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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on

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Speaker 1: iHeartRadio Love.

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Speaker 2: In this conversation with Mark Anthony. You can find out

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Speaker 2: more about him if you go to Coast to Coast

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Speaker 2: AM dot com. But he's been on coast so much

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Speaker 2: people already know about him a ton But Oxford educated

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Speaker 2: a former practicing attorney, although he still dabbles uh and

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Speaker 2: most of the time he spends in researching things like

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Speaker 2: the afterlife and in particular scientific reasons for thinking that

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Speaker 2: we do have an afterlife, which is totally cool. You

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Speaker 2: can find out more about his books too on his page,

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Speaker 2: which you can link up to at Coast to Coast

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Speaker 2: am dot com. So, Mark, Yes, I I'm gonna I

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Speaker 2: want to put a pin in everything we've talked about

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Speaker 2: up until now, except for one thing. When I was

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Speaker 2: in college, I had a physics professor. I think I

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Speaker 2: got a D. But I had a physics professor who

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Speaker 2: I loved, and he was from Korea. He was very

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Speaker 2: well known for having written the first Encyclopedia Britannica section

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Speaker 2: on holograms.

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Speaker 3: So was his.

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Speaker 2: Life was light and waves and you know many of

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Speaker 2: the things which you talked about last hour and He

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Speaker 2: used to say this thing in a very thick Korean accent.

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Speaker 2: I'm not saying it to mock him. This is not

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Speaker 2: there's no etho centrism in this. It's just the way

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Speaker 2: he talked. And it was so funny because it's stuck

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Speaker 2: in my head the way he spoke, which is he

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Speaker 2: would say, ever then of a wave, He said, you

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Speaker 2: a wave, I'm a wave. Every then a wave. And

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Speaker 2: that was the best explanation I've ever gotten that everything

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Speaker 2: is a wave because of quantum physics and because of

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Speaker 2: the energy force that we can't see. We take it

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Speaker 2: for granted, but that everything is a wave. This table wave,

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Speaker 2: you a wave, your callwavean in a wave. So I've

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Speaker 2: always loved that about it, and I love that way

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Speaker 2: of thinking about it. Now I come to this the

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Speaker 2: story of the Vietnam Red Light demons, and I say Vietnam,

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Speaker 2: meaning that that was the first recorded instance of it

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Speaker 2: and what some soldiers testified to later on and maintained

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Speaker 2: that they saw and they experienced. I'd like it if

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Speaker 2: you would, if you could, because I didn't get this

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Speaker 2: information originally. You got it before I did, because Dave

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Speaker 2: Schroeder told me, was telling me that you were willing

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Speaker 2: to take a look at it about the red light

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Speaker 2: demons of Vietnam. Explain this phenomenon.

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Speaker 3: This is a really fascinating chapter in turn normal research

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Speaker 3: and observations. And this whole whole episode took place in

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Speaker 3: roughly sixty days. It appears that this could have been

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Speaker 3: around nineteen sixty five based on everything I've been putting together.

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Speaker 3: So what happened was during the Vietnam War, the US

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Speaker 3: Army patented and used a new night vision goggle, which

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Speaker 3: were red red night vision goggles. Currently, since this time,

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Speaker 3: we're only using green night vision goggles. And the theory

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Speaker 3: was that the red knight vision goggles maintained eyes daylight sensitivity,

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Speaker 3: so it was easier for the human eye to switch

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Speaker 3: from daytime to night vision because red light doesn't force

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Speaker 3: the eye to adapt to low light conditions. Also, because

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Speaker 3: the red light stimulates the brain's neurons, increases reflex time

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Speaker 3: and spatial awareness. So on paper, this sounded grady and

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Speaker 3: but what happened was another matter entirely. So these new

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Speaker 3: goggles were issued mainly to airborne troops. However, it's notable

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Speaker 3: that the officers and the pilots of helicopters were ordered

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Speaker 3: not to wear them. So at first the goggles were

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Speaker 3: a real hit with the troops. But then about a

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Speaker 3: week later, with everyone using the red knight vision goggles,

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Speaker 3: their behavior started changing. The men started acting strangely. They

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Speaker 3: started talking about things that nobody else could see, and

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Speaker 3: they were fixated and this is real important. They were

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Speaker 3: fixated on staring at tree tops. Then they started having

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Speaker 3: discipline problems and actually began fighting among themselves. But then

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Speaker 3: came the pivotal incident. The helicopter squadron was on routine

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Speaker 3: patrol over a relatively peaceful area, so there was no combat.

