1 00:00:10,880 --> 00:00:14,840 Speaker 1: Hey, folks, it is Wednesday, March eleventh, and an execution 2 00:00:15,160 --> 00:00:19,520 Speaker 1: scheduled for tomorrow night has been called off for a 3 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:23,600 Speaker 1: man who has been on death row for thirty five years, 4 00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 1: convicted of murder, but everybody agrees he didn't actually kill anybody. 5 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:33,800 Speaker 1: And with that, welcome to this episode of Amy and TJ. Roabe, 6 00:00:33,800 --> 00:00:36,680 Speaker 1: who should start with just how rare this is a 7 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:39,360 Speaker 1: lot of executions get scheduled. It is rare for we 8 00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:42,600 Speaker 1: have a governor to step in and commute a sentence, 9 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:45,520 Speaker 1: and this governor is in a state not necessarily known 10 00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:46,640 Speaker 1: for commutations. 11 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:51,960 Speaker 2: That is all very true, but this case was exceptional 12 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:57,440 Speaker 2: because you mentioned, Yes, Charles Sunnyburton, by all accounts, never 13 00:00:57,560 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 2: killed anyone. But let's take that even a step further. 14 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 2: He never directed anyone to kill someone. He wasn't even 15 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:10,399 Speaker 2: in this same room where someone was murdered, and the 16 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:15,640 Speaker 2: person who pulled the trigger isn't on death row. All 17 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:20,000 Speaker 2: of that is just kind of head scratching, and it 18 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:22,520 Speaker 2: all rose to a fever pitch this week. 19 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 1: And yes, so what we're talking about here, folks. The 20 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:28,120 Speaker 1: state I was talking about is Alabama. Alabama is known 21 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: for if you will executions, they often do lead or 22 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:33,360 Speaker 1: up there in the top list every year of the 23 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 1: number of executions that they do pull off. And Alabama, 24 00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:38,920 Speaker 1: in fact, just a couple of years ago, led Texas 25 00:01:38,959 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 1: in the number of executions they have in one year. 26 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 1: Just to give you an idea, the governor there has 27 00:01:43,160 --> 00:01:46,400 Speaker 1: only done this twice in her history. This came after 28 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,720 Speaker 1: a significant amount of pressure. Again, Robes the case we're 29 00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 1: talking about here. Charles Burton is the guy's name, But 30 00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:58,080 Speaker 1: this is one of those cases where someone ends up 31 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:02,840 Speaker 1: charged and convicted of murder that didn't actually kill anybody, 32 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 1: but they were a part of a crime that led 33 00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:09,880 Speaker 1: to a murder and Robes. That is the type of 34 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:11,919 Speaker 1: law that sometimes is under scrutiny, but it's on the 35 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:13,600 Speaker 1: books in a lot of places, and this is at 36 00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:14,560 Speaker 1: the heart of this case. 37 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 2: Yes, it's called felony murder, meaning if you were a 38 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 2: part of a crime where a murder happened, it doesn't 39 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:24,120 Speaker 2: matter if you pulled the trigger, it doesn't matter where 40 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 2: you were. If you were a part of a burglary, 41 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:29,720 Speaker 2: a felony so to speak, and someone is murdered, you 42 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:32,400 Speaker 2: are just as culpable according to this law as the 43 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:36,360 Speaker 2: person who actually killed the other person. And this is 44 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 2: on the books. We just checked in forty six states 45 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 2: in this country. Four states have abolished it. Interestingly it 46 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 2: is they are Michigan, Ohio, Kentucky, and Hawaii. Ohio, Michigan, Kentucky, 47 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:53,120 Speaker 2: and Hawaii. Every other state in this country has these 48 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:54,519 Speaker 2: laws on the books. 