1 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:05,640 Speaker 1: Hello, I'm Michael barn and I'm Scott Sasnik. On this 2 00:00:05,680 --> 00:00:08,280 Speaker 1: weekly podcast, we explore the big money issues in the 3 00:00:08,280 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: world of sports and talk to some of the biggest 4 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:12,880 Speaker 1: players in the industry. On our podcast, we take a 5 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:16,040 Speaker 1: deep dive into the recent college basketball scandal with former 6 00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:19,840 Speaker 1: Duke University basketball player and ESPN analyst j Billis. But 7 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:22,160 Speaker 1: first let's look at the top stories of the week. 8 00:00:22,520 --> 00:00:26,640 Speaker 1: Joining us is Bloomberg Business of Sports reporter Evan Noby Williams. 9 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:30,160 Speaker 1: And let's start with a Premier League meeting that will 10 00:00:30,360 --> 00:00:33,880 Speaker 1: end without an agreement on a split of cash. Scott, 11 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:36,280 Speaker 1: this is a story you've been working on. Yeah, it 12 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:39,360 Speaker 1: seems as if all the European leagues are catching up 13 00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:42,600 Speaker 1: to the Americans. All the problems that we've had seemed 14 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:45,000 Speaker 1: to be catching up into the European leagues. There's always 15 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:48,200 Speaker 1: been harmony. They've shared the revenue. It's been a nice, 16 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:51,599 Speaker 1: nice situation. Whether you're finished last or first, you got 17 00:00:51,680 --> 00:00:54,800 Speaker 1: roughly the same share. Well, now all of a sudden, 18 00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:58,120 Speaker 1: the big clubs, you know what they are, Manchester United, 19 00:00:58,160 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 1: Manchester City, Chelsea they're getting together and saying we should 20 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:06,039 Speaker 1: get more money from the International because you know what, 21 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:09,479 Speaker 1: Americans when they tune in on NBC, they don't want 22 00:01:09,520 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 1: to see Sunderland. They're not there to see born Myth. 23 00:01:13,319 --> 00:01:16,959 Speaker 1: There there to see the big clubs. We generate more revenue, 24 00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:19,279 Speaker 1: we want to keep more. Yeah, it's a similar system. 25 00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:21,480 Speaker 1: What they're looking for is to some colleges have here 26 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:24,679 Speaker 1: in the US in that the conference signs an overall deal. 27 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:27,120 Speaker 1: But there might be two schools in the conference that 28 00:01:27,200 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 1: are a lot more high profile. They're the ones that 29 00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:31,320 Speaker 1: people want to see when they turn on the television, 30 00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:33,560 Speaker 1: and they get a bigger share of the revenue. Um. 31 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:35,560 Speaker 1: The question, I guess for me, and this might be 32 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:38,000 Speaker 1: the romantic in me, I wonder how much of this 33 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:41,720 Speaker 1: fundamentally changes the Premier League from a competitive standpoint. One 34 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:43,560 Speaker 1: of the things I love about the league is that 35 00:01:44,959 --> 00:01:48,040 Speaker 1: exactly Leicester City can happen. There is there is a 36 00:01:48,080 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 1: parody there that we haven't seen in any other European 37 00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:53,880 Speaker 1: league in a while. Um, and this is chicken and egg. 38 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:57,040 Speaker 1: But is that because they're not sharing the revenue. I'm 39 00:01:57,080 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 1: just curious as to what happens if this happens, And 40 00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:00,720 Speaker 1: I like with the small teams are saying they all 41 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 1: get together. They they sort of formed a little unit 42 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:06,320 Speaker 1: so they prevented the fourteen votes necessary for change. You 43 00:02:06,360 --> 00:02:09,720 Speaker 1: need fourteen votes. They're all saying, you need to play somebody. 44 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:13,880 Speaker 1: Chelsea can't play Manchester United every week. You know we're 45 00:02:13,919 --> 00:02:17,720 Speaker 1: here too. We participate in this league. You need to 46 00:02:17,800 --> 00:02:21,160 Speaker 1: share equally, is what they're saying. It's gonna be very 47 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 1: interesting to see how moving forward as the dollars from 48 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:28,560 Speaker 1: these international agreements go higher. Very interested to see how 49 00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 1: hard those big clubs push. Somebody has to be the 50 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: Cleveland Browns. Somebody has to be the Cleveland Fronts are 51 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:37,679 Speaker 1: on the schedule every week. Right, next one, Sorry Cleveland, 52 00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:41,200 Speaker 1: Well I love it anyway. Next topic, and this one 53 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:43,120 Speaker 1: is a big one. This is gonna be probably one 54 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:47,760 Speaker 1: of the most powerful ladies in sports. Loreen Pole Jobs. 55 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 1: She's buying into the parent of the basketball's Wizards. Yeah, 56 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 1: she's got about eighteen billion dollars to invest in this stake. 57 00:02:56,360 --> 00:02:59,520 Speaker 1: About stake and Monumental Sports and that's run by Ted 58 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 1: Leon's US. And Ted has a big desire to get 59 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:07,080 Speaker 1: Monumental to be an international brand. Right now, most of 60 00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:10,359 Speaker 1: what he's done in Monumental is centered in Washington, d C. 61 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:12,880 Speaker 1: You know, he's got, as you mentioned, the Wizards, he's 62 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:14,800 Speaker 1: got the capitals, he's got some E sports, he's got 63 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: an arena league team, he's got um, he's got what 64 00:03:18,919 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 1: we said, E sports, he's got Capital One Arena. Yeah. 65 00:03:22,720 --> 00:03:26,520 Speaker 1: So he's got a nice array of sports and entertainment 66 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:29,800 Speaker 1: properties in Washington, d C. Now, what can he do 67 00:03:30,160 --> 00:03:33,400 Speaker 1: in global nature? What can you do to bring monumental 68 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:38,000 Speaker 1: outside the US? And Loreen has a lot of philanthropic things, 69 00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 1: so she's into she's looking to sports as a vehicle 70 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:46,120 Speaker 1: for education for things like that. It's a pretty powerful 71 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:48,320 Speaker 1: tie up. It's very interest to see what she's gonna 72 00:03:48,320 --> 00:03:50,920 Speaker 1: do with it. The NBA has slowly built a stable 73 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:53,920 Speaker 1: of very powerful female owners. I mean Genie Bussing in 74 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:56,240 Speaker 1: l A gets a lot of a lot of publicity. 