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Speaker 1: Nancy Grace is coming to Fox Nation. I Want justice.

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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace premieres March ninth, only on

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Speaker 1: Fox Nation. He had a whole future in front of him.

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Speaker 1: Why was this young guy at devout Mormon scrubbed in sunshine,

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Speaker 1: hard worker, sparkling blue eyes, beautiful smile, the apple of

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Speaker 1: his family's eyes found dead, his body stabbed nearly thirty times,

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Speaker 1: throat slit, ear to ear, capped off with a gunshot

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Speaker 1: wound to the head. Why Why did Travis Alexander have

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Speaker 1: to die? In the last hours Breaking news and the

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Speaker 1: Jodi Arias criminal case, Joe the Aria is convicted of

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Speaker 1: Travis's murderer, allegedly stabbing, shooting, slicing Travis Alexander dead when

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Speaker 1: she finds out he's going to go on a trip

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Speaker 1: with another woman. Will Jody Arius walk free over my

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Speaker 1: cold dead body? I Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 1: What's going on? Um? Our friend of ours is dead

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Speaker 1: in his bedroom. We hadn't heard from for a while.

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Speaker 1: His roommates some blood. I didn't know when, but I

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Speaker 1: can give you the song to someone who went in

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Speaker 1: there can Yes, please, Hi, So what's going on? He's dead?

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Speaker 1: He's in his bedroom Okay, in the shower. Okay, how

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Speaker 1: did this happen? Do you have any idea? Well, we

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Speaker 1: have no idea. Everyone's been wondering about him for She

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Speaker 1: says that there's blood, So is it coming from his head?

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Speaker 1: Did he? It's all over the place? Hold on just

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Speaker 1: a moment. Okay, you're a good friend of of Travis's

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Speaker 1: trest Sam. Okay, Hassi had been depressed it all, thinking

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Speaker 1: about hating, suicide, anything like that. I don't think he's

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Speaker 1: been in tua. He's been really depressed because he broke

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Speaker 1: up with this girl and he was upset about that.

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Speaker 1: But I don't think he would actually kill himself over that.

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Speaker 1: Has he been threatened by anyone recently? Has he hasn't?

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Speaker 1: He has an ex girlfriend that's been bothering him and

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Speaker 1: following him in, flashing tires and things like that. And

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Speaker 1: do you know the ex girlfriend, sam Um, her name

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Speaker 1: is Jody. In the last hours, breaking news in the

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Speaker 1: case of convicted killer Jodi Arius. I mean, see, Grace,

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Speaker 1: this is crime Stories. Thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 1: You were just hearing the nine one one call May

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Speaker 1: when Travis Alexander's friends found him dead in the shower

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Speaker 1: twenty eight to twenty nine stab wounds and a bullet

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Speaker 1: to the head. But first take a listen to more

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Speaker 1: of that nine one one call. No roommate, when was

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Speaker 1: the last time he saw Travis? Was it three days ago? Um?

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Speaker 1: That do you guys? When we was lasting yourself that

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Speaker 1: I'm Travis. They want to know what's from room? Last

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Speaker 1: time I saw him? Was what part of the last

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Speaker 1: I remember seeing him? The last third day? Was him

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Speaker 1: food me me some last Tuesday? On our last Monday.

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Speaker 1: She talked to him last Monday. Okay, and everyone is

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Speaker 1: out of the house. There's no one else in the house. No,

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Speaker 1: no one's in the house. And what is your name?

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Speaker 1: My name is Michelle. I need to ask a friend.

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Speaker 1: I'm being here. I'm getting fun to me. Okay, good Hia,

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Speaker 1: And this is okay. That's hub is in his bedroom. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're hearing more of the nine one one call from

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Speaker 1: the friends of Travis Alexander that find his dead body

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Speaker 1: in the shower stall, decomposing in the last hours. The

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Speaker 1: appeal file by convicted killer his lover Jodi Arius, has

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Speaker 1: been rejected is at the end, I guarantee The answer

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Speaker 1: is no. The Arizona Appeals Court upholding the Jodi Arias

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Speaker 1: and murder conviction, Arius arguing about the quote circus atmosphere

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Speaker 1: of her trial and attacking the prosecutor. While no love

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Speaker 1: is lost between the defense and the prosecution, was there

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Speaker 1: really an appealable error guarding the trial at the time

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Speaker 1: was renowned defense attorney Kirk Nurmi for Jodi Arius, author

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Speaker 1: I've trapped with miss Arius that fought tooth and nail

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Speaker 1: to guarantee her affair trial with me an all star

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Speaker 1: panel joining me. That lawyer Kirk Nurmi, former special Asian

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Speaker 1: FBI start a Facebook series Curse of Aka Court. Bobby Chicone,

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Speaker 1: professor forensics, Jackson State University, author Blood Beneath My Feet

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Speaker 1: on Amazon, Joseph Scott Morgan, renowned forensics psychiatrist on Instagram,

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Speaker 1: doctor Daniel Bober. But right now, to Crime online dot

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Speaker 1: Com investigative reporter Alexis Terres Chuck, Alexis, let's just start

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Speaker 1: with the breaking news. The court has rejected Jodi Arius's appeal.

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Speaker 1: Tell me what happened? So, Jody ten no, I'm sorry.

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Speaker 1: Twelve years after she killed Travis Alexander filed an appeal

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Speaker 1: to the court in Arizona, and she cleaned that she

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Speaker 1: deserved to have her conviction thrown out talked out completely,

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Speaker 1: because she said that one the prosecutor was mean to her,

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Speaker 1: he was bullying her, and two that the media it

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Speaker 1: became a media circus in the court because of all

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Speaker 1: the coverage on the case, including specifically you, Nancy Grace,

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Speaker 1: you are one of the reasons why it was such

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Speaker 1: a crazy trial, and that the media influenced the jurors,

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Speaker 1: and that she deserved a new trial because one the

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Speaker 1: prosecutor was mean to her and to the media cared

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Speaker 1: about her. Did you say the prosecutor was quote mean

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Speaker 1: to her and is that what the appeal said. Yes,

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Speaker 1: she said that he was aggressive with her. Man, I

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Speaker 1: would feel like the jury would hate my guts if

