1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:03,480 Speaker 1: Why from our nations this budget thing is going to 2 00:00:03,560 --> 00:00:06,320 Speaker 1: do nothing space forts. I still think it's interesting President 3 00:00:06,320 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: Trump not playing his cards yet he minds policy and 4 00:00:09,280 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 1: politics colliding. To sound on with Kevin's Relate the insiders, 5 00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 1: the influencers, the insides. I would rather see a congressional solution. 6 00:00:17,440 --> 00:00:20,520 Speaker 1: It's part of my DNA. The Senate map in looks 7 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:22,799 Speaker 1: a lot different than it looked in. You really have 8 00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:25,680 Speaker 1: a divide within Team Trump. The president has to do 9 00:00:25,880 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 1: exactly what people seven here to do, which is to 10 00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:31,639 Speaker 1: get it done. He's sound on with Kevin Relate on 11 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:35,760 Speaker 1: Bloomberg one and one seven a m h D two 12 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:41,560 Speaker 1: Boltemore shake up inside of the West Wing. White House 13 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 1: Press Secretary Sarah Sanders announces she is resigning as the 14 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 1: White House Press Secretary. President Trump tweeted out the news. 15 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:53,760 Speaker 1: She called it an honor of a lifetime, and he's 16 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:57,560 Speaker 1: saying he hopes that she runs for governor of Arkansas. 17 00:00:57,560 --> 00:00:59,840 Speaker 1: Will bring you the latest political fall out plus geo 18 00:01:00,040 --> 00:01:05,640 Speaker 1: politics Iran US blaming Iran for oil tanker attacks. As 19 00:01:05,640 --> 00:01:09,600 Speaker 1: the golf tensions climb, we have norm Rule here to 20 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:12,959 Speaker 1: break down the policy analysis of this. He's the former 21 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 1: C I a national intelligence manager for Iran and s 22 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:22,040 Speaker 1: advisor Counter Extremism Project and United Against Nuclear Iran. Bill Ferries, 23 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:25,720 Speaker 1: Bloomberg News National Security Team Leader, will also help us 24 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:29,080 Speaker 1: navigate through that trade talks continuing. I was at the 25 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:32,600 Speaker 1: Peterson Institute across town earlier today where Larry Cudlow had 26 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:35,679 Speaker 1: a lot to say about a potential meeting between President 27 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:38,920 Speaker 1: Trump and President She is jing ping. I'll bring you 28 00:01:38,959 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 1: the latest on that front as well. But first breaking 29 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 1: news tonight as White House Press Secretary Sarah Sanders announces 30 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 1: she's resigning from her post. President Trump via Twitter saying 31 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 1: that he hopes that she will run for governor of Arkansas. 32 00:01:53,440 --> 00:01:55,680 Speaker 1: We will bring you that coming up later on in 33 00:01:55,720 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 1: the program. But also breaking developments overseas, and that's where 34 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:02,000 Speaker 1: I want to be again. US is blaming Iran for 35 00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 1: oil tanker attacks as the golf tensions climb. With us 36 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 1: to break this down, we have Norm Rule. He is 37 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:13,919 Speaker 1: the former CIA National Intelligence Manager for Iran and also 38 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:17,920 Speaker 1: a senior advisor at the Counter Extremism Project and United 39 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:21,360 Speaker 1: Against Nuclear Iran. Also joining me as my colleague, Bill 40 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:25,239 Speaker 1: Bill Ferries. He's Bloomberg News National Security Team Leader, Bill 41 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:28,520 Speaker 1: what happened today with Iran? Well, UH that you know, 42 00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:31,640 Speaker 1: our day started off with reports of these two attacks 43 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:33,959 Speaker 1: on oil tankers. One of the tankers said it was 44 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: attacked three hours apart. It repelled or survived a first attack, 45 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,440 Speaker 1: and then it was attacked again. The US came out 46 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:44,440 Speaker 1: very quickly and very strongly, with Secretary of State Mike 47 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 1: Pompeo saying that UH US intelligence assessments concluded that Iran 48 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 1: was to blame. UH it's he said, this is a 49 00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:54,919 Speaker 1: sign that Iran doesn't want to negotiate with the US 50 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:58,520 Speaker 1: or find a better agreement over the nuke ordeal and UM. 51 00:02:59,320 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 1: The issue of a lot of people raised after that presentation, though, 52 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:05,840 Speaker 1: was very little evidence has been provided on which that 53 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:08,120 Speaker 1: assessment was based, so it's left a lot of questions 54 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:10,400 Speaker 1: out there in terms of what really happened. You mentioned 55 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:13,079 Speaker 1: Secretary of State Mike Pompeo. Here he is as he 56 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: describes who he says is to blame for these uh 57 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:19,160 Speaker 1: for these attacks. Here's the Secretary of State. Taken as 58 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 1: a whole, these unprovoked attacks present a clear threat to 59 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:26,640 Speaker 1: international peace and security, a blatant assault on the freedom 60 00:03:26,680 --> 00:03:31,600 Speaker 1: of navigation and an unacceptable campaign of escalating tension by 61 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:35,760 Speaker 1: Iron nor rule. What does this mean for the situation 62 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:38,920 Speaker 1: as the US tries to to nuclearize Iran? Well, I 63 00:03:38,960 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 1: think we have to separate this from the the nuclear 64 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 1: process in general. The United States has undertaken a campaign 65 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:47,040 Speaker 1: for some time to roll Iron back in the region. 66 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,320 Speaker 1: Uh doing so would sooner or later cause Irron to 67 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:54,080 Speaker 1: push back, and they're doing so. We're watching this. Should 68 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:56,040 Speaker 1: look at this in terms of how the attacks took 69 00:03:56,040 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 1: place on Janbo drone attacks. You're watching ship attacks Iran 70 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:04,000 Speaker 1: as this for several reasons. First, no, it pays no price. Second, 71 00:04:04,040 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 1: it's one of those things that you can describe as 72 00:04:05,680 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 1: attributable to Iran, but Iran can deny it when you 73 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:10,960 Speaker 1: have a intact it see all the evidence in the bottom. 