Speaker 1: Amy and TJ present Aubrey O'Day covering the Didy trial. Okay,
Speaker 1: so hey guys, we are back.
Speaker 2: We are now in the home stretch.
Speaker 1: Officially, the government has rested and the defense has rested.
Speaker 1: But let me first introduce my guest, Elizabeth wad My
Speaker 1: search is my favorite journalist of all time, the most
Speaker 1: epic ever. Elizabeth was the one that obtained the video
Speaker 1: of Cassie being horrifically beat in the hallway and was
Speaker 1: able to bring it to the forefront and start to
Speaker 1: the really big discussion that has become this trial of
Speaker 1: Diddy and his behavior. That video was for me, I'll
Speaker 1: just speak from on my own end. That was the
Speaker 1: first time anyone on the victim side got to breathe.
Speaker 2: A lot of loss, A lot of.
Speaker 1: Things were going on during that time. That video was
Speaker 1: the very first thing that I noticed. A majority of
Speaker 1: my cell phone was like, oh my God, like I
Speaker 1: can take a breath. A majority of people that write
Speaker 1: me they felt like maybe people will believe them a
Speaker 1: little bit, and it was the first time they had
Speaker 1: ever gotten the chance to feel that in their life.
Speaker 2: What's so interesting about that? And you know, I'm hearing
Speaker 2: you speak from your perspective and the perspective of other
Speaker 2: people that you had been in touch with. But what's
Speaker 2: so interesting, and this feels like such a long time ago,
Speaker 2: because now we're at the tail end of the trial,
Speaker 2: But remember that when our team at CNN, when we
Speaker 2: broke that footage, Remember that Sean Holmes had denied everything
Speaker 2: in Cassy's lawsuits. Before that, he released a statement denying
Speaker 2: the quaims. Now, he did not get into the specifics,
Speaker 2: but when her lossuit came out, he said that it
Speaker 2: was entirely untrue. That's not a quote I'm paraphrasing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess him paying her off within twenty four
Speaker 1: hours kind of killed that for all of us in
Speaker 1: the streets.
Speaker 2: But here's what was so interesting. But I'm glad you
Speaker 2: brought up that there was a settlement because you remember
Speaker 2: that his attorney at the time, he's no longer representing him,
Speaker 2: So he's a statement to the media at that point
Speaker 2: saying that a settlement is in no way in an
Speaker 2: admission of guilt. And then what do you know, we
Speaker 2: released this video, which is obviously horrific and every which way. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and it wasn't until then that we got the apologies.
Speaker 1: Well, here's what's crazy too. Were you not tripping when
Speaker 1: you were in court? Because another thing for everyone listening,
Speaker 1: she's in court every day, So this is my first
Speaker 1: chance to really get to speak with someone that is.
Speaker 1: Of course I speak to people inside the courtroom every
Speaker 1: day all day, but for my audience, this is the
Speaker 1: first time we're getting in a true insider's perspective of
Speaker 1: the room. So I wanted, I do want to spend
Speaker 1: a lot of our time asking you about the way
Speaker 1: that things are looking.
Speaker 2: I didn't realize that. I also, yeah, it's that I
Speaker 2: was your first guest who's inside the koorom.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean, I mean, you know a lot
Speaker 1: of journalists that come forward or that talk about this
Speaker 1: are not sitting there like you are, watching every single thing.
Speaker 1: Like even for your own company, you'll go in and
Speaker 1: do reports on scene or you see reports on scene
Speaker 1: when you watch any any news company. But to sit
Speaker 1: down and like have a heart to heart with somebody
Speaker 1: that's truly observing everything, it really does open your perspective
Speaker 1: much wider. So tell me what it looked like for
Speaker 1: him to stand up. I heard he's skinnier than normal.
Speaker 1: There's reports about gray gums. I don't know what that
Speaker 1: means or doesn't mean. My people have been telling me
Speaker 1: different things, the hair being very gray.
Speaker 2: Let's got a haircut this week.
Speaker 1: By the way, Oh, there was a haircut this week.
Speaker 2: There was a haircut this week.
Speaker 1: Maybe that helps with the energy, because today's energy in
Speaker 1: writing came like a bullet through my heart with the
Speaker 1: I'm great, thank you so much. Judge, you're doing a
Speaker 1: great job. Are you in charge of the whole jury
Speaker 1: and room? And are you congratulating the judge on doing
Speaker 1: a great job.
Speaker 2: Well, the first thing is that's really important. The jury
Speaker 2: was not present for.
Speaker 1: That, so the jury didn't even get to hear him
Speaker 1: say I'm choosing not to testify.
Speaker 2: No, why the jury was on the lunch brace. And
Speaker 2: then that is when, as you said, with this rule
Speaker 2: twenty nine, that his defense filed the motion for acquittal,
Speaker 2: they are asking the judge to say that he's not
Speaker 2: guilty on all five charges. That happens not in the
Speaker 2: presence of the jury. And then, as you said, the
Speaker 2: judge didn't make a decision. So the judge basically that
Speaker 2: I'm not going to rule on this right now.
Speaker 1: But in ninety nine percent of the times. Judges never
Speaker 1: roll on Rule twenty nine motions. They want to leave
Speaker 1: it up to the jury. I highly doubt it's going
Speaker 1: to happen here.
Speaker 2: Oh no, it would be. It would be the biggest shocked.
Speaker 2: It would be the biggest shot and they either way.
Speaker 1: I wanted to say to tell me exactly how it looks,
Speaker 1: but also I wanted to say to you before I
Speaker 1: forget to analyze this when you come back with your response.
Speaker 1: It felt scary, like a freight train, like a bullet
Speaker 1: through my heart. But then when I sat with it
Speaker 1: for a second, I thought, if I'm a judge and
Speaker 1: you feel mighty as a judge, you go through a
Speaker 1: whole lot of schooling, a whole lot of test taking,
Speaker 1: a whole lot of mastering in order.
Speaker 2: To get that position.
Speaker 1: To have somebody who you've had to watch and freak
Speaker 1: off and watch women testify all kinds of different things,
Speaker 1: to have to watch that with a straight face, and
Speaker 1: then have that same man first words over you be, Hey,
Speaker 1: great job, You're doing a good job, Bud. I would
Speaker 1: go home and feel some kind of way about that
Speaker 1: type of arrogance. Did he proceed it with arrogance? Was
Speaker 1: there any of that in his facial look.
Speaker 2: So here's what I'll tell you this judge. I've covered
Speaker 2: a lot of trials. This judge incredibly fair and he
Speaker 2: has complete control over the courtroom. He has control. He's
Speaker 2: very very conscious he has control over both parties. So
Speaker 2: he kind of chuckled when he said, you know, thank
Speaker 2: you to him.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: But you wouldn't be able to tell if he found
Speaker 2: it arrogant or if he found it endearing. But all
Speaker 2: that I have to tell you is this is a drug.
