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Speaker 1: Why from our nations this budget thing is going to

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Speaker 1: do nothing Space Force. I still think it's interesting President

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Speaker 1: Trump not playing his cards yet. Headlines policy and politics

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Speaker 1: colliding to Bloomberg Sound On, the Insiders, the influencers, the insides.

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Speaker 1: I would rather see a congressional solution. It's part of

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Speaker 1: my DNA. The Senate map in looks a lot different

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Speaker 1: than it looked in. You really have a divide within

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Speaker 1: Team Trump. The president has to do exactly what people

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Speaker 1: sent him here to do, which is to get it done.

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Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Sound On with Kevin Shirley on Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: nine one and five points D two. I'm Kevin Sirelli,

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Speaker 1: Chief Washington correspondent from Bloomberg Television and Bloomberg Radio. I'm

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Speaker 1: still in the Motor City, just outside of Detroit, Michigan,

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Speaker 1: at Bloomberg's Detroit Bureau. It's ground zero for President Trump's

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Speaker 1: trade policies and President Trump just within the last hour

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Speaker 1: talking tough against China. We will break down the trade

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Speaker 1: stance of President Trump every which way. Meanwhile, news on

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Speaker 1: the debt ceiling advancing out of the Senate and now

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Speaker 1: it appears well we've avoided another political hijinks for at

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Speaker 1: least two years. What does that mean? Will dive into

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Speaker 1: the specifics of that as well. And let's not forget

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Speaker 1: fall out. Fall out, Complete political analysis and reporting from

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Speaker 1: the second Democratic presidential Debate, which has brought me, of

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Speaker 1: course here to Detroit, Michigan. Who had a breakout night,

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Speaker 1: who needs to keep moving forward in order to qualify

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Speaker 1: for the September debates, And what all mean for the

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Speaker 1: front runner, Former Vice President Joe Biden? Can he hang on?

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Speaker 1: Will dive into that with an all star panel. Brendan

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Speaker 1: Buck is back. Brendan is a Republican strategist, and we

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Speaker 1: also have a host of other folks. Uh to get

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Speaker 1: to Mark Post. He is a Democratic strategist and senior

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Speaker 1: vice president at Rock Solutions. He's the former national Press

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Speaker 1: Secretary of the d n C during the president fidential campaign.

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Speaker 1: But before we get into all of this, it is

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Speaker 1: a beautiful day here just outside of Detroit, Michigan, where,

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Speaker 1: of course the conclusion the conclusion of the second Democratic

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Speaker 1: presidental debate wrapped up late last evening. We were in

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Speaker 1: the spin room till midnight, and the talk of all

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Speaker 1: of it is just whether or not former Vice President

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Speaker 1: Joe Biden can hang on to his front runner status,

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Speaker 1: or whether or not any of these mid tier candidates

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Speaker 1: will break out and be able to fundraise off of

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Speaker 1: some of the key moments of the past hours. You know,

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Speaker 1: I was struck by a couple of things. We're gonna

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Speaker 1: get into all of the policy ramifications, but when you

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Speaker 1: take a step back, it really appears that this is

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Speaker 1: a fight for the soul and the ideology of the

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Speaker 1: Democratic platform on issues pertaining to the economy. And when

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Speaker 1: Senator Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders are espousing medicare for

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Speaker 1: all talking about trade policies, there could not be any

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Speaker 1: more of a clear to by. They didn't have to

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Speaker 1: be on the stage last night against Biden in order,

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Speaker 1: uh for this contrast to be made. We're gonna get

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Speaker 1: to that with our all stars who are holding down

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Speaker 1: the fort for me. Back in Washington, D C. Brendan

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Speaker 1: buck is back. He's the former spokesman and adviser to

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Speaker 1: HOW Speaker Paul Ryan and a partner now at Seven Letter.

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Speaker 1: Mark poston Bach is a Democratic strategist. He is also

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Speaker 1: a senior vice president at Rock Solutions, as well as

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Speaker 1: the former National Press Secretary to the d n C

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Speaker 1: during the presidential campaign. And I want to start with you.

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Speaker 1: Your former boss, Paul Ryan knows a thing or two

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Speaker 1: about the Midwest, obviously being from wid Hanson. And so

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Speaker 1: last night at on the on the presidential debate stage,

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Speaker 1: did Biden do what he needed to do to make

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Speaker 1: that pitch to Midwest voters? Yeah, I mean, I think

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Speaker 1: Biden really bought himself another six weeks as the front runner,

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Speaker 1: it's what nobody it's what nobody else on the stage

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Speaker 1: on him. You know. Uh, Kamala Harris, who took him

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Speaker 1: on quite memorably the first debate, found herself largely on defense,

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Speaker 1: we come out of here, I think it with a

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Speaker 1: people worrying about sending their kids back to school, we

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Speaker 1: don't really have much in the way of political event

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Speaker 1: until the next debate other than the Iowa State Fair.

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Speaker 1: I imagine we're going to be sort of stuck where

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Speaker 1: him really the only one in that moderate, if you will,

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Speaker 1: to see the pressure that comes on these lower tier

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Speaker 1: tier candidates in the next forty eight to seven towers.