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Speaker 1: I didn't come out guns a blazing, take no prisoners

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Speaker 1: in every martyr trial. Now, I wouldn't be hateful or

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Speaker 1: quote mean to use her words, not mine to witnesses

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Speaker 1: unless they started lying. But when you have a murder,

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Speaker 1: the jury wants avengement. They don't want a pushover in

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Speaker 1: the courtroom. I just don't understand how I play into

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Speaker 1: the whole scenario. But take a listen to ABC reporter

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Speaker 1: Paula Ferris, three years into serving that life sentence, Areas

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Speaker 1: is appealing to have the conviction overturned, alleging, among other things,

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Speaker 1: prosecutorial misconduct and that the court's failure to control news

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Speaker 1: coverage created a circus like atmosphere, which deprived her of

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Speaker 1: the right to a fair trial. The appeal also alleges

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Speaker 1: that certain TV personalities, like Nancy Grace, gave the trial

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Speaker 1: a reality TV flavor. Grace, reacting to that accusation on

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Speaker 1: her Serious XM podcast Crime Stories on Friday, how can

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Speaker 1: you get away from the fact that her own admission

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Speaker 1: and her camera can victed her, not me or anybody else,

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Speaker 1: And just days after her conviction, a defiant Arius speaking

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Speaker 1: to ABC News, So you really are never going to

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Speaker 1: tell the truth about what went down in the bathroom.

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Speaker 1: I don't know what you mean by that, because I've

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Speaker 1: told the truth, Okay. I didn't know that you were

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Speaker 1: a hater when you came to interview me. Oh, everybody's

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Speaker 1: a hater. It's everybody else's fault. But hers, I, you're

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Speaker 1: jogging my memory now. Alexis tres check. I think I

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Speaker 1: do remember Jody Arius shooting a bird at me in

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Speaker 1: the courtroom. I'm pretty pretty sure it was a sly bird,

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Speaker 1: like up against her head kind of. Anyway, that's a

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Speaker 1: whole nother can of worms. But I'll just split her

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Speaker 1: finger under her throat like she wanted to cut your throat.

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Speaker 1: Don't forget that part. Oh I forgot that part. You know,

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Speaker 1: Alexis is so great spending time with you. To your

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Speaker 1: special guest right now, renowned defense attorney Kirk Nermy, the

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Speaker 1: defense lawyer at trial, and oh what a trial. It

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Speaker 1: was not one, not two, but three trials. As I recall,

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Speaker 1: you've got the guilt innocence face, you've got the death

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Speaker 1: penalty face, which had to be redone. Maybe I'm forgetting

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Speaker 1: one of them. But Kurt Nermi is with me. Author

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Speaker 1: I've trapped with miss Arias. You can find it on Amazon.

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Speaker 1: Kurt Nermy, Let's see, does she blame you two? I can't.

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Speaker 1: I can't recall everything in her appeal. Actually the appeal

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Speaker 1: doesn't blame me. That'll come next. After her appeals denied.

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Speaker 1: Under Arizona law, miss Arias has a chance to claim

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Speaker 1: my ineffective assistance the counsel was the reason for the conviction.

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Speaker 1: So I don't know when I saw you in court,

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Speaker 1: you were fighting like a hell cat. Go ahead, well

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Speaker 1: I'll use that maybe perhaps Nancy, but yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: so that's gonna be next, those those challenges. So she's

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Speaker 1: gone after one of Martinez, she's gone after everybody else,

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Speaker 1: and you know she's obviously sued me, and now she's

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Speaker 1: going to go after me again. And to that, I say,

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Speaker 1: bring it on. I look forward to responding, ooh, you're

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Speaker 1: stolen my phrases. I love saying that right before a

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Speaker 1: trial started, Kurt Nermy what a lot of people don't know.

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Speaker 1: If they're not in the legal business, God bless them,

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Speaker 1: they've probably done the right thing. But defense attorneys get it.

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Speaker 1: Every time there's a conviction. You've got a defendant sitting

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Speaker 1: in jail looking at four walls, going I think they

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Speaker 1: convinced themselves they didn't really didn't do it. And once

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Speaker 1: in a while you do have one that didn't do it.

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Speaker 1: Very rarely, but they're sitting there and you're on the outside.

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Speaker 1: You were their lawyer, they made, had a bond with

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Speaker 1: you at trial, But then suddenly that all changes after

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Speaker 1: a few weeks behind bars, and they're like rats on

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Speaker 1: a sinking ship. They'll grab onto anything. Imagine a rat

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Speaker 1: grabbing onto you, because that's what it's like, and they

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Speaker 1: look at you. I don't have to imagine, Nancy. My

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Speaker 1: point is people think, oh, my stars, he was in effective.

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Speaker 1: He was a bad lawyer. This happens with practically every conviction.

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Speaker 1: The defendant and their new fleet of a pillot lawyers

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Speaker 1: come up with anything saying. They come the trial record,

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Speaker 1: they find any objection that was overruled, anything that happened

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Speaker 1: at trial, any turmoil in the jury, was a juror replaced,

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Speaker 1: blah blah, goes on and on and on, and they

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Speaker 1: get onto the defense attorney because that may be the

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Speaker 1: only hope they have of getting a reversal, and they

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Speaker 1: will pick through every word you said at trial, everything

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Speaker 1: you did, and try to find something that they can

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Speaker 1: claim reversible error, and defense attorneys take it. You know,

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Speaker 1: this light water off a duck's back, because it happens

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Speaker 1: every single time there's a conviction. Kirk, You're right, there's

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Speaker 1: no doubt about it. But I think with miss Arius

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Speaker 1: it will be particularly thorough and given her penchant for vengeance.

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Speaker 1: I think we're going to see a lot of attacks

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Speaker 1: on me, both in terms of what I did in

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Speaker 1: both on a personal level as well. Just keep one

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Speaker 1: eye open when you're taking a shower. Kirk NERMI will

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Speaker 1: do time stories with Nancy Grace. Um. I didn't go in,

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Speaker 1: but from what I heard, his droommate went in the

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Speaker 1: flood in his bedroom behind the door. Uh. And and

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Speaker 1: then he said it's all over. And then they went

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Speaker 1: in the bathroom and heath in his shower. Oh and

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Speaker 1: you know his his Um, his bedroom is where in

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Speaker 1: the house. It's upstairs. Um. And if you go up

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Speaker 1: the stairs, it's on the left. It's the first door

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Speaker 1: on your left. It's the only door on your left.