Speaker 2: As all judges should be with this.
Speaker 1: How long was the chuckle, Elizabeth?
Speaker 2: Oh, it was quick, Like this was a comment of
Speaker 2: like okay, moving on. You know, like he responded to
Speaker 2: be polite because of a human you have to respond
Speaker 2: to someone.
Speaker 1: Now, he definitely felt the narcissism on it. It's off putting.
Speaker 1: I feel like that's a stumble of off put that's
Speaker 1: not like a wow. I feel so lucky that the
Speaker 1: guy that was just in that video pissing all over
Speaker 1: people is telling me I did a great job.
Speaker 2: Well. Remember this is also the judge who remember when
Speaker 2: Diddy was trying to be released on bail as he
Speaker 2: was awaiting up three times three times that this is
Speaker 2: a judge. That's the third time he would not release
Speaker 2: them on bail because he agreed with executor that Diddy
Speaker 2: was a danger to society. So I think this judge
Speaker 2: is very focused on the facts, very focused on the evidence.
Speaker 2: The testimony. Something like a polite comments is not going anywhere.
Speaker 2: It's not the Dudeen's decision.
Speaker 1: Well, what's crazy is is like it's almost I know,
Speaker 1: you know as well as I mastered as a student
Speaker 1: of people, I would say I do that better than
Speaker 1: singing as a student of people. I watched ditty for
Speaker 1: many years. People are going to look at it like, oh,
Speaker 1: he's so arrogant. He thinks he run things like how
Speaker 1: I said, Wow, King Knight, you're in charge of the room.
Speaker 1: He must just never be able to get out of
Speaker 1: that mind state if he's the boss. It's in there.
Speaker 1: But I read it as a tell in a negative way.
Speaker 1: I read it as a tell a little bit. And
Speaker 1: I really need your help tomorrow. I need you to
Speaker 1: give my attorneys a little bit of the doak when
Speaker 1: they come at you with how we're wording some of
Speaker 1: these things.
Speaker 2: Well, look, I mean this is it's.
Speaker 1: Going to come down to how they word things. This
Speaker 1: trial is not a slam dunk, unfortunately, and a lot
Speaker 1: of people are confused by that. A lot of victims
Speaker 1: are pissed off by that. But it's just not a
Speaker 1: slam dunk, unfortunately, it's not.
Speaker 2: It's not at all. And look, sex crimes are incredibly
Speaker 2: difficult to prosecute. It is a staggering small percentage of
Speaker 2: how many sex crimes are even prosecuted. So the fact
Speaker 2: that this is even in a courtroom is really unbelievable.
Speaker 1: Truly, if I take my emotions off of it, it's
Speaker 1: just coming down to consent. And here's what I'm finding.
Speaker 1: In a lot of the things that were submitted by
Speaker 1: the defense. There was a lot of in writing proof
Speaker 1: that Sean was paying for the escorts.
Speaker 2: There was and.
Speaker 1: Actually, so when we talk about that, yeah, but you
Speaker 1: just really hurt you you guys. DI stumbled a little bit.
Speaker 1: The prosecution had a point where they came in and
Speaker 1: were like, wait, so did you just say that he
Speaker 1: paid you to transport somebody over across lines to commit.
Speaker 2: What Today's I thought that right, So let me tell
Speaker 2: you exactly how that went down, because you know those
Speaker 2: five charges, those racketeering sex, trafficking and transportation to engage
Speaker 2: in prostitution. So this summary witness who's been on was
Speaker 2: on the witness stand for three days, the prosecution's final witness,
Speaker 2: as you know, and I won't bore you with this.
Speaker 2: So basically he went through charts and charts and charts
Speaker 2: and charts, and in the courtroom it's actually really boring.
Speaker 2: But here people are falling asleep. But here's the thing.
Speaker 2: It actually can prove to be one of the most
Speaker 2: crucial witnesses because he is may be boring to listen to,
Speaker 2: but this witness presented evidence. And now where's that evidence
Speaker 2: going into the hands of the jury when they're in
Speaker 2: the deliberation room. So when we see that there's thousands
Speaker 2: of pages of phone records, hotel records, flight records, text messages,
Speaker 2: big state, and those flight records are showing that male escort,
Speaker 2: you know, number one whatever, you know.
Speaker 1: Couple flown from here to there and here to there.
Speaker 2: So the moment that you're talking about, which I would
Speaker 2: say for the prosecution.
Speaker 1: Already woke everyone up.
Speaker 2: It was a nice drop moment. So on read direct.
Speaker 2: Of course, the prosecution goes first. Then cross examination was
Speaker 2: a day and a half. And then the prosecutor Marine Comy.
Speaker 2: She gets up there, and this is not an exact quote,
Speaker 2: but she looks at the witness and she said, the
Speaker 2: exhibits that you showed, what wasn't that proof of traveling
Speaker 2: Cabral across state lines? And then you hear objection and
Speaker 2: then adjections the same, and then she asked it in
Speaker 2: another way, and then objection sustained, and then she finally said,
Speaker 2: didn't Cabral fly from Atlanta to Miami on a flight
Speaker 2: paid by mister? And they said yes, yes. What is
Speaker 2: so strategic and smart of both When the prosecution and
Speaker 2: the defense does this, they ask questions that they know
Speaker 2: there's going to be an objection to. They know it
Speaker 2: will be sustained. It will not be in the testimony,
Speaker 2: meaning when the jury's deliberating, they're not looking at that.
Speaker 1: But they don't forget it. You don't ever forget it.
Speaker 2: There's a praise in courtrooms which is you can't hund
Speaker 2: ring that bell.
Speaker 1: By the way, a lot of court cases are just
Speaker 1: decided by that little tiny word. You just so that
Speaker 1: little tiny pocket. If you were to be looking at
Speaker 1: a pie chart, it's like a little sliver of terry pie.
Speaker 1: But really it's where a trial's guts are.
Speaker 2: Exactly.
Speaker 1: It's been those objections that are not going to be
Speaker 1: put on record, but you still heard as a jerky
Speaker 1: xactly right now. I'm still the genius at that. Actually,
Speaker 1: all A Diddy's team has been killing that this entire trial.
Speaker 1: They've been doing a great.
Speaker 2: Job at that.
Speaker 1: What you're seeing in a lot of the writing are
Speaker 1: moments of content, But what you're hearing on the stand
Speaker 1: is that moment of consent. Is this is actually where
Speaker 1: I was and how I felt when I wrote this message.