74 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 1: But unless your name is Charlie the Tuna, you're not 75 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 1: gonna see any of the evidence of what actually hit 76 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:18,279 Speaker 1: a ship. So Iran is able to send a message 77 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:21,719 Speaker 1: touch global markets. One almost has to wonder how much 78 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 1: money was lost from Europe or Asian economies as they 79 00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:27,599 Speaker 1: paid the price for a higher oil prices. Today, as 80 00:04:27,720 --> 00:04:30,359 Speaker 1: shipping insurance goes up on on the various tankers, in 81 00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:33,280 Speaker 1: the region. So Iron was able to tell the international community, 82 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:36,880 Speaker 1: unless you press the US to lift sanctions, we will 83 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:39,560 Speaker 1: touch your economies in a very direct way. Now it's 84 00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:42,479 Speaker 1: interesting the economic angle of this. I'm reading the headline, 85 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:45,680 Speaker 1: I'm reading the story across the Bloomberg terminal just about 86 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 1: the High Stakes Diplomacy Bill and what this precisely mean. 87 00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:52,760 Speaker 1: The manager of one tanker, according to our our colleagues, 88 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:56,280 Speaker 1: the Norwegian owned front Altaire, said it was sailing in 89 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:59,240 Speaker 1: international orders when it was damaged by an explosion, and 90 00:04:59,279 --> 00:05:01,839 Speaker 1: that the incident is being treated as a quote unquote 91 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:05,760 Speaker 1: hostile attack. The ship had cargo on it in Abu 92 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:08,360 Speaker 1: Dhabi and was bound for Taiwan. Then you've got this 93 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 1: other boat. This was a Japanese operated another ship, and 94 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 1: that was attacked twice, twice three hours apart. I mean 95 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 1: this was coordinated. This was a ron trying to send 96 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 1: a message to Norm's point. But if you're in your 97 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:25,040 Speaker 1: car on your way home from work today, why should 98 00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:28,960 Speaker 1: why does this impact the US? Well, you're talking about 99 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: a heat proportion of the world's energy supplies moving through 100 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:35,040 Speaker 1: very narrow straits. I think we do need to reiterate 101 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:38,839 Speaker 1: there's still very very little public evidence of of what 102 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:41,839 Speaker 1: of who was behind this attack. We may get, to 103 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:44,599 Speaker 1: Norm's point, we may get a look at UH some 104 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:46,960 Speaker 1: of that evidence because the U S a U S 105 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:50,280 Speaker 1: official said that UH one of the ships was hit 106 00:05:50,320 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 1: by a mine and that in the in the hole 107 00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:56,640 Speaker 1: that was created, there was another mine lodged in there 108 00:05:56,640 --> 00:05:59,640 Speaker 1: that did not explode. So I would expect people if 109 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:04,920 Speaker 1: if they can safely get that mine UH deactivated UH 110 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:07,160 Speaker 1: and and provided to the public, we may get a 111 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:09,240 Speaker 1: little bit of a look at the type of construction, 112 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:12,320 Speaker 1: who maybe have been behind this kind of a thing. UM. 113 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:14,840 Speaker 1: But there's still you know, all of this happened a 114 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:18,680 Speaker 1: little over twelve hours ago. I think, UM, a lot 115 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:21,560 Speaker 1: of countries, even US allies, are still raising the question 116 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:25,120 Speaker 1: about about the evidence behind it. UM. Certainly Iran has 117 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:27,839 Speaker 1: done similar attacks in the past. UH. There are a 118 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:30,680 Speaker 1: lot of countries that may have may have an interest 119 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 1: in pointing a finger in Iran as well. Iran has 120 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: an interest in doing it. Perhaps other countries have an 121 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 1: interest in seeing Iran blamed for it. So I think 122 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:39,680 Speaker 1: we're gonna have to wait and see what happens. We 123 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 1: just spoke with Kuwait's un ambassadors. He was walking into 124 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 1: a U N. Security Council briefing on this issue. He said, 125 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 1: and Kuwait is certainly a strong ally of the US, 126 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:51,960 Speaker 1: but he said, it's too soon to assign blame on this. 127 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:55,479 Speaker 1: The investigation is still ongoing, so it's certainly true that 128 00:06:55,520 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 1: it's too soon to blame. Normally, investigations of this nature 129 00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:02,560 Speaker 1: unless there is a vance information available and there is 130 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:05,440 Speaker 1: a sense and Secretary of Pompeios statementary that might be true. 131 00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:08,039 Speaker 1: This takes some time. You're gonna have engineers want to 132 00:07:08,040 --> 00:07:10,640 Speaker 1: look at the uh the explosion to see the type 133 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 1: of damage done to the ship, for traces the explosive. 134 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 1: If there is a mind and candidly, even if it 135 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:19,120 Speaker 1: has a stamp and it say made in Tehran, it 136 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 1: means very little in the international community. We have a 137 00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 1: vast amount of weaponry that the Iranians have fired into 138 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:28,120 Speaker 1: Saudi Arabia against the thousands of foreigners who live in 139 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:30,600 Speaker 1: Syria as well, to include Americans, and there is no 140 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:32,720 Speaker 1: doubt that equipment is made in Iran and it's not 141 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:35,320 Speaker 1: available to flea market, but that has not moved the 142 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:39,120 Speaker 1: international community. You know, the State's Department and folks working 143 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 1: in the administration will say that they're trying to put 144 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:46,200 Speaker 1: as much economic isolation efforts on Iran in order to 145 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:49,440 Speaker 1: isolate them, and this type of action should Irn be 146 00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:52,520 Speaker 1: blamed As the Secretary of State is saying, I would 147 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:55,679 Speaker 1: indicate that maybe they're starting to feel that economic pressure. 