Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. I'm Carol
Speaker 1: Master along with Bloomberg's Paul Sweeney. Welcome to the Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Business Week Extra. It's our weekly podcast bringing you one
Speaker 1: of our favorite conversations from our daily radio show, and
Speaker 1: that included this guest who understands the fast food space
Speaker 1: big time. We're talking about Clifford Hudson, former chairman and
Speaker 1: CEO of Oklahoma Basonic Drive In and Sonic Corporation. He's
Speaker 1: spent several decades at the company and from he was
Speaker 1: the CEO. He's got a new book out. It's called
Speaker 1: Master of None, How Jack of all trades can still
Speaker 1: reach the top Man. I kinda say his path to
Speaker 1: SEEO not exactly a planned one, and he shares some
Speaker 1: of that story and his thoughts also on Today's Leaders
Speaker 1: with Bloomberg's Paul Sweeney and me. I think at times,
Speaker 1: both in small ways and big ways, I can actually
Speaker 1: refocus better by having some variety of my day, variety
Speaker 1: in my life and doing other things that are quite
Speaker 1: contrasted before responsibilities that carried all those years. I think
Speaker 1: actually makes me a more productive person. The subtitles of book,
Speaker 1: I think is pretty critical here how jack of all
Speaker 1: trades can still reach the top. Um. I didn't study business.
Speaker 1: I didn't study business, and undergraduate or graduate school granted
Speaker 1: studies some business law, but never really saw myself going
Speaker 1: into business in a full time way, nor running a
Speaker 1: company like I ultimately did. So it was a little
Speaker 1: coincidental in some ways. You can even say that an
Speaker 1: accidental CEO. But there is a chapter in the book
Speaker 1: it says just say yes, and in fact that we're
Speaker 1: about a four four year period. I guess yes, it
Speaker 1: was just three year far from nine two to nine.
Speaker 1: Each time I had a job opportunity to move up
Speaker 1: in the company. Um, there was a lot of training,
Speaker 1: a lot of risks associated with the center. But each
Speaker 1: time I just said yes. And then one day at
Speaker 1: the board of me, the CEO said he had a
Speaker 1: new job. The board turned to me and said, you
Speaker 1: want to be CEO and would the over twenty or
Speaker 1: three years, Clifford, who who do you think would benefit
Speaker 1: will benefit most from your book? Did you have any
Speaker 1: kind of level of employee in mind as you're writing it? Well?
Speaker 1: I think, first of all, I think the topic can
Speaker 1: have broad general appeal. I wrote the book because I
Speaker 1: felt like there are a number of good stories that
Speaker 1: I could tell from my time period in the job.
Speaker 1: But I also wrote it because I think my the leadership.
Speaker 1: I mean, if there is a expertise I developed throughout
Speaker 1: my life, it was leadership skills, and I thought being
Speaker 1: able to tell a number of people that story of
Speaker 1: the development those is a good story and one that
Speaker 1: people can appreciate it, perhaps particularly younger people earlier in
Speaker 1: their careers in this kind of a displacement period with
Speaker 1: the pandemic um people earlier in their careers might find
Speaker 1: particularly in particular enjoyment from it. But I also think
Speaker 1: a mid career person is kind of saying, you know,
Speaker 1: how should I be, you know, framing my outlook on
Speaker 1: the Should I just bury my head in deeper in
Speaker 1: what I'm doing? So I think that, uh, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe it's self serving, but I think everybody could enjoy
Speaker 1: the book. How's that? So? I love your chapter names
Speaker 1: and I've just been kind of perusing the book. You've
Speaker 1: got one that says your and matters more than your
Speaker 1: What what do you mean by that? Well? Good question, Uh,
Speaker 1: the the very idea about variety and looking out You've
Speaker 1: got to keep your head focused in a lot of ways.
Speaker 1: But in order to evolve your career and evolve your
Speaker 1: your your professional capabilities, your skill sets, you also have
Speaker 1: to be looking out. One are the ways to be
Speaker 1: to think about doing that is even within an enterprise
Speaker 1: where you're employed or if you own and operate it
Speaker 1: um there generally are going to be business opportunities within opportunities.
Speaker 1: So in other words, your what in a way is
Speaker 1: what you're working on today. You know, what do you do?
Speaker 1: When someone I asked you that, what do you do?
Speaker 1: You know? But at the same time, wherever it is
Speaker 1: you're working, whatever it is you're doing, or an enterprise
Speaker 1: you're operating, there really is a new business and a
Speaker 1: new enterprise. It's often an extension of what you're doing.
Speaker 1: It's sonic. We had that experience. I talked about this
Speaker 1: in different ways in the book, but one of them
Speaker 1: was we viewed ourselves basically as a Hamburger chain thirty
Speaker 1: years ago, and that was most of our business hamburger
Speaker 1: drinks and side orders. But the fact is we had
Speaker 1: an ice cream machine in every store, and once we
Speaker 1: simply shifted our thinking about that, developed a program again
Speaker 1: marketing it it really took off. My suspicion today is
Speaker 1: a Sonic does something in xcess to five million dollars
Speaker 1: in ice cream and it's and it's ice cream and drink.
Speaker 1: It's ice cream and drink business. Uh uh. Generally is
Speaker 1: probably more on the order of one point five to
Speaker 1: two big in sales. So it's an enormous part of
Speaker 1: the business that wasn't promoted thirty years ago. And all
Speaker 1: I want right now, Cliff, is like an ice cream Sunday,
Speaker 1: So thank you very much, because I am starving. I
Speaker 1: am starving, so good, stuffy, so interesting. You know, Cliff,
Speaker 1: being a leadership role at a major company, I'm sure
Speaker 1: you've learned a few things when you think about leadership.