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Speaker 1: And um, and it's just a big master, sweet bedroom.

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Speaker 1: That day and he's talking to his friend right now.

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Speaker 1: And there's a girl that spends stocking him and she's

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Speaker 1: changed and he's changed to h right now some information.

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Speaker 1: I hope my phone doesn't dim on like one baro battery. Okay, Well,

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna keep you on the phone until officers

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Speaker 1: are right either officers are premas arrival. Okay, okay, I

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Speaker 1: think I can hear the same guys, you're hearing the

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Speaker 1: nine one one call made by friends of murder victim

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Speaker 1: Travis Alexander to Justice Scott Morgan and forensics expert Professor

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Speaker 1: jacksonvill State University author Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon

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Speaker 1: just got described the wounds, the mortal wounds to Travis Alexander,

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Speaker 1: just thirty years old at the time he was murdered.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, Nancy, how long do we have he

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Speaker 1: He was stabbed in the back multiple times. Uh, he

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Speaker 1: was stabbed on the front of his body, in his chest. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And he had his throat cut H and H. In

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Speaker 1: my opinion, at least and I've stated this on the

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Speaker 1: air openly multiple times, he sustained what I believe is

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Speaker 1: a post mortem gunshot wound to his head. There was

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Speaker 1: no hemorrhage in that track, in that wound track, but

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Speaker 1: she did get over the top of him and literally

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Speaker 1: cut his throat in the middle of the hallway and

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Speaker 1: then dragged his body back to the shower where she

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Speaker 1: stored him. You know, there was always a controversy, Joseph

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Speaker 1: Scott Morgan about how many stab wounds he had, and

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Speaker 1: I believe that's because some of the stab wounds were

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Speaker 1: on top of other stab wounds. I agree, and what

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Speaker 1: do you make of it? To doctor Daniel Bober forensic

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Speaker 1: psychiatrists to joining us. You can find him on Instagram,

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Speaker 1: doctor Daniel Bober, Doctor Bober why shot him in the

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Speaker 1: head after twenty eight stab wounds? Yancy? I think there

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Speaker 1: was It goes back to what people say about you know,

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Speaker 1: how well you know someone and how personal a crime is.

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Speaker 1: I think there was a level of rage and viciousness

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Speaker 1: that was over the top, and I think that it

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Speaker 1: was sort of like how any times can you kill

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Speaker 1: the same person? I think she was completely berserk and

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Speaker 1: out of control when she did this, and filled with rage,

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Speaker 1: berserk and out of control. To kurtnermy joining me former

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Speaker 1: Jodi Arius lawyer, author, I've trapped with miss Arius and

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Speaker 1: it is quite a read on Amazon. Kurt Nermie, was

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Speaker 1: there anything in the appeal that surprised you? No, I

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Speaker 1: expect you to go after one and go after the media.

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Speaker 1: I think what was interesting about the appeal is how

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Speaker 1: much the court illustrated the idea that the conviction was

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Speaker 1: obtained based on the facts and not the prosecutor, and

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Speaker 1: so there was a certainly a lot of I guess

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Speaker 1: I would say derision put towards what mister Martinez did

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Speaker 1: during the court room, So that was a bit surprising,

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Speaker 1: But other than that, no, it was it was a

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Speaker 1: sound decision in my opinion. And you know, to Bobby Chicone,

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Speaker 1: how would you, for those of you just joining us,

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Speaker 1: Bobby chaka former special agent FBI star a Facebook series

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Speaker 1: Curse of Acacre, how would you decipher that crime scene? Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, I agree that there's a certain level of

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Speaker 1: rage in the crime scene, particularly when as doctor Morgan

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Speaker 1: mentioned that that he believes that shot was postmortem. Whenever

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Speaker 1: you have a shot, particularly to the face, and it's postmortem,

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Speaker 1: that indicates such a hatred, in such a rage, in

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Speaker 1: such a personal relationship to this crime that it certainly

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Speaker 1: wouldn't be perpetrated by two ninja like people coming into

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Speaker 1: rob the place or something like that, or drug debt

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Speaker 1: or anything like that. It would be very personal. It

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Speaker 1: would be someone that perceived this person, the victim, as

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Speaker 1: dronging them in some way. And so that's a very

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Speaker 1: very A postmortem gunshot to the face is a very

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Speaker 1: very specific act and it very it narrows the amount

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Speaker 1: of people that you're going to look at of course,

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Speaker 1: in this case, we have her admitting it was in

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Speaker 1: self defense. Well, if you have a postmortem a gunshot

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Speaker 1: into the face, there's nothing in that that indicates self defense.

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Speaker 1: Stab wounds to the back does not indicate self defense.

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Speaker 1: There were indications that Travis had defensive wounds on him. Again,

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Speaker 1: that's not self defendicative of self defense. So the crime

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Speaker 1: scene here just goes against anything that Jody Airis has

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Speaker 1: ever said happened in that room. You know, you just

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Speaker 1: heard Bobby Chicone refer to ninjas attacking them. As you

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Speaker 1: all recall Alexis terres Shut Crime online dot Com investigative

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Speaker 1: reporter Alexis that was one And I hate to even say,

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Speaker 1: this is a curtain ERMI listening because you're stuck with

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Speaker 1: all these the statements that she made when you go

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Speaker 1: to trial. That's why I we have the Fifth Amendment.

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Speaker 1: So Jody Arris wouldn't say all this, but she knew

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Speaker 1: that when she blabbed Alexas terres Shut. Where were her

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Speaker 1: many stories to police about the death of her lover,

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Speaker 1: Travis Alexander, including masked ninjas. First, she said she didn't

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Speaker 1: do it at all, and she kept calling the police

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Speaker 1: and asking on if they do what had happened and

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Speaker 1: get details. Then, when she was finally arrested, she came

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Speaker 1: up with this crazy story that masked intruders they looked

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Speaker 1: like ninjas, had broken in and had tied them all

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Speaker 1: up and then had killed Travis. But then she miraculously

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Speaker 1: escaped from the ninjas after having seen them and made

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Speaker 1: it and was able to thrive, yet still lied about

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Speaker 1: it for weeks on it. Well, you're right, Alexis Terres.

