WEBVTT - Heavy is the Crown 0:00:01.120 --> 0:00:04.320 You're listening to waiting on reparations a production off I 0:00:04.480 --> 0:00:15.440 heart radio. Yeah, uh yeah, yeah, yeo. I want to 0:00:15.560 --> 0:00:18.160 rock right now. I'm Dope Knife and I got my style. 0:00:18.320 --> 0:00:20.600 I'm so nice name, like my smile. Don't touch my 0:00:20.640 --> 0:00:23.640 head because I got my crown. I'm not internationally known, 0:00:23.680 --> 0:00:25.279 but I ought to be. I know all about a 0:00:25.320 --> 0:00:27.680 Graham should follow me or I stayed down under like 0:00:27.680 --> 0:00:30.360 Wila Bees dope nice sh shot cut of autore. I'm 0:00:30.400 --> 0:00:32.720 creeping through the window. Cute and stupid baby girl. I'm 0:00:32.760 --> 0:00:34.680 a himbo. Mike. Just grow the dreads out, let the 0:00:34.720 --> 0:00:36.920 wind blow voice and beat the ship met to crescendo. 0:00:37.080 --> 0:00:39.320 Now i'd be rapping unil I'll be a ghana. I 0:00:39.360 --> 0:00:41.680 don't care. I'm doing what I wanna smoking on a 0:00:41.680 --> 0:00:43.640 bunch of marr. Wanna got about a truck you would 0:00:43.640 --> 0:00:49.400 think it was a farmer. Dopey people. I'm Dope Knife 0:00:50.960 --> 0:00:56.120 and we are waiting on reparations up rock. So how 0:00:56.200 --> 0:00:59.720 you doing. I'm great. I've been thriving. I've been on 0:00:59.760 --> 0:01:02.320 the ocation. We're on summer recess from the commission for 0:01:02.320 --> 0:01:05.800 about a month um and so I've just been chilling, 0:01:05.959 --> 0:01:08.080 super hard it took me like the first two weeks 0:01:08.080 --> 0:01:11.160 to even begin to relax, Like I was like constantly 0:01:11.200 --> 0:01:13.119 like I need to be checking my email and like 0:01:13.400 --> 0:01:17.720 just like bugging out every day or anything. No, I 0:01:17.720 --> 0:01:20.560 don't even know what I've slapped this taking like very 0:01:20.600 --> 0:01:23.080 long naps is the only thing I've done with this time. 0:01:23.840 --> 0:01:27.959 Um and general and actually, okay, let's so my second 0:01:28.000 --> 0:01:32.160 album was now done, so that's not that's not nothing. Yeah, 0:01:32.480 --> 0:01:37.600 so use that little feature from our boy dumb knife there. 0:01:37.680 --> 0:01:41.600 Yeah so um so yeah, that's been like damning that 0:01:41.680 --> 0:01:43.119 to make sure it's ready for the world. I don't 0:01:43.120 --> 0:01:47.240 know what it's coming out or anything, but likes, the 0:01:47.240 --> 0:01:49.240 whole thing is, the whole thing is just like you 0:01:49.360 --> 0:01:52.120 definitely should spend as much time, you know, I mean 0:01:52.200 --> 0:01:54.320 put like thinking about putting it out as you spent 0:01:54.440 --> 0:01:56.800 into making it, so you're gonna totally yeah, it's probably 0:01:56.840 --> 0:02:00.400 not gonna come OUTTI next year. Um, but just like 0:02:00.440 --> 0:02:03.120 final tweaks because like it's funny because my first album 0:02:03.160 --> 0:02:05.800 literally like I got it like mixed and everything, and 0:02:05.840 --> 0:02:07.760 like they send it to me and I refused to 0:02:07.760 --> 0:02:09.360 listen to it for like a month and a half. 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:11.880 They're like Hey, do you have any notes? And like 0:02:11.919 --> 0:02:13.600 I just couldn't. You know how you kind of hate 0:02:13.600 --> 0:02:17.320 the sound of your own voice, Yeah, especially the start. Yeah, 0:02:17.600 --> 0:02:21.440 I res like I think I ultimately was like, yeah, 0:02:21.480 --> 0:02:23.400 it sounds great, and I like never even listened to 0:02:23.480 --> 0:02:25.280 like the final version of it. I was just like, sure, 0:02:25.360 --> 0:02:27.320 let's do it, because I just couldn't bring myself to 0:02:27.800 --> 0:02:29.840 But with this one, I'm actually really excited about it. 0:02:30.520 --> 0:02:33.800 Uh yeah, I think I'm actually really proud of it. 0:02:33.880 --> 0:02:35.400 So I've been listening to it, so I'm just to 0:02:35.520 --> 0:02:38.240 be minor tweaks here and there, but also just like, man, 0:02:38.280 --> 0:02:42.519 I'm really excited about you