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Speaker 1: I'm Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the thing. Everybody.

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Speaker 1: Welcome Alec Baldwin and Spike Lake. I've been trying to

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Speaker 1: get Spike Lee on this program for a long time.

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Speaker 1: Finally we made it happen in front of a live

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Speaker 1: audience at this year's t Rebeca Film Festival. The deal

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Speaker 1: was we would each engage the other in a discussion

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Speaker 1: about one of our favorite movies of all time. Just

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Speaker 1: listing Spike Lee's films should be enough to establish his

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Speaker 1: place as one of the deans of American movie making.

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Speaker 1: Do the right thing. Malcolm X, Jungle Fever, She's got

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Speaker 1: to have it. They defined what it means to be

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Speaker 1: black in America and help Spike smash through Hollywood's racial

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Speaker 1: glass ceiling. And he's still at it with this year's

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Speaker 1: festival favorite Black Klansmen, in which I make an appearance

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Speaker 1: alongside stars John David Washington and Adam Driver. And now

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Speaker 1: our conversation at Spring Studios in New York as part

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Speaker 1: of the Rebeca Film Festival. We didn't rehearse any of this.

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Speaker 1: First of all, let me just explain to you what

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Speaker 1: a pain in the acid is to get him on

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Speaker 1: the phone. It is so painful to pull him and

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Speaker 1: text him and text him really sunny. He calls me

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Speaker 1: back like six, mus what's up? If I see a

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Speaker 1: number on my phone, I don't know the number, I

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Speaker 1: don't pick up and he has four numbers, tell me.

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Speaker 1: I mean, what I want to know first is because

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Speaker 1: I think this helps you know these kinds of origins

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Speaker 1: help us understand this kind of film appreciation. What was

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Speaker 1: movie going in your life when you were young, when

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Speaker 1: you were a child, Tell us where you grew up,

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Speaker 1: what kind of household you grew up in, and what

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Speaker 1: was the whole TV movie dynamics of your consumption of

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Speaker 1: that kind of stuff when you were a child. I

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Speaker 1: even I never knew that you'd even make a film

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Speaker 1: growing up. I grew up in the Republic of Brooklyn.

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Speaker 1: We were the first black family to move into Cobble Hill,

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Speaker 1: which is a predominantly a town in American Navy because

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Speaker 1: Copple is right by the docks, and the docks were

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Speaker 1: Italian American, and uh, we got called nig a couple

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Speaker 1: of times first week, But once my friends sold them,

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Speaker 1: weren't a hundred of other black families moving in behind me.

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Speaker 1: Then we were just cool after that, so nothe after that.

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Speaker 1: And then we my mother decided we gotta stop paying rents,

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Speaker 1: so we bought a Brownston on a Fourth Green for

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Speaker 1: forty five thousand dollars. They go for four million. Now

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Speaker 1: what year was that? Sixty? My father grew up in

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Speaker 1: four Queen on St. Jame's Place in Fulton's. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: I remember you. Now you're a pain in the ask

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Speaker 1: then too, I couldn't get you on the phone back

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Speaker 1: at eight either. You were in four Green and sixty

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Speaker 1: eight because white flight had happened by then, and people

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Speaker 1: will move to Long Island. But what's the first movie

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Speaker 1: you saw on the big screen? The first movie I

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Speaker 1: can remember my mother took me to see really quick.

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Speaker 1: My father hated movies, but he loves sports. I got

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Speaker 1: my love of sports from my father. My mother loves movies,

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Speaker 1: but my since my father hated movies, I was my

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Speaker 1: mother's movie date. The first film I can remember my

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Speaker 1: mother took my late mother take me to. She took

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Speaker 1: me for Eastern Sunday Race musical, So Bye Bye Birdie.

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Speaker 1: And here's the thing though, that film impacted me so

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Speaker 1: much I even know it The opening credit sequence would

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Speaker 1: do the right thing. Rosie PRIs dancing. That came from

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Speaker 1: by by Bertie and Margaret. That's where it came from.

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Speaker 1: And I must have I must have been like seven

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Speaker 1: eight years old, but it just came out of nowhere?

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Speaker 1: Did I mean, this is a cliche, I guess, But

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Speaker 1: did that do something to you the first time you

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Speaker 1: saw a movie on a big screen? Did you sit

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Speaker 1: there and go? Yeah? But I didn't want them. It's

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Speaker 1: not like at that moment, but it was not who who?

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Speaker 1: Who makes a movie? So growing up, I wanted to

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Speaker 1: play a second base for New York Mets, but genetics

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Speaker 1: conspired against that happening. That's where I changed over to

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Speaker 1: the Yankees. But anyway, I wanted to be a porn star,

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Speaker 1: but you didn't have inspired against that too, So I

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Speaker 1: and I grew up wanted to be a filmmaker. But

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Speaker 1: I remember my mother taking me to see uh mean

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Speaker 1: streets when Bunny and Clyde came out. I said, can

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Speaker 1: I go? She said, I'm not taking you. I went

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Speaker 1: to see Buying Clyde. I had nightmares for two weeks

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Speaker 1: because I mean, up to that point, there was never

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Speaker 1: violent shown like that, and that that shook me for

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Speaker 1: two weeks. There was groundbreaking the pen. But the reason

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Speaker 1: why I chose On the Ward from besides is one

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Speaker 1: of the greatest films ever, is because I became very

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Speaker 1: friendly with Bud Schilberg, the great Great Bud Show. I

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Speaker 1: called him up. You know, back then you called people up.

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Speaker 1: I called Stanley Dining up, Colcazan up. You get people

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Speaker 1: on the phone. People don't realize how much that happens

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Speaker 1: in this business. And you know, I was a young filmmaker,

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Speaker 1: so you know. And and in fact, I called Billy

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Speaker 1: Waller up. He said, come on over. And I had

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Speaker 1: any time my go at people. I got my posters too,

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Speaker 1: is I got my postes, you know, just the the

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Speaker 1: sign but both but But and I we worked on

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Speaker 1: the script together, and But lived to be ninety four

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Speaker 1: or five. But when he was ninety we wrote a

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Speaker 1: script together called Save It's Joe Lewis about this relationship

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Speaker 1: between Joe Louis and Max Schmellen and his in In

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Speaker 1: the last two years of life, he would call me

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Speaker 1: every week and say, Spike, did you get the money yet?

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Speaker 1: Did you get the money yet? Because I had promised

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Speaker 1: him that I was gonna make this film before we passed.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna make that promise happen. But we just couldn't

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Speaker 1: get together up. But it's amazing as an epic has

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Speaker 1: Hitler Gebels, fdr on the Roosevelt, lenol Horn, Joe Louis,

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Speaker 1: Max Schmellon Sugar Ray Robinson. I mean it's it's uh,

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Speaker 1: We're gonna get it done one day, you know now

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Speaker 1: when you when you talk about it in the same

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Speaker 1: is in my life where I would watch movies and

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Speaker 1: I thought that movie stars were harvested on another planet

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Speaker 1: and they flew them down here or something, you know.

