a migrant. What before we move on, 185 00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:01,280 Speaker 1: I ask Freddy what he teaches. He said, as customs. 186 00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:06,080 Speaker 1: You're a professor who teaches about border crossing and customs, 187 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,920 Speaker 1: but you're crossing in an illegal crossing osa is cistoso 188 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:15,920 Speaker 1: biro I. That's just how things are here in Dapachula, 189 00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:24,760 Speaker 1: he tells me. Mexico's southern border has always been more 190 00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:29,080 Speaker 1: relaxed than the one up north. Like the customs teacher Freddie, 191 00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:31,760 Speaker 1: most people who live around here don't think much of 192 00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:36,040 Speaker 1: crossing back and forth, legally or not. But recently this 193 00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:39,320 Speaker 1: border has tightened up. That's due in part to the 194 00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:44,600 Speaker 1: arrival of the Mexican National Guard La Warria Nacunae. The 195 00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 1: National Guard is President Lopez Obrador's new security force, which 196 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:52,320 Speaker 1: we mentioned last episode. It's the one that was created 197 00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: to help fight crime, but has been deployed to enforce 198 00:15:55,600 --> 00:16:00,560 Speaker 1: immigration instead. In January, the National Guard made use at 199 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:04,000 Speaker 1: this crossing point when it scuffled with a big caravan 200 00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:09,360 Speaker 1: making its way from Central America, using force on migrants 201 00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:11,120 Speaker 1: and making mass arrests. 202 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:13,480 Speaker 8: Now, whatever you think of this so called caravan, whether 203 00:16:13,520 --> 00:16:16,000 Speaker 8: you see them as refugees or invaders, one thing is 204 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:18,760 Speaker 8: clear tonight. They're in a standoff right now with an 205 00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:21,640 Speaker 8: army of Mexican federales, and tensions are running high. 206 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 1: It was another example of Mexico's president fulfilling his promise 207 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:34,200 Speaker 1: to the United States to crack down on migration. But 208 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 1: today at the river, it doesn't really look like the 209 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 1: National Guard is doing much. For close to an hour, 210 00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:43,960 Speaker 1: we've watched people crossing illegally in rafts across the border 211 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:48,120 Speaker 1: right in their line of sight. And then a very 212 00:16:48,120 --> 00:17:04,560 Speaker 1: official looking, uniformed man approaches me, Maria. He writes my 213 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 1: name down in a beat up little notebook that he 214 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:09,760 Speaker 1: slips right back into his pocket. He tells me that 215 00:17:09,800 --> 00:17:12,080 Speaker 1: his name is Sergeant Hernandez and that he's with the 216 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:15,480 Speaker 1: National Guard. So I ask him what exactly their role 217 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:23,880 Speaker 1: here is. He tells me their job is to support 218 00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:27,320 Speaker 1: immigration agents. For the most part, he tells me they 219 00:17:27,320 --> 00:17:30,719 Speaker 1: don't really bother the Guatemalan citizens who cross back and 220 00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:34,639 Speaker 1: forth daily, but they approach others and check their idea, 221 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 1: looking for Haitians or Hondurance for example, people like Josue 222 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:57,480 Speaker 1: Catamos seem He's quick to tell me that they don't 223 00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:02,719 Speaker 1: detain migrants. They rescue them. He says, they rescue them 224 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:05,679 Speaker 1: by turning them over to immigration so they can quote 225 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 1: learn about their options in Mexico. So where do these 226 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:19,920 Speaker 1: rescued migrants go on the complex seeza commercial. They're taken 227 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:22,520 Speaker 1: to a place where they can eat and rest. He says, 228 00:18:23,040 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 1: it's called Sigrono. Now, if you're imagining that Sigroventuno is 229 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:31,080 Speaker 1: a shelter, you couldn't be more wrong. It's actually a 230 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:35,800 Speaker 1: huge immigrant detention center here in Tapachula. We decide to 231 00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:40,760 Speaker 1: head there. Next on our way, we come across an 232 00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:44,320 Speaker 1: immigration checkpoint, much like the ones the Border Patrol sets 233 00:18:44,359 --> 00:18:47,479 Speaker 1: up near the border in the United States. Okay, so 234 00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:51,760 Speaker 1: we're driving through a checkpoint. There is on the left side, 235 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:56,639 Speaker 1: UH pickup truck with lights flashing. There is a but 236 00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:59,919 Speaker 1: we're not stopped. They wave us through. Behind us, the 237 00:19:00,520 --> 00:19:07,400 Speaker 1: A van is pulled over. Bighamen says, these random militarized 238 00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:11,760 Speaker 1: roadblocks have been popping up everywhere in recent years, and 239 00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:15,760 Speaker 1: so has the military with their pickups, masked soldiers and 240 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:19,920 Speaker 1: automatic weapons. And they're not just here in Tapachula, They're 241 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:22,639 Speaker 1: on all the major roads leading out of the city, 242 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:25,680 Speaker 1: and they pop in and out along popular routes for 243 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:30,080 Speaker 1: migrants all the way to the northern border, including railroad 244 00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:33,720 Speaker 1: tracks and bus stations. In fact, advocates say it's so 245 00:19:33,960 --> 00:19:37,000 Speaker 1: hard now for asylum seekers to get to the US 246 00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:41,960 Speaker 1: border without being detained by some Mexican authority that many 247 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 1: have been stuck here in Tapachula hoping to get some 248 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:47,840 Speaker 1: kind of legal status that will make it easier to 249 00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:53,520 Speaker 1: travel through the country. For years, Mexico mostly turned a 250 00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:57,959 Speaker 1: blind eye to migrants transiting north. But now with large 251 00:19:58,040 --> 00:20:01,840 Speaker 1: caravans of migrants from Central America arriving and the news 252 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:05,880 Speaker 1: cameras that followed, pressure to stop the flow was increasing. 253 00:20:06,359 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 9: Thousands of migrants marching north through Mexico hoping to reach 254 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:13,800 Speaker 9: the US. President Trump calling it a quote national emergency, 255 00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 9: vowing to send in the US military. 256 00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:21,200 Speaker 1: In January of twenty nineteen, Mexico rolled out a humanitarian visa. 257 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:25,560 Speaker 1: The visa basically provided temporary legal status for one year, 258 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:30,200 Speaker 1: allowing migrants to work and more importantly, travel legally. Mexico 259 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:33,440 Speaker 1: shutting down a fast track program for temporary asylum, allowing 260 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:38,000 Speaker 1: migrants to stay in Mexico, but so many people applied 261 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:41,760 Speaker 1: for the humanitarian visa that the Mexican government ended the 262 00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:45,719 Speaker 1: program in less than two weeks. When they brought it 263 00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:48,560 Speaker 1: back just a couple of months later, the requirements were 264 00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:51,920 Speaker 1: tightened so much it was now nearly impossible to get 265 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:55,840 Speaker 1: one approved. So the other option was to apply for 266 00:20:55,960 --> 00:21:00,320 Speaker 1: asylum in Mexico, which more than seventy thousand people did 267 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:05,919 Speaker 1: last year. Most of those applications have been filed here 268 00:21:06,119 --> 00:21:10,040 Speaker 1: in Tapachula. Some of these applicants will choose to settle 269 00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:13,280 Speaker 1: in Mexico they realize that getting into the US is 270 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:16,960 Speaker 1: just too hard now, But many seem to be applying 271 00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:20,199 Speaker 1: with the hope that once they have legal status, they 272 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 1: can use it to travel safely and make it to 273 00:21:22,560 --> 00:21:26,280 Speaker 1: the US border. And that's what Josuer was doing here 274 00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:33,560 Speaker 1: last time we spoke. The local refugee office is overwhelmed 275 00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 1: with applications right now. More than half of all cases 276 00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:40,280 Speaker 1: have been pending for a year. In the time that 277 00:21:40,359 --> 00:21:44,000 Speaker 1: asylum seekers wait for a resolution to their case. They're 278 00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:47,240 Speaker 1: not allowed to leave Tapachula. They have to check in 279 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:51,440 Speaker 1: weekly or bi weekly to keep their cases active, and 280 00:21:51,640 --> 00:21:55,119 Speaker 1: in many cases they're sent for some period of time 281 00:21:55,359 --> 00:22:03,160 Speaker 1: to Sigrovediuno, Tapachula's sprawling immigrant detention center. They wouldn't let 282 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:06,560 Speaker 1: us in to see the facility, So we're here now, 283 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:09,720 Speaker 1: climbing to get a better view from a nearby hill 284 00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:13,160 Speaker 1: that overlooks it. Sea may you know, is the largest 285 00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:17,399 Speaker 1: immigrant detention center in Mexico. It's where the National Guard 286 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:22,479 Speaker 1: sergeant told me that they send rescued migrants. From here, 287 00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:28,960 Speaker 1: I see a large prison yard. Wow, look how big 288 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 1: it is? All you really see from here? Are you know? 289 00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:37,800 Speaker 1: The roof coverings long white. All I'm seeing is like 290 00:22:38,080 --> 00:22:41,760 Speaker 1: I think a line of people. You know, if you 291 00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:43,760 Speaker 1: didn't know any better, you would say, oh, well, it's 292 00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:48,359 Speaker 1: a school with a very big yard. But then you 293 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:51,080 Speaker 1: realize that there's a watchtower and that means that they 294 00:22:51,119 --> 00:22:53,520 Speaker 1: are watching to make sure that nobody gets out, and 295 00:22:53,560 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: there's a huge wall that goes all around it, so 296 00:22:57,440 --> 00:22:59,280 Speaker 1: you clearly cannot climb. 