Speaker 1: That looks damning if you were to see the message
Speaker 1: in black and white, but when you had the person
Speaker 1: on the stand saying when I said, oh, I wanted
Speaker 1: be extra dirty this time, in my head, I was
Speaker 1: in my room knowing that he was with the other
Speaker 1: girl and that he loved me when I did this,
Speaker 1: and then he was going to leave me or go
Speaker 1: off with this other person, or that he wouldn't even
Speaker 1: spend time with me this week, and I would feel
Speaker 1: like low self worth, no value as a person. My
Speaker 1: whole life, my identity was attached to him. I couldn't
Speaker 1: even literally drive a car or leave a house without
Speaker 1: being reported on. And I wanted his attention, and so
Speaker 1: I offered him up some free pictures or sex talk
Speaker 1: or chat in order to engage him. Because he showed
Speaker 1: these women exactly what their value was enough times to
Speaker 1: know what it is they have to do in order
Speaker 1: to be exciting to them. And when he loses interest,
Speaker 1: which basicly is coercion, that's what music industry coersion looks like.
Speaker 1: Baby girl, let me tell you what this is, that
Speaker 1: baby girl line of his. Oh man, we all know
Speaker 1: it so well, baby girl, this is what it is.
Speaker 1: This is how your body needs to look, and this
Speaker 1: is how you need to be if you want my attention.
Speaker 1: This is what you need to do, if you want
Speaker 1: a platinum album, This is what you need to do
Speaker 1: if you want to have Daddy's money and attention. It's
Speaker 1: all coercion in one way or another. It's somebody very
Speaker 1: powerful against people that are so don't even understand the
Speaker 1: power system.
Speaker 2: Then you know, this is exactly why the prosecution has
Speaker 2: spent so much time on baby oil, baby oil, baby oil,
Speaker 2: hotel rooms, hotel rooms, you know all these things. And
Speaker 2: I obviously follow all the commentary on TikTok on social
Speaker 2: media everywhere, and a lot of people are saying, we
Speaker 2: get it. He has the freak coups like why do
Speaker 2: you keep bringing this up? But you bring up a
Speaker 2: really smart point because if juror believes that this pattern,
Speaker 2: when you have done this to multiple women, even if
Speaker 2: the girlfriend's consensual girlfriends, if this is the behavior that
Speaker 2: you expect from these women, and it may not seem
Speaker 2: normal to a lot of these jurors, then they may
Speaker 2: think exactly what you're saying, Audrey, which is wow, that
Speaker 2: does feel like coercion. And even if these women in
Speaker 2: text and in person agreed to it seem willing. I
Speaker 2: keep saying throughout this trial, this is going to come
Speaker 2: down to does the jury believe what they see in
Speaker 2: evidence or do they believe what they've heard. And that's
Speaker 2: why these things are so hard to prove because it
Speaker 2: can be very, very confusing and complex.
Speaker 1: Cassie and Jane. For me, I mean, I know them both,
Speaker 1: I've been around them both. I've seen how both operate
Speaker 1: and maneuver. Two different, totally different human beings, two totally
Speaker 1: different women. I know what the jurors are seeing because
Speaker 1: I know who these people are. I know how they ask,
Speaker 1: I know what their mannerisms are. I've studied them. I've
Speaker 1: been around them enough to understand them. I know how
Speaker 1: they come up. I don't know how they came up
Speaker 1: in the room. But you, as somebody who is an
Speaker 1: observer who didn't know them in a prior life and
Speaker 1: was just observing them during this trial, if you're a
Speaker 1: person in the jury or by standard, in the room
Speaker 1: in general, were you able to see that these two
Speaker 1: girls may have different intentions when they operate.
Speaker 2: These are two completely different women.
Speaker 1: And it was clear to you you wouldn't get them
Speaker 1: mixed up, even if you were a man who doesn't
Speaker 1: think about women and that many diverse categories potentially, I
Speaker 1: believe this as.
Speaker 2: Clear as day, that these are very different women. Now
Speaker 2: is a crossover, yes, if you are maybe a more
Speaker 2: you know, adjur with more conservative beliefs. And I'm not
Speaker 2: saying that politically, I mean like conservative meaning that you
Speaker 2: would never go to a sex party and that everything
Speaker 2: you're hearing is disgusting to you. They may say, then,
Speaker 2: quite frankly, sorry, I'm going on to hand it out
Speaker 2: something that I have been thinking of, knowing these jury
Speaker 2: behaviors and how they deliberate. There can be a fair
Speaker 2: amount of floodshaming from these jurors on these women.
Speaker 1: Because I want to be honest with you, I'm doing
Speaker 1: it at home. I'm just going to straight up say
Speaker 1: it as a woman. I don't believe in it. I
Speaker 1: don't like it. I stand against it. I absolutely despise
Speaker 1: any thoughts like that, and I want to be honest.
Speaker 1: I've had thoughts like that during this trial. I don't
Speaker 1: go and broadcast them. I have personal friends that i'll
Speaker 1: express them to that I know will hold that discretion
Speaker 1: for me to be able to get something out of
Speaker 1: my body that is necessary for me to be able
Speaker 1: to keep my bias in check. All the way up
Speaker 1: until the first person got on the stand. I judged
Speaker 1: that person too many times. And I am the first
Speaker 1: celebrity that came forward and took up for her.
Speaker 2: I don't even know how many.
Speaker 1: Did after me.
Speaker 2: Frankly, not many.
Speaker 1: When I was the first person to come in this
Speaker 1: industry and say I back, Cassie you.
Speaker 2: Were I remember I was on air and I saw
Speaker 2: what you wrote, and I read it on air.
Speaker 1: I read so and I had moments where I had
Speaker 1: to where I really had to like make sure I
Speaker 1: was standing on ten toes because there were things I saw.
Speaker 1: There were willing days, and I was sitting all the
Speaker 1: way up to her taking the stand, like, man, oh man,
Speaker 1: I hope she is honest, and I hope it is
Speaker 1: what I thought it was when I saw it. You know,
Speaker 1: this is somebody that was so naive, was so young,
Speaker 1: was so unaware of so many things, and got swept
Speaker 1: into this world that is like is like Disneyland on
Speaker 1: crack and the minute hands.
Speaker 2: You crack, right, Okay, So Ashley, this is the difference.
Speaker 2: This is the main difference between Cassie in Vaine and
Speaker 2: if this is from my observation in the courtroom and
Speaker 2: if I'm a jur this is what I'm thinking. The
Speaker 2: main difference is Caffi was nineteen years old, she was
Speaker 2: signed a bad boy, She was given a ten record deal,
Speaker 2: which is not something that exists, and then suddenly she's
Speaker 2: on the label. She comes out with this huge hit
Speaker 2: which only he can control, and then she's his girlfriend. Jane,
Speaker 2: on the other hand, was not nineteen. She was a
Speaker 2: grown woman later in life, and she was a girlfriend.
Speaker 2: She says she was a girlfriend so whatever you want
Speaker 2: to call it, she was not a musician. She was
Speaker 2: not on his label, her career was not in his hand.
Speaker 2: She testified to that he was pursuing her and she
Speaker 2: was pursuing him. So very different women in very different stories.
Speaker 2: And that's why, you know, after Jane's testimony, a lot
Speaker 2: of our legal analysts on CNN we're saying, why was
Speaker 2: the prosecutors called Jane she has now damaged Cassie's testimony?
Speaker 1: What were their responses to that? Because I felt like
Speaker 1: they first thought about like she was on longer than Cassie.
Speaker 2: I don't know if she was that. It felt like
Speaker 2: Cassie was four days and Jane was six days.
Speaker 1: Yeah, why didn't need six days of her?
Speaker 2: Number one?
Speaker 1: Number two? Once she started getting past a certain point,
Speaker 1: I was wondering, like, why are we continuing this? Like
Speaker 1: it's starting to bleed into Cassie. I was feeling it's
Speaker 1: starting to take over Cassie and Cassie's She got done,
Speaker 1: and I was like, I am so glad that I
Speaker 1: stood by her. She told the truth, He told the
Speaker 1: hard truths. She told the days where she wanted things right.
Speaker 1: I gleed to things she was transparent about who she
Speaker 1: was and able to identify who that first person was.
Speaker 1: And she's been able to grow enough to be able
Speaker 1: to reflect on that, and I felt all of it
Speaker 1: was like it all felt like it felt like it
Speaker 1: sat right in my heart. In regards to defending it.
Speaker 2: Being in the courtroom, it really resonated.
Speaker 1: Now did Jane resonate with the jury?
Speaker 2: I think Jane is so complex because she's sitting there
Speaker 2: on the stands saying that my attorney representing me today
Speaker 2: is being paid by Shawn Combs, the homan with from
Speaker 2: living with my kid is being I.
Speaker 1: Can take her up the stand right then and there.
Speaker 1: Why does Soulcris be there?
Speaker 2: This was a gift to the defense and that's why
Speaker 2: she was on the stand for so long, because the
Speaker 2: defense had a field day with her and they weren't
Speaker 2: going to let her off the stand. And that's the
Speaker 2: risk you run anytime you bring on a complex witness.
Speaker 2: But I bring up these patterns which I set a
Speaker 2: few moments ago. Even if many people think that Jane
Speaker 2: was a very problematic witness, and she certainly may prove
Speaker 2: to be, there is an element of patterns that shows
Speaker 2: I'm not talking about the women's conduct. I'm talking about
Speaker 2: Shawn Combs's com.
Speaker 1: The exact There were patterns in they want he wants
Speaker 1: them in costumes, he wants them moved up white, nailed
Speaker 1: the hair a certain way, that nails a certain way.
Speaker 1: The scenes, the scenarios with the escorts, the same patterns
Speaker 1: of behaviors, the same setups, the constant desires and tech
Speaker 1: messages and communications to for them to reach out to
Speaker 1: these men and get dick photos and then even sexual interactions.
Speaker 2: With wait that, based on their testimony is a form,
Speaker 2: a major form of control. Where they are the ones
Speaker 2: who are now making these arrangements.
Speaker 1: I have a question when you watched the jury and
Speaker 1: they had the headphones on and they were watching the
Speaker 1: videos that you don't get to see, correct, correct, what
Speaker 1: were the visuals? What were the face souls giving?
Speaker 2: I have to tell you this jury like they have
Speaker 2: poker faces. Let me put it this way, when the
Speaker 2: headphones are on, there's really no visible reaction from any
Speaker 2: of the jerks. Yeah. Now it's a fool of errands.
Speaker 2: I guess what the Jersey thinks. I know, and I
Speaker 2: here after we'll do an interview and we'll be totally
Speaker 2: I heard the same thing you said.
Speaker 1: The videos. There wasn't anything to grab, Nobody was moving
Speaker 1: their faces like that. See anybody so horror?
Speaker 2: Do you remember? Because the journey didn't see the freak
Speaker 2: out videos until really the past week before they'd only
Speaker 2: seemed still exist. Yeah, that first time, which again was
Speaker 2: the first time they had seen any sexually explicit content.
Speaker 2: That was the first and only time really that I
Speaker 2: saw one of the jurors, a woman, seemed a bit
Speaker 2: horrified and shocked by it. But I think as it
Speaker 2: goes on, A I think they could be a bit
Speaker 2: defensitized to this, or B they know that they should
Speaker 2: have a poker face because they know that the media
Speaker 2: is in there and they know that we're looking at them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you don't want to be sitting there having
Speaker 1: First of all, you know, you've got to be real
Speaker 1: careful with the facial when you're watching pornography in front
Speaker 1: of the world.
Speaker 2: And also, can I tell you that is something I
Speaker 2: thought of. I mean, they've watched a lot of footage
Speaker 2: over the past week, Like how uncomfortable you eighteen jurors
Speaker 2: sitting next to each other and they're all watching porn.
Speaker 1: I mean, listen, I've opened up porn or in my lifetime.
Speaker 1: I'm forty one years old, that's watched one before. If
Speaker 1: I've come across a girl getting on her knees with
Speaker 1: her mouth open, dressed up as a dolly and heels
Speaker 1: getting pissed men pissing in her mouth, I'm not getting
Speaker 1: I'm immediately off of that entire site and onto something else,
Speaker 1: and I'm having like horrified thoughts for a few days,
Speaker 1: and I'm not really even gonna go near anything for
Speaker 1: a saw hot second because it's just a little traumatizing
Speaker 1: and a bit like just yuck.
Speaker 2: Well, so here what's interesting. So I don't know nobody
Speaker 2: besides the jury and the attorneys know what is in
Speaker 2: those videos, and that's the people that were in the
Speaker 2: courtroom that have hearing like I do.
Speaker 1: I did hear some m's and some groans and someone there.
Speaker 2: There was a day where you could hear.
Speaker 1: Everything smacking on I heard baby oil smacking on walls
Speaker 1: a lot.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, you could. There was one day in particular
Speaker 2: that you could hear, and then they realized that you
Speaker 2: could hear, so then they started turning off the mics
Speaker 2: too many.
Speaker 1: There there was some moment in Cassie's testimony where I
Speaker 1: was like dead sold and I didn't really even need
Speaker 1: to hear anything else. I would just believe whatever she
Speaker 1: wants to say in the charges and just go from there.
Speaker 1: She said we were all I was dressed up like
Speaker 1: a doll. However in the costume, he wanted my hair right,
Speaker 1: and these hook the hooker heels he wants them wearing,
Speaker 1: though I think of like stripper heels or whatever. You
Speaker 1: have to go to a special place and get these heels.