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Speaker 1: I I the idea that myself or anybody like me

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Speaker 1: could get into the movie business was just absurd, you know,

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Speaker 1: to me. And when did that change for you? Meaning

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Speaker 1: when did movie making become a direction that you wanted

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Speaker 1: to set sailing? Oh? When I went to college. I

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Speaker 1: went to Morouse College in Atlanta, Georgia, and my first

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Speaker 1: two years the house. My first two years I was

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Speaker 1: the C plus D minor student. What was your major?

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Speaker 1: I didn't have a major at that point. And so

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Speaker 1: before second semest ended ended in my south ways trying

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Speaker 1: to go back to New York. But if some of

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Speaker 1: my advisor told me had to choose the major when

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Speaker 1: I come back in the fall, And I said why

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Speaker 1: and my advisors said, because you have exhaust all your electives.

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Speaker 1: So I came back to New York and it was

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Speaker 1: a summer ninth. There was an infamous summer nineteen seventy seven.

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Speaker 1: The Yankees won the World Series. The first summer disco

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Speaker 1: heat was horrible. Therefore you had the blackout and you

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Speaker 1: had David Berkle. It's on the stad so it's amazing.

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Speaker 1: Many minutes later I wrote the Corona script with the

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Speaker 1: Mike Criol Victor Clochio called Summer sam But anyway, New

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Speaker 1: York City was broke that summer. There's a famous Daily

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Speaker 1: News front page forward to New York dropped dead. There

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Speaker 1: you go, you up to that point. If you had

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Speaker 1: your workers permit, you get the job doing something. But

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Speaker 1: there were no jobs in New York City and I

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Speaker 1: and I didn't want to spend a whole summer playing

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Speaker 1: strata matic baseball on my stoop. So at a still

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Speaker 1: my friend today, her name is if you had to Johnston,

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Speaker 1: she was very smart. She if you go to Stifers

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Speaker 1: and you had to be smart. The test for New

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Speaker 1: York City was Brooklyn Tech, Science and Stuyverson. Brooklyn Tech

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Speaker 1: was it might down the block for me here science

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Speaker 1: and stops. She got in the I mean she was smart.

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Speaker 1: So one day and I swear my mother's grave this

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Speaker 1: this was not a mistake. I was sitting on my

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Speaker 1: stoop nothing to do, and the spirit told me, goes

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Speaker 1: ce Vieta. So I went to her house. She lived

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Speaker 1: at University Towers on on Waverley No. Willoughby and uh

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Speaker 1: will it Willoughby and Ashland Cross Street from l I U.

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Speaker 1: So she's studying. I mean she's studying the whole summer.

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Speaker 1: And so there's a box in the corner of the

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Speaker 1: room and I said, what's that. She said, that's a

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Speaker 1: Super eight camera. You can have it. I said, was

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Speaker 1: an other box? She said, that's the stupid that's the

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Speaker 1: cartridge of the Super eight. The goals into the thing,

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Speaker 1: says you can have it. I'm gonna be a doctor,

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Speaker 1: so I don't need this. She is a doctor. She

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Speaker 1: went to Princeton undergrad and with the Harvard Med School.

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Speaker 1: So that was not a mistake for me to go.

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Speaker 1: We at his house that day so now it had

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Speaker 1: so now there's something to do. So I spent the

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Speaker 1: whole summer not trying to be a filmmaker, but just

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Speaker 1: shooting stuff. So I shot The Blackout. It was the

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Speaker 1: first summer discos. Every weekend there was a block party

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Speaker 1: in DJs hook them their turntables and speakers to the

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Speaker 1: thing and then, uh, it was just a crazy summer.

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Speaker 1: So I came back to school in the fall and

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Speaker 1: declared my major. That's me a mask mun Case is

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Speaker 1: a major. Now more House didn't have that major, so

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Speaker 1: I so I took master Cass across the street at

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Speaker 1: Clark College. So you had Spellman, Morehouse, Clark College, Atlanta Versity,

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Speaker 1: and Morris Brown, these all black institutions really in the

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Speaker 1: same Mary in Atlanta. And there's a teacher There's there's

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Speaker 1: a professor his name is Dr herbiker Berger, still teaching there.

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Speaker 1: And I told him I had this film I just

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Speaker 1: shot from footage. I don't know what to do with this, said,

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Speaker 1: you make up feel with it. So masthemd cases quickly

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Speaker 1: with film, TV, journalism and broadcast, and he said, make

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Speaker 1: a documentary. To make a documentary of the film. The

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Speaker 1: film end up being called last awesome Brooklyn. I worked

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Speaker 1: all semester on it, and then many times when he

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Speaker 1: had he had the key to the film lab, and

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Speaker 1: twice a week he would stay extra so I could

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Speaker 1: spent another four hours edited. And he wasn't getting paid

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Speaker 1: for it either extra. Why do you think he did

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Speaker 1: that he saw something me. I didn't see it, right.

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Speaker 1: What did he see in you that you didn't see?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I never asked him that teaches are

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Speaker 1: so important. I mean, I think you're going to somebody

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Speaker 1: giving you a hand. Explain that, by the way, because

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Speaker 1: I mean, I don't want to just kiss your butt

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Speaker 1: here all day, all night long, but because that's very

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Speaker 1: easy to do. I mean, let listen, I'm gonna get

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Speaker 1: I don't wanna get emotional here. But like in this business,

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Speaker 1: there's just something. I mean, you look at people who

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Speaker 1: are talented, and you really it just it humbles you,

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Speaker 1: it quiets you. You know, this man is one of

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Speaker 1: the greatest movie makers of the last fifty or seventy

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Speaker 1: five years in this country. Thank you, Thank you, expands

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Speaker 1: one of the greatest filmmakers alive. Thank you ever. And

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Speaker 1: so when you that mentorship thing to explain to people,

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Speaker 1: which even was news to me up until recently. You

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Speaker 1: don't guest teach, you're on the faculty and you teach

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Speaker 1: a course every year for how many years? Now, going

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Speaker 1: on teams a tenured film professor, you're gonna get a

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Speaker 1: paid check. Man fantastic he had paid now. But the

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Speaker 1: thing is that both my children went to n y U,

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Speaker 1: so that tuition ain't no joke. But my mother was

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Speaker 1: a teacher, my late mother, she taught at St. Ann's

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Speaker 1: in Brooken Heights on the legendary seven Balls. None of

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Speaker 1: my grandmother taught. My grandmother's grandma was a slave. Yes,

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Speaker 1: she graduated from Spellman. My mother, my mother graduated from Spellman,

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Speaker 1: My grandmother graduated Spellman. My father and grand grandfather and

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Speaker 1: grandfather graduated from Warhouse. My father's a freshman. Dr Martha

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Speaker 1: Came was a senior martincme the third and our classmates

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Speaker 1: the class seventy nine. But my grandmother taught art the

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Speaker 1: fifty years in Atlanta, George and fifty years she never

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Speaker 1: had one white student because of the Jim Crow laws

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Speaker 1: and in in South, specifically in Atlanta and the fifty years,

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Speaker 1: white students missed on the ate. Our teacher and my mother,

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Speaker 1: my grandmother fifty years saved their social Security checks for

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Speaker 1: grandchildren education. So says that was the first grandchild. She

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Speaker 1: put me through more house and n y U just

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Speaker 1: accumulation of the social Security checks over fifty years. M

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Speaker 1: and she gave me the seed money for my my

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Speaker 1: thesis film, Joe's Best Side Barbershop We Cut Heads is

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Speaker 1: one which wanted due to kemmy ward and a little

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Speaker 1: bit money for us. She's gonna have it the first film.

