1 00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:04,120 Speaker 1: Welcome to River Cafe Table four, a production of iHeartRadio 2 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:05,400 Speaker 1: and Adamized Studios. 3 00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:11,160 Speaker 2: When my good friend duro Olowu calls me, I never 4 00:00:11,280 --> 00:00:13,280 Speaker 2: know if he's on his way to show his collection 5 00:00:13,400 --> 00:00:17,640 Speaker 2: in Paris, curate an exhibition in Chicago, visit a wool 6 00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:20,599 Speaker 2: factory in Tuscany, or just sitting down to have a 7 00:00:20,640 --> 00:00:24,480 Speaker 2: plate of spaghetti Patarka in the River Cafe. Fajura is 8 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:28,640 Speaker 2: a man of many parts, fashion designer, art director, ventor 9 00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:32,920 Speaker 2: to young entrepreneurs, and a passionate lover of food. Right 10 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:35,680 Speaker 2: now we are in my kitchen. I'm wearing one of 11 00:00:35,680 --> 00:00:39,880 Speaker 2: his beautiful, bright dresses, and he is grating Patarka. We'll 12 00:00:39,880 --> 00:00:42,240 Speaker 2: have a talk about everything he is thinking and doing 13 00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:45,320 Speaker 2: over a long lunch. Then he will tell me he 14 00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:48,120 Speaker 2: has to go, and as always I will try and 15 00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:51,520 Speaker 2: persuade my friend to stay with me just a little 16 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:55,680 Speaker 2: bit longer. Okay, okay, all right, we are so action. 17 00:00:56,440 --> 00:01:04,000 Speaker 2: Spaghetti Bataga gota guy so batarga is. I think it's 18 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:07,480 Speaker 2: one of the great delicacies of life. Really, you know, 19 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:12,840 Speaker 2: it's identified completely with sardinia. It's the dried row of 20 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:16,440 Speaker 2: the mullet of the gray mullet, and there is botarga 21 00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:20,040 Speaker 2: of tuna, but we always use the botarga of the 22 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:20,959 Speaker 2: gray Manalat. 23 00:01:21,160 --> 00:01:24,440 Speaker 3: And it's wonderful. And here's how to cook it. Two 24 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:28,920 Speaker 3: hundred and fifty grams of spaghetti, three tablespoons of olive oil, 25 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:34,360 Speaker 3: two garlic clothes peeled and finely chopped, fifty grams of 26 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:39,199 Speaker 3: fresh flat leaf parsley, very family chopped, one dried red 27 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:45,560 Speaker 3: chili crumbled, one hundred grams of botaga, coarsely grated juice 28 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:49,560 Speaker 3: of one lemon. Those are the ingredients. You cook the 29 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:53,640 Speaker 3: pasta in a generous amount of boiling salted water, then 30 00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:58,800 Speaker 3: drain thoroughly and return to the saucepan. Meanwhile, heat the 31 00:01:58,840 --> 00:02:01,960 Speaker 3: olive oil in a sep fit saucepan and fry the 32 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:05,360 Speaker 3: garlic with the parsley and chili for a few seconds. 33 00:02:05,880 --> 00:02:09,280 Speaker 3: Add to the drained pasta, then stir in most of 34 00:02:09,320 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 3: the botaga, serve immediately with the remaining botago on top 35 00:02:14,919 --> 00:02:17,960 Speaker 3: or more plus a squeeze of lemon. 36 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:23,359 Speaker 2: How wonderful, Oh, thank you to why botaga. 37 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:27,160 Speaker 3: It's interesting because it's a difficult one. Whenever anyone asks 38 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:30,800 Speaker 3: you for a favorite anything, it's always best to think 39 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:33,160 Speaker 3: like a child and go for the first thing that 40 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:37,040 Speaker 3: comes to your mind, because there's a reason during the lockdown, 41 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:40,520 Speaker 3: and every time the lockdown was lifted. One of the 42 00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:43,120 Speaker 3: greatest things that I got to do with friends was 43 00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 3: to sneak out the river cafe and thinking about the food. 44 00:02:47,320 --> 00:02:52,239 Speaker 3: It was the pizzetta with talagio and time or the botaga, 45 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:55,079 Speaker 3: and the botaga had to come up top because it's 46 00:02:55,120 --> 00:02:57,720 Speaker 3: a very I mean, the pizzetta is difficult to make, 47 00:02:57,760 --> 00:02:58,360 Speaker 3: but good. 48 00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:01,080 Speaker 4: Botaga spaghetti is. 49 00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:02,760 Speaker 3: The most difficult thing is I would never try to 50 00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:05,160 Speaker 3: make it at home, and that's why I always look 51 00:03:05,200 --> 00:03:06,240 Speaker 3: forward to having. 52 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:08,520 Speaker 2: A river cafe it But have you been to Sardinia. 53 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:12,160 Speaker 3: I went to Sardinia twice, once in my teens and 54 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:14,960 Speaker 3: once in the early two thousands. 55 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 4: I loved Sardinia. 56 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 3: You know, you arrive in Santa as Morelda No, and 57 00:03:18,720 --> 00:03:21,880 Speaker 3: then you just think, okay, we drive inwards, you know, 58 00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:26,959 Speaker 3: and there you just drive past this wonderful, dry, almost brutal, 59 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 3: but beautiful terrain, and every way you stop and eat, 60 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:35,760 Speaker 3: you start to feel the essence of this part of 61 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 3: Italy that has a history of severe poverty and very 62 00:03:39,040 --> 00:03:42,360 Speaker 3: harsh conditions. It sort of has that feel. So to me, 63 00:03:42,760 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 3: spaghetti potaga reflects that terrain and the colors and just 64 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 3: the coarseness, but delicious coarseness. 