Speaker 1: You know, what are the key key pillars for you?
Speaker 1: And are there any leaders that you learned from well,
Speaker 1: so Keith colors that you in terms of leading a group,
Speaker 1: um uh. And I'm going to take these in this order,
Speaker 1: but they're they're equal weighted. One is I think you
Speaker 1: a leader needs to have, you know, a passion for
Speaker 1: the mission of the organization. And if the mission, if
Speaker 1: the leader doesn't have passion, then you know things are
Speaker 1: gonna You're gonna have trouble, but the leader needs to
Speaker 1: have passion for the mission of the organization. And the
Speaker 1: leader needs to have compassion for the people within the organization.
Speaker 1: And if a leader doesn't care about those people and
Speaker 1: want them to be successful, those people are going to
Speaker 1: see through that and they're going to be less loyal
Speaker 1: and they guess not going to stay around as long.
Speaker 1: They're not gonna work as hard to be as committed.
Speaker 1: I think these are two colors that are critical for
Speaker 1: leaders in virtually any position. Well, okay, I'm going to
Speaker 1: go there. I'm probably gonna get yelled at. But we
Speaker 1: have a commander in chief that doesn't seem to have
Speaker 1: a lot of compassion for what's going on in our country.
Speaker 1: I am just curious, you know, And that's not me.
Speaker 1: I think if you read and you talk to people,
Speaker 1: there is certainly that feeling. But I do wonder what
Speaker 1: you make of leadership today, especially at a time of
Speaker 1: crisis and what we say, are you know, dual pandemics
Speaker 1: between the health crisis and then also racism and the
Speaker 1: injustices there in terms of inequalities. Yeah, well, these are
Speaker 1: these are critical and important issue is um uh, Well,
Speaker 1: this is it's just lead their critical issues for our
Speaker 1: country and and they're not new issues obviously. The idea
Speaker 1: particularly is her latter point, the equality, uh critical thing
Speaker 1: for our country and its culture. Um traditionally in business
Speaker 1: dominant position that we look at boards and CEO postions
Speaker 1: now still dominant, dominated by white males. That the problem
Speaker 1: problem when that's the case is you're excluding you know,
Speaker 1: pick a number, but roughly you're excluding, you know, three
Speaker 1: quarters of the population, which means you're excluding the talent
Speaker 1: of three quarters of the population. So that that's just
Speaker 1: a hurdle. We we you know, we I think many
Speaker 1: of us thought we were building over but uh, maybe
Speaker 1: we've got some things we still have to work through
Speaker 1: as a as a country and the culture to recognize
Speaker 1: we need a big tent. We need everybody under that
Speaker 1: tent moving the same direction, um as it relates to
Speaker 1: our leader. Um. Uh So, something that you see on
Speaker 1: my website but you don't see on the book. I did. Um.
Speaker 1: I did serve in the Clinton administration in a part
Speaker 1: time position, and uh and that's kind of been my
Speaker 1: those have been my stripes all my voting life. Uh. So,
Speaker 1: I think that people need to believe that their leader
Speaker 1: once again has that their best interests at heart and
Speaker 1: compassion you know, for their lives, you know, for their
Speaker 1: daily lives. And when they don't feel that way, that
Speaker 1: the gap that opens up there is not gonna it's
Speaker 1: not gonna be healthy for an enterprise, not gonna be
Speaker 1: healthy for a country, and ultimately results in some changes
Speaker 1: in leadership. When you look at leaders that are out there,
Speaker 1: who do you admire or who do you admire you
Speaker 1: know in the past in terms of leaders well, are
Speaker 1: they variety of front uh? Um, That's a that's an
Speaker 1: interesting one. I've always been I've always enjoyed them biographical
Speaker 1: UM reading, you know, I've always enjoyed the history and UM.
Speaker 1: And so as I look back at leaders in the
Speaker 1: United States, I mean it's very easy to look at that,
Speaker 1: you know, coming out of World War Two, because that
Speaker 1: was such an extraordinary period of time. And look at
Speaker 1: the leadership that FDR provided to US, UM through the war.
Speaker 1: Look at the leadership that Eisenhower provided to its as
Speaker 1: a military figure but then also as a political figure.
Speaker 1: Coming out of the war, Um, things started getting a
Speaker 1: little you know, thin in some ways. Once you get uh,
Speaker 1: sixties seventies, eighties. Um, I think, uh uh, it's a
Speaker 1: little more challenging. I think the style of leadership that
Speaker 1: Barack Obama brought to the country, his his integrity, the
Speaker 1: way he communicated with us. I have no doubt that
Speaker 1: he cared enormously seeing United United States continued to grant succeeds.
Speaker 1: A wonderful style of leadership that he brought to the country.
Speaker 1: That was Clifford Hudson, former chairman and CEO of Oklahoma
Speaker 1: based Sonic Drive In and Sonic Corporation, spent a long
Speaker 1: time at the company. He's got a new book out,
Speaker 1: Master of None, How Jack of All Trades can still
Speaker 1: reach the top. It's a great story and a great read.
Speaker 1: Or you've been listening to Bloomberg Business Week Extra for
Speaker 1: sure to listen to Bloomberg Business Week Radio, airing live
Speaker 1: Monday through Friday at two pm Wall Street Time on
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio. I'm Carol Masser along with Bloomberg's Paul Sweeney.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg