WEBVTT - Black Lives Matter w/ Professor Melina Abdullah 0:00:02.120 --> 0:00:06.000 Positively Gam is sponsored by Basiline. See how they are 0:00:06.040 --> 0:00:13.360 working towards equitable skin care for all at Basiline dot com. 0:00:13.360 --> 0:00:15.600 This message is brought to you by Regeneron. If you 0:00:15.600 --> 0:00:18.920 have diabetes, listen closely because your ears could help your eyes. 0:00:19.160 --> 0:00:21.960 Excess sugar from diabetes could lead to eye damage and 0:00:22.040 --> 0:00:25.000 vision loss, even blindness, and you might not even notice 0:00:25.000 --> 0:00:27.880 it at first. So remember, now is the time to 0:00:27.880 --> 0:00:31.600 get your eyes checked. I care is especially important with diabetes. 0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:35.320 See a path forward with actions and potential treatment options 0:00:35.360 --> 0:00:38.000 that may help your eyes and protect against vision loss. 0:00:38.440 --> 0:00:41.199 Go see an I care specialists and visit now I 0:00:41.400 --> 0:00:44.040 see dot com to take charge of your eyesight. That 0:00:44.200 --> 0:00:48.080 is n ow E y E s e E dot com. 0:00:48.120 --> 0:00:50.320 And so that's what we mean when we say black 0:00:50.360 --> 0:00:53.360 lives matter. And I think that when you say, what's 0:00:53.760 --> 0:00:58.040 the greatest misconception is that it's a plea rather than 0:00:58.080 --> 0:01:01.440 a rallying cry. Black Lives Matter is a reminder to us, 0:01:04.360 --> 0:01:08.800 what's up everybody? I'm Gammy and this is positively gam. 0:01:08.800 --> 0:01:12.600 Every week I have raw, in depth conversation with inspirational 0:01:12.640 --> 0:01:17.720 people pushing for change on everything from aging, relationships, politics, 0:01:17.920 --> 0:01:22.200 wellness to the current issues facing the black community. In 0:01:22.200 --> 0:01:24.360 this episode, we're going to be discussing one of the 0:01:24.400 --> 0:01:29.760 most talked about movements of Black Lives Matter. The message 0:01:29.880 --> 0:01:33.959 has become a visual staple. Today we take a deeper 0:01:34.040 --> 0:01:38.680 dive to understand the mission, principles, and misconceptions of the movement, 0:01:39.120 --> 0:01:43.679 and most importantly, the impact it's had on the community. 0:01:44.080 --> 0:01:48.880 Joining me today is Dr Melina Abdullah, a professor and 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:53.840 former chair of Pan African Studies at California State University, 0:01:53.880 --> 0:01:58.840 Los Angeles, co founder of Black Lives Matter Los Angeles. 0:01:59.640 --> 0:02:04.040 Well them, Doctor Abdullah, I am so excited to talk 0:02:04.080 --> 0:02:10.280 to you today, Like, what a way to start. I 0:02:10.400 --> 0:02:12.840 am so excited to talk with you. Thank you so 0:02:12.919 --> 0:02:15.600 much for having me. I wanted to share space with 0:02:15.680 --> 0:02:18.800 you for quite a while, so I'm very excited to 0:02:18.800 --> 0:02:22.520 be with you. Yes, I'm glad that you took the time. Please, 0:02:22.680 --> 0:02:25.960 and there's so much to talk about, but I think 0:02:26.000 --> 0:02:30.520 I just want to start by having you explain exactly 0:02:30.760 --> 0:02:34.440 what Black Lives Matter is, how it got started, and 0:02:34.520 --> 0:02:38.600 what the mission is. Sure. So, Black Lives Matter was 0:02:38.880 --> 0:02:44.160 built really out of tragedy and outrage. We were born 0:02:44.240 --> 0:02:46.840 the day that George Zimmerman was acquitted in the murder 0:02:46.880 --> 0:02:51.160 of Trayvon Martin, and so we remember that all across 0:02:51.200 --> 0:02:54.200 the country, people poured out into the streets. And for 0:02:54.240 --> 0:02:57.880 those of us who are mothers, the theft of Trayvon 0:02:58.000 --> 0:03:03.560 Martin's life as a black boy really resonated for us. 0:03:03.960 --> 0:03:07.760 I remember President Obama said if he had a son, 0:03:07.880 --> 0:03:10.600 he would look like Trayvon Martin. And I actually had 0:03:10.639 --> 0:03:12.760 a son who was three years old at the time, 0:03:13.240 --> 0:03:18.440 and he not figuratively, but actually looked like Trayvon Martin. 0:03:18.639 --> 0:03:22.919 Same shiny brown skin and dancing eyes and a little 0:03:22.919 --> 0:03:26.600 bit of mischief and a lot of joy. And I 0:03:26.639 --> 0:03:31.040 think we were expecting a different outcome that you know, 0:03:31.160 --> 0:03:34.079 he Trayvon wasn't the first black boy to be killed 0:03:34.120 --> 0:03:38.840 by white supremacy, but George Zimmerman wasn't really a cop, 0:03:38.960 --> 0:03:42.080 and he wasn't even really white. His mother's Peruvian. And 0:03:42.120 --> 0:03:44.720 we thought, the system is not gonna double down for 0:03:44.840 --> 0:03:49.240 this one. And so when it did, when it said 0:03:49.320 --> 0:03:52.960 that George Zimmerman was getting off and getting his gun 0:03:53.040 --> 0:03:58.040 back and Trayvon Martin's life didn't mean anything, I think 0:03:58.080 --> 0:04:01.360 that we had no choice. We felt compelled, We felt 0:04:01.760 --> 0:04:07.880 we were divinely inspired and compelled to do work, and 0:04:07.920 --> 0:04:11.160 so for three days in Los Angeles we gathered. We 0:04:11.200 --> 0:04:14.280 don't really need a tweeter or a Instagram post to 0:04:14.320 --> 0:04:16.520 tell us where to go when something goes down in 0:04:16.560 --> 0:04:20.479 black Los Angeles, at least until very recently. We all 0:04:20.560 --> 0:04:23.279 went and gathered in a place called La mart Park, 0:04:23.600 --> 0:04:26.839 right off a crunch shop boulevard. And so I remember 0:04:27.920 --> 0:04:32.680 that day. It was July two thousand thirteen, and I, 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:35.880 along with a bunch of other folks, I had gathered 0:04:36.120 --> 0:04:39.080 three other black mamas and we did what we do, 0:04:39.160 --> 0:04:42.040 you know, fed our kids, bathed them, put them to bid, 0:04:42.200 --> 0:04:44.560 and found somebody to sit with them. And then we 0:04:44.640 --> 0:04:47.960 poured out into the streets and for three days, during 0:04:48.000 --> 0:04:51.040 the daytime we would bring our children with us, and 0:04:51.160 --> 0:04:53.760 at night we'd find somebody to sit with them. But 0:04:53.839 --> 0:04:58.840 we engaged in what Dr Brenda Stevenson calls intuitive organizing. Right, 0:04:58.880 --> 0:05:01.080 So it's just the organized saying that you feel lad, 0:05:01.160 --> 0:05:05.120 that spirit feels fills you and pulls you into And 0:05:05.240 --> 0:05:08.520 on the third day of protest, I got a text 0:05:09.240 --> 0:05:12.440 from that originated with the sister comrade of my name, 0:05:12.560 --> 0:05:16.440 Patrese Colors she's co founder of Black Lives Matter, and 0:05:16.520 --> 0:05:20.040 she invited us to meet at her black artist community. 0:05:20.040 --> 0:05:23.320 It's called Saint Elmo Village. And I was in the 0:05:23.360 --> 0:05:26.880 streets again with my biological children, my three children that 0:05:26.920 --> 0:05:29.200 were birth from my body, but also who I call 0:05:29.279 --> 0:05:32.919 my spirit children, who are my students from Pan African 0:05:32.960 --> 0:05:37.239 Studies at cal State l A. And that night, about 0:05:37.360 --> 0:05:41.240 thirty of us circled up in this courtyard of this 0:05:41.440 --> 0:05:47.080 beautiful it feels like an African village, and we pledged 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:50.480 to build a movement, not a moment. And what we 0:05:50.480 --> 0:05:54.120 didn't realize at the time is that while we were 0:05:54.120 --> 0:05:58.080 in the streets, Patrese was organizing with a sister named 0:05:58.120 --> 0:06:00.440 Alicia Garza, who I didn't know at the time but 0:06:00.520 --> 0:06:03.240 as a dear friend now. And then they later brought 0:06:03.240 --> 0:06:07.080 in Opal till Matti and say, we've been involved in 0:06:07.160 --> 0:06:11.200 struggles for justice for Oscar Grant and for Amadu Diallo 0:06:11.360 --> 0:06:15.159 and Sean Bell and Margaret Mitchell and all of these 0:06:15.279 --> 0:06:19.920 names that we could rattle off, but it's bigger than 0:06:20.240 --> 0:06:23.960 the individual names. So we have to honor the individual names. 