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Speaker 1: But but even more important than the money, and we

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Speaker 1: gotta go, we gotta talk about the films even more important.

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Speaker 1: And here's the thing though, here's what I say when

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Speaker 1: I when I speak in public, I always say this,

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Speaker 1: parents kill more dreams than anybody, so specifically if those

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Speaker 1: dreams that their children have had to do with the arts.

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Speaker 1: So I grew up in a very artistic families. So

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Speaker 1: when I said my tory, but I wanted to be

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Speaker 1: a filmmaker, nobody said, get the funk out of you're crazy.

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Speaker 1: No black filmmakers. You know, Melvin was not around anymore.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't making films. Ozzie Daves, Oscar Show Oscar Showmen

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Speaker 1: dead for many of me the years, but I only

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Speaker 1: got encouragement. And so often when a child a young

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Speaker 1: adult tells their parents, you know what, what are you

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Speaker 1: gonna major in poetry, ballet, dance, photography, whatever it is,

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Speaker 1: they're like, now they're black. Parents goes like this, as

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Speaker 1: long as your monkey has as black living in my house,

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Speaker 1: where are my clothes? Eat my food? We we didn't.

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Speaker 1: We didn't take out a second more of the house.

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Speaker 1: And I mean they got some points, you know, in

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Speaker 1: my house that played out like this. I'm going to

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Speaker 1: g W to study political science. I go up to

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Speaker 1: New York. Long story, but I go my audition for

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Speaker 1: the acting program and I get accepted, and I'm going

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Speaker 1: to go to the n y U Acting program. And

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Speaker 1: I explained to my parents how it's actually gonna cost

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Speaker 1: less for me to go to n y U, even

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Speaker 1: though it's more expensive school, because I requalified for all

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Speaker 1: this New York State based loans and scholarships, you know,

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Speaker 1: region scholarship, things that I've forfeited when I went to Washington.

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Speaker 1: So I call my family and I say, I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: leave GW. I'm not gonna go to law school. I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna go to n y U and study acting. And

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Speaker 1: my mother, I means, she screamed like a heart, like

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Speaker 1: like like Jamie Lee Curtis in a horror movie. She

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Speaker 1: was like. My mother was like, are you out of

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Speaker 1: your mind? Are you insane? She's screaming, and I go, no, no,

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Speaker 1: I go listen, I go. It's gonna cost you, guys,

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Speaker 1: let's money. And my father, let's hear him out. Let's

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Speaker 1: hear him out. Hear him out, Director Spike Lee. He

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Speaker 1: also teaches in the graduate film program at n y U.

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Speaker 1: And when we return, we'll do some analysis on our

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Speaker 1: chosen films. A Place in the Sun and on the Waterfront.

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Speaker 1: I'm Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing now,

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Speaker 1: more of my conversation in front of a live audience

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Speaker 1: at the Tribeca Film Festival with director Spike Lee. Your

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Speaker 1: films obviously deal with a lot of themes of racial

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Speaker 1: injustice and stuff forth and struggle. Are themes that are

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Speaker 1: in your own films? Are they in Waterfront as well? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Amazon Anderson Cooper. When this whole thing was happening, Kaepernick

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Speaker 1: and I watched on a ward from Again for the

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Speaker 1: million times and the stuff that Kaepernick was saying with

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Speaker 1: the same stuff did did. Marlon Brando was saying, I

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Speaker 1: want my rights. And you can see the mob was

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Speaker 1: the inn at the owners, because you have when you

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Speaker 1: have the shape up, had the things that guy was

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Speaker 1: giving out. And here here's a motherfucker here in the

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Speaker 1: scene to get under work the guy, the steward, whatever

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Speaker 1: he has to give you, like a coin. And so

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Speaker 1: after Marlon Brando, TERRYM. Lloyd testifies against Lee J. Cobb Friendly,

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Speaker 1: Johnny Friendly, he says, fucking, I'm going back to work.

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Speaker 1: So he's standing there and they're giving out a coin

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Speaker 1: to everybody, and then there's nobody there and there's some rummy,

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Speaker 1: some bump who's has his hands over the fire and

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Speaker 1: they put in and so I'm saying, the NFL, these

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Speaker 1: motherfucker's hired motherfucking quarterbacks who are horrible. So what they

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Speaker 1: did the term Lloyd, they're doing the Kaepernick. They were

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Speaker 1: I don't want to say the guy's name. The guy

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Speaker 1: had retired Chicago Bears quarterback, Go ahead say his name.

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Speaker 1: They took him my retirement, gave him a ten million

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Speaker 1: dollar contract. He was horrible. Kaepernick still can't get a

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Speaker 1: job so it was amazing. I mean, but Schilberg was

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Speaker 1: a visionary. And when I saw what they were doing

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Speaker 1: that Terry malloy, it was the same thing, and that

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Speaker 1: was doing the Kaepernick. I think that there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of legend and lore about that film. And you know

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Speaker 1: these stories of everybody's heard a million times about Brandon

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Speaker 1: doesn't do the off camera for Snicker and all that crap,

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Speaker 1: and you know, all that stuff which is not that

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Speaker 1: important is the movie about Kazan's Mia Colpa for you know,

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Speaker 1: ratting it. I'm glad what I've done to you, John Friendly,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna keep on doing it, he says, you know

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Speaker 1: you know that that no apologies for that. But for me,

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Speaker 1: it's like, you know, Brandon was someone who was did

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Speaker 1: you know Brandon? Yeah, I met Branda time I was

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Speaker 1: gonna do I was in this wheel of my life

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Speaker 1: where c you know, CBS was gonna pay people big

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Speaker 1: money to do these m ow's, the old m o

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Speaker 1: W we're gonna do. We did. I did street Car

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Speaker 1: on Broadway, which we wound up doing on a for TV.

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Speaker 1: No no, no, no, no that, but we do we

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Speaker 1: do a street car and brought we do on TV.

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Speaker 1: But that was a waste of time. But they paid

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Speaker 1: everybody a lot of money. But like, why do it

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Speaker 1: for TV when it's in the in the movie, his movie?

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Speaker 1: And so I go see him because they want to

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Speaker 1: do Canton a hut tin roof and they want him

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Speaker 1: to play Big Daddy, but they're not going to insure him.

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Speaker 1: Long story short, as I go to his house, there's

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Speaker 1: a true story. I go to his house up on

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Speaker 1: Mulholland and I go there to beg him to do Canton,

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Speaker 1: notts and roof if they will ultimately insure him, which

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Speaker 1: they wouldn't, And I mean, I'll do my my my

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Speaker 1: tepid Brando impersonation. But I said, uh, I said, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, I you know, one thing led to another.

