1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to 2 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:31,800 Speaker 1: the show, fellow Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so 3 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:35,920 Speaker 1: much for tuning in. Let's hear it for our guest 4 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:41,120 Speaker 1: super producer, the one and only Ben the Sleeping Dog Hacket. 5 00:00:41,440 --> 00:00:43,920 Speaker 1: Have you heard this nickname, Noel? 6 00:00:44,240 --> 00:00:48,680 Speaker 2: Well, I know Ben's musical output and his incredible record 7 00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:50,760 Speaker 2: songs for sleeping Dogs, So I guess it makes sense 8 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:51,839 Speaker 2: if that's what you're referring to. 9 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:52,880 Speaker 3: Yeah. 10 00:00:52,960 --> 00:00:55,680 Speaker 1: Well, as we always want to say when we're talking 11 00:00:55,680 --> 00:01:01,800 Speaker 1: about the legendary mister Hackett, this is an appellation that 12 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:05,920 Speaker 1: you have chosen yourself. Correct Ben, just a little easter egg. 13 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:11,680 Speaker 2: Checkout Ben's record. It's really really good. Boy, oh boy, Ben, 14 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 2: we got a topic today. I think we broke our 15 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:15,479 Speaker 2: rule for this topic. 16 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 3: It's so good. 17 00:01:17,120 --> 00:01:20,959 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, we went. We went a little bit closer 18 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:25,120 Speaker 1: to the modern day, just bite two years, but just 19 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:29,880 Speaker 1: by two, just by two right. Uh so uh, we 20 00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:33,279 Speaker 1: want to of course, uh, we want to of course 21 00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:37,880 Speaker 1: identify ourselves. This is the legendary Noel Brown you're hearing 22 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 1: things with with those dulcet tones. 23 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:45,839 Speaker 3: You're the legendary Ben bowling with also bringing the Tones, dulcet. 24 00:01:45,720 --> 00:01:54,480 Speaker 2: To oh Geezhus credit game recognized game. We also need 25 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:59,000 Speaker 2: to recognize. Speaking of recognizing game, Jordan the nickname TBD 26 00:01:59,240 --> 00:02:01,840 Speaker 2: run Dog, who brought us this amazing topic that I 27 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 2: was tangentially familiar with. Boyle boy as he often is, 28 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:09,280 Speaker 2: wont to do. Did he bring the heat as far 29 00:02:09,280 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 2: as details around the case of the infamous seafood dosing 30 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 2: on the set of James Cameron's Titanic. 31 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, let's get to it, all right. So the 32 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:26,239 Speaker 1: gist is this one night during the filming of this 33 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:33,200 Speaker 1: epic Titanic, which is based on a true story about 34 00:02:33,240 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 1: a ship that was considered unsinkable and spoiler alert, did sink? Yeah? Also, 35 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:45,800 Speaker 1: Abe Lincoln didn't have a great time at the play whatever. 36 00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 3: No, I don't know if I'd have quite the reach. 37 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 2: And the Titanic, by the way, did sink, in fact, 38 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:52,520 Speaker 2: on April fifteenth of nineteen twelve. 39 00:02:52,639 --> 00:02:54,600 Speaker 3: So we're going to use that as our date, our 40 00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:59,120 Speaker 3: benchmark date for this nice nice Okay, yeah, that's perfect, 41 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:06,640 Speaker 3: all right. Our buddy James Cameron is often confused with filmmakers. 42 00:03:07,080 --> 00:03:11,280 Speaker 3: He's mainly a dude who uses film to support his 43 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:13,680 Speaker 3: weird underwater explorations. 44 00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:17,959 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, fair, fair, that is a reasonable criticism. He 45 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:22,440 Speaker 2: is a bit technology forward and scuba diving and underwater 46 00:03:22,480 --> 00:03:23,880 Speaker 2: exploration minded. 47 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:26,440 Speaker 3: But he's made some bangers. I think Terminator Too. 48 00:03:26,400 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 2: Is quite good. Many bangers. Yeah, but he's also no 49 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:31,799 Speaker 2: one's friend. I'll tell you that right now. 50 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:34,400 Speaker 1: Is that true? Have you spoken with Jimmy? 51 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:37,480 Speaker 2: He's a real pill, not a nice tame apparently a 52 00:03:37,480 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 2: little difficult to work with. No, that's sort of the 53 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 2: that's sort of the thrust of today's story is that 54 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 2: he is, in fact runs his film sets like a 55 00:03:46,480 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 2: bit of an iron fisted tyrant, and that God has 56 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:51,920 Speaker 2: the way of rubbing some people the wrong wing. 57 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:57,120 Speaker 1: Sure. Sure, yeah, a lot of egos in Hollywood, But Nol, 58 00:03:57,200 --> 00:04:01,800 Speaker 1: you're my canary in the cavern for a lot of 59 00:04:01,880 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 1: diplomatic stuff. If you say someone is difficult, you're you're 60 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:10,320 Speaker 1: just so nice, So I would I would take your 61 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 1: word over theirs. 62 00:04:11,680 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 2: It is not me alone, my friend saying that this 63 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:15,520 Speaker 2: person is difficult. 64 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:16,560 Speaker 3: It is a known thing. 65 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 2: He's actually described in a source that our buddy Jordan 66 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 2: found as the scariest man in Hollywood, which, boy, yeah, 67 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:28,080 Speaker 2: scariest livid. That's right, But to your point, then they 68 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 2: are filming some of the wrap around pieces. You'll remember 69 00:04:31,480 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 2: if anyone's seen this film. There's the main story of 70 00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:40,520 Speaker 2: Rose and Jack and the door and the door. 71 00:04:40,480 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 3: There really was room on the door. 72 00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:43,920 Speaker 2: But then there's also the wrap around frame story of 73 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 2: Bill Paxton, the underwater explorer and maybe James Cameron esque 74 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 2: figure if he's casting a sort of a similar person 75 00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 2: to what he's all about, and the the the elderly 76 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:01,560 Speaker 2: Rose and this idea of finding this very important diamond artifact, 77 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:03,760 Speaker 2: the heart of the sea, the heart of the ocean, 78 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:06,080 Speaker 2: one of those kind of nice yeah. Yeah, they're filming 79 00:05:06,120 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 2: those bits in Nova Scotia, Halifax in fact, right, And 80 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:14,200 Speaker 2: people are just really enjoying a little break because, as 81 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:16,760 Speaker 2: we're gonna get to Cameron didn't really go for breaks 82 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:20,240 Speaker 2: too much, even maybe you know, union mandated. 83 00:05:19,720 --> 00:05:21,360 Speaker 3: Ones, and not much else. 84 00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 2: And there is just a delicious stew perhaps of muscles, clams, yeah, 85 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:31,240 Speaker 2: perhaps lobster, described often as a seafood bisk or a 86 00:05:31,279 --> 00:05:34,040 Speaker 2: seafood chowder or a clam chowder, and people are just 87 00:05:34,080 --> 00:05:36,479 Speaker 2: loving it. They're going back for multiple bowls. They're just 88 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 2: having a good old time enjoying this yummy, this piping 89 00:05:39,720 --> 00:05:42,919 Speaker 2: hot dish, and before long people start acting a little funny, 90 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:44,120 Speaker 2: feeling a little funny. 91 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:50,760 Speaker 1: Yes, just so, and there is a mystery afoot at 92 00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 1: the time. 93 00:05:51,680 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 3: All right. 