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Speaker 3: Several helicopters were flying together in formation. Now remember the

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Speaker 3: pilots and the officers were under strict orders not to

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Speaker 3: wear the red night vision goggles. Other troops on board

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Speaker 3: wore them, and in one helicopter, this gunner on the

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Speaker 3: starboard the right side, who was manning a fifty Calira

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Speaker 3: machine gun, suddenly opened fire without being ordered to do so.

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Speaker 3: The thing is, he wasn't firing at anything on the ground.

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Speaker 3: He was firing at something at their same altitude. Although

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Speaker 3: other than the squadrons fellow helicopters, there was nothing else

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Speaker 3: in the sky. At their attitude, the other chop choppers

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Speaker 3: started engaging in invasive maneuvers. Because all of a sudden,

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Speaker 3: fifty caliber machine guns firing out of this one. The

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Speaker 3: officer on board ordered the gunner to cease fire. The

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Speaker 3: gunner cried out he was shooting at demons. He kept

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Speaker 3: screaming demons. He said, they're horrible. They have horns, and

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Speaker 3: they're flying toward the chopper and they're coming for him.

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Speaker 3: So the officer ordered the gunner to remove the red

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Speaker 3: night vision goggles. He saw the gunner as a young guy,

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Speaker 3: sweating profusely. His eyes were dilated, so the officers thinking,

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Speaker 3: all right, he's probably under the influence of heroin. He's hallucinating. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: But then the officer tried the night red night vision

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Speaker 3: goggles and immediately he said, oh, I'll leave out the explotive.

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Speaker 3: He saw several grotesque, winged humanoid creatures flying up from

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Speaker 3: the treetops below toward the helicopter. Somehow the creatures knew

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Speaker 3: he could see them because they pointed at him, gestured

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Speaker 3: at him, and flew right at him. Immediately pulled off

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Speaker 3: the goggles and the creatures vanished, Or did they here's

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Speaker 3: the thing. Ian according to legend, According to the stories

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Speaker 3: that have come out of this, this wasn't an isolated incident.

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Speaker 3: For weeks, reports kept coming in about flying monsters spotted

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Speaker 3: by soldiers who wore the red night vision goggles, even

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Speaker 3: though officers were under orders not to wear them. Some

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Speaker 3: did and describe seeing what they described as gargoyles or demons,

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Speaker 3: but then when they took off the red knight vision goggles,

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Speaker 3: they saw nothing. However, anyone who wore them said the

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Speaker 3: creatures immediately could see them. In other words, the creatures

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Speaker 3: knew the soldiers could see them, which prompted them to

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Speaker 3: come at them. Use of the red vision right, excuse me,

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Speaker 3: use of the red knight vision goggles. Ian was abruptly canceled.

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Speaker 3: After sixty days, the military confiscated all of them. However,

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Speaker 3: in the wake of this, anyone who wore those goggles

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Speaker 3: they were mentally unstable for months after the experience.

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Speaker 2: So the you mentioned diocene die yes last hour, and

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Speaker 2: that's what the That's actually what they colored the lenses with.

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Speaker 2: That is correct, which I thought was interesting that this

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Speaker 2: particular dye which gave this red tint to the glasses

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Speaker 2: provided some benefit, but overall on the main whereas as

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Speaker 2: you said, was true that by using the red tinted

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Speaker 2: glass for the night vision it was an easier adjustment

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Speaker 2: between daytime and nighttime vision, that there were greater benefits

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Speaker 2: to the green overall over time. Do you know what

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Speaker 2: those were.