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Speaker 1: They're gonna have to see how their poll numbers fair

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Speaker 1: presidential debate September twelve in Houston. Mark Postenbach, he has

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Speaker 1: a Democratic strategist. Do any candidates drop out, and if so,

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Speaker 1: when you know, I really think that you know whether

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Speaker 1: or not they qualify for this next debate. It's going

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Speaker 1: to be particularly important if you are running a race, UM,

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Speaker 1: you're able to or excuse me, unable to sort of

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Speaker 1: get attention on TV. Um, we're unable to get traction

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Speaker 1: where you're able to raise money. UM. I don't see

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Speaker 1: anyone right now. I think it's really really early. I

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Speaker 1: don't see anybody dropping out, UM until they don't make

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Speaker 1: the next presidential debate debate. So UM again, right now,

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Speaker 1: they're looking to get attention as much as possible. UM.

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Speaker 1: Mr Yang last night was on CNN making a lot

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Speaker 1: of interesting points, getting people's attention. UM. But at the

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Speaker 1: end of the day, I still think it's going to

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Speaker 1: the next couple of months. I mean, Elizabeth Warren UH

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Speaker 1: But as Brendan said at the end of this, I

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Speaker 1: You know, it's it's interesting. Right. So there's the politics

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Speaker 1: to be contrasted not just between Senator Elizabeth Warren and

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Speaker 1: former Vice President Joe Biden, but also amongst Republicans. You know,

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Speaker 1: President Trump as we speak route to Cincinnati, Ohio, he's

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Speaker 1: hosting a fundraiser there and he will have a rally.

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Speaker 1: I think he has a lot to talk about. And

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Speaker 1: just before taking off leave in the White House for Cincinnati,

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Speaker 1: he talked about trade policy. And we all know Michigan

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Speaker 1: is a state that he carried. It's also a state

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Speaker 1: I think people forget this that center. Excuse me that

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Speaker 1: Senator Bernie Standers beat Hillary Clinton in during the Democratic

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Speaker 1: presidential primary here in Michigan. This is where General Motors

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Speaker 1: is headquartered. Uh, this is auto country, and this is

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Speaker 1: virtually ground zero for U S. M c a for

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Speaker 1: U S. China trade talks, and China. China was on

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Speaker 1: President Trump's mind before he left to depart for Cincinnati

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Speaker 1: from the White House. Take a listen to what presidents

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Speaker 1: has to say about China eating it here he is

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Speaker 1: we've taxed China on three billion dollars worth of goods

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Speaker 1: and products being sold into our country, and China eats

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Speaker 1: it because they have to pay it, because what they

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Speaker 1: do is they devalue their currency and they push money out.

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Speaker 1: But our tariffs precisely going to be part of the

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Speaker 1: new republic looking ideology, the new democratic ideology. That's what

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Speaker 1: we're gonna get into coming up next. You can download

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Speaker 1: the sound on the Bloomberg Sound On podcast on applei

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Speaker 1: to at Bloomberg dot com, or by downloading the Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: Business app. You can also find me on I Heart Radio, Spotify,

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Speaker 1: and Radio dot com. Panel stays and I'm Kevin Cirelli,

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Speaker 1: Chief Washington correspondent for Bloomberg Television and Bloomberg Radio, broadcasting

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Speaker 1: live from the Detroit out technically right outside of Detroit,

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Speaker 1: Michigan Bureau from Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg. This is

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg's Sound On with Kevin Surreley on Bloomberg one and

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Speaker 1: one oh five point seven of m h D two Baltimore.

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Speaker 1: We're now take it in tariffs on ten percent on

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Speaker 1: over three hundred billion on two hundred and fifty billion,

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Speaker 1: and it's been proven that our people are not paying

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Speaker 1: for the terror. That was President Trump speaking earlier today

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Speaker 1: depart during the White House en route to Cincinnati, Ohio,

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Speaker 1: where the President is hosting a campaign re election rally

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Speaker 1: as well as a fundraiser. It is the first rally

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Speaker 1: that he has following the conclusion of the second Democratic

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Speaker 1: presidential debate. I'm Kevin Cirelli, Chief Washington correspondent for Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: Television and Bloomberg Radio. I'm broadcasting from our Bloomberg Detroit bureau,

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Speaker 1: where I've been camped not camped out, but I've been

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Speaker 1: hanging out following the conclusion of the second Democratic presidential Debate.

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Speaker 1: I'm joined back in Washington, d C. By Brendan buck.

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Speaker 1: He is a former spokesman and adviser to House Speaker

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Speaker 1: Paul Ryan. He's a Republican and now a partner at

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Speaker 1: Seven Letters Communications. Mark poston Bach is also in Washington,

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Speaker 1: d C. A Democratic strategist, senior vice president at Rock Solutions,

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Speaker 1: and as well as the former National Press Secretary to

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Speaker 1: the d n C during the During so Mark, in

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Speaker 1: terms of tariffs, I mean you hear the President saying

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Speaker 1: that he is going to be negotiator in chief. You

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Speaker 1: know I'm here in Detroit. General Motors is headquartered here. Uh,

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Speaker 1: this is really ground zero for the trade debate. How

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Speaker 1: will the Democrats look to contrast themselves when making the

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Speaker 1: pitch that they will be better at negotiating trade deals

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Speaker 1: with China as well as with Europe and of course

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Speaker 1: let's not forget about Mexico and Canada. Well, if there's

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Speaker 1: one thing, UM and obviously being a business network, the

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Speaker 1: most important thing for businesses is to have UM some

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Speaker 1: sense of stability to understand what policies are coming out

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Speaker 1: of the White House. Unfortunately, with President Trump, you have

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Speaker 1: things that are like tweets. You're not seeing any particular

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Speaker 1: announcements that's sort that are well thought out UM where

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Speaker 1: he's consulting the business community, and that does having a