148 00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:58,960 Speaker 1: Here's the Secretary of State saying that, Well, Iran is 149 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:02,600 Speaker 1: having a temper changer. I'm curious Iran is lashing out 150 00:08:03,120 --> 00:08:07,480 Speaker 1: because the regime wants are successful. Maximum pressure campaign lifted, 151 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 1: no economic senctions entitled the Islamic Republic to attack innocent civilians, 152 00:08:12,880 --> 00:08:18,640 Speaker 1: disrupt global oil markets, and engage in nuclear blackmail. That's there, 153 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:22,920 Speaker 1: you have it, to engage in nuclear black mail. Twelve 154 00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: hours ago, the Trump administration says iron attacked two oil 155 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:30,640 Speaker 1: tankers near the entrance of the Persian Gulf, which is 156 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 1: escalating the tensions between the US and Aron. Norm Take 157 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:37,800 Speaker 1: us into the Pentagon tonight, take us into the State 158 00:08:37,880 --> 00:08:41,680 Speaker 1: Department tonight. What what? What is going to happen within 159 00:08:41,720 --> 00:08:44,840 Speaker 1: the next twelve hours and the immediate immediate short term 160 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:47,800 Speaker 1: as the US tries to contemplate a response, Well, the 161 00:08:47,840 --> 00:08:51,760 Speaker 1: administration has actually shown us recently what it what its 162 00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:54,679 Speaker 1: plans to do, and that is a heavy diplomatic role. 163 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 1: Despite the rhetoric that you've seen coming from Washington, other 164 00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:01,800 Speaker 1: players the administration is heavily in aged the Our Asian, Arab, 165 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:05,560 Speaker 1: European UH part as well as countries like Russia and SOCI. 166 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:08,199 Speaker 1: You're gonna see a heavy diplomatic press rate now to 167 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:10,199 Speaker 1: see what can be done in the United Nations Security 168 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: Council unlikely to succeed because of Russia. The military will 169 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:17,640 Speaker 1: basically be asked what can you do to prevent further attacks, 170 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:19,720 Speaker 1: which is going to be very difficult because the number 171 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:22,160 Speaker 1: of small boats in the Gulf, where I've spent a 172 00:09:22,200 --> 00:09:25,079 Speaker 1: number of years numbers in the hundreds every day. This 173 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:27,360 Speaker 1: is very, very difficult to track. And there are a 174 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:30,520 Speaker 1: large number of ships of tankers and other freighters moving 175 00:09:30,520 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 1: through the area. So it will be difficult for the 176 00:09:32,320 --> 00:09:35,520 Speaker 1: United States to observe all of this right and uh, 177 00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:37,880 Speaker 1: you know, I think that the one of the issues 178 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:40,920 Speaker 1: that came out of a Secretary of Pompeio statement today, 179 00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:42,800 Speaker 1: it was when you so quickly come out and point 180 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:45,680 Speaker 1: the finger at Iran, it does immediately raise the question 181 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:47,520 Speaker 1: of what are you going to do about it there 182 00:09:47,520 --> 00:09:50,080 Speaker 1: were a spate of attacks last month on a Saudi 183 00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:53,240 Speaker 1: oil pipeline and UH and a couple of ships docked 184 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 1: near UAE, and the US response was to accelerate the 185 00:09:57,280 --> 00:09:59,880 Speaker 1: deployment of an aircraft carrier, send bombers to the reach 186 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:03,120 Speaker 1: and and I think nine hundred or so additional troops. 187 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 1: So UH, with with this decision or assessment from the 188 00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:10,319 Speaker 1: administration coming out so quickly, I think I think there 189 00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 1: will be an expectation that the Pentagon has to provide 190 00:10:14,440 --> 00:10:16,480 Speaker 1: some sort of a response or the White House will 191 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:19,560 Speaker 1: announce something. We haven't seen what that will be yet, 192 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:22,760 Speaker 1: but the timing is very interesting in terms of just 193 00:10:22,840 --> 00:10:25,800 Speaker 1: how quickly they've apparently reached this conclusion. And we don't 194 00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:28,480 Speaker 1: know whether or not as of now, there were any 195 00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 1: casualties according to the According to the report, there appeared 196 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:35,720 Speaker 1: to have been no casualties. For four crewmen were picked 197 00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:39,720 Speaker 1: up by UH our fifth fleet from an absent UH 198 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:42,200 Speaker 1: and they're here to be the appear really are. Our 199 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:44,680 Speaker 1: fifth fleet is always on duty and they are extraordinary 200 00:10:44,679 --> 00:10:48,040 Speaker 1: personnel and UH and and just to to to wrap 201 00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:51,000 Speaker 1: this up, I mean to to Josh's point or to 202 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:53,320 Speaker 1: Bill's point, someone was with Josh mc grow earlier on trade. 203 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 1: Coming up, we're talking trade policy. But but to wrap 204 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:58,280 Speaker 1: this up, the incidents coming day after Iran back rebels 205 00:10:58,280 --> 00:11:01,720 Speaker 1: and Yemen fired a missile at the Saudi airport, which 206 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:06,120 Speaker 1: twenty six people. I mean this tensions, they just continue 207 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:08,400 Speaker 1: to escalate. My thank to my colleague Bill Ferries. He 208 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:11,720 Speaker 1: of course is the Bloomberg News National Security team leader. 209 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:14,439 Speaker 1: Busy twelve hours for you, A busy day for you ahead, 210 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:16,079 Speaker 1: Norm You're gonna stick around me and much more to 211 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:19,199 Speaker 1: talk about on foreign policy as well as domestic policy. 212 00:11:19,240 --> 00:11:22,840 Speaker 1: Coming up, the latest with regards to US China trade policy. 213 00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:24,840 Speaker 1: I'll tell you what Larry Cudlow had to say. You 214 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:28,520 Speaker 1: can download the Sound On podcast on Apple iTunes, at 215 00:11:28,559 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 1: Bloomberg dot com, or by downloading the Bloomberg Business app. 216 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 1: You can also find us on Radio dot com, I 217 00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:37,880 Speaker 1: Heart Radio, and Spotify. I'm Kevin Cerelli. You're listening to Bloomberg. 218 00:11:42,080 --> 00:11:46,239 Speaker 1: You're listening to Sound On with Kevin Surreally on Bloomberg 219 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:51,559 Speaker 1: one and one m h D two Bosom. I'm Kevin Serelli, 220 00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:55,880 Speaker 1: Chief Washington correspondent for Bloomberg Television and Bloomberg Radio. Earlier today, 221 00:11:55,960 --> 00:11:58,400 Speaker 1: I was at the Peters Institute in Washington, d C. 222 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:01,400 Speaker 1: And they hosted a calm versation with Larry Cudlow, the 223 00:12:01,400 --> 00:12:05,040 Speaker 1: President's chief economic advisor. I was able to ask him 224 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:08,160 Speaker 1: about the US and China trade talks, and I want 225 00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:11,520 Speaker 1: to play for you a portion of our exchange because 226 00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:15,560 Speaker 1: I was interested to see the developments that are happening 227 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:20,600 Speaker 1: in Hong Kong with these protests and precisely about whether 228 00:12:20,720 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 1: or not that's a counter argument to folks who say 229 00:12:24,679 --> 00:12:26,640 Speaker 1: that China can just play the long game with US 230 00:12:26,720 --> 00:12:29,560 Speaker 1: China trade talks. But when you look at what the 231 00:12:29,640 --> 00:12:33,960 Speaker 1: Hong Kong protesters who are protesting against laws against China 232 00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:38,040 Speaker 1: and China's authoritarian government, when you look at what they 233 00:12:38,040 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 1: are calling for, it would make the case that maybe 234 00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:46,800 Speaker 1: just maybe the fight for freedom and democracy, well that's 235 00:12:46,800 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 1: a long game too. Here's what Larry Caudlo had to say. 236 00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:54,640 Speaker 1: They're having a hell of a fight over that. And 237 00:12:57,120 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 1: without elaborating too much, what does that tell you? Now? 238 