1
00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:10,119
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the

2
00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:13,880
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at

3
00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:17,560
Speaker 1: noon and five pm Eastern on Applecarcklay and Android Auto

4
00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:20,680
Speaker 1: with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever you

5
00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:24,640
Speaker 1: get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.

6
00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:27,680
Speaker 2: Thanks for being with us on Bloomberg TV and radio.

7
00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:31,160
Speaker 3: Streaming live on YouTube and on your satellite radio at

8
00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:35,839
Speaker 3: channel one twenty one. With big questions about healthcare and

9
00:00:35,880 --> 00:00:38,599
Speaker 3: what will happen at the end of this month with

10
00:00:38,800 --> 00:00:42,159
Speaker 3: enhanced COVID era Obamacare subsidies that you hear us talk

11
00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:45,040
Speaker 3: about every day set to expire, we do have a

12
00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:48,440
Speaker 3: bit of a status update. A lot happened yesterday and

13
00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:50,280
Speaker 3: you heard much of it take place here in real

14
00:00:50,320 --> 00:00:52,960
Speaker 3: time on Bloomberg. We spoke with Mike Lawler just a

15
00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:55,880
Speaker 3: short time after he and three other moderate Republicans crossed

16
00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:58,600
Speaker 3: the Aisle to sign a discharge petition that would force

17
00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:02,280
Speaker 3: a vote on a three year extension, a clean extension.

18
00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:06,720
Speaker 3: This is the Hakim Jeffreys discharge petition, and so that

19
00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,880
Speaker 3: was a pretty big deal that they walked across.

20
00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:11,200
Speaker 2: The aisle on this. But there is more.

21
00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:15,600
Speaker 3: You know, the House Republican leadership also had its own bill.

22
00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:17,920
Speaker 2: It emerged Friday night. We've talked about this as well.

23
00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:21,240
Speaker 3: It does not extend Obamacare subsidies, but it did pass

24
00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:24,240
Speaker 3: on a party line vote two sixteen, two eleven while

25
00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:27,440
Speaker 3: you were out at the holiday party last night. So

26
00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,200
Speaker 3: what's going on here? Is it possible to avoid the cliff?

27
00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:33,200
Speaker 3: Senate's getting ready to go? Even if these things pass now,

28
00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:36,039
Speaker 3: you can't do anything about it till January. Right, That's well,

29
00:01:36,040 --> 00:01:39,959
Speaker 3: the discharge petition would see action on the floor either way.

30
00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:42,840
Speaker 3: Hakim Jeffreys, the Democratic leader in the House, thinks everybody

31
00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:44,160
Speaker 3: ought to stay until it's done.

32
00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:48,880
Speaker 4: Here's what he said, under no circumstances, So the House

33
00:01:48,920 --> 00:01:54,440
Speaker 4: of Representatives adjourn until we successfully extend the Affordable Care

34
00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:57,160
Speaker 4: RAC tax credits for tens of millions of Americans.

35
00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:01,600
Speaker 2: People deserve a vote today.

36
00:02:02,200 --> 00:02:09,240
Speaker 4: Not tomorrow, not next week, not next year today.

37
00:02:09,520 --> 00:02:13,840
Speaker 3: Of course, that would require a Christmas miracle. And that

38
00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:16,880
Speaker 3: discharge petition I mentioned, that's seven legislative days before it

39
00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:19,880
Speaker 3: hits the floor. That brings us likely well into January.

40
00:02:20,440 --> 00:02:23,320
Speaker 3: So let's figure out the path forward here and exactly

41
00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:24,960
Speaker 3: how we're going to fund the government past the end

42
00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:28,080
Speaker 3: of the month in January, will there in fact be

43
00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:31,040
Speaker 3: regular order? Jody Errington is with us right now live

44
00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:34,400
Speaker 3: from Capitol Hill, the Republican congressman who chairs the House

45
00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:38,079
Speaker 3: Budget Committee, the Voice of Texas, with us on Bloomberg

46
00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:40,360
Speaker 3: TV and Radio. Mister chairman, welcome back. It's great to

47
00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:42,520
Speaker 3: have you on Bloomberg. And I'm wondering what you see

48
00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:46,000
Speaker 3: here with it what seems like a dozen different bills

49
00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:50,240
Speaker 3: to attack healthcare reform or extend subsidies to some extent.

50
00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:53,040
Speaker 3: Is there any chance of a deal coming together between

51
00:02:53,080 --> 00:02:54,200
Speaker 3: now and the end of the month.

52
00:02:55,480 --> 00:02:57,120
Speaker 5: Not one that's going to become law.

53
00:02:57,320 --> 00:03:03,480
Speaker 6: Joe, let me start by saying Democrats created this additional

54
00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:09,440
Speaker 6: layer of COVID or Obamacare subsidy during COVID, and then

55
00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,799
Speaker 6: they extended it for another two years, so they had

56
00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:15,679
Speaker 6: total control of Congress, they had the White House. They

57
00:03:15,680 --> 00:03:18,799
Speaker 6: didn't extend it. Then they didn't make it permanent. They

58
00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:23,239
Speaker 6: did make the green energy tax subsidies for corporations permanent,

59
00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:26,480
Speaker 6: so they had a choice. So these are expiring as designed,

60
00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:30,320
Speaker 6: just like every other COVID program has wound down.

61
00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:32,520
Speaker 5: As COVID is behind US.

62
00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:36,480
Speaker 6: So the other piece that is important is the COVID

63
00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:41,800
Speaker 6: subsidies and the underlying program. Obamacare has increased deductibles and

64
00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:44,080
Speaker 6: premiums every year, so the question should be how do

65
00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:46,080
Speaker 6: we make healthcare affordable?

66
00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:48,040
Speaker 5: And at least the bill that was.

67
00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:50,320
Speaker 6: Passed I don't think it will become law, but the

68
00:03:50,360 --> 00:03:53,640
Speaker 6: Republicans passed out of the House last night will reduce

69
00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:57,920
Speaker 6: premiums according to CBO, by eleven percent, save thirty billion dollars.

70
00:03:58,320 --> 00:04:00,200
Speaker 6: Those are the things we need to be working looking

71
00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:03,240
Speaker 6: together on, not throwing good money after bad.

72
00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:04,960
Speaker 5: And propping up a failed system.

73
00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:07,840
Speaker 3: Well, you know, Congressman, we've even had some Democrats on

74
00:04:07,880 --> 00:04:10,560
Speaker 3: the air here who say, you're right, this is a

75
00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:13,840
Speaker 3: program that needs reform, but we also need a bridge,

76
00:04:13,880 --> 00:04:16,479
Speaker 3: whether it's a year or two, whatever the extension needs

77
00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:18,920
Speaker 3: to be so people don't get bit when they wake

78
00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:21,760
Speaker 3: up the first morning in January with what I realize

79
00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:24,479
Speaker 3: are already higher premiums. But you've got open enrollment that

80
00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:26,360
Speaker 3: goes to the fifteenth. Is there a world in which

81
00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:29,479
Speaker 3: that could be extended and a shock absorber essentially could

82
00:04:29,480 --> 00:04:29,960
Speaker 3: be put on.

83
00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:33,239
Speaker 5: You know, I don't believe.

84
00:04:33,279 --> 00:04:33,359
Speaker 7: So.

85
00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:34,920
Speaker 5: Joe and I got to tell you.

86
00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:39,960
Speaker 6: My position is, we already have tax subsidies built into

87
00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:45,479
Speaker 6: Obamacare that effectively subsidized people at the bronze level at

88
00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:49,599
Speaker 6: ninety percent of their premiums. So that's the subsidy that

89
00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:53,520
Speaker 6: taxpayers front at about sixty to seventy billion a year.

90
00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:56,479
Speaker 6: Now that's that cost is doubled when you add these

91
00:04:56,520 --> 00:04:58,039
Speaker 6: COVID era subsidies.

92
00:04:58,200 --> 00:04:59,400
Speaker 5: So you would have to do a lot.

93
00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:02,479
Speaker 6: The Democrats haven't included any of these things, but you'd

94
00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:04,640
Speaker 6: have to put an income cap so you're not subsidizing

95
00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:08,160
Speaker 6: wealthy people. You've seen the CBO reports and the GAO

96
00:05:08,240 --> 00:05:11,440
Speaker 6: reports about the tens of billions of fraud, the millions

97
00:05:11,440 --> 00:05:15,600
Speaker 6: of ineligible people. So I understand some of my colleagues

98
00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:19,640
Speaker 6: wanting a bridge, But the point is we're well beyond COVID.

99
00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:22,840
Speaker 5: They design these things to wind down and go away.

100
00:05:23,440 --> 00:05:26,240
Speaker 6: We should focus on the things like we did in

101
00:05:26,279 --> 00:05:29,840
Speaker 6: the last night's bill, closed the loophole that allows insurance

102
00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:33,800
Speaker 6: companies to actually direct people to higher cost coverage plans

103
00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:36,400
Speaker 6: that they don't want or need, and that will start

104
00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:39,760
Speaker 6: reducing the premiums and the cost of care. And there

105
00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:42,080
Speaker 6: are plenty of other ways to do it, many of

106
00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:47,080
Speaker 6: which Joe are bipartisan. So I think we throw plenty

107
00:05:47,080 --> 00:05:52,240
Speaker 6: of subsidy. Unfortunately, we're throwing the subsidy at the wrong place.

108
00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:55,799
Speaker 6: It's to the insurance company and not to the individual

109
00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:58,839
Speaker 6: and family. So we should work together to make ACA

110
00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:02,880
Speaker 6: actually affordable, the private market affordable, and bring costs down

111
00:06:02,880 --> 00:06:03,480
Speaker 6: all together.

112
00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:07,600
Speaker 3: You saw the Republican bill in the Senate, inspired by

113
00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:11,960
Speaker 3: Senator Bill Cassidy, that features health savings accounts. Mister Chairman,

114
00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:13,960
Speaker 3: is that an idea that we should be considering in

115
00:06:14,000 --> 00:06:14,359
Speaker 3: the House.

