WEBVTT - This Week In Crypto 0:00:02.680 --> 0:00:05.760 This is Bloomberg Crypto, a daily Bloomberg I Heard podcast, 0:00:05.880 --> 0:00:08.719 and I'm Stacy Marie Ishmael, Managing editor of Crypto for 0:00:08.720 --> 0:00:29.400 Bloomberg News. It's Friday, December nine. Well, the Sam Bankman 0:00:29.440 --> 0:00:32.560 apology tour continued this week, despite a number of high 0:00:32.600 --> 0:00:37.560 profile lawyers, including one who represented Bernie made Off, saying 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:40.400 that maybe the former CEO of f t X should 0:00:40.479 --> 0:00:45.120 really stop talking speaking of lawyers. As the bankruptcy winds 0:00:45.159 --> 0:00:47.720 its way through the courts, thirty year old Sam Bankman 0:00:47.800 --> 0:00:51.440 freed has in fact hired a new person to represent him, 0:00:51.479 --> 0:00:55.960 Mark Cohen. Cohen's name, if it sounds familiar, is probably 0:00:56.000 --> 0:00:58.640 because he's known as one of the lawyers who represented 0:00:58.680 --> 0:01:02.560 convicted sex offender Lane Maxwell. Today we're also going to 0:01:02.640 --> 0:01:05.640 discuss whether that big Ethereum moved to proof of steak, 0:01:05.840 --> 0:01:08.560 which happened earlier this year, although it feels a million 0:01:08.640 --> 0:01:12.640 years ago, really had a meaningful effect on energy consumption. 0:01:13.120 --> 0:01:17.280 A new academic people writing about the merge, asks the question, 0:01:17.959 --> 0:01:20.640 what if all those computers are no longer working on 0:01:20.680 --> 0:01:24.280 proof of work duty for Ethereum have just been reassigned, 0:01:24.600 --> 0:01:30.320 and they're mining other equally energy intensive tokens. Finally, why 0:01:30.400 --> 0:01:33.400 is Senator Elizabeth Warren asking questions about silver Gate? For 0:01:33.560 --> 0:01:35.800 all this and more, we're joined this week by Bloomberg 0:01:35.840 --> 0:01:39.120 Report to any Massa. To have Sam Bankman Freed come 0:01:39.160 --> 0:01:43.440 in with his kind of reputation for being this real 0:01:43.480 --> 0:01:45.760 mover and shaker in crypto was exciting to people at 0:01:45.760 --> 0:01:48.960 the time, and senior editor Dave Liqua, there's worry whether 0:01:49.440 --> 0:01:53.120 there'll be another wave of sailing or panic selling, but 0:01:53.200 --> 0:02:08.240 in the meantime, the market's actually been fairly flat. So Annie, 0:02:08.320 --> 0:02:11.200 you are on the road at the moment. What's going on? 0:02:11.639 --> 0:02:15.600 That's right. So I'm in Chicago today. I've been um 0:02:15.639 --> 0:02:18.160 back and forth here for a couple of conferences and 0:02:18.240 --> 0:02:20.920 industry events, the goal being to just talk to as 0:02:20.919 --> 0:02:24.280 many crypto people as I possibly can, as as this 0:02:24.360 --> 0:02:28.400 industry kind of absorbed absorbs. The shock waves of f 0:02:28.520 --> 0:02:33.160 t X is massive implosion, and what's a large number 0:02:33.200 --> 0:02:37.000 of shock waves. There have been so a couple of 0:02:37.000 --> 0:02:39.400 things that have been happening just this week. You know, 0:02:39.480 --> 0:02:44.359 We've had Sam Bankman Freed pop up on three Twitter spaces, 0:02:44.600 --> 0:02:49.639 several other media appearances, just a lot of him explaining 0:02:49.800 --> 0:02:52.600 what he thinks happened, or what he doesn't know happened. 0:02:52.800 --> 0:02:55.079 One thing that's been interesting to watch, at least from 0:02:55.080 --> 0:02:59.120 my perspective, is there was this big lead up to 0:03:00.000 --> 0:03:02.760 AM's appearance at the New York Times Steel Book conference, 0:03:03.080 --> 0:03:06.000 where people were shocked that he would talk to the 0:03:06.040 --> 0:03:10.519 media after all that's transpired. But what's happened since then 0:03:11.000 --> 0:03:14.400 has been has I think up ended people's expectations. Instead 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:16.799 of it being hard to get an interview with him, 0:03:16.840 --> 0:03:19.919 he'll almost speak to anyone. He's on this on Twitter 0:03:20.000 --> 0:03:22.520 spaces all the time. Like you mentioned, He's talking to 0:03:22.600 --> 0:03:25.760 every single outlet, sometimes for hours at a time. And 0:03:25.840 --> 0:03:29.320 it's become this parlor game in the crypto industry to 0:03:29.760 --> 0:03:32.520 guess what on earth he's trying to do? What on earth? 0:03:32.639 --> 0:03:35.720 The goal is here? And this is despite and I 0:03:35.720 --> 0:03:38.840 have to say this, this is despite the advice of counsel, 0:03:39.040 --> 0:03:43.520 whether his counsel or other people's counsel, or just like 0:03:43.600 --> 0:03:47.080 any lawyer in the street. The vibe from the lawyers 0:03:47.080 --> 0:03:50.840 seems to be Mr Bankman, Freed, please stop talking. Are 0:03:50.880 --> 0:03:52.960 they suggesting this is a good idea for you to 0:03:53.000 --> 0:03:56.600 be speaking? Uh? You know, they're very much not um 0:03:57.640 --> 0:04:01.560 and I mean, you know, the classic advice rate don't 0:04:01.600 --> 0:04:06.440 say anything. Uh, you know, recede into a hole. Uh? 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:08.960 And is that who I am? I mean one of 0:04:09.000 --> 0:04:12.280 the headlines that our colleagues on the legal team were 0:04:12.320 --> 0:04:14.920 able to confirm this week is that Sam Bankman Freed 0:04:15.000 --> 0:04:17.840 has actually hired new counsel who may or may not 0:04:17.880 --> 0:04:21.520 be telling him to stop talking to everyone. Yes. Um, 0:04:21.640 --> 0:04:24.000 with his apology toward there's been a lot of questions 0:04:24.040 --> 0:04:28.080 where he's going with his legal strategy, and by hiring 0:04:28.440 --> 0:04:33.599 Gillane Maxwell's lawyer tied to the infamous child sex scandal 0:04:33.720 --> 0:04:38.600 with Jeffrey Epstein, there's a real question on what he's 0:04:38.640 --> 0:04:44.960 trying to do. And Annie, from the perspective of you know, 0:04:45.120 --> 0:04:49.640 just this very very complicated set of companies. You have 0:04:50.600 --> 0:04:54.279 multiple lawyers not just representing Bankman Freed himself, but you know, 0:04:54.400 --> 0:04:57.400 personal counsel for a lot of the folks involved. You 0:04:57.440 --> 0:05:01.760 have multiple different domains and jurisdiction. How are you approaching 0:05:01.800 --> 0:05:04.680 this in terms of your reporting, you know, like and 0:05:04.800 --> 0:05:07.200 what's in terms of the crypto folks that you're talking 0:05:07.240 --> 0:05:10.840 to in Chicago and elsewhere. What are the feeling about 0:05:10.839 --> 0:05:14.120 the reverberations for the industry. I think you're exactly right. 0:05:14.160 --> 0:05:19.200 It's really a sprawling bankruptcy that has impact all over 0:05:19.240 --> 0:05:22.479 the world. I mean FTX operated all over the place 0:05:22.600 --> 0:05:24.560 of course, in the Bahamas, in the US, but you 0:05:24.600 --> 0:05:30.280 also have Europe, Japan, Vietnam, um areas all over the world. 0:05:30.880 --> 0:05:33.600 It's not a typical bankruptcy, right, Like, there are so 0:05:33.640 --> 0:05:38.560 many entities involved, and as John Ray said, there's really 0:05:38.760 --> 0:05:43.200 unreliable perhaps financial information that it's all based on. It 0:05:43.320 --> 0:05:45.920 leaves a lot of questions open about how we're going 0:05:46.000 --> 0:05:49.560 to proceed from here. And I think that a lot 0:05:49.640 --> 0:05:53.159 of the players involved have been lowering up themselves. But 0:05:53.320 --> 0:05:55.800 then you also have these entities that are going through 0:05:55.839 --> 0:06:00.000 bankruptcy and there is some confusion right now about how 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:03.000 exactly as well it will all play out. Now. When 0:06:03.080 --> 0:06:07.960 we talk about the the unusual nous of the bankruptcy 0:06:08.040 --> 0:06:10.960 and the multiple jurisdictions, one of the things that is 0:06:11.000 --> 0:06:13.839 also kind of unusual is like the contagion effect, right 0:06:13.880 --> 0:06:18.680 that this has had on other entities in crypto, Dave, 0:06:18.800 --> 0:06:20.840 As you've