94 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:58,360 Speaker 1: So, as I established earlier, you know what, I'm fine 95 00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:01,640 Speaker 1: seeing it on air. I believe in Noel Brown. And 96 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:04,320 Speaker 1: if Noel Brown says you are a pill, then I 97 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:10,240 Speaker 1: will trust Noel over you. People say that James Cameron 98 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:15,240 Speaker 1: has a reputation, as you alluded to earlier, He's a 99 00:06:15,279 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 1: guy with a lot of enemies. He is not the 100 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:25,240 Speaker 1: best with his bedside manner, which means in the rarefied 101 00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:29,039 Speaker 1: era of production that there may be people seeking what 102 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:34,839 Speaker 1: we would call petty revenge. The headline is this, someone 103 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:39,080 Speaker 1: unidentified for the purposes of our show at this point, 104 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:46,560 Speaker 1: sought petty revenge on James Cameron by assaulting innocent people 105 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:53,159 Speaker 1: with hallucinogens via crafty and crafty is just our term 106 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 1: for it's our term for where you eat when you're 107 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:02,400 Speaker 1: doing some kind of production TV or film. He is 108 00:07:03,600 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 1: a iron fist, as you said, Noel, he is an 109 00:07:06,720 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 1: iron fist director, producer, a tour we could say. And 110 00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 1: he's very intense. He wants everyone to work around the clock. 111 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 1: He's a micro manager. He at this point is using 112 00:07:22,360 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 1: the production budget of the Titanic film to launch expeditions 113 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:34,360 Speaker 1: under the water to see the actual wreckage of the Titanic. 114 00:07:35,160 --> 00:07:39,320 Speaker 1: He's going deep in the water. He built a full 115 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:43,000 Speaker 1: scale model, or I should say his production folks built 116 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 1: a full scale model of the ship off the coast 117 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:51,680 Speaker 1: of Mexico, and they built it to be repeatedly sinkable. 118 00:07:51,960 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 1: Jordan wants everyone to know that is a story all 119 00:07:55,680 --> 00:08:00,000 Speaker 1: its own. The production overall, it costs more than two 120 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:04,120 Speaker 1: two hundred million US dollars in nineteen to the. 121 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 3: Most expensive production to date at the time. If I'm 122 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:07,600 Speaker 3: not mistaken. 123 00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 1: At the time, you're correct, yeah, yeah, yeah, And all 124 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 1: right we are establishing context. 125 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:15,160 Speaker 3: Right. 126 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 1: You are working for this guy, James Cameron. As you said, 127 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 1: he's kind of like a Kubrick level a tour. He 128 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:30,760 Speaker 1: yells at people, he's smacking people. He has a schedule 129 00:08:30,840 --> 00:08:36,040 Speaker 1: of an eighty hour, six day work week. Later people 130 00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:39,679 Speaker 1: will describe it as quote the closest thing to slavery 131 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:44,920 Speaker 1: that I've ever laid my eyes upon. No breaks. People 132 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:50,080 Speaker 1: are having medical problems due to it as. I love 133 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:55,120 Speaker 1: that you mentioned this military aspect because he's got an 134 00:08:55,240 --> 00:09:00,840 Speaker 1: editor named Mark Goldblatt, and Mark says, you don't just 135 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:04,959 Speaker 1: join one of James's films, you sign on for a 136 00:09:05,160 --> 00:09:09,920 Speaker 1: tour of duty. And Cameron didn't bucket this. He said, 137 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:15,319 Speaker 1: filmmaking his war a great battle between business and aesthetics. 138 00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:20,360 Speaker 1: Can you give us the name of the or give 139 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 1: us the slogan of the T shirt he made? 140 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:26,440 Speaker 2: I could do that time means nothing in the face 141 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:27,560 Speaker 2: of creativity. 142 00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:30,680 Speaker 3: That's not true, Jim. Time means everything. 143 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:34,560 Speaker 2: Time is the only currency that we as human beings have, 144 00:09:34,640 --> 00:09:35,960 Speaker 2: and you are taking. 145 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:36,520 Speaker 3: It from all of us. 146 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:37,880 Speaker 1: I always say that. 147 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:42,440 Speaker 3: Currency. You sure do, man, you sure do. 148 00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:46,319 Speaker 2: And it is not something that Cameron seems to respect, 149 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:48,440 Speaker 2: or at the very least he believes that it all 150 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:50,640 Speaker 2: belongs to him. But this is not a secret. All 151 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 2: of this stuff is an open secret in Hollywood. From 152 00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:57,440 Speaker 2: earlier productions of James Cameron, The Abyss obviously the first 153 00:09:57,520 --> 00:09:59,439 Speaker 2: Terminator movie, which was sort of his like. 154 00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:04,440 Speaker 3: You know, kind of almost DIY esque film. 155 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 2: It was a very low budget. He came from a 156 00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:12,000 Speaker 2: background painting models in the Roger Korman school of filmmaking, 157 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,720 Speaker 2: So he really does have a background as a hands 158 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:18,480 Speaker 2: on craftsman, which I've always appreciated and respected about the guy. 159 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 2: And he definitely has a forward thinking mind. A lot 160 00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:23,960 Speaker 2: of the stuff that he depicts in the Terminator film, 161 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:29,240 Speaker 2: specially T two Judgment Day, about artificial intelligence and sentient 162 00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:33,800 Speaker 2: machines and such, certainly seem to be coming to pass 163 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:35,240 Speaker 2: in some way, shape or form. 164 00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 3: So I would call him a futurist. 165 00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:39,800 Speaker 2: I would call him a technologist, And to your point, 166 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:41,760 Speaker 2: been a lot of those things often take precedent over 167 00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:44,400 Speaker 2: the fact that he is a filmmaker. People did not 168 00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 2: believe that Avatar was going to be a big hit. 169 00:10:47,080 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 2: People thought it's too expensive, it's blue smurf people, it's 170 00:10:50,640 --> 00:10:52,880 Speaker 2: a ripoff of the plot of Dances with Wolves. And 171 00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:55,920 Speaker 2: yet the first one was the highest grossing movie of 172 00:10:55,960 --> 00:10:59,280 Speaker 2: all time, and then decade or more goes by, and 173 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:01,680 Speaker 2: then all now, I'm releasing sequels to Avatar. 174 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:03,920 Speaker 3: Why would you do that, James Cameron? People have forgotten 175 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:04,960 Speaker 3: about Avatar. Not true. 176 00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:08,920 Speaker 2: The second one made an insane amount of money as well, 177 00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:11,560 Speaker 2: and they're fun movies. He's got a whole wing of 178 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 2: the Universal Studios theme. Parks No sorry, Disney World theme 179 00:11:15,520 --> 00:11:18,720 Speaker 2: park devoted to Avatar, so he seems to know what 180 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:21,160 Speaker 2: he's doing. But in order to do that, often people 181 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:24,679 Speaker 2: with that kind of vision can be a bit tyrannical, 182 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:27,840 Speaker 2: So time means nothing in the face of creativity. The 183 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 2: crew actually had their own counter t shirts printed, saying, 184 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:35,079 Speaker 2: Jim's a hands on director and I have the bruises 185 00:11:35,120 --> 00:11:35,720 Speaker 2: to prove it. 186 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:41,559 Speaker 1: Yeah. You can see a New York Times profile on 187 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 1: our buddy Jim that was published during the production of 188 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:52,880 Speaker 1: The Titanic, and