Speaker 1: Welcome to Strictly Business Varieties, weekly podcast featuring conversations with
Speaker 1: industry leaders about the business of entertainment. Today's guest, with
Speaker 1: Cynthia Littleton in New York is UFC Chief operating Officer
Speaker 1: Lawrence Epstein. The UFC veterans speaks candidly about the growth
Speaker 1: challenges facing the mm A pioneer, the impact of its
Speaker 1: acquisition by Endeavor, its growth in international markets, and the
Speaker 1: brand building benefits of the league's new partnership with ESPN.
Speaker 1: Can you talk about the process of putting yourself up
Speaker 1: for sale and evaluating the field of players that that
Speaker 1: came knocking and how you how the final deal with
Speaker 1: Endeavor came to be absolutely you know, we bought the
Speaker 1: business in two thousand and one and spent you know,
Speaker 1: fifteen years essentially you know, growing it to what you know,
Speaker 1: became one of the fastest growing sports in the world. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, around we started getting some some inbound inquiries
Speaker 1: from a lot of Chinese companies about the prospect of
Speaker 1: buying UFC, and so by late you know, we sort
Speaker 1: of decided to begin an informal process where we talked
Speaker 1: to a variety of different potential purchasers about about selling
Speaker 1: the company. The main owners of the business, Frank runso Fertida,
Speaker 1: I think, had decided that they, you know, they're interested
Speaker 1: in exiting the business if they got the right price. Um.
Speaker 1: That process went from talking to some Chinese companies, are
Speaker 1: really talking to a variety of of of American based companies.
Speaker 1: You know, every sort of big player in the entertainment space,
Speaker 1: from the Walt Disney Company to Time Warner to uh,
Speaker 1: you know, a variety of other sort of media companies
Speaker 1: are strategic, you know, operating businesses that would you know,
Speaker 1: be I think a good fit for the UFC. Ultimately, Uh,
Speaker 1: it was obviously sold to the Endeavor Group and R.
Speaker 1: Emmanuel we had actually had a long standing relationship with
Speaker 1: our he had been our agent for almost a decade
Speaker 1: helping us with our us TV deal. So it was
Speaker 1: actually a really nice fit. He was able to meet
Speaker 1: the price. And uh, he said, it's been over two
Speaker 1: years now under the Endeavor ownership. When you first when
Speaker 1: you first heard that they were interested though in the acquisition,
Speaker 1: did that surprise you that because that was at the
Speaker 1: early stage of Endeavor building itself out to what it's become. No,
Speaker 1: it really didn't surprise me. I I mean already had expressed,
Speaker 1: you know, a passion for this business, you know, you know,
Speaker 1: for many, many years, and the question always was, you know, financially,
Speaker 1: could they go out and raise the money to get
Speaker 1: this thing done? And it's very clear that they could.
Speaker 1: They made a series of acquisitions including IMG uh you know,
Speaker 1: a couple of years before acquiring UFC, and uh, you know,
Speaker 1: already had a passion for the business. Uh, it was
Speaker 1: a really good strategic fit. So it really wasn't a surprise.
Speaker 1: Uh it was I think, you know, the right deal
Speaker 1: for us at the right time. Did you get did
Speaker 1: you get into serious discussions with anybody else? Absolutely weak,
Speaker 1: we said. We ran a process that probably lasted about
Speaker 1: nine months, and and of course, you know as these
Speaker 1: as the process sort of went along, certain parties would
Speaker 1: fall out for a variety of reasons. But uh, you know,
Speaker 1: we really got down to probably three or four, you know,
Speaker 1: really serious bidders. And you know, at the end of
Speaker 1: the day, when you know the factors that you look at,
Speaker 1: of course, price you look at, but you also look
Speaker 1: at you know, who's going to take the business to
Speaker 1: the next level. Because the Fertidas had spent a lot
Speaker 1: of time, effort, and money building this business, but they
Speaker 1: also really cared about it and they wanted to make
Speaker 1: sure that they didn't just make a financial transaction. They
Speaker 1: wanted to make sure that the business would continue to
Speaker 1: grow and continue to be part of the sports landscape.