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Speaker 1: real impact on UM businesses everywhere. You know, the most

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Speaker 1: important UM reason why there's not much business investment despite

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Speaker 1: the tax cuts, UM, despite President Trump's best efforts UM

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Speaker 1: with respect the tariffs, is because of the uncertain t

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Speaker 1: UM that these businesses are facing. And you know, when

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Speaker 1: it comes to rural America and farms, despite the President's

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Speaker 1: UM best efforts on making sure that UM that these

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Speaker 1: So I think Democrats, I think can lay claim to

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Speaker 1: a pretty strong argument on that. You don't, Brendan Buck,

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Speaker 1: I mean you know this. I mean just so being

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Speaker 1: it's made of a through the House of Representatives, from

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Speaker 1: your time working with former Speaker Paul Ryan, I mean

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Speaker 1: I was kind of reading between the lines and and

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Speaker 1: and trying to trying to parse words the past two

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Speaker 1: I mean, you hear former Congress and Better Overwork say

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Speaker 1: that tariffs or taxes. You hear some of the candidates

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Speaker 1: say that tariffs are bad. But then when when I

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Speaker 1: She actually criticized u s m C A which is

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Speaker 1: But there's similarities, are there not? Between the way that

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Speaker 1: President Trump negotiates on trade and the way that progressives

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Speaker 1: like Senator Sanders and Senator Warren would negotiate it on trade? Right,

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Speaker 1: I find very little to be happy about with the

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Speaker 1: President's approach on trade. I had hoped that there would

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Speaker 1: be a silver lining of some sort where Democrats would

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Speaker 1: sort of reject what he's doing just because it's him

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Speaker 1: and embrace a little more free trade. That's not happening.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the reality is that he's acting like a Democrat,

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Speaker 1: a sort of crazy Democrat, even when it comes to

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Speaker 1: implementing tariffs. And it is perhaps the most self destructive

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Speaker 1: thing that he does. I mean, he does a lot

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Speaker 1: of self destructive things, obviously, But you know, the primary

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Speaker 1: argument he's going to try to make for reelection is

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Speaker 1: the economy. Um, and you know you've hit on it.

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Speaker 1: It's not just the national economy. It's that region where

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Speaker 1: you're sitting right now. The President won Michigan, but he

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Speaker 1: wanted by like ten thousand votes. That's nothing. And yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's the automotive is and the manufacturing in that region

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Speaker 1: that are getting hit by this. But you know, there's

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Speaker 1: also a lot of agricultural products that come out of

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Speaker 1: that area. And if you look at a state like Wisconsin,

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Speaker 1: where my boss is from, the uh, dairy farmers in

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Speaker 1: Wisconsin are getting crushed right now now there's a number

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Speaker 1: of reasons for it, but the trade war is part

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Speaker 1: of it, and you know, I I imagine sort of

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Speaker 1: the rhetoric plays well in that part of the country

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Speaker 1: about you know, taking on China and fighting and doing

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Speaker 1: that kind of thing. But at some point, you know,

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Speaker 1: we're years into this now, the policy outcomes are not

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Speaker 1: terribly good, and people are hurting, and again, all it

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Speaker 1: does is undermine his central argument for reelection is that

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Speaker 1: I've got a great economy going. And you know, I

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Speaker 1: don't know who thought that this was, you know, a

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Speaker 1: good idea of the latest action today. I imagine nobody did.

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Speaker 1: I imagine this was another one of his just shoot

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Speaker 1: from the hip, gut instinct. I'm gonna drop another ten

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Speaker 1: percent tariff on China and and you know, that's gonna

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Speaker 1: get me somewhere. And it would be one thing if

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Speaker 1: he had been pushing these threats for for a while

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Speaker 1: and and it yielded some type of results. But at

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Speaker 1: this point it's pretty clear that China is not just gonna,

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Speaker 1: you know, fold because of this, and hopefully we can

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Speaker 1: learn a lesson soon and stop this nonsense. You know,

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Speaker 1: we talk a lot about the uncertainty for the short term.

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Speaker 1: But I mean, looking at that debate stage last night,

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Speaker 1: the Democrats are are there are candidates that are are

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Speaker 1: espousing very different trade policies and and the contrast between

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Speaker 1: them and whether or not they believe tariffs are good

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Speaker 1: or bad. There's a diversity of ideology that exists on

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Speaker 1: the left regarding tariffs in particular, that also exists on

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Speaker 1: the right. I mean, Brendan, I mean to hear you

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Speaker 1: criticize the president's use of terrorists. I mean, as you know,

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Speaker 1: there are staunch supporters of President Trump and this for example,

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Speaker 1: who are also increasingly very critical and even introduced legislation

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Speaker 1: to get him to reign in the use of tariffs.

