1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:04,360 Speaker 1: Family Secrets is a production of I Heart Radio. The 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:09,400 Speaker 1: following episode contains explicit details of sexual abuse. Listener discretion 3 00:00:09,600 --> 00:00:17,400 Speaker 1: is advised. It was the assistant headmaster. He was our 4 00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:20,520 Speaker 1: soccer coach, he was our lacrosse coach, um, and he 5 00:00:20,600 --> 00:00:24,680 Speaker 1: ran the boys acounts. This is Tim Erlick, a fifty 6 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:28,320 Speaker 1: year old bariatric surgeon, looking back on his childhood. As 7 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:31,520 Speaker 1: a ten eleven twelve year old boy, Tim was methodically, 8 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:36,000 Speaker 1: relentlessly sexually abused, along with dozens of other boys, by 9 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:39,600 Speaker 1: a middle school teacher named Sad Alton at the Pingree School, 10 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:43,200 Speaker 1: an elite New Jersey day school. This is a story 11 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:46,199 Speaker 1: about the worst sort of secret, the kind that festers 12 00:00:46,200 --> 00:00:48,640 Speaker 1: and grows over the course of a lifetime until it 13 00:00:48,680 --> 00:01:00,920 Speaker 1: becomes unbearable, impossible to hold. I'm d Ni Shapiro, and 14 00:01:01,040 --> 00:01:04,680 Speaker 1: this is family secrets. The secrets that are kept from us, 15 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:08,040 Speaker 1: the secrets we keep from others, and the secrets we 16 00:01:08,120 --> 00:01:17,000 Speaker 1: keep from ourselves. In June, Tim, along with twenty other men, bankers, lawyers, 17 00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 1: real estate developers, a social worker, a high school principal, psychologist, 18 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:26,600 Speaker 1: approached the Pingree School. They called themselves the Pingree Survivors, 19 00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:29,319 Speaker 1: and they were looking for some kind of justice, if 20 00:01:29,360 --> 00:01:33,319 Speaker 1: justice was even possible. On a fall afternoon, Tim and 21 00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:36,320 Speaker 1: I spent hours and hours on the phone, me hunched 22 00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: over my recording equipment and my son's old playroom. My 23 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:42,679 Speaker 1: son is now a college freshman, but during those hours, 24 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:45,839 Speaker 1: I looked around the room at football posters, plastic bins 25 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:50,520 Speaker 1: of legos, dented abandoned boxes of board games, scrabble, Monopoly, 26 00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 1: shoots and ladders, and I thought about what it is 27 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 1: to be a boy ten twelve, all knobby knees, skinny 28 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 1: shoulder blades and downy cheeks, still a child just beginning 29 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 1: to stretch and yearn to be bigger, older. So my 30 00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:12,960 Speaker 1: mom is from Stylingtown. My grandmother family was all from Vienna, 31 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:17,720 Speaker 1: and almost all of them except for her, her mom 32 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:20,680 Speaker 1: and her three sisters and my great aunts and my 33 00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 1: great grandmother immigrated to the United States, but the rest 34 00:02:24,320 --> 00:02:26,800 Speaker 1: of the family was all lost in the Holocaust. Tim 35 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:28,680 Speaker 1: is the fourth out of six kids, part of a 36 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 1: Jewish family who moved to suburban New Jersey and were 37 00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:33,200 Speaker 1: fortunate enough to be able to send their kids to 38 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 1: private school, the Bucolic campus of Pingree's Lower School. In 39 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:38,800 Speaker 1: short Hills is about as far away from his mom's 40 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:42,560 Speaker 1: New York City Stuyvesant Town or his dad's Southwestern Georgia 41 00:02:42,600 --> 00:02:47,040 Speaker 1: as you can imagine. It's a place that looks safe, 42 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:51,120 Speaker 1: constted by manicured privilege, as if nothing bad could ever 43 00:02:51,200 --> 00:02:54,160 Speaker 1: happen there. I know this because I was also a 44 00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 1: student at the Pingree School during that time. I knew 45 00:02:57,160 --> 00:02:59,280 Speaker 1: many of these boys. I even dated one of them 46 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:02,799 Speaker 1: when I was in seven grade. This is Tim's story, 47 00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:05,480 Speaker 1: but imagine it amplified by so many boys in this 48 00:03:05,560 --> 00:03:08,440 Speaker 1: one school, and then again in schools all over America. 49 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:12,960 Speaker 1: Just in the past two years, haras Man Rama's taft 50 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: Hot Guests, St. Paul's, and other institutions charged with the 51 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:19,400 Speaker 1: education and protection of their students have been embroiled in 52 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: controversies as the truth tumbles out, as truth tends to do. 53 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:26,920 Speaker 1: Tim entered Pingree in the fourth grade on the heels 54 00:03:26,919 --> 00:03:29,519 Speaker 1: of his older brother Andy. Andy at that time was 55 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:33,440 Speaker 1: in seventh grade, and Andy was the king of the Hill. 56 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:38,360 Speaker 1: He was captain lacrosse team, buying for student body president. 57 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:40,920 Speaker 1: So when I started at Pingery, my mom was like, 58 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:43,480 Speaker 1: you know, you need to meet Teddalton, need to be 59 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:46,640 Speaker 1: a boy Scout and automatically, you know, coming from a 60 00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:50,160 Speaker 1: big family like that, all the teachers know you. Everybody 61 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,200 Speaker 1: at Pingrey knows you. You're little to me early, you know, 62 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,720 Speaker 1: and that's how people still call me that. And it 63 00:03:55,800 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 1: was kind of nice because the older girls that you 64 00:03:58,840 --> 00:04:01,520 Speaker 1: know that Andy was friends with, you know, we're talking 65 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:03,800 Speaker 1: to me, and the older guys are cool to me. 66 00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: And he was great. Now. I started with the Boy 67 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:08,040 Speaker 1: Scouts in fourth grade, when usually it was probably like 68 00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:11,000 Speaker 1: the fifth or sixth grade kind of thing that my mom, 69 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 1: you introduced me to Ted Alton, gave me Tiddleton, I'm 70 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 1: a golden platter. One of the things that struck me 71 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:20,920 Speaker 1: again and again in all of the descriptions of Ted 72 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:28,520 Speaker 1: Alton was how charismatic and respected and how much he 73 00:04:28,839 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 1: was considered to be this kind of golden teacher, and 74 00:04:33,720 --> 00:04:37,360 Speaker 1: also that he was everywhere. That to me was one 75 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 1: of the most chilling aspects of this was that it's 76 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:43,200 Speaker 1: almost as if he designed life, or not almost as 77 00:04:43,240 --> 00:04:45,239 Speaker 1: if he It seems like he did design a life 78 00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:49,720 Speaker 1: in which he would be present in every possible way 79 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:53,320 Speaker 1: for the boys that he was going after. I didn't 80 00:04:53,320 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 1: have them to a teacher until sixth grade. He was 81 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:00,919 Speaker 1: a sixth grade like social studies teacher um, but for 82 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:06,720 Speaker 1: soccer and lacrosse and obviously both scouts. It was our 83 00:05:06,839 --> 00:05:10,320 Speaker 1: quote unquote tripping counselor, so he was in charge of 84 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:15,960 Speaker 1: taking us on these amazing I mean, I dream about 85 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: these excursions through the woods and waters of Maine, and 86 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:26,159 Speaker 1: we would go whitewater canoeing on the Penobscott and the 87 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:29,679 Speaker 1: Allagash and the Saco River, and running down the bluffs 88 00:05:29,720 --> 00:05:35,440 Speaker 1: at the Socco and and see buried villages Black staff. Honestly, 89 00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 1: that's what makes this all again so pray, is that 90 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 1: they were probably some of the best members of my life. 91 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:50,600 Speaker 1: In the Pingree survivors approached the school in search of answers. 92 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 1: They wanted the school to take responsibility for the history 93 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:57,200 Speaker 1: that had so traumatized them. Pingree's lawyers retained a private 94 00:05:57,200 --> 00:06:01,359 Speaker 1: security firm to conduct an independent investigation. The cover page 95 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:04,159 Speaker 1: of the ensuing report carries a warning that the material 96 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:12,240 Speaker 1: is sensitive, personal and graphic and not intended for children. Quote. 97 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:15,520 Speaker 1: The evidence demonstrates that between nineteen seventy two and nineteen 98 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:18,400 Speaker 1: seventy eight, while employed by Short Hills Country Day and 99 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 1: Pingree Thad Alton sexually assaulted at least twenty seven students. 100 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:28,719 Speaker 1: Alton's behavior permeated multiple facets of the former students lives, 101 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:34,240 Speaker 1: since some former students simultaneously attended Pingree, Camp Wacanaki and 102 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:37,279 Speaker 1: were part of Boy Scout Troop number sixty four that 103 00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:42,040 Speaker 1: regularly met on school grounds in a number of different locations, 104 00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 1: including his office at school during the school day, after 105 00:06:46,560 --> 00:06:49,640 Speaker 1: school in the evenings and on week ends, the school 106 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:53,200 Speaker 1: gymnasium and the girls locker room, the home of his 107 00:06:53,279 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 1: in laws, his own school owned home at times when 108 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:58,919 Speaker 1: his wife and children were present, the home of a 109 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 1: former student on Boy Scout camping trips, his summer home 110 00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:07,400 Speaker 1: in Martha's Vineyard, his truck and Camp Waganaki, including on 111 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:12,000 Speaker 1: camping trips, and inside his own cabin. In particular, the 112 00:07:12,040 --> 00:07:15,680 Speaker 1: sexual contact that occurred inside Alton's office and elsewhere included 113 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:20,040 Speaker 1: Alton's touching a student's naked penises with his hands, the 114 00:07:20,080 --> 00:07:23,080 Speaker 1: students touching of Alton's naked penis with their hands at 115 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:27,520 Speaker 1: Alton's request, Alton's placement of student's hands on his naked 116 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:31,600 Speaker 1: penis to masturbate him, Alton masturbating in front of students 117 00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 1: while encouraging students to masturbate the mutual touching of students 118 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 1: naked penises. Alton often invited groups of boys into his 119 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:43,960 Speaker 1: office as well, and had boys touched each other's penises 120 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 1: and then coaxed them to perform oral sex on him 121 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:52,600 Speaker 1: and or each other. In addition, Alton used heterosexual pornographic 122 00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 1: magazines and movies to entice the boys to touch their 123 00:07:55,880 --> 00:07:59,440 Speaker 1: own penises, those of each other, and that of Alton. 124 00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 1: For my mom, here's my mom. You know these kids, 125 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:10,320 Speaker 1: work aholic husband, We've never ever involved in my life, 126 00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:15,080 Speaker 1: never coached any of mine, little league or anything. Um, 127 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 1: I didn't really know him growing up. And so for me, 128 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:20,960 Speaker 1: Ted Alton was sort of a savior because here's this masculine, 129 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:26,040 Speaker 1: outdoorsy guy, lacrosse coach, soccer coach. My mom it was 130 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:29,520 Speaker 1: he's a father figure, you know. And it was probably 131 00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 1: about sixth grade, and she said to me, she said, 132 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:34,240 Speaker 1: I know Ted Alton. He she had she knew that 133 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:37,440 Speaker 1: something's going on. She's not a fucking idiot. She knew 134 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:40,520 Speaker 1: that that Ted Alton, you know, I was doing something 135 00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 1: with boys. But she said to me, she said, Ted 136 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 1: Alton will never touch you because he doesn't like Jewish boys. 137 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 1: But it was more important for her to have him 138 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:51,600 Speaker 1: in my life as a father figure, even though she 139 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:55,440 Speaker 1: knew that he was probably, you know, doing something sexual 140 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:58,920 Speaker 1: with these boys. And it really didn't think into me, 141 00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:03,920 Speaker 1: like until last year, of how she sort of navigated 142 00:09:03,920 --> 00:09:07,920 Speaker 1: that situation. At the point when she said that to 143 00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 1: you that he wouldn't touch Jewish boys, had he already 144 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:15,319 Speaker 1: made an approach to you? Oh yes, I've already been 145 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:18,560 Speaker 1: two years as a boy scout. I was like, yeah, mom, 146 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:24,080 Speaker 1: you know, Okay, No, he's already made his mark. We're 147 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:26,040 Speaker 1: going to take a quick break. We'll be back in 148 00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:34,120 Speaker 1: a moment. This is a story at its core that 149 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:37,560 Speaker 1: is about the failure of adults, or, in the words 150 00:09:37,559 --> 00:09:40,840 Speaker 1: of Edmund Burke, the only thing necessary for the triumph 151 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:44,560 Speaker 1: of evil is for good men to do nothing. What 152 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:48,080 Speaker 1: did Tim's mother know? What did other mothers or fathers suspect? 153 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:52,640 Speaker 1: A question that emerges again and again. How could this 154 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 1: abuse have gone on right under the noses of so 155 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:58,360 Speaker 1: many grown ups? Yeah it was. I mean, I'm a 156 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:03,000 Speaker 1: short Jewish kid and this powering, six three big guy 157 00:10:03,040 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 1: who's in the military, but with a big smile, and 158 00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 1: he was known for his bear hugs. That's how he 159 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:12,640 Speaker 1: got the nickname Bear. But I remember the pants he wore. 160 00:10:13,200 --> 00:10:16,640 Speaker 1: He always worthy, sort of like polyester pants, which we 161 00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:19,840 Speaker 1: had laugh at nowadays, you know nowadays in blue shirts 162 00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:24,560 Speaker 1: and a black tie and a certain smell. When Tim 163 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:27,199 Speaker 1: is in sixth grade, he runs away from home a 164 00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:30,079 Speaker 1: couple of times, and instead of getting on a train 165 00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:32,960 Speaker 1: or a bus and going to New York, he calls 166 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:37,520 Speaker 1: Ted Alton, and Ted caused him his parents and talks 167 00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 1: him into going back home. And then in wood Shock, 168 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:43,520 Speaker 1: I made