75 00:03:56,280 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: There's in one and Walton Cronky and Denver GAYL Miller 76 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:04,240 Speaker 1: in Utah. Obviously, Lorraine Peell Jobs is not the minority. 77 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:07,160 Speaker 1: And Alan's wife was the first female owner in d C. 78 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 1: She was the first NBA female owner. She owned a 79 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 1: piece of it of the Wizards, which is not ted steam. 80 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:13,440 Speaker 1: So Lorraine Peell Jobs is stepping into a league that 81 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 1: is very familiar with with high powered females on the 82 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:19,280 Speaker 1: ownership side. I'm curious as to what this means for 83 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:23,119 Speaker 1: the future. Is she looking for maybe a larger steak 84 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:26,680 Speaker 1: in either monumental or something else down the road. Well, 85 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 1: it was pretty clear Ted remains controlling partner in all this, 86 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:32,279 Speaker 1: and as far as I know, and I've talked to 87 00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:33,840 Speaker 1: Ted a lot throughout the years, he's not looking to 88 00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 1: get out of sports. He he loves it. But this 89 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:43,000 Speaker 1: is a pretty powerful influential tie in. Gonna be fun 90 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:45,000 Speaker 1: to see what they do together. And we've seen before, 91 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:47,200 Speaker 1: I mean, buying a minority stake in the team is 92 00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:49,680 Speaker 1: often kind of the way you get in good with 93 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:52,680 Speaker 1: the owners in a league, so that when it comes 94 00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 1: time to buy the full stake and something else, they're 95 00:04:55,279 --> 00:04:57,440 Speaker 1: familiar with you. They know your businesses, you've been in 96 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:00,560 Speaker 1: the meetings before, etcetera. Should be noted she did and 97 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 1: buy the l A Clippers before Steve Fambler. She was 98 00:05:03,240 --> 00:05:04,760 Speaker 1: part of a group that tried to buy the Clippers, 99 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 1: So clearly there's interest. And by the way, in case 100 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:11,120 Speaker 1: you're interested, Powell Jobs has a net worth of seventeen 101 00:05:11,200 --> 00:05:16,039 Speaker 1: point eight billion dollars. That's according to the Bloomberg Billionaire's Index. 102 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 1: It makes her the world's fifty four richest person. And 103 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:24,480 Speaker 1: let's move now to Alabamba buying broadcast rights to slate 104 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: of the PAT twelve College Sports another story you worked on, Scott. Yeah, 105 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:31,640 Speaker 1: it's very interesting here. The PAT twelve has for the 106 00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 1: last five or six years tried to boost the brands 107 00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 1: not only of the conference but the individual members U 108 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:41,359 Speaker 1: C l A, U s C, Arizona, Oregon tried to 109 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:45,880 Speaker 1: boost the profile of these institutions in Asia and particularly 110 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 1: in China. And it's not just about the sports. Sports 111 00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:52,760 Speaker 1: is about the front ports. It's very interesting how it 112 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:55,560 Speaker 1: all ties in, because what you're looking to do here 113 00:05:56,000 --> 00:05:59,599 Speaker 1: is get applicants, folks from China who can go to 114 00:05:59,640 --> 00:06:04,960 Speaker 1: these in institutions and most importantly, Michael Barr pay full freight, 115 00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:09,720 Speaker 1: pay full tuition. Keep in mind that that conference includes 116 00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:13,760 Speaker 1: U c l A, and USC, and that has a 117 00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:17,040 Speaker 1: lot of contingent involved with people who are from China 118 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:20,360 Speaker 1: who are studying at U c l A and USC. Absolutely, 119 00:06:20,400 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you know better than anybody else 120 00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:25,760 Speaker 1: College sports Great front Porch. Yeah, they're flexing their geographic 121 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:28,200 Speaker 1: muscles a little bit as well. They're that close to Asia. 122 00:06:28,240 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 1: They have large amounts of Asian students that come into 123 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:33,800 Speaker 1: their universities and they're taking advantage of that. Our thanks 124 00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:37,400 Speaker 1: to Bloomberg Business of Sports reporter Evan Nobie Williams, Now, 125 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 1: let's get to this week's interview with former Duke University 126 00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 1: basketball player and the ESPN analysts J Billis about the 127 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:47,080 Speaker 1: most recent college basketball scandal. Billis, who is an attorney, 128 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 1: joined ESPN in and is one of the best known 129 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 1: analysts in the game. A four year starter into Mike 130 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:56,359 Speaker 1: Shafski in the nineteen eighties, Billis was only one of 131 00:06:56,400 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 1: two student athletes appointed to the n c double As 132 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 1: Long Range Planning Committee. Since he has been an attorney 133 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:07,039 Speaker 1: with Moore and Van Allen, where he specializes in commercial litigation. 