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:06,280 Speaker 1: The Hong Kong citizens, I won't say all of them, 239 00:13:06,320 --> 00:13:09,160 Speaker 1: but at a couple hundred thousand worth risking light and 240 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:17,760 Speaker 1: limb are marching in protests of these new laws. Is 241 00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:22,400 Speaker 1: it Tienamen Square? Not exactly, because it make one think 242 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:24,559 Speaker 1: of Tianneman Square and how many years ago is that 243 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:30,160 Speaker 1: it makes one think of Tianamen Square and the battle 244 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:35,760 Speaker 1: over freedom? And I just I'm just asking a simple 245 00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:42,560 Speaker 1: question here regarding the values, norms, structures, rules of the 246 00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:48,760 Speaker 1: Chinese government hierarchy. Do they want the kind of liberalization 247 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,400 Speaker 1: that we are pressing for on the trade front. And 248 00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:54,600 Speaker 1: when you see what's going on in Hong Kong, you 249 00:13:54,679 --> 00:13:57,800 Speaker 1: kind of raise your eyebrows. I think you are, That's 250 00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 1: all and just a quick to switch gears on U 251 00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:02,319 Speaker 1: S M c A. Are you confident that the votes 252 00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:05,400 Speaker 1: are there right now from the democratic perspective in the 253 00:14:05,440 --> 00:14:07,600 Speaker 1: House of Representatives? And do you think we might get 254 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:10,960 Speaker 1: a vote ahead of the August recess? Thank you? Well? 255 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:15,800 Speaker 1: Okay um, I really should let Bob leidheiser Um. We 256 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:20,160 Speaker 1: just had a meeting about that with the President. I think, 257 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:24,400 Speaker 1: uh if. And when the Speaker gives us a vote, yeah, 258 00:14:24,440 --> 00:14:27,360 Speaker 1: I think it's gonna pass. I wouldn't dare predict timing. 259 00:14:28,360 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: And as I said earlier, I think the Speaker has 260 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:35,040 Speaker 1: been very accommodated to us, giving us a fair hearing 261 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:40,160 Speaker 1: on it, so let's be hopeful. But my biggest point 262 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:44,320 Speaker 1: was to Fred's point or some of the others, uh 263 00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 1: U s m c A. I hate to be red. 264 00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 1: U s m c A is a hugely positive economic 265 00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:55,080 Speaker 1: growth factor, and it's not You're not giving it its 266 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:59,160 Speaker 1: its place in the world. And we're proud of the deal. 267 00:15:00,320 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: We can't shape good free trade. That was Larry Cudlow, 268 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:07,920 Speaker 1: the President's chief economic advisor, speaking earlier today in response 269 00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 1: to a question that I asked him about US China 270 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:13,640 Speaker 1: trade talks as well as the US Mexico trade talks. 271 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 1: He was over at the Peterson Institute just across town 272 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:20,520 Speaker 1: here in Washington, d C. Norm Rule he is, former 273 00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 1: senior CIA officer, and Kaprika Farro just walked in and 274 00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:26,200 Speaker 1: she was listening to this and good for the program 275 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:31,000 Speaker 1: executive and residents at American University, former Democratic Minority leader 276 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:33,880 Speaker 1: of the Ohio State Senate. What do you make of 277 00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:36,800 Speaker 1: what what Mr Cudlow had to say about, Well, let's 278 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:38,200 Speaker 1: start with China. What do you have to say about 279 00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:39,960 Speaker 1: the US China trade talks through the lens of these 280 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:42,120 Speaker 1: Hong Kong protests? Right? Well, I mean we have to 281 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:44,960 Speaker 1: remember a few things about this context. I mean, we 282 00:15:45,080 --> 00:15:49,360 Speaker 1: are almost exactly thirty years after Tenneman Square the occurred 283 00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:53,400 Speaker 1: in nine nine UH, and Hong Kong is is, you know, 284 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:56,640 Speaker 1: an area that has been not only had a you know, 285 00:15:56,800 --> 00:16:00,960 Speaker 1: precarious history with mainland China, but also obviously occupied by 286 00:16:01,080 --> 00:16:06,480 Speaker 1: the United Kingdom and essentially was um made autonomous again. 287 00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:10,720 Speaker 1: In so I think that because of their history, they 288 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:17,560 Speaker 1: are very guarded, very UM proactive in trying to ensure 289 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:22,480 Speaker 1: that they're able to maintain UM a level of freedoms. 290 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:25,800 Speaker 1: And and obviously they're a very small island with a 291 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:30,040 Speaker 1: very large mainland China that is looming UM. So you know, 292 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:33,680 Speaker 1: I understand where Cutlow is coming from on that aspect, 293 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:37,640 Speaker 1: and I think that UM it is it is a concern. 294 00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 1: And let me go one step further to say this 295 00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:43,120 Speaker 1: that oftentimes when we talk about quote unquote fair trade, 296 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 1: particularly from organizations like the A f l, C, I 297 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:50,320 Speaker 1: O and trade and labor organizations, it's not about UM 298 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:56,360 Speaker 1: negotiating our labor and environmental standards down. It's about lifting 299 00:16:56,600 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 1: other nations at labor and environmental standards up. And so 300 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:03,000 Speaker 1: that's on the same page. That's how you get their trade, 301 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:05,320 Speaker 1: and that's how you expand One would argue, that's how 302 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:08,840 Speaker 1: you could expand democratic value exact casey around the world. 303 00:17:08,920 --> 00:17:10,119 Speaker 1: Let me let me press you on this though. If 304 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:13,720 Speaker 1: you're President Chujing, thing put on your Chinese analysis cap 305 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:16,560 Speaker 1: for us. If you're President shi jing Ping and you're 306 00:17:16,600 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 1: reading the reports and the cables that are coming through 307 00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:22,440 Speaker 1: regarding these protests in Hong Kong, does that influence your 308 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:24,840 Speaker 1: deal making or your decision making, or the and the 309 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:28,639 Speaker 1: ongoing trade talks with the US at all? Again, It's 310 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:30,080 Speaker 1: I think it's hard to say. I mean, I think 311 00:17:30,119 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 1: that right now he many authoritarian regimes, regardless of of 312 00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:38,439 Speaker 1: how robust their economies may or may not be, are 313 00:17:38,560 --> 00:17:42,800 Speaker 1: more focused. I would surmise on the domestic messaging rather 314 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,360 Speaker 1: than the international message. I think. I think what's interesting 315 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:48,040 Speaker 1: is everyone saying, well, President she isn't going anywhere. He's 316 00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:50,320 Speaker 1: going to be president of China for forever. Well, you 317 00:17:50,359 --> 00:17:52,960 Speaker 1: know what, Hong Kong is it going anywhere? Either? Follow 318 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,159 Speaker 1: up on that front. Uh, I was really struck by 319 00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:57,680 Speaker 1: this and I was nerning out. And I know you're 320 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:00,359 Speaker 1: I can call you a nerd absolutely, okay, because I'm 321 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:02,360 Speaker 1: probably just as much, if not more of a nerd 322 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:04,160 Speaker 1: than you are, especially when it comes to trade talks. 