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Speaker 1: I had lunch with her for four hours, and I said, uh,

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Speaker 1: uh you know, I did street Car on Broadway. Uh.

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Speaker 1: You know, like it was like six or seven years

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Speaker 1: before I heard about that from some friends of mine

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Speaker 1: that you did that. I heard you were very good

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Speaker 1: or not yes, And I heard you were very funny.

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Speaker 1: And I wish I had done more of that because

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Speaker 1: it's a very funny part and the character of Fanley

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Speaker 1: is very funny and I wish I had found more

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Speaker 1: of the humor myself. And there's a pause, and I went,

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Speaker 1: but it worked out pretty well for you just to

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Speaker 1: say it. Woun't you say? I mean, I mean, I

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Speaker 1: mean it went okay. Don't you think for how it

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Speaker 1: went over, you know, in the for the public, and uh,

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Speaker 1: but it's uh, I met him just that one time,

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Speaker 1: and uh, but what you see, he's interesting to me

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Speaker 1: because there's a couple of guys. I mean, I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: talk briefly about it from the actor's standpoint, which which

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Speaker 1: I can't help. But you know, but Gina was obviously

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Speaker 1: a big beacon for me. And there's those moments. There's

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Speaker 1: always a moment, uh, you know, John Mandolfice in the

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Speaker 1: hospital and Serpico has got the bullet hole in his

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Speaker 1: face and John Mandow puts the gold shield on him

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Speaker 1: and he doesn't want the gold helped to become a detective,

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Speaker 1: and finally he gets it in Macino, just he erupts

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Speaker 1: into this moment, this momentary sob this gasp of agony

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Speaker 1: for just a moment of his suffering, and I just

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Speaker 1: thought to myself, this is why I want al maybe

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Speaker 1: want to be an actor as much as anybody, as

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Speaker 1: much as anybody, but Gina was the one that maybe

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Speaker 1: one when he was one of them, you know, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: dog Day Surprico was one of my favorites. But and

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Speaker 1: Brando to Brando of course gets into that zone where

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Speaker 1: he doesn't care. You know, he's a prodigy and he

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Speaker 1: puts all the pieces together when he's twenty four years old.

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Speaker 1: Brando did a streetcar and brobery when it was twenty four.

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Speaker 1: I did it when I was thirty four. He I

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Speaker 1: never met him. You never did call me up two

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Speaker 1: o'clock in the morning and uh, I'm not gonna do imitational.

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Speaker 1: But he wanted me to do a film a Native Americans.

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Speaker 1: And I've never heard from after that. Well he yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and then I found lady. He would call people late,

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Speaker 1: but Tidy got my number and I unbelieve it was

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Speaker 1: him at first. But my favorite line he said to

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Speaker 1: me was I sit in his house and I'm terrified

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Speaker 1: with him. I'm terrified, terrified. I meet people who are

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Speaker 1: my peers, you know, and my generation of actors, and

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Speaker 1: I admire some of them incredibly, but it's different when

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Speaker 1: you meet Kirk Douglas or Gregory Peck and some of

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Speaker 1: these guys I met. I mean, I was like, I

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Speaker 1: literally pissed my pants when I met Gregory Peck and

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Speaker 1: uh like almost literally and uh um. And then I'll

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Speaker 1: never forget. I'm in Brando's house and he said to me,

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Speaker 1: he says, he says, you know, you and I are

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Speaker 1: like two dogs that are sniffing each other. He said,

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Speaker 1: you're sniffing me and I'm sniffing you. And he said,

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Speaker 1: and oh god, oh god, I hate that. I hate that.

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Speaker 1: He said, So you say whatever you want to say,

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Speaker 1: and I'll say whatever I want to say. I mean,

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Speaker 1: just really, he just didn't want anybody to play him.

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Speaker 1: He hated that, you know, I mean, and it was,

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Speaker 1: it was. It was an amazing day. I have a

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Speaker 1: day I spent with him now. Um So in Waterfront.

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Speaker 1: One of the other things I love about this film

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Speaker 1: is that is that you know, Kazan, having directed in

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Speaker 1: the theater, he knew that you had to set the

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Speaker 1: table with every detail in terms of the acting in

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Speaker 1: their performances. That there was one week link in the chain.

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Speaker 1: I'm talking about Fred Gwynn when I later wanted to

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Speaker 1: play Herman Munster with a small role Lee J. Cobb

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Speaker 1: and one of his greatest roles. One of the great

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Speaker 1: great great actors in history, Lee J. Cobb, Steiger, great

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Speaker 1: great actor Maori s her FIRSTRMORI sat of course. I

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Speaker 1: mean the the acting is superlative from one end to

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Speaker 1: the other. In that cast. It's it's mind blowing. It's

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Speaker 1: and and uh two ton Tony Galento. You know it

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Speaker 1: was Bud that got all those Xbox Boxers in the

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Speaker 1: film because he knew them. Yeah, I mean, just the

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Speaker 1: acting is breathtaking. But also what I what I love

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Speaker 1: is that. Uh. Also what I love is it it

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Speaker 1: so nothing on the screen really in terms of set design,

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Speaker 1: in terms of costume it's it literally is the closest

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Speaker 1: I've ever seen to a motion picture that behaves like radio,

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Speaker 1: where you only focused on the ideas. You're not thrown

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Speaker 1: by a lot of pizzazz and a lot of shots

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Speaker 1: and a lot of it's so straight ahead and so honest.

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Speaker 1: You as a filmmaker when you first saw the film,

424
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:29,359
Speaker 1: what did you think of it as a movie? How

425
00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:31,800
Speaker 1: you put together a movie? I loved it, and I

426
00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:37,679
Speaker 1: gotta give love the Lennon Bernstein score amazing and for

427
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:39,359
Speaker 1: me it is one. I know, we gotta get to

428
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:45,320
Speaker 1: your your selection. But what it has for one of

429
00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:50,160
Speaker 1: the most amazing endings of the movie with the score,

430
00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:53,560
Speaker 1: and they brought in James Wang Han the greats and

431
00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:57,119
Speaker 1: photographer to be in the roller skates. Boris Kaufman was

432
00:25:57,160 --> 00:25:59,480
Speaker 1: the cinematographer. But you see they brought in James wang

433
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:01,640
Speaker 1: How I didn't know that he did that shot. Wow,

434
00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:05,560
Speaker 1: that's amazing. Brando's peel v as he's walking towards the

435
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 1: guy and you see everybody goes and stumbles in. Everybody

436
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:14,240
Speaker 1: goes in behind him and they see the gate clothes

437
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:18,640
Speaker 1: and you see, uh yeah, called Maldon and you recently

438
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:24,919
Speaker 1: walk out. I mean that that and a lot of

439
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:30,280
Speaker 1: great lines in that movie that uh um. I still

440
00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 1: quote Brando whenever my wife would say to me. You know,

441
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:38,000
Speaker 1: she'd said to me, you know, when are you gonna

442
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:39,879
Speaker 1: take me to dinner or whatever? The line buzz And

443
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 1: you know, Brando's got the line in the in the

444
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:44,399
Speaker 1: bar with the gun and he says, it's none of

445
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:49,760
Speaker 1: your business. You have to say that line of people

446
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 1: like that will not work in the Lee household. Let

447
00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:57,440
Speaker 1: me tell you that it's none of your business, one

448
00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:04,920
Speaker 1: of your your own business, Lewis Lee. Uh. Now, now

449
00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:07,200
Speaker 1: another person in this film who I thought was that

450
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:10,399
Speaker 1: I really was taken by was the art director. You

451
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:12,639
Speaker 1: know what I do work I do on TCM and

452
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 1: things like that where I get into these details. Richard Day,

453
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,000
Speaker 1: who did the art direction on this film, was nominated.