134 00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:10,000 Speaker 1: And well, Michael, we know this one cost Rick Pettino 135 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:13,800 Speaker 1: his job already. What we have here is a mixture 136 00:07:13,880 --> 00:07:20,440 Speaker 1: of boosters, powerful coaches, a A you coaches, and sneaker companies, 137 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:25,360 Speaker 1: and somehow the money is being funneled from the sneaker 138 00:07:25,440 --> 00:07:30,560 Speaker 1: companies to the institutions, to these recruits to one not 139 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 1: only pick which school they're going to but to wear 140 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:37,000 Speaker 1: a particular shoe and then to later on hire a 141 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 1: particular agent and or financial advisor. And I mean j 142 00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 1: Billis has seen this time and time again, and I'm 143 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 1: just wondering on this story, ja did anything about it? 144 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 1: Surprise you? Well, just the involvement of the federal government 145 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 1: when you have the United States Attorney's Office of the 146 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:57,600 Speaker 1: Southern District, which is as powerful as any U. S. 147 00:07:57,600 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 1: Attorney's office in the country, and then a two year 148 00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: f b I investigation which included cooperating witnesses and wire 149 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:08,880 Speaker 1: taps and the like. Uh, that is an unusual happening 150 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 1: in almost any industry, let alone let alone college sports. 151 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:15,320 Speaker 1: So that's the thing that surprised me. Not I mean, 152 00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 1: I hate to sound cynical, but the fact that there 153 00:08:17,920 --> 00:08:21,280 Speaker 1: is money in college sports that that is not a shock. Yeah, 154 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:23,080 Speaker 1: but you wonder why they took notice, right, I mean 155 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:25,760 Speaker 1: the Southern District. And this began probably with Prete Bahara. 156 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:28,360 Speaker 1: They're they're usually looking at Wall Street. I mean, I 157 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:30,520 Speaker 1: know we're talking big money, but this isn't Wall Street. 158 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:34,200 Speaker 1: Is it worthy of the investigation? No? But but the 159 00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 1: Southern District of New York, the U. S. Attorney's office 160 00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 1: there was in desperate need of a win, and that's 161 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:42,600 Speaker 1: that's probably part and parcel why they had the press conference. 162 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:46,360 Speaker 1: But this all started from my understanding with Wall Street 163 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 1: where they had a uh an SEC fraud investigation and 164 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: UH someone that they had in their crossairs led them 165 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 1: to this. At least that's the way I understand that 166 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:02,520 Speaker 1: a person named Martin Blazer who's got connections far and wide. 167 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:05,520 Speaker 1: So that's where it started, at least at least the 168 00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:08,440 Speaker 1: genesis of it. But it didn't take a genius to 169 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:12,480 Speaker 1: figure out that there was an underground economy in college sports. 170 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:16,439 Speaker 1: And that underground economy is a natural and probable consequence 171 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:19,880 Speaker 1: of the anti doubles AMATEURSM rules. Anytime you're in a 172 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:23,840 Speaker 1: multibillion dollar business UH and you're trying to limit one 173 00:09:23,920 --> 00:09:27,480 Speaker 1: segment of that business, that being your employees, the players 174 00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:31,600 Speaker 1: two expenses only, it's no wonder there's going to be 175 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:34,440 Speaker 1: an underground economy that's going to spring up. Because talent 176 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 1: acquisition and any business is really important, and you can 177 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 1: tell that by how recruiting goes in college So the 178 00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:44,079 Speaker 1: idea that you could you could make money the number 179 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:47,600 Speaker 1: one priority, which it is in college sports. But yet 180 00:09:47,679 --> 00:09:51,560 Speaker 1: the players are going to be quote unquote amateur. Uh 181 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:54,320 Speaker 1: it's kind of hard, too hard to fathom that you 182 00:09:54,320 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 1: wouldn't see you wouldn't see this coming or know that 183 00:09:56,920 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 1: it's happening. They saw it coming. Uh, they it was happening, 184 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:04,280 Speaker 1: but but it wasn't something that they would or could stop. 185 00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:09,280 Speaker 1: Why not just simply take the amateur status controversy away 186 00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 1: and pay the college athletes? And too, why didn't the 187 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:15,400 Speaker 1: n C doumble a step in in the first place, Well, 188 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 1: then double a claim if they couldn't have because they 189 00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: don't have the investigated tools of the federal government, that 190 00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:26,160 Speaker 1: they don't have subpoena power and they can't compel testimony 191 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:30,280 Speaker 1: and uh and compel document production and the like, which 192 00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 1: I mean, I guess there is truth in that they 193 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:35,920 Speaker 1: don't have subpoena power, but I think when you know, 194 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:38,040 Speaker 1: they said it so often, they made it sound like 195 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 1: they felt like they deserved it. And there are a 196 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:43,880 Speaker 1: whole bunch of industries that are able to police themselves 197 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:47,720 Speaker 1: very well without subpoena power. I mean, I'm a lawyer, uh, 198 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 1: and I'm I'm a member of the American Bar Association 199 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:54,280 Speaker 1: and we're able to discipline our ranks. Uh. And we 200 00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:57,680 Speaker 1: don't have subpoena power either. And UH, you know there's 201 00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:00,559 Speaker 1: there's there's there are no businesses that have that. Uh 202 00:11:00,559 --> 00:11:04,600 Speaker 1: the government has that. UM, so they weren't able to 203 00:11:04,640 --> 00:11:08,000 Speaker 1: do it. Now, why won't they pay players? Um? Because 204 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:11,520 Speaker 1: they simply don't want to. Uh. They've never they've never 205 00:11:11,559 --> 00:11:14,880 Speaker 1: felt like they had to. UM. And if I were them, 206 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:17,480 Speaker 1: I wouldn't want to either, because I'd make more money 207 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:20,800 Speaker 1: if I didn't have to share it with others. But UM, 208 00:11:21,280 --> 00:11:23,280 Speaker 1: I think they've reached a point where I think I 209 00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 1: think if you want to run an amateur um sort 210 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:31,120 Speaker 1: of an amateur endeavor, UH, that's fine, but you can't 211 00:11:31,240 --> 00:11:33,880 Speaker 1: you can't sell the players for billions of dollars and 212 00:11:33,880 --> 00:11:37,800 Speaker 1: then claim it's amateur. I mean every games on television. Uh, 213 00:11:37,840 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 1: they sell tickets at these gigantic prices. The universities are 214 00:11:42,200 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 1: using athletics not just to generate revenue, which is substantial. 