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Speaker 3: Yes, well, there's advantages to both of them, because the

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Speaker 3: red makes it easier on the eye to shift from

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Speaker 3: daytime to night vision. But green, well, the human eye

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Speaker 3: sees green better than any other color because it's the

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Speaker 3: most sensitive to green light. And the theory behind this

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Speaker 3: is it's due to evolution. Well, think about it. Early

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Speaker 3: humans needed to see well in forests and planes for

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Speaker 3: gathering food, right, but also to identify predators. You know, oh, look,

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Speaker 3: there's a jaguar hiding in the grass. Green light, from

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Speaker 3: a practical standpoint, also minimizes energy consumption on LED screens

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Speaker 3: and light intensifying devices, so green you can see more detail.

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Speaker 3: In fact, the human eye can see something like a

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Speaker 3: million shades of green, more than any other color. But

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Speaker 3: the red was a test because it's best for preserving

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Speaker 3: night vision. It's a bit harder to make out fine

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Speaker 3: details in the night, but it doesn't force the eye

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Speaker 3: to adapt to low light conditions. But there's another factor

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Speaker 3: with it, red and infrared. Now, this is the important

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Speaker 3: point when you said, and you nailed it in with

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Speaker 3: the waves. Everything's a wave, okay. So when we look

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Speaker 3: at the rainbow, ultraviolet has the shortest wavelength, which is

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Speaker 3: the most energy. Red light on the other end of

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Speaker 3: the spectrum has the lowest wave length, and then even

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Speaker 3: lower than that is is infrared, which literally means before

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Speaker 3: red and infrared is not visible to the human eye.

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Speaker 3: Light is a form of electromagnetic energy. There's many forms

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Speaker 3: of electromagnetic energy on the em spectrum microwaves, X rays,

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Speaker 3: gamma rays, ultraviolet, infrared, and it's so think of the infrared.

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Speaker 3: Excuse me, the electromagnetic spectrum as a as a yardstick,

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Speaker 3: or for our friends overseas, a meter stick, and what

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Speaker 3: we can see on it visible white light would be

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Speaker 3: roughly half an inch maybe a centimeter if that on

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Speaker 3: that on that measuring stick. So what that means is

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Speaker 3: the vast majority of the electromagnet spectrum is beyond what

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Speaker 3: we're able to see with the human eye. And so

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Speaker 3: these red night vision goggles not only enabled the soldiers

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Speaker 3: to see in the red light spectrum, but also into

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Speaker 3: the infrared spectrum, which is beyond the human eyes ability

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Speaker 3: to perceive. And so this is what's known. These were

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Speaker 3: what's known as image enhancing night vision devices and what

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Speaker 3: the red night vision goggles do or in the green

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Speaker 3: daw too, But what they do is they take in

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Speaker 3: the photons, which are the particles of light, and then

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Speaker 3: they convert them into electrons, and then the electrons are

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Speaker 3: shot into an image intensifier tube which amplifies them and

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Speaker 3: converts them into from the electrons into something that we

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Speaker 3: can see with the human eye. So there's this complicated process,

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Speaker 3: but it all happens essentially at the speed of light.

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Speaker 2: Then, according to the legend, they confiscated those particular night

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Speaker 2: vision glasses that were treated with the diocene dye that

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Speaker 2: had this infrared possibilities, and they the ones that were

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Speaker 2: able to see demons. What, according to the story, happened

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Speaker 2: to the people You mentioned that they had mental issues

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Speaker 2: and stuff. But shouldn't there be massive research today, shouldn't

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Speaker 2: you shouldn't we be selling these red night vision glasses

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Speaker 2: so that people can go outside and see the demons

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Speaker 2: that are outside of their home. If that's happening.

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Speaker 3: Well, I've been researching this for some time and I

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Speaker 3: can't find any of the Vietnam era red night vision

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Speaker 3: goggles available. And I read I actually got hold of

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Speaker 3: a US Army It's now unclassified. It was a report

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Speaker 3: on the use of night vision devices by US Army

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Speaker 3: units in Vietnam. And I went through every single you know,

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Speaker 3: being a lawyer, I went through the entire document and

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Speaker 3: looked for everything and all it said. It didn't mention

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Speaker 3: any red night vision goggles, but it did mention a

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Speaker 3: number with defective parts that had to be basically taken

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Speaker 3: taken back. And I, you know, and I'm not saying

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Speaker 3: that that that is military code speak for oh gosh,

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Speaker 3: we have something like that. The problem, you know, Houston,

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Speaker 3: we have a problem. But certainly it sent my spidery

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Speaker 3: sense tingling.