0:06:24.000 --> 0:06:27.800 We have to honor Trayvon spirit. And it's also about 0:06:27.800 --> 0:06:32.360 a system of policing that descends from a system of 0:06:32.400 --> 0:06:37.520 slave catching. And so it's not just about getting justice 0:06:37.560 --> 0:06:41.159 for Trayvon. We have to transform the system. We have 0:06:41.240 --> 0:06:44.560 to end that system, and so that's what we've been 0:06:44.560 --> 0:06:48.400 doing work on for the last seven and a half years. 0:06:48.480 --> 0:06:53.880 We believe Dr Manning Marrable rites that the systems under 0:06:53.920 --> 0:06:58.440 which we live are intentionally and deliberately designed to produce 0:06:58.480 --> 0:07:02.000 the outcomes that they do. And so then our charge 0:07:02.320 --> 0:07:07.919 is in transforming those systems, toppling systems that are murderous 0:07:07.960 --> 0:07:11.680 and oppressive and violent and that steal the lives of 0:07:11.720 --> 0:07:15.120 our people, and building up new systems. So this is 0:07:15.160 --> 0:07:19.320 why we say reimagine public safety, and that's the work 0:07:19.400 --> 0:07:21.760 that we intend to do and continue to work on. 0:07:21.960 --> 0:07:25.960 Is Black Lives Matter? That brings such clarity to me. 0:07:26.240 --> 0:07:29.200 And we're gonna delve into the defunding the police a 0:07:29.200 --> 0:07:32.320 little bit later on, But I want to ask, just 0:07:32.520 --> 0:07:36.960 considering the lengths that we have to go to just 0:07:37.160 --> 0:07:41.280 to be heard and just to be considered human beings 0:07:41.360 --> 0:07:45.080 in this country, it's exhausting. What do you think the 0:07:45.200 --> 0:07:50.880 biggest misconception about black lives matter is do we even 0:07:51.040 --> 0:07:56.960 need to be concerned about particularly white people feel about 0:07:57.040 --> 0:07:59.920 Black lives matter. And I guess the only reason why 0:08:00.080 --> 0:08:03.480 I think about that too is because we do live 0:08:03.520 --> 0:08:06.640 in a global society and we do have to learn 0:08:06.720 --> 0:08:11.720 to get along. But we spend so much time assimilating 0:08:11.760 --> 0:08:17.320 into I'm gonna use your description, assimilation into what you 0:08:17.480 --> 0:08:25.520 describe as a white supremacist, patriarchal, heteronormative, capitalistic society. Are 0:08:25.560 --> 0:08:29.240 we losing ourselves in that? I love this question. I 0:08:29.280 --> 0:08:33.760 think the greatest victories of the Black Lives Matter era 0:08:35.360 --> 0:08:42.200 is the unapologetically black approach that we've taken. That. No, 0:08:42.840 --> 0:08:48.160 it's not our job to convince white supremacists that black 0:08:48.200 --> 0:08:50.640 lives matter. This is not a plea. This is a 0:08:50.720 --> 0:08:56.440 rallying cry. This is an affirmation to ourselves right, a 0:08:56.559 --> 0:09:00.120 reminder of who we are, a reminder of our power are, 0:09:00.160 --> 0:09:05.560 a reminder of our beauty and creativity and the capacity 0:09:05.600 --> 0:09:08.640 that we have to really build the world in which 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:12.599 we want to live. No, we're not pleading to anybody 0:09:13.240 --> 0:09:16.120 um to see our humanity. We know who we are. 0:09:16.200 --> 0:09:19.640 We are the daughters of God and the sons of God, 0:09:19.720 --> 0:09:24.880 and we're divine beings, and we are Mama Harriet Tubman 0:09:25.000 --> 0:09:28.960 is our ancestor. Right. We don't need to convince white 0:09:29.000 --> 0:09:32.800 folks of our value, but we do need to remind 0:09:32.920 --> 0:09:36.920 each other that all those things that they heap upon us, 0:09:36.960 --> 0:09:39.679 that they tell us that we are, is not the 0:09:39.679 --> 0:09:41.800 truth of who we are. The truth of who we 0:09:41.840 --> 0:09:45.760 are is who our grandmother's whisper to us is. The 0:09:46.120 --> 0:09:49.800 we are the dreams of our ancestors. I saw that's 0:09:49.800 --> 0:09:53.600 a shut I think we're our ancestors wildest dreams. We 0:09:53.760 --> 0:09:57.040 absolutely are. And so that's what we mean when we 0:09:57.120 --> 0:10:00.360 say black lives matter. And I think that when you say, 0:10:00.400 --> 0:10:05.160 what's the greatest misconception is that it's a plea rather 0:10:05.200 --> 0:10:08.239 than a rallying cry. Black lives matter is a reminder 0:10:08.280 --> 0:10:22.800 to us, perfect perfect Now. In sixteen, you did a 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:28.120 Ted talk Molina, and it was describing resistance as the 0:10:28.200 --> 0:10:31.160 new normal. Can you break that down for me and 0:10:31.200 --> 0:10:33.920 talk to me a little bit about that? Sure? In 0:10:34.000 --> 0:10:38.400 that talk, I quoted Henry Highland Garnett who says, let 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:43.040 our motto be resistance. No oppressed people have ever secured 0:10:43.080 --> 0:10:47.439 their liberty without resistance. When we talk about a society 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:53.320 that is white supremacist, patriarchal, heteronormative capitalist in its nature. 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:57.199 We can't succumb to that system, and that's some beauty 0:10:57.200 --> 0:11:00.800 of being an African person. We have never admitted to 0:11:01.080 --> 0:11:06.359 our own oppression. We have always engage in this resistance. 0:11:06.840 --> 0:11:09.160 So they try to take away our humanity. You know, 0:11:09.640 --> 0:11:13.560 when we think about chattel slavery um in the America's 0:11:13.600 --> 0:11:17.320 that's really the core of chattel slavery is that white 0:11:17.360 --> 0:11:20.760 folks attempted to not just steal our labor, but to 0:11:20.880 --> 0:11:26.360 dehumanize us. We never submitted to that dehumanization. We never 0:11:26.920 --> 0:11:31.040 They would call us slaves, but we never saw ourselves 0:11:31.080 --> 0:11:34.719 as such. We might have been enslaved, but we were 0:11:34.760 --> 0:11:38.479 never slaves. We were always fully human with an unbroken 0:11:38.480 --> 0:11:41.880 connection to the divine and to each other. And so 0:11:42.240 --> 0:11:46.680 resistance is about that. Resistance is about dreaming and building 0:11:46.720 --> 0:11:50.440 a world where police are not the answer to our 0:11:51.000 --> 0:11:55.280 questions about community safety. Where when we're in the midst 0:11:55.440 --> 0:11:59.160 of the greatest health pandemic of our lifetime, with an 0:11:59.200 --> 0:12:03.960 economic all up that's simply unimaginable, we reach back and say, 0:12:04.000 --> 0:12:07.720 what was the practice of Richard Allen and Biddy Mason 0:12:07.880 --> 0:12:12.560 and all of the founders of our sorority who said 0:12:12.640 --> 0:12:18.120 that mutual Aid that it is our sacred duty to 0:12:19.160 --> 0:12:23.920 use our collective resources to make sure that we are 0:12:23.960 --> 0:12:28.160 of service and that we are bound together to all 0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:31.439 of our people. And so you see this like resurgence 0:12:31.480 --> 0:12:35.160 of mutual Aid where black folks every Sunday are in 0:12:35.320 --> 0:12:39.480 Lamart Park again Lamart Park right, giving away backpacks and 0:12:39.520 --> 0:12:42.720 clothes and food and cooking for each other and making 0:12:42.720 --> 0:12:47.240 sure that even though this is the worst economic crisis 0:12:46.640 --> 0:12:52.360 I remember, right, we're making sure that nobody falls off, 0:12:52.559 --> 0:12:54.680 even if they have to live in tents. We're making 0:12:54.679 --> 0:12:57.520 sure we got tents and sleeping bags to donate. And 0:12:57.559 --> 0:13:01.360 so I think that is what resistant says, and it's 0:13:01.400 --> 0:13:06.000 also what abolition is. It's about resisting what is and 0:13:06.440 --> 0:13:12.040 imagining and building towards new worlds. So Well said, you 0:13:12.200 --> 0:13:17.760 talked about or Martin Luther King's the celebration of his birthday. 0:13:18.080 --> 0:13:22.479 You did a zoom call with co founder Patrice Colors. 