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Speaker 1: Every day Breakfast Club. Y'all don yep, the world's most

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Speaker 1: dangerous morning to show to Breakfast Club, Charlamagne to God,

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Speaker 1: Jess Hilarious, DJ Envy Envy is out today. But Lauren

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Speaker 1: Loro says, and we have a very special guest man,

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Speaker 1: the host of my favorite cable news UH network show,

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Speaker 1: Abby Phillips, is here morning. I say, Phillips is Philip,

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Speaker 1: Abby Phillip.

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Speaker 2: That's okay, though everybody to everybody puts an ess on it.

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Speaker 2: It's cool. It does not bother me. My friend says,

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Speaker 2: it's a sign of respect in our community, like Selina's.

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Speaker 1: People name.

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Speaker 2: Why do we do that? It sounds right, it feels right.

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Speaker 1: How are you?

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Speaker 2: I am good? I'm good. I'm hanging in there.

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Speaker 1: New book out Dream deferred Jesse Jackson in the fight

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Speaker 1: for black political power. I'm from South Carolina, so I

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Speaker 1: completely understand Jesse Jackson, and you know why he deserves

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Speaker 1: all all the praise. But why did you decide to

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Speaker 1: write this book?

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Speaker 2: I think that there are a lot of people who

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Speaker 2: have no idea that he ran for president, honestly, and

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Speaker 2: they don't and if they know that he ran for president,

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Speaker 2: they probably don't have any idea that he came second

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Speaker 2: in the Democratic nomination in nineteen eighty eight, so he

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Speaker 2: was the runner up. And before Obama there was Jesse Jackson.

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Speaker 2: And I think this chapter really is more important now

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Speaker 2: than ever. Back in the eighties, I think people didn't

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Speaker 2: have any way to know that what Jesse Jackson did

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Speaker 2: really mattered in the long term. But it clearly mattered

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Speaker 2: because had he not run, Obama wouldn't have been the nominee.

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Speaker 2: Had he not run, I don't know that you would

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Speaker 2: have like a Bernie Sanders or an AOC or even

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Speaker 2: a Zoron Mamdani. I mean, these are people who are

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Speaker 2: running on basically the same platform that Jesse Jackson ran on,

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Speaker 2: and he really transformed democratic politics, not to mention registering

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Speaker 2: millions of voters and putting in place a lot of

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Speaker 2: the people that you know, people like Donna Brazil, Minon Moore,

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Speaker 2: and so many others who are leaders in the Democratic Party,

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Speaker 2: they are all there because of Jesse Jackson.

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Speaker 3: What I was going to say in the back of

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Speaker 3: your book the praises, Yeah, you say, like the first

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Speaker 3: one talks about how he doesn't how Jesse Deson doesn't

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Speaker 3: get credit for how influential on American politics as he was.

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Speaker 3: What credit do you want people to give him after

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Speaker 3: they read your book.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think that he he transformed the

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Speaker 2: structure of the Democratic Party that made it easier for

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Speaker 2: outsiders to come in and disrupt the system. I think

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Speaker 2: that's really what his original goal was. When he was

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Speaker 2: running for president, he was basically saying to the Democratic Party,

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Speaker 2: you have to take us seriously as black voters, and

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Speaker 2: not just black voters, but all kinds of other voters.

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Speaker 2: He brought Arab Americans into the voting process. He insisted

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Speaker 2: on women being on the ticket. That's why Democrats had

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Speaker 2: a woman on the ticket in nineteen eighty four. He

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Speaker 2: insisted on Asian Americans being part of the political process.

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Speaker 2: So what he was arguing for was a political system

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Speaker 2: that actually takes everybody seriously. And I do think we're

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Speaker 2: closer to that now than we were in the eighties,

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Speaker 2: and he deserves a lot of credit for that. But

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Speaker 2: I also think, you know, especially younger folks who look

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Speaker 2: I count myself among them. I was born three weeks

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Speaker 2: after the eighty eight campaign was over, right, So but

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Speaker 2: I'm just saying, like, this is not about any kind

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Speaker 2: of judgment about what you know or don't know about

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Speaker 2: this particular chapter of history. But it's important to know

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Speaker 2: that Jesse Jackson, like so many other of these leaders

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Speaker 2: in our history, they had a lot of chapters and

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Speaker 2: this was a really significant I mean, he ran for

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Speaker 2: president two times, he almost won the nomination. During one

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Speaker 2: of these campaigns, he went to Syria and Cuba and

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Speaker 2: brought prisoners of war back to the United States. I mean,

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Speaker 2: he was doing a lot of things that if candidates

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Speaker 2: were doing that today, we would be like, what is

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Speaker 2: that real? But he doesn't get a lot of credit

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Speaker 2: for and I think a lot of it is because

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Speaker 2: it was the first time that so many Americans had

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Speaker 2: ever seen a black man try to do what he did,

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Speaker 2: and I think it's important to remember how much of

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Speaker 2: a you know, just a barrier breaker he was at

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Speaker 2: that time.

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Speaker 1: What was the single biggest myth or misconception you discovered

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Speaker 1: in your reporting about either of those campaigns that.

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Speaker 2: You wanted to correct that he was only running as

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Speaker 2: a black candidate for black voters. I think that's the

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Speaker 2: biggest misconception. He was obviously very interested, motivated by the

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Speaker 2: desire to make sure that black people utilize their power

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Speaker 2: not just cast a ballot, but had leverage to get

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Speaker 2: changes on the platform, policy things that mattered to their

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Speaker 2: day to day lives. But he was also in Missouri

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Speaker 2: with white farmers. He was also in San Francisco with

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Speaker 2: Asian American activists. That's why he called it the Rainbow Coalition.

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Speaker 2: I think people remember him as being the candidate for

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Speaker 2: black people, but he actually brought, as he said he would,

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Speaker 2: a rainbow of people into the political process, and he

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Speaker 2: does not get very much credit for how much appeal

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Speaker 2: he had among white voters, especially when he ran the

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Speaker 2: second time around. There's this great picture I have in

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Speaker 2: the book of him at a rally with a bunch

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Speaker 2: of white farmers in their overalls and they all have

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Speaker 2: paper bags on their heads with their eyes cut off

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Speaker 2: because they're trying to hide their faces from the Feds

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Speaker 2: who were trying to basically foreclose on their farms. And

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Speaker 2: there's Jesse Jackson in the background with all of these

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Speaker 2: white people rallying alongside them. And that's, for me, an

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Speaker 2: iconic photo that kind of shows that he had the

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Speaker 2: same energy for our community as he did for all

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Speaker 2: of those other people. And he was arguing to them, look,

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Speaker 2: we have the people who are trying to divide us

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Speaker 2: along racial lines, are trying to make you think that

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Speaker 2: you don't have as much in common as a working

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Speaker 2: class black person, and that's a lie. And a lot

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Speaker 2: of people diminish that part of his campaign because it's

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Speaker 2: easier to sort of just put him in a box

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Speaker 2: of he was just a black candidate for black.

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Speaker 1: People when we fell short, because you know, you talk

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Speaker 1: about a lot in the book about the unlikely coalition

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Speaker 1: he put together. Yeah, it seems unlikely back then, but

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Speaker 1: now it's like the norm, right, exactly the President Obama

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Speaker 1: did or what the BP tried to do. I mean

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Speaker 1: all candidates try to do it. Where did he fall

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Speaker 1: short back then?

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Speaker 2: You think there were a lot of things that happened.

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Speaker 2: I think some of them were his own mistakes, and

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Speaker 2: I write about those in the book. I mean, he

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Speaker 2: had a very big controversy with the Jewisler. Yeah, he

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Speaker 2: used a slur against Jews in private, and then it

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Speaker 2: became public and he had a hard time figuring out

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Speaker 2: how to deal with it and was slow in addressing it,

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Speaker 2: and that really dogged him, especially for the nineteen eighty

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Speaker 2: four campaign. But it had an impact on eighty eight two.

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Speaker 2: I think the other part of it was that he

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Speaker 2: was a true outsider candidate. He had almost no establishment support.

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Speaker 2: You know, he was like what Bernie Sanders was in

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Speaker 2: twenty sixteen, where nobody wanted to touch him among establishment Democrats,

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Speaker 2: and so it was harder for him to build a

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Speaker 2: real campaign that had the infrastructure that he needed to

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Speaker 2: take advantage of the momentum when he did encounter momentum.

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Speaker 2: But I would say the other thing is that he

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Speaker 2: was completely he discounted as a candidate. I mean I

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Speaker 2: went back and I read virtually everything that was written

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Speaker 2: about Jesse Jackson in those two campaigns, and the way

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Speaker 2: they talked about him as if he was a gadfly

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Speaker 2: candidate is you know, they really did not take him

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Speaker 2: seriously in the media, and back in that time, there

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Speaker 2: was no way to bypass the mainstream media. And I

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Speaker 2: do think a lot of times if he were running today,

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Speaker 2: I mean, he was such a master of the press,

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Speaker 2: of narrative, of really breaking through, but there was no Internet,

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Speaker 2: and if he had had that, I think it would

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Speaker 2: have been a different story because so much of his

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Speaker 2: message just never got to people.

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Speaker 1: That's a lot of the critique he gives to to

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Speaker 1: a lot of people say that he was just an

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Speaker 1: ambulance chasers to seek publicity. Like you know, there's an

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Speaker 1: infamous story about how he wiped Martin's blood on his shirt.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if that is even that's in the book.

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Speaker 2: Look so read. I mean you should. That part of

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Speaker 2: his story is and I'm glad you brought it up.

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Speaker 2: It's important because that is the double edged sword of

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Speaker 2: Jesse Jackson was that he was a chaser of attention

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Speaker 2: of cameras. He loved having a microphone in his face,

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Speaker 2: and it was both a gift and a curse. He

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Speaker 2: used it extremely well for decades and decades, and it

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Speaker 2: made him one of the most famous people in this

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Speaker 2: country for a time. But at the same time it

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Speaker 2: rubbed a lot of people the wrong way, including black people.

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Speaker 2: That yes, but yeah, in some cases, especially black people

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Speaker 2: were There are a lot of stories in the book

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Speaker 2: about why all of these people that he came up

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Speaker 2: with in the civil rights movement, all these elected political

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Speaker 2: leaders who were you know, they ran in the same circle.

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Speaker 2: Some of them were his friends, did not endorse his

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Speaker 2: campaigns and it was for a myriad of different reasons,

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Speaker 2: but I do think that a lot of people were

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Speaker 2: rubbed the wrong way by his constant attention seeking or

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Speaker 2: it seemed to be attention seeking. And I think that

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Speaker 2: even while you can recognize how important he was as

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Speaker 2: a figure, it's like all of these people, they're all

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Speaker 2: flawed in some really profound ways, but especially in this

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Speaker 2: particular way. I mean, any person who runs for president

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Speaker 2: has a massive ego, has a massive desire for attention,

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Speaker 2: and he fits into that category like a lot of

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Speaker 2: these other guys.

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Speaker 1: I don't mind it, though, because you know, we say

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Speaker 1: now one of the Democrats' biggest problems is not knowing

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Speaker 1: how to message. Yeah, not knowing how to communicate, not

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Speaker 1: knowing how to connect with people. Jesse did not have

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Speaker 1: that problem.