mentioned, you've covered crypto for a long time, 0:06:20.920 --> 0:06:25.000 You've covered finance for even longer. People are throwing around 0:06:25.000 --> 0:06:29.640 words like Enron made off Lehman Brothers. You know, the 0:06:29.680 --> 0:06:33.400 difference here being that unlike with made Off Sam Bank 0:06:33.520 --> 0:06:36.080 and Freed has not been charged with any kind of 0:06:36.120 --> 0:06:38.520 crime or wrongdoing, he's not been accused formally of any 0:06:38.560 --> 0:06:41.440 kind of crime or wrongdoing. Um with Enron, we have 0:06:41.480 --> 0:06:44.080 the benefit of hindsight, as we do with Lehman, to say, well, 0:06:44.120 --> 0:06:46.280 here are the things that exactly went wrong, But at 0:06:46.320 --> 0:06:50.000 least in terms of that feeling of contagion, what are 0:06:50.040 --> 0:06:51.760 some of the kinds of things that have been happening 0:06:51.760 --> 0:06:54.239 in the past few days and weeks that are giving 0:06:54.240 --> 0:06:57.800 a sense of how the market is reacting to this. Well, 0:06:57.800 --> 0:07:00.279 it's a real curious time in the market. There's still 0:07:00.520 --> 0:07:03.960 some unknowns in regards to contagion, so there's there's worry 0:07:03.960 --> 0:07:08.200 whether there'll be another wave of selling or panic selling. 0:07:08.360 --> 0:07:11.600 But in the meantime, the market has actually been fairly 0:07:11.720 --> 0:07:16.520 flat um since the the actual bankruptcy of f t X. 0:07:16.680 --> 0:07:20.000 In that time, Bitcoin has maintained its market share, which 0:07:20.040 --> 0:07:23.360 is also disconcerning to some folks because they see it 0:07:23.760 --> 0:07:29.679 as a example that there's no real safe haven demand 0:07:29.840 --> 0:07:32.200 in the market. Typically in the past, what has happened 0:07:32.320 --> 0:07:37.320 is that as markets fresh like this, the percentage goes up. 0:07:37.600 --> 0:07:40.080 Then the market turns around, the percentage goes down. But 0:07:40.200 --> 0:07:42.360 everything went down and you just in this time and 0:07:42.360 --> 0:07:46.240 it's just staying there right that idea of you would 0:07:46.280 --> 0:07:49.480 almost expect, or at least various analysts have been predicting, 0:07:49.880 --> 0:07:53.240 especially the bearish ones, that crypto prices across the board 0:07:53.240 --> 0:07:56.840 would actually be lower than where they are right now, 0:07:56.840 --> 0:07:59.760 but it's been it's been this like weirdly range bound 0:08:00.440 --> 0:08:04.320 trading situation instead. Um addie. One of the companies that 0:08:04.400 --> 0:08:07.800 has been kind of caught in this ft X contagion 0:08:08.000 --> 0:08:11.560 both directly and indirectly is robin Hood, and you have 0:08:11.640 --> 0:08:14.920 covered robin Hood very extensively. Could you just share a 0:08:14.960 --> 0:08:17.840 little bit about what is the relationship and what's the 0:08:17.880 --> 0:08:22.800 complexity between this robin Hood shares f t X situation 0:08:22.960 --> 0:08:26.360 right now. So back when Sam Bankmnfried was doing his 0:08:26.680 --> 0:08:31.320 kind of buying binge over the spring, he bought this 0:08:31.760 --> 0:08:34.840 big steak in robin Hood, which is a trading platform 0:08:34.960 --> 0:08:38.920 that's really popular among young and kind of inexperienced traders. 0:08:39.360 --> 0:08:42.000 And you know, we all recognize it from the game 0:08:42.080 --> 0:08:47.400 Stop meme stock saga of So Sam bought this huge 0:08:47.440 --> 0:08:50.160 steak in robin Hood and became one of its largest 0:08:50.240 --> 0:08:53.679 shareholders in May, and at the time people were kind 0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:58.280 of buzzing because robin Hood's share price was like really tanking, 0:08:58.960 --> 0:09:02.000 and uh, you know, to have Sam Bankman Freed come 0:09:02.040 --> 0:09:06.320 in with his kind of reputation for being this real 0:09:06.360 --> 0:09:08.640 mover and shaker in crypto was exciting to people at 0:09:08.640 --> 0:09:10.960 the time, and there was a question out there like 0:09:11.000 --> 0:09:12.600 would he ever want to buy it? Out right? Like 0:09:12.640 --> 0:09:14.280 what does he want with it? Is he going to 0:09:14.720 --> 0:09:17.640 broker some order flow deal? Like what does he want 0:09:17.679 --> 0:09:20.720 with this this steak in robin Hood? And you know, 0:09:21.000 --> 0:09:24.679 fast forward to now we've kind of had a complete 0:09:24.720 --> 0:09:28.520 one eighty and it's one of the last easily sellable 0:09:28.679 --> 0:09:32.480 liquid things that any entity related to Sam at all 0:09:32.679 --> 0:09:38.560 has in in the ft X empire. So now the 0:09:38.559 --> 0:09:42.679 big question is what will happen to that steak. I mean, 0:09:42.840 --> 0:09:47.040 it will be sold almost certainly, but when and how 0:09:47.080 --> 0:09:49.080 and who will get the proceeds from that remains an 0:09:49.120 --> 0:09:52.320 open question. For example, block Thigh has laid claim to 0:09:52.360 --> 0:09:55.520 the proceeds from that in its own bankruptcy that it's 0:09:55.520 --> 0:09:58.600 now going through. But again, like It speaks to the 0:09:58.679 --> 0:10:02.440 unusual nous of this is situation that you have this 0:10:02.640 --> 0:10:06.800 steak and some uncertainty over where it will actually where 0:10:06.679 --> 0:10:10.440 the proceeds from selling it will actually go. We'll be 0:10:10.559 --> 0:10:12.880 right back with more of the week's top crypto stories 0:10:12.920 --> 0:10:24.760 from Annie Massa and Dave Lita. One of the other 0:10:24.800 --> 0:10:28.240 things that's been, I suppose a little bit surprising about 0:10:28.520 --> 0:10:31.480 the past year is the like the back and forth 0:10:31.720 --> 0:10:35.720 of the regulatory environment that we've been in right where 0:10:35.760 --> 0:10:38.600 at intervals it has looked like there's going to be 0:10:38.720 --> 0:10:41.360 kind of a lot of momentum in terms of regulation, 0:10:41.440 --> 0:10:43.480 and then there was a pause. But what we have 0:10:43.640 --> 0:10:47.280 seen over the past couple of days is folks like 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:51.360 Senator Elizabeth Warren, you know, sending letters, which is something 0:10:51.400 --> 0:10:53.920 that she has done to several different crypto companies, but 0:10:53.960 --> 0:10:58.000 most recently to Silvergate, asking hey, what's going on with 0:10:58.000 --> 0:11:00.720 your relationship to f t X and Alaman and you 0:11:00.720 --> 0:11:03.520 can you just briefly outline what we're seeing on the 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:08.080 bank side as it relates to this crypto complexity. Yeah, 0:11:08.240 --> 0:11:11.360 I mean to the point about regulation, there's been this 0:11:11.480 --> 0:11:16.360 dance happening with the SEC and and regulators more broadly about. 0:11:16.440 --> 0:11:18.920 And I think part of the broader issue with f 0:11:19.040 --> 0:11:21.600 t X is that it fell through some cracks, Like 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:25.400 the SEC has said various things like they want exchanges 0:11:25.440 --> 0:11:28.079 to come in and register and they don't want crypto 0:11:28.120 --> 0:11:31.280 et s like that's been a whole um rigamarole for 0:11:31.320 --> 0:11:35.200 many years. But what really happened is, big picture, f 0:11:35.320 --> 0:11:37.760 t X and it's all its activities all over the 0:11:37.760 --> 0:11:41.720 world kind of fell into a regulatory void almost where 0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:45.280 no one was truly minding all of the farm from 0:11:45.320 --> 0:11:50.080 a regulatory perspective. So now the pressure is on for 0:11:50.120 --> 0:11:53.559 all these regulators all over the world to crack down 0:11:53.720 --> 0:11:59.199 figure out what went wrong, and um and and perhaps uh, 0:11:59.240 --> 0:12:03.160 you know, takes take some action, uh and not the 0:12:03.240 --> 0:12:05.920 least of which is political pressure, because now you have 0:12:06.000 --> 0:12:10.320 all of the attention of politicians, some some politicians who 0:12:10.360 --> 0:12:14.559 are