215 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:50,200 Speaker 1: They're making you know, millions upon millions with uh with 216 00:11:50,280 --> 00:11:52,560 Speaker 1: media rights deals, with a peril deals and the like. 217 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:57,160 Speaker 1: But the universities are also using athletics for institutional advancement 218 00:11:57,559 --> 00:11:59,800 Speaker 1: and Jake quick little story. Years ago, I spoke with 219 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 1: be about in, former coach of Florida State, and he 220 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:04,760 Speaker 1: told me he knew everything had changed when one day 221 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:07,240 Speaker 1: the university president showed up at his office on an 222 00:12:07,240 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 1: off day and said, boy, I noticed we had some 223 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:12,640 Speaker 1: empty seats at the last game. He said. The president 224 00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:15,439 Speaker 1: had never come into his office before, and all of 225 00:12:15,480 --> 00:12:18,080 Speaker 1: a sudden he was concerned about empty seats. The game 226 00:12:18,160 --> 00:12:20,000 Speaker 1: had changed, and he knew I wasn't long for this 227 00:12:20,040 --> 00:12:22,920 Speaker 1: sport anymore. Yeah, and you look, you'll have some of 228 00:12:22,960 --> 00:12:25,680 Speaker 1: the old time coach says, coaches saying, hey, you know 229 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 1: it's so different now. You know, we didn't get into 230 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:31,440 Speaker 1: this for the money, and you know they didn't get 231 00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: into it for the money. But they're taking the money. 232 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 1: They're not they're not disappointed about the money. And there's 233 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 1: nothing wrong with that. Uh. You know, I I believe 234 00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:42,360 Speaker 1: in making money. But I think what what's profoundly wrong 235 00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:45,880 Speaker 1: is the NT double A operates as a cartel and 236 00:12:45,960 --> 00:12:50,840 Speaker 1: so they price fixed labor at at zero and really 237 00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:54,559 Speaker 1: the players are allowed only their expenses. And what's really 238 00:12:54,640 --> 00:12:56,640 Speaker 1: sort of maddening about it is the NT double A 239 00:12:56,760 --> 00:12:59,079 Speaker 1: likes to say that these athletics, you know these uh 240 00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:02,800 Speaker 1: these schools, I mean, any money off athletics, which is 241 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 1: laughable because you know what they're But what they're pointing 242 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:10,240 Speaker 1: to is like sort of creative accounting where they'll point 243 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:13,960 Speaker 1: to the athletic department bottom line and and say, see, look, 244 00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 1: you know, nobody's making a profit or only twelve schools 245 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:19,080 Speaker 1: whatever it is, or making a profit even though it's 246 00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:24,119 Speaker 1: a multi billion dollar endeavor. Well, really, the biggest expense 247 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:28,080 Speaker 1: that an athletic department has is the cost of scholarships. 248 00:13:28,480 --> 00:13:30,720 Speaker 1: And where does that money go. That goes from the 249 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:33,280 Speaker 1: bank account of the athletic department to the bank account 250 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:35,439 Speaker 1: of the school. So the school is not out of 251 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:39,880 Speaker 1: nickel for scholarships. Um, they're they're only out the opportunity 252 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: cost of having a different paying student in that seat. 253 00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:45,240 Speaker 1: And if they could make more money off of paying 254 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 1: student being in that seat, they would certainly do it. 255 00:13:48,240 --> 00:13:52,120 Speaker 1: Uh this, there's nothing sinister about this business. It's it's 256 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:57,200 Speaker 1: a it's professional sports, and there's nothing wrong with professional sports. 257 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:00,160 Speaker 1: What's wrong is that the n C double A is 258 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:04,280 Speaker 1: telling these athletes that you can't have any until you 259 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:07,760 Speaker 1: leave here, and you can't take anything before you get here. 260 00:14:08,559 --> 00:14:11,640 Speaker 1: We get to sell you for whatever we can make 261 00:14:11,640 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 1: off of you, and you you can't share in any 262 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 1: of that. But boy, isn't it great that you get 263 00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:19,760 Speaker 1: to you get to use these nights facilities and and 264 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:22,440 Speaker 1: we'll make it look like you're getting a deal when 265 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:25,040 Speaker 1: we're the ones getting the deal. J When it comes 266 00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:27,160 Speaker 1: to TV rights in n C Double A basketball, do 267 00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:30,320 Speaker 1: you think the money there has played any sort of 268 00:14:30,440 --> 00:14:33,360 Speaker 1: role in the current situation we see with money in 269 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:37,480 Speaker 1: college hoops. It has played a role because it's the 270 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:41,160 Speaker 1: it's the it's a lot of the money that the 271 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:44,800 Speaker 1: universities are are are accepting and pocketing. And that's what 272 00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:48,040 Speaker 1: I'm talking about about selling the athletes. Like, that's what 273 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 1: the n C Double A does. And when I say 274 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:51,200 Speaker 1: it's Double A, I don't just me in the office 275 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:55,680 Speaker 1: in uh in Indianapolis. I mean every member institution. Uh. 276 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 1: They they do media rights deals and sell their games 277 00:14:59,200 --> 00:15:01,840 Speaker 1: that they're selling the players. Now they're selling some other 278 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:04,040 Speaker 1: things to their selling their own brand and the code. 279 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:07,240 Speaker 1: They're selling the coaches, but they're compensating the coaches and 280 00:15:07,240 --> 00:15:10,600 Speaker 1: and all that. But they're selling the players to television 281 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:15,280 Speaker 1: and and then they use them as billboards for peril deals. 