1 00:00:02,480 --> 00:00:10,479 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. This is the Bloomberg 2 00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: Daybreak Asia podcast. I'm Doug Krisner. You can join Brian 3 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:16,680 Speaker 1: Curtis and myself for the stories, making news and moving 4 00:00:16,720 --> 00:00:19,560 Speaker 1: markets in the APAC region. You can subscribe to the 5 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:23,120 Speaker 1: show anywhere you get your podcast and always on Bloomberg Radio, 6 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:26,120 Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Terminal, and the Bloomberg Business App. 7 00:00:27,320 --> 00:00:31,840 Speaker 2: Terry Spath, founder and CIO of Zumo Wealth. So, Terry, 8 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:35,640 Speaker 2: the China stimulus is also providing another leg for the 9 00:00:35,680 --> 00:00:39,080 Speaker 2: bulls to stand on with the soft landing thesis, and 10 00:00:39,159 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 2: people are factoring that in. But it is also competition 11 00:00:42,760 --> 00:00:46,440 Speaker 2: for funds. There's no doubt about that. It could be 12 00:00:46,479 --> 00:00:49,680 Speaker 2: sucking money away from US assets. But then on the 13 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:53,320 Speaker 2: other hand, this stimulus is likely to be good for 14 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:56,440 Speaker 2: the Chinese economy. So how are you reading the stimulus 15 00:00:56,440 --> 00:00:57,360 Speaker 2: and how are you playing it? 16 00:00:58,240 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, we have to talk about China. 17 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:03,800 Speaker 4: As you pointed out that massive nose fleed rally that 18 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:07,199 Speaker 4: we've seen recently, they've unlined the government there is really 19 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:13,319 Speaker 4: unleashed a massive stimulus and those measures have led to 20 00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:17,520 Speaker 4: these astonishing gains. They're all really good measures. They're sweeping 21 00:01:17,600 --> 00:01:21,679 Speaker 4: stimulus that's going on. They've delivered a rate cut, there's 22 00:01:21,720 --> 00:01:25,600 Speaker 4: lower mortgage rates, there's a range of monetary easing measures. 23 00:01:26,319 --> 00:01:30,160 Speaker 3: A lot of capital is being encouraged to be lent, and. 24 00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 4: That's what's driving I think mostly this just ricochet to 25 00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:37,040 Speaker 4: the upside that we've seen. 26 00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 3: And you know, we're still at levels. 27 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:42,920 Speaker 4: What's interesting is we're still at levels for these for 28 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:46,920 Speaker 4: the Chinese equities, that are lower than they were five 29 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 4: years ago. On the flip side, you've got rsi's or 30 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:54,920 Speaker 4: relative stock relative strength of north of eighty five, which 31 00:01:54,960 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 4: signals over bought situation for those stocks. 32 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:01,600 Speaker 3: So we're weighing both of those things. 33 00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:04,920 Speaker 4: We do think that there's still interesting despite this strong gains. 34 00:02:05,320 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 4: But on the other hand, we think we'll see a 35 00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:11,480 Speaker 4: pullback and some opportunities to get in at cheaper levels. 36 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:14,800 Speaker 3: And the reason for that is that both presidential. 37 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 4: Candidates are very hawkish when it comes to China, and 38 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:19,799 Speaker 4: we think that that you know, some investors perhaps are 39 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 4: forgotten about that, and we'll get some opportunities, but you 40 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 4: can also buy right now because relative to prior levels, 41 00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:29,680 Speaker 4: we're still we're still in negative territory. 42 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:31,480 Speaker 1: For sure, So do you want to be exposed to 43 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:33,799 Speaker 1: other markets in the Asia Pacific at the same time. 44 00:02:33,880 --> 00:02:35,760 Speaker 1: I mean, if you wait for a pullback and then 45 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:38,160 Speaker 1: you go into China, do you want to look at Taiwan? 46 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:39,639 Speaker 1: Do you want to look at South Korea at the 47 00:02:39,680 --> 00:02:40,280 Speaker 1: same time. 48 00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 4: I think those are all interesting ways that you can 49 00:02:44,240 --> 00:02:48,520 Speaker 4: also play this. I think that the most the clearest 50 00:02:48,600 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 4: path for us is to just look directly at these 51 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:56,360 Speaker 4: Chinese ets that you can participate in through I Shares 52 00:02:56,440 --> 00:03:00,240 Speaker 4: has an MSCI China ETF, Invesco has a goal and 53 00:03:00,280 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 4: Dragon ETF, and that provides great exposure to the trends 54 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:06,560 Speaker 4: that are going in in China. And we think that 55 00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 4: direct investment, directly investing in that theme, I should say, 56 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:13,640 Speaker 4: through those ETFs is the is the kind of the cleanest. 