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Speaker 2: He did not. He was a master connector. I mean,

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Speaker 2: he really was, and I do think he probably got

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Speaker 2: more dogged for it than he deserved because that skill

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Speaker 2: was so rare at the time, and it's rare now.

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Speaker 2: I mean, he was a black man in the eighties

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Speaker 2: filling up stadiums of fifteen twenty thousand people. There are

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Speaker 2: many candidates right now to this day that absolutely cannot

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Speaker 2: do that and he was able to do it because

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Speaker 2: he had charisma, he could deliver a speech, he could

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Speaker 2: connect with people who were otherwise not that interested in

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Speaker 2: him as a candidate. And look, it's a skill, it's

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Speaker 2: a particular gift. And I think that gift was completely

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Speaker 2: you know, it was just kind of ignored at the time.

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Speaker 2: And I think we understand now how rare that is.

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Speaker 2: People like Obama have it, people like Donald Trump have it,

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Speaker 2: people like Bernie Sanders have it, but not that many

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Speaker 2: people have it, and he had it, and at that

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Speaker 2: time it was just kind of like, well, he's not

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Speaker 2: a serious candidate.

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Speaker 4: And the opening of your book, you have a quote

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Speaker 4: from Theodore Roosevelt right about criticism.

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Speaker 2: And the man in the arena.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, how do you think social media? Well, young people

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Speaker 4: growing up in the social media area these days, how

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Speaker 4: can he learn from a quote as strong as this one.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean the quote speaks to the fact that

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Speaker 2: the reason I chose it is because I think people

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Speaker 2: often throw stones at people who are in the arena

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Speaker 2: doing the work and getting bloodied up and muddied up

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Speaker 2: by doing the work, because it's really easy to be

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Speaker 2: on the outside and criticize, but by being in the arena,

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Speaker 2: you are actually doing the thing, and it's messy and

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Speaker 2: it doesn't require you to be perfect. And I thought

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Speaker 2: that was a good quote that kind of describes Jesse Jackson.

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Speaker 2: I wrote this book, and it paints the full picture

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Speaker 2: of this man in all his flaws and all his gifts.

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Speaker 2: But the one thing you have to say about him

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Speaker 2: is that he was in the arena. He was there

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Speaker 2: at all these different junctures. He was involved in nineteen

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Speaker 2: seventy two at the historic Black Political Convention in Gary, Indiana,

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Speaker 2: where black people gathered together and asked themselves, how do

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Speaker 2: we exercise our power? He was there in the eighties,

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Speaker 2: he was there in the nineties, So he was there

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Speaker 2: in all these moments. And I think it can be

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Speaker 2: very easy to criticize those people who seem to be

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Speaker 2: actually getting up off your couch and going and doing

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Speaker 2: something about what's happening in the world is something that

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Speaker 2: very few people do, and when they do it, we

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Speaker 2: should learn from them.

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Speaker 1: Do you feel that way being one of the few

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Speaker 1: black women on cable news with their own show, Especially you,

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Speaker 1: because you know you have your own ringbow collision that

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Speaker 1: you bring together every night with all of these different voices.

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Speaker 1: Do you feel like you get a lot of that,

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Speaker 1: a lot of criticism.

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Speaker 2: Look, I don't want to I don't want people to

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Speaker 2: misunderstand this. I am not at all saying that I

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Speaker 2: am at the caliber of people like Jesse or anybody

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Speaker 2: else who's really putting their body on the line to

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Speaker 2: make the world a better place. However, what you do

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Speaker 2: is important. But I play a role, like we all

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Speaker 2: have a role, and this is mine and I and

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Speaker 2: and in a way, yeah, people are very easy to

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Speaker 2: be like, well, she shouldn't give this person a platform,

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Speaker 2: she shouldn't do this, she shouldn't do that. And I

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Speaker 2: do think it's super easy to say that when you're

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Speaker 2: just at home, like watching the clips on your phone.

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Speaker 1: And this.

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Speaker 2: I've been covering politics a long time. This is a

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Speaker 2: time in our like political life, where we have to

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Speaker 2: really know what's going on, and we have to know

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Speaker 2: what everybody is saying on all sides of the issue,

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Speaker 2: because I don't think that ignorance has served anybody well.

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Speaker 2: And particularly I get a lot of criticism from the

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Speaker 2: left from people who are like, why does she have

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Speaker 2: maga people on the show, and it's like, well, you

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Speaker 2: should know what they're saying, because just so you know,

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Speaker 2: half the country voted for Trump and for trump Ism,

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Speaker 2: and it's not helpful to be completely unaware of what

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Speaker 2: is happening in those media ecosystems. So I personally think

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Speaker 2: it's super important and I want the debate, like we

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Speaker 2: need to have that debate. I want it to be

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Speaker 2: right there, out in the open. And I also think

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Speaker 2: that it's important for people on both sides to practice

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Speaker 2: being challenged, because what we've found on the show is

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Speaker 2: that a lot of people are not used to being challenged,

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Speaker 2: and when they have somebody literally staring them in the

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Speaker 2: face saying I disagree with you, for some people, they're

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Speaker 2: like really taken aback, Like they don't really know how

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Speaker 2: to deal with that, how to counter it, how to

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Speaker 2: a really important skill in our politics, that we can

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Speaker 2: go back and forth on the issues and we can

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Speaker 2: really hash it out. And I, you know, I'll take

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Speaker 2: the criticism from all sides, but I am very proud

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Speaker 2: of what we do because I think that very few

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Speaker 2: people are willing to do it. Very few people are

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Speaker 2: willing to take the chance of even being criticized, and

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Speaker 2: I don't mind it, like that's part of the job.

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Speaker 3: What about because I know with your show there's some

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Speaker 3: moments that are like very hard hitting, right, what about

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Speaker 3: when that becomes like too much for you? Because I've

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Speaker 3: seen people step away from those debate style shows because

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Speaker 3: it personally becomes too much and is triggering for them,

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Speaker 3: especially for black women. How do you kind of cause

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Speaker 3: you get back up and do it again the next day? Like,

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Speaker 3: what is your that's my responsibility. I unfortunately can't step away,

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Speaker 3: but I understand when people do, and I actually think

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Speaker 3: that is totally good and healthy. I think it's important

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Speaker 3: to know your limits. And you know what, the good

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Speaker 3: news about me not being able to step away is

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Speaker 3: that it's my show and I can draw the lines

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Speaker 3: when I need to draw the lines. And if you watch,

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Speaker 3: as I know you do, like you've seen the times

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Speaker 3: when I've had to draw some lines at the table,

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Speaker 3: And I don't do it that often because I want

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Speaker 3: it to be not that common because when I do,

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Speaker 3: it's like when you're.

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Speaker 2: You know, really tells you it's time to stop. That's

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Speaker 2: kind of how I want it to be where it's

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Speaker 2: not like that happens all the time. But you know

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Speaker 2: that when I've reached my limit, it's the end, that's

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Speaker 2: the limit. And I think that's that I can because

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Speaker 2: I'm the host. I can draw those lines around the

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Speaker 2: kind of conduct that I will accept at the table.

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Speaker 2: And I have control over who shows up and who doesn't.

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Speaker 1: And so.

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Speaker 2: For me, I take that on the weight of having

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Speaker 2: to show up every single day. But I don't discount

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Speaker 2: any person saying I need to take a break. It's need,

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Speaker 2: I need a moment, because I think that's actually healthy

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Speaker 2: for all of us, that we we should take care

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Speaker 2: of ourselves and our own well being even while we

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Speaker 2: try to stay engaged. And I fully, I fully support

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Speaker 2: that and and I and I also will say or

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Speaker 2: that I think there are definitely people who crossed the

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Speaker 2: line and that's part of the dynamic that is not

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Speaker 2: within our control. And and that's okay. I mean I think, well, look,

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Speaker 2: I mean the more the most maybe the most famous

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Speaker 2: one was the well, yeah there was Jillian Michaels, but

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Speaker 2: I you know, you know, I'll say, honestly, Jillian Michaels

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Speaker 2: crossed the line in the sense that she said something

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Speaker 2: that was kind of embarrassing and we addressed it, but

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Speaker 2: we never said to her, you're not welcome back.

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Speaker 1: And I don't think she crossed the line.

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Speaker 2: I just think she's, yeah, that's her. She made a

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Speaker 2: decision not to want to come back. But yeah, she

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Speaker 2: The thing about that was that she actually was talking

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Speaker 2: about something that was important for us for people to

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Speaker 2: be aware of was actually happening. Because right after she

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Speaker 2: said what she said about slavery and how it's overemphasized

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Speaker 2: at museums and the Smithsonian guests who said the same

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Speaker 2: thing the president. So if you had watched our show

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Speaker 2: a couple of days before, you would have known what

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Speaker 2: was coming. And it's not just that she said it,

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Speaker 2: but the President said it, and then it actually became

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Speaker 2: the policy that they're trying to implement at the White House.

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Speaker 2: So I thought it was actually super important that that

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Speaker 2: was put out there because I think people were not

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Speaker 2: aware of the extent to which slavery was the core

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Speaker 2: thing that they were mad about in terms of how

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Speaker 2: it was being represented in our museums. So she again,

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Speaker 2: I think you're right. I don't think that we I

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Speaker 2: just would describe that as crossing the line, but we

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Speaker 2: addressed it as an important conversation that needed to be

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Speaker 2: factually addressed. But there was another incident with a person

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Speaker 2: who was on the show who said to another guest

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Speaker 2: that a Muslim guest that their pager would go on

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Speaker 2: to medi It was a reference to the Israeli they'd

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Speaker 2: like put bomb materials in pagers of the houthy terrorists

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Speaker 2: and they went off. And that was an actual line

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Speaker 2: that was crossed, because you wishing death on a guest

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Speaker 2: on the show is completely unacceptable. And he was told,

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Speaker 2: and I said publicly on the show. He was not

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Speaker 2: invited back. And so there are lines that are crossed,

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Speaker 2: and I think people understand that I'll draw them when

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Speaker 2: they need to be drawn, but I also think that

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Speaker 2: we want to have real conversations. Sometimes they get a

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Speaker 2: little bit messy, and that's okay, but I also think,

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Speaker 2: you know, disrespecting people in a way that is inhumane,

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Speaker 2: or you know, just there are some lines that we

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Speaker 2: don't want to cross, and we'll draw those lines publicly

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Speaker 2: and I'll let everybody know what's going on. But for

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Speaker 2: the most part, we're not We're trying to encourage speech,

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Speaker 2: not trying to squelch it.

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Speaker 1: The thing that buzzed me out about your show is

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Speaker 1: people will say, you know, they'll talk about Scott Jennings

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Speaker 1: or the Kevin O'Leary's or you know the guy who

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Speaker 1: said made the comments to Meddi Hussan. But you have

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Speaker 1: Anna Casparian on there, and Nina Turner and Teslin Figureo

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Speaker 1: and Bakari Seller's and Tiffany Cross and Meddi Hassan and

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Speaker 1: Michael Eric Dyson and child'swell, all of these powerful people

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Speaker 1: with powerful voices who push back on all of that nonsense.