65 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 2: I think if you go to Sardinia, but targa is 66 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:58,120 Speaker 2: so associated with Sardinia. It is the food of Sardinia, 67 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:00,480 Speaker 2: and I don't think I'd ever had it until I 68 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:03,280 Speaker 2: went to Sardinny and then you have it everywhere. You 69 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 2: have it on salads, you have it in you know, pasta's, 70 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:07,800 Speaker 2: you have it on other fish. 71 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 3: And in a way for me eating Botoga that it 72 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 3: wasn't the first time I'd had spaghetti bottaga, but it 73 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:18,159 Speaker 3: was different. It was a revelation because you really understand 74 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:22,960 Speaker 3: how it's so basic in one way, you know, it's row, 75 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:26,360 Speaker 3: but at the same time it's not caviat it's row 76 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 3: and it's but it's so sort of respected and beautifully treated, 77 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:33,240 Speaker 3: and I love that. Of course, I've eaten it in 78 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:36,839 Speaker 3: Milana Lodge where go. I also in Peruja, where I 79 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:39,400 Speaker 3: have a factory that makes my network. But I mean, 80 00:04:39,400 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 3: I haven't been to Sardinia for many years, but I 81 00:04:41,680 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 3: have my little sardina at the River cafege. 82 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:48,039 Speaker 2: Yeah, it is it's also I think Sardinia is so wild. 83 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 2: It is you can imagine the coast, but then it's 84 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:53,640 Speaker 2: so the interior is like the wild West. And what 85 00:04:53,720 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 2: about the food of your country? Tell me about growing 86 00:04:56,440 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 2: up in Lake. 87 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:00,359 Speaker 3: Yes, and you know the food in Nigeria. First of all, 88 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:02,919 Speaker 3: I had a Jamaican mother, but my mother learned to 89 00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:06,359 Speaker 3: cook all the Nigerian food. And I'm Uruba, so we 90 00:05:06,440 --> 00:05:09,920 Speaker 3: had this household where we had Nigerian food all sorts. 91 00:05:09,920 --> 00:05:13,240 Speaker 3: It's very meat based, I have to say, at least 92 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:16,160 Speaker 3: from the region that I'm from. So we had this 93 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:19,960 Speaker 3: real mix. So we'd have Nigerian food, you know, pounded yam, 94 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:23,760 Speaker 3: rich vegetable sauces with meat or fishes. But then we'd 95 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:27,400 Speaker 3: also have rice and peas, you know. And my mother 96 00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:30,239 Speaker 3: would make the best coconut candy and she would bake 97 00:05:30,480 --> 00:05:32,719 Speaker 3: and she would make rice and peas. We didn't have 98 00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:35,280 Speaker 3: aki and sulfish so much, but we had jahanny cakes, 99 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:39,800 Speaker 3: which they're almost like little buns of our fried They're 100 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 3: like little flour buns, but the dough has to be 101 00:05:43,720 --> 00:05:45,840 Speaker 3: just right and you stick them in the oil and 102 00:05:45,880 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 3: they quick fry. And usually we'd have them with scrambled 103 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:52,760 Speaker 3: eggs on the side, but in Jamaica you have them 104 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:55,560 Speaker 3: with aciine sulfish sometimes, but we had this mix. 105 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,839 Speaker 2: So your mother came from Jamaica and how old was 106 00:05:58,880 --> 00:05:59,520 Speaker 2: she when she came. 107 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 4: My parents met here. 108 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:03,040 Speaker 3: My father she came to study nursing on the winter 109 00:06:03,760 --> 00:06:06,720 Speaker 3: the windwress generation, and my father came to study law 110 00:06:06,760 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 3: and he trained as a barrister. 111 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:10,599 Speaker 4: That's how they met. Had two children. 112 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:12,720 Speaker 3: Here, my oldest brother and sister, and then went back 113 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:16,520 Speaker 3: to Nigeria in nineteen fifty nine, so just before independence. 114 00:06:17,440 --> 00:06:20,840 Speaker 3: So that's how they met and they went back. But 115 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:23,719 Speaker 3: you know, my extended family on my mother's side, a 116 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:26,480 Speaker 3: lot of them worked on the trains and in car 117 00:06:26,560 --> 00:06:29,760 Speaker 3: factories here in Darby in London, so you know we 118 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 3: would always come on holiday and then we would be 119 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:35,120 Speaker 3: staying in central London, but we would visit them. So 120 00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:39,040 Speaker 3: I also had that sort of incredible experience of being 121 00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:42,480 Speaker 3: with my cousins. Some of them were raster and I 122 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 3: was completely engulfed in that. Food was an important part 123 00:06:46,480 --> 00:06:51,799 Speaker 3: of that, but mostly things like Jamaican patties. Whenever we'd 124 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 3: have the chance to visit, my older cousin say, come on, 125 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:56,400 Speaker 3: let's go for a walk and you'd stop and get 126 00:06:56,440 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 3: the patties. But my parents were very very food with 127 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:00,480 Speaker 3: very much. 128 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:03,280 Speaker 2: Was it important to them. Did you sit down for 129 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:06,160 Speaker 2: dinner every meal? Every meal? Tell me about the lunches 130 00:07:06,200 --> 00:07:06,840 Speaker 2: and the dinner as well. 131 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:09,320 Speaker 3: Well, you know, of course in the day when I 132 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 3: was in school and I during the day, you know, 133 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 3: you go to school, but we all have breakfast and 134 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:15,240 Speaker 3: then you know. 135 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:16,800 Speaker 2: What would you have for breakfast? 