57 00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:13,760 Speaker 3: Way to go. 58 00:03:14,639 --> 00:03:17,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, just to put some numbers on the comment that 59 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:21,000 Speaker 2: you made earlier about even though we've had this completely 60 00:03:21,080 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 2: crazy rebound that these benchmarks are still way short. The 61 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:28,359 Speaker 2: Hangksing Index did gain thirty two percent, you know, since 62 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 2: September eleventh, but it's still about thirty three percent below 63 00:03:32,440 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 2: it's high in twenty twenty one. Most markets around the 64 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:36,960 Speaker 2: world are higher now than where they were in twenty 65 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:40,040 Speaker 2: twenty one, yet the Hangksing index is down by a third. 66 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:43,000 Speaker 2: But if you believe in the structural impediments in China, 67 00:03:43,520 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 2: then I guess the greater fool theory kicks in here, 68 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 2: where you buy now and sell later to a greater fool. 69 00:03:49,880 --> 00:03:53,720 Speaker 2: I know that sounds harsh. Markets markets, markets can be cool. 70 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:57,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, I hope I'm not the fool in that analogy. 71 00:03:57,520 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 3: I'm not really sure. 72 00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 4: Was or not, which is probably means I am. And 73 00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 4: I do think that you're putting out it is not 74 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:08,320 Speaker 4: a risk free trade. And whenever you see the kind 75 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 4: of nosebleed rally that we've seen in such a brief 76 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:14,160 Speaker 4: amount of time, I mean you could easily look at 77 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 4: the chart and be shocked, and look at technical indicators 78 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 4: as we mentioned of RSI and be shocked. And those 79 00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:25,120 Speaker 4: are definitely reasons to give pause. And I do think that, 80 00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:27,240 Speaker 4: as you you know, there's a number of risks that 81 00:04:27,279 --> 00:04:31,720 Speaker 4: are still out there. I mean, if Trump takes the office, 82 00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:34,799 Speaker 4: he's floated the possibility of very high tariffs on Chinese 83 00:04:34,839 --> 00:04:38,920 Speaker 4: products that could potentially decimate Asian economies. They're really looking 84 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 4: at this as a zero sum game with the US 85 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 4: and the Harris ticket is very similar. They have the 86 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:48,280 Speaker 4: same assertive policies. The Biden administration is kept a lot 87 00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:50,160 Speaker 4: of the Trump tariffs. They need an added to them 88 00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:52,880 Speaker 4: in some cases. So there's certainly risks, and you know 89 00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 4: these stiminus measures might not work. So to just you know, 90 00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:59,720 Speaker 4: buy because you're worried about missing out and hope that 91 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:02,479 Speaker 4: there's fool down the road. You know that's that's not 92 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:02,760 Speaker 4: going to. 93 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:04,839 Speaker 1: Work, or you buy because you've been short at the market. 94 00:05:04,839 --> 00:05:07,280 Speaker 1: You have no choice at this point. Let's talk a 95 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 1: little bit about what you're seeing here in the US. 96 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:12,880 Speaker 1: I mean data today from ADP that was surprisingly strong 97 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:16,680 Speaker 1: the market automatically. The knee jerk response is, hey, we're 98 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 1: not going to get a super sized rate cut at 99 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,760 Speaker 1: the November meeting. Where are you on Fed policy between 100 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:22,919 Speaker 1: now and the end of the year. 101 00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:26,240 Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, I mean, there's what I think is going 102 00:05:26,320 --> 00:05:28,000 Speaker 4: to happen and what I think should happen. 103 00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:31,479 Speaker 3: So you know what I think. I thought that the 104 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:33,279 Speaker 3: Fed could have cut and should. 105 00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:37,800 Speaker 4: Have cut much sooner and much more quickly than they have. So, 106 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:40,800 Speaker 4: you know, we finally got fifty basis points a couple 107 00:05:40,880 --> 00:05:43,560 Speaker 4: of weeks ago and that was good, except that now 108 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:47,320 Speaker 4: we're starting to see these risks on the inflation side 109 00:05:47,320 --> 00:05:50,960 Speaker 4: of things. I think this escalating conflict in the Middle 110 00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 4: East that you were talking about earlier in the show 111 00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:55,240 Speaker 4: is a real risk for inflation. 