116
00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:20,400
Speaker 6: Absolutely. We actually put we expanded health savings accounts in

117
00:06:20,520 --> 00:06:23,800
Speaker 6: the big beautiful bill that passed. We should do more

118
00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:27,960
Speaker 6: again to provide federal assistance two people. Let them keep

119
00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:30,360
Speaker 6: more of their money to provide health care for their

120
00:06:30,360 --> 00:06:33,400
Speaker 6: families and not line the pockets of insurance companies. They're

121
00:06:33,440 --> 00:06:36,279
Speaker 6: the only ones that have actually done well since the

122
00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:41,360
Speaker 6: advent of Obamacare. So there's the health reimbursement accounts. It's

123
00:06:41,400 --> 00:06:47,280
Speaker 6: similar where small businesses can provide these health savings accounts

124
00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:50,360
Speaker 6: for their employees. There are things that we're doing now

125
00:06:50,400 --> 00:06:54,719
Speaker 6: they're just plain ridiculous. We're paying hospitals more for the

126
00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:59,200
Speaker 6: same outpatient procedures that we pay physician groups to do.

127
00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:03,000
Speaker 6: If we equalize those payments, by the way, the outcomes

128
00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:05,480
Speaker 6: are the same. If we equalize those payments, we'd save

129
00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:08,120
Speaker 6: one hundred and fifty billion dollars and we'd stop this

130
00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:14,800
Speaker 6: consolidation of physicians in one big hospital, big hospital, big insurance,

131
00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:19,360
Speaker 6: big pharma. These monopoly forces are making the markets not

132
00:07:19,600 --> 00:07:23,520
Speaker 6: competitive and they are not giving the choices to the

133
00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:28,040
Speaker 6: consumer and patience, and that is at the crux of it.

134
00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:32,600
Speaker 6: That's what's the problem is too many mandates, too many loopholes,

135
00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:35,760
Speaker 6: too many regulations, too many taxes. We got to clean

136
00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:38,680
Speaker 6: it up and let competitive markets do what they do best,

137
00:07:38,720 --> 00:07:41,840
Speaker 6: and that's providing the best quality at the best cost

138
00:07:42,200 --> 00:07:44,680
Speaker 6: for a product for consumers.

139
00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:49,600
Speaker 3: You're the chairman of the Budget Committee, of course, Congressman,

140
00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:51,400
Speaker 3: what are we in for here when you.

141
00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:52,480
Speaker 2: Come back in January?

142
00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:55,680
Speaker 3: Because there seems to be a little bit louder talk,

143
00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:58,200
Speaker 3: and I realized Chuck Schumer was very clear he doesn't

144
00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:02,080
Speaker 3: want a government shutdown, but there's talk about sleepwalking into

145
00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:04,920
Speaker 3: a shutdown again with a lack of trust between Democrats

146
00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:05,840
Speaker 3: and Republicans.

147
00:08:06,360 --> 00:08:07,480
Speaker 2: Maybe we want to park that.

148
00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:09,480
Speaker 3: Over here from now because I know that you're hoping

149
00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:13,320
Speaker 3: to see regular order come back into fashion on Capitol Hill.

150
00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:15,640
Speaker 3: Do you have enough time to write a budget and

151
00:08:15,720 --> 00:08:16,120
Speaker 3: pass it?

152
00:08:17,840 --> 00:08:20,600
Speaker 6: We do, And what I would hope is that we

153
00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:26,080
Speaker 6: could actually actually use budget reconciliation again, because unfortunately, Joe,

154
00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:29,000
Speaker 6: I don't think that Democrats and Republicans are going to

155
00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:32,160
Speaker 6: be able to work together. I think many of the Democrats,

156
00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:36,360
Speaker 6: not all, but the leadership wants healthcare to be a

157
00:08:36,360 --> 00:08:39,640
Speaker 6: wedge issue for November. There are others who want to

158
00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:42,559
Speaker 6: actually address it. We have different ideas on that, but

159
00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:47,160
Speaker 6: Republicans have the tool that actually Democrats use to create

160
00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:50,719
Speaker 6: these COVID air subsidies, call budget reconciliation. It gives us

161
00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:52,959
Speaker 6: the simple majority in the Senate, so we don't need

162
00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:55,880
Speaker 6: Democrats support. We did that with the Big Beautiful Bill.

163
00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:59,640
Speaker 6: Let's do it to make health care affordable. Not just

164
00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:03,840
Speaker 6: low taxes, not just better energy policies, not just cutting

165
00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:08,640
Speaker 6: spending so we can actually reduce the pressure on the

166
00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:10,120
Speaker 6: higher prices and inflation.

167
00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:12,160
Speaker 5: Let's make healthcare affordable.

168
00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:16,000
Speaker 6: That will bring costs down, make life more affordable, cost

169
00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:18,839
Speaker 6: of living will go down, Things will get better. But

170
00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:20,840
Speaker 6: healthcare has got to be addressed, and I think the

171
00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:24,040
Speaker 6: only way to do it, Joe On unfortunately, because I

172
00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:26,400
Speaker 6: think it's better when we can work together. But we

173
00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:32,280
Speaker 6: shouldn't apologize for using reconciliation and taking a unilateral approach

174
00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:35,480
Speaker 6: as Republicans if we believe in our policies, and I

175
00:09:35,520 --> 00:09:36,240
Speaker 6: certainly do.

176
00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:38,400
Speaker 3: Well, it gives us a bit of a sense of

177
00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:40,280
Speaker 3: where we're heading in the new year. Mister chairman, it's

178
00:09:40,320 --> 00:09:41,840
Speaker 3: great to have you back, thanks for being with us.

179
00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:43,800
Speaker 3: He's Chairman of the Budget Committee in the House. Jody

180
00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:47,800
Speaker 3: Erringson of Texas on this CPI day, I know you're

181
00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:51,400
Speaker 3: having trouble following the data everyone is right now because

182
00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:55,720
Speaker 3: it's dropping at various times still because of the government shutdown,

183
00:09:55,760 --> 00:09:57,480
Speaker 3: the longest in history, and we don't even have a

184
00:09:57,480 --> 00:09:59,559
Speaker 3: complete view, not all the data we're collected.

185
00:09:59,600 --> 00:09:59,760
Speaker 5: Here.

186
00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:04,920
Speaker 3: You've got a number for November on inflation in this country.

187
00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:08,040
Speaker 3: Dare I say affordability? The President talked about it a

188
00:10:08,080 --> 00:10:09,760
Speaker 3: lot last night, and what we have here is the

189
00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:13,360
Speaker 3: headline he was hoping to read. Course CPI easing to

190
00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:18,360
Speaker 3: a four year low and shut down impacted report. First

191
00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:20,800
Speaker 3: person we wanted a call today was Liz Pancotti the

192
00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:24,360
Speaker 3: managing director of policy and Advocacy at the Groundwork Collaborative.

193
00:10:24,400 --> 00:10:27,080
Speaker 3: She's been digging through the numbers since eight thirty this

194
00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:29,680
Speaker 3: morning with us Now Live on Bloomberg TV and Radio. Liz,

195
00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:32,800
Speaker 3: it's great to see you do the numbers. When you

196
00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:35,200
Speaker 3: look under the hood, fulfill the headline.

197
00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:37,960
Speaker 8: You know, it's tough to see what we're looking at

198
00:10:38,040 --> 00:10:41,640
Speaker 8: under the hood today, given the missing data that we've

199
00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:44,800
Speaker 8: got from BLS, given the effects of the government shutdown,

200
00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:47,679
Speaker 8: it feels a little like we are flying blind.

201
00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:48,560
Speaker 9: You know.

202
00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:51,480
Speaker 8: The headline number ticked down a little bit. I assume

203
00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:53,640
Speaker 8: the President had seen that by tang he gave his

204
00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:56,360
Speaker 8: prime time speech last night. But when we look under

205
00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:58,480
Speaker 8: the hood, there is a little bit of funny business

206
00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:02,880
Speaker 8: going on. For one, the BLS imputed zeros for shelter

207
00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:07,760
Speaker 8: inflation in October, giving missing data. Unfortunately, as a result

208
00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:11,320
Speaker 8: of that and some other collection issues, we probably won't

209
00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:15,160
Speaker 8: have a really solid accurate accounting of inflation until probably

210
00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:18,680
Speaker 8: the April print as things iron out, And so I

211
00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:20,960
Speaker 8: think as the Fed looks at this head of their

212
00:11:21,040 --> 00:11:24,760
Speaker 8: January meeting, I think we're probably set to really look

213
00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:28,160
Speaker 8: at that January print for December data and potentially even

214
00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:32,600
Speaker 8: into February with that January data to see things iron out.

215
00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:34,760
Speaker 3: What worries you in here. I know the core number

216
00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:38,040
Speaker 3: impressed a lot of people. Markets are feeling pretty good

217
00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:40,479
Speaker 3: about it. We're talking about a rate cut in January,

218
00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:43,880
Speaker 3: but you're still looking at beef prices up twenty one

219
00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:48,679
Speaker 3: percent in November, coffee up nineteen percent, banana prices up

220
00:11:48,720 --> 00:11:49,440
Speaker 3: seven percent.

221
00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:51,199
Speaker 2: Real people buy this stuff, right.

222
00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:52,520
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's right.

223
00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:54,680
Speaker 8: I think, especially as we head into the holidays here,

224
00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:59,160
Speaker 8: we are really seeing grocery prices affect people. Utility bills

225
00:11:59,160 --> 00:12:01,840
Speaker 8: are up, energies up six point nine percent. I think

226
00:12:01,880 --> 00:12:04,520
Speaker 8: those pressure points in the winter are always a little

227
00:12:04,520 --> 00:12:07,520
Speaker 8: bit tougher, given you know, large holiday gatherings and high

228
00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:10,760
Speaker 8: heating bills, especially in the colder regions the Northeast and

229
00:12:10,800 --> 00:12:14,000
Speaker 8: the Midwest, those are really going to take effect on people.