Speaker 1: I only know this because we had to dance in
Speaker 1: them half the time in the girl group. But you
Speaker 1: have to like go to custom places. You can't just
Speaker 1: get these heels at Steve Madden and like they have
Speaker 1: these custom heels. And She's like, we're all standing in
Speaker 1: this fucking pool inflatable pool with like and Cassy was like,
Speaker 1: I don't know. We were standing in there. We kept
Speaker 1: asking us to get down and bathe in the in
Speaker 1: the oil, and we were just standing there and like
Speaker 1: we were like looking at each other, like what the
Speaker 1: fuck are we doing? This is stupid right for me,
Speaker 1: captivated me because it wasn't sexy, it wasn't hot, it
Speaker 1: wasn't even on the to do a look in a
Speaker 1: moment for my man.
Speaker 2: I love it was giving.
Speaker 1: Everyone in the room is uncomfortable and feels this as
Speaker 1: weird as shit. Bro with the camera, weirdo over there?
Speaker 1: What do you want us to do? What are we doing?
Speaker 2: Work?
Speaker 1: We don't know what to do? This is weird.
Speaker 2: Well, that's why these women have said that they felt
Speaker 2: like they were there to live out his fantasy. I
Speaker 2: from sitting there every day, you know, that's what the
Speaker 2: defense has been doing. Is anyone who worked for him,
Speaker 2: it was didn't you do great things for your career?
Speaker 2: And how do you feel about him today? And with
Speaker 2: the exes, you know, how do you feel about him today?
Speaker 2: No one on the stand, not even Cassie, said I
Speaker 2: hate his guts, not one person. What did she say?
Speaker 2: She said something to the effects of God, I wish
Speaker 2: I had the tramps in front of me, but something
Speaker 2: to the effect of I don't hate him, It's just
Speaker 2: not in me. And it was very powerful because she
Speaker 2: was basically showing I don't have this is I'm I'm rehashing,
Speaker 2: you know, her testimony in summarizing she was basically trying
Speaker 2: to make the point I don't have Zandata. This is
Speaker 2: not out of site, but I'm here to do what's
Speaker 2: right and what happened to me is not okay. And
Speaker 2: remember when she was asked why she was there, she
Speaker 2: said it was to right wrong. Because even though she
Speaker 2: is testifying that she was victimized, she also.
Speaker 1: Feels participated in criminal behavior. She even said it on
Speaker 1: the stand. I didn't know what's criminal when I was
Speaker 1: doing and then they tried stopping.
Speaker 2: Her exactly exactly.
Speaker 1: Wasn't aware that every sh there was a point where
Speaker 1: she started realizing what was criminal and what wasn't. That's
Speaker 1: what troubled me with Jane's testimony so much is girl,
Speaker 1: If you were confused when it was made black and
Speaker 1: white and writing in an lawsuit, you should have unconfused yourself.
Speaker 1: And then when you actually saw the video on CNN,
Speaker 1: you really should have unconfused yourself. You shouldn't have been
Speaker 1: looking at takes of his apology videos. If you notice that,
Speaker 1: did you also trip out on that? Because I was
Speaker 1: thinking of you in that moment, like you were sitting
Speaker 1: there knowing what you had in your hands and what
Speaker 1: was about to be shown to the world, while another
Speaker 1: girl was sitting there combing through his apology videos trying
Speaker 1: to figure out which one seems most since she even
Speaker 1: says that he showed me a video and I felt
Speaker 1: he didn't seem sincere in it, a different one was posted.
Speaker 2: I will tell you ad for me has been pretty wild,
Speaker 2: sitting in court and putting the pieces together, because there's
Speaker 2: a lot that even I didn't know, which is finding
Speaker 2: out you know how shown Combs found out about that?
Speaker 2: You know, of course, what did they say?
Speaker 1: How did he find out? I didn't know that part hit?
Speaker 2: So he was in bed with Jane in his home
Speaker 2: in Miami and one of his sons walked in the
Speaker 2: room and said, something has happened, And that's how he
Speaker 2: found out that it had aired. Now what's interesting from
Speaker 2: my standpoint.
Speaker 1: Is, of course you know this, that's crazy journalism on
Speaker 1: your part, because normally things are so messy. Everybody knows
Speaker 1: something that's wild. How did you do that?
Speaker 2: Can? I tell you? This is what was so interesting
Speaker 2: to me, as all these pieces are falling into place,
Speaker 2: and I'm kind of the puzzle is being stilled out
Speaker 2: for the pieces that I did not know. Of course,
Speaker 2: I did my beyond due diligence, of course, a comment
Speaker 2: from his team when you saw a report it said
Speaker 2: that we had made numerous attempts. But of course I
Speaker 2: was not reaching out directly to Shaun Holmes, Like, that's
Speaker 2: not what you do. He has representatives that he pays
Speaker 2: a lot of money to speak for these things, And.
Speaker 1: How do you learn what those representatives ares? They don't
Speaker 1: Like I always wonder, how do people know who my
Speaker 1: reds are? Is? They're like a www dot com? This
Speaker 1: is who reps this person? How do you know that?
Speaker 2: So there's a few things. So yes there is, but
Speaker 2: that when you were in a scandal a crisis, you
Speaker 2: often bring in crisis management. So like there is databases
Speaker 2: that you can pay for to basically see who reps celebrities,
Speaker 2: like who they are agents and publicists like all of
Speaker 2: the news organizations you did you have to write KK
Speaker 2: not for them. But I have made numerous attempts with
Speaker 2: her for other things.
Speaker 1: Where's she hiding? Do we know?
Speaker 2: We do not know? And I will have you been
Speaker 2: in this country? So I had reached out to you.
Speaker 2: Remember when she released that statement saying that you know
Speaker 2: she's not involved in anything and all that I did?
Speaker 1: When did she release that statement? I didn't realize that.
Speaker 2: In March, so two months before the trial, she released
Speaker 2: a statement that said, you know, all of the wrongdoing
Speaker 2: that has been alledged beside my former boss, you know
Speaker 2: I have nothing to do with egregious claims have been
Speaker 2: made about me. Blah blah blah.
Speaker 1: Did she know that they had her phones by that
Speaker 1: point when she made that statement, she did.
Speaker 2: So I reached out to offer her an interview because
Speaker 2: I would like to hear more of her. Sorry, And
Speaker 2: I did make contact with her attorney, who said, who's there, attorney,
Speaker 2: it's not I don't want to say here.
Speaker 1: Is it's somebody that I would know? Or is it?
Speaker 1: Is it a big name?
Speaker 2: Okay, it's not like one of the like celebrity like
Speaker 2: criminal attorney Okay, because if it was, I would say it.
Speaker 2: But they said to me that until the criminal case
Speaker 2: is resolved, in all of the civil cases are resolved,
Speaker 2: that she can't speak. And throughout the trial, I've reached
Speaker 2: out more and more and more a for an interview,
Speaker 2: but B two C comment and now they have gone
Speaker 2: radio set that line.