454
00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:21,720
Speaker 1: I think I don't have the statistics in front of me.

455
00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:25,359
Speaker 1: He was nominated for like nine Academy Awards and won

456
00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:28,320
Speaker 1: many Academy Awards for for a career that spanned from

457
00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 1: Dark Angel and Dodsworth and dead End in the thirties

458
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: and to how Green was My Value? And then it

459
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 1: goes onto street Car and Waterfront in in the in

460
00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:44,720
Speaker 1: the in the fifties, and this guy one oscars over

461
00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:49,280
Speaker 1: the arc of like a two decades and uh. And

462
00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:54,720
Speaker 1: of course Leonard Bernstein score, which uh, you know, the

463
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:56,639
Speaker 1: New York Philharmonic has a program that I'm the co

464
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:59,080
Speaker 1: producer I called the Art of the Score, which we

465
00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:02,399
Speaker 1: played the music. I have to picture, particularly films that

466
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:06,080
Speaker 1: have classical repertoire, with Kubrick being the uh, the ultimate

467
00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:07,840
Speaker 1: example of that, and showing films like you went to

468
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:12,200
Speaker 1: Science say again, went the Bronx very exactly exactly Kubrick,

469
00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:14,840
Speaker 1: you know two thousand and one, which we're showing again

470
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:17,320
Speaker 1: for the second time next year, Barry Linded and so forth.

471
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 1: But we've also played films where to have they just

472
00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:24,439
Speaker 1: have lush, non classical score. Although burn Steins part of

473
00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 1: that world, and we showed Waterfront and and the Philharmonic

474
00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:30,760
Speaker 1: played Waterfront In said though he didn't like the way

475
00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:35,199
Speaker 1: he wrote more music than was put in. Yeah, so

476
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:40,040
Speaker 1: he wasn't happy with the way now turn out. Can

477
00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 1: we talk about Shelley Winters. You Go, You Go is

478
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 1: amazing in a place in the sun, and when I

479
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:55,120
Speaker 1: saw her role, automatically automatically thought about her and Night

480
00:28:55,160 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 1: of the Hunter. It's almost like the same, this magic

481
00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 1: woman that just can't get it right and with the

482
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:10,200
Speaker 1: wrong guy, and she got murdered. In both films. Here's

483
00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:13,120
Speaker 1: Cliff gleaming with his beauty and she's gleaming with her beauty.

484
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 1: But the acting of Shelley Winters, her performance is unbelievable

485
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:19,520
Speaker 1: in this movie. She's incredible, But there are very few people.

486
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,320
Speaker 1: You can't shoot two people this close. And the famous

487
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 1: kissing scene between Montgomery Clift and Elizabeth Taylor. You can't

488
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: shoot two people that close and hold the camera that

489
00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:34,480
Speaker 1: close for too long unless you have two perfect looking people.

490
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:37,320
Speaker 1: And in this film you have the you have the

491
00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:39,480
Speaker 1: most beautiful man, or one of them that ever lived

492
00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:41,840
Speaker 1: in the history of the movies, and the most beautiful woman.

493
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:45,560
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's like a cinematic like a confection,

494
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:47,840
Speaker 1: you know. I mean, in terms of the delight you

495
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 1: feel from watching these people. The scene when they meet

496
00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:53,200
Speaker 1: and he's shooting pool at the party and she walks in.

497
00:29:53,840 --> 00:29:56,240
Speaker 1: I mean, there's there's there's so much for the eye.

498
00:29:56,400 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 1: There's so much beauty in this film and just flat

499
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:03,479
Speaker 1: out uti between these two people. And then beyond that

500
00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 1: is this horrible drama of what happens to to him

501
00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:10,040
Speaker 1: and to Shelley Winter. There's no spoiler alert here, but

502
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:14,120
Speaker 1: it's this film. The first time I ever saw this film,

503
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:16,760
Speaker 1: I remember he's on a television I think. I mean

504
00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:18,360
Speaker 1: a lot of these films I saw on TV because

505
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:20,800
Speaker 1: when I was a kid, Channel nine, right there you go.

506
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:24,320
Speaker 1: I mean, people, I always say the same tired thing

507
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:25,920
Speaker 1: all the time about this, but you know, no HBO,

508
00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:29,280
Speaker 1: no VS, VCRs. When I was a kid, it was

509
00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:33,520
Speaker 1: Channel eleven, Channel five, and Channel uh nine would make

510
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:36,200
Speaker 1: licensing agreements with a studio. Probably i'd of a cycle.

511
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 1: Do you remember, Okay, I'm gonna come out a million

512
00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:45,560
Speaker 1: dollar movie with the theme from Gone with the Wind.

513
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:48,400
Speaker 1: So I see this movie on TV and I remember, like,

514
00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:50,920
Speaker 1: it's not even about sexuality, I don't think, but just

515
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:52,760
Speaker 1: kind of sitting there with my mouth up and going,

516
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,640
Speaker 1: oh my god. You know, I think I'd probably kill

517
00:30:56,720 --> 00:31:01,840
Speaker 1: Shelley Winters for Elizabeth Taylor too. And that's not a

518
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:06,600
Speaker 1: hard choice, but that but that movie doesn't mean you

519
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:08,760
Speaker 1: hear you've got the guy though they both played that.

520
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:11,720
Speaker 1: I mean, Elizabeth Taylor was a breathtaking actress, and and

521
00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:13,760
Speaker 1: and and Clift was it was it was a brilliant actor.

522
00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:19,000
Speaker 1: And then you see the juxtaposition between Sheldon win Is,

523
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,680
Speaker 1: you know, a lower lower class and you know that

524
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:27,080
Speaker 1: feels really about classism. Even though Montgomery is Eastman, he's

525
00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 1: like not really part of the real family, so he's

526
00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 1: trying to get up the ladder. Two, I have to

527
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:37,520
Speaker 1: take advantage of you being here for this kind of thing. Now,

528
00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:41,080
Speaker 1: what do you do when you direct the film? Because

529
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:45,040
Speaker 1: they always say that the directors then and now. It's

530
00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 1: always been the same that they cast. Well, you try

531
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:51,040
Speaker 1: your best to get who you want for the role.

