WEBVTT - Avoiding Money Fights, with Andy Hill #102 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:02.960 Welcome to How to Money. I'm Joel and I'm Matt, 0:00:03.120 --> 0:00:06.760 and today we're discussing avoiding money fights with Andy Hill. 0:00:07.400 --> 0:00:27.960 M Yeah, Joel, that is right. We're excited to have 0:00:28.040 --> 0:00:31.640 Andy Hill on the show today. On one hand, he's 0:00:31.680 --> 0:00:33.760 an ordinary guy. He's got a regular nine to five 0:00:33.880 --> 0:00:37.239 job podcast on the side like we do. But you know, 0:00:37.280 --> 0:00:38.960 on the other hand, Andy is he's sort of a 0:00:39.040 --> 0:00:42.120 unicorn when it comes to what he's done with his money. 0:00:42.320 --> 0:00:45.400 He and his wife started out fifty thou dollars in debts, 0:00:45.640 --> 0:00:48.640 but in four years they became completely debt free after 0:00:48.680 --> 0:00:51.720 paying off their debt uh and two hundred thousand dollars 0:00:51.720 --> 0:00:55.000 of a home mortgage. Yeah. That's definitely unicorn territory right there. Um. 0:00:55.000 --> 0:00:57.800 And now eight years into it, they've grown their net 0:00:57.800 --> 0:01:01.720 worth two over seven and fifty thousand dollars. Andy's podcast 0:01:01.800 --> 0:01:05.399 is called Marriage, Kids, and Money, and today we're excited 0:01:05.440 --> 0:01:08.680 to hear more about his journey and personal finance, and 0:01:08.760 --> 0:01:11.840 in particular to dive into some ways to avoid those 0:01:11.840 --> 0:01:14.199 money fights like you mentioned. Yeah, So all right, real quick, 0:01:14.200 --> 0:01:15.640 we need to mention the beer that we're having on 0:01:15.680 --> 0:01:17.840 the show today. We're having a beer called Cream Weaver 0:01:18.280 --> 0:01:21.280 by Three Taverns Brewery local Atlanta brewery and your friend 0:01:21.319 --> 0:01:24.680 Tyler donated this right, yeah, and uh Andy, you're you're 0:01:24.720 --> 0:01:26.600 gonna have a beer on the episode as well. Up 0:01:26.600 --> 0:01:28.600 there in Detroit. What do you have it on this episode? 0:01:29.120 --> 0:01:32.520 I'm having Grand Rabbits from Black Rocks Brewery, which is 0:01:32.560 --> 0:01:35.200 actually my brother in law's brewery and they are located 0:01:35.240 --> 0:01:37.679 in Marquette, Michigan. So if you're ever in Michigan or 0:01:37.760 --> 0:01:41.119 northern Wisconsin you want to grab a brew, support Black Rocks. 0:01:41.160 --> 0:01:43.160 It tastes really good and it just helps the family, 0:01:43.240 --> 0:01:45.399 so you know, go for that. Well, it is nice 0:01:45.400 --> 0:01:47.800 to have someone in the business, right in the brewery 0:01:47.800 --> 0:01:50.600 business in your family. It's like free beer on holidays, 0:01:50.600 --> 0:01:52.840 that's for sure. Absolutely. And he's you know, he's one 0:01:52.840 --> 0:01:55.200 of those really exciting entrepreneurial stories. I won't go into 0:01:55.200 --> 0:01:57.840 all the details, but he essentially was a full time 0:01:57.880 --> 0:02:00.880 guy selling pharmaceutical sales and said, you know what, I 0:02:00.920 --> 0:02:02.760 just want to brew beer in my basement. And then 0:02:02.760 --> 0:02:05.040 he moved it to were Bruined Beer in the house, 0:02:05.120 --> 0:02:07.160 and then we're bruined beer in our own brewery, and 0:02:07.160 --> 0:02:09.280 then they started Canning going all around Michigan. It's a 0:02:09.280 --> 0:02:11.440 great that's a great story. I love talking about it. Yeah, 0:02:11.480 --> 0:02:15.080 that's awesome. Alright, So any every episode we have a 0:02:15.120 --> 0:02:19.240 craft beer because for us, it's a sign of choosing 0:02:19.320 --> 0:02:22.280 to live intentionally now, even while we're saving for the future, 0:02:22.680 --> 0:02:24.360 and you're drinking a beer with us. Thank you for that. 0:02:24.600 --> 0:02:27.000 What is your craft beer? What is the thing that 0:02:27.520 --> 0:02:31.040 excites you about spending money on today while you're doing 0:02:31.040 --> 0:02:33.240 such a good job saving for the future. The thing 0:02:33.280 --> 0:02:35.120 that I that