Speaker 1: I think there's I think there's gonna be more indictments.
Speaker 1: I think I'm predicting it. Now there's going to be
Speaker 1: more indictments and she's going to be hit with the
Speaker 1: co conspirac Remember that.
Speaker 2: When the first indictment came out, and there were numerous
Speaker 2: superseding indictments. But the prosecutors had said, and I have
Speaker 2: been reporting to the time that their investigation was still.
Speaker 1: Ongoing, and this whole battle of everyone not understanding if
Speaker 1: it was just him or an enterprise. I saw an enterprise.
Speaker 1: I saw other criminals, and I saw other crimes. I
Speaker 1: don't understand why they aren't in this case.
Speaker 2: And what do you mean by that? If there's anything
Speaker 2: that you're comfortable elaborating, like, what do you mean by that?
Speaker 1: I saw a whole bunch of people running things, not
Speaker 1: just the people that are taken The people that have
Speaker 1: taken a stand are very a very minor part or
Speaker 1: a different era, right, There's a whole lot of people.
Speaker 1: I didn't see any of them on the stand. So
Speaker 1: and to me, I said, to this person, you know,
Speaker 1: and he would They were basically saying, like, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of saying, this is just all girlfriends over here
Speaker 1: in this trial area and not just slippery subject for
Speaker 1: many reasons in many ways. And that's not just a
Speaker 1: music industry thing. Every industry's got a sleezy boss. Every
Speaker 1: industry's got somebody that doesn't know any better and wants
Speaker 1: to advance. Like every job has forms of this going on.
Speaker 1: And I was like, no, we need I don't.
Speaker 2: I don't know that we can.
Speaker 1: Look at this so wide and so systematically.
Speaker 2: First of all, they make it okay, like.
Speaker 1: No, no, and that's what I said. Well, I said, well,
Speaker 1: if everybody has this and people are just paying more
Speaker 1: attention because we're in the entertainment industry and people watch
Speaker 1: us more and this is a huge megastar, then shouldn't
Speaker 1: we make an example and show everybody else that this
Speaker 1: is not allowed in the workplace. I shouldn't we be
Speaker 1: shouldn't we then be really showing people? Because what are
Speaker 1: we going to be showing them if we don't do
Speaker 1: you know how many people fly people in sex working
Speaker 1: jobs across state lines for their satisfy faction, Like that's
Speaker 1: a very scary thing that you're putting out there on
Speaker 1: the line right now for a whole lot of fucking people.
Speaker 1: And frankly, we need to nip it in the butt.
Speaker 2: A lot of.
Speaker 1: People are not safe because a lot of people in
Speaker 1: these settings. Clearly, as you are learning, are inebriated. You
Speaker 1: can't make good calls on other people lives, what alone, emotional, soul, spirit,
Speaker 1: all the other things that we are not even discussing
Speaker 1: right now. Cassie was from the rest of her life
Speaker 1: trying to clear the emotional soul side of the that
Speaker 1: what she had to testify she did. She may be
Speaker 1: able to vocalize it ten something years after cleansing it
Speaker 1: from your soul is life work. We're not even discussing
Speaker 1: that prison sentence. Everybody in this industry understands some form
Speaker 1: of identifying this person as a fucking criminal. Everybody's disunderstanding
Speaker 1: it from different lenses, depending on what decades you were in,
Speaker 1: depending on who's around you, who you knew, what bodyguards
Speaker 1: and assistance were in place at different times. I didn't
Speaker 1: know Kk, but I sure it's fuck knew Capricorn, and
Speaker 1: I knew friend even better. But she was found dead
Speaker 1: on her couch after she sued Ditty for millions.
Speaker 2: Well, so here's what I keep telling everyone, because I'm
Speaker 2: asked about this case. Everyone, even just like my friends
Speaker 2: and family asked me, and I tell them what Ditty
Speaker 2: has been accused of. Is this thick you know, like
Speaker 2: I'm putting.
Speaker 1: My arms up like and Elizabeth. By the way, that's
Speaker 1: not even big compared to what the industry is discussing, right,
Speaker 1: very minor. That's that little tiny piece of the pie.
Speaker 1: That's how crazy it.
Speaker 2: Is for me to watch this. I'm sure I'm going ahead,
Speaker 2: I keep going. So you know, the accusations against Big
Speaker 2: all what she denies, by the way, but the accusations
Speaker 2: against him could like fill up you know, every room
Speaker 2: that you're in, right, But this case is miniscule. It's
Speaker 2: this big. It's centered around three different women. To hate
Speaker 2: that former girlfriends, I hate that with so many reasons.
Speaker 2: Why because off to the limitation.
Speaker 1: So it's insane to me, to me and from my
Speaker 1: own degrees of my own story, I have things that
Speaker 1: I still don't have answers to right. So I in
Speaker 1: some way savee or form even though I report on
Speaker 1: this trial, even though I'm somebody that everybody talks about
Speaker 1: in regards this trial, makes up fake headlinds about whatever
Speaker 1: the fuck they're going to do to me they do, right,
Speaker 1: But I'm also a human in this. I have had
Speaker 1: feelings for everybody across the board. I am somebody who
Speaker 1: had an entire career built by this man.
Speaker 2: That they lose his.
Speaker 1: Entire life freedom.
Speaker 2: I don't take that not seriously.
Speaker 1: I don't know that I would offer a hand to
Speaker 1: save him, But I don't have any particular feeling that
Speaker 1: I want him to go down. I want the prosecutors
Speaker 1: to prove their case. And I'm a bit underwhelmed in
Speaker 1: this moment.
Speaker 2: Being in the room is so different, and it's hard
Speaker 2: to explain that to me. You can't explain. But the
Speaker 2: thing is is there's a lot of grey area. Nothing
Speaker 2: is black and white. You know all the reasons that
Speaker 2: we just spoke about with Jane for particular. You know,
Speaker 2: you could see that a lot of these jurors are
Speaker 2: gonna not believe some of these women, right, there's a
Speaker 2: lot of loopholes here. However, when you have sat in
Speaker 2: the courtroom for two months and you have heard these
Speaker 2: patterns of alleged.
Speaker 1: Behavior, isn't it crazy that proving consent takes this much.
Speaker 1: You can't just be one person that says, hey, I
Speaker 1: didn't consent to that. Imagine as one woman. You know
Speaker 1: that we talk about how victims are so scared to
Speaker 1: come forward.
Speaker 2: Yet eighty plus have eighty plus.
Speaker 1: Against the biggest fucking star there is in the goddamn world.
Speaker 2: Men, ambles, men and women.