282 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:17,720 Speaker 1: So you'll have some people say, well, hey, look the 283 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:21,240 Speaker 1: players get free gear. Well, first, the coaches get free 284 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:22,840 Speaker 1: gear too, if you want to look at it that way. 285 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 1: But the players are required to wear that gear. It's 286 00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:28,480 Speaker 1: not like they get a gift certificate. They're sporting good 287 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:31,000 Speaker 1: store and they say, hey, go crazy, enjoy yourself. The 288 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 1: coaches also get golf club memberships and cars and and 289 00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 1: stipends and allowances and sometimes university housing. They get all 290 00:15:38,360 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 1: that they're allowed whatever they can negotiate, and no question. 291 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:43,720 Speaker 1: But I'm just kind of saying that that, you know, 292 00:15:43,720 --> 00:15:46,640 Speaker 1: when they point to what the players get, uh, there 293 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: there's there's no sort of understanding or acknowledgement of what 294 00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:53,680 Speaker 1: the what everybody else quote unquote gets, or what the 295 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:58,840 Speaker 1: university gets, because the university is getting uh no cost labor, 296 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:03,280 Speaker 1: you know, sort expenses only labor, and they're getting players 297 00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:05,840 Speaker 1: names and likenesses that they're able to sell for their 298 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:07,800 Speaker 1: own benefit without having to share any of it with 299 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:12,640 Speaker 1: the players. And so the question about the media rights deals, like, 300 00:16:12,840 --> 00:16:15,560 Speaker 1: you know, you made a good point. I think about 301 00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:18,840 Speaker 1: the chess team at Michigan, but I think it also 302 00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:23,000 Speaker 1: extends to Division two and Division three uh sports altogether, 303 00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:25,200 Speaker 1: Like you don't hear about scandals and Division two and 304 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 1: Division three, And I don't think the enterprise would be 305 00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:32,000 Speaker 1: any different if the players were allowed to make money, UM, 306 00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:34,760 Speaker 1: you could still require them to be full time students. 307 00:16:34,760 --> 00:16:37,480 Speaker 1: You can still require them to uh to go to 308 00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 1: school because and this is one thing that I think 309 00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 1: gets missed, and that is, no other students is told 310 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:49,000 Speaker 1: how much money they can make or whether they can 311 00:16:49,480 --> 00:16:52,239 Speaker 1: take advantage of their name and likeness in the marketplace 312 00:16:52,680 --> 00:16:55,360 Speaker 1: and still be full time students in good standing. It's 313 00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:58,120 Speaker 1: only an athlete that's told that. Well, if this is 314 00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 1: really about education and and and all that, why wouldn't 315 00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:03,680 Speaker 1: we tell that to other students too. You know, music 316 00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:07,679 Speaker 1: person on a music scholarship can can cut a record 317 00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:10,760 Speaker 1: and uh you know, appear at concerts and the like. 318 00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:13,720 Speaker 1: But yet you can't do that if you're an athlete. 319 00:17:13,840 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 1: And I find that to be a contradiction. That is 320 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:20,000 Speaker 1: uh is hard for the n C double A to escape. 321 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:22,120 Speaker 1: You know, the ones they're making money off of their 322 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 1: limiting the ones they are not can do whatever they want. 323 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 1: And I find that to be to be almost disturbing. 324 00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:31,240 Speaker 1: We've got agents, we've got money, we've got sneaker companies, 325 00:17:31,280 --> 00:17:33,840 Speaker 1: we've got a AU teams, we've got coaches, we've got 326 00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:37,920 Speaker 1: athletic directors. The money is going where it's not supposed to. Jay, 327 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:40,960 Speaker 1: were you surprised that Louisville moves so quickly to take 328 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:43,199 Speaker 1: action against Patino? I mean, the guy's a Hall of famer, 329 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:45,959 Speaker 1: and also the athletic director, Tom Jurch, who is one 330 00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:48,480 Speaker 1: of the most respected and effective a d s in 331 00:17:48,520 --> 00:17:51,679 Speaker 1: the country. I'm not I actually called that before it happened. 332 00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:54,280 Speaker 1: I expected them to clean house as soon as as 333 00:17:54,320 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 1: soon as this broke, as soon as I read the complaint, 334 00:17:57,320 --> 00:18:00,520 Speaker 1: I was actually on television going over. I knew it 335 00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:04,000 Speaker 1: was over for everybody there. Um, simply because on the 336 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:07,720 Speaker 1: heels of the last scandal, to have this happened. Uh. 337 00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:11,760 Speaker 1: You know, universities are big corporations, and as you guys 338 00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:14,240 Speaker 1: know better than I do, one of the big you know, 339 00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:16,199 Speaker 1: one of the biggest things that corporations do is they 340 00:18:16,200 --> 00:18:18,359 Speaker 1: try to get any any hint of scandle off the 341 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:21,520 Speaker 1: table as quickly as possible. And uh, and I was 342 00:18:21,640 --> 00:18:25,680 Speaker 1: a little bit surprised that they didn't act differently last 343 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 1: time with regard to the strippers candle, because you know 344 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:30,760 Speaker 1: that that would have helped get that off the table. 345 00:18:31,359 --> 00:18:33,520 Speaker 1: But I think it showed that there was no credible 346 00:18:33,520 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 1: evidence that Patino or Jurich had any any knowledge of 347 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:39,000 Speaker 1: that at all, And he had so many people there 348 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:42,320 Speaker 1: that found that unimaginable, and they couldn't find anybody that 349 00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:45,360 Speaker 1: knew about it aside from those that were directly involved. 350 00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:49,560 Speaker 1: So I understood that, but but haven't two in a row. 351 00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 1: I felt, just the pr and the way that big 352 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:57,359 Speaker 1: corporations work, uh that that that would be the remedy 353 00:18:57,400 --> 00:18:59,560 Speaker 1: they would they would use. Do you remember a while 354 00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:02,199 Speaker 1: back there's something went on over at Ohio State and 355 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:04,439 Speaker 1: the president of the university, Gordon Gey, was asked if 356 00:19:04,480 --> 00:19:06,439 Speaker 1: he was going to fire the football coach and his 357 00:19:06,520 --> 00:19:10,520 Speaker 1: response was no, I hope he doesn't fire me. When 358 00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:15,600 Speaker 1: do the educators begin to assert themselves and put the 359 00:19:15,640 --> 00:19:20,440 Speaker 1: core mission of the universities back on the front burner. Well, 360 00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:24,000 Speaker 1: the presidents have asserted themselves. I can't tell you how 361 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 1: many times I've I've heard the presidents are in charge, 362 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:28,760 Speaker 1: and I believe that, and that's why things are so 363 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:30,880 Speaker 1: screwed up. So you're saying they're signing with the money 364 00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:34,520 Speaker 1: of college sports. Of course, I mean your decisions reveal 365 00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:36,920 Speaker 1: your priorities, and the decisions have been about money, and 366 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:41,760 Speaker 1: the priorities are about money and uh and like nobody, Hey, 367 00:19:41,800 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 1: they could have said no to all these deals, like 368 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:47,120 Speaker 1: the n C Double A could could run just like 369 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:50,560 Speaker 1: the Masters and Augusta National with that fabulous property they 370 00:19:50,600 --> 00:19:53,520 Speaker 1: have of the Master's Call tournament where there are no 371 00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:57,119 Speaker 1: commercials and things are referred to a certain way and 372 00:19:57,160 --> 00:19:59,440 Speaker 1: you're gonna do things a certain way that they can 373 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:02,359 Speaker 1: they can do that they chose not to. When people 374 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:04,880 Speaker 1: talk about nine o'clock games, they'll say, why why would 375 00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 1: we have nine o'clock games? Why are these games so late? 376 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:10,760 Speaker 1: A lot of folks, including n C Double A personnel, 377 00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:13,640 Speaker 1: like to like to point the finger at media and 378 00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:16,880 Speaker 1: the television companies and say, well, you know it's not 379 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:21,280 Speaker 1: our call. Well it's absolutely then double A as to 380 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:26,440 Speaker 1: when these games start. Media companies negotiate uh, media media 381 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:30,359 Speaker 1: rights steals, and they're willing to pay a certain amount 382 00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:32,640 Speaker 1: for a seven o'clock game because of the ratings. How 383 00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:35,200 Speaker 1: many people can watch with nature wide and they're willing 384 00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:37,880 Speaker 1: to pay more for a nine o'clock game. Pinme Time 385 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:41,720 Speaker 1: Game and the n C Double are all their member institutions. 386 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:45,360 Speaker 1: They're saying, no, we'll play at nine, We'll play on Tuesday. Yep, 387 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,119 Speaker 1: we'll play on Sunday night. That was Louisville. Louisville agreed 388 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:49,560 Speaker 1: to play on Tuesday. That was one of the big 389 00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:53,199 Speaker 1: catalysts to their athletic department success. All of them are 390 00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:55,480 Speaker 1: doing it, and there's nothing wrong with that. I'm not 391 00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:58,680 Speaker 1: complaining about it. I'm just saying that these are all 392 00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:02,120 Speaker 1: these decisions that they've made. They own the property, they 393 00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:05,760 Speaker 1: own these games, and by virtue of of not paying them, 394 00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:09,199 Speaker 1: they own the players too, and they sell it, you 395 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:12,439 Speaker 1: know all Sonny. But Carroll made a great point the 396 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:14,919 Speaker 1: other day, the shoe Guru that that a lot of 397 00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:17,360 Speaker 1: people like to blame for starting all this, but but 398 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:21,360 Speaker 1: he didn't. Um. You know, he was asked years ago 399 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:23,640 Speaker 1: in a night Commission meeting by the Penn State President 400 00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:27,919 Speaker 1: of why should we why should we uh let you 401 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:30,480 Speaker 1: pay us all this money? And he says, well, maybe 402 00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:32,520 Speaker 1: you shouldn't, but you're doing it, you know, and you're 403 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:35,879 Speaker 1: gonna you're gonna keep taking it. We're all we can 404 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,439 Speaker 1: do is offer it. You're you're making the decision to 405 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:42,199 Speaker 1: accept it. And so while the while the presidents can 406 00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:45,080 Speaker 1: complain about the shoot companies all they want, you know, 407 00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:49,359 Speaker 1: they can't. They can't complete ignorance to their school signing 408 00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:52,200 Speaker 1: a hundred and sixty million dollar deal with the shoe company. 