guys, So I'll stay tuned 0:02:42.560 --> 0:02:44.960 for that. But how you been, I've been a good Joe. 0:02:45.600 --> 0:02:47.960 I'm kind of doing the same thing. Like I recorded 0:02:48.680 --> 0:02:51.119 a bunch of songs like months ago. You guys might 0:02:51.120 --> 0:02:52.799 remember there was like a plane a few months ago. 0:02:52.840 --> 0:02:55.000 I was like, hey, I've been recording a bunch of ship. 0:02:55.520 --> 0:02:57.840 So I kind of went through all of that stuff 0:02:57.880 --> 0:03:01.000 and picked out like the best joints and then like 0:03:01.000 --> 0:03:03.640 I wrote like four more new ones. So I'm putting 0:03:03.639 --> 0:03:06.560 that together to put the final touches on my album 0:03:06.600 --> 0:03:09.680 to get ready, So I'm doing that and then um 0:03:09.760 --> 0:03:18.760 oh I'm opening for Afroman August eleven in Savannah, Victory, 0:03:18.840 --> 0:03:22.120 nor A. I'll definitely mention it more as the time 0:03:22.160 --> 0:03:27.480 gets Yeah, definitely bring your vis you know, bring yours. 0:03:27.480 --> 0:03:30.120 Oh my god? Does that? Does he have new music? 0:03:30.200 --> 0:03:34.359 Is he still making making music? You know? I don't know. Um, 0:03:34.480 --> 0:03:37.200 but I'm about to go brush up and like I'm 0:03:37.240 --> 0:03:40.760 only a casual out for Afroman fan to begin with. 0:03:40.880 --> 0:03:43.000 But like when they when they came to me with 0:03:43.040 --> 0:03:45.560 the you know, the pairing for it, like yeah, do 0:03:45.560 --> 0:03:46.920 you want to do this? I was like, oh wait, 0:03:47.000 --> 0:03:53.080 dope knife Afroman. That yeah, we've got the props. That's 0:03:53.120 --> 0:03:55.400 just like six bottles of visin up on the stage 0:03:56.520 --> 0:03:59.680 and uh yeah, amazing. Well let's dope. Let's dope. So 0:03:59.720 --> 0:04:03.600 what we got today? So today, in honor of Natural 0:04:03.640 --> 0:04:06.240 Crown Day, which is on July three, which was a 0:04:06.360 --> 0:04:09.360 day of action on social media, we're predominantly black woman. 0:04:09.800 --> 0:04:12.840 We're posting pictures of themselves the hashtag Crown Act to 0:04:12.960 --> 0:04:16.960 draw attention to a piece of federal legislation, uh, the 0:04:17.040 --> 0:04:20.320 Grown Act, which stands for creating a respectful and Oakland 0:04:20.320 --> 0:04:24.560 World for natural hair. Um, it's an act that is 0:04:24.720 --> 0:04:27.960 meant to prohibit discrimination based on a person's hair, texture 0:04:28.000 --> 0:04:31.839 or hairstyle. So in honor of of this day of 0:04:31.880 --> 0:04:35.200 action that happened recently, UM, we were gonna talk a 0:04:35.240 --> 0:04:39.760 little bit about you know the importance of of of 0:04:40.080 --> 0:04:44.560 hair and with regards to our sense of racial identity discrimination. 0:04:44.640 --> 0:04:49.440 Folks have haste historically as a offshoot of racial discrimination, 0:04:49.480 --> 0:04:53.280 particularly you know, surrounding um hairstyles both natural and this 0:04:53.440 --> 0:04:55.360 one case we found where the girl got kicked at 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:56.600 school for a weave. It's like, what do you want 0:04:56.680 --> 0:04:58.720 us to do? Natalie has side you don't like the 0:04:58.800 --> 0:05:01.600 natural hair, you don't, we haven't we I don't understand 0:05:01.600 --> 0:05:04.479 which what you want me to do? Um, and then 0:05:04.560 --> 0:05:06.400 touch on how this has been addressed in hip hop. 0:05:06.400 --> 0:05:08.760 That's kind of what we got going on today. So 0:05:08.880 --> 0:05:11.560 UM as a man, but you got I mean, like 0:05:11.760 --> 0:05:14.080 you can keep it, keep it pretty close, pretty tight 0:05:14.120 --> 0:05:15.520 over there. I don't know if you have any like 0:05:15.560 --> 0:05:19.279 personal reflections to share on the world of the world 0:05:19.320 --> 0:05:24.400 of hair, sir, but well, I mean, I definitely like 0:05:24.520 --> 0:05:27.360 for the last I should I don't know how many years, 0:05:27.400 --> 0:05:29.679 But to be honest with you, the more that I 0:05:29.720 --> 0:05:33.200 was getting serious