Speaker 1: And so, you know, taking a look at some foreign
Speaker 1: buyers versus what ari and and Endeavor had I think
Speaker 1: made it made the decision, you know, sort of easy. Okay,
Speaker 1: you know, let's maybe take a little bit less money,
Speaker 1: but let's put it in the hands of somebody who's
Speaker 1: going to be able to take it to the next level.
Speaker 1: What did you I would imagine that talking to people
Speaker 1: and engaging the interest from outside companies to acquire you
Speaker 1: would tell you a lot about the strength and the
Speaker 1: potential weakness of your of the business. Did you learn
Speaker 1: a lot during the sale process? You know, we definitely
Speaker 1: learned a lot in the sale process about certainly what
Speaker 1: investors were looking for, you know, when they wanted to
Speaker 1: consider acquiring a business like ours, And it made us
Speaker 1: focus on maybe some of the things that were weaknesses
Speaker 1: or perceived weaknesses to make sure we had the proper
Speaker 1: answers and the proper sort of you know, I think
Speaker 1: ways to sort of deal with those. Um you know.
Speaker 1: The other dividend of the sale process was that so
Speaker 1: many of the parties that we were talking to were
Speaker 1: also potential bidders for our rights, the most obvious one
Speaker 1: being you know, ESPN. So Disney Company was at the table.
Speaker 1: They certainly listened to the pitch and you know, though
Speaker 1: they dropped out of the you know, the purchase process,
Speaker 1: you know, it was pretty clear to me that they
Speaker 1: were going to bid on our rights. And you know,
Speaker 1: that obviously came true because we just entered into a
Speaker 1: five year deal with with ESPN, which is gonna start
Speaker 1: January one of nineteen. There was there's been some chatter
Speaker 1: on Wall Street that that that that ESPN deal wasn't
Speaker 1: as big as it was, and the you know, with
Speaker 1: the with the B in front of the you know,
Speaker 1: in front of the billion, that it wasn't it didn't
Speaker 1: meet the expectations of endeavor and of the USC. Is
Speaker 1: that true, not at all? I mean, the deal that
Speaker 1: we did with with ESPN is really a multifaceted deal.
Speaker 1: So the headline, of course is one point five billion
Speaker 1: dollars over a five year period. Three million dollars per
Speaker 1: year that you know, is basically for a package of
Speaker 1: content very similar to what we have with Fox, and
Speaker 1: that's almost a three times increase over the Fox deal.
Speaker 1: But that's that's sort of not the end of the deal.
Speaker 1: I mean, one of the things that we're frankly most
Speaker 1: excited about is that ESPN is going to be a
Speaker 1: non exclusive seller of our pay per view products. So
Speaker 1: now we've got a real partner that's gonna be focused
Speaker 1: on selling pay per view that you know, we think
Speaker 1: can really help us grow our business. In addition to that,
Speaker 1: you know, the credibility of being in partnership with Walt
Speaker 1: Disney Company and ESPN has helped us in so many ways,
Speaker 1: including sponsorship. It's affected, you know, positively our foreign television deals,
Speaker 1: deals outside of of the United States. It's and it's
Speaker 1: just created a lot of credibility for our brand. So yes,
Speaker 1: you know, one point five billion dollars in the headline,
Speaker 1: but there's so many other benefits that we're getting out
Speaker 1: of this deal with ESPN. How um, how much would
Speaker 1: you say that your revenue mix is driven by the
Speaker 1: your pay per view events and now this more mainstream
Speaker 1: sports licensing with a partner like an ESPN. Do you
Speaker 1: know what the percentage breakdown is, Well, the percentage breakdown
Speaker 1: right now is going to change, you know obviously effective
Speaker 1: January one, because we're gonna getting more revenue from from
Speaker 1: ESPN that we were getting from Fox. So the you know,
Speaker 1: sort of the dependence or the percentage of revenue coming
Speaker 1: from pay per view will no doubt decrease. That being said,
Speaker 1: you know, we believe that the relationship with the ESPN
Speaker 1: is going to actually grow our pay per view business because,
Speaker 1: first of all, we're gonna get much more exposure being
Speaker 1: on the ESPN platform than we had with Fox. The
Speaker 1: television you know, ratings essentially are almost three times more
Speaker 1: or on ESPN and ESPN two than they are in