it says that he is uncompromising. It's 189 00:11:52,920 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 1: diplomatic when they call him a perfectionist. They they note 190 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:03,360 Speaker 1: that he as a megaphone and a walkie talkie, and 191 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 1: he's often yelling at people. And there's another relatively concurrent 192 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:16,319 Speaker 1: piece in Premiere magazine where someone says, I can't even 193 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:20,840 Speaker 1: tell the difference between yelling and not yelling anymore. It's 194 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:24,000 Speaker 1: more it's just what does he want and what do 195 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:27,359 Speaker 1: we have to do to get it done. The headline 196 00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:30,880 Speaker 1: of that article in Premiere, by the way, is quote 197 00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:36,880 Speaker 1: inside the punishing dictatorship that was James Cameron's Titanic set, 198 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 1: and we have to put ourselves back in this era. 199 00:12:41,520 --> 00:12:47,640 Speaker 1: Titanic is by all metrics, a phenomenal success. Don't roll 200 00:12:47,679 --> 00:12:50,280 Speaker 1: your eyes. It's it's a phenomenal success. It's a it's 201 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 1: a blockbuster. I think we got Celine Dion singing some songs, right, 202 00:12:56,040 --> 00:12:56,560 Speaker 1: didn't you do? 203 00:12:57,240 --> 00:12:59,640 Speaker 3: What was that song? She sure did the love theme 204 00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:01,199 Speaker 3: from Tipitanic, My Heart Will go. 205 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:04,840 Speaker 1: On, My Heart Will go On. And I guess that's 206 00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:10,360 Speaker 1: what That's what the crew was thinking. Look, there's a 207 00:13:10,440 --> 00:13:13,960 Speaker 1: weird energy on the set. There are a lot of 208 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:18,679 Speaker 1: people who are not happy, rightly so with the way 209 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:25,560 Speaker 1: they are being treated. And this guy James is, as 210 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 1: you said, kind of scary. So before they head to 211 00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:35,240 Speaker 1: Mexico to shoot the back in time scenes in nineteen twelve, 212 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:42,000 Speaker 1: before they head there, Cameron takes a smaller casting crew 213 00:13:42,520 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 1: to Nova Scotia and they're filming what we described as 214 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:50,760 Speaker 1: wrap around scenes right the frame of our story that 215 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:54,960 Speaker 1: takes place in the present day of the universe of 216 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:58,880 Speaker 1: the film. This is where we see Bill Paxton. Right, 217 00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:06,320 Speaker 1: Bill Paxton, legendary actor undersea treasure hunter, contacted by not 218 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:11,320 Speaker 1: Rose Prime, but the older Rose, and he has found 219 00:14:11,400 --> 00:14:14,200 Speaker 1: a sketch of her and he's asking kind of for 220 00:14:14,280 --> 00:14:19,040 Speaker 1: the story of this sketch, the wrap around stuff classic 221 00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:25,160 Speaker 1: Cameron in terms of dictatorship and tyranny. It's just after midnight, 222 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:31,000 Speaker 1: the last day of filming, August ninth, nineteen ninety six. 223 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:37,640 Speaker 1: Finally this dictator gives the crew and the cast a 224 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 1: break to eat some chowder. 225 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:46,720 Speaker 3: Yeah. 226 00:14:46,760 --> 00:14:49,600 Speaker 2: By all accounts, everyone says the chowder was fantastic. Marilyn 227 00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:53,720 Speaker 2: mcavey or McAvoy. I wonder if she's related to the 228 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:56,640 Speaker 2: other macavoy there. So there are some like NEPO situations 229 00:14:56,680 --> 00:14:59,560 Speaker 2: going on in the story. We've got a Deschanel, the 230 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 2: elder Deschanel, Zoe's dad in the mix as well, but 231 00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:04,240 Speaker 2: she's a set painter and. 232 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:05,960 Speaker 3: Says the chowder was unbelievable. 233 00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 2: This is according to a Vice piece on this debacle 234 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:11,640 Speaker 2: that came out in twenty seventeen. People were going back 235 00:15:11,640 --> 00:15:14,080 Speaker 2: for second bowls. People ate a lot more than usual 236 00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:18,760 Speaker 2: because it was so delicious. That's when things start going south. 237 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:22,400 Speaker 2: As I mentioned at the top, about fifteen minutes in, 238 00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:23,200 Speaker 2: we get. 239 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 3: The kick in. 240 00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:26,400 Speaker 2: People start acting a little funny, people start feeling a 241 00:15:26,440 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 2: little funny, struggling. 242 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:28,240 Speaker 3: To do their work. 243 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:33,440 Speaker 2: We really start to see things enter crisis mode when 244 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:36,880 Speaker 2: a stand in actress actually passes out, then everyone begins 245 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:41,800 Speaker 2: to scream starts throwing up. We have a comment from 246 00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:43,800 Speaker 2: a crew member in one of these oral histories of 247 00:15:43,840 --> 00:15:48,280 Speaker 2: the events saying they didn't have experience with drugs, but 248 00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:51,360 Speaker 2: the others were saying that it was like the beginning 249 00:15:51,760 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 2: of an acid trip. I don't know anything about PCP. 250 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:58,960 Speaker 2: All I know is that it has a history of 251 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:03,200 Speaker 2: putting people in like rage hulk mode where they can 252 00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:05,720 Speaker 2: get like hit by cars and stuff and they just 253 00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:09,200 Speaker 2: go limp like. It does not seem pleasant. Every time 254 00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 2: you hear about angel dust or PCP, it's usually involves 255 00:16:13,080 --> 00:16:18,480 Speaker 2: somebody doing some crazy violence or injuring themselves, or you know, 256 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:20,960 Speaker 2: just being kind of like some sort of like zombie 257 00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:23,880 Speaker 2: type situation. So this is not what I would argue 258 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:27,000 Speaker 2: a particularly fun time party drug. 259 00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:30,080 Speaker 1: No, Yeah, that's on base. 260 00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:30,560 Speaker 3: Roughly. 261 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:36,760 Speaker 1: The issue here is that for any hallucinogen, your experience 262 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 1: is going to be defined by scene and setting, right, 263 00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:43,240 Speaker 1: It's going to be defined by your cognitive state at 264 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:48,280 Speaker 1: the beginning before ingestion, and it's also going to be 265 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:55,520 Speaker 1: informed by the environment in which you encounter a hallucinogen, 266 00:16:55,760 --> 00:17:01,200 Speaker 1: and most importantly, it should be consensual. These are innocent 267 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:07,400 Speaker 1: people who are not allowed to consent to whatever happens. 268 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:11,399 Speaker 1: One crew member ask as co workers, hey, you guys 269 00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:14,359 Speaker 1: feel okay? I don't I feel like I'm on something, 270 00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:20,040 Speaker 1: and this guy classic says, believe me, I would know. 271 00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:21,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, you would. 272 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:24,240 Speaker 2: A lot of people on the set were certainly experienced, 273 00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:28,920 Speaker 2: as the Grateful Dead might say, there is an analog 274 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:31,359 Speaker 2: here with another topic that you and I have discussed 275 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,800 Speaker 2: pretty much, pretty at length on our other show stuff 276 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:35,640 Speaker 2: they don't want you to know with our buddy Matt Frederick. 277 00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:38,160 Speaker 2: And this was something that the US government actually did 278 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:43,840 Speaker 2: quite a lot of non consensually dosing civilians with hallucinogenic 279 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:46,879 Speaker 2: substances in Operation Midnight. 