about what I was trying to do, 0:05:34.160 --> 0:05:37.080 I just stopped paying attention to my hair and I 0:05:37.120 --> 0:05:39.440 was just went with whatever was the easiest, which is 0:05:39.480 --> 0:05:42.039 just shaving it like every three days or so. But 0:05:42.080 --> 0:05:44.360 when I was younger, I definitely did more interesting show. 0:05:44.760 --> 0:05:46.679 If you have any pictures we got a post session 0:05:46.720 --> 0:05:49.440 on Instagram, definitely, Yeah, I'm a grab one right now, 0:05:50.600 --> 0:05:55.320 alright butt yeah, but yeah. I mean, I guess this 0:05:55.440 --> 0:06:00.320 is gonna be somewhat of a uh, informative episod for 0:06:00.360 --> 0:06:02.839 me to hear about some of these things, because it's like, 0:06:02.920 --> 0:06:07.440 you know, I've always considered anyone's being denied service for 0:06:07.480 --> 0:06:12.000 their hairstyle or something like that that's illegal and I 0:06:12.040 --> 0:06:15.919 think it's whacked and we probably need legislation if they're 0:06:15.960 --> 0:06:18.720 like discriminating against kids in schools and stuff like that. 0:06:18.800 --> 0:06:21.600 But just just thinking back to working in service industry, 0:06:21.760 --> 0:06:24.320 I kind of understood in a sense because I had 0:06:24.320 --> 0:06:27.200 worked for different places that had different policies, you know 0:06:27.240 --> 0:06:29.880 what I mean, Like some places I was bartending, and 0:06:29.920 --> 0:06:32.120 it's like it's all about, hey, we want people to 0:06:32.160 --> 0:06:35.800 come to this place for you, like whatever who you are, 0:06:35.880 --> 0:06:39.240 so whatever you have, that's gonna be like an identifier 0:06:39.360 --> 0:06:42.919 to you. Go ahead and rocket. So you got mad tattoos, 0:06:43.120 --> 0:06:44.919 you want to do whatever with your hair, go ahead 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:47.000 and do it. But then I've worked at other spots 0:06:47.000 --> 0:06:49.719 where it's like, no, it's it's about the ambiance and 0:06:49.720 --> 0:06:51.080 the blah blah blah blah. You know what I mean. 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:53.320 If you have tattoos, cover them up, and if you're 0:06:53.320 --> 0:06:55.560 if you're if there's if your hair is doing anything 0:06:56.200 --> 0:07:00.040 that is attracting attention, check that ship. Sure they and 0:07:00.120 --> 0:07:02.440 you did. They want you to pretty much not exist exactly. 0:07:02.440 --> 0:07:04.839 And this is completely anecdotal, but like just in the 0:07:04.880 --> 0:07:08.200 particular place that I worked, it was like for the 0:07:08.240 --> 0:07:11.560 most part, it was really like the kids coming the 0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:14.280 white kids coming in with like aqua green and purple 0:07:14.320 --> 0:07:16.000 hair that they were like, no, you can't do that, 0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:19.240 but they left us at I mean, like black people 0:07:19.240 --> 0:07:20.800 who had dreads. I just told you that there like 0:07:20.920 --> 0:07:22.920 to tie it up so that it's not dangling and ship. 0:07:22.960 --> 0:07:24.840 But other than that, you know what I mean. But again, 0:07:24.880 --> 0:07:27.640 that's just one experience, and you know, like one thing. 0:07:27.680 --> 0:07:30.800 But obviously I've heard like the stories and and all 0:07:30.840 --> 0:07:33.600 that sort of stuff. So I'm interested to hear more 0:07:33.640 --> 0:07:35.520 about this Crown Act. I mean, and on that. I 0:07:35.560 --> 0:07:40.800 think one area where, particularly with an employment it's like, uh, 0:07:40.960 --> 0:07:43.240 it's like easy, it's easy for employance together, it was 0:07:43.240 --> 0:07:47.240 a discrimination when they claim like issues of hygiene because 0:07:47.240 --> 0:07:50.000 they don't understand something like dreadlocks or something like an 0:07:50.000 --> 0:07:54.800 afro to them because of the way um um, you know, 0:07:54.840 --> 0:07:58.000 black folk folks have been perceived historically. It's just like 0:07:58.320 --> 0:08:03.600 inherently dirty sort