136 00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:19,520 Speaker 3: I mean, funny enough, the big thing with like bacon 137 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 3: and eggs, like breakfast bacon and eggs, toast or my 138 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 3: mother used to make a great thing. I mean big 139 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 3: beans which aren't the best, but they were delicious on 140 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 3: brown slices, bread toasted with a thin sort of layer 141 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:37,920 Speaker 3: of butter and tomatoes. But you know, the thing is 142 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 3: there was this thing of you couldn't we could talk 143 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:41,960 Speaker 3: at the table, but you know, if you sat down, 144 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 3: the table was set, everything was set. And my mother 145 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:49,360 Speaker 3: always cooked the other thing, which was incredibly rare because 146 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 3: you know, my father's this old school that my father 147 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:53,760 Speaker 3: cooked amazingly. 148 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:56,520 Speaker 2: Well, I remember you telling me about your father cooking. 149 00:07:56,920 --> 00:07:58,360 Speaker 2: Tell me what did he cook that? 150 00:07:58,480 --> 00:07:58,640 Speaker 4: Well? 151 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 3: He cooked Nigerian food really well, everything the fourie row, 152 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:06,320 Speaker 3: which is a sort of particular vegetable that has a 153 00:08:06,320 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 3: bitter taste with different kinds of meat or fish. My 154 00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:15,520 Speaker 3: father loved fresh fish, he loved catfish, he loved the 155 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:18,920 Speaker 3: equivalent of sea bream, you know. And there were always 156 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 3: people in the huge market, the special fish ladies who 157 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:25,280 Speaker 3: were the queens. But my father loved to cook. And 158 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:28,200 Speaker 3: sometimes on Sundays or whatever, he'd say, I'm cooking. And 159 00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:31,400 Speaker 3: what struck me was my mother was an incredible cook, 160 00:08:31,680 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 3: really incredible. But when my mother cooked, the kitchen could 161 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 3: look like a vombinan fish. And then they'd be a 162 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:40,760 Speaker 3: big clean up with my father as he'd be cooking, 163 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:44,000 Speaker 3: everything would be washed and put away. Your father was 164 00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:46,880 Speaker 3: and I watched that. I mean I learned a bit 165 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:47,360 Speaker 3: from that. 166 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:49,280 Speaker 2: But do you know where he learned to cook? 167 00:08:50,040 --> 00:08:51,440 Speaker 3: I mean, if I take my father, the son of 168 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:54,200 Speaker 3: a king, nobody told him. My father taught himself. Yeah, 169 00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:56,800 Speaker 3: my father taught himself. Nobody told my father to cok 170 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:00,320 Speaker 3: and he came from that sort of really. You know, 171 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:03,160 Speaker 3: he's very quiet about it, but you know, you know 172 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 3: that he you know, this is something that he just felt. 173 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:08,800 Speaker 3: He loved and he took pride in He didn't do 174 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:11,200 Speaker 3: it often, but he did it, and he loved to cook. 175 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:13,200 Speaker 3: And sometimes he would meet us here on holiday, if 176 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:16,080 Speaker 3: we were here, he'd come and he would go on 177 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 3: special trips to certain markets where you could get Nigerian 178 00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:21,240 Speaker 3: ingredients and cook. 179 00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:24,200 Speaker 2: There was a comment that you just mentioned that I 180 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:26,800 Speaker 2: don't want to that slip and you said your father 181 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:28,960 Speaker 2: was the son of a king. I don't think I've 182 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:31,840 Speaker 2: ever met anybody. I don't hang around the royal family 183 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:32,319 Speaker 2: very much. 184 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:35,720 Speaker 3: No, No, my grandfather is an about, you know, of 185 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:38,280 Speaker 3: a certain region. And my father said, mother, I'm saying, 186 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:41,360 Speaker 3: is my father or back insurgion. My grandfather was this 187 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:43,720 Speaker 3: guy that we just I never really looked at this ray. 188 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 3: We just bowed to him all the time. He was 189 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:48,960 Speaker 3: a wonderful man and he died in one hundred and something. 