49 00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:56,480 Speaker 1: And this is what happened to Charles Burton back in 50 00:02:56,600 --> 00:02:59,520 Speaker 1: nineteen ninety one. Look at everybody it acknologists and admits 51 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:02,680 Speaker 1: he was a part of a robbery at an auto zone. 52 00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:05,520 Speaker 1: Six guys going to rob this place. He is one 53 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:07,440 Speaker 1: of the six. He runs in the part of the 54 00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:11,640 Speaker 1: robbery and runs out after robbing the place. His guys, 55 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 1: his boys are all you know, making their way out 56 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:17,400 Speaker 1: of the store, if you will, robbery in progress. After 57 00:03:17,560 --> 00:03:21,920 Speaker 1: he leaves the store and is making his escape, one 58 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:26,520 Speaker 1: of his accomplices shoots and kills a customer. He is 59 00:03:26,639 --> 00:03:29,120 Speaker 1: literally the guy on death row for thirty five years, 60 00:03:29,160 --> 00:03:33,639 Speaker 1: has was literally not even in the building when the 61 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:36,240 Speaker 1: murder took place. The guy who actually did the murder 62 00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 1: ends up getting the death penalty. I have it right. 63 00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:41,520 Speaker 1: He died in prison roads But did they not? They 64 00:03:41,560 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 1: took the death penalty back before he even died. 65 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,640 Speaker 2: Right, his sentence was commuted to life in prison before 66 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 2: he died. Yes, so he was taken off death row. 67 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:53,640 Speaker 2: And turns out Burton was the only member of that 68 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:56,080 Speaker 2: six person team who went in to rob that store 69 00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:58,200 Speaker 2: who actually ended up on death row. 70 00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 1: So let's do for the Claire already there, folks, we 71 00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:03,200 Speaker 1: are talking about a crime in which someone was shot 72 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:07,720 Speaker 1: and killed. The guy who shot and killed the guy, 73 00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 1: his sentence was reduced to life in prison. So why 74 00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:15,560 Speaker 1: is it the guy who did not pull the trigger? 75 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 1: Why would his sentence need to be death? That is 76 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:23,360 Speaker 1: the basic breakdown of even if you're for the death 77 00:04:23,360 --> 00:04:25,919 Speaker 1: penalty robes, that doesn't make sense, correct. 78 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:29,080 Speaker 2: And so, as you mentioned, there was mounting pressure from 79 00:04:29,160 --> 00:04:32,240 Speaker 2: the community there in Alabama, and not just from people 80 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:36,160 Speaker 2: who know Sonny Burton, who loves Sonny Burton. No, it 81 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 2: wasn't just family and friends. This came from the victim's 82 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:42,320 Speaker 2: own daughter. She wrote an op ed which we will 83 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:45,520 Speaker 2: get into. It was very powerful at the end of 84 00:04:45,640 --> 00:04:50,880 Speaker 2: last year, begging, literally begging the governor to not kill 85 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:54,440 Speaker 2: Charles Sonny Burton. She said it would not honor her 86 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:58,599 Speaker 2: father's memory. And so with all of that pressure and 87 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:05,280 Speaker 2: the clock ticking again. Burton's execution was scheduled for Thursday, yesterday, 88 00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:07,919 Speaker 2: and this was surprising, just even that it was so early, 89 00:05:08,040 --> 00:05:10,880 Speaker 2: the timing of it. Usually Governor's wait until the eleventh 90 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:14,479 Speaker 2: hour to the last moment. Governor k Ivy decided to 91 00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 2: come out on Tuesday and commute his sentence. 92 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:20,080 Speaker 1: Well, she knew her answer already. Why wait and why 93 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:21,919 Speaker 1: make him wait? That's me. I don't know if that 94 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:25,520 Speaker 1: played into it, but from a human standpoint, that was 95 00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:29,039 Speaker 1: a little bit of humanity. I would say. She offered 96 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:31,080 Speaker 1: him his family and his supporters. 97 00:05:30,680 --> 00:05:33,960 Speaker 2: And she actually released his statement and it was it 98 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 2: was very telling, and I thought it was very well said, 99 00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:39,120 Speaker 2: and it was certainly appreciated by Sunny Burton. But this 100 00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:42,919 Speaker 2: is what the governor announced yesterday. Doug Battle, that's the 101 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:46,200 Speaker 2: victim in this case. Doug Battle was brutally murdered by 102 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 2: Derreck de Bruce while shopping in an auto parts store, 103 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 2: but de Bruce was ultimately sentenced to life without parole. 