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Speaker 1: I want to play for you just one final bite

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Speaker 1: about what President Trump, and he's trying to say that

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Speaker 1: tariffs are actually costing not the U. S. Worker or

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Speaker 1: or businesses, but that they're costing China. Take a listen

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Speaker 1: to the President Trump before he left. First, since Nattie,

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Speaker 1: we're taking in many billions of dollars. There's been absolutely

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Speaker 1: no inflation, and frankly, it hasn't coast our consumer or

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Speaker 1: anything could coast China. Mark Poston about Democratic strategists senior

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Speaker 1: vice president at Rock Solutions. I mean, I you know,

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Speaker 1: I want to I want to not conflate stories, but

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Speaker 1: I think we also have to look to see the

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Speaker 1: forest from the trees, and we have to think big picture,

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Speaker 1: and we gotta keep it simple. And when you look

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Speaker 1: at how the President is saying, like he did the

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Speaker 1: other week, that there might not be a trade deal

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Speaker 1: with China until after the election, he's setting expectations. And

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Speaker 1: I think when you look at what could happen in

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Speaker 1: the fall, he's banking, banking that U S m c

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Speaker 1: A gets ratified. And I think you could even I

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Speaker 1: mean you hear the news of today where he's you know,

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Speaker 1: the tariffs on with China. I think you couldn't see

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Speaker 1: a situation where he plucks on additional tariffs on Mexico

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Speaker 1: in order to try to four the hand of Speaker

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Speaker 1: Pelosi to get a vote, or even in another situation

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Speaker 1: he could pull out of NAFTA altogether to try to

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Speaker 1: force to get a vote. But in the short term,

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Speaker 1: a lot more uncertain days ahead, are there not? Mark, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I do think there's uncertain the president. Part of it

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Speaker 1: is that, as Brendan said, the president wakes up one

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Speaker 1: day and makes a decision and that's it, and it's

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Speaker 1: over a tweet. Um. I also think in many ways

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Speaker 1: that a lot of his policies are to try and

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Speaker 1: cover up for things that didn't work. Right. So the

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Speaker 1: tax cuts, for example, we're supposed to um spur you know,

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Speaker 1: business investment, and instead they did. I mean if you

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Speaker 1: consider that, you know, you know, stock buybacks perhaps, but

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Speaker 1: I mean, like the reality is that his tax cuts

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Speaker 1: um didn't work. Most Americans aren't feeling um any better

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Speaker 1: after the tax cuts, and so he's you know, sort

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Speaker 1: of I'm not even there, and I can just see

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Speaker 1: Brendan Buck like ready to literally like I don't even know,

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Speaker 1: just like grab, I'm gonna I'm gonna get Martin the floor.

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Speaker 1: But you know, go ahead, mark Um. You know, I

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Speaker 1: think you know, he's constantly trying to find ways to

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Speaker 1: sort of move the ball forward. I mean, if you

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Speaker 1: look at something like healthcare for example, that you know,

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Speaker 1: the GOP does not have a healthcare proposal, um if

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Speaker 1: the A c A goes down, so what is the

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Speaker 1: president trying to do? He's trying to come up with

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Speaker 1: short term ideas and plans on things like prescription drugs

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Speaker 1: or surprise billing. Um. And that's because he doesn't have

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Speaker 1: anything to fall back on, and he refuses to sort

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Speaker 1: of stop and and reevaluate where he is. He's just

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Speaker 1: keep moving forward. So that's where we're going to see

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Speaker 1: some of these policies that that aren't going to work

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Speaker 1: over the course of all Right, Brandon respond, go ahead.

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Speaker 1: Just this morning, the Wall Street Journal reported at the

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Speaker 1: sort of wave of inversions that companies have been moving

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Speaker 1: overseas has reversed as a result of the tax reform

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Speaker 1: law that we passed. And I don't think anybody can

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Speaker 1: argue that people aren't doing better than they were years before.

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Speaker 1: In fact, the second quarter business investment was not super strong,

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Speaker 1: but because for the preceding six quarters or so, it

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Speaker 1: was quite strong. Um. You know, there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: things you can criticize what the president has done. I

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Speaker 1: don't think that you can suggest that tax reforms has

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Speaker 1: not helped people feel better. Uh, it has not helped.

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Speaker 1: It's hard to argue that it has not helped the

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Speaker 1: business community, small small businesses. UM, and frankly just made

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Speaker 1: people feel a little better about their lives, that they

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Speaker 1: can get ahead a little more. All right, We're gonna

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Speaker 1: keep this conversation going, coming up set ceiling time. Do

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Speaker 1: you believe this President Trump got a deal with Speaker Pelosi.

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Speaker 1: You can download Down on podcast by uh download on

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Speaker 1: Apple it tunes, at Bloomberg dot com, or by downloading

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Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Business app. You can also find us on

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Speaker 1: Radio dot Com, I Heart Radio, and Spotify Panel Stay Stays,

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Speaker 1: Brendan buck Mark Poston Back and I'm Kevin CURRELLI Chief

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Speaker 1: Washington correspondent for Bloomberg Television and Bloomberg Radio. You're listening

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Speaker 1: to Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg's Sound On with Kevin Surreley

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Speaker 1: on Bloomberg one and one oh five point seven f

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Speaker 1: m h D two Baltimore. That is such a great song.

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Speaker 1: YouTube's beautiful day. And I'm Kevin Sirelli, chief Washington correspondent

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Speaker 1: for Bloomberg Television and Bloomberg Radio. I'm I've stuck around

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Speaker 1: Detroit and it is a beautiful day here in Detroit.

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Speaker 1: It's been a beautiful past couple of days. I've been

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Speaker 1: here on assignment covering the second Democratic presidential debate. But

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Speaker 1: there's policy news that happened in the Upper Chamber back

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Speaker 1: in Washington, d C. Brendan Buck is a former UH

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Speaker 1: Press secretary to House Speaker Paul run Uh. He is

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Speaker 1: also now at Seven Letters Communications. Mark poston Bach is

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Speaker 1: a Democratic strategist and senior vice president at Rock Solutions

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Speaker 1: and former National Press Secretary of the d n C.