I end up splurging on, that I 0:02:35.160 --> 0:02:38.800 spend too much money on are the activities that my 0:02:38.880 --> 0:02:42.200 kids sign up for. So if my kid even remotely 0:02:42.240 --> 0:02:46.880 has some sort of interest in dancing or swimming or tennis, 0:02:46.919 --> 0:02:50.400 I immediately sign them up for it. And it's actually 0:02:50.440 --> 0:02:52.440 to the detriment of our both our budget and our 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:56.560 our marital sanity sometimes because we end up getting into 0:02:56.600 --> 0:02:58.720 too many activities. And it's kind of funny because now 0:02:58.800 --> 0:03:00.639 that I'm a parent, that's where I want to dump 0:03:00.639 --> 0:03:03.240 a lout of my money because I see how happy 0:03:03.280 --> 0:03:05.880 they get and I want to live vicariously through them. 0:03:06.040 --> 0:03:10.360 Before they came along, it was concerts and I would 0:03:10.360 --> 0:03:13.200 buy roadbikes because I was at two triathlons, and that 0:03:13.320 --> 0:03:15.560 all's just sort of shifted towards my kids because I 0:03:15.600 --> 0:03:17.639 just I love seeing how happy they are and I 0:03:17.680 --> 0:03:19.480 love seeing them light up. So that's that's kind of 0:03:19.480 --> 0:03:21.679 where I'm dumping my money lately. All Right, I'm gonna 0:03:21.680 --> 0:03:23.720 start putting some fun things in their brains, like space 0:03:23.760 --> 0:03:29.080 camp exactly right. Only cost ten thousand dollars for two weeks, 0:03:29.240 --> 0:03:33.680 so big right. Alright, andies, let's let's dive in. On 0:03:33.720 --> 0:03:37.080 a recent episode of your podcast, you mentioned that you've 0:03:37.120 --> 0:03:40.080 had a particularly bad day at work, right, and that 0:03:40.360 --> 0:03:43.240 made you work towards diversifying your income. Can you tell 0:03:43.280 --> 0:03:45.440 us basically what happened and then where did that take 0:03:45.480 --> 0:03:49.120 you in your personal finance journey. Yeah. So I've been 0:03:49.160 --> 0:03:52.840 working in the corporate event marketing world for about fifteen years, 0:03:53.120 --> 0:03:56.600 and I am in my late thirties, and so I've 0:03:56.640 --> 0:03:58.000 been I've been doing this for a while, and you 0:03:58.080 --> 0:03:59.880 kind of get into a groove and you start doing 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:02.200 well in your career, and you know, you start to 0:04:02.200 --> 0:04:04.360 get to a point where you're you know, enjoying things. 0:04:04.360 --> 0:04:08.360 You're in a managerial level, and then something's happened, you know. 0:04:08.440 --> 0:04:12.119 So one day our company purchased another company, and then 0:04:12.120 --> 0:04:15.240 with that came a different management over. So when that 0:04:15.280 --> 0:04:18.120 management came over, they said, all right, Andy, you are 0:04:18.200 --> 0:04:20.960 not in this position anymore. You are now in this position, 0:04:21.400 --> 0:04:23.919 and those people you were managing, you're not managing them anymore, 0:04:24.640 --> 0:04:28.120 and we're changing your title. It's a demotion and this 0:04:28.160 --> 0:04:30.400 is what you're gonna have to deal with. And I've 0:04:30.440 --> 0:04:32.720 been working really hard up until that point with this 0:04:32.760 --> 0:04:35.799 new company. I had been exceeding my goals every year 0:04:36.400 --> 0:04:38.839 and crushing them and you know, bringing in more sales 0:04:38.880 --> 0:04:42.840 and more clients. And at this point I realized there's 0:04:42.920 --> 0:04:46.760 really nothing that I could do I was in control 0:04:46.839 --> 0:04:48.920 of that really had anything to do with this this 0:04:49.000 --> 0:04:51.400 decision that they were making. And at that point, I said, well, 0:04:51.440 --> 0:04:54.000 you know what, maybe I need to stop trying to 0:04:54.080 --> 0:04:57.200 care so much about my career and try to care 0:04:57.240 --> 0:04:59.880 about something that maybe I do have control on over, 0:05:00.040 --> 0:05:03.320 or at least something that brings me some joy or 0:05:03.400 --> 0:05:08.240 some entrepreneurial spirit or creative spirit. So at that point 0:05:08.320 --> 0:05:10.440 I decided, well, why don't I try to start my 0:05:10.520 --> 0:05:13.440 own thing, my own little entrepreneurial adventure, and that's when 0:05:13.440 --> 0:05:15.760 I decided to start the podcast because I've listened to 0:05:15.800 --> 0:05:17.960 a lot of folks like you guys that are sharing 0:05:18.000 --> 0:05:20.600 these great stories and inspiring people on how to save 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:23.760 money but also enjoy life. And I thought I had 0:05:23.800 --> 0:05:26.400 something to contribute. So that's where I started, at least 0:05:26.400 --> 0:05:29.760 diversifying in the small business world. And then at that 0:05:29.800 --> 0:05:32.040 time too, I also wanted to diversify my income and 0:05:32.240 --> 0:05:35.960 other fashions as well. Yeah, and I think income diversification 0:05:36.200 --> 0:05:38.919 is something that we don't talk about a whole lot. 0:05:39.120 --> 0:05:42.200 There's there's all these ways to attack your frugality or 0:05:42.200 --> 0:05:44.839 start investing, and we've talked about side hustles on the 0:05:44.839 --> 0:05:47.760 show before, and that's something that people. I think, no 0:05:48.080 --> 0:05:51.520 is a way to increase your income, right, but specifically 0:05:51.520 --> 0:05:55.320 the journey towards having a more diversified income. You I 0:05:55.360 --> 0:05:57.640 believe you said you wanted to have income from five 0:05:57.680 --> 0:06:00.720 different sources. Uh, coming in right, that's like your goal. 0:06:00.920 --> 0:06:03.320 So tell us kind of what those sources are and 0:06:03.320 --> 0:06:06.720 and what a diversification of where you get your income 0:06:06.760 --> 0:06:09.400 from means to you. Yeah, I would say, you know, 0:06:09.520 --> 0:06:11.720 so outside of the small business that we talked about 0:06:11.720 --> 0:06:13.839 that I'm slowly building, which brings me a lot of joy. 0:06:14.000 --> 0:06:16.680 For first and foremost, it brings me joy more than income. 0:06:17.080 --> 0:06:19.800 The other thing is that my wife has started to 0:06:20.640 --> 0:06:24.720 pursue a side hustle per se. She's been doing stay 0:06:24.720 --> 0:06:27.920 at home mom duties over the past four or five years, 0:06:28.000 --> 0:06:30.800 and it's been a really important thing for our family 0:06:31.440 --> 0:06:33.920 that our kids were able to be at home with 0:06:33.920 --> 0:06:37.880 her and enjoy some great bonding time. But she also 0:06:37.920 --> 0:06:40.680 needs some sanity time for herself too, so she started 0:06:40.720 --> 0:06:43.680 to do a little side hustle for herself. She's really 0:06:43.720 --> 0:06:47.560 into organizing, so she started um working for a small 0:06:47.560 --> 0:06:49.960 business locally where she does home organizing. So she goes 0:06:49.960 --> 0:06:53.320 into people's homes and creates order and helps them to 0:06:53.440 --> 0:06:55.279 declude their lives. So that brings her a lot of 0:06:55.600 --> 0:06:59.479 Maricondo Jr. Exactly, it's very I mean talk about you know, 0:06:59.560 --> 0:07:02.039 of the times, right, tidying up with Marie Condo. And 0:07:02.080 --> 0:07:03.920 she sort of laughs at at that a little bit, 0:07:03.920 --> 0:07:07.640 because you know, Mariekando kind of comes in and says, hey, 0:07:07.680 --> 0:07:09.720 here's all the things that you can do to spark joy. 0:07:09.880 --> 0:07:12.600 All right, I'll see you later. And but really, when 0:07:12.680 --> 0:07:14.480 NICOLEA goes into here all the things you can do 0:07:14.560 --> 0:07:16.160 to declare your life, and I'm gonna help you do 0:07:16.200 --> 0:07:18.120 it right now. So it's, uh, it's a little bit 0:07:18.160 --> 0:07:20.400 a little TV magic where they walk away and come back. 0:07:20.560 --> 0:07:23.480 But so that's one of the avenues that we're doing 0:07:23.480 --> 0:07:26.480 to diverse fire income is where Nicole started to do 0:07:26.560 --> 0:07:29.880 something that she's passionate about. The other area as we 0:07:29.960 --> 0:07:32.640 are saving up for our first rental property, which Joel, 0:07:32.720 --> 0:07:35.000 I know you are all about, my friend, and it's 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:37.040 helped to make a big deal in your life. So 0:07:37.080 --> 0:07:39.080 we're saving up for our first rental property and hopefully 0:07:39.120 --> 0:07:41.960 get some some income that would be um coming in 0:07:42.000 --> 0:07:45.560 on a study basis, and then the fourth one would 0:07:45.600 --> 0:07:48.600 be investing in a taxable brokerage count. So we do it. 0:07:48.640 --> 0:07:50.720 We've done a lot for our retirement over the past 0:07:51.040 --> 0:07:53.280 whatever ten years now, and we've built up a lot 0:07:53.280 --> 0:07:55.000 of funds in there, and it's starting to look a 0:07:55.040 --> 0:07:56.720 little outside and I'm like, all right, we're gonna be 0:07:56.760 --> 0:07:59.560 really great when we're sixty five, and I'm like, okay, well, 0:07:59.560 --> 0:08:02.520 we don't really have anything for thirty five or forty. 0:08:02.640 --> 0:08:07.040 So we're starting to diversify our investments there and see 0:08:07.080 --> 0:08:09.640 where we can go by by building that up a 0:08:09.680 --> 0:08:11.280 little bit. And then really the fifth one is I 0:08:11.280 --> 0:08:15.880 don't I don't plan on really stopping working. Um. I 0:08:16.040 --> 0:08:19.440 enjoy you know, having a full time career and you know, 0:08:19.480 --> 0:08:22.920 providing benefits for my family. So I'll continue to grow 0:08:23.000 --> 0:08:26.080 my career and do really well at my job. And 0:08:26.160 --> 0:08:28.880 you know, if if things don't work out well there 0:08:28.960 --> 0:08:31.520 over time, I've got a great amount of skills that 0:08:31.560 --> 0:08:34.480 I can utilize in other places that will, you know, 0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:38.080 keep you very employable. So so those five different sets 0:08:38.120 --> 0:08:39.839 I think will make me feel a little bit more 0:08:39.880 --> 0:08:43.160 comfortable than the vulnerable position that I found myself in 0:08:43.200 --> 0:08:45.360 a couple of years ago. So diversifying your income, that's 0:08:45.360 --> 0:08:48.320 one way you can handle your money well. Another way 0:08:48.440 --> 0:08:51.199 is to reduce the amount of money that you've got 0:08:51.240 --> 0:08:53.559 going out right your expenses. And so is this about 0:08:53.559 --> 0:08:56.160 the same time that you guys decided to go ahead 0:08:56.160 --> 0:08:57.800 and pay off your house so that you didn't have 0:08:57.840 --> 0:08:59.640 that mortgage hanging over here. Yeah, I think it's sort 0:08:59.640 --> 0:09:01.520 of s elated us a little bit. We did have 0:09:01.640 --> 0:09:04.800 this pay off the mortgage plan when we bought our 0:09:05.000 --> 0:09:07.040 newest house, and that was sort of the agreement that 0:09:07.080 --> 0:09:09.240 my wife and I came to. I was very happy 0:09:09.320 --> 0:09:12.280 living in our thousand square foot bungalow home that we 0:09:12.320 --> 0:09:14.880 had my original bachelor pad. But she said, okay, well 0:09:14.920 --> 0:09:16.920 we're having our second child. You know, maybe we can 0:09:17.040 --> 0:09:18.880 move into a little bit bigger home, into a nicer 0:09:18.920 --> 0:09:22.320 neighborhood with better schools, and like, okay, fine, but that 0:09:22.440 --> 0:09:25.199 mortgage seems so big. If we get this house, it's 0:09:25.200 --> 0:09:28.360 just gonna make me feel claustrophobic, like I always have 0:09:28.480 --> 0:09:30.839 to perform at work, and if I fail, then I'm 0:09:30.880 --> 0:09:32.720 failing my family and I'm failing me. It just made 0:09:32.720 --> 0:09:36.360 me feel really stressed. So we made an agreement, said, okay, 0:09:36.360 --> 0:09:38.160 we'll get the house as long as we can pay 0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:41.080 it off in five years, and so you know, she'd 0:09:41.080 --> 0:09:44.439 get her dream home and I'd get my stress mortgage 0:09:44.480 --> 0:09:47.360 free life. And we agreed to that, and