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Speaker 1: I don't understand why nobody ever highlights that you have

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Speaker 1: voices on TV that don't get on TV. Teslann figure

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Speaker 1: is only they only put our own Fox movies, Anna,

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Speaker 1: it's only on the Young Turks Nework. They don't put

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Speaker 1: these people on telephone.

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Speaker 2: We look for people to bring on who bring a different,

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Speaker 2: unique perspective. That's the whole idea is that people like

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Speaker 2: Anna and Teslin and others, when we bring them on

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Speaker 2: the table, it's because we don't we don't want just

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Speaker 2: like the typical talking head that you hear on television.

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Speaker 2: Because I also think that what they do is they

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Speaker 2: represent more people. They represent regular people and how they think.

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Speaker 2: And one of the things that I love about the show,

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Speaker 2: because I hear it from people when I go out

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Speaker 2: into the country, is that they watch and when they

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Speaker 2: hear something, regardless of what part of the political perspective

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Speaker 2: they're on, they'll say, yeah, that's what I was thinking.

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Speaker 2: And I want people to think that that their POV

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Speaker 2: is their point of view, is represented at the table

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Speaker 2: in some way. And so yeah, we try to find unique, new, interesting, dynamic,

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Speaker 2: energetic voices, people who are smart, people who can get

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Speaker 2: in there in the conversation and are not passive. They're

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Speaker 2: actively listening, they're actively responding, they're thinking on their feet,

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Speaker 2: they're not just regurgitating talking points. We don't get there

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Speaker 2: every single day, but that's the goal that we try

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Speaker 2: to get at. And so yeah, we on both sides

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Speaker 2: of the aisle, by the way, because we also look

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Speaker 2: for fresh voices on the right, because I just think

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Speaker 2: that there's people are tired of the same old, same old,

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Speaker 2: the kind of talking past each other where you know,

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Speaker 2: one person is saying one thing and then the other

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Speaker 2: person is saying another and they're not ever responding to

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Speaker 2: each other, and the ideas that are put on the table,

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Speaker 2: and we try to move past that because I think

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Speaker 2: it's not that interesting to be doing that in this

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Speaker 2: day and age. And what I am also really proud

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Speaker 2: of is that we get into the actual issues. We're

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Speaker 2: not just talking about the politics and how it's going

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Speaker 2: to play with the right and how it's going to

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Speaker 2: play with the left. I'm going to ask you who

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Speaker 2: are tariffs really helping and who are they really hurting,

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Speaker 2: And like we're going to talk about the actual issue,

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Speaker 2: not just quote unquote how it plays, because I think

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Speaker 2: that's kind of like a lazy way to approach real

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Speaker 2: issues that have an impact on people's real lives. Nobody

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Speaker 2: cares how it plays. They want to know how it's

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Speaker 2: affecting their actual pocketbook.

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Speaker 4: What you had dedicated this book to your daughter and

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Speaker 4: your two parents. I wanted to ask you a question

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Speaker 4: you said to my daughter, Naomi, who showed me?

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Speaker 1: How?

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Speaker 4: How did your daughter show you how?

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Speaker 2: What you mean? I never knew how much I could

437
00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 2: do until I had my daughter. And I think I

438
00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:39,720
Speaker 2: know a lot of mom's parents can relate to that

439
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 2: that I was probably limiting myself before I had her,

440
00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:51,320
Speaker 2: because being a parent, You're like doing so much every

441
00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:57,639
Speaker 2: single day, and there's nothing more motivating than your child.

442
00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:00,639
Speaker 2: There is nothing that wakes me up up faster in

443
00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:04,359
Speaker 2: the morning than my daughter and knowing that I have

444
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:07,640
Speaker 2: to get up and adam not only to put food

445
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 2: on the table and a roof over her head, but

446
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:14,000
Speaker 2: to show her what it means to work really hard.

447
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 2: And I started working on this book like two months

448
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 2: before I found out that I was pregnant with her.

449
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,960
Speaker 2: It was kind of a surprise, yeah, and I was like,

450
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:28,760
Speaker 2: oh my god, what am I going to do? And

451
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:33,240
Speaker 2: then the morning sickness hit and then I was launching

452
00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:36,439
Speaker 2: a show and I was like, I don't know if

453
00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:39,159
Speaker 2: I can do this, but I did. But I did it.

454
00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:43,639
Speaker 2: And then when she was born and I was trying

455
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:46,920
Speaker 2: to raise a newborn as a first time mom and

456
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:49,800
Speaker 2: then trying to work on this book, the thing that

457
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:52,440
Speaker 2: kept me going was that I cannot quit on this

458
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 2: for her. And so, yeah, she showed me how to

459
00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:02,639
Speaker 2: do the things that I set out to do, and

460
00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:09,000
Speaker 2: everything that I start, I finish because of her. Because

461
00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 2: that's what we have to do for our kids, is

462
00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 2: to like we are showing them the way. And she

463
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:16,840
Speaker 2: watches me, and you know, she knows, like mommy's going

464
00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:19,480
Speaker 2: to a speech, Mommy's going to an event. You know,

465
00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:24,720
Speaker 2: she like she really she clocks it. She recognizes everything

466
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:29,320
Speaker 2: that I'm doing, and it's in that brain somewhere. And

467
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:31,560
Speaker 2: I know that when ten years from now she's four,

468
00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 2: and now ten years from now, fifteen years from now,

469
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:37,680
Speaker 2: that's going to be her normal. And that's what I want.

470
00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:39,879
Speaker 1: Is expensive, so.

471
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:49,480
Speaker 2: It's ridiculous out here to raise and educate a child.

472
00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:53,200
Speaker 2: So yes, that is so powerful. I do love you

473
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:55,400
Speaker 2: shed light on that. For me, that's really dope.

474
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I wanted to ask you to write when

475
00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:00,919
Speaker 1: you did get the backlash from the Jillian Michael's thing.

476
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:04,040
Speaker 1: There's a lot of people making comments, and social media

477
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:06,560
Speaker 1: is one thing, but when the comments come from people

478
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:10,000
Speaker 1: you actually know, like whether it's other, whether it's prominent writer,

479
00:28:12,080 --> 00:28:14,520
Speaker 1: no name, But how did that make you feel?

480
00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:21,920
Speaker 2: I think it was disappointing because I really hope that

481
00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:27,560
Speaker 2: we understand how important it is for people to be

482
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:31,359
Speaker 2: free to say things that other people disagree with, because

483
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:36,000
Speaker 2: when the tables turn, we want that ability. And I

484
00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:39,000
Speaker 2: also think it does not do us any favors to

485
00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:44,640
Speaker 2: pretend like a lot of people don't agree with Jillian Michaels,

486
00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,600
Speaker 2: and that it's an opportunity for us to correct the record,

487
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:52,640
Speaker 2: educate you, to educate, to inform, to put facts on

488
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:57,800
Speaker 2: the table. And I know, can I be real, I

489
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,760
Speaker 2: know black people who agree with Jillian Michaels. I've heard,

490
00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:04,480
Speaker 2: and not just recently. This is a her talking point

491
00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,240
Speaker 2: about how slavery existed all in the world, and we

492
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:09,600
Speaker 2: overemphasize it here in the United States. I have had

493
00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:13,800
Speaker 2: black people say that to me, you know, ten years ago,

494
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:16,160
Speaker 2: fifteen years ago. So it's not like this is a

495
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:18,840
Speaker 2: new talking point. She didn't invent this out of nowhere.

496
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:21,560
Speaker 2: So it's an opportunity for us to correct it. And

497
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:25,920
Speaker 2: I feel like people who if you call yourself a journalist,

498
00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:30,240
Speaker 2: you should never I don't think we should be in

499
00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:33,480
Speaker 2: the business of saying it would be better for us

500
00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:35,720
Speaker 2: to just not hear the thing that we disagree with.

501
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:39,600
Speaker 2: It is an opportunity for us to do what we're

502
00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:44,320
Speaker 2: supposed to do, which is to actually give people something

503
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 2: real to counter it with, gives people facts to arm

504
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:52,560
Speaker 2: themselves with. That is what our job is as journalists.

505
00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, Andrew gillim say he never he said this.

506
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:56,720
Speaker 1: When we did it was the night of the election.

507
00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 1: Maybe it was a couple weeksly armament, but he was

508
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 1: talking about in reference to your he said, I never

509
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 1: want to be blindsided about what the other side is

510
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 1: thinking ever. Again. Absolutely, And then I think about that,

511
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:10,480
Speaker 1: and I also think about and think about somebody. Think

512
00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:14,040
Speaker 1: about an eight year old child or a fifteen year

513
00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:16,440
Speaker 1: old child that might be just up watching CNN one

514
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 1: night or see that clip go viral. If there's nobody

515
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 1: there to correct that woman Jillian in that moment, they

516
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:24,680
Speaker 1: might believe that too. They might take that information and

517
00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:27,200
Speaker 1: run with it. So you need people there to educate.

518
00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:29,760
Speaker 1: I don't know why they're upset because you platform both.

519
00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:33,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, and look, there's a whole As you know,

520
00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:37,280
Speaker 2: the media is so fragmented right now. Everybody is consuming

521
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:41,600
Speaker 2: media in their own silence, and a lot of people

522
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:45,200
Speaker 2: on the left, liberals or whatever, they have no idea

523
00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:50,960
Speaker 2: what's being said in those conservative ecosystems. And one of

524
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:53,240
Speaker 2: the things that we do is sort of try to

525
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:58,400
Speaker 2: merge those information lanes a little bit more so that

526
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,720
Speaker 2: we're actually hearing each other and so that you're not blindsided,

527
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:04,000
Speaker 2: because there's a whole other world that's happening over here

528
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 2: that you don't even know about, and you don't find

529
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:10,160
Speaker 2: out about until people vote, and by that point it's

530
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:14,640
Speaker 2: too late. So there should be more of this happening

531
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:20,240
Speaker 2: where we hear each other. We're able to put fight

532
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:25,360
Speaker 2: fight if information with information, put facts facts against facts,

533
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:29,560
Speaker 2: and have people pick, based on their own judgment, what

534
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:34,960
Speaker 2: makes the most sense. And I trust people enough to

535
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:39,959
Speaker 2: do that. I have enough respect for other human beings

536
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 2: that they can make decisions on their own. But I

537
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 2: do think that it requires that we really understand what

538
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:48,280
Speaker 2: we're even talking about, and so I don't you know,

539
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,040
Speaker 2: I mean, look, it is a disappointing, yes, But I

540
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:55,200
Speaker 2: also think that many of the people who criticize what

541
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:58,640
Speaker 2: we do spend a lot of time just talking to

542
00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:01,360
Speaker 2: other people who agree with them. And that's a choice,

543
00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 2: but it's not a choice that I'm making. And I

544
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:08,440
Speaker 2: think actually a lot of people want to know, They

545
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:09,320
Speaker 2: actually do want to know.