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Speaker 1: During the presidential campaign, Brendan, did you see this? Did

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Speaker 1: you see this? What the Senate did today? They actually

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Speaker 1: did something a sixties seven to eight vote. They passed

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Speaker 1: a massive budget deal. This a according to CNN, that

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Speaker 1: would stave off the looming threat of a potential default

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Speaker 1: on US debt and prevent automatic spending cuts to domestic

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Speaker 1: and military funding. They raised the death sailing. I mean,

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Speaker 1: this is this is for two years, two years. I mean, Brendon,

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Speaker 1: I feel like you're like, I couldn't we have gotten

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Speaker 1: that back when I was in the in the House. No,

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Speaker 1: I mean we actually didn't have too much Trump It's

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Speaker 1: the the ironic ironic things. We didn't have too much

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Speaker 1: trouble raising the debt limit with this president. I just

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Speaker 1: don't think he cared too much about it. Now I

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Speaker 1: am getting having a little fun with everybody is celebrating

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Speaker 1: that the debt limit has been increased for two years.

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Speaker 1: And you know, everybody thinks the drama is over. Um,

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Speaker 1: hold up, we still have to fund the government. Um.

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Speaker 1: And I think that we have quite the battle in

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Speaker 1: store still ahead. Um. As you know, government funding will

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Speaker 1: run out this fall. Uh. And the last time we

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Speaker 1: went through this exercise, we had the longest government shutdown

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Speaker 1: in history. I don't know that the dynamics have changed

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Speaker 1: a lot, other than maybe the President realizing that that

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Speaker 1: didn't work out too well for him. But we still

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Speaker 1: have a lot of drama ahead of us. And UM.

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Speaker 1: While it's certainly a good thing that we don't have

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Speaker 1: to deal with the debt limit for another couple of years,

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Speaker 1: I don't think the fund is quite over you. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I'm an optimist, but a little drama for from a

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Speaker 1: journalist perspective, markets drama. Drama can be a good thing.

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Speaker 1: But there's no drama over the falling on the US debt. Right.

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Speaker 1: You would say this is a win for them. I'm

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Speaker 1: not trying to this is a win for Speaker Pelosi

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Speaker 1: and President Trump. No. Uh, yeah, I believe so. I

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Speaker 1: think again, to to Brendan's point here, we did strike

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Speaker 1: a deal, but at the end of the day. Um,

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Speaker 1: this is not something to be trifled with. I think that, um,

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Speaker 1: if we were to sort of end this um as

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Speaker 1: a as sort of a constant issue over time, I

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Speaker 1: think the economy would be in a in a much

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Speaker 1: better place. It just seems, um a little absurd that

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Speaker 1: we have to go through this um every couple of years.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, I think that this is a positive step,

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Speaker 1: but I'm still concerned with the overall impact of having

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Speaker 1: to wait at the very last minute to get this

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Speaker 1: done when it should be something simple. I'm actually with

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Speaker 1: Mark on this. I am on record, give me bringing

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Speaker 1: people together totally off. You guys are like not even

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Speaker 1: in the same book, not let alone the same page

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Speaker 1: on taxes. But look at this on the for compromise.

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Speaker 1: I've just been through so many of these dumb fights

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Speaker 1: and it's not worth the risk that would happen if

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Speaker 1: you know, there's another spontaneous fight between Trump and Pelosi

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Speaker 1: and they can't come together. I think we should just yeah, right,

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Speaker 1: I think we should just eliminate the debt limit altogether.

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Speaker 1: And uh, you know, forget this, uh these manufactured crises

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Speaker 1: that we come up with every two years. How would

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Speaker 1: how would that look? Explain that because the folks who

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Speaker 1: are who are driving from from work to here get

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Speaker 1: rid of the debt limit. How how would that love

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Speaker 1: the demo would the mechanism being the Develomit doesn't affect

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Speaker 1: how much we spend. It allows us to borrow to

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Speaker 1: pay for obligations we we've already made. And you know

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Speaker 1: we've never breached the debt limit. Every time we get

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Speaker 1: close to it and we need to borrow more to

431
00:22:51,359 --> 00:22:55,879
Speaker 1: pay for Medicare or Social Security payments or the military, uh,

432
00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:59,399
Speaker 1: Congress has to vote to increase the statutory limit that

433
00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:02,040
Speaker 1: says this is how much you can borrow. Um. In

434
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:05,360
Speaker 1: recent years, it has just become sort of a political football.

435
00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:08,399
Speaker 1: For a long time, they would sort of hide the

436
00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:10,320
Speaker 1: vote on it, and any time you passed a budget,

437
00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:12,959
Speaker 1: it automatically went up. And we sort of got rid

438
00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:15,639
Speaker 1: of that over time. UM. So now it becomes this

439
00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:21,840
Speaker 1: big dramatic thing, and you can't it's so politically um dicey. Uh.

440
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:25,000
Speaker 1: There's so much politics around it that you can't even

441
00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:27,159
Speaker 1: just vote on it on its own. And so what

442
00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:29,159
Speaker 1: we've end up having to do is attach it to

443
00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:32,520
Speaker 1: other things to give Member Congress some cover to suggest

444
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:34,880
Speaker 1: their voting for this, not the debt limit increase, because

445
00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:38,399
Speaker 1: there's nothing more potent than a thirties second ad that

446
00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:41,840
Speaker 1: says you voted to increase the amount, you know, the

447
00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:44,680
Speaker 1: debt limit by you know, a trillion dollars or whatever

448
00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:47,800
Speaker 1: it is. All right, coming up more politics, policy and analysis.