him a plaque. I said thanks, and he 169 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:45,560 Speaker 1: kept that in his office, you know, for all the 170 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:48,679 Speaker 1: you know, probably for years, probably still has it for 171 00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:52,880 Speaker 1: all I know. And how fucked up is that? And 172 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:55,480 Speaker 1: I guess in some ways he was kind of a 173 00:10:55,520 --> 00:10:58,559 Speaker 1: first love, maybe the father figure who crossed the line. 174 00:10:58,559 --> 00:11:01,440 Speaker 1: But we all felt loved by him. And that's why 175 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:04,080 Speaker 1: no one said anything, because if we don't want him 176 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:06,080 Speaker 1: to get hurt, and we also got something out of it. 177 00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:08,679 Speaker 1: It was there was a pleasure to it. What kind 178 00:11:08,760 --> 00:11:12,720 Speaker 1: of a crush in sixth grade. But on the flip side, 179 00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:15,800 Speaker 1: I would also being gratified by ten Alton and other 180 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:19,360 Speaker 1: boys because the boy scouts and it was very confused, 181 00:11:19,440 --> 00:11:24,400 Speaker 1: extremely confusing. There's a psychological theory called imprinting, in which 182 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:27,160 Speaker 1: a young animal learns the characteristics of a desirable meat. 183 00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 1: Just think of ducklings following their mother. There are key moments, 184 00:11:32,120 --> 00:11:35,320 Speaker 1: vulnerable moments, when his imprinting can occur, and when it does, 185 00:11:35,840 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 1: it can have lasting, even permanent consequences. Tim hates this theory, 186 00:11:41,760 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 1: which was mentioned to him by a therapist. He quickly 187 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:46,439 Speaker 1: fired and I get it. He doesn't want to think 188 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:50,040 Speaker 1: of himself as permanently branded altered forever by the abuse 189 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:53,680 Speaker 1: of Ted Alton. But what is the sexuality of a ten, eleven, 190 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 1: twelve year old boy? In many religious traditions, thirteen is 191 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:01,120 Speaker 1: the age when manhood first begins. What does it do 192 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:05,280 Speaker 1: to a psyche to have powerful sexual feelings triggered before 193 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:07,120 Speaker 1: a boy is ready and in the hands of a 194 00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:10,160 Speaker 1: skilled predator who was an honor to be invited into 195 00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:12,120 Speaker 1: t and there would be other boys there, And it 196 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:15,160 Speaker 1: all started out very tame is game truth or dare? 197 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:17,880 Speaker 1: And then it was then it became you know, more 198 00:12:17,960 --> 00:12:21,000 Speaker 1: dares and less truths. And what happened is it sort 199 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:26,600 Speaker 1: of spawns these relationships with these other boys, and for years, 200 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:31,680 Speaker 1: these other boys do things without head around. I slept 201 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:34,120 Speaker 1: with multiple sets of brothers, not at the same time, 202 00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 1: but a brother my age, and you know, one kid 203 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 1: my age and his older brother want the brother who 204 00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 1: slept at each other. So it's really really dark and dirty, 205 00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:48,679 Speaker 1: and it's it's the conversation that nobody wants to have. 206 00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:56,960 Speaker 1: So having all that be so knitted together with love 207 00:12:57,000 --> 00:13:00,199 Speaker 1: for this, you know, seemingly loving a father figure year 208 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:03,240 Speaker 1: and then everybody else who's in this kind of chosen 209 00:13:04,280 --> 00:13:07,600 Speaker 1: band of boys, I mean, it would be impossible to 210 00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:14,520 Speaker 1: be anything other than just horrendously confused. One of the 211 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:18,800 Speaker 1: things that I found in in digging into the material 212 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:22,280 Speaker 1: was the way in which Ted said to many of 213 00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:25,480 Speaker 1: the boys, this is our secret. And there was some 214 00:13:25,559 --> 00:13:29,880 Speaker 1: combination both of loyalty to him and of almost a 215 00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:33,680 Speaker 1: kind of implicit threat of no one can know about this, 216 00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 1: but also the potent combination of I've got the report 217 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 1: in front of me, um language like reasons for the 218 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:47,160 Speaker 1: lack of reporting by former students, right, you had in 219 00:13:47,200 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 1: the in the mix of UM for me and some 220 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:53,280 Speaker 1: of the guys, I know you know, the really deep 221 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:56,560 Speaker 1: doing to loneliness, because again what leads us into Ted's hand. 222 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:58,680 Speaker 1: But you know, an absent father, you know, I mean, 223 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:01,600 Speaker 1: I mean I came from a large family and who 224 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:04,720 Speaker 1: had time for me. I mean, thank God for my grandparents. Um, 225 00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:07,199 Speaker 1: but I never felt loved in my house, you know, 226 00:14:07,240 --> 00:14:09,240 Speaker 1: I think my parents ever said that to me. And 227 00:14:09,280 --> 00:14:11,840 Speaker 1: that's that's what he gave you. He showed us love. 228 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:16,240 Speaker 1: Here's another quote from the report. It is a well 229 00:14:16,280 --> 00:14:19,720 Speaker 1: known and well documented fact that child victims of abuse, 230 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:24,560 Speaker 1: especially sexual abuse, rarely report that abuse while they're still children. 231 00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:27,760 Speaker 1: In other words, even if they are able to hold 232 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:29,880 Speaker 1: on to it or remember it, it seems like there's 233 00:14:29,920 --> 00:14:33,320 Speaker 1: just this feeling of responsibility and shame and so many 234 00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:36,080 Speaker 1: complex feelings that are all tied up in it. I 235 00:14:36,120 --> 00:14:39,480 Speaker 1: think I spent thirty plus years of my life, h 236 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:43,000 Speaker 1: thirty five plus years really thinking that it was my 237 00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:46,960 Speaker 1: own fault, that I thought this out, that I needed 238 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 1: a father figure, that I enjoyed it, that I wanted it. 239 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:53,280 Speaker 1: And then there's also to be honest with your boys. 240 00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: There's two reasons why you know, boys never talked about this, 241 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 1: and it's because number one, you're going be accused of 242 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:05,240 Speaker 1: being gay, and number two, you know you're gonna they're 243 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:07,280 Speaker 1: gonna think you're gonna be a child molester one day. 244 00:15:07,480 --> 00:15:12,240 Speaker 1: And in nineteen seventy four, seventy five or seventy six 245 00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:15,840 Speaker 1: or whatever, this is being gay is essentially you know 246 00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:18,560 Speaker 1: your death tennis, So that is just not gonna happen. 247 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:21,480 Speaker 1: And you get near forties and your fifties and Eve 248 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:24,880 Speaker 1: internalize all this stuff. And for me, if I didn't 249 00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:26,600 Speaker 1: deal with it, I probably wouldn't be alive right now. 250 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:30,480 Speaker 1: When Tim finishes the eighth grade, his family falls on 251 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:34,560 Speaker 1: hard financial times, which precipitates a move to Baton Rouge, Louisiana. 