230
00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:17,440
Speaker 8: At groundwork, we had analysis out just two weeks ago

231
00:12:17,520 --> 00:12:20,480
Speaker 8: that showed that popular holiday gifts are up twenty six

232
00:12:20,559 --> 00:12:23,480
Speaker 8: percent this year, given so many of those are imported

233
00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:26,320
Speaker 8: from China and tariff rates are just really high. So

234
00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:28,760
Speaker 8: while the headline number, you know, might seem a little

235
00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:32,680
Speaker 8: bit optimistic, as we look at what expectations are, you know,

236
00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:35,640
Speaker 8: the New York Feds November survey, at Conference Board Data,

237
00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:38,680
Speaker 8: University of Michigan, all of those are showing that American

238
00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:40,720
Speaker 8: families don't feel like relief is coming.

239
00:12:42,080 --> 00:12:44,600
Speaker 3: So does the market have this right about January or

240
00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:46,600
Speaker 3: does the Fed need to see more?

241
00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:48,760
Speaker 8: I think the Fed will want to see more. I

242
00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:50,839
Speaker 8: think given the missing data. You know, we'll see where

243
00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:54,560
Speaker 8: PCE comes in and what was imputed for that. But

244
00:12:54,679 --> 00:12:57,880
Speaker 8: just given the lack of data we have for October November,

245
00:12:57,960 --> 00:12:59,439
Speaker 8: I think the Fed is going to want to see

246
00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:01,079
Speaker 8: things out a little bit more.

247
00:13:01,679 --> 00:13:01,880
Speaker 6: You know.

248
00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:05,240
Speaker 8: Also, with the labor market ticking the unemployment rate ticking

249
00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:08,360
Speaker 8: up earlier this week, I think that the combination of

250
00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:10,640
Speaker 8: those things will probably see the Fed hold off in

251
00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:15,800
Speaker 8: January to get a little bit more information under our belts. Additionally,

252
00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:18,360
Speaker 8: I think as part of the price collection for November,

253
00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,200
Speaker 8: a lot of that data was collected during Black Friday

254
00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:24,520
Speaker 8: sales and other promotions, and so just waiting to see

255
00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:29,439
Speaker 8: what price decreases or lower price increases stick, I think

256
00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:31,839
Speaker 8: the Federal went a little bit more information before making

257
00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:32,640
Speaker 8: a policy move.

258
00:13:33,880 --> 00:13:36,319
Speaker 3: You stay up late to watch the president last night, Liz,

259
00:13:36,800 --> 00:13:38,000
Speaker 3: I did, though.

260
00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:39,920
Speaker 8: It wasn't a very long speech. As you said, we're

261
00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:40,960
Speaker 8: running on a speedboat.

262
00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:43,840
Speaker 2: I think a couple minutes ago it was. It was

263
00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:45,000
Speaker 2: a speech on a speedboat.

264
00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:47,000
Speaker 3: But he talked a lot about what you and I

265
00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,520
Speaker 3: are talking about, and in fact ran through prices. He

266
00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:53,760
Speaker 3: had Thanksgiving Turkey down thirty three percent, eggs down eighty

267
00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:57,200
Speaker 3: two percent. He said, everything else is falling rapidly. Here's

268
00:13:57,200 --> 00:13:59,160
Speaker 3: a sense of the president in his primetime address.

269
00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:03,559
Speaker 10: We're bringing our economy back from the brink of ruin.

270
00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:07,800
Speaker 10: Wages are rising much faster than inflation. There are more

271
00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:11,240
Speaker 10: people working today than at any time in American history.

272
00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:16,439
Speaker 10: One million, four hundred and fifty thousand military service members

273
00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:21,720
Speaker 10: will receive a special we call Warrior dividend before Christmas.

274
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:25,960
Speaker 10: I'm also taking on the gigantic health insurance companies. I

275
00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:29,640
Speaker 10: will announce some of the most aggressive housing reform plans

276
00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:31,160
Speaker 10: in American history.

277
00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:33,240
Speaker 2: Okay, a lot of that.

278
00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:35,560
Speaker 3: We're bringing the economy back from the brink of ruin,

279
00:14:35,840 --> 00:14:40,600
Speaker 3: he said there, Liz, Wages rising faster than inflation, more

280
00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:43,880
Speaker 3: people working today than at any time in American history.

281
00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:45,280
Speaker 2: Is all of that supported by data?

282
00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:47,080
Speaker 5: You know what we saw in.

283
00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:49,880
Speaker 8: The jobs report this week. We saw the unemployment tick

284
00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:52,960
Speaker 8: up a little bit. We have seen retailers say that

285
00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:56,480
Speaker 8: they are hiring a lot fewer seasonal employees this year.

286
00:14:57,120 --> 00:15:00,880
Speaker 8: Real wages are not looking so hot. I don't see

287
00:15:00,880 --> 00:15:02,960
Speaker 8: a lot of truth in the president's statement. You know,

288
00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:05,480
Speaker 8: it was kind of funny. I think Mike Conzol pulled

289
00:15:05,520 --> 00:15:09,520
Speaker 8: the spreadsheet of CPI data and just sorted by, descending

290
00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:12,840
Speaker 8: to see what price points he pulled out. I was

291
00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:15,640
Speaker 8: confused by airfares and sports tickets, but I thought those

292
00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:17,600
Speaker 8: were funny ones to pull out, And apparently if you

293
00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:21,120
Speaker 8: just sort by the biggest numbers, that's where you got them.

294
00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:23,760
Speaker 8: I think for most families, they're not even thinking about

295
00:15:23,800 --> 00:15:26,200
Speaker 8: the price of airfares or sports tickets right now because

296
00:15:26,200 --> 00:15:28,600
Speaker 8: they're struggling to pay the grocery bill and the electric bill.

297
00:15:29,640 --> 00:15:31,360
Speaker 2: Oh you're making me want to fly somewhere.

298
00:15:32,200 --> 00:15:34,960
Speaker 3: Just in thirty seconds here left, Liz, Are you still

299
00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:38,000
Speaker 3: waiting for the real impact of tariffs because of front running?

300
00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:39,160
Speaker 2: When does it show up?

301
00:15:39,920 --> 00:15:40,120
Speaker 9: Yeah?

302
00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:42,240
Speaker 8: I mean I think we're seeing this in Christmas presence

303
00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:45,680
Speaker 8: right now under the tree. Harvard Pricing Lab shows that

304
00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:48,200
Speaker 8: goods prices are up about seven percent from their pre

305
00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:50,840
Speaker 8: Liberation Day trend, and I think Goldman still has the

306
00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:53,880
Speaker 8: estimated about fifty five percent of tariffs being passed through.

307
00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:56,520
Speaker 8: I think we are at the tail end of those

308
00:15:56,920 --> 00:16:01,680
Speaker 8: inventories that were kind of inflated ahead of that Liberation Day.

309
00:16:01,880 --> 00:16:04,480
Speaker 8: The President has still not figured out exactly what's going

310
00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:06,480
Speaker 8: on with China, So TVD there.

311
00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:09,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, TBD. It could be an interesting new year for

312
00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:12,280
Speaker 3: a lot of reasons. Following our conversations with Liz Pancotti,

313
00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:16,280
Speaker 3: Thank you, Liz, and Jody Errington, better fasten the chin strap.

314
00:16:16,360 --> 00:16:20,080
Speaker 3: Our conversation coming up with Congresswoman Sarah Elfreth, the Democrat

315
00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:23,160
Speaker 3: from Maryland on Bloomberg. Stay with us on Balance of Power.

316
00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:24,920
Speaker 3: We'll have much more coming up after this.

317
00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:32,640
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch

318
00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:36,640
Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple, Cocklay,

319
00:16:36,680 --> 00:16:39,440
Speaker 1: and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can

320
00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:42,960
Speaker 1: also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New

321
00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:46,760
Speaker 1: York station, Just Say Alexa played Bloomberg eleven thirty.

322
00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:51,240
Speaker 3: The Press Secretary Caroline Levitt just a short time ago,

323
00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:56,440
Speaker 3: announcing on social media that there's a new name for

324
00:16:56,480 --> 00:17:01,160
Speaker 3: the Kennedy Center, taking to to write, I have just

325
00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:04,000
Speaker 3: been informed that the highly respected board of the Kennedy Center,

326
00:17:04,080 --> 00:17:06,159
Speaker 3: some of the most successful people from all parts of

327
00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:10,320
Speaker 3: the world, have just voted unanimously to rename the Kennedy

328
00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:17,359
Speaker 3: Center to the Trump Kennedy Center. Congratulating in this note

329
00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:21,720
Speaker 3: not only President Trump, but likewise, she says, congratulations President Kennedy,

330
00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:25,880
Speaker 3: because this will be a truly great team long into

331
00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:26,440
Speaker 3: the future.

332
00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:29,280
Speaker 2: We need to get to Tyler. She's on the north

333
00:17:29,359 --> 00:17:29,800
Speaker 2: lawn of the.

334
00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:35,520
Speaker 3: White House right now, Washington Correspondent Tyler. Everyone saw this coming, right.

335
00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:37,800
Speaker 3: The President made himself the chairman of the board.

336
00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:38,920
Speaker 6: Right.

337
00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:42,520
Speaker 9: This was I guess long expected, considering it's really the

338
00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:46,800
Speaker 9: latest effort under this Trump administration to remake the institution

339
00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,000
Speaker 9: here in the nation's capital. Of course, you'll recall back

340
00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:52,879
Speaker 9: in February we saw that major shakeup of the board.

341
00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:55,879
Speaker 9: Many members that had been appointed under the last administration

342
00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:58,720
Speaker 9: were fired, and as you mentioned, we saw President Trump

343
00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:03,240
Speaker 9: himself appointed as the new chair. Now there is reporting

344
00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:06,080
Speaker 9: that this vote happened with President Trump.

345
00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:07,960
Speaker 11: Phoning into the meeting.

346
00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:10,439
Speaker 9: That's according to some media reports that have already started

347
00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:14,080
Speaker 9: circulating after this tweet was posted by the White House

348
00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:17,679
Speaker 9: Press Secretary Caroline levitt Worth, also mentioning the last part

349
00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:20,399
Speaker 9: of that post on x She says that the building

350
00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:23,320
Speaker 9: will no doubt attain new levels of success and grandeur.

351
00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:26,000
Speaker 9: In her words, important contextterior will call. When the one

352
00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:28,919
Speaker 9: big beautiful bill passed this summer, Tucked inside of it

353
00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:32,560
Speaker 9: was two hundred and fifty seven million dollars appropriated specifically

354
00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:37,440
Speaker 9: for a renovation of the Kennedy Building. So, Joe, this really,

355
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:40,919
Speaker 9: as we're discussing, is the latest in what has been

356
00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:44,199
Speaker 9: a series of steps this year, both with the institution itself,

357
00:18:44,240 --> 00:18:45,840
Speaker 9: but of course the backdrop that this is in the

358
00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:49,600
Speaker 9: nation's capital, and President Trump has tried to assert his

359
00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:53,440
Speaker 9: authority here in the nation's capital, including when it comes

360
00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:56,280
Speaker 9: to the National Guard and crime and working with.

361
00:18:56,280 --> 00:18:57,120
Speaker 11: The local government.

362
00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:01,360
Speaker 3: We've of course seen ticket sales impacted by the politics

363
00:19:01,359 --> 00:19:05,600
Speaker 3: around the Kennedy Center, and even some touring shows cancel appearances. Tyler,

364
00:19:05,640 --> 00:19:07,920
Speaker 3: I thought only Congress could rename the Kennedy Center.

365
00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:08,560
Speaker 2: Is that the case?

366
00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:11,800
Speaker 9: I'm going to have to get back to you on

367
00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:14,560
Speaker 9: the exact specifics of that. According to the White House

368
00:19:14,560 --> 00:19:18,280
Speaker 9: Press Secretary. This was a vote by by the board, which,

369
00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:22,000
Speaker 9: as we've been discussing, was experienced a shake up earlier

370
00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:26,160
Speaker 9: at this year under the Trump administration. So I'll get

371
00:19:26,160 --> 00:19:29,040
Speaker 9: back to you on the exact specifics on how this happened,

372
00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:31,240
Speaker 9: but as you alluded to, widely expected.

373
00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,520
Speaker 3: I appreciate this, Tyler, and we'll keep our eyes on

374
00:19:35,560 --> 00:19:37,440
Speaker 3: this EO signing that's set to begin a couple of

375
00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:39,040
Speaker 3: minutes from now, and it looks like they'll be running

376
00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:41,480
Speaker 3: late at the White House. Tyler Kendall on the North

377
00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:44,280
Speaker 3: Lawn today with news on now that I get well

378
00:19:44,359 --> 00:19:48,000
Speaker 3: the Trump Kennedy Center, we'll see if that's codified. Sarah

379
00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:51,640
Speaker 3: Elfreth was listening to our conversation. The Democratic congresswoman from

380
00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:55,320
Speaker 3: Maryland joins us now on Bloomberg TV and Radio live

381
00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:58,520
Speaker 3: from Capitol Hill. Congresswoman, it's great to have you back

382
00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:01,040
Speaker 3: on Bloomberg. I didn't think i'd be asking you about this,

383
00:20:01,119 --> 00:20:04,399
Speaker 3: but does Congress need to have a say in renaming

384
00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:06,680
Speaker 3: the Kennedy Center? And as a Democrat, would you buy

385
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:08,679
Speaker 3: tickets at the Trump Kennedy Center?

386
00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,800
Speaker 12: Thanks Stove for having me on. And I was giggling

387
00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:15,520
Speaker 12: over here while I listened in on that conversation. Just

388
00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:19,640
Speaker 12: like the President trying to rename the Department of Defense

389
00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:22,000
Speaker 12: and the Department of War, this is a similar situation.

390
00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:25,399
Speaker 12: It requires an Act of Congress, and so this is

391
00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:29,080
Speaker 12: pretty make believe at the moment. And unfortunately taxpayer dollars

392
00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:32,600
Speaker 12: might be used to change the name on the wall.

393
00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:35,520
Speaker 12: But the truth of the matter is we have a

394
00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:39,120
Speaker 12: system of checks and balances and shared governing here in Washington,

395
00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:41,120
Speaker 12: and Congress is going to have to approve that.

396
00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:43,080
Speaker 11: I would be a no vote.

397
00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:46,840
Speaker 12: As you mentioned, ticket sales are down. There's kind of

398
00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:50,680
Speaker 12: rimifications of the presidents getting so involved in the Kennedy

399
00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,399
Speaker 12: Center politics. I don't quite understand it when we have

400
00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:56,200
Speaker 12: so many other issues, serious issues the American people are

401
00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:59,200
Speaker 12: counting on us to address, while he's spending so much

402
00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:00,880
Speaker 12: time on this boggles the mind.

403
00:21:01,440 --> 00:21:04,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, it's just something we thought we'd get your

404
00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:04,639
Speaker 3: take on.

405
00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:07,400
Speaker 2: Congresswomen, We're a little more interested in.

406
00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:09,760
Speaker 3: Your take on healthcare right now because we had a

407
00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:13,800
Speaker 3: remarkable conversation yesterday with Mike Lawler, the Republican from New

408
00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:17,479
Speaker 3: York who signed on to Hakeim Jeffrey's discharge petition to

409
00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,800
Speaker 3: extend Obamacare subsidies. He was one of four Democrats to

410
00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:23,680
Speaker 3: do so. Now I realized Republicans passed their bill last

411
00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:27,720
Speaker 3: evening that doesn't touch Obamacare subsidies, and I'm wondering what

412
00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:30,080
Speaker 3: you think about the next step here. I just asked

413
00:21:30,119 --> 00:21:33,440
Speaker 3: Congressman Jody Arrington this same question. Is there a deal

414
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:35,840
Speaker 3: to be had here? Or were as good as over

415
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:36,280
Speaker 3: the cliff?

416
00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:39,720
Speaker 12: Listen, I'm an optimist. I wouldn't be in this business

417
00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:42,359
Speaker 12: if I weren't. I would like to believe that cooler

418
00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:46,200
Speaker 12: heads can prevail, particularly as upwards of twenty million Americans

419
00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:50,560
Speaker 12: are set to experience this huge affordability crisis on January first,

420
00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:53,760
Speaker 12: because Congress has chosen not to act. Holse Speaker Johnson

421
00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:57,159
Speaker 12: has chosen willfully chosen not to negotiate with Democrats to

422
00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:59,920
Speaker 12: get the votes he would need to pass something at

423
00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:03,280
Speaker 12: actually meaningful and lower the cost of healthcare insurance for

424
00:22:03,560 --> 00:22:06,000
Speaker 12: tens of millions of Americans. You know, maybe we'll get

425
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,399
Speaker 12: a Christmas miracle. Cooler heads can prevail and we can

426
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,640
Speaker 12: come together. I'm great grateful for Mike and the three

427
00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:15,080
Speaker 12: other Republicans for signing on. I think they heard they

428
00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:18,119
Speaker 12: saw the light, they heard from their constituents. They're doing

429
00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:21,160
Speaker 12: something about it. That's what everybody watching at home should

430
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:24,840
Speaker 12: expect of their members of Congress. But you know, do

431
00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:26,560
Speaker 12: I think the speaker is going to call that up

432
00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:29,199
Speaker 12: for a vote before we adjourn in I don't know,

433
00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:30,640
Speaker 12: maybe an hour, not.

434
00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:34,040
Speaker 3: Likely, maybe an hour, well, yeah, because I guess by

435
00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,800
Speaker 3: the rules, with it being discharged, that would likely put

436
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:40,359
Speaker 3: you into the beginning or middle of January when you

437
00:22:40,359 --> 00:22:44,040
Speaker 3: get back right, Is this the issue that defines the midterms?

438
00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:46,600
Speaker 3: Is this what brings Democrats back into power?

439
00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:50,720
Speaker 12: I think this is one part of the issue that brings,

440
00:22:50,800 --> 00:22:53,200
Speaker 12: you know, hopefully the confidence of the American people back

441
00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:56,399
Speaker 12: to the Democratic Party. It's the affordability crisis broadly. You

442
00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:59,120
Speaker 12: were just chatting about the impacts as we're going into

443
00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:02,399
Speaker 12: the holiday season. I spent my small business Saturday a

444
00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:06,119
Speaker 12: few weeks ago visiting small shops in Annapolis and an

445
00:23:06,119 --> 00:23:08,320
Speaker 12: elicant city in my district and just talking to those

446
00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:12,400
Speaker 12: business owners about the tariff hits that they took purchasing

447
00:23:12,440 --> 00:23:14,480
Speaker 12: a lot of the products that they had on shelves

448
00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:16,880
Speaker 12: for the holiday season pre tariffs, and then to come

449
00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 12: to find out that they're going to have to pay,

450
00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:24,320
Speaker 12: depending on the country, thirty percent tariffs. They can't afford

451
00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:26,520
Speaker 12: to eat those costs. They're being passed on to the

452
00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:29,000
Speaker 12: American people. And that's just one part. We talked about

453
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 12: groceries before, we talked about you know, I just paid

454
00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:35,159
Speaker 12: my electricity bill and it was staggering. We talk about health, insurance, housing,

455
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:39,720
Speaker 12: childcare here constantly. You know, the Republicans promised to solve it.

456
00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 12: The President promise to solve it on day one of

457
00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:44,960
Speaker 12: his presidency. We're almost a year into that with no

458
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:47,720
Speaker 12: meaningful impact. At least folks back at home and my

459
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:50,240
Speaker 12: district aren't feeling the impact of his actions. And so

460
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,960
Speaker 12: I think this is a mantle that Democrats are really

461
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:57,280
Speaker 12: charged up to lead on over the next year and

462
00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:00,800
Speaker 12: prove not just that we're against the President or against Republicans,

463
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:04,000
Speaker 12: but were actually for solving this affordability crisis.

464
00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:09,399
Speaker 3: Congresswoman, you represent Maryland's third district, which includes all of Annapolis,

465
00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:12,040
Speaker 3: and of course that means our great Naval Academy. You're

466
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 3: also a member of the Armed Services Committee, so I'm

467
00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:18,399
Speaker 3: sure you're knee deep in conversations and briefings around what

468
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:23,359
Speaker 3: the President's referring to as a naval blockade around Venezuela.

469
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:26,560
Speaker 3: There was a closed door briefing earlier this week, and

470
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:30,560
Speaker 3: I'm wondering what questions you have going forward and whether

471
00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:33,280
Speaker 3: you think this is the march to war in the Caribbean.

472
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:37,240
Speaker 12: It's really unclear. I was in two closed door classified

473
00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:41,479
Speaker 12: briefings this week and I left with more questions than

474
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:44,520
Speaker 12: answers that I have received from both Secretary Hess Secretary

475
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 12: Rubio and the Navy. Fourteen percent of our fleet is

476
00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:54,080
Speaker 12: now engaged in some type of conflict, undefined conflict. I

477
00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,280
Speaker 12: was with the Secretary Secretary Hexith when he talked just

478
00:24:57,359 --> 00:25:01,280
Speaker 12: two weeks ago about not entering the American people and

479
00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:05,080
Speaker 12: our service members into meaningless and endless wars, and yet

480
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:10,359
Speaker 12: our goals with Venezuela are completely undefined. And as a

481
00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:12,399
Speaker 12: member of Congress, member of the Armed Services Committee, that

482
00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:15,399
Speaker 12: really troubles me. It's keeping me up at night with

483
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:18,240
Speaker 12: so many of my constituents, including a lot of folks

484
00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:21,000
Speaker 12: from the Naval Academy down there right now. At the

485
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:23,760
Speaker 12: same time, the American people deserve to have answers. This

486
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,359
Speaker 12: is months long engagement in a part of the world

487
00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:30,000
Speaker 12: that the President can't define our goals or what were

488
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:32,719
Speaker 12: we why we have fourteen percent of our fleet down

489
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:35,600
Speaker 12: there in the first place. And as I've said, I

490
00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:37,840
Speaker 12: can't tell you how many times in my first eleven

491
00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,199
Speaker 12: months in the House, our founders and framers structured the

492
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:47,320
Speaker 12: Constitution intentionally putting war powers in Article one. With the Congress. Unfortunately,

493
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:51,119
Speaker 12: we had two resolutions yesterday that did not pass to

494
00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 12: kind of regain some of that control. I hope the

495
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:56,240
Speaker 12: American people are equally concerned.

496
00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:00,239
Speaker 3: Fourteen percent is a remarkable number. Congress will and I've

497
00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:02,920
Speaker 3: only got a minute left. The President said yesterday, having

498
00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:06,560
Speaker 3: framed this about drugs until now, that this is about

499
00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:10,199
Speaker 3: the oil. He said, Venezuela took our oil illegally and

500
00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:11,480
Speaker 3: we're going to take it back.

501
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:13,320
Speaker 2: Is that what this is about oil?

502
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:16,600
Speaker 12: I don't know what it's about. I also think that

503
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:18,240
Speaker 12: it's a false bill of goods that he's selling to

504
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:20,280
Speaker 12: the American people. And listen, I've had family members who

505
00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:22,879
Speaker 12: have unfortunately lost their lives to fentanyl. But if we

506
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:25,240
Speaker 12: were focused on fentanyl, we'd be focused on China and

507
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:28,200
Speaker 12: not on Venezuela. What they're taking, what they're sinking or

508
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 12: boats carrying cocaine, not boats carrying fentanyl. And at the

509
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:36,000
Speaker 12: same time, the president is pardoning literal drug kingpins who

510
00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:39,920
Speaker 12: are been convicted by juries of actually killing people through

511
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:42,720
Speaker 12: the drug trade. So there's a mismatch of messaging here

512
00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:44,960
Speaker 12: that is also deeply, deeply concerning.

513
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:50,040
Speaker 3: Democratic Congresswoman Sarah Elfreth of Maryland. It's great to have you, Congresswoman.

514
00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:52,719
Speaker 3: Thanks for being part of our conversation. We'll assemble our

515
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,080
Speaker 3: political panel next only here on Bloomberg.

516
00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:57,600
Speaker 2: Stay with us on Balance of Power. We'll have much

517
00:26:57,600 --> 00:26:58,800
Speaker 2: more coming up after this.

518
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:07,720
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch

519
00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:10,800
Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on

520
00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,200
Speaker 1: Apple Coarclay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App.

521
00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 1: Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch

522
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:19,240
Speaker 1: us live on YouTube.

523
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:24,200
Speaker 3: Last evening, it was the Diplomatic Reception Room, the venue

524
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 3: for a primetime address from the White House, adorned with

525
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:34,760
Speaker 3: the Christmas trees and decorations, the President walking into people's

526
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:37,399
Speaker 3: living rooms to deliver a message. Well, I guess on

527
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:40,280
Speaker 3: a lot of things, but mainly affordability and the fact

528
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:43,439
Speaker 3: that the guy before him made all of this a

529
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 3: problem President, as we mentioned a little bit earlier, starting

530
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:49,639
Speaker 3: with eleven months ago, I inherited a mess that was

531
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:51,680
Speaker 3: the first line out of his mouth, and I am

532
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:53,600
Speaker 3: fixing it. He went on to say, the reviews have

533
00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:56,160
Speaker 3: been interesting this morning. White House course says he knocked

534
00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:57,639
Speaker 3: it out of the park, and that's been the case

535
00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:02,000
Speaker 3: pretty much from maga twitter. The Atlantic described him as

536
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:07,840
Speaker 3: drenched in panic, the President racing through the script, barely

537
00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:10,159
Speaker 3: taking a breath and speaking at high volume right up

538
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:14,240
Speaker 3: on the microphone, actually distorting it at times. Axios calls

539
00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:18,000
Speaker 3: it a fiery, combative president, insisting the economy is stronger

540
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 3: than people think. Trump's speech, Mike Allen writes, was closer

541
00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 3: to a festivus airing of grievances than a Christmas message

542
00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:27,679
Speaker 3: of hope.

543
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:33,240
Speaker 2: A festivus for the rest of us. Listen here at home.

544
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:36,520
Speaker 10: We're bringing our economy back from the brink of ruin

545
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:40,520
Speaker 10: to last administration and their allies in Congress looted our

546
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:44,720
Speaker 10: treasury for trillions of dollars, driving up prices and everything

547
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:48,600
Speaker 10: at levels never seen before. I am bringing those high

548
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 10: prices down and bringing them down very fast.

549
00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:58,760
Speaker 3: Eighteen minutes. They say it was the speech that Susie.

550
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,160
Speaker 2: Wiles wanted him to give and Sylvania last.

551
00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:05,320
Speaker 3: Week worth noting did not hear the words hoax or

552
00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:09,520
Speaker 3: con job with regard to affordability. So let's play it

553
00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 3: to the panel. I have intentionally not had a conversation

554
00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 3: with Ricker Jeanie. I wanted to save this for air.

555
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,719
Speaker 3: They were both watching just like you were. And there

556
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 3: were us now Bloomberg Politics contributors, Republican strategist, Rick Davis,

557
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:24,800
Speaker 3: partner at stone Court Capital, and there's Genie Democracy visiting

558
00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:27,200
Speaker 3: fellow at Harvard Kennedy School's Ash Center.

559
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 2: All right, Rick, did anything change in this speech?

560
00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:34,520
Speaker 3: And what were people thinking in their living rooms who

561
00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 3: don't follow politics every day.

562
00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 7: Well, first of all, I'd like to say it was

563
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:40,840
Speaker 7: a beautiful speech in the sense that it was a

564
00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:45,040
Speaker 7: really pretty location. I love the festive nature of it.

565
00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:48,040
Speaker 7: It's different than most presidents do where they show the

566
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:49,120
Speaker 7: long hallway.

567
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:49,720
Speaker 13: With a red carpet.

568
00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:52,640
Speaker 7: So, you know, kudos to the events folks at the

569
00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:55,640
Speaker 7: White House for doing such a pretty thing. But I

570
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 7: would say, you know, I think it was an attempt

571
00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:02,720
Speaker 7: to change things. It was very clear that the goal

572
00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 7: of this speech was to get Donald Trump out of

573
00:30:05,360 --> 00:30:08,600
Speaker 7: the hot box that he put himself in by calling

574
00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 7: affordability a hoax, and the disastrous speech he gave in

575
00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:16,840
Speaker 7: Pennsylvania that did the same.

576
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:19,080
Speaker 13: So clearly they.

577
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 7: Were rocked by that at the White House needed to

578
00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:23,640
Speaker 7: get something done before the holidays. This was the one

579
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:27,440
Speaker 7: opening he had. They'll followed this up with a North

580
00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 7: Carolina visit and with hope that he doesn't do the

581
00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:39,720
Speaker 7: meandering negative Donald Trump on the economy and on affordability.

582
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,400
Speaker 13: But I think they did accomplish that goal.