personally embarrassed because they may have accepted donations from SPF. 0:12:14.760 --> 0:12:17.679 So the banking relationships is going to be a key 0:12:17.720 --> 0:12:20.320 element of that story to watch. You know, if you 0:12:20.320 --> 0:12:22.360 were a crypto company in the past several years, you 0:12:22.360 --> 0:12:24.840 couldn't just go in through the front door at JP 0:12:25.000 --> 0:12:28.080 Morgan and set up an account. So the banks that 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:32.760 did work with crypto companies, including f t X. So 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:35.400 we're looking at, like you mentioned, banks like silver Gate. 0:12:35.840 --> 0:12:39.240 There are real big open questions about the contours of 0:12:39.280 --> 0:12:43.680 those relationships and how much oversight they had, you know, 0:12:43.760 --> 0:12:47.520 how much they were doing to really enforce uh, the 0:12:47.640 --> 0:12:49.840 rules there, and I think that will be an area 0:12:49.880 --> 0:12:54.800 that we need to keep an eye on. Dave, Are 0:12:54.800 --> 0:12:59.520 there any big things going into three that we're encountering, 0:12:59.720 --> 0:13:02.559 you know, reporting that we expect might set the tone 0:13:02.640 --> 0:13:05.760 for what happens next. Yes, and there's a few things 0:13:05.800 --> 0:13:09.000 look at. Um. One is the world of mining. We've seen, 0:13:09.480 --> 0:13:12.320 uh that's a been area that's been decimated on three 0:13:12.320 --> 0:13:15.720 fronts to from higher energy prices earlier in the year 0:13:16.440 --> 0:13:20.880 and now with the lending relationships falling apart. As this 0:13:21.200 --> 0:13:25.680 downturn lasts on it, it's gonna be a a bankruptcy 0:13:25.720 --> 0:13:28.400 watch in that sector. To so several of these firms 0:13:28.440 --> 0:13:32.080 have said we're on the edge and unless this market 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:35.320 picks up, they're likely going to be there. So they've 0:13:35.400 --> 0:13:38.119 kind of exhausted the reserves in the in the upmarket, 0:13:38.240 --> 0:13:42.760 it was unusual thing that they were hoarding the bitcoin 0:13:42.840 --> 0:13:45.679 that they're mining because they wanted to play the appreciation 0:13:45.720 --> 0:13:48.920 game so that they were both investors and producers at 0:13:48.920 --> 0:13:51.600 the same time. On the way down, they've been selling 0:13:51.640 --> 0:13:55.360 the fun operations and the senses that they've run out 0:13:55.360 --> 0:13:59.719 of that or they've run through those reserves now and 0:14:00.679 --> 0:14:05.240 unless the market picks up, it's going to be bankruptcy 0:14:05.360 --> 0:14:08.240 probably for the case of them, a lot of them, 0:14:08.440 --> 0:14:11.960 and um that's going to have repercussions u as the 0:14:12.720 --> 0:14:15.200 as it has with the lenders. To stay on the 0:14:15.240 --> 0:14:19.040 miners for a second, our colleagues on you know what 0:14:19.080 --> 0:14:22.240 we call the Green Team, so who cover like energy 0:14:22.240 --> 0:14:27.320 in the environment sustainability wrote up a really interesting documents, 0:14:27.320 --> 0:14:31.600 a kind of an academic paper that was questioning whether 0:14:31.920 --> 0:14:36.520 the supposed environmental and energy saving benefits of the merge 0:14:36.680 --> 0:14:41.040 in which you know, the Ethereum blockchain moved from proof 0:14:41.080 --> 0:14:44.160 of work to proof of steak was really all that 0:14:44.240 --> 0:14:47.760 good for the world. And the central question of that was, well, 0:14:47.920 --> 0:14:54.080 have all of these former Ethereum proof of work miners 0:14:54.120 --> 0:14:57.120 have they really switched over to becoming like validators and 0:14:57.160 --> 0:14:59.800 a proof of state context or are they just repurposing 0:14:59.800 --> 0:15:03.000 their machines elsewhere? And I know you and David pant 0:15:03.120 --> 0:15:05.240 who is like, are one of our reporters who covers 0:15:05.280 --> 0:15:07.880 crypto mining A lot have talked about the fact that 