190 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:55,120 Speaker 3: Very stoic but very wise, tough, but very wise. We 191 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:57,160 Speaker 3: used to go up and see him. He would come 192 00:09:57,200 --> 00:09:59,959 Speaker 3: to Legous with his whole entourage and stay with us. 193 00:10:00,320 --> 00:10:03,960 Speaker 2: And what would food be like my mother's food? 194 00:10:04,360 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 3: He would only eat my mother's food. Really, yeah, which 195 00:10:07,160 --> 00:10:11,640 Speaker 3: was the biggest compliment considering you know there we would 196 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:13,440 Speaker 3: eat what they cooked. We usually used to go for 197 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:15,400 Speaker 3: the New Year, so it would go three days before 198 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:18,560 Speaker 3: New Year. They'd be cars full of fireworks for the 199 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:21,760 Speaker 3: kids in the village and then and then. But I 200 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:24,640 Speaker 3: don't really remember the food. It's strange, I think because 201 00:10:24,679 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 3: we were just you know, it's rural, rural, and you know, 202 00:10:27,720 --> 00:10:30,400 Speaker 3: you go crazy. It's like children just being allowed to run. 203 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 3: So food was really not something that was on my mind. 204 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 3: But again, there was a lot of meat and a 205 00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:40,160 Speaker 3: lot of fish. We didn't eat chicken in the village, 206 00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:42,959 Speaker 3: and I asked my father. We ate chicken at home. 207 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 3: But later he stopped in his sixties, and I said why, 208 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:49,760 Speaker 3: and he said, there's this whole story. Basically, chicken saved 209 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:52,960 Speaker 3: the village. Hundreds of years ago, the enemies were coming. 210 00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:55,320 Speaker 3: People ran up through the mountains. I don't know if 211 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 3: this is true. It's a fable. They ran off into 212 00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 3: the mountains. When they got to the village, they were 213 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:04,920 Speaker 3: looking for the people, but all the foot prints leading 214 00:11:04,920 --> 00:11:07,840 Speaker 3: to where they had escaped to were visible. But when 215 00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:10,920 Speaker 3: the villagers were leaving, they let loose all the chickens 216 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 3: because they didn't want them to be captured, and the 217 00:11:13,840 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 3: chickens ran all over the footprints and scattered them, so 218 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:18,720 Speaker 3: they're held in high esteam. 219 00:11:18,960 --> 00:11:19,400 Speaker 2: I see the. 220 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:24,560 Speaker 4: Chickens generally, you know, I love chickens. 221 00:11:35,120 --> 00:11:37,320 Speaker 2: When I see you in the river cafe, usually come 222 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:41,160 Speaker 2: with one person, and you're very engaged, and I think that, 223 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:44,800 Speaker 2: how does that work when you're designing? Do you have 224 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:47,280 Speaker 2: pins in your mouth? Can you eat or do you 225 00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:49,720 Speaker 2: do not eat? Or do you do take your team 226 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 2: out for meals or do you I. 227 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:53,520 Speaker 3: Don't have a team, which you know, I have to 228 00:11:53,559 --> 00:11:56,400 Speaker 3: say I have a very very small team, and therefore 229 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,080 Speaker 3: it's sort of not isolated. I don't make all the things. 230 00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:01,319 Speaker 3: I have someone who cuts them properly for me. I 231 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:05,400 Speaker 3: can do the early things. But sometimes if I'm working 232 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:09,079 Speaker 3: really intensely, you look and it's three o'clock and you think, gosh, 233 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:11,199 Speaker 3: I haven't had lunch. But then I just save it 234 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:13,439 Speaker 3: up for supper, you know, for a really good supper. 235 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 3: So I usually, you know, breakfast, I can just have 236 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:21,040 Speaker 3: a coffee and some homemade granola. But lunch, now, yes, 237 00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:25,000 Speaker 3: I will stop. And especially during lockdown, you know, you 238 00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:28,800 Speaker 3: make something and sometimes it's Yesterday's faster sauce with fresh 239 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:32,240 Speaker 3: faster or a salad. I used to think I didn't 240 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:34,720 Speaker 3: have the patience to make really good salads. 241 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:35,360 Speaker 4: But I do. 242 00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:37,000 Speaker 2: You need patience to make a good. 243 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:39,200 Speaker 4: Sell, need patience to make food patience. 244 00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, when you cook at help, do you find it 245 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:43,520 Speaker 2: relaxing to cook? Do you find it's a way of 246 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:45,240 Speaker 2: kind of winding down? 247 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:48,400 Speaker 3: Absolutely, because you do switch off. I mean when you're 248 00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:51,720 Speaker 3: trying to get the peel off the garlic, things like that. 249 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:55,160 Speaker 3: Concentrating tomatoes, like getting the core out is always a 250 00:12:55,760 --> 00:12:58,440 Speaker 3: chill for me. I've tried focused, but with everything else 251 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:01,439 Speaker 3: I do not have. I was really out your eloquently 252 00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:04,600 Speaker 3: written recipe, but I never know how much of anything 253 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:05,040 Speaker 3: to put in. 254 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:06,120 Speaker 4: I just go with my gut. 255 00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:08,640 Speaker 2: Do you go with your Yeah? Yeah? And what about 256 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:11,160 Speaker 2: Chicago when you were there? Tell me about the show. 257 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:15,920 Speaker 2: It involved the city, it involved culture, it involved design 258 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:17,960 Speaker 2: and art, and yeah. 259 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 3: Well, you know, the director of Madeline Greenstein asked me 260 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:24,240 Speaker 3: if I would do a show of my work, and 261 00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:26,800 Speaker 3: I thought, I mean, I love what I do, but 262 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:29,199 Speaker 3: I just felt, you know, there's more. I have curated 263 00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:32,400 Speaker 3: art shows, contemporary art shows, and I said I wouldn't 264 00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:34,120 Speaker 3: do that, but I'll do this, and I said, I'm 265 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:37,360 Speaker 3: going to curate because Chicago is an incredible city that 266 00:13:37,440 --> 00:13:40,560 Speaker 3: has incredible people and the most incredible things in the world. 