583
00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 7: He spoke about affordability in a way that you would

584
00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 7: pretty much want him to do it. But other than that,

585
00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 7: the balance of the speech was kind of a waste

586
00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 7: of time. I think, you know, even though it was

587
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:55,640
Speaker 7: a short speech at fift at eighteen minutes, I think

588
00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 7: he could have done the whole thing in five considering

589
00:30:57,680 --> 00:30:59,280
Speaker 7: what I thought was the good parts.

590
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 3: Okay, Lindsey Graham ally of the President of course, on Twitter,

591
00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 3: high energy, great delivery, grand slam, home run, on making

592
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:12,560
Speaker 3: the case that the best is yet to come?

593
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:13,840
Speaker 2: Genie, is he right?

594
00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:17,000
Speaker 5: You know?

595
00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:20,239
Speaker 14: Donald Trump came across last night. He was screaming, He

596
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:23,800
Speaker 14: was red faced, He looked like he was some kind

597
00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:27,120
Speaker 14: of prisoner who didn't want to be there giving the speech,

598
00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:30,280
Speaker 14: And in fact, afterwards he told reporters in the room

599
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,560
Speaker 14: that Susie made him do it, and I thought that

600
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 14: was a perfect encapsulation as to what happened last night.

601
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:39,480
Speaker 11: He did not want to be there.

602
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 14: He does not have the interest he said he had

603
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:47,240
Speaker 14: on the campaign trail of making lives better for all Americans.

604
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:51,560
Speaker 14: His interest is apparently retribution and attacking his opponents, and

605
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,760
Speaker 14: that's what he spent most of the speech doing. He

606
00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:58,360
Speaker 14: started off on Joe Biden and he never got off him.

607
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 11: And how does that help.

608
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:04,640
Speaker 14: He's been in office eleven months now, everybody knows it

609
00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:07,720
Speaker 14: is his economy, and much of the facts he.

610
00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 11: Talked about were not true.

611
00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:13,520
Speaker 14: So I don't know what speech Lindsay Graham heard. This

612
00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:16,280
Speaker 14: was not a home run. This was a home run

613
00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:18,959
Speaker 14: if you are a Democrat and want to run against

614
00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:20,680
Speaker 14: Republicans in the new year.

615
00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:25,080
Speaker 3: Well, okay, Rick, let's talk about style. You know, he

616
00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:28,720
Speaker 3: was shouting and he raced through the script. Wasn't a

617
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:31,240
Speaker 3: lot of breathing. He was clearly trying to be high

618
00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:34,080
Speaker 3: energy and impactful. And I get that, but did it

619
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 3: remind us that Donald Trump needs an audience to be effective.

620
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:42,120
Speaker 7: I could, as you point out, there was no audience

621
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:46,120
Speaker 7: for this. It was basically like a stage with only

622
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:49,400
Speaker 7: a few aids standing behind a camera. It was also

623
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:51,560
Speaker 7: a different kind of camera in the sense that the

624
00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:54,320
Speaker 7: teleprompter was directly in front of him. Normally, he likes

625
00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:58,200
Speaker 7: to move that head back and forth reading the teleprompter,

626
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 7: driving the operator crazy because they'll stop and tell other stories.

627
00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:08,040
Speaker 7: The quote meandering that he likes to do. None of

628
00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 7: that last night. So it is not the Donald Trump

629
00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:17,080
Speaker 7: that we have gotten to know. And again, I mean,

630
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:20,760
Speaker 7: I think you must punctuate it with this. I mean,

631
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 7: I don't think Donald Trump in his lifetime is given

632
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,720
Speaker 7: a speech that didn't get to twenty minutes. I mean

633
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 7: that was really amazing in and of itself. And as

634
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:35,920
Speaker 7: you say stylistically, rather than meandering, he rushed through this thing.

635
00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:38,120
Speaker 7: I mean it was how quick can I get this

636
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:40,320
Speaker 7: done and you know, get back to my you know,

637
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:45,040
Speaker 7: watching the White Christmas episode. So I mean, like, I really,

638
00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:48,440
Speaker 7: I really thought I was seeing a different guy up there.

639
00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 13: Maybe they got a doppelganger to call this one in.

640
00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:54,480
Speaker 3: When I got into the radio business, Genie it was

641
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 3: a really different experience than it is now, and everybody

642
00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:00,440
Speaker 3: was fast talking and deep voices and whiz banging and

643
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 3: the rest of it. And he used to be a

644
00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:05,080
Speaker 3: term in the newsroom called news on a speedboat. That

645
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 3: was literally what you were trying to deliver. It was insane.

646
00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:11,640
Speaker 3: The president kind of did speech on a speedboat last night.

647
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:15,279
Speaker 3: Can you deliver stylistically as you move away from the

648
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 3: politics here, just as a communicator, can you deliver a

649
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:22,480
Speaker 3: message that lasts with voters on a speedboat?

650
00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:29,360
Speaker 14: You know you can, You absolutely can if your heart

651
00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 14: is in it. And the problem with Donald Trump last

652
00:34:32,160 --> 00:34:36,120
Speaker 14: night was the fact he was talking fast. Obviously just

653
00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:38,920
Speaker 14: watching and listening to him because he didn't want to

654
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:41,120
Speaker 14: be there. And that's what he told the pool reporters

655
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:44,719
Speaker 14: after Susie made me do it. What he wanted to

656
00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:49,160
Speaker 14: say was everything is great, everything is fantastic. If it's not,

657
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:52,000
Speaker 14: which the polls say people don't believe it is, then

658
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 14: blame Joe Biden. That was his message, and that is

659
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:58,719
Speaker 14: not a winning message. And so that is the problem.

660
00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:03,359
Speaker 14: You couple that with the number of misstatements I think

661
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:05,359
Speaker 14: is the best way to put it, that he made

662
00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:09,080
Speaker 14: on everything from inflation to unemployment, to immigration to tariffs.

663
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:10,359
Speaker 2: I mean, the list goes on and.

664
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:14,120
Speaker 14: On, and he simply cannot find his way back to

665
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:17,160
Speaker 14: where he was on the campaign trail saying to people,

666
00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:21,239
Speaker 14: I understand what you're contexting with, and I am here

667
00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 14: to make it better. That message he has not been

668
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:26,560
Speaker 14: able to deliver since he's gotten into the White House.

669
00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 14: And so, yeah, you can talk fast and do it,

670
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:32,319
Speaker 14: but he was not able to do that last night.

671
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:34,480
Speaker 14: And so I think the big question is what happens

672
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:35,440
Speaker 14: in North Carolina.

673
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 2: That's right Friday night.

674
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:39,800
Speaker 3: We're all going to be listening see if he is

675
00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:42,879
Speaker 3: a little more like Pennsylvania or was a little more

676
00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:43,520
Speaker 3: like last night.

677
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:45,120
Speaker 2: I think we probably know what to expect here.

678
00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:49,080
Speaker 3: But I wonder if you guys saw what the president

679
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,960
Speaker 3: did with the so called Presidential Walk of Fame outside

680
00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:57,160
Speaker 3: the White House colinnade right outside the Oval Office. This

681
00:35:57,200 --> 00:35:59,280
Speaker 3: is where he hung all the pictures of the presidents

682
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:02,760
Speaker 3: and put it framed photograph of an autopen in place

683
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:06,759
Speaker 3: of Joe Biden. He's added plaques that add context in

684
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:08,040
Speaker 3: biographical information.

685
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:09,080
Speaker 2: There you go.

686
00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:11,239
Speaker 3: If you're with us on YouTube, thank you see you

687
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:12,960
Speaker 3: see what I'm talking about here. It looks like something

688
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:16,120
Speaker 3: you'd catch in a museum. These are like brass plaques

689
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 3: below the framed photos. In the words of Caroline Levitt,

690
00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 3: the White House Press Secretary, as a student of history,

691
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:28,520
Speaker 3: many were written directly by the president himself. Indeed, Joe

692
00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:31,759
Speaker 3: Biden's reads Sleepy Joe Biden was by far the worst

693
00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:37,080
Speaker 3: president in American history. Nicknamed both sleepy and Crooked Obama,

694
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:41,000
Speaker 3: Barack Hussein Obama was the first black president, a community organizer,

695
00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:43,200
Speaker 3: one term senator from Illinois, and one of the most

696
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:45,520
Speaker 3: divisive political figures in American history.

697
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 2: George W.

698
00:36:46,760 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 3: Bush created the Department of Homeland Security, but started wars

699
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:53,240
Speaker 3: in Afghanistan and Iraq, both of which should not have happened.

700
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:56,799
Speaker 3: Bill Clinton served as attorney general governor of Arkansas before

701
00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:59,720
Speaker 3: winning the presidency in what was called a major upset

702
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:00,880
Speaker 3: over George H. W.

703
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:01,680
Speaker 2: Bush.

704
00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 3: In twenty sixteen, he writes, Clinton's wife Hillary lost the

705
00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:07,560
Speaker 3: presidency to Donald J.

706
00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:12,080
Speaker 2: Trump. Rick, taxpayers are going to have to pay to

707
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:13,120
Speaker 2: have these remove, right.

708
00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:18,759
Speaker 7: Yeah, I'm sure taxpayers have already paid to have them

709
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:21,719
Speaker 7: put up, and that should anger some taxpayers because it

710
00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:25,560
Speaker 7: is an incredible waste of money. Look, if Donald Trump

711
00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:28,960
Speaker 7: wants to write a history book and subtle scores, I

712
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:30,480
Speaker 7: think it's great right write it.

713
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:33,680
Speaker 13: You can even do it while you're president. I don't care.

714
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:37,560
Speaker 7: But then at least people who buy it with their

715
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:41,120
Speaker 7: own money, and he's not writing it with taxpayer money.

716
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:45,719
Speaker 7: The White House is an iconic building that should not

717
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:48,839
Speaker 7: be partisan in and of itself, and the fact that

718
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:51,920
Speaker 7: these are tacked up there indicates a different kind of

719
00:37:52,040 --> 00:37:53,600
Speaker 7: role for that structure.