252 00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: But Ted Alton had already done all the damage you 253 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:41,760 Speaker 1: would ever do by the time the boys hit puberty. 254 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:44,960 Speaker 1: He was kind of done with them. By eighth grade, 255 00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:50,360 Speaker 1: Tim had aged out. Everybody deals with trauma in a 256 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:53,600 Speaker 1: different way. Some people turn to sports, some to drugs 257 00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:56,840 Speaker 1: and alcohol. Tim just kept himself busy with his studies. 258 00:15:57,600 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 1: He graduated at the top of his class in high school, 259 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:03,440 Speaker 1: got into a great university. He kept busy with front life, 260 00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:07,280 Speaker 1: government bita Kappa. He eventually went to medical school and 261 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:10,480 Speaker 1: shose surgery one of the most difficult of all residencies. 262 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:15,000 Speaker 1: He was involved in everything because if he had free time, 263 00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:17,840 Speaker 1: if he was alone with his thoughts, he would go 264 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 1: to a very dark place. There's moments when there was 265 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:25,240 Speaker 1: a holiday or vacation, I'd have a hard time because 266 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:28,720 Speaker 1: I would just think too much. And I even to 267 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:32,840 Speaker 1: this day, I don't do well by myself. So that's 268 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:34,640 Speaker 1: how I sort of coped, which you know, I think 269 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:36,240 Speaker 1: it's better than most when I look at some of 270 00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 1: the very high achieving guys. But then there's then there's 271 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:42,920 Speaker 1: also a group of guys. There's two guys who were 272 00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:47,359 Speaker 1: teenagers who killed themselves. They killed themselves when they were teenagers. 273 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 1: Or you mean they killed themselves later, No, they killed 274 00:16:50,040 --> 00:16:58,920 Speaker 1: themselves when they were teenagers. Correct. Tim embarks on his 275 00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:02,680 Speaker 1: life as a quote on successful adult. At least on 276 00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:07,679 Speaker 1: the outside. He has girlfriends, dates women, enjoy sex with women. 277 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:11,320 Speaker 1: Eventually he gets married and has three children, but there 278 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:14,400 Speaker 1: are instances in which he finds himself attracted to men. 279 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:20,000 Speaker 1: Because here's the thing, Tim is gay. You know, I 280 00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:24,879 Speaker 1: always had attraction to women. I always had long term girlfriends. 281 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:27,639 Speaker 1: You know, there was a part of me that was 282 00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:32,159 Speaker 1: attracted two men after I moved. I never acted on 283 00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:35,240 Speaker 1: it all through college. I wasn't still he in the 284 00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:39,200 Speaker 1: medical school. I had one incident and then had such 285 00:17:39,240 --> 00:17:42,280 Speaker 1: negative feelings about it afterwards, felt so much guilt and 286 00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:45,360 Speaker 1: shame and nausea. To be honest with you, I don't 287 00:17:45,359 --> 00:17:48,879 Speaker 1: think I vomited, but I just felt so shitty that 288 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:51,560 Speaker 1: I didn't do anything again for years. Tim, did you 289 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:58,080 Speaker 1: at the time recognize that you're really negative? Almost visceral 290 00:17:58,160 --> 00:18:05,119 Speaker 1: physical response was directly tied to that childhood abuse? Not 291 00:18:05,240 --> 00:18:08,240 Speaker 1: at all, Not at all. I still think you know 292 00:18:08,359 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 1: my brain when I thought about Ted and the boy, 293 00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 1: I thought about that man. I was lonely, I was 294 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:17,800 Speaker 1: looking for a father figure. I enjoyed the sexual gratification. 295 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:21,439 Speaker 1: And that was the script that I told myself. But 296 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:24,040 Speaker 1: I still probably tell myself, but maybe that was a better, 297 00:18:24,400 --> 00:18:27,320 Speaker 1: a safer place, that narrative and the reality you know 298 00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:30,920 Speaker 1: in nineteen four that I'm gay and that I was 299 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:34,360 Speaker 1: sexually abused and my family fucking sucks. So for me, 300 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:37,320 Speaker 1: I think that narrative for me was very self protective 301 00:18:37,560 --> 00:18:40,359 Speaker 1: and un't I don't mean to laugh, but no, I 302 00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:44,120 Speaker 1: think that that's true. And and there's something really powerful 303 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:47,160 Speaker 1: and interesting about adaptation, you know, being able to be 304 00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:54,360 Speaker 1: adaptive under even really really extreme circumstances. Tim goes through 305 00:18:54,359 --> 00:18:57,919 Speaker 1: the motions he digs into his bariatric practice. He and 306 00:18:57,960 --> 00:19:00,520 Speaker 1: his wife welcomed two girls into the world, and then 307 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 1: his son is born. But there's something about having a 308 00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:07,359 Speaker 1: boy that really, um kind of rocked my world, remember 309 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:12,480 Speaker 1: when he was born, and that really led to more 310 00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:15,399 Speaker 1: feelings of my life, of thoughts about me as a 311 00:19:15,440 --> 00:19:19,080 Speaker 1: boy and Pitt and the Voice Scouts and my adventures 312 00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 1: and you know what happened to me. And I mean, look, 313 00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:24,160 Speaker 1: I always, I always knew what happened. You know, I didn't. 314 00:19:24,520 --> 00:19:26,159 Speaker 1: I'm not one of these people who said, you know, 315 00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:28,040 Speaker 1: I never thought about it, and boom, you know, I 316 00:19:28,080 --> 00:19:29,480 Speaker 1: read about it and all put it back to me. 317 00:19:29,520 --> 00:19:32,720 Speaker 1: Yet I knew every day it happened. I probably thought 318 00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:35,840 Speaker 1: about it every single day in my life. But when 319 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:40,639 Speaker 1: he was born, it really became pervasive. At the time, 320 00:19:40,840 --> 00:19:44,400 Speaker 1: Tim lived in Westport, Connecticut. Westport is not too far 321 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 1: from me, I know it well. If you look up 322 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:51,480 Speaker 1: effluent suburb in the dictionary, Westport's picture would appear, well, 323 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:54,199 Speaker 1: not really, but you know what I mean. It's a 324 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:57,720 Speaker 1: place where mom's in Lulu lemon yoga pants, push strollers 325 00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:01,000 Speaker 1: down Main Street and tanned fit dad's take their kids 326 00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:05,080 Speaker 1: to jiu jitsu and tennis lessons on weekends. A place 327 00:20:05,119 --> 00:20:07,240 Speaker 1: where if there is some aspect of your world that 328 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:10,679 Speaker 1: is secret or painful, you might feel like you're the 329 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:14,200 Speaker 1: only one. Everybody looks like they're living their best life. 330 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:19,119 Speaker 1: My point is Tim tried really hard to wrap up 331 00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:23,560 Speaker 1: his secrets and put them away. I've gotten the therapy 332 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:31,440 Speaker 1: in two eight, right around Thanksgiving, really triggered by marital problems, 333 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:35,120 Speaker 1: work problems. Everything is sort of coming to a head, 334 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:39,080 Speaker 1: and I was sort of a taking time bomb. I 335 00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:42,240 Speaker 1: couldn't keep this sort of house of cards I built. 