0:13:23.000 --> 0:13:28.280 It was you and Trudy Goodwin, who is affectionately known 0:13:28.440 --> 0:13:32.959 as Mama True. Yes, she's one of the our our 0:13:33.000 --> 0:13:38.680 precious elders from the Black Panther Party Lamomba ben Delli, 0:13:38.840 --> 0:13:42.679 I hope I'm pronouncing these names properly and doctor I 0:13:42.880 --> 0:13:46.520 can yale you moja. Those two are from the Malcolm 0:13:46.760 --> 0:13:51.000 X grassroots movement. So you did a zoom call and 0:13:51.080 --> 0:13:56.040 your topic was keeping us safe, that we keep us safe, 0:13:56.120 --> 0:13:59.120 we being the black community. Can you tell us a 0:13:59.120 --> 0:14:04.080 little bit about discussion about community driven approaches to keep 0:14:04.200 --> 0:14:12.520 us safe based on as you all describe, preparedness not fear. Yes, 0:14:13.320 --> 0:14:18.400 it's no secret to anybody that white supremacy, violent white 0:14:18.440 --> 0:14:22.760 supremacy has been unveiled in this country. So it's always 0:14:22.760 --> 0:14:25.920 been there, right is it's the foundation of the America's 0:14:26.000 --> 0:14:28.960 right Um, the America's were built on the stolen land 0:14:29.080 --> 0:14:32.560 of Indigenous people and the stolen labor and stolen lives 0:14:32.600 --> 0:14:36.280 of African people. White supremacy is at the foundation. So 0:14:36.320 --> 0:14:39.160 when we hear a lot of this rhetoric about this 0:14:39.240 --> 0:14:41.800 is not who we are, No, this is absolutely who 0:14:41.800 --> 0:14:45.920 we are or who America is. America is it's not 0:14:46.080 --> 0:14:49.040 what we wanted to be. And so how do we 0:14:49.200 --> 0:14:54.200 then do the hard work of undoing, of ending white supremacy. 0:14:54.360 --> 0:14:58.720 And as we watched that siege, that failed coup on 0:14:58.760 --> 0:15:02.760 the Capitol on Janu weary six, we were reminded that 0:15:02.840 --> 0:15:06.440 white supremacy is pervasive. It didn't begin an end with 0:15:06.520 --> 0:15:11.160 Donald Trump, right, it is everywhere, even in California, where 0:15:11.200 --> 0:15:15.840 we think we're a liberal state, and so it's important 0:15:16.200 --> 0:15:23.040 to move forward recognizing that and reminding ourselves of what 0:15:23.240 --> 0:15:26.160 got us this far down. Freedom's wrote and it was 0:15:26.320 --> 0:15:32.440 a community driven approach to safety. That it's black folks 0:15:32.480 --> 0:15:36.960 looking out for black folks, it's working class folks remembering 0:15:37.160 --> 0:15:42.720 that our interests are aligned. It's building approaches. And I 0:15:42.760 --> 0:15:45.720 don't want to belabor it too much with a personal story, 0:15:45.760 --> 0:15:49.880 but can I tell one real quick? Yes? Please? So 0:15:50.160 --> 0:15:55.200 in August of I'm a single mom of three children. 0:15:55.680 --> 0:16:00.640 We were squatted and what that means is white premacist. 0:16:00.720 --> 0:16:04.280 And it sounds like it was clearly a white supremacist. 0:16:04.480 --> 0:16:08.640 Typical southern white male voice called into l a p D. 0:16:09.080 --> 0:16:12.080 And made a false claim that I was being held 0:16:12.200 --> 0:16:16.520 hostage along with my three children. And this is how 0:16:16.600 --> 0:16:20.600 police are complicit, because he actually said he was trying 0:16:20.600 --> 0:16:23.320 to send a message to Black Lives Matter, So they 0:16:23.400 --> 0:16:25.600 knew right off the bat that it was not a 0:16:25.640 --> 0:16:30.120 real call. Nonetheless, police came to my home at nine 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:33.440 o'clock in the morning, surrounded my home with assault rifles, 0:16:33.760 --> 0:16:37.840 helicopter overhead, probably forty or soap ups. When I came 0:16:37.880 --> 0:16:40.560 to the window, I live off a crunch us, so 0:16:40.600 --> 0:16:42.920 I just thought something was going on in the neighborhood. 