546
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:12,960
Speaker 3: How do you feel when people say that CNN is

547
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 3: a network that just does what you just said you

548
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:18,200
Speaker 3: don't want to do, Like your show is different because

549
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:20,440
Speaker 3: you bring on these different voices but I've even seen

550
00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 3: people say that they feel like sometimes the other voices

551
00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:24,360
Speaker 3: that are brought on are kind of brought on just

552
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:27,120
Speaker 3: because they have to be there, not because like anybody

553
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:29,040
Speaker 3: truly wants them there because CNN is known to be

554
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:31,280
Speaker 3: or people think CNN always leans one way.

555
00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 1: How do you feel about that it does?

556
00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:35,280
Speaker 3: Well, mean, yeah, and it's your network, so yeah, don't

557
00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 3: I mean, well, look, I would say it's fair to

558
00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:43,479
Speaker 3: say that that CNN we're not Fox News, but we're

559
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 3: also not MSNBC.

560
00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 2: We're true, we're probably center left, and I think that

561
00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:52,000
Speaker 2: has a lot to do with our audience. But we

562
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:58,040
Speaker 2: watch when you actually watch CNN, we have Republicans on

563
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:05,600
Speaker 2: every hour of the day, every single one, I'm pretty sure,

564
00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:09,320
Speaker 2: maybe with very few exceptions, but virtually every hour of

565
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:13,120
Speaker 2: the day. So they're not always on in the context

566
00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:16,560
Speaker 2: that we put them on. But we as a network

567
00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:20,000
Speaker 2: have a diversity of viewpoints on the air, more so

568
00:33:20,920 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 2: than our competitors. And so, I mean, liberal media is

569
00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:31,760
Speaker 2: a criticism that I think we hear a lot, but

570
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 2: there's also way more liberal media and way more conservative media,

571
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:40,000
Speaker 2: and so I don't, I don't know, I don't put

572
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:42,840
Speaker 2: that much stock in it. I think it's I think

573
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:45,360
Speaker 2: it's it's a little bit of reflection of the cable

574
00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:49,320
Speaker 2: news audience. But I also think that there are extremes

575
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:51,240
Speaker 2: on both sides, and we're not in the extreme.

576
00:33:51,960 --> 00:33:53,680
Speaker 1: I think, real quick long. I think another thing is

577
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 1: that y'all show conservatives who aren't necessarily maga like the

578
00:33:57,600 --> 00:34:00,240
Speaker 1: se Cups of the world that Adam Kinsinger there is

579
00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:00,800
Speaker 1: a range.

580
00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 2: Las week, I believed, well, no, no, not, Yeah, he's

581
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:09,240
Speaker 2: on MSNBC. But there's there is a range to your point,

582
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:12,640
Speaker 2: and it's not just you know, there are mega conservatives.

583
00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:16,400
Speaker 2: There are people like se and Melissa Fara who are

584
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:21,040
Speaker 2: sort of somewhat anti Trump Republicans. We have libertarian people,

585
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:27,279
Speaker 2: we have progressives, we have just establishment democrats. There is

586
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 2: a range of political views and we tried to have

587
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 2: them represented in one way, shape or form. We have

588
00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:39,800
Speaker 2: people who I cannot put them in a box. I

589
00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:43,600
Speaker 2: don't like, I don't know how to describe their political views.

590
00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:46,120
Speaker 2: We bring those people on, but we also bring on

591
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:49,720
Speaker 2: people who are just not you know, we have Roywood

592
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:52,960
Speaker 2: Junior on all the time. We have Wendell Pierce comes on,

593
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,680
Speaker 2: like we bring on people who are Yes, just people

594
00:34:56,719 --> 00:35:01,879
Speaker 2: who are just insightful and smart, and you know, they're

595
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:06,040
Speaker 2: just interesting and they bring depth to the conversation and

596
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:09,040
Speaker 2: they put things on the table that regular that like

597
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:12,680
Speaker 2: the classic New York and DC types don't put on

598
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:16,719
Speaker 2: the table. And so I think that we are so

599
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:20,400
Speaker 2: much more multi dimensional than left and right, than Democrat

600
00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:24,359
Speaker 2: and Republican, and that should be better reflected. And who

601
00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:25,480
Speaker 2: talks on television.

602
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 3: H you brought up a this was like a I

603
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:29,960
Speaker 3: think it was like a few weeks ago you were

604
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:32,800
Speaker 3: talking about cancel culture, and I saw people reacting to

605
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:34,719
Speaker 3: this too. You said that liberals need to take more

606
00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:38,120
Speaker 3: honest for where cancel culture went wrong, and this was

607
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:41,400
Speaker 3: after Kimmel was pulled from air. Yeah, there's been a

608
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:44,160
Speaker 3: lot of conversation about if cancel culture is even a

609
00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:46,400
Speaker 3: real thing at this point. Yeah, but where do you

610
00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:49,160
Speaker 3: think the liberals went wrong with cancel culture?

611
00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:54,480
Speaker 2: I think that there were some specific moments, you know,

612
00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:59,600
Speaker 2: not just around race, by the way, but even around

613
00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:07,279
Speaker 2: you know, around COVID, around other things where whatever, Yeah,

614
00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:11,520
Speaker 2: whatever you want to call it. I I'm not endorsing

615
00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 2: any viewpoints that are right or wrong, but I think

616
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 2: it's asking the question, should people be forced out of

617
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 2: their jobs or you know, should the should the weight

618
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:29,640
Speaker 2: of sort of public opinion force people out of their

619
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:32,320
Speaker 2: livelihoods because of things that they say, maybe because of

620
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:34,680
Speaker 2: mistakes that they make. I think it is just a

621
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 2: fair conversation to have, because, as we saw when Charlie

622
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 2: Kirk was assassinated, you had people making comments on Facebook

623
00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:50,480
Speaker 2: about how they didn't like what he said and then

624
00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:57,240
Speaker 2: losing their jobs over it. The government pulled people's visas

625
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:03,600
Speaker 2: and revoked their citizenship over comments like that, and I

626
00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:06,839
Speaker 2: just think globally, look, I think one of the criticisms

627
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:11,759
Speaker 2: of me making that point was that even long before this,

628
00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:15,040
Speaker 2: there was cancel culture in the eighties and the nineties,

629
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:18,720
Speaker 2: and I think that's one hundred percent true. But shouldn't

630
00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:20,759
Speaker 2: we evolve to a point where we don't do this

631
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:25,160
Speaker 2: kind of thing anymore where we think really hard about

632
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:29,400
Speaker 2: what is the bar for us to say you should

633
00:37:29,440 --> 00:37:34,399
Speaker 2: be run out of society for something that you said,

634
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:37,319
Speaker 2: for an opinion that you have. And I think that's

635
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 2: a fair question to ask. Look, I don't think we

636
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:45,520
Speaker 2: should be operating based on what was done to us

637
00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:48,719
Speaker 2: in the past, because I think if we do that

638
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:50,839
Speaker 2: we're just it's like a ball rolling down a hill.

639
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,279
Speaker 2: We're only going to dig ourselves deeper and deeper into

640
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:56,320
Speaker 2: a hole that we cannot get out of. And I

641
00:37:56,400 --> 00:37:58,560
Speaker 2: think every single one of you would want to be

642
00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:01,560
Speaker 2: able to say I disagree with X, Y and Z

643
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:04,640
Speaker 2: person and not lose your job over it. Absolutely, So

644
00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 2: that's the only point I was making that the principle

645
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:11,200
Speaker 2: here is not that we want to be able to

646
00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:13,759
Speaker 2: do what they did to us. The principle is that

647
00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:16,759
Speaker 2: people ought to be allowed to say things that other

648
00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:22,960
Speaker 2: people disagree with without risking losing their livelihood and their

649
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:28,040
Speaker 2: jobs over an opinion or even a mistake. That sometimes

650
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:33,160
Speaker 2: people make mistakes, they say things that they regret, and

651
00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:38,440
Speaker 2: people should be allowed to make mistakes and atone for

652
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:42,399
Speaker 2: them without their lives being completely ruined forever. I think

653
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 2: we would want that for us, and I think we

654
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:45,279
Speaker 2: would want that for people we disagree with.

655
00:38:46,680 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 4: My last question is, going back to your book, is

656
00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:53,920
Speaker 4: there a politician that you see today right that you

657
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:56,600
Speaker 4: would say as a reflection of Jesse Jackson's legacy.

658
00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:01,640
Speaker 2: You know, what I would say is that there are

659
00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:05,880
Speaker 2: there are several politicians that are influenced by Jesse Jackson,

660
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:10,759
Speaker 2: but none of them have so far proven that they

661
00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:15,239
Speaker 2: can actually do what he sought out to do and

662
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:19,759
Speaker 2: be successful at it. So I would say that, you know,

663
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:24,719
Speaker 2: Bernie Sanders is a Jacksonian politician in the way that

664
00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:29,640
Speaker 2: he talks about economic issues. AOC is like the next

665
00:39:29,760 --> 00:39:32,280
Speaker 2: level of that she brings in the sort of social

666
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:36,000
Speaker 2: justice piece that I think is lower on the list

667
00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:41,080
Speaker 2: of priorities for someone like Bernie Sanders. And I think

668
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 2: so I think that there are there's sort of like

669
00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:48,920
Speaker 2: this new generation of populist politician who are talking about

670
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:52,000
Speaker 2: issues in the way that he did, basically arguing to

671
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:56,320
Speaker 2: voters that the system isn't set up for you, that

672
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:59,920
Speaker 2: it's not you know, it's sort of like this idea

673
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:05,160
Speaker 2: that as working people, the system is set up for

674
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:07,920
Speaker 2: the rich and the powerful and the corporations. That's the

675
00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:10,560
Speaker 2: type of message of Jesse Jackson hatt and you hear

676
00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:13,120
Speaker 2: that in a lot of other politicians. But to me,

677
00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 2: the thing that's been missing from so many of them

678
00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 2: is being able to bring together the diverse coalition. Because

679
00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:22,880
Speaker 2: if you're a Democrat and you're trying to run for

680
00:40:23,600 --> 00:40:27,120
Speaker 2: a national office and you can't rally black people and

681
00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:30,120
Speaker 2: Hispanic people and Asian Americans and like the whole coalition

682
00:40:30,280 --> 00:40:33,080
Speaker 2: you're going to fail. You're going to fail. And that's

683
00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:36,279
Speaker 2: where Bernie Sanders went wrong, is that he never really

684
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:39,400
Speaker 2: was able to get people of color on board. He

685
00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:41,879
Speaker 2: had the economic piece, but he didn't have the other piece.

686
00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:45,040
Speaker 2: And so I think the book kind of has a

687
00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:48,160
Speaker 2: question mark at the end of it because it's a

688
00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:51,520
Speaker 2: real question are there any politicians who can do both

689
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:53,839
Speaker 2: of those things at the same time, Because that's what's

690
00:40:53,920 --> 00:40:57,600
Speaker 2: required in order to build a true coalition in the

691
00:40:57,680 --> 00:41:01,160
Speaker 2: Democrat In today's Democratic Party, you can't have one without

692
00:41:01,239 --> 00:41:03,839
Speaker 2: the other. You can't have the economic piece without the other,

693
00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:07,359
Speaker 2: and so it's I think it's an open question who's

694
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:08,000
Speaker 2: going to be able.

695
00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:08,160
Speaker 1: To do that.

696
00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:11,160
Speaker 4: Are you doing an audio version?