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Speaker 1: Listen to our friend at ABC, This is Ryan Owens.

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Speaker 1: The jury also saw a second interrogation from the next day.

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Speaker 1: Arius is back with a new outfit, a jail jumpsuit,

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Speaker 1: and a very new story. Now she admits she was

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Speaker 1: at his house that day, but says two masked intruders

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Speaker 1: broke in. She even acts out how she cowered in

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Speaker 1: the corner as the duo slaughtered Alley Lexander and threatened

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Speaker 1: her family mafia style. Arius again tells the detective if

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Speaker 1: she were going to kill Alexander, she would definitely do

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Speaker 1: it differently. I don't think I could stab him. I

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Speaker 1: think I would have to shoot him continuously until he

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Speaker 1: was only years later, did Arius finally admit she was

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Speaker 1: the killer. Her attorneys are trying to convince this jury

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Speaker 1: she did it in self defense. After the couple fought

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Speaker 1: in just those two minutes, Jody had to make a choice.

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Speaker 1: She would either live or she would die. Wow, Okay,

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Speaker 1: Kurt Narmy, that wasn't you speaking? Who was that, Jennifer Wilkes.

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Speaker 1: That was Jennifer Wilmot, I believe in the opening statement

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Speaker 1: of the trial. Yes, right, Wilmot, thank you for correcting

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Speaker 1: me with me, Kurt Narmi, lawyer for Jodi Arius, author

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Speaker 1: of Trapped with miss Arius. You were hearing a tiny,

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Speaker 1: tiny taste of what the jury got to say. Ample.

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Speaker 1: Every day, the various stories areas put forward and then

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Speaker 1: her lawyers are stuck with conflicting state was to explain

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Speaker 1: away to the jury now, Alexis Torreschuk, investigative reporter with

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Speaker 1: Crime Online, Alexis, we know that a bulk of the

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Speaker 1: appeal was about one Martinez. Take a listen to this,

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Speaker 1: Mike Pelton, ABC. The state argues Arius did get a

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Speaker 1: fair trial and any missteps by prosecutor one Martinez didn't

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Speaker 1: impact the jury. But Presiding Judge Jennifer Campbell, pressing on

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Speaker 1: this point, I'm going to pin you down on this.

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Speaker 1: You agree that improper conduct was engaged in on the

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Speaker 1: part of the prosecutor in this case. There are some instances, yes,

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Speaker 1: not as many as the defense argues, and none that

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Speaker 1: resulted injury prejudice. Each side with thirty minutes to argue

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Speaker 1: whether Jodiarius will have her conviction overturned, a decision these

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Speaker 1: three will make but unclear when Hi, guys, Nancy Grace here,

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Speaker 1: I have investigated and prosecuted literally thousands of felony cases.

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Speaker 1: I have covered literally thousands of cases of missing people,

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Speaker 1: adults and children, unsolved homicides, violent crimes. My question is

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Speaker 1: what can we do about it? I don't want to

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Speaker 1: just sit back and report on it. I want to

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Speaker 1: take action, and I know you must feel the same way.

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Speaker 1: And here is the news we have all worked so

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Speaker 1: the sarser Bridley, Oh Holy Night, the stars a Bridley Shine.

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Speaker 1: It is a night our dear Syser longly world and

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Speaker 1: singing error Pie until he appeared, and the soul felt

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Speaker 1: its word a thrill of home. The weary world rejoices

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Speaker 1: for Yonder brace a new and glorious morn. Bye on

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Speaker 1: your knees. Oh he angel baresis, Oh night dee bye

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Speaker 1: now when Christ was born, ohne dee bye night, Oh

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Speaker 1: night de bye. Yes. I had to play the whole

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Speaker 1: thing so you could hear Jody Arius wait for it,

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Speaker 1: hit the high note, satellly that it's not the way

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Speaker 1: her testimony turned out at trial. For those of you

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Speaker 1: just joining us in the last hours, the Arizona Court

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Speaker 1: of Appeals upholls Jodi Arius says conviction and life sentence

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Speaker 1: for the brutal murder of her lover, her boyfriend, Travis Alexander.

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Speaker 1: It also mentioned an aside claiming the prosecutor had bullying

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Speaker 1: behavior at their words, not mine. Well, he's a prosecutor,

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Speaker 1: for Pete's sake. What do you how do you expect

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Speaker 1: him to act in the face of a woman he

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Speaker 1: knows stabbed an unarmed demand nearly thirty times and then

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Speaker 1: capped him in the head. What do you think Travis's

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Speaker 1: family wanted a pussycat that just laid down in the

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Speaker 1: middle of the courtroom and let the defense roll right

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Speaker 1: over him. Well, kirknrmi is with us, the Jodi Arias

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Speaker 1: trial lawyer, author of Trapped with miss Arius to kirk nrmi,

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Speaker 1: and then I'll circle back to Alexis Treschuk. What were

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Speaker 1: the claims against one Martinez, the lead prosecutor on appeal? Now,

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Speaker 1: I know he's been there's been a lot of claims

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Speaker 1: of sex harassment, that he would come on to everything

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Speaker 1: that won't buy in a skirt. To put it mildly,

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Speaker 1: that aside, what were the claims against Martinez that could

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Speaker 1: have affected the outcome of the trial? Sure, it's not

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Speaker 1: just what the court characterized his bullying behavior with Massius,

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Speaker 1: but I think it's also the bullying behavior. And you

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Speaker 1: won't catch me defending one Martinez's behavior in the court room.

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Speaker 1: I've worked with many a professional prosecutor that wouldn't go

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Speaker 1: to this extreme, and mister Martinez making insinuations about doctor

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Speaker 1: Samuel's having an untoward interest in miss Arius and some

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Speaker 1: of the Kirk Kurt Narmy, do you believe it's true?