104 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 2: Charles Burton did not shoot the victim, did not direct 105 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:59,279 Speaker 2: the triggerman to shoot the victim, and had already left 106 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:01,680 Speaker 2: the store by the time time the shooting occurred, yet 107 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:04,719 Speaker 2: mister Burton was said to be executed while de Bruce 108 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:07,560 Speaker 2: was allowed to live out his life in prison. I 109 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:11,239 Speaker 2: cannot proceed in good conscience with the execution of mister 110 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 2: Burton under such disparate circumstances. I believe it would be 111 00:06:15,600 --> 00:06:19,159 Speaker 2: unjust for one participant in this crime to be executed 112 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 2: while the participant who pulled the trigger was not. 113 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:27,039 Speaker 1: That's simple. I mean, this is almost common sensical, and 114 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:30,760 Speaker 1: I mean it just is. I don't necessarily hear that 115 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 1: much of a drum beat. We have the DA who 116 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:36,160 Speaker 1: didn't agree with it. We'll hear those comments. But brother, 117 00:06:36,320 --> 00:06:41,200 Speaker 1: I mean, generally speaking, don't most level headed, decent folks 118 00:06:41,240 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 1: think that's what should happen. 119 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 2: I can't imagine that somebody, well other than the DA, 120 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:49,480 Speaker 2: which yes, we will get into, would think otherwise. And 121 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:52,360 Speaker 2: to that point, there was a petition on Monday that 122 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 2: folks delivered to the governor with more than sixty thousand 123 00:06:56,720 --> 00:07:00,200 Speaker 2: signatures from the state of Alabama asking for her to 124 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 2: commute his sentence, and they actually even had a demonstration. 125 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 2: They walked from the Governor's mansion to the state capital 126 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 2: about a mile and a half to try and just 127 00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:12,800 Speaker 2: create these images of solidarity to put the pressure on 128 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:16,480 Speaker 2: the governor to do the right thing. And so she did, 129 00:07:16,520 --> 00:07:19,840 Speaker 2: and I actually really loved we got to hear directly 130 00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:22,960 Speaker 2: from Sunny Burton via his attorney, his reaction to the 131 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:27,800 Speaker 2: governor's commutation. He said this to Governor and about Governor Ivy, 132 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:30,000 Speaker 2: she has proven to the people of Alabama and the 133 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:33,840 Speaker 2: world that she is a responsible governor. And I thank her. 134 00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:37,720 Speaker 2: Just saying thank you doesn't seem like much, but it's 135 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:40,040 Speaker 2: what I can give her, and I do thank her. 136 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:41,920 Speaker 2: Thank you. Governor. 137 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:44,960 Speaker 1: Well, there is value still, right, And somebody's like, what 138 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:45,920 Speaker 1: is he seventy five? 139 00:07:46,160 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 2: Seventy five? 140 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:49,920 Speaker 1: All right? So doing that math, he was around forty 141 00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:55,280 Speaker 1: or so when the crime took place. I mean, there 142 00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:58,840 Speaker 1: are people around him. They are family members, and someone 143 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 1: even in that jail, maybe that he's having an impression 144 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:07,200 Speaker 1: his life is worth something to somebody. And I know 145 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:10,640 Speaker 1: he's being punished for his crime. And it's one of 146 00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:12,679 Speaker 1: these weird stories. We cover a lot of these death 147 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:18,120 Speaker 1: totally stories, and some of them have excuse me, robes. 148 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:20,920 Speaker 1: It seems like almost the majority of have some kinds 149 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:24,400 Speaker 1: of extenuating circumstance that makes you when you take it 150 00:08:24,440 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 1: all into context, it's not just guilt or innocence, death 151 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:31,360 Speaker 1: or life. There's so much. Just like this case, Babe, 152 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 1: if you convicted murderer for a robbery that resulted in 153 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:38,800 Speaker 1: a death, he sounds like the worst dude ever. But 154 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:42,240 Speaker 1: in that group, sweetheart, he didn't go in there trying 155 00:08:42,280 --> 00:08:43,160 Speaker 1: to kill somebody. 