0:15:07.920 --> 0:15:11.680 you know, these machines aren't necessarily easily transferable between causes, 0:15:12.160 --> 0:15:14.320 But do you think this like these kinds of questions 0:15:14.360 --> 0:15:17.960 around what is this core constituency doing? Is that something 0:15:18.000 --> 0:15:22.920 you see that's going to continue into There is strange 0:15:22.960 --> 0:15:25.680 dynamic going on right now in this market where they 0:15:25.680 --> 0:15:29.920 basically just pull these plugs on these computer setups on 0:15:30.000 --> 0:15:32.000 it and if you can repurpose them where you can 0:15:32.040 --> 0:15:35.640 make money and say the supporting some of the other blockchains, 0:15:35.680 --> 0:15:38.880 what you don't have the volume that you did with 0:15:38.920 --> 0:15:42.160 Bitcoin or the or the rewards for that stake on it. 0:15:42.280 --> 0:15:44.240 David would just telling me the other day about a 0:15:44.280 --> 0:15:48.400 great story about the literally um people who own the 0:15:48.440 --> 0:15:54.600 miners going to hosting facilities and storming the offices demanding 0:15:54.680 --> 0:15:58.480 that they get their deposits back and being told you 0:15:58.560 --> 0:16:01.560 can't have your deposits back, but you can go in 0:16:01.600 --> 0:16:05.240 the back in the factory area and take your minors. 0:16:05.240 --> 0:16:08.480 So people are literally coming in with trucks taking a 0:16:08.520 --> 0:16:12.800 computer equipment away and stockpile on it or wherever that's 0:16:12.840 --> 0:16:15.240 a wild visual, and we've had a lot of wild 0:16:15.360 --> 0:16:18.320 visuals this week. Um, you know, the the idea of 0:16:18.400 --> 0:16:21.400 somebody's just like seek unplugging computers and seizing them is 0:16:21.400 --> 0:16:23.880 certainly one of them. But we also had a story 0:16:24.200 --> 0:16:29.400 from some of our colleagues in Miami about trash bags 0:16:29.440 --> 0:16:33.200 full of F t X swag right that there was 0:16:33.880 --> 0:16:36.400 h there were another set of crypto kind of parties 0:16:36.440 --> 0:16:39.400 and events that were happening in Miami recently. And one 0:16:39.400 --> 0:16:41.240 of the bits of swag that you kind of get 0:16:41.280 --> 0:16:43.040 if you were a v I P was just you know, 0:16:43.400 --> 0:16:46.240 an F t X Miami like legacy swag T shirts 0:16:46.240 --> 0:16:48.480 which people are collecting like if they're you know, Lehman 0:16:48.520 --> 0:16:52.920 Brothers backpacks. Oh, I'm sure they'll be turning up on 0:16:53.040 --> 0:16:57.160 eBay very soon. In terms of get your nostalgic ear, 0:16:57.520 --> 0:17:00.280 it's great analogy in there that the and you do 0:17:00.400 --> 0:17:03.000 have a boom bust and a party like this, there's 0:17:03.000 --> 0:17:05.520 always the clean up afterword and maybe this time of 0:17:05.600 --> 0:17:08.080 them beatings, you see, we will have to be stuck 0:17:08.119 --> 0:17:10.960 with that. Thank you Annie, and thank you Dave. You 0:17:11.000 --> 0:17:12.840 can find more of their work on the Bloomberg Terminal 0:17:12.880 --> 0:17:20.119 and on Bloomberg dot com. This is Bloomberg Crypto, a 0:17:20.240 --> 0:17:23.600 daily podcast from Bloomberg and I Heart Radio. For more 0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:26.280 shows from I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, 0:17:26.520 --> 0:17:30.679 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Send us 0:17:30.680 --> 0:17:33.520 your comments, questions, or suggestions for the show to Crypto 0:17:33.600 --> 0:17:40.040 at Bloomberg dot net. The supervising producer of Bloomberg Crypto 0:17:40.119 --> 0:17:43.359 is Vicky very Galina. Our senior producer is Janet Babin. 0:17:43.960 --> 0:17:47.600 Our producers are Mohammed Faruk and Sharon Barriro. Our associate 0:17:47.640 --> 0:17:51.400 producers are Ty Butler and Moses on Them. Desta wonder 0:17:51.480 --> 0:17:57.480 At is our engineer. Original music by Leo Sidron. I'm Stacy, 0:17:57.560 --> 0:18:06.600 Marie Ishmael. Have a great weekend. N A the st 0:18:08.320 --> 0:18:09.080 ASA