323 00:18:05,160 --> 00:18:08,920 Speaker 1: Appreciate that. Thank you. I wear those policy I'm I'm 324 00:18:10,119 --> 00:18:12,080 Speaker 1: all right, you can. You can be healthcare queen, and 325 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:17,000 Speaker 1: I will be king nerd. So I was like geeking 326 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:19,880 Speaker 1: out today at the Peterson Institute because here, like Cudlo 327 00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:23,800 Speaker 1: is saying, essentially into this room of like you know, 328 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:27,840 Speaker 1: a dozen or like fifty or so like financial folks 329 00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:32,639 Speaker 1: in town, this meeting that everyone is like anxiously eagerly 330 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:35,479 Speaker 1: awaiting between President Trump and President shi jing Ping at 331 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:38,600 Speaker 1: the G twenty, this one off meeting. The Chinese haven't 332 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:41,639 Speaker 1: even yet agreed to it. It might not even happen. 333 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:44,440 Speaker 1: It's huge, and and and then he goes he just 334 00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:46,840 Speaker 1: tucks this in twice, which means you know he meant 335 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:49,840 Speaker 1: to do it. Was that that if it doesn't happen, 336 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:54,280 Speaker 1: there could be quote unquote consequences, i e. Terroriffs against 337 00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:57,159 Speaker 1: the Chinese. So if this meeting doesn't even happen, I 338 00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:01,920 Speaker 1: mean there's always a threat of eariffs that is looming well, 339 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 1: as we've learned. But but that but I think as 340 00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,040 Speaker 1: you as you look at and you try to game 341 00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:09,560 Speaker 1: this out, especially President Trump is saying you better meet 342 00:19:09,600 --> 00:19:11,959 Speaker 1: with me or else, right or else? What though? I mean, 343 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:14,399 Speaker 1: that's the thing. I mean, you know, it's it's a 344 00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:16,960 Speaker 1: trade war for a reason. It's not a one sided battle. 345 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:19,720 Speaker 1: I mean, we up the anti, they up the anti. 346 00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:21,280 Speaker 1: We have the anti day of the Anti. And there 347 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 1: are political consequences in the United States significant, Uh, you know, 348 00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:28,240 Speaker 1: economic consequences for a variety of industries, whether you're the 349 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 1: auto industry or you know, the agricultural sector or whatever, 350 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:34,000 Speaker 1: because you know, China is going to place tariffs on 351 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:36,800 Speaker 1: our goods too, so it isn't justin or else from us. 352 00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:39,359 Speaker 1: There are consequences for the United States. Well, I was 353 00:19:39,480 --> 00:19:42,280 Speaker 1: I was struck by this just the political lens of 354 00:19:42,359 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: all of this. I mean, you haven't really seen much 355 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:49,040 Speaker 1: movement and whatnot in the in the political polls in Youngstown, Ohio, 356 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:52,320 Speaker 1: where you're from, or in western parts of p A 357 00:19:52,480 --> 00:19:57,440 Speaker 1: and seeing the shift, But it looks like the administration 358 00:19:57,800 --> 00:20:00,440 Speaker 1: from what I gathered from from Cudlow's remarks, he's he 359 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:03,440 Speaker 1: used the expression quote unquote kick some butt. He said, 360 00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 1: you gotta kick some butt. That's what Larry Cundlo said. Uh, 361 00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:08,480 Speaker 1: they're in this for the long haul. They're not they're 362 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:11,200 Speaker 1: not blinking. I agree with you. I don't think they're 363 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:12,720 Speaker 1: gonna blame You think they get U S m C 364 00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:16,639 Speaker 1: a pass before August recess. Oh that's a stretch, all right. 365 00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:18,560 Speaker 1: Coming up, we're Norm's going to weigh in on on 366 00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:22,840 Speaker 1: whether or not a president or a presidential candidate should 367 00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:25,119 Speaker 1: take four and dirt. Did you guys see this that 368 00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:28,280 Speaker 1: President Trump gave an interview to George Stephanopolis over an 369 00:20:28,280 --> 00:20:30,720 Speaker 1: ABC Caprica Far is going to react as well on 370 00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:33,399 Speaker 1: Kevin Cirelli. You can download the Sound On podcast on 371 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:36,800 Speaker 1: Apple iTunes, at Bloomberg dot com, or by downloading the 372 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:39,359 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business app. You can also find me and my 373 00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:43,160 Speaker 1: colleagues on Radio dot com, I Heart Radio, and Spotify. 374 00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:52,159 Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg. You're listening to Sound On with 375 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:56,600 Speaker 1: Kevin Surreally on Bloomberg one and one oh five point 376 00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:00,119 Speaker 1: seven f m h D two Baltimore, Breaking new US 377 00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:03,720 Speaker 1: Tonight headlines, crossing the bloom Bird terminal. White House Press 378 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:08,959 Speaker 1: Secretary Sarah Sanders she's resigning. She says that after three 379 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:11,399 Speaker 1: and a half years, she's grateful for her time. It 380 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 1: was the quote unquote honor of a lifetime President Trump 381 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:17,040 Speaker 1: tweeted out that he hopes that she runs for governor 382 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:19,040 Speaker 1: of Arkansas. I'll bring you the latest on that coming 383 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:21,440 Speaker 1: up on in the program. But I was really struck 384 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:24,120 Speaker 1: by something that caught fire today based upon an interview 385 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:28,920 Speaker 1: that George Stephanopolis over at ABC he gave to President 386 00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:32,000 Speaker 1: Trump about whether or not the President of the United 387 00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:38,920 Speaker 1: States would take dirt political dirt ammunition allah Hillary Clinton 388 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 1: in an election. Take a listen to the President Trump 389 00:21:42,040 --> 00:21:45,960 Speaker 1: and what he had to say. If somebody called from 390 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:50,680 Speaker 1: a country Norway, we have information on your opponent. Oh, 391 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:52,680 Speaker 1: I think i'd want to hear. You want that kind 392 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:55,199 Speaker 1: of interference in our elections. It's not an interference. They 393 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:58,840 Speaker 1: have information. I think I'd take it. He would take it. 394 00:21:59,080 --> 00:22:04,160 Speaker 1: Capri far Oh She is executive and residents at American University, 395 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,360 Speaker 1: former Democratic Minority leader in the Ohio State Senate, Normal Rule, 396 00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:12,760 Speaker 1: former senior CIA intelligence officer. Now he's at the Counter 397 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:16,439 Speaker 1: Extremism Project and United Against Nuclear or around. All right, 398 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:18,760 Speaker 1: norm I gotta ask you, what do you make of 399 00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:21,080 Speaker 1: what the President had to say. I think I can 400 00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:26,280 Speaker 1: categorically say that it's unlikely Norway will on our elections, 401 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,480 Speaker 1: and we can be we don't have to be worried about. 