156 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:46,199 Speaker 2: No, and he's I mean, there are lots of folks 157 00:08:46,200 --> 00:08:49,679 Speaker 2: who are around that time who said he actually was like, 158 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:51,840 Speaker 2: no one gets hurt, no one gets hurt. He was 159 00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 2: not a violent person. So yes, when we cover these cases, 160 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:58,160 Speaker 2: a lot of times we're not oftentimes talking about these 161 00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:03,120 Speaker 2: premeditated evil and yes, that is sometimes what we see 162 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:05,440 Speaker 2: in death row cases, but a lot of times it 163 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:11,199 Speaker 2: is these stupid mistakes that people make when they're committing 164 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:13,880 Speaker 2: another crime. Someone dies, not that you shouldn't have to 165 00:09:13,920 --> 00:09:17,320 Speaker 2: pay for it, but you start to actually examine what 166 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 2: happened leading up to the murders, and oftentimes it's not 167 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:23,520 Speaker 2: what you would imagine in a death penalty case. 168 00:09:23,720 --> 00:09:27,960 Speaker 1: It's what the law says is allowed. But is that 169 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:31,160 Speaker 1: what it should be? I don't know. 170 00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:33,600 Speaker 2: It was interesting to hear from the DA, because you 171 00:09:33,679 --> 00:09:37,960 Speaker 2: heard the governor's words, you heard directly from sunny Burton, 172 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:40,160 Speaker 2: and you will hear from the victim's daughter here. But 173 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:43,760 Speaker 2: the DA was perhaps the one person who just he 174 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:44,280 Speaker 2: dug in. 175 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 1: He We always see this they sometimes when evidence is 176 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 1: presented of someone's innocence, the DA will still stand by 177 00:09:54,920 --> 00:09:57,040 Speaker 1: and the police will still stand by because they don't 178 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 1: want their work being questioned. And this is just this 179 00:10:00,320 --> 00:10:01,000 Speaker 1: is all this is. 180 00:10:01,240 --> 00:10:04,439 Speaker 2: Yeah, So this is what the DA had to say 181 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 2: following the Governor's decision. There has never been any doubt 182 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:11,440 Speaker 2: that sunny Burton has Douglas Battles blood on his hands. 183 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:15,760 Speaker 2: Burton does not deserve special treatment because he is old. 184 00:10:15,840 --> 00:10:18,880 Speaker 2: He could have been executed a long time ago, but 185 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 2: like many Death Row inmates, he chose to drag out 186 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:27,280 Speaker 2: his case through endless, frivolous appeals. I firmly believe that 187 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:29,760 Speaker 2: he should have faced the punishment imposed by a jury 188 00:10:29,800 --> 00:10:35,520 Speaker 2: of his peers and upheld by numerous judges. Damn, I 189 00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:36,000 Speaker 2: don't know. 190 00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:41,319 Speaker 1: All that cases it's been upheld, all that stuff, does 191 00:10:41,520 --> 00:10:45,120 Speaker 1: it is true? But wow, we applied a little decency 192 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:47,200 Speaker 1: into our justice system. I'm okay with that. 193 00:10:47,960 --> 00:10:50,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think he was implying that somehow the 194 00:10:50,280 --> 00:10:54,800 Speaker 2: reason why Burton was being or his death sentence was 195 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:57,240 Speaker 2: being commuted to life in prison was because he is old. 196 00:10:57,320 --> 00:10:59,640 Speaker 2: That's not the case at all at all, and so he, 197 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 2: I think was conflating. He was trying to act as 198 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:05,079 Speaker 2: if that was the reason why the governor made her decision, 199 00:11:05,120 --> 00:11:06,120 Speaker 2: and clearly it was not. 200 00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:08,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, he's getting special treatment. 201 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:11,840 Speaker 2: Okay, all right, when we come back, this will leave 202 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 2: you with, I think, just some hope and some recognition 203 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:20,280 Speaker 2: that there is beauty and decency in this world. We're 204 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 2: going to read you some of the most powerful excerpts 205 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 2: from the op ed that Doug Battle's daughter wrote to 206 00:11:26,400 --> 00:11:39,320 Speaker 2: the governor. Welcome back, everyone to this episode of Amy 207 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:42,520 Speaker 2: and TJ, where we are talking about a really remarkable 208 00:11:42,600 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 2: situation that happened in the state of Alabama. You don't 209 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:49,600 Speaker 2: see this every day, but Charles Sunny Burton on death 210 00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 2: row his sentence was commuted by Governor k Ivy after 211 00:11:54,280 --> 00:11:57,319 Speaker 2: taking a look at the situation. There had been a drumbeat, 212 00:11:57,320 --> 00:11:59,839 Speaker 2: a groundswell of support for Burton because when you look 213 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:03,920 Speaker 2: the facts of the case, this was someone was murdered 214 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:05,920 Speaker 2: in the commission of a burglary that he was a 215 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 2: part of. He was not the person who pulled the trigger. 216 00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:11,640 Speaker 2: In fact, he wasn't even in the building when his 217 00:12:11,840 --> 00:12:15,400 Speaker 2: cohort shot Doug Battle in the back of customer who 218 00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:17,960 Speaker 2: was lying on the ground in the middle of this robbery. 