449
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:51,000
Speaker 1: I'll take you into the Spin room from last night,

450
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,240
Speaker 1: where I spoke with several of the candidates. Panel stays

451
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:56,359
Speaker 1: Brendan Buck, former spokesman and advisor to House Speaker Paul

452
00:23:56,440 --> 00:24:00,159
Speaker 1: Ryan and now a partner at Seven Letters Communications and

453
00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:03,320
Speaker 1: Mark Postenbach. He has a Democratic strategist and senior vice

454
00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:06,720
Speaker 1: president at a Rock Solutions. He was also deputy press

455
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:10,639
Speaker 1: secretary to Biden's campaign in two thousand and eight and

456
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:15,000
Speaker 1: the press secretary at the Democratic National Committee. You can

457
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:19,399
Speaker 1: download the Sound On podcast on Apple on Apple's iTunes,

458
00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:22,359
Speaker 1: at Bloomberg dot com, or by downloading the Bloomberg Business app.

459
00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:25,240
Speaker 1: You can also find us at Radio dot com, I

460
00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 1: Heart Radio, and Spotify. I'm Kevin Cerelli, Chief Washington correspondent

461
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:38,840
Speaker 1: for Bloomberg Television and Radio. This is Bloomberg. This is

462
00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:43,959
Speaker 1: Bloomberg's Sound On with Kevin Surreley. On Bloomberg one and

463
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:46,679
Speaker 1: one oh five point seven f m h D two, Baltimore.

464
00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:51,560
Speaker 1: I'm Kevin SERELLI, Chief Washington correspondent FRO Bloomberg Television and

465
00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:53,960
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio. I stuck around the Motor City. I gotta

466
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:57,159
Speaker 1: be honest. I've been to Detroit before several times in

467
00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:02,760
Speaker 1: the last cycle. But Detroit in the summer it is beautiful, beautiful,

468
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,720
Speaker 1: as we say back home in my hometown outside of Philly. Beautiful,

469
00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:09,320
Speaker 1: the people, the food, the pizza. I didn't know Detroit

470
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:11,359
Speaker 1: was known for pizza. Let me tell you something. The

471
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:14,960
Speaker 1: pizza here is phenomenal. Uh. The sin you know, Shinola,

472
00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:18,639
Speaker 1: they had that store on Fourteenth Street, but Shinola makes

473
00:25:18,920 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 1: and they had a hotel here now and their food

474
00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:24,440
Speaker 1: was amazing, to their waffles. Uh. So we have We've

475
00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:26,760
Speaker 1: had a great time here in Detroit. I'll be back

476
00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:29,960
Speaker 1: in Washington tomorrow. Uh. And there's been a lot of news,

477
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:31,760
Speaker 1: but I want to take us back into the spin

478
00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:34,280
Speaker 1: room from last night to go back to the debate

479
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:38,119
Speaker 1: and what it means for this this quiet August recess summer.

480
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 1: The next Democratic presidential debate is gonna be on September

481
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:44,879
Speaker 1: twelfth in Houston and the threshold, and I said this

482
00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:47,920
Speaker 1: to Chairman Perez, Tom Perez, the chairman of the Democratic Party.

483
00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:51,720
Speaker 1: I said, like, when are all these candidates respectfully drop out?

484
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:54,640
Speaker 1: I mean, there's a million candidates, if like running for president.

485
00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:56,879
Speaker 1: And the points at the d n C made and

486
00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,159
Speaker 1: I thought this was interesting, was you know, back the

487
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:03,679
Speaker 1: twelve cycle, Republicans had the kitty table debate, remember this,

488
00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:06,480
Speaker 1: the kitty table debate, and then like the main event,

489
00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:08,399
Speaker 1: and they didn't like that, so they thought, you know,

490
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 1: we're just gonna do a random raffle uh and whoever

491
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:13,119
Speaker 1: gets on the stage gets on the stage. But the

492
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:16,240
Speaker 1: other thing that's interesting is that the d n C

493
00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 1: got a got the networks to get two nights, two

494
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,560
Speaker 1: nights of prime time coverage. And they're they're happy. I mean,

495
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:25,760
Speaker 1: there are folks who are at the d n C

496
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,160
Speaker 1: who were happy about that. I thought that was interesting.

497
00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:31,400
Speaker 1: Brendan Buck is here. Brendan Buck is back in Washington. Rather,

498
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:35,119
Speaker 1: he works at Seven Letters Communications. He's a former advisor.

499
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:38,520
Speaker 1: It's a previous Republican Speaker of the House, Paul Ryan.

500
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,679
Speaker 1: Mark poston Bach is also with him in Washington. D

501
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:45,720
Speaker 1: C he's the democratic uh democratic strategist. He's a senior

502
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:50,480
Speaker 1: vice president at Rock Solutions in Washington. He's Forbiden back

503
00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 1: in two thousand and eight, uh and and was the

504
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:57,280
Speaker 1: profyterian sixteen over at the d n C Mark. I

505
00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:01,280
Speaker 1: were talking about debates, and I heard through through my

506
00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:05,040
Speaker 1: my buddy Daniel Littman at Politicos reporting that you actually

507
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:11,439
Speaker 1: you snuck triumph the insult comic dog, that little that

508
00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:15,560
Speaker 1: puppet dog that insults everybody into a debate hall. What

509
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:18,800
Speaker 1: is the story with this? Well, actually, um, he was

510
00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:22,080
Speaker 1: already credential I just okay, you know what that this

511
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:24,359
Speaker 1: soft topic because there are a couple of people Bloomberger

512
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:26,960
Speaker 1: couldn't get credentized. Go ahead. I was not involved in

513
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:31,359
Speaker 1: the credentialing process. Someone else had had, you know, dealt

514
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,640
Speaker 1: with that. So I apologize to any of your colleagues

515
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 1: who were not able to get into that. Um. Basically,

516
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: what happened was triumph is I don't know if that

517
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 1: many people know, but uh, he's often late to things.