of then transferred that like undertation projection 0:08:03.640 --> 0:08:05.760 onto your hair when they don't understand anything about like 0:08:06.320 --> 0:08:10.160 maintenance or this or that, and so like you know 0:08:10.320 --> 0:08:13.920 in and um in we I actually tried to bring 0:08:13.960 --> 0:08:16.120 forward or an amendment to a piece of legislation here 0:08:16.120 --> 0:08:19.520 in Athens to protect against hair discrimination in our non 0:08:19.520 --> 0:08:22.800 discrimination ordinance. And we're talking about like, oh, well, you know, 0:08:23.320 --> 0:08:28.160 if it's your natural hairstyle, um, if a white black whoever, like, 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:31.520 they can't discriminate against it. It's like okay, but both 0:08:31.640 --> 0:08:34.240 me and this other white commissioner technically have her hair 0:08:34.320 --> 0:08:36.680 down right now. She's an old white lady with like long, 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:38.920 you know, gray hair, and I got the afro out, 0:08:39.600 --> 0:08:41.880 Like if they tell me to put mine up because 0:08:41.920 --> 0:08:45.240 it's a sanitation issue, but they don't tell her to 0:08:45.240 --> 0:08:48.520 put it up. Like we're both wearing we're both wearing 0:08:48.520 --> 0:08:52.200 your hair natural, so like count and we had this 0:08:52.360 --> 0:08:56.600 long discussion about whether or not that counted as discrimination. Um, 0:08:56.640 --> 0:09:00.400 so just on that and what's your like? First of all, 0:09:00.480 --> 0:09:03.040 I mean, how long have you You've always rocked the 0:09:03.080 --> 0:09:05.520 giant afro since I've known you, But how long have 0:09:05.640 --> 0:09:07.920 you rocked it? In? What's you're like? Background? Yeah, I 0:09:07.920 --> 0:09:10.520 should totally give some background. Yeah, no, no, yeah, So 0:09:10.640 --> 0:09:13.959 I stopped straining my hair and I was think fifteen 0:09:14.000 --> 0:09:15.800 years old, so I've been wearing like this for about 0:09:15.880 --> 0:09:18.560 thirteen years now. Um, And like at the time, it 0:09:18.600 --> 0:09:20.840 was just purely like I fucking hated going to the salon, 0:09:21.120 --> 0:09:23.680 just like I hated sitting in a chair for hours 0:09:23.720 --> 0:09:26.679 and getting my scalp burned, and just like and like 0:09:26.760 --> 0:09:29.400 and straining my hair with a way to become invisible, 0:09:29.559 --> 0:09:32.360 like just to fit in to get to like keep 0:09:32.360 --> 0:09:35.200 it low key. It wasn't like I felt like it 0:09:35.280 --> 0:09:37.440 was an expression of who I was, nor did I 0:09:37.480 --> 0:09:39.439 really feel like an afro was nexpression when I was 0:09:39.480 --> 0:09:41.959 I was just looking sick of just you know, every 0:09:42.040 --> 0:09:45.480 month or whatever, getting all these chemicals and in my 0:09:45.520 --> 0:09:47.679 hair and all the ship and so to stop and 0:09:47.840 --> 0:09:50.560 just kind of like out of rebellion, like just fuck 0:09:50.600 --> 0:09:52.920 you guys, I don't do this anymore. But like I didn't. 0:09:53.040 --> 0:09:57.560 I wasn't aware of like the like you know, the 0:09:57.600 --> 0:10:01.240 ties of like natural hair and that's like symbolism within 0:10:01.280 --> 0:10:03.520 the civil rights movement or anything like that. People started 0:10:03.520 --> 0:10:04.920 telling I always like the name is, I don't know 0:10:04.920 --> 0:10:08.160 who funk that was? Um, Like I was just like 0:10:08.480 --> 0:10:10.920 it's kind of almost more of like a punk emo 0:10:11.080 --> 0:10:14.199 sort of thing. I was just like, look authority, bro. Yeah, 0:10:15.080 --> 0:10:18.319 it wasn't necessarily like a cultural identified No no, no, no, 0:10:18.360 --> 0:10:20.360 it was just like yeah, I mean, being an angsty 0:10:20.400 --> 0:10:24.760 little bit and just not wanting to deal with like yeah, 0:10:24.880 --> 0:10:27.920 it's in the like all this effort that put in 0:10:28.080 --> 0:10:33.280 I put into like disappearing at school, you know every day. Um, 0:10:33.320 --> 0:10:34.840 and then I just wanted to like this ever since, 0:10:34.840 --> 0:10:39.680 because yeah, I just don't. I mean, I I value salons. 