336 00:20:42,760 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 1: I couldn't keep it together any longer. I was really 337 00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:51,320 Speaker 1: really struggling. If I hadn't of gotten into therapy and 338 00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:54,560 Speaker 1: really done the work that I need to do, um, 339 00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:57,000 Speaker 1: I probably would not be alive today. And I know that. 340 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:00,080 Speaker 1: I know that. But either I was going to know 341 00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:03,760 Speaker 1: myself or I was going to run off the road 342 00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:05,879 Speaker 1: driving to New York at three o'clock in the morning 343 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:10,600 Speaker 1: to meet somebody asleep with them after working a twelve 344 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:15,280 Speaker 1: hour day and putting my kids to bed. We're going 345 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:24,160 Speaker 1: to pause for a moment. Even though Tim felt comfortable 346 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:26,879 Speaker 1: with his therapist, he didn't talk about the sexual abuse. 347 00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 1: By that Alton, he was trying to keep it all going, 348 00:21:30,119 --> 00:21:34,160 Speaker 1: his marriage, his family, his practice, his attraction to men. 349 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:36,840 Speaker 1: And I was in a lot of denial. And I 350 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:38,879 Speaker 1: didn't and I didn't want to talk about it. I 351 00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:40,879 Speaker 1: wanted to deal with the problems at hand. I didn't 352 00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:43,000 Speaker 1: really see this that you were that they were all related, 353 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,560 Speaker 1: but obviously they were just really hard to admit that. 354 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:50,720 Speaker 1: It really wasn't so much much later that I realized 355 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:52,800 Speaker 1: that I liked being with men because I liked being 356 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:54,560 Speaker 1: with men and had nothing to do with the fact 357 00:21:54,600 --> 00:22:02,960 Speaker 1: that that I was molested as a child. Tim's therapist 358 00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 1: asked him to create a timeline of the abuse. The 359 00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:08,800 Speaker 1: writing unleashes his memory and also begins to give him 360 00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:12,600 Speaker 1: a sense of purpose. So every Friday I started taking 361 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:15,399 Speaker 1: off and I would sit at the Westport Library and 362 00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:18,640 Speaker 1: I was basically writing for therapy, and it would lead 363 00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 1: me to sort of finding people. Well, let me think, well, man, 364 00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:24,639 Speaker 1: that kid was next to me in the tent, and 365 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:28,320 Speaker 1: this guy went to camp with and you know, Wow, 366 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:32,080 Speaker 1: where where are they all now? And so I accumulated 367 00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:36,160 Speaker 1: a list of fifty or sixty names. Half were other 368 00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:39,720 Speaker 1: children that I knew for a fact were abused, noe, 369 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:43,520 Speaker 1: more kids I suspected the restaurant or parents who I 370 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: felt probably knew. And then there were teachers who was 371 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:50,359 Speaker 1: extremely cathartic to put it on paper. And I started 372 00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:52,840 Speaker 1: reaching out to people. I traveled, and I went to 373 00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 1: visit some of these guys that I grew up with 374 00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,800 Speaker 1: to connect, to bond with him, to talk about this, 375 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:03,600 Speaker 1: because I've been thinking about this in my brain for still. 376 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:07,320 Speaker 1: It was like a like a tape cassette's on a loop. Finally, 377 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:09,639 Speaker 1: I just wanted to be able to talk to somebody 378 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:11,480 Speaker 1: about who was there to validate because I thought I 379 00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:14,240 Speaker 1: was going crazy. So I was starting to really be 380 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:22,520 Speaker 1: aware and read about stories. I'm somebody who hates picking 381 00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:24,119 Speaker 1: up the phone to call a person who may not 382 00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:27,040 Speaker 1: want to hear from me, which is why I'm a novelist, 383 00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 1: a memoirist, and now a podcaster and not say an 384 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:35,000 Speaker 1: investigative journalist. So when I think about what Tim did next, 385 00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:37,800 Speaker 1: I'm pretty blown away by the courage it took. I 386 00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:39,760 Speaker 1: think you will be too. But that's what sort of 387 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 1: led me on the path. And I did talk to 388 00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:44,200 Speaker 1: a few of these guys, some of them who told 389 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:47,280 Speaker 1: me to funk off. Who is my number. One of 390 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:49,439 Speaker 1: the guys have become like a brother to me, like 391 00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:53,120 Speaker 1: one of my dearest friends in my life, who when 392 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:56,480 Speaker 1: I actually ended up hiring this law firm, this one 393 00:23:56,840 --> 00:24:00,240 Speaker 1: friend basically told me, he said, look, I'm I'm proud 394 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:02,800 Speaker 1: of you, but I can't talk to you anymore. I 395 00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:04,959 Speaker 1: don't want this in my life. Good luck to you, 396 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:08,000 Speaker 1: but do not ever call me. And it was hurtful, 397 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 1: but I also knew that I needed to go forward 398 00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:13,240 Speaker 1: and do this. And fast forward a year later and 399 00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:16,679 Speaker 1: being his brother, both point us and it has been 400 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:18,960 Speaker 1: the best thing that he has ever done in his life. 401 00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:23,000 Speaker 1: And I'm so proud of him. So the Pingree Survivors, 402 00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:26,000 Speaker 1: the band of boys who had once been methodically groomed 403 00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,400 Speaker 1: by Ted Alton, become a band of men hell bent 404 00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:33,000 Speaker 1: on transcending their history of abuse. And it all started 405 00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:36,520 Speaker 1: with Tim reaching out, picking up the phone, trying to 406 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:41,159 Speaker 1: make contact. You remember, I was out in Napa at 407 00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:44,720 Speaker 1: a friend's wedding, and I took the time out to 408 00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:49,000 Speaker 1: drive down to Monterey to have drinks with one of 409 00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:50,840 Speaker 1: these guys. And that was the first time I've seen 410 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:54,480 Speaker 1: him with sweer children. I had actually, you know, paid 411 00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:57,280 Speaker 1: like people finders dot com or something like that to 412 00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:00,520 Speaker 1: figure out where he lived prior to that, and I was, 413 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:04,000 Speaker 1: I guess I was sort of cyber stalking these people. Um. 414 00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:06,080 Speaker 1: But I called him up, said, hey, look, I'm gonna 415 00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:09,560 Speaker 1: be in California. I want to come down there and 416 00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:12,080 Speaker 1: I want to go out of the beer And that's 417 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:15,520 Speaker 1: exactly what we did, and quickly, I don't know how 418 00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:18,280 Speaker 1: it started, um, but I brought it up. I said, 419 