280 00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:47,879 Speaker 3: Climax or MK Ultra. 281 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:52,240 Speaker 2: I'm kind of interchangeably referred to that program, which was, 282 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:56,000 Speaker 2: you know, an absolute horror show, because anytime that you 283 00:17:56,080 --> 00:18:00,520 Speaker 2: are doing this to someone without their knowledge, the immediate 284 00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:04,240 Speaker 2: thought can often me I am am I losing my mind? 285 00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:08,200 Speaker 2: Am I having an absolute psychotic break? Which could lead 286 00:18:08,280 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 2: to some very horrific consequences. 287 00:18:11,080 --> 00:18:15,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, we we see multiple reports from people in the 288 00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:20,920 Speaker 1: crew who drank this h or let's say it this way. 289 00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:24,879 Speaker 1: They had this experience, right, and at first they can't 290 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:28,439 Speaker 1: explain it. One guy says, or one person says, I 291 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:34,160 Speaker 1: feel toxic and beside myself. Yeah, and that's a very 292 00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:38,640 Speaker 1: honest one. And Bill Paxton says, one minute I felt okay, 293 00:18:38,840 --> 00:18:42,160 Speaker 1: the next minute, I felt so beat me here, Ben, 294 00:18:42,760 --> 00:18:46,480 Speaker 1: I felt so anxious. I wanted to breathe in a 295 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:47,600 Speaker 1: paper bag. 296 00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:50,520 Speaker 2: And I actually saw an interview with Paxton talking about 297 00:18:50,560 --> 00:18:53,719 Speaker 2: this where he is experienced, and he talks about it 298 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:56,960 Speaker 2: thus in that way. He just kind of was like, 299 00:18:57,000 --> 00:18:58,840 Speaker 2: you know what, I'm just going to ride this out. 300 00:18:59,240 --> 00:19:02,040 Speaker 2: And he just cried the six pack and started smoking 301 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:04,040 Speaker 2: joints because he was like, I know what this is. 302 00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:06,679 Speaker 2: I don't know exactly what substance it is, but I 303 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:07,959 Speaker 2: know the only way to get through it. 304 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:09,359 Speaker 3: The only way forward is through. 305 00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:12,440 Speaker 2: So that's exactly what Bill Paxton did as a as 306 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 2: experienced you know, hallucinogen user and stoner. 307 00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:21,439 Speaker 1: And we see people having visual hallucinations. Imagine you're the 308 00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 1: steadicam operator and you see colors and fog, right, and 309 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 1: your job is to look at things. So how's that 310 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:32,000 Speaker 1: going to work? 311 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:33,359 Speaker 3: Streaks in my frame. 312 00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:38,720 Speaker 1: Geez, oh my gosh. So James will be furious, right 313 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,760 Speaker 1: if he was not one of the people affected by 314 00:19:41,840 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 1: the chowda. He's feeling suddenly and distinctly woozy, and of course, naturally, 315 00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:55,119 Speaker 1: since these folks are not all, you know, hallucinots, a 316 00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:58,320 Speaker 1: word I just made up, that's very kind of you. 317 00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 1: This is a lot of people are naturally saying what 318 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:08,359 Speaker 1: happened to me earlier, and they're concluding, maybe they got 319 00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:12,800 Speaker 1: some bad chowda, maybe they got you know, some bad shellfish. 320 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:15,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, James refers to I believe. 321 00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:18,520 Speaker 2: He starts shouting as he was wont to do about 322 00:20:18,520 --> 00:20:24,200 Speaker 2: some sort of neurotoxin potentially in play, a paralytic shellfish neurotoxin, 323 00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:26,720 Speaker 2: because again he's a bit of a science minded fellow, 324 00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:28,119 Speaker 2: so he may or may not know a little bit 325 00:20:28,119 --> 00:20:31,480 Speaker 2: about what he's talking about, and he's trying to get 326 00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 2: out of there so that he can make himself induce vomiting. 327 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:37,639 Speaker 2: But unfortunately, all of a sudden, he realizes he's so 328 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:41,639 Speaker 2: discombobulated he can no longer find his way out of 329 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,679 Speaker 2: this labyrinthine set, to be fair, which he had been 330 00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:45,800 Speaker 2: shooting in for weeks. 331 00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:47,520 Speaker 1: He can't find a place to puke. 332 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 2: You can't find a place to puke. I would just 333 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:51,560 Speaker 2: do it where you stand, buddy. I mean people were 334 00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:55,800 Speaker 2: certainly doing that on the Titanic itself. This is something 335 00:20:55,840 --> 00:20:59,520 Speaker 2: that is really causing him distress, and Ben, you gotta 336 00:20:59,600 --> 00:20:59,880 Speaker 2: do it. 337 00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:00,679 Speaker 3: The thing he. 338 00:21:00,720 --> 00:21:04,160 Speaker 2: Screams is classic camera and it sounds like a line 339 00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:05,560 Speaker 2: from Aliens truly. 340 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:07,200 Speaker 3: In fact, it could well be. 341 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:10,880 Speaker 1: There's something Eddy, get it out. 342 00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:15,720 Speaker 3: Then the chest burster bursts forth. 343 00:21:16,440 --> 00:21:21,520 Speaker 2: His pal Louis Abernathy Lewis to his friends who played 344 00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:25,120 Speaker 2: the character who named after him, Lewis Bodine in the film. 345 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:29,000 Speaker 2: I don't remember that character, but he's apparently here. Suit 346 00:21:29,920 --> 00:21:33,040 Speaker 2: he has a line that says, she's a very old liar. 347 00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:35,359 Speaker 2: By the way, I have to give Jordan and his 348 00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:39,919 Speaker 2: podcast too much information TMI a shot, because they do, 349 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:42,640 Speaker 2: like I believe, a three part history, oral history on 350 00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 2: the filming of Titanic, So not just the clamshowder incident, 351 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:49,159 Speaker 2: but like all of this other stuff that was very 352 00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:52,800 Speaker 2: much worthy of its own series of episodes, just the 353 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:56,760 Speaker 2: whole chaotic mess that was the filming of Titanic. His 354 00:21:56,840 --> 00:21:59,639 Speaker 2: buddy Lewis Bodine said, I was just shocked at the 355 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:03,639 Speaker 2: way he looked talking about camera. One eye was completely red, 356 00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:05,680 Speaker 2: like the terminator eye. 357 00:22:05,359 --> 00:22:07,600 Speaker 3: A pupil, no iris beat red. 358 00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:10,160 Speaker 2: This is already a scary dude, and now he's coming 359 00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:11,320 Speaker 2: at you looking like that. 360 00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 3: The other eye looked like he'd been sniffing glue since 361 00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:17,920 Speaker 3: he was four. That is a very descriptive line. 362 00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:22,200 Speaker 1: Let's spend some time on that, because it is an indication, 363 00:22:22,560 --> 00:22:27,080 Speaker 1: as any medical professionals in the audience tonight will know, 364 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:32,320 Speaker 1: it is an indication of something going to ry if 365 00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:37,840 Speaker 1: your pupils are not matching in diameter, and that can 366 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:44,399 Speaker 1: imply some very dangerous, very scary and possibly life changing 367 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:48,639 Speaker 1: events in your brain. All right, it can indicate brain damage. 368 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:53,240 Speaker 2: Well, let's just again mention that PCP isn't some happy, 369 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:56,040 Speaker 2: fun time party drug. It is like it's often referred 370 00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:59,760 Speaker 2: to as a hallucinogen, but it's hard stuff. It is 371 00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:03,400 Speaker 2: a serious street drug and often you know, enjoyed by 372 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:07,919 Speaker 2: kind of scary people. In my experience, at least, you know, 373 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:11,120 Speaker 2: as I've read about it, and seeing I've never encountered 374 00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:12,200 Speaker 2: the stuff in my life. 375 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:15,080 Speaker 3: Well, I've certainly run in some sketchy circle. 