518
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 1: Now he's uh he was like Triumphant the puppet and

519
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,919
Speaker 1: kept both you know, he got there a little too

520
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:56,360
Speaker 1: late and unfortunately, uh, secret service had made it difficult

521
00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 1: for him to get in. Uh wait wait wait, so

522
00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:03,399
Speaker 1: try the installed comic book. The puppet couldn't get into

523
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:06,200
Speaker 1: the debate hall and he had a credential. Yeah, so

524
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:08,080
Speaker 1: he had to you know obviously as you know, they

525
00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:11,000
Speaker 1: do uh security suites, and he was not what debate

526
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:15,040
Speaker 1: was this? This was I think it was Charleston. I

527
00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:18,280
Speaker 1: believe that was January of and this was this was

528
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:21,199
Speaker 1: with Was this was this the general election? Or was

529
00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:26,159
Speaker 1: this was the primary? Standard? And Clinton? Wow? Wow, all right,

530
00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:28,480
Speaker 1: Brendan Buck, I mean you have some debate stories. I mean,

531
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:30,960
Speaker 1: what what what's the weirdest debate story that comes to

532
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:34,639
Speaker 1: mind from your memory? No. I was just telling them

533
00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:36,239
Speaker 1: they're in the break that I've only actually been in

534
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:39,240
Speaker 1: one spin room in my life and Lucky, I'm like,

535
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 1: I need a helmet, go ahead. Yeah. And you know

536
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 1: they had a nice intern holding a sign next to

537
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 1: me for people to come up if they wanted to talk,

538
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 1: but nobody wanted to talk to me like this, and

539
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:50,480
Speaker 1: they were like Eric Fernshram and you know they're you know,

540
00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:53,280
Speaker 1: hot shots in the Romney campaign who riched it in.

541
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:55,560
Speaker 1: It was kind of sad, you know, I gotta be honest.

542
00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 1: So if if you've never been to the debate spin room,

543
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's bedlam and it's awesome. I mean,

544
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:02,240
Speaker 1: this is what I live for. Is like, you know,

545
00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:04,240
Speaker 1: you've got like I don't know what they're called. What

546
00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 1: are those things called, like the signs with the rectangular

547
00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:09,959
Speaker 1: signs with the names of all the campaigns, whatever they are,

548
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:15,240
Speaker 1: they're as lollipops. They're they're called lollipops. I didn't know

549
00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:17,960
Speaker 1: that either, Mark Poston about just earning just coming in

550
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,600
Speaker 1: with the drop in the the wow. Today, I learned

551
00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:23,040
Speaker 1: the T I L. Colon Today. I learned those signs

552
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:25,000
Speaker 1: are called lollipops. But I don't think you can refer

553
00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:27,040
Speaker 1: to that. I'm like, so the Biden campaign is holding

554
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:28,720
Speaker 1: a lollipop in the spinner and people are gonna be

555
00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:34,760
Speaker 1: like what I would well so last night. I mean,

556
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:37,040
Speaker 1: But but to Brendan's point, it is a little bit

557
00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:41,600
Speaker 1: awkward when you have some of these senior campaigns and

558
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:44,840
Speaker 1: like no or even the candidates because there's so many

559
00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 1: of them, and no one wants to go to their

560
00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:49,640
Speaker 1: lollipop because like you're like trying to get to Comba.

561
00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:52,480
Speaker 1: Harris you're trying to get to Elizabeth Warren and then

562
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:54,720
Speaker 1: like there's like it's it's like it's like high school.

563
00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:56,240
Speaker 1: It's like a high school dance. I mean, it's it's

564
00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,160
Speaker 1: really fascinating, uh to to watch that. All Right, So

565
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:01,160
Speaker 1: I'm in the spin room anyway. But all that said,

566
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:03,760
Speaker 1: we took a long place to get to this back

567
00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:07,760
Speaker 1: to the spind room. But I thought that Julie and

568
00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 1: cashtro did enough last night to get him in position

569
00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:16,200
Speaker 1: for the third debate. Mark, do you agree, Yeah, I

570
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 1: think he did a particularly good job. Hopefully for him.

571
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 1: He's raising some money a little bit. Um. One thing

572
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 1: that was interesting is after the debates and then I

573
00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 1: think it was Van Jones aske him oqution um sort

574
00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:30,960
Speaker 1: of say, you know, your concern about ice, that's particularly

575
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:35,440
Speaker 1: it's big on your sort of agenda. Um, but can you,

576
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:39,040
Speaker 1: you know, basically disaggregate the idea that we should decriminalize

577
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:44,120
Speaker 1: people crossing the border um and ice. Couldn't you solve them,

578
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,640
Speaker 1: you know, deal with the ice issue, um and not

579
00:30:46,760 --> 00:30:49,000
Speaker 1: decriminalize the border. He didn't really have a good answer there,

580
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 1: so I think he might get pressed to the next debate.