267 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:45,600 Speaker 3: Very quietly, it's all there. And basically I decided to 268 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:48,320 Speaker 3: do a show that shows people in Chicago what they have. 269 00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 3: So the MCA, the Museum of Contemporary Art in Chicago, 270 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:55,080 Speaker 3: where I did it. I picked a lot from their collection, 271 00:13:55,880 --> 00:13:59,720 Speaker 3: but then I asked every major museum there, from the 272 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:03,920 Speaker 3: Art Institute, the Terror Foundation into it high Low, if 273 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:06,840 Speaker 3: I could borrow works, and everyone says, oh, they'll never allow. 274 00:14:07,080 --> 00:14:09,920 Speaker 3: You know, it's very complet They all did, and of 275 00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:13,040 Speaker 3: course some of the people with the greatest collections, I'd 276 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:15,880 Speaker 3: never even seen some of their collections, but all of 277 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 3: them opened their doors to me, usually over breakfast, lunch, 278 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:21,600 Speaker 3: or dinner, to look at their collection and borrow anything. 279 00:14:21,720 --> 00:14:26,480 Speaker 3: So really I sort of was left with this encyclopedic 280 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:32,479 Speaker 3: from David Hammond's to Margriet to Lynette, to Louis Nevilson 281 00:14:32,800 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 3: to Michael Armitage, Bryce Marten, you name it. I mean 282 00:14:37,640 --> 00:14:42,160 Speaker 3: unbelievable mixed with Malix c Dbay mixed with it was 283 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 3: all inspiring and it all came together because they were 284 00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:49,880 Speaker 3: featured out about the size of it and the number 285 00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 3: of works, But I think it's the same thing with 286 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 3: you when you're cooking. The way I approach my curatorial 287 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:58,120 Speaker 3: practice with art, which is why I do it, is 288 00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:01,840 Speaker 3: I don't believe in put things in categories because I 289 00:15:01,840 --> 00:15:05,960 Speaker 3: always think ingredients go together when they're together, if they're 290 00:15:06,040 --> 00:15:10,240 Speaker 3: right for each other. So my approach is it can 291 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:14,120 Speaker 3: be the biggest or the most revered artists mixed with 292 00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 3: people that are as incredible artists but not known. And 293 00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:20,600 Speaker 3: I don't like the world or use the word outside 294 00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 3: artists because it's so patronizing. Really, it's almost the way 295 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:27,320 Speaker 3: women artists were called women artists in the seventies. 296 00:15:27,720 --> 00:15:28,520 Speaker 4: And you put it all. 297 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 3: Together and at the end, I would walk through the 298 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 3: gallery about an hour or two before, and it was 299 00:15:34,040 --> 00:15:38,040 Speaker 3: six huge galleries, you know, filled with work, three hundred works, 300 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 3: and there was a calm, and that's how I know 301 00:15:40,520 --> 00:15:43,640 Speaker 3: it's fine. So yes, I wanted to really show that 302 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:46,480 Speaker 3: city because I think a lot of people Borrow, Borrow 303 00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 3: Borough have the shows that involve works from all over 304 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:52,920 Speaker 3: the world, so much planning and finance or whatever, and 305 00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:56,120 Speaker 3: they have incredible things in their cities. That the public 306 00:15:56,160 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 3: don't see. And I think, why do people give all 307 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:00,400 Speaker 3: this art, you know, these families and people that have 308 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:01,760 Speaker 3: donated art to these museums. 309 00:16:01,800 --> 00:16:03,240 Speaker 4: It's for the public to see. 310 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:06,160 Speaker 2: But it also sounds like you're a personal relationship with 311 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:09,000 Speaker 2: the people that gay And then you had that tiny 312 00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:12,400 Speaker 2: little sense if we did this in over lunch, dinner, breakfast, 313 00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:16,440 Speaker 2: because I think that's also interesting how people use or 314 00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 2: go to a restaurant, and so maybe do you think 315 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 2: that made them more relaxed with you or yes? 316 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:23,080 Speaker 4: I think so. 317 00:16:23,280 --> 00:16:25,200 Speaker 3: I think you're right, and I think, you know, some 318 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 3: people do it with alcohol, and I like a good 319 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:32,080 Speaker 3: glass of wine or whatever, but food levels everyone alseo. 