0:10:39.720 --> 0:10:42.520 It's like the therapeutic environment, Like I understand what this 0:10:42.559 --> 0:10:46.160 place they hold in our culture, but like personally for me, 0:10:46.200 --> 0:10:49.360 it's just easier to not like worrying, Oh when am 0:10:49.400 --> 0:10:51.559 I kind of book my appointment and hey a hundred 0:10:51.600 --> 0:10:54.280 dollars and dada, I just like, you know, get up, 0:10:54.360 --> 0:10:56.719 watch it, brush it. It goes like this and then 0:10:56.720 --> 0:10:58.520 I just lived my life and I just don't think 0:10:58.559 --> 0:11:01.640 about it. I just don't care. But that freedom, that 0:11:01.720 --> 0:11:04.760 freedom to not care, the freedom to whether it's like, oh, 0:11:05.000 --> 0:11:06.840 you know, you can go to your job interview and 0:11:06.840 --> 0:11:08.760 your dreadlocks and not be worried about it. You can 0:11:08.760 --> 0:11:11.080 wear your hair natural and afro and not worry about it. 0:11:11.320 --> 0:11:13.120 You can where are we've and not worry about it 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:15.400 like that that I think is at the essence of 0:11:15.440 --> 0:11:19.480 what this Act is meant to accomplish. That. But in 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:22.559 terms of like freedom, you know, I mean I have 0:11:22.679 --> 0:11:26.360 I have like some other questions, but I guess we should, uh, 0:11:26.520 --> 0:11:28.920 we should let them out. What We're gonna get more 0:11:29.000 --> 0:11:32.720 in depth into the set everything after the jump. Yeah, 0:11:44.960 --> 0:11:48.520 So I'm wondering if you know, and please stop me 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:51.240 if we get into it. But so, how do they 0:11:52.320 --> 0:11:54.760 enforce it or what's the plan to like enforce it. 0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:57.960 So in my research on the Crown Act at the 0:11:58.000 --> 0:12:02.840 federal level, like they repeatedly say like, oh, the bill 0:12:03.000 --> 0:12:07.640 outlines um methods of enforcement. Um, if you give me 0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:11.760 a second, I will actually um the bill. Because here 0:12:11.840 --> 0:12:17.000 if if an employer, like, for example, if they're gonna 0:12:18.679 --> 0:12:22.800 discriminate against somebody who has dreadlots. But then like somebody 0:12:22.920 --> 0:12:26.240 can come in with like a mohawk, a white person 0:12:26.320 --> 0:12:28.080 come in with a mohawk and do an interview, and 0:12:28.080 --> 0:12:30.880 that's like a clear cut example, you know what I mean? 0:12:31.200 --> 0:12:33.920 But what happens when there's not that clear cut example? 0:12:33.960 --> 0:12:35.599 And how do you like, I'm wondering, like, how do 0:12:35.640 --> 0:12:38.400 they determine when it's just yeah, it's interesting that it 0:12:38.520 --> 0:12:42.559 is specifically focused on hairstyles that are linked to racial 0:12:42.640 --> 0:12:45.120 or ethnic identity, and so it does not like if 0:12:45.160 --> 0:12:48.480 you get discriminated against some faces, up, I have pink hair, 0:12:48.840 --> 0:12:51.760 and then I actually then be something that we might 0:12:51.760 --> 0:12:53.640 discuss later. I wanted to talk a little bit about, 0:12:53.679 --> 0:12:56.280 you know how Shaky Richardson sort of inspired a lot 0:12:56.280 --> 0:13:00.160 of people with having a very unconventional per to no 0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:03.320 solemn general but like she had orange hair, that's not 0:13:03.360 --> 0:13:06.959 necessarily something that isn't like inherent to black culture or 0:13:07.040 --> 0:13:09.480 something that people seek out as like a black thing. 0:13:09.960 --> 0:13:12.120 But because she is a black woman, it might be 0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:15.439 looked upon differently than if she was a white woman. Um. 