WEBVTT - BONUS EPISODE: Blunt Truths on Marijuana

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<v Speaker 1>No, really, no, really, they really don't really fans. It's

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<v Speaker 1>David Google.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Google.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm here with you today with a bonus edition of

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<v Speaker 1>really No Really Now. In the most recent edition of

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<v Speaker 1>the show, we had doctor Ryan Sultan, the assistant professor

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<v Speaker 1>of clinical psychiatry at Columbia University. Now he came on

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<v Speaker 1>to talk about people behaving badly, the Karens at the

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<v Speaker 1>pool or the people going crazy on airport, right, and

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<v Speaker 1>so we were having that discussion. But during the taping,

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<v Speaker 1>Peter admitted that he was coming could Turkey off of

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<v Speaker 1>the use of marijuana that had gotten out of hand

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<v Speaker 1>since COVID, so much so that when he went off

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<v Speaker 1>of it, he was he was having a hard time. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>thankfully for us. Doctor Sultan is an expert in the

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<v Speaker 1>areas of anxiety disorders depression ADHD, and substance abuse ketamine

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<v Speaker 1>and cannabis youth, so he was the perfect person to

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<v Speaker 1>talk to the research the new extensive research showing issues

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<v Speaker 1>with heart issues with parts of the brain actually shrinking

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<v Speaker 1>with extended cannabis youth.

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<v Speaker 3>So we wasn't.

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<v Speaker 1>Really part of the behaving Badly type of show that

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<v Speaker 1>we were doing for you, but we felt that it

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<v Speaker 1>was an important, helpful conversation that we wanted to share

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<v Speaker 1>with you. So without further ado, let's go to Jason

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<v Speaker 1>and Peter for really, no, really, it's.

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<v Speaker 2>Starting because the oscars happened recently and.

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<v Speaker 4>You got through them without smoking.

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<v Speaker 3>Leave. That's really I've given up. So I gave up.

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<v Speaker 2>I could do a medical podcast and we just did

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<v Speaker 2>a report. Just literate the latest report. I'm having a

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<v Speaker 2>tough time even talking today.

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<v Speaker 4>So what should I call renegade Parana and get it

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<v Speaker 4>back over.

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<v Speaker 3>Boot roller blood.

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<v Speaker 2>So in the report, and this is not a small sampling,

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<v Speaker 2>this is like over four hundred thousand people now that's

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<v Speaker 2>been not legalized for all, they found the stroke risk is.

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<v Speaker 3>Through the roof.

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<v Speaker 2>The lord caught smoking for smoking even for edibles. The

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<v Speaker 2>lung cancer risk is through the roof. And I went

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<v Speaker 2>out the other night, and you know, I've been smoking heavily. Heavily,

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<v Speaker 2>Oh I know. Yeah, And I'm not proud of it

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<v Speaker 2>because I started using it to go to sleep, and

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<v Speaker 2>I was using it to eat dinner, and then I

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<v Speaker 2>was using it to have.

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<v Speaker 3>Cereal, right, So and it was so easy to do.

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<v Speaker 2>I sprinkle it knowing that I'm not going to go

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<v Speaker 2>dumpster diving and throw it out. And it's been three

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<v Speaker 2>days and I've quit before, but this time has been

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<v Speaker 2>really difficult. My cold turkey cold turkey, and I can

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<v Speaker 2>feel it. I can really feel it because the stroke.

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<v Speaker 2>When I read those statistics, it was incredible. But as

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<v Speaker 2>far as the oscar, I'm the same way with sugar.

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<v Speaker 4>I've been off sugar now for twenty three twenty four days.

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<v Speaker 3>And congratulationships down and wait your cholesterols down. My cholesterol

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<v Speaker 3>fell one hundred points.

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<v Speaker 2>So today's lesson is if you lose weight, your cholesterol

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<v Speaker 2>goes down down, and if you stop pot you're ready

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<v Speaker 2>to kill the guy whose cholesterol has gone down. So

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<v Speaker 2>joining us now is doctor Ryan Sultan, Assistant Professor of

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<v Speaker 2>Clinical Psychiatry in the Department of Psychiatry at Columbia University

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<v Speaker 2>and the Irving Medical Center in New York State Psychiatric Institute.

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<v Speaker 2>He's an expert in the area's ADHD and cannabis use.

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<v Speaker 2>Will talk about that. Welcome well, but I wanted to

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<v Speaker 2>ask you something really important. We had opened this by

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<v Speaker 2>talking about cannabis, and I'm very candid about my cannabis

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<v Speaker 2>use that I got really out of hand during COVID.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh boy, yeah, and a lot of people's did well.