0:16:42.920 --> 0:16:45.520 It can be busy around here, but they were actually 0:16:45.560 --> 0:16:47.920 here from me. When I came to the window. Two 0:16:48.040 --> 0:16:51.560 officers actually pointed their A R fifteen in the window 0:16:51.680 --> 0:16:54.400 at me. So I did what mothers would do. I 0:16:54.440 --> 0:16:57.240 got my my kids to the back room, got them 0:16:57.240 --> 0:17:00.440 to safety, and I did have my comrade who helps 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:04.040 with security present, and I just looked at him and 0:17:04.119 --> 0:17:06.200 I said, I have to go online. And I went 0:17:06.240 --> 0:17:11.200 on Instagram Live. And I was nervous about giving my 0:17:11.280 --> 0:17:14.119 home address out on social media, but I said, I 0:17:14.119 --> 0:17:18.040 don't have a choice. So I asked everybody please get 0:17:18.119 --> 0:17:20.439 here as soon as you can, because in my mind, 0:17:21.640 --> 0:17:25.680 I said, if these people kill me, I don't want 0:17:25.720 --> 0:17:28.280 them to do it in the dark. I want everybody 0:17:28.320 --> 0:17:32.639 to see what happens. And I didn't. I wanted to 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:38.080 keep my children as safe as possible. So they had yelled, 0:17:38.680 --> 0:17:42.120 gotten on the loudspeaker and sick everybody inside this address 0:17:42.160 --> 0:17:44.000 come out with your hands up. So I had my 0:17:44.080 --> 0:17:48.520 children secured in a back room, had the security person 0:17:48.640 --> 0:17:51.600 staying with them, and I put my hand out the 0:17:51.640 --> 0:17:53.840 front door, and I said, there's a phone in my hand. 0:17:53.880 --> 0:17:56.560 There's just it's just a phone. And I'm thinking of 0:17:56.640 --> 0:18:00.679 Karin Gains and the way she was killed. And my 0:18:00.800 --> 0:18:04.000 kids are screaming, please don't go out. But I had 0:18:04.040 --> 0:18:06.159 to pull them away from the house because what if 0:18:06.160 --> 0:18:10.160 they started shooting into the house right with my children inside. 0:18:11.560 --> 0:18:15.040 So as I walked out, what I didn't see when 0:18:15.080 --> 0:18:17.720 I looked out the window is there were about a 0:18:17.800 --> 0:18:22.959 dozen or so neighbors already standing outside. And when I 0:18:23.040 --> 0:18:28.080 walked onto my front walkway, and I can never tell 0:18:28.080 --> 0:18:31.440 this without tearing up. Two of my neighbors who are 0:18:31.440 --> 0:18:38.080 also parents black parents. The husband walked up. Now imagine this. 0:18:38.200 --> 0:18:43.200 A black man walks in front of these dozens of 0:18:43.200 --> 0:18:47.760 officers with the song rifles to me and he goes, sister, 0:18:47.880 --> 0:18:49.800 what are you doing? Why are you leaving the house? 0:18:49.800 --> 0:18:52.480 And I said, my kids are inside, and he said, 0:18:52.520 --> 0:18:56.040 I get it, and he said so the sergeant says, 0:18:56.119 --> 0:18:59.920 walked towards me and otis is his name? And he said, well, 0:19:00.000 --> 0:19:02.520 if you're going, I'm going. And he put his body 0:19:02.880 --> 0:19:07.240 right in front of mine, and his wife stood beside me, 0:19:07.320 --> 0:19:11.160 and the three of us began to walk towards the police. 0:19:12.560 --> 0:19:14.760 And we got there and it was clear they knew 0:19:14.800 --> 0:19:17.680 they were just there to terrorize me. They didn't even 0:19:17.720 --> 0:19:19.960 bother to check if I was okay, if I was 0:19:20.000 --> 0:19:22.880 who I said I was, if the kids were okay. 0:19:22.920 --> 0:19:27.520 So they were just there to traumatize and terrorize. But afterwards, 0:19:28.040 --> 0:19:30.679 Sophia and Otis had me and my kids come to 0:19:30.760 --> 0:19:33.879 their house and they fed us. And I asked Otis, 0:19:33.920 --> 0:19:36.440 I said, why did you do that? Because if there's 0:19:36.480 --> 0:19:39.480 anybody more at risk than a black woman, it's a 0:19:39.520 --> 0:19:44.600 black man, a big black man too. Yes, And he said, well, sister, 0:19:44.680 --> 0:19:47.080 if they started shooting, I wasn't gonna let you be 0:19:47.160 --> 0:19:51.080 the one to take the first bullet. Wow. And so 0:19:51.200 --> 0:19:56.439 I'm sharing that story to say that it affirmed for 0:19:56.600 --> 0:20:00.639 me what we mean when we say we keep but safe. 0:20:01.400 --> 0:20:07.000 The police were there to maybe kill me. White supremacy 0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:12.000 was absolutely trying to kill me and possibly my children, 0:20:12.960 --> 0:20:16.840 but my neighbors. And it wasn't just Otis and Sophia, 0:20:17.000 --> 0:20:20.159 it was doesn't that's what I mean. That's why we 0:20:20.280 --> 0:20:23.520 keep us safe as such an important mantra. It's such 0:20:23.560 --> 0:20:28.320 an important practice that we trust each other to keep 0:20:28.320 --> 0:20:31.640 each other safe, but we also provide safety to each other. 