697
00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:13,080
Speaker 2: Yes, I did it. I did it, and it'll be

698
00:41:13,120 --> 00:41:16,279
Speaker 2: available for people like me who don't have time to

699
00:41:16,360 --> 00:41:17,560
Speaker 2: carry around a book.

700
00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:20,240
Speaker 4: Just love to hear you speak, because, to be honest,

701
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:23,360
Speaker 4: your voice has a calmness to it that would be

702
00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:25,880
Speaker 4: great for me to learn all of this stuff, you

703
00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:27,200
Speaker 4: know what I'm saying, Like a lot of stuff that

704
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,160
Speaker 4: I don't know, Like, yeah, your voice is really calling

705
00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:31,440
Speaker 4: thank you thank you.

706
00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 1: Did you get what school did you go to? And everything?

707
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 1: And did you always want to be, you know, doing

708
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:35,759
Speaker 1: what you're doing.

709
00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:40,879
Speaker 2: I went to Harvard or whatever I went. But look,

710
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:44,759
Speaker 2: I I grew up in Booie, Maryland. Okay, I'm a

711
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:50,560
Speaker 2: PG girl, and I went to Bowie High School. I

712
00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 2: just I was a real nerd. I worked really hard

713
00:41:54,640 --> 00:41:56,919
Speaker 2: and I got into Harvard and that really changed my life.

714
00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:01,160
Speaker 2: But the reason I ended up as a journalists is because,

715
00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 2: first of all, I always loved politics, but I didn't

716
00:42:04,040 --> 00:42:06,160
Speaker 2: know I didn't want to be in politics. I don't

717
00:42:06,280 --> 00:42:11,800
Speaker 2: like to be honest, I don't like politicians. But I

718
00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:14,440
Speaker 2: love current events. I love history, I love government. And

719
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:16,400
Speaker 2: when I was in college, I went on a civil

720
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:19,600
Speaker 2: rights and service tour to We started in Memphis at

721
00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:23,280
Speaker 2: the Lorraine Motel. We went to Mississippi, and we traveled

722
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:25,800
Speaker 2: around to all these different sites and I blogged about

723
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:28,360
Speaker 2: it and it was like a bug like.

724
00:42:29,480 --> 00:42:29,920
Speaker 1: I was so.

725
00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 2: Convinced by the power of the people who were journalists

726
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:39,040
Speaker 2: at that time and took the things that were happening

727
00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:41,759
Speaker 2: in these tiny towns and brought it to the entire

728
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:45,919
Speaker 2: country and really helped change the trajectory of civil rights

729
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:49,600
Speaker 2: in the country, and I really identified with that, and

730
00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:53,120
Speaker 2: I identified with the power of being there to tell history,

731
00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:56,880
Speaker 2: and that changed everything for me. And at that point

732
00:42:56,960 --> 00:43:00,279
Speaker 2: I decided that I wanted to be in journalism, and

733
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:01,800
Speaker 2: I decided to pursue it.

734
00:43:01,920 --> 00:43:02,799
Speaker 1: And I.

735
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:08,400
Speaker 2: Got kind of lucky that my first job was at

736
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:13,040
Speaker 2: kind of a startup Politico, which now is not a

737
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:16,320
Speaker 2: startup anymore, but at the time it was, and I

738
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:18,640
Speaker 2: was their very first class of interns, and they just

739
00:43:18,719 --> 00:43:22,440
Speaker 2: kind of let me do whatever and gave me an

740
00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:25,800
Speaker 2: extraordinary amount of opportunity. They hired me after college. I

741
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:29,760
Speaker 2: was covering the Obama White House. I have a late birthday,

742
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:33,239
Speaker 2: so I was twenty one when I was out there,

743
00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:36,840
Speaker 2: literally at the White House in the briefing room, and

744
00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:41,239
Speaker 2: so they gave me an incredible opportunity to dive right

745
00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:44,920
Speaker 2: into national politics. And I've been doing it ever since,

746
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:49,040
Speaker 2: and the medium has changed. I've gone from print to television,

747
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:54,040
Speaker 2: but you know, I've covered two presidents, I've covered several

748
00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:57,840
Speaker 2: presidential campaigns. I've done a lot in politics, and I

749
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:02,680
Speaker 2: think it's all culminated to this moment where I have

750
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:05,640
Speaker 2: an opportunity to help people, not just tell people what

751
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:08,640
Speaker 2: is happening, but help them understand it, because I think

752
00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:13,840
Speaker 2: that people are over they're oversaturated with just all the

753
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:18,080
Speaker 2: stuff that's happening, and they need a lot of help

754
00:44:18,840 --> 00:44:22,080
Speaker 2: just understanding what really matters, what should break through to them.

755
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:23,680
Speaker 2: And that's what I get to do in my job

756
00:44:23,760 --> 00:44:24,040
Speaker 2: right now.

757
00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:26,120
Speaker 1: I've heard people say things like, you know, you're the

758
00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:29,680
Speaker 1: future of CNN, but you know, how do you handle

759
00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:32,719
Speaker 1: being labeled at when legacy media itself is kind of

760
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:34,360
Speaker 1: like fighting to stay relevant.

761
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:37,399
Speaker 2: Yes, we are fighting for our lives out there. I mean, look,

762
00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:41,640
Speaker 2: I think in the media, everybody is fighting for attention.

763
00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:46,640
Speaker 2: It doesn't matter what medium you're in, and so we're

764
00:44:46,719 --> 00:44:50,920
Speaker 2: in that. We're in that fight alongside everybody else. But

765
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:54,440
Speaker 2: television isn't really going anywhere. It's just that we have

766
00:44:54,560 --> 00:44:57,200
Speaker 2: to evolve with people. We have to meet them where

767
00:44:57,239 --> 00:45:01,279
Speaker 2: they are and both the method that we talk to people,

768
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:07,120
Speaker 2: but also the content. And I'm really grateful that we

769
00:45:08,080 --> 00:45:09,839
Speaker 2: about a year ago, a little over a year ago

770
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:12,960
Speaker 2: is when we started to do my show this way,

771
00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:16,400
Speaker 2: and I'm really kind of grateful that we did because

772
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:20,359
Speaker 2: it really speaks to what people are looking for, which

773
00:45:20,400 --> 00:45:22,160
Speaker 2: I know you talk about a lot Charlemagne, which is

774
00:45:22,520 --> 00:45:25,920
Speaker 2: they're looking for more authenticity and media, and I think

775
00:45:26,040 --> 00:45:30,040
Speaker 2: legacy linear media has been very slow to that because

776
00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:36,000
Speaker 2: they don't want to sacrifice being authoritative for being relatable.

777
00:45:36,520 --> 00:45:38,320
Speaker 2: But I think that there's a way to do both,

778
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:41,440
Speaker 2: and there's a way to kind of give people information

779
00:45:42,080 --> 00:45:45,600
Speaker 2: while also speaking to them in a way that they

780
00:45:45,800 --> 00:45:51,120
Speaker 2: understand and leveling with them and identifying with them, or

781
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 2: putting people on TV who they identify with. And so

782
00:45:55,239 --> 00:45:59,800
Speaker 2: the innovation is happening, and CNN is going to be

783
00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:03,520
Speaker 2: streaming soon, so people who don't even have cable are

784
00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:07,759
Speaker 2: going to be able to literally just open up their

785
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:10,440
Speaker 2: app and pay a small monthly fee and you can

786
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:15,000
Speaker 2: watch it. And that's the future. And we're on Instagram

787
00:46:15,239 --> 00:46:18,800
Speaker 2: and you know, these our clips go crazy viral because

788
00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:22,560
Speaker 2: that's how people are consuming information. I mean, I wish

789
00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:25,520
Speaker 2: they watched the whole show, but I also appreciate that

790
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:30,320
Speaker 2: people who don't even watch TV are seeing what happens

791
00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:35,160
Speaker 2: on the show because cable TV still remains incredibly relevant.

792
00:46:35,520 --> 00:46:38,560
Speaker 2: That to me tells me what the relevance is. People

793
00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:40,719
Speaker 2: may not be turning on their TV every night at

794
00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:43,320
Speaker 2: the same time, but the clips are getting millions of

795
00:46:43,480 --> 00:46:47,399
Speaker 2: use because they still think it's important when they see

796
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:50,920
Speaker 2: something with a CNN logo on it that there's some

797
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:55,839
Speaker 2: authoritativeness there. So we still have that responsibility, but where

798
00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:57,960
Speaker 2: we have to evolve, just like everybody else does.

799
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:02,040
Speaker 3: What media changing, and it's now because media is changing

800
00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 3: politicians and politics is changing as well to in the

801
00:47:04,600 --> 00:47:07,640
Speaker 3: way that people speak to people. Kamala Hair said to

802
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:12,040
Speaker 3: BBC that she possibly may run again because I know

803
00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:14,239
Speaker 3: you were also very honest about what she did and

804
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:16,040
Speaker 3: do right and what you thought she did do right

805
00:47:16,080 --> 00:47:18,360
Speaker 3: when she ran. If she was to run again, like,

806
00:47:18,520 --> 00:47:20,200
Speaker 3: where does she meet in the middle with that? Because

807
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:21,680
Speaker 3: I think that's one of the things that fell off

808
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:24,200
Speaker 3: with her last campaign, is that that was happening with media,

809
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:26,839
Speaker 3: but she didn't meet us where some people were at

810
00:47:26,880 --> 00:47:28,920
Speaker 3: and speak straight to certain people. So what does she

811
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:30,560
Speaker 3: do this summer run and shoes she even run again?

812
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:33,319
Speaker 2: You know, I've been talking to a lot of people

813
00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:37,359
Speaker 2: about that because, as you know, this book was very controversial,

814
00:47:38,080 --> 00:47:41,720
Speaker 2: and it was even more controversial than you think in private.