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<v Speaker 2>And I didn't even realize it started for bed that

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<v Speaker 2>The story I told myself was I needed to go

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<v Speaker 2>to sleep because I don't sleep well, and then I

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<v Speaker 2>needed to eat dinner and I needed to get up,

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<v Speaker 2>and I needed this.

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<v Speaker 3>Because my kids are going through this stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>You specialize in cannabis use ADHD and especially with antipsychotic

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<v Speaker 2>treatment and teen if you had to give us an umbrella,

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<v Speaker 2>because as I said, to start this, the cannabis you is,

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<v Speaker 2>they just found out with one of the bigger tests

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<v Speaker 2>ever that they've done that increases the risk of stroke

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<v Speaker 2>tremendously and lung disease, et cetera. So I threw it

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<v Speaker 2>out and this is day three and I can feel it.

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<v Speaker 2>I can feel that I'm a different guy. I'm a

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<v Speaker 2>bit scattered, and I'll come coming down. Do I also

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<v Speaker 2>noticed that when I was using it, the more and

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<v Speaker 2>more I used it, the more I got edgy, the

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<v Speaker 2>more I got shaky, and I knew that rationally, Buddy

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<v Speaker 2>didn't stop. So if you can address that, so.

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<v Speaker 5>Many things going on with cannabis right now, you know

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<v Speaker 5>one of the main things that has come up is

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<v Speaker 5>that we had this pendulum shift from cannabis is the

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<v Speaker 5>worst thing ever to it's a totally natural, benign tennessee.

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<v Speaker 5>And like both of those things are wrong, actually right,

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<v Speaker 5>Like those are those are extreme examples. And and so

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<v Speaker 5>there's this idea that that cannabis has no negative side effects,

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<v Speaker 5>which is just incorrect. Another thing that's important about cannabis

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<v Speaker 5>is the cannabis that you have access to now is

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<v Speaker 5>not the cannabis you had access to when you were

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<v Speaker 5>a teenager. It is substantially stronger by design. By design,

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<v Speaker 5>it is substantially stronger than the stuff that you had before.

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<v Speaker 5>And when you think about like whenever we've done that before, right,

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<v Speaker 5>like morphine versus fentanyl, Like fentyl is like one hundred

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<v Speaker 5>times stronger than morphine, like and we didn't have an

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<v Speaker 5>opioid crisis when we only had fentanyl, when we only

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<v Speaker 5>had a morphine, right like it was when we created

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<v Speaker 5>this much stronger version. So like the cannabis of today,

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<v Speaker 5>it's it's you know, you got natural cannabinoids in your

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<v Speaker 5>in your body that we all just have that are

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<v Speaker 5>binding to the cabina receptors, and like you know the

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<v Speaker 5>weed of probably my parents' generation. You put a little

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<v Speaker 5>bit in a joint, you take one hit, like it

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<v Speaker 5>would bind to that, it would feel nice. The weed

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<v Speaker 5>now is much stronger, is binding to that receptor and

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<v Speaker 5>is clinging on to it so much. And then now

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<v Speaker 5>that it's binding to it so much, your body says, oh, oh,

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<v Speaker 5>I don't need as many cannabina receptors, so they make

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<v Speaker 5>well less caannabino receptors. We can see that on a

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<v Speaker 5>function MRI that you have reduction of the cannabinoid receptors.

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<v Speaker 3>So now when you stop, you feel awful.

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<v Speaker 5>You feel awful because there isn't enough naturally circulating cannabinoids

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<v Speaker 5>to compensate, and you don't have the the receptors that

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<v Speaker 5>you had before because it's down regular and the more

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<v Speaker 5>potent is the stronger it is, the more that phenomenon

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<v Speaker 5>is going to happen.

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<v Speaker 2>So when you talk about it, because I had done

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<v Speaker 2>this on the radio years, this is why you.

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<v Speaker 3>Have this rebound anxiety. By the way, how long does

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<v Speaker 3>that last?

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<v Speaker 5>By the way, Uh, you know, the fMRI data shows

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<v Speaker 5>that you know, on a scan it looks pretty much

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<v Speaker 5>normal after about thirty days of no use.

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<v Speaker 2>You're almost there, Pete, No not. But I got to

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<v Speaker 2>push back anytime I talk about this on radio. And

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<v Speaker 2>this was before I had to use that I do.

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<v Speaker 2>Now you get to call from every stone in the

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<v Speaker 2>world going that's because you're doing it wrong.

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<v Speaker 3>You got the wrong dude, you got the wrong strain. Yep.