297 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:10,480 Speaker 5: OUTA Paranovcentos Santa migrantes t i Photosibiowski said on Pocomaster's 298 00:23:10,520 --> 00:23:14,399 Speaker 5: media Canestale Doremuro and. 299 00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:21,680 Speaker 1: On the Bejamen tells me the detention center is so overcrowded. 300 00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:25,520 Speaker 1: It's supposed to house about nine hundred people, but up 301 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:28,919 Speaker 1: to two thousand have been crammed together. He says that 302 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:33,320 Speaker 1: recently migrants leaked photos of people sleeping in the bathrooms, 303 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:37,760 Speaker 1: one on top of another. In April of twenty nineteen, 304 00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:42,720 Speaker 1: more than a thousand migrants, including families with children, broke 305 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:47,280 Speaker 1: out of Sigloventuno after a dispute over lack of food, 306 00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:52,879 Speaker 1: sanitation and overcrowding. By the way, we reached out to 307 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,240 Speaker 1: President Lopez Obrador's office as well as to other senior 308 00:23:56,320 --> 00:24:00,800 Speaker 1: members of his administration for comment. Our requests were all denied. 309 00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:07,720 Speaker 1: So far, I've seen the outskirts of Tapatula, but now 310 00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:10,560 Speaker 1: we're finally heading into the city. I want to search 311 00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,959 Speaker 1: for Housua in the central Plaza, which is a place 312 00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:18,320 Speaker 1: I knew he used to go to a lot at 313 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:22,400 Speaker 1: the plaza. I'm surprised to see just how diverse Tapatula is. 314 00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:26,560 Speaker 1: It's buzzing with live music and street vendors of all kinds. 315 00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:31,200 Speaker 1: So we are in the plaza, the central plaza. There's 316 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:33,520 Speaker 1: a lot of activity at Sunday afternoon, which is when 317 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:36,360 Speaker 1: everybody comes to the plaza to get your shoes, shine, 318 00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:40,080 Speaker 1: to stay with your girlfriend, to have a cup of 319 00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:44,000 Speaker 1: coffee or a drink. And there is some football game 320 00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:47,639 Speaker 1: that is happening. I don't know anything about football, but 321 00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:50,200 Speaker 1: there's a football game that's going on, so we are 322 00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:54,240 Speaker 1: here to look and see what's going on. I meet 323 00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:57,000 Speaker 1: a man from Haiti who approached me when he saw 324 00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: I had a microphone. He told me that he's been 325 00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:03,040 Speaker 1: stuck here for months waiting for asylum, and the weight, 326 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:17,679 Speaker 1: he says, is far from easy. He says there are 327 00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:20,760 Speaker 1: many Haitians here, families with four or five kids, and 328 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,640 Speaker 1: the parents can't work and don't have money for food 329 00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:26,679 Speaker 1: or diapers. He's been here for five months, but he 330 00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:29,000 Speaker 1: still doesn't have a work per me, so he's selling 331 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:41,879 Speaker 1: cold bottles of water in the plaza to support his family. Okakia, 332 00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 1: there's nothing for him here in Tapachula. He tells me, 333 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:48,760 Speaker 1: he's trying to get to Tijuana. There he hopes his 334 00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:50,720 Speaker 1: family in the US will be able to help him 335 00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:53,920 Speaker 1: pay for a Koyote to try and smuggle him across 336 00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:57,119 Speaker 1: the border. Before I leave, I take out my phone 337 00:25:57,160 --> 00:25:59,960 Speaker 1: and pull up a photo of Hosue and ask him 338 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 1: if he's seen him to us best Sta Personata persona. 339 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:10,520 Speaker 10: No, I moved okay, different plaza. 340 00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:12,560 Speaker 1: He says, there are a lot of guys who could 341 00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:16,400 Speaker 1: look like him here. In the end, I don't get anywhere. 342 00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:24,360 Speaker 1: Later on, I stopped by Albergue el Buen Pastor. It's 343 00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:27,679 Speaker 1: a shelter that I know Oswell lived in for a while. 344 00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:30,600 Speaker 1: We've been following the case of a young man for 345 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:34,000 Speaker 1: many months now, and he was here, and I want 346 00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:40,640 Speaker 1: to know if you recognize him. It is Tjaukish. Can 347 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:42,000 Speaker 1: you tell me what you know about him? 348 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:42,200 Speaker 4: Quent. 