Speaker 1: Fox and Fox Sports one. In addition to that, ESPN
Speaker 1: has got an incredible digital ecosystem, you know, which of
Speaker 1: course has got you know, earned, it's got their media,
Speaker 1: it's got you know so many you know, many things
Speaker 1: that are attracting people to you know, that platform. So
Speaker 1: we're gonna additional exposure via that and um, you know,
Speaker 1: we believe that you know, when there's sort of one
Speaker 1: click away from buying a pay per view in that
Speaker 1: ESPN ecosystem that's going to add incremental buys. So certainly
Speaker 1: from the outset, you know, the percentage of revenue coming
Speaker 1: from pay per view will decrease, but over long term,
Speaker 1: you know, we think we're going to grow that business
Speaker 1: and you know, who knows where it ends up. You know,
Speaker 1: three or four years from now, are you going to
Speaker 1: do more events that that air strictly on ESPN and
Speaker 1: are not offered in a pay per view format. So
Speaker 1: we're gonna do forty two events uh next year, which
Speaker 1: is about a three event increase over what we're gonna
Speaker 1: do in uh forty For those forty two events will
Speaker 1: appear in some portion on one of the ESPN platforms
Speaker 1: or either ESPN the broad reach you know, flagship network,
Speaker 1: or the new ESPN Plus O T T platform. Twenty
Speaker 1: nights will be exclusive to ESPN Plus. The entire fight
Speaker 1: will be on the ESPN Plus platform, twenty two nights
Speaker 1: will there'll be some portion of the programming which will
Speaker 1: be on on the ESPN Flagship Flagship network. And then
Speaker 1: we're still going to have twelve pay per view events.
Speaker 1: Those will be exclusively shown on pay per view, So, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, uh that that's exactly the number we've had
Speaker 1: this year and for the last several years. Do you
Speaker 1: feel like in this world of where people are becoming
Speaker 1: so accustomed to streaming, you know, the instant gratification button
Speaker 1: is you know, the instant gratification is so important to
Speaker 1: consumers now for video, do you feel like is the
Speaker 1: pay per view model maybe becoming outmoded in this in
Speaker 1: this environment. No, not at all. I mean, in fact,
Speaker 1: I think the pay per view business is more relevant
Speaker 1: now than it ever has been. If you would ask
Speaker 1: that question five years ago, I said, well, you know
Speaker 1: what pay per view is a tough business, is churn
Speaker 1: business us. You know, you've got to sign them up,
Speaker 1: every sign up, every single time. And we did, you know,
Speaker 1: a huge event October six, and of course everybody laughed
Speaker 1: after the event was over. That being said, in this
Speaker 1: world of cord cutters and cord shavers and cordin ever's
Speaker 1: having an Ala cart, you know sort of I can
Speaker 1: buy it, you know, whenever I want to. Is UH
Speaker 1: is a distribution platform that makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, our philosophy for the last five
Speaker 1: years is the following. I mean, we didn't know where
Speaker 1: consumers were going with, you know, how they wanted to
Speaker 1: distribute content. So our strategy was build franchises in all
Speaker 1: the important areas, pay per view being one of them,
Speaker 1: O T t v R, Fight Pass platform being another,
Speaker 1: you know, broad reach, you know being Fox Sports and
Speaker 1: Fox Sports one and soon to be ESPN, and then
Speaker 1: sponsored content Youtubees and those sort of you know pieces,
Speaker 1: you know, the twitches and those to those types of platforms.
Speaker 1: Build franchises in those four areas and then give yourself
Speaker 1: anough flexibility to move content among those different franchises as
Speaker 1: their as consumers desire to consume content changes, and I
Speaker 1: think it's it's worked out really well. So we feel
Speaker 1: pay per view is an important part of that ecosystem,
Speaker 1: and it also gives you the ability to peak the
Speaker 1: peaks on these really big events. I mean, we did
Speaker 1: a boxing event last year with with Connor McGregor and
Speaker 1: Floyd Mayweather. I mean it did four point six million
Speaker 1: or so pay per view buys. You know, those type
Speaker 1: of events gave you the with pay per view, give
Speaker 1: it the ability to peak the peak and not leave
Speaker 1: any money on the table. Is pay per view are people?