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<v Speaker 2>So the point being, I always got the pushback people

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<v Speaker 2>yelling everybody does podcast, you're doing it, You're doing it wrong,

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<v Speaker 2>you got the wrong kind of pot. You have to

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<v Speaker 2>this that. How do you even answer that? Because people

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<v Speaker 2>on pod that are using a lot of it are

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<v Speaker 2>going to be really resistant because, like I said, if

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<v Speaker 2>you said it's thirty days of this, I'm in. I'm

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<v Speaker 2>in because I don't want have a stroke. But how

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<v Speaker 2>do you tell somebody thirty years old who's taking it

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<v Speaker 2>because they're convinced that it helps with their ADHD or

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<v Speaker 2>it's helping me whatever they have.

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<v Speaker 5>And and and and it might actually it might help

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<v Speaker 5>with their ADHD. There's a little bit of data that

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<v Speaker 5>that that that some that strains, and we don't have

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<v Speaker 5>this downright, meaning we can't replicate it in a medical

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<v Speaker 5>way that it might it might do that. So I

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<v Speaker 5>want to validate for them, it does reduce anxiety and

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<v Speaker 5>it does improve mood symptoms. So everyone who says, hey, like, no,

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<v Speaker 5>it actually made me feel better, they're right. But but

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<v Speaker 5>the thing that that they need to think about is

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<v Speaker 5>the flip side of it, particularly with the anxiety and

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<v Speaker 5>depression stuff, which is that you know, if you the

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<v Speaker 5>more you're using it, it's probably making that condition.

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<v Speaker 3>Worse for you. I can feel it. I can feel

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<v Speaker 3>and you don't realize that.

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<v Speaker 5>You don't realize it, and and and and and the

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<v Speaker 5>cannabis is sneaky. It's really sneaky. It plays a trick

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<v Speaker 5>on you. You're using it more and more. Eventually you get

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<v Speaker 5>to a point where where if you you need it

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<v Speaker 5>just to feel normal, uh, and and to just sort

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<v Speaker 5>of function. I really I spend a lot of time

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<v Speaker 5>talking with people about that. And you know, one of

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<v Speaker 5>the ways I start with is just like, let's let's

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<v Speaker 5>just write down how often and like how much we

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<v Speaker 5>think we're using Like you don't have to change anything,

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<v Speaker 5>like just write it down, just record it, like no judgments,

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<v Speaker 5>like because most of the time when we do that,

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<v Speaker 5>it turns out it's it's more than we thought it was,

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<v Speaker 5>right and same thing with drinking. You ask anyone how

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<v Speaker 5>much they drink, almost everyone is going to underestimate.

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<v Speaker 2>And the amazing thing about the phenomena is aware of it.

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<v Speaker 2>As I was, I'd be in my day and I'd

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<v Speaker 2>be going, I feel pretty good, feel pretty good today,

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<v Speaker 2>everything's going well on PERF doing whatever, and I go,

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<v Speaker 2>but I'm still going and I know what it's doing that,

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<v Speaker 2>but I'm still going to do I'm.

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<v Speaker 3>Still going to do it.

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<v Speaker 4>Of that, it wasn't I always will with sugar. And

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<v Speaker 4>I realized that when I was in an acting class.

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<v Speaker 4>My acting teacher said, you go out for an audition

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<v Speaker 4>and you do a bad job.

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<v Speaker 3>What do you do?

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<v Speaker 4>I go get a Snickers bar? Right now? You go

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<v Speaker 4>out for the audition, you do a great job. What

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<v Speaker 4>are you doing?

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<v Speaker 3>I go out for I think as well, there you go.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but just thing scared. This thing scared me, I

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<v Speaker 2>mean it scared. This report was a pretty valid report.

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<v Speaker 5>And again I'm sure people are going to work and

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<v Speaker 5>there are other aspects of it, so that one is

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<v Speaker 5>is uh, in some ways not surprising because uh, you're

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<v Speaker 5>you're the inhalation of any kind of smoke damage is

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<v Speaker 5>going to damage your runks, right, I mean this is

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<v Speaker 5>like you are burning something, okay, like so like you know,

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<v Speaker 5>just like if you were in a fire, that wouldn't

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<v Speaker 5>be good for you either. The other thing that I

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<v Speaker 5>worry actually more about, because the lung thing is the

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<v Speaker 5>obvious thing to be worried about.

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<v Speaker 3>The thing that I worry.

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<v Speaker 5>About is all this data that we have on the

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<v Speaker 5>on the changes in the structure of your brain.

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<v Speaker 3>That's what I worry about.