376 00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:18,280 Speaker 1: Well, Ben, right, you and I were talking offline earlier. 377 00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:19,960 Speaker 1: You smoked a lot of wet. 378 00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:28,320 Speaker 2: Right, if I'm not mistaken. There's wet, which is yeah, 379 00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 2: that's right. There is the old joint dipped in PCP, 380 00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:34,359 Speaker 2: and then there's also the shurm stick of lore, which 381 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:37,240 Speaker 2: would be a joint dipped in embalming fluid. But you're 382 00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:40,399 Speaker 2: right then the wet is definitely a thing and again 383 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:41,679 Speaker 2: kind of scary people. 384 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:45,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, this is not the thing you should do to 385 00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:51,359 Speaker 1: your friends. You should never dose people with drugs. It's 386 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:57,000 Speaker 1: not let alone people in a professional environment. James Cameron, 387 00:23:57,040 --> 00:24:02,240 Speaker 1: by the way, is not having his first psychedelic rodeo. 388 00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:08,359 Speaker 1: He was talking, as Jordan points out in Oral History 389 00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:13,639 Speaker 1: of Terminator two on the thirtieth anniversary of that film's publication, 390 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:18,359 Speaker 1: and he says, look, when I came up with the 391 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:24,600 Speaker 1: plot idea of Terminator two, I was on ecstasy. I 392 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,600 Speaker 1: remember this is a quote. I remember sitting there once 393 00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:31,919 Speaker 1: high on e writing notes for Terminator and I was 394 00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:35,520 Speaker 1: struck by Sting's song that I hope the Russians loved 395 00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:38,200 Speaker 1: their children too, And I thought, you know what, the 396 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:41,439 Speaker 1: idea of a nuclear war is just so antithetical to 397 00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:46,800 Speaker 1: life itself. That's where the kid came from. James amazing, 398 00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:52,160 Speaker 1: but also ecstasy. I don't know, I'm so square, man, 399 00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:53,800 Speaker 1: I'm scared of that stuff. 400 00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:54,560 Speaker 3: Yeah. 401 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:57,080 Speaker 2: I don't think of ecstasy as a hallucinogen either, honestly, 402 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,480 Speaker 2: like a clubby kind of party drug. I guess it was, 403 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:03,040 Speaker 2: and I didn't think it was super popular in the 404 00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:05,320 Speaker 2: era in which Cameron would have been writing this stuff. 405 00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:06,760 Speaker 2: I would have thought it'd be much more likely that 406 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:09,159 Speaker 2: he'd have taken a tab of acid or something. But 407 00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:12,600 Speaker 2: there you go straight from his mouth to the Ringer's ear, 408 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:15,760 Speaker 2: which I do love podcasts from the Ringer Network. When 409 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:19,680 Speaker 2: Cameron went back to the set, he found that everyone 410 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:23,200 Speaker 2: had left and it was a really eerie, spooky kind 411 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:25,680 Speaker 2: of ghost town of a scene. He described it like 412 00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:28,160 Speaker 2: an episode of the Twilight Zone when talking to Rebecca 413 00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:31,080 Speaker 2: Keegan for her book The Futurist, referring to James Cameron. 414 00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:34,400 Speaker 2: Of course, in an effort to mitigate some of this chaos, 415 00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:37,480 Speaker 2: and assistant director had herded everyone into the dining area 416 00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:40,560 Speaker 2: where I bet that was a scene, y'all, and divided 417 00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:43,879 Speaker 2: them into two groups. We've got good crew and bad crew. 418 00:25:43,960 --> 00:25:46,040 Speaker 2: Are you a good crew or are you a bad crew? 419 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,800 Speaker 2: It was described like a game of Red Rover. As 420 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:52,000 Speaker 2: soon as someone on the good crew started feeling funny, 421 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:54,399 Speaker 2: they'd switch over to the bad crew side. You gotta 422 00:25:54,440 --> 00:26:01,240 Speaker 2: respect the assistant director production assistant mind did organization here 423 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:02,520 Speaker 2: in this situation, right? 424 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:09,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, So the folks who identify, whether they self identify 425 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:14,200 Speaker 1: or are identified as bad crew, we're looking at sixty 426 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,640 Speaker 1: to eighty five people. Again, this is a huge production. 427 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:24,240 Speaker 1: These folks who are not feeling well are loaded into vans. 428 00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:28,879 Speaker 1: They are taken away to Dartmouth General Hospital. They are 429 00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:34,600 Speaker 1: losing their minds, moaning, crying, wailing, and it's not too 430 00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:39,919 Speaker 1: long after they arrive that one of the attending doctors 431 00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:46,960 Speaker 1: immediately clocks there must be something afoot. There's clear evidence 432 00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:53,800 Speaker 1: of non consensual intoxication of some sort. So the staff 433 00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:59,159 Speaker 1: begins distributing liquid charcoal, which, by the way, don't get 434 00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:02,960 Speaker 1: in a situation where you need liquid charcoal, but if 435 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:07,200 Speaker 1: you are in a situation, remember that can kind of help. 436 00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:10,719 Speaker 1: So the nurses are going to soak up the toxins. 437 00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:13,840 Speaker 1: That's the idea, right, So the nurses are hoping this 438 00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:19,879 Speaker 1: will counteract the drug. Whatever substance has been dosed onto 439 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 1: the crew. The issue is the time window right the 440 00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:28,840 Speaker 1: ingestion of the body, the delivery of the drug. Unfortunately, 441 00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:32,720 Speaker 1: these people are already not in the best place, so 442 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:37,040 Speaker 1: a great many of them refuse to follow the doctor's 443 00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:41,640 Speaker 1: orders to consume this liquid charcoal. They stay in their beds, 444 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:47,840 Speaker 1: tripping hard. This is a hospital crew that is understaffed, 445 00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:51,199 Speaker 1: kind of a skeleton night crew, and they are not 446 00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:56,959 Speaker 1: equipped to deal with this like this small army of 447 00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,080 Speaker 1: people showing up at one am. 448 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:02,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, whacked up out of their gorge on substances at 449 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:08,040 Speaker 2: the time unknown Marilyn McAvoy again the I believe set 450 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:11,240 Speaker 2: painter I recalled in that interview with a vice. We 451 00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:13,719 Speaker 2: all got put in these cubicles with the curtains around us, 452 00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:15,840 Speaker 2: but no one wanted to stay in their cubicles. 453 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:17,960 Speaker 3: This is truly our hurting cat situation. 454 00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:21,000 Speaker 2: Everyone was out in the aisles and jumping into other 455 00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:22,000 Speaker 2: people's cubicles. 456 00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:24,639 Speaker 3: Aha. People had a lot of energy. Some were in 457 00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:27,880 Speaker 3: wheelchairs flying down the hallways. What a scene. I mean. 458 00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:33,040 Speaker 2: Everyone was high. Packson reportedly was a stabilizing influence. As 459 00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:35,920 Speaker 2: I had mentioned, a set decorator named Claude Russell would 460 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,760 Speaker 2: recall the beloved star of Twister and Apollo thirteen sitting 461 00:28:38,760 --> 00:28:41,400 Speaker 2: next to me in the hallway of the hospital and kind. 462 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:41,720 Speaker 3: Of digging it. 463 00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:44,479 Speaker 2: Like I said, the only way out is through, and 464 00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 2: he was just kind of taking it as it came. 465 00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 3: Good Old Bill Porri p love that guy. 466 00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:54,040 Speaker 1: And here Jordan points out a Cracked article. We love Cracked. 467 00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:57,840 Speaker 1: You can check out the creator of Crack dot com 468 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:01,640 Speaker 1: on several episodes of Ridiculus his history. Shout out to 469 00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 1: Jack and Miles. You can also check out their show 470 00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:10,200 Speaker 1: Daily Zeitgeist Anyway Cracked great writing. A writer named j 471 00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:15,400 Speaker 1: M McNabb says the following, and Jordan wants us to 472 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:22,160 Speaker 1: read this in full because it is a hilarious description. Noel, 473 00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:26,760 Speaker 1: this is a longer quote, so let's round robin it 474 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:27,880 Speaker 1: now'll kick us off. 475 00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 3: Sure. Great. 476 00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:33,880 Speaker 1: Everyone was so friggin high that they started racing wheelchairs 477 00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:37,240 Speaker 1: down the hallway and formed a spirity conga line led 478 00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,480 Speaker 1: by legendary cinematographer Caleb Deschanel. 479 00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:43,920 Speaker 3: Zoe's dad yep Yeah mentioned that earlier. For sure. 480 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:50,000 Speaker 2: Caleb, famous cinematographer, as documented in the Camera and biography 481 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 2: The Futurists and We had also referenced the director used 482 00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:57,120 Speaker 2: his walkie talkie to radio his ad assistant director while 483 00:29:57,160 --> 00:30:00,360 Speaker 2: she was standing directly in front of him. The then 484 00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:03,200 Speaker 2: leapt at Cameron and stabbed him in the face with 485 00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:07,680 Speaker 2: a pen before being dragged away by hospital staff. All 486 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:10,640 Speaker 2: while Cameron sat bleeding and laughing. 487 00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:15,200 Speaker 1: Paxton, freaked out by the bedlam, quietly ducked out of 488 00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:18,960 Speaker 1: the er with a teamster, I love our teamsters, don't 489 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:22,120 Speaker 1: get us guys, and went back to the set, where 490 00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,520 Speaker 1: he drank an entire case of beer, which he later 491 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:30,040 Speaker 1: told the La Times quote seemed to help. 492 00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:33,120 Speaker 2: The mania in the hospital eventually died down and evolved 493 00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:35,960 Speaker 2: into a game of hacky sack. As you know, these 494 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:38,560 Speaker 2: things tend to do. That's the only that's the only 495 00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:42,080 Speaker 2: possible outcome as the collective high mellowed. 496 00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:46,200 Speaker 1: So these people ride the wave and they go back 497 00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:49,960 Speaker 1: to their they go back to their billets, they go 498 00:30:50,040 --> 00:30:54,880 Speaker 1: back to their sleeping places, and they all realize this 499 00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,800 Speaker 1: is how crazy production is. They all realize when they 500 00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:02,920 Speaker 1: come back to ground and that they have to go 501 00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:06,480 Speaker 1: to work the next day. Right, you can file a grievance, 502 00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:10,040 Speaker 1: but you have to accomplish the mission. One guy says, 503 00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:14,120 Speaker 1: all right, I'm gonna grab my guitar real quick. I'm 504 00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:17,480 Speaker 1: going to write a song about this, which I you know, Ben, 505 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:21,440 Speaker 1: I think you would love this aspect of making a song. 506 00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:26,640 Speaker 1: It's not even a protest song. It's an acknowledgment of 507 00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:27,520 Speaker 1: the event. 508 00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:32,959 Speaker 3: Story song. Very Troubadour esque. 509 00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:38,280 Speaker 2: According to Jake Clark, one of the few folks who 510 00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:41,920 Speaker 2: actually didn't get laced because of a shellfish allergy, James 511 00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:45,000 Speaker 2: Cameron and Bill Paxton were spotted back on set at 512 00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:48,800 Speaker 2: four in the morning with beat red eyes. He says, unbelievably, 513 00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:52,120 Speaker 2: Jim had a bottle of scotch and Bill Paxton had 514 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:54,600 Speaker 2: a bag of joints because he was a real stone 515 00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:55,440 Speaker 2: in the morning. 516 00:31:56,400 --> 00:32:01,120 Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, you know, whenever smoke two joints, and especially 517 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:03,320 Speaker 3: you know this is a special occasion. Let's just say. 518 00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:08,560 Speaker 2: Another actor on set who didn't partake was Susie Amos, 519 00:32:08,560 --> 00:32:11,120 Speaker 2: who plays Old Rose's granddaughter. 520 00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,000 Speaker 3: Thankfully Old Rose. By the way, the actor who played her. 521 00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:18,880 Speaker 2: Either didn't eat that much or skipped it, or there's 522 00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:21,760 Speaker 2: varying accounts that she may have been dining off campus 523 00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 2: and so she was okay, because that could have really 524 00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:27,840 Speaker 2: done a number on an older person. Amos, however, went 525 00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:30,960 Speaker 2: on to marry James Cameron, and Cameron would later joke 526 00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:34,200 Speaker 2: around with Vanity Fair that she's always been high on 527 00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:36,640 Speaker 2: my list of suspects, which leads us. 528 00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:39,280 Speaker 3: To the who done it of it all? 529 00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:49,640 Speaker 1: Get it high on my list of suspects? So the 530 00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:53,920 Speaker 1: good news is that no one suffers any long term 531 00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: debilitating injuries. This is not going to haunt people for 532 00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:04,000 Speaker 1: the rest of their lives. The big questions are what 533 00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:08,920 Speaker 1: happens to the principal actors here the Leonardo DiCaprio is 534 00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:13,400 Speaker 1: the Kate Winslets. What happens to the mystery? Do we 535 00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:22,040 Speaker 1: ever locate or identify the person who poisoned the chowder? Look, 536 00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:25,480 Speaker 1: luckily we do have the police show up, They test 537 00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:31,520 Speaker 1: leftover chowder and they verify that it is laced with PCP. 538 00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:36,760 Speaker 1: Also shout out to Billy Zane, another actor who plays 539 00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:41,200 Speaker 1: like the bad guy boyfriend. He later will say, I 540 00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:44,160 Speaker 1: wish I was there. Those kids had all the fun. 541 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:48,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, if you say so. Billy didn't sound like much 542 00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:50,080 Speaker 2: fun to me, but I hear you. Billy, of course 543 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:53,440 Speaker 2: was in the past parts of the film, as were 544 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:58,160 Speaker 2: the leads Leo and Kate, so they were gracefully, you know, 545 00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:02,800 Speaker 2: not subjected to this horror show. The Halifax Police Department 546 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:05,840 Speaker 2: investigated the case for two and a half years. They 547 00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:09,240 Speaker 2: actually issued a warrant for the Department of Health records 548 00:34:09,239 --> 00:34:11,120 Speaker 2: and got a list of every single person who had 549 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:14,600 Speaker 2: worked on the set and they can compile the ten 550 00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:19,960 Speaker 2: page report, which was actually heavily redacted, but no suspects 551 00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:21,000 Speaker 2: were ever identified. 