112 00:05:56,320 --> 00:06:00,120 Speaker 3: This port strike which is just started up in that 113 00:06:00,200 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 3: East coast and on the golf on the Gulf coast. 114 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:06,240 Speaker 4: That it can be a real risk to inflation. And 115 00:06:06,320 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 4: so I think even with those those things happening and 116 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:13,719 Speaker 4: risk of inflation to the upside, I still think there's 117 00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:15,960 Speaker 4: a very good chance that the FED cuts and you know, 118 00:06:16,040 --> 00:06:18,320 Speaker 4: then you's then you've really got a bit of a mess. 119 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:22,240 Speaker 2: I'm curious what you think about public markets versus private market. 120 00:06:22,279 --> 00:06:25,360 Speaker 2: It's very interesting interview that Mark Rowan gave to Bloomberg, 121 00:06:25,680 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 2: the CEO of Apollo, and he's talking about how you 122 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:32,560 Speaker 2: know banks are levered twelve to one, and you know 123 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 2: private sector companies have low, if any leverage, and that 124 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:39,520 Speaker 2: you know, Paula's in this business. So he's talking in 125 00:06:39,520 --> 00:06:42,080 Speaker 2: his own book to a certain degree. But are you 126 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:45,400 Speaker 2: are you wary of private markets for both private credit 127 00:06:45,440 --> 00:06:47,160 Speaker 2: and private equity or are you game. 128 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 4: Well, I think for our for our clients, hole we 129 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:54,919 Speaker 4: focus exclusively on daily liquidity, so we're always in the 130 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 4: public markets, and there's there's often different things going on 131 00:06:58,480 --> 00:07:00,920 Speaker 4: in both of those markets, but are not as easily 132 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:05,279 Speaker 4: investible themes for most for most people and certainly for 133 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:07,839 Speaker 4: our client So our focus is primarily on the public 134 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 4: market to the debt side as well as the equity side. 135 00:07:12,240 --> 00:07:16,040 Speaker 2: Terry Spath, founder and CIO of Zooma Wealth and you 136 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:18,760 Speaker 2: can also catch some comments that she made on Bloomberg 137 00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 2: Television earlier. 138 00:07:27,760 --> 00:07:30,600 Speaker 1: Onto one of our top stories, open Ai completing a 139 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:33,920 Speaker 1: deal today to raise six point six billion dollars in 140 00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 1: new funding. Let's bring in Bloomberg's Katie Roof. She covers 141 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:41,560 Speaker 1: the venture capital Space Force, and she joins us from 142 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 1: Los Angeles. Thanks for making time, Katie. From what I understand, 143 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:48,120 Speaker 1: we're talking about evaluation now of around one hundred and 144 00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:51,160 Speaker 1: fifty seven billion dollars. How do we get at that valuation? 145 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 5: Yeah, that's right. So it's one hundred and fifty billion 146 00:07:55,880 --> 00:08:00,120 Speaker 5: pre money valuation, meaning prior to the investment, and so 147 00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:02,680 Speaker 5: the one fifty seven is when you add in the 148 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:05,600 Speaker 5: size of the round, which is above six and a 149 00:08:05,640 --> 00:08:09,920 Speaker 5: half billion, and so all in the company now is 150 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:12,160 Speaker 5: a total value of one hundred and fifty seven billion, 151 00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 5: and you know, just earlier this year it was eighty 152 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:17,800 Speaker 5: six billion, so a pretty big jump, Katie. 153 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:20,640 Speaker 2: What will they do with the six point six billion 154 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:25,120 Speaker 2: dollars that they've raised besides spy and video chips. 155 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:28,240 Speaker 5: Right, I mean, certainly it's going to be used for 156 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 5: a bit of R and D. You know, it's it's 157 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:35,160 Speaker 5: a capital intensive business building this AI technology, and it's 158 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:38,720 Speaker 5: become a very competitive landscape. You know, there's other highly 159 00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 5: valued companies in Silicon Valley like Anthropic and cohere, and 160 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:49,000 Speaker 5: you know they need to keep investing in their technology 161 00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:52,520 Speaker 5: to make sure that they are ahead. You also have 162 00:08:52,559 --> 00:08:57,000 Speaker 5: Elon Musk, which recently raised sixty six billion for his 163 00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:01,240 Speaker 5: own AI company, Xai, and so know they've got a 164 00:09:01,280 --> 00:09:02,119 Speaker 5: lot of competition. 