815
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:45,680
Speaker 2: In private, I think there's a lot of controversy around

816
00:47:45,760 --> 00:47:48,520
Speaker 2: it because I think that there are a lot of

817
00:47:48,680 --> 00:47:51,840
Speaker 2: bridges that are burned here, whether she wanted to or not,

818
00:47:52,719 --> 00:47:55,799
Speaker 2: and I think it will be very difficult for her

819
00:47:56,120 --> 00:48:02,279
Speaker 2: to mend those fences that she'll need in order to

820
00:48:02,360 --> 00:48:05,239
Speaker 2: run if she just decided to run again. I think

821
00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:08,560
Speaker 2: this book read kind of like somebody who was kind

822
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:12,239
Speaker 2: of done with it. So I will be interested to

823
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,160
Speaker 2: see if she decides to do it. But one thing

824
00:48:15,239 --> 00:48:21,200
Speaker 2: I'll say, I mean, I think that she still has

825
00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:27,600
Speaker 2: to figure out how to tap into authenticity in how

826
00:48:27,640 --> 00:48:31,040
Speaker 2: she presents herself to the public, because this world is

827
00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:37,239
Speaker 2: not getting more kind to politicians who cannot level with

828
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:42,279
Speaker 2: voters and cannot show up any and everywhere. And you

829
00:48:42,360 --> 00:48:45,719
Speaker 2: know my Fred Astead Herndon, who just left the New

830
00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:47,440
Speaker 2: York Times but he's going to be at Vox. He

831
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:49,840
Speaker 2: just wrote a piece about zoron Mum Donnie, and he

832
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:51,640
Speaker 2: had this line that I think a lot of people

833
00:48:52,200 --> 00:48:54,799
Speaker 2: quoted that was about how politicians have to be able

834
00:48:54,840 --> 00:48:59,480
Speaker 2: to talk in thirty second bites, in three minute clips,

835
00:48:59,719 --> 00:49:03,759
Speaker 2: and in three hour interviews, and that's the future. You

836
00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:05,600
Speaker 2: have to be able to do it all. You have

837
00:49:05,680 --> 00:49:08,239
Speaker 2: to be able to show up in any medium, and

838
00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:11,960
Speaker 2: people get in a second who you are and what

839
00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:15,279
Speaker 2: you're about. And I think that she still has work

840
00:49:15,360 --> 00:49:18,600
Speaker 2: to do in that respect, and maybe this book is

841
00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:21,680
Speaker 2: the first kind of foray into that, because I read

842
00:49:21,719 --> 00:49:25,600
Speaker 2: her last book and the tone was completely different. This

843
00:49:25,719 --> 00:49:28,960
Speaker 2: is a different kind of book, and it was an

844
00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:32,920
Speaker 2: opening foray into her showing people more of herself. But

845
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:36,240
Speaker 2: she's going to have to catch up to the speed

846
00:49:37,320 --> 00:49:45,239
Speaker 2: and the kind of realness of media and politics. That

847
00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:48,880
Speaker 2: will be the bar in twenty twenty eight. Like in

848
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:51,560
Speaker 2: twenty twenty eight, the bar is going to be are

849
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:55,520
Speaker 2: you a politician that can show up any and everywhere

850
00:49:56,200 --> 00:50:00,359
Speaker 2: and authentically reach people? And I think she is still

851
00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:03,279
Speaker 2: straddling the old world and the new world, and she's

852
00:50:03,320 --> 00:50:04,880
Speaker 2: gonna have to figure out which one she wants to

853
00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:05,120
Speaker 2: be in.

854
00:50:05,480 --> 00:50:08,000
Speaker 1: I agree with that. I think it's actually more important

855
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:10,520
Speaker 1: just to show up any and everywhere as your true,

856
00:50:10,560 --> 00:50:13,399
Speaker 1: authentic self. I don't think you should worry about whether

857
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:14,919
Speaker 1: or not this is gonna be a thirty second sound

858
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:16,680
Speaker 1: bite or a three minute clip or three I'll just

859
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:18,440
Speaker 1: go have the conversation because the media is gonna do

860
00:50:18,480 --> 00:50:20,239
Speaker 1: that for you. The media is gonna chop it up

861
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:22,000
Speaker 1: for you yes, but.

862
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:27,840
Speaker 2: Yes, but I also think, Look, I mean I am

863
00:50:27,920 --> 00:50:32,040
Speaker 2: I'm a journalist, so I deal with her campaign and

864
00:50:32,360 --> 00:50:35,520
Speaker 2: all of that. And I'm telling you the answer is

865
00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:38,680
Speaker 2: not yes to everything in terms of where she's willing

866
00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:41,440
Speaker 2: to show up. And some of that is maybe staff

867
00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:43,960
Speaker 2: and how they try to kind of protect their principle.

868
00:50:44,560 --> 00:50:47,880
Speaker 2: But in the future, you have to be willing to

869
00:50:48,040 --> 00:50:49,839
Speaker 2: talk to any and everyone. You have to be willing

870
00:50:49,920 --> 00:50:52,000
Speaker 2: to take risks. You have to be willing to sit

871
00:50:52,040 --> 00:50:54,920
Speaker 2: in front of people who might very well be hostile

872
00:50:54,960 --> 00:50:57,880
Speaker 2: to you and win them over. And I think that

873
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:02,359
Speaker 2: up and you might, yeah, so what exactly, And I'm

874
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:04,759
Speaker 2: just telling you it's that was not how they ran

875
00:51:04,800 --> 00:51:08,040
Speaker 2: that last campaign period. It wasn't and they're going to

876
00:51:08,080 --> 00:51:10,080
Speaker 2: have to She's going to have to be willing to

877
00:51:10,120 --> 00:51:13,360
Speaker 2: do that, which is gonna it's it's going to require

878
00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:17,320
Speaker 2: taking a lot of risk. But that is the future

879
00:51:18,239 --> 00:51:24,520
Speaker 2: of politicians. The ones who will thrive in tomorrow's media environment.

880
00:51:25,160 --> 00:51:27,320
Speaker 2: They they you got to be willing to go everywhere

881
00:51:28,719 --> 00:51:32,800
Speaker 2: on a dime, prepared or not briefed or not. That

882
00:51:33,080 --> 00:51:36,239
Speaker 2: is how it works, and that's not how they ran

883
00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:40,200
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty four. And if she's going to run again,

884
00:51:40,640 --> 00:51:44,640
Speaker 2: it's going to have to be a complete overhauls strategy.

885
00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:46,839
Speaker 1: Like don't wait, don't and just for all of them,

886
00:51:47,160 --> 00:51:51,839
Speaker 1: don't wait until it's actual twenty seven, not do it now,

887
00:51:52,120 --> 00:51:55,040
Speaker 1: Like start going to these places now. And I think

888
00:51:55,080 --> 00:51:57,520
Speaker 1: that a lot of them should be launching their own platforms.

889
00:51:57,800 --> 00:51:58,960
Speaker 1: They should have their own podcast.

890
00:51:59,000 --> 00:52:03,600
Speaker 2: Gaven news I mean, and look, I mean, you say

891
00:52:03,640 --> 00:52:05,920
Speaker 2: what you want about Gavin Newsom, this is what I'm

892
00:52:05,960 --> 00:52:09,880
Speaker 2: talking about. He had this podcast and he was bringing

893
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:15,000
Speaker 2: on all these conservatives on and he got a lot

894
00:52:15,040 --> 00:52:17,360
Speaker 2: of criticism for it. But I think what he was

895
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:21,000
Speaker 2: trying to show was a willingness to talk to anybody

896
00:52:21,800 --> 00:52:26,080
Speaker 2: and to debate anybody. And again, I think there's a

897
00:52:26,160 --> 00:52:28,320
Speaker 2: lot of that that's going to be required in the future.

898
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:30,640
Speaker 2: You've got to prove to people that you can win

899
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:34,920
Speaker 2: the argument. And if you can't do that, it doesn't

900
00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:40,759
Speaker 2: matter how polished you are, how experienced or knowledgeable you are.

901
00:52:41,280 --> 00:52:44,040
Speaker 2: I think that's the baseline bar that you're going to

902
00:52:44,080 --> 00:52:46,680
Speaker 2: have to cross for a lot of voters in this

903
00:52:46,800 --> 00:52:48,160
Speaker 2: future media ecosystem.

904
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:50,759
Speaker 1: No, I agree. You know. The interesting thing that the

905
00:52:51,080 --> 00:52:52,640
Speaker 1: VP is doing. I think the book tour. I think

906
00:52:52,640 --> 00:52:54,000
Speaker 1: this book is going to help her a lot. Yea,

907
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:56,239
Speaker 1: because it's the first step to being completely honest and

908
00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:58,879
Speaker 1: then going on to book tour, but also going into

909
00:52:58,920 --> 00:53:01,640
Speaker 1: these cities and talking to you know, locals when you're

910
00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:04,200
Speaker 1: in these cities. I think that's gonna go a long way.

911
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:06,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's always important to do that.

912
00:53:06,760 --> 00:53:08,919
Speaker 1: But none of these candidates are going to really stand

913
00:53:08,960 --> 00:53:10,440
Speaker 1: a chance in hell if none of them were really

914
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:11,800
Speaker 1: willing to challenge capitalism.

915
00:53:12,560 --> 00:53:16,959
Speaker 2: Well, well, you know, I mean there's some truth there, Okay.

916
00:53:17,239 --> 00:53:21,160
Speaker 2: The part of that that I would say is true

917
00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:25,319
Speaker 2: is that when you look at what Trump is doing

918
00:53:25,440 --> 00:53:32,160
Speaker 2: as president, in a way he's challenging capitalism. He's putting

919
00:53:32,239 --> 00:53:37,640
Speaker 2: tariffs on countries indiscriminately just because he wants to, making

920
00:53:37,719 --> 00:53:40,880
Speaker 2: the case that he's doing it for Americans. He is

921
00:53:40,960 --> 00:53:46,840
Speaker 2: taking government stakes in private companies. That's a Bernie Sanders idea.

922
00:53:47,120 --> 00:53:51,879
Speaker 2: By the way, he is creating a government website where

923
00:53:51,920 --> 00:53:57,600
Speaker 2: people can shop around for prescription drugs, another Bernie Sanders idea.

924
00:53:58,560 --> 00:54:03,640
Speaker 2: So his willingness to just take some of these ideas

925
00:54:03,719 --> 00:54:07,440
Speaker 2: the Democrats have been talking about and just do them,

926
00:54:07,680 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 2: no matter how controversial, they are. Has been one of

927
00:54:11,239 --> 00:54:14,880
Speaker 2: the things that whether you like him or not, what

928
00:54:15,120 --> 00:54:16,920
Speaker 2: people will say about Trump is that he does what

929
00:54:17,000 --> 00:54:20,480
Speaker 2: he says. And I think the Democrats one of the

930
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:23,080
Speaker 2: big problems that they have is that voters don't think

931
00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:26,160
Speaker 2: they're going to do what they say. They say all

932
00:54:26,239 --> 00:54:28,080
Speaker 2: the right things, but they don't think they're going to

933
00:54:28,120 --> 00:54:31,920
Speaker 2: do what they say. And so whether it's challenging you

934
00:54:31,960 --> 00:54:36,359
Speaker 2: can call it challenging capitalism or challenging whatever, voters want

935
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:39,200
Speaker 2: to know that you're willing to buck the system for them,

936
00:54:40,640 --> 00:54:44,759
Speaker 2: and I think Trump does that right now in a

937
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:50,200
Speaker 2: way that really like shakes people up and makes people

938
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:53,920
Speaker 2: really mad. But that is also why a lot of voters,

939
00:54:53,920 --> 00:54:56,040
Speaker 2: whether they like him or not, they will describe him

940
00:54:56,040 --> 00:54:56,640
Speaker 2: as effective.

941
00:54:57,480 --> 00:54:59,040
Speaker 1: I wonder how it all because it's like he's bucking

942
00:54:59,080 --> 00:55:00,400
Speaker 1: the system, but it has only been fit in the

943
00:55:00,480 --> 00:55:02,680
Speaker 1: rich right now, and it's not even benefiting his voters.

944
00:55:02,719 --> 00:55:03,920
Speaker 1: I wont to why he and.