320 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:36,320 Speaker 3: It disarms certain people. And because people always think, whether 321 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:38,200 Speaker 3: it's in the art world, in the fashion world, in 322 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:42,160 Speaker 3: the food world, people always think that you're coming into 323 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:45,720 Speaker 3: a scenario with a plan. No one just has lunch 324 00:16:45,800 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 3: with each other. Like if somebody calls references, Oh, I 325 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 3: was wondering if you like lunch, and I say, oh, yeah, 326 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:54,240 Speaker 3: of course, Oh do you want to know why? And I, well, 327 00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:57,640 Speaker 3: I didn't think there were why you know, And you're right, 328 00:16:57,720 --> 00:17:01,520 Speaker 3: I think the great thing about food you can start 329 00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:04,600 Speaker 3: even talking about business or work. But once the first 330 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:11,240 Speaker 3: monscules go into your mouth slightly off, the other thing 331 00:17:11,560 --> 00:17:18,560 Speaker 3: is really it's almost what you said, projects, deals, breakups, 332 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:23,639 Speaker 3: getting together, dangerous liaisons, you know, ideas. I love eating 333 00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:26,360 Speaker 3: in restaurants on my own, I get great. I love 334 00:17:26,400 --> 00:17:27,520 Speaker 3: eating in restaurants. 335 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:28,800 Speaker 2: What do you like about it? 336 00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 3: Because it's I feel grown up? Yeah, I feel like 337 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:36,800 Speaker 3: the movies, you know, and I feel grown up, and 338 00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:40,080 Speaker 3: I just think, you know, this is a wonderful establishment. 339 00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:41,760 Speaker 4: I can just admire it. 340 00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:44,760 Speaker 3: I can look around and when you hear the murmurs 341 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:46,920 Speaker 3: and no one's looking at you, I mean they are 342 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:50,040 Speaker 3: because they're thinking, how come? But really all you can 343 00:17:50,080 --> 00:17:53,159 Speaker 3: see are people eating. You see the movie, it's like 344 00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:54,040 Speaker 3: a Brunell movie. 345 00:17:54,560 --> 00:17:57,160 Speaker 2: I remember that used to come. I mean, it feels 346 00:17:57,160 --> 00:18:00,359 Speaker 2: so long ago. Yeah, but I think coming meet me 347 00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:03,840 Speaker 2: when I'm almost finished work. And so we'd come at 348 00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:07,080 Speaker 2: the end of the s and sit down, and you'd 349 00:18:07,080 --> 00:18:09,919 Speaker 2: come in a bit before, and then I would be 350 00:18:10,080 --> 00:18:10,680 Speaker 2: up and down. 351 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 3: Remember sometimes you'd get up and say, oh, I have 352 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:13,600 Speaker 3: to do this, and I'd say no. 353 00:18:13,640 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 2: Go go. And we watched the restaurant winding down, and 354 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:21,200 Speaker 2: every beautiful scene come and talk to you. And do 355 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:23,480 Speaker 2: you remember the night that you gave me a coat? 356 00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:26,480 Speaker 2: And I was waiting and those at the end, and 357 00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:28,960 Speaker 2: the restaurant was almost empty, and so I just put 358 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,439 Speaker 2: on this beautiful Durer coat and then everybody was putting 359 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:35,440 Speaker 2: it on. The receptionist was putting it on, and everybody. 360 00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:39,600 Speaker 2: We were all so excited about. And I think that 361 00:18:39,680 --> 00:18:44,520 Speaker 2: restaurants are places where you say the unexpected happen. Magic 362 00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:54,919 Speaker 2: when you create a dress, when you created the skirt 363 00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:57,879 Speaker 2: that I'm wearing of yours right now, and the process 364 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:02,359 Speaker 2: of creating and then it being worn and then it 365 00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:05,840 Speaker 2: may be lasting for centuries. Maybe not. And food, do 366 00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:08,680 Speaker 2: you think that there's a kind of relationship. I sometimes 367 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:10,840 Speaker 2: think that I make a work of art when I 368 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:14,080 Speaker 2: make up a parat art, and maybe it is a 369 00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:16,200 Speaker 2: slight work of art. It's not like a dua dress, 370 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:18,680 Speaker 2: and then it's eaten and then it's gone. So you're 371 00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:22,040 Speaker 2: judged by the moment if somebody's paratart is too sweet 372 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:25,560 Speaker 2: or it isn't cooked enough. Because fashion is could be 373 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:29,520 Speaker 2: defined is temporary, absolutely, but it's in fashion. But do 374 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:31,760 Speaker 2: you think there's relationship between food? 375 00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:35,160 Speaker 3: I do, But I think what you said about food 376 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:39,359 Speaker 3: is very interesting because it's true there's a moment for food, 377 00:19:39,359 --> 00:19:43,120 Speaker 3: and as soon as it's consumed, it's the memory that remains. 378 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:45,800 Speaker 3: But for the maker, who's like the creator of it, 379 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:49,200 Speaker 3: that's the only moment they feel they will be judged. 380 00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 3: I don't like to think of what I do as fashion. 381 00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:55,320 Speaker 3: I'm a fashion designer, but I'm not interested in fashion. 