165 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:05,960 Speaker 1: Boy, but there's been a lot of upheaval. I think 166 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:08,960 Speaker 1: it's fair to say in the c suite. Mirror Maradi, 167 00:09:09,040 --> 00:09:12,679 Speaker 1: who was the chief technology officer, recently stepped away from 168 00:09:12,679 --> 00:09:15,200 Speaker 1: the company at around the time that we were hearing 169 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:20,200 Speaker 1: that the structure from kind of nonprofit status to for 170 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:23,160 Speaker 1: profit it's kind of complicated. Maybe you can help me 171 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:26,679 Speaker 1: understand that to some extent, but I'm surprised that there 172 00:09:26,760 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 1: is this level of enthusiasm for what may be I 173 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:34,559 Speaker 1: don't want to say questionable in terms of leadership going forward, 174 00:09:34,640 --> 00:09:38,160 Speaker 1: but there are a number of questions around the core 175 00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:39,760 Speaker 1: group of people who are here right. 176 00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:44,200 Speaker 5: Yes, certainly there are some questions about the direction of 177 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 5: the company. They've obviously had a lot of departures and 178 00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 5: a lot of executive drama. But you know, there's people 179 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:53,320 Speaker 5: who are big believers in Sam Altman. I've talked to 180 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 5: investors who say, you know, they're okay with some of 181 00:09:57,440 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 5: these other departures, that it's Sam that's the key person 182 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:01,679 Speaker 5: for them. 183 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:05,199 Speaker 2: There was this question raised by the ft about open 184 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:12,240 Speaker 2: Ai demanding or requesting exclusivity agreements from these investors. In 185 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:15,600 Speaker 2: our own reporting, we say that they simply discouraged investors 186 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,600 Speaker 2: and there was no actual agreement on it. Can you 187 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 2: shed any light on this because you're talking about some 188 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:25,400 Speaker 2: really big besides Thrive Capital and Microsoft, Causal, a venture's fidelity, 189 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:28,839 Speaker 2: some really big investors. How much teeth is there in 190 00:10:28,880 --> 00:10:31,080 Speaker 2: this request for exclusivity? 191 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:34,319 Speaker 5: Yeah, and so a lot of times this happens to 192 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 5: a certain degree with private companies where venture capitalists, you know, 193 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 5: kind of pick a team. And so we saw this 194 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:45,559 Speaker 5: actually already with open ai existing investors Sequoia Capital and 195 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:49,679 Speaker 5: Andres and Horowitz. They're not participating in this round because 196 00:10:50,640 --> 00:10:54,440 Speaker 5: it could be seen as because they invested in Ilia 197 00:10:54,640 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 5: Sutskovar's Safe Superintelligence. Now, Ilia was one of the form 198 00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:03,760 Speaker 5: board members of open Ai who departed recently, and so 199 00:11:04,640 --> 00:11:08,080 Speaker 5: it does seem like there's starting to be an emerging 200 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:11,760 Speaker 5: pattern here where even if you were an open end investor, 201 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:14,280 Speaker 5: if you've gone to Ilia, doesn't seem like you're in 202 00:11:14,280 --> 00:11:14,800 Speaker 5: this round. 203 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:17,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, that was a shocking departure that happened to wild 204 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:20,520 Speaker 1: Back talk to us about what it means that Apple 205 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:22,120 Speaker 1: didn't participate in this deal. 206 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:25,960 Speaker 5: You know, it's hard to say why they chose not 207 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:29,600 Speaker 5: to invest. I mean, they had been in discussions. We 208 00:11:29,679 --> 00:11:32,079 Speaker 5: don't know if they will invest at some point down 209 00:11:32,120 --> 00:11:35,520 Speaker 5: the road or what the reason was. But they still 210 00:11:35,559 --> 00:11:39,280 Speaker 5: do have strategic investments. You know, Microsoft has been a 211 00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:42,160 Speaker 5: continued investor in them, and then in Nvidia joined this 212 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 5: round as well. 213 00:11:44,080 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 2: I was kind of half joking about the Nvidia question 214 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:49,080 Speaker 2: about buying all those chips, but there are some investors 215 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:50,840 Speaker 2: out there that are saying. The way I would play 216 00:11:50,880 --> 00:11:55,600 Speaker 2: this is actually to