720
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:58,560
Speaker 3: Genie Ronald Reagan was a fan. He wrote of President

721
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:01,520
Speaker 3: Donald J. Trump long before President Trump's historic run for

722
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:04,680
Speaker 3: the White House. Likewise, President Trump was a fan of his.

723
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:07,920
Speaker 3: Even Republicans get a back end and compliment here.

724
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:10,359
Speaker 13: That's right.

725
00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:12,920
Speaker 14: I'm sure George Washington was a fan of Donald Trump's

726
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:16,480
Speaker 14: too as well. Joe, you know, listen, this is indicative

727
00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:18,960
Speaker 14: of what we saw last night. This is somebody who

728
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:22,520
Speaker 14: is much more interested in attacking Rob Reiner, who is

729
00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:26,520
Speaker 14: interested in putting up plaques, attacking his predecessors, who is

730
00:38:26,560 --> 00:38:29,440
Speaker 14: interested in doing all kinds of things except dealing with

731
00:38:29,480 --> 00:38:31,759
Speaker 14: the healthcare and the issues and the cost of living

732
00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:34,279
Speaker 14: that people are feeling that he rushes over.

733
00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:38,000
Speaker 3: I'm starting to think the speech didn't change any minds

734
00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:41,120
Speaker 3: at least on our panel. Stay with us on Balance

735
00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:43,319
Speaker 3: of Power. We'll have much more coming up after this.

736
00:38:48,120 --> 00:38:51,600
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcasts. Catch

737
00:38:51,680 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple,

738
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:58,200
Speaker 1: Cockway and Android Otto with the Blueberg Business app. You

739
00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:01,120
Speaker 1: can also listen live on Amazon on Alexa from our

740
00:39:01,160 --> 00:39:07,000
Speaker 1: flagship New York station Just Say Alexa played Bloomberg eleven thirty.

741
00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:10,400
Speaker 3: This story jumps off the page, speaking of which jumps

742
00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 3: off the terminal with a scoop that you're not going

743
00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:15,600
Speaker 3: to hear about anywhere else. As usual, Jamie Terra Bay

744
00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:18,840
Speaker 3: is way ahead with the headline the Trump administration turning

745
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:23,360
Speaker 3: to private firms in cyber offensive. Yeah, you know, we

746
00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:25,359
Speaker 3: asked this question a lot around here when we talk

747
00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:29,560
Speaker 3: to cyber officials with the White House, smart folks at csis,

748
00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:34,200
Speaker 3: what are our offensive capabilities? Can we do a stucksnet

749
00:39:34,239 --> 00:39:36,120
Speaker 3: around here? Can we turn the lights out in Moscow

750
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:38,920
Speaker 3: if we need to? Nobody ever answers that question. Have

751
00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:42,799
Speaker 3: you noticed that I get really long answers, but not

752
00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:44,440
Speaker 3: really a sense of what we can do or with

753
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:49,480
Speaker 3: the country is interested in doing enter Jamie's story. The

754
00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:53,920
Speaker 3: administration preparing no to enlist private companies in more aggressive

755
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:57,240
Speaker 3: efforts to go after criminal and state sponsored hackers, according

756
00:39:57,280 --> 00:40:00,440
Speaker 3: to people familiar with the matter, she's with us right now,

757
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:03,440
Speaker 3: Bloomberg National Security, Capital Influence reporter.

758
00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:04,600
Speaker 2: Great work, Great to see you.

759
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:08,480
Speaker 3: Are we talking about the crowd strikes of the world,

760
00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:10,480
Speaker 3: the Palo Altos or Is this a different class of

761
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:11,240
Speaker 3: cyber company.

762
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:14,280
Speaker 15: There's a different kind of company that you don't really

763
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:17,920
Speaker 15: hear a lot about, particularly people who've come out of

764
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:21,840
Speaker 15: the intelligence community. They've left an NSA or CIA and

765
00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:25,040
Speaker 15: they create their own companies. And what they do is

766
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:29,640
Speaker 15: they have technology that they've developed that could be considered

767
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:33,279
Speaker 15: dual use, but they frame it as defensive tech, and

768
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 15: so it's usually contracted to you as cyber command, which

769
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:38,560
Speaker 15: is really the place where a lot of this offensive

770
00:40:38,600 --> 00:40:41,840
Speaker 15: cyber normally happens, and they can deploy it for a

771
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:44,160
Speaker 15: defensive or offensive means.

772
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:45,480
Speaker 11: But the fact is.

773
00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:47,920
Speaker 15: Once that a contract is signed and the tech is

774
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 15: handed over, the company does not then know what what

775
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:53,719
Speaker 15: the government does the technology.

776
00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:56,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, these are privately held companies, not publicly traded companies

777
00:40:56,719 --> 00:40:58,080
Speaker 3: that are Listener's own.

778
00:40:58,040 --> 00:41:00,600
Speaker 15: Shares of right now, I don't think so you never know.

779
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:05,040
Speaker 15: I think that definitely this is the signal that this

780
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:09,000
Speaker 15: is sending is to industry that there's an opportunity here.

781
00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:11,319
Speaker 11: So a lot of people are very excited about it.

782
00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:13,839
Speaker 15: Some of them are extremely gung ho, but others are

783
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:18,200
Speaker 15: quite reticent because it does get rid of that gray

784
00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:22,120
Speaker 15: area where they can say that they're they're developing defensive

785
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:25,400
Speaker 15: use versus offensive use tech. But also because you know,

786
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:28,560
Speaker 15: if they do have shareholders or investors, for some people,

787
00:41:28,719 --> 00:41:31,040
Speaker 15: they could be very leary about getting on the wrong

788
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:31,600
Speaker 15: side of that.

789
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 11: There's a lot of risk.

790
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:36,960
Speaker 15: Inherent in the activity and in the operation. And so

791
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:39,200
Speaker 15: we still don't know any of the details, but we

792
00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:43,440
Speaker 15: you know, but there's been speculation, and I've been tracking

793
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:46,440
Speaker 15: this since April this year, so there's been a lot

794
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:49,600
Speaker 15: of conversations and chatter about what this would look like

795
00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:50,719
Speaker 15: and what that posture is.

796
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 3: Well, we've got a lot of questions for you here

797
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:55,319
Speaker 3: for starters, Is the United States government not capable of

798
00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:57,400
Speaker 3: doing this work? Do we have the brain power, do

799
00:41:57,480 --> 00:41:59,439
Speaker 3: we have the resources to do this on our own?

800
00:41:59,480 --> 00:42:02,480
Speaker 3: Or is this clearly telling us that we don't.

801
00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:05,480
Speaker 11: We have the brain power. I don't know that we

802
00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:06,520
Speaker 11: have the scale.

803
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:09,600
Speaker 15: And that is something that people who have left government

804
00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:11,960
Speaker 15: will tell you as well as people who are in government.

805
00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:15,479
Speaker 15: And we saw this in the previous administration, the sort

806
00:42:15,480 --> 00:42:18,920
Speaker 15: of the cyber workforce gap of five hundred thousand. The

807
00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:21,839
Speaker 15: new National Cyber Director Sean can cross things. Now it's

808
00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:24,920
Speaker 15: closer to a million short. And this is something where

809
00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:27,120
Speaker 15: industry is saying, we can.

810
00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:27,640
Speaker 11: Bridge the gap.

811
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:32,280
Speaker 15: And that's really you're dealing with adversaries, for example, China,

812
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:34,920
Speaker 15: which denies a lot of the cyber attacks, or Russia,

813
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:38,120
Speaker 15: which don't really sort of see a divide between military

814
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:40,640
Speaker 15: and civilian and they just throw everything they can or

815
00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:42,560
Speaker 15: they want to at different targets.

816
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:44,759
Speaker 11: And this is combating not.

817
00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:48,480
Speaker 15: Just all those nasty ransomware attacks that we've been reporting

818
00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:51,800
Speaker 15: on for so long, but also the nation state activity,

819
00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:56,240
Speaker 15: which is the espionage, the sabotaged intelligence gathering, the IP theft.

820
00:42:56,560 --> 00:43:00,520
Speaker 15: So it's a whole of house approach, very very aggressive.

821
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:02,920
Speaker 3: Wow, this is fascinating to speak to us about the

822
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:05,319
Speaker 3: legality of this. Now, I guess if the companies don't

823
00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 3: know what you're doing with the software, that's the whole

824
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:11,120
Speaker 3: point right, because technically what you're describing is a new

825
00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:14,840
Speaker 3: class of defense contractor are you not in wouldn't Congress

826
00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:15,600
Speaker 3: have to have to say in that.

827
00:43:15,880 --> 00:43:18,439
Speaker 15: I think that there's well, we know for sure there's

828
00:43:18,480 --> 00:43:21,279
Speaker 15: going to be at least one executive order once this

829
00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:25,520
Speaker 15: strategy is announced sometime next month, but no one I've

830
00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:27,839
Speaker 15: spoken to says that that's going to be enough. There

831
00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:30,640
Speaker 15: needs to be legislation because you know that EOS can

832
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 15: obviously turn on a dime, cancel, et cetera. So that

833
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:36,000
Speaker 15: doesn't really kind of give anyone any kind of real

834
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:41,440
Speaker 15: legal protection. It doesn't spell out or codify authorities or

835
00:43:41,480 --> 00:43:44,200
Speaker 15: protections for people who want to be doing this. So

836
00:43:44,880 --> 00:43:46,800
Speaker 15: it's going to be really interesting to see how the

837
00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:49,759
Speaker 15: Hill takes it. And I know I've been reporting that

838
00:43:49,800 --> 00:43:54,960
Speaker 15: there have been obviously, you know, investigations into what that

839
00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:57,759
Speaker 15: policy would look like. But everyone that I've spoken to

840
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:00,840
Speaker 15: about this, people who have been very senior in intelligence community,

841
00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:02,400
Speaker 15: have come back to me is that the devil is

842
00:44:02,440 --> 00:44:05,239
Speaker 15: in the details. We don't know what it looks like yet,

843
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:07,680
Speaker 15: so so we're still waiting.