409 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 1: You know that they've all done this, and the n 410 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:58,679 Speaker 1: C double A has has, They've all been involved, they 411 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:01,760 Speaker 1: all made they're all really mark people. They all made 412 00:22:02,359 --> 00:22:07,240 Speaker 1: conscious decisions and they built this business up, this multibillion 413 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 1: dollar industry purposefully and methodically into what it is. And 414 00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:14,640 Speaker 1: so they can't claim ignorance or somehow. You know, it's 415 00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:16,919 Speaker 1: like the bank saying, God, I can't believe what I 416 00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:19,040 Speaker 1: can't believe. Where this business is now just kind of 417 00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:22,840 Speaker 1: happen overnight. Didn't happen overnight. There was lobbying done. All 418 00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 1: these decisions were made by smart people that knew what 419 00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 1: they were doing. We're talking with j. Billis, who used 420 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:32,680 Speaker 1: to play for Duke University, now an ESPN analyst. And 421 00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:35,320 Speaker 1: I always joke about being an old man, but it's 422 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:39,000 Speaker 1: true because my twenty six year old son reminded me 423 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:41,800 Speaker 1: of something. And it was last year we were watching 424 00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:44,159 Speaker 1: uh you have been basketball and I said, yeah, I'm 425 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 1: gonna watch it on TV and my son said, oh, Dad, 426 00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:49,440 Speaker 1: I'm gonna watch it by streaming it. And it hit 427 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:51,919 Speaker 1: me again. It's like, my goodness, this is how the 428 00:22:52,040 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 1: sport has changed so much. How we watch college sports, Well, 429 00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:58,680 Speaker 1: everything's changed. I mean, you know, our our grandparents listened 430 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:02,120 Speaker 1: to games on the radio from the old Yeah, then 431 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,919 Speaker 1: television came in. Now we have the Internet and is 432 00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:08,440 Speaker 1: you're mentioning streaming, So the delivery system may be changing, 433 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 1: but the models basically the same. And that is the 434 00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:14,920 Speaker 1: the n C double A and its member institutions, all 435 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,560 Speaker 1: the conferences, they own the they own the properties, they 436 00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:21,440 Speaker 1: own the content, and they're selling it to media companies. 437 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:25,120 Speaker 1: You know, the Big ten just did a multimedia company 438 00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:29,359 Speaker 1: deal that's similar to what the NFL has. And you 439 00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:32,320 Speaker 1: know they're they're going from a twenty you know, over 440 00:23:32,359 --> 00:23:36,359 Speaker 1: twenty million dollar per school payout annually, they'll be up 441 00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 1: over forty millions and uh and that's real money. And 442 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:44,240 Speaker 1: that doesn't include what they're licensing, is their merchandizing and uh, 443 00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:47,560 Speaker 1: and it doesn't include what they make off apparel deals 444 00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:51,440 Speaker 1: each of their individual schools, so that the systems of 445 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:55,359 Speaker 1: wash and money. Uh. And so you know this is 446 00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:59,280 Speaker 1: not amateur sports. It is not, And anyone that claims 447 00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:05,399 Speaker 1: it is is either not very bright or lying. You 448 00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:07,720 Speaker 1: can't sell stuff for billions of dollars and claim at 449 00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:09,760 Speaker 1: perimeter a couple of minutes left. I want to ask 450 00:24:09,800 --> 00:24:11,960 Speaker 1: you about the power that the players have that I 451 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:15,080 Speaker 1: think they're just starting to learn. We got a glimpse 452 00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:18,320 Speaker 1: of it with the Missouri football team threatened not to play. 453 00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 1: And can you imagine the conversations going on at the 454 00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:24,160 Speaker 1: President's office, the athletic department, and the networks. They need 455 00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:27,359 Speaker 1: this content, They must put something on the air. What 456 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:30,720 Speaker 1: would happen if one team, two teams, doesn't matter at 457 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:34,080 Speaker 1: the final four, decides we're not taking the court. What 458 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:37,440 Speaker 1: kind of change would that foster? I don't know that 459 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:41,000 Speaker 1: that just doing that would foster that much change unless 460 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:44,439 Speaker 1: it unless it serves as a catalyst for other player 461 00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:48,720 Speaker 1: protests where they could flex their economic muscle. I think 462 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:52,320 Speaker 1: the initial reaction would be just like that of maybe 463 00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:55,320 Speaker 1: John Carlos and Tommy Smith or or some of these 464 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:59,040 Speaker 1: anthem protests where uh, folks would point at the players 465 00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:01,919 Speaker 1: and say, oh, you you know, you spoiled brats. You know, 466 00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 1: we want to watch the game, and now you won't 467 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:07,080 Speaker 1: perform for us for free. It's amazing how people kind 468 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:09,840 Speaker 1: of turn things around and and misdirect and kind of 469 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 1: missed the point. I think what would be a lot 470 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:16,280 Speaker 1: more effective for players. I've said this before is you know, look, 471 00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:18,760 Speaker 1: the players have a tough spot because they're transient. They're 472 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:21,919 Speaker 1: only there for four or five years, and organizing it 473 00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:25,000 Speaker 1: would be difficult. Uh, and they've got a lot of 474 00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:28,199 Speaker 1: people that would try to discourage them from doing this. 475 00:25:28,440 --> 00:25:31,760 Speaker 1: Jay Billis, who used to play for Duke University now 476 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:36,760 Speaker 1: he is a TV analyst for ESPN. Thank you so much. Jay, 477 00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:39,320 Speaker 1: We appreciate it, and thank you for your time. What 478 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:43,600 Speaker 1: a pleasure. Oh it's my pleasure. Thanks for having me. Takeaways. Billis, 479 00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:47,000 Speaker 1: who has been covering this sport for years, just simply 480 00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:50,520 Speaker 1: have the attitude. When we mentioned about the scandal in 481 00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:54,639 Speaker 1: college basketball, he said, yeah, and it's like, hey, this 482 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:58,119 Speaker 1: has been going on for years, that dirty little secret 483 00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:00,960 Speaker 1: that's been known for a long time. My takeaway is 484 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:05,600 Speaker 1: you sometimes see these pockets of professors who get together 485 00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:09,120 Speaker 1: and say that the mission of education has been lost 486 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:11,520 Speaker 1: in big time college sports and that they don't mix anymore. 