invest more in Nvidia. We still 217 00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:57,640 Speaker 2: have a lot of questions about AI, not only on 218 00:11:57,679 --> 00:11:59,719 Speaker 2: the security side, but also on whether or not it 219 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 2: really does eventually get to productivity. What do you hear 220 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 2: from investors they think this is going to be a 221 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:09,000 Speaker 2: big boon in productivity or not so much. 222 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:13,000 Speaker 5: You know, I was in Silicon Valley last week at 223 00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:16,320 Speaker 5: the Y Combinator demo day, and there was not a 224 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:19,520 Speaker 5: single investor who seemed to care about anything other than AI. 225 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:23,000 Speaker 5: Everyone just feels like this is, you know, the future 226 00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:26,480 Speaker 5: of technology and that any business, no matter what their 227 00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:30,680 Speaker 5: core business is, it's going to incorporate artificial intelligence in 228 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:31,400 Speaker 5: a major way. 229 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:34,760 Speaker 1: That said, is anybody concerned about a level of maybe 230 00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:37,199 Speaker 1: a hype. We had a very interesting piece on the 231 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:42,720 Speaker 1: Bloomberg today quoting an MIT professor of economics, Darren Ausimoglu. 232 00:12:43,160 --> 00:12:46,440 Speaker 1: He was saying, yes, AI may be promising. There's a 233 00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:48,319 Speaker 1: little chance though it's going to live up to its 234 00:12:48,360 --> 00:12:52,200 Speaker 1: hype and by his calculation, only a small percentage of 235 00:12:52,240 --> 00:12:55,280 Speaker 1: all jobs and I think his figure was merely five percent. 236 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:59,080 Speaker 1: Is ripe to be taken over or at least heavily 237 00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:02,120 Speaker 1: aided by AI over the next decade. So there are 238 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:04,360 Speaker 1: a lot of skeptics out there as well. 239 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:08,439 Speaker 5: Yeah, absolutely, and there are people that are concerned from 240 00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:11,760 Speaker 5: an ethical perspective, you know, as you mentioned earlier. But 241 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:14,640 Speaker 5: you know, in terms of job displacement, I think, you know, 242 00:13:14,679 --> 00:13:17,040 Speaker 5: even the investors who believe in AI are well aware 243 00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:20,320 Speaker 5: that this is going to be something that happens, but 244 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:24,080 Speaker 5: they view it as more of an inevitability. They see 245 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:28,600 Speaker 5: it as you know, technology is going to continue to 246 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:32,840 Speaker 5: develop and that you know, some jobs may become more 247 00:13:32,920 --> 00:13:37,720 Speaker 5: efficient because they you know, are no longer you know, 248 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:41,400 Speaker 5: doing data entry and some of these other technology types 249 00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:45,000 Speaker 5: of tasks that the technology can handle for them. But yes, 250 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:48,560 Speaker 5: certainly there's going to be you know a lot of 251 00:13:48,679 --> 00:13:51,320 Speaker 5: changes to a lot of jobs, and some of it 252 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 5: will be positive and some of it will be negative. 253 00:13:53,320 --> 00:13:55,199 Speaker 1: All Right, we'll leave it there, Katie, good stuff, Thank 254 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:56,760 Speaker 1: you so much for making time to chat with us. 255 00:13:56,800 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 1: Katie roof Bloomberg Venture Capital reporter joining us from Los 256 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:03,320 Speaker 1: Angeles today as we take a closer look at this 257 00:14:03,440 --> 00:14:07,320 Speaker 1: big funding round for open Ai, the company completing a 258 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:10,680 Speaker 1: deal to raise six point six billion in new funding. 259 00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:23,120 Speaker 2: Charles Stewart, the third Distinguished Professor of Political Science at MIT. Professor, 260 00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:26,600 Speaker 2: thank you very much for joining us here on Bloomberg Daybreak, Asia. 261 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:28,640 Speaker 2: I see in your notes that you say that vice 262 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 2: presidential debates don't really move the needle much in general 263 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:36,280 Speaker 2: on elections. So what would the impact of this one 264 00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:36,640 Speaker 2: have been? 265 00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 6: Well, I think a couple of things. One about this 266 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 6: election maybe, and then but more importantly, maybe about the future. 