844
00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:10,240
Speaker 3: Well to that end, you write that a new national

845
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 3: cyber strategy to be released by the Office of National

846
00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:17,040
Speaker 3: Cyber Director will outline this plan that you're talking about.

847
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:20,120
Speaker 3: I'm picturing you in some sort of dark parking lot

848
00:44:20,239 --> 00:44:23,480
Speaker 3: being handed a copy of have you seen this draft? Is? That's?

849
00:44:23,880 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 3: What's it going to say? And when's it coming out?

850
00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:29,000
Speaker 15: There are six pillars under the strategy to SAFT.

851
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:30,520
Speaker 11: It's five pages long.

852
00:44:30,600 --> 00:44:33,120
Speaker 2: It's five pages, and.

853
00:44:35,120 --> 00:44:40,040
Speaker 15: It's being sort of shown and shared to industry think tanks,

854
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:43,480
Speaker 15: former government officials, former security officials, to get their take,

855
00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:46,719
Speaker 15: get their feedback. Some of the wording may change, but

856
00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:48,759
Speaker 15: the substance of it is going to be the same.

857
00:44:48,800 --> 00:44:52,359
Speaker 15: And the thing that everyone was struck by was how

858
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:55,480
Speaker 15: short it was, but also that the first pillar in

859
00:44:55,560 --> 00:44:58,560
Speaker 15: these six pillars was the offensive cyber.

860
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:00,880
Speaker 11: And quote unquote unleashing the private sector.

861
00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:03,400
Speaker 3: Wow, So what do our allies think about this? And

862
00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:04,839
Speaker 3: are they going to get in on this game? Will

863
00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 3: they start hiring these same companies?

864
00:45:07,160 --> 00:45:10,000
Speaker 15: So some of the conversations that I have had with

865
00:45:10,080 --> 00:45:14,120
Speaker 15: folks overseas is that they have been really waiting for

866
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:16,640
Speaker 15: something like this, and it's going to be really interesting

867
00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:19,640
Speaker 15: to see how the US threads this need or legally

868
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:23,680
Speaker 15: and what example or precedent that will set for its allies.

869
00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:27,200
Speaker 15: I have people in the UK who are very keen

870
00:45:27,239 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 15: to see this happen, people in Japan who are very

871
00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:34,239
Speaker 15: keen to see this happen, people in Europe. But what

872
00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:37,160
Speaker 15: it does say is that there's a sense of urgency,

873
00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:42,399
Speaker 15: there's a sense of necessary, necessary, necessity of scale, and

874
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:45,360
Speaker 15: that everyone sort of feels like they've just been taking

875
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:47,520
Speaker 15: these hits for so long that they really want to

876
00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:50,640
Speaker 15: start pushing back and doing it in a very aggressive way.

877
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:55,120
Speaker 3: So just create a new family of digital blackwaters.

878
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:56,560
Speaker 11: That's the risk.

879
00:45:56,719 --> 00:45:59,200
Speaker 15: And I think that that's why everyone's waiting to see

880
00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:04,959
Speaker 15: what what the legality is because right now, the way

881
00:46:04,960 --> 00:46:08,600
Speaker 15: that it sort of described me is when private contractors

882
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:12,920
Speaker 15: go and work for an agency, they share the same keyboard,

883
00:46:13,440 --> 00:46:17,919
Speaker 15: right and now under this new policy, potentially they could

884
00:46:17,920 --> 00:46:20,759
Speaker 15: be working off different keyboards and they may even know

885
00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:23,200
Speaker 15: who they're targeting. Or if they could say, you know,

886
00:46:23,280 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 15: go into this electricity grid and take this actor out

887
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:29,440
Speaker 15: of the infrastructure, like just out of the networks, take

888
00:46:29,719 --> 00:46:33,480
Speaker 15: get the mouse, so they'll know they're not stupid, you know,

889
00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:37,320
Speaker 15: and so but it also exposes them. So if I'm

890
00:46:37,760 --> 00:46:40,879
Speaker 15: if I'm going after you and I've seen you in

891
00:46:41,040 --> 00:46:43,400
Speaker 15: like a network and you see me and you're like,

892
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:44,759
Speaker 15: you know what, I'm going to go in there and

893
00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:46,640
Speaker 15: I'm going to burn your entire architecture.

894
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:48,160
Speaker 11: So it does.

895
00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:51,920
Speaker 15: So it has this So the sort of the there's

896
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:53,320
Speaker 15: almost the kinetic.

897
00:46:53,280 --> 00:46:55,840
Speaker 11: Responds to this, but it also can.

898
00:46:57,120 --> 00:46:59,320
Speaker 15: The fear that I've heard from a lot of industry

899
00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:02,880
Speaker 15: CEOs who do have shareholders is the fear of, you know,

900
00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:07,120
Speaker 15: people who are already on Putin's bad list, possibly being

901
00:47:07,120 --> 00:47:11,080
Speaker 15: indicted or extradited if their companies are known to be

902
00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:14,360
Speaker 15: carrying out this sort of activity for the government.

903
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,600
Speaker 3: So this I can just imagine the congressional hearings a

904
00:47:17,640 --> 00:47:19,040
Speaker 3: couple of years from now, right.

905
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:21,360
Speaker 15: But it really tells you that there's so much that

906
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:23,200
Speaker 15: we don't know. But at the same time, there's so

907
00:47:23,320 --> 00:47:26,560
Speaker 15: much that everyone is talking about. People have been looking

908
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:28,960
Speaker 15: at this in so many different ways. The idea of

909
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:34,080
Speaker 15: letters of mark, which is what privateers operated under during

910
00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:37,360
Speaker 15: one of the American Wars in the eighteen hundreds, I

911
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:40,399
Speaker 15: can't remember the date exactly, but what it allowed them

912
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:43,200
Speaker 15: to do was the idea that they go in they

913
00:47:43,239 --> 00:47:46,040
Speaker 15: disrupt the British Navy or whoever and they take.

914
00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:48,400
Speaker 11: The booty, right, and maybe this happens now.

915
00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:52,920
Speaker 15: That has been dismissed by a lot of the experts,

916
00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:56,560
Speaker 15: but a representative in the House has introduced a resolution

917
00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:58,040
Speaker 15: regarding letters of mark So it's.

918
00:47:57,920 --> 00:47:59,360
Speaker 11: Not out of the realm of possibility.

919
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:00,680
Speaker 2: This is absolutely so.

920
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:04,440
Speaker 11: This is the future of warfare, definitely one side of.

921
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:07,000
Speaker 3: It, Mike, Cyber is a tool we spend so much

922
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:09,920
Speaker 3: time talking about spending billions of which is the first

923
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:12,840
Speaker 3: trillion dollar defense budget this year for all of this

924
00:48:13,040 --> 00:48:16,160
Speaker 3: hardware that will purportedly be used in a war with

925
00:48:16,239 --> 00:48:19,080
Speaker 3: China someday, when you're talking about a whole different level.

926
00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:24,800
Speaker 3: Here are these companies prepared to meet these requests, because

927
00:48:24,840 --> 00:48:27,760
Speaker 3: I'm guessing these would be monster contracts with the Pentagon.

928
00:48:27,880 --> 00:48:31,120
Speaker 15: There is a billion dollars in the one big beautiful

929
00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:35,920
Speaker 15: bill under injopack com that is meant for offensive cyber operations.

930
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:40,720
Speaker 15: The money's there, and industry, it's going to be interesting

931
00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:42,400
Speaker 15: to see who steps up and who.

932
00:48:42,320 --> 00:48:43,399
Speaker 2: I bet you they're getting ready.

933
00:48:43,440 --> 00:48:45,520
Speaker 11: Now those conversations are happening.

934
00:48:46,080 --> 00:48:48,680
Speaker 15: I am being told that they're happening, and everyone is

935
00:48:48,719 --> 00:48:50,480
Speaker 15: waiting to see what the contracts look like.

936
00:48:50,680 --> 00:48:53,440
Speaker 11: So we don't know yet. We have to see.

937
00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:56,040
Speaker 3: I want to know who Jamie's talking to here now

938
00:48:56,040 --> 00:48:58,399
Speaker 3: when I just quickly, we've got about a minute left

939
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:01,200
Speaker 3: here are we talking about what I mentioned? That something

940
00:49:01,239 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 3: in the spirit of stucks net turning the lights out?

941
00:49:03,680 --> 00:49:06,960
Speaker 3: Or is this about embedding ourselves in infrastructure the way.

942
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:07,640
Speaker 2: China's done to us.

943
00:49:07,680 --> 00:49:08,720
Speaker 11: That's a really good question.

944
00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:09,239
Speaker 2: We don't know.

945
00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:14,320
Speaker 15: Maybe we will never know what n Essay and cybercom do.

946
00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:19,359
Speaker 15: For all sorts of reasons, they could be there right now.

947
00:49:19,440 --> 00:49:20,480
Speaker 11: We have no idea.

948
00:49:20,600 --> 00:49:21,359
Speaker 2: This is too much.

949
00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:24,320
Speaker 3: The calls coming from inside the house and it's Jamie

950
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:27,560
Speaker 3: Terra Bay. Great reporting, Jamie, Thank you for bringing that

951
00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:29,839
Speaker 3: to us. If you didn't know about this story, find

952
00:49:29,840 --> 00:49:33,080
Speaker 3: it on the terminal and online. The Trump administration turning

953
00:49:33,120 --> 00:49:35,040
Speaker 3: to private firms in cyber offensive.

954
00:49:36,640 --> 00:49:39,080
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast.

955
00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:42,839
Speaker 3: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify,

956
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:45,520
Speaker 3: or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find

957
00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:48,399
Speaker 3: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at New Time

958
00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:50,560
Speaker 3: Eastern at Bloomberg dot com.