0:20:31.760 --> 0:20:34.720 So thank you for indulging me in the personal story. 0:20:34.760 --> 0:20:38.560 But it's just for me. It was um eye opening 0:20:38.720 --> 0:20:42.919 and life changing and gave me a trust in my 0:20:43.160 --> 0:20:49.440 people that I don't think could ever be quantified. Yeah, 0:20:50.520 --> 0:20:53.960 I have to experience something like that to to feel 0:20:54.000 --> 0:20:57.240 it to the depths that I'm sure that you do. Yeah, 0:20:57.400 --> 0:21:01.879 I'm so sorry. Just sounds insane. Yeah, it was insane. 0:21:01.920 --> 0:21:07.520 It was traumatic. And again, my people helped me to heal. 0:21:07.760 --> 0:21:11.280 They donated money to put bars on my house, you know, 0:21:11.359 --> 0:21:15.480 they relocated me. You know, they made sure I was fed, 0:21:15.640 --> 0:21:19.360 my children were fed, and and that's the practice. That's 0:21:19.359 --> 0:21:21.879 what got us through. That's that's how you know, we 0:21:21.960 --> 0:21:25.360 are the descendants of enslaved people. We got each other 0:21:25.520 --> 0:21:30.720 through chattel slavery, through Jim Crow, through segregation, through cointelpro 0:21:30.920 --> 0:21:33.720 through all of these things. We did that and that's 0:21:34.040 --> 0:21:36.040 the truth of who we are. And I just think 0:21:36.080 --> 0:21:48.679 that's a beauty of who we are. Yeah, so you 0:21:48.760 --> 0:21:53.720 talked about about healing Molina, and that was one of 0:21:53.800 --> 0:21:57.240 the points that Mama True was making in that call 0:21:57.400 --> 0:22:00.440 that you all had, and she spoke about the use 0:22:00.520 --> 0:22:07.080 of yoga and meditation and sam bowls and chanting art 0:22:07.119 --> 0:22:10.919 and music, all of those things to help keep the 0:22:11.080 --> 0:22:15.520 community healthy spiritually. Talk to us a little bit about that, 0:22:15.640 --> 0:22:20.080 because our spiritual well being is just as important as 0:22:20.119 --> 0:22:24.400 our physical well being. Absolutely, so all of those practices 0:22:24.560 --> 0:22:29.480 that Mama True talked us through our imperative and they 0:22:29.640 --> 0:22:34.560 are spiritual well being and our physical well being are 0:22:34.680 --> 0:22:38.480 tied together. So if I don't meditate every day, I 0:22:38.560 --> 0:22:40.960 start to lose my mind. If I hadn't have been 0:22:41.080 --> 0:22:44.800 prayed up, I sincerely doubt that I would have been 0:22:44.840 --> 0:22:48.960 able to be as deliberate and calm in the midst 0:22:49.000 --> 0:22:53.120 of crisis. And so all of that is hugely important. 0:22:53.119 --> 0:22:55.800 And I'm resistant often times to the term that people 0:22:55.920 --> 0:22:58.720 use self care because I think that sometimes that can 0:22:58.760 --> 0:23:03.960 be selfish care. But community care and healing justice are 0:23:04.160 --> 0:23:08.000 really really important, that it's important that we take the time. 0:23:08.080 --> 0:23:11.639 I have not pledged to myself that I'm gonna walk 0:23:11.720 --> 0:23:14.359 every single day, and so I have not missed today. 