382 00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:58,040 Speaker 3: I never have been. I'm interested in the culture of style, 383 00:19:58,359 --> 00:20:01,600 Speaker 3: and that's not pompous. That just incorporates everything, you know. 384 00:20:02,040 --> 00:20:05,840 Speaker 3: But at least with clothes, you really get the chance 385 00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:09,760 Speaker 3: to see it on different women of different shapes, different ethnicities, 386 00:20:09,760 --> 00:20:13,040 Speaker 3: different physiques, you know. I mean, it's a very beautiful 387 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:14,879 Speaker 3: thing to see. And you see it on people you 388 00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:17,359 Speaker 3: don't know. Sometimes I'm in New York or even in 389 00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:20,359 Speaker 3: London or wherever in the world, and I see someone 390 00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:24,280 Speaker 3: run across the road and I think it's four winter. Yeah, 391 00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:29,119 Speaker 3: twenty four winter twelve. You know, that's nice. So I 392 00:20:29,520 --> 00:20:32,080 Speaker 3: do have this constant reminder of the work in a 393 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,080 Speaker 3: way that for you you have to keep creating it. 394 00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:38,040 Speaker 3: You know, it's not it comes and it goes, but 395 00:20:38,119 --> 00:20:41,160 Speaker 3: it's it's more sustaining routie than I work aout. 396 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:42,920 Speaker 4: Food is life. 397 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:45,919 Speaker 2: Food is life. Clothes a life. 398 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:48,400 Speaker 4: Close a life, but food is life. 399 00:20:48,560 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 2: Yeah. And do you think that when you talked about 400 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:56,720 Speaker 2: food in growing up, because your clothes are a reflection 401 00:20:56,840 --> 00:21:00,840 Speaker 2: of also, yes, growing up in Africa. Think that your 402 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:03,960 Speaker 2: identity as a designer is to do with memory and 403 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:05,360 Speaker 2: history as absolutely. 404 00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:07,280 Speaker 3: I always say, you don't know where you're going until 405 00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:11,440 Speaker 3: you know where you've come from, whether it's creatively, sexually, 406 00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:14,640 Speaker 3: wherever you know, you just don't know. Emotionally. You can't 407 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:17,240 Speaker 3: say you're in love unless you've been in love before. 408 00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 4: You know. 409 00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:21,560 Speaker 3: One of the greatest things that I got from my 410 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:24,560 Speaker 3: growing up and my assistance was a cosmopolitan eye. And 411 00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:28,159 Speaker 3: that's what my parents showed us. Look at everything. You know, 412 00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:32,480 Speaker 3: we mix Nigerian with everything. You give everything its credence, 413 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:34,359 Speaker 3: even though you know where you're from. You know, you 414 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:37,800 Speaker 3: respect yourself, but also look at everything. And I'm one 415 00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:39,800 Speaker 3: of those children. You know when you were a child, 416 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:43,160 Speaker 3: like really young, and you'd be given boxes of toys 417 00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:45,680 Speaker 3: and left like in the corner, and your parents or 418 00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:48,200 Speaker 3: whoever was with you would turn around and they would 419 00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:51,480 Speaker 3: take the toys out and they would expect you to 420 00:21:51,560 --> 00:21:53,960 Speaker 3: put them back in the box to try and fit 421 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:56,000 Speaker 3: them in the little square. Well, I was the kid 422 00:21:56,040 --> 00:21:58,200 Speaker 3: that always had them rearranged on the outside. 423 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:02,639 Speaker 2: Always range. And that's what you're saying about your cooking, 424 00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:03,639 Speaker 2: real range. 425 00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:06,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, yeah. And this is the other thing I 426 00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:10,200 Speaker 3: have to say. This is not a sucker, but Ruthie, 427 00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:13,280 Speaker 3: everyone that works at the River Cafe or has worked 428 00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:16,879 Speaker 3: as a River Cafe, the one thing they never lose 429 00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:21,440 Speaker 3: is their love of food. Now that might seem simple, 430 00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 3: but it's something that they saw and learned at. 431 00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:26,280 Speaker 4: The River Cafe. 432 00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:29,199 Speaker 3: And you can see, especially when they're very young, you 433 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 3: can see them looking for that love while they're working. 434 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:35,320 Speaker 3: And I think the love that they're looking for when 435 00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:37,840 Speaker 3: you teach them how to prepare is what goes on 436 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 3: our plate. So when I eat the botaga, it's not 437 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:42,880 Speaker 3: just a spaghetti bottaga. It's sort of a plate of love, 438 00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:45,400 Speaker 3: you know. And by the time the lemon is squeezed 439 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:47,800 Speaker 3: on it, it's like a kiss. 440 00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:50,520 Speaker 2: I was going to say that if there was a 441 00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:54,720 Speaker 2: hint about if you make that spaghetti botaga, that last 442 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:57,119 Speaker 2: squeeze of lemon juice is crucial, isn't it. It's the 443 00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:59,440 Speaker 2: one thing that you think, well, because there's so many 444 00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:01,879 Speaker 2: different ways of making it, and some people do it 445 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:05,120 Speaker 2: very very dry. They just put the graded potarga into 446 00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:08,240 Speaker 2: the spaghetti and we make it quite oily, oily and one. 447 00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:10,480 Speaker 2: But I think that what you need to do is 448 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:12,879 Speaker 2: cut that with that squeeze of lemon a thing. 