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<v Speaker 5>So in kids, which by the way, is under twenty five, okay,

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<v Speaker 5>under twenty five, is your brain is developing to lease

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<v Speaker 5>till twenty five your ADHD it's probably even later than that,

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<v Speaker 5>there's evidence of structural changes. And then in long term

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<v Speaker 5>cannabis users, and you know in in Scandinavian countries, they

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<v Speaker 5>you know, their socialized system, they monitor everyone, they have

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<v Speaker 5>records and everyone, so they are to look at people

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<v Speaker 5>for many years. Cannabis users, their hippo campus is smaller.

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<v Speaker 5>Your hippo campus is a big memory center. And one

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<v Speaker 5>of the most acute effects of cannabis is the effect

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<v Speaker 5>on memory. I mean, anyone who smokes pot is aware

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<v Speaker 5>of this, and so like what does that what does

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<v Speaker 5>that mean? I actually don't know the answer, right, like

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<v Speaker 5>I don't. I don't know the answer. No one has

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<v Speaker 5>the answer.

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<v Speaker 2>Thing.

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<v Speaker 4>But then you get the superstars, like I'm assuming based

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<v Speaker 4>on what they themselves have said, superstars like Snoop Dogg

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<v Speaker 4>or who are who are able to I mean, they

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<v Speaker 4>seem to be completely functional. In fact, there seth Rogen's

0:11:04.160 --> 0:11:06.560
<v Speaker 4>probably doing a hundred times more in a day that I'm.

0:11:06.520 --> 0:11:07.319
<v Speaker 3>Capable of do it.

0:11:08.360 --> 0:11:13.880
<v Speaker 5>And you know, the thing with with uh mind altering substances,

0:11:13.920 --> 0:11:16.960
<v Speaker 5>and this was true for alcohol too, is that uh,

0:11:17.800 --> 0:11:21.720
<v Speaker 5>we all don't respond the same to them. And also

0:11:21.800 --> 0:11:24.520
<v Speaker 5>the situation that we're in the life, we're in, the

0:11:24.720 --> 0:11:27.120
<v Speaker 5>environment we're in is going to affect that too. And

0:11:27.240 --> 0:11:29.439
<v Speaker 5>and and yes, there are people that seem to be

0:11:29.559 --> 0:11:33.199
<v Speaker 5>really heavy cannabis users and there does not appear to

0:11:33.240 --> 0:11:35.680
<v Speaker 5>be any negative comment for them, but that's not gonna

0:11:35.679 --> 0:11:36.280
<v Speaker 5>be everyone.

0:11:36.400 --> 0:11:38.880
<v Speaker 2>May I wrap this episode up by saying, in the

0:11:38.960 --> 0:11:41.839
<v Speaker 2>words of your mother, don't worry so much about Snoop Dogg.

0:11:41.880 --> 0:11:46.640
<v Speaker 3>Worry about you, your mother, your mother, we should hear.

0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:50.199
<v Speaker 2>Sorry to wrap every episode, don't don't worry about seth Rog.

0:11:50.320 --> 0:11:55.000
<v Speaker 6>Seth Rogen jumps off of U right now as another

0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:57.480
<v Speaker 6>episode of Really No Really comes to a close. Let's

0:11:57.520 --> 0:12:00.559
<v Speaker 6>thank our guest, doctor Ryan Sultan. He's the director of

0:12:00.679 --> 0:12:03.680
<v Speaker 6>Integrative psych as well as being director of Sultan Live

0:12:03.720 --> 0:12:07.000
<v Speaker 6>at Columbia University. You can follow him on Instagram where

0:12:07.040 --> 0:12:09.880
<v Speaker 6>he is at Our Sultan MD and on x where

0:12:09.920 --> 0:12:13.360
<v Speaker 6>he is at Doctor Ryan Sultan. Our little show hangs

0:12:13.400 --> 0:12:16.559
<v Speaker 6>out on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, and threads at Really No

0:12:16.720 --> 0:12:19.679
<v Speaker 6>Really podcast And of course you can share your thoughts

0:12:19.720 --> 0:12:23.160
<v Speaker 6>and feedback with us online at reallynoreally dot com. If

0:12:23.200 --> 0:12:26.199
<v Speaker 6>you have a really some amazing fact or story that

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<v Speaker 6>boggles your mind, share it with us and if we

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0:12:32.160 --> 0:12:35.600
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<v Speaker 3>You get your podcasts.

0:12:50.000 --> 0:12:53.320
<v Speaker 6>Really No Really is a production of iHeartRadio and Blossy Entertainment.