349 00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:50,560 Speaker 1: I don't find any clues as to his whereabouts here, 350 00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:54,240 Speaker 1: but I do meet sister Olga, who says she remembers 351 00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:57,080 Speaker 1: Roosue but hasn't seen him in a while. She's been 352 00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:01,040 Speaker 1: running this house for migrants for decades. Sister Orga says 353 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:04,919 Speaker 1: she used to have an army of volunteers. Now no 354 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:06,520 Speaker 1: one really shows up to help anymore. 355 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:17,639 Speaker 11: OI for oil Giano miramos is a hinte particular Youmura's 356 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:26,240 Speaker 11: Sister Mui Inumano gim migrants. 357 00:27:27,040 --> 00:27:31,520 Speaker 1: She says Tapachula is becoming more racist and inhumane, that 358 00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 1: everybody complains about wanting migrants gone. And it's not just here. 359 00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:39,960 Speaker 1: The caravans used to be greeted all over Mexico by 360 00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:43,600 Speaker 1: well wishers handing out medicine, food, and water, but those 361 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:44,760 Speaker 1: days have passed. 362 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:50,840 Speaker 9: This is what an anti migrant protest looks like in Mexico. 363 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:54,720 Speaker 9: There's anger and waving the Mexican flags and signs like 364 00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:58,600 Speaker 9: this one, which translates to no to the invasion. 365 00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:03,040 Speaker 1: Sister Orga says when migrants were just passing through here, 366 00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 1: maybe it was easier to be more compassionate. But now, 367 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:10,600 Speaker 1: she says, the asylum process keeps people stuck here, so 368 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: they're in the blastas they're lined up outside government buildings, 369 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:18,000 Speaker 1: they're sleeping in the streets. And Tapatula is in Mexico's 370 00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 1: poorest state, Chiapas. Resources here are limited and migrants are 371 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:27,879 Speaker 1: an easy target for people to take out their frustrations. Now, 372 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:31,439 Speaker 1: without helping hands to make ends meet at the shelter, 373 00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:34,160 Speaker 1: Sister Orga has had to come up with a new 374 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:49,080 Speaker 1: plans to support the shelter and themselves. The migrants take 375 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:53,360 Speaker 1: part in a donut baking and selling operation. For now, 376 00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:57,800 Speaker 1: it's just enough to scrape By the next morning, at breakfast, 377 00:28:57,840 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 1: my phone rings. It's a video call finally from Jusue. 378 00:29:13,400 --> 00:30:24,440 Speaker 1: That's coming up. Stay with us, not yes, okay, we're back. 379 00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:30,320 Speaker 1: At long last, I received a video call from Hostua. 380 00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:33,479 Speaker 1: It's the first time I'm seeing his face since we 381 00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:41,760 Speaker 1: met a year ago. Into tempo tvistore no devisto, and 382 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:45,880 Speaker 1: after everything, it turns out he's not in Tapachula at all. 383 00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:51,560 Speaker 1: He's back home in Ondurasus flips the camera on his 384 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:58,200 Speaker 1: phone and shows me he's using the Wi Fi at 385 00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:08,280 Speaker 1: a cafe in Telugal, back the capitol. Huswet tells me 386 00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:12,400 Speaker 1: he left Tapachula the day before I arrived, that some 387 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:14,960 Speaker 1: guys had beat him up in the market, and that 388 00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:17,000 Speaker 1: he says he couldn't take it anymore. He was scared, 389 00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 1: always thinking that someone was right over his shoulder coming 390 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:23,920 Speaker 1: to punish him for finding that police report after he 391 00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:26,760 Speaker 1: jumped out of that truck, or that the gangs he 392 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:30,560 Speaker 1: ran away from in Honduras would follow him here to Tapachula. 393 00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:34,920 Speaker 1: After all, it's really close and there were central American 394 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:37,600 Speaker 1: gang tags on the walls all around town that I 395 00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:41,520 Speaker 1: saw myself. In the end, Joswet took off back to 396 00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:44,840 Speaker 1: hondudas the gangs were there too, but at least there 397 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:47,240 Speaker 1: he could stay with his grandmother instead of sleeping on 398 00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 1: the streets. But Mexican law says he must be present 399 00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:55,080 Speaker 1: for in person checkins with immigration while his asylum petition 400 00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:58,720 Speaker 1: is pending. So when Josuet went to the asylum agency 401 00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:01,520 Speaker 1: to let them know he was lead, that meant his 402 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:06,040 Speaker 1: asylum case in Mexico would be closed. Three months waiting 403 00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:22,520 Speaker 1: in Tapachula was for nothing. Later that day, I have 404 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,280 Speaker 1: a chance to meet with Alma Marquez. She's the head 405 00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:28,920 Speaker 1: of the refugee agency here in Tapachula. It's called GOMAR. 