402 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 1: As a retired intelligence officer of prediction there with high confidence, 403 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:34,200 Speaker 1: I don't think the Norwegians or what we need to 404 00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:35,960 Speaker 1: worry about it. Here's what we do need to worry about. 405 00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 1: That such comments could encourage malign states and this this 406 00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:44,720 Speaker 1: would include obviously Russia, but China other countries who would 407 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:47,639 Speaker 1: seek to play with our polities and collect information and 408 00:22:47,680 --> 00:22:51,200 Speaker 1: conduct cyber operations in the hope of of just finding 409 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:54,240 Speaker 1: a receptive audience. I think it's the best better practice 410 00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:57,200 Speaker 1: to say that if anyone calls a US political figure 411 00:22:57,359 --> 00:23:01,080 Speaker 1: and implies they have this information, the person probably an 412 00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:03,200 Speaker 1: invest in the country, you should say, I don't want 413 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:05,000 Speaker 1: to hear it, and I'm going to report this call 414 00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:08,840 Speaker 1: to the Federal Beer Investigation. I think I certainly defer 415 00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:12,960 Speaker 1: to you, sir, as someone who is a a I 416 00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:16,159 Speaker 1: mean that sincerely, as as someone who is obviously a 417 00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:21,920 Speaker 1: retired not an old man, but a retired UH professional 418 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:25,640 Speaker 1: in the intelligence community with longevity. UM. But I will 419 00:23:25,720 --> 00:23:30,639 Speaker 1: say this, I had similar conversation on air earlier today, UM, 420 00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:34,280 Speaker 1: on a different on a different Network on Yes On 421 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:37,840 Speaker 1: on Neil Cavuto's show. Um, anyway, I don't know what 422 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:40,560 Speaker 1: the rules are regards to talking about other networks. That 423 00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:44,040 Speaker 1: being said, well I didn't, I I'm blaming you then, 424 00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:47,000 Speaker 1: So basically, you know, this is the thing. I don't 425 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:48,919 Speaker 1: care if you're a Democrat or Republican. I don't care 426 00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:52,960 Speaker 1: if it's Norway or Russia. I absolutely agree that it 427 00:23:53,119 --> 00:23:57,200 Speaker 1: is unacceptable to engage. This isn't your you know, garden 428 00:23:57,359 --> 00:24:01,399 Speaker 1: variety opposition research, which frankly, if you retain someone in 429 00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 1: the course of a campaign that is disclosed in your 430 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:08,560 Speaker 1: Federal Elections Commission UH financial reports, for example. This is 431 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:12,119 Speaker 1: not the same thing as having a casual conversation with 432 00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:15,440 Speaker 1: a leader of the G twenty. This is someone basically 433 00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:18,159 Speaker 1: saying we have dirt on your opponent. This is a 434 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:21,359 Speaker 1: foreign entity trying to get involved in one way, shape 435 00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:25,800 Speaker 1: or form and an American domestic electoral process, and it 436 00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:28,240 Speaker 1: is unacceptable. And if somebody brings it up to you, 437 00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 1: you should say, I'm sorry. You know, I appreciate and 438 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:35,480 Speaker 1: value our relationship, but I don't think this is inappropriate. 439 00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:38,440 Speaker 1: The laws are there laws about this kind of stuff, 440 00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:42,480 Speaker 1: not a not not not not a legal expert, not 441 00:24:42,760 --> 00:24:44,959 Speaker 1: not are in the calligence community, but there are, there are, 442 00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:50,800 Speaker 1: there are instances where the intelligence community might uncover reports 443 00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:54,159 Speaker 1: that foreign governments are students swaying our elections. You've had 444 00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 1: the Russians for decades attempt to sway American elections, to 445 00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:00,879 Speaker 1: influence our political process, going back to the nineteen thirties. 446 00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:03,760 Speaker 1: This is nothing new. It's nothing new that That's what 447 00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 1: I felt some kind. But what is new is not 448 00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:07,840 Speaker 1: turning it over to the FBI. I mean when this 449 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:09,800 Speaker 1: is you know, for example, there's a very you know, 450 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:13,040 Speaker 1: well known example of for for example, not Norway, but 451 00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:16,919 Speaker 1: Al Gore's campaign in two thousand was apparently approached. They 452 00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:19,920 Speaker 1: immediately went to to the Federal Bureau of Investigation and said, 453 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:22,720 Speaker 1: this is the issue. Here's the other problem with this 454 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:26,399 Speaker 1: is that the second that you open yourself up to 455 00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:29,560 Speaker 1: a foreign entity, then they have something on you. They say, 456 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:31,440 Speaker 1: you did this for us, or we did this for 457 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:32,720 Speaker 1: you know, what are you gonna do for like an 458 00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:35,000 Speaker 1: episode of The Americans? Wait, I gotta play for you. 459 00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:37,000 Speaker 1: You know who agrees with you and you're a Democrat, 460 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:40,119 Speaker 1: and I think this is a pretty common with you 461 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 1: Senator Marco ruby O, Republican. No, that's here, Senator Marco 462 00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:48,920 Speaker 1: ruby O, Republican from Florida, take a listen. Yeah, my reactions. 