487 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:15,560 Speaker 1: But Jay makes the point that at the highest echelons 488 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:19,200 Speaker 1: of the universities, they're complicit in all this because they're 489 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,879 Speaker 1: taking the money. All the networks can do, all the 490 00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:26,920 Speaker 1: sneaker companies can do is offer the money. Nobody has 491 00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:30,400 Speaker 1: to say yes and take it. But they've taken it before, 492 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:33,840 Speaker 1: they're taking it now, and they will continue to do 493 00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: so in the future. That you said that he hoped 494 00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:39,399 Speaker 1: this was the That was Gordon g the president of 495 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:41,760 Speaker 1: Ohio State. Right during one of the scandals. They were 496 00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:44,040 Speaker 1: the football team. They asked if he was going to 497 00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,920 Speaker 1: fire the football coach, and his response was no, Actually, 498 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:50,960 Speaker 1: I hope he doesn't fire me. If that doesn't sum 499 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:56,160 Speaker 1: it all up, I don't know what does feel better 500 00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:58,520 Speaker 1: to be number one than number five? A number because 501 00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:00,159 Speaker 1: we have a chance to go for to are in 502 00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:01,800 Speaker 1: a rown. Good numbers are a good time. When I 503 00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:04,000 Speaker 1: first started wearing the number, I would just have the 504 00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:08,960 Speaker 1: in five Bloomberg Business of Sports, the number of the week. 505 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:11,760 Speaker 1: And now for the number of the week, I'm surprising 506 00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:17,120 Speaker 1: you this week the number is forty five, I think 507 00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:22,280 Speaker 1: Donald Trump, I don't know what think about. Now. I'm 508 00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:25,280 Speaker 1: gonna give you a hint. This is obviously where the 509 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:28,520 Speaker 1: business of sports, but this is an age, so I'm 510 00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:30,919 Speaker 1: gonna give you right now, just tell me. I have 511 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,000 Speaker 1: no idea this. This podcast has a time limit, right 512 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:39,600 Speaker 1: like a baseball game. For the Calgary Flames have officially 513 00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:45,520 Speaker 1: signed forty five years yes, through a one year contract. 514 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:49,880 Speaker 1: Five time NHL scoring champion is second behind Wayne Gretzky 515 00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:53,760 Speaker 1: in NHL history with one thousand, nine hundred fourteen points 516 00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:58,440 Speaker 1: on seven hundred sixty five goals and about eleven forty 517 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,240 Speaker 1: nine assistant He didn't miss a game while playing for 518 00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:04,240 Speaker 1: Florida last season. I'm impressed he's making a million bucks 519 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,320 Speaker 1: at forty five. He's still doing it. I've seen the 520 00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 1: guy work out. It's unbelievable. Does he still have the mullet? 521 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:10,760 Speaker 1: I mean, that's what I want to know. There's there's 522 00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,320 Speaker 1: a contingent of fans who wear the mullets and they 523 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,399 Speaker 1: travel around to see Yeager play. That they're great. You know, 524 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:20,000 Speaker 1: I'm into the hockey. To do this at age forty, 525 00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:26,959 Speaker 1: night in, night out is absolutely something to behold. Yager. 526 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:30,439 Speaker 1: Yeager is pretty impressive guy that he can do this 527 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 1: and we're talking about at the highest level in the 528 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:36,320 Speaker 1: NHL and I we're not talking now Gordy. How God 529 00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:38,520 Speaker 1: bless him, I mean, and God rest his soul. He 530 00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:40,960 Speaker 1: came in for you know, I think like you know, 531 00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,200 Speaker 1: for a few minutes one time he played with his 532 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:45,840 Speaker 1: son's play with his sons, whatever. But we're talking about 533 00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:51,040 Speaker 1: playing on the ice, actual time, three periods going. That's 534 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:54,000 Speaker 1: doing something. He's he's scoring points. And the fact that 535 00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:56,880 Speaker 1: somebody's given him one more season and that he's able 536 00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 1: to do it, Like I said, pretty darn impressive. You 537 00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,360 Speaker 1: the man. You've been listening to Bloomberg Business of Sports. 538 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:04,440 Speaker 1: We are here each and every week at the same time, 539 00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:06,840 Speaker 1: exploring the world of money in sports. Michael la Bar 540 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 1: and I'm Scott Sashnik. Thanks for joining us, and please 541 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 1: tune in next week when we speak with the biggest 542 00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,960 Speaker 1: and brightest in the world of sports business. You're listening 543 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,680 Speaker 1: to Bloomberg Business of Sports on Bloomberg Radio around the 544 00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:21,080 Speaker 1: world and online as an Apple podcast on night Tunes.