Speaker 1: Do you find consumers are very price sensitive. If you
Speaker 1: go up or down five or ten bucks, do you
Speaker 1: see a big swing in Not really, I mean it
Speaker 1: depends on the event. I mean it's like anything else
Speaker 1: in life. I mean, if people perceive as quality a
Speaker 1: must have type of event, um, you know, they become
Speaker 1: a little bit price you know, less sensitive to price.
Speaker 1: I mean what we also see is when you increase
Speaker 1: the price, you also increase clustering. So you know, our
Speaker 1: events are very social type events. I mean people are
Speaker 1: getting together somebody, perhaps pizza and other grabs of beers
Speaker 1: and the sodas, and they all come over to the house.
Speaker 1: The more expensive the event goes, we see the clustering increase.
Speaker 1: We also see an increase in our close circuit business,
Speaker 1: which is where we display in bars and restaurants, you know,
Speaker 1: the UFC events. We'll see an uptick in people going
Speaker 1: to bars and restaurants if we increase the price for
Speaker 1: particular events. So I mean, at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: if the event is high quality, people are going to
Speaker 1: figure out a way to see it. They might modify
Speaker 1: their behavior, but they're still going to watch the event.
Speaker 1: And even though all those people at a part at
Speaker 1: a person's house party or at a bar. They're not
Speaker 1: they're not each individually paying. You probably love the social
Speaker 1: aspect of that because it makes a UFC something that
Speaker 1: people look forward to. It's a it's a it's a destination,
Speaker 1: if you will, I would imagine that that's percent correct.
Speaker 1: I mean, we love that community aspect of our events.
Speaker 1: It makes it more fun when you're hanging out with
Speaker 1: a bunch of your friends, and you know, it also
Speaker 1: makes you more likely, you know, to watch it again.
Speaker 1: So maybe tonight we're gonna do the event at my house,
Speaker 1: but a month later we'll go over to your place,
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, it just creates at a more
Speaker 1: fun environment to watch these events or social events, and
Speaker 1: they're supposed to be fun, and if you've got a
Speaker 1: bunch of your friends with you with you, they certainly
Speaker 1: are more fun they would be for sitting by yourself,
Speaker 1: right right. Um. On the streaming side, you know, everybody
Speaker 1: is trying to fit. Everybody that I talked to has
Speaker 1: a slightly different template for how whether it's just scripted
Speaker 1: series or a reality show or a sports event. I'm curious,
Speaker 1: do you have anything in your ESPN deal that basically
Speaker 1: rewards you for success if you hit a certain number
Speaker 1: of streams or their escalators in any in any of
Speaker 1: your deals. I'm curious about the mechanics of these times. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we didn't. We didn't structure any sort of bonuses if
Speaker 1: we help them get a certain number of additional subscribers
Speaker 1: for for ESPN Plus, for example. Um, you know, we
Speaker 1: still will be retaining our own O T T platform,
Speaker 1: which is called fight Pass, And of course we've got
Speaker 1: the reward that will have be a pay per view.