we worked 0:09:47.400 --> 0:09:49.880 hard on that together. In five years, that's the normal 0:09:49.920 --> 0:09:52.040 amount of payoff time, right that most people take the 0:09:52.400 --> 0:09:55.200 mortgage five years, thirty years, you know yours? Right? You 0:09:55.200 --> 0:09:56.920 can you can get a five year mortgage through UH 0:09:57.000 --> 0:10:00.319 through Quicken loans, right right? Yeah? Well, and that, I mean, 0:10:00.320 --> 0:10:04.280 that's incredible, man, I mean that's truly rare. Right, Matt 0:10:04.280 --> 0:10:07.679 called Unicorn in the lead up to this episode, and 0:10:08.000 --> 0:10:09.679 I mean that is the Unicorn territory. You paid it 0:10:09.720 --> 0:10:12.040 off in four years. What was it feeling like when 0:10:12.040 --> 0:10:14.640 you paid off the mortgage? It was great. I mean honestly, 0:10:15.120 --> 0:10:18.080 the grass in front of our house just felt different 0:10:18.160 --> 0:10:20.640 walking on it, because it was like, we own this place, 0:10:20.679 --> 0:10:22.680 this is ours, this is our home forever, and we've 0:10:22.880 --> 0:10:25.280 We've found a home because of my wife, because she 0:10:25.320 --> 0:10:27.160 really wanted to find a really great place to live 0:10:27.240 --> 0:10:30.000 and a great community and great schools that I think 0:10:30.080 --> 0:10:32.880 we're going to be in literally for another years. We're 0:10:32.920 --> 0:10:36.000 happy where we are. That makes it even more exciting 0:10:36.040 --> 0:10:37.679 that this home is paid off and we're going to 0:10:37.760 --> 0:10:41.360 be in it for a long time. So to your point, originally, Matt, 0:10:42.000 --> 0:10:47.320 the expenses dropped dramatically. I mean we were making I 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:51.640 think eighteen hundred dollar payments. Uh that's with taxes and insurance, 0:10:51.679 --> 0:10:54.480 so thirteen hundred dollars with the principal and interest. So 0:10:54.640 --> 0:10:58.280 I mean every month being able to free up thirteen 0:10:58.320 --> 0:11:01.120 hundred dollars in our budget to do whatever we want, 0:11:01.559 --> 0:11:05.440 whether it's save up for rental, property, go on more vacations, uh, 0:11:05.480 --> 0:11:08.000 splurge on kids activities, you know, things that we could 0:11:08.040 --> 0:11:10.439 do together to make our our family happy. Has has 0:11:10.520 --> 0:11:13.720 just helped, uh not only me feel a lot less 0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:16.719 stressed in my day job, but also you know, give 0:11:16.800 --> 0:11:19.080 us a lot more joy at our house. Yeah. You know, 0:11:19.360 --> 0:11:21.400 paying off your mortgage is kind of one of those 0:11:21.480 --> 0:11:24.040 hotly debated things in the personal finance community. It's one 0:11:24.080 --> 0:11:26.040 of those things that just kind of it's an argument 0:11:26.040 --> 0:11:29.079 that never dies. Uh. So when you guys were debating 0:11:29.120 --> 0:11:31.400 and that, and partly that's because rates are just incredibly 0:11:31.400 --> 0:11:34.120 low right now, and the fact that if you have 0:11:34.120 --> 0:11:36.560 an interest right in the threes, like, why wouldn't you 0:11:36.640 --> 0:11:40.440 prioritize saving and investing for retirement? So take us through 0:11:40.440 --> 0:11:42.600 that thought process and the discussions that you guys had. 0:11:42.679 --> 0:11:45.800 Was peace of mind worth more to you and your 0:11:45.840 --> 0:11:50.680 family than even kind of that decision about the return 0:11:50.720 --> 0:11:53.000 that you're going to get on the money. Yeah, Joel, 0:11:53.040 --> 0:11:56.880 If you look at the math from seventeen when we 0:11:56.960 --> 0:11:59.280 paid this more, when we paid this three percent interest 0:11:59.280 --> 0:12:02.240 payment off, the stock market did all or a lot 0:12:02.280 --> 0:12:04.600 better than three right, So if you're looking at the 0:12:04.640 --> 0:12:07.080 pure math of the thing you'd say, wow, that that 0:12:07.160 --> 0:12:10.559 doesn't seem like a good you know, you see your money. Honestly, 0:12:10.840 --> 0:12:15.240 it was all emotional, stress based, and it just it 0:12:15.280 --> 0:12:17.920 was one of those decisions where it's like I I 0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:21.440 went through buying a home in two thousand four and 0:12:21.520 --> 0:12:23.200 bought it at the top of the market, and then 0:12:23.360 --> 0:12:27.199 two thousand my home was worth half of the value 0:12:27.200 --> 0:12:30.400 of it. I overbought. That was the exact opposite situation. 