552 00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:28,080 Speaker 1: Ultimately, as a result of this redactive report, however, we 553 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:33,280 Speaker 1: want to say it, nothing shakes out. This mystery remains 554 00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:39,080 Speaker 1: unsolved today. No suspects were ever identified by HPD. The 555 00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:44,640 Speaker 1: case gets closed in February of nineteen ninety nine. There 556 00:34:44,719 --> 00:34:48,600 Speaker 1: are a couple of theories, and I know we're running long. 557 00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:48,600 Speaker 3: But. 558 00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:54,160 Speaker 1: Folks, fellow ridiculous historians, I think it's important to you 559 00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:59,359 Speaker 1: just give a couple of pieces of speculation, right. 560 00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:02,600 Speaker 2: One that maybe seems a little obvious and that maybe 561 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:04,359 Speaker 2: I had alluded to at the top of the show, 562 00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:10,120 Speaker 2: is this idea of a disgruntled production crew member. Cameron 563 00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:13,279 Speaker 2: himself endorsed this theory for years, saying that he has 564 00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:15,000 Speaker 2: a good idea of who did it, even though he 565 00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:17,880 Speaker 2: couldn't prove it. We had fired a crew member the 566 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:21,320 Speaker 2: day before because they were creating trouble with the caterers. 567 00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:24,800 Speaker 2: Interesting he told this to Vanity Fair. So we believe 568 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:27,600 Speaker 2: the poisoning was this idiot's plan to get back at 569 00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:31,319 Speaker 2: the caterers, whom, of course we promptly fired the next day. 570 00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:36,399 Speaker 2: So it worked, okay, Yeah, man, what a bummer though, 571 00:35:36,400 --> 00:35:39,440 Speaker 2: Like the caterers, by all accounts, the clam chowder was 572 00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:43,200 Speaker 2: deliciously They're kind of unfair to blame the caterers if 573 00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:45,600 Speaker 2: someone dosed the I mean, like I guess, at the 574 00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:47,840 Speaker 2: end of the day, someone's got to take the fall. 575 00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:53,680 Speaker 1: It sticks, though, because why did this occur? Cameron himself 576 00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:59,560 Speaker 1: acknowledges the motive, or the suspected motive behind this incident, 577 00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:03,680 Speaker 1: and he says in that interview we mentioned earlier from 578 00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:08,360 Speaker 1: Vanity Fair the following quote, of course, the operating theory 579 00:36:08,719 --> 00:36:12,040 Speaker 1: was that I was such a psycho maniac that the 580 00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:17,879 Speaker 1: perpetrator was trying to get back at me. He actually sorry, 581 00:36:17,960 --> 00:36:20,879 Speaker 1: nailed it, Jim let me a mendez. He didn't say 582 00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:24,719 Speaker 1: that to Vanity Fair. He said this on the Q podcast, 583 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:27,239 Speaker 1: which was hosted by Tom Power, and he. 584 00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:29,120 Speaker 3: Said and then caveat at the f out of you. 585 00:36:29,239 --> 00:36:31,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, he said, I reject that theory out of hand 586 00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:35,160 Speaker 1: for obvious reasons, And we don't know if he was 587 00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:36,520 Speaker 1: yelling at Tom off. 588 00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:40,279 Speaker 2: Mike, I'm reading this in a yelling voice because I 589 00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:42,720 Speaker 2: no longer know the difference between yelling and not yelling. 590 00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:47,360 Speaker 2: After with this character, we've also got a disgruntled member 591 00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:50,760 Speaker 2: of the catering crew as a potential suspect. There's also 592 00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:53,920 Speaker 2: the possibility that one of them had it in for 593 00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:57,880 Speaker 2: Jimmy c If you guys ever seen the episode. 594 00:36:57,440 --> 00:36:59,440 Speaker 3: Of Home Movies where they go. 595 00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:02,760 Speaker 2: To camp Camp Campingston Falls and they might be giants 596 00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:07,440 Speaker 2: or in it, there is a drama teacher in that 597 00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:11,320 Speaker 2: episode who talks about having worked in the film worked 598 00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:14,839 Speaker 2: in the biz. I worked in craft services for jim 599 00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:15,800 Speaker 2: James Cameron. 600 00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:17,040 Speaker 3: He likes fruits. 601 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,120 Speaker 2: I'd ever see him every day and said, I go, hey, 602 00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:20,960 Speaker 2: mister fruit, how about some more fruit. 603 00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:24,320 Speaker 3: I'll always remember that. And that is clearly a reference. 604 00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:26,839 Speaker 2: To this incident without actually talking about drugs on a 605 00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:28,719 Speaker 2: relatively kid friendly show. 606 00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:32,040 Speaker 3: So, yeah, caterer, disgruntled caterer. 607 00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:36,879 Speaker 1: M Yeah. The theory being that the theory being that 608 00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:41,000 Speaker 1: this ought tour yelled at someone in crafting. He was 609 00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:45,560 Speaker 1: given a cup of soup that he thought was too hot, 610 00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:49,640 Speaker 1: and again this is anecdotal. He threw the soup on 611 00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:53,000 Speaker 1: the floor and said, don't you ever serve me boiling 612 00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:56,600 Speaker 1: soup again? This is oh my god, Yeah, this is 613 00:37:56,760 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 1: not This is not Cannon, you know what I mean. 614 00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:03,320 Speaker 1: This may be Cameron, but it is not Cannon. 615 00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:04,960 Speaker 3: Doesn't that remind you of that? 616 00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:07,640 Speaker 2: I think you should leave sketch where he drinks the 617 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:12,240 Speaker 2: gaspacho soup and says, it's burning, it's burning my mouth. 618 00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:14,959 Speaker 1: Let me explain something to you. When you expect cold 619 00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:19,000 Speaker 1: soup and it's room temperature, it's room timp it's room tis. 620 00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:20,640 Speaker 1: He should have gone with the wall. 621 00:38:20,719 --> 00:38:24,160 Speaker 2: That's very much James Cameron moment there. 622 00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:25,719 Speaker 3: Don't you ever serve me blowing souper? 623 00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:29,120 Speaker 2: Beginner's also an excellent clip of Metallica in the studio 624 00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:33,279 Speaker 2: with their producer Bob Rock and the drummer who's the 625 00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:37,200 Speaker 2: pain in the butt drummer, Lars. The producer's talking to 626 00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:40,640 Speaker 2: him about the drums and he accidentally rolls over Lars's 627 00:38:40,640 --> 00:38:42,360 Speaker 2: foot with his chair, and he goes. 628 00:38:42,160 --> 00:38:44,680 Speaker 3: Don't you ever do that to me again? And then 629 00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:47,120 Speaker 3: the guy goes, wear's some shoes. 630 00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:50,759 Speaker 2: It's a really funny moment. It reminds me of this 631 00:38:50,840 --> 00:38:54,120 Speaker 2: exchange as well. However, Earl Scott, the CEO of the 632 00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:57,080 Speaker 2: local catering company in question here, who provided the chowder, 633 00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:59,520 Speaker 2: he stuck up for his people, as you do. 634 00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:00,319 Speaker 3: When you're leader. 