267 00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:48,760 Speaker 6: About this election, I think you know, the debate was 268 00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:53,120 Speaker 6: helped to establish the characters a bit. It helped to 269 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:58,200 Speaker 6: establish Walls as kind of Minnesota nice and every man, 270 00:14:58,480 --> 00:15:01,119 Speaker 6: maybe a little bit out of his league, but nonetheless 271 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:06,800 Speaker 6: a decent guy. For Vance, it established him as smart 272 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 6: and perhaps not quite the kind of boogeyman that the 273 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:14,880 Speaker 6: Democrats have bade him out to be. So that might 274 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:19,000 Speaker 6: change how people perceive those candidates, but probably won't move 275 00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:22,480 Speaker 6: certainly will not move the needle in the elections of 276 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,440 Speaker 6: their principles. I think probably the most important will be 277 00:15:26,160 --> 00:15:28,920 Speaker 6: how these candidates fare for the future, for the twenty 278 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:32,480 Speaker 6: twenty eight or thirty two election. Where for on the 279 00:15:32,560 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 6: Van side, I think the outcome is that he showed 280 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:37,880 Speaker 6: himself to be kind of up to the task of 281 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:46,200 Speaker 6: take of justifying Donald Trump's positions and has set himself 282 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:50,760 Speaker 6: up really as certainly an heir to his movement, and 283 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:53,960 Speaker 6: so people like Ron DeSantis in Florida have to be 284 00:15:54,120 --> 00:15:56,720 Speaker 6: now kind of worried about what it's going to look 285 00:15:56,800 --> 00:16:00,200 Speaker 6: like in twenty eight whereas on the other hand, and 286 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:02,920 Speaker 6: Wals didn't seem to have kind of the fire in 287 00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:07,520 Speaker 6: the belly that Vans or most successful presidential candidates have. 288 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:12,120 Speaker 6: And so you know, I suspect the Democratic candidates and waiting, 289 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:13,880 Speaker 6: we are breathing a sigh of relief. 290 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:16,760 Speaker 1: The tone was pretty surprising to me. I mean, a 291 00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:19,840 Speaker 1: level of civility and a lot more focus on policy 292 00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:23,200 Speaker 1: and a fair amount of agreement between the two. Did 293 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 1: that surprise you at all? 294 00:16:25,640 --> 00:16:27,720 Speaker 6: You know it did, But you know, maybe we're just 295 00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:30,520 Speaker 6: kind of red. We're kind of used to the new normal. 296 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:32,920 Speaker 6: I was, you know, talking to my students today about 297 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:36,240 Speaker 6: this and how this debate was kind of similar to 298 00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:40,440 Speaker 6: every debate that we've seen before, certainly you know, twenty 299 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:44,600 Speaker 6: twelve and before, and so you know, maybe there is 300 00:16:44,640 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 6: something about, you know, the particular person of Donald Trump 301 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 6: that has led to a certain type of debate, but 302 00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:54,920 Speaker 6: that you know, candidates can be civil toward each other 303 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:56,920 Speaker 6: when when they're not Donald Trump. 304 00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:01,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a there's an elector out there that doesn't 305 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 2: really want a nice guy in the office. Now, of 306 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:07,879 Speaker 2: course we're talking about vice president instead of president. But 307 00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:13,000 Speaker 2: I remember talking to some very very intelligent Republican voters 308 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 2: who said they want somebody who's going to shake things up. 309 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 2: So when you look at what we got from the 310 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:22,560 Speaker 2: Minnesota governor about you know, sort of striking that image 311 00:17:22,640 --> 00:17:25,879 Speaker 2: as an every man and a nice guy. Uh, is 312 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:28,880 Speaker 2: that what what voters on the Republican side? I mean, 313 00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:30,119 Speaker 2: is it easy to reject that? 314 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,360 Speaker 6: Well? I think you know, all these both of these 315 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:36,200 Speaker 6: candidates are appealing to their base, but also they need 316 00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:39,159 Speaker 6: to appeal to the middle in order to win election. 317 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:45,080 Speaker 6: That's always the you know, always the tension in a campaign. 