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Speaker 2: Okay, but that's that's exactly what I'm getting at too.

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Speaker 2: When we go back to intuition and then we talk

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Speaker 2: about the ability to sense auras, that this would if

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Speaker 2: this were as we discussed, if the paranormal really just

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Speaker 2: lesser understood normal circumstances, then we should be able to

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Speaker 2: just make them. We don't need there was they weren't magic.

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Speaker 2: It wasn't like somebody waved a wand over them. Even

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Speaker 2: if it's just a matter of taking the armies currently

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Speaker 2: available military surplus green nighttime vision goggles, taking out those

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Speaker 2: lenses and putting in red ones, we should be able

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Speaker 2: to replicate those red goggles, right.

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Speaker 3: One would think so. And you know because when Kilner,

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Speaker 3: when the scientist Walter Kilner was making his oor goggles

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Speaker 3: back in the early twentieth century, back in the nineteen twenties,

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Speaker 3: that's exactly what he was using. He was doing the

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Speaker 3: dice die sign and die, putting it between to photographic plates.

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Speaker 3: What it was first used for Ian was stellar photography

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Speaker 3: because the dysigon and die increased the sensitivity excuse me,

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Speaker 3: the sensitivity to light beyond the visible spectrum. And think

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Speaker 3: about you know, the early twentieth century, we have these

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Speaker 3: massive telescopes and now they're being able to photograph them,

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Speaker 3: and then they realized that, well, we have to see

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Speaker 3: beyond visible light and they were using uh, these red

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Speaker 3: screens and wow, we're seeing more than that. But then

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Speaker 3: Kilner started saying that, you know, you can see auras

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Speaker 3: with them, which is is just a whole nother discussion,

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Speaker 3: and you know, I've talked to Dave Schrader and to

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Speaker 3: other of my friends who are in the paranormal investigation field,

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Speaker 3: and everybody wants to get a hand their hands on

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Speaker 3: these Vietnam era goggles. I think the answer to your

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Speaker 3: question is it's the process of how the disin and

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Speaker 3: dye is actually applied. I think just painting a lens

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Speaker 3: red with that die, I don't know if that's enough.

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Speaker 3: I think there may be a process because everything I

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Speaker 3: read is it is put between two pieces of glass.

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Speaker 3: So there is a lot more to this than just

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Speaker 3: looking at red lights. But here's an interesting thing. So

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Speaker 3: the military confiscates the red night vision goggles, replaces them

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Speaker 3: with green, and then reports of UFOs has gone off

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Speaker 3: the scale by military personnel using green night vision goggles.

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Speaker 3: And even though they're not using red goggles, they're using

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Speaker 3: green goggles. There's actually a tour company in Sedona, Arizona

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Speaker 3: that takes people out into the desert and lets them

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Speaker 3: wear green night vision goggles to see if they can

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Speaker 3: find UFOs. So the answer to your question is, yes,

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Speaker 3: we're doing this, it's just not happening with red knight

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Speaker 3: vision goggles. That see gargoyle type entities. It is using green,

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Speaker 3: which is a whole different wavelength, which may enable people

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Speaker 3: to more easily see UFOs or UAP unidentified aerial phenomenon

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Speaker 3: through the green light spectrum.

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Speaker 2: Okay, but my intuition, my hunch is that if everything

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Speaker 2: about this legend were true, then we would have we

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Speaker 2: would be able to recreate those goggles again, that there's

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Speaker 2: nothing special about them in the sense that they weren't

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Speaker 2: you know, they weren't pulled from a stone, they they

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Speaker 2: weren't sprinkled with pixie dust. That if it's scientific that

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Speaker 2: we should be and if it's really true that we

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Speaker 2: can see demons in the infrared, then we should be

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Speaker 2: able to anytime we're in the infrared, be able to

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Speaker 2: see them anytime we're using some sort of because there

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Speaker 2: are other ways to see infrared, to look through into

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Speaker 2: that or through an infrared lens without using night vision glasses.

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Speaker 2: That that's not the only way to do it.

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Speaker 1: Listen to more Coast to Coast AM every weeknight at

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