406 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:32,200 Speaker 1: I want to know what kind of protections the Mexican 407 00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:36,880 Speaker 1: government is supposed to offer to someone like Cosue. You're 408 00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 1: a refugee, You're leaving your home country and the place 409 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 1: that is supposed to be giving you safe haven isn't 410 00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:47,160 Speaker 1: able to protect you. Do you think those people should 411 00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:50,760 Speaker 1: continue to apply for refugee status in Mexico if they've 412 00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:54,000 Speaker 1: been a victim of a crime in Mexico or really 413 00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:59,040 Speaker 1: should they then be by international law allowed to apply 414 00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:00,360 Speaker 1: to another. 415 00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:13,120 Speaker 12: Country victim mexicopus thendras a Tousia respond Alma says anyone 416 00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:15,720 Speaker 12: who is a victim should just go to the police. 417 00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:19,760 Speaker 1: Plus, she says there's a process to protect victims of crime. 418 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:22,320 Speaker 1: If o Sue had told them before he left to 419 00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:25,160 Speaker 1: Hondudas that he was afraid, he might have been able 420 00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:29,280 Speaker 1: to be transferred out of Tapatula. And then in the 421 00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:33,240 Speaker 1: middle of speaking with Alma, I get a call from Hosue. 422 00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:42,240 Speaker 1: No is calling. Well, actually hold on a second, Osue. 423 00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:46,240 Speaker 1: We're talking about your case. When you came to close 424 00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:49,320 Speaker 1: your case, did you tell Comard why you were leaving? 425 00:33:50,280 --> 00:34:01,880 Speaker 1: As He did tell an official that his grandmother was 426 00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:04,920 Speaker 1: worried about him because of what happened, And he says 427 00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:07,200 Speaker 1: he showed the official the report that he had made 428 00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:10,520 Speaker 1: with the police. He says, no one ever mentioned the 429 00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:15,440 Speaker 1: possibility of moving him somewhere safe elsewhere in Mexico like that, 430 00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:18,360 Speaker 1: Like what do you recommend to a young He's like 431 00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:23,760 Speaker 1: so many other Hunduran men right his life is under threat. 432 00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:26,360 Speaker 1: He's afraid all the time. He has people who have 433 00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,520 Speaker 1: died all around him. He feels that he could be 434 00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:30,600 Speaker 1: killed at any moment. 435 00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:37,480 Speaker 12: We have to check the case because I cannot give 436 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:40,800 Speaker 12: you right now my point of view of the case. 437 00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,200 Speaker 1: And then Alma ads in. 438 00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:49,399 Speaker 12: Spanish, kinsiando comparison as who's to a Central America? Well, 439 00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:51,040 Speaker 12: the sirke los Conosco. 440 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,720 Speaker 1: I've been doing this for fifteen years, she says, dealing 441 00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:58,479 Speaker 1: with Central Americans. I know them. Well. You can't get 442 00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:03,640 Speaker 1: stuck on one case. In the end, Josue may not 443 00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:08,480 Speaker 1: have used the right words to trigger special protections, and 444 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:13,080 Speaker 1: it's hard to believe asylum policy sometimes comes down to 445 00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:17,640 Speaker 1: just that words. But even if he had. 446 00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:24,120 Speaker 12: Porquet porque ca cons Andramosel says and Tasinko percentes loses 447 00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:25,280 Speaker 12: and Taisinko. 448 00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:34,000 Speaker 1: Rica doesn't, Almaz, sixty five percent of all asylum seekers 449 00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:37,560 Speaker 1: are here in Tapachula. They could all say they want 450 00:35:37,600 --> 00:35:40,160 Speaker 1: to move to a different city, and it's not like 451 00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:43,719 Speaker 1: she can move them all. The larger problem, Alma says, 452 00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:49,040 Speaker 1: is Mexico's asylum system is sorely underfunded and understaffed. While 453 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:52,439 Speaker 1: the agency's budget was doubled from the year before, it's 454 00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:55,200 Speaker 1: just a little over two million dollars for twenty twenty, 455 00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:59,040 Speaker 1: and most of their financial support is coming from outside 456 00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:02,399 Speaker 1: of Mexico, and we'll get into that a bit more later. 