318 00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:48,840 Speaker 6: And so even though you know, the brand right now 319 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:52,520 Speaker 6: for Trump and for Vans is really kind of digging 320 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:58,200 Speaker 6: in and you know, being aggressive, you have to appeal 321 00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:01,800 Speaker 6: to people who don't quite like the aggression. And so 322 00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:06,399 Speaker 6: I think that's the balancing act certainly that Vance was 323 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:08,760 Speaker 6: trying to play last night. It seems to me that 324 00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:12,920 Speaker 6: that would be the most consistent thing to make sense 325 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:14,960 Speaker 6: of it is that you know, he's trying to appeal 326 00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:19,080 Speaker 6: to the so called you know, soccer mom's suburban housewives, 327 00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:21,760 Speaker 6: that he knows he's going to have to get a 328 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 6: few of those in order to win the election. 329 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:28,680 Speaker 1: How would you evaluate how the moderators performed and at 330 00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:30,679 Speaker 1: one point what appeared to be a little bit of 331 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:33,200 Speaker 1: fact checking? Did they do a good job. 332 00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:36,400 Speaker 6: Only a little bit of fact checking? You know, I 333 00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:39,840 Speaker 6: you know, they were not as aggressive on fact checking 334 00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:45,200 Speaker 6: as certainly the ABC moderators were a couple of weeks ago. 335 00:18:45,359 --> 00:18:47,640 Speaker 6: But there's a fair argument to be made that it's 336 00:18:47,720 --> 00:18:50,639 Speaker 6: up to the candidates to do the fact checking. I mean, 337 00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 6: I think that a lot of the electorate would liked 338 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 6: the moderators to do the fact checker because they believe 339 00:18:56,320 --> 00:18:58,359 Speaker 6: the moderators can kind of go for the jug eater. 340 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:02,400 Speaker 6: But you know, the election is not about the moderators. 341 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:05,760 Speaker 6: The election is about the candidates. And I think it's 342 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:09,439 Speaker 6: a fair argument to be made that if one of 343 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:15,840 Speaker 6: the candidates is misrepresenting or lying, then what we should 344 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:18,720 Speaker 6: be seeing is the to the other candidate calling them 345 00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:21,879 Speaker 6: on it. And so if there wasn't heavy fact checking yesterday. 346 00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 6: You know, it could be as much on the candidates, 347 00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:27,840 Speaker 6: and I think particularly on on Waltz as it is 348 00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:28,840 Speaker 6: on the moderators. 349 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 2: Was there anything particularly substantive in the comments about a 350 00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:35,960 Speaker 2: foreign policy from from the two. 351 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:40,120 Speaker 6: You know, that was interesting because yesterday, certainly the top 352 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:42,440 Speaker 6: of the news was about foreign policy in the Middle East, 353 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:45,680 Speaker 6: and so it was understandable that the debate began there. 354 00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:52,560 Speaker 6: It struck me that both both Fans and Waltz, you know, 355 00:19:52,680 --> 00:19:58,000 Speaker 6: kind of laid out firm positions for America's place in 356 00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:01,840 Speaker 6: the role in the Middle East. U They both kind 357 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:08,159 Speaker 6: of set up, i would say, again on brand explanations 358 00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:10,600 Speaker 6: for what their parties would do. Donald Trump would be 359 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:14,360 Speaker 6: mean and would get the rest of the world to 360 00:20:14,359 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 6: toe the line. The Democrats will work with their allies, 361 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:22,320 Speaker 6: to with our allies to deal with the tough issues 362 00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:24,720 Speaker 6: around the world. So I think, with respect the tone, 363 00:20:25,400 --> 00:20:29,600 Speaker 6: the two candidates, you know, kind of set the stage 364 00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:33,600 Speaker 6: to really display their party's brands. But I don't think 365 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:38,040 Speaker 6: there was anything new last night, No headlines about developments 366 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:39,520 Speaker 6: on foreign policy, for sure. 367 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:43,440 Speaker 2: Professor thank you for joining us here on the program. 368 00:20:43,600 --> 00:20:48,560 Speaker 2: Professor Charles Stewart, the third Distinguished Professor of Political Science, said, mit. 369 00:20:50,080 --> 00:20:53,040 Speaker 1: This has been the Bloomberg Daybreak Asia podcast, bringing you 370 00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:56,200 Speaker 1: the stories making news and moving markets in the Asia Pacific. 371 00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:59,679 Speaker 1: Visit the Bloomberg Podcast channel on YouTube to get more 372 00:20:59,720 --> 00:21:03,359 Speaker 1: apt episodes of this and other shows from Bloomberg. 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