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:20.720 There's interesting implications there. But with regards to enforcement, UM, 0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:24.239 the federal the federal bill says that if you're discriminated 0:13:24.240 --> 0:13:27.120 against her federally assisted program, so like if you are 0:13:27.600 --> 0:13:31.080 if you are participant in public housing or any other 0:13:31.120 --> 0:13:34.640 sort of UM, I don't know, wicked snap programs like that, 0:13:34.800 --> 0:13:37.120 and someone tries to deny you on the basis of 0:13:37.800 --> 0:13:41.240 you know, your dreads look gross or something. UM, they 0:13:41.280 --> 0:13:44.160 say it should be enforced by the same means as 0:13:44.200 --> 0:13:47.000 if um, it was a part of the Similar Rights 0:13:47.040 --> 0:13:50.480 Act of nineteen sixty four. So there's like a precedence 0:13:50.520 --> 0:13:55.760 said from state to state assuming UM, yeah, probably very 0:13:55.880 --> 0:13:57.640 state to say it says, you know, to say, within 0:13:57.679 --> 0:14:00.400 the same jurisdiction as would be in for if it 0:14:00.440 --> 0:14:03.520 were a part of the Civil Rights Act. Um. But 0:14:04.080 --> 0:14:08.120 what was gonna say, Um, So yeah, same thing with 0:14:08.160 --> 0:14:13.880 like housing programs. UM. You know, it would be UM 0:14:14.160 --> 0:14:18.079 enforced with the same measures as would any other infraction 0:14:18.160 --> 0:14:19.920 under the Fair Housing Acts. And so it sort of 0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:23.040 tucks it into um, some of these other pieces of 0:14:23.160 --> 0:14:27.600 legislation that already exists in terms of existing enforcement mechanisms 0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:31.920 rather than like piloting yeah yeah, and interesting, the Civil 0:14:32.000 --> 0:14:38.840 Rights Act of nineteen sixty four, um actually did um, 0:14:38.960 --> 0:14:42.400 it did protect I mean it prohibited prohibited discrimination based 0:14:42.440 --> 0:14:46.200 on race, but only protected against discrimination against Afros specifically. 0:14:46.240 --> 0:14:49.560 I guess it's like the fucking stereotypical well that was. 0:14:49.600 --> 0:14:51.960 That was like as as much as the imagination went 0:14:54.000 --> 0:14:56.560 yeah yeah, you know, like they see the yeah with 0:14:56.600 --> 0:15:00.560 the Caesar or afro, Yeah exactly, and so some of 0:15:00.600 --> 0:15:06.680 the more some of the protective hairstyles like locks, twists, trades, um. 0:15:06.760 --> 0:15:08.760 And I guess I mean we could get into this 0:15:09.000 --> 0:15:11.360 a little back and forth about like whether like we'ves 0:15:11.400 --> 0:15:13.360 count because this what is this one example? Or this 0:15:13.440 --> 0:15:17.160 girl I mean she had like she had extensions, let's say, 0:15:17.680 --> 0:15:19.760 so they were meant to look like natural hair, but 0:15:19.800 --> 0:15:22.680 it wasn't her natural hair. And even so, I mean 0:15:22.920 --> 0:15:25.640 I guess that one to see a picture. I mean, 0:15:25.680 --> 0:15:27.560 the whole thing, the whole thing is the whole premise. 0:15:27.640 --> 0:15:30.440 I just whatever it is that we you know, end 0:15:30.480 --> 0:15:33.440 up getting into, I just want my position is the 0:15:33.440 --> 0:15:38.160 whole premise of it is whack. Somebody's hairstyle isn't determinative, 0:15:38.560 --> 0:15:41.480 determinative who they are as a person, you know something 0:15:41.520 --> 0:15:43.840 about their personality, or what type of worker they are, 0:15:43.960 --> 0:15:45.880 what type of student they're going to be, all of 0:15:45.920 --> 0:15:48.400 that ship. So wait, wait, do you want to just 0:15:48.600 --> 0:15:50.840 you want just get started. I'm sure we can. Being 0:15:50.960 --> 0:15:52.880 his fault, yeah, we're kind of jumping all around. Yeah, 0:15:53.040 --> 0:15:54.920 let's let's just let's get into it, and then let's 0:15:54.920 --> 0:15:58.480 get into where this bill comes from. So the spill 0:15:58.640 --> 0:16:01.040 or these bills rather the federal one, and then there's 0:16:01.120 --> 0:16:03.800 various versions that have been passed the state and municipal level. 