457 00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:07,440 Speaker 1: By Mexican law, asylum claims are supposed to be resolved 458 00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:12,359 Speaker 1: in fifty five days, not over a year. Last year, 459 00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:16,919 Speaker 1: the agency only ended up granting refugee status to less 460 00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:21,280 Speaker 1: than two thousand people from Hondura's, Guatemala and El Salvador, 461 00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:26,240 Speaker 1: even though more than seventy thousand applications were submitted in total. 462 00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:38,920 Speaker 1: If we zoom out for a second, the recent HOSTWIF 463 00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:42,440 Speaker 1: found himself seeking asylum here in Tapachula in the first place, 464 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:46,080 Speaker 1: instead of the United States, where he hoped to eventually 465 00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:50,399 Speaker 1: make It is because Mexico has been developing itself as 466 00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:56,000 Speaker 1: an asylum destination, you could say, an alternative to the US. 467 00:36:56,760 --> 00:36:59,680 Speaker 1: And that's in part because Mexico is getting help and 468 00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:02,800 Speaker 1: incur urge to do this both from the United States 469 00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:08,399 Speaker 1: and from the UNHCR that's short for United Nations High 470 00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:15,920 Speaker 1: Commissioner for Refugees. We made our way to their office 471 00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:21,440 Speaker 1: in Tapachula. Okay, so we are standing. We're kind of 472 00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:28,319 Speaker 1: in a residential neighborhood in Tapachula, so far away from 473 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:34,520 Speaker 1: downtown corner building here with high security. There's a camera 474 00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:38,160 Speaker 1: out front. There's some you know, razor not razor wire, 475 00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:41,080 Speaker 1: but there's wiring around and it says in all white 476 00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:44,759 Speaker 1: and it says UNHCR acn U are la Cincia de 477 00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:50,000 Speaker 1: la the United Nations Agency for Refugees. There are no 478 00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:55,280 Speaker 1: lines here or asylum seekers waiting outside. It almost feels 479 00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:58,719 Speaker 1: like this place is out of their reach now. The 480 00:37:58,800 --> 00:38:02,640 Speaker 1: UNHCR was created after World War Two to make sure 481 00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:07,200 Speaker 1: that what happened then would never happen again. Jews who 482 00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:10,480 Speaker 1: tried to escape the Holocaust were denied entry to almost 483 00:38:10,520 --> 00:38:14,399 Speaker 1: every country in the world. Many were famously turned back, 484 00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:19,600 Speaker 1: only to meet their deaths. So this international agency's mission 485 00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:24,240 Speaker 1: is to protect refugees and asylum seekers. Today in Mexico, 486 00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:27,360 Speaker 1: it works with the government to come up with systems 487 00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:31,160 Speaker 1: to process and admit asylum seekers, and they have a 488 00:38:31,239 --> 00:38:43,720 Speaker 1: sixty million dollar budget this year to contribute to Mexico's efforts. Today, 489 00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:47,080 Speaker 1: we're here to meet with Jioanni Lipperty. He's the deputy 490 00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:51,360 Speaker 1: representative with u NHCR in Mexico. I told him the 491 00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:54,960 Speaker 1: details of Hoswe's case to get his take on why 492 00:38:55,040 --> 00:38:58,120 Speaker 1: HOSWD didn't receive any kind of special protection. 493 00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:01,480 Speaker 13: This looks like one of the real genuine cases in 494 00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:09,160 Speaker 13: which the person that you're describing all the reason and 495 00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:12,719 Speaker 13: the right to have an alternative to move somewhere else. 496 00:39:13,360 --> 00:39:16,400 Speaker 13: In that sense, I think that it's a problem to 497 00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:19,600 Speaker 13: say that it did somehow fail into the cracks, and 498 00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:21,560 Speaker 13: unfortunately probably is not the only one. 499 00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:25,840 Speaker 1: Giovanni says, while they've made progress, there's still a long 500 00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:29,160 Speaker 1: way to go in getting the asylum system to work 501 00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:32,560 Speaker 1: the way it should. I wanted to know more broadly 502 00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:35,800 Speaker 1: why you and HDR was here in Mexico. 503 00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:40,400 Speaker 4: Specifically, each and every country should be a country where 504 00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:43,280 Speaker 4: there are opportunities for people that are need of international protection. 505 00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:47,640 Speaker 4: I think that Mexico is today one of the countries 506 00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:55,239 Speaker 4: that could offer opportunities and possibility for integration of refugees 507 00:39:55,960 --> 00:39:59,800 Speaker 4: much better than many many other countries, that would put 508 00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:04,600 Speaker 4: as the top developed country in the world. The fact that. 509 00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:10,680 Speaker 13: Employment there is plenty of opportunity, There are plenty of opportunities. 