00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:20,200 Speaker 1: do you ever think about what it was like when 420 00:25:20,200 --> 00:25:22,280 Speaker 1: we were kids or the effect has had in your life? 421 00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:26,080 Speaker 1: And and that became two three four or final I 422 00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:31,280 Speaker 1: don't even remember, of alcohol and tears and hugs and 423 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:38,320 Speaker 1: a little bit laughter. Tim continues his detective work. His 424 00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:40,480 Speaker 1: children are wondering why their father is all of a 425 00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:43,440 Speaker 1: sudden taking trips, spending late nights talking on the phone 426 00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:46,440 Speaker 1: behind closed doors. So finally he decided that he's going 427 00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:49,960 Speaker 1: on a reconnaissance mission, and he returns to Pingry, the 428 00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:53,560 Speaker 1: scene of the crime with his oldest daughter, Zoe, I 429 00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:57,240 Speaker 1: took her one weekday during the must have been off 430 00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:01,080 Speaker 1: school school break, and we went down to pingry Do. 431 00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:04,560 Speaker 1: I wanted to go look at old yearbooks to remember 432 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:09,080 Speaker 1: names and faces and teachers that I couldn't remember. So 433 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:11,160 Speaker 1: we were driving down there and I said, well, I'm 434 00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:14,359 Speaker 1: doing a little research. When I went to the school, 435 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:16,080 Speaker 1: I told him the story that my brother had died, 436 00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:18,120 Speaker 1: which is true, and I wanted to find some old 437 00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:21,960 Speaker 1: photos of my brother at his time at Pingary It's 438 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:23,719 Speaker 1: a really important time from So that was my execuse 439 00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:26,960 Speaker 1: to get into the school library. And Joe and I, 440 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:31,200 Speaker 1: my my oldest daughter, we went down to the school. Yeah, 441 00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:34,120 Speaker 1: I hadn't been there since, you know, the sixth grade 442 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:37,760 Speaker 1: or seventh grade or whatever it was, and uh, it 443 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:42,159 Speaker 1: was really really uncomfortable. But they had renovated the school, 444 00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:44,240 Speaker 1: so at least his office was gone. I didn't have 445 00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:47,399 Speaker 1: to see that, but they were the cross fields and 446 00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:51,040 Speaker 1: the soccer fields and the building and this sweet little 447 00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:57,439 Speaker 1: wonderful school. We're always awful has happened. Tim begins to 448 00:26:57,520 --> 00:27:00,520 Speaker 1: understand that Ted Alton's abuse is not lim did to 449 00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:04,640 Speaker 1: a small group of boys. The yearbook photographs Joga's memory 450 00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:07,400 Speaker 1: and he reaches out to another boy, now grown man, 451 00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:11,600 Speaker 1: who he remembers from that time. The two men reconnect 452 00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,600 Speaker 1: and for the first time Tim hears and understands that 453 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 1: there were adults, many adults, not only his parents, but teachers, administrators, 454 00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:24,600 Speaker 1: board members who had suspected Ted Alton of abuse and 455 00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:29,159 Speaker 1: done nothing. Once Alton's behavior had become impossible to ignore, 456 00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:32,199 Speaker 1: a meeting of prominent fathers was called for in a 457 00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 1: board member's home, and a psychiatrist was brought in to 458 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:37,600 Speaker 1: advise them, and we actually have a notes and meeting, 459 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:43,600 Speaker 1: and basically a psychiatrist his recommendation that these fathers was 460 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:45,800 Speaker 1: that bas need to get the scuy at the school 461 00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:50,680 Speaker 1: and not discuss it and just move forward, but basically 462 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:52,919 Speaker 1: deny the whole thing. Don't put the kids through the 463 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:57,480 Speaker 1: trauma of a trial. Remember earlier when I said that 464 00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:00,760 Speaker 1: this story is ultimately about the failure of adults, Well, 465 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 1: this is even more than a case of good men 466 00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:06,439 Speaker 1: doing nothing. These men, and they did all seem to 467 00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 1: be men, knew they needed to get rid of Alton. 468 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:12,720 Speaker 1: So they passed the trash in Tim's words, and write 469 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:17,560 Speaker 1: Alton a glowing letter of recommendation to another new Jersey 470 00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:22,359 Speaker 1: Prep School, essentially making Alton somebody else's problem, and not 471 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:24,760 Speaker 1: seeming to consider that this would mean he would continue 472 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:30,879 Speaker 1: to abuse kids elsewhere. And these were dads, who fathers, 473 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:34,160 Speaker 1: who worked on Wall Street, who were the CFO of 474 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:37,960 Speaker 1: huge companies. And I think that there is a part 475 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:40,840 Speaker 1: where they wanted to let's just put this to bed. 476 00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:44,280 Speaker 1: Nobody wants to be the father who is working while 477 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 1: their son is off in the woods being abused. Here's 478 00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:51,880 Speaker 1: where a very strange coincidence enters the picture. While I 479 00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:54,000 Speaker 1: was working on this story, I happened to run into 480 00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:56,040 Speaker 1: a man who had been a teacher at Pingree long ago. 481 00:28:57,040 --> 00:29:00,400 Speaker 1: And by the way, this never happens. I can count 482 00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:02,240 Speaker 1: on one hand the number of times I run into 483 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:04,920 Speaker 1: anyone I had known it Pingry in my entire adult life. 484 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:07,920 Speaker 1: It just doesn't happen. This guy was well aware of 485 00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:11,120 Speaker 1: the controversy and the twenty one survivors. I asked him 486 00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:14,040 Speaker 1: if he had ever suspected anything. And here's what he said. 487 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 1: We knew, he said, We all knew that something very 488 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 1: wrong was going on in Ted Alton's office. I debate 489 00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:24,640 Speaker 1: about whether to tell him this because it's just such 490 00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 1: a slap in the face. But I have to, I 491 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:30,800 Speaker 1: have to tell him, well, you know, he just gave 492 00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:34,480 Speaker 1: me chills, and and and I don't really if this 493 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:37,440 Speaker 1: stuff get me angry anymore, But this is what makes 494 00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:42,080 Speaker 1: me so angry, so angry, because we know they all knew. 495 00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:46,000 Speaker 1: We know the athletics director who hired Ted to be 496 00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 1: his coach, who who owned the camp at Loganoki. We 497 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:54,240 Speaker 1: know he knew. Fathers spoke to him about this, but 498 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:59,320 Speaker 1: nobody did anything. Camp Waganaki is perhaps the darkest part 499 00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:03,000 Speaker 1: of a very dark story. Waganaki was owned by Pingree's 500 00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:07,520 Speaker 1: Director of Athletics, award winning soccer coach, biology teacher. In fact, 501 00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:11,200 Speaker 1: he had been my biology teacher and responsible for bringing 502 00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:15,040 Speaker 1: in some of the largest donations in the school's history. Yeah. 503 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:19,160 Speaker 1: So for four years, um from fourth to you know, 504 00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 1: I don't know, fourth to seventh grade summers, I my 505 00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:26,360 Speaker 1: two brothers spent at Camp Waganoky in East Waterford, Maine, 506 00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:31,560 Speaker 1: which was owned by uh, you know, Pingree athletic director. 