581
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: I think that obviously. I think it's in the last

582
00:30:55,080 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 1: poll of people Um supported that policy of decriminalizing legal

583
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:03,600
Speaker 1: boarding across to the extent that he did well for

584
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:07,200
Speaker 1: himself in a Democratic primary, I think he probably did

585
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:11,360
Speaker 1: the most damage to the party overall by again having

586
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:14,680
Speaker 1: to talk about decriminalizing border crossings. You don't have to

587
00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:19,400
Speaker 1: be a Trump nationalist to think that that's a crazy idea,

588
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 1: and that is one of the things that you know

589
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 1: that you know, along with providing free healthcare for legal immigrants,

590
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:26,880
Speaker 1: to the things that while you know it may provide

591
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:30,760
Speaker 1: an opening for him on this primary, is the kind

592
00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:33,120
Speaker 1: of stuff that just really sets back. I think whoever

593
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 1: the Democratic nominee is, if they have to adopt positions

594
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:40,360
Speaker 1: like that to win the nomination, it's just it's just

595
00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:42,720
Speaker 1: crazy to most people. I think. So even beyond the

596
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,240
Speaker 1: issue of immigration, I mean medicare for all, and it

597
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 1: really we talked earlier in the program about trade and

598
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,720
Speaker 1: tariffs and uh, you know, economic vision and whatnot, but

599
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:57,400
Speaker 1: medicare for all is a lingering issue and that Senator

600
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 1: Sanders and Senator war And have forced every other candidate

601
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,480
Speaker 1: to react to. And Senator Kamala Harris, I mean, I

602
00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 1: think I can say this as a reporter, I mean,

603
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:11,000
Speaker 1: objectively speaking, her plan is not this is not Medicare

604
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:13,520
Speaker 1: for all, as Bernie Standers and Elizabeth Warren know it.

605
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:19,480
Speaker 1: Her plan is also uh, something that would separate, according

606
00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:23,520
Speaker 1: to her her own words, would separate an individual's healthcare

607
00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:27,840
Speaker 1: from their employer. We're here and I'm here in Detroit, Michigan,

608
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 1: Mark Post and bach uh, And there are a lot

609
00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:33,560
Speaker 1: of union workers who work for General Motors were g

610
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:36,240
Speaker 1: M s headquartered in Detroit, who might not want to

611
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:38,800
Speaker 1: give up their health care. And so how's that going

612
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:41,560
Speaker 1: to play in a general election? Well, I don't think

613
00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:43,720
Speaker 1: it's going to be fatal for the Democratic Party. I

614
00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:45,800
Speaker 1: think that you know, as as you know very well,

615
00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:47,440
Speaker 1: and as Brendan knows, once you get into the general

616
00:32:47,520 --> 00:32:50,520
Speaker 1: king people start moving to the middle. And so I

617
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:52,640
Speaker 1: see that happening on the issue of health care what

618
00:32:52,760 --> 00:32:54,840
Speaker 1: I think right now for the Demo. But there, I mean,

619
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:57,880
Speaker 1: I got oppressive, respectfully because there I mean to me,

620
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:02,360
Speaker 1: some of these policies they're layand I mean Elizabeth Warren

621
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:06,200
Speaker 1: and Bernie Sanders are essentially saying like if if this

622
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:09,720
Speaker 1: is this is the new Democratic ideology, Medicare for all,

623
00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 1: the new that miss test, right, Yeah, the new moments. Yeah.

624
00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:14,640
Speaker 1: I mean I think at the end of the day,

625
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,520
Speaker 1: I can speak only to the primary because that's why

626
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:19,959
Speaker 1: no for sure, right, And I think that in this

627
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 1: particular case, um, everyone's sort of espousing some variation of

628
00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:26,480
Speaker 1: Medicare for all. The problem is if you listen to

629
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 1: Bernie Sanders and you listen to Elizabeth Warren, they make

630
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,360
Speaker 1: a provide a full throwed defense of the policy. And

631
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: that's where I think. You know, Kamala Harris is a

632
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,200
Speaker 1: great candidate. I think she's going to remain very strong.

633
00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:39,880
Speaker 1: But when when asked that question about Medicare for All

634
00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 1: and what her plan does, it's not so much the

635
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:44,240
Speaker 1: difference between her plan and Medicare for All. She didn't strong.

636
00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:46,440
Speaker 1: She didn't seem confident in her answer, and I think

637
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:48,760
Speaker 1: that came through. So if you are gonna, you know,

638
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 1: lay out a stake, you know, stake acclaim with respect

639
00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:53,400
Speaker 1: to health care, it's got to be strong. People have

640
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:55,000
Speaker 1: to want to you know, people are going to believe it.

641
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:56,400
Speaker 1: We're gonna have to leave it there. Both of you.

642
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Speaker 1: Please come back and thank you so much for holding

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Speaker 1: down the fort for me in UH, Washington, d C,

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Speaker 1: running Buck Mark Boston, Buck Brenn in front of the program.

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Speaker 1: Mark first time on, but he'll be back. UH. Brendan's

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Speaker 1: at Seven Letters Communications, Mark is at Rock Solutions. It's

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Speaker 1: been I want to thank our whole team. I want

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Speaker 1: to thank Ko in the control room, Charlie Valmer, Christine

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Speaker 1: Baratta in d C. David Suckerman, our according field producer

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Speaker 1: who has been on the road with me the past

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Speaker 1: couple of days. UH, because it's it's a team effort

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Speaker 1: and and I'm grateful for all of them. I'll be

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Speaker 1: back in d C. Kevin CURRELLI, Chief Washington correspondent for

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg TV and Radio. Here listening, Tolmberg