510 00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:21,400 Speaker 1: The migrants we spoke to in Dapachula might disagree about 511 00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:25,719 Speaker 1: that notion of plenty of opportunity in Mexico for them, 512 00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:30,360 Speaker 1: Giovanni says, the UN is just trying to help, but 513 00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:34,360 Speaker 1: there's a question of whether diverting migrants for making it 514 00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:37,040 Speaker 1: to the United States by giving them a chance to 515 00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:42,400 Speaker 1: stay in Mexico is actually helping them. Yes, Mexico is 516 00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:46,360 Speaker 1: a larger and more prosperous country than the Central American nations, 517 00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:49,440 Speaker 1: but it suffers from many of the same issues around 518 00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:56,920 Speaker 1: safety as the places migrants are escaping from. Take Hostwest case. 519 00:40:57,520 --> 00:41:01,720 Speaker 1: At various points he was homeless, unable to work, hungry, 520 00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:06,840 Speaker 1: and nearly killed. Here is this what safety looks like 521 00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:11,759 Speaker 1: for him? And it turns out there's a word for 522 00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,520 Speaker 1: what's happening here in Mexico because it's part of a 523 00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:17,240 Speaker 1: global trend called externalization. 524 00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:24,040 Speaker 2: Externalization where states are gradually pushing the airboarders outwards, are 525 00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:28,200 Speaker 2: making it increasingly impossible for refugees and assylum seekers to 526 00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:32,000 Speaker 2: even reach the territory of the world's most prosperous states. 527 00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:35,920 Speaker 1: This is Jeff Crisp. We reached him in London. He 528 00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:38,640 Speaker 1: spent many years as a higher up at the UNHCR. 529 00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:44,719 Speaker 1: Since leaving, he's been highly critical of the organization and externalization, 530 00:41:45,120 --> 00:41:46,080 Speaker 1: he says. 531 00:41:46,239 --> 00:41:50,279 Speaker 2: And this is a global trend in the industrialized world. 532 00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:54,200 Speaker 2: It's a policy being pursued by the United States, by 533 00:41:54,239 --> 00:41:57,480 Speaker 2: the European Union, and by Australia. 534 00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:01,240 Speaker 1: It's also happening, for example, in Libya, where the European 535 00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:05,200 Speaker 1: Union is funding the local government to intercept migrants at 536 00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:09,160 Speaker 1: sea and put them into tention in dismal conditions, and 537 00:42:09,200 --> 00:42:12,520 Speaker 1: in Australia, where asylum seekers have been sent to camps 538 00:42:12,560 --> 00:42:17,279 Speaker 1: on remote Pacific islands. It means migrants are being corralled 539 00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:21,040 Speaker 1: into poorer countries where they aren't necessarily better off than 540 00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:25,000 Speaker 1: where they started, and Jeff says the UNHCR is in 541 00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:28,360 Speaker 1: a tough position to do anything about it, in part 542 00:42:28,600 --> 00:42:30,480 Speaker 1: because of the source of its money. 543 00:42:30,800 --> 00:42:36,040 Speaker 2: It's become increasingly constrained in recent years as governments have 544 00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:40,840 Speaker 2: pursued more restrictive refugee and asylum policies. And one of 545 00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:47,000 Speaker 2: my arguments has been recently that nh is very worried 546 00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:51,560 Speaker 2: about losing US support, and the US provides around forty 547 00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:53,280 Speaker 2: percent of the organization's budget. 548 00:42:57,880 --> 00:43:01,520 Speaker 14: Partly, i would argue, because depends so heavily on the 549 00:43:01,600 --> 00:43:06,080 Speaker 14: US for its funding, it's been very wary, in my opinion, 550 00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:10,320 Speaker 14: of actually going out in public and criticizing the policy 551 00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:12,280 Speaker 14: is pursued by Donald Trump. 552 00:43:30,280 --> 00:43:32,960 Speaker 1: It's the first week of March down I'm back in 553 00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:35,720 Speaker 1: New York City and I get a call from Jusue. 554 00:43:44,760 --> 00:43:47,279 Speaker 1: I can't believe what he tells me. He's decided to 555 00:43:47,320 --> 00:43:50,880 Speaker 1: go back to Mexico. He's leaving in just a few days. 556 00:43:51,200 --> 00:43:55,879 Speaker 1: He's headed back to Tabachula. And then right before he's 557 00:43:55,920 --> 00:43:57,160 Speaker 1: about to make the trip. 558 00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:02,600 Speaker 7: W Joe has been a says, this outbreak around the clock, 559 00:44:03,280 --> 00:44:08,359 Speaker 7: and we're deeply concerned. We have therefore made the assessment 560 00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:13,800 Speaker 7: that COVID nineteen can be characterized as a pandemic. 561 00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:17,840 Speaker 1: Mexico and Whatatemla, like many other countries around the world, 562 00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:22,080 Speaker 1: announced they might close their borders due to the coronavirus pandemic, 563 00:44:22,760 --> 00:44:26,200 Speaker 1: but virus or not. On the second week of March, 564 00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:29,960 Speaker 1: oswe hitch tide back to Tapachula, making it out of 565 00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:34,879 Speaker 1: Gatemala just before it closed its borders. Once in Tapachula, 566 00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:38,640 Speaker 1: oswe Wehn and got Aminian at Comar, the refugee office. 