Speaker 1: And by the way, I even said this to a
Speaker 1: man that's very powerful today, I would never in my
Speaker 1: life suit this man. And I am out here with
Speaker 1: my voice. I use it all the time. I was
Speaker 1: fired on National TV because I was using it. I
Speaker 1: was blacklisted, and I still used my mouthpiece. I'm somebody
Speaker 1: that people consider have balls in this specific setting, definitely,
Speaker 1: I would never go after him in any type of
Speaker 1: legal way unless I had video from A to Z,
Speaker 1: so I could just leave all bystanders and opinions of
Speaker 1: everything aside and be able to prove it from A
Speaker 1: to Z. Okay, But there are eighty people who aren't
Speaker 1: even necessarily seen as the girl with balls like me,
Speaker 1: that have come forward and alleged horrifying things, which has
Speaker 1: happened to no other mega celebrity in my lifetime that
Speaker 1: I have seen. It can't even be brought in. And
Speaker 1: yet we're gonna come down to a jury of people.
Speaker 1: We're gonna come down to knowing that they're gonna go
Speaker 1: into a room and decide whether they believe exactly in
Speaker 1: the consent, because this thing is going to come down
Speaker 1: to consent.
Speaker 2: That's all I hear.
Speaker 1: Anyone saying, why did the girls come back and ask
Speaker 1: for jobs after death? Is a consent piece all anyone
Speaker 1: con continues to talk about it.
Speaker 2: No one is.
Speaker 1: Nobody's asking whether the baby oil is real. Nobody's asking
Speaker 1: if they ask for guys World. Nobody's even asking if
Speaker 1: the stripper heel part is real. Nobody's asked. It's just
Speaker 1: did they want did they all want this? Or did
Speaker 1: they not? And in writing you can see everybody say
Speaker 1: they don't want it, they feel used, they feel this
Speaker 1: and there, And in writing they can see them saying,
Speaker 1: I want to be sexy for you tonight, daddy. You
Speaker 1: can see both in writing that. What's crazy to me
Speaker 1: is we are not moving the mark forward for any
Speaker 1: victim in this world to feel comfortable on their own
Speaker 1: merit to say I did not ask for this, I
Speaker 1: did not want this this one time. I wanted it
Speaker 1: twenty times, but this one time. Are these three times
Speaker 1: I was raped or I was violated, or I didn't
Speaker 1: want this? It doesn't matter if you did it twenty
Speaker 1: billion times before, if one time you did not want it.
Speaker 1: That is rape, that is violation, and that is what
Speaker 1: is so hard for juris to understand. But with that
Speaker 1: being said, that that feeling of like believing someone on
Speaker 1: their merit and do you know how difficult it is
Speaker 1: to go against this human.
Speaker 2: Remember the justice system, even if it should be and
Speaker 2: it is designed to be, it's not about the truth.
Speaker 2: It's about what twelve people believe.
Speaker 1: Correct, It's a theater. I literally said on the first
Speaker 1: day of trial something on Twitter while it had to
Speaker 1: go back and bookmark it, like let's see the theater begin,
Speaker 1: Like this is it. This is going to be a
Speaker 1: masterclass in theater. But beyond all of this, these charges
Speaker 1: are so very big. There are so many of them,
Speaker 1: so many of them that weren't even brought into this case.
Speaker 1: But this case is the one not to miss on.
Speaker 1: That's where the feeling of a little dissatisfaction with the
Speaker 1: prosecution's case. And by the way, I don't even know
Speaker 1: that they feel satisfied because they had.
Speaker 2: A lot of things blow up on them during jury selection.
Speaker 2: It's not a slam dunk.
Speaker 1: And part of the reason for that, and it should
Speaker 1: have been.
Speaker 2: And this is what I was going to say is
Speaker 2: there are severe limitations that are put on prosecutors and
Speaker 2: the defense, But this is the prosecutor's case to prove
Speaker 2: there are serious limitations for the scope of what they
Speaker 2: can do and what they can't do. And the scope
Speaker 2: of this case is so limited, even though allegations spanning
Speaker 2: twenty years.
Speaker 1: It's like you watch our president do an amazing speech.
Speaker 1: They've written their own speech. Both sides have written their
Speaker 1: own speech, and they're trying to fight to get as
Speaker 1: many words of their speech in before the time runs out.
Speaker 2: That's exactly right for both.
Speaker 1: So what's so sad about all of this is is
Speaker 1: there were no limitations on any of this behavior. When
Speaker 1: it's tried, there's tons.
Speaker 2: Of course, that's how it is.
Speaker 1: But this should have been going on since the nineties.
Speaker 1: I know people that were twirling and twirling in the
Speaker 1: freak oftin the nineties. So it took this long for
Speaker 1: us to get here, and now we still have the
Speaker 1: world centered on is anyone a hoe?
Speaker 2: What chaming?
Speaker 1: Hasn't this all just industry fodder? Everybody wanted it entertainment
Speaker 1: as usual. We are still and we've never seen anything
Speaker 1: like this. The magnitude of what this is. This is
Speaker 1: a nine point seven earthquake happening in front of us.
Speaker 1: We've got a few of them. By the way, I'm
Speaker 1: sure you're real busy over there. We're at war. Ice
Speaker 1: is down the street, and we got Diddy coming through.
Speaker 1: It's there are earthquakes, shifting, big shifting things occurring. Is
Speaker 1: the way that this time feels give us a bad
Speaker 1: outcome because we're normalizing so much chaos that the jury
Speaker 1: will just do a little bit more of that when
Speaker 1: they decide on this, because you know, damn well, when
Speaker 1: you go look back at history, let's just bring up
Speaker 1: a case like oj Simpson.
Speaker 2: It's documented on Netflix.
Speaker 1: Now by the lawyers themselves of how much tomfoolery they played,
Speaker 1: how much scripting and narratives and bullshit they came up with,
Speaker 1: and how they truly get depended on a sign of
Speaker 1: the times to get them through. The sign of the
Speaker 1: times right now is we are at war in.
Speaker 2: The Middle East.
Speaker 1: Ice is down the block, detaining people that you don't
Speaker 1: even really dislike or have any issue with it, and
Speaker 1: we are everybody's wondering if they're going to have their
Speaker 1: job any year. I think because technology is moving so fast.
Speaker 1: I don't even know if I'm watching a real person
Speaker 1: when I watch people online anymore. Look is it's getting scary.
Speaker 1: It is a crazy time. And you're absolutely right that
Speaker 1: all of these trials, it depends on the world and
Speaker 1: which we're living so culturally, politically, socially, how things are different.
Speaker 1: I mean, when I covered the first Weinstein case in
Speaker 1: twenty twenty, it was a completely different time of the world.
Speaker 1: But I want to leave you with something that resonued
Speaker 1: with me. I recently didn't.