219 00:12:18,440 --> 00:12:21,840 Speaker 2: And the man who pulled the trigger got a life sentence. 220 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:25,080 Speaker 2: His death sentence was commuted to life in prison. In fact, 221 00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:29,400 Speaker 2: no one was executed for the murder except for Burton, 222 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:34,520 Speaker 2: who was scheduled to die by nitrogen gas tomorrow. The 223 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 2: governor stepped in and made a decision to commute his 224 00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:42,360 Speaker 2: sentence to life in prison. This all came after an 225 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:45,440 Speaker 2: op ed from Doug Battle's daughter. She wrote this at 226 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:50,600 Speaker 2: the end of last year. Actually, and it's a powerful letter. 227 00:12:50,640 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 2: We've seen letters like this be written, and they're not 228 00:12:53,920 --> 00:12:57,600 Speaker 2: always considered. We've certainly seen that in other cases. 229 00:12:58,280 --> 00:13:00,800 Speaker 1: And don't know for sure if the governor read it 230 00:13:00,880 --> 00:13:03,160 Speaker 1: or considered it, but it probably made. 231 00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:08,559 Speaker 2: Its way, yes, and her title was powerful just from 232 00:13:08,559 --> 00:13:12,040 Speaker 2: the start. My father was murdered, Alabama is about to 233 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:15,960 Speaker 2: execute the wrong man. She goes on to say, today, 234 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:19,240 Speaker 2: mister Burden is seventy five years old, wheelchair bound, and 235 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:23,280 Speaker 2: in poor health, suffering from severe rheumatoid arthritis. He is 236 00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:26,800 Speaker 2: frail and poses no threat, yet Alabama plans to execute 237 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:31,160 Speaker 2: him using nitrogen hypoxia, an untested execution method that would 238 00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:34,880 Speaker 2: cause him to suffocate while conscious. It's interesting. She goes 239 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 2: on to say when she was a child, she was nine, 240 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 2: by the way, when her father was murdered, she wanted 241 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:42,240 Speaker 2: to see these men die, but that changed as she 242 00:13:42,280 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 2: got older. 243 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:49,679 Speaker 1: And Yeah, if justice had been I guess rendered immediately, 244 00:13:50,400 --> 00:13:52,960 Speaker 1: we never would have had thirty five years of people 245 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:55,160 Speaker 1: to grow up, to come around, to understand the case 246 00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:57,960 Speaker 1: a little differently, understand the law a little differently, and 247 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:00,200 Speaker 1: maybe just to soften their hearts. I don't know. Is 248 00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:02,520 Speaker 1: the time good for justice or bad for justice? Depends 249 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:03,480 Speaker 1: on which side. 250 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:06,199 Speaker 2: That's a really, really good point. It's so interesting how 251 00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:09,560 Speaker 2: what you think about something or how you feel about 252 00:14:09,559 --> 00:14:14,400 Speaker 2: a situation can drastically change over time. And we have 253 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:17,200 Speaker 2: seen this, we have talked about this, and she expresses 254 00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:20,200 Speaker 2: this in this letter. How frustrated she was because she 255 00:14:20,320 --> 00:14:23,080 Speaker 2: said she was told by the Attorney General's office that 256 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:26,720 Speaker 2: she had no say, no say in what happened. And 257 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:30,280 Speaker 2: we've seen that with victim's families not having any say 258 00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:31,520 Speaker 2: in the punishment. 259 00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:33,800 Speaker 1: I don't know if she did this time at all, 260 00:14:33,840 --> 00:14:35,920 Speaker 1: but I will continue to be an advocate for that 261 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 1: law when the death penalty is on the table. When 262 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 1: the death penalty is imposed, I guess by a jury, 263 00:14:42,640 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 1: I think yes. The family of the victim should be 264 00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 1: the one to ultimately say no. I shouldn't be able 265 00:14:48,720 --> 00:14:51,400 Speaker 1: to say yes, I want somebody killed, but you should 266 00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:53,240 Speaker 1: be able to say no. And this is one of 267 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 1: those these folks should be listened to. 268 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:59,240 Speaker 2: Yes like almost in a sense, giving the victim's family 269 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 2: veto power to a death sentence. She said, I am 270 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 2: a victim's family member. My voice should matter. Her final 271 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:08,760 Speaker 2: paragraph was the one that I hope will leave everybody 272 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:11,840 Speaker 2: with a yes, a hopeful feeling. My love for my 273 00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:16,680 Speaker 2: father does not require another death, especially one that defies reason. 