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Speaker 1: I don't know if she's tried it with you, that

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Speaker 1: Joe Arius approaches many many men with sexual undertones and

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Speaker 1: her just natural way she deals with guys. I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: dispute that. But that does not mean and I've known

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Speaker 1: doctor Samuels for a long time. I knew him a

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Speaker 1: long time before he got in that courtroom, that does

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Speaker 1: not mean his professional ethics would be compromised. I consider

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Speaker 1: a man him a man of great integrity. Well, actually

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Speaker 1: I do too, Kurt Narmy, I do too. I guess though,

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Speaker 1: when you see Arias being flirtatious with the doctor who's

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Speaker 1: analyzing her, it opens up the avenue of suggesting flirtation

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Speaker 1: between the two of them. But now doctor Samuels is

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Speaker 1: a shrink, correct he is? Well? I doubt pretty seriously.

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Speaker 1: Samuels as as well respected to see as Annie's a shrink,

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Speaker 1: would have he wouldn't touch Arias with a ten football.

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Speaker 1: I can guarantee you that because there are snakes in

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Speaker 1: that woman's head. I hate to use that phrase, but

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Speaker 1: it's just so appropriate. No way, Okay, what else did

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Speaker 1: he do? According to you? Well, not according to me,

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Speaker 1: not according to me. According to the Appellet court, they

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Speaker 1: talked about mister Martinez's behavior with miss La Violette and

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Speaker 1: the bullying behavior and the confusing questioning. It was Violette

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Speaker 1: the one that wrote that paper about snow White and

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Speaker 1: the Seven Dwarfs about how I was at misogynist or

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Speaker 1: something like that. Was that her? Well that there was

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Speaker 1: a lot of discussion about the title of that. Yes,

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Speaker 1: that was she had written something. And I never read

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Speaker 1: that article, so I can't speak to the contents of

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Speaker 1: that article. But I do remember this massive argument between

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Speaker 1: her and Martinez about the seven Dwarves and naming the

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Speaker 1: seven Dwarves, and like I say, you know, like the

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Speaker 1: Appellet Court found, I think there was a lot of

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Speaker 1: bombastic behavior in that. And that's what the Court of

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Speaker 1: Appeals called out and basically said Arrius was convicted not

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Speaker 1: because of mister Martinez, but in spite of him. Now

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Speaker 1: kurtin Army's referring to I guess I would say a

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Speaker 1: battered women's expert, a shrink of sorts and an article

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Speaker 1: that she had written regarding snow White and the Seven Dwarfs,

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Speaker 1: and Juan Martinez seized upon it as he has a

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Speaker 1: right to do. In cross examination. You put up an expert,

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Speaker 1: and a good prosecutor will look up every article, every

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Speaker 1: thesis that they can, every book that they can find

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Speaker 1: by that expert and pick it apart. And that's exactly

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Speaker 1: what he did. Do you remember that, Alexis to Reschuk,

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Speaker 1: I do I remember? The court was stunned as Jua

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00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:51,800
Speaker 1: Martinez attacked this woman, this Alice Lavelette. She's I want

423
00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 1: to say she looks like a blonde grandma, but that

424
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:56,320
Speaker 1: might be making her too old, but anyway, she is.

425
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:59,760
Speaker 1: She attacked her, so he was yelling at her and

426
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 1: she wasn't even the defendant, and he just kept hammering her.

427
00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:05,760
Speaker 1: And she thought back very hard. But you know, she

428
00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:10,120
Speaker 1: started getting death threats after the way. That's not right,

429
00:29:11,080 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 1: that's horrible. What we do know about the expert, Miss Violette.

430
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 1: When the domestic abuse specialist Alice La Violette gave a

431
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:27,720
Speaker 1: talk once called was snow White a battered woman. Little

432
00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:32,400
Speaker 1: did she think that eight years later that would come

433
00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:36,080
Speaker 1: back to haunt her. But with her testimony that Jody

434
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:40,760
Speaker 1: Arius was an abused woman at the hands of her

435
00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 1: murder victim, Travis Alexander, I guess he did bring it

436
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:48,520
Speaker 1: up on cross exam. A lot of claims have been

437
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:52,240
Speaker 1: made about Juan Martinez, the lead prosecutor in the case

438
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 1: against Arius, but I know this much. While the appellate

439
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: court called him a bully, they did not reverse the case.

440
00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friends at ABC justin Pazzera.

441
00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 1: This is the complaint right here, eighteen pages detailing years

442
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:11,200
Speaker 1: of what's being described as unwanted sexual advance as even

443
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:15,040
Speaker 1: leaking information about the Jodiarius trial. But although what's being

444
00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:17,800
Speaker 1: alleged in this report is surprising to most of us,

445
00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,080
Speaker 1: for some people, they're really surprised it's taken this long

446
00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:24,960
Speaker 1: to get here. It's one of Miracopa County's top prosecutors,

447
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:29,920
Speaker 1: Juan Martinez, his name making national headlines during the Jodiarius trial.

448
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 1: Today his name front page on this formal complaint filed

449
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 1: by the State barb of Arizona. It is just appalling

450
00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:40,520
Speaker 1: and shocking. Tammy Rose was a reporter assigned to the

451
00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:44,240
Speaker 1: Jodiarius trial. She says she was interviewed three times by

452
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:47,640
Speaker 1: the state bar as part of this investigation, looking into

453
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:52,160
Speaker 1: if Martinez violated rules of professional conduct. It's alleged during

454
00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,240
Speaker 1: the Arias trial, Martinez was having an affair with a

455
00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:58,920
Speaker 1: blogger who was also covering the trial. Rose says she

456
00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 1: was friends with that blogger. She was the one that

457
00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:05,200
Speaker 1: told me that she was having an affair with one Martinez.

458
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 1: And you know, I knew he had a living her friend.