0:12:30.400 --> 0:12:33.079 I bought a home that took up seventy of my 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:35.640 income from the mortgage. I never wanted to feel like 0:12:35.679 --> 0:12:37.920 that again. I never wanted if you like that again. 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:40.840 So with this new home buying process, we put almost 0:12:40.840 --> 0:12:44.280 fift down on the home and paid it off in 0:12:44.320 --> 0:12:46.480 four years so that we never have to even think 0:12:46.880 --> 0:12:50.839 about the mortgage ever again. And yes, it was a 0:12:50.880 --> 0:12:54.719 stress focused, emotional focused sort of decision, and I am 0:12:54.800 --> 0:12:57.200 so glad that we did. And even looking back at 0:12:57.200 --> 0:13:00.840 the numbers, Yeah, we could have made hundred thousand more 0:13:00.880 --> 0:13:03.040 dollars or whatever whatever the number is. You know what 0:13:03.080 --> 0:13:04.560 I would have done with all of that money that 0:13:04.600 --> 0:13:06.520 I've made in the stock market as soon as as 0:13:06.520 --> 0:13:08.080 soon as I got to it, I would have paid 0:13:08.080 --> 0:13:10.640 off the mortgage just because that's the type of feeling 0:13:10.679 --> 0:13:12.920 that I have in my life and my wife too. 0:13:13.000 --> 0:13:15.520 It makes us feel great to not have any debt 0:13:15.559 --> 0:13:18.719 in our life whatsoever. It's yes, it is motional based. Absolutely. 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:21.000 I have to clarify one thing. You're not a professional 0:13:21.000 --> 0:13:23.400 athlete or anything like that, right, Like, I'm not making 0:13:23.840 --> 0:13:26.640 millions of dollars like this isn't you And you mentioned 0:13:26.640 --> 0:13:28.480 to your wife stays at home, so this isn't like 0:13:29.080 --> 0:13:32.600 you have to be making two four hundred thousand dollars 0:13:32.640 --> 0:13:34.719 a year. Now, we're we're in the one. We're in 0:13:34.720 --> 0:13:36.559 the one hundred to two hundred thousand dollar range. To 0:13:36.559 --> 0:13:38.800 get everybody kind of a you know, a basis, but 0:13:38.880 --> 0:13:40.880 that's I mean for a lot of the conversations we're 0:13:40.920 --> 0:13:42.560 having with a lot of people, that's you know, when 0:13:42.559 --> 0:13:45.000 you've got a dual income household, that's probably not too 0:13:45.040 --> 0:13:46.800 far off from a war A lot of war people are. 0:13:46.800 --> 0:13:48.920 I mean, the average I know is like fifty sixty 0:13:49.000 --> 0:13:51.120 something like that. Um, but yeah, that's where we are 0:13:51.160 --> 0:13:53.199 in our lives. So you know, while you're working on 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:56.160 the mortgage, you mentioned how you guys pretended that you 0:13:56.240 --> 0:13:59.200 got paid less to pay off your mortgage more quickly. 0:13:59.320 --> 0:14:01.520 You know, it's an effect of kind of mental trick 0:14:01.880 --> 0:14:03.959 that you played on yourself. Um, why do you think 0:14:04.000 --> 0:14:06.360 that worked for you? And you know, are there other 0:14:06.400 --> 0:14:09.680 decisions that you made that kind of allowed you to 0:14:09.679 --> 0:14:13.120 stay focused on your goals? Yeah, that's a great question. 