532
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 1: You have a dream cast, and you try to get

533
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,200
Speaker 1: them in terms of their availability, and there there there

534
00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:58,080
Speaker 1: there their desire to be in the film, and can

535
00:31:58,160 --> 00:32:00,280
Speaker 1: you afford them, and so all those things come together,

536
00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:02,320
Speaker 1: which I want you to speak about for people to

537
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:05,760
Speaker 1: understand what an extraordinarily difficult thing that is to do.

538
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:08,720
Speaker 1: I meaning, you're you're gonna make a film, Spike Lee

539
00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:11,040
Speaker 1: is gonna make a film, and you're gonna have anybody

540
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 1: in your films. People are begging to work with you,

541
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:18,440
Speaker 1: and sometimes you don't get who you want in the film. True. Well,

542
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:25,360
Speaker 1: since we are here at the Tribeca Film Festival, the

543
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:30,479
Speaker 1: role of sal I offered to Mr de Niro, You

544
00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:34,000
Speaker 1: want to do it, that son of a bitch. No,

545
00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 1: I think it's Daniel. You got nominated, and I think that,

546
00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:46,200
Speaker 1: which I mean, I love Bob and I wanted my film,

547
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 1: but de Nirol might have tilted. It was meant to

548
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:54,280
Speaker 1: be asemble piece do the right thing. You mean you

549
00:32:54,280 --> 00:33:00,920
Speaker 1: had two taro, I mean every was in it, but

550
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:06,840
Speaker 1: no one's really Richard Edson the Great Ruby, d Ozzy Davis.

551
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:11,320
Speaker 1: You no but Sam Sam Samuel Jackson and he was

552
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:16,360
Speaker 1: saying back then, and Carlo Jean Casposito, Rosie Perez. That's

553
00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:19,880
Speaker 1: her first film is Martin Lawrences first film, Robin Harris

554
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:24,440
Speaker 1: first film, The Late Robin Harris. So it's been my

555
00:33:24,560 --> 00:33:29,040
Speaker 1: experience things happen for the most part the way it

556
00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:31,280
Speaker 1: should be, because that's not the only time where I

557
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:35,480
Speaker 1: wanted someone and I didn't get them and it turned

558
00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:39,840
Speaker 1: out for the best because I got somebody who just

559
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,200
Speaker 1: fits better. So and it also like its like a

560
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:46,320
Speaker 1: sports team, you know. I mean one year the Lakers

561
00:33:46,360 --> 00:33:51,320
Speaker 1: head like by all stars starting, they were terrible because

562
00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:54,200
Speaker 1: it was no there's no chemistry and everybody's gonna be starting.

563
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:58,520
Speaker 1: Everybody can't be like it just needs to come together.

564
00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:02,360
Speaker 1: It's interesting because you hear that across the board. You

565
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:04,640
Speaker 1: have an ensemble of people and if you change one

566
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:08,920
Speaker 1: little thing, it would upset the now. Now without naming names,

567
00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 1: because one of my goals into you know, embarrassing anybody.

568
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,280
Speaker 1: But when you make films as a as a director,

569
00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 1: and your films are dramas, they're they're they're they're acting,

570
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:20,960
Speaker 1: is at the four. You don't do action films and

571
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 1: space movies and all this other crap. I'm sorry, I

572
00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:29,520
Speaker 1: didn't mean that. Um Um, what I meant was, uh,

573
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:37,080
Speaker 1: because we love space movie, let's face. But when you're directing,

574
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:41,440
Speaker 1: what is directing performance for you? Now? Because like, you

575
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:43,120
Speaker 1: bring these people in, and you bring people who are

576
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:45,279
Speaker 1: going to play the role, and you you assume they're

577
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:47,840
Speaker 1: pretty good to go. But what happens when it's not working?

578
00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,279
Speaker 1: How involved are you involved? And like walking up to people,

579
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:52,680
Speaker 1: take them aside and go, hey man, this is what

580
00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:55,239
Speaker 1: I need in the scene. Yeah, but you can't have

581
00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:59,719
Speaker 1: to be done you know, in a whisper if you

582
00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 1: do that, I felt you're gonna lose actor, even if

583
00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:05,320
Speaker 1: you take him aside and do it. Know what I'm saying,

584
00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:08,080
Speaker 1: It has to be done private exactly. I agree with you.

585
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 1: Oh no, it should be private, you know. So you

586
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:15,440
Speaker 1: really here's the thing, don't you try to head that

587
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:20,200
Speaker 1: stuff off in rehearsal. You can't be on the on

588
00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:22,840
Speaker 1: the day while you're shooting hundred of people, you know,

589
00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:25,319
Speaker 1: crew members, and you're discussing the character and the ark

590
00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:27,160
Speaker 1: all that stuff. That stuff has to be worked out

591
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 1: in rehearsal. But sometimes whether I'm having a bad dare

592
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:34,200
Speaker 1: actor having a bad day, things that happen. You're just

593
00:35:34,239 --> 00:35:40,399
Speaker 1: trying to go through it, but and make sure that

594
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 1: at the end we're done that we talked. So you

595
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,600
Speaker 1: gotta get you gotta work that shipped out so it's squashed,

596
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:51,200
Speaker 1: done with and you could continue in good spirits. I'm

597
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 1: reminded of my dear, dear friend who passed away, Marvin Worth.

598
00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:58,000
Speaker 1: You know, Marvin Bruduce Malcolm X. Give me an example.

599
00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 1: Maybe he's one producers who actually contribute to help you

600
00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:06,920
Speaker 1: make the movie you want to make. Marvin bought the

601
00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:12,799
Speaker 1: rights to the autobiography of Malcolm X, as told by

602
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:20,040
Speaker 1: Alex Haley. I mean really really many years ago, and

603
00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 1: he's been trying to make it. Set lamed a whole

604
00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:27,040
Speaker 1: bunch of people. One time, Richard Pryor supposed to play him,

605
00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 1: and he said, he sent me letters saying you want

606
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:36,319
Speaker 1: to be involved as film, So I never I never

607
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:40,920
Speaker 1: got the letters. So then I was reading the papers

608
00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:45,400
Speaker 1: that Denzel Washington was gonna play Malcolm X. He had

609
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 1: already done the play a Broadway When Chickens Come When

610
00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:51,120
Speaker 1: Chickens Come Home, The roost and the director was gonna

611
00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:58,280
Speaker 1: be Norman Jewison, and I said to myself self, hold

612
00:36:58,360 --> 00:37:05,719
Speaker 1: the funk up. Yeah, and Norman great director in the

613
00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:08,000
Speaker 1: Heat and the Night. I mean he's done many, many

614
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:14,440
Speaker 1: fine films. And I just began to talk about a

615
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:16,560
Speaker 1: little bit and then Marven Worth called me, says, Spike,

616
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:24,879
Speaker 1: stop talking. Let's have you and Norman sit down, and

617
00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:28,400
Speaker 1: so we we met. I mean, this is not a

618
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:34,560
Speaker 1: new story, it's old. And uh, Norman want to note

619
00:37:34,560 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 1: why I want to do it? And I told him

620
00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:41,239
Speaker 1: and he gracefully said, okay. He didn't have to do that.