459
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,200
Speaker 1: I knew she was married. The complaints continue to detail

460
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:16,160
Speaker 1: accusations of unwanted sexual advances. Thirty females working inside the

461
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 1: County Attorney's office were interviewed for the investigation. In twenty fifteen,

462
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 1: Martinez allegedly told the law clerk he wanted to climb

463
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 1: her like a statue, and on another occasion, he allegedly

464
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 1: asked a woman to leave her husband for him to

465
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 1: Alexis Tourezcha climb online dot Com investigative reporter, I hear

466
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:40,120
Speaker 1: what the claims are. My question is what did any

467
00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 1: of that have to do with the trial. Did it

468
00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 1: effect that your oars in any way, none of his

469
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:51,640
Speaker 1: actions with the blogger and that other woman or the

470
00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:55,239
Speaker 1: women in his office. What did happen in court was

471
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 1: that Jennifer Wilmot and mister Martinez one Martinez had a

472
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:03,280
Speaker 1: argument in front of the judge and she said something

473
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:05,480
Speaker 1: like this isn't this wouldn't be how you would treat

474
00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:07,600
Speaker 1: a spouse. And he said, oh, I would hate to

475
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:11,440
Speaker 1: be ever married to you. And it was a really

476
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:15,280
Speaker 1: cruel comment and totally unnecessarily and totally uncalled for it.

477
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:17,960
Speaker 1: So the judge said, cut it out. Did the jury

478
00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:20,840
Speaker 1: hear it? Repeat? Did the jury hear it? Okay, then

479
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:22,960
Speaker 1: what do I care? Not? Sorry, I mean I don't

480
00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 1: approve of his comment, but I mean she started it.

481
00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:28,760
Speaker 1: Wilmot started it by saying you wouldn't put your spouse

482
00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:33,160
Speaker 1: this way. Well, I gotta say she started that. But

483
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:37,640
Speaker 1: that aside, it didn't happen in front of the jury.

484
00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 1: It means nothing to the area's trial or murder conviction

485
00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:02,400
Speaker 1: crime stories with Nancy Grace stated Arizona versus Jody an

486
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:06,800
Speaker 1: Arius verdict Count one, we the jury Duian paneled and sworn,

487
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:09,480
Speaker 1: and the above and titled action upon our ohs do

488
00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:13,520
Speaker 1: finally defendant as to count one, first degree murder guilty.

489
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:21,200
Speaker 1: Five jurs find premeditated zero fine, felony murder seven fine

490
00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:26,720
Speaker 1: both premated, hated and felony signed a four person. Is

491
00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 1: this your true verdict? So say you one and all

492
00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:35,440
Speaker 1: guilty guilty of murder and the death of Travis Alexander,

493
00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:38,840
Speaker 1: stabbed nearly thirty times, his throat, slashed ear to ear,

494
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:44,440
Speaker 1: and shot in the head. Why because her lover, Travis Alexander,

495
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 1: who had broken up with her, was taking another woman

496
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 1: on a Caribbean vacation. Jodiarius comes over. They have a

497
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:56,120
Speaker 1: marathon sec session all day long. At the end of it,

498
00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:58,360
Speaker 1: he's still going to go on the trip with the

499
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 1: other girlfriend. Bam, she killed him. M okay. Joe Scott Morgan,

500
00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:07,720
Speaker 1: forensics expert, Professor Forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of Blood

501
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:10,960
Speaker 1: Beneath My Feet, tell me what you deciphered from the

502
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,960
Speaker 1: crime scene and why there was no way this Court

503
00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:16,960
Speaker 1: of Appeals was going to reverse this case. Absolutely no way,

504
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:19,680
Speaker 1: you know, Nancy, I think probably you know. I covered

505
00:34:19,680 --> 00:34:21,400
Speaker 1: this case for a long time on the air, and

506
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:24,920
Speaker 1: one of the most striking things I remember we had

507
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:29,239
Speaker 1: recreated the crime scene. Was looking at the pictures from

508
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,040
Speaker 1: the crime scene and seeing what we had recreated in

509
00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 1: the studio. When you look at the vanity in the bathroom,

510
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:40,719
Speaker 1: one of the just it's a gut punch. He actually

511
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:46,360
Speaker 1: sprayed blood onto the surface of the sink. He looked

512
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:49,160
Speaker 1: at himself in the mirror for at least a moment.

513
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:51,960
Speaker 1: He had an awareness when he came out of that shower.

514
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:55,759
Speaker 1: I think she backed off for a second. We had

515
00:34:55,800 --> 00:34:59,799
Speaker 1: what's referred to as fine aspirate spray, which means she

516
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,840
Speaker 1: clipped along and as he's coughing up blood, it's spraying

517
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:06,759
Speaker 1: all over the sink, all over the mirror. And then

518
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:09,799
Speaker 1: he begins to try to get away from her. He

519
00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:13,160
Speaker 1: moves down the hallway, his body finally gives out. She

520
00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:15,840
Speaker 1: gets on top of this guy. Nancy and I have

521
00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:18,600
Speaker 1: these visions of her just putting her knee in his back,

522
00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:21,960
Speaker 1: lifting his chin up and taking that knife and cutting

523
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:24,560
Speaker 1: his throat. And then, as we had mentioned earlier, she

524
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:26,880
Speaker 1: took that pistol and she shot him right in the

525
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 1: top of the head. Well, you know what, there are

526
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:32,600
Speaker 1: other guys out there that are lucky that they made

527
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:36,960
Speaker 1: it out of their relationship with Jody Arius alive. Take

528
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:40,040
Speaker 1: a listen to ABC's Ryan Owens, Sir, could you introduce

529
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,520
Speaker 1: yourself to the jury police. On day one of her

530
00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:47,040
Speaker 1: defense Tuesday, Arius's attorneys called an ex boyfriend she dated before,

531
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:50,520
Speaker 1: Travis Alexander, the man she now admits she stabbed and

532
00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:53,120
Speaker 1: shot in June of two thousand and eight. Arius says

533
00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:56,560
Speaker 1: she killed the thirty year old Mormon businessmen in self defense.