635 00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:03,960 Speaker 2: He spoke to Entertainment Weekly and blamed the production. A 636 00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:07,040 Speaker 2: lot of Spider Man fingerpointing going on here, Ben claiming 637 00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:11,399 Speaker 2: that it was the Hollywood crowd bringing in their psychedelic shit. 638 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:14,240 Speaker 2: I don't think it was purposefully done to hurt somebody. 639 00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:17,000 Speaker 2: We like, it just slipped. Whoops, my PCP fell in 640 00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:19,759 Speaker 2: the soup. Better not say anything. It was done like 641 00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:21,520 Speaker 2: a party thing that got carried away. 642 00:39:21,600 --> 00:39:22,520 Speaker 3: That is absurd. 643 00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:27,880 Speaker 2: Again, PCP not a party thing, not for consumption of 644 00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:30,280 Speaker 2: the general partying audience. 645 00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:34,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, it doesn't hold chowder for me and I think 646 00:39:34,239 --> 00:39:37,480 Speaker 1: for a lot of us. The third theory we need 647 00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:42,520 Speaker 1: to know is the speculation that there was a disgruntled 648 00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:47,439 Speaker 1: local who pulled a prank, who wanted to get over 649 00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:53,600 Speaker 1: on Hollywood just for the lulls. There's no evidence to 650 00:39:53,920 --> 00:39:59,120 Speaker 1: support this. As we're recording now on July third, beautiful 651 00:39:59,160 --> 00:40:04,080 Speaker 1: Thursday here in twenty twenty five. The case remains closed. 652 00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:09,800 Speaker 1: The perpetrator has not been found. There are a couple 653 00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:14,279 Speaker 1: of folks who have tried to get more information from Halifax. 654 00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:19,000 Speaker 2: Right Tricia Ralph, Commissioner reviewed the redactions and concluded the 655 00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:22,920 Speaker 2: Halifax Police were not justified and withholding information related to 656 00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:27,640 Speaker 2: law enforcement tactics and inter governmental affairs, especially since the 657 00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:32,160 Speaker 2: material exceeds the fifteen year protection window. However, some of 658 00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:36,080 Speaker 2: that personal data will go on to remain redacted. Ralph 659 00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:39,440 Speaker 2: ordered the remaining details to be made public. The police 660 00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:42,399 Speaker 2: were expected to release details in May of twenty twenty four, 661 00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:46,120 Speaker 2: but so far have not done so curious. 662 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:50,640 Speaker 1: We do have one kind of cool update from our 663 00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:54,640 Speaker 1: research associate, Jordan. I just can't say enough good stuff 664 00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:58,280 Speaker 1: about this guy. He's a regular Ben Hackett, Ben's sleeping 665 00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:03,640 Speaker 1: dog Hackett, this guy. Horden notes that the production team 666 00:41:03,760 --> 00:41:07,320 Speaker 1: had an update of their own. They made T shirts. 667 00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:10,040 Speaker 1: I love it when people make T shirts. And the 668 00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:15,520 Speaker 1: T shirt shows an image of the Titanic sinking into 669 00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:21,560 Speaker 1: a big bowl of chowder, and the logo says bad Crew. 670 00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:23,720 Speaker 1: Going back to what I was saying earlier about good 671 00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:24,640 Speaker 1: and bad crew. 672 00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:27,200 Speaker 3: Be divided crew bad crew. Yeah, yeah, Do you want 673 00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:28,800 Speaker 3: to give the sun Stairs situation? 674 00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:31,640 Speaker 1: Yeah? You want to give the final word to Jimmy 675 00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:32,360 Speaker 1: c himself. 676 00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:35,560 Speaker 2: I guess we must, since he is the boss. He 677 00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,360 Speaker 2: told the Canadian podcast Q with Tom Power that we 678 00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:41,160 Speaker 2: referenced before in twenty twenty three, a bit of a 679 00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:44,080 Speaker 2: mixed message here, not gonna lie. He said, you haven't 680 00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:47,920 Speaker 2: lived until you've been high on PCP, which, by the way, 681 00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:51,320 Speaker 2: I do not recommend anyone beautiful. Really, what do you 682 00:41:51,360 --> 00:41:55,920 Speaker 2: really mean, Jim, What are you really thinking? Yeah, he's 683 00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:59,279 Speaker 2: an odd character that Jim Cameron. Not happy with the 684 00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:05,680 Speaker 2: way Christopher Nolan portrayed the atomic bomb. He's been, you know, 685 00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:08,200 Speaker 2: very outspoken recently, saying he thought it was a cop 686 00:42:08,239 --> 00:42:13,880 Speaker 2: out the way that Nolan failed to his mind adequately 687 00:42:14,000 --> 00:42:19,800 Speaker 2: show the horror and literal fallout of you know, Oppenheimer's creation. 688 00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:22,520 Speaker 2: I know I haven't seen the movie actually, but apparently 689 00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:25,759 Speaker 2: there is a scene that sort of art Sallee kind 690 00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:29,640 Speaker 2: of shows some charred bodies in the audience, says Oppenheimer's 691 00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:32,640 Speaker 2: giving a big keynote address of some kind and I 692 00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:34,920 Speaker 2: guess that was a choice, but Cameron didn't like that. 693 00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:37,320 Speaker 2: But we also know that Cameron's someone who is really 694 00:42:38,080 --> 00:42:40,680 Speaker 2: spent a lot of time thinking about nuclear holocaust, so 695 00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:41,480 Speaker 2: I could see that. 696 00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:45,760 Speaker 1: Are you Accusie James Cameron of being outspoken? 697 00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:47,920 Speaker 3: He has a bit outspoken. 698 00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:50,360 Speaker 2: I do highly recommend listening to the interviews that he 699 00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:53,200 Speaker 2: did with The Ringer. He's been on a couple of 700 00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:55,680 Speaker 2: the different shows I want to say, the big Picture, 701 00:42:56,040 --> 00:42:58,000 Speaker 2: and then of course there is this oral history that 702 00:42:58,560 --> 00:42:59,440 Speaker 2: Jordan was referencing. 703 00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:01,759 Speaker 3: But he's we got some really interesting takes. 704 00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:03,520 Speaker 2: On the state of AI and I think he's coming 705 00:43:03,560 --> 00:43:05,799 Speaker 2: from a pretty educated place on that. 706 00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:07,400 Speaker 3: So do check it out. 707 00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:12,960 Speaker 1: And thank you for checking out this episode of Ridiculous History. 708 00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:17,560 Speaker 1: Big big thanks to our super producer Audit Ventures, mister 709 00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:21,040 Speaker 1: Max Williams, Big big thanks to the legendary Ben the 710 00:43:21,120 --> 00:43:25,520 Speaker 1: Sleeping Dog Hackett, our guest superproducer, Big thanks to aj 711 00:43:25,719 --> 00:43:32,120 Speaker 1: Bahama's Jacobs Jonathan Strickland aka the Quister, who, by the way, folks, 712 00:43:32,680 --> 00:43:34,960 Speaker 1: I made sure I could say this on air. Just 713 00:43:35,080 --> 00:43:37,880 Speaker 1: had a birthday like a person. 714 00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:42,120 Speaker 3: Yeah it happens. Happy New Year, as you would say Ben. 715 00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:46,040 Speaker 2: Huge thanks to Christoph Rasiotis and Eves Jeff Coates here 716 00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:49,200 Speaker 2: in Spirit. Oh and again just another huge thanks to 717 00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:53,120 Speaker 2: Jordan run Talk who just absolutely killed it on this episode. 718 00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:57,120 Speaker 2: Outline and do check out his podcast DMI Too. 719 00:43:57,080 --> 00:44:01,360 Speaker 3: Much Information, which is a lovely and educational listen. Agreed, 720 00:44:01,560 --> 00:44:03,080 Speaker 3: We'll see you next time, folks. 721 00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:07,520 Speaker 2: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 722 00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:09,720 Speaker 2: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.