449 00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:15,760 Speaker 3: But it's just the right. That's where the love comes in. 450 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:19,920 Speaker 3: You just it's kacina dii mama, you know, but it's 451 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:22,360 Speaker 3: really that and I love that. And I'll just say 452 00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 3: something about the potaga, which is very interesting. It's never 453 00:23:26,520 --> 00:23:30,800 Speaker 3: I love savory but not salty. Yeah, And it's the 454 00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:35,239 Speaker 3: perfect thing right where you just want. The portions are 455 00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:36,080 Speaker 3: also perfect. 456 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:38,840 Speaker 4: You never feel it's too much, not too much. 457 00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:41,959 Speaker 2: So that brings me to our very last question of 458 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:46,560 Speaker 2: comfort and friendship and love, all the topics we've talked 459 00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:49,439 Speaker 2: about memories and so if you were thinking about what 460 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:52,160 Speaker 2: is your comfort food? If you wanted food is comfort, 461 00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:55,280 Speaker 2: would you go back to your early days of food, 462 00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:57,440 Speaker 2: the food your mother made you, or would you think 463 00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:00,480 Speaker 2: of comfort food as a particular dish or what would 464 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:02,240 Speaker 2: be your comfort food? 465 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:05,959 Speaker 3: I think I would think of comfort food as anything, 466 00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:08,280 Speaker 3: because I'm very open. So I also love Indian food, 467 00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:11,840 Speaker 3: South Indian food. I love Japanese food. But I think 468 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:16,639 Speaker 3: of comfort food as food that somehow seems to have 469 00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:20,639 Speaker 3: the integrity of the ingredients within it, and people just 470 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:24,520 Speaker 3: took the time and the effort to use the best ingredients, 471 00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,840 Speaker 3: not necessarily the most expensive, just the best, and think 472 00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:32,359 Speaker 3: about everything to do with how it feels a sense 473 00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:34,960 Speaker 3: of safety that you get when it goes in your mouth. 474 00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:38,840 Speaker 3: And I think, instead of picking specific food, I always 475 00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 3: look for food that reminds me of a place. For instance, 476 00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 3: of course River Kaffee, for anywhere in Italy. I mean, 477 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 3: I love Rome. You know I love Rome. So I'll 478 00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:53,120 Speaker 3: try and order something with the cheese that I used 479 00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:57,320 Speaker 3: to eat in Lot. I still do legos. I love 480 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:01,359 Speaker 3: jell of rice with fried planting fried plantain. I could 481 00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:05,400 Speaker 3: that could be my last meal. Okay, it's just andsoft. 482 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,000 Speaker 2: What is what is fried planting fried plantain? 483 00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:11,320 Speaker 3: Plantain comes from almost the banana family, but it's large, 484 00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:13,960 Speaker 3: it's full of potassiums it's very good for you when 485 00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,160 Speaker 3: it's boiled. The treat as a child was we would 486 00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:20,800 Speaker 3: have fried plantain chopped up, fried and then we'd have 487 00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:24,800 Speaker 3: it with the delicious omelet. My mother used to do that. 488 00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:28,640 Speaker 3: And fried plantain. I mean sometimes if I'm eating any 489 00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:32,119 Speaker 3: Nigerian food, like something with rice, I can't quite I 490 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:35,160 Speaker 3: don't feel I've eating it well until I have fried plantain. 491 00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:39,000 Speaker 2: And that is comfort. I mean that is you know 492 00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:43,439 Speaker 2: you've described it's comfort. It's memory, it's memories, memories, and 493 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:46,640 Speaker 2: then when you are feeling that you need comfort, maybe 494 00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:49,399 Speaker 2: you also need the memory of when you didn't need comfort. 495 00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:52,240 Speaker 3: And I love the fact that I can think of 496 00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:54,879 Speaker 3: having it with any of your sources, like I'll just 497 00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:57,359 Speaker 3: have that and a sauce. And it's not about the 498 00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:00,639 Speaker 3: easiness of it, because it has for me, has to 499 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:04,200 Speaker 3: be just so right, sliced in a certain way, slide 500 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:07,199 Speaker 3: the sultan and fried in a certain way, and it's easy. 501 00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:07,879 Speaker 4: I'll cook it for you. 502 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,480 Speaker 2: Let's do it. Thank you, Drew, Thank you. 503 00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:12,359 Speaker 3: I love you. 504 00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:12,960 Speaker 4: Bie. 505 00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:20,560 Speaker 2: To visit the online shop of the River Cafe, go 506 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:26,119 Speaker 2: to shop Therivercafe dot co dot uk. 507 00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,800 Speaker 1: River Cafe Table four is a production of iHeartRadio and 508 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 1: Adami Studios. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, 509 00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:39,440 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,