567 00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:54,719 Speaker 1: He records it on his phone. Ko He says he 568 00:44:54,800 --> 00:44:58,760 Speaker 1: wants to reopen his case, but they tell him bad news. 569 00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:01,759 Speaker 1: They say that the document he signed when he left 570 00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:05,359 Speaker 1: in January means he abandoned his case and that if 571 00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:08,360 Speaker 1: he wants to apply for asylum he needs to start 572 00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:12,600 Speaker 1: over the process they say could take another year. Another 573 00:45:12,680 --> 00:45:27,880 Speaker 1: year of waiting in Tapachula, Yeah, I know, losient Hosue 574 00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:32,279 Speaker 1: says his desperation is growing. With lockdowns in place, there's 575 00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:35,000 Speaker 1: no work and that means no food. 576 00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:44,680 Speaker 10: Also think that are you not? 577 00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:48,960 Speaker 1: Sometimes he has to skip meals and he's on the 578 00:45:49,080 --> 00:45:52,200 Speaker 1: verge of being homeless again. And many years that the 579 00:45:52,200 --> 00:45:56,239 Speaker 1: refugee office is going to be closed through June. That 580 00:45:56,480 --> 00:46:01,720 Speaker 1: weight he was dreading it keeps on extending. Gomar is closed, 581 00:46:02,080 --> 00:46:06,480 Speaker 1: so his paperwork just sits there, much like he does waiting. 582 00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:19,440 Speaker 1: How long do you think you'll stay in Mexico quadroos, 583 00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:22,800 Speaker 1: He says, now he's thinking he'll ultimately stay in Mexico 584 00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:26,719 Speaker 1: for a while, maybe four years or less if possible, 585 00:46:26,880 --> 00:46:29,160 Speaker 1: if he can get to the United States where he 586 00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:36,319 Speaker 1: really wants to be. Kisignificat is yo? Kiros get don 587 00:46:36,400 --> 00:46:51,600 Speaker 1: to significa parati yi. I asked Josue what does getting 588 00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:55,239 Speaker 1: to the United States mean to him? And he says 589 00:46:55,280 --> 00:47:03,680 Speaker 1: a chance to do better in life, Josue has now 590 00:47:03,719 --> 00:47:07,120 Speaker 1: made four attempts to make it to the United States 591 00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:10,640 Speaker 1: and spent years of his life, all to end up 592 00:47:10,680 --> 00:47:14,879 Speaker 1: here in Tapachula with nothing to show for it. He's 593 00:47:14,920 --> 00:47:20,760 Speaker 1: happy to be alive, is about all he can say. 594 00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:31,759 Speaker 1: Just recently, I get another message from Hosue. He's a 595 00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:34,719 Speaker 1: little bit desperate. He tells me he's feeling sick with 596 00:47:34,760 --> 00:47:38,040 Speaker 1: a high fever, cough and body aches, and he can't 597 00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:43,320 Speaker 1: find any medical help. He's wondering if maybe it's the coronavirus, 598 00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:50,279 Speaker 1: but after all, he's gone through a deadly virus is 599 00:47:50,400 --> 00:48:40,920 Speaker 1: just another addition to his long list of fears. This 600 00:48:41,000 --> 00:48:44,600 Speaker 1: episode was produced by Julieta Martinelli and myself, with field 601 00:48:44,640 --> 00:48:49,480 Speaker 1: production from Fernanda Camarena and Benhamid Alfaro and help from Isabelacoda. 602 00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:53,560 Speaker 1: It was edited by Marlon Bishop. The Moving Boarder series 603 00:48:53,680 --> 00:48:56,680 Speaker 1: was produced in partnership with the Pulitzer Center, with additional 604 00:48:56,719 --> 00:49:00,000 Speaker 1: support provided by the Ford Foundation. The series executive produce 605 00:49:00,040 --> 00:49:04,280 Speaker 1: uer is Diane Silvester. The Latino USA team includes Miel Massis, 606 00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:09,560 Speaker 1: Sophia Palisa, Ka, Luis Trees, Antonia Seerjuidro Genesimoca Gini Montalbo, 607 00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:12,959 Speaker 1: Alisa s Garce and Alejandra Sarassard, with help this week 608 00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:16,480 Speaker 1: from Raue Berees and Juan Diego Ramirez. Fact checking by 609 00:49:16,480 --> 00:49:20,920 Speaker 1: Amy Tardif. Our engineers are Stephanie Lebou and Julia Caruso. 610 00:49:21,040 --> 00:49:24,360 Speaker 1: Additional engineering this week by Lia Shaw. Our director of 611 00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:28,239 Speaker 1: Programming and Operations is Natalia Fidelhotz. Our digital editor is 612 00:49:28,280 --> 00:49:31,640 Speaker 1: Amandel Cantra. Our New York Women's Foundation Ignite fellow is 613 00:49:31,719 --> 00:49:35,280 Speaker 1: Julia Rocha. Our theme music was composed by Zee Rubinos. 614 00:49:35,560 --> 00:49:37,480 Speaker 1: If you like the music you heard on this episode, 615 00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:40,640 Speaker 1: stop by Latinousa dot org and check out our weekly 616 00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:44,560 Speaker 1: Spotify playlist. I'm your host and executive producer Marie Josa. 617 00:49:44,880 --> 00:49:47,680 Speaker 1: Join us again on our next episode, and in the meantime, 618 00:49:47,840 --> 00:49:51,800 Speaker 1: look for us on all of your social media. Stay safe, Joe. 619 00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:58,840 Speaker 10: Latino USA is made possible in part by the Ford Foundation, 620 00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:04,160 Speaker 10: working with visionaries on the front lines of social change worldwide, 621 00:50:04,360 --> 00:50:09,080 Speaker 10: the John D. And Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation, and funding 622 00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:12,440 Speaker 10: for Latino usas Coverage of a Culture of Health is 623 00:50:12,520 --> 00:50:14,840 Speaker 10: made possible in part by a grant from the Robert 624 00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:16,160 Speaker 10: Wood Johnson Foundation.