274 00:15:17,160 --> 00:15:21,400 Speaker 2: Mercy does not dishonor him. It honors the values he 275 00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 2: taught me. I ask Governor k Ivy to review this 276 00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 2: case and commute Charles Burton's sentence. If she cannot, I 277 00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 2: ask her to do something this state has never done. 278 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:36,640 Speaker 2: Explain honestly and directly why Alabama believes this execution is necessary. 279 00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 2: I have been waiting for answers since I was nine 280 00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 2: years old, and just writing that ap ed in the 281 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:49,440 Speaker 2: paper reached Burton and he reacted to it, saying, she 282 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:51,000 Speaker 2: forgave me. And I want to say how much I 283 00:15:51,040 --> 00:15:54,920 Speaker 2: appreciated that she lifts a whole lot of guilt off 284 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 2: of me. It has been remarkable to see victims families 285 00:15:57,760 --> 00:15:59,320 Speaker 2: offer grace. 286 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:03,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, because they need peace, and that's usually what comes 287 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:07,040 Speaker 1: out of it. What does it serve? Whose memory? Does 288 00:16:07,080 --> 00:16:10,480 Speaker 1: it serve to kill somebody else? Ever, and again, people 289 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,280 Speaker 1: think justice, and I know there are death penalty advocates 290 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:15,920 Speaker 1: out there, but she the most important word there. And 291 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,560 Speaker 1: when we don't hear a live man is mercy. Why 292 00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:21,080 Speaker 1: do we not get out of our heads that mercy 293 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:24,240 Speaker 1: can be a sign of strength for whatever reason, if 294 00:16:24,280 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 1: you show mercy, you're a weakling. Even week on crime 295 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:32,160 Speaker 1: folks will get accused of It's okay, It's an incredible 296 00:16:32,200 --> 00:16:35,840 Speaker 1: strength to give someone mercy who has certainly someone who's 297 00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:40,760 Speaker 1: harmed you God forever, altered her life and she can 298 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:43,160 Speaker 1: show mercy. Come on, y'all, that's remarkable. 299 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 2: And look, it's it's not as if he's walking out 300 00:16:46,280 --> 00:16:49,000 Speaker 2: of prison. He will continue to serve the rest of 301 00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:52,320 Speaker 2: his life behind bars. He does being punished. Yeah, he's 302 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:54,960 Speaker 2: going to die there for the crime. Yes, he's just 303 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:59,600 Speaker 2: not going to die by nitrogen gas tomorrow, which. 304 00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 1: Is Alabama's new thing. First state to ever start using that. 305 00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 1: I think their past six or seven executions have been 306 00:17:05,280 --> 00:17:07,320 Speaker 1: with this nitrogen gas. And quite frankly, we have heard 307 00:17:07,359 --> 00:17:10,360 Speaker 1: some ugly reports out of what happens when people are 308 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:12,760 Speaker 1: executed with this stuff, but they continue to use it. 309 00:17:13,440 --> 00:17:17,400 Speaker 1: But it is not happening tomorrow, this one at least. Meanwhile, 310 00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:21,480 Speaker 1: there's another one scheduled for tomorrow in Texas, I do believe, 311 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: and then another two scheduled for this month in Florida. 312 00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:30,640 Speaker 1: So there are more on the way robes, and more 313 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:32,520 Speaker 1: will be added to the roles. And I'm sure, just 314 00:17:32,560 --> 00:17:35,320 Speaker 1: like last year, De Santo's down there, he signed any 315 00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:36,760 Speaker 1: death warrant they put in front of them. 316 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:39,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, he is trying to get the more than two 317 00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 2: hundred and fifty people I believe on death row. He's 318 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:44,359 Speaker 2: trying to bring those numbers down and he's certainly going 319 00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:46,320 Speaker 2: at it. So, yes, there already will be how many 320 00:17:46,520 --> 00:17:48,280 Speaker 2: I guess it was three last month, and he's already 321 00:17:48,280 --> 00:17:50,760 Speaker 2: got two more this month. So we'll of course continue 322 00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:54,120 Speaker 2: to follow all of the developments, but this was this 323 00:17:54,320 --> 00:17:56,160 Speaker 2: was a moment that was worth noting and we hope 324 00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:58,040 Speaker 2: you got something out of it. Thank you for listening 325 00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:01,320 Speaker 2: to us. As always, I mean me Robot alongside TJ. Holmes. 326 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:03,600 Speaker 2: We will have Morning run up for you very soon, 327 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:04,919 Speaker 2: so watch out for that.