945
00:55:03,960 --> 00:55:09,439
Speaker 2: Even you know, look the tariff thing. He he's making

946
00:55:09,520 --> 00:55:13,160
Speaker 2: the case to Americans that this is a benefit to them,

947
00:55:13,880 --> 00:55:18,040
Speaker 2: but the economics don't work, they don't make sense. Farmers

948
00:55:18,320 --> 00:55:21,080
Speaker 2: would beg to differ right at this moment. They are

949
00:55:21,239 --> 00:55:26,400
Speaker 2: struggling mightily under these tariffs. Small businesses are struggling mightily

950
00:55:26,520 --> 00:55:30,640
Speaker 2: under these terraffs. So there is obviously a really big

951
00:55:30,719 --> 00:55:34,239
Speaker 2: difference between what Trump is doing and what he's saying

952
00:55:34,320 --> 00:55:37,520
Speaker 2: and what is actually happening. But I do think that

953
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:42,959
Speaker 2: it's breaking through and I and my only point about

954
00:55:43,000 --> 00:55:46,920
Speaker 2: that was just there's a Democrats have become way more

955
00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:51,040
Speaker 2: establishment in the last fifteen years because Trump is so

956
00:55:51,160 --> 00:55:54,759
Speaker 2: anti establishment. They've defined themselves in opposition to Trump, and

957
00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:58,560
Speaker 2: so they've become sort of an avatar of the system.

958
00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:02,080
Speaker 2: And I don't think they realize the degree to which

959
00:56:02,160 --> 00:56:06,120
Speaker 2: voters do not like the system at all. And the

960
00:56:06,320 --> 00:56:09,160
Speaker 2: next Democratic nominee is going to have to be able

961
00:56:09,200 --> 00:56:12,600
Speaker 2: to tap into that one way or another, to say

962
00:56:12,719 --> 00:56:16,040
Speaker 2: to people, I get it, you don't actually like the

963
00:56:16,080 --> 00:56:19,920
Speaker 2: way things are work working, Stop defending this status quo

964
00:56:20,600 --> 00:56:24,160
Speaker 2: and figure out what an alternative is that isn't just

965
00:56:24,320 --> 00:56:30,359
Speaker 2: opposition to Trump. And do I see anybody actually doing

966
00:56:30,440 --> 00:56:35,920
Speaker 2: that right now? Not really, But look, time will tell,

967
00:56:36,040 --> 00:56:38,680
Speaker 2: Like we've got a long way ahead, and any if

968
00:56:38,760 --> 00:56:41,799
Speaker 2: history tells us anything, sometimes the person who ends up

969
00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:44,640
Speaker 2: rising to the top is not the person that any

970
00:56:44,680 --> 00:56:46,839
Speaker 2: of us are thinking about or talking about it. It's

971
00:56:46,880 --> 00:56:50,440
Speaker 2: somebody who's going to come seemingly out of nowhere, but

972
00:56:50,560 --> 00:56:54,000
Speaker 2: not going to come from the center of the political

973
00:56:54,080 --> 00:56:55,000
Speaker 2: universe right now.

974
00:56:55,360 --> 00:56:58,640
Speaker 3: So we'll see if to your point of everything you

975
00:56:58,760 --> 00:57:01,120
Speaker 3: just said, right, if Jesse accent right was able to

976
00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:04,920
Speaker 3: actually become president president, get in office just do things

977
00:57:05,040 --> 00:57:09,280
Speaker 3: for people that he cared about, how would Barack Obama's

978
00:57:09,280 --> 00:57:11,960
Speaker 3: presidency have been different. Kamala Harris just on this run

979
00:57:12,040 --> 00:57:14,000
Speaker 3: feeling like she has to dodge certain things and can't

980
00:57:14,040 --> 00:57:16,480
Speaker 3: speak straight to black people. How would all of that

981
00:57:16,600 --> 00:57:18,040
Speaker 3: be different if he had been able to get in

982
00:57:18,120 --> 00:57:19,680
Speaker 3: office and do what he was doing before he was

983
00:57:19,760 --> 00:57:21,120
Speaker 3: voted president or not voted.

984
00:57:21,120 --> 00:57:23,640
Speaker 2: But that's really interesting. It's such an interesting question. I mean,

985
00:57:24,040 --> 00:57:27,920
Speaker 2: I think one of the reasons that Vice President Harris

986
00:57:28,840 --> 00:57:34,080
Speaker 2: and Barack Obama have had to present a certain way

987
00:57:34,160 --> 00:57:40,479
Speaker 2: to the American public is the perception that a broad

988
00:57:40,520 --> 00:57:44,400
Speaker 2: swath of the electorate, especially white voters, won't take a

989
00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:49,480
Speaker 2: black candidate seriously unless they are very buttoned up, have

990
00:57:49,680 --> 00:57:54,080
Speaker 2: the resume all lined up, the whole thing. And that's accurate,

991
00:57:54,840 --> 00:57:57,520
Speaker 2: right that, Like, we all understand that you kind of

992
00:57:57,600 --> 00:58:00,720
Speaker 2: have to clear a higher bar in order to even

993
00:58:00,760 --> 00:58:03,680
Speaker 2: be let in the door. And I do wonder if

994
00:58:03,760 --> 00:58:07,480
Speaker 2: the country had successfully elected a black president who was

995
00:58:07,560 --> 00:58:13,560
Speaker 2: running on a progressive platform thirty years ago, whether they

996
00:58:13,600 --> 00:58:16,640
Speaker 2: would have that same burden. And I don't know, maybe

997
00:58:16,680 --> 00:58:19,240
Speaker 2: they would not have. You know, one of the things

998
00:58:20,200 --> 00:58:26,520
Speaker 2: about Jesse Jackson is that his fluency in a wide

999
00:58:26,640 --> 00:58:30,920
Speaker 2: range of issues. As somebody who never was elected to

1000
00:58:31,080 --> 00:58:38,200
Speaker 2: political office, who came out of the segregated South, who

1001
00:58:38,320 --> 00:58:41,360
Speaker 2: came out of a civil rights tradition, he was right

1002
00:58:41,480 --> 00:58:46,320
Speaker 2: up there with all the other candidates on the debate stage,

1003
00:58:46,600 --> 00:58:50,640
Speaker 2: talking about foreign policy, talking about economic policy, giving speeches.

1004
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:52,160
Speaker 2: I mean, I would talk to people who would say

1005
00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:54,439
Speaker 2: that they would give him, you know, like a thirty

1006
00:58:54,480 --> 00:58:56,120
Speaker 2: minute briefing, and he would go in there and he

1007
00:58:56,160 --> 00:59:00,320
Speaker 2: would weave a whole speech around an issue. He could

1008
00:59:00,320 --> 00:59:04,800
Speaker 2: take information in and very quickly turn it around into

1009
00:59:04,880 --> 00:59:09,360
Speaker 2: something that was compelling to an audience. And so he

1010
00:59:09,560 --> 00:59:14,440
Speaker 2: had a kind of intellect that was not very respected

1011
00:59:14,520 --> 00:59:18,160
Speaker 2: at the time. And I do think that, you know,

1012
00:59:18,480 --> 00:59:20,720
Speaker 2: if the country had elected a black president, I think

1013
00:59:21,160 --> 00:59:24,800
Speaker 2: candidates today who are running who are like Kamala Harris

1014
00:59:24,840 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 2: or Barack Obama would not have to would not have

1015
00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:34,680
Speaker 2: to do so much to show white Americans in particular

1016
00:59:35,120 --> 00:59:40,240
Speaker 2: that they're qualified and that they have the basic, you know,

1017
00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:44,400
Speaker 2: qualifications to fit the job. I think that added burden

1018
00:59:45,240 --> 00:59:49,040
Speaker 2: is one of the reasons that it's hard then to

1019
00:59:49,120 --> 00:59:51,880
Speaker 2: turn around and say to those same candidates, well, you've

1020
00:59:51,880 --> 00:59:55,120
Speaker 2: got to be authentic, because that same authenticity is what

1021
00:59:55,720 --> 00:59:59,120
Speaker 2: they get knocked for early on in their career. So

1022
00:59:59,240 --> 01:00:01,240
Speaker 2: it is I'm not say suggesting that it's easy. I

1023
01:00:01,280 --> 01:00:03,520
Speaker 2: think it is difficult. You have to be able to

1024
01:00:03,600 --> 01:00:06,040
Speaker 2: do both things. And actually I would say Obama actually

1025
01:00:06,320 --> 01:00:10,520
Speaker 2: did both things pretty well. He was incredibly credentialed, but

1026
01:00:10,640 --> 01:00:14,000
Speaker 2: he was incredibly authentic in the communities where he needed

1027
01:00:14,040 --> 01:00:16,160
Speaker 2: to be authentic in. And I do think that it

1028
01:00:16,280 --> 01:00:18,320
Speaker 2: is possible to do it, but it is absolutely a

1029
01:00:18,400 --> 01:00:21,760
Speaker 2: higher bar, and it's a higher bar still to this day,

1030
01:00:21,920 --> 01:00:25,080
Speaker 2: because we've only done it once elected a black person

1031
01:00:25,160 --> 01:00:27,760
Speaker 2: to the highest office in the land, and so there's

1032
01:00:27,800 --> 01:00:30,600
Speaker 2: still a lot that has to be dealt with in

1033
01:00:30,720 --> 01:00:34,439
Speaker 2: terms of people's preconceived notions of what people of color

1034
01:00:34,560 --> 01:00:37,200
Speaker 2: can do at high levels of political office.

1035
01:00:38,160 --> 01:00:41,680
Speaker 1: My last question when Cameron took a sip of pink

1036
01:00:41,720 --> 01:00:44,880
Speaker 1: Horsepower on your show, like you just took a sip

1037
01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:45,080
Speaker 1: with that.

1038
01:00:45,520 --> 01:00:48,240
Speaker 2: Is there something known in the industry about how did

1039
01:00:48,320 --> 01:00:56,760
Speaker 2: he treated his artists? Sorry, I'm going to get some

1040
01:00:56,880 --> 01:00:58,280
Speaker 2: cheeks after this horse.

1041
01:00:58,120 --> 01:01:01,040
Speaker 1: Powers joint and you were going to And then when

1042
01:01:01,120 --> 01:01:02,800
Speaker 1: Cam said he was going to get some cheeks after

1043
01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:05,600
Speaker 1: your interview, did you understand what was happening in that moment.

1044
01:01:06,880 --> 01:01:11,840
Speaker 2: I knew that we needed to end the interview. Obviously,

1045
01:01:12,280 --> 01:01:15,000
Speaker 2: I knew we needed to end the interview. We were

1046
01:01:15,080 --> 01:01:18,120
Speaker 2: up against the end of the show and we didn't.

1047
01:01:18,640 --> 01:01:23,120
Speaker 2: We had to get to a certain time, so you know,

1048
01:01:23,280 --> 01:01:28,600
Speaker 2: I had to land that plane and I did, and look,

1049
01:01:28,680 --> 01:01:33,040
Speaker 2: I mean it was ridiculous, but as we know, that

1050
01:01:33,240 --> 01:01:33,760
Speaker 2: was the point.

1051
01:01:34,320 --> 01:01:36,760
Speaker 1: So the person who had to transcribe the show afterwards

1052
01:01:36,760 --> 01:01:37,520
Speaker 1: ask you what that meant?