507 00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:34,760 Speaker 1: You know, so you have this wonderful, rich summer and 508 00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:37,400 Speaker 1: I was up there for seven weeks every summer. My parents, 509 00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 1: you know, need to get rid of all the boys, 510 00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:42,080 Speaker 1: you know, building his wonderful relationships. And on the flip side, 511 00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:45,840 Speaker 1: it was having had all non steroids because you know, 512 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:49,000 Speaker 1: gave him a free license to for five days in 513 00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:51,240 Speaker 1: the woods with him. Trip you know was to be 514 00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:53,520 Speaker 1: five days at a time the Alegash I think trip 515 00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 1: was almost a week and there was no adult supervision 516 00:30:56,920 --> 00:31:02,640 Speaker 1: other than him. So um, it was really this very 517 00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:06,320 Speaker 1: strange time because it was so wonderful, but then it 518 00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:08,800 Speaker 1: was also so dark, and I remember falling into this 519 00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:12,120 Speaker 1: sleep in his tent with the cries from one of 520 00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:14,680 Speaker 1: my friends who was abused for the first time. I 521 00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:18,040 Speaker 1: was a kid from Pennsylvania, you know, if he didn't 522 00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:20,320 Speaker 1: go to Pingary and where the rest of us was like, oh, 523 00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:21,840 Speaker 1: this is all that We've been doing this for years 524 00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 1: as boy scouts, So what are you crying about? Get 525 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:30,800 Speaker 1: used to it. After the school's independent report, the survivors 526 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:34,520 Speaker 1: were each interviewed by Pingree's attorneys and insurance provider. They 527 00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:36,560 Speaker 1: were questioned as to why they hadn't complained at the 528 00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:40,440 Speaker 1: time to a responsible adult. So when when they had 529 00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:43,040 Speaker 1: that argument of why didn't you complain to somebody who 530 00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:45,400 Speaker 1: knew They all knew who were going to complain to 531 00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:49,280 Speaker 1: you know, Ted Dalton's mother in law was the vice 532 00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:52,040 Speaker 1: principal of the school. Who we're going to complain to you. 533 00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 1: We're gonna plain the administration. He was the administration. It's 534 00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:58,680 Speaker 1: ludicrous to think that that we had any voice whatsoever. 535 00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:02,520 Speaker 1: So finally, at you know, efty years old, I finally 536 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:04,960 Speaker 1: have a voice. And that, for me is what this 537 00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,720 Speaker 1: has all been about, is giving me a voice. That 538 00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,400 Speaker 1: the writing was about. That's what our conversation is about, 539 00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:13,560 Speaker 1: is giving you know, a boy who never had a 540 00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:18,320 Speaker 1: voice in his home, this family, in the school. That's 541 00:32:18,800 --> 00:32:22,000 Speaker 1: that's what I think about. Pingry also sent a letter 542 00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:25,240 Speaker 1: to the whole school community. I received one myself. In it, 543 00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:29,960 Speaker 1: the school denied prior knowledge of its history of abuse. Ironically, 544 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,080 Speaker 1: this denial is ultimately what made many of the men 545 00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,920 Speaker 1: step forward. They had understandably been reticent about being public 546 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:40,600 Speaker 1: about reliving the worst chapter of their lives. But the 547 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:42,680 Speaker 1: letter was a punch in the face to some very 548 00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:47,080 Speaker 1: strong willed people. We had a joint call, and maybe 549 00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:49,280 Speaker 1: only eight of us were on a call. We all 550 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:51,760 Speaker 1: went around and you know, people all live all over 551 00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:54,240 Speaker 1: the place, and men on for like two hours and 552 00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:57,880 Speaker 1: everybody told their stories and just hearing you know, these 553 00:32:57,920 --> 00:32:59,800 Speaker 1: guys some of them, somebody didn't know something. These guys 554 00:32:59,800 --> 00:33:02,960 Speaker 1: didn't know it all. Some of them. I remember, God, 555 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:04,840 Speaker 1: he was the guy who was like, you know, he 556 00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:07,760 Speaker 1: was my water skia coach at camp, and I thought 557 00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 1: he was the coolest guy. You know, and he's on 558 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,800 Speaker 1: the call and you know, and you're talking to me. 559 00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:15,840 Speaker 1: The guy who was the captain of the football team 560 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:19,080 Speaker 1: is great athletes. He was on the call. But hearing 561 00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:22,600 Speaker 1: everybody's stories and it just made me so freaking sad. 562 00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:25,560 Speaker 1: But I also think it's somebody that finally, for the 563 00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,560 Speaker 1: first time for many of us and in all these years, 564 00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:32,239 Speaker 1: like people that can we can identify with. Because as 565 00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:34,520 Speaker 1: much as you can explain this to your friend and 566 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:37,200 Speaker 1: you know, your your wife or your lover or whoever, 567 00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:40,040 Speaker 1: you hear the same things like, oh well, I hope 568 00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:43,080 Speaker 1: you get closure, And you never get closure on this stuff, 569 00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:50,080 Speaker 1: you evolve. The Band of Men came to New York twice. 570 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:54,920 Speaker 1: The first time they were individually deposed. After those depositions 571 00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,440 Speaker 1: were taken, there was a lot of stalling until the 572 00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:00,800 Speaker 1: two sides agreed to discuss the matter. Kingley knew that 573 00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:03,880 Speaker 1: the survivors had a strong case. Some of the survivors 574 00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:08,360 Speaker 1: wanted to go to court, some didn't. We had to individually, 575 00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:13,279 Speaker 1: over the course of the week tell our stories to headmaster, 576 00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 1: representatives from the boarders, trustees, attorneys for the school, attorneys 577 00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:22,840 Speaker 1: for the insurance company, representatives from the insurance company, and 578 00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:25,600 Speaker 1: then our attorneys that we're all in this room sort 579 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:32,040 Speaker 1: of reliving our story specifically. And also we were asked 580 00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:36,719 Speaker 1: to write our what they call our impact statements. How 581 00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:40,799 Speaker 1: did this abuse affect your life? Is what they're trying 582 00:34:40,840 --> 00:34:43,319 Speaker 1: to do, and they're trying to meet a settlement and 583 00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:45,879 Speaker 1: figure out what is this case worth? Does this guy 584 00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:48,240 Speaker 1: have a case? And I'll tell you writing that impact 585 00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:53,319 Speaker 1: statement was really was trouming them of itself. Yeah, but 586 00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:58,400 Speaker 1: the similar things is depression, anxiety to a side attempts, 587 00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:06,480 Speaker 1: ex editions, huge sexual identification problems, marital discord, job failures. 