Speaker 1: So the more pay per views we sell, of course,
Speaker 1: you know, that's a variable revenue stream. The more we sell,
Speaker 1: the more we make. But there's nothing in our deal
Speaker 1: that specifically rewards us for adding additional subscribers. Now that
Speaker 1: being said, we want to renew this deal twenty times
Speaker 1: down the road with ESPN, so we're obviously incentivized to
Speaker 1: do everything we can to make them happy. And as
Speaker 1: you can see, you know, ESPN Plus is clearly a
Speaker 1: priority for them. Yeah, for sure, How do you differentiate
Speaker 1: what you're gonna put on fight Pass versus what might
Speaker 1: be on the in the ESPN ecosystem. You know, it's
Speaker 1: just part of the deal, and it's also part of
Speaker 1: you know, sort of the way our fans are used
Speaker 1: to consuming contents. So virtually every one of our cards
Speaker 1: sort of right now starts on the fight Pass platform,
Speaker 1: the sort of what we call the early prelimbs, and
Speaker 1: then we'll transition typically to Fox and soon to be ESPN,
Speaker 1: and then the main card will either be on you know,
Speaker 1: a broad reach network or on pay per view. So
Speaker 1: I think we've we've conditioned our fans to know that,
Speaker 1: you know, the fights sort of start on on the
Speaker 1: O T T platform and then they progress the different
Speaker 1: different platforms for the rest of it. In addition to that,
Speaker 1: you know, we've got a bunch of other content that
Speaker 1: we've got on the fight Pass platform, so you know,
Speaker 1: magazine os features on our athletes, our entire library, and
Speaker 1: then we've licensed probably twenty five or thirty other types
Speaker 1: of martial arts promotions there, so some of its mixed
Speaker 1: martial arts, some of its boxing, some of its kickboxing,
Speaker 1: some of the jiu jitsu. So I mean, we're trying
Speaker 1: to create, you know, a point of differentiation for the
Speaker 1: fight Pass platform, which is sort of the go to
Speaker 1: place for all types of martial arts competition. In addition
Speaker 1: to a robust offering of UFC. One of the things
Speaker 1: that of course made UFC is so attractive and so
Speaker 1: valuable is that it has become a magnet for so
Speaker 1: many young men, you know, teenage boys, young men. Is
Speaker 1: that is there a misperception that this is a really
Speaker 1: this is a guy's guy sport. Do you have a
Speaker 1: more broad a broader audience than than people like me
Speaker 1: would perceive. Well, you know, you're absolutely right that sort
Speaker 1: of the core audiences that eighteen to thirty four year
Speaker 1: old male that's certainly, you know, the biggest part of
Speaker 1: our audience. But you might be surprised to know that
Speaker 1: thirty percent of our fans here in the United States
Speaker 1: are women. UM and part of that is because of
Speaker 1: the fact that we have of female athletes within the
Speaker 1: organization um SO and that's a growing part of our business.
Speaker 1: In addition to that sort of gender breakdown, we're one
Speaker 1: we're really the most diverse audience when in the world
Speaker 1: of sports right now, other than the NBA, which over
Speaker 1: indexes US when it comes to African Americans, UM we're
Speaker 1: number two. UM in every other sport we have the
Speaker 1: most compared to every other sport, we have the most
Speaker 1: diverse fan base, so and it's growing faster than frankly,
Speaker 1: the rest of our business. So where there's African Americans,
Speaker 1: Hispanic and women, that part of our business is growing
Speaker 1: quicker than than the rest of our business. So we'recoming
Speaker 1: more diverse every day. Have you seen benefits to being
Speaker 1: part of the Endeavor family? Obviously a big part of
Speaker 1: that company is is w M ME a company that
Speaker 1: builds stars and is you know, one of the world's
Speaker 1: largest talent agencies. Has that been a benefit? Huge benefits?
Speaker 1: So just in the process of building stars, I mean,
Speaker 1: they're so good at doing it. And it's not just
Speaker 1: about building stars, it's building them quicker than we we've
Speaker 1: done in the past. And I think they've done a
Speaker 1: great job in helping us sort of build the star
Speaker 1: power and enhance the star power of our existing athletes.
Speaker 1: The second thing that's been great is that we've got
Speaker 1: a bunch of celebrity investors that are actually invested in
Speaker 1: the UFC, and so you know, they're out there, you know,
Speaker 1: promoting the product because they've got a self interest in
Speaker 1: it now. And then even those that don't have a
Speaker 1: self interest in it, I mean, for example, Drake, he's
Speaker 1: a he's a w M E client. I don't believe
Speaker 1: he's an investor, but he's out there, you know, helping
Speaker 1: us promote UFC, using his social media platforms to help us.
Speaker 1: He actually, you know, uh, recently streamed a fight at
Speaker 1: one of his concerts in Las Vegas. So he's been
Speaker 1: you know, just incredibly helpful to us, you know, growing
Speaker 1: and expanding the brand. And those are just a couple
Speaker 1: of the anecdotes about how, you know, the w M
Speaker 1: E and Endeavor organization has really helped us build stars
Speaker 1: and enhance you know, the UFC brand. Can you give
Speaker 1: us an example of a of a crossover opportunity or
Speaker 1: a you know, a placement or a guest star shot
Speaker 1: for one of your fight Is that really helped boost
Speaker 1: that person's profile outside you know, outside of the world
Speaker 1: of UFC, in in TV or film or I mean
Speaker 1: there's so many, uh, there's so many you know, uh,
Speaker 1: whether it's movies or television shows or things that have
Speaker 1: integrated UFC into I mean. The thing is, actually, before
Speaker 1: UM Endeavor bought the company, you know, one of the
Speaker 1: biggest promotional things that we had done to expand you know,
Speaker 1: sort of the fan base of UFC was you know,
Speaker 1: we got one of our fighters on Entourage and that
Speaker 1: was all done by Ari got chuckolated l on the show.