534
00:35:56,920 --> 00:36:01,680
Speaker 1: I because we were in love. He didn't want his

535
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:05,040
Speaker 1: face shown publicly. But Daryl Brewer told the jurors he

536
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:08,719
Speaker 1: dated the much younger Arius for four years. They even

537
00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:11,680
Speaker 1: bought a house together, and the divorce dad says she

538
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:17,040
Speaker 1: was great with his son. Jody was a very responsible, caring,

539
00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:22,280
Speaker 1: loving person. Did you ever see y at jealous towards

540
00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:26,400
Speaker 1: women that you came into contact with? No, But on

541
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:29,600
Speaker 1: cross examination, Brewer may have done damage to his ex

542
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:33,560
Speaker 1: girlfriend's case. He told the prosecutor Arius took a nude

543
00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:36,560
Speaker 1: picture of him in the shower. Remember she snapped these

544
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:40,919
Speaker 1: photos of Travis Alexander in the shower seconds before prosecutors

545
00:36:40,960 --> 00:36:44,480
Speaker 1: say she started stabbing him, as I tell Kurt Nurmi,

546
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,920
Speaker 1: former defense lawyer for Jodi Arius at trial, an author

547
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:52,799
Speaker 1: of Trapped with miss Arius on Amazon. Better keep one

548
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,080
Speaker 1: eye open on the door when you're taking a shower,

549
00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:59,440
Speaker 1: Take a listen again to Ryan Owen's ABC. But prosecutors

550
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:03,000
Speaker 1: alleged is a stalker who brutally attacked her x in

551
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:05,200
Speaker 1: a jealous rage when she found out he was seeing

552
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 1: other women. Arius's defense, which is expected to start next week,

553
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:13,200
Speaker 1: will have to overcome a mountain of forensic evidence, including

554
00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:17,560
Speaker 1: pictures taken on this camera found in Alexander's washing machine.

555
00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:21,600
Speaker 1: Prosecutors say Arias literally tried to wash that evidence away,

556
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:25,640
Speaker 1: but on its memory card, detectives discovered not just those

557
00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:28,279
Speaker 1: racy photos from the couple's sexual encounter the day of

558
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:31,920
Speaker 1: the murder, but a series of twenty shots of Alexander

559
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:36,920
Speaker 1: posing in the shower minutes before his death. Prosecutors say

560
00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 1: Arius put down the camera and picked up a knife,

561
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:44,480
Speaker 1: stabbing her unsuspecting victim. The most damning picture comes after

562
00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:47,760
Speaker 1: the camera was dropped. It's too graphic for us to show,

563
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:50,279
Speaker 1: but the jury saw a shot of what appears to

564
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:54,880
Speaker 1: be Arius actually moving the bloody body. Prosecutors say she

565
00:37:54,960 --> 00:38:00,520
Speaker 1: was especially cold blooded after the crime. He played this

566
00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:03,960
Speaker 1: voicemail areas left on Alexander's phone a few hours after

567
00:38:04,040 --> 00:38:07,680
Speaker 1: she killed him. Morbidly enough, she invited a man she

568
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:14,640
Speaker 1: knew was dead to come visit her. Okay, that's just freaky,

569
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:18,360
Speaker 1: you know, Kurt Rmy, renowned defense attorney and author of

570
00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:22,040
Speaker 1: Trapped with miss Arius on Amazon. Don't you just hate

571
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:28,279
Speaker 1: it when you're murder defendant your client snaps photos at

572
00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:33,280
Speaker 1: the murder saying then leaves it and the victim's washing machine.

573
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,120
Speaker 1: It's certainly not a dream for any defense attorney, And

574
00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:40,200
Speaker 1: particularly when she was also making the assurgence of self

575
00:38:40,239 --> 00:38:44,799
Speaker 1: defense she was making him. It was just another you know,

576
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:48,440
Speaker 1: nail in her coffin that unfortunately I had to be

577
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:53,200
Speaker 1: a part of her her defense. You know. So, Kurt Rmy,

578
00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:57,000
Speaker 1: what was the biggest obstacle that you faced trying to

579
00:38:57,160 --> 00:39:01,960
Speaker 1: defend her? The see evidence. We've talked about some of

580
00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:05,760
Speaker 1: the forensic evidence, and doctor Morgan and Bobby has chimed

581
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:08,960
Speaker 1: in on the realities there, and those were the biggest,

582
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:12,680
Speaker 1: biggest obstacles. But as you know, Nancy, the sixth Amendment

583
00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:15,399
Speaker 1: allows miss Arius to tell her story if it can't

584
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:19,480
Speaker 1: be proven untrue, and so she had that opportunity, and

585
00:39:19,600 --> 00:39:23,359
Speaker 1: she was given that opportunity, which will be a good

586
00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:27,560
Speaker 1: thing when her postconviction relief petition comes around. When what

587
00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:30,799
Speaker 1: comes around when her postconviction really claiming that I was

588
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:34,320
Speaker 1: in effective assistance of counsel. Oh yeah, it's coming Bryce yourself,

589
00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:40,799
Speaker 1: you know, to Bobby Chicon, former special agent FBI. When

590
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 1: you decipher this crime scene, what do you see? Well,

591
00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:49,680
Speaker 1: we see obviously anger and rage and personal animists in

592
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 1: the most extreme sense, personal animists against this victim. And

593
00:39:54,080 --> 00:39:56,799
Speaker 1: so you start looking at who had an ax to grind. Right,

594
00:39:56,840 --> 00:40:00,560
Speaker 1: This wasn't robbery, it wasn't a dead collection, it wasn't

595
00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:03,520
Speaker 1: any of the other things that sometimes act as a

596
00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:06,759
Speaker 1: motive for murder. This was anger and rage. This was

597
00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:09,920
Speaker 1: personal animists towards this victim. So we start looking at

598
00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:13,920
Speaker 1: who could have had that level of anger and rage

599
00:40:13,960 --> 00:40:17,640
Speaker 1: and animus towards Travis. And there's a very small people.

600
00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:20,319
Speaker 1: Hopefully we none of us have that kind of person

601
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,359
Speaker 1: in our lives, but you know, if you do, it's

602
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:26,200
Speaker 1: probably a very small circle of people who hate you

603
00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 1: that much, and what could make them hate you? And

604
00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:32,560
Speaker 1: when someone has pre incident behavior like she did in

605
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 1: renting a car, indicating premeditation, and they have incident behavior,

606
00:40:36,719 --> 00:40:38,920
Speaker 1: which is the rage and the overkill at the scene.

607
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:41,720
Speaker 1: And then they have post incident behavior, which is lying

608
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:47,000
Speaker 1: about what happened. In all three phases, everything works against

609
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:50,080
Speaker 1: Jodi Arius in this case, none of her behavior before

610
00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:52,720
Speaker 1: the incident, during the incident, or after the incident helps

611
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:56,720
Speaker 1: her try to establish any sense of innocence in this crime.