0:14:13.120 --> 0:14:14.679 And I think when you look at how to pay 0:14:14.679 --> 0:14:16.160 a mortgage off and you're like, oh, how did you 0:14:16.200 --> 0:14:18.280 pay it off? It's like if you ask the question, 0:14:18.360 --> 0:14:19.640 as soon as you think about it, you knew how 0:14:19.640 --> 0:14:21.400 it how it was paid off. You put a lot 0:14:21.440 --> 0:14:23.960 of money towards the principle every month, right, So but 0:14:24.080 --> 0:14:26.120 how do you do that? Then? How do you psychologically 0:14:26.120 --> 0:14:28.760 trick yourself or what are the hacks to get yourself 0:14:28.800 --> 0:14:30.760 to do that. So one of the things that we 0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:34.840 did is that I get paid twenty six times per year, 0:14:35.040 --> 0:14:39.560 which is essentially every two weeks versus the twice a month, 0:14:39.600 --> 0:14:43.680 so paychecks versus twenty four paychecks. I just pretended like 0:14:43.720 --> 0:14:45.600 we got the twenty four. So every time we got 0:14:45.600 --> 0:14:48.120 those extra two, which would be twice a year, both 0:14:48.120 --> 0:14:50.760 of those would go towards the mortgage. Every time I 0:14:50.880 --> 0:14:53.440 get a bonus for kick and butt at work that 0:14:53.480 --> 0:14:56.400 would go towards the mortgage. When we moved into our 0:14:56.440 --> 0:14:59.320 new home and we had different things and that we 0:14:59.360 --> 0:15:01.640 wanted to maybe be sell because we didn't use anymore 0:15:01.680 --> 0:15:04.120 because we have kids. My road bike that we talked 0:15:04.160 --> 0:15:07.320 about earlier that when on craigslist, I took that money 0:15:07.320 --> 0:15:09.480 and threw it to the mortgage. Things that I didn't 0:15:09.520 --> 0:15:11.120 use anymore. We moved to a new town and I've 0:15:11.120 --> 0:15:12.840 got little babies, I don't have time to, you know, 0:15:12.920 --> 0:15:14.800 go road biking. I bought it. I had a moped 0:15:14.840 --> 0:15:16.640 back in my old play same sort of thing I'm 0:15:16.680 --> 0:15:18.960 not I'm I'm not using it, sell it go towards 0:15:18.960 --> 0:15:21.760 the mortgage. These types of things that didn't really steal 0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:24.320 a lot of our joy, that we weren't even using anyway, 0:15:24.600 --> 0:15:26.200 helped us to do that. My wife sold a couple 0:15:26.240 --> 0:15:29.520 of purses, things like that. Other things that we did 0:15:29.600 --> 0:15:32.040 to help keep the consistency going. My wife and I 0:15:32.080 --> 0:15:34.560 met on a monthly basis for what we dubbed the 0:15:34.560 --> 0:15:37.280 budget party, where we'd get together and we talk about 0:15:37.360 --> 0:15:39.960 our spending from the previous month, our plans for the 0:15:39.960 --> 0:15:41.920 current month, and then how we are, how we're doing 0:15:41.920 --> 0:15:44.680 on our goals and we did that every month pretty 0:15:44.760 --> 0:15:47.080 much the entire portion of our marriage now for seven 0:15:47.120 --> 0:15:50.800 eight years, and that really helped us to stay consistent 0:15:50.840 --> 0:15:53.720 with our goals and pay off this mortgage on time. 0:15:53.800 --> 0:15:56.120 So it was great. That's awesome. Yeah, and we want 0:15:56.120 --> 0:15:59.000 to talk more about specifically how you and your wife 0:15:59.000 --> 0:16:00.600 have handled money together there and we want to talk 0:16:00.680 --> 0:16:02.640 more about the budget parties, and we'll get to that 0:16:02.640 --> 0:16:04.400 in just a little bit in the show. I wanted 0:16:04.400 --> 0:16:06.000 to ask you too real quick while we're on the 0:16:06.000 --> 0:16:09.800 topic of real estate about rental properties, such awesome stuff 0:16:09.840 --> 0:16:11.880 about paying off your mortgage and kind of the ways 0:16:11.920 --> 0:16:15.400 that you can trick yourself into doing better with your 0:16:15.400 --> 0:16:17.240 money so that you can get there more quickly. And 0:16:17.280 --> 0:16:19.800 I think money is so psychological. That's that's like a 0:16:19.880 --> 0:16:21.560 huge thing that a lot of people need to hear 0:16:21.600 --> 0:16:23.960 that there are ways that you can kind of accelerate 0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:26.680 that by by tricking the way that your brain actually works. 