463 00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:51,560 Speaker 1: He should reach out to the FBI, and I think 464 00:25:51,600 --> 00:25:55,280 Speaker 1: both parties and all the candidates should agree that they 465 00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 1: would do so. You know, I it's so there you 466 00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:01,400 Speaker 1: have it. I mean, this is for Marco Rubio's perspective 467 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:04,440 Speaker 1: and non partisan issue. And here's here's Senator Richard Blumenthal, 468 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:08,080 Speaker 1: Democrat from Connecticut. He was reacting as well that this 469 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,640 Speaker 1: got a lot of pick up. Here's Bluementhal. We're talking 470 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 1: here about the president of the United States being offered illicit, 471 00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:20,439 Speaker 1: illegally obtained information by a foreign government, a sworn adversary 472 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:23,800 Speaker 1: and enemy of this country, to be used against the 473 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:28,080 Speaker 1: political opponent that is in a class of its own. 474 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:33,159 Speaker 1: And the president has put himself beyond the pale. He 475 00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 1: is entitled to no credibility on any accusation against any 476 00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:43,679 Speaker 1: political opponent. That Senator Richard Blumenthal Blumenthal, a Democrat from Connecticut, 477 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:47,159 Speaker 1: reacting to this law and crime Dan Abrams actually had 478 00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:48,960 Speaker 1: a peace out there. You know, the law expert long 479 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:53,280 Speaker 1: crime by Danny Abrams, and he says. According to my 480 00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:55,639 Speaker 1: colleague Nancy Lions, who just passed this long to me, 481 00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:59,680 Speaker 1: that the federal election law, administered by the FEC, the 482 00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:05,239 Speaker 1: Federal Elections Commission, prohibits contributions, donations, and other expenditures by 483 00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:09,040 Speaker 1: foreign nationals in any federal, state or local election, as 484 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:12,159 Speaker 1: well as an exchange of anything of value. So I 485 00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:15,120 Speaker 1: guess that the question becomes what does anything of value mean? 486 00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:18,320 Speaker 1: But like, is it political dirt? Is? Like, how do 487 00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:21,280 Speaker 1: you even define political dirt? It's it was an interesting 488 00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:24,320 Speaker 1: exchange with regards to President Trump. ALRT coming up. We're 489 00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:27,080 Speaker 1: gonna stick with politics. We're gonna get you. The latest 490 00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:31,000 Speaker 1: on Kelly Ann Conway was in the news today major early. 491 00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:33,399 Speaker 1: We're gonna get you the Hatch Act and whether or 492 00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:36,240 Speaker 1: not she's in violation of that, and Sarah Sanders will 493 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:38,520 Speaker 1: she run for governor of Arkansas now that she's announced 494 00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:41,320 Speaker 1: that she's resigning from the White House. I'm Kevin CERELLI 495 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:45,200 Speaker 1: Download the sound on podcast on Apple iTunes, at Bloomberg 496 00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:48,240 Speaker 1: dot com, or by downloading the Bloomberg Business app. Check 497 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:51,640 Speaker 1: us out on Radio dot com, I Heart Radio and Spotify. 498 00:27:51,760 --> 00:28:00,160 Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg this is Sound On with dev 499 00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 1: On Bloomberg and HD two Boltemore. It's one of the 500 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:10,280 Speaker 1: greatest jobs I could ever have. I've loved every minute, 501 00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: even the hard minutes, I have loved it. I love 502 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:15,879 Speaker 1: the President, I love the team that I've had the 503 00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:19,240 Speaker 1: opportunity to work for. She's just feeling the love. White 504 00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 1: House Press Secretary Sarah Sanders, who announced earlier this afternoon 505 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:26,760 Speaker 1: that she is resigning from her post after three and 506 00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:30,200 Speaker 1: a half years. President Trump via Twitter urging her to 507 00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:34,399 Speaker 1: run for governor of Arkansas with me in studio, my 508 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:37,919 Speaker 1: good friend and friend of the program. Capri Cafaro, executive 509 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:41,760 Speaker 1: and residents at American University, former Democratic Minority leader in 510 00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:47,080 Speaker 1: the Ohio Senate, a Youngstown, Ohio native. Alright, Capri Valley 511 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:52,080 Speaker 1: will how will history wait? Where the Mahoning Valley? I'm 512 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:54,840 Speaker 1: Trumble County, not youngs I'm not Honing. I'm Tremble, all right, 513 00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:58,120 Speaker 1: I'm don't But what do you think of Sarah Sanders? 514 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:00,040 Speaker 1: Who's gonna get the job? What do you make? I 515 00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:02,040 Speaker 1: have no idea who's going to get the job. But 516 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:04,280 Speaker 1: I mean, I don't. I know there's a lot of 517 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,760 Speaker 1: people reading into her departure. I would say, I would 518 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:11,440 Speaker 1: say this, nobody lasts more than two or so years 519 00:29:11,680 --> 00:29:15,000 Speaker 1: as the White House. Uh, you know, Press secretary. It 520 00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:18,360 Speaker 1: is the biggest it is the worst job in Washington, 521 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:20,240 Speaker 1: and it is the biggest headache, and it is the 522 00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:22,200 Speaker 1: one that has the most turnover. So you know, the 523 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:23,880 Speaker 1: mood she even said. I mean when I was talking 524 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:25,360 Speaker 1: to the Moods the other week, I mean he said 525 00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:27,479 Speaker 1: he lasted like what ten days, right, but he had 526 00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:29,600 Speaker 1: like a weird he wasn't the actual like press secretary. 527 00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:33,440 Speaker 1: He had like a strange title. Um, but either way, 528 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 1: I mean, I have no idea who's going to take 529 00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:37,720 Speaker 1: her spot, but I think that you know, three and 530 00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:40,080 Speaker 1: a half years is a long time in press secretary, 531 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:43,120 Speaker 1: dog years in the White House and more. You know, 532 00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:45,760 Speaker 1: good luck to her and and um, you know, I'm 533 00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:48,640 Speaker 1: sure she had a lot of stories to tell and 534 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:51,400 Speaker 1: has had a front row seat to history. Well that 535 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 1: was okay, all right. I mean, you know, as as 536 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:56,440 Speaker 1: a human being, I have no problem with Sarah Sanders, 537 00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 1: and no people have all kinds of issues with her. 538 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 1: But look, she did her things. She of the job. Listen, 539 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:03,400 Speaker 1: I'm a reporter. I don't give my opinion. I'm a reporter. 540 00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:05,400 Speaker 1: I'm a journalist. No word, I can't stand in this 541 00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:07,960 Speaker 1: industry when you I was a print reporter, as you know, 542 00:30:08,440 --> 00:30:11,000 Speaker 1: and then you you become a TV correspondent or a 543 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:13,719 Speaker 1: radio anchor, which I'm incredibly grateful for, and they all 544 00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,360 Speaker 1: use the word talent. I'm like, no, that's gross. I'm 545 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,680 Speaker 1: a journalist, Like that is what I am. I'm a journalist. 