612
00:40:56,840 --> 00:40:59,920
Speaker 1: And do you, dud Jar Daniel Bober or your forensic psychiatrist,

613
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:03,759
Speaker 1: you've seen it all. I hate to invite you into

614
00:41:03,800 --> 00:41:06,399
Speaker 1: the mind of Jody Haaris, but what is going on

615
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 1: in there? Nancy? You see this a lot in people

616
00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:12,239
Speaker 1: who have either what we call antisocial personality or borderline

617
00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:15,759
Speaker 1: personality disorders. They are all people in our lives that

618
00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:17,239
Speaker 1: we know, maybe there's not a lot of them that

619
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:21,480
Speaker 1: they're people that react so disproportionately. They go from zero

620
00:41:21,520 --> 00:41:23,759
Speaker 1: to one thousand and a second, and they you know,

621
00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:26,120
Speaker 1: they have an ax to grind against you, and they

622
00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:28,600
Speaker 1: just do it in a way that is not at

623
00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:31,600
Speaker 1: all congruent with you know, what you've done to them.

624
00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:34,200
Speaker 1: They just feel slighted, and in this particular case, you know,

625
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:37,440
Speaker 1: she was just like a volcano of rage, a volcano

626
00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:44,960
Speaker 1: of rage to Joseph Scott Morgan, Jacksonville State University forensics

627
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:50,440
Speaker 1: professor and author, why in you know, Nancy, back to

628
00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:54,920
Speaker 1: what Bobby was talking about, this this idea of rage,

629
00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:59,799
Speaker 1: and I hate that Travis Alexander had to go through

630
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:03,319
Speaker 1: the I'm thankful that this woman is off of the

631
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:05,720
Speaker 1: streets now. I think one of the one of the

632
00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:09,600
Speaker 1: potentially most dangerous things that could happen is that she

633
00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:13,040
Speaker 1: has released at a very young age back onto society

634
00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:17,600
Speaker 1: because she has got some serious, serious mental problems. And

635
00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:20,839
Speaker 1: I'm just looking at the forensic evidence, Nancy, to put

636
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:26,279
Speaker 1: it very bluntly, she absolutely ripped this guy to shreds.

637
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:30,040
Speaker 1: And I can't tell you how much energy, how much anger,

638
00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:33,040
Speaker 1: how much rage is involved in this in order to

639
00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:37,600
Speaker 1: perpetrate this kind of physical violence, this level of physical violence.

640
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:42,719
Speaker 1: I've worked organized organized crime hits before that were not

641
00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:48,480
Speaker 1: this violent. It is absolutely abhorrent with us. The defense

642
00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:54,399
Speaker 1: attorney for Jody Arius Kurt Narmy. When will it end? Well,

643
00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:56,759
Speaker 1: that's a good question, Nancy. She has a chance to

644
00:42:57,160 --> 00:43:00,600
Speaker 1: appeal to the Supreme Court to have her decision and reviewed.

645
00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:03,719
Speaker 1: The state Arizona State Supreme Court. Unfortunately it can end

646
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 1: there because she wasn't sentenced to death. That's I know

647
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:08,200
Speaker 1: a lot of people want a death sentence, but it

648
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:11,879
Speaker 1: certainly makes the appeals less tent plentiful, and she will

649
00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:15,000
Speaker 1: have her petition for postconviction relief. She will claim that

650
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:17,880
Speaker 1: I was ineffective, that I didn't do certain things, like

651
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:21,759
Speaker 1: you said earlier combing over that record. But like I

652
00:43:21,800 --> 00:43:25,200
Speaker 1: said a moment ago, I didn't hope her story got

653
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:28,080
Speaker 1: to be told, her descense got to be actualized in

654
00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:31,560
Speaker 1: that court room. However contrary it was to the forensic evidence.

655
00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 1: So she's going to have a lot less to complain

656
00:43:35,040 --> 00:43:37,759
Speaker 1: about because her defense was actualized. And like I said,

657
00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:41,480
Speaker 1: that's something I look forward to because of what miss

658
00:43:41,480 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 1: Arius's defense and everything put me through on a personal level,

659
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to confronting her assertions. Very excited about it. Alexas,

660
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:52,560
Speaker 1: what is her life like behind bars? She's pretty sorry

661
00:43:52,600 --> 00:43:57,400
Speaker 1: life behind bars. She is remote, sur sal but you

662
00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:01,840
Speaker 1: know what, she has gosh uch cash in her commentary account,

663
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:04,360
Speaker 1: but she is able to shop too, gole Heart's content.

664
00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:11,320
Speaker 1: She's buying can sardine, She's buying canned samich buying cans

665
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 1: of beans. She also has to buy a pino to

666
00:44:13,719 --> 00:44:17,480
Speaker 1: treat her stomach issues after she eats that. She is

667
00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:21,560
Speaker 1: buying paint and art supply. So I guess when I

668
00:44:21,560 --> 00:44:23,600
Speaker 1: said it was a little star behind bars, she's thinking

669
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:27,040
Speaker 1: the best of it. She also has a job behind bars.

670
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:32,160
Speaker 1: She's originally working cleaning toilets behind bars. Excuse me, Jackie

671
00:44:32,200 --> 00:44:34,759
Speaker 1: here for some odd reason that you know, I'm gonna

672
00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:37,319
Speaker 1: have to have Bober comment all that keeps up with

673
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:42,200
Speaker 1: Arias behind bars And she just posted one of her photos,

674
00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:47,200
Speaker 1: her works of art, basically tracing every magazine article photos

675
00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:51,280
Speaker 1: for one thousand dollars. And guess what people are buying

676
00:44:51,360 --> 00:44:55,400
Speaker 1: them and men are still falling at their feet. Word

677
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:58,480
Speaker 1: to the wise, don't take a shower with Arias. Guys,

678
00:44:58,520 --> 00:45:01,839
Speaker 1: if you're so into her ployees, listen to me. Okay,

679
00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:07,960
Speaker 1: Round one, the state wins by what happens next. Nancy

680
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:11,120
Speaker 1: Gray's crime story, signing off Goodbye friend,