0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:06.960 Go to stores of discrimination against black people with dreadlocks, 0:16:07.000 --> 0:16:11.040 twist natural hair, or even shockingly weaves. Um. A study 0:16:11.040 --> 0:16:14.480 connected by Dove found that black women are more likely 0:16:14.480 --> 0:16:16.960 to change their hair their natural hair to conform with 0:16:17.040 --> 0:16:19.920 social norms or expectations at work, and the black women 0:16:19.960 --> 0:16:22.080 are one point five times more likely to be sent 0:16:22.160 --> 0:16:24.960 home from the workplace because of their hair. Um. I 0:16:25.040 --> 0:16:29.520 definitely got told, particularly when I was so yo, look 0:16:29.720 --> 0:16:31.520 check the ship out. This is kind of wild, and 0:16:31.560 --> 0:16:33.320 I kind of find it a little suspect, But like 0:16:33.360 --> 0:16:37.080 I think I'm down. So Dove is like the leader 0:16:37.240 --> 0:16:42.760 of this political coalition of the National Urban League, Color 0:16:42.800 --> 0:16:47.160 of Change, Western Center on Lawn Poverty to like pass 0:16:47.240 --> 0:16:49.960 the Crown Act. Like they are championing the passage of 0:16:50.000 --> 0:16:52.880 the Crown ex federally. Um. If you go to the 0:16:52.880 --> 0:16:55.880 Crown Act website, they give you information on there's like 0:16:56.040 --> 0:16:59.400 model legislation, there's sun a petition, There's that gives you 0:16:59.440 --> 0:17:01.600 a link to the mail your senator. There's other resources. 0:17:01.600 --> 0:17:04.880 So like they're like, it's like, I personally have never 0:17:04.880 --> 0:17:09.080 seen a corporation like lead the charge on passing legislation 0:17:09.080 --> 0:17:10.639 like this before. It's kind of like creepy and girls 0:17:10.640 --> 0:17:13.240 some I just did. I just did a Google search 0:17:13.320 --> 0:17:17.080 for Dove hair study and like a bunch of stuff 0:17:17.080 --> 0:17:19.560 about the Crown Act that's coming up. Yeah. They yeah, 0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:24.800 they did research into both perceptions and changes and attitude 0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:27.200 or like the things that people have actually done, as 0:17:27.200 --> 0:17:29.840 well as like fears that people have about discrimination in 0:17:29.880 --> 0:17:34.239 their right places. I don't see what insidious motivation there 0:17:34.280 --> 0:17:37.000 could be, So I mean it seems like yeah, and 0:17:37.640 --> 0:17:39.639 any good thing. Yeah. I mean, like I feel like 0:17:39.640 --> 0:17:43.960 you very frequently with like you know, corporate diversity initiatives, etcetera. 0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:48.560 You see them give money to organizations to do this 0:17:48.640 --> 0:17:52.040 kind of work. But process is more common than I realized. 0:17:52.040 --> 0:17:53.679 I just don't funk with corporations that much, So I 0:17:53.680 --> 0:17:55.919 didn't didn't dune at me that they do this kind 0:17:55.960 --> 0:17:58.000 of all the time. But from what i've a good 0:17:58.000 --> 0:18:02.600 amount of this stuff is actually dated back in a minute, 0:18:02.680 --> 0:18:06.400 yes before. Yeah, they were here before the George Floyd ship. Yeah, 0:18:06.440 --> 0:18:08.560 and so it's like they've been at it. And from 0:18:08.600 --> 0:18:10.679 what I can tell from their social media presence around 0:18:10.720 --> 0:18:15.040 the campaign, it's not like, you know, like by Dove, 0:18:15.240 --> 0:18:17.840 you know, like they're not promoting themselves. They just happened 0:18:17.840 --> 0:18:19.199 to be a partner in this word, which I just 0:18:19.200 --> 0:18:21.919 find really interesting. But anyway, so they did they they 0:18:21.960 --> 0:18:25.919 did a study, um, you know around uh, you know, 0:18:26.240 --> 0:18:28.919 behavioral changes that black women often have to make or 0:18:28.920 --> 0:18:30.439 feel they have to make in order to fit in 0:18:30.440 --> 0:18:33.600 in the workplaces, and then actual punitive action that's been 0:18:33.600 --> 0:18:35.720 taken against black women, you know, black women being sent 0:18:35.760 --> 0:18:39.640 home from work more often. UM. I definitely felt pressure 0:18:39.640 --> 0:18:43.159 when I was going to become a teacher, Like I 0:18:43.200 --> 0:18:45.280 got people telling It's like who told me, like you can't, 0:18:45.600 --> 0:18:47.560 you can't, we can't be a teacher and looked like that. 0:18:47.560 --> 0:18:49.320 It's like straight up not like it like not like 0:18:49.480 --> 0:18:52.080 job interviews. But when I was like consulting with people 0:18:52.119 --> 0:18:55.720 in the profession, like most time honestly almostly got it 0:18:55.720 --> 0:18:58.919 from like white guys. But um, but they were like, yeah, no, 0:18:59.040 --> 0:19:01.120 that's not gonna work. And then it don't even it did, 0:19:01.280 --> 0:19:03.560 but that but that alone, when you do you think 0:19:03.560 --> 0:19:05.399 they were telling you? Do you think they were telling 0:19:05.400 --> 0:19:07.560 you in terms of like what they thought or what 0:19:07.600 --> 0:19:11.320 they thought the reaction was going to be exactly so um, 0:19:11.359 --> 0:19:14.720 not necessarily on the basis of anything they had seen 0:19:14.760 --> 0:19:18.840 with regards to workplace policy and probably their own racism. Um, 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:21.120 but even hearing that, like that's enough to this way 0:19:21.240 --> 0:19:24.160 someone like M and I was looking into a little 0:19:24.160 --> 0:19:25.760 bit later in the episode, like maybe I want to 0:19:25.760 --> 0:19:27.680 apply for that job or like oh there's nobody they'll 0:19:27.720 --> 0:19:30.400 let me work there, you know, look you know, or 0:19:30.560 --> 0:19:32.919 or enough to change your style like with a legit 0:19:33.040 --> 0:19:35.199 change the way you look because it scared of what 0:19:35.400 --> 0:19:39.679 might happen. It sucks, But it's just like, you know, 0:19:40.560 --> 0:19:44.240 there's just other things that it's like that same sort 0:19:44.240 --> 0:19:48.480 of thing applies to like for example, it's no secret 0:19:49.000 --> 0:19:52.520 I smoke, you know what I mean. And I've always 0:19:52.560 --> 0:19:56.080 had to navigate from jobs that drug tests. It's always 0:19:56.119 --> 0:19:59.200 been like a man, that job would be cool, but 0:20:00.359 --> 0:20:02.720 I'm weighing it out, and it's like, it's not really 0:20:02.720 --> 0:20:05.359 worth me changing my style, you know what I mean, 0:20:05.520 --> 0:20:08.040 get to go work there. But if I personally know 0:20:08.080 --> 0:20:09.800 that if I was in a situation to where I 0:20:09.800 --> 0:20:13.119 had to have that job where my choices were more limited, hey, 0:20:13.160 --> 0:20:15.280 I might have to stop smoking in order to pay 0:20:15.280 --> 0:20:17.800 the light bill, and that's a decision I have to make. 0:20:17.960 --> 0:20:20.359 It's like, from a cultural aspect, it sucks because that 0:20:20.359 --> 0:20:22.200 shouldn't even be the case, you know what I mean, 0:20:22.280 --> 0:20:25.920 It should not be the case. No, Yeah, but it's 0:20:25.960 --> 0:20:30.080 interesting with that. Um like that both of these things, 0:20:30.080 --> 0:20:34.600 both hairstyles and um consumption habits, could be seen as 0:20:34.640 --> 0:20:38.760 a lifestyle choice, whereas like protective hairstyles for like black hair, 0:20:39.440 --> 0:20:41.479 it's not really a choice like if you to keep 0:20:41.520 --> 0:20:44.160 your hair healthy, if you're trying to like grow it out, 0:20:44.359 --> 0:20:47.120 if you're trying to prevent breakage, etcetera. Like you kind 0:20:47.119 --> 0:20:49.160 of if you kind of gotta do it, and that's 0:20:49.160 --> 0:20:51.000 no offense. You can like you said, you can stop 0:20:51.000 --> 0:20:53.240 smoking if you really had to, but like you kind 0:20:53.240 --> 0:20:56.160 of got aware, like your braids, you know, if you're 0:20:56.160 --> 0:20:59.360 gonna keep your hair out exactly. I mean, I just don't. Yeah, 0:20:59.359 --> 0:21:01.840 people from out the culture don't don't stand that. And 0:21:01.880 --> 0:21:04.240 so like employers like, well, why don't you choose to 0:21:04.240 --> 0:21:06.280