546 00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:24,280 Speaker 1: But I remember as a journalist interviewing Sarah Sanders in 547 00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:27,040 Speaker 1: the in the pre debate spin room and one of 548 00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:30,360 Speaker 1: the debate places were crazy she was. She was just 549 00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:33,520 Speaker 1: had just joined the campaign, and you could tell she 550 00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:38,040 Speaker 1: was even then committed in it too, to the Trump world, 551 00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:40,440 Speaker 1: to the Trump political world for the long haul. And 552 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:44,520 Speaker 1: she has been there really virtually since the beginning of 553 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:47,480 Speaker 1: this uh okay. So that's why I think it's gonna 554 00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:49,440 Speaker 1: be hard to find a replacement for her, because she 555 00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:54,080 Speaker 1: President Trump values loyalty and people that understand him and 556 00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:56,200 Speaker 1: that are willing even the narrations. I mean, you had 557 00:30:56,240 --> 00:30:58,840 Speaker 1: Sean Spicer, who is a state is a staple of 558 00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,600 Speaker 1: Washington and of it in politics, and the reins previous 559 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:06,080 Speaker 1: political apparatus of Washington he kick started at all in 560 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:09,440 Speaker 1: the early days of the administration, when there was press 561 00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:12,240 Speaker 1: confort to his briefings, would his briefings would be carried 562 00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:14,960 Speaker 1: on by every cable network. Then you get the mood 563 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,320 Speaker 1: and then you've got Sarah. So it's been well and 564 00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:20,880 Speaker 1: look they I mean they stopped carrying briefings because briefing 565 00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 1: start stopped happening to So let's not forget that, all right, 566 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:25,640 Speaker 1: and then Kelly and Conway was back in the news. 567 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:29,400 Speaker 1: She's in violation of this this hat chack. So apparently 568 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 1: there's a law that says if you are which is 569 00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:34,320 Speaker 1: at the Hatch Act, that if you are in the 570 00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:38,400 Speaker 1: White House, you cannot talk politics. Well, here's a comment 571 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:41,200 Speaker 1: that she made several months ago that has found her 572 00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:44,040 Speaker 1: in violation, some would say of the hatch Ack. Here's 573 00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:46,800 Speaker 1: a comment that she made. Here it is Doug Jones 574 00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:50,440 Speaker 1: in Alabama. Folks, don't be fooled. He'll be a vote 575 00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:55,320 Speaker 1: against tax cutting. I'm telling you that we want the 576 00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:58,200 Speaker 1: votes in the in the Senate to get this tax 577 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:02,360 Speaker 1: this tax bill through. So the Hatchack says that on 578 00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:04,720 Speaker 1: numerous occasions, that occasion being one of the remember that 579 00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:09,880 Speaker 1: Doug Jones. I had to try to explain that to 580 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:13,040 Speaker 1: international press during that entire mess. Well, the hat chack. 581 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:15,440 Speaker 1: This is what's interesting, because this is very nuanced, and 582 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 1: let's let's focus on it. The hatch Ack says that 583 00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 1: you can't use your job to campaign for or against 584 00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:26,360 Speaker 1: another political candidate. She says like she's shrugging this off 585 00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:29,280 Speaker 1: and and and saying that she's doing her job. I 586 00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:32,320 Speaker 1: don't know if the intent. What do you make of this? UM? 587 00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:35,280 Speaker 1: I think that this is emblematic of how and I 588 00:32:35,360 --> 00:32:37,600 Speaker 1: don't say this as a partisan but but simply as 589 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:40,080 Speaker 1: as my observation, I think this is emblematic about how 590 00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:42,640 Speaker 1: some of the lines are blurred within the Trump administration, 591 00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:45,360 Speaker 1: where you have someone who is, you know, a senior 592 00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:48,680 Speaker 1: advisor like Kelly and Conway, who, in some ways, whether 593 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:53,600 Speaker 1: it's implicit or explicit, UM straddles those those lanes between 594 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,920 Speaker 1: political and official government. And I think when when you 595 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:00,720 Speaker 1: walk that very fine line, things like that are bound 596 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,920 Speaker 1: to happen, whether they were intentional or not. But the law, 597 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:08,240 Speaker 1: you know, is not necessarily going to care about whether 598 00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:11,760 Speaker 1: or not. You know, when the hat check was written. Nine. 599 00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:14,600 Speaker 1: Someone can make the case that back in nine. But 600 00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,560 Speaker 1: they didn't have Twitter and cable news and all of that. 601 00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:19,560 Speaker 1: I mean, it seems a little antiquated. It sounds like 602 00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:21,880 Speaker 1: that's something that maybe the the House Democrats might want 603 00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:25,160 Speaker 1: to pick up. You mentioned democrats. You mentioned Democrats while 604 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,560 Speaker 1: headlines crossing the Bloomberg terminal. Now fresh out of the 605 00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:30,120 Speaker 1: d n C. By the way, Tom peest tomorrow chairman 606 00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:31,760 Speaker 1: of the d n C. I'm gonna interview him. The 607 00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 1: first Democratic debate was announced, and we've got like sixty 608 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:40,000 Speaker 1: seconds left. I can't there's who wasn't announced. Okay, so 609 00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:44,040 Speaker 1: we have the mayor of Mirmar, Florida, U Seth Malton, 610 00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:47,719 Speaker 1: the congressman from Massachusettslton did not make it. He did 611 00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:50,440 Speaker 1: not make it, and the governor of Montana. Those are 612 00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:53,440 Speaker 1: the three bullocks buck. Yes, so those are the three 613 00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:56,680 Speaker 1: out of twenty three that did not make it. And 614 00:33:57,000 --> 00:33:59,840 Speaker 1: there's a whole right, there's a whole list of criter 615 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:01,480 Speaker 1: are you having to do with how much money and 616 00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:03,200 Speaker 1: how and all that sort of thing that you've raised 617 00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:05,800 Speaker 1: to get on the stage. We gotta go. We gotta 618 00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:08,520 Speaker 1: leave it there. But all the big names, Biden, Kamala, Warren, 619 00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:11,560 Speaker 1: they're all in the booker may repeat, all right, thank you, 620 00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:14,840 Speaker 1: Kaprika Farro to make it's really as well as to 621 00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:17,280 Speaker 1: Bill Ferries. That's it for me. You're listening to Bloomberg 622 00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:18,600 Speaker 1: one