621
00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:44,279
Speaker 1: He had the gig. He was a director, he was

622
00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:47,480
Speaker 1: the one the Marvel Worth chose and also Warner Brothers.

623
00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 1: So I've always had the respect for Mr Jewison because

624
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:57,920
Speaker 1: he could have said, fuck you, Spike, I don't care

625
00:37:57,960 --> 00:38:00,640
Speaker 1: who you are. I'm directing this feel. But there are

626
00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:02,839
Speaker 1: producers and this is I guess what my question is,

627
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:05,040
Speaker 1: because a lot of people that that's an intangible for

628
00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:07,879
Speaker 1: a lot of people. What producers do beyond, as they say,

629
00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:10,319
Speaker 1: bringing a vital element to the table, the script, the star,

630
00:38:10,520 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 1: the money from the studio. They've got the juice with

631
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:15,120
Speaker 1: the studio, what have you. But there are producers who

632
00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:16,920
Speaker 1: have actually have they've helped you make your films. If

633
00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 1: they've they've contributed to man, there's no way pout. I've

634
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 1: been involved. I was directed Malcolm X without the late

635
00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:27,480
Speaker 1: great Marvin Worth. I went to a screening. Marvin invited

636
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:32,200
Speaker 1: me to a screening, uh at the Academy in uh,

637
00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:34,360
Speaker 1: not the DJ but the Academy, you know, one of

638
00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:36,840
Speaker 1: the great great screening rooms in all of Los Angeles,

639
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:39,239
Speaker 1: which is saying a lot. And then we went to

640
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:43,200
Speaker 1: that screening of Malcolm X there and uh, I gotta say,

641
00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:45,239
Speaker 1: it's one of your greatest films. That's a great, great film,

642
00:38:45,239 --> 00:38:48,840
Speaker 1: Malcolm X. You had a great job. All that goes

643
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:52,799
Speaker 1: to Mr Denzel Washington. I know we're talking all the films.

644
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:54,680
Speaker 1: I have to just say this real quick because tomorrow

645
00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:59,160
Speaker 1: let's see Denzel Washington. Dad the opening of Life coming

646
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:05,239
Speaker 1: coming four three curtain call. It's like a nine right, ye,

647
00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:10,640
Speaker 1: not that long. But people ask me all the time,

648
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:15,719
Speaker 1: you know, we uh, Denzel more better Malcolm X. He

649
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:19,360
Speaker 1: got game inside man. So it's been a minute. But

650
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:24,880
Speaker 1: Denzel people asked me about his performance. He prepared a

651
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:28,319
Speaker 1: year before. He told his agent, don't give me any

652
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:33,440
Speaker 1: more work, learned to praying Arabic, speaking Arabic, learning to

653
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:39,440
Speaker 1: read the Koran, cut out pork, cut out alcohol, because

654
00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:49,319
Speaker 1: he under Denzel understands that just sounded like somebody or

655
00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:53,560
Speaker 1: looking like that's just surface and he and he knew

656
00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:56,880
Speaker 1: that if he did the job need to be done,

657
00:39:57,880 --> 00:40:02,319
Speaker 1: that Malcolm's spirit will come into him. I put my

658
00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:05,320
Speaker 1: hand on a stack of Bibles. There was a scene.

659
00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:09,279
Speaker 1: All the speeches in the film were Malcolm's words, and

660
00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 1: there was one speech. I mean, he was killing it

661
00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:14,880
Speaker 1: and I'm looking at him. I got the mom to

662
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:18,480
Speaker 1: him looking at Ernest right here, my great cinematograher, Ernest Dickinson.

663
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:21,960
Speaker 1: So I see that, to see him looking at the sides.

664
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:26,279
Speaker 1: And the scene is about the end. Some great called

665
00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:29,680
Speaker 1: cut and he keeps going, we're shooting film, and he

666
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:34,320
Speaker 1: went off another two minutes and finally Ernest a Spike.

667
00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:38,080
Speaker 1: We ran out. So I woke up to Denzel. He's

668
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:42,319
Speaker 1: almost like in a daze. I said, d what was that?

669
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:46,000
Speaker 1: So what are you doing? He said, Spike, I don't know.

670
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:50,920
Speaker 1: I can't tell you what I just said. That ship

671
00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:53,760
Speaker 1: can't happen if you don't prepare for it. He worked

672
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:58,000
Speaker 1: a year and and and asked anybody was on the

673
00:40:58,040 --> 00:41:01,480
Speaker 1: set that day? We thought we saw Malcolm Front. Do

674
00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:03,240
Speaker 1: you know? You know what I love about that film? Also,

675
00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:06,440
Speaker 1: it's tough sometimes if you play if the film calls

676
00:41:06,520 --> 00:41:10,960
Speaker 1: for an actress, a woman to play that role of

677
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:15,160
Speaker 1: the wife of the the you know, it's a supporting role.

678
00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:19,000
Speaker 1: And uh, what I love was I thought, if Angela

679
00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:22,360
Speaker 1: La Bassett was my wife, nothing I couldn't do either,

680
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:27,000
Speaker 1: you know, and brought it. She was so wanted. Angela

681
00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:29,640
Speaker 1: Bassett is such a great actress and she's so wonderful

682
00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:31,919
Speaker 1: on that film. So I understand that we're gonna take

683
00:41:32,520 --> 00:41:37,800
Speaker 1: some questions. You know, what's up? Spoke? My name is Chris,

684
00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:40,479
Speaker 1: I'm from Virginia, and I just wanted to ask you

685
00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:48,040
Speaker 1: what do you think of Black Panther? My brother, I've

686
00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:53,680
Speaker 1: seen it four times me too. I look at the

687
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:57,280
Speaker 1: world now differently before Black Panther and at the Black

688
00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:01,879
Speaker 1: Panther that that should change everything, especially for people of color. Now,

689
00:42:01,920 --> 00:42:05,080
Speaker 1: wait a second, I mean I think in these times,

690
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:06,680
Speaker 1: in these modern times where we're trying to all be

691
00:42:06,719 --> 00:42:09,319
Speaker 1: more sensitive and more inclusive, don't you want to know

692
00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: what I thought a black panther? I mean, do you

693
00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:22,879
Speaker 1: want to ask me? Go ahead, I was actually gonna

694
00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:29,120
Speaker 1: ask you about Infinity Wars and yeah, my brother, you

695
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:32,080
Speaker 1: bought the catsups. You know it was the down. We're

696
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:38,279
Speaker 1: give us the next question. Next question, can you tell

697
00:42:38,360 --> 00:42:40,680
Speaker 1: us a little bit about your new movie, The Black

698
00:42:40,719 --> 00:42:44,160
Speaker 1: Clansman and what that's based on. The Black Clans was

699
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:47,080
Speaker 1: based on the book my Man Hair is in It.

700
00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:55,480
Speaker 1: Ron Stalwarf was the first after American policeman in Carrell Springs.