Speaker 1: And even to this day, people come even tho it
Speaker 1: was like a decade or so ago, people will say,
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, I remember when chuckolate Dell was on Entourage.
Speaker 1: That was a great episode and that really, you know,
Speaker 1: that really helped us grow the brand. You know, whether
Speaker 1: it's talk show hosts, whether it's you know, getting on
Speaker 1: you know, the late night shows or getting on you
Speaker 1: know sort of morning you know television was Good Morning America.
Speaker 1: You know. Conan O'Brien, for example, has been just great
Speaker 1: in bringing our athletes you know, on his He did
Speaker 1: you know, really a funny segment with Connor McGregor in
Speaker 1: the lead up to the October sixth event. And you know,
Speaker 1: Conan is is an investor, but that opportunity, you know,
Speaker 1: just wouldn't have been there to get you know, regular
Speaker 1: coverage of our athletes on his show. Um without the
Speaker 1: endeavor relationship, there's no there's nothing better than a you know,
Speaker 1: enthusiastic talk show host or somebody talking about your your
Speaker 1: product to move the needle, whether it's you know, whether
Speaker 1: it's shoes or packaged goods or for sure it's great.
Speaker 1: And then you know Conan just does He's so funny,
Speaker 1: you know, he's so into the sport, you know, and
Speaker 1: he really likes Connor and they have this great sort
Speaker 1: of back and forth relationship. And you know, then that
Speaker 1: stuff after it airs, you know, clips of it go
Speaker 1: viral and you know people are of course, you know,
Speaker 1: using their social media platforms to to you know, in
Speaker 1: further enhanced the distribution and all that stuff sort of
Speaker 1: leading up to the event, you know, just enhances you know,
Speaker 1: the interest in the event and ultimately gets more people
Speaker 1: buy pay per views. Is there? Um? You know, I
Speaker 1: think you have the you have the high class problem
Speaker 1: of of being so successful that there's that there are
Speaker 1: some start up ventures and and some burgeoning leagues that
Speaker 1: are that are you know, could grow into competitors significant
Speaker 1: competitors to UFC. Are you on the one hand, the
Speaker 1: expansion of the market is you know, it is probably
Speaker 1: a good thing for the M M A world, But
Speaker 1: are you concerned about you know, the rise of new competitors.
Speaker 1: You know, we've got some real competitors out there. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, uh, in the US Belletour, which is owned
Speaker 1: by Viacom. Outside the US, this is a global business.
Speaker 1: You know. One FC is built a very nice business
Speaker 1: in Asia. You know, we don't see it as a
Speaker 1: zero sum game. You know, we're only doing forty two
Speaker 1: events per year. Um. We we feel that, you know,
Speaker 1: if somebody watches bellot or or one FC or one
Speaker 1: of the dozens of promotions around the world and they
Speaker 1: like what they see, you know, they're probably gonna, you know,
Speaker 1: take a shot at enjoying some of our contents. Is
Speaker 1: where the market leaders, so um said, we don't see
Speaker 1: it as a zero sum game. You know, the we
Speaker 1: have a fair amount of competition for athletes at times.
Speaker 1: You know, at the end of the day, we're sort
Speaker 1: of rooting for those guys to be successful because if
Speaker 1: people like the product and uh, you know, they enjoy it,
Speaker 1: they're probably gonna come check out UFC at some point.
Speaker 1: But what would you say, I mean, I would imagine
Speaker 1: that with your growth and the growth of the market,
Speaker 1: that the that the athletes salaries have probably come up
Speaker 1: significantly in the last couple of years as they see
Speaker 1: all those big numbers, no doubt about it. I mean,
Speaker 1: Connor McGregor. Uh last year made over a hundred million dollars.
Speaker 1: He was the third highest paid athlete, you know, behind
Speaker 1: I think Ronaldo and maybe a Lionel Messy. You know,
Speaker 1: so that's pretty astounding stat right it is. It is
Speaker 1: so there's no doubt that fighter comp has has increased.
Speaker 1: But you know, at the end of the day, the
Speaker 1: overall business grown too. So you know, we don't see
Speaker 1: that as a bad thing. We see that as a
Speaker 1: good thing. You know. We want athletes to be able
Speaker 1: to make not only a good living, but a great living,
Speaker 1: because that means more athletes will come into the sports
Speaker 1: seeing it as an economic opportunity. So, you know, once again,
Speaker 1: that's a that's a good problem to have fighter fighter
Speaker 1: comp going up as you expand in perst in to
Speaker 1: box and now into ESPN, very mainstream traditional TV UM.
Speaker 1: You know, UFC is made its name. It is a
Speaker 1: very physical, it can be a very violent sport. Is
Speaker 1: that is there pressure at all to tamp down on
Speaker 1: some of what has made the UFC very appealing. No,
Speaker 1: I don't think there's any any pressure to sort of change,
Speaker 1: you know, anything about the sport other than to be
Speaker 1: proactive and make sure you're doing everything to make the
Speaker 1: sport as safe as possible and to provide information to
Speaker 1: athletes so they can make informed decisions. I think if
Speaker 1: if mistakes have been made by other sports organizations, it's
Speaker 1: been it's been the latter it's like, you know, not
Speaker 1: giving athletes information so they can make informed decisions. And
Speaker 1: I think, you know, we've been very proactive in doing
Speaker 1: that and making sure that we're studying our athletes as
Speaker 1: much as we can. You know, we've been funding a
Speaker 1: study with the Cleveland Clinic, which has a location in
Speaker 1: Las Vegas, where we're studying the brains of our athletes
Speaker 1: and those of boxers. And the goal of the study
Speaker 1: is twofold. I mean, number one, trying to figure out
Speaker 1: are certain people, based upon their physiology, just predisposed towards
Speaker 1: brain injury? And number two, are there early indications before
Speaker 1: somebody starts manifesting a cognitive deficit that we can see
Speaker 1: and if we see those things, you know, get them
Speaker 1: out of the sport. Um. You know, there's about six
Speaker 1: hundred athletes in the study, about six UFC and about boxers,
Speaker 1: and UM, you know, there's been a three or four
Speaker 1: peer reviewed medical studies already published on this data. So
Speaker 1: the good news is we're getting closer to where we
Speaker 1: are right now with the eye for combat sports athletes,
Speaker 1: So as a condition of getting you know, a license
Speaker 1: to be a boxer, mmy athlete, you've got to get
Speaker 1: an exam. If you've got a detached retina, you can't fight,
Speaker 1: you can't get a license anywhere. We want to get
Speaker 1: to the same point with the brain where we'll have
Speaker 1: some sort of a test, will follow athletes over a
Speaker 1: period of time. If there are changes in their in
Speaker 1: their brain, for example, they're done. They're not able to
Speaker 1: fight anymore. So we can get people out of the
Speaker 1: sport before they actually do you know, get injured. So
Speaker 1: we're all full the next three to five years, we're
Speaker 1: gonna have those type of tests and it may be
Speaker 1: you know, taking taking requiring athletes to get m r
Speaker 1: E s of their brain and then make that a
Speaker 1: condition of licensure on an annual basis. And if changes
Speaker 1: are seen, once again, just like the eye, you're out
Speaker 1: of the you're out of the business. You have to
Speaker 1: do something else with your life. So that's the stuff
Speaker 1: that that we're doing to make sure the landscape is
Speaker 1: as safe as it possibly can be. International is a
Speaker 1: very big growth opportunity for you. Are there are there
Speaker 1: markets that you're in that are becoming big growth drivers
Speaker 1: for you? And are there markets that you you aren't
Speaker 1: in but you want to be in? The answer, you
Speaker 1: know the second question. First is, you know, we're in
Speaker 1: virtually every market right now. We're on TV. I think
Speaker 1: in a hundred and sixty countries and territories. We're reaching
Speaker 1: about one point one to one point two billion homes
Speaker 1: with every single one of our UFC events. So there's
Speaker 1: not a lot of places on the planet right now
Speaker 1: where you can't view you know, UFC content, you know,
Speaker 1: if you've got an Internet connection certainly, or if you
Speaker 1: have you know, a basic you know sort of television package. Um.