588 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,440 Speaker 1: The list goes on. But so that's the kind of 589 00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:12,000 Speaker 1: thing we had to talk about, which is, you know, 590 00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:15,520 Speaker 1: hard enough to do with our therapists, but then to 591 00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:17,319 Speaker 1: do it with in front of a people, a group 592 00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:21,000 Speaker 1: of people who obviously, for me, I would target on 593 00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:22,600 Speaker 1: my back because I know they all hate naked. I'm 594 00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:26,440 Speaker 1: the one who brought all this diffruition in the end 595 00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:32,440 Speaker 1: Ingry settlement. Yes, right, yes, and yet there is a 596 00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:35,040 Speaker 1: thorn in the side of that settlement, one that may 597 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,960 Speaker 1: never be put right. The owner of Camp Waganaki, who 598 00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:42,400 Speaker 1: just had the most expensive building in Pingree's history named 599 00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:46,439 Speaker 1: after him. Right, that is one of the first things 600 00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:50,800 Speaker 1: that was discussed amongst the plaintiffs, and it's a recurring 601 00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:54,439 Speaker 1: theme in all of our stories, is that how could 602 00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:57,400 Speaker 1: he have not known? And you know, we we know 603 00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:00,759 Speaker 1: that one of the fathers spoke to him know about Ted, 604 00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:04,319 Speaker 1: and everybody at the camp knew, and so we did. 605 00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:08,440 Speaker 1: We asked, we said, have some compassion for us. You know, 606 00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:12,440 Speaker 1: let's let's do our investigation. Let you do your investigation. 607 00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:16,399 Speaker 1: Please don't shove it in our face. And the name 608 00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:20,480 Speaker 1: of sixty million dollar building after someone that let this 609 00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:23,719 Speaker 1: go on. I'd like to quote from the letters signed 610 00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:25,960 Speaker 1: by the survivors and addressed to the Pingree community after 611 00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:29,000 Speaker 1: the report first came out. So in it it's written 612 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:31,360 Speaker 1: that we hope that revealing the truth about the abuse 613 00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:33,040 Speaker 1: of Pingree will serve as a first step in the 614 00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:36,040 Speaker 1: healing process. Do you feel now that there have been 615 00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:38,840 Speaker 1: steps taken towards your personal healing, towards the healing of 616 00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:42,520 Speaker 1: the men who were those abused boys? Absolutely, I um. 617 00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:46,520 Speaker 1: But it's really about I think the conversations and connections 618 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:50,120 Speaker 1: between us, which is all elevated everybody else up. I 619 00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:53,520 Speaker 1: spoke to one gentleman today and talked him a few 620 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,200 Speaker 1: months and you know, he had written that he had moved. 621 00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:57,560 Speaker 1: You have to be closer with son and and so 622 00:36:58,000 --> 00:36:59,800 Speaker 1: I know that he connects with you know, another planet, 623 00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:02,640 Speaker 1: become good friends, and they traveled together. And then this 624 00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:05,200 Speaker 1: summer I spent a week in Florida with the one 625 00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:08,960 Speaker 1: guy went the Jersey Shore was another one. And I 626 00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:13,600 Speaker 1: think it's those moments of that camaraderie, you know. And 627 00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:15,560 Speaker 1: again I think if you look at us, a lot 628 00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:20,000 Speaker 1: of us don't have strong family connections or um and 629 00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:23,160 Speaker 1: maybe some resentment. I mean, hey, where are my parents 630 00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:28,319 Speaker 1: when this is going on? The last thing I would 631 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:31,440 Speaker 1: ask is like now moving forward, like moving forward in 632 00:37:31,480 --> 00:37:34,799 Speaker 1: your life where this is starting to be something that 633 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:37,440 Speaker 1: you feel ready to move on from in the sense 634 00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:40,360 Speaker 1: that you've had There's no such thing as closure, but 635 00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:45,359 Speaker 1: you do have a certain degree of what would you say? 636 00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:48,520 Speaker 1: You know, I just said, there's one day where my 637 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:51,000 Speaker 1: and my kids have been through a lot because of 638 00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:55,000 Speaker 1: all this um and I hope there's one day where 639 00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:58,200 Speaker 1: they can really get back and reflect and think, Hey, 640 00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 1: my dad as much a bad guy, he did a 641 00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:03,640 Speaker 1: lot of good and maybe here's a reason now why 642 00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:07,520 Speaker 1: he wasn't there. He was disconnected. You know, I don't 643 00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:10,200 Speaker 1: want to be a survivor. I want to be a 644 00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:11,640 Speaker 1: thriver and I need to and I want to move 645 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:13,920 Speaker 1: from this and I feel good about that every single day. 646 00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:24,160 Speaker 1: It's a wonderful feeling. I'd like to thank my guest, 647 00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:27,319 Speaker 1: Tim Rlick for his courage and sharing his story with 648 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:30,120 Speaker 1: us today. You can find out more about Tim's work 649 00:38:30,200 --> 00:38:33,560 Speaker 1: to make the Pingree School and other institutions safer and 650 00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:39,560 Speaker 1: healthier for children at Pingree survivors dot org. Family Secrets 651 00:38:39,560 --> 00:38:42,440 Speaker 1: is an i Heeart media production. Dylan Fagan is a 652 00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:46,840 Speaker 1: supervising producer, Andrew Howard and Tristan McNeil are the audio engineers, 653 00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:50,880 Speaker 1: and Julie Douglas is the executive producer. If you have 654 00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:53,279 Speaker 1: a family secret you'd like to share, you can get 655 00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:56,640 Speaker 1: in touch with us at listener mail at Family Secrets 656 00:38:56,680 --> 00:39:00,080 Speaker 1: Podcast dot com. You can also find us on to 657 00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:04,359 Speaker 1: Gram at Danny Writer, and Facebook at Family Secrets Pod, 658 00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:08,439 Speaker 1: and Twitter at Fam Secrets Pod. That's fam Secrets Pod. 659 00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:12,719 Speaker 1: For more about my book, Inheritance, visit Danny Shapiro dot 660 00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:20,320 Speaker 1: com