0:23:14.400 --> 0:23:17.439 I don't care if it's raining. I don't miss my walk, 0:23:17.520 --> 0:23:20.840 I don't miss my meditation. And then I also believe 0:23:21.160 --> 0:23:25.960 that our spiritual practices provide us with kind of a 0:23:26.040 --> 0:23:29.680 hedge of protection that when we're doing Black Lives Matter 0:23:29.720 --> 0:23:32.119 work off in the first work we'll do is respond 0:23:32.359 --> 0:23:36.120 to a killing of somebody. Right, So somebody was killed 0:23:36.160 --> 0:23:39.400 by the police, and we go out and we're standing 0:23:39.440 --> 0:23:43.639 on their blood like literally, and when we go we 0:23:43.880 --> 0:23:50.639 poor libation m hm. And we do work spiritual work. 0:23:51.040 --> 0:23:54.440 But I still believe my Grandma's with me and she's 0:23:54.480 --> 0:23:58.280 not gonna let nobody touch me either. I think that's 0:23:58.359 --> 0:24:02.479 really important. It really is helpful, believe it or not, 0:24:02.600 --> 0:24:06.199 because during these times when you know I and I 0:24:06.240 --> 0:24:09.440 had to remove myself from social media. I've talked about 0:24:09.480 --> 0:24:12.679 this before. I have to remove myself from social media 0:24:12.720 --> 0:24:16.680 from time to time because I get so riled up 0:24:17.280 --> 0:24:19.840 and I'm not out there on the front lines like 0:24:20.000 --> 0:24:22.679 you and and so so many of the people that 0:24:22.720 --> 0:24:26.280 I've spoken with comfortably in my home but just full 0:24:26.359 --> 0:24:31.800 of frustration and feeling very helpless and hopeless. So these 0:24:31.840 --> 0:24:36.960 measures to keep yourself aware but also to keep yourself 0:24:37.040 --> 0:24:42.320 in a safe and calm space spiritually and mentally is 0:24:42.400 --> 0:24:46.080 so important so that we can figure out what it 0:24:46.280 --> 0:24:48.840 is that we're what our role is supposed to be 0:24:49.040 --> 0:24:51.920 to support all of you. I want to talk about 0:24:51.960 --> 0:24:54.680 that a little bit later, but that is important too, 0:24:54.720 --> 0:24:57.320 because we have a part to play in all of 0:24:57.359 --> 0:25:10.240 this as well. But so let's talk a little bit 0:25:10.280 --> 0:25:16.400 more about your ideas about defunding the police, because for me, 0:25:16.600 --> 0:25:20.960 I feel like defunding the police is just the beginning 0:25:21.800 --> 0:25:25.720 of trying to change a system that actually needs to 0:25:25.760 --> 0:25:30.879 be just abolished and recreated a completely different way. But 0:25:31.119 --> 0:25:35.399 understanding that that is such a challenge and that's gonna 0:25:35.440 --> 0:25:39.879 take time. We certainly, like I said, starting can start 0:25:39.960 --> 0:25:43.919 with just defunding. So talk to us about the audience, 0:25:43.960 --> 0:25:47.199 because I think people have a total misconception about that. 0:25:47.440 --> 0:25:50.600 Of course, So see, Gammy, this is what I've been 0:25:50.640 --> 0:25:53.879 wanting to get with you. I love what you're saying. Absolutely, 0:25:54.200 --> 0:25:59.399 defund the police was a budgetarian. We thought it was 0:25:59.480 --> 0:26:03.359 a real league modest way of getting to abolition right then, 0:26:04.000 --> 0:26:06.560 and and I know it takes a while to bring 0:26:06.600 --> 0:26:12.399 people along with us, but abolition is absolutely necessary. It 0:26:12.440 --> 0:26:16.160 would be ridiculous for us to say, you know what, 0:26:17.280 --> 0:26:20.399 we don't want to abolish slavery, let's just reform it 0:26:21.400 --> 0:26:25.439 exactly exactly. That's real time, right, I just gotta go. 0:26:26.080 --> 0:26:30.840 Police are a vestige of chattel slavery. Police are the 0:26:31.720 --> 0:26:36.320 evolved form of slave catchers. So as ridiculous as it 0:26:36.359 --> 0:26:40.560 would be to say reform chattel slavery, that's the same 0:26:40.680 --> 0:26:45.159 ridiculousness with which we have to meet the idea of 0:26:45.200 --> 0:26:49.640 reforming policing. That said, not everybody is there, and they go, well, 0:26:49.680 --> 0:26:52.320 what do we do about safety if we don't have police, 0:26:52.359 --> 0:26:56.040 because they haven't taken time to be imaginative and even 0:26:56.080 --> 0:26:58.840 be thoughtful. Right, I don't know anybody black who feels 0:26:58.880 --> 0:27:01.480 safer when a police our pools up behind them. But 0:27:02.280 --> 0:27:05.760 it was really easy. So about a year into Black 0:27:05.800 --> 0:27:07.959 Lives Matter, we got a copy of the city budget. 0:27:08.000 --> 0:27:11.320 We were staging a protest and somebody handed us a 0:27:11.320 --> 0:27:15.000 copy of this city budget and inside it had this 0:27:15.119 --> 0:27:19.800