701
00:42:56,640 --> 00:43:01,319
Speaker 1: He ended up infiltrating the clan reading the paper, and

702
00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:04,799
Speaker 1: the clan put it at in paper when we need

703
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:11,600
Speaker 1: new members. So ron Stalward thinks as a joke, you

704
00:43:11,640 --> 00:43:14,880
Speaker 1: know it's a Google. So she calls up and thinking

705
00:43:14,920 --> 00:43:19,000
Speaker 1: as a joke, he leaves. They don't pick up as

706
00:43:19,000 --> 00:43:23,040
Speaker 1: a voicemails. He leaves his real name and phone number,

707
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:27,600
Speaker 1: and the clan calls back and said, we want you

708
00:43:27,640 --> 00:43:31,080
Speaker 1: to come down for inter of you. So since he's

709
00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:35,600
Speaker 1: an African American, he can't really show up for the

710
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:40,040
Speaker 1: inter of you, so he has to sin, my man,

711
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:44,480
Speaker 1: is that a Boston Red Sox hat? There? Thank you?

712
00:43:46,600 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 1: Row seven twelve, Row seven that be oh boy, So

713
00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:59,080
Speaker 1: he has to get a white police officer to play him.

714
00:43:59,160 --> 00:44:05,080
Speaker 1: That's Adam dry Her And so we're in official competition

715
00:44:05,120 --> 00:44:09,319
Speaker 1: that can and it opens August tenth, so check it out.

716
00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:13,239
Speaker 1: And who plays the lead? The lead is played by

717
00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:18,960
Speaker 1: John David Washington, Denzel's eldest son. Denzel's son. You might

718
00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:22,440
Speaker 1: have seen him in Ballers. We have time for one more,

719
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:25,640
Speaker 1: one more um in the scope of all of your projects,

720
00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:29,200
Speaker 1: what is the work that has been most transformative and

721
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:32,360
Speaker 1: what is the legacy that you hope to leave. She

722
00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:36,120
Speaker 1: was actually looking at you. She pretended it was for

723
00:44:36,200 --> 00:44:38,279
Speaker 1: both of us, but she was looking right at you

724
00:44:38,320 --> 00:44:42,000
Speaker 1: when she said that it's okay, It's okay. I would

725
00:44:42,040 --> 00:44:49,839
Speaker 1: say I did a documentary called Full Little Girls, which

726
00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:52,799
Speaker 1: is about the bombing of the nine three Birmingham Church,

727
00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:55,400
Speaker 1: the sixth Street Baptist Church, and Broma, Obama. Full of

728
00:44:55,440 --> 00:45:00,480
Speaker 1: girls were killed. Jago who were in the and FBI

729
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,600
Speaker 1: knew who did it a week after. One of the

730
00:45:03,600 --> 00:45:06,879
Speaker 1: guy's name was Donna Mine Bob. His nickname was Dna

731
00:45:06,920 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 1: night Bob. And for many years the case was cold

732
00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:19,040
Speaker 1: and before the film opened at the film form, Karen

733
00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 1: Cooper and a couple of days before the open the

734
00:45:23,160 --> 00:45:29,920
Speaker 1: FBI called me and they said, want to see the film.

735
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:33,120
Speaker 1: The day after the film opened, they reopened that case.

736
00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:38,520
Speaker 1: After many, many years, they went to trial. It was

737
00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:51,839
Speaker 1: Motherfucker's died in prison. True story. They they killed, murder

738
00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:55,760
Speaker 1: those full little girls and just went about their lives,

739
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:00,759
Speaker 1: you know, and they died in I think I don't

740
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:08,480
Speaker 1: know how many wanted to, but they died in prison. Well,

741
00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:12,400
Speaker 1: I mean, this is gonna sound corny and sound stupid.

742
00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:13,640
Speaker 1: When I was on my phone by the way a

743
00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:15,440
Speaker 1: moment ago, trying to look up something about him, and

744
00:46:15,560 --> 00:46:17,520
Speaker 1: my wife, who's here, texted me and said, put your

745
00:46:17,520 --> 00:46:23,279
Speaker 1: phone down. She literally texted me, she wrote, enough with

746
00:46:23,360 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 1: the phone. My legacy is not really that much about Honestly,

747
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:30,680
Speaker 1: I don't really think about the work I do that much.

748
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 1: It comes and goes. It's sand castles, you know, I mean,

749
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:36,240
Speaker 1: the ocean comes. It's the moment you have with people.

750
00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:40,040
Speaker 1: I'm doing The Edge with Tony Hopkins, and he and

751
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:42,600
Speaker 1: I would have lunch together and we would do dueling

752
00:46:42,840 --> 00:46:46,240
Speaker 1: Richard Burton impersonations together over lunch. And I'll never forget

753
00:46:46,239 --> 00:46:48,400
Speaker 1: that to the day I die, and I wanted to

754
00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:49,960
Speaker 1: work with him, and he called me recently I had

755
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 1: me comeing to a movie with him, and it was

756
00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:53,520
Speaker 1: it was really, I mean it was. We did one

757
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:55,440
Speaker 1: day I shot this little thing. I won't give it away,

758
00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:57,399
Speaker 1: but what a great honor it was to get good.

759
00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:01,480
Speaker 1: I did a movie with Ed Norton. Ed directed this

760
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:03,719
Speaker 1: wonderful movie mother Lis Brooklyn. I'm in this crowd with

761
00:47:04,080 --> 00:47:07,560
Speaker 1: people I worship, you know, uh Cherry Jones and Connavali

762
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:10,759
Speaker 1: and uh Willem to poe him on the set with

763
00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:12,479
Speaker 1: him going oh man, this is what it's all about.

764
00:47:12,520 --> 00:47:14,440
Speaker 1: You know. To me, it's who you work with. I

765
00:47:14,440 --> 00:47:17,239
Speaker 1: got to do a Good Shepherd with Bob Denier would

766
00:47:17,239 --> 00:47:20,120
Speaker 1: walk up to me and uh Matt Damon and he

767
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 1: would talk to me, and literally, after like thirty seconds,

768
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:24,960
Speaker 1: I would I mean, I couldn't hear him. I went deaf.

769
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:28,400
Speaker 1: Oh the movie starts screening it in my head and

770
00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:29,759
Speaker 1: he talked to me, give me the direction. I look

771
00:47:29,800 --> 00:47:31,480
Speaker 1: at my go. I'm sorry because you repeat that. I

772
00:47:31,520 --> 00:47:35,000
Speaker 1: wasn't listening to a word you said. Just now, Hey,

773
00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:38,480
Speaker 1: look at me go. You're very good, Alec, very good

774
00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:41,880
Speaker 1: to be with those people, to be with them, And

775
00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:43,759
Speaker 1: with that in mind, would you all please join me

776
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:46,680
Speaker 1: in thanking our guests. One of the greatest movie makers

777
00:47:46,680 --> 00:48:00,920
Speaker 1: in history. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Spike Lee's

778
00:48:01,080 --> 00:48:06,160
Speaker 1: Black Klansmen will be in theaters August tenth. I'm Alec

779
00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:10,480
Speaker 1: Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing, M