Speaker 2: Interview with Toronto Burke, who is the founder of the
Speaker 2: Me Too movement, and her life work has been advocating
Speaker 2: for survivors of sexual violence. And I was talking to
Speaker 2: her about this case, about the Ditty case, and she
Speaker 2: said to me, it is such a whim that he
Speaker 2: is even in a courtroom. And where I'm about to say,
Speaker 2: I thought was so poignant of her. She said, the
Speaker 2: criminal justice system has never been set up for vistims
Speaker 2: and we should not put all of our eggs in
Speaker 2: that basket, because if you do, you will just be disappointed. Oh.
Speaker 2: I thought that hearing that from her and hearing her perspective.
Speaker 1: It's going to be the perspective. I refuse it, I
Speaker 1: rebuke it. We did not go through I I will
Speaker 1: just speak for me as a woman that has been
Speaker 1: in the music industry for twenty some years.
Speaker 2: My life's work.
Speaker 1: Will not go in things. We have to do better.
Speaker 1: As a system. We had to hold ourselves accountable and
Speaker 1: be responsible for our be behavior, for the behavior that
Speaker 1: we witness. Call the cops, tell on people. Normalize using
Speaker 1: the justice system, more normalize believing in it. That way,
Speaker 1: when you sit on a jury, you will hold yourself
Speaker 1: to a higher standard because people that are sitting on
Speaker 1: there right now are holding a whole lot in their hands,
Speaker 1: and it's so much bigger than Ditty or any Jane do.
Speaker 2: And I will tell you from my coverage of trials
Speaker 2: like these, I have learned, of course, the vertist it's
Speaker 2: not just symbolic, but it's quite literally put someone behind
Speaker 2: bars or not. So it is. I don't want what
Speaker 2: I'm saying to be taken out of contact, but it's
Speaker 2: not important. Of course the vertict is important. But what
Speaker 2: I have learned from my coverage is it's not just
Speaker 2: the vertist, it's also how these trials and the awareness
Speaker 2: of it and the discussions and the discussion we're having
Speaker 2: now how it impacts society and how it impacts pulls.
Speaker 1: The discussion if it gets off is so damaging. I
Speaker 1: don't know that I'd want to stay in the fight. Liz, Okay,
Speaker 1: let me ask you this, how are you going to
Speaker 1: feel as the journalist that first had their hands.
Speaker 2: On watching.
Speaker 1: Him dropkick Cassie, and you knew what the impact it
Speaker 1: would have that you had in your hands and you
Speaker 1: saw it before it was put on CNN. I think
Speaker 1: the work that we have done speaks for itself. And
Speaker 1: I think again, verdicts are so important, and verdicts are
Speaker 1: symbolic of what people think are is right or wrong.
Speaker 2: But for Chogkoms, there's no going back. Domestic violence is
Speaker 2: absolutely unaccessible and what we saw in that video was
Speaker 2: horrific on every which cellular levels, and even his defense
Speaker 2: said that that is their whole defense, is that what
Speaker 2: he's done is indefensible. However, he's not guilty of these
Speaker 2: charges because they knew there's no way around it. So
Speaker 2: there's two ways to think of it. There's a court
Speaker 2: of law and there's a court of public opinion. And
Speaker 2: Cassie back in twenty sixteen when she was violently beaten
Speaker 2: in that hallway. Well, guess what, the people at the
Speaker 2: hotel didn't do anything. They were paid off. The police
Speaker 2: did not do anything. So you have these different systems
Speaker 2: people that are supposed to help when bad things happen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I literally shout hotels at on my Instagram now
Speaker 1: that weren't involved in any of the transcripts. Every time
Speaker 1: I learned a new hotel's name, I was heartbroken because
Speaker 1: I will never stay there, right.
Speaker 2: But to make answer your question, you have these different
Speaker 2: systems that are supposed to protect us all in society.
Speaker 2: If something bad happens, you call the police. They're supposed
Speaker 2: to help you. If something that's rights in a hotel,
Speaker 2: they're supposed to do something. And what I've learned is
Speaker 2: the power of journalism and the power of people just
Speaker 2: using their voice and being truth tellers is so impactful
Speaker 2: because as you're saying that that tape is the most
Speaker 2: important piece of evidence. By the way, the defense said
Speaker 2: that too. They were working very hard to get it
Speaker 2: out of the case. We'll get how the prosecution wouldn't
Speaker 2: have that tape if it were not for our team's
Speaker 2: work at CNN, and that showed to me the power
Speaker 2: of journalism and again the power of people using their voice.
Speaker 2: So that is what I pray to.
Speaker 1: God, that the exclamation point doesn't stop at you, but exclamation.
Speaker 2: Point, exclamation point, exclamation point. I will also say, the
Speaker 2: final point I want to make is this case, no
Speaker 2: matter what happens, has put such a spotlight on domestic
Speaker 2: violence and violence against women, which one in four women
Speaker 2: in America experienced some form of intimate violence, intimate partner
Speaker 2: violence throughout their life. And I know that from my reporting,
Speaker 2: and I also know for my reporting that after we
Speaker 2: broke the Cassie Taste and then after Cassie posted about
Speaker 2: it on her Instagram, number repeated numbers were skyrocketing at Rain,
Speaker 2: which is the rape potline, and it's a domestic violence potline,
Speaker 2: So it showed there is real life impact and this
Speaker 2: is not in this case. This is a celebrity issue.
Speaker 2: It's Sean Combs and Cassie, but it's not a celebrity issue.
Speaker 2: This is a systemic problem around the world and this
Speaker 2: case has really put a spotlight on that. And that's why,
Speaker 2: regardless of the verdict, and again I'm not trying to
Speaker 2: discount the verdict. It's incredibly important for everyone involved in
Speaker 2: this style on both sides, and for people watching and.
Speaker 1: Eight eighty civil eighty plus civil suits that are well.
Speaker 2: That's the other thing too, is what I will be
Speaker 2: watching with my reporting is what happens in this vertice
Speaker 2: will greatly impact all the civil accusers. We will either
Speaker 2: see suits being pursuit or we will see suits being withdrawn.
Speaker 1: For some reason, I don't know what life looks like
Speaker 1: at the end of this one, and I should mm hmm,
Speaker 1: But somehow this great week changes so much m m.
Speaker 1: Maybe because my whole entire life has been in the
Speaker 1: music industry. We're either going to like allow this stuff
Speaker 1: or we aren't right and that's the trip and not
Speaker 1: as an Actually I don't see anyone else getting tried
Speaker 1: that's gonna bring this back up in my lifetime.
Speaker 2: It's like watching a nominee for as for.
Speaker 1: The female president go. It's like, we're not gonna probably
Speaker 1: get another one in my lifetime.
Speaker 2: Like this sucks.
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe you know, it's like this is a big one.
Speaker 1: I don't know who's bigger it's coming next. This is
Speaker 1: pretty big. Everyone should be paying attention. Thank you, Lis,
Speaker 1: thank you,