1053
01:01:38,720 --> 01:01:40,560
Speaker 2: What do you need to get some Well we all

1054
01:01:40,600 --> 01:01:43,960
Speaker 2: were just like, what just happened? Yeah, you know, I

1055
01:01:44,040 --> 01:01:47,520
Speaker 2: mean whatever, it's I'm not going to give this much

1056
01:01:47,600 --> 01:01:49,479
Speaker 2: more oxygen because I know that's part of the point.

1057
01:01:50,160 --> 01:01:52,439
Speaker 2: I know he was here a little while ago talking

1058
01:01:52,480 --> 01:01:52,840
Speaker 2: about it.

1059
01:01:53,000 --> 01:01:54,880
Speaker 1: Let me ask you, because what was your favorite viral

1060
01:01:55,000 --> 01:01:58,000
Speaker 1: news network moment. Was it the sixty minutes joint? Was

1061
01:01:58,040 --> 01:02:01,120
Speaker 1: it the bill O'Reilly or the seeing and drinking pink horse?

1062
01:02:02,280 --> 01:02:02,720
Speaker 2: Seeing that.

1063
01:02:05,160 --> 01:02:09,760
Speaker 3: By far, I'm sure he did said before it wasn't

1064
01:02:09,880 --> 01:02:12,000
Speaker 3: like it wasn't personal anything with you. He just felt

1065
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:14,040
Speaker 3: like the network only hits him up for things that

1066
01:02:14,320 --> 01:02:15,840
Speaker 3: aren't about what he does outside of.

1067
01:02:15,880 --> 01:02:20,160
Speaker 2: All I will say is that we were told by

1068
01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:23,120
Speaker 2: his team that he wanted to talk about this, not

1069
01:02:23,240 --> 01:02:26,600
Speaker 2: the other way around. So that's we Obviously, we don't

1070
01:02:26,640 --> 01:02:29,200
Speaker 2: book people about things they don't want to talk about,

1071
01:02:30,040 --> 01:02:32,040
Speaker 2: So we would never bring someone on the show and

1072
01:02:32,200 --> 01:02:35,200
Speaker 2: force them to talk about something that they didn't agree

1073
01:02:35,280 --> 01:02:38,880
Speaker 2: to talk about. So I don't know. I mean, everybody

1074
01:02:39,120 --> 01:02:40,680
Speaker 2: we have free will, We can do what we want.

1075
01:02:42,120 --> 01:02:45,240
Speaker 2: But like I said, I knew immediately. Actually we we

1076
01:02:45,360 --> 01:02:48,200
Speaker 2: knew pretty early on in the interview that we needed

1077
01:02:48,240 --> 01:02:54,560
Speaker 2: to get out as possible. You know, it was I mean,

1078
01:02:54,600 --> 01:02:58,800
Speaker 2: it was from the from the get go. Yeah, I'm

1079
01:02:58,840 --> 01:03:02,040
Speaker 2: not new to this, Like I know, from the beginning,

1080
01:03:02,120 --> 01:03:06,800
Speaker 2: when somebody is not interested in being and being interviewed,

1081
01:03:06,880 --> 01:03:09,000
Speaker 2: and so we knew we needed to get out. But

1082
01:03:09,080 --> 01:03:11,480
Speaker 2: it was just a timing thing, you know, when you're

1083
01:03:11,480 --> 01:03:15,160
Speaker 2: at the end of the show. And he was actually

1084
01:03:15,320 --> 01:03:18,320
Speaker 2: supposed to be on the show earlier but was late,

1085
01:03:18,480 --> 01:03:21,640
Speaker 2: and so we we we're just figuring out how quickly

1086
01:03:21,680 --> 01:03:25,240
Speaker 2: we could hand off to Laura Coates at eleven o'clock.

1087
01:03:25,880 --> 01:03:27,760
Speaker 1: That put you in a good class. So Cam's got

1088
01:03:27,800 --> 01:03:36,320
Speaker 1: some really good interviews with news and got some great moments.

1089
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:37,840
Speaker 3: Will get said on the playlist somewhere.

1090
01:03:38,440 --> 01:03:42,120
Speaker 2: Absolutely absolutely not, we are not. That is not a class.

1091
01:03:42,480 --> 01:03:43,960
Speaker 1: And I think you said I want to be he

1092
01:03:44,000 --> 01:03:45,960
Speaker 1: said was his favorite. I asked him which one was

1093
01:03:46,200 --> 01:03:50,400
Speaker 1: the and is a Cooper sixty minutes interview the bill O'Reilly?

1094
01:03:50,440 --> 01:03:52,880
Speaker 1: When he was like, you mad you met a film?

1095
01:03:52,960 --> 01:03:55,800
Speaker 1: He said, yes, because horse Power.

1096
01:03:56,880 --> 01:04:01,040
Speaker 2: I'm happy for Yes, I'm happy for him.

1097
01:04:03,280 --> 01:04:08,000
Speaker 3: But you know, stuff like that person when it happens. No,

1098
01:04:08,920 --> 01:04:11,760
Speaker 3: absolutely not not personally, but just like why you why

1099
01:04:11,960 --> 01:04:12,439
Speaker 3: my show?

1100
01:04:15,640 --> 01:04:15,680
Speaker 1: No?

1101
01:04:16,080 --> 01:04:19,000
Speaker 2: I you know what, let me just I'll just say

1102
01:04:19,040 --> 01:04:22,160
Speaker 2: this because I don't I've never talked I've actually never

1103
01:04:22,200 --> 01:04:27,000
Speaker 2: talked about this before. But when that happened. Our booker

1104
01:04:27,120 --> 01:04:30,920
Speaker 2: who booked that interview was a young woman and she

1105
01:04:31,120 --> 01:04:37,920
Speaker 2: was very upset about it. And I said to her afterwards,

1106
01:04:38,320 --> 01:04:40,720
Speaker 2: and I said to my entire team. I was like,

1107
01:04:41,160 --> 01:04:43,520
Speaker 2: this is not going to be a reason that we

1108
01:04:43,640 --> 01:04:46,440
Speaker 2: play it safe. We are not going to take this

1109
01:04:46,840 --> 01:04:50,040
Speaker 2: as a moment to say, oh, this happened to us,

1110
01:04:50,120 --> 01:04:52,000
Speaker 2: We can't have people like that on our air again.

1111
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:56,680
Speaker 2: I don't believe in that. I think that we are.

1112
01:04:56,960 --> 01:05:01,560
Speaker 2: We are out here trying to you hear from people

1113
01:05:02,080 --> 01:05:07,000
Speaker 2: who are interesting and different, and maybe sometimes it goes left,

1114
01:05:08,080 --> 01:05:11,000
Speaker 2: but I'm not gonna this is We're not gonna come

1115
01:05:11,080 --> 01:05:14,200
Speaker 2: down on you for booking this interview because we want

1116
01:05:14,280 --> 01:05:17,240
Speaker 2: to bring interesting people onto the show, and it was

1117
01:05:17,280 --> 01:05:20,080
Speaker 2: important to me to convey to them that we're not

1118
01:05:20,360 --> 01:05:23,400
Speaker 2: gonna go into a little ball and be like, oh

1119
01:05:23,480 --> 01:05:26,480
Speaker 2: my god, this went viral and this was embarrassing. No,

1120
01:05:28,040 --> 01:05:32,320
Speaker 2: this too shall pass. Like he had his moment, it

1121
01:05:32,440 --> 01:05:34,080
Speaker 2: was fine. I don't really care.

1122
01:05:35,080 --> 01:05:36,760
Speaker 1: I do.

1123
01:05:36,920 --> 01:05:39,080
Speaker 2: I wish he didn't do that on the air yet.

1124
01:05:40,320 --> 01:05:42,560
Speaker 2: But but I'm not using it as an excuse to

1125
01:05:42,600 --> 01:05:44,960
Speaker 2: say that we're going to play it safe on television,

1126
01:05:45,000 --> 01:05:48,240
Speaker 2: because that's not what we're doing here.

1127
01:05:48,640 --> 01:05:54,840
Speaker 1: So book a fantastic job, fantastic booking what's her name, fantastic.

1128
01:05:54,240 --> 01:06:00,400
Speaker 2: Book every night she was Unfortunately she moved to a

1129
01:06:00,440 --> 01:06:03,400
Speaker 2: different city, so she's no longer with us. But yeah,

1130
01:06:03,440 --> 01:06:06,720
Speaker 2: but we listen, we I it wasn't just her. I

1131
01:06:06,840 --> 01:06:09,560
Speaker 2: told her boss too, and I was like, we are not.

1132
01:06:10,880 --> 01:06:14,040
Speaker 2: We are not going to treat this like some kind

1133
01:06:14,080 --> 01:06:16,960
Speaker 2: of major mistake, because it was not. It is television,

1134
01:06:17,480 --> 01:06:20,520
Speaker 2: and sometimes in television you have guests and you don't

1135
01:06:20,520 --> 01:06:22,600
Speaker 2: know what they're going to say, and the whole point

1136
01:06:22,720 --> 01:06:27,520
Speaker 2: of TV is not to be predictable and boring, So let's.

1137
01:06:27,320 --> 01:06:29,880
Speaker 1: Not do that. I thoroughly enjoy your bookings. I thoroughly

1138
01:06:30,000 --> 01:06:32,600
Speaker 1: enjoy your show. Make sure y'all watch Abby Phillip on

1139
01:06:32,760 --> 01:06:35,160
Speaker 1: CNN News Night every night at ten and then this

1140
01:06:35,360 --> 01:06:36,840
Speaker 1: Table for five comes on at ten.

1141
01:06:37,480 --> 01:06:40,600
Speaker 2: Am on Saturday sdays. And don't forget to buy.

1142
01:06:40,520 --> 01:06:42,680
Speaker 1: The book Yes I dreamed of is out right now

1143
01:06:42,840 --> 01:06:46,760
Speaker 1: Jesse Jackson in the Fight for Black Political Power, Abby Philip,

1144
01:06:47,040 --> 01:06:48,200
Speaker 1: keep doing a great service. Though.

1145
01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:50,520
Speaker 2: Thank you guys having me come on the show sometime.

1146
01:06:50,560 --> 01:06:54,320
Speaker 2: All of you really, yeah, I know you have. I

1147
01:06:54,400 --> 01:06:58,160
Speaker 2: know you have some political viewpoint. You know what I'm

1148
01:06:58,160 --> 01:07:01,080
Speaker 2: saying stuff, Even Take for five, I know it's I

1149
01:07:01,160 --> 01:07:03,960
Speaker 2: know it's late at night, so Table for five you

1150
01:07:04,040 --> 01:07:06,640
Speaker 2: can come on, it's a different time, so it's more

1151
01:07:06,680 --> 01:07:09,600
Speaker 2: of earlier for your schedule. Yes, thank you're going there.

1152
01:07:09,720 --> 01:07:11,400
Speaker 2: Argue for us, we'll be supporting.

1153
01:07:11,840 --> 01:07:14,439
Speaker 1: I enjoy watching It's Abby Philip. It's the breakfast club.

1154
01:07:14,800 --> 01:07:18,440
Speaker 1: Hold up every day a way click yours up the

1155
01:07:18,520 --> 01:07:20,760
Speaker 1: breakfast club. You an'll finish the y'all dumb