0:16:27.080 --> 0:16:28.800 So now you want to buy a rental property, and 0:16:28.840 --> 0:16:31.640 you want to buy it in cash, which is a 0:16:31.720 --> 0:16:34.120 big goal in and of itself, tell us, like why 0:16:34.160 --> 0:16:36.000 that's one of your goals, Why that's one of your 0:16:36.040 --> 0:16:38.320 income streams that you want to generate and kind of 0:16:38.360 --> 0:16:41.080 how you're planning to get there. Yeah, So, since we 0:16:41.160 --> 0:16:43.400 paid off the mortgage and we're really enjoying this debt 0:16:43.400 --> 0:16:46.000 free life, we said, well, it kind of feels silly 0:16:46.000 --> 0:16:47.560 to go back and get a mortgage now if we're 0:16:47.560 --> 0:16:50.280 gonna get our first rental property. So my wife and 0:16:50.280 --> 0:16:52.200 I agreed, why don't we just keep on saving our 0:16:52.240 --> 0:16:55.120 money until we have enough to buy one in cash. 0:16:55.160 --> 0:16:58.320 So we've been doing that now for about two years 0:16:58.960 --> 0:17:01.680 and we have close to about a hundred thousand dollars. 0:17:01.680 --> 0:17:04.000 And in Metro Detroit and some of the you know, 0:17:04.080 --> 0:17:06.600 suburb areas where a lot of the younger folks are living, 0:17:06.600 --> 0:17:08.600 you can get ah, you can get a thousand square 0:17:08.600 --> 0:17:12.240 foot home for about a hundred thousand bucks, and you 0:17:12.280 --> 0:17:15.200 can become a landlord. So that is our current plan, 0:17:15.680 --> 0:17:17.640 and the reason that we want to do it with 0:17:18.200 --> 0:17:20.640 you know, no debt whatsoever, is just there's a lot 0:17:20.680 --> 0:17:23.720 of perks to that. There's no mortgage payments, there's no 0:17:23.800 --> 0:17:26.240 closing costs. You know, it helps when you're in a 0:17:26.280 --> 0:17:29.320 competitive market, right, I mean, who you gotta you get 0:17:29.520 --> 0:17:31.119 deal with people who are buying in cash. You can 0:17:31.240 --> 0:17:33.720 have a better opportunity, more of the money is coming 0:17:33.720 --> 0:17:36.280 back to you, more cash flow, right. And then again 0:17:36.359 --> 0:17:38.560 back to that first point that I keep making less 0:17:38.600 --> 0:17:40.919 stress less things that I have to worry about. If 0:17:40.920 --> 0:17:44.600 I have another mortgage, that really adds onto my stress level. 0:17:44.680 --> 0:17:46.280 As you can tell, there's a there's a theme going 0:17:46.280 --> 0:17:50.840 on here. Well, I think that's huge because debt, money 0:17:50.840 --> 0:17:54.320 stresses looming over us, mortgage payments, all those sorts of things, 0:17:54.359 --> 0:17:56.840 they have a weight on our psyche. And so it's 0:17:56.880 --> 0:17:59.560 not just obviously the nuts and bolts, because like you said, 0:17:59.560 --> 0:18:00.879 if it were the uts and bolts, you wouldn't have 0:18:00.920 --> 0:18:02.440 paid off your mortgage in four years. You would have 0:18:02.440 --> 0:18:04.600 invested in the stock market. There's so much more that 0:18:04.640 --> 0:18:06.840 goes into it. And I love that you're prioritizing the 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:10.240 full range of how you can optimize your own life 0:18:10.280 --> 0:18:13.439 as opposed to just like what's the best number on 0:18:13.480 --> 0:18:15.879 a spreadsheet? Right, And and that's where a lot of 0:18:15.920 --> 0:18:20.360 our decisions come from. What's the least time consuming, least 0:18:20.400 --> 0:18:23.720 stressful way that we can go about creating financial decisions 0:18:23.760 --> 0:18:27.639 for our family. So a listener recently you mentioned Andy 0:18:27.880 --> 0:18:30.200 wrote to you and said, I know you're thinking about 0:18:30.240 --> 0:18:32.920 buying a rental of property, don't do it? And so 0:18:33.040 --> 0:18:35.600 did did that give you a little bit of pause? Like, obviously, 0:18:35.680 --> 0:18:37.000 you know the market's kind of hot. And then you've 0:18:37.040 --> 0:18:39.600 got listeners reaching out saying, don't be a dumb you 0:18:39.640 --> 0:18:42.840 don't invest in real estate. Let did that make you think? Yeah, 0:18:42.880 --> 0:18:45.520 you know, I've really liked when my friend reached out 0:18:45.560 --> 0:18:47.960