Speaker 1: That being said, there are certain markets that we see
Speaker 1: a tremendous amount of upside in. You know, first is
Speaker 1: the US. I mean, we've certainly made a lot of
Speaker 1: progress here, but we feel like the CSPN deal is
Speaker 1: going to take us the next level. Our second biggest
Speaker 1: market currently globally is Brazil. It's one of the foundations
Speaker 1: of the sports I mentioned to you know, Gracie jiu
Speaker 1: jitsu and Brazilian jiu jitsu is a you know, key
Speaker 1: skill that you've got a master in order to be
Speaker 1: successful in our sport. So we've got a lot of
Speaker 1: fans and a lot of athletes from Brazil. But um,
Speaker 1: you know, the list of countries where there's a lot
Speaker 1: of potential is is very long. I mean one of
Speaker 1: the areas of the world we're spending a lot of
Speaker 1: time on now is China. It's gone from a top
Speaker 1: twenty market frankly revenue wise to a top five market
Speaker 1: revenue wise, and it's obviously a huge country but also
Speaker 1: a martial arts tradition in China. So I think you're
Speaker 1: gonna see a lot you know of effort goes towards
Speaker 1: growing that market, you know, over the next several years.
Speaker 1: We had our first event in mainland China last year
Speaker 1: in Shanghai, huge success, sold out the Mercedes Benz Arena
Speaker 1: in Shanghai, and and that's a big deal in China.
Speaker 1: I mean, there's not like a huge culture of buying
Speaker 1: tickets there. But other than the NBA and US, you know,
Speaker 1: not many sports have sold out. Um, so we're really
Speaker 1: proud of that, and it really showed, you know, there's
Speaker 1: a great fan base there. I mean I went to
Speaker 1: that event. Fans were there early, Um, they knew all
Speaker 1: about the sport. We had eight Chinese athletes on that card,
Speaker 1: and so you know, we've got about twelve to fifteen
Speaker 1: Chinese athletes now and that number is going to grow.
Speaker 1: We'd like to get to you know, where we are
Speaker 1: at Brazil seventy or eighty you know, Chinese athletes on
Speaker 1: the UFC you know roster, and so I think you'll
Speaker 1: see a lot of investment and a lot of interesting
Speaker 1: things happening with UFC and China going forward, looking ahead
Speaker 1: to twenty nineteen, What what are the events are the
Speaker 1: initiatives that we should keep an eye on for UFC
Speaker 1: next year. Well, first and foremost of course, is launched
Speaker 1: the ESPN deal. Um, you know that's our January first,
Speaker 1: we're doing our first event uh in at the actually
Speaker 1: at the Parkway Center here in New York on I
Speaker 1: believe the nineteenth of January. So that's gonna be you know,
Speaker 1: sort of a seminal you know event for us, the
Speaker 1: first the first UFC under the ESPN relationship. Uh. You'll
Speaker 1: continue to see significant international expansion China and other markets
Speaker 1: being a high priority. UM and UM. You know, in
Speaker 1: addition to that, I think you'll continue to see us
Speaker 1: distributing content anywhere and everywhere that content is distributed. We're
Speaker 1: going to continue to be sort of on the leading
Speaker 1: edge of content distribution. UM. In addition that, UH, there
Speaker 1: will be some new sponsors that will be coming in
Speaker 1: as a as UFC sponsors, both in the UFC and
Speaker 1: both in the United States and around the world. So
Speaker 1: a lot of exciting things coming up in twenty nineteen
Speaker 1: for us. Great well, listen, Thank you so much for
Speaker 1: taking the time and talking us through all of this.
Speaker 1: It's an fascinating business. Thanks for having me, Thanks for listening.
Speaker 1: Be sure to check in next week for another episode
Speaker 1: of Strictly Business.